Wicked Wanderings
Delve into the enigmatic realms of the mysterious, unearth tales of haunting encounters, explore the chilling depths of true crime, and unravel the threads of the unexplained. Join us on the Wicked Wanderings Podcast for a riveting journey through the realms of the unknown and the haunting mysteries that linger in the shadows.
Wicked Wanderings
Ep. 55: Ghostly Recounters and Family Tales
Ever wondered what it’s like to live in a haunted Victorian house? Auntie M recounts her spine-chilling experiences in North Adams, from eerie footsteps to unsettling occurrences that left a lasting mark. Amidst these ghostly tales, we lighten the mood with some good old family banter and share our hereditary fascination with the morbid and supernatural, ensuring a perfect blend of shivers and chuckles.
On Hazardville Road, we relive a spontaneous summer outing that took a dark turn with an encounter on cremation day and a haunting discovery in Watershop's Pond. From tragic deaths on Route 190 to a submerged family's car, these stories highlight life's unpredictable and often chilling nature. We further delve into the fascinating history of Watershop's Pond, including its most recent draining, which revealed an array of submerged vehicles and artifacts, adding layers of mystery and intrigue.
We couldn't wrap up without discussing the legendary Ed and Lorraine Warren, whose work has significantly shaped the paranormal field. From their famous investigations like the Conjuring house to their personal experiences with auras and exorcisms, we cover it all. Our conversation rounds off with heartfelt family stories and Irish traditions, painting a vivid picture of how history, religion, and the supernatural intertwine in our own lives. Tune in for a captivating journey through the paranormal, historical, and familial connections that promise to entertain and enthrall.
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Wicked Wanderings is hosted by Hannah & Courtney and it's produced by Rob Fitzpatrick. Music by Sascha Ende.
Wicked Wanderings is a Production of Studio 113
And now we talk shit, your turn.
John:My turn, don't put me on the spot.
Mom:There's always people in your life you can talk shit about Usually it's your exes. But and go. We all have an ex or two. Some of those people are in the room Whose ex? My ex is in another room.
John:Is that Sky? When you said Sky had to talk shit about people. Oh, it's okay, you can always talk shit. And I was like, but sorry, some of those people are real. So what's the topic for this evening?
Mom:Auntie Becky's stories that we thought were real and she just told us they were all a lie.
John:Wait what.
Hannah:Which one? All of them, all right, let's. Let's start with this. Okay, hi, I'm hannah. Join me as I delve into true crime, paranormal encounters and all things spooky. Grab your flashlight and get ready to wander into the darkness with me. This is Wicked Wanderings. Hello, wanderers, and hello to a special episode from South Maine Wells.
Rob:Maine, wells, beach, the south coast of Maine. We've already said it. Moody Beach 10, 15 episodes again.
Mom:And we missed the Agunquit Gay man contest today and I'm so disappointed in my family.
Hannah:I am disappointed too, Mom Chi Chi was there, that would have been so much fun to say that contest today that whiskey's going to fall over.
Rob:It's on the edge of the book.
Hannah:No, it's not, It'll be fine. So I want to say hello to everyone. So hello Rob.
Rob:Hello, Hannah.
Hannah:And we have a couple special special guest today. So I want to say hello to Mom, mom's here, mom's here. Hi Mom and hello Jonathan. Hello, and our very, very special guest, who's never been on the podcast before and I don't think has listened to it Aunt TM.
John:She doesn't have electricity or Wi-Fi or no no.
Mom:Wait a minute, wait a minute.
Aunty M:She doesn't get paid, then, oh, I didn't know, there was a stipend.
Hannah:Wait, there's a stipend, Mom shh. Usually you have to make us dinner to get on this podcast. We did the dishes.
Mom:We did the dishes, john cooked, john did all the cooking.
Rob:Yes, john, thank you for a fabulous dinner of lobster whitefish rice.
John:I'm exhausted.
Aunty M:Exhausted.
John:Exhausted from my days in the big way apple. I don't think anyone calls it that.
Hannah:But, by the way, like I did get the salt water for the lobster, so you're welcome.
Rob:I carried it up.
Hannah:I got it, though, so there's something to be said for that I don't do shit.
Mom:You ate it though, so there's something to be said for that I don't do shit, you ate it, though Was it good. I don't eat lobster, but the fish was wonderful. Yeah, the haddock was delicious.
John:Sorry, I keep burying myself in your breast. It's not on purpose.
Hannah:It's fine we're close. It's fine For the Wanderers, we're sharing a mic tonight.
John:So I'm sorry we, I'm sorry. We're just a little bit closer than we usually are.
Hannah:You know, I thought we had enough mics and we just don't.
Rob:We have five mics. We just on our on our uh Rodecaster Pro board there's only uh four inputs.
Hannah:Yeah, it's. There's something to be said about five inputs, so we'll have to work on that.
Mom:Yeah, Well, I have a big mic. I was told.
Hannah:A big mic, I was told A big mic With inputs. My mic is bigger than yours. All right, so that's Wicked Wanderings After Dark people. So let's talk about something else.
Rob:Which is not a real podcast.
Hannah:We should really make it one, because we keep talking about it.
Mom:But she wouldn't have her mother and her aunt on it.
Hannah:I can tell you that so Wanderers as you probably can tell from having about a year, right, yeah, we're over a year. Yeah, that, um, I'm pretty macabre and morbid person and you're probably wondering where that comes from.
John:Uh, so, it's hereditary newsflash.
Hannah:Spoiler alert it's very hereditary, so I'm gonna have the one the only auntie m on and talk about all of the weird shit that she's done over the years including having gravestones, rubbings and visits to different parks with lots of headstones yes.
Hannah:So probably one of the freakiest stories I can tell you Wonders is that when I was young, granny, I was like, let's go to a graveyard, sure, let's go. And we were walking around All of a sudden she'd go, don't fall in the hole. And I used to freak out so bad because she would say there'd be an open grave in front of me. It was fun. Yes, it was fun. Yes, it was good times. It was good times. Traumatizing, but good stuff. Yes, yes, but we went to a lot of good places.
