Sound Off #102 - Netflix’s IP Gambit, Dave & Buster’s sales decline, and more!

Sponsored by Intercard!
Sponsored by Alan-1!

On this week's show, we push past a strong holiday season to ask how venues earn repeat visits in 2026, from search-proof naming to smarter attraction mixes, while tracking Netflix’s IP ambitions, leadership shakeups across LBE, and the tech trends operators can’t ignore. Along the way we dissect Netflix House, Dave & Buster’s decline, and why some kids’ IP venues miss their audience.

• choosing names that surface in real searches and different languages
• building post-holiday demand with clear offers and return hooks
• Netflix’s Warner IP bid, counterbids, and attraction licensing impacts
• Netflix House pilot strategies in Philadelphia and Dallas
• arcade selection, pricing models, and IP fit inside premium spaces
• leadership changes at F1 Arcade and Play Playground
• Zero Latency’s partner-led expansion and companion attraction logic
• Drive Shack’s corporate rebrand to Golf Entertainment Group
• Planet Playskool closure and audience-definition basics
• Dave & Buster’s comparable-sales declines and strategic risks
• Arcade1Up’s licensing strain and acquisition rumors
• Elaut's new-wave crane, pricing, and design choices
• VR and MR content updates, Meta and Apple pivots
• AI glasses etiquette, marketing backlash, and near-term impact

Subscribe and visit LBX Collective for more!

Chapters

• 0:00 Holiday Wins, Return Visits, And Branding
• 2:10 Names That Search Well And Why It Matters
• 5:30 Sponsor Break: Intercard Cashless
• 6:10 Netflix’s Bid For Warner IP And Fallout
• 12:30 Counterbids, Regulators, And Global Politics
• 16:30 Inside Netflix House: Philly vs Dallas
• 21:00 Amusements, IP Fit, And Pricing Questions
• 24:00 Leadership Shakeups: F1 Arcade And Parks
• 28:00 Play Playground’s New CEO And Expansion
• 31:00 Zero Latency’s Bahrain Push And Pairing
• 33:30 Drive Shack Rebrands To Golf Entertainment
• 35:30 Planet Playskool Closure And Lessons
• 39:00 Who’s The Audience And Who Pays
• 42:00 Dave & Buster’s Declines And Risks
• 46:00 Arcade1Up Turbulence And Possible Sale
• 50:00 Sponsor Break: Allen One
• 50:40 ELAUT Wonderkin: New-Wave Claw Reveal
• 54:30 VR Content Arms Race And MR Theaters
• 58:00 Meta’s Pivot, Apple’s Struggles, And AI Glasses
• 1:02:00 AI Backlash, Hype, And What’s Next

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:02

Are you on the edge of your seat? Because we're about to speak with Kevin Williams, covering today's latest trends in location-based entertainment. Brought to you by the LDX Collective, your community to collect age and inspired. All right, everyone. Let's buckle up.

SPEAKER_01: 0:23

All right. Well, welcome everybody to another sound off with Kevin Williams. This is number 102 for December 16th, 2025. We have like just two more before the end of the year. It's kind of crazy.

SPEAKER_03: 0:36

Very crazy.

SPEAKER_01: 0:39

All right, all right. Well, let's dive right in here, Kevin. How are you going to change my mind today?

SPEAKER_03: 0:47

Well, um, it's kind of a subject we touched upon now, but at this uh the most important time of the year for some operators regarding private hire and events, you know, the question has to be how are they going to better promote themselves uh regarding the uh popularity, the entertainment offering that they're giving at their facilities after the holidays? Because if the person has come in and done uh maybe uh a family group or a social group or a private party, that's one bite of the cherry. But we're not a theme park industry. We have to be able to get these individuals to come back again and again and again and offer a level of repeat visitation that is uh on par with uh the social entertainment uh attributes that we're seeing in the sector. And so I am interested how many operators, just as they're taking a breath and uh finishing the last of uh their turkey supper, are thinking about what they're going to be doing in 2026 to better promote themselves and their offering to their market.

SPEAKER_01: 1:53

Yeah, I mean, so much of this also comes down to the naming of your facility and what you're doing and just your overall brand position, attraction position in the market. I mean, it is certainly about promotion. There's no question that they should be doing everything from social engagement, influencer marketing to essentially paid ads, SEO, um, you know, working on corporate sales outreach, you know, direct outreach. Well, there's the list could go on, but at the same time, also, you know, it's funny that you picked this one specifically, you know, with continue. I mean, all that, yes, is expensive, does require money and effort and time and expertise. Uh, but you also have, you know, when you have names that are like continue question mark that are also difficult to find and search for on uh in a Google Maps search or in a Google search or whatever you're using, um, you want to make sure that your brand stands out in a way that isn't just going to get lost. We were talking on the LBX show on Open and Shut just a couple of days ago. There was one group that was called Lot of Games. Um, and when I searched a lot of games, first of all, if I just searched that alone, then there's no way that came up. And when I searched a lot of games, I can't remember, I think it was in Seville maybe. Um, and I searched Lot of Games Seville in Spain, and it still didn't come up because it was coming up with like board games and other things and places I could buy games and I could go to game stores. And so you have to make sure that the name you're going with as well is going to be able to stand out.

SPEAKER_03: 3:23

Going with retro gaming lounge rather than retro arcade is an interesting choice and a decision that you will find out through a search engine, especially there there is a difference here. The old mindset from 2000 and 2010 in the marketing and the promotion side would have said we need to have a name that's easy to search. Now, with our heads on in the 2026 market, we need to have a name that's easy to search based on the analytics of our target audience. If I say that to a couple of the C-suite guys, uh, they won't understand what I mean. They won't understand that the person's analytics will barge in the way of a casual search that a couple of years ago or even a decade ago would have been an easy find. Not typing in LOT of games rather than typing in L O T S English approach, lots of games is a major factor. That is a translational error. Putting in the word gaming into a UK amusement entertainment facility is a misunderstanding of the market. And using uh question mark or any kind of uh formulaic uh keystroke at the end of uh a name is another problem that will cause issues. Those are just the basics, and we haven't even touched upon do you have to re uh paint your facility this year, literally, to make it look different? Will you have to change your brand? Will you have to change the layout of your machines? There's a lot of things before we even get to major restructural changes to a facility. Those sites that are having a really good Christmas and holiday period, and I'm from the data that we're getting, it has been a very strong uh private hire year for us and a seasonal year for us. That doesn't mean that next year is going to be equally as successful unless you put the energy in.

