Wizards, Warlocks, Spooks and Holy Ghost(Occult) - Sheik Denham El

What lies beyond the veil of our physical senses? Sheik Denham EL joins us for a fascinating journey into the world of hidden knowledge—what many call "the occult."

This eye-opening conversation challenges conventional thinking about spirituality, ancestral practices, and the unseen forces that influence our lives. Sheik Denim L, an initiate of multiple spiritual traditions including Sufism and martial spiritual orders, breaks down how the word "occult" simply means "hidden knowledge"—nothing inherently sinister about it. He explains how indigenous spiritual technologies from Hoodoo to Santeria represent sophisticated systems our ancestors mastered, not primitive superstitions to be feared.

The discussion takes unexpected turns as we explore the fascinating connections between martial arts and mysticism. Did you know Filipino Kali practitioners used a system called Anting-Anting, incorporating amulets and spiritual protection into their combat? Or that powerful prayer women in Southern Pentecostal churches were often skilled practitioners of occult sciences? These revelations demonstrate how spiritual technologies were never separate from daily life but integrated into everything from protection to healing.

Most compelling are the personal experiences shared—from witnessing seemingly impossible physical feats during spiritual ceremonies to strange synchronicities that defy explanation. These firsthand accounts challenge materialistic worldviews while offering glimpses into what might be possible when we reconnect with ancestral knowledge.

Whether you're a skeptic or spiritually inclined, this conversation offers valuable insights about reclaiming knowledge that belongs to us all. As Sheik Denim L powerfully asks: "How does those who were once worshipped become worshippers?" Perhaps it's time to rediscover w

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• 21:14 (Cont.) Wizards, Warlocks, Spooks and Holy Ghost(Occult) - Sheik Denham El

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:10

what's going on? Everybody out there is ron brown lmt, the people's fitness professional, aka soul brother number three. Soul brother number three in the building. Number three to shake denim l because he's soul brother number two now, who's so brother number one?

Speaker 1: 0:27

james brown brother ah I knew that's who you were saying, but I didn't think that's. You know what I mean. I thought you, I thought it was more complicated than that, so complicated. So, brother number one, james brown. So today we're talking about the unseen, right, we're talking about the unseen forces. Do they exist? Right? I would do does. Does uh do demons and these? You know, you know entities exist. Do they exist? Or is it spookism? You know what I mean. So you know I got wizards, warlocks, spooks and holy ghosts from the jizzer, from the jizzer, uh. What is it called? The G-O-D? What's the name of that song? The G-O-D? The G-O-D. Qualify those who wants to try the G-O-D.

Speaker 2: 1:15

I know what you're talking about.

Speaker 1: 1:16

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Wizards, warlocks, spooks and holy ghosts Rizaless defraud the host, and when it steps out of its place then it gets smacked in the face.

Speaker 1: 1:28

You know what I'm saying oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, peace King Matala, peace, king Matala. I don't know if anyone else has what I have in my supreme alphabet or born you truth. In my supreme alphabet it talks about Allah, you know being, you know God of all worlds, lord of all worlds, seen and unseen. Right, and I always wondered yeah, swordsman, swordsman, Swordsman. And my supreme alphabets? It says you know, lord of all worlds, seen and unseen. Alphabet it says you know, lord of all Worlds, seen and unseen. And when it says unseen, I always thought like unseen, what is that saying? What is that really? What is that really talking about? What is unseen? You know it could be something else, any other, any other gods, if they have that In their alphabets, you know they could add on. However, you know From my experience, you know you know the way I grew up, my mother. You know my mother. She deals with, like you know, her ancestral roots when it comes to voodoo and all of that voodoo, et cetera.

Speaker 1: 2:39

And hold on a second Greetings from oh yes, nc. Amber L, amber Hill, l Islam. More so from my perspective. You know the voodoo thing and all that was always around and I always wondered, like, what's the science behind that you know saying, and at a point I just deemed it as spookism, spookism, you know saying, just deemed it as spookism, spookism. You know I'm saying, um, but later on I found out that this is an occult teaching right. This is an occult world and, um, you know, I just never really dove deep into it to have a full understanding of it. So that's why we brought chic denim l today to build on it. So peace to you, you brother Sheik Denim L. Hope all is well with you. I trust all is well with you. Thank you for coming out this evening. I really appreciate you and your words of wisdom. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2: 3:39

Thank you for being here, brother, thank you for having me. But yeah, I mean, I mean, you just mentioned voodoo man. You know what I'm saying. Like to some people that's spooky. You know what I'm saying Because when you don't have a knowledge of a particular thing, it can become spooky. It can become something that you would just draw up and proceed with from your own understanding, lacking knowledge of it. You know, we talk about things a lot of times. People talk about stuff they have no knowledge of, all the time as if they're experts. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2: 4:10

It's something that's very, very common, because we regurgitate the things that we may hear, or even if we're very religious people, religion teaches very strongly against what we will call the occult. The word occult simply means hidden. There's nothing scary about the word. Occult simply means hidden. It's nothing scary about the word. It just means hidden. It just means knowledge that you haven't been exposed to. You know what I'm saying. So that's what it is. That's what the occult is hidden knowledge or knowledge that you have not been exposed to. You know what I'm saying. And you mentioned earlier about a law being the Lord of the worlds. Worlds is plural, so you know that's a plural word right, so that's more than one world right.

Speaker 1: 4:50

Right.

Speaker 2: 4:51

Yeah, the Lord of all of the world, seen and unseen. Well, now, when you're dealing with seen and unseen, you got to remember the human being only has so much capacity to see with his physical eyes. There's only so much you can see that you can pick up with your eyes because of the way your eyes vibrate, at a particular rate of speed and a particular rate dealing with light. You know what I'm saying. We can only see so much, so just the things around us that we can't see. There's unseen things going on around us at all times. Now, dealing with the unseen worlds, now you're talking interdimensional, or you're talking interdimensional, or you're also talking about just other galaxies that you'll never physically see with your eyes or probably get a chance to travel to, physically fly to whatever. But that word unseen can be vast. It can be, can be drawn up to define or to be defined, or expressed in a couple of ways. Yeah, you understand what I mean. Okay, yes, for sure, for sure.