Aunty M:We did.
Hannah:But I want to know about places that before we were even born, you had some type of apartment in North Adams that you said was haunted it was half of an old Victorian house round rooms all the way up to the third floor and one night I was in the bathtub.
Aunty M:I could hear someone walking around on the third floor. The bathtub was on the second floor.
John:Oh, good Lord.
Aunty M:So I just did something that I read somewhere and yelled all right, that's enough, go away. And it stopped, and it wasn't you. But me, no one else there would be. And I also had two cats at one time. Neither one of them would go up those stairs to the second floor. Never, never, went upstairs.
Mom:Yeah, I went to visit and she put me in a bedroom on the second floor.
Hannah:You can handle it.
Rob:Wait a minute. You used to own cats. I had two cats at one time. Wow, were you trying to keep your family from coming over, because everyone in your family is allergic to cats?
Aunty M:I wasn't allergic to it. One of them scratched me and didn't even realize, and I got what they call cat scratch fever.
Rob:I didn't know it was a real thing.
Aunty M:I think that's a song, yeah.
Rob:It is a song.
Aunty M:Yeah, it is a song Cat scratch fever yeah.
John:From back in your days. All of us are terribly allergic to cats and dogs.
Mom:They actually didn't have music back in our day.
Hannah:You guys were still banging on bones.
Rob:Bongo.
Hannah:Yeah, in caves Right.
John:Cracking rocks together. What was that? Cracking rocks together Boom.
Mom:I did see the ghost, though. One time he cheated.
Hannah:Oh, what do you mean? You saw it, mom, please explain. It woke me up, what do you?
Mom:mean, it's really the only time I've ever seen a ghost, and I was staying at her house and their bedroom was on the first floor. I was on the second floor and was woken up by a man. Oh boy.
Rob:I thought I got lucky.
Mom:And just kind of groggy, and I just remember he had red on like a red shirt or a red jacket. And I said what do you want? And I knew it wasn't Michelle's husband, ex-husband or husband at the time, and it was just a very and he goes, are you comfortable? And I said, yeah, I'm fine. He goes. Oh okay, good, have a good night. And that was it. And then in the morning I said to Michelle sometime it's in my room last night. She goes oh, that's a ghost on the third floor, don't worry about it. Oh God, don't worry about it. Oh God, at that point I did not know. She thought she had a ghost in the house. So then of course I'm like totally freaked out. Let me out of this crazy place.
Aunty M:No, it was fine, they weren't bothersome. No.
Hannah:A gentleman in a white coat, though.
Mom:Red Red coat Sorry. I distinctly remember a red something, didn't you say it was some kind of top hat, or something too I don't know I might have.
Rob:It's been a long time, but I do remember a red coat or jacket or something. Was it like a red jacket from the?
Aunty M:1700s. Oh I, I she was half asleep, right, but on the, the house wasn't that old, it was victorian right, 19th century it was probably built in, I would say the 20s or the 30s, because the downstairs, the furnace was actually converted from coal to gas. Yeah, to gas.
John:How interesting.
Aunty M:It still had the hole in the wall of the cellar where the coal used to come down. It was the biggest, biggest furnace you've ever seen, but you don't ever know what the house was built on top of.
Mom:Could have been another house, could have been a graveyard, could have been I mean, the north adams is an old town, yeah, yeah absolutely, and I, I so to kind of talk about where we're.
Hannah:Where we are right now, there are so many small, tiny little graveyards that are built across route one, right like I somebody didn't even notice yeah, like even like two or three graves just kind of fenced in that I didn't even know existed.
John:When I was coming down from Portland to meet you all on Saturday morning, we avoided Route 1 because it was busy and we took Route 9 and some of the back streets, Lovely old farmhouses and every few lots of land land. There was a small little family cemetery just off the route.
Aunty M:It was really cool yeah, I think that first cemetery I brought you to was in wilbraham and there was a gravestone that I had done a project on for high school. Evidently the first american ballad was written um in wilham area, about a guy had gone up to the top of Springfield Mountain, got bit by a snake and he knew he had two options he could stay there and die or he could see his sweetheart one more time. So he came down the mountain to see his sweetheart one more time. She sucked the venom out of his leg and they both died. Oh jeez what? Yeah, that was a nice song. So for a high school project we rubbed the gravestone on the guy's grave.
Aunty M:What? And we got the music out of the Springfield Library and had somebody play it on guitar. I can tell you I got an A on that song.
Mom:Oh my God, yeah myself and my partner Is that the cemetery that's on Tinkham Road in Wilbraham? Yeah, that's the one, the one that, when we had the tornado, remember the tree.
John:The tree went down and they found a grave site had been encompassed by the tree.
Mom:Wow, that was really cool.
Aunty M:There's also a gravestone in there with five children that died.
John:Yeah, that's what we bring up.
Aunty M:Had drowned in a rowboat or something on. I think it was Five Mile or Speck Pond, one of the ones on Wormwell for him.
Mom:Actually a great cemetery to visit.
John:And they were all cousins, right.
Aunty M:They were somewhat related or friends or something.
John:but yeah, it's an amazing tombstone because it's all. It just mentions all of them together. It's really. We only went to.
Aunty M:Oak Grove once Remember they had that big monument to the Titanic because evidently one of the mayors of Springfield's son had died in the Titanic and they put this marker there, see, I haven't been to Oak Grove, I've only been to Springfield cemetery with you. Oh, that's an old Victorianorian cemetery that was a great.
John:That's a great cemetery yeah, they have all the way pre-civil war, all the way up, yeah what I really like about the springfield cemetery is that two things I'm going to mention is that, um, it was tradition for like the first hundred years, until we get into like the 1920s and 30s, when more people had um vehicles and we had the hearses that were, you know, gas run rather than horse run. The tradition was they would arrive to the gates of Springfield Cemetery on that kind of extension to Maple Street, take the casket out and then walk it into the cemetery rather than take the horse and carriage in.
