S3 Episode 16: The Energy Crisis Inside Our Children: Mitochondria, Behaviour and Healing with Kelsey Spanbauer

Welcome to My Mighty Quinn

In this powerful episode, I’m joined by Kelsey Spanbauer — midwife, cellular healing expert, and founder of Engedi Wellness Centre.

Kelsey’s work sits at the intersection of biology, environment and parental intuition — helping families understand what is truly happening beneath the surface of chronic childhood conditions.

Together, we explore a concept that changes everything: That beneath many of today’s rising childhood challenges — anxiety, autism, ADHD and autoimmune illness — lies something far more fundamental.

An energy crisis inside the body’s cells. 

This conversation takes us deeper than protocols, deeper than symptom management — into the role of mitochondria, cellular safety, and the signals that determine whether a child’s body moves toward healing or survival.

It is both confronting and deeply hopeful, because when we understand how the body truly works, we stop fighting it — and start working with it.

Key takeaways

• Why many childhood conditions may stem from a cellular energy crisis — not isolated symptoms 
• What mitochondria really do — and how they influence behaviour, immunity and development 
• The concept of the cell danger response and how it keeps children stuck in chronic illness 
• Why conventional and even holistic treatments can fail if cellular energy isn’t restored first 
• How modern environments (light, EMF, water, stress) are directly impacting children’s biology 
• Why healing must follow a specific biological sequence, not a scattergun approach 
• The powerful role of the parent in regulating and guiding healing 
• How small, foundational changes at home can shift a child’s trajectory 
• Why resilience — not symptom suppression — is the true marker of healing 

This episode is about asking a different question.

Not what is wrong with my child?
But what is their body trying to tell me?

Because our children are responding — intelligently, biologically — to the environments, stressors and signals around them.

And when we change those signals, we change the outcome.

Resources

Free Guide

Kelsey's Website

Transcript

Lucia Silver (00:01)
Hello, my name is Lucia Silva and I'm founder of the Brain Health Movement and you are listening to my mighty Quinn. There is something happening inside our children that we are only just beginning to understand. Across the world we are seeing rising rates of anxiety, autism, autoimmune illness, attention disorders, inflammatory brain conditions and chronic health struggles in children.

and many researchers and clinicians now believe that beneath many of these conditions lies something surprisingly simple, an energy crisis inside the body's cells. Today's episode is called The Energy Crisis Inside Our Children, Mitochondria, Behaviour and Healing.

Welcome back to My Mighty Quinn. This podcast and the work we do at the Brain Health Movement exists to help parents understand the root causes of their children's learning, attention, behavior and health challenges. Because when we understand the biology beneath the symptoms, everything changes. Over the years on My Mighty Quinn, we've explored many pieces of that puzzle. The nervous system, the immune system, gut health, trauma, environmental toxins and developmental neurology and more.

But beneath all of those systems sits something even more fundamental that I have been discovering, and this is energy. The energy that powers every process in the body and the tiny structures inside our cells responsible for producing that energy, the mitochondria. Today's conversation is the first time on My Mighty Quinn that we are diving deeply into mitochondrial and cellular medicine.

because if the body does not have the energy to heal, repair, detoxify, regulate inflammation, then almost every other intervention we try will eventually hit a wall. And that is why today's guest is so important. I'm joined by Kelsey Spanbauar, a midwife, master herbalist, cellular healing and detox expert, and founder of NJEDI Wellness Centre.

Kelsey has spent years working with families navigating complex childhood conditions from autism and PANS-PANDAS to autoimmune illnesses, seizures and profound neurological inflammation. Her work focuses on precisely this, on understanding how cellular energy and mitochondrial signalling shape whether a child's body moves toward healing or toward chronic inflammation. Kelsey is also a mother.

who knows what it feels like to watch a child slip away and what it takes to bring them back. And it's one of the reasons I wanted to bring her voice to you today, because the work she's doing sits at a fascinating intersection between biology, environment, and parental intuition. Welcome, Kelsey. I'm so happy to have you.

Kelsey Spanbauer (03:00)
I'm so happy to be here. I'm so excited. I love this topic.

Lucia Silver (03:06)
I kind of wanted to share with everybody that before we even press record for this conversation, Kelsey and I had already been catching up in stolen pockets of time across our pretty much eight hour time difference. Me standing on a pitch dark football field in blustering rain while Quinn trains phone balanced in one freezing hand and Kelsey fresh from delivering a new-born baby holding that sacred threshold between worlds. And we've met knee to knee, woman to woman, mother to mother.

not because it's convenient, but because what we are witnessing demands a different kind of presence. We have to show up differently because what we are facing now is different. Children today are not presenting with the same challenges we saw 20 or even 10 years ago. The burden on their bodies, brains and cells is unprecedented. And yet the dominant medical responses, especially for children, have barely evolved. The conversation is not about rejecting medicine today.

but it is about ending default compliance as Kelsey has shone the light on for me. It's about curiosity, it's about education, it's about reclaiming our role as informed, confident advocates for our children because the cost of staying silent is now too high. So I am genuinely so excited and honoured to have Kelsey with us today.

And Kelsey, I would love to start. I mean, I could talk to you for days and there is so much I want to just.

take out of that incredible brain of yours and bring to our listeners. But we're going to take it in chunk size pieces. And I would love to just warm up really with the origin of this before we go anywhere kind of scientific. I'd love you to share how you came to this work because you've been a midwife, you've walked families through birth and early life. What was the moment you realized that symptom based care was never going to be enough for the children that you were seeing?

Kelsey Spanbauer (05:05)
Yeah, you know, that was really early on. So I've been in private practice since I was 20. I started really, really young, really early and early in my career as a midwife, I practiced out of the hospital, but we would occasionally end up in the hospital for a complication that merited being there or parents who possibly changed their mind and had decided they wanted pain relief or something like that. And the way they treated the parents

and the child in the hospital was just mind blowing. It's like you would see them take a symptom and try to attack it and make that symptom go away, but they never asked why. Why is that happening? Why is this happening now? Why is this baby doing this? Like I can tell you, I've seen new-borns taken from their mother's arms who were perfectly fine. And then they start kind of they start breathing too rapidly.

