Growing Together
Step into a virtual garden of spiritual growth and community connection with the "Growing Together" podcast. This podcast is a nurturing space for individuals seeking to deepen their faith, cultivate relationships, and explore the boundless beauty of a shared spiritual journey.
Each episode of "Growing Together" is a breath of fresh air, where Pastor Michael, Syd, Nic, Pastor Holly, and Pastor Roger try to navigate the twists and turns of life while staying rooted in faith. Their warm and inviting presence makes you feel like you're sitting in a cozy living room, engaged in a heartfelt conversation with old friends.
Diving into topics ranging from personal growth and self-care to building resilient relationships and fostering a sense of community, the podcast aims to equip listeners with the tools to nurture their faith in all aspects of life. Through scripture readings, open discussions, and interviews with experts in various fields, "Growing Together" provides a holistic approach to spiritual development.
Whether you're a lifelong believer, a seeker on the spiritual path, or simply someone curious about how faith can shape lives, "Growing Together" offers a welcoming haven for everyone. Tune in during your morning routine, while taking a leisurely stroll, or even during a quiet moment of reflection – the podcast fits seamlessly into your daily life.
Join the "Growing Together" community and embark on a journey of discovery, growth, and genuine connection. In a world that can sometimes feel disconnected, this podcast reminds us that nurturing our faith and cultivating meaningful relationships can lead to a life that's deeply fulfilling and spiritually abundant. Subscribe now to start your journey of growing together in faith and fellowship.
Growing Together
Taming Anger's Grip
Have you ever wondered why we get so angry? What's really happening beneath that heated emotion? In this raw and revealing conversation, we unpack the spiritual dimensions of anger and discover it's rarely just about being mad – it's almost always a response to deeper feelings of hurt, disappointment, or fear.
Drawing from the wisdom of Proverbs, we explore powerful metaphors like "a person without self-control is like a city with broken-down walls" (Proverbs 25:28) that illustrate our vulnerability when anger takes control. While society often glorifies explosive reactions, scripture consistently warns against letting anger dictate our responses. As one host confesses, "I need to step back and think about it, because when I'm angry, I say things I really don't mean."
Perhaps most fascinating is our examination of Jesus' righteous anger. From flipping tables in the temple to becoming "indignant" when disciples prevented children from approaching him, Jesus demonstrated there are appropriate times for anger – but his expressions were purposeful, controlled, and motivated by love rather than selfish interests. This challenges us to distinguish between destructive emotional reactions and righteous indignation that drives positive change.
The conversation takes a deeply personal turn when we discuss generational patterns of anger. "At some point, you will have to deal with your father's demons," one host observes, highlighting how anger tendencies pass through family lines until someone consciously breaks the cycle. This awareness invites us to examine our emotional inheritance and make intentional choices about what we pass forward.
Whether you're struggling with anger issues, trying to understand someone who is, or simply want to develop greater emotional intelligence from a biblical perspective, this episode offers practical wisdom and spiritual insight. Remember, as James 1:19 instructs: "Everyone should be quick to listen, slow to speak and slow to become angry." In those three simple directives lies a lifetime of relational wisdom.
It was all set up like a war.
Speaker 2:Yeah, battle zone yeah, they had. I played laser tag there that day, but not a lot, and we only used one floor, we didn't use all three, so like they had it separated. They also still have the swimming pool in that building because it's the old YMCA. Oh, I didn't know there was that. Yeah, there's a swimming pool in there.
Speaker 1:I thought it was on the third floor. I thought it was on the third floor.
Speaker 2:No, swimming pool's not on the third floor, it's on the well. It's technically the second floor because you go up steps to get in, like you go up a flight of stairs. So there's a basement, but it's on the second floor. They were going to turn it into a skate park originally, so the people who owned it when it was Rack Center had all sorts of big ideas for it, but they weren't open often enough for really to utilize it and then it wasn't like I could just go by myself. You had to either take enough people to play or you. It was kind of hard to guarantee that there'd be enough people to do anything. So but we had a lot of fun.
Speaker 2:When we went, there was one girl who worked at the company with me. She brought her boyfriend who, whose name I know but I won't use. He is well known in the community. He's kind of a jerk and not the super nice guy man. It was just he and I at the end and I pelted him with a dodgeball and he was so mad I thought for sure he was going to shank me in the parking lot.
Speaker 1:He was ticked, nick.
Speaker 2:I was just telling Roger and Beth the dragon will arrive on the 26th, so I just texted my seamstress. Today the 23rd, 23rd, so I've only got three days. Text my seamstress to see if she would be able to squeeze me in because I want to wear it to the competition.
Speaker 3:Oh, absolutely.
Speaker 2:But that's not going to be my opener, by the way. I haven't decided what I'm going to open with yet, but I'm going to save the dragon for for second round.
Speaker 3:If I make it to the second round, we'll see why I was going to comment today you posted for the event into existence you know you posted that and I was going to put go get them tiger. I was like that's kind of stupid. I'm sure it would have gotten some laughs.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it would have, my wife would. Nobody else would have got.
Speaker 2:Yeah, not many people, not many people. Um, looked through the contestants again, we're down to 19. One kid dropped out. Nobody else would have got it. Yeah, not many people, not many people. Looked through the contestants again we're down to 19. One kid dropped out, so he wasn't. Do you remember I was telling you that there are some people who are going that aren't really shouldn't be there?
Speaker 4:Qualified yes exactly.
Speaker 2:He was one of them, so I'm kind of happy that he's not going to be there. But at the same time now you're down to 19 contestants, so it's just one of those so there's one woman one woman, penny is her name yes I saw that yeah have you ever seen like an elvis impersonator as well a woman I I.
Speaker 2:So I've actually sold jumpsuits to a lady in the uk who is an elvis impersonator, so my build is almost perfect for her. She just has to let out the top a little bit, but then, like, otherwise fits her really, really well.
Speaker 1:That's cool yeah.
Speaker 2:And then there's also an African-American Elvis in this competition, which I find very interesting.
Speaker 4:Oh, yeah, and.
Speaker 2:I say that because I watched a documentary many years ago, before I was ever really like super into it, and there was one guy who was in the ultimate elvis competition.
Speaker 2:he would make it to the ultimate competition at graceland every year for like five or six years but he couldn't win and he said I know that it's because when they see me they can't see elvis and he said that would be tough to overcome he said, if it was like it was, if it was a blind competition where the judges didn't see the people, and he was good, he was really good, he'd be like a white Chuck Berry Right how do you do it? Yeah, it doesn't matter how good you are, there's just something about it. It's weird.
Speaker 3:So there's a Bill Elvis and a Billvis.
Speaker 2:Yeah, is that right? Yeah, so you should really try to find some of them on social and watch their videos, because you'll be like, okay, that shouldn't be happening. The one guy in the gold LeMay jacket, I think that's Bill Elvis. Yeah.
Speaker 3:I can't remember which is which.
Speaker 2:Super nice guy, very nice guy. There's another guy from Ohio that's going to be there. That's the Tony guy that's in the list.
Speaker 4:Yeah, you guys going to carpool, no.
Speaker 3:Awesome. They all have to stop at a gas station.
Speaker 2:So here's the yeah, Get out so they have an opening night like just karaoke. It's at a bar close to the hotel that everybody's staying at and, like you had to sign up in advance, I did not sign up up and they keep emailing me asking me if I'm gonna sign up and I'm not. I'm gonna go and watch, but I'm not signing up. I'm not gonna let them know what songs I'm good at and let them steal them from me, right? I was like because if I hear a dude and he does american trilogy really well, guess what song I'm picking if I pick before him american trilogy, because I want him out.
Speaker 2:Yeah Right, I don't get why people would go in there and show up, but anyhow I think that's smart. I've just got. That's my strategy. I want to win, so we'll see.
Speaker 3:I saw there's one Young Elvis there are which one? Well, I think it was. I mean he looks like the 50s Elvis one.
Speaker 2:Well, I think it was. I mean he looks like the 50s elvis. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, lane um lane crew. He actually just won a competition, I don't remember where.
Speaker 3:Not super impressed with his vocals, it means again seems like a really nice guy, like just, I don't know, I don't know, we'll see, but I just wonder, like you know, because it seems like most of you are, you know, 70s late 60s, 70s elvis, then he's young elvis. How much harder will that be for him I actually think it's an advantage for him that's what I was because there aren't many young elvis's that are performing at all.
Speaker 2:So I think being younger or being a younger elvis, it's going to bring a unique style. Yeah, we're going to be doing vegas music and if the judges don't like Vegas style Elvis, they're going to gravitate towards that guy. I mean, if he's any good at Young Elvis, you know what I mean I'm just excited to do it. It's something I've never done before. I told Alyssa. I said top three, I would be thrilled.
Speaker 4:Top three.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean. I want to win, don't get me wrong, but if I can place top three, my fear is, if I don't like, if I don't make it to round two, I'm never going to want to do a competition again, and I had this terrible fear that I won't. I just will give up on Elvis altogether, like I'll just stop doing it because, okay, well, I must not be that good at it. Therefore, why?
Speaker 1:do it.
Speaker 2:That's just their opinion. Yeah, and it's different when you're in a competition than when you're doing what I'm doing, so just trying to process it.
Speaker 4:Is it the first weekend of May or the second?
