NYPTALKSHOW Podcast
NYPTALKSHOW: Where New York Speaks
Welcome to NYPTALKSHOW, the podcast that captures the heartbeat of New York City through candid conversations and diverse perspectives. Every week, we dive into the topics that matter most to New Yorkers—culture, politics, arts, community, and everything in between.
What to Expect:
• Engaging Interviews: Hear from local leaders, activists, artists, and everyday citizens who shape the city’s narrative.
• In-Depth Discussions: We unpack current events, urban trends, and community issues with honesty and insight.
• Unique Perspectives: Experience the vibrant tapestry of New York through voices that reflect its rich diversity.
Whether you’re a lifelong New Yorker or just curious about the city’s dynamic energy, join us as we explore what makes New York, New York—one conversation at a time.
Tune in and let your voice be part of the dialogue on NYPTALKSHOW.
NYPTALKSHOW Podcast
Syracuse History & Culture Part 2 - Ishmael Bey & Shiek EL
Beyond the five boroughs lies a New York story rarely told—Syracuse, a city that served as America's social laboratory where policies affecting Black communities nationwide were first tested and refined.
In this eye-opening continuation of our Syracuse history series, native residents Sheik Denim L and Ish provide firsthand accounts of how this "experimental city" shaped national approaches to urban communities. They reveal shocking historical facts: Syracuse contained America's first explicitly labeled "Negro section" on city maps, pioneering redlining practices that would spread nationwide. Even more disturbing, the RICO Act—typically associated with mafia prosecutions—was first deployed against Black youth in Syracuse before being exported to other cities.
The conversation paints a vivid timeline of community transformation. The Civil Rights era brought relative prosperity with strong two-parent households and thriving Black-owned businesses throughout the South Side. By the 1980s, strategic dismantling of support programs like CEDA (summer youth employment) and community centers created vulnerability just as crack cocaine arrived—a sequence that appears methodical in retrospect. Today, while Syracuse ranks first nationally in childhood poverty, the city spends $85 million on an aquarium while Pioneer Homes, New York State's first housing project, loses its renewal contract after 50 years.
Hip-hop emerges as a thread of resilience throughout the narrative. Syracuse developed its own vibrant scene, with university students bringing early mixtapes from NYC while local break dancers, DJs and poets created cultural spaces of resistance. The Nation of Islam and Five Percent Nation established significant presences, offering structure and knowledge to youth navigating difficult circumstances.
Take a journey th
Welcome to the Fit, Healthy and Happy Podcast hosted by Josh and Kyle from Colossus...
Listen on: Apple Podcasts Spotify
NYPTALKSHOW EP.1 HOSTED BY RON BROWNLMT & MIKEY FEVER
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what's going on? Everybody? It's ron brown lmt, the people's fitness professional, aka soul brother number what, when I'm sold brother number three? Now hold on one second before you talk. Uh shake denim ill, can you turn the music off in the background, cause I don't want. Yeah, yeah, copyright strikes and all that. Let me know when you turn it off. You turned it off, yep, yeah, so, uh. So brother number one, I say on here, but according to uh shake denim denim number one, I say on here, but according to Shake Denim Ill, I'm soul brother number three.
Speaker 1:Yes, sir, I'm soul brother number two. He's soul brother number two Since 1981, bro, all right, that's peace. So now, how you doing. Oh, first off, I got on a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle shirt, right Okay, and it's green, so that's why it looks like I'm a part of the graphics. So, yeah, pardon me y'all, but you can see me and, most importantly, you can see Shake Denim L. So let's talk about it. How you doing. How you doing this evening.
Speaker 2:Yo bro, I'm good man, I'm chilling you, you know. I'm saying taking it easy man, you know, got off work and just relaxing man. Yeah, I mean just it's cool now ain't doing much, that's peace that's peace, so let's go into it.
Speaker 1:We're talking about, uh ah, it's history. It's the history of syracuse part two. We're talking about syracuse part two. Um, I just want to let everyone know. So, brother, number three, put, put a different color on yo. Yo, I can't now, I can't, it's all. I'm already stuck with it it is what it is now bro, you know, I mean.
Speaker 1:I'm a part of the screen now. So now, um, I wanted to. The reason, I want to let everyone know that the the reason why this Syracuse piece is extremely important to me is because the whole concept of NYP talk show was not only to bring, you know, the conscious movements to the forefront and and and try to put it into the media, so to speak, is also to highlight parts of New York that people don't talk about. People act like New York is just the five boroughs, but that is just not the case whatsoever. There's so many great things going on in the state of New York and we're kicking off that piece with Syracuse. Oh, wow, we got Mikey Fever on tonight. Mikey Fever on, hold on, hold on. Yep, yo, mikey Fever, you see me, you see my shirt.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, yo that. Oh no, what's up with that green screen Green?
Speaker 1:screen. Yeah, yeah. So I was telling the people on how important this Syracuse piece is to us, because we wanted to highlight the whole New York state.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so that's where we left off here. So Shake Denim, let's go right into it. I want to ask you what was Syracuse like for Black residents during the Civil Rights era, if you have any information on that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was prosperous in a sense. I mean, we had two family. The two family structure was very, was very permanent at that particular time. It was very, it was very apparent. Most families lived in homes. I mean, we did have, you know, by 1950, 1951, they had removed A whole war. The fifth war was removed and they put up an infrastructure, an interstate, and now it's funny because right now they're removing that same interstate that displaced a whole world of Asiatic people. You know what I'm saying. So they're removing it now, you know they're removing it.
Speaker 2:But besides that, we had, there was, everybody was working. You know there were, there were, there were factories, a lot of factories, people were working. But there was also, there was also, from my understanding, there was also a strong civil rights movement, because when I came of age, when I got, you know, when I came, I was born in 68. So when I came about seven, eight years old, I was running into organizations like Harambee and all these different types of organizations that were centered around African learning or cultural consciousness, things of that nature, and of course that was stemming off probably from the earliest, you know the earlier things that was happening in the 60s.
Speaker 2:But the family structure was pretty, pretty strong. There were, there were, there were. I'm sure there was families that didn't have, you know, two parents or whatever, but the majority of my friends and their parents, you know, they came up in with a structured household and we had businesses. Everybody had businesses. Syracuse is full of Asiatic businesses and we had businesses. Everybody had businesses. Syracuse is full of Asiatic businesses. South side was full of businesses grocery stores, different types of clothing stores, tailors, all types of different things right in the community. By the by the mid 70s into the early 80s, a lot of those businesses had begun to shut down and were sold off or the family members didn't want to continue the businesses of, you know, of their parents or whatever, when it's other things.