SPEAKER_01: 5:28

Yeah, indeed. All right, well, coming up after the quick break, we will dive into the trends. Intercard is the only cashless system designed, developed, and manufactured all under one roof. They introduced cashless technology to the amusement industry and have been leading the way for over 30 years. Cashless systems from Intercard increase customer spending, get satisfaction, and boost revenues by up to 30%. Intercard is so proud to be serving the amusement industry. And if you are already part of a global family of customers, they hope you will become one soon.

SPEAKER_03: 6:05

Thank you, Intercard, and a really busy biz for us now. Number one, the story that everybody's been talking about at the moment, which is a constantly changing landscape, is uh the uh positive offer that Netflix put in front of uh the board uh at Warner Brothers, and they accepted initially. So, you know, seeing$82 billion uh thrown around here uh is interesting. What Netflix was actually acquiring was what much more interesting, and uh I think a lot of the media was wrapped up in the uh concern of a streaming service getting into the film uh and uh IP business without understanding the bigger picture. And again, this is a criticism of the quality of the kind of media services that we have out there. Uh and we have to be very careful uh how we get our information and how we evaluate our information. This wasn't the purchase of the whole of the uh Warner Brothers Discovery Group. The news service and some of the streaming services were not going to be part of the deal. Um, this was going to be IP acquisition and film acquisition. Uh, and a lot of our friends in the media missed out that Netflix is already in the cinema industry through its relationship with AMC that we've talked about previously here on Sound Off. From an interactive entertainment point of view, which is uh what are the hats I wear, it was amazing to think of the IP that Netflix would be getting its hands on that exists in the amusement sector from all of the stern pinball ranges of products based uh, you know, uh on uh Lord of the Rings or Game of Thrones, all the way down to the Wizard of Oz redemption machine just launched uh from our friends at Raw Thrills, all would have been touched in some way, their continued usage of that IP, or even backdated IP, or even the request, depending on how Netflix management wants to play this game. There's nothing to stop them turning around and saying uh Mortal Kombat cannot be used anymore in uh the arcades because we've taken over. When an IP changes hands, an IP changes hands. I know there are a number of individuals that will argue with me that if you brought the product uh then you own it, but remember this is uh in the commercial entertainment sector, and we can't just utilize uh IP in the commercial entertainment sector willy-nilly like a consumer. The other areas of interest, how was this going to affect all of the Warner Brother IP-related uh attractions, theme parks, and ride films that were out there? You know, would the King Kong ride film still be running at Universal? Would uh our friends uh at Sally still be able to run their DC-based uh dark ride experience? What would happen to Harry Potter? You know, the the media became a little bit uh uh uh expanded upon this. The relationships with Six Flags, the uh relationships with Universal were not going to be going anywhere. They'll just have to be renegotiated, and there'll be extra zeros uh at the end of uh those negotiations. And then finally, the shoe dropped that this isn't a fate accompli. This isn't a guarantee that this is all she wrote, and that it was a definite that Warner Brothers was going to be uh acquired by Netflix because, surprise, surprise, uh a counterbid, uh hostile takeover, was thrown into the mix by our friends uh currently uh at 108 billion from Paramount. Uh Paramount, a victim or a possible victim of acquisition themselves, uh looking to uh try and restructure. There is Comcast on the horizon at this moment of recording. Uh the news is still uh very secretive whether Comcast is going to throw in. The same way with Disney and others who may gather together and throw in because they've seen the backlash from uh the trade towards the Netflix acquisition. And then we have the unknown forces, uh federal regulation scrutiny. There is a strong possibility that even though uh the uh the streaming operation of Warner Brothers is not included in this deal, this is still quite a large corporation uh that has a wide selection of IP looking uh at acquiring another large bushel, uh bushel of IP from uh the Warner side. And then finally, there's the political, uh the unknown unknowns. Uh, and we know that our friends at Paramount have been trying to apply a little bit of political pressure through their contacts with the White House to see if their uh hostile takeover can be given preferential details. And the interesting thing in the background, when I was writing this slide in particular, I added uh international interests UAE. And uh of the time of writing uh recording this, we've now found out that the Saudi uh Financial Fund has thrown their hat in the ring in supporting one of the hostile uh takeovers as a competitor to uh the Netflix takeover, and we do know how the White House would like to support that side of the fence.

SPEAKER_01: 11:37

Yeah, and while White House intervention does, or we'll call it federal intervention intervention, but yes, ultimately the White House, it's uh you know Trump's buddy, um, you know, Larry Ellison's son, who owns and and runs Paramount uh Paramount at the at the moment. Um, while that that certainly have an impact, you also have the shareholders. We don't know what the shareholders uh will vote to do with this as well. While uh I mean obviously the shareholders they get a it's a a cash offer versus a stock and cash offer from Netflix. It's the whole kit and caboodle versus having to go through all of the efforts of splitting up the the organization. Um but uh you know it there's there's a lot that's gonna come down to really deciding how this thing shakes out. I think that ultimately the IP and uh well, I mean, look at the end of the day, we don't know ultimately, but like the IP, the studio will be almost find a better, more welcome home within the Netflix culture. Um, but the you know fact that it can all go to Paramount and scoop it up would be interesting to see how it could go. But you know, I I do I do worry a little bit about the potential IP going to die under the Paramount banner.

