The meaning of Assata Shakur's Legacy to Black Women with Tiffany French

Chapters

• 0:00 Welcomes, guest intro, topic set
• 1:12 Assata’s early life and influences
• 4:20 From civil rights to self‑defense
• 5:56 Roles in BPP and Panther 21
• 8:12 Shift to the Black Liberation Army
• 9:56 Internal conflicts, misogyny, leadership
• 15:40 Women’s labor, care, and leadership
• 19:20 Feminism, Florence Kennedy, key books
• 24:20 Jersey Turnpike: shooting, injury, trial
• 29:20 Prison abuse, search, and trauma
• 33:40 The jailbreak and exile to Cuba
• 38:40 U.S. pressure, bounties, Castro’s shield
• 42:48 Modern activism vs. movement integrity
• 47:00 Legacy, comparisons, and takeaways
• 53:00 Plugs, where to find Tiffany, closing

Transcript

SPEAKER_04: 0:10

Peace world, we are back again. NYP Talk Show. We got our sister from day one, Tiffany. AKA Uhuru, I call it Tiffany RBG. AKA online, she would chop your head off if you come ahead with that nonsense. Very articulate, sister. She's passionate about her people. And she's she's royal to the core. Tiffany, welcome, my sister. How you doing?

SPEAKER_05: 0:39

I'm doing great. How you doing?

SPEAKER_04: 0:42

I'm good. I'm good, man. I'm good, man. It's one of those days just tired. Peace to the chat. You know, I don't want to, I don't want to butcher this person's name. But is it Devon? Devaran. Flops.

SPEAKER_05: 1:00

Flops.

SPEAKER_04: 1:02

Yeah.

unknown: 1:03

Okay.

SPEAKER_04: 1:04

Shawnee. We got Shawnee in the building. Shawnee's been a long time, bro. Peace, man. Okay, peace, peace. Peace. Peace. And tonight we'll be talking about the meaning of a the meaning of Asada Shakur's legacy to black women with Miss Tiffany.

SPEAKER_05: 1:20

Yes.

SPEAKER_04: 1:21

You know.

SPEAKER_05: 1:22

Okay, he says pronounced his folks. Okay.

SPEAKER_04: 1:25

Folks. Alright, we got you, folks. So, Ms. You know, we we lost Auntie Asada this year.

SPEAKER_05: 1:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 1:33

You know, who was very pivotal to the movement. You know, salute to the sister, the mother, yeah, who's now an ancestor. Yeah. Who has contributed to the struggle of the people here in these shores of North America during the civil rights movement? As many other sisters that um the unsung sisters, rest in peace, and to them, if they pass, empower to them, they are if they are still alive. But we're gonna talk about Auntie Asada. So, first question I have for you, sister. What events in Asada Shakur's early life shape her political consciousness?

SPEAKER_05: 2:11

Well, the events that took place, of course, um, is oppression and the civil rights. Yep. So those things played a factor because she came up around a time, you know, when um and also Malcolm X and also put it out there as well. She came up around the time when, you know, those two gentlemen were very prominent in the black community. And you know, uh, although she was from New York, but she also grew up in North Carolina. So there was a heavy racism in the South. So yeah, that, yeah, so that shaped her views on society and you know how black people were going about dealing with oppression and the condition, the living condition of black people as well. So if I'm not mistaken, I believe she grew up in the rough part of New York. If I'm not mistaken, she grew up in, I think she was raised in Harlem somewhere, right?

SPEAKER_04: 3:23

So Harlem, I believe so. Yeah, born Joanne Chestermart.

SPEAKER_05: 3:30

Yes. So, you know, during that clima time period of Harlem, it, you know, the black neighborhoods was pretty um, it was it was in terrible conditions at that time, and you know, it wasn't a lot of adequate resources for African Americans.

SPEAKER_04: 3:48

Definitely, yeah, definitely. So we got to what shaped her political consciousness was her upbringing in the South, being raised in New York, experiencing the assassination of both King and Malcolm. You know, then you got the mega efforts, and what else, you know, with the civil rights, what was taking place amongst, you know, amongst the blacks in this country, you know, by the hands of the by the hands of you know the supremacists at the time.

unknown: 4:21

Okay.

SPEAKER_04: 4:22

So that basically that molded her that fueled her. So growing up, how did growing up during the civil rights movement affect Shakur's worldview? I know we we say what shift her consciousness, but what did like what pivotal moment made her want to get involved?

SPEAKER_05: 4:41

Well, because I I think for a lot of them, I think um, you know, when Dr. King had his march, marches taking place, and he was trying to practice the concept of non-violence, and when they were marching, they were being brutalized and attacked by the police, or they were getting hit with sticks or whatnot. But there was a lot of them that refused to fight back because that was the concept that he stands on. But but then there were some that were going to fight back anyhow, you know, by any means necessary. There was some that said that, hey, I am for self-defense, you know. So um, and I think that's because and I think that shaped her, just seeing the brutality of what was happening to black people while they were protesting, standing up fighting for the rights to vote, fighting for the rights to have equality in this country.

SPEAKER_04: 5:51

Got you, got you. So that was what led her to join the Panthers. So we're gonna go to this one. What roles did Shakur play within the Black Panther Party?

unknown: 6:02

I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_04: 6:03

What role did she play within the Black Panther Party? Roller roles, what was her role in there?

SPEAKER_05: 6:12

Um well, as far as her specific role, yeah. Um I know that she was a part of the Black Panther 21. Now, I don't, I'm gonna be honest with you, I don't remember what specific role she played as far as like what assignment was given to her, yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 6:36

But she was just more mostly an activist, more than likely.