And so then they treat them for respiratory distress, but they were anxious. You know, instead of asking, why is this baby doing this? Like, is there an infection? Does this baby actually have respiratory distress? They just treat it like to silence the symptom, but the baby's actually saying, wait, put me back with my mother. You know, and that's just one example that might seem a little bit silly, but when in private practice, you start working with kids and little things start coming up, right? Like even

Let's not even talk about sick kids right now, just really healthy babies. The more parents ask, why is this happening? And follow their curiosity instead of just trying to silence. Like if a symptom is a signal and we put it out before we figure out what it means and what the body needs, we just don't get anywhere. So I feel really fortunate in having learned that from watching intuitive, strong, beautiful, strong-willed mothers.

Lucia Silver (07:02)
And do you think it came to you, by virtue of just seeing it happen so many times and the outcome not being successful? I mean, you're delivering these children and you're watching this happen and you're watching to a certain extent power just being removed from a mother. I mean, that's kind of what you're doing when you take a child away and you give it some medication, right?

Kelsey Spanbauer (07:22)
Yeah, and I think, you know, the home birth space, our goal as midwives is to keep all the power with the parents, right? Which is how it's supposed to be. Having a baby is a very intuitive, very natural, very, very, very empowering, beautiful healing experience if you're in a safe space. But the minute someone comes in and tells you that they need to tell you how to do it, you disconnect from your instinct because you stop.

understanding what your body is telling you because you're looking outside yourself. You're looking to somebody else. And I'm not saying there was never a moment for that because there are times when we were not meant to be alone either. Right. Obviously, or midwifery wouldn't matter. We would just birth our babies alone in the woods. But with a safe midwife in a safe space, you're listening to your own body and then communicating this is what I'm feeling. What does that mean? What do I need? Then moving forward together.

versus in, if we're comparing this, right, even to paediatric care and the full conventional model, it's, this is what your body's doing, this is what it needs to do, and someone from the outside coming in and telling you, okay, you're ready to push, but maybe you're really not, and you don't feel that way at all. That's a completely different experience than your body just instinctively pushing. I mean, when you leave a woman alone, it's like throwing up out your butt. Like, it just happens to you 99 % of the time.

And that experience, you tell them I'm pushing now versus someone coming in saying, okay, your 10 centimetres dilated, let me teach you how to push. And then of course they don't do it right. And then it takes too long and then their pelvis is too small. And then their baby is too stressed. And then there's too much bleeding. It just kind of transforms into this.

slowly slowly eking more and more power, more and more connection, more and more autonomy out. And then that's just the birth, right? That turns into a total train wreck. And then you have, now you have this baby and this mom who's been stripped of everything she thought she knew about her body. And now what does she do? She doesn't look within to say, this is what my baby is saying. This is what my baby needs. She's looking to someone.

in a white coat, does that mean, are they hungry? Am I feeding them right? Are they eating enough? Like, is this normal? And then we send them home. And what do you expect when things start to go sideways? These are to have anxiety or they start to have symptoms. They're not curious, they're scared. And instead of being grounded and understanding this is what triggered this or this is what's going on with my child, they immediately look to someone else. And unfortunately, the first thing that happens

90 % of the time, unless you're remarkably lucky, is that someone else tries to silence that signal before that curiosity can ever happen. And now we're silencing alarms for years and years and years and years. No wonder all of a sudden we get a eruption of symptoms, so to speak, later on.

Lucia Silver (10:28)
Yeah, when you describe it that way, it really makes my insides turn cold because it really is. You're at your most vulnerable when it's happening as well. So you're know, you're you're powerful in that you're a mother giving birth. But at the same time, you're you're you're at your most vulnerable. And if it's the first child you've ever had, you don't know. And you're not able to just get up from the bed and say, hey, give my baby back or hey, I don't want antibiotics at this point or whatever it is that your position is, whatever your voice is, it is your most vulnerable moment.

And then as you say, you're already into an escalating situation where your child also, not just you as a mother, your child also has begun ⁓ a journey of lack of co-regulation because they're not then with you. So the child is then detached, the child is then, you know, maybe the gut microbiome is already on a funny journey because you've been given as Quinn was antibiotics from the get go. And so it's like, as you say, when we,

silence those symptoms. That's like the canary in the gold in the coal mine again, isn't it? That's like those symptoms were supposed to show us something and instead we just kept going deferring to the white coat and handing the pill, you know, somehow. yeah, it's hearing you say it as a midwife really crystallizes just how pivotal that moment really is for the rest of the journey.

Kelsey Spanbauer (11:42)
Yeah.

When you think about biology, mothers becoming mothers for the first time, they're being born too. And this is the experience, the way they navigate their pregnancy, the way they're treated in their pregnancy, the way they navigate their birth and the moments afterward is what shapes the way they mother their children. It's what builds or breaks down their confidence. And so when we have, you know, it's different in every country.

but generally around only 4 % of women estimated to be birthing in a safe environment, the way that I would define safe. I'll take responsibility for that statistic, right? But then what are we doing to the confidence in our mothers? And the moments of birth and the moments after are the most impactful to our biology and to our how we develop. And as moments go on, they become less and less impactful.

But the level, when we're gonna talk about mitochondria, we're gonna talk about signals and safety, The experience that our cells have, that our biology has of perceived or actual safety, completely changes the way our mitochondria behave, which completely changes the way that we develop. And so when we have mother who isn't perceiving confidence or safety, right? She's perceiving.

vulnerability and helplessness. And then we have this baby being taken away. Their only biological ability to say, is wrong, I need connection, is they breathe rapidly, they cry, they squirm around, they get rapid heart rate. And instead of that being interpreted as, okay, what does this baby need? Bring them back to safety, which is what their biology, that's all they need.

it's interpreted as all these other things. And obviously that's like a very broken down. There's so much nuance to new-born care. I'm not trying to oversimplify it. Like there are times when kiddos need help breathing just because they need help breathing. I've done that hundreds of times. That's not what I'm talking about. But I think it feels clear, right? What I'm saying.

Lucia Silver (14:01)
It feels absolutely

clear and I think it's the broad foundation and context for our conversation. This is a little bit about where life begins, where mum begins, the beginning of that journey. ⁓ I think we should move to talking a little bit about what changes are happening in children from your perspective. You've worked with families now for many years and what do you feel you're seeing in children today that feels fundamentally different compared to say five, 10 years ago?

Kelsey Spanbauer (14:28)
So much. You know, I'll say in the midwifery community, there's a lot of chatter. Why are things so much harder? Why are babies in more distress? Why are women so unwell? Why are babies so unwell? So there is this broad arching. Everything is different than it was. ⁓ And that could be a whole other podcast on like maybe what those things are. But when I look at older children and

you know them coming into clinic and coming and going. The thing that really strikes me is they're not playful. They're not curious. They're like withdrawn. They're kind of in their own little world. They're not engaging normally with their parents or the way that I saw them even six, seven years ago.