Speaker 2:So there was, there was, there was prosperity. You know the time was very, um was very prosperous at a particular point in time. You know everybody worked, everybody had jobs, everything was good. Um, we had our own, we had. We had little issues police, police brutality, certain little situations that happened here and there, but the civil rights thing was pretty strong. Syracuse was pretty strong. With politics, the early the mid-60s, early 60s, mid-60s Syracuse was pretty strong politically, just having political awareness. Our communities were more politically aware than they are now. I would say in those times Definitely.
Speaker 1:All right, I'm going to Peace.
Speaker 4:Peace and blessings to the family so good to going to peace-ish Peace, peace and blessings to the family. So good to see everybody how y'all doing this evening.
Speaker 1:Great man, great great. I like that setup your mic sounds right, man, I appreciate that.
Speaker 4:Thank you so much, king. Try to invest in it. I can't hear you, god. You can't hear me. You can't hear me. I can't hear you, god. Okay, can everybody else hear me?
Speaker 2:okay, yeah yeah, I hear you. Okay, okay, that's crazy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he's joking around Yo. So the same question what was Syracuse like for Black residents during the Civil Rights era?
Speaker 4:During the Civil Rights era. I would definitely agree with my brother. As far as the civil rights, the civil rights era, you had a lot of leaders that would step up in Syracuse and those leaders they were kind of in on a national level, but in Syracuse we leaders, they were kind of in a on a national level, but in Syracuse we're considered a small city. So there were a lot of things that inflected us that then affected people nationally. Example we were one of the first people to get um the red line district. Historically, when you look at where it started at, it started in syracuse wow actually had on the first maps of syracuse.
Speaker 4:They had negro section of town and they actually said negro on the map. So we were allocated these areas of syracuse only for black people, you know, and that hadn't been done before. So they would experiment with us even with, like, the rico act you just saw how diddy was facing rico charges on something that was a manifestation of the man Act. That man Act was of course put in creation to go against Jack Johnson as a boxing champion. They would use the man Act because he was running around with white women and of course they couldn't get him, defeat him in the ring. So they created the man Act to catch him on kidnapping charges of the white women that he was running with.
Speaker 4:Well, that man Act evolved into the RICO Act and they inflicted the first RICO Act on the Syracuse black youth. Those street gangs were being seen as racketeering gangsterism on a whole other level. That had never been done before the experiment on Syracuse. And then it goes off to other areas because we're a small quote-unquote city.
Speaker 3:That's crazy. I have a question, being that Syracuse, I believe, is close to Canada, right?
Speaker 4:It is. We're in central New York, yeah, but we get that Toronto, buffalo and Toronto area. We're in central New York, yeah, but we get that Toronto. You know Buffalo and Toronto area yeah.
Speaker 3:You don't believe, maybe I could be wrong. Some of the remnants of that prejudice redlining, came from the time when so-called slaves were running to the north, because I know a lot of them had little villages around that borderline.
Speaker 4:That's true. Just outside of Syracuse we have a spot called Auburn New York. Auburn New York is one of the homes of Harriet Tugman. It was one of her last homes that she lived in and it's a museum today. So it was very instrumental. You accurately said of the Underground Railroad and slavery. We have statues in Syracuse called the Jerry Rescue. That was where they actually broke into the courtroom and broke that slave out of bondage. So it was very instrumental. That was spot on. Yes, sir, brother Mikey.
Speaker 3:I remember that because one of my elders, mr Ray May rest in peace, took my father and I up there as I was a child, I remember that just came back.
Speaker 4:You actually have little tunnel areas too. Too, in Syracuse you have tunnel areas where if you go down to basements they interconnect. That was the way that they were able to kind of run some of the slaves through. Yes, sir.
Speaker 1:All right, Second question. Mike, you want to go with the second question?
Speaker 3:Go ahead, all right, second question Go ahead.
Speaker 1:Gar. Second question how was the black population in Syracuse changed over the decades? Changed over the decades.
Speaker 2:First of all, I can't hear the brother and I can't hear Ish. I couldn't hear none of that dialogue that just went on, oh really. Yeah, he was saying that I can't hear Ish, I can't hear the brother, I can't hear brother Mikey, I think it is. Yeah, I can't hear them.
Speaker 3:You may have to log off and log back in.
Speaker 4:Yeah, you're about to go out and come back in, because I can hear you and everybody.
Speaker 1:I can't hear them. I can hear you very well, brother. What they're saying is log out and then come back in.
Speaker 2:Okay, I'm going to do that, all right.
Speaker 1:Islam peace, peace to Abin brother. Shawnee said wow, that's what I wanted to ask how big is Syracuse? Shawnee wants to ask how big is Syracuse? Yeah with.
Speaker 4:Syracuse, although we're in central New York, we're considered the small out of the big three outside of New York City. Of course you have the boroughs and you have even the groups outside of the boroughs, but we're smaller than Albany, we're smaller than Buffalo. We're even smaller than Rochester. For us, our population, for us, to get a dome was a big thing. That dome was holding 50,000 or 60,000 people, but it was a big thing for us because we're small. Everything revolves around quote unquote the university.
Speaker 3:We're smaller than Rochester. I've been to Albany. It's crazy he's saying this. We got to take a trip up there, ron. I got family Clinton in Washington and this was what 97. They had it on the hill up there where I saw like the Nation of Gods on Earth had their little center over there and I remember no disrespect. A lot of gods would come from up north, you know, from prison system. You hear them out there building. It was in Albany.
Speaker 4:Absolutely. Can you hear us?
Speaker 2:okay, now Definitely I can hear y'all now, you know what I'm talking about.
Speaker 3:Clinton and Washington on that hill.
Speaker 1:That's the goal is to go around to different places in New York. However, we got to build this, build it more. Syracuse has to be the first spot we go to and for sure we already been talking about going out there. We've been talking about going out there now, since we've been doing the podcast.
Speaker 3:Hell, yeah, it's that drive. It's like drive. You're like no, it's the drive.
Speaker 4:It's about four hours.
Speaker 2:Yeah, about three and a half four hours. Yeah, about four hours. You can do that, man, it's an easy ride.