Speaker 1: 5:45

Okay, so you said it could be expressed in a couple of ways.

Speaker 2: 5:50

Yeah, and I just gave a couple. I just mentioned unseen being something right here on this plane With the physical eyes that we can't see. Also, maybe other planets and other worlds or galaxies that we would never be able to physically see With our own eyes or even physically get to go there, but maybe can go there astrally, who knows. And then you got the unseen, where you're just dealing inter-dimensionally. Things happen in dimension dimensions. You know I'm saying so. We, we have we have planes of dimensions and things that that's stacked as well Third dimension, fourth dimension, fifth dimension, dimensional things as well.

Speaker 1: 6:27

Okay, okay. So what's your experience with the occult?

Speaker 2: 6:33

Oh, it's just, you know, like I said earlier, it's hidden knowledge, it just means hidden knowledge, and I'm just, I'm a student of many things, man. You know, I have a history with the occult. You know, dealing with certain, certain things, dealing with, as you mentioned, ancestral information and ancestral knowledge, you know, I'm saying dealing with the elements, dealing with, um, natural magic, sympathetic, magic, things of that nature, man, okay, so we're like for what I know, like I was, I was dabbling with the Santeria a while back.

Speaker 1: 7:06

I was in my 20s. I was just doing the knowledge at that time, just doing the knowledge of everything. I've experienced some things where I watch people dance kind of wild bite a chicken's head off and you know, and things like that.

Speaker 2: 7:25

Yeah, that's the low-wow, that's the orisha, that's what they call the low-wows. When you're being riding, when you're being ridden, it's called being ridden. You know what I'm saying. When the low-wows come down and they take your form and they ride you, they begin to express through you. You know, some people prophesy, some people, like you said, they flip around, roll around or whatever, but it's no different than going to a Pentecostal church on Sunday and saying the same thing, but they catch the Holy Ghost Right Rolling around on the floor. You know what I mean. And they're speaking in funny languages that nobody can interpret. You know it's right amongst our own people, right in what you call church. Matter of fact, the Pentecostal churches if you go back into the South, the Pentecostal churches or the strong prayer churches were some of the most. Some of those women were some of the most advanced specialists in the occult sciences. Those women in those Pentecostal churches with those prayer rooms, the women with them, big old hats on, yeah.

Speaker 1: 8:22

Yeah, for sure, for sure. So what, what? What's the validity to the, to the lowest, like, like? Is that actually happening? Or people are just hyped up and you know what's the science?

Speaker 2: 8:35

behind it. Like well, when you, when you witnessed it, what did you see? Did you see it?

Speaker 1: 8:40

actually happen. When I witnessed it it looked wild to me. I've never I've seen it in church like in baptist churches. I've seen it before, but this one was a little different because this person was like like eating glass oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's real.

Speaker 2: 9:01

I mean, think about if you're eating glass, brother I. You can't fake that. You can't fake I mean, unless you got a prop set up prior. You know you can't fake that. Like me, I'm a skeptic of everything. Yeah, no doubt I mean me too. I mean, you know, I'm skeptical about a lot of things. You know what I'm saying, but that I've witnessed as well and that I've experienced. You know what I mean. That makes me know and understand that there's another whole side of reality that many of us don't deal with, because other demographics or other social institutions have driven us away and we fear these things, while those same institutions that have driven you away and we fear these things, while those same institutions that have driven you away from it utilize and subdue you through it.

Speaker 1: 9:51

Right Now. My experience with these energies for instance, for me to still be curious about it is that not only did I see that ceremony going on, where this person was eating glass bit the chicken's head off, blood was going everywhere. It was just a wild scene. And then there was two instances. One day I went to this gathering. I was young. I went there for a female. I went there for a female, I went there for a female.

Speaker 1: 10:26

I went there for a female. She was like I want you to come and check out my church. I said, all right, I'm going to check out your church, right? So I go to the church and then I, and when I go in there, I'm standing there, you know, cause at that time I already had knowledge of self. So I'm like everybody in there, 85, 85. So I'm kind of like laughing. I'm laughing in my mind. I'm not laughing out loud, but I'm laughing in my mind. I'm like these people are crazy man. So then, uh, I'm standing there at the end of the whole thing and this guy would walk around and he was touching people's foreheads, right and so, and people were falling out. And I'm laughing like yo, this shit is like a joke, right To me. And then he came over to me and touched me in my forehead Word is born. I fell out. I fell out Like I went out and then I woke up.

Speaker 1: 11:17

When I woke up, I just felt like at peace and like really light and I never understood how that happened. I don't know how that happened. Like you know, I'm saying like, like these people meditate, and all of that for long periods of time, meditate, pray, whatever you want to call it, and they're activating something that we're not dealing with. You get, I'm saying, and I think that's what it is, you know I'm saying they're like, like, almost like monks, you know, like, like, like like shallon monks, yeah, meditate for long periods of time. They could like, touch someone and and send electrical, you know, uh, energy throughout their body. You know, I'm saying the hill, the hill, like I watched, uh, uh, a Tai Chi master do that before. You know what I mean. So I think it's all together, like it's all relative, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1: 12:13

Also, um, there was another time when, um, you know, I went to go see my mom. She was in church. I went to go see my mom, I sat in the back and, um, he told, he said everybody stand up and we, he's walking around, walking around and he, he's giving everybody a hug. He gave me a hug and, bro, like something happened, I don't know what happened, like, after the hug, just like, I felt, felt clean. It was just a wild experience. That's why I'm curious, because I think that all of this stuff is relative to the occult sciences.