SPEAKER_03: 12:51

Uh the reason I didn't include uh the shareholders in that list is because uh the uh C-suite at uh Warner Brothers has given them the hand. The the shareholders do whatever they're told to do and say thank you very much. That is one of those things that uh if you're a uh dictatorial C-suite, you make sure that you load your shareholders or your key shareholders with uh individuals that will toe the line rather than be angsty. Something that our friends at Six Flags is beginning to understand what they should have been doing with uh their uh their investment groups. Uh I know this game's gonna run and run. This isn't just going to be sorted out next year. We may be having to get into 2027 before this is fully sorted out. And I am beginning to think that from a federal point of view, a paramount Saudi-backed uh um uh uh opportunity may be more attracted to them than Netflix. You you'll notice how few of the Netflix chief executives and well-known and individuals that appear in the business sheets compared to the chief operators uh within the Paramount or the Comcasts or the uh the Disneys uh or all of the others. And that that's very telling of how Netflix works. And I do agree with you, I would feel a little bit more comfortable with Netflix holding onto the IP than what our friends of Paramount have done, even though all of a sudden Paramount seems to be suffering a kumbaya or male cooper over the uh what they've done with certain very high-level IPs, and they're now trying to go back to basics. I give you what is happening with Star Trek. The next one up, of course, is uh our friends at Netflix. Uh another story that uh seems to have been uh uh wrapped in mystery is their continued investment into the Netflix house while the media was fixated in uh seeing them acquiring studios. Uh I am fascinated how uh the Netflix house operation has been run. And I actually have a personal opinion uh regarding how they have uh been developing this. We had obviously previously the Philadelphia facility opening that had a number, you know, it had its two key attractions and it had a number of peripheral attractions. We have now the Netflix Dallas facility opening, and it is two key uh attractions based on IP, and then a more diverse peripheral uh selection. And I have a personal opinion that I think that Netflix is running two teams, two different teams uh to open up their first two Netflix houses, and then they're going to evaluate the information from those two openings and then apply it to their next opening. And that uh concept, that brain fart that I have passed on, has borrowed a little bit more credibility with the news that at the same time that uh we had about the opening of the Dallas facility, right stuck at the bottom uh of this coverage was the announcement that rather than 2026, 2027 is now the new opening date for the Las Vegas third facility in the Netflix chain.

SPEAKER_01: 16:12

Yeah, that's really interesting theory and would would seem to speak to how there are some differences in at least the uh the mix and the layout. I mean, at the same time, I think some of the marketing, some of the some of the look development and stuff is like, you know, coming from the same set of resources. I mean, both both locations, the way they have the top-down maps are very similar. So, but I think like from your your perspective, the I think it's a really interesting take that they could have been developed and designed by two very different teams. And that would also lead to, I think, the fact that uh, and I also so I want to back up. I do wonder if those two different teams also got to select which IP they worked with, or if they were given the IP to work with. Because, you know, for example, if you're given Squid Games instead of Wednesday, um, you're going to have a potentially different experience where Squid Games very much leads to the mission room, adventure room, um, challenge room type scenarios that they've done with the with the survive the trials. You cannot do the same thing with the Wednesday IP. You sort of can, but doesn't really fit with the overall makeup of that of that IP. And so with Squid Games, it was very naturally led into a different type of attraction than like an escape room, um, escape experience type attraction that you you had with Wednesday.

SPEAKER_03: 17:27

The I I don't think there's two uh two teams coming up with the basic fundamental overarching concept. I think there's two operational infrastructure teams. I get the feeling that there is a central team that is spitting out the Wednesdays, spitting out the Squid Games, spitting out uh the uh escape uh dark kinds of which are crown jewel IPs and have developed internally at Netflix's experience team. It is the the periphery of the infrastructure build out, the fit out, and uh the allocation and layout uh I think the little bit nebulous at the moment, and that speaks to if we use Dallas as an example, Dallas uh diverts quite considerably uh from what uh we saw in Philadelphia. There is no uh VR component here, there is no sandbox VR. There is uh you know, the F and B, the food uh component is still the same, but we have the first appearance now of direct amusement product being placed into uh a Netflix house. And this is an important line in the uh in the sand because amusement machines just dropped into a heavily themed IP environment can be lost in the mix, can fall by the wayside, and can show uh their limitations. And already we see 21 amusement machines placed in the Netflix replay zone. What an original name that was. Um, and of those 21 machines, some of the selections have been a bit surprising. We have uh a centerpiece amusement product, which is a re-themed Pixel Games Interactive Floor linked to a Netflix, uh very loosely uh laid to a Netflix license, uh, floor is lava. That said, they've got Floral that is Lava at home. They had a relationship with Sandbox VR to create a unique floor is lava VR experience. You can kind of say, why didn't they have one or why did they redevelop another? They have dropped in amusement machines that are, in some cases, kind of questionable why you would have uh those type of products in an IP laden Netflix themed experience environment. And then there's the the whole of the amusement machines that have been selected for this uh space. You know, 21 amusement machines, some of them of an interesting uh caliber, I would say, for an IP uh-filled environment. Uh, as we've said, the floor is lava, is uh a pixel games off the shelf product that's been lightly re-themed. And of course, Dallas is a very crowded amusement sector. I just wonder how many locations in the Dallas area already have a pixel floor. How much of the game selection for the Netflix House Dallas has been based upon what their competitors are doing, or are they so arrogant that they don't feel that they have any competitors? The pricing model, how the games are paid for, whether this facility actually has a price center are all questions that we hopefully will have answered once we get to see more of this. And I know that all of these decisions will now go into what we see in 2027 with the Las Vegas facility.