Speaker 2:No, it is the third, it's the week right before Railroad Days. I'm literally going to go there, come home and then start Railroad Festival. It's going to be a long two weeks. Actually I have an Elvis show, believe this or not. I have an Elvis show the Thursday. Before I leave in Zanesville. I'll leave on Friday morning, drive over there show so they have karaoke contest or the karaoke thing on Friday night. Saturday is the competition. I'll drive home Sunday morning. Monday we start Railroad Festival, set up On the Thursday of Railroad Festival. I have a show in Carrollton and then I come back and I do Railroad Days that same night.
Speaker 4:So you're going to be gone Thursday.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I will, but I'll be gone, you guys will be set up.
Speaker 3:It'll be good to go. Yeah, it'll be fine.
Speaker 2:Because I'll be back before the Midway opens. Way too many.
Speaker 4:Too many chiefs, not enough Indians. Yeah, that is a fact my friend.
Speaker 2:I will be back before the Midway opens, so it won't be terrible opens, so it won't be terrible Okay.
Speaker 4:I'm going to hold you to that.
Speaker 2:Beth will be there.
Speaker 1:I know. Oh goodness, I'm plugging extension cords as I go.
Speaker 2:There I don't have to use extension cords. There's lots of outlets there.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we've got plugs.
Speaker 3:I will use the occasional power strip just if I need lots of power in one place, but it's fine it's outside, so it can't burn anything down, yeah so quick question about these jumpsuits I just thought of this so did elvis always have like an input like here's what I want, like, what like with the tagger, which is like I want a tagger or I want a dragon, did he ever like put I would guess it more presented to him I would?
Speaker 2:guess that he probably said, like the phoenix jumpsuit, he had that in four different colors. He had black with white on it, black with red on it. My guess is is there was one presented and he's like oh I love that, but I want it in a variety. Um, I would guess the tiger was during his karate years, so that was part of the kenpo karate studio that he was part of. So I'm guessing he was like I want a tiger on there. Then bill baloo, who did all of that, probably came back with a design and said here's, and then he was able to make tweaks.
Speaker 2:I saw a really cool piece of elvis memorabilia that I would have loved to have had, but it was fifty thousand dollars and well you know I don't have money floating around like, but it was $50,000. And well you know I don't have money floating around like that. But it was a belt that had the Aloha Eagles on the front of it. The leather was basically just folded over and it had a couple of the Eagles punched into it and on the back was a handwritten note from Bill Ballou that said hey, elvis, these are the Eagles that we'll use on the belt for, um, the American Eagle jumpsuit and Elvis put okay, elvis, and sent it back to him. So that was how they communicated. How cool of a piece of memorabilia would that be? To have 50 grand was a bit steep though, yeah. Yeah, because you had an Elvis signature, a Bill Ballou signature and a piece that Elvis would have touched and held. So it was pretty cool.
Speaker 1:Never wore it though?
Speaker 2:No, because it wasn't an actual belt, it wasn't a wearable belt, it was just like it was the white leather with the eagles on it, so he would have a feel for what it was going to look like Like a replica. Yeah, For what it would look like.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you'd have to get insurance on something.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh yes.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah my car.
Speaker 2:It costs more than Beth's house. Yep, oh goodness.
Speaker 1:It's a little less than Jarvis' truck.
Speaker 2:So we pivoted on tonight's topic. It was originally going to be death of the disciples.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean I've hit like the summary of all of them, but I haven't had the chance to really dig deep, which I want to do Because I kind of want to get some of the backstories on these apostles, like you know, what were they doing at the time? I want to get a little bit more out of it, but yeah, I mean just the summary, it's wow.
Speaker 2:So we pivoted and we had gossip and anger on our list. We chose anger, but Beth needed to make sure she got home to get her notes. She went home and couldn't find her notes, so we still don't have notes. We're going to wing it. She wrote some stuff down.
Speaker 1:All right.
Speaker 3:Well, beth, start her off. Yeah, this is your topic. Your topic, your baby. It's your baby, you rock it.
Speaker 2:She was in a mood when she did.
Speaker 4:Was she angry yeah?
Speaker 2:she was angry, she was angry, she really was Okay.
Speaker 1:I really was, and so I listened to this pastor, mike Winger, and he does like a podcast and I really liked him Great minds think alike and he made me laugh when he said about the definition of anger is with that? Just the only way he could describe it was that, grr, this makes you mad, grr. And I thought, yeah, that's right on it, but it's amazing how much is in Proverbs all about anger.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And how not to.
Speaker 2:So I did not go the same direction with this.
Speaker 1:No I did not.
Speaker 2:No, I did not All right At all. How did you go the same direction with this? No, no, no, I did not All right At all.
Speaker 1:Did you go with it?
Speaker 2:I actually went with righteous anger and the anger of Jesus. Oh so took a little, took a little twist on that.
Speaker 4:Kind of cool, though, because you weren't here when.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and.
Speaker 4:Beth, clearly, like we knew that she was going to take this, yeah, so this will be fun.
Speaker 2:This will be really good Because we talked about a couple of Sundays ago about the 400-year separation between Old Testament and New.
Speaker 4:Testament.
Speaker 2:So I think then you kind of—I mean Old Testament's full of wrath, so we can talk about that even, but then we can jump to New Testament stuff. So okay.
Speaker 1:Well, I mean even talking about when Jesus was angry. What was it? Where was he at in the I'll never get this right when he healed the man's hand and they were angry that he had sinned because they healed him, or they thought he sinned because they healed him on the sack. That just I mean that goes to show that. But he didn't react in anger.
Speaker 2:Yes, Well, there are several times that he does. There are several times in the New Testament where Jesus is clearly angry and he reacts as such, but his anger is different than our anger.
Speaker 3:Sometimes I wonder if his was like calculated To some degree Perfect.
Speaker 4:Yes, because, again, again, it's that, it's that righteous anger, it's that, um, like he, he's purposeful, he's angry because they are knowingly sinning or not believing what god has yeah has taught them or brought them to believe yeah, like his flesh isn't taking over, correct this a yes, this is not a flesh man becoming angry, this is a spiritual anger.
Speaker 2:But go ahead with some of yours, because the book of Proverbs does have. The book of Proverbs has a lot in it anyway, Like just good life lessons just good life lessons.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think I'm marked lessons, yeah, I think.
Speaker 1:I'm marked. Well, I can't remember. Did I not mark it? The one about where you're slow to speak and your anger?
Speaker 2:I can't remember where that's, at Proverbs Talking to your microphone.
Speaker 1:Oh, I don't like doing that. Proverbs 15.1. A gentle answer deflects anger, but harsh words make tempers flare.
Speaker 2:I would like to point out that Jesus came to fulfill the law, not abolish the law, and we should be listening to all of the Proverbs just to be clear.
Speaker 1:But how often can we? When we get angered, we can't really respond.
Speaker 2:Will you read it again?
Speaker 1:A gentle answer deflects anger, but harsh words make tempers flare.
Speaker 2:Can you tell a story?
Speaker 1:Yeah, tell it.
Speaker 2:So it's probably. It's just been a couple of weeks, so it hasn't been a long time ago. I was on the phone with somebody and while I was talking to them it was disclosed to me that something I'd had said to somebody else in confidence had been disclosed to other people. Basically it turned into a game of telephone. I said this to this person, this person told that person, that person ended up telling this person and then a quarrel between the two of them formed because of what I said but was taken out of context. Okay, so when I found out that it had happened, I called my wife and I said I need to address this. Is this an appropriate way? And she said absolutely.
Speaker 2:So I picked up the phone and I called the person who I said it to. I said I want to start this conversation by saying I am not angry at you, but I am confused and I want clarity before I have any emotion. I said I said this to you in confidence. This was then conveyed to somebody else. They said no, it wasn't. And I said well, I know for a fact that it was, because they knew word for word what I had said to you. But as we talked there was clarity around the fact that even when they shared it with the other person, it was a in context, it wasn't hurtful, but it hurt that person's heart because it was about somebody that they loved, somebody that they cared about. So then they come back to the next person and they're like why would he say that?
Speaker 4:Because they were hurt.
Speaker 2:They were hurt. So then they and when I say it caused a strife or a quarrel between the two of them, it wasn't like they were arguing or fighting or anything like that, but it was it tensions mounted, and so I have found that in all circumstances and I do it as quickly as possible, I don't let it fester, because I'll get mad real quick. You know, if somebody calls me and says um, you know, hey, I was just on the phone with Beth and she told me that you said X, oh, no, no, no, Like you know, I'll get mad because like, how dare they? But I've decided that it's best if I handle it in the moment. I call and I say I heard that this was said and I need to understand why it was said, and I find that that helps me or stops me from like that flare up of anger, where you're all of a sudden so angry that you can't even think straight.
Speaker 2:That's the only thing you can think of.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm the opposite. I have to sit back and think, because when I'm angry, I say things I really don't mean. So, and I know, if I have that opportunity, I'm going to say, and I'm going to say what I want to say. So I have to stop and step back. And I've learned this quite a bit in the last few months.
Speaker 2:It's funny, I used to be that way Much younger. I used to be hot-headed and I would say something that would hurt you. I didn't care. You know what I mean. If you said to me even if what you said to me wasn't necessarily hurtful, but I deemed it to be hurtful I was calling names and making fun of your haircut and making fun of your eye patch, like Roger, I mean, he's not wearing an eye patch, but he should be.
Speaker 3:You shouldn't have said anything. The audience could have had that.
Speaker 2:Roger walking around in an eye patch.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he's got a hook hand.
Speaker 3:now too, I had that.
Speaker 2:Roger walking around in an iPad. Yeah, he's got a hook hand now too.
