Diddy do it? Bronx news and Moorish Mondays

Harlem's hip-hop heritage pulsates with life, yet beneath the beats lie controversial truths and whispered rumors seeking the light. This episode doesn't just walk you through the legacy of icons like Diddy and Biggie; it tears down the facade, exposing the industry's darker side, from contentious lyrics to the exploitation within. We're joined by Brother Jelani Bay, who offers a riveting look into the Moorish American community's fight for autonomy and the balancing act between religious freedom and state law.

Venture with us as we dissect the intricate web of relationships among hip-hop's elite, where power plays out in celebrity mansions equipped with enigmatic tunnels, and the personal becomes public in the most unexpected of places. Our conversation stretches further, confronting the chilling tales that echo through exclusive gyms and the silent echoes of gun violence in the Bronx. These tales are not just narratives; they are a call for community action and a wake-up call to the somber realities faced daily.

As we wrap our journey through this labyrinth of fame, faith, and legislation, we not only debate the current state of hip-hop and its moguls but also challenge the structures governing the Moorish American movement. We question the intricacies of religious government, the role of corporate America, and what it truly means to establish a nation within a nation. Your participation is not just welcomed—it's essential—as we strive to untangle these threads, fostering growth and enlightenment within and beyond our vibrant Harlem roots.

Transcript

Harlem Hip-Hop Culture Discussion

Speaker 1 0:00

Yo, I'm from Harlem, harlem in the house. Yo, look, look, look, harlem in the air. I'm Harlem, I just called him Harlem.

Speaker 3 0:07

I'm my co-host. Mikey Fever just got up. I don't know what happened. We started talking about Diddy. We talking about Diddy claiming Mount Vernon now, or Harlem.

Speaker 1 0:18

Harlem man, the Harlem, I'm on the Bronx, bro. I'm on the Bronx, yeah, I'm on the Bronx bro. Yeah, man, nah, man, you see the way he dress. You see he got the little Dougie Fresh dance. Come on, man, he got the Dougie Fresh dance he ain't from Harlem.

Speaker 3 0:36

Harlem in the house yo yo hey, yo look y'all talking about Yo.

Speaker 1 0:46

Hey, yo look, yo look. Y'all talking about you know you wanted to get in with the suspect lyrics that Puffy said. How about the suspect lyrics Biggie said?

Speaker 3 0:54

when Biggie said the girl looks so good I want to suck on a daddy joint Whoa. And I couldn't believe it. I was like what I had to answer that Mikey from Brooklyn bro.

Speaker 1 1:05

Hey yo look man, I'm a Pac fan.

Speaker 4 1:10

I got sweat. I got techniques dripping out my butt, cheeks laying on my stomach so I don't fuck up my sheets.

Speaker 1 1:16

That's what you made Big say what the what the and he damn sure did too man alright, y'all wanna talk about craziness.

Speaker 2 1:28

How about Cam your mom mobbing and raping a Saudi Arabia? Come on bro, what was?

Speaker 3 1:33

that about that ain't nothing bro what is that?

Speaker 2 1:37

we ain't talking about Cam now your mom mobbing and raping a Saudi Arabia yo look, we ain't talking about Cam now man.

Speaker 1 1:44

We talking about the Puff Daddy campaign, his little crew, little rainbow around there. You know what I'm saying. But yeah, they were saying a lot of suspect stuff, man. You know A lot of choice, man, how about DMX yeah. I ain't gonna lie. I don't know where DMS got that from and I always sussed because I was locked up with him. I'm like yo, homie, I know you wasn't doing that on the jail. You know what I'm saying. You got me twisted Like yo. That, right there, threw me off.

Speaker 3 2:18

Yo, I want to figure out. Why does K-Born Mike has feedback you got an echo right.

Speaker 2 2:25

Yeah. I don't know why you got no echo in here, Come on man.

Speaker 3 2:33

Wait, wait, wait, kick it right now. K-born, I think that was Clips Mike One, two one, two, One, two, one two.

Speaker 1 2:40

Go ahead, mike Yo One two, one, two Yo Yo 1-2-1-2.

Speaker 3 2:47

Yeah, anyway, let's keep it going, man. Let's keep the ball rolling. We're talking about Biggie.

Speaker 1 2:52

We're talking about Somebody got to join on live, because I can hear you echoing too, yeah, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 2:59

Let me pause mine for mine. Let me mute my mic.

Speaker 3 3:11

There ain't no more pauses man, mine for mine, let me mute my mic. No, did, no diddy, no diddy, yeah, I think, okay, that might have been. Yeah, that's, that's mike's mic. Yeah, yeah, so yeah, we, we're going back in. We're talking about, uh, oh, no, we're not going back in. Nah, no, diddy, time out Yo. So check it. We're talking about, we're talking about Diddy, yo, man, that whole thing that happened with Diddy, that's going on with Diddy, is sounds crazy. First of all, I want to start off from the beginning with him his dreams and aspirations of becoming an executive, you know, with Andre Harrell Uptown, and he was basically Andre Harrell's protege. Now, Protegate.

Speaker 3 3:57

Now, oh wow, so he's Andre Harrell's protégé right Now. What was?

Speaker 1 4:15

going on between him and Andre Harrell. Let me be the answer to that. Well, andre Harrell's the one who got puffed and all that man. You know what I'm saying Because Andre Harrell always was a little weird. Remember he had the Dr Jekyll with Mr Hyde.

Speaker 3 4:26

Oh yeah, I remember that.

Speaker 1 4:29

Let's go back to that. You know what I'm saying. He was Dr Jekyll with Mr Hyde. You see him in the nighttime. He was a rapper. You see him in the daytime, he was the businessman with the three-piece suits and all this and that on.

Speaker 1 4:49

Well, from what the rumor was with Kim Porter was that she walked up in there and Puff was giving that man a head in the bathroom. So that allegedly was the rumor. That that means was what she had on him. And then I heard that in return, Puff did that same thing on the other people. We're saying that and I heard the saying. That he was saying was that if you got power, you can make another man suck your joint. Oh, that was the thing, yeah, and that's showing power. Wow, you know what I'm saying. So that was allegedly what he was throwing out there and was running on brothers and a couple of brothers that I don't want to throw their name out there because it put them out of the game, man, and they was brothers that really was doing it and so them rumors came out. Them rumors came out like in the 90s this ain't no 2000 rumors or nothing. Now this is 90 rumors and put them brothers out. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 5:35

Wait, hold up, so Clip. You know about that.

Speaker 4 5:37

Yeah, I heard a little rumors back in the day about Puff and the gay antics and all of that from back then. A few rappers, a few rappers I can't say everybody's names, but it's a few rappers out there that I've heard some stories on from back then.

Speaker 1 5:52

Yeah, because don't forget, when they were saying who's the gay rapper, that was back in the 2000s.

Speaker 4 5:59

Yeah, actually that was 90s. Yeah, you know what I'm saying. I'm not going to sit here and speculate, but back then the word was Eric Sermon. Oh yeah, I remember that. I don't know how he said it.

Speaker 1 6:12

Yo Suge Knight was saying that though Suge Knight was like, but they was like yo, man, why you don't want EPMD down with you. He was like nah, man, that dude Eric Sermon's a fruitcake man, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 6:27

So Suge Knight threw that out there back in the day. Hey, what Arnel Bay is saying on the chat, I can't see from here.

Speaker 2 6:37

You can't hear your mic, mike, can you hear me? Yeah, now I can hear you. Yeah, he said he's saying Little Rod, a foreign producer and videographer for Diddy, filed a lawsuit in New York federal court alleging that rapper previously sexually harassed, drugged and threatened him.

Speaker 1 6:55

Yeah, but he also said that Diddy's son did it to some female too. You know, you dragging yourself down is one thing. When you start dragging your kids down, you know, and that goes, go down for the brothers that be all hustling and you want to make your kid a baby drug deal. I done seen it happen and them kids end up in jail all their life Back and forth, back and forth, back and forth. You in a gang and you won't put my kid down with it. All right, you was the dude who knew how to gang bang. You ain't the kid that, or your kid in jail, you're killed.

Speaker 1 7:22

You know we've seen that in all with OG Bobby Johnson. Man, you see what they doing to your kid out there. Man, you know what I'm saying. Say anything they did to you. So you know, when you dragging your kid into something that you're doing, it's crazy, man. You know, unless it's something legal and it's something that you're doing, that's positive, you doing it. They're all dragging your kid in it. Man, and he got in that lawsuit that he's seen puff daddy's kid allegedly drug a female and took advantage of her too. So you know, that's alleged, alleged.

Speaker 3 7:54

But well, I want to cable. I want to take things from now as the born, right, so start from the from the beginning, right? So like, okay, so we would. Y'all were talking about the rumors and all of that in the 90s and everything like that, right? And you said Andre Harrell basically groomed Puffy, right? Yeah, when I used to work at 63rd Street Equinox in the gym. The thing about the gym is you meet everybody, bro, like all the celebrities you could possibly think of. Gym is you meet everybody, bro, like all like all the celebrities you could possibly think of be in them gyms. Now, I met Clive Davis and Clive Davis's boyfriend. Now, yeah, hey y'all.

Speaker 1 8:38

Look, let me say one thing, I'm not gonna cut you off. Let me say one thing real quick, hold on. You also know, when you work in them, gyms, there's certain gyms, people going there and that's not going to cut you off. Let me say one thing real quick, hold on. You also know, when you work in them, gyms, there are certain gyms, people go in there and that's not the gym for you.

Speaker 3 8:49

Well, what you mean?

Speaker 1 8:50

Like some gyms is just not the gyms. Some gyms is for the gyms, for the brothers in there and people that's getting in there. Some gyms is just all rainbow. The hookup spot yeah yeah, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 9:02

Like I need to do an episode on the gyms like because check this out.

Speaker 1 9:07

Because I had a membership to the Exodus one time and there was a couple of them joints that I had to. I ain't coming back to this one.

Speaker 3 9:14

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, like in the gym that I was in right that I worked in, I met Clive Davis and his boyfriend right Now. Clive Davis I'm going to say alleged boyfriend, alleged boyfriend Clive Davis basically groomed Andre Harrell, right yeah.

Speaker 1 9:39

So my thing is I heard Quincy Jones was doing a lot of that too allegedly Quincy Jones, yeah lot of that too.

Speaker 3 9:46

Allegedly Quincy Jones. Yeah, you know anything about this clip. Look at your boy.

Speaker 4 9:50

Temme Pac put it out there that Quincy Jones was out here. You know on his that's a fact.

Speaker 2 9:58

He wrote him a letter.

Speaker 1 9:59

Yeah, and Pac ain't gonna be out here just throwing those lines.

Speaker 2 10:02

I don't know if, clipping on a line from Pac's song, he said take a dollar and I kidnapped your daughter.

Speaker 4 10:08

Kill your wife and hit the funeral room. Tell you who gave me the order.

Speaker 1 10:11

Just gave the order yeah, Well there's a lot of stuff that been going on, man, especially with the manipulation of. You know it all go back to manipulating the young people. Man, you know what I'm saying. You're already robbing them for their money. You're robbing them for their publishing. You're robbing them for you know what I'm saying for their likeness and everything that they got, and now you're robbing them out of their manhood.

Speaker 3 10:36

But what is the science of the science? What is the crazy? What is that about, though? Like what is the point of it? Is it just like the industry is just gay, is that?

Speaker 1 10:47

what it is like, what it is. Are you trying to please the other? You know I'm saying when, when it was done, when all the brothers was there, it wasn't doing that. You heard brothers saying my business hours is nine to five. Nine to five is my business hours. That's where the brothers was in control when they started all that and it go way back to when we started and we was on the job and they had all the dude Barry Wise once he came in. That dude done, robbed more dudes than any dude that's in any jail doing nobody, don't matter how much time they doing, that's the guy that own job records.

Speaker 3 11:29

Hold on. You said Rage On their base. They said Rage, ain't got herpes from P Diddy.

Speaker 1 11:35

They're saying oh, they're also saying Usher did too.

Speaker 4 11:40

I ain't gonna run with that one, but that's crazy.

Speaker 1 11:43

They're saying Usher did too, man, you know.

Speaker 3 11:46

Oh, I heard about that too, yeah.

Speaker 1 11:48

His moms had to pick him up in the hospital and all that you know. So there's just a lot of things with this dude named that have been flying out there for years. And then you know, like I was speaking to my sister before we got on and I was telling her, you even got like when Cassidy Cassidy put her lawsuit out, she said he broke her nose in front of his mother. The other female said he chipped her tooth and did all this in front of his mother. And I was like man, if I would have swung on a girl in front of my mom's, my mom's and the girl would have jumped me, my mom's jumping me. Period, that ain't going down. So you gotta be like you know you breaking females noses and all that in front of your mother. Like you, just ruthless boy.

Speaker 3 12:30

Mm-hmm. So K-Born, k-born and Clip both of you brothers have been in the industry. Have y'all seen any kind of weird stuff or anything like that?

Speaker 4 12:42

Nah, I ain't seen too. I haven't seen anything weird me personally, but I think all the extra super, extra, super-duper tough niggas that be trying to act tough, I just think they get it Because you're trying too hard to be tough.

Speaker 1 12:56

Yeah, you're putting too much out there. I feel, like this man Whenever you go somewhere. If you look at all of us, we all got different type of facial hairs, right, but we all got some type of facial hairs when you get around these dudes, you've never seen grown men. You see the Caucasians, that's their style. You've never seen grown black men. They got nothing man. They look like they just born. They look like they just came from Attica in the chest of the molester program.

Speaker 3 13:30

I'm going to say I'm going to kind of agree and disagree at the same time, because LL got that, look boy.

Speaker 1 13:40

That's just LL, but LL been. Had we not talking about LL, ll been out of this LL been out of this.

Speaker 1 13:46

Ll been out of this. We talking about dudes. Ll ain't never had fish in it, that's just LL. We talking about the dudes that was born again, roughnecks. That was running around here doing all that. You had probably the dreads, you probably had dreads on your bed and all that. And now we seeing you and your joint just butterball soft. You ain't even got a mustache. Now you know that's illegal in the black community, man, you ain't got the mustache.

Speaker 2 14:11

Illegal, that's the pedo vibes.

Speaker 1 14:14

Look, if you say you're going to accidentally cut your mustache, you can't come outside for two weeks.

