Quotes from Kwame Ture - Imole mosi chukwu oyeh

Kwame Touré's revolutionary wisdom comes alive through seven powerful quotes that challenge us to reconsider our relationship with land, identity, and liberation. Join Emoli and host Ron Brown as they unpack the profound legacy of this Pan-Africanist thinker in a conversation that weaves together history, philosophy, and practical strategies for African unity.

The discussion begins with Touré's reflections on the devastating impact of denying freed slaves their promised "40 acres and a mule" – perhaps the most far-reaching betrayal in African American history. This broken promise didn't just withhold property; it fundamentally altered the psychological landscape for generations. Through Touré's observations organizing in the American South, we see how land ownership directly affects confidence, political courage, and willingness to stand for one's rights.

When exploring the tension between imported ideologies and African traditions through the powerful declaration that "Marx is not our ancestor," the conversation shifts to how revolutionary principles can harmonize with spiritual values rather than creating unnecessary divisions. Emoli shares personal insights on bridging these philosophical worlds while honoring African cultural foundations.

The discussion takes an especially fascinating turn when examining Touré's interaction with Ho Chi Minh, who asked when African Americans would repatriate to Africa. This moment reveals how global revolutionary leaders recognized African nationalism as the logical foundation for worldwide African liberation. The parallel with Chinese communities establishing Chinatowns while maintaining connection to China offers a model for how Africans can organize globally while recognizing their true ancestral base.

Whether you're deeply familiar with Pan-African thought or just beginning to explore these ideas, this episode provides accessible entry points to understanding how land, identity, and liberation remain interconnected challenges for African people worldwide. Listen now to discover how Kwame Touré's revolutionary wisdom remains strikingly relevant for today's liberation movements.

Chapters

• 0:10 Introduction and Seven Quotes
• 5:46 40 Acres and the Land Question
• 14:26 Marx Is Not Our Ancestor
• 26:23 Dr. King's Tactical Nonviolence
• 42:53 Repatriation and African Nationalism
• 49:03 Closing Thoughts

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:10

what's going on, everybody out. There is ron brown, lmt, the people's fitness professional, aka soul brother number one, reporting for duty, and we have the brother magnetic alarm in the building. Uh, we have peace, great. We have emoli in the building pan Peace, great. We have Emoli in the building Pan-Africanist. And we're going to build on Kwame Touré. If I mispronounce something, please fix it. Help me fix that. Seven quotes from Kwame Touré by Emoli.

Speaker 1: 0:44

So the first thing, first things first. Man, when you come in the chat like comment share, subscribe first off. We're also pushing the super chats pretty hard right now. We're trying to continuously build this podcast, this platform, and take it to another level. Actually, you know, we have one studio, in-studio podcast. We're trying to do more in-studio podcasts. We're trying to go around to different groups and film their culture and things like that as well. So, support the brand. It's a media brand, it's a media brand. The podcast is just the mother of it, right, and then, and it branches out into other things. So support the brand. Super chat, super chat. Let's go into the quotes right now. Seven quotes from Kwame Torre.

Speaker 1: 1:39

All right, uh, first off, the first one. We shouldn't lightly dismiss 40 acres and a mule either, kwame Nkrumah, is that the right way? Nkrumah, nkrumah, right, yeah, kwame Nkrumah would tell me. All libertarians began with land working in the Delta. We began to see clearly how the withholding of these 40 acres had been no trivial blow, all right. In fact, almost exactly 100 years later, the lasting, visible, painful consequences of that betrayal were still undeniable, sketched in our people's condition. Of the many, many betrayals and disappointments African had suffered at the hands of the Republic, I began to see how Congress failed to make good on its promise. Of those 40 acres to the freedmen was arguably the most far-reaching and injurious. No doubt, no doubt about it. So that was the first quote, that was the first one.