Speaker 1:All right, the next one I have is Proverbs 15, 18. A hot-tempered person starts fights. A cold-tempered person stops them. So that goes back to when I want to respond quickly. I had to learn to step back and shut up, so I look at that statement too whenever you think about it.
Speaker 2:There are people in this world who are and there is a difference in this. There are people in this world who are hot-tempered, who will fight with anybody just for the sake of a fight, and then there are people who are peacekeepers. They want to keep the peace. And then there are peacem are peacekeepers, they want to keep the peace. And then there are peacemakers, the ones who want to step in and resolve whatever tension exists. And I think about that cool temper that is the peacemaker not always the peacekeeper, because sometimes the peacekeeper will just go into a shell I'm not going to fight, I'm not even going to defend myself, I'm not going to have a conversation because I don't want the tension. But the peacekeeper tends to be that level-headed person that can come in and say Beth, I know that you were really mad when you said that and I know you didn't mean it. You should really consider apologizing. That is a peacemaker, and they tend to be the cooler head that can walk into those conversations much more easily.
Speaker 1:The cooler head that can can walk into those conversations much, much more easily.
Speaker 4:I used to not get quite that bad, that quick, but sometimes sometimes it depends on the situation exactly and the person my emotions just get the best of me and then I start slurring my words and I'm like sounds stupid. I'm like, nah, I've found that stepping back and thinking about it and cooling off it doesn't always work.
Speaker 1:No, Sometimes it just festers it more yeah.
Speaker 3:What do you think has been the catalyst for you to go backwards in that circumstance?
Speaker 1:I'm going to blame it on change of life. That's funny, I don't I mean because my faith is stronger now than it has been, but I just Some of it is that, some of it is that.
Speaker 2:So the further you walk into your relationship with Christ, the more the enemy tries to grab a hold, and anger is a quick and easy way to do it. Oh yeah, you know what? Can you believe that they just said that to you? How offended are you? And that's I mean. Anger really runs back to the word offense. There's really.
Speaker 2:I get angry because I'm offended, I get angry because I'm hurt, and this was a point that I was going to make anyway, but it just popped into my head now. I don't think that anger is real in the sense that it's its own emotion. I think we anger is triggered by all of the other emotions that then we try to isolate it as its own. I'm never mad because I'm mad. I'm mad because you've hurt me, so I'm sad or disappointed or whatever other emotion I might feel. Or I'm mad because you've made me cry'm sad or disappointed, or whatever other emotion I might feel. Or I'm mad because you've made me cry. Don't ever do that, you know. So I feel like anger in and of itself comes from the other emotions that we feel.
Speaker 3:Yeah, well, I think it's the most accessible emotional weapon that we have then I can get loud with you. It can come out of the holster quicker.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Pew pew pew pew. So, yeah, it's really easy to use and I think too, it can be a comfort thing, Like you tend to, I think, once you become an angry person. I mean it's just like autopilot you use it for everything. Like anything that irritates you, anything that you don't agree with. All those, you know all the issues that you have you know in some ways.
Speaker 3:I mean, yeah, it makes you react, probably in ways that you'll regret it every time, but in the moment you know it's a comfort, it helps you, it helps people through that situation, for good or bad. Most of the time you'll go back and go. Yeah, I probably shouldn't have said that. Yeah, I probably shouldn't have reacted that way, but in the moment, sometimes maybe people feel that's all they have. It's control.
Speaker 2:It becomes control. The only way that I can control this situation is to be angry Instead of having self-control.
Speaker 3:that's the only way you way that I can control this situation is to be angry. Yeah, Instead of having self-control. Yes, yeah, that's the only way you feel like you can control the situation.
Speaker 2:The louder you get the righter you are, the righter you are.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's how it works, yeah.
Speaker 2:I think it's interesting too that you'd say it that way, because then we go back with a peacekeeper, they're going to shut down and I win.
Speaker 3:Right yeah.
Speaker 2:But I find myself not able to get loud with a peacemaker. Right, so the people who are really talented at being able to calm a situation. It's hard to get mad at them because they're logical. They're usually pretty even about their emotion in the situation. They can see it from both sides. They're able to say hey, listen, what you're experiencing doesn't feel good, but imagine what they're experiencing right now. I'm certain that that doesn't feel good either.
Speaker 1:Dawn is a perfect example.
Speaker 2:Yes, she's a very even-tempered person.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Listen, I have a guy at work who is like this guy doesn't get excited about anything. He doesn't get excited about anything, like he doesn't get worked up, he doesn't get angry. And if you say to him hey, what do you think about this? He's like yeah, that sounds like a good idea, we should work on that, we should really try that.
Speaker 1:And if there's two people who are in disagreement, he's like well, let's step back and think about this for just a second.
Speaker 2:I'm like I don't want to step him in the face, but he just has that it's, and he's a dad, which I think is like they don't yell. They are not yellers. His wife is so soft-spoken that I think if I ever heard her yell I would be shocked.
Speaker 1:They just they have a different demeanor about them I wish I'd had that years ago, oh me too.
Speaker 2:I still don't have it. I was practically sitting on Easton the other day to give him his pill Good gravy.
Speaker 1:I think anger, though, is a self-defense too, Because if I spew out to you, then I'm protecting myself from allowing you to see how bad you hurt me yeah certainly, that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:I think that it's the go-to, regardless of the emotion that we feel yeah.
Speaker 2:I think happiness is the only one that we typically don't see anger Like. I'm feeling good about myself today, so I don't need to be angry about anything. But if I'm sad or if I'm, even if I'm just simply annoyed or over stimulated as parents that's's so easy to experience I get touched out. Easton, if you give me one more hug today, please do not touch. He's sweaty and he stinks and I'm like dude go play, but he's like I love you and comes over and wants to. Oh, gosh.
Speaker 2:And so then I try so hard not to be mean, but it's hard because I'm overstimulated. At this point I don't want any more touch, leave me alone.
Speaker 1:Well, take all you can get, because in about another four years I know that's what I'm saying- so that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:So like trying to process that into like don't be hurtful about it, because they want Again. Those years aren't.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we used to see Maggie 24 seven. Now we're lucky to see her two hours a week.
Speaker 2:It's crazy. She just disappears into her bedroom and it's like hey, how you doing Okay. It comes for dinner. Every whip stitch.
Speaker 1:Sarah and I had a little bit of tiff over Easter and she's like I don't want grandma to be cool, I'm mom, I want to be cool.
Speaker 2:It doesn't work like that.
Speaker 1:I said well, this is the thing. Grandma's only going to be cool for a few more years. Yeah, and she's going to be busy with school functions. She's going to be busy with friends and grandma's not going to be fun anymore. And then grandma's going to be busy with friends and grandma's not and then, and then grandma's going to be old and smell like mothballs.
Speaker 2:So I said just let me enjoy my time I also think that, like my parents always allowed my grandparents to be the cool ones. They my, like my grandma, I, this was a, and I know that my parents knew this. I know that my grandma knew this. But we would go to grandma's house and we wanted to spend the night, mom and dad would say no, so we lived right down the street, so we would go to grandma's house and fall asleep on the couch and then she would call my parents hey, michael fell asleep on the couch, we just let him stay here tonight. And they would always say yes to grandma.
Speaker 2:Right, I wasn't asleep, we get up, we'd play phase 10 or whatever, but, or whatever, but grandma, like, she was always the cool grandma, um, my grandpa, let us go out in the wood shop and work within. That's how I, like, acquired my taste in music, which is incredibly eclectic because of all of the things I got to do with my grandparents, um, and my, but my parents were the disciplinary right like in my life. So, but I think that that's how it should be. Grandparents should always be. You should be able to sugar them up, shake them and send them home.
Speaker 4:Just wait for the top to blow off.
Speaker 2:But that doesn't mean that parents have to be angry.
Speaker 3:As a parent you've earned that I think.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I agree, it's like putting the mento in the Coke. Yes, yes, shake it up and hand it off.
Speaker 2:Top blows off of, it makes a mess in the house.
Speaker 1:They puked in a clothes basket full of clean clothes well I got lots of verses but not a whole lot of story to go with it. Keep going, keep going, all right my ears are ringing.
Speaker 3:You got more proverbs. I got a few proverbs you go on ahead.
Speaker 1:I got some too. You might hit on the same ones.
Speaker 3:Well, for me, I always think that self-control is such a big thing To practice. Self-control is probably one of the most important attributes of somebody who's trying to overcome their anger, because you really do have to practice self-control, not just with anger, but in all things yeah because I think it all kind of works together.
Speaker 3:And in proverbs um, let's see, this is 29, 11 he says a fool gives full vent to his anger, but a wise man keeps himself under control. And then I think, a little farther down, I had it, I think I lost it. Yes, proverbs 29, 22,. An angry man stirs up dissension and a hot temper. One commits many sins. So I think once you become an angry person, once you're kind of using that weapon all the time, then I think it can lead you into a lot of other shortcomings you know, because you're already practicing.
Speaker 3:You're practicing one bad habit, so most likely you know others are going to follow when you don't have good self-control. So and do you? And when I say self-control, does that mean like 0%, you never get upset, you never get angry. No, but it just like Michael says, in professional situations, you know, if you're going to be a leader, if you're going to be in management, then you better have self-control. Because guess what, if you lose self-control, then everybody underneath you is going to lose self-control. Yeah, because you're the nucleus, you're the one that controls everything, you're the one that sets the tone and you lose their respect too yeah.