Speaker 2: 13:05

It is, bro, because most preachers a lot of preachers, I can't say most, but many preachers are initiates of other things, bro. They're initiates of other schools of thought. You know they belong to other spiritual orders and other societies where other things is taught as well. You know what I mean and you can cross and you can cross and you can cross reference these things. Like you can utilize certain things in religion, you can utilize certain healing techniques and certain healing rituals in any religion, because it's healing. You know what I'm saying. It may not come from religion at all, but you can use it in a religion to heal somebody. You see what I mean. So you could use it in a religion to help somebody. You see what I mean. So the religion, the real sciences, is what they call pagan or heathen man, the pagan sciences or the heathen sciences. That's where religion comes from.

Speaker 2: 14:04

When you really look at the origin of churches and where they are, where they were built. They were built on pagan grounds, man. Many churches sit on grounds where other rituals were held before there was even a religion called Christianity. Many places are built on those same grounds and then when you look at the churches and you look at the buildings, I mean you see the flower of life symbolism, you see the elemental symbolisms of life expression, the Fibonacci patterns and all types of other sacred geometry all over the walls and signs and symbols that had nothing to do with Christianity but that's all over Christian churches and so on and so forth. Man, that's all spells, those are all rituals, those are all rituals, right?

Speaker 1: 14:44

Peace Crip Jesus, peace Crip Jesus, king Mathala. In yoga, they talk about controlling breathing in your mind to a point you can make it rain. That's a fact. All the above is caused by the Son of man. Now, I don't know anybody else's experiences. I made it rain, brother. I made it rain. Okay, now check this out Anybody else. When you in a like back in the days, me and the guards we used to build on the corner, and you and like when you're building at certain points I don't know if you've been through this, but it's like it's like you're not really there physically, you know, I'm saying it's like you're traveling and then it start raining. Though it start raining, I experienced that twice, so that's what I'm saying.

Speaker 2: 15:34

Like so, with the teachings anybody else have experience with, with building and this happening, like, yes, I have not not only in the build, not only with the gods, but also when I was with an African dance troupe called Shanti Amani, you know what I'm saying. You know, we did a ritual to Shango in the park and we made it thunder, lightning and all that. It was a clear summer day out. The clouds came black, all that man. You know what I'm saying. I mean, this is kind of things In the Moorish Holy Quran.

Speaker 2: 16:10

Chapter 1 of the Moorish Holy Quran is an invocation. Chapter 1 is a method of Teaching you how to Control lightning, air, fire, water, earth, thunder. All of that is in chapter 1. But people don't understand what chapter 1 is. They just read it, but not understanding that. It's an actual invocation when you're calling the elements Hear ye now all living things. Hear ye now Fire, air, water, earth. Hear ye now, see what I'm saying. Spirit man speaks from the highest planes of life. This is who's calling. This is who's speaking now. The spirit man is calling Hear ye now all protoplasts, living things, all that. He's calling them and commanding them and invoking them for his own purpose and can direct the lightning, can direct the thunder and so on and so forth.

Speaker 1: 17:04

Right, that's moral science, right, that's what make it a science.

Speaker 2: 17:15

See Moral science is a science and Islamism is the religion.

Speaker 1: 17:18

Right okay, okay, so now, back. Now to go back to the subject of oh, we're already on there now. Yeah, you've experienced this rain coming down, thunder, etc. Yeah, it's, it's what's your, what's your background as far as the occult.

Speaker 2: 17:43

If you can share that, well, I have a, I have a vast background in the occult man. I'm gonna, I'm gonna initiate a couple of different sacred orders. I'm an initiate of a couple of different sufi orders. I'm an initiate of a couple of martial spiritual orders. Um, I was, I was a free mason. I went through the lodge um, you know what I'm saying. I also, I'm also highly adept in science of hoodoo. My family family is from Mississippi. I mean my grandmother and my grandfather were very high in certain sciences. I mean dealing with the elements, dealing with nature, dealing with graveyards, dirt and all that type of stuff.

Speaker 1: 18:19

Man, so if you can give us, you know, like an idea of you know what you've been through as far as Sufism, if you could build on that, you know real quick.

Speaker 2: 18:38

Okay, Well, Sufism is what they call the inner teachings of Islam, and in Islam you have what they call inner and outer teachings, right, and you have Sharia, and then you have what they call Tasha Wuf. Sharia is the outer law. You know Quran, the law, the Sharia laws and so on and so forth, and then you have Tasha Wuf. Tasha Wuf is the inner laws, the spiritual, the unseen, and a lot of that is simply based around. It's mystical, it's mysticism. It's based around the abjad, which is the numerical values of the Arabic numbers and the letters themselves, Kharufism, where you study the study of actual Arabic letters, as well as the Hebrew letters and their um ability to transform into talisman or to turn into sigils or to be used for um, or to be integrated or cross integrated with other sciences such as combat you know what I'm saying Such as you know Salat, or maybe even Hoodoo combining, combining you know Sufism with hoodoo, combining hoodoo with Salat, and so on and so forth, Because when you study ancient indigenous combat systems, there's mysticism that's attached to it. You know what I'm saying, which is what's missing in our combat systems today there's no mysticism, there's no spiritual science that's attached to it at all, and you're missing the big picture. You're missing the big picture. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2: 20:08

So there's certain things that has to be understood when it comes down to the occult, because the occult is not just people thinking about devils and witches and evil things. Remember I said that the occult means hidden knowledge. Also, the occult is being able to take that hidden knowledge and apply it and transfuse it into other things. One second knowledge and apply it and transfuse it into other things. One second Appreciate it, man. I'll take some. Thanks. Man, that's my slender law, Excuse me. Slender law just brought me some ginger beer. Man, I love ginger beer, Thank you. So yeah, so ginger beer, yeah, man, so yeah. So where was I, bro, Before I got interrupted?

Speaker 1: 21:31

You were talking about martial sciences. Oh yeah, it doesn't have. It's like missing that piece, right, and that for me I'm noticing, like with the forms are sharp, with angles like 90-degree angles, 45, 90-degree 45, 90-degree 45. And it's like when you're moving your feet on the floor it seems like they're making some kind of like a pattern.

