Why Dedicated Space Transforms Counseling Education And Student Wellbeing

We pull back the curtain on how space, funding, and proximity shape counseling education, arguing that dedicated, coherent homes make safer clinics and stronger clinicians. Humor lightens the load as we unpack real trade-offs, practical design, and why proximity is pedagogy.

• why scattered programs strain safety, supervision and morale
• what a dedicated counseling home includes and why it matters
• how funding models and “internal rent” distort priorities
• the link between proximity and emergency response
• cohort pathways, predictable schedules and faculty access
• culture-building through living room vibes and shared spaces
• confidentiality risks of sharing clinical work in common buildings
• competitive admissions, program identity and student belonging

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Transcript

Cold Open And Reset

SPEAKER_02 0:15

Let me ask you a question. Do you feel like Wait, wait, hold on, man. Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, man. Welcome to the cast, y'all. Oh, yeah, I guess. You know, it's been a week since we've seen y'all. It's because we, you know, we we we planned on We planned on having a cast. And uh we got on the cast about 20 minutes late, and then we just kind of messed around the whole time.

SPEAKER_01 0:38

And uh made no sense.

SPEAKER_02 0:41

Absolutely nothing that we talked about. Nothing was used at all. Absolutely nothing we talked about. So yeah, we s we we were like, you know what, let's just not put out a cast this week and let's start anew. Yeah, because it's our prerogative. Yeah, let's start new. This is our cast, this is our life, you know. Just deal with it. Yeah, bro, it's our prerogative, man. So anyway, uh we got a couple of things we want to talk about today. Not really. Uh we just kind of flying off the cuff. Uh but I got absolutely no list to but let me ask you a let me ask

Do We Use Our Resources Well

SPEAKER_02 1:10

you a question. Yeah, do you had a question? Okay. So go ahead, man. So so do you feel like your program uses the resources you have well? Yeah. You know when I feel like to be honest, man, I feel like we're a really good program that's besides that. No, no, that's had really good retention and really good enrollment. And I think we're seeing this like boom in students kind of flocking to our program. And and because of that, our cohorts are like threatening to go over the 25 student threshold, you know? Okay, but where but where does y'all but where does y'all's money come from though? What do you mean? Backdoor deals and No, I mean So so like so like our our program from the dominoes we play against the kinesiology department. Nah, nah, nah, nah. Okay, so so so and I could be wrong. From the spades game we play against the business department. Nah, man, is it okay. Is it is it is it is it tied to undergrad enrollment? Uh yeah, I guess you

Who Pays For Space

SPEAKER_02 2:18

would say it's kinda uh you know, I guess everything is kind of tied to undergrad enrollment, you know. Yeah, yeah. But how did y'all get the new building? How did y'all get like Well, it's not actually our building. Yeah, it's not actually our building. It's like the university's building, and we have to like pay for the rooms in the building. Which is weird because it's like we're kind of paying ourselves, you know. Um Yeah, and they're they're trying to figure that out, you know, but but you mean like y'all an independent program that pays the university to use university? No, no. It's almost like this building is an independent building and the university pays to f to to be housed, kind of like in the building. It's just a weird situation, man. And again, I just got here, but like, you know, let's say I want to reserve a room for December 1st and uh that's next door to my classroom, I would have to pay for that room. Like the program would have to pay for that room. That's interesting, man. Yeah, and so like you know, we we're we're in this like new um process where we're like re-evaluating. I mean the whole university is like reevaluating how we spend money and stuff like that, you know? And that was one of the things that came up where it was just like, well, why are we why are we I mean, we take money from our program to pay for a building, and that money goes back into the university and couldn't kind of gets like recycled to our program. Like, what's the point of kind of paying? Well, you know, where does the money go? Yeah, I just I wonder because like like it's like y'all's program's students' tuition is your program's money. Nah, no, it goes to the university. Okay, okay. Yeah, it goes to the university. Yeah, I just I just wonder how that works, you know, because it's like you know, there is like okay, from our students' perspective, we don't have a we don't have a place on campus. Oh, okay, yeah, yeah. You know what I mean? Like for for our for our students. It's you know, and it's like we're we're an established program, you know, like consistently good. Not only do we produce really good counselors, but we produce people who would then graduate, start private practices, heal, contribute to the you know, economy in Texas, you know, yada yada yada, right? And I'm talking immediately.

SPEAKER_03 4:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 4:53

You know, immediately.

SPEAKER_03 4:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 4:55

Um I mean ain't none of them gave back to the program. If somebody's out there listening, and you just want to start a scholarship. You know what I mean? Nah, bro, but but you ain't no big dog. Uh you graduate from. Well, yeah, but I I contribute through time. You know, it's like tithing. Yeah, no, the university don't need time. They pay you for time. But what your program needs is for you to start buying $2,000 coffee machines that come with his own generator and and hotbox. Leave my coffee out of it, bro. Yeah, yeah. Leave my coffee out of it, man. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Anyway, man. No, no, but but but but yeah, our I would say our students don't really and I think faculty, you know, like sometimes you just don't feel