Speaker 3 14:18

Nah, I cut my shit, I cut my joint. My joint is always clean. Actually, it just grew out a little bit because I was sick, but there's a reason why I cut it off, though there's a reason.

Speaker 1 14:30

Yeah, you know what I'm saying. Usually somebody has a job. You're in the Army, or maybe for something you know you may be, for your religious status but you're doing business and trying to get new growth.

Speaker 4 14:39

You ain't slick.

Speaker 3 14:42

It's a business.

Speaker 2 14:44

I bet for Ron.

Speaker 3 14:48

Your mic. Cut off, mike.

Speaker 1 14:50

You off.

Speaker 3 14:51

Wow yeah.

Speaker 2 14:53

I heard you there. Can you hear me now?

Speaker 1 14:55

Yeah.

Speaker 2 14:56

I say for Ron and other brothers that have knowledge of self, some of them follow Elijah Muhammad's program To keep your you know your facial hair clean To be presentable. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 15:07

Hey yo I want to ask y'all a question.

Speaker 2 15:09

What's up?

Speaker 1 15:10

Why did Puff Daddy have tunnels and all that in his house?

Speaker 2 15:16

Allegedly.

Speaker 4 15:18

I don't know if he bought the house like that.

Discussion on Tunnels and Controversial Connections

Speaker 1 15:22

That's the F-scan. Don't forget. Every time you hear these freaky stories, at these freaky parties, there's always a freaky tunnel or something along.

Speaker 4 15:30

I know the tunnel was found in the LA crib. I didn't hear any stories about the New York crib or the Miami crib.

Speaker 1 15:38

So even if you got a, tunnel and you running immigrants underground or you got a tunnel. Why you got a tunnel? Man, you know what I'm saying. Like what's going on here, homie.

Speaker 3 15:47

Yo, what's the tunnels about, though? What's that though?

Speaker 1 15:52

Epstein had tunnels.

Speaker 3 15:54

Epstein had tunnels down in the bottom of his house too. But like, let's bring it back to the knowledge. So, like in the beginning, when Puff was dealing with Andre Harrell, were they involved, though? Does anybody have any facts on that?

Speaker 1 16:11

According to Kim Porter, she said she walked in the bathroom in a club when she first met Puffy and that's what Andre Harrell told him that, yo, you got power, you can make a boom-boom. And she caught them in the act and that's why I let her be, but she still rock with him after she started doing fellatio.

Speaker 1 16:32

You got to figure like this If I'm just nobody and I'm in the club, these two dudes is big somebody. You know she's a female, they two big somebodies. And you know she probably was rapping to him anyway before she, you know, seen all that. But now, after they seen all that, they just buttering her up with all the gifts in the world. You know it's a little hard to all break out when your whole intentions was going there to me to do, to get some money anyway.

Speaker 2 16:56

But I kind of disagree, though, because she procreated with the man you know.

Speaker 1 17:00

I'm saying how can you lay down next to somebody.

Speaker 4 17:03

That's laid on in life, man, that's laid on in life, but the psychology is to lay down next to somebody who does the things that you do.

Speaker 2 17:11

That's kind of sick. Like guess what baby, I sucked the dick today. Oh, you too.

Speaker 1 17:15

That's kind of sick all right when you really look at it, when you really look at people, that's queer. Who they always hang out with, who their they best friend is Females, so she ain't got nothing to do with it. She ain't mad. She ain't mad. You can see yo, nobody on the block may like him. You know, nowadays they'll jail him, but back in the days, what Nobody don't like, who he hanging out with, all the bad females and they'll jump you right now for him.

Speaker 3 17:45

Well, let's talk about Diddy's suspect, like everybody who was around him, who Hold on a second. Yeah, why stay there and know it exactly? Why stay there and know it? That's what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 18:00

So that's why I want to try to figure out.

Speaker 3 18:01

I want to verify what you're saying.

Speaker 1 18:03

Everybody is not against that. You know what I'm saying. Everybody ain't against it. That's why they got a whole community. That's why they got rights. That's why they got more rights than me and you. Everybody is not against that. We may be, or some other people may be, but that's not. You know. Everybody ain't against it. To some people, yo to. You know what I'm saying. We see, like most of the people, the guys that be having all the, all the transvestite dudes, and they'll tell you all back. You know, I'm not gay, I'm married. They just dress like that or just they fed us to have the apples and all that they hat and all that, but you know they married. So sometimes these things are acceptable in a relationship.

Speaker 4 18:42

It may be weird to us, but you know, in a relationship and it may be weird to us but you know People be already in a relationship and they be already so deep in it by the time they found out that homeboy caught up like this or whatever the shit people got going on.

Speaker 1 18:57

Look at swing clubs you know what I'm saying I mean, and then you don't know what he probably told you. He probably told you I came in here, broke, I'm buying you a brand new Benz tomorrow.

Speaker 4 19:06

They were screaming. What the fuck was this? For a while they were screaming. Johnny Gill was this. For a minute they were screaming. Eddie Murphy has some parts in this. In a minute they were screaming. Oh yeah, I remember that I remember that.

Speaker 3 19:18

Yo, I'm going to tell y'all this, though Like I Like being, like I said being at that gym on 63rd Street in Lexington, equinox, bro, I've seen some weird stuff. Like I've seen some really super masculine dudes. I used to see every single day my man I don't want to say his name, but he used to clean up the bathroom and all of that. He used to clean up the restroom and all of that, and he'll come out and go yo, bro, a lot's going on back there and I'll be like what you mean, he's like yo. You know, son, that big dude, diesel, like A lot of sword fighting, the big Diesel dude.

Speaker 1 19:59

Yeah, yo Ron Yo you know what I said.

Speaker 3 20:04

Yo, Ron, they had sword fights back there, bro, like yo it goes down in the gym. Son, I'm telling you Like on the real, like yo I can't go Like, if you like, in the saunas and all of that in the steam rooms and all of that, stay like, depend on the gym, stay out of them. Joints B. You know what I'm?

Speaker 1 20:21

saying Yo, look when I was living in. Harlem.

Speaker 1 20:24

I had a pass to the Exodus. I had an Exodus gym joint and it was certain of them joints that I went to one time like, nah, I ain't coming back here, and you know what I'm saying. And I'm not going back there Because, you know, once you got the pass, that was like you could go wherever you at, and I'm working the way downtown. I live in Harlem, so I'm all in between Manhattan. Believe me, bro, you will find one that you gonna go to and that's the one that you gonna stick in yeah, pause, pause, pause no ditty.

Speaker 1 21:00

Yeah, yo look, but you know. But it's crazy though, man. You know we gotta it just been going on before the rap game because the rap game it wasn't into that, but before this it really started with the comedians.

Speaker 4 21:13

I don't know, bam Bada was out here yeah.

Speaker 1 21:20

Yo, cliff Bam Bada wasn't out here before they made Flip Wilson turn to Geraldine. Oh, that's a good one.

Speaker 3 21:28

That's a good point, bro. All right, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 21:31

Yeah, so you know. So they really was hitting with the comedy, you know, with the comedians making all of them. You think it had something to do with drugs.

Speaker 3 21:42

Huh, you think it had something to do with drugs. Huh, you think it had something to do with drugs like cocaine and all that Quaaludes, yeah.

Speaker 1 21:51

They were doing that. They were definitely going to do the same thing. That's going on right now.

Speaker 4 21:55

Quaaludes supposedly was there to relax the anus muscles.

Speaker 2 21:58

Y'all come on, man.

Speaker 3 22:02

Come on man no ditty bro Come on, no ditty.

Speaker 2 22:04

man no ditty bro. Come on, no ditty.

Speaker 4 22:06

I'm just saying that's the word, that's the history.

Speaker 2 22:09

What he's saying is true because, you know, before it was called AIDS, it was called a grid. Remember that, like you know what I'm saying, and they were into taking heavy drugs at Studio 54. And they were getting wild with that.

Speaker 1 22:24

Yeah, but people still taking heavy drugs, so that don't have nothing to do with your action.

Speaker 4 22:28

Yeah, but we ain't talking about crack. They taking them euphoric drugs that had it in a whole nother space somewhere else.

Speaker 2 22:34

All you drug users.

Speaker 1 22:36

y'all better straighten it up, man, before you got there you knew what was going on, so you was going down there with those sole intentions. Yo, there, you knew what was going on, so you was going down there with those sole intentions. Yo, I'm about to go down here. Yo, you know that party man, we're going to freak off, man, we're going to get twisted. You already know what was going on.

Speaker 4 22:51

First of all, if I'm walking up here, if I'm walking up here and I see people, even if it's men and women, if I see them in here, butt-ass, just boning, I, I ain't gonna lie.

Speaker 1 23:03

You know, I've been to a couple of joints where you know I ain't got nothing to do with it. You know what I'm saying. I've been to a couple of beaches where like, uh-oh, anybody on the whole beach is naked. I ain't got you know what, you ain't put yourself into. But if you going to Puff Daddy party boy, you going to be in the soap.

Speaker 2 23:19

You better be careful.

Speaker 1 23:25

Yeah, man, but uh, you know, like, like I said, you know when they start forcing things on and that's what they be doing. So it's like, and that's why it becomes a crime. If people is getting into where adults is going, what they want to do, that's between them. But when you dangling somebody career in front of them, or you dangling uh, you don't contract in front of them and yo I'm going to blackball you if this don't happen, or I'm going to do this, allow this to happen. If this do happen, that's where it become an issue, where your police start getting involved with somebody. Yo, because that's really a form of extortion. You know you're just doing it for sexual needs instead of for money. You know what I'm saying. But at the same token, it's a crime, man, and that's what they be doing. You know, allegedly, what it seem like.

Speaker 1 24:09

Yeah, so basically All I know is one thing I've been making arrests for 30 years. Right, they don't be inviting us to the tours and they don't be inviting us so evidently. I always thought it because we ain't you know don. I always thought it was because we ain't, you know, going to be the brothers that was partying with the you know the nose candy and all that. But it could have been also because we ain't the brothers, you know, and all that too, because it's always the same people. If you know what's going on, it's always the same people doing this. It's always the same people in the pictures. So that's the same people that's in the lawsuit now, later on in life. So we already see why they was blowing up. No, diddy, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 24:47

So basically the making of the band. They got off lucky by walking for some cheesecake. You see, he didn't find a track good enough. So he's like you know, just walk for some cheesecake.

Speaker 4 24:58

And don't forget a lot of them dudes were hardcore.

Speaker 1 25:01

A lot of them dudes were making the band was hardcore dudes, they was hardcore street dudes, so they wanted to beat Puff up and all that anyway, just for him making them go through all that. So he most definitely knew that they wasn't the ones to try that on. You know what I'm saying? They wasn't the ones, hey, cliff.

Speaker 3 25:20

So what's your take on all of this?

Speaker 4 25:24

He ain't lying. I mean, I've been around a few bad boys, cats from bad boy camp and all of that. I ain't seen no homosexual activities, not in front of me. I don't think they would do it in the studio and all that. Whatever parties they got going on, I don't even want to participate in that because that's their parties. I'll smack shit out of one of them. I ain't with none of this weird shit.

Speaker 2 25:49

So he didn't say, yeah, I want to party with you.

Speaker 4 25:53

I don't want to party I want to party, party.

Speaker 2 25:55

I want to party party.

Speaker 4 25:58

I heard about puff parties. Craig Harris' party was out of control back then.

Speaker 2 26:02

But didn't Tigger say that they had like Chippendale men in there with the bow ties and all that.

Speaker 1 26:06

Now, first of all, if I go to your party, if I go to any one of y'all three parties, right yeah, and some dudes come out with some bow ties on yo homie, I'm going to feel offended. Now I see, if they came out, you know, like it's a little routine, they got the girls with all them and they going, and the girls is over here and there's dudes over here, but if all of us is in there, it's just basically dudes. Like why we got these dudes in there with bow ties on man, you don't butterball naked.

Speaker 2 26:32

I just don't get that part, you know I'm going to take you shopping, like he wanted to take. As Sue said, he wanted to take 50 shopping. Let me take, we'll play boy. We're going to go to Tiffany's right now. We just walk out. You know they send us an invoice. Let me take you shopping.

Speaker 1 26:46

Hey yo man, you sound like him too, man Whoa whoa whoa whoa hey boy.

Speaker 4 26:51

Hey yo man, what are we talking?

Speaker 1 26:54

about here. Hey, yo look If you notice or not, right?

Speaker 2 26:59

Yeah.

Speaker 1 27:00

Everybody. It's like all right, you see where? Friday, right when Debo rolled up, everybody know Debo's a thief. Oh man, they go. Debo Won't put their chains in, and all that. You know what I'm saying. They don't stall them on Debo. If you notice or not, when Puff Daddy come, he be in the interview. When he come, as soon as he open his mouth, everybody be like Like I hope this motherfucker don't say nothing to me. Man, you know what I'm saying. I don't hope that. I did know that. I hope he don't talk to me. Man, you know what I'm saying. Everybody be like yes, and then once he start, everybody be like because they already know the things that come out of his mouth. Is not really how you know.

Speaker 4 27:39

Pause Yo.

Speaker 1 27:43

How men, you know what I'm saying. Men don't greet each other and all that. Like yo, what up daddy? Hey yo man, you looking good, you know you in the pool, you chilling, yo, yo yo.

Speaker 3 27:56

K-Born. You gotta, you can't, don't front. Meek Mill looks suspect in that joke.

Speaker 1 28:01

Nah, he didn't look suspect. Hold on, hold, on, hold on K-Born.

Speaker 3 28:04

Hold on hold on hold on K-Born that brother Meek Mill was in the pool cooling up his booty hole.

Speaker 1 28:12

Yes, he was Yo whoa, yo listen, yo listen. Check it out, brother, Check it out, check it out. He was in the pool, just like any one of us would be in the pool. Show it off, he cooling. Nah, I wouldn't be like that. Nah, nah, that's why I'm making him feel uncomfortable.

Speaker 2 28:27

Nah, you're not calling me daddy man you don't know how to act like that.

Speaker 3 28:30

What happened before that? What?

Speaker 4 28:32

the hell is you trying?

Speaker 3 28:33

to rap to me.

Speaker 4 28:34

I don't know what happened at that pool. I know Meek was looking like he wasn't trying to respond to him.

Speaker 2 28:47

Yeah, man, just chilling, yo, he look like he got a beauty.