Speaker 2: 22:07

See, when you're doing kata, when you're doing kata, imagine taking your kata and taking, say I don't know, say, a straight punch, taking that straight punch, and when you punch you visualize the Arabic letter Elif. You know what an Elif look like? Look like a straight line. It's an axis, it's the divine axis, it even has a meaning. So imagine your punch coming in Elif. Your punch turns into an Elif visually. So whatever you visualize with that blow, it actually becomes that because it makes it so Transmission, words of power, mantras Added to the sprites, added to the movement, the sliding of the foot into a horse dance, you may say, you may say ba, the ba is the bee. You know what I'm saying In the Arabic In the visualization of B. You know what I'm saying in the Arabic In the visualization of it. It's like all of that stuff is relevant, bro. It all coincides and it all coexists. For instance, in Silat there's a method in Silat, there's a sorcery method in Silat where you charge and consecrate your blade. Your blade becomes a living spirit because you ritualized it, you consecrate it, you put words of power or certain prayers on the blade, literally on the blade. They're etched into the blade, literally. So when it's when the blade is breathed upon or certain things don't, the blade, the blade, literally. So when it's when the blade is breathed upon or certain things don't, the blade has its own mission. Vibration, okay yeah, vibration, frequency and a mission. It has a purpose, right?

Speaker 2: 24:00

So you may see those gentlemen, those same cats. They may have a bag on their shoulder or something wrapped around their waist. Down South they call it mojo, mojo bags or gree-grees. You will hear that in the old talk in the South I got my mojo working, I got my mojo working. Well, that's the mojo bag that they're carrying that's filled with certain types of things that either brings protection, that brings um other types of uh, frequencies around you. People like that are never alone. They got things working all the time around them, unseen things. A lot of times it's spirits, frequencies, graveyard spirits. It's a lot of different things, but they control them.

Speaker 1: 24:48

Okay, can you explain, like these Spirits right? So, coming from the 5% nation, most 5%, I want to say most, I'm going to say some 5% Would say you know, we don't deal With spirits and things like that. So you know, I think it's just the word that gets misconstrued.

Speaker 2: 25:06

It does get misconstrued, brother, because anybody who understands the science, first of all, the word spirit is spiritus, it's a Latin word, right.

Speaker 1: 25:20

Okay, spiritus, yeah yeah, it means breath Right. Okay, spiritos, yeah yeah, it means breath Right.

Speaker 2: 25:28

So how? We don't believe in spirit Because it's breath, it's spirit that's got you talking To say I don't believe in spirits and spooks. It's breath or spirit or a spook that got you speaking, right, right. So when we're dealing with spirit or spirits, you're dealing with frequencies. Everything is vibration, frequency or sound that has taken on a form. This us, we're a frequency. We're a frequency, a pure frequency, in a physical form For this plane of existence, designed for this plane of existence. Yet we're not the body that we're using. This is just the tool, this is the vehicle that we're using For this plane of existence.

Speaker 2: 26:18

We express soul expressions Through a physical form, yet you can't see the soul, but you can see the expressions of the soul through this physical form. That's magic. That's unseen, because the authentic you is unseen, but we see the expression of the unseen through the seen, expression of the unseen through the seen. We can't see Allah, but we say Allah is seen and heard everywhere, but we can't see him. But we can see and hear him everywhere. But we can't see him, but we can see and hear him everywhere. So then obviously we can see him. If he's seen and heard everywhere, then we can see Allah.

Speaker 2: 27:04

But what is a law to each individual? You understand what I'm saying. What is a law to the individual? Who sees a law or not? It's the same thing with these sciences. You know what I mean Like crossroad science.

Speaker 2: 27:21

Every city, every inner city, has a crossroad, bunchunches of them when you can stand and see four corners. Every place has a crossroad and every place that has a crossroad there has been some work done on that very crossroad. In that place, new York City, chicago, they all got crossroads. In that place, new York City, chicago, they all got crossroads and a lot of those areas got things that protect it or things that's attached to it.

Speaker 2: 27:55

That's why certain blocks are known for death, because nothing happens on it but death. Because what's on that block? It has to be fed with blood. So death happens all the time and most of those blocks are protected or shrouded with low frequencies, low frequency spirit, anything that you know, low frequency spirit. And then the people take the spirit. You know what I'm saying. Like you know even the way we wear clothing, the colors we wear. We wear black, we know we wear black. Our children wear black a lot. The children wear a whole bunch of black all the time, all the time hoodies cover. You know, all the time, man, just all the time.

Speaker 1: 28:47

So what's the science with black?

Speaker 2: 28:52

Well, in the occult sciences, black represents Satan or Saturn. You know what I'm saying. So it's like, when you see, it's the lowest vibration. But that's only in the science of, because you know, black has another meaning in another school, and this is what I've been telling people as well. You know, depending upon the school that you're dealing with or that you're dealing from, things don't mean the same things. They take on different understandings and they take on different tones Depending on the schools you come out of. And because it takes on a different tone, it takes on a different outcome.

Speaker 2: 29:30

Because we buy into, when you buy into a mass agreement, brother, you become, you become the agreement. You said earlier the dude touched you on your forehead and you passed the fuck out. Yeah, you kind of bought into a consciousness, mass agreement, something. He did something to you, but he was doing something to everyone and you were sitting inside of a Bro. Whenever you go somewhere, you're not the only spirit there now, everybody else in. There is a bunch of spirits now A whole bunch, and some of there is a bunch of spirits, now A whole bunch, and some of those people or some of those bodies have some things attached to them. It's easy for someone to walk in who's not acclimated to what's happening in that place and get caught up in the vibration, the frequency and all of that. It's mass agreement, it's spiritual, it's like hypnotism. You know, what I'm saying Was music playing. Music was playing. Okay, exactly, it wasn't getting faster and faster, it was the tone speeding up. The tone was slow. First of all, look at me, watch me. You're rocking. First, the tone is slow.

Speaker 1: 30:50

Nah, I wasn't rocking, though I wasn't rocking.