Speaker 3: 3:03

Should I enter now? Yes, sir, okay, how I see my interpretation is that Kwame was referring to organizing Africans in the southern, in the Delta for civil rights, in the civil rights and human rights movement in in in the United States for voting rights, for, for to organize politically and independent political organization, and that when he was organizing Africans there that there was a difference between the attitude of those Africans who were uh land owners versus those who were tenants on uh, uh white people's land. And he was saying that those who had their own, who owned the land, they were more confident, they were more enthusiastic about independent political organization standing up for their rights and interacting with SNCC organizers. They were easier to organize than those who were living on white people's land because they were more timid, they were more worried about what the landowners would do if they tried to start attending meetings to organize for voting rights, for other rights. And so I think that land ownership issue is very, very important and Kwame was alluding to the 40 acres and the mule and how land ownership affects the behavior and attitudes of people you know. And so how I understand that particular section is that the denial of that 40 acres and a mule to the Africans, particularly many Africans, who even fought in the military of the Union Army, you know, against the Southern Confederacy not giving those people land.

Speaker 3: 5:36

You know, all those Africans. You know, because those Africans helped the Union Army to win the war. They were losing the war, and so I mean the civil war in the States. They were losing the war, and so when the Africans were allowed to enlist in the Union military, within nine months they were able to win the war. And so they promised those Africans, you know, that we were going to be able to have 40 acres and a mule with the Freedmen's Bureau. And so those Africans, the land that was supposed to be allocated to Africans was land that was previously held by Southern slave owners, and so that land was supposed to be reallocated for the freedmen. And so when Lincoln was assassinated and Andrew Jackson took over, instead of allowing for those Africans to receive that land and have a base, a land base, where they would own the land and be able to cultivate the land and independently facilitate that land and to some extent it would still be under America, but they would still be landowners and have large pockets of land that they own. And so with that situation that would have empowered Africans to some extent. And so by changing, with Andrew Jackson changing and then handing that land back over to the white slave owners instead of giving the land to those Africans, kwame Ture is saying that's a great betrayal. It's the betrayal of those Africans, you know, efforts in enabling the Union Army to win that war against the Confederacy, and then following that with the Ku Klux Klan, with terrorism against those Africans.

Speaker 3: 7:47

And so I think that to me, by examining Kwame's statement, we could also look at the African population in America in terms of land ownership, because we're not a population who have real ownership over that land, and it's also affecting the attitude of Africans there, you know, say, vis-a-vis other populations of Africans, like in Jamaica or in, like you know, haiti, or in Africa itself. You know, our population is primarily not landowners, our population is primarily not landowners, and so that reality affects our attitudes about our nationalism, about our confidence to develop economic infrastructure for our community to employ our own people, you know, and for our political representation to employ our own people, you know, and to for our political representation to represent our interests in earnest. So that that's how I look at that quote by Kwame Ture that certainly, as Africans, we have to have control over the land, and having control over the land will give us the confidence Amir Karkabraw used to say what land, what soil are you? You know. So there's an ashes to ashes. We're part of the soil. That's our culture, you know.

Speaker 3: 9:16

The soil is our culture and so our relationship to it, you know, affects us greatly. And so certainly you know, if we're not controlling land, then that's going to affect us in every aspect. You know of behavior, and so you know, to me that means that we have to fight for land. You know, like I said in the previous podcast, that you know we shouldn't be building castles in the sky instead of fighting for land, and I think that, because we're used to not having land ownership, you know particularly the African population and the snakes, sidetracked and misguided and shooting in the wrong direction when it comes to our struggle, and it also helps us to be thinking about nationalism in ways where we're not concentrating on a land base.

Speaker 3: 10:22

Okay, okay on a land base.

Speaker 3: 10:25

Okay, okay, yeah, we're able to be directed towards types of nationalism where there's not actually a land base, a tangible land base involved, or a land that we're controlling that we can set up a government or some kind of political administration on, you know, which is, you know, putting us in so many different directions.