John:And then the other thing I love about that cemetery is just kind of the explanation of why there's so many civil war graves in there is because when you look at a map, um, if you look at the train lines, springfield is pretty much exactly north of new york city and pretty much overall new york north of washington dc. So when a lot of the servicemen who were on the fighting side for the north came back home they ended up in Springfield. They may have been from Boston or Rhode Island or Maine or Vermont other parts north but because Springfield was roughly directly north they ended up in hospitals in Springfield and died there and then were buried there.
John:That's why there's so many Civil War veterans for the North buried in Springfield Cemetery. That's interesting.
Aunty M:That's really sad. Yeah, but there's a great book about the cemetery with a lot of pictures and a lot of history in it. That was. I can't remember who the author is.
Hannah:Is that the one you got from RTL? Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay.
Aunty M:Yeah, and isn't. In the chapel there's supposed to be a Tiffany window.
John:You are correct. Apparently that's what they say it is. We had a good time. I remember it was the summer between graduating from college and getting my first job. You took me out there with Grandma spontaneously and we wandered around and all of a sudden we were like, oh my goodness, it's so cloudy and kind of dusty. What's going on? We didn't realize it was like cremation day.
Aunty M:Oh jeez.
Rob:And all of a sudden everything was very sandy and smoky.
Hannah:So you inhaled some people, unfortunately.
John:I like to think it was probably the oak casket, not a beloved snorting grandma.
Mom:No, she was cremated over on Parker.
Aunty M:Street.
Mom:She wasn't cremated there.
Aunty M:I think that's right over there I don't know, but there's interesting stones over there too Local people, so that's fun.
Hannah:So you also. Auntie Em, you have an interesting story about a family being found in a pond in Springfield.
Aunty M:There was an old story. I don't know how true it is. My father told me so maybe he made it up. He was Irish. He made up a lot of stuff.
Hannah:But in.
Aunty M:Watershop's Pond. We love a good story. By the way, Across Watershop's Pond is some of the houses are on an incline and supposedly this family got in the car to go on vacation and something happened where the brakes fell and they ended up in the pond. Nobody saw it and nobody realized they were missing for weeks or so and they never found them. And then when they drained the pond one time, they found the car and skeletons.
Mom:Wow, crazy, was it decades later? Yeah, it was decades later.
John:That was supposed to be like the 1920s.
Aunty M:I think right, yeah, I think something like that yeah.
John:It makes it extra spooky.
Aunty M:Yeah, yeah, that was scary. I mean whole family, that's awful. Oh my God, yeah, there's weird things happen all over the place.
Hannah:And also, like you, used to work in Connecticut for a very long time. Yeah, and I think it's Hazardville, connecticut, right, which is kind of like a subset of Enfield. Yeah, there were some interesting things that used to happen on that road.
Aunty M:When I was working up there it was Route 190. It's a pretty big hill. It goes from Enfield straight up to Stafford Springs and beyond, and there just was a lot of accidents on there. One of the accidents was a kid that worked with us was in the volunteer fire department. They had a house fire right on the road, supposedly, and it was in the middle of a winter storm. Supposedly they got the okay to go in that the electricity had been shut off and they put the fire out and the kid backed up. He backed up into a live wire with um um oxygen tanks on his back and he died, he died he was only like 18, 19 oh my god, that's too young.
Aunty M:And there was a lady who was a volunteer, volunteered all the time and people take and pick her up and she was coming to work and, um, one of the gals was supposed to pick her up. She said stay at your house. It's raining like cats on dogs. She said, no, no, I'm gonna meet you at the end of the road. Now, she was just that kind of person. She wasn't going to put anybody out right. And um, somebody hit her and killed her wow on the street.
Aunty M:Then we had another one that was even weirder, where the it was some kind of big accident and they were bringing people into the hospital. They called on the on call or nurse. She was going up the hill and coming down with one of the doctors that was leaving for the day and he saw that her car had broken down. So he stopped his car, tried to cross the street to help her and somebody hit him and he passed away too. Jeez, all this stuff on that street.
Aunty M:It was horrible I just think there's something to say about that well, there was one more issue too, where there we had a like a doa one time and they couldn't figure out how this guy had died. And when they did the autopsy, the best they could figure out was that he was walking up the hill. Yeah, and maybe the side mirror of a tractor trailer hit him, because that's where his injuries were.
Hannah:Oh my God, and just for everyone, doa means dead on arrival, right? Oh yeah, okay, yep, definitely. So there was always something on that street.
Aunty M:It was always something on that street, it was always something Cursed.
Rob:And just going back to the firefighters, you mentioned that they had oxygen on their back. Those tanks are actually not pure oxygen because of fires, because oxygen burns much more. So, it's just regular compressed air.
Aunty M:I think it was the metal of the tanks that actually did the damage, hitting the live wire. Yeah.
John:Sorry, I don't want to push us back into the other story, but I actually found a news article mentioning the water shop's pond being drained, so this is what it says. This is actually an article from uh only a couple years ago, when watershops pond was drained again oh, yes, yeah, that was what like.
John:And they found like 50 cars from like the 50s, 60s, all the way through the 90s and 2000s, with a safe. A pair of you know anyway, and it goes in references it said you know actually this is not the first time that we found a lot of stuff submerged in watershops spawn.
John:The first time the pod was drained, uh, was in 1941, uh, for the installation of new piers likely for the, the bridge that crosses, uh the washups pond, workers found a car containing the bodies of david and alicia lee, as well as their three children, who had been reported missing without a trace 10 years earlier, in 1931. Their disappearance touched off a nationwide search that ended without any sign of where they went, until april 1941, when the pond was drained. Uh, with the discovery of their car, it was assumed that the family was driving east down eastern avenue at night. Uh, and then they ended up missing the turn at hickory street and instead went straight into the water of watershop's pond yeah that is freaking crazy.