The Cost Of Being Scattered

SPEAKER_02 5:50

like, you know, you have a place on campus, and it's really because it's like, dog, we're teaching, although we're teaching in the nursing building, we taught in the business building. We we we don't even teach in the building that our office is in. See, this is this is the thing that I think I'm gonna start uh we'll we should probably start the cast here, you know, but just because man, we're in like a weird financial situation when like talking about money or talking about like where we get money from, is like, I don't know, man, kind of like you know. Uh we got this dude that that just got hired to like fire a bunch of people called the Hatchet Man. You know? Like, Jesus, you know. Yeah, that's that's you know what I was talking about? You remember how we have to pay, how we have to like reserve the room and pay for the rooms? Well, they were like, Yeah, that's stupid. And who was in control of that? Oh, Ginny? Yeah, Ginny, you're fired. Like, that's what I'm talking about, you know. Ginny was just like, whoa, I got like a retirement plan and like a, you know, and they were like, nah, you're out. You know, so like even talking about this stuff is like, motherfuckers listening. Um but but but what I will say though is um yeah, what what I will say is I think I think it is I I think you have a different experience if you're in a program that has a house on campus. You know, like we have so we have this building, right? We have this building, and in the building is our is our faculty offices on the same floor, faculty offices, on the same floor our clinic, right? On the same floor, our our GA bullpen, which is like little cubicles where all of our GEs are. And on the same floor is our like kind of kitchen, you know, uh our break room, you know, on the same floor is like, you know, the playroom, all the all the you know, as our clinic, you know. So like we're all kind of housed in one place and in the same building is where we teach. You know, so you just pop downstairs and the classrooms are there. And also there's like this little resource library with these like, you know, seats. I I'm not sure that comfortable, but like these seats where like our students meet for uh staffing and meet for like if we have guest speakers, like it's kind of all in like one space. Yeah, you can do trainings in there, you know, you can do trainings in there, but also also just being on a university's campus, because this building is h houses everything, we have parking on this building, you know, in these buildings. So like you don't have to like park at some random parking lot and then like walk to the building, you know. You can just like park here and and pop in here, you know. So like there's something to say about, you know, you're always gonna run into a student or a faculty member at some point, you know, even just walking into the building, you know. And I think I think programs like y'all's where, you know, your office is in one building, you teach in one building, you know, you you're in a clinic in a clinic is in another building. Yeah, it's kind of like your program is kind of like spread out. You know. And there's a lot of communication you gotta do on the front end to be like, this is where we're meeting, and this is what we're doing, and this is you know we're gonna be in this. We don't we don't even have we don't when we do faculty meetings, we don't even we meet in in our program director's office. We don't even have a dedicated space. We don't have a dedicated space that would be helpful. Wow. You know? And and I

What A Dedicated Home Looks Like

SPEAKER_02 9:30

think the thing and part of it, part of it makes me feel like, man, do they understand what we're doing here? I don't know that the university truly understands what like counseling does. Counseling program does, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, and and I know our students feel that, man. And nobody nobody pitches a fit, man. But dog, we've had some times where students will walk in and I'm talking to you know our students, man. Look, if we're in if we're in a bar fight, uh we're in an alley, pick any one of my students. Anyone? I'll be back to back with them. Anyone. Anyone. Anyone, even the even the ones that look like they're about to break out in prayer. I would still, I would still trust them in a bar fight. In the name of the Father, the Son, Holy Spirit type stuff? Bruh, hey, bring Peter and Paul, because once they hit you, they will fall. I'm telling you. So we I do, man. I do, bro. I forsake you in the name of Jesus. Nah, bro, no, it even the first years, but especially the third years. Yeah, see. Those those internships. The first years are Maliwappers. They don't really know what's going on. They just know that they're doing brawl and they need to fight, you know. Yeah. Yeah, the third the ones going into practicum and the ones in internship. Oh, man. Oh, I mean, they I you know what I'd hear is, oh, I'm ready to die. No, I'm ready for this. No, I want this. That's what I hear. And that's what you want to hear. I'm not here. That's in third year. That's a third year. Crafted by me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, that that's who I want for the that's who I want, man. And and so, and so sometimes our students will walk, you know, walk on campus and I'll come in this building, man. You know, come in this building, and you'll have these like clean cut, you know, health scientist students being like, Can I help you?

SPEAKER_01 11:45

You know.

SPEAKER_02 11:47

Can I help? Can I help you? Like, do you know how many like I was a sniper in the military. Like, can I can I help you? Listen here, buddy boy. Yeah, it but so it's just, you know, and that look, that is not fussing. Yeah. Like that is not fussing. I'm just saying. I get it. I'm just saying. Yeah, daddy's not fussing. Yeah, I get it. There's a little bit of fuss in there. Yeah, come on now. At what point are we gonna go, hey, hey man, let's let's support the winning team. Come on. Let's give $3.2 million to build them a building and and and and reclaim. We're not even asking for that. Wow. We're not even asking for that. We just go buy some family homes and tear them down so we can build us a concept. Displace, displace family so we can have a good building. Let's reroute traffic in Belton on Main Street so we can build this account. That's all we ask you for. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Take money from schools so that we can have a good working meeting space. Yes, that's all we need. You know? That's all we need We need a place to play D D. That's what we need. And I'm just gonna say this is that there are places on campus that could be repurposed. That's not being used. We buildings, bro. Huh? We're buildings. Oh man, let's just say education could be happening. That's all I'm saying. No, I need names. No. No, I need names. Nah, but for but for real though, like it, you know, and it's been something and it it it it's a morale thing, you know, like because the students are not find yourself in the in the soccer outhouse. Yeah, who be trying to run out of the world. That's fine. No, that's fine, man. That's fine. It's just Doug, you it's just you know how dope it would be, man, if you had a building where you