Speaker 1 28:51

Mikey. Overdoing it, mikey, looking like a victim.

Speaker 2 28:54

That's how he look on that pool, Like he needed a towel. Man, like I'm a hype.

Speaker 3 29:01

What about that verse? Lord forgive me for what I did with Diddy.

Speaker 4 29:07

Was that AI?

Speaker 1 29:09

First of all, we know he ain't kill nobody.

Speaker 2 29:12

Was that AI?

Speaker 1 29:13

Now, what did y'all do? It could be AI.

Speaker 3 29:19

Hold on. That's what I'm saying, k-born. He didn't do nothing, so what else?

Speaker 1 29:24

did he do with Diddy? God need to forgive you. Yeah, because you know Diddy ain't doing rights out of Chinese way, so it wasn't no type of. They took no life or nothing.

Speaker 3 29:34

Exactly. So hold on. I want to pull that lyric up. Oh man, because you, because yo.

Speaker 2 29:41

Yo Ron, it's probably with AI. It was probably AI.

Speaker 3 29:45

Lord forgive me.

Speaker 2 29:46

It could be AI.

Speaker 3 29:47

What I did with Diddy. You think that's AI.

Speaker 2 29:54

I believe so. It's probably AI.

Speaker 1 29:57

Nah man, I know you said, the girl looks so good I could suck on her daddy joint.

Speaker 2 30:03

That was big, that was him. Biggie was just can suck on her daddy joint.

Speaker 1 30:05

That was Biggie, that was him.

Speaker 2 30:06

Biggie was just. I don't know bro, that was just Biggie, that's just the line. But listen, you see what this does. Rest in peace to Biggie Smalls.

Speaker 1 30:15

I love Biggie Smalls.

Speaker 2 30:16

This makes you question raps. All right, no disrespect, I love Mobb. Deep Godfather 3. Deep godfather, three spit prodigy's verse. What are you saying? Live wide right behind me in a.

Speaker 3 30:28

remember that kick, kick what you're saying, because I don't know what you're saying godfather three.

Speaker 2 30:38

Now I was brought up to have no fear. Live wide right behind me in the rear. Like it makes, it makes you question lyrics now. Like yo, you be like what?

Speaker 1 30:46

the oh, nah, nah nah, nah, no disrespect to.

Speaker 2 30:48

Prodigy, no disrespect.

Speaker 1 30:49

You know what I'm saying? I love it.

Speaker 2 30:52

Yeah, I know, I know that, but you see how sick it is.

Speaker 1 30:55

Yo, you know they was rolling 40D Crew back there.

Speaker 2 30:58

Yeah, no disrespect I understand what you're saying.

Speaker 1 31:01

Pop just made everything a little suspicious, yeah man.

Speaker 1 31:03

Look when he was on the Nori joint. You see how uncomfortable you got to figure. These dudes are younger than us man, so you know if we was that young how we would feel. So he made everybody in that room feel uncomfortable, especially Fab, fab like yo, he throwing it off. Like you already partied with you, bro Yo, I'm talking about me and you Party, bro Yo, I'm talking about me and you Party party. All right, like where you going at with this man, like we party, party. Like I done been with you. We done drunk 100 bottles. It was girls there. We was smoking weed, we was dancing Like nah, I'm talking about me and you one-on-one Party, party.

Speaker 2 31:36

Well, I would have been like listen, it's past my curfew, I don't know what kind of party you talking about.

Speaker 4 31:43

I feel uncomfortable. Can you stop asking me?

Speaker 1 31:46

questions. Yeah, man, yo wake up. You're making me feel uncomfortable, man, very, very, very uncomfortable homie. You know what I'm saying? Why you say that? Because you rapping. To me it seems like man.

Speaker 2 31:57

How about him singing Happy Birthday. Happy birthday to you. Yeah, he did the road to you, the road joint. I'm like, bro, you're a grown man. I don't even tell my pops happy birthday like that. It's like a happy birthday pop, that's it, none of that extra shit.

Speaker 4 32:12

I don't even call my father, daddy.

Speaker 1 32:14

My daughters would call me singing, my son would call me and be like happy birthday pop. I wouldn't, even sing man, you ain't Luther.

Speaker 2 32:20

I don't even call my pops daddy. I never call my pops daddy. I don't even call my pops daddy. I never call my pops daddy a day in my life yo. What up pop? It was never come on, bro. Yo yo, daddy you looking good, I get it back then. That's how the guys spoke back then you're cool, daddy yo and all that.

Speaker 4 32:34

But they ain't saying daddy, yo daddy, yo right that was like an old yeah it was like an old, like yo, old shit, what up, daddy-o.

Speaker 2 32:42

Yeah, what up, daddy-o, daddy, you look a good daddy-o, it was never yo what up.

Speaker 1 32:46

Daddy, you know what I'm saying. Yo, daddy, you going out. Daddy, you would have been in a fight man.

Speaker 4 32:51

I mean, I remember the locks was using that sling Like what's up, daddy.

Hip-Hop Industry and Suspected Exploitation

Speaker 1 32:59

Yeah, you good extra cool moment came. Yo, what up, daddy. Yo, what up player. You know what up? You know it was a word for like player what up? You know certain people. You know he had that little flow. He came through but it was never and you ain't go on with it. After that, the first read, you went on. He wasn't. Yeah, daddy, I'm saying we're going to hang out, daddy.

Speaker 3 33:26

I'm talking on man, with this whole Diddy situation right. So I saw a picture with French Montana basically spooning Diddy.

Speaker 1 33:30

It was a whole bunch of them. It was like four of them in that picture. They probably just cut them two out, but it was like four of them. They had the tropical suits on and all that. Yeah, I've seen that man, yeah.

Speaker 4 33:39

I don't even want to see that. I probably do see it.

Speaker 3 33:46

That was at Jay-Z party, that was at the Rock Nation's party. Yo, why was French Montana up on his booty like that though?

Speaker 4 33:50

Oh come on, bro, I don't know, I was little baby.

Speaker 1 33:54

Yo, look, I was little baby when he was giving one brother like, oh yo, what up my dude, you gave him a brother hug. Now you could come through and have a group hug, you know, with all of you know, but all that got to be a circle Like yo, what up y'all? Yo, we don't do sandwiches, man, we go in there.

Speaker 1 34:09

You know what I'm saying. You don't get on the back of another bro. I'm giving you yo what up, bro. I ain't seen you in a long time bro. No brother, come give you know what I'm saying. I'm about half man. Yo what's going on back here, blair?

Speaker 2 34:29

You got to tell Diddy no, sometimes you got to uppercut him Like yo. Bro, bro listen.

Speaker 1 34:33

See, but games we play, you know, like me, like I done been in a lot of group homes before. Like I said, you know I was incarcerated, state, federal, county the games we play and the games the Caucasian play is different. You feel me Like they play games that we just don't play and it's all fun and games with them. But you couldn't do that with a brother.

Speaker 4 34:57

Because if you watch Jackass, they play a lot of homosexual games and they yeah, I mean, they do it in jail too.

Speaker 1 35:04

You be in jail, they run about brother got a towel, slap another brother on the butt and that's all fun and games in they race. You do that to a brother and see how many times you're going to get stabbed. He's not going to turn around and laugh. You know what I'm saying. They play them games, though, and don't be nothing homosexual about it. That's just the way that they be playing and the way they be talking speaking. Hey, yo man, you suck my such, such and such man. You're a cocksucker and we don't play them games. You tell a brother suck your proper part, it's on and popping.

Speaker 3 35:40

Oh yeah, for sure.

Speaker 1 35:41

But for them when they know, hey, Billy, come over here, man, Billy, this cocksucker right here, he just came and said, but that's acceptable with them, you know what I'm saying. But now when these dudes that had the ability like the big I'm putting it out there All the hip-hop executives that was of color, either they were the ones that went wrong. They're in jail, or they dead or they fruity, Because they went there and wanted to go to the next level. We was good with just grinding and doing what we do in the hip-hop community. Like you know, the hip-hop is like the street.

Speaker 1 36:18

These brothers want to be the brothers to be the first hip-hop millionaire and the first hip-hop billionaire. How the hell you getting a billion dollars in hip-hop man, when You're doing something strange? For some change, bro. We ain't stupid. We've been making records since the 80s, the 70s. Curtis Blue ain't even got a private jet and he ain't stopped making records since he started and he's still hot and he's still in churches, he's still over here and he's still doing all this. Why these dudes got so much money? Because they're doing things outside of hip-hop.

Speaker 2 36:52

Business investments.

Speaker 1 36:53

They running around with the billionaires. And oh, I got friends. That's millionaires. If my friends is millionaires, that's slapping me on the butt and giving me sandwiches and sandwich hugging me. I'd rather hang out with my dudes. That's Dalliners man.

Speaker 4 37:09

Yo, giving me sandwiches might be the illest term, yeah.

Speaker 1 37:14

You know like what you doing, homie, you done lost your rabbit-picking mind man. You know, even if it's one of your boys, it's bad. You got pulled to the side Like yo, homie, you get hurt or something like that. Don't run up on another dude. I know you wanted to greet him, but wait till he turn around, bro, and then greet that man like you know what I'm saying. Greet me like a man.

Speaker 2 37:33

You know what I'm saying they high five like this, they high five like this.

Speaker 1 37:40

Yeah, yeah, from him trying to. A lot of this comes from greed. Oh, I want to get a million dollars. Before I earn a million dollars, I want to get 10 million dollars so I can come back to the other rappers and show them who I am.

Speaker 4 37:54

Yo ain't no money worth my butthole getting ripped. Nah, I'm sorry you might look like this.

Speaker 1 38:00

Look at the pattern they're going, Cliff. This is the same pattern the old school was doing with the Melly Mells and all them.

Speaker 3 38:10

Oh, he went there.

Speaker 1 38:11

Check it out now when they got down but it wasn't sexual, it wasn't robbing them of their manhood, it was robbing them of everything that they ever had, of their music, of everything. These dudes was going around knowing that they got jerked at Sugar Hill Records and they was bringing all the other groups there saying, yo, I'm going to get y'all the same deal I got. And they was getting them the 100% same deal they got, which was a deal you get jerked brother so it's the same.

Speaker 1 38:44

Can't use that word either so right now, you got these brothers. You know you making records, like I've been making records since the 80s. I ain't got all that. So I'll be a perfect example. I'm gonna use myself as a example. Hey yo, man, how y'all brothers getting all this money, how y'all brothers doing all this, bring you down to the ultimate party, man. When you get there, the ultimate party man. When you get there, when you leave here, man, you're going to be on. Well, I've been down for 30 years. I still make a record of what's going on. You get in a party next thing. You know you're in the middle of a whole bunch of other things, man, and if you want to get in and do what they're doing. But if you want to be yourself and come on out and have to go through the 30 years, like me, you're going to get up out the room.

Speaker 3 39:34

So basically, I'm trying to figure out who. Do you think Biggie participated in some?

Speaker 4 39:41

No, I don't know, I don't know. I know a lot of lines he said.

Speaker 3 39:46

Yo Heavy D was around all of this too, no.

Speaker 1 39:48

Heavy D wasn't with the TV. I know this man. A lot of them brothers changed, oh yeah that's true, that's true. A lot of them, brothers, changed once they got down with Puff Daddy. I mean brothers came in hardcore.

Speaker 3 40:10

And after he was finished, either they was like soft core or they was dead.

Speaker 2 40:12

Yo, what's the death around this dude. It's the terms he's using. I'm sorry, bro. With this situation, gotta be careful with the words they said they came a little rugged and left a little meek.

Speaker 1 40:22

Yeah man, because you know a lot of these brothers came in hard core. You know a lot of them, but you know you try to ask yourself why everybody keep leaving the label. But they blowing up. You know of your no ditty, but you know the label is getting rising but people was leaving. Like what happened to the hit makers? What happened to these? What happened to them? What happened?

Speaker 4 40:45

to them Like what's going on here? You know, like I said my man Kirk, I've got questions for a lot of dudes that was um hip-hop dudes that just had a lot of suspect lines and they robbed me. Like DMX said, I ripped your butthole out of place, like that was out of control.

Speaker 3 41:01

Yeah, DMX was saying a lot of stuff.

Speaker 1 41:03

Yeah, he was saying a lot of stuff. He was getting outrageous.

Speaker 4 41:05

Thinking of the king of it, but DMX was saying it's wild.

Speaker 1 41:11

You got to figure that, like I said, I've been making records for 30 years. When you're rapping, you're really expressing yourself, you're really saying what you're going through and things that's happening, things that you're seeing, for them to be putting that out and the lyrics that's happening, things that you're seeing. So for them to be putting that out, you know, and the lyrics that's in there, those lyrics is lyrics that you actually seen, that you actually did, you actually something, because you know you just don't just make up a lyric. You know what I'm saying, like some people do, but very seldom you do. You got to have some type of connection to it.

Speaker 4 41:44

Yeah, because you can't say Biggie said throw him over the bridge like what. Biggie said don't you know, my nigga got a? Fucking kidnap kids, fuck him in the ass, throw him over the bridge. That's how it is.

Speaker 3 41:59

Nah, nah, nah, nah that's not how it is. That's not how it is, bro.

Speaker 1 42:05

I don't know nobody who never said that that's the way it is. You know what I'm saying?

Speaker 2 42:08

I got blood on my hand because there's no remorse. I got blood on my because I'm a corpse. I'm a nasty nigga. What are we talking about? But I think you know what it is. There was a point when dudes were doing Shock value, rap, shock value, rap, gothic rap, what they call that again yeah, I know horrorcore, yeah, horrorcore, yeah.

Speaker 1 42:31

So sometimes I think, yeah, that wasn't my type of yeah, but when you come out and say it's horrorcore, you ain't say it's hardcore, and then you going into this other stuff. You know what I'm saying. That's something you may expect if that's the type of music you're listening to. Like you watch a sci-fi movie or something, and you know what you're expecting. You're going to see all this crazy stuff but you don't want to watch to see Friday on that channel.

Speaker 3 42:55

Right, but you know, when DMX said I got blood on my hand and all that, remember that album. He was covered in blood and he had Marilyn Manson on that album. So he was still, he was going that hardcore lane.

Speaker 1 43:12

You ain't going to have hardcore man when you got blood on you and all that that's called. That's that sacrifice.

Speaker 4 43:16

You also said if you got a daughter under 17, I'm going to rape her.