Speaker 2: 30:52

Not you. I'm not Not you, not you. I'm talking about the people. The tone is slow and then, next thing, you know, the tone get faster, the tone. Everybody start clapping the tone. People rolling Everybody start clapping the tone. And people rolling around, the drum is faster. Everything speeds up Because that's a part. The drum is the door, the drum is the door. The drum is a sound, it's a vibration.

Speaker 1: 31:26

King Mataw and my culture black ain't saying it's God, but yeah, that's what the God said already. He said that you know these words that we use. It depends on who's basically saying them and how you acknowledge them. It's based on the individual.

Speaker 2: 31:44

Yeah, and when you're talking about Satanism, you're talking about Satanism Came because of Christianity. Satanism Is a manifestation of Christianity. The Bible Talks about Egypt a whole lot. It talks about how it's polytheist, so on and and so forth, blah, blah, blah. Now if you look at Satanism closely and examine it, all of the symbolisms of Satanism is Egyptian. The eye of Amin Ra Ma'at, that's a satanic deity to Christianity. The Ankh, all of that stuff is satanic deity to Christianity. The Ankh, all that stuff is satanic to Christianity. It's the answer to Christianity's Scariness. Here's Satanism.

Speaker 2: 32:35

But understand, in the African traditions there's no Satan, so that don't even Vibe with us. And even in indigenous traditions there's no Satan, there's no devil, there's man. Just like somebody taught who made the devil? Well, what is the devil? Who made God? What is God? One man's God is another man's devil, indeed, but man is man himself is just a devil. He's a devil too In thought. His actions can be devilish. You know what I'm saying. So who made devil? Did Elohim make the devil? Did God make the devil or did God just make man? Now, man has the choice of higher self or lower self. Man has the ability to. Did God make the devil or did God just make man? Now, man has a choice a higher self or a lower self. Man has the ability to become God or devil. So did God make a devil, or did God just make man? You understand where I'm coming from. Indeed, you know what I'm saying. So it's like oh.

Speaker 1: 33:43

L Divine Peace, L Divine, what's going on? L Divine, what's up with you?

Speaker 2: 33:51

I mean he ain't lying According to the lessons. That's an actual fact. He just spit Right. You know what I'm saying and that's the thing. See, you know what about us? We love the good things about us All the good stuff but there's some wicked stuff too. We got to learn to take it all. We got to learn to take the whole story. We can't pick and choose the good stuff and the bad stuff. Take the whole story, because that's what makes us a great people. It's who we were and who we are, what we come from, where we've been, how resilient we are, how we beat this, how we transform, how we change. We're adaptable, swift and changeable. Adaptable, that's what we've always been. Our whole history has been adaptation and we're still adapting right now as we speak.

Speaker 2: 34:43

So, when it comes down to these sciences, I tell people all the time Study, ancient, study Haiti, study the Haiti revolution, study the Haitian revolution. Study Bukhman the Muslim, who was also a Hulgun. Bukhman the Muslim Was Muslim, but he was a Hulgun, a Haitian Hulgun master, mixing Haitian Hulgun With Sufism, islam Mixed together and created a hell of a fusion. And this is what we're not doing. What we need to be doing today is mixing these sciences, because they mean something. They're all in our hands. But we ain't being scientists. We ain't mixing one-third this and one-third that to create a mixture that's out of this world. But that's't being scientists. We ain't mixing one third this and one third that to create a mixture that's out of this world. B but that's how I operate. I've been one who's always dealt with fusion. I was taught to add on, so I always add on to everything and I pull from other things, I pull the best parts from other things and bring them into me.

Speaker 2: 35:53

Yeah, indeed, zoroastrianism as well. A hundred percent Ahura Mazda, and you know, zoroastrianism deals a lot with fire and flames. There's a lot of flame or fire science in Zoroastrianism, a lot with Fire and flames. There's a lot of flame or fire science In Zoroastrianism, as well as the comedic science of the lake of fire, in Anubis, taking you into the underworld across the lake of fire For purification, for the soul to be purified. But Christianity just tells you that this is the lake of fire that you will burn in forever.

Speaker 2: 36:21

See the parallels, indeed, so so, see the parallels, indeed, so, so, yeah, man, so it's. It's all of these sciences. To me, brother, they're very, very well and they coincide and we have to become more studious, not limit ourselves to just one, just one school of thinking, because our people sit in every school. If you were real master, you would be able to walk and sit in every one, every chair, and have something to offer in every chair you sit in because of where you have sat, where you have walked you know what I'm saying when you have you know what I'm saying Met yourself and all that type of stuff. Man.

Speaker 1: 37:05

All right To take it to. So you, you spoke about sufism right, and you mixed it with hope. Uh, who do now explain what?

Speaker 2: 37:15

do is who do? Is the ain't who do? Is the religion of our people in the south to pretty much. Voodoo is just an offshoot of what they call voodoo From our perspective on these shores, from those who came over and the descendancy I mean, you got little, you got family from down South. Brother, oh yeah, for sure you ever been down South? Oh yeah. So where were you at what city? Georgia, Florida, Texas, Texas, okay, yeah, so you'll see some things like. You'll see things and maybe stuff like the broom getting swept on your foot and they spit on the broom.

Speaker 1: 37:52

Right.

Speaker 2: 37:53

Or they'll take salt, washing salt, throw it over the left or put salt in front of the doorway a line of salt in front of the doorway. Or they'll take the Bible and put it on the 23rd Psalm and lay it on the bed and burn a candle next to it. That's all. Those are all tenets of hoodoo. That's basics. The Psalm, psalmic, sorcery, using the Psalms for sorcery work, because the Psalms are magic. The Psalms can be used to cause things to happen, used properly, the right time of day, the right day, right planetary alignments, and so on and so forth. It's a science B. You gotta know the days of the week, you gotta know what angel rules Monday, tuesday, wednesday, what planet rules, and so on and so forth. It's not just something that you just, it's not just some type of little game. It's science.

Speaker 1: 38:48

Okay, so if you can give me a little more about hoodoo, because you know, I know the Gullah Geechee yeah.