It feels like they are trying to survive instead of just enjoying their life. It feels like they're trying so hard to just be okay and cope with transitions. It shouldn't be that way.

Lucia Silver (15:27)
Yeah,

you've talked to me about their difficulties adapting and that they're easily thrown over the edge into dysregulation. I think that's something that you see quite a lot in your clinic, isn't it, with parents seemingly not able to help them or redirect them.

Kelsey Spanbauer (15:41)
Yeah, and I think that comes back to the original issue too, is parents are just so absolutely overwhelmed that when their child is thrown into dysregulation, whether it's from a busy schedule or sickness, it seems like this is also very different. Children get a common cold and then they have crazy anxiety or their ADHD gets terrible. ADHD isn't normal either, by the way. And all these symptoms start to come up that persist.

for months and months and months and months. And that's not normal, that's not common, that's definitely more than it was 10 years ago. So is mast cell activation. I see a lot more of that, so much more of that than I ever did before. And I think, you know, these kids don't tolerate any level of stress. It's like one tiny drop just puts them over the edge and now they're having symptoms, which should not be the case. Our children should be

the most resilient among us.

Lucia Silver (16:40)
And I think this will make so much more sense as we move into talking about mitochondrial health, but just that we sort of skirted past it. But I think for both you and I in our mission to serve families, we're looking at mum and dad and the whole family ecosystem, not just the child. And that when we're talking about this overwhelm and we're talking about immune systems going crazy and everything feeling too much and only just coping.

we often see that reflected in the parents as well as the children in the whole family. So this is not just this conversation, although we're all about paediatric care here and whole child healing. This is a family story. And I always want to just reemphasize that because I don't think we can go anywhere with healing our children if we don't first address ourself. And I know that's a big piece for you and me, Kelsey, and our stories with our own children, starting with ourselves. So every time we say,

kids in this conversation, just include yourself, mummers, if you're listening or dads, because it's a really important piece, isn't it, Kelsey?

Kelsey Spanbauer (17:42)
It is and you know, we in in my clinic, like if someone were to seek one on one care with us, we generally treat the whole family or at least the mom and the child. So if we're working with autism, pandas pans, anything complex, mom comes in too. And we would like to say it's not optional, but generally speaking, moms are like, please, like help my brain. Like I need my brain back. And so

Lucia Silver (18:06)
Help me.

Kelsey Spanbauer (18:11)
It's really beautiful because I'll be on a call with a child in one of our rooms and then an hour later I'll hear the mom on a call crying, you know, getting left on and getting care in another one of our rooms. And it really is the way that it has to be. You know, like you could have the most profoundly intelligent, brilliant, helpful clinician team in the world. If you

Do not regulate your nervous system. And if mom does not get on board, if we cannot bring the tools that the mitochondria need into the home, doesn't matter how amazing your whole team of doctors is, you're not gonna get anywhere. It has to come into the home. And with the way that the world is, it usually comes into the home through the mother. So sometimes it's dad. So if your dad, know, championing your kid's health.

That's amazing, I'm not leaving you out. But generally we see the mom bringing these ideas and these things into the home, which is ⁓ really fantastic. But it is family. Not only does the healing come through the family, and when you look at mitochondria, that is also very relevant, but the toxic burden and the trauma and the mitochondria breakdown also comes through the family. So a really important conversation.

that I would like to continue later is dealing with mom's health and wounds and mitochondria before conception is part of how we prevent this in the first place. So if that's true, how much more important is it that supporting the mom is critical during helping a child through recovery as well?

Lucia Silver (19:57)
Absolutely. And thank you so much for clarifying that because it's where we start now. I didn't use to start our courses and our educational platforms in this place, but I unequivocally do now. start at home, home, mum, mum. So thank you. And this is very much why I wanted to talk to you, Kelsey. You you defining your approach and understanding exactly how you begin this healing journey. And I kind of want to pause here because this is

This is so important because there is a sequence, I think, to healing and it's not the same for everybody, but it is very much led by listening and led by understanding each little miracle in front of us. And there are lots of people talking about diet and supplements and protocols, but your work is organized very much around cellular and mitochondrial health as the starting point. ⁓

So talk to us Kelsey, why must the cell, why must mitochondrial function come first if anything else is gonna work long term?

Kelsey Spanbauer (21:02)
Well, let's think about what you're asking their body to do, right? So in autism, in pandas pans, we can kind of simplify them all into neuroimmune dysregulation, right? And

What you're asking the body to do is retrain the immune system to stop attacking itself and start attacking pathogens. You're asking the body to detox, a detoxification, like a toxin burden that was so enormous, the body decided to stop detoxing and store it because of the demand on the body to attempt to eliminate it. And you're asking the body to move forward developmentally.

when the body has paused development because A, there wasn't the resources to continue, B, there was too much interference, and C, the body is prioritizing survival. And I think this is where a lot of clinicians and parents forget this piece is detox and development pause, methylation, all these hot topics. The body pauses them intentionally.

to prioritize survival, to conserve energy. So this is where this energy crisis piece comes in. If we do not have enough energy, cellularly, to do these things, we're pushing clinically, right? Killing yeast, killing infections, moving mould, regulating the immune system, up-regulating, down-regulating, whatever your provider is doing, it doesn't...

really matter, you're gonna move the needle maybe a little bit, best case scenario, worst case scenario, you're gonna get a crazy reaction because the body doesn't have the energetic capability to keep up with you. The terrain is set to survival, not regeneration, not healing, not moving forward. So the beautiful thing is when you understand that's the way biology works, you can come in alongside it.

and partner with its own process and be so much more successful. Otherwise, it's like you're taking a system that is so severely taxed and you're asking it to do the most expensive processes that it could do, but there's nothing there. It can't do it. So now you're stressing the system out more. And instead of putting out the inflammation fire, you're actually fuelling it.

which is why so many kids get worse with treatment. This whole idea of it gets worse before it gets better, I personally don't ascribe to that. Healing is never like this perfectly straight line. It's always kind of a little chaotic and that's normal. But like this pushing past crazy Herck's reactions or detox reactions being necessary as a part of the healing road, I personally think that's not how our biology is designed. That's us.

pushing our biology past a threshold. It's blocked off on purpose.