Speaker 3:We cut the road a little bit.
Speaker 2:You asked a question about how has the community changed over the years. It's changed significantly due to a couple of factors. One thing about Syracuse if you study it and how it was designed and how it was built Ish can bear witness, he can verify it as well Syracuse, it's an experimental place. It's an experimental city. It's a place where they run tests and they do certain types of things. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:Syracuse was the first place that RICO was utilized for children, teenagers. You know RICO was racketing. You know the conspiracy laws that they were using to pin the mafia, la Cosa Nostra. Syracuse, new York. They used that for some youth who weren't even recognized, you know, weren't technically a gang at all. It was just from a community, from a street or whatever, had no hierarchy, had no name, titles or whatever, but they were very. They were very, you know, efficient at what they did, though. You know what I'm saying. But that's just an example.
Speaker 2:It's changed over the years due to certain factors, and it got worse. We had an influx of heroin that began to hit syracuse in the, I'm gonna say, the mid 90s. Um, we had a lot of. We had a lot of what we call transients coming from jersey and they brought a lot of heroin with them. You know I'm saying the hustle. You know the opiate game just kicked up because Syracuse is a crack was, was, was a crack cocaine spot. That's what it really. That's what it was. You know, the heroin thing just came and took it by storm. Downtown Syracuse became a haven and it just is right now. It's just it's digressed tremendously. I mean, we were ranked number one in childhood poverty nationally just in the last couple of years.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 2:Wow, wow, yeah, wow, yeah. But you know what's crazy? The places where that are considered the impoverished areas is where the most stores are. You know what I'm saying? The most family dollars and you know dollar trees and things of that nature. Yeah, interesting.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's funny, you couldn't. You couldn't hear what I was saying, but I was pointing that out also, so you're just spot on. That shows that it was right and exact. We're talking about the experimental city, us being a small city, the ronco act. That's exactly what we were talking about, but you can hear the conversation, so you're spot on mind detect, mind. You know that, you know indeed, we, we got the roots. Yes, sir you already.
Speaker 3:You already know I got this question. Who were some of the unsung local heroes in Syracuse black history.
Speaker 2:Man Oliver Lee.
Speaker 4:Brother Oliver, oliver Lee, definitely Oliver Lee, one of the elders of the city. Yeah, brother, baba Omobuwale Omobuwale. For sure, ted Grace, definitely. Mr Grace he was a martial artist. He also created an academy. It was for children, a cultural academy, a haven for us and for people to go to. Young couples would be able to take their children there, knowing that their children would be safe at the academy.
Speaker 2:Definitely Things like that we had a lot of influential elders that would you know work in the community and we knew all of them. You know, I mean like we we sat, we sat with, with all of them in some form. You know. I mean even even like it's a brother named bongo on south bank he runs, he runs a restaurant. Bongo has been a staple in the community for 50 years, man. Before he was a restaurateur, he had a store called Island on South Salina Street and he brought a lot of West Indian, jamaican history and all that type of stuff. And he married an American sister and he just became a staple in the community as well.
Speaker 4:Man, and they lived across the street from me in 1976, so I've been influential by a lot of these people you know, just in the immediate community. We lived on maple street in 76 and he was my neighbor across the street yeah, yeah, there was reverend.
Speaker 2:there was reverend walker and reverend theodore jones. Um, they were very influential, um, they did a lot of things for the people. It was just, you know, it was a lot. Actually, when you think about it, I know I'm missing people. Right, it was so many. We was around in those times. Syracuse was very cultural. It was culturally sound. You know what I'm saying. It was culturally renaissance and it was culturally sound. You know what I'm saying. It was culturally Renaissance. It was culturally sound. We had culture. I mean, we had cats, we had the historians, we had gods, we were culture. But it died, it got destroyed. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4:We even had television shows too, like Caramoo. My mother was a poet, so she used to do the Saturday or the Sunday morning poetry sessions on a show called Karamu Very African conscious, and things like that, and folk art gallery and things like that.
Speaker 3:That's cool Indeed, indeed In our communities, man, because over here in the city we had, like it Is. Remember that, ron.
Speaker 2:With that dude, with Bill Noble.
Speaker 3:And it's crazy, gil Noble, and it's so crazy Shout out to Gil Noble.
Speaker 1:Gil Noble inspired this show. I'm the new Gil Noble.
Speaker 3:It's crazy how that story is constantly repeated, how crack came in and destroyed us. We had the heroin in the 70s, 60s, 70s, cocaine, but when that crack came about it really cracked our communities, man.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that was a great shot, man. I mean you got to give the enemy, to give the enemy his, his respect, because he's he's an admirable opponent.
Speaker 2:He's an he's an admirable opponent. It is what it is. He's an admirable opponent. That means that we, he studies, he researches and he knows certain. He knows things because they set the environment in order to do what they do. Certain he knows things because they set the environment in order to do what they do. So when you design the environment, it is easy to take control and put certain things in place because you already know the needs of the people, not what they want, but the needs you. You take away the needs and you give them what they want yeah, man, he had patience also patience.
Speaker 3:Unity and patience, that's what it is. They play the long run run and you see what happened?
Speaker 2:right, they played the crack game so strong that they forgot about heroin. And they forgot. They said oh, that's just an urban issue, leave it there and let them go. But now look, look today.
Speaker 3:Fentanyl is killing their own, and now it's epidemic.
Speaker 4:Yeah, now it's cold red yeah now it's epidemic.
Speaker 2:It's so much so an epidemic that they've created facilities where you can. They have shooting facilities where you can go shoot up. There's a nurse there in case you, you know, I mean in case you fall out. They got the nox along and all that stuff. Man, you got actual shooting facilities. We used to have to go, and you know shooting galleries in the hood, somewhere in an abandoned building or whatever, but they actually created a resource harm reduction where they can actually, you know, you go into a place. They give you needles, give you clean needles, give you everything you need to clean your needle with and everything man.
Speaker 3:All because little Dylan died right.
Speaker 4:Yeah, exactly Now, it's humanized yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, all right.
Speaker 1:Who were some of the unsung local heroes.
Speaker 2:You already said that. Right, how has gentrification affected Syracuse's community? Well, as you know about Pioneer Homes, losses on, lost his renewal contract right after 50 years. Right, correct, correct. So that means that all of those people living in that particular housing project or housing pilot will have to be displaced and removed somewhere else because she bought all of that.