Morale, Belonging, And Identity

SPEAKER_02 13:50

could teach in it, you can do your clinical work in it. Yeah, that's awesome. That's the building we're in right now. Uh yeah, you could also have dedicated meeting spaces, you could do trainings, not just for the students, but for the community. Yeah, but ethics CEUs. I feel like maybe this is maybe this is boring the hell out of our listeners, but like I feel like every counseling program needs its own dedicated space. No, no, no, no. And I also feel like No, let me let me no Okay, let me let you finish and then I'll come in and correct. No, and I and I feel like I feel like every counseling program is like, you know, bursting at the scene. Like everybody's I feel like everybody on a university's campus is fighting for space. Everybody feels like, no, no, we could use no if we had a building we made. No, we need 182 and 183 and 184 and 185. I don't understand. We have these contract workers come in and we need no, we need the thing and we need the we know we gotta show up. You know, I I it's just everybody needs space on a university's campus. You know, I don't even know how everybody fits you know in this thing. I I would I that that's one of the reasons why I I I would want to get into administration when I'm like a hundred years old. You know, I feel like I need like three decades to really understand the landscape of like how a university works. You know, legitimately how a university works. I mean, all the way down from like the paper cups that that are in the cafeteria all the way to like the you know, like what chairs go into like the meeting rooms, you know, like what like I just I don't feel like I have the prerequisite experience to be like, we just need this, and I don't understand why we can't get it. You know, because they're like, well, yeah, because we're tied up in a in a construction deal with the city ordinance that I need to do. For sure, for sure. I don't know, Brad. For sure, man. For sure. For sure. I'm just I'm just saying. I and I don't I don't think every I don't think every counseling department needs its own building. You know what I mean? I I really don't know. No, not just a building, but like its own space, you know? Yeah, okay. That's different. You know what I mean? Because it it it is there's like a so like, you know, we were when I was at ODU, we had an education building, you know, in the education building, there was there was these dedicated wings or spaces for different departments, you know. And it was like you look, your the counseling space is the third floor, you know, and it's like your office is here, the clinic is here, as well as your teaching spaces are here, you know. And Doc, there's something about like just having that ownership over your stuff that made students feel just a little bit more accepted, and you know what I mean? Like and you just kind of you're just new, you know, and like with your students, you know, I would imagine they have a sense of ownership. And and the thing is is that our students do as well, and they do feel a sense of like, you know, this is our program. Because I think that's important. Yeah, you know, I think that I think it's important for students to graduate with a sense of like, man, I like I made it through this program. Yeah. You know, I you know. I also think like it's gonna shift once we start our doc program. Like once we start our doc program, you know, the culture of the program is gonna change. And I think we're, you know, we're gonna we're gonna have like, we're gonna try to build an observation room, you know? Um kind of like we had when we was in Wyoming, you know. Uh where it's, you

Space, Safety, And Clinical Proximity

SPEAKER_02 17:40

know, it's just like I man, our program, the the dopest thing about our program is that it's like uh it has this kind of like living room type of vibe, you know, where like you know, you can you can come in and just kind of like hang out, you know, and I think we're gonna try to perpetuate that culture with like, you know, with with a space that's kind of conducive to that. See, that's that's what we want. Yeah, because it because it's like it's like built-in self-care. Yeah, it is. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah. The program's hard and you know, you'll be challenged and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But like, uh do you remember what it was like at UMHB at in the CLC? Yeah, the the the the house. Yeah, the house. It felt like a house. Like it felt like you when you went into practicum, especially when you were in internship, you legit felt like this is my house. Like this is this is my bathroom, so I gotta keep it clean. This is my living room, so I gotta keep it clean. This is I wanna be a I wanna be a I I want to be a part of CSI because I want to give back to the to the younger cohort. I want to make the program better. I want you know that keep it. This is my like the observation room was a place where you could really just like sit and chill for like hours. Hours. You can talk. But but I think but I think that's the thing that's really hard to explain to somebody who like doesn't know what it's like. But dog, some of our students, man, some of our students, they will have six sessions back to back at an internship site, they'll come to the COC. That in one session they'll have to decide whether or not to call CPS, another one they're dealing with the family after they do CPS. You know, and it it's tough stuff, you know what I mean? And then it's like, where you go after that?

SPEAKER_03 19:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 19:28

You know, like I Doc, I'll see nursing students in the nursing building until 10 o'clock at night, and they're just sitting around on whiteboards learning. You'll see PT, OT, DPT in here upstairs, uh learning with the with the whiteboards and the, you know, and it's like, and we have the clinic, but it's like the clinic is mad. I mean, we have like seven rooms and like 2,000 clients an hour. You know, it's like and then and then the students just go home. Yeah, so there's no place to just come back to the city. There's no what do you you know what I mean? Yeah. You know, and it's like, well, of course we can go to the nursing building. It's uh it's it it it's everybody's building. But it's like we're sharing confidential. Yeah. You know what I mean? It's like it's it's just one of the nursing programs, mobs, you know, one of the kids in nursing programs like something. Yeah, or or the or the sister of somebody who's in the in the OT program that we're working with the fit, you know, like come on, man. That's what y'all that's what y'all should do, bro. Y'all should be able to do that. And I'm not I'm not I'm not saying like y'all don't give us our own building. We're letting these secrets out. We're letting these secrets out. We are the eyes and ears of this community. We are letting these secrets out. Nah, it's just and it and I think it's just particularly hard, you know, when you have probably one of the most diverse programs on campus, but one of the most diverse student bodies, uh-huh, you know. And and it and it's not in your hurt, you heard I say. It's the truth. It's the truth. And it feels like and it feels like what does it feel like? Tell me what it feels like. If you can find a feeling on this feeling well, on this feeling.