Speaker 3:So if your workers always see that you're angry that you don't have situations under control, well then guess what I mean? They're probably going to do the same thing. Right they they're probably going to do the same thing. They're not? Going to know where to draw the line and that can make things very difficult for you in a professional standpoint. And I would say the same thing goes for family as being the father, the husband in the household if you don't have good self-control, which doesn't mean that you don't discipline.
Speaker 3:Discipline is not getting angry. There is a difference. But if you lose your self-control, if you're always upset, if you're always yelling at everybody else, then your household is probably going to be in disarray. It's hard to live with somebody who's always angry. That always has something to be shaken up about. So you have to think about those things.
Speaker 1:But I think that when you live in that kind of household, that's how, what you continue to create, that's what generational curses, that's what I was going to say, that becomes a generational curse.
Speaker 2:I always say when I talk about generational curses at some point you will have to deal with your father's demons, and what I mean by that is, it's not always your dad, it may be your grandfather, it may be your great grandfather, but at some point you are going to have to face that in order to stop it. And so I think anger is an easy one to pass on, because when it's kind of like poverty, you know, when you raise somebody in poverty, they tend to raise their children in poverty. When you get angry, your children get angry. When your children get angry, their children get angry. And you just pass this down forever until somebody finally says I'm not going to be angry anymore, I'm not going to be that way.
Speaker 3:Um. So sometimes it can work that if you're always angry, you know, then your child may go through life fearing making people upset. Yes, so they won't be assertiveive, they won't do things they should do because they're going to be afraid that you know they're going to make somebody upset.
Speaker 2:So I actually had to google this because I've been watching a show called homicide in las vegas, which is a docuseries, and it's all about the high profile crimes that have happened in los angeles and how they were tried and whether they won or not, and such Does anybody know the name Phil Spector, yeah, music producer.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 2:I mean he's produced. You lost that love and feeling with the Righteous Brothers, like big, big Be my Baby by the Ronettes.
Speaker 2:Yes, I was gonna say I mean he produced John Lennon and I mean the Beatles, you name it. He has. He has worked with all of the hot names shot a girl in the face in his house and it was not the first time he had brandished a gun at somebody. He would be, I don't. There was a guy, there was a famous singer, and I don't remember who it was, who had been in the studio all day, and he said to Phil, hey, I'm tired, I'll record that tomorrow. And he gets a gun out and he says no, you'll record the song tonight. And the guy turned around and walked back into the studio and recorded the song.
Speaker 3:Wow.
Speaker 2:Nobody at any point thought to say something to somebody that this guy had lost his mind until he kills somebody. So that is that self-control. When you start to form a bad habit, it only goes until it's absolutely out of control. And can you imagine and this I've lived, this in my life Can you imagine being so angry that you, you're willing to carry that everywhere that you go and have it explode in places that would not be logical to explode? Think about it like this let's say that you're really terrible with your kids and you're you're always yelling and you're always mean. And one of your kids goes to school and they tell their teacher that you're always mean to them and the teacher calls job and family services and you know job and family services comes to your house and you get angry because they show up and what do you start to do? You start to scream and yell and shout and they immediately go.
Speaker 2:Nope, this isn't good because you can't control it. You've lost complete control at some point. It's so weird to me that people are capable of getting to that point.
Speaker 1:You think somebody that's always angry is happy or unhappy?
Speaker 2:I mean if they're happy. It would be bizarre to me, but there are some people, I'm sure, who do enjoy it, who it's their way of life, that it doesn't really affect their outcome.
Speaker 1:They're just angry about everything. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So it doesn't matter whether you like.
Speaker 4:They love to complain about everything, yeah.
Speaker 2:You go to. You know, they go to Walmart and they just complain that they've only got self checkouts open. And then they go to the car and they complain because there's, their life is just that way and it doesn't it doesn't really affect them.
Speaker 3:Most of those people end up being very, very alone yeah I have one person that it's a friend on facebook, but we were only like friends through another friend. Somehow he's still my friend on facebook just because I unfriend those people and I probably should, I just haven't done it. But because it's almost like I want to say it's entertaining, but it's just. There's no one else like him, they'll probably post at least once a day, and it's always complaining.
Speaker 2:Anti-something. Something, yes, anti-something.
Speaker 3:And sometimes it's just so ridiculous. And you're just like man, do you ever have a moment where you're not looking to criticize something? Yeah, yeah, yeah, but yeah.
Speaker 4:Like living life through those lenses, like I can't imagine.
Speaker 3:And then you're looking for people to. Yeah, point the finger at oh yeah, add to yeah yeah. So you're like you're trying to breed discontent.
Speaker 2:Yep, yeah, that's a good way to put it You're looking to breed discontent.
Speaker 3:That falls right into my next Because.
Speaker 2:I'm angry. I need you to be angry with me, which turns into forming a posse, which turns into that'll be deep.
Speaker 3:Proverbs 30, 32. If you have played the fool and exalted yourself, or if you have planned evil, clap your hand over your mouth. Or if you have planned evil, clap your hand over your mouth, For as turning the milk produces butter and as twisting the nose produces blood, so stirring up anger produces strife. Twisting the nose produces blood.
Speaker 2:I like that I like that.
Speaker 1:I just see the three stooges. What verse was that that?
Speaker 3:was 30, 32.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 3:And 33.
Speaker 1:Yeah that's got a little chuckle out of that, why?
Speaker 2:well, I don't know, you have to ask her why she's why did why? Why did you laugh?
Speaker 1:well, I'm just when I read it about striking the nose causes blood. When jarvey had that wound on his leg that I had to pack every morning at 3.30 in the morning and I'd put the dressing on. Oh, that's too tight, take it off now it's too loose, you gotta put it on a little bit tighter, and that one morning I said I'm gonna punch you in the nose he's sitting on the edge of the bed and I'm down wrapping his leg.
Speaker 1:It's 3.30 in the morning and he's like you're jamming that. You know cotton tip down in there too far and I'm like just shut up. I'm not a very patient nurse.
Speaker 2:And she was enjoying it. Every minute, every minute. It's too far. Let me see if this hurts even more.
Speaker 1:I have Proverbs 25, 28. A person without self-control is like a city with broken down walls. So pretty much you you know in the bible times they all had their walls for protection you put that down, you're just creating your own problems. Build the wall yeah, let's not address politics talk about anger.
Speaker 4:Yeah, no now everybody's stirred up.
Speaker 2:There are people who just turned us off. I don't know you got any more Now everybody's stirred up.
Speaker 1:There are people who just turned us off. You got any more.
Speaker 3:Ephesians 4, 25.
Speaker 3:Therefore, each of you must put off falsehood and speak truthfully to his neighbor, for we are all members of one body. In your anger, do not sin. Do not let the sun go down while you are still angry and do not give the devil a foothold. He who has been stealing must steal no longer but must work doing something useful with his own hands that he may have something to share with those in need. So I think that just goes back to. You know, if you're spending all your time angry, you're not producing anything worthwhile. You know you're probably. You know you're not bringing people to you for sure. You know you're pushing a lot of people away.
Speaker 1:You're definitely not.
Speaker 3:And you're letting that emotion control your entire life. You know you can't grow. You can't grow when you're consistently angry at people or I feel like you I don't know like.
Speaker 4:I feel like you almost can't be in the right like walk with the lord. If you're always angry, you know what I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 1:I think too that, like I mean wait, and it hardens your heart. Yeah, that's the other thing. I mean, over time it's just going to, you know, make it harder. Person Really watch how we display our anger, you know, because there's always that person watching. Oh yeah, oh yeah.
Speaker 3:And if they're like you know, and if you're doing God's work and somebody sees your anger, then they'll go, hmm.
Speaker 1:Hypocrite. Exactly, and that's what defers so many people from Christianity. I think the last one I had wrote down was Romans 12, 17, and 18. Let me see if I got it marked here. What was up with you today? Never pay back evil with more evil. Do things in such a way that everyone can see you are honorable. Do all things that you can to live in peace with everyone. I think that one took me back to my mom, always telling me two wrongs don't make a right, two wrongs don't make it right.
Speaker 2:Well, if you go back and you and I don't know the scripture and I'm not trying to know the scripture it talks about. You know, we pay an eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth, but Jesus tells us later on to turn the other cheek. And so I think that it's important to understand that when somebody gets angry with us over something, that and let's be very clear that being angry is like drinking poison and hoping the other person dies because I'm angry at you, so I'm gonna drink poison and I hope that you die.
Speaker 2:you don't even know that I'm angry right I'm carrying it around and I'm just bitter over something you're probably not even aware that I'm holding on to, and so there's no reason to maintain the anger, which is why I'm a firm believer in always having the conversation. There's no point in holding on to that anger if you're not going to at least glean something from it. Like I can be upset about something, but I want to grow from it. I want to say, okay, why am I angry? What is causing me to be angry? Is it because I'm hurt? Is it because I'm sad? Is it because I'm whatever? I want to grow from it, not just be angry for the sake of being angry and hopes the other person figures out that I'm angry.
Speaker 1:How are they going to know, unless you tell them?
Speaker 2:Well, they'll know, because then I'll go tell three other people, who will then eventually tell them be it true or not. They'll find out that I'm angry like that's the, the typical? Yeah, I mean, that's the christian way, isn't it? Well, because we don't know how to be direct with one another. So we'll and again, we talk about holy gossip, we'll get into that one in another episode but you start telling people. Well, can you believe that beth did this to me? Yeah, can you believe that this?
Speaker 2:can you believe that Beth did this to me? Yeah, can you believe that this? Can you believe that that? Yeah, somebody needs to be praying for Beth. She needs to go to the altar on Sunday morning, and you say all of those things.