Speaker 4:So just to put perspective to it, he said Pioneer Homes. It's called Pioneer Homes because it was the first projects in the state of New York. The first projects in the state of New York. That's crazy. Right Again, syracuse was an experimental city, so that first project in New York State is now being moved out for them to put a highway in the gentrification. I used to live in a building that was called Towns and Towers. They closed Towns and Towers down to make it housing for doctors, for the university.
Speaker 4:So that's the gentrification right, they clear out the projects, they clear out the towers, they put in the students and that's how it becomes Yuppieville.
Speaker 2:And they're removing the interstate now. It's a billion dollar project. They're removing the interstate through all. Like I said earlier, they're removing that interstate that displaced people originally in the 50s.
Speaker 4:The 15th Ward was removed when they put I-81 up and I explained to them that we had the first red line district in the country. Yeah, yeah, that's what I was explaining to them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly, definitely experimental. So you can see, like he said the first, and it's crazy because the way they built pioneer homes, they didn't build it like this, they didn't build it like this, they didn't build it up, they built it like row houses, like the old slave, like row houses, slave quarters, slave quarters, just design, you know that's crazy, because what I do notice, wherever a project is, there's always a highway nearby.
Speaker 3:I just told somebody that the other day.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think we spoke about that right, yeah me, and you spoke about that as well.
Speaker 3:It's like, as you said, it's an experiment. And how is it that they have $100 million for a project but can't defeat the poverty that's taking place up there? Because it's real up there. I heard stories, man, upstate New York is real.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we were up at arms because you know there's so much poverty that takes place in Syracuse. They just spent over 80 million dollars to put in an aquarium. To put in an aquarium, why would you take funds that the state needs and you have so much poverty around but yet you would spend over $85 million for a new aquarium?
Speaker 2:It's a damn shame.
Speaker 1:And I'd be on the edge man, I'd be on the edge.
Speaker 2:I'm sorry. I apologize if I you know, I don't know about profanity, so I don't want to get you flagged or anything.
Speaker 3:But I'd be all over it.
Speaker 2:It's one of. You know it's definitely criminal and it's again, it's by design. You know the brother mentioned poverty. He mentioned how up here, you know it's real Poverty Isn't. To me, poverty is a tool. I mean the poverty that was created. See, it's designed and at one point in time we were, we were, we were well. But then when you begin to remove resources from a community, extracting them methodically, you can cause a ripple effect. For instance, you have to get to the kids, right, because the kids, if the kids ain't got nothing to do, what happens? They'll make something to do. So if you take away something constructed from them, like summer jobs. You remember Cedar? I do, I remember.
Speaker 4:CEDA? Yep, tell them what CEDA was. Yeah, ceda was a program that was set up to give you know children summer jobs and jobs that they can do at a young age, establishing a career. But these were things that were set up from the government for the urban youth in order for them to get their feet wet and to start establishing those things.
Speaker 2:Exactly. We had things like night gym. We had a lot of things in place where a child would be safe, a safe space, you know what I'm saying. And even in these safe spaces they had education and learning was going on as well. Tutoring, different types of things was happening. So you begin to extract that. So now you take away these safe spaces and you take away these resources for kids to work, to get money, to learn certain things. Now they're outside. This was happening around. It began happening in the early 80s by the time crack hit. It was perfect because when crack hit, the kids was already at the point where that was. That was. That was a perfect. That was perfect. That was a. It was something to do. See, when I was coming up, all the hustlers was grown. They were grown men.
Speaker 2:There was no children hustling, but then children became hustlers youngsters correct without up without Youngster Correct, without guidance per se, life's experiences and so on and so forth. So we know the outcome of that. We're all products of it. I was 12 years old in 1980. I turned 12.
Speaker 4:So we in the midst of it, man, Right, right, I did want to point something out too from y'all prior program Y'all were pointing about, y'all talking about hip hop. I do want to attest that Sheik Denim L was one of the top break dancers of the city. That that that would.
Speaker 2:That's definitely true, he was getting down with the get down.
Speaker 4:I was one of with the get down.
Speaker 2:I was one of the illest. I was one of the illest. I bear witness.
Speaker 4:I was not, but he was, so that is true it was an MC but you were definitely one of the break dancers, for sure.
Speaker 4:I was one of the illest, for sure. And I wanted to point out also is what was missed was we caught a ground level of hip hop, because a lot of things revolved around the university, right? So a lot of the people would come from their hometown, they come from the Bronx or come from Brooklyn and bring that in and they would have the radio stations and they would have the radio stations. So we were able to catch a ground level of people Maybe their siblings were still in the city or they were from the city and come down with the music. That's how we were able to catch it so quickly, because it revolved around the university. That was an aspect that wasn't touched on. But y'all that breakdown was excellent as far as what y'all were breaking down last episode.
Speaker 2:Praise God, you know what we do man Also. Far as what y'all were breaking down last episode. Oh, praise you know, you know what we do man also. You gotta remember I was running, I was running like I was running with g and them back in like like 80, 81 g man and them, yeah, and he, and you know he was, he was a harlem, he was a harlem baby.
Speaker 2:You know he was going to the city all the time and he was bringing, he was bringing a lot of the mixtapes back and he was, he was a dj as well, and you also, you, you know, you know rapski passed away, right, you know, I do like two or three weeks ago.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, rapski yeah, bootleg was a bootleg rapski brother robert harrison jr was was a legendary dj in the syracuse hip-hop scene right and the legendary crew called the koc crew, right? You just passed away, good brother man. Yeah, we all. We all got histories together, right?
Speaker 3:all right, I got one question that's like that's out of the curriculum. Um, how's the crime level up then? Is it hasn't intensified amongst the youth like a lot of youth shootings and stuff?
Speaker 2:oh yeah, see, we got an influx. We got it. See, syracuse is a sanctuary city, so you already know what it is. We got a lot of influx of different nationalities, specifically Africans and specifically different types of Southeast Asian, okay, but mostly Africans, mostly Somali, mostly Somali Bantu, and so much. So there's an African mafia. There's a bunch of youth, they still kids, they off the chain.
Speaker 4:They do, they do. Yeah, they definitely participated in increasing the crime that comes through, unfortunately.