SPEAKER_05: 6:39

Right, she was in, but yeah, she was in activism, yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 6:42

All right, that that's deep right there. So she was a Panther 21. I believe that was uh along with um, as we know, Tupac's mother, late mother makes you rest a piece of meaning, and uh, what's the eldest name? His name, Daruba Yoruba, something like that, or um, yeah.

SPEAKER_05: 7:03

Um, he has his mommy name. I know it's um, I think I know the first name starts with a W, but his middle name is Ibn Daruba. He's still around to this day.

SPEAKER_04: 7:14

Oh, really? Yeah, definitely. So she was out there, you know, doing the moves with the people, you know, fighting for the 10-step, you know, the 10-step program, trying to implement that for the people, right in the community with the Black Panthers, and I believe was wasn't it like she was she was part of the Pent 21. And was she going back and forth with the West Coast, something like that, I believe, traveling back and forth, or did or did Chicago?

SPEAKER_05: 7:42

I don't I don't want to but put you the history, but I know she met Huey Newton, and I know that she was working alongside with him, um, but I don't recall if she was going back and forth to Chicago or the West Coast, but I know that she was working alongside with Huey Newton.

SPEAKER_04: 8:04

No, I believe she was with the BLA, right? The Black Liberation Army.

SPEAKER_05: 8:07

Yeah, she was, yeah. After she left the Panther, yes, she went to join the uh Black Liberation Army, yes.

SPEAKER_04: 8:14

Got you. So how did her relationship with the BLA evolve over time?

SPEAKER_05: 8:22

Well, I think the BLA had a little bit more to offer than what was offered in the Black Panther organization, you know, because a lot of them had bad experiences with Huey Newton, and that's something that people don't yeah, people don't really talk about. Um I know she mentioned in the book where at one time that there was a situation where uh the two members, the brother I mentioned, brother Daruba was one of them. Um they he ended up kicking them out or exiling them or something, get rid of them, whatever the case may be. Something about they were being the enemies or traitors, or he looked at them as agents.

SPEAKER_04: 9:15

Really? And what led to was that was that was it was it act wasn't an actual did they have actual evidence of them being traitors, or was it part of the cointel pros tactic?

SPEAKER_05: 9:27

Right, he felt like they was a part of the COINTELPRO tactic, I believe. But yeah, he had felt like they was traitors or whatnot, and he got rid of them. He basically said, these people gotta go. Like he exiled them. So, and I think that that was the I think that was the breaking point for her to say, you know what, it's time to leave the Black Panther Party and just transition over to the Black Liberation Army. Yeah, that's what I believe. Yeah. Um, but yeah, you know, there's been stories about Huey Newton that a lot of people won't talk about, you know, coming from people who were former Black Panthers and their experience with him.

SPEAKER_04: 10:10

Experience with him, like what gripes they have with the Huey Newton.

SPEAKER_05: 10:15

Okay, so um basically, you know, his attitude, you know, he was coming off as being pretty condescending. Um he's he mistreated some of the members in the organization, um, particularly the women. He mistreated the women particularly. And him and Bobby Seal was one at one point in time they had a good relationship because Bobby Seal was a co-founder. However, there was an incident where they got into it and he pretty much did Bobby Seal dirty. Let's just put it like that. So, you know, a lot of times, if you notice when they talk about the Black Panthers, right, as far as the founders is concerned, they'll talk about Huey, but they don't talk much about Bobby Seal.

SPEAKER_04: 11:11

Yeah, I think so. Huey was more of a face out there. He was more of a big one. Right, exactly.

SPEAKER_05: 11:16

Huey was more of a face, but he wasn't the one that really put in a lot of work in the Black Panther Party. It was people like Bobby Seal that really put in the work, Elaine Brown, um, Asada Shakord, you know, Bunchie Carter, Fred Hampton, they were the main ones that put in the work. So, because Huey didn't really spend as much time with the organization because he was staying in and out of trouble, and he also had a serious drug addiction.

SPEAKER_04: 11:49

Damn, yeah, damn. He didn't, but I believe many of them, maybe like you know, through all that pressure, they were under constant scrutiny with the law and harassment, right? Try to find some escapism through the drugs, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_05: 12:07

Right, and then she also gave a critique on like how things were structured within the Black Panther Party. It wasn't in her mind, in her opinion, she felt like it wasn't as organized as it should be, you know. Like she did mention about the books they was reading, like one of them was the Red Book.

SPEAKER_04: 12:27

Oh, the quotes from Chairman Chairman Ma.

SPEAKER_05: 12:30

Yeah, now she did say that, you know, uh she gained some information out of that, but she was just saying, like, overall, it wasn't as structured, right? And I know she was uh also speaking on the fact that Huey was not a great speaker, like he was not good at public speaking, so it was hard for her to really be more attentive.

SPEAKER_04: 12:55

So Huey, so it sounds like um, from what I'm hearing, a lot of internal conflict. Yeah, it was a lot of internal conflict, yeah, it was ego sex, um, misogyny, sexism.

SPEAKER_05: 13:13

Yes, it was yeah, it was a lot of that going on, yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 13:17

So with that, with all that being said, with Asajikoa's role in the Panthers, her dealing with all these um hurdles, right? Because not only is she fighting sister systemic oppression, supremacy, and she's also dealing with conflict within the organization, right?