Speaker 3: 10:45

You know, which is putting us in so many different directions. You know, and I think our enemy is clear, that we don't have that clarity regarding land ownership and control, and so we're getting, you know, misdirected in terms of the type of nationalism. We're getting this types of religious nationalism and all kind of nationalism and identities, because identity, national, our national identity will come from our land base. You know, if we're Ghanaian, then we know that this is the land of Ghana and this is the territory we're based in, being a Ghanaian on, you know, or a Haitian. But we're getting identities from our enemy that are not based on any land base and we have so much fervor with these identities because of mental slavery. But if we're able to focus on the land, then now our nationalism becomes very clear, like it is for other people throughout the world.

Speaker 1: 11:52

Okay, now when you speak on land right and what do you suggest? Now, I'm assuming you're suggesting repatriation, right, right?

Speaker 3: 12:03

Yes, yeah, I'm suggesting repatriation, like African nationalism.

Speaker 1: 12:09

OK, so let's say, if I wanted to buy land in Ghana, right, the first thing I have to do would I have to get a visa first off. Right? What would be the process?

Speaker 3: 12:23

Well, what the process would be. You'd have to get a visa, yes, to come to Ghana, and I would say do your due diligence. But, as african, you can get access to land in ghana. You can get access to land in ghana.

Speaker 1: 12:41

In other parts of africa, you can get access to the land because I'm african, or just because you have you, you might have the finances, financial capabilities to do so.

Speaker 3: 12:55

I would say the financial capabilities to do so. And also, because you're an African, you know there's ways for Africans to return to Africa and be able to get citizenship in Africa. You know, if you're serious to be able to get citizenship in Africa, people are returning to Sierra Leone, people are returning to Burkina Faso, people are returning to Guinea-Bissau, nigeria, ghana. People are returning home. You know significant numbers of people are returning home and it's going to become more. Okay, so it's certainly going to become more. As Africa becomes more independent and unified, our people are going to come home.

Speaker 1: 13:40

I think so. I can see that, because over here, I don't know, it's not looking too good. But when it comes to dual citizenship, you know what would be the process for that.

Speaker 3: 13:58

Well, you have to apply for dual citizenship. There's people that you could be directed to help educate Africans about that process and, as we go forward, if you're interested or people are interested, they can be directed to such people. Gotcha, all right. So we're interested or people are interested, they can be direct to such people.

Speaker 1: 14:18

Gotcha All right, so we're going to move on to the second quote. So the second quote.

Speaker 3: 14:25

But the land issue, you know. Okay, well, we can go to the second quote. The land issue is very important. That land issue is very important, but let's go forward.

Speaker 1: 14:36

Okay, so the chief was a western, educated man, yet strongly invested in a contradictional belief in practice and with impeccable nationalist credentials in struggle. Uh, it is he who, after some differences with a European expert, is said to have exploited in, explode, exploited, no, exploded, exploded in cabinet. Mr President, must I remind you that, after all is said and done, karl Marx is not our ancestor.

Speaker 2: 15:18

Can you type the page number?

Speaker 3: 15:20

so the listeners can also, you know, possibly look on with us.

Speaker 1: 15:25

Page 629. Page 629. So this is from a book. If you explain the book, seven quotes from Kwame Ture. That's the name of the book.

Speaker 2: 15:40

No, no, that's just what we entitled this. The book is Ready for the Revolution, right?

Speaker 3: 15:45

Yes, the book is Ready for the Revolution. By Kwame Ture, it's an autobiography.

Speaker 1: 15:52

Ready for the Revolution is the book and the page we just read. The first quote was 288. The second one was 629. So if you want to expound on that, you can.