Speaker 2: 38:56

Yeah, the Gullah Geechee is hoodoo voodoo. It's a combination, because they got a over on the Gullah in South Carolina. They got a whole African village over there there. I forgot the name of the village, but there's the Olatunji. I think it's the Olatunji village, but it's an African village. It's a West African village. They maintain the West African traditions and then you got the Gullah Geechies who maintain their situation and you see the hoodoo through the church. It's all in the church. You know what I'm saying the prayer bags, the prayer rituals, the prayer call.

Speaker 1: 39:31

You know what I'm saying. I forgot about all of that.

Speaker 2: 39:34

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 39:36

I forgot all about that, wow, okay.

Speaker 2: 39:44

Mm-hmm, red dirt, okay, red dirt nail spikes, graveyard dirt, railroad spikes, you know what?

Speaker 1: 39:56

I'm saying. My thing is like what's the validity of all of this? Like does this stuff work, you know, have you seen any?

Speaker 2: 40:05

it worked, it worked, it worked, it definitely works, it works, it works because it's it's. It's you working, it's you working the ethers man? It works. It's magic, it works. Be beat, spells, be cases, it works, it works, it works. I can't validate it for you.

Speaker 1: 40:27

You understand.

Speaker 2: 40:30

Yeah, the only way something of that nature could be validated for you is you having your own infinite experience, your own personal experiences, with that science B, but I can tell you that it's very real, the science of the ancestors. You know, you may have walked into a house down south and you see it, and you know they got altars in the house, got an altar where you. You might not call it an altar, but you may have seen a table In somebody's house down south With a whole bunch of pictures of the family People who are passed away, all on the table Decorated, with a whole bunch of pictures of the family people who are passed away, all on a table decorated with a bunch of little things all over the tables or whatever. But ain't nobody on that table picture alive and you will never see a person who's alive on a table with people who passed away, because the altar is the altar is a doorway.

Speaker 1: 41:28

Okay, explain that. That altar is a doorway. Okay, explain that part right there.

Speaker 2: 41:33

You use your altar To open doors, spiritual doors, astral doors, portal doors, and you have to be careful with mirrors, very careful with mirrors, especially old mirrors. Never go, never go to an antique store and buy a mirror from it. Man, you see what I mean. If you do, take that mirror and sit it outside in the sun for about a day or so, man, two or three days, man, so you can clean it. Cleanse it Because you got to remember how mirrors in ancient, the old mirrors, were made, man. The old mirrors were made with certain types of ingredients that can hold frequencies, so you may look in the mirror and somebody else's face show up, and the mirrors can also be portals. Things can come through the mirror that's the thing I never.

Speaker 1: 42:33

The only thing I experienced is what I explained earlier. But now, as far as like energies and all of that, like I mean, I could say I've experienced some other weird things too, but I don't know if it was my eyes. You know what I'm saying. I don't know right, right.

Speaker 2: 42:56

Well, you know frequencies, man. Sometimes other other other worldly entities use frequencies and sounds and things to speak through, like white noise on a TV when you the white noise or even white noise on a radio. Sometimes they also use your lighting system, electricity lights and shit. They do a lot of work in different ways depending on what you're working. Know what you working on, man, Okay.

Speaker 1: 43:29

Okay, so as far as, like you know, quote, unquote, spirits and things of that nature, you know what's the science with that, Like from what I'm learning right, but I'm what I'm gathering is that, um, these energies like so, if we could look at it more, I was like energy right.

Speaker 2: 43:54

Yeah, you can. You can, I see that. I can see that, like when you think about the seven African powers, or the Orishas, what they call them. In Vodun, the Orishas, the seven African powers. Or in Santeria, the seven African powers, or whatever, ogun, yemaya, shango, oya, you know, oshun? You ever heard those names before? Yeah Right, so many people. Some people teach that these beings actually live. Some some teach that these beings actually live and that they became ancestors and they became elemental forces. Some people teach that these seven African powers already exist within you. You understand, like their frequencies or energies that are already a part of your makeup. When you're using these sciences, what you're doing is you're drawing. You're drawing that frequency up or you're drawing it out. It's already a part of you. Quote unquote you know what I'm saying. Like, you got seven chakras, seven African powers, seven Elohim. Are all of these things a part of you already? You know what I'm saying Because you got to remember what is the makeup of man, what is man and what is his physiology.

Speaker 2: 45:05

You see what I mean. So why do we have a pituitary gland, a pineal gland and a hypothalamus gland and why is there three wise men in the book? And I just named three parts in your brain. You know I mean so. A lot of things tie right back to you. The biggest mystery is man himself, but he's outside of his own self seeking answers, when the whole mystery is his own self. Everything else is just an introduction to you through signs, symbolism and allegory, and stories with great names that the initiate only understands and that the profane mind don't get. They just see it as a story. But initiation makes a difference. When you become initiated into certain things, there's things that come along with initiation, depending upon what schools of thinking you're going into. I mean, an initiate knows things that the average person won't know.

Speaker 1: 46:08

But no man or woman has ever come back to say, hey, this thing exists, that exists. So how do we deal with that? What you mean? Because we got people. No man has come back from the dead. Oh, come back from the dead, right.

Speaker 2: 46:22

Well, you have people, quote unquote who have died for two or three minutes and came back know I'm saying, they gave their little visions or whatever. Um, but what is death? Because I'm, I'm taught, and from my studies I can't die. I can, I can, I can, I can throw my, I can throw my body away, but I can't die. There is no death. The body disintegrates. The body has a time constraint with it. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2: 46:53

Just like going to jail, you know how you're in jail you're behind the wall, you do good time behind the wall, you get out and good things happen to you from behind the wall because you did your good time, you transitioned, so on and so forth. Well, the body is a prison too, and we're behind the wall because you did your good time and you transitioned, and so on and so forth. Well, the body is a prison too, and we behind the wall with this thing called body, and if we do good time in the body, and when we released, there's other good things happening. For those who know, when you're released, the more you gain while you have this body in your consciousness, the more you take with you when you leave this body. It's important to learn certain things, so when you leave you can use those things when you outside of this form.

