Panther Of a Thousand Faces | New Black Panther Party - Magnetik Allah

Black power gets thrown around like a catchphrase, but we want to talk about what it costs, what it requires, and what it actually does. On this NYP Talk Show build, we bring back Magic Allah to break down the New Black Panther Party through the lens of “The Panther of a Thousand Faces” a global legacy of the Black fighting spirit that shows up wherever oppression shows up. That frame takes the Panther out of a single time period and forces us to look at patterns: police violence, hunger, displacement, poor schools, colonialism, and why resistance keeps reappearing in different places under different names.

We also get specific about mission and training. Magic Allah lays out the sole purpose of a Panther and the five duties, then pushes past surface-level symbolism to talk about Black power as an internal source of courage, discipline, and clarity. We dig into why ideological development matters, how confusion can sabotage organizing, and what structured political education looks like, including civics, the Bill of Rights, and human rights frameworks that help you move in the real world.

From there, we connect strategy to everyday life: how local politics actually controls policing, why civic pressure starts with the offices we vote for, and how communities can partner with service networks for housing, mental health, and recovery instead of pretending one organization can fund everything alone. If you’ve been looking for grounded conversation on Pan-Africanism, revolutionary Black nationalism, community programs, and political education, this one delivers. Subscribe, share this with someone who cares about real change, and leave a review with the one idea you’re taking into your week.

Transcript

Greetings, Health, And Introductions

SPEAKER_02 0:11

Peace, peace, world. How you doing with your brother Mikey Fever? Welcome to another episode of NYP Talk Show, the realist podcast within this conscious sphere. Don't forget to comment, like, share, and subscribe. We got super chats. We got the website. Got some things coming down the line for you guys. Hope all is well. Peace to y'all on this beautiful Thursday. Peace to the family. Peace to the gods. Peace to the earth. Peace to Islam and Lakeham to the Nation of Islam. Peace to the Hebrew Israelites. Peace to the ATR movement. Shout out to everybody, man, out there. Peace. Peace. Peace. We got our brother who's not unfamiliar with this platform, who's been putting in the work with the Black Roundtable. Shout outs to him and brother Vic. They have bringing a lot of good information, and these brothers are real solid in what they do. They don't believe it, they walk it. You know what I'm saying? Our good brother Magic Allah.

SPEAKER_00 1:09

Peace, pays to the family. So glad to be back on the NYP Talk Show, Building in the Building.

SPEAKER_02 1:16

Yeah, man. Last show we had was great with you and Brother Hassan, man. And I think you again coming out. You had the root canal and you still rocked out with us, man. The salute to you, man.

SPEAKER_00 1:26

Yeah. You know, yeah, it's a work in progress, man. It's still under construction. I'm working with it, you know. Just the whole I know the healing. No, because health is important as you as you get into your power years, your 50, you gotta make sure that's on points. I'm doing my best, sir.

SPEAKER_02 1:41

You don't look like you're in your power years, bro.

SPEAKER_00 1:44

Oh, thank you, man. Man, I appreciate that. That's what I need to hear, sir.

SPEAKER_02 1:48

What's the secret? Following what the how to eat to live.

SPEAKER_00 1:53

Um, yeah, that's that's a piece of it, but I would say just try to keep yourself in good spirits, you know, it's positive spirits and you know, not taking stuff too serious because be amazed at how much laughter and joy can change just a bad day. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 2:09

Yeah, that is so true, man. People don't understand that a little bit of that, man, just a smile, a good gesture helped the day go by, man. We have a negative thought in mind, and out of nowhere, that laughter just breaks that that dark cloud.

SPEAKER_00 2:22

Changes the whole frequency, you know? Indeed. Indeed.

SPEAKER_02 2:25

True

What The New Black Panther Party Is

SPEAKER_02 2:26

indeed. So tonight's show, family, we got a good show tonight. The brother's gonna present to us. It's Panther of a Thousand Faces, new Black Panther Party. Can you break that down for us? What is the new Black Panther Party, brother? I know we got an introduction that you provided us that I'm going to add right now.

SPEAKER_00 2:44

All right. Um, I love that you asked that question. Because, you know, what we're not talking about is the old Black Panther Party. You know, we're talking about some uh the most preserved, I say, quintessential elements of what make up what we call the Panther cake. The ingredients that we saw that we could take from the old Black Panther Party and then make something new and then make something that could go into the future. Not necessarily we're gonna we're not gonna say better. We're not gonna, you know, put nobody down, but make something that's suitable for us to be able to take into the future and that would be you uh useful. Okay. Um uh I know a lot of people observe at a at a certain point within the old Black Panther Party, a lot of things that made it the Black Panther Party were taken from out of it. Instead of being black power, it was power to the people. Right? Okay, right. It was power to the people. Uh and as it became power to the people, a lot of the stuff that had to do with black people specifically got kind of washed out. Right? We began to see different colors of people show up at these rallies and whatnot, and show up in the Black Panther offices. And all of a sudden, something that was for black power became everybody else's power and power to the people. And we saw a rainbow pop up. But somebody else came and kind of took it away and pushed it into a different direction. So at a certain point, uh black people said, hey, well, we need that back because the same stuff that was going on when we created the Black Panther Party is going on now. So we need that same setup. And uh, you know, the question was, well, what do we want to, what parts of it do we want to bring back? What parts of it do we not want to bring back? And the parts of it that, you know, people wanted brought back and emphasized was Pan-Africanism, revolutionary black nationalism, black liberation theology, the 10-point program. Um uh, I'm not gonna even say nothing like the Red Book, because that was some of the stuff that twisted it and took it into a different direction. But a party that was uh centered around the new one.

SPEAKER_02 5:12

You say what now? You're talking about Chairman's Mao book, the Red Book.

SPEAKER_00 5:15

Yeah, but that wasn't a part of the formula for the new Black Panther Party. The the formula for this was revolutionary black nationalism, pan-Africanism, and liberation theology, and then programs to you know demonstrate and show and approve this to the neighborhoods which the chapters was in, you know. And um, I use this phrase here, the Panther of a Thousand Faces, because what it says is that it says this Panther is in all of us. Whether we be in Haiti, whether we be in Africa, whether we be in Jamaica, whether we be in Europe, no matter where we be, this panther is in all of us. When we say this panther or by stat, we're talking about the black fighting spirit. And the reason why I can say this and qualify that the Panther is in all of us is because all of us have had to fight against white supremacy in order to exist. Period.