Rob:Thank you, for finding that yeah, that was good yeah, I remember a few years ago when they they drained I think it was it was either 2019 or 2020 that they drained it again, because I was working at western new england university when they did that save the turtles, I would drive turtles crossing I would drive past water shops, ponds, and I remember looking at it and it was just a little stream at that time because they had drained it. But yeah, they found quite a few vehicles from you know, the the 50s, the 60s 30.
Rob:No, it happened. They found vehicles from the time they last drained it, which was the 41 you said.
John:Yeah, so this was an article from MassLive in November of 2020. And they said that the last time they had drained Watershop's Pond was 1941. And there's some wonderful photos here and you can see that some of these vehicles there's a little bug from the 50s or 60s in there and apparently a lot of the neighbors were going out with metal detectors and they found guns and a preserved set of high heels from the 40s.
Rob:I mean, there's some really weird stuff that they were able to find in the mud it just makes you think uh, you know what, what are they gonna find next time they drain it? Yeah, you know, in another 80 years, right?
Hannah:interesting, but the original reason they were gonna drain it most recently yeah uh, they had to fix the dam yeah, by springfield college.
John:Okay, yeah, I remember that, all right apparently the dam's from 1824, so it's quite old. Um, I was actually really impressed because I didn't even think that particular area of springfield was was settled enough for a dam in the 1820s it's actually a very good point.
Hannah:So, auntie m, there was another story that I absolutely love from you that you went to go see lorraine warren and you ended up talking to her, which is incredible for the paranormal community I had seen it in lorraine warren actually three times the first time oh my god, I know it's three.
Aunty M:Oh yeah, first time was at western new england. They were, they were doing a seminar and, um, yeah, it was pretty interesting and she explained that he that she saw auras around people and that she was very sensitive to things she didn't do any private readings, yeah, yeah, and that he was a demonologist and what that meant was he would go in and research whatever was going on.
Aunty M:He, but he wasn't there to fix it right, they would find people to fix, whether doing exorcism, cleansing of the house or whatever it was, and they they had shown a lot a slideshow and it was really good. And the second time I saw was up in north adams, uh I'm not surprised, because there was some creepy stuff in North Adams.
Hannah:Yeah, they were up at.
Aunty M:I think it was one of the hotels or something we saw. A bunch of us from Mark went and then the third time was over in Chicopee and at that time they were doing the lecture and all of a sudden this guy got up in the back and he went bananas and threw a chair across the room and at that point they had had a guy that was helping them. That was also a state police officer for the state of connecticut and, uh, he just said you know, relax, guy right, we'll give you back your money. Get, get out the door, you're okay.
Aunty M:He was with somebody at a date and she was like flabbergasted and she was like in tears. She could not believe he pulled a stunt. The same time Mrs Warren sat down in front of us. We said are you okay? Because she was shaking. You know you get this violent guy in the room. And so we got her calmed down. But when I got home I was like my gosh, these people go out and look at ghosties and all kinds of things, but that's scary yeah, but that's scary yeah yeah, they.
Aunty M:They were teaching at some point near at the university of connecticut. They were teaching courses that's amazing.
Hannah:I watched an amazing documentary about them and and like they have, like the original annabelle doll still in their collection. And it seems like their son-in-law really took over what they were doing.
Aunty M:Yeah, I've seen him too. They said when they were lecturing that sometimes they would come out of places. Ed would come out of places they just didn't feel right about. They actually had a camper in the backyard and he would stay in the camper. Oh, you know to so not to bring anything into their house yeah you know, sometimes it would go rocking in the back, I guess, but yeah they were.
Hannah:They were really the ones that brought, like, the conjuring house to light and everything and with there's been a lot of drama with the conjuring house lately, and so I think there's something to be said about the original people that actually were like yeah, there, there is something going on with your house, uh, and there was they.
Aunty M:They showed simple things from, I think it was in west harford. There was a house that they had a big deal things going on there and, um, I don't know if they investigated there was somebody in enfield that had problems. Yeah, yeah, I'm not too sure where that was, but there was one of the shows. One of the investigating people were on that show there was a house near bridgeport too, yeah, um there was a cemetery.
Aunty M:There still is a cemetery up um in connecticut. They said it's most haunted cemetery in the united states. They investigated.
Hannah:I think they investigated that too new england has a lot of weird places a lot of weird people. There's a, there's a.
John:But I think, I mean I think the If we go one step deeper. Yes, we have weird people, but I also think you know, besides the area around the original settlement in Jamestown in Virginia, the oldest English or Western European settlement is up here in New England.
Aunty M:Yes.
John:And I think there's something to be said for that of layers and layers of generations of people staying in one place. Yes, that adds to kind of the spookiness of of New England. I mean, I was telling you the other day about the way that Vermonters in the 19th century would freeze their relatives for the winter. I mean there's some weird stuff that happens when you're in a place that's been settled for hundreds of years by Western Europeans and also in a place that gets very cold and warm and has changes of seasons. I think it kind of alters people.
Hannah:I would agree with that. That's definitely true, definitely true. Mom, do you have anything to add? You've been so quiet.
Aunty M:Say no, don't shake your hand.
John:She's actually freaked out by us now and will shortly be leaving. Bye, bye, felicia.
Aunty M:She didn't know she was ghost bait staying with me. That's why.
Mom:I have not seen the war, and so I really couldn't add to that, I'm jealous because I mean they were just if you saw them walking down the street you wouldn't even look at them twice.
Aunty M:Just really down-to-earth people.
Mom:Is it true that they would bring priests in to do the exorcisms?
Aunty M:They would They'd use from what I understood, it wasn't just priests but there was other religious people. I guess most religions have some kind of form of exorcism, so they would work with anyone that could help.
Mom:I was just thinking about that incident where the gentleman went a little bit kind of cuckoo, yeah, or just you have to wonder about what was going on with him, that there was something that recognized what they were doing and that's why he reacted.
