The Transatlantic Slave Trade: What Schools Left Out

Start the timeline at the wrong date and the whole story tilts. We rewind the Atlantic narrative to 1415 and 1441—when Ceuta fell to Portugal and the first captives were seized from Mauritania after Europeans failed to tap West Africa’s gold—and we follow the money, the maps, and the names that made an economy out of people.

With Mariel Smith L, a journalist‑turned‑educator grounded in Moorish history, we trace the trans‑Saharan networks that linked Morocco to Timbuktu, Gao, and the Akan fields, and how Moorish agricultural know‑how in Iberia taught Europe to industrialize sugar, cotton, rice, and indigo. We dive into papal bulls that sanctified perpetual servitude, the Inquisition’s turn from “Moor” to “Morisco,” and the quiet paperwork that swapped “Moor” for “Indian” in colonial ledgers. A 1721 English map labeled “Negroland” becomes a smoking gun: cartography as racial policy. Along the way, we surface early resistance erased from schoolbooks, including the 1522 Wolof revolt in Hispaniola and maroon traditions that prefigure later revolutions.

This conversation makes a clear case: nationality and legal status moved in lockstep. Strip nationality, and the law can render a person “property.” Restore historical context, and agency returns: trade routes, schools, treaties, and family archives that carry Moorish identity across centuries. We also unpack how Indigenous enslavement in the Americas was reclassified under the floating label “Negro,” revealing how race operated as a flexible tool for dispossession. If you’ve only heard 1619, you’re missing the prologue—and the prologue changes everything.

Listen for a method you can use to read colonial records critically, connect precolonial polities like Oyo and Dahomey to coastal wars and captives, and rethink how names shaped power. If this expanded timeline and lens helped you see more, share the episode, subscribe for new drops, and leave a review with the biggest idea you’re taking forward.

Chapters

• 0:00 Opening And Mission Of The Platform
• 1:38 Funding The Movement And Call To Action
• 3:20 Guest Introduction And Background
• 6:20 Growing Up In Chicago And Media Path
• 10:55 Shift From Journalism To Teaching
• 17:20 Mindfulness Work And School Programs
• 18:24 Framing The Slave Trade Conversation
• 19:52 Moors As First Targeted And Trade Networks
• 23:12 Portuguese Entry And 1441 Capture
• 26:40 Beyond 1619: Missing Centuries
• 29:20 Salt Gold Routes And Muslim West Africa
• 33:05 Post‑1492 Spain And Moorish Industry
• 37:20 Early Revolts And Muslim Resistance
• 41:20 Inquisition, Renaming, And Denigration
• 46:05 Negro Land Maps And Reclassification
• 50:40 Why Hide Moorish Identity
• 54:05 Reading Colonial Records Critically
• 58:16 Indigenous Enslavement And “Negro” Label
• 1:02:05 Term Drift: Moor, Morisco, Negro

Transcript

SPEAKER_05: 0:12

What's going on, everybody? Out there is Ron Brown, LMT, the People's Fitness Professional, aka Soul Brother, number one, reporter for duty. And tonight we have Marielle Smith L in the building to talk about the transatlantic slave trade. Before we go into that, before I have you guys do the knowledge, I'm gonna start saying it a lot. Do the knowledge. Do the knowledge to this commercial.

SPEAKER_00: 0:38

Peace family. Welcome to NYP Talk Show. This is more than a podcast. It's a country platform rooted in truth and culture from the 5% nation, nation of Islam, forest movement, and face to race. Our mission is to reclaim our narrative and uplift the African Fat Cross with real stories and real conversations. Support us through Super Chat during live code. Donations on HashCat. GoFundMe, Patreon, or Buzz Prout. And directing our official merch, available on our website and right here on YouTube's merch shelf. Every dollar, every super chat, every hoodie builds the movement. This is NYP Talk Show.

SPEAKER_05: 1:27

Alright, we're back, we're back, we're back. I gotta play that commercial every now and again just to let you brothers and sisters know. You know, uh it takes finance to raise a nation, right? That's what the prophet noble draw at least said. It takes finance to build a podcast. And uh I was taking that very lightly. I said, the people, you know, they'll don't donate whenever they feel like they want to donate, but no, I gotta kind of like give you a call to action. Give you a call to action. Uh don't forget we got the super chats and everything available for you guys to click on and donate to the um movement. And uh we got the brother here, more Morel, right? Right? I said it right, right?

SPEAKER_02: 2:09

Moriel.

SPEAKER_05: 2:09

Moriel, Moriel Smith. This brother is 28 years old. I just want to say that. I just want to say, uh, we got we got a troll, we've got a troll in there in the chat. It's all good. But this brother, uh Moriel, I said it right. Right? Moriel, yes. Moriel. Moriel is 28 years old. Let's drop a bomb for that. 28 years old. Moorish American. Oh, yeah. Yo, uh Ben, he's younger than you, man. Pizza, Ben. He's young. We got the young Moors in the building. Got the young Moors in the building. I'm the big brother here. I'm the big brother here. Yo, so let's talk about it, man. We're talking about the transatlantic slave trade. Before we go into it, let's get a little history about you. Oh, before we go into that, I don't want to go on a tirade, but I just gotta let y'all know, I am not on Facebook like that anymore. I deleted my pages. The only pages I have are business pages. So if you think I vanished like I'm the feds or an agent, just go to Ron Brown LMT business page or NYP Talk Show business page. That's what I'm on. I can't have the distractions of looking at other people's stuff and all that anymore. I gotta focus on what I'm doing here. So that's what that's what happened with that. Anyway, now let's go to it. Let's give a little history on yourself and uh uh uh uh let's go into it. So uh you're from Chicago, correct?

SPEAKER_01: 3:49

Yes, sir. Born and raised on the South Side. Uh, first and foremost, we want to rise and give perfect praise to Allah, honors to a prophet, giving honors to my leadership, Keith Dendritz L, Supreme Grand Speaker of the More Science Temple of America, and then honors to Edward Millier, the first Supreme Grand Speaker of the More Science Temple of America as well.