Speaker 2:And then you got to think about what we call the homegrown beef south side, east side, north side, west side and the little communities within these territories that's been beefing for 70 years and shit. Every generation is the same shit. They don't even know why they're doing it. Right now, man, it's just poverty. Yeah, the homegrown stuff. They don't even know why they're doing it.
Speaker 1:So do you have Bloods, Cribs, GDs.
Speaker 2:Eh, in the 90s there was running around, everybody was a Bloods, the late 90s and all that. But now you don't hear nothing about Bloods and Crips. Yeah, not so much the commercial.
Speaker 4:like Bloods and Crips it go on blocks.
Speaker 1:You know, from certain block areas.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's how it is in Syracuse 112 versus. Lex, block Lex block versus. You know, that's how Syracuse operates.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Were there any key uprising protests or movements led by Syracuse residents?
Speaker 2:Led by Syracuse residents.
Speaker 4:Yeah. I don't know. I can't think of any, like any specific ones that we would know.
Speaker 1:OK, ok, now I want to go into Nation of Islam questions. When and how did the Nation of Islam first arrive in Syracuse?
Speaker 2:Well, for me, I ran into him when I got kicked out of the Navy. When I got kicked out I came home. It was what? 80? I came home in 89. And that's when I ran into them in 89, brother Kenneth Muhammad. So I'm assuming they were probably here 86, 86, 87, maybe even earlier, because there was a presence of the Nation of Islam, the first resurrection, the first generation, pardon me, under the Honorable Elijah Muhammad there was elders still, there was brothers around who was from that school of thought, who was from that. You know what I'm saying. So they were. I remember some of them. They were still. They were around. You know what I mean. But so the Nation of Islam under the Honorable Elijah Muhammad was around. I got knowledge itself in 1980. I got that from G because he got it from the city. I mean he brought the lessons back. I got it from him. But when I came home in 89, that's when I ran into Farrakhan in the Nation of Islam, his Nation of Islam was 89 for me.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I would agree. When you were a child and you would go downtown, you would see Nation of Islam members selling the newspaper downtown. That was in the 70s, yeah yeah. The Balalian News. The Balalian News, exactly. So then, when Wharf Dean took over the nation, you still had members that would be in the downtown area selling the newspapers at that time that time.
Speaker 4:When Minister Farrakhan's group had started to come up in those early in those 80s, you would still have the Muslim presence. When I was in Syracuse I got out the military in 89. Also After I got out, minister Khalid would come again to speak at the university. I first met Dr Collin in the early 90s by him coming up to the university giving speeches, because him and Minister Farrakhan would go to the universities in order to make money. They would do lectures. So that's how I was able to meet them.
Speaker 2:That's a fact. And guess who guarded them at that time? The 5% Nation. Any university they went to, it was the guards that was protecting them, correct? He didn't have an FOI.
Speaker 4:No, it was still being formed, exactly.
Speaker 1:Wow, that's history right there.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I have a question.
Speaker 3:That's dope though. Were there any key NOI temples or mosques established in Syracuse?
Speaker 4:We always had what was called study groups not actual mosques, but we had study groups that were being established. After I got knowledge of self, I was still in the military in San Diego and me and my wife had joined in San Diego and then when I moved back to Syracuse we just continue at that time so we had study groups. The main mosque would be coming out of Buffalo and then the smaller groups like Rochester and Syracuse would then follow under that umbrella of Buffalo.
Speaker 1:Under Buffalo.
Speaker 3:Buffalo what to turn?
Speaker 1:around West Side. What's his name? Rick James. Is he from Buffalo? I?
Speaker 2:think.
Speaker 4:He is Rick.
Speaker 1:James, he got banned from Syracuse.
Speaker 4:He got banned. Yeah, All he did was this was around like 79, this was about 1980. I was one of the children. He came to the Landmark Theater. All Rick James did was light a joint and then throw a couple nickel bags in the audience. That's all he did, and they banned Rick James for life from Syracuse.
Speaker 1:That's crazy.
Speaker 4:He saw Mary Jane and he started throwing nickel bags. That's how old that was. He was throwing nickel bags on the audience.
Speaker 2:Rick James was the beast man. I'm telling you, man, Rick James is something.
Speaker 1:Okay, now where were we? So all right, what was Mr Farrakhan's influence in the area, if any?
Speaker 2:Mr Farrakhan had a lot of influence at that particular time. I mean, we were young, you know what I'm saying and you know we was God and he was spitting lessons. He was speaking 120. Like it was just what it was and he had ventured into the, into like the, what I call the hip popular arena. He was not only just doing what he was doing, but he started getting popular with MCs and with the culture, with the culture, man, you know, and it just went. It just went, I mean it just went for it, just just what it was. But later on in life you know what I'm saying me and Ish had to demonstrate some things, man, on that whole situation later on in life, man.
Speaker 1:On a NOI man on that whole, on that whole situation later on in life. Man on, uh, on on it on the noi yeah, yeah, we did a whole demonstration b it.
Speaker 2:The demonstration is the top demonstration. Nobody has ever topped it. Everybody borrowed from it and never said where they got the information from. But we did a groundbreaking joint b you know, I mean it and it just, it's just kept, it's kept going, it's just kept going. He just kept, he's still, he's still going. You know what I'm saying? I was just. I just happened to come home from South Africa and had been. Remember I told you I was in South Africa and I and I had to get my children back, so I infiltrated Scientology. Remember I told you that.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So I knew certain things. So Ish sent me a picture with a chair and it says COS on the chair, and I remember he said this brother Malik Kasha sent me this picture, brother, what do you know about this picture? Like, what do you know? I said, oh see, that's the Church of Scientology. I said, oh, the Church of Scientology is coming to labor meetings now, scientology. I said, oh, the church in Scientology is coming to labor meetings now. And then I just broke down and told him everything, everything I knew about the church, from auditing from the OT operating thetans.
Speaker 3:I went through the whole joint.
Speaker 4:He did. He went through the whole Dianetics and deciphered all of the questions that I had. He knows more information about Scientology. He's forgotten more than I know to this day. I would defer to him. If I needed information about what was the inner workings of Scientology and what's being applied, I would bounce it off of him. So I would say, Professor, what about X, Y and Z? So the first people I went to was Sheik Denim L and my teacher Steve Coakley. To was Sheikh Denim L and my teacher Steve Coakley.
Speaker 4:When I started seeing that there were these secret meetings taking place between Scientology and the Nation of Islam. Those are the first two people that I went to.