SPEAKER_03: 13:37

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04: 13:38

From your perspective, as a as a sister that studies and that's part of that's that's part of the resistance against supremacy and and the and the other plagues that affect black people. How would you at that time you know deal with something like that?

SPEAKER_05: 13:59

Deal deal with those matters if I was in that organization, yeah. Well, to be honest, I would have my breaking point. I'll be at the point where I would no longer want to be bothered, wanting to have anything to do with it. Because if the respect is not there, if the acknowledgement is not there, then what am I doing here? If we're supposed to be fighting about oppression, right? And however, you're doing the total opposite, you're doing exactly what your oppressor is doing, then why should I continue to put up a fight? So basically, I'm wasting my time and it's a total lie. So now it's starting to it's starting to look like the whole thing is a facade. You see what I'm saying? And I'm not saying that those members did not have good intentions, right? But if you have too much internal conflict, then it becomes questionable as to what is the general purpose, what is the whole goal here? Is it to really do something that's gonna benefit the black people as a collective, or is it about an egotistical thing? Is it about making one the center of attention? You know, and then it seemed like with Huey New in case he wanted to be the center of attention, he wanted to be that face. You see what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_04: 15:51

Well, you don't think I mean, you know, how old were they back then? They were like in their early 20s when they started this movement, right? I believe right. Yeah, some of the members were in their early 20s, some of them were teenagers, even teenagers, so right with that with that see having that much momentum and influence over the people at a time like that could get to your head and not justifying it, but you know, that could build it that that could build a an ego amongst many, and you know, they they have to worry about Cointel Pro, you gotta worry about who's who's genuine with you, who's loyal to you. So that's again they under constant threat from both external and internal forces, and you know, the external forces are far greater than the internal forces, you understand? So they out there dealing with inertia within the community because they also being ridiculed by other black people for what they're doing, right? You know, you know, the role, you know, the men out there trying to protect and the sisters, some of them, you know, try to have sisters on the back, on the back burning, but sisters were like, nah, we we are stepping on the front line with you, brothers, to represent the revolution to you know to bring about change. And I believe you can't not believe, I know you can't have a relate uh uh revolution without the sisters' involvement. You do need the sisters, you understand? Because nine or ten times the sister is is more you know far more of a word than than the actual brother, right?

SPEAKER_05: 17:26

And then when you but here's the problem going back to what you say about the external and internal conflict, when you have too much internal conflict, right? That brings a major in interference as far as what the focus is. Okay, so we have to we have to look at some things. There was misogyny taking place within the Black Panther Party. Okay, there was a lot of patriarchal points of views, okay. So yeah, I remember a lot of those men were very um chauvinist towards women, you know. I can give you a good example. They were upset one time when Elaine Brown was appointed as one of the leaders. A lot of those guys, and yeah, they didn't like that. They didn't like the fact that she was appointed as a chairman because they didn't they believe that they believe that in the back of their minds that women should not be in a position of leadership. And now you're talking about this being a revolutionary concept, right? But in the back of their minds, they feel like women should not be in a position of leadership. They feel like women should just be behind, like you said, be behind closed doors, remain quiet, or whatever the case may be. You know, and then you'll also be surprised to find out it was that way in the civil rights movement.

SPEAKER_04: 19:10

Yeah, I heard stories like that too.

SPEAKER_05: 19:13

Yeah, you know what I'm saying? They didn't want women to be in a position of leadership, they wanted to be all male-dominated, and that's what made it complicated. That would that's what made it problematic.

SPEAKER_04: 19:24

See, Nandy said it is I just heard that you know, I heard of a lady named Jean Seaberg, her connection to the Panthers back then. She also noticed, uh, she also mentioned this. I read a similar book Jasmine Guy wrote for the late great shakor.

SPEAKER_05: 19:40

Right.

SPEAKER_04: 19:41

Women are the natural engine for all societies. Yeah, I get that. I get that, and that's a fact. We were socializing the patriarchal world. Yeah, that you know, an inferior, uh, insecure man will operate that way because naturally, natural instincts is a man wants to protect a woman, shelter her, love her, what's up, keep her from harm's way. But if she's um if we're both under attack by external force or enemy, who's better than to have on my side is my lady as well. You know what I'm saying? If the soldiers are fighting and they can't hold up, the woman will be the one there to go all out for you. You know what I'm saying? It goes back to like ancient times when when when that um who was it with Horace was chopped on little pieces and it took um what's her name again? Uh I keep forgetting her name.

SPEAKER_05: 20:38

Oh, some ISO to put them back together, ISIS, yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 20:42

To put it to put them back together. People put them back together, and also in the game of chess, the queen is the one that protects the queen when all the soldiers are yeah, she's the one that protects the king, yeah, because she's considered the most powerful piece on the board. Yeah, thank you, Osiris. So so I never like I understand what a man will it's I look at it from both sides of the fence, you know, the men want to protect the woman, but if we're both at war, we all we all going to war, we have to go to war exactly, and and and you know that's the natural instinct of a man to protect a woman, you know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_05: 21:15

That's a natural instinct, but if you're making it to where that woman, if you don't acknowledge her humanity, right? And if you don't acknowledge her as who she is, as just as a human being, and you keep making her feel feel like she's less of that, then it's gonna be hard to keep her by your side, of course. If you're abusing her mentally, emotionally, and physically, then you're not protecting her, you're just doing as much damage as the outsiders.