Speaker 1: 47:30

Uh, uh. The God said uh, my uncle died and came back to. He said it was just black.

Speaker 2: 47:42

That was his experience. Other people, other people came back and said it wasn't black, it was other things, and everybody's experience is different. You know what I mean. So I've never been to that point, I've never physically tasted that what they call death or the stopping of my heart. I've never been to that point. But what I have done is I've been outside of my body numerous times.

Speaker 1: 48:07

Astral projection is a very, very real thing and when you actually project, you go places see, my thing is I I've never experienced any of that, so that's why I'm so curious about it, and I think that, you know, doing a podcast on this on a regular basis is important to kind of like. I know there are certain things you can't speak on. You know, when you, when you become a part of this, um, um, hold on, how do you do it? Uh, oh, how do you do it? I want to try it. Yeah, me too, god, I want to, I want to learn, I want to figure this out too, um, and I think that the only way you can do that is you have to kind of be initiated into these ciphers and things like that.

Speaker 2: 48:51

Well, action, projection is very, very easy. I mean, we do it when we go to bed, you're doing it out of, you're not able to control it, you call it dreaming, You're projecting, you call it dreaming, you're projecting, you call it dream, but your soul is traveling, bro, and we call it dreams. You know what I'm saying. Now, be able to do that consciously, while you're awake, where you don't have to go to sleep, where you lie through meditation, breathing, visualization, and it's a wrap.

Speaker 1: 49:37

This is a good one. Just remember how to get back Someone insane. I hear this too a lot.

Speaker 2: 49:43

Well, because they didn't pay attention to the core that they're attached to. Your soul can never get lost, bro. If you don't have knowledge, you may not know, but you're going to come back to your body. But, like you said, you may come back a little off. I mean, I mean, but nine times out of ten when you ask to project, you're going to see. You're not going to go too far, you're not going to what's what I'm looking for?

Speaker 2: 50:14

A person with knowledge of self will be fine actually projecting. Like I mean, I can't you know, and maybe I'm wrong, I don't know, but I've never had a problem getting back, ever, because it's my, the home base, is my physical form. It's sitting in in lotus position somewhere and I'm, without you know or laying or whatever. I'm off. I'm going to come back to my source. How do you get lost, unless you talk to an astral entity and they take you? You allow yourself to be talked and taken somewhere. Somewhere, you know, I mean, but that don't happen with me, man so you actually seen astral entities yeah, who does, if you actually?

Speaker 2: 51:01

yeah, you've seen them too in your dream state.

Speaker 1: 51:06

Listen, man, in my dream state I saw something kind of weird. Like two weeks ago, a friend of mine, a close friend of mine, had a dream that I saw his dad smoking a cigarette. His dad is no longer with us. Now I like yo, I ask, I say yo, did your pop smoke cigarettes? He say yeah, my pop did smoke cigarettes. See, see.

Speaker 2: 51:33

See, and that mean pop ain't dead either. Pop somewhere enjoying a cigarette.

Speaker 1: 51:45

I don't know Cause that. That situation Like Stuff, that I see man, is kinda weird Like.

Speaker 2: 51:51

Bro, that's. That's why it's supposed to be weird For you, for you to make sense of it Like, huh what, and you just said it, bro, did your pop smoke cigarettes? Yeah, he did. Why is you seeing his pops? Man, well, what? And you just said it, bro, did your pop smoke cigarettes? Yeah, he did. Why is you seeing his pops?

Speaker 1: 52:08

man. Well, me and his brother just reconnected after not really building with each other for Like, we always build, but we haven't seen each other in a physical in a while. And we've seen each other in a physical and then I would say, matter of fact, before we even seen each other in the physical, I had this dream we after for a while, and then you ran into him and then I saw him in the physical after that.

Speaker 1: 52:37

Yeah, okay. So I don't know. That's why I said like this, is why I'm curious about it, cause I see some shit happening, bro.

Speaker 2: 52:48

You're getting all types of answers, bro. You're getting all types of confirmations. You want somebody to just walk through your door, b Like you just sit in your living room and somebody just like, walk through the door. Not open it up and walk, but just come through the door. If you see that you'll be all right, what?

Speaker 1: 53:05

I'm doing for you. Somebody got to come through and say yo, we here.

Speaker 2: 53:10

Yeah, you know, if you wake up at night, you know you may go to bed. Wake up and your grandmother is in front of your bed Like boy. What more do you need? You know what I'm saying? Like we here, all you got to do is talk. Call us.

Speaker 1: 53:24

Another weird thing happened. Another weird thing. I'm not on no spooky, I'm just like Bro, you're not spooky at all.

Speaker 2: 53:30

I fully understand what you're coming for. It's not spooky brother, this is another thing that happened.

Speaker 1: 53:36

I now my sister died years ago, right, and um, I'm just like you know. I'm like I'm thinking about my sister. I'm thinking about my sister, right, and I'm like you know what man, I went to her grave site one time. One time since she's been gone, I said, yo, I want to go a second time. You know what, let me pick this Sunday, right. I'm like yo, ma I want to go to Deshaun Gravesite this Sunday. She said, you know what, this Sunday is right. I'm like, nah, this Sunday is her death's anniversary. I'm like, what, like this, like stuff like this is kind of I don't know man.

Speaker 2: 54:32

Bro, she hit your sister. Hit you, bro, she hit you up. That's why you start thinking she hit you. Your sister hit you up, man.

Speaker 1: 54:43

I don't know bro.

Speaker 2: 54:45

I'm just trying to figure this shit out though bro, I'm gonna tell you, all I'm gonna say is this we don't die, bro, we don't die, we don't die. It's not the final leaving. The physical form is not the final. It's not the final destination, man, it's not think about. Think about the history. Final destination, man, it's not.