Speaker 3:Alright, so with the science. I don't want them to come on here and try to ban us for this but I know with some of these methods is um, I'm going to be honest, I picked up a book, I picked up Dianetics. I'm going to be real with y'all, right, and as I was reading and studying, a lot of past life regression is practiced within the science. People don't want to admit, but I'll just leave it like that. We live in. It's real.
Speaker 2:You know what, brother? I'm going to tell you something, man. He called it the analytical and the reactive mind. That's what he termed it. It's actually just the highest self and the lowest self. Let me ask you a question, brother when is your mind at? Can you point it to me, can't?
Speaker 2:point it, right? Right, we can point where the brain is, though, right, see, the mind is somewhere out here. It's not a physical thing, right? It's something you tap into, so, in a sense, that's a whole lie. It's actually he's dealing on the science of your higher self and your lower self, the God and the devil. That's within Z, that's all, but he had to put his own twist on it, though. You know what I'm saying, and you know, if you don't understand, that L Ron Hubbard was a science fiction writer. He wrote science fiction stories, comic books, characters and the whole shit. Excuse my language.
Speaker 2:Then you would yeah, then you would understand. You know how he was good with the wordplay.
Speaker 4:And one can't ignore the fact that you had the whole him and Aleister Crowley relationship with him and Jack, with him and Jack Parsons.
Speaker 4:Jack Parsons yeah, yeah, when you deal with that part of the history that can't be ignored. I sat down with his great-grandson for over three hours for his great-grandson to break down to me the documentation that he still has. I spoke with Jamie DeWolf and in my speaking to him he was showing me the stuff that his grandfather was into, you know. So when elijah muhammad said to leave that stuff alone, they asked elijah muhammad that, specifically, what about the church of scientology? He said it was of the devil, that it was a devil science and that's what that's what his great-grandson proved wow and we
Speaker 1:knew it, so hold on hold on. We need a Scientology part two with both you brothers on, because we did a Scientology with Ish probably like a year or so ago. Right, that'll be peace.
Speaker 4:And did anybody refute that information I presented? No, they can't they never will.
Speaker 1:I think they demonetized that video though my apologies.
Speaker 2:That's a strong possibility, word up. You know the thing is, man, it's crazy because we was even getting little subtle pushback, but nobody, I mean bro, we, we, we were so bold with it. It was, it was, it was just, it was just the, it was just bold. The way it was, the way we did, it was just bold, man. It wasn't no, it wasn't no, fear man, we just, we just did it this way.
Speaker 4:They said that we were crazy because minister farrakhan didn't admit it until after. We came forward and pulled the veil back. We said this is what they're doing. He came later on and admitted that that's what he was doing. That's how early we were. There is no source reference that we had to refer to because we were the source reference Facts.
Speaker 2:Facts. We broke it down because see Farrakhan speaks. He spoke in riddles. He talked about a new book. There would be a new book that would come. It would have new teachings. He spoke about this. I've seen that speak, yeah, well, it was Dianetics.
Speaker 4:That was a new book and we had the quote Right we had the quote when his minister, tony Muhammad, said he was going to put the Dianetics book next to the Holy Quran. Take it To Mecca and let the scholars Know. You will never understand this Book Quran, until you understand this book. Dianetics Ain't that something?
Speaker 2:I'll tell you, boy, I'll tell you, I'll tell you that.
Speaker 4:I'll tell you that would have been a one-way ticket if he would have did that. But that's what they were talking about.
Speaker 1:Yeah for sure. All right Now. The next question is Mike, you want to go?
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, all right. How did the NOI interact with the local politics or police in Syracuse?
Speaker 2:Ish could give a better description of that.
Speaker 4:Yeah, complex relationship. One thing was, as we just talked about a few minutes ago, the RICO Act. Right, we just talked about the RICO Act. The RICO Act was enacted when Nation of Islam people would come. Dennis Muhammad would come, collect names of the street organization members and then handed it to the police department, collected all of the names of these people. The police then collected the names of these individuals, put cases on these individuals and put them under federal indictment. Put cases on these individuals and put them under federal indictment. Now you had another element of the Nation of Islam that had nothing to do with the police. Those were the Khalid babies. Those are the ones who are going to be most likely the rabble rousers, who are going to be into the youth organizations.
Speaker 4:Dr Khalid was plugged into the gang members. Whenever he would land in your city he would want to know where are the drug dealers at, and he had two major vehicles he used to drive. He had two Rolls Royces, a white one and a black one, and he called them his tanks. So when he would roll up in your city, he wanted to make sure he was driving better than the biggest drug dealers and he was dressed sharper than the biggest drug dealers because he would get their attention. I'm driving better than you, I look better than you, I'm dressed better than you and I'm plugged into God. So come on down to the temple and get some of these teachings and you can find out why I look better than you, dress better than you and drive better than you. Young brother, that was his tank, as he would call, so he was plugged into that element of the Nation of Islam. Two different relationships Okay.
Speaker 2:Powerful psychology Right.
Speaker 1:For sure, for sure, who were some prominent NOI figures in Syracuse history Ish.
Speaker 4:I was assistant minister in Syracuse, new York. I was influential when it comes down to being in Syracuse and being able to have some influence and I really came from a 5% background. You know, sheik Denim L had knowledge of self about a year before I did, but we were babies. We were babies with the knowledge of self. So us being plugged into the youth. We were already having street ciphers, we already engulfed in the culture and understanding 120 and the power being invested in the youth. So we're able to take that energy and go into the ranks. So we're able to take that energy and go into the ranks, as some individuals will go into the more science temple. I went further into the nation of islam to move up in the ministry ranks because I was taught by dr collin so I was able to go that route when other ones went the more science temple route directly taught by dr collin directly.
Speaker 1:Yeah, directly taught by Colin Colin was super smart man Right.
Speaker 4:And I was around him for many, many times before I would even ask a question. It would benefit me to meet him in New York and see how he walked through 125. He would walk in like a mayor, go into this part of 125, starting at this store, walk all the way through and me just be a fly on the wall over his shoulder watching how he politics, watching his diplomacy, watching how he moves in a militant way as a baby. And then he would just turn around and say I'll be right with you, brother, and I'll be that person just waiting while he's working the room. But he would never forget this young brother. I'm young but asking these questions thinking I'm deep. I wasn't deep at all, but I'm asking these questions to him while he's still working the actual room.