SPEAKER_02 6:07

Talk about it. Talk about it.

SPEAKER_00 6:12

If so, you got crumbled and humbled and then, you know, sent on your way. That's how that went. If you was gonna exist, I'm gonna say after, I'm gonna say even after the seventh century, you had to fight and struggle against white supremacy if if you had black scam.

SPEAKER_02 6:32

True indeed. True indeed. I I love how you said that. You linked that to Bassett. That that that fight in warrior spirit is in all of us. It's in all of us, and we we have to wake up and how you said that we've been fighting white supremacy since the 1700s, even before then. And I think that's just something that's just a that's that's just a cancer that's within society that's always, you know, is gonna spread value others. And I'm glad that you said that. So with this um presentation right here, brother, I was looking at it earlier, but I was like, you know what, I won't I want to wait to experience it with the viewers and listeners, man. Right. If we if we could get into that, can you walk us into that?

SPEAKER_00 7:15

Um, could you read it, family? I I tried to put on my glasses to be able to see it, but I can't see it, brother. It's very I got you. Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_02 7:25

The Panther of a Thousand Faces, the Black Fighting Spirit is an anthology which takes a historical look into many appearances of the Panther throughout history. From Bassette, daughter of Ra to the Oh pardon me. Trying to see myself also mystery of Europe and even on the big screen in a motion picture. The Panther is a multidimensional concept which has made its way into the fields of in into the fields of endeavor, classes, religion, genders, ethnicity, as well as locations and time periods. Whenever whenever and whenever you see whatever wherever you see a police, terrorism, hunger, human rights, abuse, poor schools, displacement, marginalization, oppression, racism, and colonialism, you will see a Panther Party or something like it emerge. That's deep right there, bro. Resistance everywhere. Wherever you see it, there's gonna there's gonna be resistance. You feel me?

SPEAKER_01 8:35

That's right.

SPEAKER_02 8:35

Yes, sir. Pardon me, I'm trying to I'm trying to really focus in and see because I'm my glasses as well. I'm like, I'm trying to you know, um, the text is a little small. Why we knew Black Panther Party must tell the story. Many have attempted to tell this story and were unsuccessful. You cannot tell a story about an international phenomenon using a localized perspective or a micro-nationalist viewpoint. We appreciate all efforts before us to take us into the subject. They have all brought us closer to seeing this phenomenon clearer. It says the first of all, we cannot isolate the Black Panther into one time period. That is the shallow approach to a very rich, deep legacy. The Panther is the embodiment of the fighting spirit, the spirit which endows the oppressed with the spirit to push back. That's that that's that that's that's that right. Resistance, man, not not giving in. It is the mind which creates a counter-narrative and then makes the narrative the narrative. When the mind, the pen and the sword join forces with the will of the people, a kind of magic happens. This kind of magic we call the Black Panther. Let me go forward. Make sure I don't miss no part and cut off. Um I can't see that part right there.

SPEAKER_00 10:09

No one of us is greater than all of us?

SPEAKER_02 10:11

Yeah, definitely. I couldn't say that. All could cut off in the bottom. All of us together, no single story is greater than the whole story. In fact, if you're not gonna tell the whole story, then why tell it at all? That right there. That's powerful right there, bro. Hold on. I gotta give that some sound, man. I gotta give that some sound. Oh my god, that's that right there, bro. Yo, that that is self, that that's that right there is is the is the declaration right there, bro. That said it off. That right there said it all.

SPEAKER_00 10:51

I mean, and that's that's that's uh that's that's the that's the perspective that we're approaching this um this Panther. Because we know once again, it's an international concept. Period. I was just watching a joint the other day, a movie that was on um uh Tubi. Yeah, man, this was about the Black Panther Party of New Zealand. I had no idea, I ain't gonna even lie to you. I had no idea there was a Black Panther Party of New Zealand, and they were talking about all of their struggles and you know what they went through and stuff, and I was just like, okay, so you know, there we go again. Anywhere where these type of big uh conditions exist, yeah, this type of thing will pop up. You see, even outside of America, way over on the other side of the world where they're dealing with, you know, some type of oppression, racism, colonialism, maybe all three. You know what I mean? They said they looked and they saw what we were doing. They had posters up at Huey P. Newton and Angela Davis and all kinds of shit. And uh uh Bobby Seal up in the New Zealand office. I was like, wow, I see.

SPEAKER_02 12:04

That's powerful right there.

International Origins And Symbols

SPEAKER_02 12:06

So when did the new Black Panther party um when was it created, brother?

SPEAKER_00 12:11

Um we say we go back to, I'm gonna say 1964. Um there's a piece that a brother named Bob Brown did, who was a comrade of uh Kwame Touray and one of the early members of SNCC. Uh, but we say 1964, I believe it was in the YMCA in New York with uh uh Queen Mothermore, Max Stanford, who was the head of uh uh Rampart, I mean not Ramparts, but Ram. And then um, yeah, and then Kwame Touray. And they got together and they wanted to find a way to create uh, hmm, how could I say this? Like an umbrella group for people that were kind of trapped in the Democratic Party or trapped in the Republican plantation, and they wanted to have a place where they could come together and do black politics, you know, without the snares of the Democratic and the Republican Party. So they created the Black Panther Party. And this was like in New York, you know, where they brought it together. And then, now that's one uh as they as uh Bob Brown calls it, leader of kittens that happened in New York. Then somehow, this idea, when the kids decided to go down to Alabama, right, the Switch kids decided to go down to Alabama, the Ram kids decided to go down to Alabama to Lowe's County, that idea they looked around down there and they saw all the Panther stuff down there, you know, all the high schools and stuff and the colleges and stuff using that, you know, that Panther. So they said, well, wow, you know, and when they got down there, the Lowe's County Freedom Organization, you know, came into, came into be. And this was a um a black town that was 85% black, but the black people didn't hold no offices. So they said, well, then we should be able to take office if we can get the vote, but they couldn't get the vote because every time they came to get the vote, then the Klan came out with the gun. And so, you know, when you look, there's a sign you guys can all Google the audience. I would challenge you guys to Google this um Alabama Democratic uh Party. And on the top it says, you know, Alabama Democratic Party, and on the bottom it says white supremacy, and then has a chicken in the middle. And I just want to remind everybody that chicken represents us. Wow. Yeah, you know, you know how we like fried chicken in the south. Yeah, we was that chicken that was getting fried. So this is why we went from that symbol, the chicken, to what?