Speaker 2 43:21

Woo, that's what you're saying I think because he was bringing that dark, that's what you're saying. I think because he was bringing that dark, that's not dark.

Speaker 4 43:31

Wow, that was wild, your mom mobbing and raping her Arabia. Saudi Arabia.

Speaker 3 43:38

Back in those days, remember, they weren't any cameras like they are now, so you can imagine what was going on back then.

Speaker 2 43:44

It wasn't an internet. You get your word out. Be like yo. This is what was going on back then. It wasn't the internet.

Speaker 1 43:46

You'd get your word out. You'd be like yo, this is what's happening to me. It wasn't the internet, you had to come out, word of mouth and, like we said, we've been hearing the rumors, but how far that's going to go? We ain't going to be the ones running around. Yo, we heard, yo who you heard it. But nowadays, you know, brother, get on the internet or whatever, and yo, this would happen to me. Somebody may even have a video of it.

Speaker 4 44:13

This dude said he was getting fond of my trade for boys. What?

Speaker 2 44:21

You've been good in junior. He was out there wilding too.

Speaker 4 44:24

Yeah, but yo he be wilding Dude said I've been doing in junior was out there while in two yeah, but yo he be wildin'. Dude said you've been good in junior was gripping him regular parts.

Speaker 5 44:29

He was getting fucked up by Tray. He be wildin', bro Wildin'.

Speaker 2 44:34

He was like let me out yo, let me out yo, hold on, hold on Let me out.

Speaker 3 44:39

So you're saying that. What's his name? Rod Yo. Why the hell is his?

Speaker 5 44:44

name Rod. Bro, what's his name Rod?

Speaker 4 44:48

That's.

Speaker 2 44:49

Wild.

Speaker 4 44:49

Paws.

Speaker 1 44:55

What do you got to do before the pause? Are you talking about the dude Rod?

Speaker 4 44:57

Paws. Yeah, the dude Rod said that he was getting groped by Cuma Gunning Jr and Puff Crib. So why was you getting groped by Trey? He was young, he was young.

Speaker 1 45:10

Yeah, he young man, you know what I'm saying. He trying to get in where he fit in, not knowing that this was going in. You know, like yo, what are y'all doing?

Speaker 2 45:19

homie, you know I can't hear you Don't get in where you're fitting in, that whoa yo this whole episode is paused.

Speaker 1 45:27

Now, bro you gotta call this the no ditty episode get in where you fit in, whoa yo so hold up, we got.

Speaker 3 45:40

Who do you think? Okay, black Rob ain't getting mixed up in that.

Violence, Religion, and Hypocrisy in Bronx

Speaker 1 45:43

Black Rob is too gutter you gotta figure like this man. You can't really put too much by, even with them, because at the end of the day these dudes ended up sick man. Like, what are you sick from? You know you can run around here and we can't hear you. Cliff, you can run around and say that oh, he was sick from this, oh, they were sick from that. We don't know what they were sick from?

Speaker 4 46:12

Yeah, a lot of these dudes got sick.

Speaker 1 46:14

All of them that went down. They got from gun violence.

Speaker 4 46:18

Most of them all ran to God for some reason, yeah.

Speaker 1 46:22

And usually when people be going, you know you start repenting. And all that because you know that you're going down. We think you actually turning to God, but you actually repenting your sins because you know that these are your last days. You know so. You know these dudes died of sickness. They died like. You know you don't want to put it to right. You know you really want to get it out there. You don't know what they had, man.

Speaker 4 46:43

Niggas thought Mace was bugging because he got up out of Dodge. I'm out of here. This shit is out of control. I'm going down.

Speaker 1 46:51

I'm going to church Mace is another puff daddy, though Hold on.

Speaker 3 46:57

Mace is another puff daddy. But check this out. Hold on With Mace right. There's a clip out there where someone asked this is years ago too. Someone where someone asked this is years ago too. Someone asked I think it was on 105, no, what was the name of that show? 106 and Park. I think AJ O'Frie asked him, as Mase Puffy just made a gospel album, can he do that? And then Mase said well, can't RuPaul make a gospel album? Now he said that back in the days Like way back. Mase knows something, bro.

Speaker 1 47:38

Yeah, but you gotta figure like this Mase probably was Mase probably got.

Speaker 4 47:44

I think they probably tried to violate or violated Mace and he was like I'm out of here, yo, I can't do this. There ain't enough money in the world, I'm gone.

Speaker 1 47:52

Yeah, yeah. But all Mace was doing? He ran around Because you got to figure like this Mace, just like Puff, but without all the sex and everything. He a crook too. No, I'm not disputing this. He ran around here and false profited. That's like me and you, god. We went through our transition. When we was young, we did what we did. You know what I'm saying. Then we got older, we was righteous when we was young, but then we really recognized it and started living it out. That's like right now, tomorrow, you see us and we are cold, 85 again. That means all our righteousness was phony. Because you look at Mace, he at 85 again.

Speaker 1 48:29

You cursing, you calling people, all the N-words you know, even though you're not in a church, no more you still supposed to be holding yourself in a righteous way because you already done, went to that righteous path and you've been in that path for a while. So I can understand you. Even if you on the internet, you on the podcast, you supposed to be some dude, that yo, yo, that's Mase man, yo, that brother, boom. Ain't supposed to be no cussing on your platform. We don't even do no cussing. You know what I'm saying. We try to hold it to the lowest we could. And for you to be up here, just you know, cussing and doing this and you were ex-pastor and all that man. You look super phony man, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 49:11

I kind of Just like me similar to that church stuff. He be in church screaming all this nonsense. But I'm like dog. You be with us on Saturdays with the heathens wildin', but then you go to church. There's certain things you can do, like yo I'm still hangin.

Speaker 1 49:26

the heat is wild, but then you go to church. You still can hang out. There's certain things you can do. I'm still hanging out with the crew. I ain't too good to hang out with the crew. I still hang out with the crew. I'm not going to parties. I'm not drinking.

Speaker 2 49:41

I'm not hustling, but I'm still with the crew.

Speaker 3 49:42

You know what I'm saying. I just got to hang out with the crew. Yeah, yeah. So real quick, real quick. Before we clip out of this, I want to talk about what I heard you talk about on IG, Lord K Bone, when you was talking about a two-year-old baby grazed in the Bronx.

Speaker 2 50:02

Oh man, I heard about that one over the weekend.

Community Concerns and Political Inequities

Speaker 1 50:05

Yeah, that's right up on Fordham Road, like you know where I live at too, and it's like somebody just got killed in a train station up there. This is a big, giant shopping district, you know, one of the biggest shopping districts in the Bronx, you could say, besides 149th Street. You know, and it's just ridiculous man, you know, it's just ridiculous man, you know. And we got these politicians, uh the councilwoman that I'm always going against, which is parina sanchez, that's never in the community, never doing nothing. We got the assemblywoman, uh, tapia udelkatopia, who's never in the district, never doing nothing. And you know, you're just standing right, standing right there. And then they got a program that they fund millions of dollars and their office is on Fordham Road and you still ain't stopping nothing or doing nothing.

Speaker 1 50:54

When they first went to Fordham Road, I was like why would they invest in a program that's on Fordham Road when Fordham Road is a shopping district and the police supposed to be taking care of that? You know, because you know that's not a community. Community is like. You know, we live on a block, so we know that people is like community Fordham Road is just different people traveling all day, every day. It's like 42nd Street, you know, people come up here to shop. They got no connection to here other than buying something. So you know, why would you fund a program that's housed on Fordham Road? You feel me, and they're saying that you're trying to help the community. You need to be funding a program that's in the community, that's going to help the community.

Speaker 1 51:35

And right now you know, and then a sad thing about it, that's when the kid got grazed, like a lot of you know, nothing really happened to the baby, but the next day is the baby's birthday, the baby turned three. So really happened to the baby, but the next day is the baby's birthday, the baby turned three. So there's too much going on. Man, you know, you walk down Fort Monroe right now, worcester State District. Once you get off the train, the 4 train from the 4 train, all the way from Jerome Avenue to the Grand Concourse, it looks like a third world country. All the stores is closing now because outside the store you got everybody from a different country selling fruits and clothes and sneakers. Why pay $7,515,000 a month for a store in Portland Road when you can just open up for free?

Speaker 1 52:21

You feel me, but when we was doing it and going out there and was on 125th Street and selling undershirts and all that. They shut it down. We was on the news. They was coming out there with buses, with MTA buses, locking up all the black people. But now that is all you know, the people that's the same nationality as the elected officials. That's in our community. It's okay for them to ride motorcycles on the sidewalk and not get a summers. It's okay for them to open up and cook food and sell food without a food license, without a vending license. It's okay for them to open up fruit markets and all that right On any block that they want to, and it's unfair.

Speaker 4 53:05

That's a fact. They did lock us all up when we was out there selling, when we was out there doing independent black business like independent black businesses. They removed all of that from us.

Speaker 1 53:17

Not only did, they took it, they made everybody go. It was a whole riots and all that was coming out. They were busters locking the brothers up and the sisters and they made everybody to today, go to 116th Street, to that mall. Yeah, that mall is out of town, but it's okay for them, other people to come from a different and the people that was doing it, we from here. But it's okay for people to come from other countries as long as they're your nationality and you count on them to get your votes later on. Once you get them in here, it's okay for them to open up any kind of shop they want to, with any type of license you know.

Speaker 3 53:50

That was happening in. What was that? That was like in 2005's, 2008's, when they was locking people up for that.

Speaker 1 53:59

Yeah, they was locking up everybody. They took a couple of our stuff we was selling the leather jackets and all that. Oh, you got a vending license now. Yeah, but right now, you know I done seen them come up to the moms and pops that be out there, that you know the old Frank people selling the Franks, take their old Franks there. I done seen them come out to the people with their little Coquito. You got your little Coquito out there, yo, 50 Cent. They take that. Why you ain't taking these people's fruit stands? All of this stuff. They got the whole Fordham Road flooded. Take it. Where's the paddy wagons? Where's the stuff at? Where they vending license at?

Speaker 1 54:41

So there's a lot going on right in front of us that we don't be jumping out the window because these people was counting on them. They're letting them do whatever they do because later on they was counting on them after they. They're letting them do whatever they do because later on they counting on them down with the latin votes. That's a part of that community. So when they want to go back to the vote, you remember me. I let you come through town, you came over here and then I let you open up on the street illegally. So I just let you know you won't.

Speaker 1 55:03

You know it's like this, all the okay corrals. Like you know you won't believe me. You know it's like this is all the okay corrals. Like you know, you're up here and, like the army, be all you can be, do whatever you want to do, as long as you ain't black. You know, because if you're black, american and you sell a guarantee to Egypt, you're American. You go out there and say, well, I'm going to open up a fish stand and little fish and chip, join out there. They're going to be out there every day. You got an offending license. They'll give you 100 summonses for people selling fruits and all this all around you and nothing is happening.

Speaker 3 55:34

Right, hey brothers, we got another live coming on right now actually. So, man, it was a pleasure building with you brothers today. We're back again next Monday, same time, same place.

Speaker 2 55:47

I'm in love bro.

Speaker 1 55:48

Hey yo Clip, you got to come back on with us, man.

Speaker 2 55:51

Yeah, man Clip. It's been a minute, bro, where you been. Yeah, man.

Speaker 4 55:55

We're going through some shit, but I'm all right though All right, just don't end up in Diddy's Tunnels, man.

Speaker 1 56:06

No, hey yo look, hey yo look, hey yo look you doing bad. Hey, yo, you get on your feet, right now after this Pauly Yo peace, y'all Peace.

Speaker 6 56:15

Yo.

Speaker 3 56:18

Who's?

Speaker 2 56:19

coming in? Who's next guest?

Speaker 3 56:21

We got Brother Jelani Bay in the building. What's going on, Brother Jelani Bay?

Speaker 6 56:26

Peace, peace, peace, peace Islam.

Speaker 3 56:29

Islam. We're here. We got you Moorish Mondays. That's the theme every Monday, moorish Monday. It's a pleasure to have you on again. Brother Sharif Anil Bay is supposed to be on with us too, but maybe he's. He teaches. I think he teaches something like that martial arts before this. So you know it is what it is. But you know if he comes on, if he doesn't, it's still peace. He's back on Wednesday for those who are here for Brother Sharif. But we got Brother Jelani Kalfani Bay. What's the da there on your name?

Speaker 6 57:11

um. My full attribute and title is jelani delisa abdullah kalfani bay okay, okay.

Discussing Moorish American Government and Legislation

Speaker 3 57:21

So now, um, you wanted to come on. You know, uh, you know this is pretty much long overdue. This is a a live. We started doing a lot of lives now, um, brother, so I'm, you know, just to let you know, and anybody who's on uh the live right now. We do have super chat, so if you want to donate to the uh brand, you can. We plan on doing a podcast in studio, in studio, in studio. So that's our next goal after basically becoming uh, you know, monetized, and having a thousand subs and all this good stuff and it's appreciated and it's definitely appreciated. And jelani, jelani bay was one of the first people to give us interviews to help build a platform and we greatly appreciate you, brother.

Speaker 6 58:09

Gratitude, brother. Yes sir.

Speaker 3 58:11

So now let's let's talk about it. Brother, I don't know if you, if you, wanted to come on to clear some things or you wanted to talk about. I know you know the big part of Islam, brother Islam, brother Ray Bay in the building, islam and Brother Jelani. You know we talk a lot about unity when we, when we get a chance to speak, and really that was that's always kind of been the theme around us when we are talking in general. So I mean, what's what's on your mind today? You know I got a lot to talk about. What do you have to talk about? You know, let's start with you.

Speaker 6 58:52

Well, I mean, brother, you know, for our last conversation, you know my main theme is Morse government, because you know we negate that. You know what I'm saying. We spend too much time trying to manipulate somebody else's law when Prophet Nobodrali gave us our own law. Once you have a constitution, you have your own judicial system, you have your own governmental body politic and this is why the man said in Act One we empower to make the law and enforce the law. And those laws that we make and enforce, they're for Moorish American Muslims only, and nobody can abrogate that but the problem is, the so-called leadership is not making this legislation OK.

Speaker 3 59:49

So what you're saying is is that okay? So I want you to, to, to break down the specifics of what you mean. Um, when you, when you say that you have, you have the prophet's law, right, that's what you said, right? And then you have? What other law did you mention?