SPEAKER_01: 20:59

Yeah, there's no question that that's the reason why they pushed out the date to 2027 so they can take key learnings they've had from not just what things have drawn the most attention, but also just operational things. I mean, this is the first time they're operating their own experiences. You know, they've worked with fever in the past for a lot of their other pop-up experiences. And so there's a lot of operational learnings they're gonna have. Um, and uh, it'll be interesting. I'm gonna go check this thing out in January. So I'll be in the Dallas area in January and really look forward to popping in here and seeing what the experience is like, especially the replay experience. I really am curious how divergent it is uh from a standard arcade experience that you're gonna get at any family entertainment center.

SPEAKER_03: 21:41

That is something that we will really be looking at closely. If they drop the ball on the uh Netflix replay uh environment, that's a difficult one to bounce back from. Uh, and uh I give you our friends at Sony and Wonderverse as an example of that.

SPEAKER_01: 21:58

Yep, exactly.

SPEAKER_03: 22:00

Moving on and changes of foot. Uh 2026 is going to be marked with a lot of new C-suite executives. Uh most of the changes are now board and investor driven, uh, feeling that there is a new pair of hands needed, that the markets have changed drastically, that there is a lot more competition than they were actually expecting. I was speaking to one investor that was incredibly surprised at how many competitive socializing and brand new entertainment venues had popped up. Courtesy of watching uh uh our uh our poor uh publications uh and services here, and they are now having to rethink. Having an executive team that doesn't understand the entertainment market when the entertainment market is growing around you can be very dangerous. And so uh our friends uh F1 Arcade have taken on a brand new global president. Uh so it kinds of shows where they're going with uh the drive for uh their next generation of entertainment venues, especially after they're uh testing the waters with F1 box.

SPEAKER_01: 23:11

This is both good and also potentially concerning to see happen so early. Um it's concerning because maybe they're seeing some early numbers that uh are coming back that are saying that they're they're not seeing the type of gameplay, visitation rates, return visitation rates, uh FB sales, etc., that are they need to do a shakeup. Um, you know, I've been concerned for a long time that they've really overbuilt the facilities as far as the number of simulators and and other aspects. Um, but at the same time, they're making a change relatively quickly in their life uh span as well, which is the good thing that I'm you know, that that I think is coming out of this. It's not great for the fact that they're having to make this change, but the fact that they're doing it now and not waiting too long, I think, is good before they continue their massive, very rapid expansion that they've been under for the last year and two years, really last two years.

SPEAKER_03: 24:00

Last year. I I I think you've hit the nail on the head. We've touched upon this before, that uh, you know, maybe the original C-suite didn't see the uh oncoming light in the tunnel. Uh, it wasn't daylight, it was reality calling. And this situation of being able to move fast and replace with a strong individual very quickly kind of bodes well for the future. Now he has to uh uh make it work, as it were. Uh again, another change in management structure. Uh this one really, the theme park side of our business is going to be going through a lot of changes, people having to readdress themselves to uh the new landscape that Six Flags brings us to and what is happening with Universal, as well as from the European parks, the appearance of Paramount into the uh European theme park market with their new London facilities, as well as the existing sector having to redress itself and redress itself by bringing in new younger executives uh uh to help lead uh the futures for some of the very important of the uh the brand. We we've already touched upon this particular operation when they restructured themselves and cast off their North American investments uh to focus on their European investments and taking on uh a brand new chief operations officer kind of uh is a continuation of that path. And then uh uh a kind of a surprise uh change, uh though I suppose we have touched upon uh a possible need for a little bit more direction, a little bit more rudder. Uh we have uh our friends at play playground uh going for a brand new chief executive. Uh what that new executive is going to be uh doing um will be interesting. You know, we have two facilities open. We have their Nashville site, which we hardly talk about. Uh we are always focused on their Las Vegas facility, and it's not our fault. We would talk about it if we had more information, but the national site, Nashville site, doesn't seem to get uh as much loving. Hopefully, the new chief executive has been given a remit to uh take this concept, give it a good shake, uh, and throw it back into the market. I kind of get the feeling that it is a it's a fair game has gone through kind of a similar process where two facilities opened, seemed to have stalled a little bit, needed a major shakeup, got acquired. Uh I'm not saying that this is an indication that play playground is about to be acquired, but it does show that there was a need for a management rethink.

SPEAKER_01: 26:51

Yeah, I mean, look, maybe it's uh the fact that uh, you know, Jennifer Worthington, who's the current or or you know, is the current CEO of Play Social, um, you know, she was the you know, maybe the founder kind of early stage, like helped get them off the ground, get these first two locations opening, and now they just need somebody with a little bit more operational chops. You know, John um this Phil Royal comes from Merlin Entertainment. He's the current head of operations uh at Legoland Resorts. And so, you know, he comes with a pretty decent pedigree for operating larger, bigger facilities. And so I think they're you know, one, it's a step up for him. So congratulations to Phil for kind of moving into his CEO role. Um, but also this might signal that Play Playground is getting ready to think about more global and international, you know, international and even domestic expansion. And so um, I think they're gonna have to deal with the situation at the Luxor in Las Vegas at some point, that location. I think it will work for another year, maybe two years, and then they'll have to probably think about moving to another location in Vegas or moving uh all those assets to some other place, depending on their lease. I'm not sure. Typically, that's you know, we've talked about that location before, it's where attractions go to die. And so um, you know, we'll see how long they can continue to really operate there. But uh, this is probably a good signal that they're getting ready for that type of uh greater expansion.

SPEAKER_03: 28:13

It is a promotion up, or should we say a ladder uh acceleration? Uh, the individual coming in has more experience on uh operations for a younger audience than he does for competitive socializing, and that is a baptism of fire. Uh, I'm also pointing to the need for a new pair of hands to shake this uh brand up uh in a very crowded and competitive uh market at the moment where its USP is not going to stand out as much as it would have when they first launched this. Uh partnerships uh continuing as well. Our friends at zero latency are now moving into Bahrain. They have found a partner to um roll out a number of their free roaming arena VR experiences within this very affluent territory. It's a difficult one, uh, and you need to have a very strong partner that gets it uh straight away. And so uh we wish them a lot of luck with this uh partnership, and it will be interesting to see the next phase from zero latency, who we're going to be touching on a little bit later.