SPEAKER_02 14:49

To the panther. Yeah, got you. I like that, yeah, man. Because there's cows over here. All right, being that we in 2026, right?

Five Duties And Panther Purpose

SPEAKER_02 14:58

This is a question for those who don't understand what the new Black Panther Party is, and those who do know, I hope you know you further do your investigation. What is the central mission in this day and age, and how how would we explain to um ordinary black people or black fam, you know, black families that haven't studied any revolutionary politics? How will how would we break it down for them?

SPEAKER_00 15:23

So, first of all, let me say I want to give a shout out.

unknown 15:25

Go ahead.

SPEAKER_02 15:27

The intro itself was dope. That that's that mission statement right there is dope, but how can we really embed it in them to get on board with this?

SPEAKER_00 15:37

Thank you for the question, bro. Um, I want to uh give recognition and a shout out to Brother Daryl Hawkins, also known as Nasir Natula, who's the chairman now. Brother's doing a very good job, um, has restructured it, been able to do what we call the house cleaning, eating all the rats out of the house to where the house can be clean and ready for new people to come in and new ideas to come in. Okay. So with that, I would send everybody to uh the new blackpantherparty.black. It's the new blackpantherparty.black. Yeah. And that's the website, and that's you can kind of look at and see. And on the website, we have a newspaper that's coming out. You know, it's the new Black Panther Party uh newsletter, newspaper. And you can just kind of you know read through it and kind of see what we're about and what we represent, but to put it in a nutshell and sum it up for our listening audience, um, I would talk about what we call the five duties and the sole purpose of a panther. Okay, so we say, we say the sole purpose of a panther is to be a revolutionary in the African people's liberation struggle and to mobilize the masses towards self-determination. A Panther must be a vanguard example for African people at all times, black people. In order to accomplish this great and divine mission, he or she must be one, spiritually, culturally, and politically conscious. Two, respectful and courteous to all people and demand the same in return. Three, militant, always engaged in the war for the hearts and minds of black people while carrying oneself in an organized and orderly fashion. Four, humble, willing to release any arrogant attitudes and superior ideas of oneself, discipline, willing to sacrifice your lore or personal desires for the greater good of the mission. That's what we call the five duties. And yeah, you know, it's it's something that things that people can carry with them throughout their day, throughout their week, amongst their family, amongst their community. And many times, if you demonstrate these qualities, you won't really have to preach. People will just start asking you things and listening to you and paying close attention to you and doing what you do because these are very magnetic qualities. You don't see a lot of people that have these qualities nowadays that are consistent with it. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 18:17

I like that. I like that. I like that. And it's the number five, man, power and refinement. You see what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 18:22

And that's why I added it on black power and refinement. See, because yeah, you got the five duties. And if you add them duties on to yourself, that's a refinement within itself.

SPEAKER_02 18:34

Yeah, that five has a lot of power to it. I love truth, freedom, justice, equality.

SPEAKER_01 18:38

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_02 18:40

Everything that makes, and that's what that's what we strive for. Indeed.

Black Power Beyond Slogans

SPEAKER_02 18:44

What does black power mean today beyond the rhetoric, symbolism, uniforms, and demonstrations?

SPEAKER_00 18:51

You know, well, you know, we know black is um that's the original people, period, of the planet, the people who built the planet. Before the planet had an infrastructure, um, these people came and built the infrastructure of the planet, all over the planet. And that's no exception on any part of the 196,940,000 square miles of the planet. Okay, so when we're talking about black power today, we've seen it manifest in the form of uh slogans, in the form of like fashion statements, black power, people use it for that. Um, you know, once again, political parties, social movements. But when we're talking about black power today, right, in this dimension, me as a national minister of culture and the MBPP, we're talking about substance that you can go within and plug into, even as an individual, okay? Substance that you can go into. There's times when black people need that courage to be able to stand up to somebody, to an unjust law, or unjust ruler, or a teacher at your kid's school, or a policeman that's acting outside of his duty. You know what I mean? There's times when you need that inner source of power to give you the courage to stand up to them and let you know that you're intelligent enough to be able to confront this person and their bullshit and back them up. That's the first black power we're talking about. Okay, because if a person does not have that, it's not a too good of a chance they're gonna be able to come into an organization and find something, something, I don't know, outside of themselves to attach to to make them powerful. Now they got to have an internal source of what? Black power. That can only come through, um, I would say, an inward journey. Looking into yourself, not the inward journey, see, or you look inward and you see an inward.

SPEAKER_02 20:51

No, no, the inward journey. Within deep within.

SPEAKER_00 20:56

You see, to find that the best part of yourself. And once you start digging into that self and you become dissatisfied with the other part of yourself, so dissatisfied that you use that dissatisfaction to multiply the better part of yourself, then you bring that to the organization, right, with other people who are doing the same thing. And this is why we say the new Black Panther Party, because there's a renewal. Even for an older person that comes in, they don't have to be real young. They could be, but when they come into this, they're gonna feel young again because there's gonna be a renewal or what Dr. Collie called a blackism. Right? Yeah, we're all of the thorough shit about black, you're reminded about.

SPEAKER_02 21:40

Gotcha. What what makes the new Black Panther Party different from any other liberation group for black people? You know, what makes it like so much different? Because you know, in the 60s, we know when the Panthers came, they had other groups that represented civil rights and political um other agendas for people. They were viewed as like um. They were respected, but they weren't as feared as the Panthers. Like the ferocity the Panthers had. Because not only were they just branching guns, people assume they just brandish guns, but they were lethal in the sense of intellectualism as well, knowing the law.