Speaker 6 1:00:06

Well, there's this, you know, just like there's only two world powers, and that's the Roman Catholic Order of Mary and Christ or the Roman Catholic Church, and then the order of Islam. That's the only real beef. You know, in the in this world uh arena, you know we, always, we uh, the united states is always uh picking with the middle east and in israel and palestine, and and you know all that. And then you know we, as morish american moslems, that's one of their biggest problems, you know they. They try to discredit us as morish american mos Muslims so that the African American won't come nowhere near us. And you know, you can't, you can't forget what George Washington said in 1774 at the first Continental Congress, when he was the chairman, and he said that it is imperative that we remove the fezzes and the turbans from the heads of the Moors and remove their sandals and take a blood oath that we never teach these people who they really are, so that 200 years from now they won't know who they are, what they are or where they came from.

Speaker 2 1:01:22

I have a question.

Speaker 6 1:01:24

Yes, sir, brother.

Speaker 2 1:01:25

How can we put this into practice? As far as litigation, like saying that George Washington had honored all this in the? You know, as you mentioned in the in the press, how can we go about to have him honor a treaty as such to come into fruition, to recognize us as a nation within a nation?

Speaker 6 1:01:45

Okay. So now listen. Going to the religious corporation, a religious corporation is a subnational entity, that's a government that exists inside of another government. Instead of going for treaties, have them enforce their own legislation. Their own legislation recognizes and I hate that word the autonomy of a religious corporation. That's what Noble Drawley gave us, and that is a body politic or a government like a municipality. So in the legislation we are expected to organize our own local government, meaning what they have we must have. That's why we created the Ministry of Land Transport and Navigations. They got a DMV. That's why we did the Ministry of Holistic Health, because they have clinics and hospitals, you know, so on and so forth. We Labor and vocation, because they have technical schools, see so. And then Noble Drawlees Supreme Moorish Customary Court, because every court is a corporation, see so their corporation is attached to Rome, whereas in the Noble Drawlees Supreme Court is attached to Islamism.

Speaker 6 1:03:08

Under our law, we have the free and sundry Morse law counseling to adjudicate things pursuant to chapter, verse, sentence, paragraph, divine constitution and bylaws, additional laws and the laws in the Moorish Holy Quran. Just like the Muslims take the Surah and Ayats and that's their law, the Sharia law, it's the same way with the Hasidic Jews and they have a lot of courts and stuff like that, and they have a degree of autonomy with these courts and the laws of religion dictate that separation, see. So it's nothing like I'm trying to make up anything. There's actual legislation that recognizes a religious jurisdiction. We have negated and organized in that jurisdiction For years. You can quote me on asking for unity, asking for us to standardize those laws.

Speaker 6 1:04:11

Those laws are the end of chapters and verses of our doctrine. Let's take those out and codify them. Let's create our own Black Slaught Dictionary. Henry Black ain't a Moorish American Moslem. Why do we keep using somebody else's law to protect us when we have our own law to protect us? And I'm no mastermind. So let the masterminds come together and organize this law so our people can have protection. That's all. And we've used this strategy time and time again. And it's shut down cases. They either stay them or doggone, what they call it's another word for it when they shut it down all together.

Speaker 2 1:05:02

Walk out.

Speaker 6 1:05:04

No, no, they just shut the case down where no other action can be put on you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 1:05:11

I don't know the term for that one yeah, and that's that's trying to.

Speaker 6 1:05:15

In other words, they're running from the victory. They'll shut it down before they take that out, and that's a form of a victory. You see what I mean? Because that means that your legislation is effective enough where they go scurrying but I have.

Speaker 2 1:05:32

I have a question are there any cases that that are recorded in like supreme court? That's in file, because usually you could reference that to show effectiveness yeah, there are some um God, us versus.

Speaker 6 1:05:51

There's three of them, one of them dealing with the prison system recognizing Islamism as a religion. F Turner Ill had legislation about our feds Wearing it in the courtroom.

Legal Counsel and Religious Law Debate

Speaker 5 1:06:05

No, that's not true brother Say what now, sir? Islam, islamlam. First let me say islam to the brother. But that's not true about f turner ill. Oh, it isn't, no, sir. That's not true about brother f turner ill well, that's Brother. F Turner Ill, you know, performed successfully in the capacity of legal counsel on a number of occasions, but he set no legal precedents. He set no legal precedents.

Speaker 6 1:06:43

Did he win the case or did it go into Supreme? I know it didn't go into Supreme Court. But did he win the case or did it go into Supreme Court?

Speaker 5 1:06:49

I know it didn't go into Supreme Court, but did he win the case? He successfully represented certain people as it relates to a couple of issues, but there was no case law made and there was no precedence made. Not at all.

Speaker 6 1:07:09

Well, that's strange because you know, I've never been challenged about wearing a fez in court.

Speaker 5 1:07:16

Yeah, of course not because it's allowed as a religious headdress.

Speaker 6 1:07:20

Absolutely. I believe that was the subject matter at hand in that particular um. That was counseling that f turner ill did. Like I said, I just read the papers on the brother and um. That's what it said.

Speaker 5 1:07:33

I haven't done any in-depth research but, like I, said, but, like I said, that led that that set no legal precedence. Religious headdress has always been allowed, regardless of religion, in a, in the courtroom. The difference is there's there's. Here's the difference we're dealing with here, among other things. Yes, religious freedom is allowed. What the brother said, what you said about religious law, though. Here's the problem there is nowhere in the United States where religious law has superseded the civil authority. Nowhere, unless it is a religious matter. Nowhere has it superseded civil authority. We don't have the power to do that.

Speaker 6 1:08:22

Title 42, 2000, BB1, 2, 3, and 4. Title 42 of what Of the United States codes? Quote it please. Something to the effect of no official of the state or subdivision of the state can burden one's religious belief or practice.

Speaker 5 1:08:45

Okay, that's right, that's agreed, but that doesn't give religious law authority over the civil authority. It doesn't.

Speaker 6 1:08:55

So what does the first amendment say? The first amendment says not even congress can make a law with respect to religion. What does that mean? That literally?

Speaker 5 1:09:05

Brother. It literally means separation of church and state.

Speaker 6 1:09:09

Hello. So we're church, they're state. Diversity of citizenship diversity of state.

Speaker 5 1:09:16

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no no.

Speaker 6 1:09:22

I don't know what you're doing nowadays, dear brother, but I fight them all the time. But brother.

Speaker 5 1:09:27

okay, now here's what's deep about what you just said. The prophet didn't fight the government. He said I'm going to help the government If you fight the government.

Speaker 6 1:09:34

you're always going to have cases where some European immigrant looks at you and go well, no, you're a nigger, but who are you fighting? Anyone who burns our religion.

Speaker 5 1:09:51

But you're talking specifically in the courtrooms.

Speaker 6 1:09:55

No, not specifically the courtroom. We write correspondence to the governors, to the attorney generals. Why?

Speaker 5 1:10:04

Hold on. Why are you writing correspondence to the attorney generals and the governors of the state Diplomacy?

Speaker 6 1:10:12

Putting them on notice, putting them in contract. So are you.

Speaker 5 1:10:15

Okay, hold on Next question Are you part of the United States government or not? No, you are not part of the prophet's program or the prophet's teaching. Then Chapter verse.

Speaker 6 1:10:31

Chapter verse where the prophet said we are part of the United States, we are part of the four-teacher movement.

Speaker 5 1:10:37

Hold on, I'm going to get my literature, but before that I can quote you on that. Get the Quran.

Speaker 3 1:10:42

Islam, islam, islam. I want to just say this real quick brothers, real quick brothers. Now, both of you brothers have a point and I want to make sure both points are clear so that the public, the viewers, understand. So the brother, tim Z, said Brother Jelani is right. I don't know on what point is he making. He's saying Brother Jelani is right.

Speaker 2 1:11:05

They're referring to no school on Fridays. That the prophet? Because, as Ray Bates said, did not the brother make it so that Morris' children didn't have to go to school on Fridays so they could be observed at the holy day?

Speaker 6 1:11:18

Did the prophet do that? That's case law Board of Education versus Edwards or something. Edwardson or something like that.

Speaker 5 1:11:26

Listen, the prophet laid a foundation for certain things to happen. Now, when you're talking about the whole school.

Speaker 6 1:11:44

Thing on Friday that was put in place by the Moorish American Society of Philadelphia in April of 1933. All right.

Speaker 5 1:11:48

Resolution 70 or something like that, I mean 75? Resolution 75 came immediately after that and it was because of that action, brother, those actions were not lawmaking, they were administrative. You guys got to know the difference Now. Act 4 of the Divine Constitution and bylaws and Act 5 of the divine constitution and bylaws refutes what you just said, dear brother, brother listen.

Speaker 6 1:12:13

There is no constitution in the world that mentions another constitution in its constitution. When he says we are not to overthrow the laws of the government, he's not talking about the US government. He's talking about the Morris-DeVine National Movement. He's talking about the Morris government. What?

Speaker 5 1:12:31

Morris government bro.

Speaker 6 1:12:33

The Morris-DeVine National Movement.

Speaker 6 1:12:36

Now I remember when we doggone read that document and a whole paragraph was missing where he said that he was attending the inauguration of the governor representing the morris devine and national movement and that he would all going to be representing the uh, he would be attending the president's inauguration later on that year under the same banner. But then the document you had didn't even have that paragraph in it. So that's folly in itself that you have the same document, one has a whole paragraph omitted and one has the paragraph there. So there's no doubt that there's been folly in the Morris Devine and National Movement. Worlds have been changed around in the Morris, devine and National Movement.

Speaker 6 1:13:22

Brother, I'm going to ask you a question. It's all through it. The one we have makes more sense.

Speaker 5 1:13:30

All right, brother, I'm going to ask you a question that I asked you years ago, and I'm going to see if your answer is the same thing. If what you're saying is true, brother, if we're separate from the United States and not part of the United States, why did the prophet and over 3,000 mores in 1928 participate in the elections?

Speaker 6 1:14:04

Well, you know, do you have the documentation where their ballot was cast and their votes were counted? I've never seen it. I know you talked to me before about the block grant thing and stuff like that. I remember that and I respect that. But by the same token you're also talking about a new era in time. In the 1920s there was a lot of things that could be done, whereas in after 33, when they started monetizing the birth certificates could be done, whereas after 33, when they started monetizing the birth certificates, a lot of things changed. A lot of us got put in a servitude status. The gold and silver standard was discontinued. There was no real money after that. What does that have to do with citizenship? The wealth was on the birth certificate. What does that have to do with?

Speaker 5 1:14:44

citizenship what? What does that have to do with citizenship?

Speaker 6 1:14:50

What? What does that have to do with citizenship? Right, because the government denationalized the people when by making them corporations, when, in 1933, may 5th 1933. The executive order who got denationalized? Negroes, especially Anybody who got a birth certificate.

Speaker 6 1:15:13

Because before that we put that in our book of law. Before that, we put that in our Bible, right, brother, and the Bible is a book of law. Right, brother? You have to take the Bible to court and prove your identity. It's a book of law. Right, brother? Our need to take the bible to court and prove your identity, brother, it's a book of law as well, brother, are negroes the only people with birth certificates. No well, now no.

Speaker 5 1:15:37

So everybody got birth certificates in multiple countries now let's go back so you can answer the original question, because you did not answer it, you dodged it. Why in the world did the prophet have himself and 3,000 plus Muslims vote in the elections in 1928?

Speaker 6 1:15:58

Now, the only thing I heard on that is that he what's the word he used? It's not sponsored, it's another word. That basically meant that he supported Alderman Dupree. Who, who yeah, who's? The man dupree, dupree there's no such person I may be saying it wrong, then there's no alderman. What was his name?

Speaker 5 1:16:35

listen, brother when I asked you this years ago, you answered honest. You know what your answer was. Your answer was I never knew that they voted.

Speaker 6 1:16:49

I'm basically saying the same thing. I'm asking you for the documentation of where it happened, because I never knew. I never seen any literature in my 21 years that showed me that Cross Bay, Julia Bay, Robert Ill all of these people were on a ballot somewhere. I've never seen it.

Speaker 5 1:17:19

So my answer is still the same I never knew it happened. I've never seen the evidence. Now my next statement is this If you didn't know that this took place, if you didn't know that this took place, how can you make the assertions you're making now that you've lived it?

Speaker 6 1:17:39

Hold on, now that you know it took place, Brother, that's irrelevant to me because I know when I go, if I'm ever in a courtroom and I state my status as a minister, I state my status as the director of a religious corporation, things change.

Speaker 5 1:18:00

Here's my question to you about that Cases? Disappear. Here's my question to you about that what are you doing in the courtroom in the first place?

Speaker 6 1:18:07

Brother, it's as simple as getting pulled over because they think you a Negro.

Speaker 5 1:18:12

You think our prophet came so that you You're talking about the 20s brother.

Speaker 6 1:18:16

This is 2024.

Speaker 5 1:18:20

Brother, let me finish my question Back then.

Speaker 3 1:18:23

Let him finish more. Let him finish, brother Jelani. Let him finish what he was saying.

Speaker 6 1:18:29

Let him finish, brother Jelani, let him finish what he was saying. Stop refereeing.

Speaker 3 1:18:33

I have to referee. What do you mean? Stop refereeing, I gotta referee.

Speaker 2 1:18:38

This is crazy man. Let's keep it civil and respectful man. We can have a great dialogue man.

Speaker 3 1:18:45

Let the Maul finish saying what he's gotta say.

Speaker 5 1:18:48

Go ahead, bro. I'm a Muslim. Go ahead and talk, brother.

Speaker 6 1:18:53

Welcome to the show, welcome to the club. I am too.

Speaker 3 1:19:00

Well, look, islam, pardon me, Let me just say this real quick. Let me just say this real quick before we go further, any further. So this discussion, brother Jelani, this is Moorish Mondays, pretty much we are. We had some plan, like we were going to do a martial arts thing about Brother Sharif Bay. I completely forgot about the fact that I did wanted to have Brother Jelani come on and build on some things, and then he hit me up, he says where's the link? So that's, you know. Then I just plug, you know, basically put them in the, in the chat, in the, in the, in the conversation, or what have you, which I didn't think was a bad idea. I don't think it's a bad idea.