SPEAKER_05: 4:08

Uh oh, he might have said uh he slid that in there, he slid but also as well.

SPEAKER_01: 4:18

I I want to give also honors to my grandfather, who I found out was a member of the temple after I feel I realized I was a Moorish American, and it brought me closer to the prophet's mission and why I'm doing what I've what I'm doing now, because I realized that once you once I started to get knowledge of self, and that knowledge of self led me back to my own bloodline, my own flesh and blood, that you know that's what it became real for me. So I want to give honors to all of those people.

SPEAKER_05: 4:46

Honor, honors, honors, honors, brother. I like how you started that started that off. Honest to your uh your your family and all that. Um, so let's let's go into it. So you're from Chicago, okay, and you're from the south side of Chicago, as you said, right? Okay, south side of Chicago. And what age did you move from the south side of Chicago?

SPEAKER_01: 5:05

Uh so I moved from Chicago when I was 18. Uh, I got a scholarship to go to school at the University of Missouri, Mizzou. Uh, went to school for mass media communication journalism. Uh, initially wanted to be a sports broadcaster. Um, so I did a lot of internships. I interned for ESPN for a little bit, uh, SEC Network. Uh, I've done time at NBC. Um, yeah, I used to really want to be a sports anchor. Even when I moved to Denver after college, I used to work for the Denver Post. I covered uh high school basketball, and I also uh was on the advertising team there as well. So, you know, my background um is in journalism, actually.

SPEAKER_05: 5:45

Nice, nice. Okay, so uh you your background is in journalism now. Being that you're from the south side of Chicago at 28 years old, I mean, you came up in the Chief Keefe era.

SPEAKER_01: 5:56

I did. I literally uh, you know, most like my freshman year of high school when that happened. And honestly, you know, during that time, it felt so fun. But in reality, as I get older, it's probably wasn't a good idea for 14 and 15 and 16-year-olds to think that they run the city. So, you know, and now in retrospect, it's like, wow, it's it's crazy to happen. But while it was happening, man, it truly felt like um I I honestly personally, I give a lot of honors to somebody like a Chief Keith because he shows somebody like me that you can, you know, be successful just being yourself, honestly. Right, right, and be mainstream and all these different things. So, you know, that is my era.

SPEAKER_05: 6:40

Now, check this out. I'm 45 now. When Chief Keefe came out, I was probably 30. I was listening to Chief Keefe, yo. It was yeah, it was nuclear. Yo, it was nuclear. Yo, I I was on that Chief Keefe. Because you know, because I I work out, like that's my profession, like training and all that. So, like, like Chief, you throw that cheap that first album, you throw that on, go in the gym, pump out some stuff. Like, man, that was a great album. It was a great time, too. Yeah, it was a great time. I knew that that kid was gonna blow. I knew that I knew him and the Migos were gonna blow. Anyway, that's that's neither here nor there. Let's keep it moving. Um, so now you you go through that Chief Keefe era, um, and and you didn't get caught up in the criminality and all that.

SPEAKER_01: 7:32

No, I I play sports, so I play football, ran track. So, you know, being in sports kind of just kept me busy, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_05: 7:41

Right. And you know, um that had the locker room turn for real.

SPEAKER_02: 7:46

Oh, definitely.

SPEAKER_05: 7:50

So, so you didn't so that that here's something else, right? Because this show was all about changing the narrative, right? You know, changing the narrative. We think that people, everybody that comes out of Chicago, they're gonna be gun-toting or or or you know, talking crazy. You actually went to college and and had your own and had your own profession and all that. So, so that's a that's a different twist to what you normally hear in mainstream media and things like that about people from Chicago. So that's peace. So you you you go you're you're a um uh whatchall, sports commentator and things like that. You worked in that field. What brought you to uh becoming a history teacher?

SPEAKER_01: 8:32

Um honestly, you know, when I when I when I say I gained knowledge itself, it was around the time of my senior year in college. And me and the homies were just uh first off, to give even background information to that, my freshman year of college was the year that the Mizzou football team went on strike and they got big news. It was on CNN, CNN was on our campus, all these different things. And the football team went on strike because it was his brother named Jonathan Butler who went on a hunger strike because of the racism that was in the graduate school at Mizzou. So that was like my first year in college seeing that happen. So, with that in the background, by the time I became a senior in college, you know, Trump, this was Trump doing Trump's first presidency at that time, and me and the homies were just you know having real insightful conversations. And one day, like I was like, I'm tired of like hearing like the complaints. Like, what can we actually do as a people to rise up? Right. So then that led me down a rabbit hole of listening to Malcolm X speeches, Martin Luther King's speeches, right? Fred Hampton, all the people that say, you know, these are leaders, these our heroes. And once I started to hear these speeches, I'm like, they're talking about the same thing that's going on right now. So what has changed? So then that that that made me want to look for more. And I seen I seen the Hidden Colors documentary. I seen the Hidden Colors documentary, and on that, they was talking about the Moors and Massamusa. So when I heard Massamusa, it reminded me of a lecture that I had gone to my freshman year in college with this dude named Sean Koffey, he came and he was talking about how Mass Mamusa was a Moore and the richest man in history. So I'm like, okay, Moors, richest man in history. Let me look into that and see, like, all right, what's what's to this? So then that's what then led me down a rabbit hole of, you know, of course, I feel like now, particularly at that time 2018, 2019, but I feel like even now, when people start to get into the movement, some of the first people that you run into is uh, you know, a Taj Tariq Bey, uh uh, you know, uh, what's the brother's name? Um Abdullah. Abdullah Bey, all of those type of brothers. So that was kind of like, and honestly, it was Taj Tariq Bey that said I watched one of his videos and he was saying, like, yeah, like we not black. And like it just clicked, like, yo, whoa. Like we really not black. Like, we really are not black. We have just been socialized and conditioned and cut off from knowledge to now we we just gone alone to get along. So that that was really like then got me into the profit. I started reading about Nobu Juwali, and then to you know, to me, it was shocking because like I'm from Chicago. How come we didn't learn about this, right? And really, so in Chicago, there's this thing called the Bud Billikan Parade. And the Bud Billikan Parade actually started the year after um the first uh Marsh American parade in 1928 by Abbott, who was the founder of the Chicago Defender newspaper. So, like this parade that's been a staple on the south side of Chicago and it having links to the Marsh American Parade the year prior, it's just like all of these things started to like connect for me and it was just like it really felt like the world stood still, especially once again. Once I found out like my grandfather was interested in this and was in the temple, that's when like the world, the universe stood still for a few seconds to me. It was like, okay, this is what I need to be doing as an individual. And because of that, right, you know, when you first get in knowledge of self, you start thinking, it's like you try to start separating yourself, isolating yourself, you start to seem crazy to your friends and your family and all of these different things. So I went through all of that in the beginning, but you know, through ground grounding myself and really starting to, you know, really take my own ego out of it, I was able to like really get you know the clear picture. And now, you know, as far as you know, friends, family, things like that, I feel like they have a mutual respect for what I'm saying. Um, even last year, I was able to do um a presentation with Dana Marnich in the Chicago Dusabo Museum, where I have friends and family come out. So I feel like that was a full circle moment for me as well. Wow, wow, wow.