SPEAKER_00 22:15

I like how you highlighted that very, very much because when we have class, that's what that's exactly what we're talking about. Let's keep it a buck, family. It's just me and you on here talking, but I know a lot of people listening, but most people know that they can't really see black people from here, from as far as fighting. They know on a one-on-one, we will tear your ass out the frame. Sometimes we can fight multiple people with just one of us. They know that. They know who all the heavyweight champions are. Floyd Mayweather, um, you know, people like Abdullah Mason. We got major hand game, man, scraps all day till the wheels fall off. Okay. But what many of us do not have is the same ideological scrap where we can defend the integrity of our ideas and defend our culture from being misused and abused, right? Or defend our politics against another set of politics and be successful and have confidence in our ability to be able to defend our politics and our culture, right, from invasion. That's what we're talking about today in the new Black Panther Party. And then as a result of being able to defend, right, the integrity of our culture, the integrity of our ideology, the integrity of our politics, we're able to maintain and preserve our community. Because the community needs all of these things, but they must have integrity to them to where anything cannot come in and out of it and control it and manipulate it using what I call uh uh uh string cheese. You know, string cheese is white, and it's money that got strings attached to it.

SPEAKER_02 23:55

I like that. I like that. You see, I like that.

SPEAKER_00 23:58

We don't need to pour string cheese. You see, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:02

Cause because I because I I see it like, you know, through research and my own analysis, I see that, you know, our people sometimes have like a messiah complex, or we we used to have that voice that represents us. Right? And sometimes that voice that represents us is sometimes tailored by the somebody other than us. Yeah, powers that be that wants you that person to pacify you. Again, um I'm not I'm not slandering the elders that pass, you know, you know, like though, you know, MLK, he was feared because what he did with the the the uh boy the boycott later on, they realized he had that power to really dismantle the system financially. And you know, civil rights and stuff, but they they didn't embrace um a Martin Luther King like that. I mean, no, no, no, not Martin Luther King, pardon me, Malcolm X, or Elijah Mohammed wasn't embraced as such, or um, for instance, uh, Huey P. Newton. Why you know what why why is that?

SPEAKER_00 25:08

Um, yeah, man, I mean, certain things, narratives go counter to their narratives because they'll listen to you talk. But what they're trying to figure out while you're talking is what is this person's underlying message or point that they want to drive people to? Where are they taking us to? Where is this car headed? Okay, so when they look at Martin Luther King, they was like, oh, this his car is headed to a very happy place with a whole bunch of happy niggas and a whole bunch of white people having ice cream cones and drinking from the same water fountain. They look at Malcolm, it's like, oh, his car is headed to a real black place with big afros and shit and Africa symbols and stuff and jazz music playing. And it was just a choice. Let's keep it real. Some of us wanted to go to where Martin's car was headed. Yeah. Right? But then as we got closer to that, we took that route, as Martin said, have I walked my people into a burning house? Right? Yep. And they said, well, holy man, maybe I need to get back on the main street, the freedom road, because this off-road he done took us on is not what they said it was gonna be.

SPEAKER_02 26:26

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 26:27

You see what I'm saying? So I I think that's what that's kind of what pushed people this way or that way. You know what I mean? Because somebody could sell you something or tell you almost anything, finally. But when you start to and you have to make it walk and talk, that's a whole nother ball game. And they had to make this so-called talk about equality that Kennedy was talking about, that Eisenhower, with all the presidents was talking about. It's even in the Constitution, the very founding documents of this nation. Okay, make it walk and talk. Because y'all sure wrote the shit, and anything you say would can and will be used against you in the court of law, baby.

SPEAKER_02 27:08

Okay, see, and that and that's where Malcolm was taking them. Okay, he's looking to take them from the court of law. You get what I'm saying? So you know, man, it's just so much.

Training, Curriculum, And Movement Security

SPEAKER_02 27:20

Now I I was not enough to unpack. So, with this new Black Panther party, what is the curriculum? You did mention, like, you know, they don't do that, they don't do the red book. But say business, I want to sign up. What's the process I'll go through? Like, will I be paying that is?

SPEAKER_00 27:33

You would sign up, of course, there'd be a background check and stuff. There's like there's like a class that's either every day or at least three days a week, done by a brother named Pharaoh Zip Ties. And um, he walks you through the five duties until you can memorize them and put them on cap, and also the nine local objectives, which are the things that the different Panther chapters or members do within their regions or areas to uh this is basically the program, the daily, weekly program, you know. Yeah. Um, and then you would come to Tuesday class, and Tuesday class is like political science. I teach that class, and you know, we talk about like, for instance, it's a six-week program. So we talk about the Bill of Rights, talk about the UN Declaration for human rights, um stuff like the G Code that we talked about on here, the 11 principles of uh white supremacy. Yes, sir. Um, and you know, just just things that are important to know as a Panther, because I was born into the party. So for a long time, I was hanging around the old party, the old people and stuff. And at a certain point, I was like, well, we need to do more stuff, y'all. And they was like, Well, we agree with you, but you're a lot younger than us, and we're a lot older than you. So why don't you go find some younger Panthers and teach them what we've shared with you? I said, you know, that's a good idea. So that's when I took it from the commemoration party to the MBPP and made sure that all the Panther stuff, I knew the Pantherisms, as like a professor of Pantherism, me, you know, I made sure I shared all of that with the new Black Panthers. And I'm really striving to um just build a relationship between Brother Aaron Dixon, you know, because he's a real cool, real solid brother from Seattle and the MBPP. And, you know, we've had some good talks, you know. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:27

I want yeah, I'm glad you you mentioned that too um with the old party, new party. Is there like any compare and contrast? Because I know like with older party back then, they were under so much like stress from Cointel Pro, FBI, internal conflict, right, and you know, many other tactics that were used to, you know, create you know disparity and conflict amongst them. How do you guys view um view these tactics? And are you guys well equipped to know how to vet that out?

SPEAKER_00 30:01

It is what it is, friend. You're always gonna have that on the table that's working against you, you know, that hidden hand. You're always gonna have that. Um, but realistically, um, you know, we just say that. To me, myself, if I'm gonna look at this, Kate, and if I'm gonna go back in time and our struggle, the heartbeat of it, the heartbeat of it is the fighting black spirit. Okay, yeah, you know, when you look back to our history and you see people like Harriet Tubman, you see within her a bastet and a fighting black spirit, you know, in the field which she was working in, liberating souls, you know. She said forward or under. We're not separate, you know, you can't go back forward or under. When you look at somebody like Adam Clayton Powell, who was a minister and a politician, but irregardless, I know a lot of ministers, I know a lot of politicians, they ain't nothing like him. Because you saw within him and the way he represented Harlem a fighting black spirit. When you look at um, you know, somebody like um uh Sigarway Robinson, who was born in Detroit, or not born in Detroit, but came to Detroit and started fighting in Detroit. And this was at a time when they didn't want to show the black fighters, they didn't want to give them a real shot. He went all throughout America and all around Europe whooping white men's ass. I mean, whooping them really bad with both hands in a way that nobody had never seen nobody do it, and the way he represented black, the majesty that he represented, the way he did it, and the machness that he did it with. Once again, you saw the fighting black spirit. So even though they worked against us, they oppressed us, you know, they lied on us and spied upon us, right? He had another champ who was from Detroit too, Joe Lewis. He was quiet. Right? And first the white man beat him, but then he came back and smashed the white man, Max Smelling, I believe was his name, faded him. Yeah. And this was this was like black America whooping white racist Hitler, Nazi Germany. All the time.