Speaker 3 1:19:43

Dialogue is dialogue. Everyone here we're adults. You know I have to referee the situation. If I gotta cut off someone's mic, that has to happen. If, if there's this, if there's too much chaos going on, you have something to say, brother, you have something to say jelani, brother sharif has something to say. Both of you have valid points. For the viewers to get the points, well, it has to be refereed. That's just how it's going to go.

Speaker 2 1:20:16

Don't forget. It has to be clear for the viewers and listeners as well. Do your thing, brothers.

Speaker 3 1:20:22

Brother Sharif, can you say what you were getting ready to say, please?

Speaker 5 1:20:26

I'll let the brother finish. I want to listen.

Speaker 3 1:20:27

All right.

Speaker 6 1:20:36

If Brother Sharif, you can you say what you're getting ready to say? Please, I'll let the brother finish. I'm gonna listen, all right, if brother sharif was coming on to speak about martial arts, I'm a martial artist also let's talk martial arts. If you forgot about what you approached me about and you wanted me to discuss, then let's drop it and let's talk about martial arts.

Speaker 3 1:20:48

All right. So now, now I got to make sure that. What? So? Now, this is live right. And for me, I always keep it a buck, I always keep it a hundred all the time, all the way around, all through and through. Now, as far as you and I are concerned, right now, I didn't necessarily forget about what we would, because, honestly, I don't even I don't know what we were really getting ready to talk about. Honestly, I thought we was talking about unity, you know what I'm saying and then you went in to talking about law and this, that and the third. So I just let it flow. Yes, yes, yes, yeah, brother, hold on hold on hold on no no, no, no, no, no.

Speaker 3 1:21:24

I'm going to make knowledge be born, cause when we, when we, before we even got on here, we was talking about talking about unity. That's one point we was talking about. And another point we was talking about is you wanted to clarify, but before, before this even happened, right, you, we were supposed to do a podcast, a war. A while back, you, you, you retracted, you didn't want to, you didn't want to do it because, for whatever reason, for whatever reason. So now we're on here, now You're talking about law. Brother Sharif came on. He doesn't agree with some things that you're saying. Things are getting a little heated, for whatever reason, who knows, I don't know, because I'm not emotional about this, neither I. All right, so let's continue.

Speaker 6 1:22:12

Here's one thing about me if I'm angry, I become monotone and very quiet. Other than that, man, I'm just all going basing off. But the thing about it is is this it may I divulge what we were supposed to be talking about.

Speaker 3 1:22:30

Okay, I was going to divulge what we were supposed to be talking about. Brother Jelani, I need you to specify when exactly we said that we were going to talk about this specific subject.

Speaker 6 1:22:41

Yes, sir, here's what the conversation was.

Speaker 3 1:22:44

How long was this conversation? How long ago was this conversation that you talked about?

Speaker 6 1:22:48

Yes, sir dear brother, brother, but now hold on a second. Um, just to let you know, um, I'm a grand master in the knights templar. We have the first moorish american lodge I'm. I'm running up and down the east coast. So when we contacted each other I thought we were picking up. I came to you and said let's talk about Morris government. And you said, before we do that, let's clear up these fallacies about me overcharging people or doing work for people and taking their money and not doing the work. So my mindset was coming on here to clear that up. I didn't know what the subject matter of it and that was.

Speaker 3 1:23:30

So why didn't you specify that before you got on?

Speaker 6 1:23:34

That's the last conversation we had there, brother, and I apologize.

Speaker 3 1:23:37

Conversation happened months ago, no more.

Speaker 6 1:23:40

Yes, sir, that's the last time we talked and I apologize.

Speaker 2 1:23:43

But can we say something?

Speaker 6 1:23:46

The impression that I apologize. Let's talk martial arts. I have no problem. Let's go ahead and blend in and talk martial arts, because Sharif is an excellent Kung Fu instructor. But while we was

Speaker 3 1:24:03

already going in the direction that it was going and we were already flowing. Things were flowing already and because you said that I'm refereeing, that's when things kind of went to the left.

Speaker 6 1:24:15

Don't be emotional. Sugar Don't be emotional.

Speaker 3 1:24:19

I'm not getting emotional.

Speaker 6 1:24:21

I said it. I apologize, I digress, please forgive me, please forgive me.

Speaker 3 1:24:25

Hey, mo, listen, listen, listen. It's not about that, mo. What I'm saying is this. What I'm saying is, brother, you said I don't have to, don't referee. But I'm just. It's not about being emotional. I'm letting you know. I and Mike, we have to control the room all the time, no matter who's on. Respect Got to referee, respect, respect Got a referee. So if it's out of hand, we got to clip it. You know what I'm saying? We got to fix it. Can we get it back on track? I want to get it back on track. I want to get it back on track. The Brother Sharif had something to say. In reference to what did you say? What happened? Can you recall, brother sharif?

Speaker 5 1:25:12

sure I can recall yeah um, the topic at the moment where I had asked the simple question of um. If he's holding that position, can he ask, can he answer the question as to why? In other words, if in fact the Moorish movement and the prophet intended for the movement and the organization to be separate from the United States government? The question is why did he actively and aggressively participate in governmental affairs of a foreign nation, allegedly by participating in the election in that election year? And it wasn't just for one individual, it was for a slate of elected officials. So that was the question. The first time I asked he didn't answer. So I asked the question again. And that's when he mentioned an individual that wasn't on the slate and I said that individual wasn't on the slate. He said, well, maybe I miss, miss, misspoke or you know whatever the person's name. And that's when I began to say listen, it's an entire slate. And that's when the brother started talking and I couldn't get a word in, so I just shut up.

Religious Government and Moorish Advocacy

Speaker 6 1:26:24

Well, dear brother, I apologize but I don't know anything about that. What I study is religious government and the powers of religious government. And when I see in Chapter 48, we, as a clean and pure nation, the centers of Africa, do not desire to amalgamate, that's a separation or marry into the pale skin nations of Europe. That's a separation or marry into the pale skin nations of Europe, or follow after their religion, knowing that religion is a form of law. And then we are returning the church and Christianity back to the European. Well, that is for his earthly salvation, meaning that anything that is Christian, we do not have to deal with it, because the next pair of the next verse says we are returning to Islam, for that is for our earthly salvation. So those those verses are speaking of a separation Right, not an organization. So these are the things that I read and I get. I get the impression that we are supposed to develop our own.

Speaker 6 1:27:30

I look at the Vatican. The Vatican has every department that the United States and every country of the world has. The Hasidic Jews same thing, even the Amish and the Quakers. They have different departments that are the same in every other government. The Moorish Americans where's our school? Where's our police department? You know where's our litigators to defend our Moors. You know when we're dragged into foreign courts. Where are these things? Why hasn't nobody took the time to develop these things? And nobody took the time to develop these things, you know, because we need them, because you got people, just because they say they're Moors, are being persecuted and they're not equipped to defend themselves. Or a group of individuals study law on the level where they can protect our Moorish American citizens, and those Moorish American citizens can hire them to speak on their behalf as councils. That's where my mindset is brother protection for our people. My mindset is brother protection for our people.

Speaker 6 1:28:52

I'm not on no highfalutin tip or nothing like that. I've been a victim of these municipalities. I've been tortured, my family's been tortured. So I want solutions so that nobody's family ever gets tortured again. That's my whole mission, man. That's the only thing I thrive for. That's it. If I don't know certain literature or certain historical facts, please forgive me. I haven't studied that because I've been studying that the religious law and how the prophets work compares to that religious law. See, I don't know everything, I just specialize. That's like Brother Akeem Bey. He specializes in the genealogy of the different personalities and linking them back to the Moors, to the Phoenicians and the Hittites and the Girgashites. That's his specialty.

Speaker 3 1:29:53

Okay, islam, cry, cry, innocence, all right, islam, islam, real quick. I want to know this, right. So, brother Sharif, you have the documentation of the prophet. Uh, basically, casting a ballot is how did you word it?

Speaker 5 1:30:06

it's not even just listen, it's, it's. It's. It's not like some hidden stuff hidden somewhere in a in a in a box. This was the. This is contemporary history. It wasn't just written about by the moors. It wasn't just written about or recorded by the moors movement. The chicago defender recorded. The Chicago Defender recorded it Like. This is well known. It's part of American history.

Speaker 3 1:30:33

So Brother Jelani says he hasn't seen it.

Speaker 5 1:30:36

That's hey, okay. But now here's the kicker, though, and this is my point, if you see it, not if when Now you have a real conundrum, because if that happened, part of it.

Speaker 6 1:31:15

That's a good question, because, I'm sorry, that's a good question, man, because, see, in Morris Holy, we say chapter, verse, sentence, paragraph, so we don't speculate on what we read. You know, we take it as gospel, like every other religion. Their doctrine, they take that as gospel See. So, stories outside of that gospel, that doctrine, I'm not familiar with. You see what I mean, and that's God's honest truth, you know. So please enlighten me, because I understand that 2024 is a new era in time. There are a lot of things that were going on now that did not go on back then, you know, and we, as Moorish Americans, have not made the adjustment for the new era in time. That's all, brother, and that's all I thrive for to get us prepared, because we got a lot of things coming down the pipeline and we're not ready for it at all Understood.

Speaker 3 1:32:28

But let me ask you, this being that the brother sharif has proof of what he's he, of his claim right now. He has proof, let's say, you see it tomorrow, how? What would be your, your, your thoughts on that?

Speaker 6 1:32:47

I would acknowledge it as true, but Morris government is still paramount and Morris government is still necessary. Not desiring to amalgamate is necessary. Every liberal religious government in this country lives in peace.

Speaker 3 1:33:05

He just asked you a question.

Speaker 5 1:33:07

No, no, I cut him off. Apologies, Let him continue. I remember the question.

Speaker 6 1:33:14

Every religious government lives in peace. They had a show on Amish Mafia where they was beating the taste out of doggone the villagers for interfering with their people and the sheriff negotiated with the man. He didn't lock him up, he didn't threaten him. You could tell there were two different body politics negotiating and I just don't see that with the Moorish Americans. I see them going for Black's Laws, laws, dictionary accepted for value, uccs and all of this garbage.

Speaker 6 1:33:53

When the prophets chapter, verses and sentence and paragraph has enough power to protect us if we use it properly, like we don't when we do affidavits, it's all the prophets' words. It's all the prophet's words chapter, verse, sentence, paragraph, quotes from the additional laws, the divine constitution. That is our weapon, that's what we, and it shuts them down because it's religious in nature and they can't make a judgment on religion. So it shuts them down. So that's an effective tactic to keep this pirate off of us. We've done it time and time again. So it's hard when we've actually done it, it's hard to say well, no, well, okay, I'm going to change my whole way because of a voting situation.

Speaker 6 1:34:55

It's hard, when you've actually done it, for me to do a reverse or 180. See, we were jumped on just because we were Moors. The assistant chief, police, lied on us and said we were El Rukins. I remember I told you last time and they attacked us and at that time the Eldermores didn't know what to do to assist us. And instead of jumping ship like my family did and a lot of other ones, I said I'm going to sit here and bang and swing and try to figure out this classical mess. That's all that's it. And if I'm going to sit here and bang and swing and try to figure out this classical mess, that's all that's it. And if I'm doing it in ignorance, that I'm doing it in ignorance, but it's hard when you've been effective in this particular strategy, islam, I yield.

Speaker 2 1:35:46

I have a question though.

Speaker 6 1:35:47

Yes.

Speaker 2 1:35:48

With what he's saying, reef, is that even feasible? Is it possible? Well, let me.

Speaker 5 1:35:57

I'll address that, but let me ask. I want to ask this question. The brother quoted from chapter 48. We, as a clean and pure nation descended from the inhabitants of Africa, do not desire to amalgamate and marry into the palestinian nations of Europe, neither serve the gods of their religion. Right, isn't that what you said? Yeah, you equate participating in another nation's governmental affairs with amalgamation, am I correct? Yes, sir, here's my question. Did the prophet amalgamate with the European in 1928 when he advocated for voting in that system?

Speaker 6 1:36:41

I don't know what his strategy was in doing that, sir. I don't know, I don't know.

Speaker 5 1:36:45

Either either he did or he didn't, and we know he did, so answer the question. You know it for sure, brother. I don't know, I don't know why he did it. Either he did or he didn't, and we know he did, so answer the question, guess what you know it for true brother.

Speaker 6 1:36:52

I don't know it yet what you showed me as evidence. I might need another change of mind, but until then, he's out there.

Speaker 3 1:36:58

He's out there. He's out there as public information. I think he showed it at one point. Right, hold on Brother.

Speaker 5 1:37:04

Ron. Hold on Brother Ron. Hold on Brother Ron. Listen, whether you've seen it or not is irrelevant to my question. The question is and I'll use the word if If it took place would he be guilty of amalgamating my opinion, like everybody else said.

Speaker 6 1:37:30

It's one way or the other, bro. I would say yes, okay, and here's the reason why Praise the Lord.

Speaker 5 1:37:35

That's what I want to hear, all right, all right, and here's the reason why.

Speaker 6 1:37:46

You know, one of the things I've criticized is about successions. All right, when you first start something out, you appoint people in positions and you try to appoint the people that are expertise in each of those positions, but after a while, there comes a time where the people must choose the leadership based on the standards developed by that original people who were appointed. So when will we have a national election for the next Supreme Grand Sheik, the one who will represent us to all governments of the world? Those who think they are qualified, let them go throughout the country to the various temples and campaign and convince the people they're qualified. And we vote, and I look at that as a free national ballot. You see what I mean. I mean, that's how I look at it. That's just one of the things that I look at, because when the new president comes into place, he should be in the TV, looking at our TV channel, to find out who the new Supreme Grand Sheik is that he got to deal with.

Speaker 6 1:39:06

But we're not thinking on that level, see, and that's why we have no peace, because we have no structured government that is there to protect us. You have various different ideologies. You got people who live in the Hadiths excuse me, the oral statements and don't even touch the Moorish Holy Quran. You know so our way of thinking as Moorish Americans is garbled, so when do we sit down and ungarble it? When do we untie the spaghetti strings? When do we straighten things out? When do we put some structure to who we say we are?

Speaker 5 1:39:56

I'm still waiting for you to answer that, brother. I'm still I'm waiting. I was listening intently. I still don't get what your response has to do with my question.

Speaker 6 1:40:06

Brother, I said for the next time. I said I don't know. And you asked me did I think it was amalgamation if he did it? And I said yes, so I believe I answered the question, sir.