Speaker 3: 16:07

OK, we said Karl Marx is not our ancestor. I think during that period of time, there were a lot of Africans in Ghana who were subscribing to Marxism, you know, ideologically, to direct us towards socialism. And so, um, during that period, there was an ideological struggle, not just an ideological struggle, but a philosophical struggle as well that was taking place and, um, you know the this chief, um, he was, um, someone who was well-educated in the Western educational system, his name was Nanakobana Nketiah IV and he was the paramount chief of Segundi Takradi, segundi Takradi. And so he was arguing in cabinet that's in the, not in cabinet. He was arguing I'm sorry, go ahead, he was arguing because it was in a formal, he was in a formal government setting, in cabinet, yeah, it was in cabinet. He was arguing in cabinet that Marx wasn't our ancestor. So, evidently, somebody who was a European was quoting Marx in order to try to make a point to him, and he came out and he said you know, marx wasn't, is not our ancestor.

Speaker 3: 18:05

And so how I'm interpreting it is because, you know, one of the things that persists in our environments as Africans is an ancestral struggle. You get me when we have foreign people, you know Europeans, who are imposing their ancestry on us, just like Trump is putting the names of Pickett and Hood and Lee on military forts in America. Currently, right, these are European ancestors, right. And so there's the ancestral struggle. And so when we look at education in universities, then you have Socrates and Plato and Aristotle and Nietzsche and Schopenhauer and Beckley and Marx that are being taught to our, you know, students, african students in philosophy. If you go into religious, you know arena, you're having peter and paul, and you know all of these people, these uh, uh, uh, that are being also, you know, imposed on our people, you know, as and as ancestors. But a lot of these people that we're introduced to all the time, even our children are, you know, exposed to Thor, you know, and a white ISIS, you know, and all kinds of pagan ancestors in the cartoons. And so if you look critically at our society, then foreign ancestors, you know, which is a part of foreign culture, is imposed onto us, you know, making us extensions of them, while our ancestry is being vilified, particularly, you know, our ancestry is vilified in America and our ancestry is being vilified particularly, you know our ancestry is vilified in America and our ancestry is also vilified even in Africa, and so our ancestry must be respected.

Speaker 3: 20:29

And then we talk about philosophy and ideology. We should be looking to our own experience, our own culture and experience. So ancestry is something that is paramount in our culture. That's why libation is poured in order to honor ancestors and, furthermore, we are actually physically, you know, our ancestry. That's why the DNA can be used to trace ancestry, because we're physically part of our ancestry and our DNA has memory. That's why we look like our ancestry and we dance like our ancestry. You know he's saying that. No, you know we, you can't bring you know without us looking at our own material conditions and for our interests for our interests, you know, not the interest, necessarily of European workers. And so I think that Kwame Ture is putting this in there to make that point raw and clear, that you know this African chief in cabinet. This is what he said. When all is said and done, marx is not our ancestor, and so when we're looking at Marx, there's things that we can accept and things that we may not want to accept.

Speaker 1: 22:36

Can you give some examples, accept and things that we may not want to?

Speaker 3: 22:39

accept from life. Can you give some examples? Well, kwame Turei used to always talk about the role of religion in revolution. He said that when he was in the South organizing, the only place they could have meetings were in churches. And he said that an old woman would say if God ain't in this movement, it ain't going nowhere. And so, you know, looking at, looking at that situation, you know, marxism is philosophical materialism. According to Marxism, leninism and the sole reality of matter necessarily is atheistic or is atheism. And so if we're organizing among Africans who have a strong spiritual orientation, you know, then it doesn't, it's not, it's not, it's not realistic at this time to try to encourage our people to be atheists as part of our organizing process and a part as a part of our organizing strategy, you know. And so therefore, you know we should have a a type of um of of strategy or our type of tactics to approach our people who are religious.

Speaker 2: 23:59

I remember you told me something back in the day family we were talking about religion and you said in dialectical materialism it means opposites and how they work together. You said so if religion can be used for negative things, if it can be the opium of the masses, then it can be used for liberation as well. And that's dialectical materialism. It can be used for good, it can be used for bad. It's about how the person is using it, how the person is thinking. I never forgot that.