SPEAKER_02 32:15

I love that history. When I when I, you know, growing up watching those old documentaries and reading those doc and reading, you know, reading books and documentaries and hearing oral oral lessons from elders tell me about that, I'd be like, wow, how they destroy these men publicly or through fine, you know, financially, taxes or whatever to get them with, like the polls.

SPEAKER_00 32:35

I mean, even when we use the term G.I. Joe, who's the Joe they're talking about? Joe Lewis. Joe Lewis. Yeah. It's like, so um, even if we go to Patton's Panthers, right, in World War II, these were the black men of Patton soldiers, because he was a major general, who went into Germany and freed a lot of the internment camps because the white boys didn't want to do it. Only the black Patton's Panthers went in and did that. This is another part of the legacy of the Panthers that we're talking about, you know. So we're talking about a very vast legacy, a fighting black spirit that goes far back and far forward, and it's here with us now.

SPEAKER_02 33:23

Got you, my brother. I love that. What what role do the sisters play in the movement, in roles in leadership?

SPEAKER_00 33:30

What role do sisters play?

SPEAKER_02 33:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:33

Um, sisters, any position that they would, you know, like to play and whatnot.

SPEAKER_02 33:37

We I like that.

SPEAKER_00 33:39

Um there's been plenty of sisters. In fact, one um the old Black Panther Party, Elaine Brown, I would say, ran about the tightest version of the Black Panther Party, you know? Um, right now we have a lot of sisters that are in on the leadership council and who are leaders of chapters, etc. It's a very important thing to have that uh male and female balance, that yin and yang balance, in order for things to be home. Because the black home has a nuclear family in it. Irregards of what anybody wants to say, if you're a man, you're a woman, you're a child, there's only one way you could have got to the planet. A man and a woman laid down together, got together, and produced enough love to produce you. And that is what we honor, that union.

SPEAKER_02 34:29

I got you. So sister put up, Desiree put up 85%.

SPEAKER_00 34:34

85%. Why's why why'd she put up that?

SPEAKER_02 34:38

I don't know, but you know, she gotta further explain that.

Women’s Leadership And Police Accountability

SPEAKER_02 34:42

Um how how does the movement confront police misconduct, right? This is two questions in one. Police misconduct and how does how do how does the com how does the movement just the conflict within the community as far as the black on black violence and ills that lays within our communities, how do we deal with that? The new Black Panther Party?

SPEAKER_00 35:08

Uh let's see, uh, police misconduct. Um I myself, I I like to use the term police terrorism because when I see some of the stuff that they're doing and the fact that a lot of these people they're doing this against are unarmed, you know, civilians, and these people are armed and they're trained and they're getting paid, so they have a they're getting financed to do this.

SPEAKER_02 35:32

But they're doing tax dollars.

SPEAKER_00 35:35

Our tax dollars is our money, so we're paying for our own ass whoopings a lot of times. Exactly. And it's an expensive ass whooping, right? Public servant. There you go. So um I think we could find better ways where this money could be used rather than paying for you know honorable ass whoopings. Honestly. I mean, because that's essentially what it is. Because we, I know you work hard, I work hard, your parents have worked hard. We everybody in the sound of my listening voice works hard. We don't want to keep putting our money into uh something that's abusive and it's uh shown and proven not to work. So um I think, you know, once again, getting a grasp of the civics because these people we vote in. You vote for the mayor, and the mayor selects the police chief. So we can't really necessarily vote the police chief in and out, but what we can do is put the pressure upon the mayor whom we voted in. Like, wait a minute, do you like that job? Okay, the money's good. Okay, okay, okay. Well, you're about to lose it. Because you're not doing what we need you to do, player.

SPEAKER_01 36:40

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 36:41

Yeah, you're playing for the other team. And if you're gonna play for the other team, let the other team vote for you and finance what you're doing. But right now, you're supposed to be playing for us, and we you ain't hitting no home runs. Yeah, you know, so I'm glad.

SPEAKER_02 36:54

I'm glad you said that civics, civics, civics is so important. Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_00 36:57

That's I mean, because there's stuff, yeah, we can go and demonstrate about and holler and scream and advocate about, but um, when you start telling these people who have these positions that you voted in there, okay, we're about to vote you out. And then the other incumbent who's about to come in after them sees what you did, they're like, well, wait a minute, I don't want that to happen to me. Okay, now let me give you an example. So down in um, I guess it's Texas, right? And this is where Carmelo Anthony got that messed up sentence. Yes? Yeah, right? Okay, so the judge, that judge is going out. He's about to retire. And that's probably why they gave him the case.

unknown 37:40

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 37:40

Because they knew he could, he didn't have to extend his career. So he could do some fuck shit and get away with it and just walk off into the sunset, right? Okay, but on the other side of things, we see a whole new legal team on board for Carmelo Anthony, right? So the way they're about to implicate everybody who was involved in that kangaroo court mistrial is gonna be an example to whoever comes in after them. If you do this, this is what can happen to you. So that's another part of how we show and prove we as um organizations, we partner with other organizations who work in that field of activism in different locales to effect change. You see what I'm saying? And sometimes, like I said, if you got enough of the percentage of black people in your county, you can vote these people out. A bad prosecutor. Say, in the case of in South Carolina with Mr. Chow, who killed the kid, right? Which ran the kid down in the store, right? Yeah, you but the obviously the prosecutor, at least this guy was shooting at people in the parking lot. Locked the door one day and was beating up little black girls in the store. Okay, but obviously this went to the police. The police took it to the prosecutor and they decided what? Yeah right, okay, so voters, we need to vote dude out because he's not doing, he's not using his prosecutory powers correctly. You supposed to have been had him out of there. Now he's chasing somebody down to kill somebody, but y'all been watching the escalation of this for a minute. Went into the parking lot and was shooting at people.