SPEAKER_04: 21:57

That's a fact, you know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_05: 21:59

You'll be looked at as her number one enemy, and I just gotta keep it real on that because she's thinking, well, this man who I thought that was my support system, right? Who I thought is my protector, he's going against me, he's doing more damage to me than what I have to deal with on the outside. So, how can I fully trust him? How can I fully embrace him? And how can I continue to stand by him if I gotta deal with this? You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_04: 22:34

I understand they are coming in with these comments. If I'm saying name correctly, Nandi, Nanji, even the resa stories, Patakis, when the men casted Oshun out, see the black witch ya video on Oshun.

SPEAKER_05: 22:53

I heard about something like that about the Risha. I heard something similar to that.

SPEAKER_04: 22:58

Because you know, that person saying that if we live in a patriarchal patriarch, you know, patriarchal society society, right? I believe so, but you know I like what she said.

SPEAKER_05: 23:11

This sister, I'm sorry, I don't know if this is a sister. She said it's hard to honor your man if you're in defense mode from him. Is that that's a fact? That's a fact. That's a major fact, right there.

SPEAKER_04: 23:23

That's a fact. I I try not to subscribe to that because I never um, you know, the majority of us were were, I don't want to say, some were raised wrong, was given the wrong information. You know, the one that's on cliche by saying, Oh, it's the hip-hop music. No, it's it's the principles that you know that we see on television as well, or what our fathers told us, or what the men in our lives have instructed us. But sincerely, I don't believe no man wants to function like that. You understand? Uh unless he's sick in the head, because I don't see the woman as subservient to me, secondary. You know what I'm saying? Because I see it as um, you know, a woman's a ride or die, and I see with Asada Shakur, what she has experienced from reading her book and the other soldiers was unfortunate because I believe she was very sincere in what she wanted to do. Yeah, even down to what led to the um the shooting with that police officer on the Jersey Turnpike.

SPEAKER_05: 24:23

Yeah, uh-huh.

SPEAKER_04: 24:24

She was very worried about Zai. Was it Zaid?

SPEAKER_05: 24:28

Zaid, yeah, but he knows he died. Yeah, he died.

SPEAKER_04: 24:32

He was very concerned. So you could tell by the sister's um compassion that you know what we see now with what how most men view women and how vice versa women view men, to me, is it is a sickness that entered our community.

SPEAKER_05: 24:51

Right.

SPEAKER_04: 24:52

I may not be articulating it correctly, but it's a sickness because we should not be at each other's throat. You understand? But unfortunately, that's how it is now because as the person said, when a woman is in constant um defense mode, that there goes the friction right there. She's not in a natural state to be, you know, how y'all say it now? My soft girl era, yeah. The soft girl era, yeah. I can't be my feminine energy because I gotta worry about this fool putting hands on me or him being non-compassionate, right?

SPEAKER_05: 25:28

And it's not about not being feminine because you're gonna always have that femininity, but it's about the fact that you have to be in survival mode all the time, you have to be in that defense mode, you know what I'm saying, and you just don't have that chance to actually relax, you know what I'm saying, without being so tensed up, you know, and then you're going through a lot of anxiety, you know. So a lot of things that women are dealing with, as far as anxiety concerned, people don't understand that that's a real thing, you know. But it's just that most women don't know how to articulate, hey, I'm dealing with anxiety, I'm dealing with depression, I'm dealing with trauma. They can't really articulate it. So, what best way they know how to do it, what better way can a woman articulate what is going on with her internally as far as emotionally through anger? You know what I mean? So I'm not making a justification because I believe that as women we should learn how to manage our anger, we should learn how to manage our emotions and not let allow these things to get the best of us.

SPEAKER_04: 26:39

I always say that sometimes I I'm I'm called insensitive in that manner. Like I'm very I'm very compassionate, even with my lady, I'm very compassionate, right? And I always try to tell her, yo, regulate your emotions because you know they always try to pick women as being irrational, and I'm I I I disregard that I'm like a lot of women are are rational, they are told to be irrational, right? You know, and it's a man's job to guide and instruct them right on how to you know be rational, don't let your emotions get the best of you, right?

SPEAKER_05: 27:15

And also, we are the natural leaders if we want to be honest about that. We are natural leaders.

SPEAKER_04: 27:21

Oh man, you're gonna get some flack for this one saying that I mean well, we are natural leaders because let's look at it like this, and I don't mean to get off the subject matter, but let's look at it like this when the man is not in the household, right?

SPEAKER_05: 27:36

Who is primary caring for the children? The one the women, okay, the women are taking care of the household duties, they are doing domesticated things, whether it be cooking, cleaning, washing, making sure the kids go to bed, right? And if the man comes home with the money and he gives her the paycheck, she'll make sure what the bills get paid, right? She makes sure she buys the things for the house that is needed, right? So she's taking care of the domestic things. And most of the time, the children are spending more time with the mother than they are with the fathers. If it's not with the mother, it's somebody, it's a female, nine times out of ten in the family, whether it be the grandmother, the aunt, or it could be a godmother. But for the most part, the children are spending more time with the women. That's why when you look at these jobs, right? When you look at the school system, right? If you go into the elementary school system and you look at the kindergartens all the way up to first, second grade, who do you mostly see teaching these children? The women, because they are the primary leader, they are the primary teachers.