Speaker 1: 24:31

Now I think his screen is frozen. He's going to go out and come back. I would like for you to expound a little bit more on land acquisition. As one of the guards say, the knowledge was talking about that Monday. So you know, do you have any idea on how you want to go about doing that? Is your plan to move to Africa? Is that in your plans?

Speaker 2: 25:04

No, I mean, I just honestly think we need to be functional family so that we're able to move across the planet and not just be stuck somewhere.

Speaker 2: 25:14

You know, I want to be able to go to the Caribbean. If I need to go to the Caribbean, I want to be able to go to India, just all the parts where our people are at. You know, when we need to go to teach, to trade, you know, as Mo, as as more, as more, as the travelers, and wherever we travel, we take knowledge with us, we take culture with us. You know, we take goods and services with us and everybody's always happy that we came like black Santa Claus. You know, and that's what I think has always been one of our, um, our best qualities you know that we could take goods and services, people that are needed over here, right, and go and take these people from over here and bring them over to where they're needed at most needed, most appreciated. You know, and I think that's like I said, I think that's our role within this you know this black world culture, you know.

Speaker 1: 26:09

For sure.

Speaker 2: 26:10

And then, when we stop doing it, the British start doing it. You know this black world culture, you know For sure. And then, when we stopped doing it, the British started doing it. You know, when they captured our train routes, our shipping routes, somebody else started doing it. That was really what was the beginning of white supremacy, when they captured our train routes and they cut off our ability for our cities to interact with each other and they assumed that role. You know, right, that's what I see, because it needs to be a functional Pan-Africanism family Can't be where we just show up. We need to find the people that Africa needs and then direct them to the different countries where they're needed at. You see, I think that'd work a lot better.

Speaker 1: 26:57

All right, so now I want to go into the third quote.

Speaker 3: 27:02

Can I land on the second quote? Yes, what I'm saying is farming used to even encourage us to read the Bible, read the Quran and read the books that our people are into, so we can look at the principles in those religions and try to harmonize those principles with the revolutionary principles. I'll give a quick example that, like the golden rule, do unto others as you have, others do unto you, and that golden rule is consistent with humanism as a principle which says treat each person as an end in and of themselves, not merely as a means to an end. You know, okay, so that's a ideological principle With a philosophical principle where we're looking at each man as primarily a spiritual being, originally endowed with a certain inward dignity, integrity and value, which implies duties of a socialist kind.

Speaker 3: 28:14

In Christianity and Islam they're looking at man as being primarily a spiritual being, but they're saying this is the creator spirit in us.

Speaker 3: 28:23

In Islam it says that Allah created mankind of a sounding clay and black mud, fashioned into shape and then put up his spirit in man to make man complete. And in Christianity it said that man is made of dust and then God put his Holy Spirit, or his living breath, in man. You know, we can agree, has dignity, has integrity, has value, and that every single person should be respected, you know, along such lines. So so there's there's ways that we can look at people as revolutionaries. We can look at people's spiritual orientation and find commonality in order to organize our people and liberate our society. So I think he's talking about the approach, how we're looking at each other, and then also how we're looking at organizing our people and relating to our people and not have an antagonistic type of development between those of us who are maybe traditionalists, muslims, christians or what have you and not have us centripping, but rather able to harmonize ourselves for our common interests.

Speaker 1: 29:40

Gotcha Makes a lot of sense. All right. Now you want to go to the third one? Let's go, All right. I parted company with nationalists on Dr King. It seemed clear to me that nonviolent mass action was an effective tactic. I supported any strategy that could move the southern masses of our people to confront American apartheid Page 111. Ok.