SPEAKER_01: 29:29

Yeah. I'll just say, I mean, it'd be interesting. I if if these are planned to be integrated into existing facilities, other FECs, or if these are going to be standalone zero latencies, um yeah, I mean, like you know, added into resorts, it's a great added resort attraction, it's a great uh you know, added FEC attraction. Um they haven't been super successful in standalone installations um in compared to installations where they are paired with other attractions or other hospitality, you know, hospitality experiences like hotels and resorts.

SPEAKER_03: 30:06

It is something I've constantly talked about, Sandbox and uh our friends at zero latency, which is they're a companion attraction rather than a standalone attraction. Uh, based upon the numbers that we have access to, we can see they always do better when they're part of a bigger mix. Uh, but that is true of many uh intensive immersive entertainment experiences, uh, be it a tocker social or the way down to a virtual reality experience. Uh, they they share audience capabilities that can help promote them. This will be part of a growing, you know, zero latency has to make some announcements soon about uh where they're going with their next stage. Now they get closer to the 200 facility number. Uh and their franchisees from the earlier period are going to want to see a payday, as it were. Moving on and rebranding and reshaping. Um, Drive Shack has uh rebranded itself as Golf Entertainment Group. Now, I I would have thought it would have gonna be the other way around that uh a company called Golf Entertainment Group would be rebranding itself to Drive Shack. Anyway, Golf Entertainment Group doesn't just own the Drive Shack, um, what I would call the Top Golf competitor, uh even though they don't have the same number of uh Drive Shacks as Top Golf does. They are a golfing brand. They have two, they have the Drive Shack uh four facilities. Uh they have the Pottery, which is a non-technic technology infused mini golf kind of approach, and they also have interest in the golfing sector directly through their American golf courses. Um, so this is kind of proper golf, mini golf, uh, and shooting bags, next generation golf. And uh the company has read the uh tea leaves, as it were, and seen the shakeup in the market, and so they position themselves as golf entertainment group, and we're led to believe that they have uh secured new investment to uh expand the chain. We touched upon this uh a couple of days ago in uh open and shut. The situation uh finally came to a head uh at Planet Play School. Thank you to our sources for uh feeding us the detail uh on this situation because it is clear that none of the parties involved want to talk about what the hell's going on here. Uh, you know, there is the danger that you may have turned up with your friends to go to uh Planet Play School only to be greeted by the close sign. Um I'm led to believe now that TripAdvisor is also now uh confirming that the uh New Jersey site has closed. The Hasbro licensed property here is a difficult one. It was going into a target-rich environment. There is a strong audience base within uh the locale of where they've placed this, but what they rolled out, the final release of uh this particular concept, which was taken on board by a franchisee. So this is a license by a third party, not being run by uh Hasbro, but uh uh buying the Hasbro licenses, seemed confused. Uh, I mentioned on a number of occasions of what the Play School brand actually was, uh, and that was what you were promoting your facility to be with Hasbro, and what was actually delivered in the facility itself was confusing. Why Transformers was uh in a play school environment, or if you weren't aiming at a very young audience, why were you using the Planet Play School brand in the first place? Lot of reasons. I would love to go into a proper post-mortem, but I will need a lot more information on what's going on here because there are multiple reasons why this uh New Jersey facility could have closed, be it from landlord problems, management operation problems, facility problems, to even being the wrong thing for the right market. These are all questions that need to be answered. And as long as certain executives keep their lips sealed on what's going on, the longer it'll take us to be able to do that.

SPEAKER_01: 34:24

Yeah. It is interesting because when you look at their, you know, some of the videos that that are online, um, you know, barring the Transformers, which actually interesting doesn't lease doesn't show up at all on their promo uh bumper videos. Like you never see the Transformers attraction, even though you see it obviously right there in the picture. Um, the it has a very similar experience to Acraylo experience. And Acraylo Experience has done marginally well, but not uh not super well in the fact that they're actually just closing, you know, they're closing down one or two additional locations while they're looking at maybe potentially uh licensing their IP versus trying to run their own attractions. And I know this was obviously a uh a partnership and not a run by Hasbro itself, um the way that the Crayola experiences were with uh Hallmark. But uh it does feel like I wonder if there's just a market gap for something that just doesn't align with the target audience and these types of like interactive play experiences that just maybe seem to struggle with this age group.

SPEAKER_03: 35:30

Who is your audience? Who is paying for the experience? What is the experience? Those simple questions at the beginning of my consultancy. So it is near enough the first question that I will ask, other than here are my bank details, please pay me on time. The issue is that too many C-suite executives uh saw this um aspect of the market, excuse me. Uh saw this aspect of location-based entertainment as a very strong utilization for a fidgetal environment. Figital is an important part of uh the thinking for utilizing of IP. So a number of these companies that have very strong IP have suddenly turned and pivoted uh towards wanting to get into the bricks and mortar. And many of these executives thought, how difficult can it be? You know, I I remember at least four years ago, uh, certain executives walking around IALPA and other uh entertainment trade shows very arrogantly, you know, not wanting to get involved with uh the established entertainment divisions, but wanting to go it themselves. Uh pulling in maybe advisors, but the majority of the development, the design was going to be done through a partnership with an established company that could sell them a good brand uh identity. Hey, we've run uh retail facilities before. We can run an entertainment side, and those mistakes have been costly. And as you point to the Crayler situation, there's a lot more behind the scenes of what went wrong with uh that target audience uh positioning. We have a similar thing happening with Sony, uh, with Wonderverse. We have a similar thing happening with some of the other Hasbro and Mattel properties that have been developed by partners uh in the Middle East uh and uh other localities. We will be getting very close to that come to Jesus moment. The one thing I'm hoping for is that we don't have a kind of 1990s location-based entertainment boom bust, where just because they uh the original C-suite didn't understand it, they paint all of us as a failure rather than taking a deep breath and saying maybe we need to get some gardeners in if we're going to try and grow a garden.