SPEAKER_04: 28:56

You see what I'm saying? So she's the first teacher, actually. She's actually the first, she's actually the first teacher during the nine months of gestation, so it's important to know exactly. We see I'm not to cut you to I glad, I I am so glad that you said that, right? Right. Anybody could give birth, anybody could be could could reproduce life, right? Right, it takes a special being to be a parent, right? You know, it's important, like any mother could give birth, but she has to have that God-given gift to be the right mother, right? To you know, instill proper information, and depending on her circum on her circumstances, how she was raised. You understand? So I do honor the fact that what you said, because I I come from a home, my mother was the main one, right? I see the toll it took on her. You understand? Yeah, like I see I see the effects that it has because you know there's times the mother may not have time to feed herself, she's worried about her children, you know what I'm saying? She's staying. About the next day, like I gotta make sure this child's good and this and that, you know. You know, like she doesn't get a break, she could be sick and she's still going. Meanwhile, you know, not all, but some men when we get sick, we be like, I'm staying in the bed. That's all I know. But you know, the sister will be the one out there, so I get what you say, right?

SPEAKER_05: 30:20

And uh also going back to Asada Asada Shakur, right? Where you know, her views. I know you was gonna ask me something about the feminist or feminism.

SPEAKER_01: 30:34

Yeah, I was gonna I was gonna ask a question, right?

SPEAKER_05: 30:38

So, yeah, uh Asada, you know, based on her experience being locked up in a women's prison and interacting with various women and hearing their stories, right? That made her more connected with the sisters in a way, and also she mentioned the books that she read, which is one of them called Black Women in White America. Okay, and this book is written by uh Jordia Lerner, uh liner, learner, liner. So this book was written in 1972, and she said that book had changed her perception, right? And then it was another book that she read, which called the Sedaria, and that that is based off the Hindu or Buddhism concept, either Buddhism or Hindu concept, right? So it's a story by a young boy who goes into um spiritual state, and he learns how to just pretty much adjust into the world, you know, just by walking on the spiritual path. So she was saying that that those things, those two books inspired her, and then it was another book that she read was based on poetry. Um, but she's but she did mention the book about the black women in white America, yep, and then also she talks about a lawyer that inspired her. I got my notes right here. So yeah, the lawyer, her name is Florence Kennedy, okay. Yeah, Florence Kennedy was a black lawyer, but she was also in the women's movement, and she was a feminist, and she said to Florence Kennedy, what what they told her in the courtroom, they she said, uh, they said to her, they said, Well, this woman's not a criminal lawyer. Okay, she's not a defense attorney. So she said, Well, I'm not looking for a criminal lawyer, I'm looking for a political lawyer. That's what she said to the people in the courtroom. And she looked over there and she said to um Florence Kennedy, she was like, I would like to make you my lawyer. And the reason why she said, the reason why she won't appointed her because she said she needed black women, a black woman who is politically involved, right? Who is in who was in involved in activism and who understands the plight and struggles of black people. So she chose this woman because the lawyer that she had previously, the lawyer that she had before her, was not the best lawyer. And I think that lawyer happened to be a white woman, and she didn't really like her, yeah, as much. She didn't desire her as much. So she wanted somebody who's black and who was uh a political activist and who understood the plight of black people and who could relate very well, and that's where she chose this lady, Florence Kennedy, who went by the name Flo.

SPEAKER_04: 33:47

Wow. So um Nandy, if I'm saying correctly, yeah, she said it's amazing what will stay in the memory years later after I've read a book with Asada. When she was 18 and accepted an invite to a guy's house for him to have other guys there, she heard him. Can you elaborate more on that, Nandy?

SPEAKER_05: 34:10

I think I read somewhere where I know she mentioned that there was a guy that she was playing with, joking around, wrestling with, or whatnot. And the guy kept trying to get her to engage in sexual activity with him, and she told him no because she was worried about being pregnant, and he said, Well, I have some Vaseline. Oh wow, right, I got some Vaseline, and you won't get pregnant. So she looked at him, she told him no, and they just you know went back playing or whatnot, but she told him no, he was not getting it.

SPEAKER_04: 34:48

Weirdo, weirdo, super weird, oh crazy man. But you know, what does she um like for the women's movement? Do you think Asada would would have supported what we call feminism today, the feminist movement?

SPEAKER_05: 35:04

Um, I believe to a certain extent, to a certain extent, not all the way, because I don't think she would be supporting the fact that there are women going around bashing men, you know what I'm saying, or throwing men under the bus. You know, I don't think she will support that. Now I think she would support women's rights and knowing that women deserve a right to their humanity, right? I think she would also support black women, especially, but I don't think she would support uh anything that's dealing with misangery concept or anything that's dealing with bashing the opposite of sex, of course.

SPEAKER_04: 35:52

I'm not with that. Yeah, I know I don't support the bashing of opposite sex because my thing at the end of the day she didn't come from that state, that's not that was not her point or her stance, you know.

SPEAKER_05: 36:03

Her stance was fight for the liberation of black people, exactly.

SPEAKER_04: 36:09

Yeah, I would, I wouldn't, I don't believe she would do something like that. I doubt it because this new form, and I might get attacked for this. It sounds like you hear it from both sides where they say the red pill talk guys and the feminist movement, it's not like like it sounds like both sides hate each other. I'm like, yo, when you hear them online speaking, I'm like, it sounds like pure hate.

SPEAKER_05: 36:29

Yeah, she would address the issues that is currently affecting or have always been affecting women. She will address issues like I'm I believe she will address the issue like the patriarchal system and white supremacy, you know, and the oppression that black women go through. And also she would talk about the racist, the systemic racism that black men go through. But yeah, that's my view on that. That's what I believe that she will stand for.