SPEAKER_02 39:19

Exactly. So basically, not upholding the law and knowing civics. So you know our people sometimes we we are we get caught up in politics emotionally, not doing the rational side of things, being logistic logical about it. Like, this person's black, I'm gonna vote for them. Yeah, instead of just really studying the law, not saying everyone would have time, but as you said earlier, the group has civic courses where they'll teach you the essentials to know what you're looking for. Yes, sir. And that's dope. You know, peace peace to y'all for real for doing that, because we do need it out here. A lot of us are not civically um educated.

SPEAKER_00 39:58

You ain't lying. And then you wonder why things are the way they are. Civics impacts us even more than national politics because civics is your local ecosystem, you know, of people and resources. So you have to know that, or the very thing you need could be right up the street from you, but you don't know where to call. Mm-hmm. Ghostbuster.

Community Harm And Partnership Programs

SPEAKER_02 40:24

So, and how do but how does a movement deal with um issues within the community, like the crime amongst the brothers and sisters in the community, the gang violence, the drug infestation? Is it the old tactic of going into the drug houses and dumping them in the street?

SPEAKER_00 40:40

Um, that's that's kind of a difficult one. That's kind of a difficult one and it's kind of an ongoing thing. Um, you know, but some of the programs that we um, you know, we try to find other groups that can help people find services, right? Because we don't necessarily have a whole bunch of money to provide services for people to get them up out of those positions and conditions. So we try to partner with other groups who have services as far as housing, as far as mental health, as far as drug abuse, and then funnel people to those services and encourage them to stick it through. Do your due diligence, you know, with whatever the services, be it, you know, drug abuse program, a housing program, whatever it be, mental health program, and just encourage people to, you know, stick with it. Because um, you know, we're not we're not united way, man. You know, that we're you know, we're going off the people's money and the people's donations, but that's good because the people get to determine what it is and what it is not, you know. Beautiful, beautiful. That's you know, that's pretty much, but once once people join the organization, you see many streams to take you to many places that have resources and whatnot. But we don't like to announce that from the rooftops. We like to, you know, allow people to join the organization. Once again, you go to the new black panther party uh dot black, and um, you know, you can look at the website, and the newspaper will be going up probably in a couple days, which will be on the website, you know, and you can go play by play, blow by blow. You know, day by day.

SPEAKER_02 42:14

I want to take a look at that, man, because I always admire what the Panthers have done. We know with the breakfast, the um they had the um the breakfast programs back in the day. Yes, sir. Yeah, it's very, very powerful. The sickle cell, they were helping clean up the community, and what's so real about it is that as American citizens, as a country saying that, like you said, the document would say that you know we all equal this and that. You see a group of people doing something positive in the community, yet you wouldn't you would not fund them. They were being funded by celebrities and other, you know, other people see release funding them. Why is it I I already know the answer for this, but just for just for the sake of conversation. Right, right. The government and people may not agree with me, would not fund they demise. And when I say fund they demise, it's like you're removing all the sick patients out of the healthcare system. So if I'm helping everyone in the community, they're doing well, they're being educated civically, the Panthers are there instructing them, they may have vocational training and you know what training of weapons and how to protect their own community and how to be smart politically and legal-wise, then it's a problem for the system. They would not they don't want that, they want to keep that destitution perpetuating. Because the ghetto, because imagine if everybody in the hood now are on the G code, they are on Panther timing. Where's the crime?

SPEAKER_00 43:44

You might be on to something there, my brother. You because you might be on to something there, sir. See. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 43:52

Where's the crime? 'Cause now it's gonna be a problem. Like, oh wow, they they these people they they they they woke up, they no longer eighty fivers now.

SPEAKER_00 44:00

We can't just tell them anything and treat them any kind of way, right?

SPEAKER_02 44:04

They're not going for it no more. So I I want to see the new Black Panther Party get involved with groups like Nation of Gods and Earth and the Moors. Yes, we may have different theologies whatsoever, understanding, but it's a common goal, is to uplift the people. Indeed. Have you guys tried reaching out to the um, I mean that you're a guy, but reach out to other groups to see if they want to get on board with you guys?

SPEAKER_00 44:28

Well, I mean, this is what I like about the New Black Panther Party. Okay, one thing we know about the Nation of Gaza Navarre that it's not a political entity. Neither is the Nation of Islam. Okay. Neither is like a lot of the comedic joints or a lot of the so-called conscious groups. They're not really political, okay? It says right here, you know, as uh to be spiritually, culturally, and politically conscious. That's one of the five duties of the Panthers. So I say that to say that people who are in the nation of Gaza and Earth, people who are in the nation of Islam, people who are Moorish and whatnot, who are in other social, religious, cultural organizations can join the party and act out a group of politics that are black politics. You know what I mean? And that's the beauty of the party. You can even be a Mason, you could be from Africa, you could be from the Caribbean, you could be from anywhere on the continent, as long as you're black and you can find a set of black politics that, you know, uh reinforces black culture and is reinforced by black culture and it's owned by black people, and you don't get lost on a Democratic or Republican plantation. That's what I like about the party so much. Because everybody always says we need a political party. I say we already got one. You do. But people tried to turn it into a gun club and a social club.

SPEAKER_02 45:48

Yeah, that's that's that's that's what happened. They get caught up in the aesthetics of it, and I just think I just want a gun. But no, these brothers back then were really reading. Like um, yeah, like the uh, who was it, Huey P was very intelligent. Bobby Seal and intelligent, um, even down to like Tupac's mother, Sada. I mean, meanie defending herself in court without a lawyer.

SPEAKER_00 46:11

And one. She was thorough, right? Yeah. I mean, they were, you know, I remember when I was a kid, and as growing up, these guys were just very extraordinary people. Period. They were my dad was a very extraordinary person. Aaron, Elmer, later on when I met Kwame, these people were just extraordinary. The stuff that they were saying, the way they were saying it, the way they did it, was very profound. Period. And they weren't one-dimensional, they were multidimensional, and they could pretty much have a conversation with anybody and have the conversation come out pretty good. That's what impressed me about the Panthers. And it wasn't like this is just a Christian group or a Muslim group or this is just a Hebrew group. It was like this is an everybody group. People from all different parts of the black, you know, walk of life walked into the Panther Party, man, and brought all of that with them and enriched the party because they brought all of their, you know, enrichments from the different aspects of black culture.