SPEAKER_05: 13:12

That's peace. That's peace. So you got the knowledge of yourself, and um, how did your parents receive this new you?

SPEAKER_01: 13:21

Uh my parents, so my parents about your age. So my parents was pretty like at first, they was like, you know, what you own, like my mom was like, You squatting in people's houses and stuff like that. Like, no, no, mama, no, had to break down all of that to her. Like, you know, these people have wait, real quick.

SPEAKER_05: 13:38

So, your parents are my age or or or a little younger.

SPEAKER_01: 13:42

My dad turned 46 this year. My mama be 46 on the 29th of November. Wow. Yeah. So, and it is funny. It's funny because I got a lot of homies that's like around their age, and they be like, yo, you remember this in the 90s? I'm like, nah, I don't. I wasn't I wasn't conscious there, bro.

SPEAKER_05: 14:05

Yo, so so they so how they receive so it was like uh you you squatting, they they basically took on the same kind of like uh idea that the media gave and the internet and all of that. So, okay, okay. So they weren't 100% with it.

SPEAKER_01: 14:23

They didn't really understand at first, but then after you know, some time went past and I got to explain, and then even my father, uh, once he seemed that like his father was on this, so there was a whole big gap in connection between them because my grandfather was born like 1924, so like he was like 60 something when my dad was born, so it was a huge age gap, a huge big misunderstanding, all of those different things. So when then I found this book of my grandfather's with his writings, and he's talking about the great I am, and he also has like a book in the Library of Congress. It's it's it's called Super Substantialism to Extremism. So, like all of these spiritual concepts that he's talking about, and so once I was able to show my dad that and see and he's seen a connection, he went and bought a Quran himself. So it's just like you know, slowly but surely, my friends and family are like, you know, they ask me questions here and there, so I can I can't ask for more than that at right now, right?

SPEAKER_05: 15:20

Right. So now you get into be you you you then so what got you to being a teacher? So did you go to school for that and did you get the credential for for that? And how did that happen?

SPEAKER_01: 15:31

Oh, so that happened based off of so um after so COVID happened, right? So prior to COVID, I was working in journalism, etc., etc. After COVID happened, um pretty much everybody at the Demon Post and all that got laid off. And I wanted to honestly change my direction. So I started to work in a nonprofit space, which I still do today. Started to work for the not in a nonprofit space, and then I started um working for this nonprofit uh that was based around chess. So my first initial uh introduction to DPS, different public schools, was being a chess teacher. Now, all the while, you know, as a more young North American interested in my history, I was studying. Um I was blessed to actually have a teacher that actually grew up, you know, the block behind my grandfather's house as well. So I feel like all of this was divine and meant to be. But um, based off of that, doing all of my studying, one day being a chess teacher in multiple schools, uh, we was re-going over our contract with one of the schools that we were in, and I pitched to them teaching an African-American history class. And they seen you know how I was with the students, how I always dropped, you know, knowledge and stuff all the time, and they wanted to hear my pitch. So I was able to pitch the class to them, pitch the curricula to them, and they wanted the class. So from there on, I started to uh teach African American history uh in Denver Public Schools.

SPEAKER_05: 17:06

Nice. Okay, okay, and then after that, you start teaching, right?

SPEAKER_01: 17:12

Yeah, so after that I started teaching. Um now, currently, um, as I am still teaching in the school, they transitioned me to a new role from an organization uh called Holistic Life Foundation. Um, Holistic Life Foundation um pretty much runs mindfulness rooms in schools across the country where students that are you know having problems with regulating their emotions, being mindful, focusing, behavior issues, things like that. Instead of a you know, a reward punishment duality, they take a restoration approach and helping teaching children more about mindfulness, uh, meditation, breath work, things like that. Um, so now I'm over like five schools across the nation, three in Milwaukee, one in Chicago, one out here in Denver, um, running that program as well. And I also taught Thai Chi in schools as well. So I work with another nonprofit called Apprentice of Peace and then a mentoring program. So I've worked with several different um nonprofits here in Denver as well.

SPEAKER_05: 18:10

That's peace, brother. That's peace. So now let's now that we know your history a little bit, let's go into the transatlantic slave trade with school. Hold on, good. We need more Quran students of study. More Quran students. Okay, I see what you're saying, brother. Right. Okay, so now uh let's go into the transatlantic slave trade and what schools left out. So let's go with the first question from a uh Moorish identity and historical narrative. From a Moorish American perspective perspective, how should we understand the identity of so-called African slaves brought to America?