Speaker 2: 55:08

Think about the history of your ancient ancestors before any religion. Think about in all the indigenous religions, or not even in religion, but all the indigenous cultures they deal with ancestral worship and gratitude and ancestral reverence. You know what I'm saying. They even do spiritual rituals and initiations and rituals around, going to the ancestral land, in the spirit world to speak to their ancestors, kind of like how your boy did in Wakanda movie when he went back and was talking to the ancestors and they were all standing there and he was in the spirit world. That's our reality. There is no white dude in heaven sitting around with a list saying okay, oh good, you go to the left, you go to the right, checking people's names off, saying he was good, you did good, and all that type of stuff. You know what I mean.

Speaker 2: 56:17

So we have to learn to get back to that, our ancestral sciences, man, because this is where we will become Strong again, man, because chasing after the strange idols Of different nations of people has gotten us where Nowhere. How does those who were Once worshipped Become worshippers? Something happened along the way. We gave up some of our own things to do something else and in the process, you gave your soul away. Man, when you give up your spiritual, when you give up your source energy, it's a wrap. Drop your God to pick up another God, the God of your people. For 10,000 years, you drop that deity to pick up another God of your foreign enemies and you bask in it. You know what I mean. There's a consequence to pay, man. There's a consequence to pay. We have to go back to what our ancestors left for us, man. We got to go back to those indigenous sciences.

Speaker 2: 57:38

Your moms was doing voodoo. You've been around it all your damn. You've been around it all your life, bro. And that's when we miss things, when we're around it all your damn. You've been around it all your life, bro. And that's when we miss things, when we around it all our lives, because it's just so normal. We just, you know, I mean, it's just that's what mom do. That's what mom do. Yeah, it ain't nothing. I mean we don't think about it because it's just because it's just around us.

Speaker 2: 57:56

You know I'm saying but it's around you and it's been around you, so it's, it's on it's, it's on your dna, it's on you, man, and as time progresses you will come into this working information. You will come into it as you are. You're being led, you're being guided. Right now, bro, I'm not talking about by me. You're being guided. You're going to be guided right to these sciences. You're being guided.

Speaker 2: 58:24

That's why your interest is there. That's why you, all of a sudden, you got an interest in the occult and all of these things. You know why? Because you've mastered a particular rudimentary science already. You understand the science of initiation, in a sense because you're God. You had to manifest 120. You had to know the supreme alphabet. You had to know the supreme math. You had to manifest 120. You had to know the Supreme Government. You had to know the Supreme Math. You had to be able to recite those with an understanding. You had to be able to go to 0 to 9. You had to do that. That's an initiation. You know what I'm saying. So you're an initiate in one science already. You're an initiate in a number of other sciences, martial sciences. You're an initiate, so you're an initiate, so you, you're an initiate in in sciences already now the thing is, whatever martial arts that you are initiated in, find the spirit side of those arts, find that's what I've been trying to do.

Speaker 1: 59:21

I've been asking questions, I've been saying like so you know, because you know, with Khalid PTK, I'm like so what did they like? What was their spiritual side?

Speaker 2: 59:31

I'm going to tell you why hold up For TD Tertia. That's with Leo Gaji, right? Yep, leo Gaji. If I'm not mistaken, he's a Christian, I think so. So he's not going to tell you about Antin. He's not going to tell you about the sorcerer. He's not going to tell you those things because he's a Christian. So you're going to miss that with him. I'm giving you something right now. Write this word down. Get a pen and write this word down. All right, you ready? Yeah, I'm going to spell it for you. A-n-t-i-n-g One word.

Speaker 1: 1:00:15

A-N-T-I-N-G Say that word, anting Say it twice. Anting, Anting.

Speaker 2: 1:00:23

Look Anting Anting up Right now. Do it. If you can't write quick, Look it up. Google it real fast, Alright, and read it. And read the definition of it, Read what it says.

Speaker 1: 1:00:40

The term Anting Can refer to two distinct things. One Anting Behavior this refers to two distinct things. One anting behavior this refers to the maintenance behavior observed in birds and some mammals like squirrels, where they rub insects.

Speaker 2: 1:01:00

No, put collie next to it, Like put anting, anting, put Anting, put Kali, put magic, or Anting Arnie's magic.

Speaker 1: 1:01:12

Oh, here it is now. Oh, you said Anting, Anting. Okay, I just put Anting.

Speaker 2: 1:01:17

So Anting.

Speaker 1: 1:01:17

Anting is a Filipino term for amulets or charms often believed to possess magical properties and protective powers. It's also a system of Filipino folk magic and sorcery that utilizes these amulets. These items, ranging from simple objects like stones or dried fruit to more elaborate pendants, are thought to offer protection, strength and even prosperity to the wearer.

Speaker 2: 1:01:50

Yep, yep. And you see that in a lot of systems I just mentioned to you about Grigori bags and Mojo bags, mojo bags in hoodoo, yeah, you know what I'm saying. So this is universal science Amulets, talismans worn on the body, you know what I'm saying. Making the body the triangle. Yes, yes, yeah, kali, the triangle. So, and that's Filipinoipino. Indonesia has sorcery, javanese sorcery, that's connected to the sea lock. You understand what I mean. I'm creating a system, the graveyard system of my combat, connected with hoodoo, visualization and harufisms and other things. B? B, you know what I'm saying. So it's time, man, like it's time, to do these things. We slipping Hold on. I'll call back. It's my daughter. I'll call back.

Speaker 1: 1:02:58

Well, I was just about to say we're an hour in. Oh, okay, we're an hour in. Your daughter called at the right time. Thank you for coming out this evening. Really appreciate you. We're going to do Wizards, warlocks, spooks and Holy Ghosts again A call the next time you're up. Alternate Friday.

Speaker 2: 1:03:18

All right, let's do it.

Speaker 1: 1:03:19

All right, we're going to just keep building on this and go in depth on this and I'll come back with some with some findings. All right, yeah, yeah, do that. Indeed Peace to everybody in the chat. I really appreciate y'all and we are out of here. Peace, peace you.