Speaker 3: 30:25

I think that Kwame, on that quote on King, he's doing the same thing that I did, you know, when I was younger, you know, I would talk, quote Malcolm X or Mawali, and, you know, speak against Dr King. And so me and Chris, one time we were walking with Rafiki, and Rafiki was like, nah, we shouldn't take that approach of you know, saying we're supporting Malcolm X but we're condemning Martin Luther King. We should look at the positives and negatives in both and then try to develop out of and advance the struggle that they both waged. You understand. And so when, uh, and so he so kwame ture, he used to always talk about the things that dr king contributed to our struggle. You know, he talked about how King was a great mobilizer while Malcolm X was a great organizer. And he talked about how Dr King taught us to face the enemy without fear. You know, confront the enemy, Go to. He said that it was. It was a gift, you know, and an ability of Dr King to be able to get the people to stand up to the white men in America they were afraid, you know, timid, you know they have been terrorized by the Ku Klux Klan and the police and for Africans to get in the street and stand right face to face with the police in America was a very great accomplishment and stand up for our actual rights, our right to vote, our right to to ride on the front of the bus, you know very. And then later, the poor people's campaign. And so King was, you know, a gifted orator and he was, he was, he was a person that had a high integrity, you know, he was consistent in what he said. You know, if he said that he's going to be nonviolent and that's his principle, then he later told America that, you know, they need to be nonviolent.

Speaker 3: 32:48

In Vietnam, you know, and around the world, you know, in their war machine against poor people all over the world, you know, and called America said, and I also agree that with nonviolence as a principle, rather nonviolence is a tactic, because King was being protected by armed guards. So that showed that the people in his organization even didn't agree with nonviolence as a principle. But what he did bring to to our struggle was very important and invaluable. And Dr King was like the moral voice. And so you see what happened.

Speaker 3: 33:40

When they assassinated King, what did the people do? What did Africans do? All over America? They rose up. You know and let the enemy know that. You know we're not just going to just take this lying down with the assassination of King. You know so. They destroyed properties that didn't belong to us. You know and let them know that now we're going to destroy, we're going to do something that is going to know negatively affect you, if you know, for taking out, you know, somebody who is a great, you know, african, like dr king, and a lot of what dr king stood for and what he advocated for and what he, you know, demonstrated, what was, um, uh, not publicized by the capitalist media. I think that's very important. I think now on social media, some of the presentations and speeches and interviews Dr King presented are now being shown on YouTube and those types of things. But, like Kwame said, why we can't wait Dr King's book, why we Can't Wait?

Speaker 3: 35:01

Dr King came to Ghana and he met with Kwame. He took pictures with Kwame and Krumah and he said that he supported Ghanaian independence against colonial rule, he was anti-colonialist, and then he even said that what he learned and what he saw in Ghana, you know, inspired him to fight for the rights of Africans. You know, stronger in America, that was in 57, he came to Ghana for independence, for independence ceremony, you see, and they were asking him in an interview, you know, how do you think about Ghana? He said well, we wish we could have you know what the Ghanaians are having for the Africans in America.

Speaker 3: 35:53

That was my impression.

Speaker 2: 35:54

When I saw his connection to Kwame Nkrumah I thought he was more. He took more of an impression from Kwame Nkrumah than he did from the guy from India.

Speaker 3: 36:07

What's his name? Mahatma.

Speaker 2: 36:08

Gandhi, mahatma Gandhi. I saw our struggle more parallel with the Convention People's Party than Mahatma Gandhi's struggle. I saw it much closer and they were both alphas as well, he and Nkrumah.

Speaker 3: 36:23

Nkrumah was a sigma.

Speaker 2: 36:25

He was a sigma. Okay, yes, Okay. So I was close.

Speaker 1: 36:32

Now you want to go into the third. No, this is not the hold on. How many did we get?

Speaker 3: 36:39

One quick point to make is that. So that demonstrates that Martin Luther King was looking at the tactics that he was using in America and Africa. You know, exactly tactically. But on the colonial question, martin Luther King was clear that Africans have the right to control our land, africans have the right to independent government, africans should be sovereign, have the right to national self-determination and sovereignty, and so therefore, you know, king was very clear on those aspects, but he was just looking at the actual conditions of Africans in America and said, ok, in order to get these Africans to stand up and move forward, these are, this is this is what we need to do to get us from step A to step B.