SPEAKER_01 47:10

See?

SPEAKER_02 47:13

Oh man, it's so beautiful to hear this. I know. Are you

Building Black Politics Without Plantations

SPEAKER_02 47:17

guys still championing the 10-step program?

SPEAKER_00 47:19

It's still part of it, or you just yeah, indeed, that's still in there, but you know, we just took it and made that into the nine local objectives, and then kind of walked it to where it's not just like you're saying this is what we want. Now we're saying, no, these are the things we have programs centered around. And as a cat have nine lives, we have, you know, the Panther has nine local objectives. So these are nine layers of existence and activity that we feed into, even if we don't do it directly. We're helping groups that are doing this type of activity and directing people who, you know, are interested in that towards them.

SPEAKER_02 47:56

Have any local politicians or assembly men reached out, try to sit down with the Panthers, the new Black Panther Party? Took time to want to get to know them, or they just avoid them all in total.

SPEAKER_00 48:07

Um, in different places. I know um we have a sister who um works with some of them down south, you know. So what you micallet, uh Chokwe Lamumba, who later became the mayor of Mississippi, he was one of the advisors, you know, the elders who helped it born this into existence, a reality we call it the new Black Panther Party. So um, you know, his son is mayor down in Jackson, Mississippi. So anyway, we can champion that brother and you know, work with that brother, he's going through some things down there in Mississippi. Um, his son, because, you know, these are like the first Pan-Africanist mayors in history that I know of, right? He and his son. So they they they've taken them through some things, you know. So sometimes, but I mean, up here in Seattle, we have a guy named Larry Gossett, and he actually went down to um with Aaron. Aaron, let's see who else was with him, somebody else, and Larry Gossett drove down to Oakland to get the charter at Little Bobby Hunter's funeral. So he later on, they told him, hey, we don't need you to jump all the way in the Panther, you know, joint. We just need you to be a politician. So he became a politician. This was one of the longest standing King County council members and council members in Seattle of all times, just recently retired. So, you know, there's a lot of people who are um, even Mary and Barry. He was uh, you know, kind of with Snick and stuff, but he was very pantherisque, you know, very, very pantherisque. Just to name a few. You know, a whole bunch of people came from out of that um, I would say that that particular contingent of time, and then became politicians. Um, you know, if we're to keep going, um uh Bobby Rush from Chicago. Yeah, he became a um, he's a um senator or something right now. So there's there's a lot of people that that spawned, that black power movement spawned that went into the political arena, you know? Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_02 50:10

That's important. That's important, that's important. Have any um I'm just gonna ask a question off the top. Have you guys ever um any celebrities reached out to you guys?

SPEAKER_00 50:22

Um, see, No Limit Records back in the day gave uh the party a nice little chunk of dough. Um Lil Bootsy, we used to do security for him back in the day. Um, I think the party did security for Erica Badu back in the day. He's some, you know, down in Texas and whatnot, because it was real deep in Texas. And just, you know, a lot of rappers and stuff have reached out to the party because number one thing people know, I would say the party for, whether it be the old Black Panther Party or New Black Panther Party, is knowing the law, number one, and like a security event management force. People know that we're good for that, you know. Agree to put us in the category of what we do, go to court with you, help you to get a better deal, whatever the deal is gonna be, and then to if you're having a party or event, we can help you to facilitate it and do event management, you know?

SPEAKER_02 51:15

Now, you guys know no joke. I I that's what Brother Ron and I met at um a Panther rally for Sada Shiko hands off Asada. This is 2012, 2011-2012 in Harlem. And there was an elder sister there that I remember seeing growing up as a child. Her husband passed in the hospital. She said there's a lot of complications, and she believes that the you know they were involved in in his demise. And the way these brothers, I'm talking to her, the way these brothers surrounded her, she's like, I know this child. It's okay, let him through. These brothers were intense, man. I get in, I had to get a hug in between. I'm like, they were serious, bro. Like, no fear with them, man. And like you said, they know the law very well. Like X Mat of um speak from the police, they said, and uh, I believe Malik Shab Malik Malik Shabazz was there.

SPEAKER_00 52:10

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_02 52:13

And um, who's that brother again? King Samir.

SPEAKER_00 52:16

Yeah, King Samir. Okay, yeah, that was back in the day. Yeah, man. Yeah, how's King Samir? Have you heard from King Samir? I have not, man. Um, he he's not really in the party yet. Neither is uh Malik. Malik's not in the party either. He he left and went to do some other stuff, you know. Um yeah. Um, you know, we had a it's basically all new membership. Basically all new membership. About 97, 95% of the people we're in now are all new. And that's why it's called the new Black Panther Party, you know, because we're teaching a new group, uh, I would say a lot of old principles and principles that have been um revolutionized as well, right up to date.

SPEAKER_02 52:59

Yeah, renewed. What's the difference between a new Black Panther Party and other organizations such as NFAC?

SPEAKER_00 53:09

Um Well, this in the MVPP, I can say now there's a heavy uh focus on ideological development. Okay, we have some, we say S1W, security of the first world. Why do we say security of the first world? Because the first world is the world of ideas. Okay, so if if people if we can't stand in ideological unity, there's gonna be no uh unity of action. Right? We have to have unity of thought, and we have to make sure that the integrity of the ideas is kept intact. And if people are saying either we're A or we're B. No, you have to determine whether it's A or B, because when it's both A and B, that's called confusion.

SPEAKER_02 53:58

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 53:58

So that's one thing we have to really if somebody is ideologically compromised, their body is no good to me. Because your mind is compromised, your mind has been poisoned. We're gonna be saying go left and you're gonna go right.

SPEAKER_02 54:11

Talk about it, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 54:13

I can't work with you, man. So that was one of the first primary things that we wanted to lay out, man, is to give people okay, what ingredients belong in this? What ingredients do not? And how do we keep the things that do not belong in here out and the things that do belong here in, and then multiply what does belong in here, the ingredients that are in here. And that's what we're in the process of doing right now, family. Because um, you know, once again, without that mind power and that that black power that's internal, which comes through study and practice, consistent study and practice. You can't do much for us, you know?