Lucia Silver (24:06)
Yeah, the body knows best. And again, it's this area of slight arrogance that we think we need to impose something as opposed to facilitate something with the body, right? That was a really helpful description of ⁓ why we're seeing this great big stop sign on development and stop sign on the areas which we think we need to push forward on. Because of this lack of resource, lack of energy, what I perhaps should have asked you earlier, but

we're on the way now, what exactly is mitochondria? So we've understood it's the energy producer to a certain extent, before we dive any deeper into the importance of mitochondria in cellular medicine and health, could you just explain what the mitochondria are for any of our listeners who don't actually know?

Kelsey Spanbauer (24:55)
Sure, I'd love to. So inside of our cells, there are these tiny organelles called mitochondria, and they're shaped kind of like a little bean, ⁓ and they're famous for their ability to generate energy. Inside, they have layers of membranes that surround them. this is really important, layers of lipids of fats that surround the mitochondria, the same as that surround all animal cells.

In between those two membranes is where the mitochondria make ATP. So that's our body's fuel source. And there's 500 trillion of these mitochondria. What most people like to forget about them is they're also the antenna for the body, for regulation, for safety. They're constantly surveying the environment, the internal environment, and the external environment, looking for threats, for dangers, or

for safety and the signals that come into the mitochondria that they receive really dictate how they behave and whether or not they mutate into what we call dysfunctional form or they stay in what we would consider a healthier form of mitochondria.

Lucia Silver (26:13)
So it's, in layman's terms, the sort of the battery cell. I mean, it just seems to me crazy that we've arrived at any sort of approach without discussing mitochondria. I mean, I know that a lot of the practitioners in the space will say, we need to ensure that you're resourced. So with some of the chiropractors, they'll...

do hyperbaric oxygen, they're trying to help fuel the system. So there is an acknowledgement of it. But I'm curious as to how we've so lost our way with what seems to be

Kelsey Spanbauer (26:36)
Mm-hmm.

Lucia Silver (26:46)
so obvious, if you don't mind me saying.

Kelsey Spanbauer (26:47)
I think it's

this mentality of how can we make the mitochondria work better, right? And that makes sense. That makes sense to our brains. That makes sense to our bodies. How can we make them make more energy? That's what people are saying. That's creatinine. That's some of these other supplements that are mitochondria supplements. How can we make them make more energy? But what we're forgetting is

They decide if our body goes into a critical danger state or a regenerative state. They're also sensing the environment. And so you can try and biohack and get them to make more energy or we could be curious and we could say, why are they in an energy depleted state? Why are our mitochondria in a survival state? And what can we do to help them, A, repair their structure?

so they actually can make more energy because so many parents and practitioners, they're pumping all these supplements to try and make that electron transport chain produce more ATP, which makes sense chemically, but it doesn't make sense if you're curious because curiosity says, why is that electron transport chain inefficient in the first place? And can we just repair that structure to start with so that we're not putting more pressure?

on damaged mitochondria? Does that make sense? Instead of saying make more energy, make more energy, why don't we repair the engine so it works a little bit better?

Lucia Silver (28:21)
Absolutely,

makes complete sense. it's almost like we're back to making the same mistake we were within mainstream medicine where we are addressing the fire, not the smoke. We need to absolutely understand and keep just asking why until you can't ask why anymore. If you can't ask why anymore, then hopefully you're now addressing the root of the root cause. Because when mitochondrial health is compromised, it would seem to show up

in everything that we're talking about in this space, behaviour, anxiety, learning struggles, regression. ⁓ And this is where this piece that you have taught me so much about in your webinars and writings, the cell danger response. So talk to us about this, please, Kelsey, in language that parents can understand. What is this cell danger response? And with it, why is it that, therefore, that many of the protocols that parents are trying

Even good therapies often backfire if cellular energy isn't restored first.

Kelsey Spanbauer (29:25)
Yeah. So this is where the nuance between mitochondria making energy being really, really important, but also mitochondria behaviour being really, really important matters. So like I said, they survey for danger, right? So when the mitochondria sense threat, they trigger something called cell danger response. This work was on cell danger responses primarily done by Dr. Robert Navio.

It's really remarkable. ⁓ And what we see is this cycle triggered by the mitochondria that are actually, the cycle is actually designed to cause increased resilience, increased adaptability and full body tissue regeneration. It's a healing cycle. But the problem is there is so much danger input in our world today. And this is where I'd like to pause.

This is why I think this isn't popular is because the sexy topic, right, for helping our children heal are toxins and parasites and infections. And all of these things are really, really important and they do need to be addressed. And they do affect mitochondrial behaviour and they do trigger cell danger response. But the mitochondria actually respond behaviour wise more quickly to light.

to water and to electrons. So we have these kids that are living indoors under lighting that causes chaos in the mitochondria. They're not drinking the type of water that their cells need and they're never getting grounded. They have low electron transfer and they have low energy. Now, when the energy drops to a certain place in the cell, that triggers cell danger response. And so,

We have these kids that are already low energy and now they're living in this environment that not only inhibits cell energy, it also triggers this cycle. And so when the cycle gets stuck, so there's three different phases, and when the cycle gets stuck in any of those phases, that's chronic illness, that's chronic disease, that's chronic symptoms of any kind, not just autism and autoimmunity. I'm talking like...

98 % of a chronic illness or chronic set of symptoms is cell danger response stuck in a cycle.

Lucia Silver (32:01)
that inflammation, Kelsey, is what is happening with cell danger response without becoming too scientific, but is it inflammation?

Kelsey Spanbauer (32:09)
It triggers inflammation. It triggers full body inflammation. So in early cell danger response, the cells actually initiate an inflammation as part of a mechanism to protect the body from more damage. It's how our immune system functions. And so if you stay stuck in that early stage, which is where a lot of our PANS, PANAs and autism kids are, then we get this continued

inflammatory signal coming from the one part of our body that's actually capable of down regulating inflammation in our whole body. So again, this is where curiosity and nuance is really important. The goal is not to silence cell danger response or to turn it off. It's to help the cells complete that cycle because when the body does what it's supposed to do after cell danger response is triggered, we see

membrane regeneration on our cells, which increases energy, we see within three days, the body can regenerate its own gut lining. is part of the transition that happens during the phases of cell danger response is the body will trigger regeneration of the gut barrier. Like our biology does, and then we get full systemic, like the tissues start repairing themselves.