Hannah:So something interesting. So I actually watched a documentary about the Warrens not too long ago and they were very sensitive to what those people believed. And there was one time where it did have to do with the catholic church and they were strict um catholics and none of the priests would come out and they actually made a ruckus enough where the local news anchors and stuff would come out and they're like good, we want this to get out because the, the church, the diocese isn't helping them at all and this is ridiculous. You should be helping these people that are supposed to be part of your faith. And they finally came out, but it was because the Warrens made a fuss about it.
Mom:The Catholic Church when we grew up, went to parochial school and kind of know that background. It was always very much it was all God and not evil. But in my opinion, in a lot of people's opinion, if you believe in God as an almighty, then God says there is evil and there is a devil and there is a lot of evil in the world. You have to believe in evil and if you're a man or a woman of God, then I think it's your responsibility to reach out to people and bring whatever light and healing you can and not just say, oh no, I only believe in God, that's true, I don't believe in the devil. You can't, because Jesus very clearly in the New Testament talks about the devil and God in the Old Testament talks about evil and the devil.
Mom:So you have to take all of it as a package and realize that there's something. Now, whether you want to take it to beings that are not evil, that just try to touch us in certain ways. I used to work with a woman that every time she saw a butterfly she thought it was her brother. Now you know if that's what floats your boat, I don't, but that's just a totally different way of looking at the afterlife than looking at evil. You know what I mean. There's just, there's a lot. It's a big package.
John:And Hannah or Annie. You guys probably know this story better than I do about the warrens, but, um, I'm going to paraphrase it.
John:I'm probably going to get it most of it wrong, but a gentleman was going through a hike somewhere in connecticut because the warrens were really based around connecticut right, yeah yes, um, and stumbled upon this like clearing and found this like really bizarre looking statue in a clearing and and he ended up taking it home whether it was his first visit there or his second visit there and someone ended up connecting him to the Warrens and the Warrens knew immediately it was some sort of very specific Satanist statue, oh, wow.
John:And they said we implore you to return it to wherever. They couldn't return it, but it was one of my favorite stories about like these people aren't there to create a bigger fuss about something that may or may not exist. They're there to kind of put the, the books where they need to be, back in the library of like let's fix this and put things back and respect where other people are coming from, whether they are satanists in the woods or not. But that always kind of intrigued me of like, oh, these people aren't just there to woohoo into it's not the speedometer, but it's the electrometer. Speedometer is when you run, but whatever it is, they weren't there for that.
Hannah:They were there to kind of set things right.
Hannah:So I know, when I watched in the documentary, that Lor warren went to a very strict parochial school, from my understand, and so she tried talking to the sisters about how, oh sister, your colors are brighter than mother's colors, and of course the mother doesn't want to hear that her colors aren't aren't as bright as everyone. So they they tamed it down for her, saying you can't talk about that stuff here. So I think for her, she for Lorraine, she couldn't talk about the things that she wanted to and it and it wasn't because, like you said, john, she is, she didn't want the fame for it. She was like this is maybe a gift that I was given and Because it's an unknown gift or something that may show power outside the church, they don't want to know what I'm capable of. And it seems like the Warrens were always protectors. They were never people that, like you said, were out for influencing other people or to get fame. They just wanted to help other people with the other side that others could not necessarily understand.
Mom:Michelle do you recall who in our family mom used to talk about some relative of hers that used to see and read auras?
Aunty M:Yeah, can't remember who it was.
Mom:I don't remember who it was, but there was someone in her family and she had a spirit guide and actually someone had painted a picture. But was it Minnie, minnie, minnie.
Aunty M:Little Minnie Tribal, yeah, minnie Tribal.
John:So I was always wondering this and I should have asked Grandma but I know, little is like a moniker but was her full name Minnie Tribal, or was it Minnie Tribal Hopkins? I think it was T-R-i-b-o-u tribal, tribal, that was her last name. Yeah, I thought so.
Aunty M:Yeah, I thought so, but I always I knew she was a cousin but, she actually drew a picture of her spirit guide, who was an indian, native native american indian, which used to sit in yeah, she's jim m bedroom.
Mom:As kids we used to go up to their old farmhouse up in the backwoods of Maine and when we heard the story you could look into my Aunt Mabel's bedroom. She had moved down to the first floor. She was early 90s back then.
Aunty M:Early 90s, then yeah.
Mom:And there was a picture of this beautiful Native American indigenous person. Whatever there was a picture, but my understanding of the story was that Minnie was a medium.
Aunty M:Yes, and it was through that and she had done the picture of what she perceived.
Mom:But I thought the spirit guide told her and of course you know stories. You know stories that it was go up into the attic and there's a picture of me in a trunk and that's where she found it and that's where the picture is. I wish I had the picture or you had the picture, someone had the picture, we don't know what happened to the picture, but I remember saying it.
John:But to put it in perspective, when you guys talk about your aunt, your Aunt Mabel was actually your great-great-aunt, oh yeah. No, it was Grandma's aunt. She was our grandmother's aunt, so it would have been your great-great-aunt. Yeah, at least Because she's our aunt. Maybe it would be our great-great-great-aunt, yep, but it's kind of amazing. I mean, she was born in the late 19th century and lived until the 1980s right, yeah, she was a Hopkins Very proud of the.
Mom:Yeah, she was the first hyphenated woman I ever met Because, yeah, hopkins Kimball Couldn't give up the Hopkins name because of what it entailed with being the family on the Mayflower and their lineage and who they were, and there was a lot of pride in that, even though they sold all their land in a gunfight to go farming up in Bangor.
John:I mean, if we really want to talk about spooky stories, it's that we own most of what's now Wells Agonkwa and a part of York multiple acres and now we just come up here for vacation. They couldn't you couldn't farm it, that's really the horror story of the whole podcast.
Mom:Yeah, they couldn't farm it, that is so true. They couldn't farm it, that is so true. They couldn't farm it there was no vision for it, being any kind of a Couldn't do potatoes here Darn. So they moved out to Bangor, which, if you've ever been in Bangor, is not great farming land either.