SPEAKER_02 54:54

Yeah, yeah, you gotta put that work in, you gotta put the pain in, as they say.

SPEAKER_00 54:58

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_02 54:59

Challenge yourself, break those barriers in your mind, liberate the mind first and foremost, inside and out. Your family, everything must it's like you you you basically you're no longer thinking for yourself, you gotta think about your comrades.

SPEAKER_00 55:14

And a family collective perspective, you know. We say how to walk your panther. Learning how to walk your panther, not my panther, your panther, because it's a panther inside of you. If you just let it go wild, it'll tear a whole bunch of shit up. But if you learn how to walk your panther correctly, then you'll know how to use it, how to defend these political sets of politics, how to defend this ideology, how to defend this culture, you know, without coming unglued. Okay, and then you turn your enemy into your ally. That's a better idea. Okay. Yeah. Yes, sir. Or just with a better idea.

SPEAKER_02 55:57

Better idea, but then you be you'd be you'd be so close up to him, he's gonna know where to move. You already got him. You already dishonor with a smile. He's already disarmed.

SPEAKER_00 56:07

I think this guy they got a better idea. We need to fuck with them, and then they fucking with you. And that's what we want to do, man. Shake hands and make friends. Politics is world without bloodshed, you know. And I think um, if we're to look at the American public in general, the people who taught the most of politics to the American public is clearly, without a doubt, the Panther Party. Black Power family, right? Who demonstrated the First Amendment, demonstrated the Second Amendment, demonstrated the Fifth Amendment, demonstrated the Fourth Amendment, made them walk and talk. These amendments that they wrote down, okay. Yeah, y'all gonna have to show and approve that if you said that, the 13th Amendment, the 14th Amendment. Yeah. A lot of people didn't even know they existed until we busted them out. They started reading over them.

SPEAKER_02 56:54

It's true, man. Yeah, I seen like the impact of Fred Hampton when people from different walks of life were getting involved and actors were getting involved and was pouring money into him to do stuff in the community. Like we said earlier, the Brefix program, the Sicker Cell program, yo, that's that that's impactful right there. It's different. It's different, man. And throughout the United States and now you know, international had people on their toes, like, yo, who are these Panthers? Like, you know, they say what they want about them, they commys, they influence. They thought that to see a brilliant group of black people use their brain, they thought that it was outside influence. They couldn't believe it. Like, yo, who's doing this? It was brothers and sisters that were educated that outsmarted you, went to colleges, recruited young men and women, instructed them not not to um be outlaws, but to work within the law. Indeed.

SPEAKER_00 57:54

Oh my god, they know the law too. That part right there, brother. And I like that you emphasize that because there's nothing you will find in the five duties and the nine local objectives, okay, and the twelve general orders that asks you to do anything illegal. In fact, it will make a more law-abiding citizen, a more orderly society to go by these five duties, these nine local objectives, these twelve uh general orders. Word.

SPEAKER_02 58:26

Exactly.

How To Learn More And Join

SPEAKER_02 58:28

My brother, man, we you you have to come back to further explain this.

SPEAKER_00 58:32

Oh, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 58:35

This is beautiful. I'm gonna look it up again. The website is newblackpanther party.black, right? Yes, sir. Yes, sir. So I can just type in nbpp.black or just go.

SPEAKER_00 58:44

Nah, you gotta type out the whole word in the new Black Panther Party, and then you know you can find the membership part, the join us part, and you know, just look at some of the newspaper and see some of the articles and some of the programs that's going on. And there's so much stuff, that's a better way to do it, to send you to where all the stuff is at, whether they try to but I'm gonna be coming on here every first and last Thursday. So we're gonna call it Pan Thursday, and we're gonna show and show and prove the Panther of a Thousand Faces, you know.

SPEAKER_02 59:15

Definitely, man, because I'm gonna look see what's the local chapter out here in New York. I know, you know, I'm doing my thing, but uh I wouldn't mind go sitting down and listening because I love to hear stuff like this to get different insights and maybe some keys I missed out on. Somebody could pull me in the coat and like, oh, check this out, go look into that, you know, because this is where we're supposed to do. We we're supposed to meet up and this is the round table taking effect right here. Like, you know, everybody's coming to the table drop, dropping their little jewels. Yeah, yo, try this, man. See if that works. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 59:43

So that's how you get the best part, yes, sir. You know what I'm saying? Well, we we definitely invite you to come on the Zoom on Tuesday if you're available, then you know, sit in with us. And um, we have a just a political education classes. You know, everybody enjoys it.

SPEAKER_02 59:57

Definitely, definitely send that information, man. Hopefully, you know, if I'm in the show, I'll probably catch it after. But I will have it running simultaneously next to each other, brother Mag, man. It's an honor to have you, bro.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:11

Man, it's always a supreme honor, family, to be on here building with the builders and on NYP talk show, man. And did the show then come to this point and it's still going strong.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:22

No, we have to, man, because we're gonna say mission as you, man. It's just that we want to change the narrative for our people. We know what's being displayed on television is not the best of the people. And I mean that not only here, globally. You know, they always try and say uh Africa is destituted, but they hide the beauty of it. You know, that's right. That they always say that it's war-tone poverty over there. They look at the Caribbean as war-tone, they don't show the good side, like the the the excellence that's there with the brilliant young minds that's trying to find a way here, even here in America. So it's time to that's what NYP's about, is to show a different side of the people, man. Yeah, the best part. Yeah, and that's what we have you here, man, because you is very important. Shout out to Brother Vic, too, man. Oh, Vic, I said what up, man. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:11

Well, we're gonna have him back on here, too. We're gonna go through the build, and I'm gonna get uh the chairman of the party to come on here and so y'all can meet him. Really good, brother, strong, strong brother, ex-marine brother.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:23

You know, we we need that, man. Yeah, on some school behind the door stuff, but anyway. With that being said, NYP family, the brother came down, he represented, he demonstrated for us. Give him love. Don't forget to comment, like, share, and subscribe. Check out the website, the new blackpantherparty.black, you know, and show some love, man. With that being said, we out. Peace.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:46

Black cloud family. Black cloud.