SPEAKER_00 21:20

No, but for real. But for real.

SPEAKER_02 21:22

It just feels sad. I think you're in uh uh sadness. No, it just feels it feels a little dismissive. Like it feels like you're working. Irrelevance. Yeah. Not irrelevant. No irrelevant. No irrelevant. That's the right. If it feels like you're working twice as hard for half as much. Yeah. You know? Hold on, wait. Let me let me let me play the violin music. If you can find the smallest violin in the world, that'd be great. Yeah, no, yeah, yeah, yeah. Go ahead. No, so tell me about working twice as hard for half as much. Now listen, now listen. Let me just get it straight. What was your salary again? You see, because you know you said twice as hard for half as much. So I'm trying to figure out.

Satirical Ad: Coffee IV Drip

SPEAKER_01 22:12

This is not about payment and no, no, don't laugh. No, because no, you talking about the new building.

SPEAKER_02 22:28

Yeah. No, no, we're talking about money. No, but those two things are complete. No, we're talking about money. It's complete. No, because you over here talking about how fucking that's what I'm saying. I'm not saying me, I'm saying the students.

SPEAKER_01 22:52

Okay, let me get this.

SPEAKER_02 22:54

Uh-huh. No, what's your salary? Oh, I don't. Unhand me, good chair. You ruffian.

SPEAKER_00 23:11

You ruffian. You unhand me, you ruffian.

SPEAKER_02 23:17

I don't know. I don't see why. I don't see why that's the I don't see why that's the focus here. Come on, man. Hey, take a pickup for for for some more space. You see what I'm saying? What would that do? You know what that would do? That would trickle down to the to the king. Trickle down. To the cleaning staff that has to go in and clean the extra rooms. That would help out Miss Linda, who's working three down. So you're talking about the trickle down theory. Listen, man. Ms. Linda, Miss Linda gotta eat. You know? Like she can't and she got now, she gotta empty out three chair scans instead of instead of just yours in your office. You know, now we gotta get three maintenance people to handle the cappuccino machine that you and Dr.

Competition, Reputation, And Fit

SPEAKER_02 24:00

Noble.

SPEAKER_01 24:01

Yes, and we've earned it.

SPEAKER_02 24:04

Yes. No. No. Get yeah, get Miss Linda. Yeah. No, mate. See, when we start talking about real money, you start to get all squeamish. Always find a way. Be out with it. Well, what's your salary? Tell the people that you want to. How much money do you make? There's no reason. What's the monthly? What's your monthly payment? That's what I'm trying to figure out. There's no reason to bring up salaries. I don't understand. I don't understand why. Is it is it is this not public knowledge? Public knowledge. Yeah, if you if you're listening to this cap right now. Try to go look, go look, if it's public, go look at this stuff. See why they don't have a new building. See, yeah, your your salary cap is why you're getting scattered around all over the place.

SPEAKER_01 24:58

That's why.

SPEAKER_02 24:59

Yeah, we do be scattered, bro. Like chaff. Like chaff, bro, we tumbleweeds, man. Will we do a class outside in that corner? Alright, yeah. Uh-huh. No by the but behind the generator. But I won't be able to hear anything. Yeah, that's that's fine. Okay. Yeah, no. Nah, bruh. It's just take less money and get more space. You so you're telling me your your students need more space, and you're like, nah, but daddy needs to go golfing. So I do have a tea time today. But that's beyond the text. That's beside the point. That's what I'm saying, man. That's beside the point, man. No, let's be honest, JT. What? Let's be honest. About what? You don't really want to be able to do that. Because I don't understand what you're angle. No, it seems like what you're trying to say is. You're trying to put a puggy green in your office. That's what you're trying to do. But if if if if we needed a golf simulator in your office. Or if we needed a a what? If we needed a full sensory room where where there's holograms all over the wall, you know, for us to be able to take care of ourselves, then so be it. A fully immersive golf simulator. Well, actually, it's a fully immersive psychotherapy simulator. Yeah, that just happens to simulate. Yeah. Pebble beach. Pebble beach. Or who who who knows, whatever.

unknown 26:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:32

You know, or any local country club. Yeah. We'll be fine. It's not even like I'm asking for much. Really. When you think about it, it's more of an investment. No, but for real. I do wonder, I do wonder though, like, you know, because I you know, I don't really care. I I don't care if it's a new building, if it's an underground building, I don't care if there's a tunnel underneath anything, you know. But I do think it is important for students, and you know, and I know our listeners should probably feel this, especially if they're from a program where they do feel like the university. Our listeners didn't didn't look used to today. Your Your students don't your students don't care? U My students don't care because my students are privileged.

SPEAKER_00 27:25

Yeah, you see.