That's what our body is capable of doing. It just doesn't make sense to me why we work in any other order or why we don't operate within that system because it works so well. There is already an inherent self-repair system that has 500 trillion workers. Let's use it.

Lucia Silver (33:57)
Yeah.

And when your child grazes their knee, I was talking to Beth Lambert of Documenting Hope a couple of days ago and we just saying, you know, when your child grazes their knee, you just know it's going to scab over and heal because the body just does what it does. You know, there's no need to get in there with, you know, ointments and this and that and this and that. I mean, it's just the most miraculous thing if you leave it to do what it needs to do. This cycle, Kelsey, that you're talking about, this

bringing the system, if you like, or facilitating, supporting the system out of cell danger response when it's ready and feels safe enough to do so. Are you describing a cycle that is largely physiological? These are things that the cell needs to feel or retain or absorb or what is it back to light, ⁓ water and electrons again? Is it the same thing that will create that cycle? Because

we're still back to what do we do about it? My child is clearly in a, if you're talking another language that parents know about, it might be fight or flight. In another language, parents might talk about sympathetic dominance. Here at a cellular level, you're talking about this is really where this is being triggered from. This is coming from it at a cellular level and it's highlighting danger. So what do we do?

Kelsey Spanbauer (35:20)
Yeah, this is that deeper root cause of sympathetic dominance. Like the cell danger response can keep you in fight or flight. And so I think there's so many layers to addressing cellular healing and every person is so different. So there's the biochemistry piece, which is what everyone wants to talk about, right? That's parasites, diet, supplements, infections, toxins that needs to be addressed.

in my opinion, first in the environment. Remember, mitochondria are surveying for danger. So if there's still danger in your environment, you have no business giving them 10 million supplements to try and detox or deal with an infection. We have to change the environment first in order to change the signals the mitochondria are receiving. And then that includes our body too. So there is a place for dealing with infections and toxins. I do that with my clients. I'm not saying don't.

I'm saying the order is critical. The order is critical. And then there's the biophysics piece, which is what people don't want to talk about. People don't want to talk about blue light or the lighting in their home or ⁓ the reduced amount of sunlight or how much time kids spend in school. They don't want to talk about water source or how we're really designed to drink and interact with water. They don't want to talk about circadian rhythm and how sunlight and seasons affect our diet and our immune system.

and our biology, but all of those things impact the mitochondria this quickly. So do beliefs and thoughts and traumas. And people don't wanna talk about that. This is one reason why before my team takes on a one-on-one client, we wanna know, do you believe your child can heal? Do you believe that it's designed to? How do you speak over your child? Are you constantly berating them for their behaviour?

and talking in front of them like they're always gonna be this way, it's just the way they are? Or are you saying to them, you know what, today was really hard, but it was better than yesterday and I'm so proud of you and I know that tomorrow's gonna be better than today was and we're gonna do it because all of those things impact mitochondria extremely quickly. And so if we're constantly being berated by EMF and blue light and unwilling to address that,

And then having these negative beliefs, not only that we've inherited, this is something I really had to deal with with my son who had ⁓ really profound developmental delays and seizures was, you know, he was conceived in an abusive situation. And so for me, in my, he inherited this trauma feeling of I'm not supposed to be here.

And I remember the moment my friend told me that, and I started saying to him, and this sounds so silly, but I started saying to him, I'm so glad you're here. You have a purpose here. And it completely shifted the way everything we were doing impacted him. And it's not voodoo, it's not witchcrafty, it's not woo-woo. Our cells respond to actual threats and perceived threats. The mitochondria just have to not feel

safe, even if the danger is gone. And this is where we see so many PANS-PANAS kids stuck. Their cells are still responding to perceived threats. They still don't feel safe. And so when you're looking at, as parents, how can we practically start working with the cells so that we can get to those deeper layers that we know our kids need? Because their biology is just too burdened.

to detox sometimes on their own. A lot of kids will through this process. I've seen some kids, I actually just did a scan the other day where we didn't do any active detoxing and all of his heavy metals, even mercury, are way down. Just from doing mitochondria, cell danger response, and membrane repair, it is possible. But a lot of our kids do need that deeper work. The burden's just too heavy. So how do you get them there? Like address the light, address the EMF, get the right kind of water.

Those things are so inexpensive and they're in everybody's power to do. Get really clear about your own beliefs and gratitude. Speak gratitude and affirming statements over your child every single day because it impacts the way their mitochondria are behaved. It might not change their symptoms overnight. You know, they're probably not gonna stop speaking overnight because you said, I'm so glad tomorrow's gonna be better than yesterday, but it's gonna change the posture of their mitochondria.

And eventually, if the mitochondria get to that place where they feel safe enough, then they become curious. And that's where you get a child who reconnects with their environment. Okay, there's a little more eye contact, a little more curiosity, gut symptoms start to get better. There's a little less fight or flight. And then if we move on to the next phase, we have a more impact gut barrier. There's less digestive issues, less constipation, less diarrhea, less... ⁓

just over sensitivity, right? Like they're not reacting to 30 foods anymore. There's maybe three you need to be careful with. They're less reactive to every fragrance or chemical or transition. They become just a little more grounded and the and the body is kind of saying, OK, like we can do some repair now. Let's do repair. And then if we move forward from there, then you have this full body. We got this like we're in healing mode. We're in development mode. We're moving forward.

And it's normal, like there's 500 trillion mitochondria doing this, right? So it's normal for there to be a little bit of push and pull back and forth. We're designed to go into the cycle. We're just not designed to stay stuck there. And so what I like to say is take a list and this is something that I'll give you, a list of everything in the environment, in their body.

biophysic wise, right, which is your lights and your water and your electrons and then biochemistry, which are infections and foods and supplements and toxins. What can you change today that's going to send a healing signal, a safety signal to help their cells feel safe, prioritize those things, and then start moving down the list with what you can do ⁓ to reduce the amount of danger signals coming in and increase the amount

of safety signals coming in. And I think one of the biggest challenges we face, to be really frank with you, is lighting. Our kids do not get enough sunlight. They're bathing in EMF, especially if they live in a city. It is so, so hard for the mitochondria to function optimally, to create enough energy without adequate sunlight and with high doses of EMF. So getting really real about is your child in an environment they can heal in and

What can you change about those two things? They really impact mitochondrial behaviour.