SPEAKER_01: 18:51

How should we understand is that from a Moorish American perspective, it was the Moors who were first uh subjugated, uh enslaved, snatched off the coast, and trafficked to the Americas first, yes.

SPEAKER_05: 19:07

Hold on. So this is this is key. What you just said is key. So you're saying that the Moors in particular were the ones uh in captured, enslaved, subjugated, etc. Right? Yes, so before anyone else, there were the Moors, yes, sir.

SPEAKER_01: 19:31

So now with that being said, though, um what has to be I would say emphasized on is that historically speaking, the Moors have always been a federation or confederation of several different ethnic groups, right? Pre-Islam and after Islam.

SPEAKER_04: 19:51

So yes, drop the bomb for him, right?

SPEAKER_01: 19:56

Yes, sir. And we have we have to really understand that because you know typically we think that we're even now, right? Most African Americans are a mixture of several different ethnic groups from West Africa, right? So prior to the transatlantic slave trade, how did these specific ethnic groups interact with each other prior to European colonization? Well, the biggest way that these different ethnic groups were interacting with one another was through the trans-Saharan trade. Well, who ran the trans-Saharan trade? Moorish people. Right? So that's what we have to. So with that being said, right, when we look at you know, Morocco, Algeria, Libya, Tunisia, these are the kingdoms that the prophets say we set up. Now, understanding that connection deeply with the ancient Ghana Empire, the ancient Mali Empire, and Songhai Empire. So North in West Africa has deep ties, again, going back to pre-Islamic times. So understanding that this is where the network came from, where you would have, right, the Mendinka, the Fulani, the Wolof, the Akan people, Yoruba people, right? Um, people in modern day Guinea, what they would call um like Futajalong. These areas were already in communication due to the commerce that was coming through the trans-Saharan trade. And with the commerce came schooling as well. So Islam and I would say the more sphere and network was already deeply implanted in West Africa 500 years, a half a century before you get a true stronghold of the Spanish and the Portuguese now being the first to uh take advantage of the political situation that happens on the coast of West Africa.

SPEAKER_05: 22:12

Check. I like that. I like how you put that. So now they were the first to be captured, subjugated, etc. Right? So what happened after they were captured, subjugated, etc.

SPEAKER_01: 22:27

So I want to put a uh put some more context to that. So there was a it was a Portuguese or Portuguese uh navigator by the name of Antom Goncalvez or Guns Gon Calvez or Gonzalvez, something like that. And the first people to actually be snatched off the west coast of Africa came from Mauritania. And the reason why Antom wanted to snatch these people off the coast of Mauritania, and I would say it was around the year 1441 to be exact. So these are your first Africans in West Africa that's getting snatched off the coast in 1441. So what happened was they were actually trying to access the gold that was in the Mali Songhai Empire, and once they couldn't get access to the gold, it was Anton who said we should just try to snatch the people. So the first Africans to be snatched off the west coast of Africa was because Europeans could not get access to the gold that was in the Moorish Muslim empires. Okay, you gotta repeat that again, brother, because that's the first West Africans being snatched off the coast of West Africa, first off in Mauritania, in Mauritania was because the Portuguese could not get access to the gold that was in the interior of West Africa. So they decided to snatch people off the coast, right? To see, so Anton did that specifically to see like what rewards could he get. So 1441 is about 10 years, 10, 12 years, that then in the 1450s, you get all of these papal bulls, right? You get the Roman pontifics, you get the uh intercaterra, all these different things. Um, for the papal bull of 1453. This is when now the Pope at that time is saying, all right, enslave all the Saracens and the pagans. Because Anton, right, this Portuguese sailor brought these people back to Portugal, and they was like, Well, maybe we can just enslave the population. So again, you know, I know the concept of the topic of today is like the more sellout things like that. This is why things like that, you know, phrases like that are just not historically accurate because again, the first Africans taken came from Mauritania and they were taken because they couldn't get access to the golden in the interior of West Africa.

SPEAKER_05: 25:29

Okay, all right, that's gotta be a clip right there. Yeah, clip that up and throw that and put that out in the algorithms, man. Um, do you believe the transatlantic slave trade narrative is fully accurate, or are there missing pieces or misrepresentation?

SPEAKER_01: 25:48

Yes, the the missing pieces and the misrepresentation of the transatlantic slave trade is the two centuries that they don't like to talk about the 16th century and the 17th century, right? Um or uh the 15th century and the 16th century, so the 1400s and the 1500s, right? Usually when they talk about the transatlantic slave trade, where do they start? 1619. Right, but that was a whole a whole almost 150 years of the Spanish and the Portuguese again, the same European nations, right, from which the area where the Moors ruled for 800 years came from, right? So with the Moors falling, if we had a uh if if so if you look at a map, right? Spain is right above Morocco and North Africa. So if the Moors controlled the southern part of the Iberian Peninsula, right, the Portuguese and the Spanish didn't really have free range to explore in the Atlantic because they controlled the southern part, right? So now once you get the southern part now falling to the Catholics, now you start to see a lot of exploration happening in the Atlantic. So then it starts with 1415. That's this is another date that all Moore Moorish Americans need to understand. 1415. 1415 is when the Moroccan city Sueta fell to the Portuguese, and this was the first uh you know outpost, trading posts that Europeans were able to set up in Africa, you know, post-Islam, basically. So once the Portuguese now get their foothold, get a get a get a trading post in Morocco, now they're able to now explore further down the west coast of Africa.

SPEAKER_05: 27:51

Repeat that again. So this is important right here.