SPEAKER_02 27:27

They don't know. They don't know what it's like to have. They don't know what it's like. They don't know what it's like to be like, where's my professor's office? Bruh, bruh, I listen, I I went where's my clinical campus? Bruh I went to uh uh to I did a keynote speech for a university, man. No, what's in university? Huh? Say the name out loud. I bro, I don't even remember the name. Why? To be honest, to be honest, but I I went there. I think I started with an A, bruh. Yeah. And and uh Man, what I tell you, bruh, I was like, where are y'all? Yeah. Like where where is this place? What do you what do you mean

Pathways, Cohorts, And Program Design

SPEAKER_02 28:10

not all of your faculty members are officing around each other? Yeah. You know, like what do you mean y'all in four buildings? How can you keep track? How can you gatekeep for the community if you know, like, you know what I mean? It's like, what do you mean your clinic is on two seven streets over? Yeah. You know, like who's watching? That's how it is, man. I don't think, yeah, universities don't really understand how much proximity we need uh to each other to be able to ensure that we're doing good clinical work. You know, like if I'm teaching a class downstairs and there's an emergency in the clinic, somebody uh this happened like last year. Somebody would knock on the door and say, like, hey Dr. Austin, there's something going on in the clinic. I tell my class, y'all take take ten minutes, you know. I'd go upstairs, I'd figure out where the emergency was, you know, if I can help, cool. If if I can find somebody that can help, cool, then I'll pop back downstairs and teach my class. I can't imagine if I'm like halfway across campus, you know, they'd have to call my cell phone. And I'd if if I see my cell phone ringing, I'd have to pick up. I'd have to be like, hey, y'all, give me like what 30 minutes to get across campus to figure out what's going on, then to get back across. Yep. You know, like I I I I can't. I I couldn't imagine. You know And the thing is is that and the thing and again, I think it's more for the students than anything. Our students, but also students around our just in counseling programs that feel just like our you know, our students do. Because this isn't the first time we've heard this, you know, from from us or from a colleagues, you know, where you you feel like, you know, like, hey man, are we like do y'all just not want to talk about us? Like, you know, like what's what's going on, man? But I look, bruh. And I wouldn't even want a ribbon cutting. See, this is I wouldn't want a ceremony. See, this this part, this today is exactly what I'm glad y'all got to experience this. Because this is exactly what it's been like my whole life. This is what it's like playing FIFA with you and with Cairo. I I I'm trying to I'm trying to play. I'm trying to start the game and play. And y'all are fiddling with the the the team management. Y'all are trying to mess around with, oh, I got this one kid, I got Max Down when he's he's 15. But hey, we're gonna put the him here, and then we're gonna do this there, and then we're gonna do that there, and then we're gonna have this second wave come in at this time, and the 16 minutes gonna look like this, and we're gonna move him and we're gonna shift formations, and we're gonna do this, and we're gonna be high-pressed, we're gonna do a swing attack off the left side, and we're gonna have the keeper play with his feet, and we're gonna blah, and then we're gonna, we're gonna ta-ta-da, we're gonna ha-ta-ta. I just hit start and let's play, hello. He's the Harland is not actually the play. I'm controlling Harlem. Everybody's Harlem. Messi is not actually on the field. I'm Messi. I'm the I'm the red trigger. I'm Messi. Messi does what I don't want to know anybody. Messi's limits are my limits. Yeah, you're not actually playing. Golly. You know, I'm trying to talk about some real stuff that's been going on. What kind of real stuff? And you're talking about we just need more space in our building. If we got 13B, then we can move Felicia to 13A. Then we can move. What don't you care? It's the it's the truth. The programs were last retention. If they have to, it's the retention that's their show. That's funny. See, you you don't you don't care. You don't care because you don't care. I hope y'all made it to school. I hope y'all made it to school on time. Who's ever listening to this on their way to school right now? I hope y'all made it to school on time and y'all made it all the way through this this podcast. What do you mean, bruh? Your listeners. Your listeners don't no see, no, see, because your students are privileged. Let's just call it what it is, bruh. My students are extremely privileged, and and there should be no shame for that. They have a really healthy faculty in a in a building that's their own with uh on campus clinic that sees community members and and staff and students. Now, n does that does that trickle down though? Like to do you feel like you have undergrad students? Uh I don't think we have undergrad students because we also have I mean we have some undergrad students for sure, but you gotta understand we also have uh university counseling center

Ownership, Culture, And Student Growth

SPEAKER_02 33:00

on campus too. No, we do we do too, but I'm just saying, like, do y'all do you feel like there's an undergrad student now that comes to campus and and is studying psychology or social work or sociology or criminal justice, you know. And they they want to get into counseling and they see that there is a counseling building. Yeah You know, and it and it makes them and it makes them want to Well we do we do like our graduate assistants do outreach in on campus, so like they have like stuff, but like but our program is competitive, you know, like we have people from all around literally the world trying to get into our program. You know, so like you you know you can't just expect to go to like St. Leo and then Turlin's, you know, and then like UL and then I get into the graduate program and I graduate, you know, like it's you know we had almost hundreds of applicants, you know, for the last for the for the newest cohort, you know. I feel like it's becoming more competitive every every semester where we have new students coming in. Like when students apply to the program, bro, we're getting 90 to 100 applicants every every time. You know, it's a hard order. So let me ask you a question. If you would just allow me to cut into the episode just for a little bit, I think I'll I think I have a product that you guys may actually use. It's something that me and Jude's been working on for a really long time, and we feel like you know it's finally at a place where we can we can promote it on the cast. It's called the Clinician's Coffee IV Drip. It's the only medically questionable, FDA ignored caffeine delivery system designed exclusively for our listeners, the mental health professionals who really, really need it. You know, the ones who's hanging on by an absolute licorice thread. Now, do you have back-to-back sessions? Maybe even triple back-to-back sessions, you know, one of those days where you forget to pee, you hadn't blinked, and you don't even remember your own name. Well, good news. We've created a wearable. Now, this is a wearable, so it's extremely convenient. It's a wearable IV that pumps pure, uncut, unadulterated caffeine straight into your bloodstream, straight into the bloodstream, like the unethical coping scale. It is all right. Now, listen, there's two really important modes here, all right, that I really think you should pay attention to. Alright, we have mode one, it's called burnout prevention. Alright, this is a slow drip that keeps you awake, alert, and just disassociated enough to survive that client who wants to process every single childhood memory in real time. Alright? And then for some of the more adventurous people, this is Jude's particular favorite. We have mode two. It's called Supervision Afternoon Delight. It's a high pressure blast of espresso that hits harder than that first time you had kind of transference in session. And for those of you doing couples work, we didn't forget about you, we have a patented couple session turbo shot. Now, this one activates automatically the moment two adults start arguing like siblings in your office. I mean, you feel that double dose hit your system so fast your pancreas will file a complaint. Now, listen, there's just slight, I wouldn't even call them slight. I mean, it's barely even noticeable side effects here. Okay. Only a couple people in our clinical trials have experienced this, so I don't even feel like I should mention it. But Jude said that it may be important for you guys to know about the side effects. So it's just really three. It's you know heart palpitations, but don't worry about that. It's just it's small, all right. Just a little bit of heart palpitations. Some people in the trial said that they felt like their heart was going to explode, but that was just maybe one or two or five or six people, right? Uh the next thing is something called mud butt.