Speaker 5 1:40:20

Okay, so you believe that if it took place, which it did, then the prophet went against his own law? I mean, that's what you did then the prophet went against his own law. I mean, that's what you say no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

Speaker 6 1:40:40

yes, to me it is amalgamation, because you're voting in somebody else's power.

Speaker 3 1:40:55

You did say yes. You did say yes, brother.

Speaker 5 1:40:59

You said yes, you said yes.

Speaker 3 1:41:01

I didn't put words in your mouth. He went against his own law.

Speaker 5 1:41:03

Yeah, I didn't put words in your mouth, bro, you did say yes.

Speaker 6 1:41:08

Brother, that's my misunderstanding. If the truth comes out and I'll eat it, but it has to be revealed to me. Yeah, I've been in here over two decades, but I'm still a baby. I'm still not above learning.

Speaker 5 1:41:27

Well, here I'm going to assist. Five years ago, I asked you this question and your answer was wow. I didn't even know that that took place. But yeah, that was five years ago. Obviously, you have not done your due diligence to figure it out one way or the other. It wasn't important to me, gotcha Well, I will put it in your lap tonight before you go to bed. Gotcha Well, I will put it in your lap tonight before you go to bed.

Speaker 6 1:41:51

I'll probably put it on the shelf, because it's not important to me. The prophet in the 1920s participating in the voting situation. I don't know what his thinking was, I don't know what his mission was or what his strategy was, but in 2024, 2024 I have no place for that thinking okay, more islam, real quick, brother sharif.

Speaker 3 1:42:12

With asking that brother, what asking that question? Brother sharif, brother sharif. What asking that question to the brother posing that question? What was your point exactly?

Speaker 5 1:42:24

the point is this I, to put it simply, and I, and I'm not being, and, to put it simply, and I'm not being. To put it simply, I'll quote a famous actor in a famous movie. Right, and based on what the brother just said, this is not offensive Because he's saying well, if that took place, then you know what? I ain't got time for that kind of thinking, I'm on something else, I'm on some other time, got it? So I'll quote Denzel Washington in the movie American Gangster. Call it what you want, still call it blue magic.

Speaker 6 1:43:00

I feel you, brother. So now you know. It reminds me of our last holy day call, Of our last holy day call. A brother from Tunisia Came on the call and told us we weren't Muslims and we weren't practicing Islam. And although brother Akeem Answered his questions Once that question was answered he went on to another Subject matter until I, who really don't have the best of patience, told the brother he was disrespectful for interrupting our holy day call for 45 minutes, trying to push his ideologies about Islam on us like we don't have a religion. So, like I said, until I get proof, you can't push anything on me. If it's not in the holy Quran, if it's not in the divine constitution of bylaws, the additional laws or the the doctrine chapter, verse, sentence, paragraph, then I will question it.

Speaker 5 1:44:12

Can I refresh your memory on something? Yes, sir, please. All right, I quoted earlier, a few minutes ago, act 4 and Act 5 of the Constitutional bylaws. You said that your interpretation of that is that when he says said government, he's talking about the Moorish government. Am I correct? Yes, I asked you. What is that? You said the Moorish Divine National Movement. Am I correct? Do you remember our last conversation on New York Perspective, when I asked you to prove that the Moorish Divine National Movement is the Moorish government and your response was that's what I heard.

Speaker 6 1:44:51

No, I read it when In the prophet's warning, the letter should be read at every meeting, february 1929. And we had a discussion about that, because the rendition you had didn't have that last paragraph. And I read that last paragraph.

Speaker 5 1:45:14

But I have to return them.

Speaker 6 1:45:16

When he was at the inauguration he didn't say that he represented the Moorish Science Temple, the Moorish Holy Temple of Science, the old Canaanite Temple. He said he was there representing the Morris Divine and National Movement.

Speaker 5 1:45:33

Now, brother, there's nothing wrong with that. And he also said Morris Divine National Movement during the time when the name Morris Science Temple of America was in use, because they were synonymous, brother, they're not separate.

Speaker 2 1:45:47

Hold on, hold on hold on.

Speaker 5 1:45:49

They're not separate, and I had asked you even in a previous show to show me, to show me, proof that the term Morris Divine National Movement is distinct from the Morris Science Temple of America, and that is the Morris government. Show me Well.

Speaker 6 1:46:07

I don't see Morris Divine National Movement on the affidavit that was placed on Cook County Illinois. I don't see it on there. Where do you see it In the doctrine I just quoted?

Speaker 5 1:46:20

Yeah, but that says nothing about it being the Morris government. Where is it incorporated or established?

Speaker 6 1:46:29

What up Show If an official shows up at a political jurisdiction and with all governments, when you present yourself, you present your name and the government you represent and that doctrine at the inauguration of the governor. It says that the prophet represented us as the Morris, Divine and National Movement. I'm just going by what the literature that we read every Friday and Sunday says.

Speaker 5 1:47:09

I got you. Nowhere does that say it's the government brother, nowhere, so show me.

Speaker 6 1:47:15

Where is it? Show me? It's an implication If he said that's what he represents that's all I needed to hear.

Speaker 5 1:47:21

brother, Did he go to?

Speaker 6 1:47:22

the inauguration representing the Boy Scouts.

Speaker 5 1:47:26

Brother, that's all I needed to hear.

Speaker 3 1:47:28

So you're basing your philosophy of the teachings on an implication.

Speaker 6 1:47:34

Me.

Speaker 3 1:47:35

Yeah.

Speaker 6 1:47:36

Not when it's in black and white, dear brother.

Speaker 5 1:47:39

Where is it in black and white? The?

Speaker 6 1:47:42

letter that should be read at every meeting. We read it every Friday and Sunday. Where does it say that? Now, who wrote it? Brother, read it every meeting. We read it every friday and sunday. Where does it say now, who, now? Who? Now? Now, now, who, who wrote it, brother? I don't know, brother, where.

Speaker 5 1:47:55

We read this every friday and sunday, brother brother, where does that document say that that is the government?

Speaker 3 1:48:04

the government, more the government where where it is.

Speaker 6 1:48:09

It is implied because he said that he represented the morris devine and national movement. Where else would that be, brother? Brother, using all five of your senses, what else would that be?

Speaker 5 1:48:25

Where's the brother? Where Listen?

Speaker 6 1:48:28

you're asking government sir.

Speaker 5 1:48:30

You're asking people to literally rest their belief on an implication.

Speaker 6 1:48:40

No, not really, Not really. You know, things are said and they lead to different things. If I, that's like me, all right. As a martial artist, if I go to a martial arts function, I go under the auspices of the Triple Fist Chaos Martial Arts Society. That is the governing body of our particular martial arts society. When was it established, our society? 1989. Where Springfield Mass? What people did it? Myself, yes, sir, and eight other martial artists Outstanding. How was it done? It was done at a meeting.

Speaker 5 1:49:40

Certificates were signed and proclamations were put in place. Now show me the exact same process, or similar process, for the Moisture by National Movement as a government.

Speaker 3 1:49:47

As a government.

Speaker 6 1:49:50

It's not there, Brother Sharif.

Speaker 5 1:49:51

I know it's not there because I used to believe it too, because the person that first started that rumor was a man named Ross Adiel.

Speaker 6 1:50:03

I just learned that today.

Speaker 5 1:50:05

Now you know, I believed it too.

Speaker 6 1:50:08

See it's hard, but when I see it in black and white, see what, in black and white, show me the name of our government, brother, because we can't be a nation of people without a title for our government.

Speaker 5 1:50:21

Our government is the United States government, brother. That's what the prophet said. That's what the prophet said.

Speaker 6 1:50:28

Where did the prophet say that? That's what the prophet said. Where did the prophet say that our government is the United States government?

Speaker 5 1:50:32

I didn't say USA.

Speaker 6 1:50:34

The United States government.

Speaker 3 1:50:43

Hmm, thank y'all. Thank for the viewers, thank you for yes, thank you appreciate that.

Speaker 2 1:50:53

I'm just a little silent, just letting you guys do your thing. My thing is that unity under one flag, we all fighting for the same thing. Let's just come to an agreement. It's okay to disagree, well, this is where it happened.

Speaker 6 1:51:12

And once again we're talking about two different eras in time. You're talking about the United States Corporation or the United States Republic, because you can't have a constitution and be part of the United States Corporation. That's a corporation. Washington DC don't have a corporation. Washington DC don't have a constitution. That's my understanding, brother.

Speaker 3 1:51:40

Islam. I was trying to figure out like. I got lost there because I'm trying to get to the point, brother Sharif, you got to make the point. Make the point, brother Sharif. Make the point. Make the point, brother, because it's going to get lost. Here we go.

Speaker 5 1:51:58

Ready. There's a host of jealousy. Hold on, I'll pull it up here. This is one of the memos warnings to be read at every meeting. Let me pull it up. I mean, there's so many places it's like where do I begin? But here's one. I'll go here. I'll start here. I'll start here. Hold on, three letters to be read at the end of each meeting.

Speaker 5 1:52:33

All righty, here we go, to be reclaimed in every meeting. It's long. I'm glad to know that I have a few faithful mores among you all and I desire for them to know the truth and the divine truth. There is a host of jealousy about me in the movement now, by the same people on our side of the nation that claimed it was only a joke and unreal. But now, since they have found out from the government officials and the nations of the earth that this is the only sole foundation that all Asiatics must depend upon for their earthly salvation as American citizens, they are working every scheme that they can to disqualify me, so they themselves may take charge of the situation. That's one, let's go. We got one more, what's?

Speaker 6 1:53:21

one. I didn't hear anything about the United States, because an American is not a United States citizen. Prove that I didn't hear anything about the United States. No, no, no, no, no.

Speaker 5 1:53:30

Prove that I didn't hear anything about the United States.

Speaker 6 1:53:31

No, no, no, no, no. Prove that you said. You're going to show me where it says United States.

Speaker 3 1:53:36

Brother Jelani, just let him flow and then you can come and rebuttal it, because now people are lost, people don't know what's going on.

Speaker 1 1:53:47

Welcome to the club.

Speaker 6 1:53:52

Please proceed.

Debate on Moorish Government and Corporation

Speaker 5 1:54:00

Here we go. This is the prophet, divine warning for the prophet for the nations. I am here by calling on all true citizens that stand for free national government and the enforcement of the Constitution to help me in my great missionary work, because I need all support from all true American citizens of the United States of America. Help me to save my people who have fallen from the constitutional laws of this government. I am depending on your support to get them back to the constitutional fold again, that they may learn, or will learn, to love instead of hate and live according to love, truth, peace, freedom and justice. Supporting our free national constitution of the United States of America. Free national constitution of the United States of America.

Speaker 6 1:54:50

Okay, Once again you said United States. United States of America and United States are two different jurisdictions. No, they're not.

Speaker 5 1:55:03

That's what you said Watch this, watch this. I want to share something real quick.

Speaker 6 1:55:08

One is constitutional.

Speaker 5 1:55:09

The other one is corporate. Let's set up and you I never do this, but this is an important topic United States versus United States of America, corporation versus republic let's set up a debate on your platform on this topic Negative, I don't debate. It doesn't have to be you, because there's other people that support this, so we'll pick somebody. Okay, praise the Lord, but that's another one. But here's the point, though, brother Jelani. Here's the point.

Speaker 6 1:55:50

Neither one of those are Moorish government, are they? No, no, it's three points more to the jurisdiction.

Speaker 3 1:55:56

See, because religion is automatically constitutional Islam, a Mikey Fever Islam. Can you read what Brother Ray Bay is saying? Because Brother Ray Bay is asking Give me a second. I got you.

Speaker 5 1:56:07

Neither brother, neither one of those is a more is more government. I agree. It says hold on. It says supporting our free national constitution of the United States of America. The problem was very specific. It didn't say supporting our own more government, Didn't say that. It says supporting our free national constitution of the United States of America. Why, You're missing the point, bro. The point is is that he's talking about part and partial of the United States of America, bro.

Speaker 2 1:56:42

Islam Brothers pardon me, and that's clear, and that's clear. Ray Bay said Sharon read chapter 48, instructions number four. Then he said Shar, sharon read chapter 48, instructions number four. Then he said Sharif read chapter 48, instruction number four. Yeah, that's what he wants to read.

Speaker 5 1:56:57

Moor side symbol of America is a lawfully organized I'm sorry, lawfully chartered and incorporated organization. That's what 48, 4 says.

Speaker 3 1:57:12

Right, I forgot about that.

Speaker 1 1:57:15

Incorporated where In the Morris government?

Speaker 5 1:57:17

Hold on Incorporated where In the Morris government.

Speaker 6 1:57:22

Alright. You know what they told me at the Secretary of State I asked them about in Connecticut it's stock, non-stock and non-stock religious. They told me about all the reports and the fees paid in stock and non-stock. When it came to non-stock religious, they said upon the original registration, after that we don't have to give them our change of address, we don't have to report to them no more, because what that did and what the prophet did Was put them on notice that he is there. Then the secretary of state told all the other corporations this entity is there. I got that from the secretary of state and every time we put a religious corporation in place they start sending us catalogs and credit cards applications, and we didn't apply for these things. But the Secretary of State put the state on notice and then they then started soliciting us. But other than that we don't report to the Secretary of State, we don't have any relationship with them than putting them on notice that we're there and that's because we've done it 12 times, dear brother, let me tell you something.

Speaker 5 1:58:42

What you're describing right there happens to every single person who incorporates a corporation from another state. That ain't nothing new. It's called a foreign corporation relative to the state that you're operating in.

Speaker 6 1:58:59

A religious corporation and those other corporations are not the same thing Because of the First Amendment to the United States Constitution. You're missing the United States Constitution.

Speaker 5 1:59:12

You're missing the point, bro. What you just described happens to anyone who is operating in a particular state under a corporation that comes from another state.

Speaker 6 1:59:34

You talking about a foreign corporation, brother, that's all. It is no, brother, because we have domestic and we have foreign corporations, and it's the same thing. We don't report to nobody.

Speaker 5 1:59:47

But see, we're talking about first of all. What do you mean? You don't report to nobody. But see, we're talking about First of all. What do you mean? You don't report to anybody.

Speaker 6 1:59:54

After we establish it. We get no correspondence from the secretary of state. We get no correspondence from the government. It is acknowledged that is a religious corporation in town and there's legislation saying that we're responsible for the organization of our own local government you got to show me that.