SPEAKER_04: 37:02

That's crazy. That's crazy. Because I don't, I don't, I don't support that, that uh, that whole that whole like hierarchy of you know, a woman are below, because at the end of the day, you come from a woman, you know what I'm saying? And I'm not saying it's a school, no, you don't score no cool points, you know. We all come from a woman, right? You know, without the woman, there's no life, there's no life, there's no life, period. You know what I'm saying? And again, a woman will support you quicker than your homeboys will support you.

SPEAKER_05: 37:29

Oh yes, oh yes, okay, so oh yeah, more than likely, more than likely. If she's an upright woman, she will.

SPEAKER_04: 37:38

That's the key word. You gotta be upright, yeah. And you gotta be upright males too. So you know, it goes both ways, you know what I'm saying? Both playing their part, things will work, you know, correctly. But it it the scales have to be balanced, it has to be, it can't, it can't be yielding one way, you know.

SPEAKER_05: 37:55

Right, right. And then I also read in the book, which is in well, I looked up some information online that it was the yeah, I think he was the godfather or the uncle Tupac Shakur. Because I know his son Kadhafi. Yeah, Qaddafi, yeah, was a member of the outlaws. The outlaws, yeah. He was a member of the outlaws, yeah. And I read that it was him that freed her.

SPEAKER_04: 38:36

Oh, but she got exiled to Cuba, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05: 38:41

That got her up, got her away from the men's prison, and yes, sent her to Cuba, yeah. He was the one that was behind it.

SPEAKER_04: 38:48

What led to that shooting on that highway?

SPEAKER_05: 38:53

Okay, so they got pulled over, right? For their tail lights and for going past the speed limit. Okay.

SPEAKER_04: 39:10

Um past the speed limit.

SPEAKER_05: 39:12

Yeah, going past the speed limit. So it was her and Zaid, and there was another gentleman. Um, let me look his name up. I got it in my notes. At this time, his name was uh Brother Clark Square or Square, but he went by the name uh Sanja Accoli. So they tried to say that she was the one that pulled the trigger. But allegedly, that's what they try to say.

SPEAKER_02: 39:48

Allegedly, yeah.

SPEAKER_05: 39:49

Yeah, she couldn't be the one to pull the trigger if she got injured.

SPEAKER_04: 39:56

Okay, yeah, I believe she was shot, right?

SPEAKER_05: 39:59

Yeah, she was shot, yeah. So it was impossible for her to pull the trigger, but she was they pointed the finger at her, so they never really said exactly like who was the one that actually pulled the gun and killed that sergeant on the road, right? But she was accused of that, she was was the one that was charged for something that she didn't do, and you gotta remember back then they didn't have DNA testing. No, you know what I'm saying? They didn't have those type of forensics around, not at all.

SPEAKER_04: 40:32

You know, I believe the same thing happened to Huey, too. When Huey was shot, right? I believe Huey was shot during a routine police stop as well, right? Like I'm sorry, I don't call that at the same time as Asada, but I believe Huey was shot as well at one point. I don't know, but I don't remember yeah, but she but she she was shot in Jersey, yeah.

SPEAKER_05: 41:02

Yep, and I think it was at a turnpike, if I'm not mistaken, but um, yeah, they tried to say that. See, and then at that time it's law enforcement words over hers. So if the law enforcement said you shot somebody, like if the police officer said that you the one that shot somebody, the the judge is gonna take his word or her word over your word.

SPEAKER_01: 41:28

Exactly. Exactly.

SPEAKER_05: 41:31

They're gonna take yeah, the officer's word, they're gonna go for it, they're gonna support their their own people before they support you. Because they can sit here and say that yeah, you did this, and it's like, okay, you did it now. We're gonna throw the book at you, and don't let it be somebody that's white.

SPEAKER_04: 41:51

Exactly. At that time, so at the time, right?

SPEAKER_05: 41:56

They're gonna throw the book at you.

SPEAKER_04: 41:58

So they said allegedly she shot the cop after she received two gunshots. She was taken to the hospital. According to a book, from I could recall, was that she said she looked at Zy Za Zaid in the face, and he was like soulless on the floor, and it was raining, something like that. She remember the raindrops falling in her wound on the side of the road. It was painful for her to breathe. And then she said the ambulance came and when the ambulance came and got her, the cop was the cop was thrusting his knife stick into her wounds. I remember she said that in the book, in the ambulance, and she's like, I might die here. The cops were whispering to her, like, we we we're gonna kill you, you B B B word, N-word, B word, B-word. And then eventually she got to the hospital and they they still were uh torturing her until a black nurse came in and she said she felt at ease when the black nurse walked into the room, right? Yep, something like that.

SPEAKER_05: 42:57

Yep, yep, in the book, yep, she did. Yep.

SPEAKER_04: 43:00

And then I I don't correct me if I'm wrong. Did they try did did they attempt to attempt to to sodomize her, I believe, something like that?

SPEAKER_05: 43:08

Oh yeah, so okay. So when she went into the when she went into the jailhouse, right? You know, they have to search you. Okay, then you gotta strip your clothes off, you know, you gotta strip your clothes off, get naked, and all that stuff. They gotta search you. So she was saying, as they were searching her, right? Um well the first question she asked was, does she have to give consent to be searched? And she was told yes, and if she did not give consent, they could put her in solid solidary confinement. So she didn't want to go in solidary confinement, so she said, okay. So she said that uh they were touching her area, of course, you know, they have to put their finger to it, all that and yeah, and so as they put their finger on her, they had to send her to the doctor to run some tests on her, or whatever the case may be. And she didn't trust the doctor that was there, she didn't trust that, you know.