SPEAKER_01: 27:55

So once the Portuguese are able to get that stronghold in 1415 in Sueza in North Africa, they are now able to be able to explore down the west coast of Africa more freely. Because again, a lot of the commerce that was going on in West Africa was coming from the interior, was coming from the Trans-Saharan trade routes, it was coming from a Sidu Massa in Morocco to a Gao or Tenbuk two or to a Tagaza where the salt mines were at, and then the salt would then get carried down into a 10 buck two, down into a Boray or the Khan Goldfields. So then now salt is being traded for gold.

SPEAKER_05: 28:39

The brother right here, man. This brother right here, he's always in the chat with the heat, man.

SPEAKER_01: 28:49

Shout out to you, brother.

SPEAKER_05: 28:51

All right, so now um keep going.

SPEAKER_01: 28:54

Yeah, so the salt that came from the Tagaza area was then now traded for the gold that was coming from southern Mali and Breuray or the Akonfields in northern Ghana. So that's another thing, too, is that like I wish I could pull up a map of West Africa, but from Morocco all the way down to the northern parts of Ghana, uh, modern-day Ghana, modern day Nigeria, Benin, uh Guinea, all of that was Muslim. All of that was Muslim. Or within the Moorish Muslim trade network. Right? So the proof is in the history. Right. The proof is in the history. Uh that answer your question, or do you want me further elaborate?

SPEAKER_05: 29:59

I wanted you to further. Elaborate on the fact that uh yeah, well, I mean, there's so much to well, you already basically explain the missing pieces and uh the misrepresentation. Let's go to this one right here. How does Moorish history before 19 uh before 1492 connect to the people later labeled Negro, black, or color?

SPEAKER_01: 30:23

That's a beautiful thing. Because so in Spain, or you know, in Andalusia, Spain didn't exist in in that time, uh, our people spearheaded what they call the Green Revolution or the Agriculture Revolution. You might be able to look it up and they might call it the Arab Agriculture Revolution or something like that. But because we introduced cotton, we introduced you know silk making, we introduced um sugar, sugar cane, all of these different things to Europe, right? And these techniques, these these agricultural techniques for mass production in Europe is what gave them the knowledge to want to mass produce cotton and sugar and rice and indigo in a transatlantic and transatlantic slave trade, is because they started they seen how industrious we were. So, again, understanding as well is that if we look at Christopher Columbus's voyage, his prerogative was for them to go to India, right? And they wanted to go to India because the spice trade was lucrative. Well, prior to the Spanish getting into the spice trade, we we ran the spice trade because all the way from Spain, Morocco into India, it was mostly Muslim, and because the Muslims was holding down, you know, the Middle East and things like that, what you know, modern-day Middle East, etc., the Spanish could not just go straight through the Mediterranean through Asia into India. So you get the Spanish and the Portuguese taking racing each other, taking two different routes. The Portuguese circumnavigate Africa, come from the south around Africa, and then go to India, while Christopher Columbus is trying to sell the Spanish on, we can go west and go around to get to India. All right, so the trade network, the Spanish and the Portuguese wanted access to the money, they want access to the money that was flowing into Spain from the Muslims. And even after 1492, when the Spanish forced a lot of Moors to convert to uh Catholicism and things like that, we were still the most wealthy part of the Spanish Empire because we had the knowledge of work in the land in the industries and things like that. So when a prophet is saying that the Moors are the most industrious subjects of Spain and that they didn't get expelled until 1610, he's breaking down a whole portion of our history that's not been put in context.

SPEAKER_05: 33:06

You know what? I never thought about that. Expelled from Spain in 1610?

SPEAKER_01: 33:14

Mm-hmm. So after 1492, the Moors, Moorish Muslims had about 10 years to practice their religion freely. Now the Jews, they were, you know, exiled from the jump in 1492. Unless they converted. So it was in 1502 when Isabella, the Queen of Spain at that time, was like, you know what? From from uh it was it was from Precious from the Cardinal at that time, his name escapes me. I think his name is uh Cesarnos or something like that. But he basically put into Isabella, the Queen of Spain at that time, that no, we cannot have them practicing their religion openly. So then that's when you get the mass, the mass um uh forced conversion to Christianity, and then now you get the rise of a lot of crypto-Islamic and crypto-Jewish practices in the European countries. So from 1492 to 1610, right, Moors was still a huge part of the Spanish Empire. Now, with that being said, here's probably why a lot of people would think that the Moors sold out. It's because after the fall of Granada in 1492, some Moors stayed, some Moors left. A lot of Moors stayed because, you know, to them, they've been there for hundreds and hundreds of years.

unknown: 34:44

Right?

SPEAKER_01: 34:44

So that's home to them. Some Moors left because they didn't want to be ruled by Christians. So when the Moors left, a lot of them went to Morocco, they went to Algeria, they went to uh, you know, and Mali, they went further south into Mali, or they went to the Ottoman Empire.

unknown: 35:02

Right?

SPEAKER_01: 35:02

So what now what we're really looking at is the nuance of our people being the brightest minds at that time. And now some are on the side of the Spanish, and some are on the side of the resistance, but it's all based upon personal situation, money, social status, all of these different things.

SPEAKER_05: 35:31

Check, check, check. That was thorough, bro. Okay, so let's go to the next one. Um uh okay, rewriting the narrative, right? Um, how much of the slave trade history taught in public schools do you feel is incomplete or intentionally off uh altered?

SPEAKER_01: 35:51

Um again, this time period um prior to 1619. Do you all know that the first African quote unquote slave revolt happened in 1522? And it happened on Christmas Day, and it happened by some wool off Muslims from synagogue. The first African slave rebellion in the Americas happened in 1522 by wool off Muslims. This is the part where in America though, I believe it was in um I want to say I want to say Mexico.

SPEAKER_05: 36:37

Mexico.

SPEAKER_01: 36:38

Let me see.

SPEAKER_05: 36:41

Keisha Johnson said uh it was in Hispania, so uh Haiti or the Dominican. Okay, because the sister said Keisha Johnson said inspired by a Haitian Revolution.