Speaker 5 2:00:15

I don't believe that because there is no government. First of all, show me I in that name, you know, you show me, you show me cool. But let me tell you right now texas would have long done that.

Speaker 2 2:00:34

That's true. What's going on right now?

Speaker 5 2:00:36

Okay, get my point Right. Texas would have long done it. Matter of fact, they wouldn't have to do anything. They're already a state.

Speaker 2 2:00:47

To add on to what Jelani's trying to say how can you know? You know, as a lot of some wars do believe in that where you know they want to be a nation within a nation. Right they do, and we are hold on hold on, mikey.

Speaker 5 2:00:57

Let me say this we are a nation within a nation okay, of course but that, but, but, that, but, but that means something.

Speaker 2 2:01:03

It's not what people think it means of course there's a lot of nations within a nation, but I think he wants a separation of government, or probably they're misconstruing or conflating the fact that they see Hasidic Jews have their own.

Speaker 5 2:01:16

Religious laws. Now you're from Brooklyn, bro, so you see it all the time. Okay, do you think the Hasidic Jews Are immune from civil authority? Look at what just happened recently.

Speaker 2 2:01:30

Oh, with the whole COVID thing.

Speaker 5 2:01:31

Yeah, what about the raid on the one synagogue? With the tunnels, yeah, so how in the world are they immune to the civil authority? No, they get arrested too. They go in front of the courts too.

Speaker 2 2:01:47

It's tax dollars. They just work collectively and pay for you know there you go, bro.

Speaker 5 2:01:53

That's not true? Oh well, the city Jews have their own government and their own police. Nah, you're from Mikey, you're from Brooklyn. Mikey, you're from Brooklyn, you know better.

Speaker 3 2:02:06

Islam real quick. The Brother Jelani did say. The Brother Jelani has a point when it comes to them having like their own kind of like policing force and yes you know. So what's? What is that then?

Speaker 5 2:02:19

brother, that's in conjunction with the civil authority. Understand you? I'll put it to you. Understand? That's like in Chinatown, go to Chinatown, go to Chinatown, you see it. But guess what's? In Chinatown, on Elizabeth Street, a police precinct that says NYPD. See my point? It's in conjunction. In other words, it's socio, the interface or the separation and the distinction is sociocultural people. That's why there's a German town, that's why there's a little Italy, that's why it's sociocultural Little Italy. Don't got Italian police. Come on, man Marie.

Speaker 6 2:03:11

Please.

Speaker 6 2:03:12

Connecticut General Statutes 598-33-264J.

Speaker 6 2:03:19

Nothing in this part shall conscrue as limiting or restricting the rights, powers, privileges, immunities or the practice of any church or religious society established or incorporated prior to October 1969, under this chapter or under any other law or special charter of the state, nor as requiring any such church or religious society to alter or change any rules of discipline, customs or usage in respect to its policy or government.

Speaker 6 2:03:58

Nor as interfering with the lawful acquisition, purchase, use, management, conveyance, sale or other disposition of any property, real or personal, owned or held on said date for public religious worship or otherwise by any such church or religious society.

Speaker 6 2:04:20

Nor as interfering with the lawful receipt of any grants, donations, funds and trust or otherwise for any charitable, educational or ecclesiastical purposes, including but not limited to the public religious worship and missionary purposes, by any such church or religious society. Nor as interfering with the right of any such church or religious society to have succession by its corporate name for the time stated in its articles of association or its incorporation and when time is stated perpetually, to sue and be sued and complain and defend in any court, to have and use a corporate seal and alter the same at pleasure, to elect in such manners as it may determine all necessary officers and to define their duties and obligations, and to make reasonable bylaws for its government, the regulations of ecclesiastical affairs and the management of property, including the holding, purchasing, selling, conveying or such property, real or personal, which it may have taken in payment of or as security for debts due to it. I've heard government a couple of times, brother.

Speaker 5 2:05:53

Of course Toys R Us has a government, bro. It's a corporation. Hold on brother, hold on, hold on Brother. I'm not being facetious, but I'm glad he thought that was funny. But check this out. Everything he said and everything he read I agree with 100%. But here's the problem. In this country we have what's called separation of church and state, right? Do we know what separation of church and state means? People? First of all, everything that the brother said I agree with 100%, because it's talking about within the context of religious organization and there is government, because you have authority within a corporation, within a religious organization or any other type of organization. But guess what? You don't have Nowhere in your religious organization, in its bylaws, in its creation, does it cover civil authority or superseding civil authority. It operates within the confines of its design. It does not operate outside of that. It does not operate Outside of that and the laws that you just read Are 100% in conformity With that fact.

Speaker 6 2:07:20

But it doesn't say that.

Speaker 5 2:07:22

You just read it.

Speaker 6 2:07:24

No, it said it's government, it's own government. It didn't say nothing about civil authority, brother. See, that's what I mean about chapter and verse government, its own government. It doesn't say nothing about civil authority. Brother, it's government. See, that's what I mean about chapter and verse, bro. Can I finish? I'm going to read it for what it is. I'm not going to add little more.

Speaker 3 2:07:39

Brother Jelani, just let him finish. Brother, Just let him finish his point.

Speaker 5 2:07:43

Bro, you stay cutting me off man.

Speaker 6 2:07:47

I apologize, brother.

Debate on Religion and Civil Authority

Speaker 5 2:07:52

People think that they see the word government and that means, oh, we're independent of another government. That's a problem. That's a problem. They see the word government, oh, that means we can just do everything that every other government does. No, you can only do what's within the confines of the structure of your organization. Let me repeat that you can only operate within the parameters of the purpose of your organization. I'm going to say it one more time you can only operate within the parameters of your organization. And one other thing there is absolutely no law that exists, no law that exists in this country, in the United States of America, whether you want to call it a corporation, republic or whatever that allows a state to create an entity greater than itself or independent of itself. There is none.

Speaker 6 2:09:09

Nowhere in the legislation that I read Did it say anything about an organization. It said church or society, not organization. Let me reword my Society. Is responsible for organizing Its own government. I'm not going to read into that, because that's the legislation of the state. They knew what they was doing when they wrote it, or they would have said with the exception of civil authority. So I'm just reading what it says.

Speaker 5 2:09:44

Okay, so watch this, watch this. There's no laws in this country, in any state, that allow for a society to do the same thing, a society to do what? To create the creation of a society that would be independent of the state or superior to the state. If that was the case, there would have been no civil war, the South would have ceded peacefully and there would be the Confederate States of America and the United States of America. What's the relationship about those organizations? And cannot even acknowledge that the Confederate States existed as an independent entity, because Congress doesn't have the power to do so. In the congressional record it's not called the Civil War, it's called the rebellion.

Speaker 6 2:10:44

What does that have to do with religion? It's society and government.

Speaker 5 2:10:52

This is what it has to do with religion, brother. We have separation of church and state. That doesn't make religion and state equal and independent. You need to study the doctrine of the separation of church and state. It does not make religion equal and independent to the state, it doesn't. It just means that religion cannot inform affairs of state.

Speaker 6 2:11:17

That's what it means. So when it says Congress shall make no law with respect to religion or the practice and establishment thereof, what does that mean Exactly?

Speaker 5 2:11:31

what I just said. It means exactly what I just said that religion does not overshadow the state.

Speaker 6 2:11:40

Forgive me, my reading comprehension must be off, but when I read that it tells me that the state, when it comes to somebody's religious beliefs and practices, cannot make policy to override the laws of their God.

Speaker 5 2:12:03

Yeah, it does mean that too. But what does your religious society have to do with civil authority?

Speaker 6 2:12:17

Nothing, we suppose we have our own.

Speaker 5 2:12:20

No, no, no, no, no. You don't have your own civil authority.

Speaker 6 2:12:23

Okay, we don't have it because mores have not created it.

Speaker 5 2:12:26

No, you don't have it, brother, because it already exists. Brother, who did? You don't have it, brother, because it already exists.

Speaker 6 2:12:33

Brother.

Speaker 5 2:12:33

Who did you have to file with? Who did you have to file with brother your stuff? Who'd you file with? Now, before you answer the question, hold on. Before you answer the question, keep in mind that it's public information. It's public information. Who did you have to file with? Secretary of State Putting him on notice? So why no? No, you didn't put him on notice. You incorporated brother. Stop putting on notice. You incorporated. It's public notice. You're a not-for-profit organization. Incorporated. It's public notice. You're a not-for-profit organization.

Speaker 6 2:13:12

What we're, what the profit put in place a religious corporation. I just told you that. The woman told me that, other than putting it on the record, there's no other responsibility to the state.

Speaker 5 2:13:26

I didn't make that up. A state official said that, brother, you didn't file an affidavit, you incorporated.

Speaker 6 2:13:35

I mean, I understand. I mean, I guess you in spirit was there with me, Brother you filed an incorporation document, brother.

Speaker 5 2:13:44

You incorporated, you incorporated.

Speaker 6 2:13:50

That's what you say. But even if it is an incorporation as a religious corporation, we were told that that religious corporation has no relationship to the Secretary of State.

Speaker 4 2:14:05

after filing that's what you were told. That's what I was told.

Speaker 6 2:14:13

All right, bro, and we've done it 12 times. Okay, let's talk martial arts. Tell me about Mo Yinka.

Speaker 3 2:14:29

Well, the martial arts conversation. We're going to have to run that next week man. Because you know, this is normally an hour. Every show is an hour. Every show is an hour. Yeah, yeah, I don't know if you want to continue or you're done there. It seems like it's like a stalemate at that point there. I'm done, my brother. It seems like it's like a stalemate at that point there.

Speaker 2 2:14:51

I'm done my brother, it was a great, you know what I'm saying. Dialogue, I learned. You know what I'm saying. Both brothers are from both sides of the sphere, they have philosophical views and they want to go further.

Speaker 5 2:15:04

We can even argue as Muslims, but that's the thing You've got to be Muslims, this cutting off and disrespect and facetiousness, that's out. I don't do that, that's out.

Speaker 6 2:15:18

Well, brother, you know, if I did, brother, I apologize. I'm just very zealous about my point and I apologize humbly. But you know this is not our first bout and previous bouts. Those bouts will never happen again. So I apologize if I cut you off there, but I have much respect for you. You know what I'm saying. But I have much respect for you. You know what I'm saying. We've known each other for years, so there's no love lost. Like I said, I have enough respect for you as a Seafood and as a Grand Chute because you are very knowledgeable. I've watched your debates over and over again. You've always crushed your opponents. So you know, if you think I cut you off disrespectfully, I apologize. For the record, I was just trying to defend my dean, that's all all right, that's, that was peace.

Speaker 3 2:16:22

Uh, like I said earlier, you know, this was uh, just like I had, um, what's the name? Uh, brother arnil bay coming when sharif was on. This was just like I had what's his name? Brother Arnil Bay come in when Sharif was on. It was just a spur of the moment Arnil Bay was in. I said, hey, just come on. So for me this was just like Jelani come on in. He helped us build the platform, just like the brother Sharif in the beginning. So, hey, come on in, it's Moorish Monday, let's build. Why?

Speaker 6 2:16:51

in the beginning, so, hey, come on in, it's Moorish Monday, let's build, why not? Hey brother, that cat was like shots fired. Oh man, oh killed him. You know, he was like the hype man.

Speaker 3 2:17:01

All love and peace to both. Bro, who was the hype man, though, Now hold on hold on hold on.

Speaker 6 2:17:07

Y'all know that.

Speaker 3 2:17:09

Who was the hype man, though? What do you headshot? Headshot that's what he was saying throughout the whole thing. Oh, you talking about Arnel B?

Speaker 6 2:17:22

it's all love, man, it's all love. Really, I enjoyed this segment and maybe we can do that segment, brother Ron, because it's very important. You know, because you know, nobody talks to me, they talk around me. So when you came to me with that, I said enough is enough. We're going to address that.

Speaker 3 2:17:45

Oh, you're talking about your situation with the.

Speaker 6 2:17:47

Yeah, with the thing we was talking about before, yeah cause I mean everything we're doing, we're doing for the people. So you have smelly culprits out there that don't want nothing done for the people. You see what I mean? They really don't, so they'll communicate trash. You know, there's always two sides of a story his side, his side and the truth. So when you brought to brought that to me, I want to bring the truth.

Speaker 3 2:18:19

Hear my side of the story now the thing about it is what we're talking about. I don't really want to talk about on this yeah, that's why. That's why I'm being on this, on this episode, but, um, you know, if you want to do something like that which I don't really want to do, really, you know- I mean okay, but we'll leave it alone, because but if you want to, if you want it, because my thing is like this I don't want to cause no issues, so like if you want to do something like that, you can't be the only one to talk.

Speaker 3 2:18:51

You know what I'm saying, so the so people who may disagree with what you're saying are gonna have to be on too. You know what I'm?

Speaker 6 2:18:59

saying well, exactly, I would love to see these people who have the disagreement everybody hiding like doggone, you know, like, like, like, uh, you know ghouls and stuff like that, brother, because if you have a problem with me, communicate it with me, but don't tell everybody falsehood about me. And then when I come out and go, okay, look, let's address this, let's step to me, let's see what it is, and then nobody's around, don't, nobody want to step up, because I got horror stories from these moors.

Speaker 3 2:19:31

Well, that's a whole another energy. That's a whole another energy in episode.

Speaker 6 2:19:39

It was very educational and Seafood a grand chic. My email address is SeafoodJelaniBay at gmailcom. Please send me any type of literature or anything so I can read over, sir, so you know I can get an understanding overstanding understanding. I welcome it with open arms.

Continuous Commitment to Personal Growth

Speaker 5 2:20:01

I mean I'm going to send it to you, because I said I was going to send it to you but you said out of your own mouth that basically you might as well wipe your backside with it, because you're going to sit it on a shelf and think what you think anyway, but I'm going to send it though.

Speaker 6 2:20:11

Yeah, I mean, it's always for my improvement. I've just never. You know, send it to me please, I'll read it, I'll check it out. You know we'll do a Friday or Sunday call on it. You know we don't run from information, brother. That's what it's all about. It's the age of Aquarius man. You know. We got to know.

Speaker 3 2:20:35

And we got to take action. Islam, so I want to cut the show. Peace to everybody. Man, thanks for coming out viewing us. We really appreciate it. See you live Wednesday, 7 o'clock. Peace.