SPEAKER_04: 44:09

So yeah, that was that is crazy, crazy what she endured. So she's in the hospital being tortured, and she said she just kept having visions of her and her grandmother speaking, so that comes to show you the strength again, the strength of a woman. You know, and I'm gonna make this clear. I know us men, we made stupid you know, mistakes in the past, you know, playing with women's emotions whatsoever, or even speaking ill towards a woman.

SPEAKER_05: 44:40

That's the worst thing that we can do, is to disrespect a woman, you know, it's a human being, you shouldn't disrespect nobody unless there's warranty, but this uh uh a woman, but you know, again, as you said, she must be upright herself, respect herself as well, right, and have respect for other women because you got women that are very that very they are very conniving towards one another, especially when a man is involved in the picture, you know, so you know, and or if it's about a certain way that a woman looks, like this woman looks a certain way over here, and this woman don't dress or don't have the class or don't have the style, then she tends to get looked down upon. You see what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_04: 45:38

So they like the they like you, Tiffany. You're getting some people like you. Yeah, man, we gotta get we got we gotta bring Tiffany back, man. She's been missing for a while.

SPEAKER_05: 45:51

I know, I know, I know.

SPEAKER_04: 45:54

So so when Seiko, so she's in the hospital, she went to prison. How did the plan go about to break out? Allegedly, for legal purposes. Hmm. How did how did it execute such a plan like that? Because that was like bold. That right there is gangster. I don't care what you little dudes do in the corner, what y'all call gangster, that right there, what they were doing back then.

SPEAKER_05: 46:22

Yeah, I think they this is my opinion. I can't tell you verbatim, but I think they were influenced by the um there was a white group called the Underground Weathermen.

SPEAKER_04: 46:33

I think Underground Weathermen. I heard about them, yeah.

SPEAKER_05: 46:36

Yeah, and they was doing they wasn't doing some they doing some stuff, they was doing some stuff like breaking, yeah. They were doing some stuff for real. So I think they were influenced by them in a sense, so they figured out well, shoot, we can execute this plan to go ahead and get this woman up out of there, you know. So you gotta remember they was radical, yeah. You know, they was radical mind, and I think they was also influenced by um what's the name, George Jackson?

SPEAKER_04: 47:02

Oh, the man, the man child, George George Jackson, his brother that went into the courtroom, yeah, yeah, yes, yeah. So that brothers, yeah.

SPEAKER_05: 47:11

Solid that brothers, yeah. So I think because of that influence, right? I think they felt like okay, we need to bring about a revolution, and we're gonna bring this revolution as a way to get this sister up out of here and send her to you know, send her to Cuba, and then Cuba protected her ever since. At that time, it was I think Fidel Castro that was in a position of leadership. He was not he was not gonna let her go back to America, of course not, you know what I'm saying, and that's when America and Cuba was at odds with each other.

SPEAKER_04: 47:50

Shout out to Fidel Castro, man, he rest in peace, right?

SPEAKER_05: 47:53

He was not gonna America, and ever since then, huh?

SPEAKER_04: 47:58

And that man, I said respect to Castro and that man for what he did, you know what I'm saying, right?

SPEAKER_05: 48:04

Yep, and that's when they kept her there, they kept her there until she died, you know. She adapted to the culture, the Cuban culture, she was well protected, and no matter how many times the U.S. put a bounty on her a million-dollar bounty, almost every president, including Obama, he was the main one who was putting the bounty to get her back to America or extradite her back to America so she can be locked up in prison. They said no, we ain't bringing this one back. She's good over here, she ain't going nowhere. She's not coming back. It don't matter what you do, we're not taking the money, and no, we not giving her back.

SPEAKER_04: 48:49

She's fine. Let me get something to Obama. You know what I'm saying? I met Ron at the Osada Shakur rally in 2012. I think 20 2011, 2012. That's when we met up because I was out there with the Panthers and salute to all the soldiers out there that was protecting that was rallying for the sister. But this is for Obama right here for being a traitor.

SPEAKER_00: 49:13

You and your motherfucking mama.

SPEAKER_04: 49:15

You know what I'm saying? That's for Obama right there. Because how dare you try to sell onto your soda out there like that, you man? You should have never done something like that, right?

SPEAKER_05: 49:25

And it was like so many black people was giving him a lot of praises like, oh, he's the first black president, yada yada yada, woody woody woo. But do you not look at and see what he was doing? He wasn't really focused too much on the issues of black folks at that time, he was putting every other issues around before black people, like the incident that happened with um the people up there in the church.

SPEAKER_04: 49:49

Oh, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05: 49:51

Yeah, in Charleston, South Carolina. It was not, he did not put enough focus and emphasis on issues saying, you know what, we need to pass a bill to combat against hate crimes, right? Or even when it came down to police brutality, you see what I'm saying? So, you know, um, the whole fact that he's the first black president, okay, it sounds cool, but and so what that's another topic we gotta come back on, right? And so what? I mean, what that what that really means, because a lot of the blacks that's in a position of politics, right, they're not catering to the community in a way that we hope for them to do, or you know, so we expect for them to do, right? If you look at the condition of um a vast majority of the black population that has black leaders, right, that are democrats at that, it seems like things get worse. You're about to take it somewhere else and have them boycott you, but you know, that's a topic for another day, but I just want to throw that out there.

SPEAKER_04: 51:07

So before we get up out of here, right? From from what we discussed about Asada Shakur's legacy and what people, especially black women America, can you know what lessons they could take from her plight, what she has gone through. Do you think, and this is a this is a this is a monkey wrist right here. Do you think Jasmine Crockett is the new is the representation of Asashakor?