Closing Riff And Sign Off

SPEAKER_02 37:40

Uh, I you know, I didn't experience it, but some people in the clinical trials mentioned that it I can give you verbatim on what they said, it just felt swampy down there. I so you know, you take that for what it what it is. Um, and the last one, this is this is particularly important. Um Jude said that he exclusively felt that. Um he said that let me see what he says. I gotta read this. Let me put my glasses on. Uh he described it as spiritual detachment. Um, he made sure to say that it's not nihilism, but you know, he just don't know Jesus. So that you know, he just we lost him for a minute, you know. I think that was when he was transitioning to the turbo shot. Listen, I don't know. Um, but listen, for you special listeners out there, you can use the code TWINTHIS for 10% off uh your first drip bag, you know. Uh you can go to our non-existent website and you know get as much as you want. Uh because our our friends here at the Twin Therapist, we really, we really care for y'all. So, alright. Uh yeah, back to the show. Question, would y'all do that? Would that be the case if your program wasn't good, but still in the same university? No, I think if our program was not good, we wouldn't be getting these advocates. But you know why? Because because it's it's competitive. We have us, we have McNeese, we have Southeastern, we have Nichols, we have uh UNO, um, we have LSU, we have UL Monroe, um, we have uh Yeah, but but also but also you work at like a big university. The biggest, yeah. Yeah. Wait, what? The biggest in the state of Louisiana, yeah. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. And so there's we in the south. It hurts, it hurts, huh? It does.

unknown 39:48

It hurts.

SPEAKER_02 39:49

No, but for but for real, because I do feel like there's some programs out there that's just, you know. And the students don't know. Students don't know. Students have no idea. I I bet there's some programs that's like, man, enrollment is like down. Like, I don't, you know, we need to. What do we, you know, we just you know, we just don't have that problem. Yeah, because I I'll have some students, dog, who will they'll they'll they're using our books in their class. Oh yeah. Right? Using their books in our class. And they they have to do this assignment, you know, where they have to like come and find a professional in the area, right? And so they come, they they they will email me or call me. You know, this happens probably like these are graduates. Oh graduates, okay. Yeah, in other graduate programs around. Yeah. You know, and they'll have uh I I'm talking like 10 students a semester. You know, will give me a call and wanna eat want to interview me, you know, for for the for the project. It's like um it's almost like every program has the same project, you know? And they'll be using my books. Yeah. You know, and uh yours too, I guess. If no, I I caught that, but you know, whatever. Yeah. Uh and and and and they'll be like, I didn't know you taught. Well, I didn't know it was right. You know, and it's like, well, how how did you not know? Well, because students don't choose programs based on really how good they are sometimes. No, I know, and there's no way really to know. Yeah, I think students choose programs where like I'm living in life yet, or I'm gonna go to this is this is this is the program that's right there, and it's gonna it's gonna be bad. And so I talked to them, and they're just like, dang, man, I I'm already halfway through this program. I wish I would have known about you know, and it's like, well You wouldn't have made it anyway, but you know Nah man, nah nah nah. If you're in that program, you wouldn't have made it over here, but you know, Nah, but I think but it I feel like there needs to be a way keep dreaming, loser. Nah, but there needs to be a way for for us for for students to be able to know if a program is good or not. Yeah. You know what I mean? Because like you know, if if and and you can you don't have to answer this question, but do you feel like your program is the is the b one of the best programs in the area? Like if students have five programs to choose from, would you would would you say that your program and try to be unbiased. Would you would you say your program is the I am unbiased. This is a statistical fact. Yes, it it is. And I know that because, you know, we get rarely, I would say ever, do we get a student that leaves our program for another program because they're like, it just wasn't. Do students leave their program for your program? Well, not 100% up to the students. We've had students from almost every every graduate program. There's one in particular where they, you know, they're like uh what's the name? What's the name? I can't I can't do that, man. I can't do that. But I can I can't do that. Let the people know. Look, if you don't tell them, they're gonna be late for school. The listeners are gonna be late for school. I can't do that. They won't have a good day at school. I can't do that. I can't do that. I can't do that. Come on, man. Say it in Spanish, bro. In Spanish? Uh yeah. Come on, said you say uh cowboys.

SPEAKER_01 43:28

Nah I can't, I can't no I can't I can't do that, man. I can't. I can't I can't, man.