Speaker 4:Your side eye on her on Sunday. Yeah, right.
Speaker 2:And what happens is she don't show up on Sunday, yeah.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 2:She's on on the boat and doesn't show up on Sunday and I'm like she needs Jesus.
Speaker 1:No, Listen, I can get a lot of Jesus on that boat. Turn up that music and sit there.
Speaker 2:So, but like, if I say something to Roger, who says something to Linda, who says something to you know, penny, who says something to Vicky Hickey, who, and eventually, like it, just continues to grow and something that was really not super important becomes this situation that nobody even really needed to know about. But because I'm angry, because I'm hurt, because I'm whatever, I use that then to—.
Speaker 4:Leave Vicki Hickey out of it. I know.
Speaker 2:Listen, I'm told that she is on a sweater hunt. She is out buying all of the sweaters. That's awesome.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but I think that if we go back to what the book tells us is what God's word is. You know, when you're upset with your neighbor, you go to them and we don't it's. We don't like that confrontation.
Speaker 2:No, no, I do. I don't like the confrontation, like I don't want to argue with you for the sake of arguing with you, but I love to be able to call somebody and have a hard conversation and it be fruitful, because that's proof that it can be done.
Speaker 4:Yes, yeah.
Speaker 2:That we can have a conversation.
Speaker 3:A lot of people. You might have to admit that you were wrong.
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah, yes or even humble yourself and say I can see your side.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I don't have to agree with you, but I can see why you feel that way, I can see how that. I can see whatever. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I would like to point out that last Sunday, my message was identity crisis. That was the title of my message for Easter Sunday, which is a weird Easter Sunday message, but it's what I do, uh, identity crisis, and three people got saved last Sunday on a message that was meant to offend.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like the purpose of the message was to get somebody to go. Okay, I get it, I see it, I see what's happening and it was mind-blowing. Pastor Holly and I were talking about it and she's like it's so crazy how God can move in such and I don't want to call it a simple word, but it was a fairly simple message and it was like here it is. It's just gospel as it's presented. Take and do with it what you want.
Speaker 4:You, and it's just gospel as it's presented.
Speaker 2:Take and do with it what you want. You're trying to wake people up and three people go. Okay, got it and give their hearts to Jesus on Sunday morning.
Speaker 1:I knew when you did that invitation.
Speaker 2:Well, let me tell you why I did it. Let me tell you why I did it. It was not on the agenda originally, but I was like it's Easter Sunday A lot of people here who don't normally come.
Speaker 2:When I was preaching, I said something to the effect of how many of you know Jesus as your Lord and savior? And some people started putting their hands up like not everybody, and I didn't intend them to, I was. I just kept preaching and I saw one person's hand kind of creep up and I knew that I had to do it. So now, mind you, in my head while I'm preaching and you can probably catch it if you go back and listen to it my mind moves from the message that I'm preaching to how do we work in an altar call? How do we work in a salvation prayer? At the end of this.
Speaker 2:So I was like I kind of moved into this pivot in order to make all of it come together, and I was so thankful that I did, because when we did the salvation prayer and we asked them to come forward, the one who likes whose hand crept up almost ran to the front and I was. So I was like, okay, that was definitely the right call, but I'm. It never ceases to amaze me the miraculous things that God will do in such a small place, in such a small place. So is it my turn?
Speaker 1:It's your turn.
Speaker 2:Okay, I got one more Okay.
Speaker 3:Okay, james 1, 19. My dear brothers, take note of this. Everyone should be quick to listen, slow to speak and slow to become angry, for man's anger does not bring about the righteous life that God desires. Two ears, one mouth. Like our teachers used to tell us why can't this generation like, because what did you say? What did your?
Speaker 2:grandparents used to say I had a thought he's asleep on the couch.
Speaker 3:No, they just had a lot of good say oh yes, and we can't come up with anything. No, we come up with skibbity toilet Rizzler Chicken jockey.
Speaker 4:We come up with skibbity toilet.
Speaker 2:Rizzler Chicken jockey.
Speaker 3:We come up with some weird stuff. I mean, my grandpa used to say you make a better door than you do a window.
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely, we ain't got nothing on us.
Speaker 1:I tell Jarby that all the time He'd stay in there.
Speaker 2:My grandpa's. I'm not going to repeat that one my grandpa always had the dandies like they were always oh I uh, never mind, I'm not gonna tell that story either did you talk about the one?
Speaker 1:my mom always said two wrongs don't make it right.
Speaker 2:I was thinking, yeah yeah, that was what, yeah, yeah okay, so this is not necessarily about anger as much as it is about the heart of a person who typically is angry. Okay, so this is the story of Ananias and Sapphira. There was a man named Ananias who, with his wife, sapphira, sold some property. He brought part of that money to the apostles but claimed that it was the full amount. His wife agreed with this deception. Then Peter said Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart? You lied to the Holy Spirit and you kept some of the money for yourself. The property was yours to sell or not to sell as you wished, and after selling it, the money was yours to give away. How could you do a thing like this? You weren't lying to us, but to God. And as that story goes on, he ends up striking Ananias dead and then ends up striking Sephirah dead. And what's bizarre to me is they were so wrapped up in looking good that they would claim this lie. Now, this is one of the few times that we see somebody just drop dead in the New Testament from the wrath of God, and I'm shocked by it, because you know that they would have been miserable people. What choice would they have had? Because what reason would they have had to lie, unless they were miserable people, and you can almost guarantee that they would have argued that no, that's not true. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I gave you everything, but the Holy Spirit said no, you didn't. And the Holy Spirit knew. Whether Paul knew or not, the Holy Spirit knew, and that's truly what matters. So when you're angry, whether you're angry inside or outside, the Holy Spirit already knows that You've already sinned if you're experiencing it on the inside right. So I think it's important for people to understand that anger can't just be. I can't just scream into a pillow and pretend like I'm not angry, because, guess what, I'm still angry. My heart is still hard, I'm still experiencing that spiritual emotion. That is not healthy for my spirit man. My flesh man can be angry all at once because in my opinion it's dead anyway, but my spirit man cannot be angry. I cannot allow that to keep my heart hard. Okay, okay, back to where I really wanted to be Mark 10, 14. Now we could go a lot of ways with this.
Speaker 2:I would love to talk about Lazarus. Whenever Jesus went to the tomb and he wept. If you read that, continuing like people, read that and go oh, jesus wept because Lazarus died. No, he wept because he was angry. He was frustrated that none of them believed the things that he had told them. I've told you that he is just asleep. I have told you that he will wake up. I have told you all of these things and all you can hear is that, yes, in the last days he will rise again. So Jesus has anger there and the anger is displayed through weeping. But that's not my favorite one, because my favorite one is this All right, so we are in uh, mark 10, and it'll be 14 through 16. I'm actually gonna start in 13.
Speaker 2:One day, some parents brought their children to Jesus so that he could touch them and bless them, but the disciples told them not to bother him. When Jesus saw this was happening, he was very displeased with his disciples and he said to them let the children come to me, don't stop them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these. Kingdom of God belongs to such as these. I assure you, anyone who doesn't have their kind of faith will never get into the kingdom of God. If you read that in King James Version I forget the word that it uses. Let me look and see if I can it said he was indignant. Jesus was angry that they would tell the children not to come to him.
Speaker 2:So I struggle with people complaining about the kids being noisy in the sanctuary. Listen, my kids aren't noisy in the sanctuary. They know better, right, but they were raised in church. They've been in church their entire lives. They don't know anything different than Sunday morning stand, sit, go to class, whatever the case may be. But there are some people who come to church for the first time with kids who throw blocks across the sanctuary and make loud noises and do all of the things. Listen, unless you have faith, like a child, you will not enter into heaven. So much so that Jesus was angry when they tried to stop the children from coming to him. We have to stop worrying about what the things that are going on around us when we're in the sanctuary Listen. Hats. I know like everybody gets on me about this because, like I get so weird about this stuff, I don't care if you wear a hat in the building.
Speaker 4:I noticed Chase didn't wear a hat on Easter he didn't?
Speaker 2:He's like I'm not going to wear a hat in the building I noticed Chase didn't wear a hat on Easter. He didn't.
Speaker 4:He's like I'm not going to wear a hat Because he'll mention it. If I wear a hat, He'll mention it. No, he's like, no, I got to have some mad respect for this day, oh goodness.
Speaker 2:So people get upset about hats. Now I don't allow the kids to run in the building, not necessarily out of respect for the building but out of safety, because they just run into people. They don't care, they don't care, they're not allowed to throw things and there's like, there's behaviors. But that's more about safety than it is just about respect for the house. But I don't get worked up about those things because I'm just happy that they're here. Right, you know you have kids that are calling around on the floor under the chairs and you, and, while that may be disturbing to some people, at least they're in church.
Speaker 4:And I feel like at that point you need to have self-control, to be more focused, because at the end of the day, this is coming from a new mom. That is life. You might forget, or maybe you didn't have a newborn or a toddler, a pre-toddler, that's teething like crazy. What's held all the time like that's life, I'm sorry I think sid's experiencing something right now.
Speaker 2:I think sid's feeling a certain way right now because I mean, or are you overstimulated?
Speaker 4:yeah, just bring the kid or happy. Yeah, let me, let me just be angry you know, take an hour and a half to to prepare, and then by the time we take an hour and a half to do you, and then by the time we take an hour and a half to do you know to prepare, then it's nap time, like everyone just forgets sometimes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they know and newborns and not even newborns. Toddlers are hard, it is hard to deal with. I mean honestly, until they're out of diaper phase it's hard yeah because there's always you're, you're packing that bag and you've always you.