Speaker 4:I was very blessed and to be around this brother. I was around Sheikh Danim El for 40 plus years. Do you know how blessed I am by Allahah? I'm blessed to have a relationship with sharif bay for over 35 years. I mean uninterrupted access to great minds, so we were able to all make each other great because we all came from the same school. To have uninterrupted access to that kind of knowledge from this brother since the 70s into the 80s. Man, that's nothing but Allah's mercy.
Speaker 2:Praise Allah. And you know, bro, I mean we can do this all night, this accolade stuff, man, you know we go way back, man. Let me tell you something, man, I ain't want to tell nobody. This man, but Ish, he like to dance in strobe lights, oh Lord, he like to pop lock on the strobe light.
Speaker 4:He's giving a babysitter secrets.
Speaker 2:He like to pop lock on the strobe light. I used to be the light thing clicking it on and off like this. That's hip-hop.
Speaker 4:I confess. I confess we were together when MTV first got debuted in 1981. We were watching the TV when MTV first started. That's how far back we go.
Speaker 1:King Gabe said yes, you are, when men honor man. You are when men honor man. You honor Allah. Peace, King Gabe. The next one. What's the next question?
Speaker 3:Nation of gods and earth.
Speaker 1:Nation of gods and earth, you ready? We only got 10 minutes. We only got 10 minutes.
Speaker 3:How did the 5% you ready? We only got 10 minutes. We only got 10 minutes. How did the 5% nation take root in Syracuse? I?
Speaker 1:already know the answer. God answered that on the first one, but go ahead.
Speaker 2:With me. I got knowledge of self. Like I said, you got to get him one day on here too, man, the brother G. His name is Eman Abu Hudayan, abu hudefa now, but um, he brought knowledge itself, man. He brought, he brought back 120. One day we was in the basement because he had a basement. His basement was like a, was like a tunnel in new york city and just a graffiti tunnel. You walk down the steps graffiti all over the walls. You get to the bottom, the turntables in the corner. It's a. It's a floor full of linoleum over here, burnt bomb walls, anything man, that sound like my place to be man yeah, man, you know, I mean, so you know, down there and him, it was him.
Speaker 2:his name was born wise and it was brother, uh, king justice, born wise king justice. And it was another brother. I can't remember his name. And I was just down there break breaking and you know, just adding on and listening and I'm like yo, what the hell is he talking about? Man? But I got pulled in quick. I liked it, I was like yo, so I went to G. I was like yo, man, yo can you teach me that? And he just gave me the lesson, he just gave them to me, and after that it was a wrap. I got to one. I mastered 120 before my enlightener, before the person who gave me, who gave me lessons?
Speaker 4:And that same individual was gave the same information to my cousin His name. His name was Smooth G and Smooth G is our parents or siblings. He gave that information to me, so that's how I was able to get it. In the early 80s also, the same individual was just giving out life. He was giving out life to the youth he was doing his job.
Speaker 2:You know what's crazy? He was giving out life and death Because G had a kilo at 13 years old. You know what I'm saying. So I mean we talking a real life history, we talking about a cat. I mean he was an ill DJ too. Nice, real nice. Him and Rapski had some of the iconic battles. Dj Battles was between him and Rapski, who just passed away Iconic battle. But he went on to do music with Trackmasters, with Rich Nice and them Videos music studio. But he was going back and forth between the drug game and the music game. But now he, for the last 20 years, 20 plus years man, he's a reformed Iman, muslim, beautiful children, got about seven children, a wife, beautiful family. He's doing great.
Speaker 4:And we would take trips to New York too. Whenever we go to Harlem, we go to Mecca to make sure we're able to get knowledge.
Speaker 2:Yeah, indeed, go to the parliaments as well. Go to parliaments. Yeah, we would also hold ciphers right in the town. I would start a cipher anywhere, anywhere. If I seen God, I would start a cypher anywhere, yes, anywhere. If I seen God, I would just I would anywhere, correct. But we would also meet uniformly in a place called Wilson Park, Right, you remember that Ish?
Speaker 4:I remember Wilson Park Absolutely. We had a cypher right there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we had some cyphers right there. That was a little bit in the old, that was in like the early 90s, going into like the early 90s. God rest their dead. That was Mutaz, our brother, who's the other brother, the other brothers that Sharif used to run with Brother.
Speaker 4:Salaam. We had.
Speaker 2:Zulu, you know, and brothers like that Brother Salaam. And.
Speaker 4:Malachi Z York. Malachi Z York used to come through to Syracuse. He had members. He was running in Brooklyn, but you see Imam Esau in Syracuse, new York. Yeah, I remember running into Imam Esau.
Speaker 2:I remember running into him and I remember running into Dr York at the Gardenia. Yeah, you would Right down the line of street when he had that crew.
Speaker 2:He had that group called she. It was a singing group called she. Yeah, man, yeah, dr York, yeah, because I got into the science of Imam Issa when I went to the Navy in 86. I ran into a cat named Hassan D Geronimo from Queens and he had all the Dr York stuff. But the gods was like yo, that's Dr Cork, don't mess with that. It's now siphoned in there, but yo, I'm a wise man, you know what I mean. I'm going to do the knowledge and I found it. I found things in it that was intriguing, enlightening and educating for me.
Speaker 2:You know, I wasn't just, my mind wasn't closed just to 120.
Speaker 4:We were always seeking knowledge, you know, no matter what the school of thought was. That's what we pride ourselves on?
Speaker 1:Yeah, indeed Me too, me too. But when York started talking about aliens, he lost me with that. But you know what, though, I'm starting to like look at it a little bit nowadays, like you know, like there could be a possibility you know what I'm saying Like let's not close our mind off to things that you know we don't truly understand, right?
Speaker 2:Right, because I'm going to tell you something, brother, we not alone.
Speaker 4:Right, we not alone, I agree. And for Dr York, he made some mistakes as far as he had an organization. But they started going anti-5% and they put out a 5% book and when you went against the gods on that level. There was no fly zone. Yeah, it was a no yeah.
Speaker 2:He went against Noble Juali as well. He went against all the rosters. He went against everybody.
Speaker 3:Holly Selassie.
Speaker 4:Holly Selassie, exactly. So he started burning some bridges and kind of putting themselves on an island, you know.
Speaker 3:Had to get G-checked.