SPEAKER_02 43:50

No, but for but for but for uh uh uh curve. Uh you I how you say how you say curve? Uh that's funny, bro. Nah, yeah. Let me just name them all nickel Nickel State uh being in Monroe. Uh we're better than everyone. No, but for but for but for real, but for real. No, honestly, man, there's I think every program is is good in their own right, you know. For sure. Like I just feel like depends on what you want to l what you what you want. No, but but honestly, I mean I think our program I think we are s kind of like centrally located. You know, so I think our program is like a lot, has a has a yeah, we're a good program, we have good family. But I I also think our location plays a huge role in students' ability to like maybe live in a place where a program doesn't offer them the same thing our program will offer them. It's still a good program, but they may not offer the same thing. You know, like I don't think there's any program in the in our um in our state that offers a business of counseling class where you get to learn how to like you know the ins and outs of the business for sure. So like if you want to if you want to be more of a business-minded clinician, then like you'll choose our program. Uh if you're living in like, you know, I don't know, Lake Charles, or you're living in uh Baton Rouge or you're living in, you know, Mandaville or Science. Wherever, you know, like UL may be a good a good place for you, you know. Um but but you know, but also if you're living up in Hammond, you know, and you're like, uh yeah, I would love to take like a business of counseling class, but also like this program in South Eastern is like damn good. So like I'm gonna go here, you know. Yeah, for sure. For sure. For sure. Uh for sure. And and yeah, so you know, I yeah, bruh, yeah, uh yeah. But but I I do think that there is something said to have uh one of the other programs I um one of the other programs uh uh I had the the pleasure of like teaching in was Southeastern's program. And they also have like a very unique uh uh setup to where you know the the the classes are in the same building as all the professors' offices. So like it's all like one unique kind of like you know, place where you know there's a coffee shop across the street. You know, it's just like um you know, it's just they just have like a really good setup, you know, to where like it's set up for like this kind of small um you know uh living room type of thing. Yeah, like like professional, professional clinic, like just you know, but also really homey. I mean it's like set up for counselors to be successful. And and you know what? You know, like they kind of all come from this cut from the same cloth, you know. It's like uh yeah, you know, yeah. But like, you know, other universities, like the one we got into for our PhD program, but didn't go, I'm not gonna name the the university, but like they kind of described it as like like a spider web's nest of classes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Why do I know which classes are offered in the city? But even that, even that that's what I'm saying, even that university, like when we went there, it's like, dog, where do we go to class? Like, what do you mean we go to class in that building over there? And then I now I gotta go find the faculty and y'all's offices are all scattered around. Like I don't even know. Yeah, I know. I think I think a telltale sign of a really good program is this is your pathway through the program. Yep. No matter if you come in in the spring or the fall, this is your pathway. Yeah. These are the these are your courses. These are your instructors. These are your instructors. These are the only professors you'll see here. These are the people you gotta get to know. Their offices are all located in this one building, the clinic is located all in this one building, and all your classes will be in this one building. You may have like a random research class that's like on campus, but you're gonna go with your whole cohort, and usually people jump in all in like one car to go, you know. Um and that's it. Like this thing, that's all you gotta worry about, you know. Um, I think those programs are like, I think those programs for me at least are the programs where I'm like, oh, yeah, I'm gonna go there. Yeah, I wanna I want to to go there, you know. And then when you're in it, you know, you feel, you know, like, oh yeah, this is my program. I got a student. Give me one second. But yeah, you and you feel you kind of have this feeling of like like this is this is my place. You know, if something goes wrong, this is where I go. This is where I go. Yeah, I know that if if Hi Johnson's not in his office, then Dr. Swanson's gonna be in the office. Yeah, yeah. We're gonna wrap up, but was even man, there's some programs where even though the faculty and the clinic are all in one building, sometimes the faculty ain't there. Ain't there? Yeah, doors, and it's like, bro, where is everybody? Bruh. Like, seriously, where is it's a ghost town. Yeah. Or or it's so clinical that it doesn't feel like you can be yourself. I can just pop into to you know to a professor's office and be like, hey, can you put on my video from from last week? There's something I'm gonna do with the 23 minute mark. You gotta you gotta be a big thing. There's a big TV screen, and you can invite you, three other friends, you know, that's in the community that's in the program. Yeah. And you can watch a session. I mean, if we get an observation room, I guess when we get an observation room and our program, that's where I'm hanging out. If then if students want to find me, I'm in an observation room. I mean, honestly, dog, our doc program was something else. Yeah. But one of the dopest things was that this is your building. This is where your faculty offices are. Okay, it felt like a home away from home. Once you got into the classes, these are where your classrooms are, and it's all set up for y'all to be successful. And then here's your clinic. I think. You know, and in the clinic, here's your space. Students make it. Remember? Man, we had a space for to do notes, we had a nut, we had a little kitchen. I mean, it was just and it was ours. Yeah. You know, and and you just I'm just saying, you're paying a lot of money, it's a big experience. You know, you're look, I'm not look, I I don't think it's a secret, you know. It's like if you put up our program compared to any other program on campus, and I think this goes for all continent programs, our students grow the most emotionally. Yeah. Our students are going through it. Well, yeah. I mean, I think our students are going through it. My thing is, I think I think continent programs in general, like, you know, like Megnee. You know, McNeese has a has a pretty good program where where students grow. Um, you know, students grow. Yeah. And you know, same thing with Southeastern, same thing with us. You know, but I think Yeah, same same Tarleton, same thing with with whatever. Whoever's I think the difference is, maybe not the difference, but I think one of the things that students really want is like a place to like a place to like call home, Essentially. That's what I'm saying. Yeah, man. Like, you know, you drive by campus and you're like, that was the building that I did. Yeah, that I that I developed and that was the place that forged. I tell my students all the time about the COC and how it was like a hundred-year-old house, and you can hear the creaks of wood and the or just even if you think about stuff like this, like you think about you're teaching a class where you're teaching graduate students this class, while at the same time the clinic is humming, while at the same time your doctoral students are doing a relationship training for community members. And another doc student is doing going on. Yeah. And it's just and and you know what I mean? Come on, come on, man. Come on. We're not just we're not just we're not just teaching students in grading assignments. Yeah. Like you know, like uh our students, our program, not just. Look at him begging, look at look, look he begging, look, look. No, but not just I I'm talking all counseling programs. If you're in a building, you know. If you're in a building. Please give me a building. Please. But again, again, I'm not saying I'll take an old metal building. I'll take a building. Build a old look, build an old our house in the back. Build an old our house in the back and put some put some some um some one of those AC units in the back. Yeah, man. Oh, yeah. I don't I'm talking AC that drip in there and matter of fact, look, go buy a couple houses in the neighborhood adjacent to and just put some DC. Just put some old drywall up in between those houses and put us a little brainwashed by the university, bro. It always leads to displacement. It always connect them all with a little tunnel. You know, you have to have AC in the tunnel. I just look I just want to kick families out and buy home in this game. Do whatever you gotta do, I'm just saying, bro. Anyway, man. All right, bro. All right, man. Yeah, we gotta put a cast out. So I guess this is it. So I hope you I hope y'all made it to school because this is I just want y'all to know this is not what I want to talk about. You tripping, man. This is not tricky. This just needed to be said. I did not want to see this is manager mode. I did not want to talk about it. No, this needed to be said. I did not want to talk about it. I'm not and look, I'm not just talking. Look, that ain't not fussing. I'm not just talking about me. I'm talking K crap. I'm talking, I'm I'm accreditation. Listen, I'm so sorry. We need to get somebody on it. Listen, write right, you can write us in, you can write in at the twin therapist at gmail.com and let's let him know how boring this is. What is this monopoly? What are we talking about? What are we talking about? I can't I cannot be the only counselor. I can't be the only counselor educated that. Uh suffering, taking grenades right now. We're talking about machine needs its own shelf and I've been going like that. Nah, bro, I beat 'cause you've been to those programs where you looked around and you were just like, what are we doing here?