Hannah:Better than here, I guess, when it's rocky, but Mabel's husband was starting with him.
Mom:He married, she fell I guess when it's rocky, but Mabel's husband was story with him. He married, she fell in love with him and he married another woman and Mabel said if I can't have you, I'd have a nobody baby. And his first wife died. Mabel was in her early 30s, which is yeah, I know. Just died, died randomly, she was in her early 30s and the wife passed away and she married him and they never had children, but then he mysteriously died in a fire.
Hannah:Uh-oh, yes, let's talk about that story next. You or Auntie Em talk about who he was, what he did and how it happened.
Aunty M:I don't know what he did, but he used to lend money to people to help them and he carried a little black book with him all the time with who and how much he wasn't strict on when he had to pay him back. He was just a nice guy. He was a nice guy and was helping people out.
Mom:Yeah, he wasn't like I don't know what you would call him. He wasn't like a Scrooge. No, but he wasn't like somebody that was going to break your kneecaps if you didn't pay him. No, it was more philanthropy yeah, but they had a farm and then he died in a fire and the book was missing. But Mabel did say that many years later people came to her and gave her money and said your husband lent me money.
Mom:Here's the money. But she knew for a fact that there was people in the book that she never saw the money from the weird stories.
Aunty M:I know how. About that other mean story about um being in stephen king's book? Go onM, please talk about that. Our great uncle, carlton Littlefield, was the state rep for the state of Maine at one point and one of his jobs was to go over to what they called the academy, which was their high school, and view the teachers and write up something how they were doing. One time I read Night Shift by Stephen King and the name came up Carlton Littlefield. Now how many Carlton Littlefields can there be in this world? And so when I went up there, linda and I went up there and we saw Uncle Carlton he was well into his 80s by then and he said Uncle Carlton, you know the Stephen King, your name's in his book. And I gave him a copy of the book with his name in it and he read it and he said to me well, I hope to heck you don't think that's me in there.
Aunty M:I said no I just thought it was interesting that he used your name At the same point in that book. There was a Cumberland farm.
Mom:It's called the Night Owl. The Night Owl.
Aunty M:So aren't we driving in the dark to get back to the hotel? And there's the Night.
Mom:Owl. We're standing there on the pay phone no cell phones. Back then, folks Right On a pay phone talking to our mom to say, look, we got up to May, we were bringing my grandmother back, we were teenagers. Look, we got up to May, we were bringing my grandmother back, we were teenagers, what Like 18? And 19. We were young and this one says you know how I am Whack in my arm. I'm like what the hell, Leave me alone, Leave me alone.
John:We're being charged by the minute here.
Mom:And I looked up and it says the night owl store or something Market. So in one of the stories up in behind the night owl is this neighborhood where this story took effect. So, idiots, instead of running back to the hotel, we go driving the neighborhood in pitch black to see if we can see where that house was that Stephen King wrote about. You know, the two of us crazy people.
Rob:Yeah, so did he write about him, or did he not?
Aunty M:He used his name, he knew who he was, because he had met him at a high school where he was teaching. At that time they were living in a trailer, I think at that point.
Rob:So your uncle denied it then.
Aunty M:Oh, he said he, you know. I think they used his name, he knows that Okay. But he thought that was what the character had done in the story. You don't think that was a true story, yeah. Poor Uncle Carl.
John:But I think it's so cool that someone as famous as Stephen King was just the English professor in Hamden.
Aunty M:This little tiny town in Maine. Well, that's how he started. Yeah, he, and his wife too, was up there at that time.
Hannah:I think there's something to be said. It's an honor nowadays to be mentioned in this David King novel, but probably back then you're like, oh God, you read a couple of his first novels. You read Cujo. You're like I had nothing to do with this. Salem's Lot yeah, it's like I had nothing to do with this nonsense.
Aunty M:I think Carrie was like.
Mom:One of the first movies.
Aunty M:Yeah, sam's Lot was one of the first books.
Mom:I was. It was the first book I remember reading. Yeah, I was probably in the late 70s. Yeah, yeah, those are good.
Hannah:I think that's all our main stories I have to say, though, my favorite is still Pet Sematary so far.
Aunty M:Really I'll keep going baby.
Mom:There's never, I have to say, my favorite Stephen King book. Of everything that I've read and I haven't read everything is Firestarter I haven't gotten to that one yet, but I've read Thinner. Thinner's excellent too, Thinner's good, but Pet Sematary.
Hannah:I loved it. I couldn't get through it. I gave a one star. I don't know there was something about it. I was like this is so fire starter Wasn't the movie?
Aunty M:true, barrymore, but I didn't. I never saw the movie.
Mom:I'm going strictly by the book, Cause I get sometimes Stephen King Like when we talk about the shining. The book was fantabulous.
Hannah:No doubt about it.
Mom:Shining was amazing Sitting in a movie theater watching it and at the end I went. I'm like an idiot in the movie theater wait that didn't happen in the book and I just totally ruined the whole movie for me.
Hannah:I know I watched the shining before I read the book and so I finally read the book a couple years ago and I was like I watched it again with my husband and I'm like, oh no, no, the kids should have a bigger part. What is this nonsense with the twins? Because the twins you don't see in the book, the daughters that died, like I know that guy shouldn't be axed in the back, like that's not how it happens but I do love the scene where all of a sudden you have a frozen Jack Nicholson, I think that's really good cinema and
Mom:that's something that you you won't get in a book. But you're right, I think there's really good cinema and that's something that you won't get in a book. But you're right, I think there was a lot in the movie that I was not happy with.
Hannah:And with the book too. I'm glad out of the movie they left out those sculptures, those grass, the topiaries. Yeah, they weren't in the movie which in the book they weren't necessary. They weren't in the movie which in the book they weren't necessary. They weren't sorry, steven, but they weren't yeah. Tell him how to write.