SPEAKER_01: 37:58

Yeah, indeed.

SPEAKER_03: 38:00

Moving on, and uh getting some gardeners in if you're going to get gardening, uh, kind of brings us to the latest news of Dave and Busters. So uh previously uh in the reportings, you could throw all of the previous management under a bus because they'd made some really big mistakes, and you were going to sort that out, and you'd be turning the ship around tootsuite. And then at the end of the year, you've got your next numbers, and you haven't turned the ship around. One would argue that you found another iceberg to wrap. Uh, this is a serious situation for Dave and Busters. Um, I've been privy to some more behind-the-scenes detail of how they've tried to address the problems and how serious the problems were that the uh replaced management found themselves dealing with. Um we could tell quite clearly during IALPA when we attended that Dave and Busters event that they still were trying to sort out their problems for those of us that walked around the facility uh at Universal Drive in Orlando, which is a flagship facility, a very prominent tourist-heavy facility. They still hadn't got to grips with how to place games, and they were still dealing with the situation with their social base. Um, and one thing that I will point to with these numbers that have just been made available, uh, you know, they they show us the 4% drop. They are they also show us the net loss uh for the year, and they still obscure main events.

unknown: 39:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 39:43

So that is concerning.

SPEAKER_01: 39:45

It is it is can it continues to be mind boggling that they obscure main events and it's hidden um on underneath all of the Dave and Busters, and they cannot continue to lose 10% of their revenue, you know, like you have a 10% revenue loss uh every single year. Um and and Or net loss anyway, right? Of uh their total revenue. And obviously the bigger concern here, I think, besides just the overall net loss, I mean, because that can be driven by a number of things, capital expenditures, etc., right? Um, is that the fact that they still continue to have comparable sales, uh store sales dropping by four percent, um, despite all the changes they've already made. So they continue to lose um the same store sales, continue to decline year over year, and it's been that trend for a number of years now. They have to reverse that.

SPEAKER_03: 40:29

And they can't hide it. It it happened prior to the previous management, it happened during the previous management, it's happening with this management. I argue that this is like running a bar, and they have removed fear from their lineup. It is that severe that they have made a change to their fundamental uh operation that is now hold them below the waterline, and the current management team are so out of touch with working in location-based entertainment and uh Eatertainment that they can't see what they've left off the table, what has been removed. They're trying, you know, they're you know mixing metaphors here. They are the individuals uh in the dark striking matches to try and find out which fuse to replace to get the lights back on. And we're now at a situation where they're in they're in the danger zone now. They they cannot carry on like this. If they report again their next quarter, uh a number where we see a 4% or even maybe a 6% uh site-on-site uh problem in their sales, then they're out. And then the alarm bells start from the investors, and then a serious root and branch change takes place, and that may even be the halting of new facility builds. Um, I know of one uh Dave and Buster's facility that was about to start uh building out, and that has paused at the moment. I don't know the reason for that, and I'm desperately trying to find out. I don't know what's happening also with uh some of the advisors that Dave and Buster's current management had brought on to help them uh re-rewrite the ship, re-uh uh return to a course of success, uh, and whether those they were listened to or whether their advice was too little too late. We are in a very important situation, and I am surprised how little our industry is talking about this. Moving on, and uh another company that finds itself uh going from boom to bust, and a company that has an indirect uh impact on the amusement industry. Our friends at Arcade OneUp are the developers of a wide range of uh consumer versions of popular classic arcade machines. They license uh the original arcade machine properties and develop consumer version minis that can be put in every person's rec room. Very popular when the sun was shining and when people were spending on their rec rooms. Not as popular when people are tightening their belts. Uh and the situation that we have is that uh our friends at Arcade One have been going through refinancing and restructuring. They've still have to pay very expensive licenses for the IP that they use, so they have recurrents as well as having to develop new products, and they've even pivoted towards an even smaller form factor, a uh a bar top kind of new version of their machines uh for uh a younger audience and for the an audience that doesn't have a rec room anymore, uh or a man cave, I suppose would be some people's uh descriptions. And they've also entered into some very unusual new relationships with distributors to get these products in front of the uh customers, uh placed in certain retailers using a certain list uh distributor. Anyway, a lawsuit popped up recently um with Atari over outstanding payments and various restructurings. Um we also got information from sources that uh plans to develop a new range of arcade properties that's been put on shelf because they just didn't have the cash. And then there was rumors that there's a possible acquisition in the wings. All of this happened, and then they lost their CEO. And you know what I say when the CEO disappears and there is no replacement to be found, something's happening. This is the top golf moment, I suppose. Uh so I'm not sure if I'm going to be talking to you in a couple of weeks' time about uh someone buying uh arcade one up or uh maybe arcade one up going into some protection.

SPEAKER_01: 44:52

Yeah, I mean I wouldn't be surprised if somebody comes in and buys them. There's uh it it's it there's there's so many different consumer-facing brands out there that could scoop them up and continue to run them. They they are popular, yes, they'd go through cycles. Um, you know, we have the Mrs. Pac-Man. Um, you know, I I've purchased the Mrs. Pac-Man in the past um, you know, machine. And they're they are, you know, it so I would not be surprised if we see this get scooped up by somebody else versus just going into administration.