Speaker 2: 37:31

These are the kind of tactics you know they both very successfully used boycotts and strikes, what we call positive action to effect change. You know that's what one thing they had in common. They used it masterfully and they had a string of things they were doing, not just one thing one, no, it was like A, b, c, d, e, f, g, yeah, and also you notice that Martin Luther King never condemned black power and also the SNCC organizers who were, you know, working with him.

Speaker 3: 38:08

He was close with some of those youth, like Kwame Ture. So Martin Luther King was someone who maybe he was going to be nonviolent. But deacons for defense were there, sncc were there and, like Kwame said, a lot of them were armed. So, martin Luther King, he said for him, martin Luther King, this is what he's going to be nonviolent. But he was working with other people who were using various type of tactics and methods and so he was looking at what he was doing tactically, you know, tactically and strategically, and I think that he was trying to apply certain methods to the conditions in America, that he was trying to apply certain methods to the conditions in America, you know. So the mistakes Martin Luther King made, like taking nonviolence to the level of a principle, we can correct those mistakes and look at those methods as tactical methods rather than principle, you know, than a principle that, like he, like how he looked at it. That's something we can learn from that and then also be able to be more dialectical in the kind of tactics that we, you know, like looking at how to be able to work with other African groups. You know we can be more objective in our approach to struggle and looking at what works. You know what type of things is effective in being able to advance our interests forward as Africans. You know what works and so what Dr King was doing, it was effective and it was working.

Speaker 3: 40:12

No-transcript. Their modus operandi is to terrorize Africans. So when you get in the streets and you start organizing on the streets, you know to confront them. That's not no small thing. Your life is on the line. Your life is on the line. Your life is on the line. And so you know for Dr King to get all those Africans Christians, you know, africans in the South who have been terrorized by Ku Klux Klan and white police, you know all those years, all these, you know all this period of time to get them, to confront them on their rights was a very great accomplishment. You know who else was going to get the Africans to come to the streets. You know to confront the enemy.

Speaker 3: 40:59

And so, as the Africans were coming to the streets to confront the enemy, then that created a bigger space for revolutionaries who were armed, like the Deacons for Defense and SNCC organizers and others to be able to come with their guns, you know, and not, you know, be singled out and targeted so easily.

Speaker 3: 41:20

Right, right, you understand what I'm saying. And so, like Mao Zedong wrote in his book on guerrilla warfare Mao Zedong was saying that we need to revolutionaries need to swim in a big ocean rather than in a small pond Say that revolutionaries need to swim in a big ocean rather than in a small pond. And so, by King being able to get the masses to come to the streets, now that is making the ocean bigger for those in SNCC, those in deacons for defense and other formations to become more active, and it makes it more difficult for the enemy to target some of us that they would be able to target more easily, like how they, how they're naming some africans as black identity extremists. You know, if all our people, if our men, the masses of our people, are in the streets confronting the enemy, then it's more difficult to target you, those who are in the revolutionary intelligentsia, or those who are, you know, very active organizers, very vibrant and active organizers. So that condition is better for us to make change.

Speaker 2: 42:32

Yes, sir, good.

Speaker 1: 42:35

Hold on one second. So now let's go into the next one. The next one is then he. Then he suddenly leaned closer and asked when are you African Americans going to repatriate to Africa? I said, well, sir, we are not there yet, but that remains the ultimate goal, but it will surely be in the future, as the contradictions continue to develop. Page 601.

Speaker 2: 43:13

That was the conversation he was having with Mao right.

Speaker 3: 43:16

No with Ho Chi Minh.

Speaker 2: 43:17

Okay, Ho Chi Minh, pardon me.