Speaker 2:You get here and you realize you didn't put any diapers in the diaper bag. That's a real problem, like that's a real kind of meltdown moment. But I think the point is is that we tend to forget that that is the next generation of the church and if we don't allow them to be a little bit noisy and a little bit messy and you know, finger paint and do all the kind of wild, crazy stuff in church, they will grow up to resent the church. Right, and when they grow up to resent the church, listen again. My kids understand how to behave in church because they were raised in church. Yes, but they also expect church to still be somewhat entertaining. Emmett is looking forward to dodgeball. He's like Dad, do you think I can go this year?
Speaker 2:I'm like heck yeah, it's not going to hurt him to come and play dodgeball. But I wouldn't tell Dale you probably shouldn't bring Elsa, because if she gets pegged in the face with a dodgeball she's going to know it. I wouldn't tell you to bring Rosalind. Cooper probably shouldn't come. There's an age at which they can come. But we talk about age of accountability. Yeah, we talk about the age at which they should take communion. Here's the thing I don't think there's an age for communion, but there is an understanding of who Jesus is, what the blood represents, what the body represents, like there's. And if, if you're raising a child who doesn't understand it, they should not be taking communion.
Speaker 2:Right, like that's just the way that it is and that is on you, not on me right, right, if they come up front, I'm gonna let them have communion, but that is on you and not on me, because now we do communion after the kids have gone to class, but there are some of the older kids still stay in there and so we just like, as a parent, you have to, you have to deal with that well, some parents don't want to deal with that no, because their kids. I didn't get one, I didn't get one or they don't want to have to explain yeah they don't want to have to be the teacher.
Speaker 2:Yeah well, you know, that's and that's all, parents all the time they want the school to teach their kids about.
Speaker 2:You know all of the the things in life, rather than them having to be teachers as well. Um, and then the other one that we have to obviously talk about while we're sitting here is when Jesus goes into the temple and he starts flipping tables. He is not flipping tables because he's losing at Monopoly. He's not flipping tables because somebody has made him angry. He is flipping tables because they have turned a house of worship into a den of thieves. I will tell you that when Florence was here, you weren't allowed to sell fundraiser items in this building. Like, if you, if your kids were selling cookie dough, you were not welcome to bring that into the building because she viewed that as like now, we're just exchanging money.
Speaker 2:This is, and when Jesus was doing that, when he was, when he became angry, they had taken sacrificial animals. They were selling to people who are coming through to pay their taxes We've talked about this who are coming through to pay their taxes, and they were making money off of it. They were making a profit off of it. And in the old Testament somewhere and I don't we just recently read this, Sid, if you're up to speed on the speed on our reading they said that if you get to the altar to sacrifice an animal and you realize that your heart is not right with God, leave the animal, go, get right with God, come back and sacrifice the animal.
Speaker 2:That is not what they were teaching. They were teaching buy the animal, sacrifice the animal, now you are clean. Buy the animal, sacrifice the animal, now you are clean. And it was this ritualistic transaction that was happening. They were exchanging money and again they were making money off of all of these things. They had genuinely turned the temple into a place where they could make a profit and it was a problem, and it was a real problem and can I tell you, it's why people hate the church today. Look at the money machine mega the church today. Look at the money machine mega churches. And I don't discredit any of the things that they're doing, but they're running businesses, not really running ministries.
Speaker 2:I was reading some Google reviews for a certain church in our area that's slightly larger than most other churches, holy smokes. The one review was like you know, we were new to the area. We decided to pop in here. Had you not told me that it was a Christian church, I would have never known what they stood for, what they believed. They'd never mentioned the gospel. The name of Jesus may have been mentioned once or twice and the pastor had to go to his Bible to reference the scripture because he couldn't remember any of it. Now I think that that's like if you wanted to quote it and you wanted to read it exactly how it's written. I think that's fair, but the point was was they were like this is not okay. This is the they said. Their last line was this is the textbook definition of a lukewarm church, and that's exactly what the body of Christ has become the lukewarm church.
Speaker 2:That's because we want to please everyone Well exactly so is it Casting Crowns that has the song. We want our coffee in the lobby.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:We want our missions overseas, we want a rock star preacher Like that's what people come to church for now. They want smoke and they want lights and they want listen. I have a really good friend who is no longer a pastor but used to be, and they did what they called a seeker service. So this service was designed for people who were not saved to come and hear the gospel. So our hope is that we're going to do something wild and crazy and you've never heard the gospel of Jesus or you're not a believer that you can come and understand what we believe in, what we do. Okay, they would play you know highway to hell or bat out of hell, like their worship team is playing.
Speaker 2:This music guy flying through the sanctuary on a motorcycle using chainsaws to cut up logs, like it was the spectacle to get people to believe in Jesus. And he told his congregation do not come to this service, do not come to this, because if you come you will be offended. And it worked. He grew a church of 60 people to a church of 300 people Because he wasn't afraid to go outside of the box. Yeah, to quote unquote entertain these people for a short moment so that they could understand who Jesus really is.
Speaker 1:But did they really? I mean, did they?
Speaker 2:Oh, yes, no, Did they have a church of believers.
Speaker 2:Yes, they had a very strong church of believers. Listen, he is probably one of the. He has a PhD and he has a doctorate in biblical studies. Incredibly intelligent man, but he is an entertainer at heart and he knew that in order to get people to even come into the church for those services, you were going to have to make a name for yourself. That people's like I just want to see what he's going to do, I just want to see what he's going to do. And then they get there and they're like holy smokes. He really died for me. Like, I mean, when they were cutting up, they were talking about the body of Christ and hacking this log into pieces and like all of the pain and suffering, that it was nuts, the stuff that he would tell me that he did, but it worked, but it worked. You couldn't do that here.
Speaker 2:Oh no, you couldn't do that here, because if you even said I'm going to have a seeker service and I don't want you to come, the place is still going to be filled with people that come in and they're going to be like what is happening in here, and I rightfully so. But I think there's a point when we have to understand the difference, because Jesus wants those people to come to him, right. Right, we have to make the gospel accessible to all of those people, and if, as Christians, we can't see value in that and all we want to do is be angry that somebody won't do it the way we want to do it, like that's a big one for me, well, you don't do it the way I would do it. I don't really care, I don't. I one time preached a message and I don't remember the message. I don't remember the week that it was. I walked out of the pulpit and I had somebody say why didn't you do an?
Speaker 2:altar call at the end of that message and you know what I wanted to do Twist their nose until it bled Because I was like how dare you, how dare you.
Speaker 1:But this is the thing the altar is open at all times.
Speaker 2:If you felt led to go to the altar, you should have been there, and not just that, but if God didn't speak that to my heart in that moment, then there was no reason for me to do it, right, right. So I feel like there are people who get angry or frustrated, or they don't understand certain things, and then they become resentful and then you deal with.
Speaker 4:They expect themselves out of.
Speaker 2:Oh yes, yes, that's one of my go-to phrases. I cannot expect myself out of other people because nobody else is going to do it like I do. Nobody else is going to think the way I think, operate the way I operate. It's a good thing for me yeah, and then I get angry when they don't do what I, what I would do yeah even doesn't matter how clear the direction is or how clear I think it is. I'll just give you this example. Why is he pointing his hand?
Speaker 4:you talk about my, my eas table? No, no, that wasn't my idea, by the way.
Speaker 2:I we, we do some crazy stuff at work. So I had um, the general manager of the theater. He called me. He's like hey, I was told to give this project to you so that you could make it happen. He's like here's the vision. He's like I want this great big box hanging from the loft of the barn. He's like, and it's going to be a magic trick and inside of that box the entire show is going to be a prediction that the audience is going to make. He's like so I need this thing to be rigged up. It needs to be safe. Yada, yada, yada.
Speaker 2:I came up with I shouldn't say I, me and my maintenance team came up with this. I mean, this box was, which is three stories tall, like this thing is. It's humongous. And last night they started to mount it and we had to bring in a lift to do it. Bring in this lift, and we start putting it up and I get a text message from the owners and the theater general manager and they're like full stop, we don't want to do this, we're afraid that it's too dangerous and that it's going to hurt somebody. So so I spoke to all of the safety aspects. You know, we put in an electric winch, there's no way it could drop. It's less than 1% chance that this thing would fail. Yada, yada, yada.
Speaker 2:And they said we understand that, but we won't stake our livelihoods on it, because if that box were to drop and kill somebody, they're on the hook for it. Not me, right, and I was like fine. So they're like a, one by one, by one box, eight feet off the ground. You want to talk about? Take the wind out of your sails. You know what I mean. You've just put all of this time and energy. And I had two options in that moment Be angry or get over it and get it done. Right, and I chose get over it and get it done.
Speaker 2:Was I frustrated because we put time and energy into that box and it looked freaking cool? Yes, I was. Yeah. Was I frustrated because we put time and energy into that box and it looked freaking cool? Yes, I was angry. I wasn't angry, I was frustrated. But I realized that, like I said, that's not my yeah. If that box were to fall and kill somebody, I might lose my job because the company is going to go under, but they're going to lose their homes. They're going to lose their businesses yeah, like it's going to be ugly, and so we have to put into perspective that it's not always about us and the things that we want it's. Sometimes we have to put into perspective that it is about other people it's about the people around us.