Lucia Silver (42:34)
Since you've been talking about this, Kelsey, I've been very aware of how to do it at home, you know, and how to make some changes because I've been very much exposed to all the other protocols, primitive reflex integration, the diets, so much wonderful stuff. And Quinn is, God willing, in an incredibly fabulous space and has only ever had one major pan's flare. But that said, I'm always on the lookout for what is still putting stress on his system.

It is so hard for parents listening, you when you're trying to live with circadian rhythm, want to sort of, wouldn't it be wonderful if we could rise with the sun and go to sleep when the sun goes down? the minute, you know, it gets dark, which it does super early in the winter in the UK, you know, like 3.30 PM, we're straight into artificial lights. And my voice is always hollering around the house going.

Kelsey Spanbauer (43:20)
Yes.

Lucia Silver (43:26)
Don't put the overheads on, just put the dimmer switch, keep it low, know, don't put the big bright, as Quinn's going up the stairs to his bedroom and the light goes on again. Don't put, but it's everywhere. And then we want to watch a little bit of wind down telly together. And I'm aware that that's also kind of blue light after the time that we ideally would, but then we don't get any sort of just downtime where the two of us are so exhausted. We may not have the energy always.

As a mum, particularly if I've been working since six in the morning and then it's nine o'clock at night and I just want to cuddle up with him on the sofa, sometimes we don't feel like reading. Sometimes we just want to watch a little bit of something and be passively entertained. But I suppose all of this, this is just moving the dial, becoming aware, doing a little bit less TV. We're not a big phone or gaming family. I've kept Quinn off that pretty much. So that's not a challenge for us. It's a huge challenge for other families where kids are.

That's their go-to entertainment. The minute they get in from school, they think they're relaxing and down regulating with the phone. We know very well that it's doing quite the opposite. It's upping the brain into some great big frazzles, so not helpful at all. But there are many things that you've said that are, they don't cost anything unlike a lot of these other fancy protocols. And it's simple. I keep thinking it's so like a plant. It's like describing.

in your school biology photosynthesis. You would not expect that plant to do okay if you didn't stick it in the light and you didn't give it water and oxygen. And even we talk about talking to our plant kindly. I mean, those are the, that's what you're talking about with my Glyconrial Health. And I was like, oh my God, that was my GCSE biology. That was me at 13 in my biology class, understanding how to nurture a plant.

Kelsey Spanbauer (45:07)
Sure.

Lucia Silver (45:18)
I know we're more complicated but in some ways what you're saying is so simple, it's stripping back, it's back to nature and grounding and the simplest and most beautiful things in life that we have become disconnected from.

Kelsey Spanbauer (45:35)
Yeah. And I think that's where it's so challenging is all these other fancy protocols and like reflex integration and chiropractic care and dealing with heavy metals like those are all really important. And most of our kids need those things as well. But they don't replace a safe environment for ourselves and

We have to be willing to really check with our instinct, like reconnect, like back to the beginning of our conversation. Is the amount of blue light, is where you live, is that interfering with your child's ability to heal, to get well? So, know, Quinn is in a more stable place and he's tolerating that, but a lot of children in an active flair, they will not tolerate that amount.

of exposure, even for a quick wind down at nine o'clock. there's so many things you can do to make that lighting, especially in the winter in your house, safer and better for yourselves. It doesn't have to be perfect. Something's ever going to be perfect. We just want more safety signals coming in than danger signals coming in. And unfortunately, light is a battle because our kids are all addicted to it and we're addicted to it. And that's really hard to say, gosh, how much am I really?

on my phone, how much am I really on my screen? Am I willing to spend 15 bucks to get incandescent bulbs in my house instead of LED ones? Like that's, it's not really that big of a deal, but it's this mindset hump to get over because we understand what that means for our lifestyle. We understand what that means for our own personal responsibility for how we're living. And it requires

a lot of change and you know, sometimes when a child is really, really, really struggling or even my adult clients, I'll tell them, I want you to put your phone and your laptop in your safe and I want you to leave. Go somewhere as close to the equator as you can get. And they make remarkable, like they stabilize when they're really, when I'm talking to these people, like, we're gonna go check ourselves in the hospital. We are done. They stabilize because of the sunlight.

because of the electron transfer. And sometimes we have to make those hard decisions. Like we have to leave them only home. We might need to move to get, I've had times where I've had to leave when I was dealing with my own health, get out of the EMF of the city for a little while. And so, you know, not demanding perfection, but I am saying like, if you wanna do cellular medicine, if you wanna work with mitochondria,

You can't just do all the fancy protocols and then ignore light or ignore water. We have to have those things on board in order for ourselves to make energy. Otherwise, it's kind of like this boat full of holes and you're plugging it with all these protocols. But as soon as you stop, it's just going to take on water again because there's not enough energy to maintain a healing process or maintain a healing cycle. And their biology is capable of doing it if we

give it what it needs. And as your children move through, those demands change and their resiliency increases. The number one sign that your child is healing is increased resiliency. They're more adaptive. They're less sensitive. So like my kiddo with developmental issues, I can tell he's progressing because if he does get an exposure to a food or a toxin that would have triggered him, he doesn't regress as much anymore.

we really don't see any regression at all. He gets a little hyperactive. So I know like it's still impacting his biology. It's still worth avoiding. And then my kiddo with Lyme's disease, like he is so much less sensitive. He's in remission now, but every once in a while, like if he's really, really stressed, something will trigger symptoms and it typically only lasts a day or two and he's so much less sensitive.

He couldn't be around perfume. He couldn't look at sunlight. There's so many things he couldn't tolerate at all. Like he had anaphylactic reactions to over 10 different foods. When he was so little, they wouldn't prescribe an EpiPen. And all of that has resolved itself and he's less sensitive. So as your children move through the healing cycle and move through the process, they'll tolerate a late night family movie night. We do that at our house now, but I make them wear blue blockers because...

Because I know that if they don't wear blue blockers and they watch a movie at 9 o'clock at night They're gonna be anxious and dysregulated in the morning Put glasses on and they're fine

Lucia Silver (50:26)
Wow are those glasses?

Are those glasses blue blockers?

Kelsey Spanbauer (50:31)
Yeah, so I can send you

the link, there's a few companies that make really quality glasses that they block the blue light, so it supports the circadian rhythm a little.