SPEAKER_01: 36:55

Right, so that was that was two, three hundred years before the Haitian Revolution. We're talking about 1522. Haitian Revolution happened in 1804, right?

SPEAKER_05: 37:05

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01: 37:06

Right? So again, so starting going back to what I was saying, it was the Moors that were the first one to be subjugated, forced to be Christian, trafficked over to the Atlantic, and then created Maroon resistance forces.

SPEAKER_05: 37:23

Hold on, Leo, Leo Lion, what's going on?

SPEAKER_02: 37:28

Pull it back.

SPEAKER_05: 37:29

Hold on, time out, hold on, hold on. Because when we talk about the Maroons, we're talking about Jamaicans.

SPEAKER_01: 37:36

Not only Jamaicans, okay, but even then, even in Jamaica, right, we talk about the Maroons, and I know that we're gonna get off topic, but some of the treaties in Jamaica starts off that um people like Kofi and things like that, um with Asalama Lakeham. Uh Salta Afros has Sultana Afros has a few um essays out there that talk about from more essay called From Moors to Maroonage. A lot of again, your a lot of slave reports, period in the Americas were led by Muslims. MacIndale, right? Dodie Bookman, oh right, the first one, 1522. So it's not it's not that we gotta understand the political climate at that time. Again, Islam has been ruling Spain for 800 years. So when now the Spanish start to travel and the Portuguese start to travel the world, their world lens is still based off of their interactions with the Moors.

SPEAKER_05: 39:00

Okay. All right, now why'd you say that?

SPEAKER_01: 39:04

I said that because when you look at, you know, a lot of the documents of you know those early travelers and navigators and things like that, they say things like, oh, you know, the women of Cuba wore drapes like the Moorish women of you know Granada, right? Because they their world view is still coming from right even their own. You have you have European scholars who call Spain and Portugal still Moorish nations after they subjugated the Moors during that time. So it's just like a lot of the cultural customs were still Moorish in origin for the Spanish and the Portuguese. Think about it, right? The United States is not even 250 years old, but think about how we've been subjugated to right the ruling class's psychology, right? Now take that, it put 800 years to that, right? You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_05: 40:17

Okay, okay, right, okay. Now, um, let's go to the next one. Um, what role did the Europeans play in rewriting or renaming Moorish history?

SPEAKER_01: 40:32

Um the Europeans played a big role. Inquisition, Inquisition, yes, the Inquisition, yeah, the Inquisition is very huge. You know, a beautiful thing, we was just um so in the Inquisition history, you have these confraternity brotherhoods called the I might be mis saying the word, but the capo roll system. And if you look up the Inquisition Capo Roe system, um so these these uh systems were used for penance ceremonies, right? So penance is basically like you know, you basically asking for forgiveness and confession and all these different things, and that was a ceremony that the Spanish will actually put uh Moorish Muslims and Moorish Jews in public to shame them um for you know whether that's praying or you know, doing customs of their religion. But the funny thing about it is the uniforms of these capital roads literally mirror the Kukas Klan uniforms, right? So there's another aspect of our racial history, you know, of this history that hasn't been unfolded. Like, why did the Kukas Klan style themselves the way that they did? They got the inspiration from the Spanish Caparo because in the 1800s, right, the history of the Moors and Spain and all these things have been exoticized or orientalized as well. That's that's another aspect. What was what was the question? Yeah, I can give another.

SPEAKER_05: 42:11

So the question was uh what was what role did the Europeans play in rewriting or renaming the Moorish history?

SPEAKER_01: 42:17

Yeah, so again, the process of denigration is also something that we need to look at. So again, after 1492, and the Moors started to having to be forced to convert to Catholicism. So now the Moors are going from being Moors to now being called Morisco, which is like the Spanish version of calling us boy, basically, and then you have the term mudejar, which is like the tamed one, right? And then you start to get words like Negro, so like even like the Portuguese in the book, and um the brother who made the book, Jack D. Ford, who made the book Africans and Native Americans, he talks about how the Portuguese separated um negros de terra in Brazil versus negros de Guinea from West Africa, right? So there's there's another aspect. So out the gate, the Portuguese were calling the natives of Brazil Negroes, and then differated these so-called Negroes from so-called Negroes in Guinea. So there's another aspect that you know Europeans don't take up, don't talk about been rewritten, and then also, too, there's a map. Uh, I'll probably be doing something on this soon. There's a map that came out in 1721 um by the English, and the same area that I was talking about, ancient Mali, ancient Songhai. This area was called Negro land. Okay, yes. I can even I I can even share it.

SPEAKER_02: 44:07

Yeah. Let's do that.

SPEAKER_05: 44:13

African Royal, yes, yes, brother. Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_03: 44:20

So check this out.

SPEAKER_01: 44:42

So the map right here. Negro land. The southern part is called Guinea. So Negro land is the area in West Africa, according to the English at this time, was the predominantly Muslim area.

SPEAKER_05: 45:20

Wow. And what with the okay, I see that Timbuk. Songhai.

SPEAKER_01: 45:29

Agadez, right? Timbuk. Yeah, uh, Kano and Nigeria, yeah, all right, Seneca, right, all of these areas, Sierra de Leone, yeah.

SPEAKER_05: 45:42

Wow. Whoa whoa, that's crazy, bro.

SPEAKER_01: 45:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05: 45:46

So it's like all Islamic, that whole area right there.

SPEAKER_01: 45:52

This is the same area of the Mali Empire, the same area of the Songhai Empire, two of the biggest empires in the history of West Africa. Right. So these are is it's so much that's been twisted, not told about, omitted, that the Europeans have put in place for us to, you know, not know who we are.

SPEAKER_05: 46:28

Hey, now, you know, we hear that a lot. You know, the Europeans they don't want you to know who you are, they don't want you to know who you are. We hear that all the time. My question is, why don't they want us to know who we are? And the cliche uh thing to say, people would say, because they once we learn how great we are, we're gonna overthrow them or whatever the case may be.