Speaker 2:And so when I'm angry and I show nothing but anger all the time or when I'm frustrated and I show nothing but frustration all of the time, people will pick up on that and then you become the person who is never satisfied. You become and people still think that about me because I'm such a control freak. I'm a control freak because I don't believe that everybody that I have in my life is trustworthy. Right, people will say I want to help with that, and then they don't help with that. Or they say I'll take care of that, and then it doesn't get taken care of.
Speaker 2:And so then, beth, I think this is yours you can trust some people with a lot and some people with little, and there are some people who I only trust with little. And when I can trust you with little, I will give you more. But I don't want that to be misconstrued or misconveyed as being angry or hostile, because that's not the truth. The truth is is I just need you to understand the importance of, whatever the task is that we're, that we're doing that spirit of excellence that we talk about yeah yeah, I've got more, but we're over an hour, so well, I just wanted to.
Speaker 3:Uh, I had one more thing and uh, jesus mentioned seven ways to guarantee god's anchor and they often refer to these as the seven woes. So this kind of goes on through, uh, the new testament and I have it here in matthew, so it kind of spreads over Matthew in like chapter 23. But I got a little highlight of what those seven woes are. So the first one is not letting others enter the kingdom of heaven and not entering yourselves and not entering yourselves. Number two converting people away from God to be like yourself. Number three blindly leading God's people to follow man-made traditions instead of God's word.
Speaker 3:Number four involving yourself in every last detail and ignoring what is really important justice, mercy and faith. Number five keeping up appearances while your private world is corrupt. Number six acting spiritual to cover up sin. And number seven, pretending to have learned from past history, but your present behavior shows you have learned nothing.
Speaker 2:Can you back up and read those last two for me again, the last two. I need you to read those real loud for anybody that's listening, real loud, Okay, number six, acting spiritual to cover up sin.
Speaker 3:And number seven, pretending to have learned from past history. But your present behavior shows you have learned nothing.
Speaker 2:Preach Good gravy. That's got to hurt. Think about that. How many times have we portrayed ourselves as righteous or holy or whatever? And this is just on that show that I was watching, that LA Homicide show there's a guy who murders two people in cold blood in their driveway. He shows up to the courthouse when he gets arrested, holding guess what A Bible.
Speaker 1:Jailhouse salvation.
Speaker 2:No, he wasn't even in jail at this point. He had not been arrested. So they had proof uh, they were. They had proof that he was there, but not enough to prove it. But they had two eyewitnesses and so they wanted him in a lineup. He was not, he would not come willingly, so they had to get an arrest warrant in order to make him come to the lineup. And he shows up to the lineup holding a Bible. He ain't read a word of that Bible, but he's pretending to be righteous so that people will look at him and think that he is changed and it was like 38 years after the murders happened.
Speaker 2:Can you imagine 38 years later? Wow, I think it was actually 40 years to the day when he was finally convicted. Can you imagine that family having to deal with that for 40 years? So he shows up with this Bible because he wants to look a certain way. He's pretending like he's learned something when in all honesty, hasn't learned a thing, Hasn't learned a thing.
Speaker 2:The first one that you said, though, like prioritizing religious rituals over like actual needs, actual human needs, and that goes back to the healing of the man on the Sabbath. Do you know what I mean? This is a man-made rule that you can't work on the Sabbath because God took a day of rest, and so they've turned this into a thing. You know, in our denomination insists that I shouldn't say insists, but they highly recommend that all of their pastors take a Sabbath, that we all have one day of rest where we are not working.
Speaker 2:And I said I would love for you to tell me when I can do that. I'm not trying to be stupid, but I have a day job that I have to go to right, so that's five days a week, and that job is really, honestly, on call seven days a week. So you know we can say, okay, I'll take that on Saturday. It doesn't work like that, because Saturday is my day to get stuff done at my house. That's not rest, that is not rest at all, and so I feel like, oftentimes, we prioritize that because it's something that religion says we should do versus something that Jesus says that we should do. So.
Speaker 4:What was the fifth one? I think it was.
Speaker 3:One, two, three. Keeping keeping up appearances while your private world is corrupt.
Speaker 2:Oh, can I speak to that one? Sure, For just a second. So I'm going to reference the young adult Christmas party. I was just talking about this with somebody else. A conversation ensued at the young adult Christmas party that was a little off color, it was a little weird, and that happens pretty regularly because we're a fairly close group of friends, Like we all. We have a regular chat together and we all spend time together, and so and it wasn't like oh my gosh, this shouldn't be happening. But it was a conversation that I was like I would be uncomfortable having this with anybody Like for me it's not something that I want to discuss. And somebody said something to me oh, you don't do this. And I said absolutely not. And then later I said to my wife I said, even if I did, you think I?
Speaker 2:I would never in a million years tell anybody in that room, because I have such great respect for you right right we want to share some of the most intimate details. Listen, I know stuff about people in this church that would make you vomit yeah, you only you only heard mine, because I was mad.
Speaker 2:I don't. But here's the thing I don't even think I remember yours so likely it wasn't anything that was like it didn't scar me. I can tell you that I have heard some stuff that has scarred me for life, that like I'll never forget it. These are when I retire from pastoring, I will write a book with these stories in it. When I retire from pastoring, I will write a book with these stories in it, guaranteed.
Speaker 2:And I thought to myself, we so often on social media portray this perfect lifestyle, when behind the scenes, everything is an absolute mess. And even if what you're doing does not feel messy to you, it is not in the will of God and therefore it is still, in fact, messy. But we don't want to talk about that. We don't want to talk about the things that are a little bit iffy, we don't want to make people uncomfortable. And now, see, I have to be careful on Sunday mornings now, because the big kids don't go back to class.
Speaker 2:So we're in the Old Testament, so all of the young adults are doing a Bible read together and we're all on the same plant I shouldn't say all of us, but a handful of it. And uh, right now it's talking about um Abraham and sleeping with, with his wife's servant, and like I mean, the word sex is in there far more often than I care to think about. But here's the word sex is in there far more often than I care to think about. But here's. What's funny is I have realized that just recently in my life I used to be able to watch TV and if there was an inappropriate adult scene it didn't bother me. Now I find myself fast forwarding through that stuff because I'm like it's not, like it's not something that I care to put myself. But now I'm reading the Bible and it's there and I'm like, can we fast forward this?
Speaker 4:I know the bible and it's there and I'm like, can we fast?
Speaker 2:forward this like I know I was listening. I'm like what was the? What was the lots? Two daughters that went into the tent had sex with him and I was like what is happening? Why are we reading this?
Speaker 4:but in the way he read it too, I'm like stop it.
Speaker 2:Are you listening to the new living translation? That guy is creepy when he talks about those things and then that one laid down with the deck.
Speaker 4:I'm like duh.
Speaker 2:But it's an important part of what we're reading and what we're doing, but when you come to a place in your life where that is like you're not comfortable with those conversations, that's a new level of spiritual maturity where you can say I don't want to have this conversation, I'm not comfortable sharing that part of my life with you. You, you aren't somebody that I would entrust with. That information about my life, um it just. It is really strange to think, though, that there are some people who just share it openly, just tell you about all the things. All the things.
Speaker 1:That's Jarvie and I have this ongoing battle about Mike and Molly. He loves that. I was like they're just foul. It's foul. I said they're either drinking or talking about sexual relationships.
Speaker 2:They're gross. Yeah, I don't know that I've ever watched it. I've seen clips of it, but I don't know that I've ever watched it.
Speaker 1:He's like well, it's not Mike and Molly, it's her drunk mom.
Speaker 2:I said exactly, You're still watching it, yeah still, and you're still consuming it to some degree. Yeah, and that's a hard part of life is learning to not consume the things that will trip you up.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 2:You know there are. So think about and I say men because it is a majority men problem, but it's not strictly men, but men who are addicted to pornography and they watch a TV show where there's a half naked woman. Do you think that that doesn't?
Speaker 4:I mean that immediately triggers their mind into some sort of like I was, uh, at my grandma's today and she had like a little I think it was like my grandpa's old wallet, like when he was in the service like there were a couple different pieces that were laminated, like his vaccination card, um, a couple other things. There was like a military card. But then there was a billy graham newspaper article and it spoke just exactly about that. He said, basically saying like how a 22 year old male's mind acts yes, that's normal, but acting lustfully on it is not, you know correct.
Speaker 4:So, and it was, I was, but you know for him to carry that with him, like you know he carried that with him.
Speaker 2:I think it's important to say that and I talk about this anytime I talk about lustful thoughts that men are stimulated by sight, women are stimulated by touch. So for a guy it is much easier to be stimulated than it is for a woman. So, like you can see something and go, you might see a man and go oh, he, he's, that's a good looking man, he's handsome, whatever. But you are not going to get so wrapped up in it Like a man would if it were a woman, and so it is much easier for us to sin in that way than it is for women.
Speaker 4:Or like instant versus response, or do you know what I'm talking about? Like men are, it's like instant yes whereas women you have to like they have to respond to something that takes time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yes, and so I feel like men don't realize that about themselves, and so then they're quick to get excited about anything. Do you know like? This is probably one thing that I've learned just being in the service industry, and you hear this a ton in the hotel world we have almost our entire front desk staff is female, both of our properties. Our phone staff is mostly female for our cabin properties, and what's funny is you get a guest who's upset for whatever reason, and when they call and you're talking to this person, they're like well, that person was flirting with me the whole time I was checking in. No, they were being nice yeah.
Speaker 4:You were trying to flirt with them.