Lucia Silver (50:43)
great, because I heard that there weren't any real ones on the market because we had some at the beginning and some are when those are nonsense. So I'm so pleased to hear from you because that is definitely something we want to share with our families because then you can have a little bit of naughty night time screen, right? And you don't have to worry so much. Kelsey, you've been talking a great deal about how to advocate really, how to feel empowered enough and how to be curious. You know, lot of that takes, for many people, bravery when it comes to

Kelsey Spanbauer (50:56)
Yeah

Lucia Silver (51:13)
asking those questions or not kowtowing to the medical system. This is really the intersection of intuition and biology really. And I just want to speak now that we're understanding a little bit more about mitochondrial health, about the mother's voice again and come full circle because I know for me that there is no way that I would be where I am now with Quinn and everyone who's followed my journey had I not absolutely

demanded to know why and challenged the countless doctors and experts that I came into contact with who were telling me to ignore what I was seeing with this very extreme stim and many of the different things that we the symptoms that that I was really being encouraged to ignore or suppress. So this is a very important part of this journey, understanding how we can become empowered and understanding really how the medical system

in some respects is failing us. You know, what health care is still doing today, especially for children that hasn't meaningfully changed despite the epidemic we're now facing. I'd love you to just speak into that a bit more. I mean, it's self-evident from what we're saying that this is not the language of mainstream medicine. This is not what you're going to hear from your GP typically. But how can we encourage ⁓ parents to feel

confident and mothers to feel encouraged to not doubt themselves and change what they really have always known wasn't quite right.

Kelsey Spanbauer (52:49)
Yeah, you know, I think as much as our biology is designed to monitor for danger and then repair itself, our biology as mothers is designed to know what our children need, especially when they can't speak for themselves. And, you know, this is something that I think needs to be non-negotiable in your team. If you are surrounded by practitioners or people who are telling you you're wrong about your gut instinct.

they need to go because you're not gonna get the map that you need. You're not gonna understand how to read your child's symptoms and know what that means to move forward. And I can tell you clinically, I see this all the time. If I have moms that come on a call and they're like, but this is how, and I'll make a suggestion and they're like,

I just have a feeling that I don't wanna do that. I actually wanna do it like this. Do you know how to do that? I will completely change my recommendation to work with their intuition, with that clinical evidence. And it works every single time. I've never seen a mom say, I feel like this is what my kid needs. And then we find a way to meet that needs that aligns with her intuition. I've never seen it them not improve, never once.

And I think that there's not going to be a fantastic medical explanation for that, but we are all biologically unique. And if your kid can speak for themselves, they're regulating with you. Like you can identify a lot of that. And I think what's really cool is if you have a team who values your intuition and who is also skilled and knowledgeable, they're going to know how to bring

the two together to say, you know, like, okay, this is how we can meet you where you are. And you can, you can move forward with these tools. And that is just profoundly, it's, it's profoundly validating to the mom. It creates this sense of mom and baby being held and protected together. And they always move forward together. And I'll tell you when we treat our clients like that, which we always do,

When let's say we're doing something really clinically advanced like brain detox, which is that's a big deal. Like anyone telling you, can just cross the blood brain barrier and pull toxins out willy nilly. They are wrong. That's a really big deal. You're moving the most poisonous substance on the solar in our solar system out of their brain. Like that matters. Who will be doing something like that. And we're in really, really close contact. Right. And and they'll be like, OK, this happened. Like, what does this mean? And I'll ask.

questions. The first thing I always do is ask questions because mom has the information that I need. I don't understand how clinicians practice without intuitive parents because mom has the information they need. She just might not know that that's what that is yet or how to access it. So like a huge part of what we do with moms is we reconnect that we build that. And by six to seven months of working together, I'm not getting those messages anymore. What I'm getting is, hey,

this happened and I understood it meant this. So I did this. What do you think? And I'm like, awesome. You know, they're starting to connect the dots and marry the tools and the skills with their own intuition. And those are the parents that make the most progress. It doesn't mean you have to know everything. And that's what's so beautiful about mitochondrial medicine and about working with herbs instead of pharmaceuticals is it is very intuitive and you don't have to understand the science. The science is really fun.

and it's really cool to learn about, but you don't have to understand how it works to make remarkable progress moving forward. As long as you get the order right and the signals right, progress is inevitable. It's a really, really beautiful way to watch the whole family come together and heal. And one thing that I love, which is maybe a little not popular again, but dads are usually really sceptical.

And usually around two months in, I'm getting calls from dads like, what are you doing that's different than what every other doctor is doing because like, do you work with men? You know, like you get the whole family on board because you're not in this power over power under dynamic. whatever you do moms, like place yourself with a team who doesn't need power over you and who will value

your insight into your child because you are the best expert on your child and you have the information your clinician needs to help you move forward and to teach you, they should be teaching you the tools so that you can use them with your intuition. In my opinion, that's the best case scenario is we're taking the experience and the wisdom and the skills of your clinician team if you have one, if you need one.

And you're pairing that with your knowledge of your child. That's where you're going to get inevitable progression, in my opinion.

Lucia Silver (58:15)
just want to pause and have you say that again, Kelsey, about mothers or chief caregivers. are the main expert. Just say it again, because I think we really need to understand this point. You are the main expert. Go on, say it again.

Kelsey Spanbauer (58:28)
Yeah, mothers, you are your child's best expert. You are their biggest advocate. You have the information that your clinician needs to pair with their skill to help you move forward. The information that you have is not, by the way, I forgot to mention. That's what everything should be should be built on, because your child's response, their body's response to the work that you're doing is the map. Their symptoms

are the map for where they're at in cell danger response, for where their biology is inhaling and for what they need to move forward. And you are the person that has that information or if dads, if you're the primary caregiver, then it's you. And that information should be the spine of your protocol, which should constantly be evolving based on your information that every single time I have a call with a mom, I'm making adjustments to what I think based on

what you say, because you know your child better than anybody ever will. Bringing those two together and then empowering you with the skill so you can continue. It's not a quick road. It's not a quick road. This problem in the mitochondria started four generations ago. It's not going to fix overnight. But if you can take your expertise of your child and pair it with the tools that your child specifically needs, which is going to be different for each kid.

you will move forward. I don't care how sick your kid is, you might not get 100 % in a year, but you will move forward.