SPEAKER_03: 45:20

I wish they'd had a management team in place that had a little bit more foresight. Um, you know, according to the rumors on the street, the management team was uh a lot more interested in uh learjets and expensive hotels than a long-term plan. That is a rumor, again. Uh I'm just uh repeating what I read on the internet. But the uh the issue here is that if you'd had a long-term plan, you could have worked out what products you're going to be licensing, what shape they're going to be, and then you could have uh buffered yourself against possible downturn in your core whale audience purchasing the same thing again and again and maybe aiming for a new audience. Your core audience of purchasers religiously buy these systems and they complain about the minutiae of the controls and what version of the ROM code they've used and what shape of the cabinet that they have recreated. I've been on those forums. These guys are very meticulous about the quality of these. To then try and pivot to a new audience that doesn't have that level of engagement with a small assistant is a difficult sell at the best of times. And uh I think whoever takes on Arcade One Up will have three things to deal with, which is who they're trying to sell to, the situation regarding the IP that they pay for, how much of it they still want to pay for, and how much of it they need to continue to have a relationship. And the more I look at this, the more I think that a company like Atari wouldn't be so stupid as a possible acquirer of this, at least they wouldn't have to pay themselves uh for their own IP. Uh but also it's that type of company, a Hasbro, an Atari. Uh yes, uh, those are the ones that I was gonna say a Mattel, but no, maybe not. But those type of companies that have a proven manufacturing uh and IP handling operation may be a much safer pair of hands to move forward, especially now that they've lost their CEO and they're going to need a C-suite injection, as it were. Indeed.

SPEAKER_01: 47:27

Well, coming after coming up after a quick break, we'll continue with the trends. However, your game floor with arcades by Allen One. Whether it's perfectly foreign things to Dr. Pepper's photo playing, having official flight company's updates, or defending cities to attempt to make a commander reach card. Alan One has something to every venue in arcade floor that is delightful gifts. Each game is also an active later each floor. Free app attracts player top scores and brings guests back to your venue for more. Visit Allendax1.com to learn more. That's AllenDaxx1.com.

SPEAKER_03: 48:00

I wonder how many um Atari remixes our friends at Netflix house purchased. Are we allowed to promote brands like that? Yeah, sponsorship. But it just makes me think about the type of products you would put into a facility like that and what they actually did. But anyway, off to the uh tech trends. And uh we we were very naughty uh during our IALP uh sound uh um uh guest gab uh uh talking about the elot uh machine. Uh I know a lot of people sent me texts afterwards saying I couldn't see the picture of the uh the machine that was being held up by Clint. And you know, I didn't know what well. Here we go, guys. This is the Elot Wonderkin. This is their concept. Uh we have new wave claws at home. Uh it is called the eClaw 2.0. It is going for a very heavily uh LED-illuminated front bezel component. It can be networked, it does also have software on board uh to allow it to be remotely supported, uh, as well as other unique features. Uh, the unique features that fe uh the ELOC field will put them in a very strong position uh to compete with the Chinese invasion and Taiwanese it now, invasion of the what I like to call new wave claw machines. Uh they felt so strongly about this and one other product uh that they hid it in an inflatable tent uh at Ayalpa, which is what we were alluding to during our conversation that you know you had to pass the uh dogs of Cerberus and an armed guard uh to get into an area to see this. And a lot of operators that passed Cerberus and the armed guards to get to see this raised an eyebrow. Uh, not because they didn't think that uh it was an interesting uh upgrade for Elot to move from their traditional uh crane machines, which they said were fantastic and didn't need to be replaced to actually now going to creating a replacement, but sticker shock. There were people needing to be revived after they heard how much this uh machine cost. I'm not going to quote the show price uh because I'm led to believe that that sticker shock has actually forced Elot to uh rethink about what they're going to be charging, and we will be able, uh hopefully in March at uh Amusement Expo uh to give you a rundown then, unless Elot decide to bring this uh machine to the EAG show in London uh next month.

SPEAKER_01: 50:46

You know, look, I have to say I'm a fan. Um I think that they've taken a big swing. I appreciate their their uh new approach. Um there's a lot of features in this thing. Uh we're not gonna go and itemize, you can check it out on Allowance website. Um they are doing some very interesting things here um that I think they need to do. And um, you know, their form factor as well is different and unique. And this is gonna stand out on your on your game floor uh for sure. Um now obviously these are intended to be sort of like the new wave crane uh experiences versus maybe just standing out there on your game floor mixed in with the rest of your thing, with the rest of your games, but um but it will certainly stand out and um you know looking forward to seeing how it does.

SPEAKER_03: 51:31

My only criticism, opinionated individual that I am, I wish they hadn't gone with black. I have a problem with black machines in dark amusement facilities, and most amusement facilities lean on heavy surface colours against light colours, and one of the reasons why so many of the new wave uh claw machines are white and bright is so that they can pull themselves out of being sucked into the black phase. Sadly, I think they are going to have to think about uh a colour refresh for this brand, but you're quite right, it is target rich. All the things that they were pushing back against a couple of years ago when we were talking about the invasion of the new wave machines, they've been man enough to accept uh and incorporate. And uh I'm only here to see the industry grow, not to see it fail. And so I wish them a lot of luck with this. Please just address the sticker price. Moving on, and we have uh an interesting bundle of uh new releases just as the uh year ends in the um what are the uh location-based XR market, and I'll I'll define that a little bit more in uh later on. The new VR content is focused on three things. Number one, always having to update with new content, number two, utilizing your own internal development resources rather than depending on licensed content, and number three, keeping up with the Joneses, and each one of these companies are competing against themselves in one way or another regarding what they do in the market. Uh so Sandbox VR, we've already touched upon uh regarding their involvement with Netflix, but they're standalone facilities, over 68 of them, and they're all hungry for new content, and not all of this new content can always come from a licensed IP. So they have gone back to their well, and one of their popular games they've redeveloped for that market. Our friends at zero latency with over a hundred of their facilities. Uh, again, they can't depend on going and uh licensing uh the latest uh Warhammer uh property. They have to develop it, and they've gone back to their well, and one of their popular games they've redeveloped. Synthesis VR has partnered with uh a proven uh VR Studio and uh rolled out a six-player game free roaming game. So that allows a VR Arcade to have a free roaming experience that can directly compete with our friends at Zero Latency, our friends at Sandbox, our friends at uh Another World, our friends at uh all of the other um free roaming uh uh uh arcade LBE offerings out there. We VR in Japan have developed their own content, which is uh again uh developed for a free roaming environment, but they're going for an adventure style uh approach rather than a uh blasting zombies kind of thing. Uh and this is developed in partnership with HTC Versus, uh which is uh really aiming at a free roaming uh landscape along with all of the other systems in this market. Very interesting to watch. We've also seen now mixed reality entering the market uh for attractions, and one of the uh areas that we saw at IALPA uh embracing immersive experiences was the zoological and the aquarium market. And uh in Spain, one of the aquarium parks has opened up a theater experience that uses virtual reality uh headsets, uh, MetaQuest IIIs, but they're using them in a mixed reality uh approach. And this is kind of uh what we were alluding to about nearly 10 years ago with the uh the dream of uh magic leap of having a uh a whale in your auditorium. Now you do have a whale in your auditorium. The only problem I have with this is the uh the difference between the marketing visuals uh that the company has been running with on their website and in the press release, and what the actual visuals seen through the uh MetaQuest III look like.