SPEAKER_01 54:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 54:59

It's just look, if you're listening and you're looking around and your faculty is scattered, and y'all teaching in some program where there's some shelves of Yeah, there's some shelves of some hydrochloride, whatever, behind you, and you're just like, what are we doing in classes with Bunsen burners? Like, you know what I mean? And it's like it's like, hey, why are we taking research class in in in the gym? Hey, to be fair, when I taught at when I taught at Southeastern, Southeastern had this classroom that was adjacent to this kitchen. And sometimes when I taught group class, I teach like the lecture portion in the in the classroom. And then we go to like we move to the kitchen to do group class. It was the it was the one of the best classrooms because it was like you're just like literally in like a kitchen, in a in an open kitchen. For sure. For sure. For sure. Come on, bro. You can't tell me some scheduler. You cannot tell me some scheduler was like, okay, let's put the, let's put the sociologist and the thing and the biologist and where do you want to put the counselors? That's what you're doing. Put them in the kitchen. That's your job, bro. That's that's that's that's what you're gonna be. You're gonna be part of uh uh uh economic uh no sp spatial development. Uh you're gonna be a part of the the ball, you're gonna be the key master. No, I was on one of those committees. I was chairing one of those committees. And they were like, what are we doing here? Come on, man. Again, that did not fuss. Again, this is the most boring cast I've ever I I ever I hated every second of it. No, you talk about you always want to talk about like your feelings and stuff. Um this is a real Is it the issues, huh? The issues, bruh. And and I'm t I am telling you there's people out there that's gonna go, yeah, you know? I'm telling you, man. It's not it's not the lady driving her kids to school. The lady driving her kids to school is like, uh she's gonna appreciate this. I know she will. It's not my students who are like, yeah, I'm not even counting this as an indirect hour. What do we gotta say? What do we gotta say? Counseling? Counseling, theory, fraud. Care for yourself. There you go. Yeah. So indirect, kind of. Anyway, I gotta go do my job, man. Yeah, man. I gotta go warm up my computer in the classroom. Uh my I don't teach until one o'clock, but you gotta warm it up sometime. You know why? Probably because you're teaching in some war-torn battlefield across campus. That's probably why. Hey, baby. I know, I know, I know you're able used. Hey, my hey, sweet thing. Hey, mom. You gotta put a cigarette lighter up on the luminant on the light. Hey, hey, sweet thing. You gonna you gonna work for daddy today? Come on, bruh. Hey, come on. What would I what what buttons do I have to press? How can I work? I can't even zoom people in the city. What you need for me today, huh? I promise you, I'm not gonna click all because when I open when the computer starts, I'll be clicking. I be Google, PowerPoint. The computer's like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

SPEAKER_00 58:19

Wait. Let me start up for this guy. Hold on. Hold on. I got a lot of CPUs to be running on. Give me a second. You're trying to open up Canvas and Google and Gamma and what? Sir. Sir. Unhand, you ruffian, sir, you ruffian.

SPEAKER_02 58:59

Later, man.