Aunty M:Yeah, you didn't need those in there. That's balls, have you read?
Hannah:Christine yet.
Aunty M:Oh yeah.
Hannah:No, I have fire starter and Dr Sleep next.
Mom:If you read Christine, it probably won't have the same impact, because our cars do talk to us, our phones talk to us. Our Alexas talk to us, but back when Christine came out, nothing talked to you.
Hannah:And Carrie right, which I know is completely different with the girl, but what was supposed to be the modern Carrie Sorry, I'm thinking of another author, nat Cassidy, with you guys are looking at me like I'm crazy Mary the book Mary by Nat Cassidy. Okay, so it was another horror book I read. But he read Carrie when he was young and he modeled Mary after Carrie.
Aunty M:Yes, we didn't even hit the Irish. Oh, hit the Irish? No, they didn't. Our grandmother was from Ireland and she was taught as a child that if she looked in the by the Protestant church and looked into the yard of the Protestant church, you'd see the devil standing there, what? And then she she also had. She had a lot of ghost stories too. She said she was walking home and she saw one of the farmers in the field. Gave him a wave, she, he waved back. She got home and her mother said to her did you know, farmer so-and-so died. He goes. No, I just saw him. She said, no, he died a day ago. So yeah, she always saw, but she always so told us while we were in church if we turned around you'd see the devil in the back of the church.
Aunty M:So that's how they kept us quiet in church.
Hannah:We were afraid to death, to turn around but like, is there some qualm to some of these, these superstitions? No, they were just catholic and they was just.
Mom:You know, protestants, yeah, but just just think about the history, just from a historical point, of ireland and the I mean she was from the southwestern part of ireland, very, very catholic and um, and what happened with the English, the British, and I mean Cromwell and everything. I mean it's just they come with that history and she was born in the late 1800s so a lot of that history was very recent to her. So that's how they kept them from thinking what is this about? The Protestant faith that's so interesting and might be a little more dynamic? And the Catholic Church had and probably may still have, a really strong hold in some countries. They're very powerful and very strict.
Aunty M:But the Jewish families too. I mean, it was like super blessing if you had a daughter or son going to the priesthood to become a sister and a lot of the families believed that you had to have at least either Mary or Joseph, which is your children's name.
Mom:That's why she was Elizabeth Mary, her sister was Mary, yeah, and they had a nun they did.
John:Mary Stella.
Mom:Well, that wasn't her. She was Mary Stella, that's the name she took, took right. Yeah, he took Mary Stella, yeah.
John:So to kind of interconnect it to the Protestant church in England, it would have been the Church of England, it would have been an Anglican church, right church in england it would have been the church of england, it would have been an anglican church right and there, undoubtedly, there would only be a few people who would have ever attended service there, because it was specifically put aside for whoever loaned the land that you were living on, oh so, whether it was a duke or lord of some, sort so, um, I know when I was actually went back to dingle, which is where we come from, and saw barry ballyferriter, where our your grandmother- our great-grandmother was baptized.
John:That land was all owned by an absentee english lord who I think never, or very rarely ever went to that part of ireland. He just kind of reaped the rewards of being able to own it which.
John:Of course leads itself into the irish famine, but that chapel or that church, that english church, would have been set aside for his use or for kind of higher mucky mucks in town. Um, so of course it was also talking about a class divide of like don't even bother looking into that church because you know we're the ones who are being subjugated. You have no interest in, no business going into an Anglican church because of what they did to us during the famine and what they're doing to us now.
Hannah:There's another story Grandma used to tell about wakes in Ireland which I think there's something to be said about wakes, cause I feel like people use that, so they they use it interchangeably Wake and viewing, viewing.
Mom:There is a difference. Wake is more religious, like a Catholic.
Hannah:Anybody can have a viewing Exactly, but with the wake, you see the body, and I feel like for the Irish it was way different than that, because you actually hear like they would ice the body.
Aunty M:Put the beer around the body cold like very morbid to macabre to some people. But there would be several days and it would also be a lot of food. Right, there would be um, the um decedent in coffin. Yes, there, displayed, displayed, yes. So grandma always used to tell the story about a gentleman that was a hunchback. So they put the coffin up in the corner of the room and of course, the food and everybody's toasted him and the whole bit. Well, after three days of standing up and being a hunchback, they had roped him in. But the ropes broke and he fell right onto the kitchen table with all the food. I guess everybody thought he took his last step. They were scared to death, oh God. But grandma used to tell some funny stories. You don't know how true they were, but you've got to remember my dad.
Mom:Your grandfather worked for the funeral home.
John:His dad was an embalmer.
Mom:Yes, so he spent a lot of time picking up dead bodies and experiencing things, and my father was a wonderful man, but he was a big chicken.
Aunty M:He didn't want anything to do with that at all yeah, I remember he picked up toast on the start picking up his first body out on um wilbraham road almost out to wilbraham and at that time was just farmland up right and on.
Aunty M:The second story was a gentleman that died in his sleep in his 80s, very old, and my grandfather took my father to help him bring the body back. Yeah, and he went up the stairs and my father took one look at the body and said where's the gloves? My grandfather says, pick up the jade day, let's go. So I guess when he got home he was so traumatized he soaked his hands for hours in a soapy water.
Rob:Oh my God, it was scared to death.
Aunty M:Do you remember the other story you used to tell about going up north somewhere like in the Berkshire somewhere, to pick up a body? And they picked him up in a regular station wagon and they stopped at this diner to have a little bite to eat. And when they stopped at the diner there was a guy there and they got chatting with the guy and he said you know, I'm going down towards springfield and my grandfather says hey, you come take a ride with us. Um, we're going the same way, not remembering that there's a body in the back. So he said I'm gonna use the men's room and be right out. And the poor son of a gun, he must have gone taking one look and there was no sign of him anywhere, anywhere. They scared him to death.