Speaker 3: 43:21

Yeah, yeah. So that quote, I think that it's clear where our nationalism? Because Ho Chi Minh used to sail on ships back and forth to New York and he heard Garvey speak and was very impressed with Marcus Garvey, and so he was so impressed that it said that he made a financial contribution to the UNIA, the Universal Negro Improvement Association that African communities lead. And also Ho Chi Minh wrote articles condemning the lynching of Africans in America. He wrote articles I've read the articles in a book that Ho Chi Minh wrote against lynching of Africans. And so Ho Chi Minh was somebody who had heard Garvey's line Africa for Africans, those at home and those abroad.

Speaker 3: 44:18

And when Kwame Ture went to Vietnam, some of the cadres that he met were Marxist, like Marxist, leninist oriented. And we have that, like Kenyatta was talking about, in our movement. We have those who are more nationalist oriented. We have those who are more nationalist oriented. We have those who are Marxist. You know various. You know factions that are looking at socialism as an objective. You know for our people, that is, a better economic system for our people. And so with this he said those are some, but, but the question is what type of ideological orientation that they have to guide us to achieve socialism.

Speaker 3: 45:02

And so Ho, ho Chi Minh, he had been exposed to nationalism from Garvey and others. And so when Kwame went to Vietnam and he met Ho, that he would first those, those who, those other Vietnamese, they were pushing a Marxist line. But when he met Ho, ho Chi Minh was like, well, when are you Africans, when are you African-Americans going back to Africa? And so he was like, wow, you know, look at what the man Ho Chi Minh, leading the Vietnamese, the Viet Cong, against American imperialism and defeating American imperialism, a great, great hero like Ho Chi Minh. And so for him to say what he said to Kwame Ture, it was very profound and took him aback to hear Ho Chi Minh say such a thing.

Speaker 3: 46:02

And so Kwame Ture was like, when he reflected on what Ho Chi Minh was saying you're right, you know, that's the ultimate goal. You know Africa is the ultimate goal for African people, you know. And so for those of us who are in the United Snakes, you know to look and say you know where's our nationalism, which land is ours, what soil are we? You know we have all these struggles going on now, you know, to a very high extent because of mental slavery and our detachment from our land and the natal alienation that was infused into us in america during the genocide of chattel enslavement, and so that's now trying to tie us to other lands instead of our actual land, where we come from.

Speaker 3: 46:58

And so that nationalism is African nationalism. That's our nationalism, is African nationalism, and so you know, that is the viable nationalism for our people. You know, and that doesn't mean we can't own land in other locations of the world and that doesn't mean we can't organize ourselves in other locations in the world. But if you look at the Chinese, you have a model. They have Chinatowns all over in the States, don't they?

Speaker 1: 47:27

Right.

Speaker 3: 47:28

For sure. Yeah, so that doesn't mean that China is not the base for the Chinese people in America, does it? Just because they have Chinatowns in America, that doesn't mean China is no longer their base for their nationalism. So if you look at Africans in America, it's the same thing, but only because of mental slavery. Chinese don't have mental slavery. That's why the governor, when he won the election in Washington, state that where where's the first place he went. I think his name was Gary Locke, right.

Speaker 2: 48:03

Yep, yep, gary Locke. He became the governor.

Speaker 1: 48:09

Well, his screen is frozen again, but I want to end right here. I want to end right here and you know, and come back and build on this. There's a lot of things that I want to build on with the brother Emoli and yourself, I think. Did he come back?

Speaker 2: 48:33

yeah, he coming back yeah, cause this is an important subject and it has to be presented in it's proper perspective. Man, yeah, he's coming back. Just a philosophy, you know, and it produces exact results. And he has produced exact, precise results. You know, he's not just somebody who's just talking or theorizing.

Speaker 1: 49:05

Indeed indeed. So on that note, man, we're going to click out. Thank you for all who were on the chat. Thank you, brother Magnetic, for coming on. Really appreciate your contribution and we are out of here.

Speaker 2: 49:23

Peace.