Speaker 2:There is a difference and you were mad that you didn't get what you wanted. I can't tell you, when I worked at the front desk at one of my hotels, one of my old hotels how often I was as a front desk manager. The girls would tell me hey, there's a guy in this room who asked me multiple times to come to his room. How weird is that. But men think that they can ask the question and here we are. So I I we're way off topic, but I think that it's important to to note that it is. It is a real problem. It is a real problem that men have to be very cognizant of, but so do women. Yeah, because when you dress a certain way, you know you're drawing attention to yourself and so and I don't like women should not be ashamed of their bodies and they should be able to dress however they want, but understand what that does right.
Speaker 3:My wife the other day said to me, because sometimes it'll be the first ones to go, can you believe he looked?
Speaker 4:that's what I was about to say. Really yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there are. This is again no jab at breastfeeding. I think breastfeeding is beautiful, it's natural, whatever. But you have those moms who breastfeed in public and they don't cover themselves up and they wonder why people stare. I'm not staring because I want to look at you. I went, whoa, wait a second, that just happened, right. Do you know what I mean? Like, it's that kind of like that shock factor and, yeah, and culturally we're not used to it, so that's always going to be that way, right? So I feel like there's a don't be offended that somebody has taken a second look or glanced when you have put yourself in a position where they're going to yeah, right, yeah, it doesn't hurt to take a receiving blanket, just flip it Right, right and it's hot under there, Okay, cool, Get it.
Speaker 2:I'm not and I'm not saying that like I don't care what you do, but just there people are going to take a second look. Yeah, I don't think that it's disrespectful.
Speaker 4:Just know that they're going to take a. It's going to happen. It's not natural.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's going to happen. They don't wear tops anyway, so there's always a baby hanging off and you know it's whatever. Yeah, that's normal for them. It is not normal culture here, and so you, we, we as a, as a society, have to adapt a little bit. But then also, you know, as individuals, we have to adapt a little bit as well. We have to know what decorum is and know how to behave ourselves yeah yeah, you know, but you might as well not have a netflix, or a.
Speaker 3:HBO Max account or any of those, Because if you do, you're going to see something they're going to get you. I mean because all the shows are that way.
Speaker 4:Oh yeah.
Speaker 3:I mean all of them.
Speaker 4:That's what makes the money.
Speaker 3:Yeah, very few.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And that's how they make their money.
Speaker 2:Well, because they're entertaining the world.
Speaker 4:Yeah, their intention is to entertain the world.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and there's no like when we were kids, there was boundaries to what you watch, Like your parents didn't even have to control it.
Speaker 4:They controlled it for us Right.
Speaker 3:Even to the point where, okay, if it was kind of a risky show, it doesn't come on until like 10 pm, once the kids are in bed. Right Now it's just, it's a free for all, everything's on the same and it's instant.
Speaker 2:You can watch it anytime you want yeah. You know, I think back to when we talk about those things and we'll jump to an Elvis conversation, like when they censored Elvis and would only show him from the waist up.
Speaker 2:That was society as a whole saying this didn't feel like it was okay. Now we can't decide what's okay and what's not, because if I tell you this doesn't feel okay, our moral compass is broken. We've had this conversation a million times as well. And without Jesus, without God, without the Bible, what is your moral compass point? How do you have morals if you don't have a basis, a baseline for morals? This is what gives us that baseline for morals. And so you know, in a society that doesn't want to believe in Christ still feels like we should have morals, but those morals are incredibly twisted.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I can remember. Growing up I wasn't allowed to watch Sonny and Cher.
Speaker 2:Because how Cher dressed.
Speaker 1:Yep.
Speaker 2:Cher was, she was who.
Speaker 1:My dad thought that too. That's probably the real reason I wasn't allowed to watch. Dad didn't get to.
Speaker 2:Mom wouldn't let dad watch Cher, so nobody's watching Cher in this house.
Speaker 1:But yeah, because of how she did dress. And MTV. I remember when MTV came out I was not allowed to watch that either.
Speaker 2:That's interesting, I mean. But I get it because now you're into it, a type of Wait, a minute.
Speaker 3:How old were you when MTV came out? Because I was 22. I was like five or six.
Speaker 1:So I probably was about 12, 13, 14, right in there, damn.
Speaker 2:Would you think Beth was a lot older than she is?
Speaker 3:Well, I, just Because to me it wasn't.
Speaker 2:You see how you create strife in the room, create tension.
Speaker 3:I guess I would assume by then you was almost like late teens, or.
Speaker 4:No.
Speaker 2:I don't even know when MTV came out.
Speaker 1:It was like early 80s 81, 82 right is when it came out so maybe I was a little bit older, but I wasn't allowed to watch it.
Speaker 4:Yeah for some reason I feel like it was 79.
Speaker 2:I don't know why, but it could all I know is I wasn't around for it.
Speaker 3:That's all I'm saying I remember my, my parents they were uh, recording it on vhs because it was that big of a deal, so they had all the music videos on VHS so they could watch them anytime they wanted.
Speaker 2:And then one time your dad recorded over their wedding VHS.
Speaker 3:My mom would exercise to music videos.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh 1981.
Speaker 3:She would have big cans of corn and stuff.
Speaker 2:I was just going to say I remember growing up my mom would and I don't like. These were like you could mail order VHS tapes, exercise VHS tapes and whatever they were. They upstairs and you'd hear thump thump, thump thump because coming back down off that, that's a huge step, I think box jumps yes.
Speaker 4:I was like what is going on? Your calves were probably looking nice.
Speaker 2:I was like this is crazy.
Speaker 3:Actually I don't think MTV was too bad until, honestly, until they quit playing music videos and they started reality TV that's when it started getting bad in the early 90s agreed and they lost all logic at that point.
Speaker 2:I remember I had a friend in high school who would race home from school. When we got off the bus she would run straight into the house, turn on MTV and watch Total Request Live, which was an absolutely worthless show, because they rated the songs that were on the pop charts and, like you started at 10 and you worked your way up to one and for weeks it would be the same stinking show but they would have different people on it because you know the songs would move around on the chart by one or two spots but ultimately it was the same list of songs for weeks until one new song would pop on and then another new song would pop on, but she would race home to watch that every single day and they didn't even play the whole song.
Speaker 2:You would hear a clip and see a clip of the video. You never even saw the whole thing. What is like? Why are people entertained?
Speaker 4:by this?
Speaker 2:why are people entertained by this? I didn't want to listen to Carson. Daly talk about all of these bands and panoramic shots of all the people standing outside of the studio in New York City. Nobody cares, nobody cares. But teenage girls at the time loved that show.
Speaker 3:And you can't do that today. I mean everything's YouTube, Everything's Insta. You don't need shows like that anymore it's funny.
Speaker 2:Do anybody still watch the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade? How many of you actually watch it on TV? I don't we watch it on YouTube?
Speaker 1:what's the difference? Live?
Speaker 2:it's really not necessarily different, but the angle that you're getting is a highly produced angle. We get to see all the ugly like cause, all of that stuff is prerecorded, like all of their vocals are prerecorded. None of that's real. And you get to see the really bad stuff when you watch them on on YouTube, because they're not positioned like the ABC cameras are like yeah it's like some guy with the cops half of a cop's back in the frame and yeah, I watched the turkey bowl first.
Speaker 2:You watched the turkey I have never watched it, don't even know what it is on fox 8 news that's about to oh frozen turkey never seen it.
Speaker 3:They hit the cans of cranberry never seen it. Yeah, and of course, everything goes to charity, but it's just fun because everybody dresses up in costume.
Speaker 4:You've never even heard of it. Never heard of it. I feel like it's advertised a lot.
Speaker 2:What's the joke about the turkey drop? There are turkeys everywhere. It's an old sketch, wkrp or something like that.
Speaker 4:It's not. The sky is falling, no hold on.
Speaker 3:But I find it highly entertaining. I don't miss it yeah. I said all the turkeys, everything goes to charity. Yeah, they're well tenderized.
Speaker 4:Yeah, Is it? Did you say before or after WKRP Cincinnati?
Speaker 3:So it's before the Macy's day parade, yeah, so I think it starts at. It might start like at 6 am.
Speaker 4:Yeah, something like that. I think my dad would watch it and then, right before the parade would start, we would catch the tail end of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's called WKRP Cincinnati, oh the show yeah. And there's a like they're dropping turkeys out of a helicopter and it's a whole.
Speaker 3:Frozen turkeys.
Speaker 2:No, they're live turkeys. It turns into chaos. I was going to say frozen turkeys.
Speaker 3:That could be a little dangerous. I'll have to check that out. It's weird. I used to watch it when I'd be on summer vacation, at two in the morning, Whatever it was on Nick at Night or whatever but that was on a lot, jeez yeah.
Speaker 2:Okay, Well, so we ended up messed up in our rotation because Dawn and Beth were both gone. So it's technically it was Dawn's turn to pray, but Beth missed, so she got skipped. So then it went to Nick. So now it's back to Beth, and then when Dawn comes back, it'll go back to Dawn and then over to Roger. It's nothing like making that super complicated, right.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:All, roger, it's nothing like making that super complicated right? Yes, all right, beth, so it is all you.
Speaker 1:Dear Heavenly Father, we just thank you that we can come together and have the conversation that we can have regarding your word, and we thank you that how you have opened our eyes and opened our mind to your word tonight. Dear Father God, we ask that you bless each and every one of us as we leave here tonight and get us home safely, and that you remind us as we go through our paths throughout the days that not to anger, not to be quick to anger, to look at you first and always. In Jesus' precious name, I pray, amen, amen.