SPEAKER_01: 56:05

Yeah, this has always been the biggest issue with AR experiences, I think, is when it comes to the marketing, what you see on the website and what you actually experience when you walk in the door are very are usually very two uh two very different things.

SPEAKER_03: 56:18

Moving on, and uh our friends at Meta have gone through some changes. They made an announcement or uh they had an announcement leaked, and then they had to confirm it that they're going to be pulling back on their investment uh or their budgets into their VR side of their business, and they're now going to be focusing a lot more on their AR. This uh carries on from what we were stating previously. They also turned around and said that they're developing a new headset for next year, and uh, which they said will be focused at uh the VR and the MR sector, but then they dropped the big bombshell by saying it won't be subsidized as much as their previous. So this side of the consumer VR market is definitely going through a major change uh at the moment. And then our friends at Apple, they have uh uh finally had to admit uh how much the sales of uh their system have uh generated. You know, they've plowed uh nearly eight billion dollars in over the 10 years to develop their uh mixed reality or spatial computing headset, and uh they've only achieved uh 47% of what they were uh of what they were actually hoping to uh sell of the system. So it is sadly a dud uh in the eyes of uh the corporate side of the business, and it's now clear that Apple will have to be moving into either the AI glasses market or totally rethinking their strategy. But that may be immaterial because so many Apple executives are leaving the company now. Uh it was rumored uh a couple of months ago that Tim Allen would be leaving, retiring from Apple uh next year, and then for the last couple of weeks, we've had a revolving door of uh Apple executives leaving. Even one of the chief developers on the Apple Vision Pro leaving to join Meta and to work on their AI glasses, so quite a uh a bonfire of the vanities going on at Apple. Yeah. So quickly on the AI stuff, and um we've seen the first instances of people complaining and pushing back about uh AI glasses. Uh woman on a New York train uh broke a pair of glasses that were being she was being filmed by by an influencer, and it seems to have started a spate of problems, and now it looks like the theme park industry as well as other service industries are going to have to come up with an official statement about the usage of these glasses in their facility. This will be incredibly embarrassing if Disney has to come up with a statement about the usage of AI glasses uh in their parks after doing such a big PR deal with Meta to promote their AI glasses in their recent Connect conference. Uh AI is uh following me everywhere I go. Um while I was in the Netherlands, uh McDonald released an AI uh created uh Christmas commercial that only lasted 24 hours before the whole of the country demanded it to be pulled off. It was so appalling. If you go on to uh our Facebook uh link, you'll see uh a link to uh that particular video. But uh save yourself the the brain rot. It's not good.

SPEAKER_01: 59:44

Yeah, I don't even understand why I was gonna say I don't even understand why they even attempted this after Coca-Cola got such a backlash from doing their Christmas AI commercial again after they got a backlash last year because you know and then AI.

SPEAKER_03: 1:00:00

Continued with uh receiving the Person of the Year award from Time. Uh it was actually the creators of uh uh AI that received uh the auspicious uh opportunity to be on the cover alongside uh other such numeries as Stalin, Adolf Hitler, Donald Trump, and Paul Potts. The uh I'm not hopefully the AI uh entrepreneurs are not going to have the same kind of level of world-changing events on us, but it is interesting to see uh you know AI figurating so heavily uh uh in all of our aspirations going forward to the end of the year. And I I think 2026 will just be a continuation of this.

SPEAKER_01: 1:00:42

Yeah. I mean, look, I appreciate that they made this time of the year or person of the year, um, time person of the year uh at some level, but it feels like it's just a little too early. I feel like the impact that it's had on society, while large and will continue to get larger, I mean significant. I don't want to downplay the impact it's had on society already in the last three years since the first GPT model came out or the chat model came out. But I will say that it's not quite at the point where I would say it's person of the year. I think when we get to agentic AI, it really starts to do things for us on a regular basis, displacing uh workers on a regular basis. That's when it's time to probably uh think about this.

SPEAKER_03: 1:01:19

I would have waited a year, uh, because I think we're very close. Uh, but uh obviously the guys and girls that uh compile the person of the year uh for the Times were also uh doing a little bit of betting on the uh the side of uh because I I uh you know I was reading a story about how there was a spike in complaints on the online betting services of trying to work out who was going to be on the front cover. Either way, uh maybe a little bit more time in the oven. Anyway, thank you for surviving uh this latest uh sound off. Uh if you have any information you want to pass on, please check us up on LinkedIn. Uh we have the monster that is our coverage of uh the IALPA show going out now. Um, over five uh glorious episodes of that. Uh we also have a new uh entertainment social arena uh coming out soon, hopefully before the end of the year, but definitely into the new year. Uh and remember you can listen to this on audio. And if you've got any information, email me. Anyway, Brandon, did we survive that?

SPEAKER_01: 1:02:28

I think we did. I think we did. And look, we're looking forward to one more sound off before we take a holiday break. And so uh we'll see you on the next one.

SPEAKER_03: 1:02:36

Have a good one.