SPEAKER_01: 46:50

But I I think it's it's it's it's more depth to that definitely reason when we look at the psychology of racism, the psychology of racism is that European people, people of paler skin, right, are inherently better than people of a darker skin, right? And that all of us have been taught that when we came from Africa, our people was just half naked, dancing in the jungle, and got caught with some nets. Is that not true? Right? Pretty much so with so with that being said, right, this is why they couldn't just enslave us as being Moors. Because this term is tied to a history that goes that shows that we were teaching them, we even enslaved them and subjugated them. But if we give you the history of the Negro, then all you can go back to is being subjugated, right? So it's a mentality is to keep our people at a certain state mentally because if I give you proof of what you've done, you'll be inspired to do it again.

SPEAKER_05: 48:13

All right, now um, how should Moorish Americans uh uh critically approach colonial records about slavery?

SPEAKER_01: 48:23

Moorish Americans should critically approach records about slavery by getting the context of how West Africa was functioning prior to it, right? Because again, a lot of these modern-day nation states did not exist prior to the you know encroachment of European colonialism, right? Ghana was Ashante, right? Nigeria was Oyo, right, or Igbu teroi, the the Iri or the Nri Kingdom, right? These were different names, different politics, all of that. So understanding the background context will now understand why, right? When the let's look at the movie Woman King, the kingdom of the home was worn with the Oyo Kingdom, right? And because these two kingdoms was worn with each other, the Europeans was able to benefit off of the captives of the war. So if we understood, all right, how did an oyo start? How did the dahome start? Then we'll be able to understand the context of okay, this is how the Europeans were able to flip these kingdoms against each other. Also, what we got to understand is there wasn't a right, the concept of how we see each other as Africans wasn't the same, right? Because literally Africa only applied to the Tunisia area. This is where the word comes from. It comes from the area of Tunisia in Libya.

SPEAKER_05: 50:01

Okay, can you elaborate on that?

SPEAKER_01: 50:02

Yes, sir. So prior to um, so a lot of people say that you know the term Africa comes from you know, Scipio Africanus, who was the Roman general who came to you know to help defeat Carthage. Yeah, no, and the reason why we know that is because the Romans would give their generals the name of the place that they conquered. So obviously the name Africa was there before Scipio conquered it, because that's how he got the name added to his basically his badge as a general. So usually the name comes from uh Dana Martin said the name comes from uh a king that came from Yemen or uh Sabia area called Ibn Ifriqus. So this name, the name Africa, or you know, the etymology of the name comes again prior to any Roman interaction as well, and that area that it was given to was the area around Tunisia and Libya. So again, even this concept of everybody in the continent being African has an origin in Moorish territory, Tunisia, Tunisia, right? So it's just like the history speaks for itself, and it's us dispelling this context because really truly uh the the term Moor for a relatable context is really a pan-African word in a sense where it's a connector because Moorish people have lived through different eras. We live through the Islamic era, we live through the Christian era, we live through the Judaic era, we live through the ancient Egyptian Empire, all of these different things. So, where the divisions are at in our community today isn't actually warranted by history, but because we don't know the history, and we've been mentally colonized, our first thing to do is divide and label, right?

SPEAKER_05: 52:09

So, right, indeed, indeed. All right, do you believe uh geography and misclassifications? This is a great segue. Uh, do you believe some people classified as slaves were actually already in the Americas prior to the European arrival?

SPEAKER_01: 52:28

100%, 100%, because what we have, what's not talked about is that there was an American slave trade, and that a lot of you know Native people in the north were shipped south to South Carolina, and from there they were shipped to the Caribbeans, and then from there they were shipped back, and it was actually a lot of people that were of Yamasi descent. Uh, there's a brother, uh Seiko Jenu, who speaks about this, and the Yamasy were known to have dark skin from the records of a Herman and Cortez and things like that. So that was actually the game. The game was to bring certain Africans over here to dispossess the people here of their land. And in Jack D. Ford's book that I was mentioning earlier, once the edict came out that uh from Spain and from Portugal and from the Pope that they were no longer allowed to enslave native people, what the Portuguese did was just call them Negroes to enslave them. So the term Negro was specifically used to dispossess and wipe out the humanity and history of individuals. And this is what we really have to understand as a people is that we've been reduced to being able to now only identify some semblance of kinship based on skin color. We've been reduced to that. If we understood who we are, we would know that kinship comes from right, trade, schooling, spiritual centers, communicate, all of these different things. But no, we only see the connection coming from skin color because we've been reduced to that knowledge, all right.

SPEAKER_05: 54:20

Woo, wow, wow. Yeah, hear it. Do you hear that bomb dropping, or does it sound like mechanical? It sounds bad. No, it's good. Okay, it sounds like an actual bomb, though. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right, so now um, let's go to it. Um, how did labels like more Negro, black, and Indian get mixed and reassigned over time? You were kind of like explaining that earlier, but yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 54:48

Yeah, um, you know, it's funny.

SPEAKER_05: 54:52

Oh, and the brother Abdullah, I don't mean to cut you off, the brother Abdullah and Yasrael, Yisrael is dropping it on that. Like, if you go in the uh if you go in the the playlist on this page and you go into civil litter or civil letter, oh no, civil litter, you'll see all the videos on that. So they break down like how it you we go from one name to the next name, and then it was like slowly, slowly brings us to negro, black, and color.

SPEAKER_01: 55:22

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_05: 55:22

Over time.