Lucia Silver (1:00:04)
this is incredible to me, it makes me want to weep because it takes me back to where I was at the beginning of my journey where it felt like no one was listening and when I was getting the information about root causes, I was being gaslit and told to be quiet. So it is absolutely the antithesis of what many of us are experiencing within the conventional medical model. And I'm not saying that there isn't a place sometimes for those doctors and sometimes for those interventions, but

what you're really talking about now is not just that you have the intuition and the information and as you say the spine to navigate the story, but you are actually integral to the healing journey as well. You are part of that co-regulation, you are part of that absolutely interdependency between mother and child that is necessary not just at the beginning, but throughout.

And so I think when you understand that ecosystem and the delicacy and the imperative nature of it happening together, it's a different form of power and a different form of, I feel brave in a new way with this. I feel excited for Quinn's and my future for our together healing and to go on this journey with you as well and understand it more and more.

parents really as the movement, Kelsey. You've built this extraordinary Undoctor Academy and Undoctor School around educating parents directly as I have and am endeavouring to do through our whole child healing course and roadmap. ⁓ So just in tying this all together, why do you believe in formed

Educated parents and not institutions are the movement that will change the future of children's health.

Kelsey Spanbauer (1:02:02)
Well, one, there's just never gonna be enough practitioners who get on board to help every child. And two, they're never gonna be in your home unless you're lucky enough to marry one. So you need to have these skills. need, and this is where the conversation gets a little hard, right? We have to take responsibility for what are you willing to do for their environment? And are you willing?

Lucia Silver (1:02:15)
You

Kelsey Spanbauer (1:02:32)
learn these skills because they're not that hard. They're easy enough for most parents. some of the more complex clinical things like treating Lyme's. In my practice, I don't just treat Lyme's for someone. I teach them how to do it. It's not that hard. Parents don't need to be managed. They need to be trusted and supported.

And that means finding the right team for your family. If you're lucky enough to have done so, then take a minute to celebrate because you're like in the 2%, you know? And I think that there are so many clinicians that mean well, like so many that wanna make a difference in this space, but they're never gonna be in your home and they're never gonna be there long enough. And if your child is four years old right now and you get remission and then there's another trigger in puberty, they're not gonna be there then.

but you will have the tools then to one, have prevented a more severe flare and two, to know exactly how to respond. You don't ever have to flounder. And this is where I think like in my journey, I suffered so much personally and with my children and watching them suffer, but I never floundered because I knew I was connected to my intuition and I knew what to do. And that's what I wanna give parents.

but you're never gonna get that from someone else. That has to come from trusting yourself, from healing that connection with yourself. And that has to come from knowing that you have the skills and the tools or the resources to learn them so that you can confidently move forward. And it's one thing I love about on doctor school is so many people told me, don't do that. Like people need to be paying you for your time to learn these things.

and what if something goes wrong? I'm like, it's safe. Healing the cells is safe. They can do it. And so I went ahead and I put it out there and we get messages every single day. We've been doing the most basic things and my child is speaking. There's no more night terrors. They're sleeping through the night. They're potty training. My kid ran up and hugged his dad for the first time. I didn't even know he knew his dad existed until yesterday. They haven't had a pandas flare in three months and all we're doing is the basics.

These tools are integral to everything that you're doing on a more advanced level and they're not too hard to be in the home. And so I just really feel like, you know, there's something, if you can humour me for a minute, maybe backtrack 30 seconds.

I don't feel like I was a part of this problem, but I would like to apologize to all the mothers and all the parents on behalf of the medical system. I'm so sorry that you were gaslit, that you were lied to, that you weren't given the information that you needed, that your power was taken from you, that you weren't heard, that you weren't trusted. And if you could humour me and just take that apology coming from maybe someone who didn't do it and let it be enough.

to let it go so you can reconnect and move on because your kid needs you. And we're not gonna change that system. Maybe someone will, but it's not my fight. I fought as a midwife, I'm telling you what, I fought to change the system. I got in there, I got in there with the OBs and with the nurses. I made friends, I made wars. I got in fights with EMS in the hallway. I fought to make the hospital a safe place for women to have babies.

budge the needle. But empowering parents with the tools to do it and creating a safe place for them to do it changed everything for the families who took that responsibility. So that's what I'd like to do with this. I'd like to take this autism and this autoimmunity space and say it's extremely nuanced. It's extremely complicated. But if you trust yourself and if you bring these tools into your home, it's not too hard for parents to do. It's just not. You guys, you can do it. You're amazing. You're brilliant. You're intuitive.

You are the key, you are the cornerstone without you, nothing that I could do would work anyway. So don't give up and forgive. You have to forgive and change your mindset and be brave and surround yourself with people who believe you because I really, really believe we're at a turning point where we're gonna have an entire generation that loses its voice or we're gonna have an entire generation of mothers who prevents that.

My mission is to make this, no matter how many people hate me, I get death threats all the time. don't like, no matter what happens, I want that to be the story. As we had a generation that almost lost its voice, but a generation of mothers stepped up and it didn't happen. Let's do that.

Lucia Silver (1:07:31)
I'm with you. Amazing. I'm breathless with it, Kelsey. It absolutely grounds and galvanises my mission to hear as well and to know that our children are not broken, they're burdened, that we are here to facilitate that healing, that we have the power, the intuition, everything that we need. we're...

actually burdened by outdated systems and we're burdened by a culture that has quietly trained parents to surrender authority instead of strengthening it. And unlike you, if there's one message I want to carry forward from this conversation, it's this, do not default. As you've said, get curious. Do not outsource your intuition. Do not accept symptom management is the ceiling of what's possible.

What I've learned from you is cellular healing is not fringe, it's foundational. And really to keep learning, keep learning wide-eyed childlike wonderment. Our children are here to teach us and this is such a huge gift from this generation of so-called unwell children. They are our greatest pathway to connection to the greatest source.

And before we close, want to properly acknowledge you, Kelsey, because what you bring is rare. You hold science and biology with real depth, but you never stop or strip parents of their humanity, their intuition or authority in the process. You don't speak over families, you walk with them. And that matters more than ever. So thank you for the hours you pour into families. Thank you for the integrity that you bring to this space and to

every parent listening, you are not powerless, you are not imagining it and you do not have to do this blindly. Kelsey has generously shared a resource for listeners which you'll find in the show notes along with further links to look deeper at Kelsey's amazing work and resources and if you enjoyed this conversation please follow the episode and share ⁓ it with another parent who might need to hear it.

because the more parents who understand the biology beneath their children struggles, the more children we can help. And that's the mission behind My Mighty Quinn and the Brain Health Movement. Thank you so much for joining us, Kelsey.

Kelsey Spanbauer (1:09:56)
Thank you for having me.