SPEAKER_05: 51:34

Nah, hell nah, hell nah.

SPEAKER_02: 51:39

Hell nah. You don't think so?

SPEAKER_05: 51:42

Nah, nah, nah, nah. Assasha core was much greater than it. You know, she wasn't no politician.

SPEAKER_04: 51:51

The sister was no politician, but Toma as far as as far as her courage.

SPEAKER_05: 51:58

Nah, nah.

SPEAKER_04: 52:00

Say Wiki Dillard. Who is that?

SPEAKER_05: 52:07

She's the sister that was uh with Boyce Watkins.

SPEAKER_04: 52:13

Boyce Watkins, Boyce Watkins, was that the Fly Nubian sister channel?

SPEAKER_05: 52:17

Yeah, he had a channel for the sisters called the Fly Nubian Sisters Channel. It was pretty cool, and yeah, she was on there with Boy Watkins.

SPEAKER_04: 52:28

I gotta look her up and check her out. Was she deep as a sider? Was she raw? Listen to him approach this Vicky Dillard character.

SPEAKER_05: 52:38

I mean, nah, she wasn't nothing like Asada, you know what I'm saying? But I mean, she a strong speaker, but she she nothing like Asada, nothing like a sister soldier, nothing like that. Definitely nothing like Sister Soldier. I would say Sister Soldier was more like Asada than any of those.

SPEAKER_04: 52:58

He was he was sister soldier, because I think now this whole um black this black activism thing to me amongst men and women, it's like a new marketing scheme now.

SPEAKER_05: 53:12

It it is, it is, you know, it's because it's counter-revolutionary, it's about yeah, it's a counter-revolutionary thing, it's about making profit, it's about being a celebrity, you know what I'm saying? That's what it's about, and most of the people that you see leading these marches and protests are you know mainstream people, people who got their names in the public already, you know what I'm saying? So they're you best believe they're making money off of this. That's why black the Black Lives Matter movement, they caught so much flack because they were very disingenuous, they made 90 million dollars, and now one time they paid or gave out any type of money to these victims' families.

SPEAKER_04: 54:02

They did give you one thing, though, a few things painted sidewalks that's big, yeah.

SPEAKER_05: 54:10

That's it. That's it.

SPEAKER_04: 54:15

You did get a painted sidewalk, though.

SPEAKER_05: 54:18

That's it, you know what I'm saying. Now, although the Black Panthers had a part, but although you know, certain members of the Black Panther parties, you know, or organization in the time in the 60s and 70s wanted to be like celebrity figures or whatnot, they did have celebrity support or what have you, but they weren't walking around here getting paid like that, they weren't living in mansions, you know what I'm saying? Asala Shakur wasn't even living in no mansion, she was living in somebody's house or something, right? During that time, and then she they went on the highway, they was going somewhere when that incident took place. So Asada Shakur wasn't a rich woman, she wasn't a wealthy woman, she wasn't trying to gain national attention, you know what I mean? She wasn't trying to be a celebrity, she was about the movement, right? That was her focus on the movement, however, because of the incident that took place, right, and it was dealing with racial profiling, she caught the attention the same way well, Finny Shakur. Finny Shakur wasn't trying to be no celebrity at that time, but because you know she was in the Black Panther Party and her relationship with Matulu Shakord, you know what I'm saying? It caught the attention, right? She was one of the members of the uh organization that was locked up, and around this time she was pregnant with Tupac.

SPEAKER_04: 55:52

Yeah, when she got locked up, she was pregnant with Tupac, who would later become a rapper, a well-known rapper, and target by targeted by the US system, but yeah. Um this is deep. We could go on forever, you know. We gotta bring you back on here to get on more things because I know you you have a lot of information, you got a lot to say, and we we gotta bring you back on here, you know, because deep down on your heart, you do care about the people, yeah. You know, you're very knowledgeable, yeah, and you're passionate about what you do. Um, let the people know where they can find you at.

SPEAKER_05: 56:36

Uh, so you guys can find me on my channel, which is Tiffany89. So I'm gonna type it in the conversation for you guys. Yeah, Tiffany89. You can find me on my channel. Uh, also, if you are friends with me on Facebook, you can just type in my name, Tiffany L. French. You can type me on Facebook. Um, let's see. I have a TikTok page which is Lightbred89. You can find me there, Lightbread89.

SPEAKER_04: 57:11

Always lighting people up.

SPEAKER_05: 57:15

And yeah, not necessarily. But yeah, yeah, you can find me on TikTok, Lightbred89. Um, also, like I said, Facebook, Tiffany L French, and YouTube, Tiffany89. Now, I do have other outlets channel, I mean outlet, I mean, uh, other um social media platforms. Um, oh, I also got another Facebook page, which is Wisdom Golden Wisdom. So that's my other page. You can add that page as well. But I do have an Instagram, I have a um what you call that, a Twitter, but I don't really be on those as much. I don't really be on Instagram Twitter as much. So so those pages that I mentioned are the main pages that I be on.

SPEAKER_04: 58:04

Gotcha, gotcha. All right then, Tiff. I appreciate my sister for coming out. We gotta get you back on. It's always love. Don't forget people to comment, like, share, subscribe. We got super chat. Shout outs to the whole NYP team. With that being said, peace.

SPEAKER_05: 58:22

Peace. Thank you.

SPEAKER_04: 58:24

Welcome, sis.