SPEAKER_01: 55:23

So yeah, and and what that is, um, is the again the process of denigration. Is that right, you go from a Moore to a Morisco to a Moody Hart to a black of Moore in English to now just the term Negro being used. But also, so what's interesting is is that in 1621, I'll give up two instances. In 1621 and in 1622, in 1621, the Peabody Harvey Museum has, and this is known amongst a lot of Moors, is that uh um that the colonial powers at that time exchanged the word Moore for the term Indian. So that happened in 1621, and then in 1622, we have record that in the Inquisition in Spain is that the Spanish put out an edict not to record the lineages of Moors and Jews purposefully, all right. So here we have so if we look at it, right, 1619 is when most people say the transatlantic trade started, but then by 1621, the term Moors being replaced with Indian. By 1622, the Spanish are no longer recording the ancestry and lineage of the Moors and Jews that they have in their colonies in the Americas, and over time, this is now you get that erosion of the terms. So it was basically um depending on which colony you were in, right? Because you have the British, you have the Spanish, you have the Portuguese, you have the French, and you have the Dutch, who are the main you know, five colonizers of the Americas. So depending on which colony you were in and who you were working with at that time, is why over time you have some colonies calling people more, some just calling the Negroes, etc. Even look at like uh the history of uh of us of Moors in Florida, where Florida goes from being owned by the Spanish, then the English get in on it, and then now the the you know native Moors and people are are fighting with the English against the Spanish, and then now the Spanish say, well, if you come and be Catholic, you'd be free from slavery. So now Moors are now fighting with the Spanish to fight to push the English out. So there's there's a lot of political games that were played during the colonial era based off of this growing you know crusade against our people.

SPEAKER_05: 58:06

Check, check. Hey, you you brothers and sisters, y'all come in to come in on this uh uh uh uh live really late. Y'all on what they call CP time. Come on, y'all. Come on, yeah. Y'all gotta do better, y'all, with that, man. That that's why it's great for me to in the beginning just talk about your history because they're gonna come in 10 minutes later anyway. Anyway, let's go to the next one. Um, last question before we cut out. And hopefully, man, you would like to come back on again, man. You you you're dropping a lot, a lot, a lot of information. Hold on. I definitely just got here. Come on, God. Peace to the God. Come on, God, come on, CP time now. Come on now. Now, let's get to it. Um, when discussing, you hey guard, you gotta rewind this this uh video right here. This is a young guy right here. Young God. You want what are you uh wisdom bill. He's he's uh uh what did I say? Yeah, wisdom bill. He's wisdom bill, god wisdom bill. Anyway, uh when discussing the slave trade, how important it is it to distinguish both nationality and legal status.

SPEAKER_01: 59:21

That's important because it was the stripping of nationality that made us legally or the part of our ancestry that were made legally chadow and property at that time. They could not make us beast of the fields, chadto, etc., while still recognizing our humanity, and that's and that was the whole play. The whole play of introducing the terms Negro, black, and color was to strip us of our humanity, it was to dehumanize. Us right so now the Negro becomes a beast, a beast of burden, right? So all of these things were used again. I'll go back to this word, denigrate to devalue who we are as people. So how that plays into nationalities again, the nationality had to be stripped in order to create this status of a slave caste or a slave class. So this is why now today, even today, we have to reject these terms because, based off of the paper trail of the history, the term black is used to keep us subjugated at the bottom in their hierarchy. Because they came up with the concept of race, right? So if we talk about white supremacy, what is white what is white supreme over? Black. What they've really done is created a mythology about how they plundered our wealth and resources and land. And now we are continuing, it's like an abusive relationship. How are we going to get past this abusive relationship while still using the keywords that signifies the abuse? And this is what our people don't understand about you know who we are as a people here in the nations that we know we we really do think we're black. We really do think we're just niggas. And that is the problem, is that now we have been because we think like this, they can calculate our every move. Because I know your thinking doesn't go past a certain point. You you won't look at your history past 400 years. You don't even like history, you don't even like politics. It's boring. All of these things, all of these conditions have been set to keep us stagnant in purgatory. So that's the importance of nationality and its relationship to slavery, is that it doesn't mean that, oh yeah, you know, if we all today, if every African American, so-called African-American, was today understand that they was a Marsh American, that doesn't mean that you know the cooker pressure might get turned on and people might try to enslave us. But what that means is now we have a better understanding and context of the world that we live in and a better chance to preserve who we are moving forward into the future. Check. So, yes, sir.

SPEAKER_05: 1:02:57

Check, check, check. So, man, uh um we're we're out of time right now. Um, I think the next time you come up, I'm gonna have to hit you with an hour and a half, bro. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:03:08

I'll just get started, bro. Let's get warmed up, right?

SPEAKER_05: 1:03:12

You need an hour and a half. We gotta give the guard an hour and a half. So um uh but we'll yeah, we're gonna chat about that. We're gonna have the guard back up here again. Um, and uh yeah, we're gonna build on that. But uh on that note, thank you for everybody for coming out this evening. Thank you, brother, for dropping the jewels on us. And um, I forgot the brother's name he referred you to me. Uh brother Taliq. Taliq, Taliq. Taliq, if you're watching, Taliq, peace to you, brother. We need to have you up here to build some time about some things. I got some questions for you. You know, I got some questions for you, man, uh, about uh the Moorish movement, brother. You would be setting things on fire up here. Um so reach out to me see and let me know if you want to do something, brother. Uh on that note, peace to everybody in the chat. And let me run this commercial before we um go, because the prophet said it takes finance to raise a nation, and I'm saying it takes finance to raise a podcast. Peace to everybody out there, and we are out of here.

SPEAKER_00: 1:04:20

Peace family. Welcome to NYP Talk Show. This is more than a podcast, it's a conscious platform rooted in truth and culture from the 5% nation, nation of Islam, Moorish movement, and masonry. Our mission is to reclaim our narrative and uplift the African diaspora with real stories and real conversations. Support us through Super Chats during live shows, donations on Cash App, GoFundMe, Patreon, or Buzz Sprout. And by refting our official merch, available on our website and right here on YouTube's merch shelf. Every dollar, every super chat, every hoodie builds the movement. This is NYP Talk.