Speaker 1:Right, were there any local? Well, we already spoke about the bills no parliaments or nothing like that out there.
Speaker 2:We never had parliaments, we just had ciphers. We never had parliaments where other gods came from other places and you know what I'm saying besides gods from the university or whatever, but no, we just had ciphers.
Speaker 1:What about artists into the 5% teaching? I mean, you introduced me to a group. I forgot their name, but I think it was like, from what it sounds like, it sounded like one was a Moor and the other one was a 5%-er.
Speaker 4:Or it sounded like oh, like two kings and a cypher.
Speaker 2:Two kings and a cypher. Yeah, them cats was alright, they did their thing. They did their thing. Any other artists In regards to what Coming out of Syracuse? Coming out of Syracuse? Coming out of syracuse or just coming out of syracuse? Oh no, the key, the cats who came out of syracuse, wasn't more, it wasn't more than five percenters.
Speaker 2:Um right, who I, who I referenced you about syracuse was um makiba and scratch right, right, makiba yep that's who I referenced you um reference reference to you about Syracuse, like somebody who they actually had a deal. They had a deal, but Scratch, you know he's just a dirty cat. Man Took the money and ran with it, did something else, left Makeba. Makeba went back to work at UPS man.
Speaker 3:Right, right, good brother.
Speaker 2:Definitely a good brother. I think he's in Atlanta now selling cars or something, if I'm not mistaken.
Speaker 3:I'm not laughing at the UPS thing, I'm like he just spilled everything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's what he did. He ripped a lot of people off man. He had a little music studio and all that type of stuff and people would come and spend money and they knew he had like a little clout.
Speaker 4:but he used that to his advantage and syracuse had, you know, some, some homegrown talent that came through, you know, like the artist uh post malone post.
Speaker 2:Malone is from syracuse. Yeah, yeah, yeah syracuse um.
Speaker 4:You got actors.
Speaker 3:Even though I don't like scientology, tom cruise he's from syracuse so we've had had, you know, the Baldwin family, alec Baldwin and the Baldwin family, mother.
Speaker 2:Baldwin, she's very sweet, richard Gere, richard.
Speaker 4:Gere yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, richard Gere. Also the kid, the rapper. What's his name? Aaron Cooks Stolgaard, yeah, stolgaard.
Speaker 3:Yeah, he from over here. Yeah, he's from Syracuse. He's with Griselda right.
Speaker 4:Yeah, exactly, and he did some work with Lord Jamar.
Speaker 3:I believe the majority of them are either Muslim or 5% is within that. Griselda crew right.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and they're all from central New York and from our area. So we take a lot of pride in Griselda and what they represent. They speak for us. You know a lot of the culture, of what we see.
Speaker 2:And put.
Speaker 4:New York City on their back. They put all of New York on their back.
Speaker 3:There's nobody better Shout out to my fellow Zoe on that team.
Speaker 1:Hey, shout out to Jim Jones. Shout out to Jim Jones, jimmy.
Speaker 3:Jimmy's struggling, struggling hard Jimmy better wait.
Speaker 2:Yo, mr Brown you know, Max.
Speaker 3:B coming home. Jimmy nervous man, jimmy nervous man. Max B was that dude?
Speaker 2:Jimmy a little nervous man. That's why he's starting to beef with everybody. He want to be relevant.
Speaker 1:He'll be alright. Can you talk about street knowledge and education clashed or aligned? Like street knowledge and education? Did it clash or did it align?
Speaker 2:For me it aligned. For me it aligned, it will always align. Street knowledge and education, or street knowledge and wisdom, or the attainment of such and such street knowledge, if used properly, will lead you to those things. Street knowledge will guide you to heaven or it can guide you to hell, but it's the intent of the user, whoever's using the street knowledge or who's, you know.
Speaker 4:I'm saying it's the intent right yeah, and I would say it's not mutually exclusive. You can have both. You can be extremely wise with street knowledge. That doesn't limit you. You can still debate, you can still have a body of knowledge that nobody can compare that to. It's all about your methodology. How tight is your methodology and the information that you're pushing? You know, if you look at Shake Denim L, he has his bachelor's degree, he has his master's degree, but he has street knowledge first. He merged both. I have my college degree. I just merged my foundation. I was making six figures with just the high school education. I coupled that so I could put more tools in my tool belt to increase my value in my career. But I was already making six figures with just a high school education. So it's about merging both.
Speaker 1:Right right Indeed.
Speaker 2:I say it simply like this you can either be a product of your environment or you can make your environment your product.
Speaker 3:Facts, facts, facts. Your environment, your product, facts, facts.
Speaker 1:I like that right there. I like that right there you can use it bro, you can hold it. Thanks, man, I appreciate it. I'm taking that yo. But on that note, man, thank y'all for coming out this evening. I really appreciate y'all. I got more questions, though. I would love for y'all to come out, and I got more questions, though, so I would like for y'all to come back again and do a part three and close it out with, maybe part three.
Speaker 2:I got mad questions.
Speaker 1:I don't know if there's a part four to this man.
Speaker 2:Hey, man, we appreciate you, brother, for just even giving the exposure to upstate New York, like you're doing, man, we appreciate it because I've always felt you know what I'm saying New York State is an entity in its own anyway, you know what I'm saying. I mean, we're one of the original colonies, one of the first original colonies. There's more things going on in our past and in our present that we ain't even touched on with our people here in New York State or the history of this place period.
Speaker 1:Man, I was listening to this audio book Occult in America. I'm listening to Occult in America and it's just talking about New York, new York, new York, new York, new York. I'm like damn, there's something going on New York, new York, new York, new. York, new York, new York man, right, I'm like damn, there's something going on up here man.
Speaker 2:It's full of witchcraft. B Some of the areas you live in, some of them, locations and them blocks are filled with incantations. Man, Certainly like you got demons and certain things controlling or overseeing areas astrally. Man Like people, man like people. Oh that brother crazy. I.
Speaker 3:You're on burial grounds.
Speaker 4:All that We'll be able to break some of that down. Yeah, have us back, we'll talk about it. And your interest in Central New York. It doesn't go, you know, unrecognized. Bless both of y'all for just having the interest. You know, welcoming us on your show, I always feel like I'm at home, so bless both of you and your loved ones Likewise bro.
Speaker 1:Likewise, and we are out of here. Peace.
Speaker 2:Peace, one love Y'all be easy.