Hannah:Sure up in my space station wagon with the dead body wasn't there a story too, though, where he, where grandpa, went, helped his father and, like the body, had its like last breath? Oh, I don't remember where the body had the last breath and it popped up and scared the crap out of him well, the way I, so I never heard that story about the hitchhiker.
Aunty M:That's a great story.
John:Yeah, the one I remember, which may be the same but may not be, was. They were probably up in um hungry hill in a you know a triplex and the story I heard was that grandpa had to help his father take a body out of the third floor and grandpa was on the bottom of the casket or at least the body.
John:Oh, I remember great grandpa was on top and somebody stumbled and the body came up over and on top as they were going down the stairs. So I don't know if that's the same when you remember, but I can only imagine that feeling. Oh, my goodness, the body's come back to life. Oh geez.
Mom:And my father never wanted to work. He did work, as you know. He would open the door and drive the horses and stuff until he went to work for the Sprint, for Moose paper. But yeah, he didn't. My father was. He was good to like, you know, put the suit on and shake the hands and I'm so sorry, but yeah, my grandfather was. He was the only son and when you had to get the body out of the house, when you had to get the body out of the house, you had to get the body out of the house Very different now from you have to have a coroner come in and all of that. A lot of times they would just back down, would just call the funeral home, especially if you had someone that was expected to die and it wasn't, you know.
Hannah:I just feel like it goes to show. You know like sometimes I feel like some people in our family wonder why we are so macabre and then you think back, it just makes sense why it doesn't bother us yeah, especially when they say things to you um like oh, if you're going to awake, make sure you sign the guest book you have to sign the guest you have to sign.
Aunty M:That's the big rule, because they're going to look back later and say were you there or not? So that was the big, big one.
John:You taught us that when we went. I mean, I think, our first viewing was probably, it was probably six. Yeah, you were like make sure you sign the book and I'm like why they? But when you were talking about, like you know, oh, we have a little bit of a dark humor, but I think there's something to be said about.
John:We kind of grew up that death is natural, we are all going to die, it's a cycle and we might as well laugh at it and enjoy and know that at some point we're all going to die and that's okay and we can laugh at it and make fun of it and make light of it, because it makes it easier to realize we're all gonna have, this is all gonna happen, yeah, and it's all going to be okay and we're gonna have a good time as we go and I think also, uh, having good family around you that's gonna take care of you after death too, because any family place that I've any funeral or viewing that I've been to or wake, it's like the family takes care of you.
Hannah:You're gonna have a good time. Your wishes are gonna be, you know, just played out exactly. Thank you, rob. So I think there's something to be said for that, because the irish definitely know how to how to party, how to party we just watched this movie recently.
Rob:it took place in in Ireland and there was a funeral going on At the same time the funeral was going on, the daughter started to go into labor while she was visiting her mother upstairs you don't remember this movie you watched recently? Nope, yeah. And she ended up having the baby right next to her dead mother. That was in the bed, because that's how they do funerals yes. Over there yeah.
Hannah:Yes, no, it wasn't her mom.
Rob:Yeah, it was her mom. Her mother had died and she was coming back.
Hannah:I thought it was her aunt or something, but anyways, yes, you're right, it was the only bed available. Yes, and they were viewing her in her bed and they're like honey. This is where we got yeah, hop on.
Rob:Oh, what was that movie? I don't even remember what it was called I found it. It's called stay the movie is called stay yeah, because I had the girl from taylor.
Hannah:Shilling from um orange is the new black that's right, that's right yeah do you remember what grandpa's job was at the funeral?
Aunty M:he was an embalmer no, no I'm talking dad, not not oh dad when he was a kid.
Aunty M:It used to be that there was a smoking room in the funeral homes and was just men men only and the women would stay upstairs praying. Well, what happened was, when they were downstairs in the smoking room, they could also go out a back door and over next door to the bar and they'd be over there having drinks while the wives are out praying with the beads. So his job was like Mrs O'Malley comes over and says Joey, go get Mr O'Malley, we're ready to go home. His job was to run down the stairs, back up the stairs over to the bar, get o'malley out of the bar and back to his wife, and that's what he did for a job that's a great irish name.
John:I had no idea that's so great yeah yeah, that was his one of his jobs.
Aunty M:oh sure, mrs o'malley, I'll get him Never knowing they were out there having a brewski, or you know, shot.
John:I mean, that is such a ring of truth about it.
Aunty M:I mean yeah, yeah.
Mom:Now, when your grandmother died, you guys remember being around her bed and just all. She's gone and all of us are there and the nurse walking in and going is everything okay? And we're like, yeah, Then why is the pull cord, why is the call button for the nurse pulled?
John:Remember that.
Mom:And there was nobody near it and we all laughed at the time because grandma would never pull the button. No, no, dad would never pull the call button in the hospital, she would never hit her Don't want to bother anybody, that button around her neck.
Mom:She didn't want to bother anybody. So I always felt like that was kind of her. Hey, I'm leaving now. I just want you to know I can hit the button. You know, because we're all standing there and the button is. There's nobody near it, why would any of us call? And we all kind of looked at each other and it was kind of it was a little spooky but it was a little bit comforting in a way to think that she was kind of saying I gotta go. You know I gotta go, but I don't remember that with dad. It was hard for me with dad because I had three little kids, two little kids, two little kids at the time your brother was born. But I do remember that distinctly with your grandmother.
Aunty M:Yeah.
Mom:She was just saying goodbye. I hit the button.
Hannah:Alright. Well, thank you everyone. Thank you, Auntie Em Welcome. Thank you. And Mom, thank you, You're welcome, Johnny thank you.
John:You're welcome, always a pleasure.
Hannah:And Rob, thanks for producing once again Of course. Is this a bonus episode?
Rob:No, this will be a weekly episode. Okay, make sure if you haven't already like all our socials, especially on TikTok, because once we hit a thousand followers, we can go live, so you can see this whole shit show live while we're recording.
Hannah:And we're at the water. Who doesn't want to see it on the water?
John:Who doesn't want to see water? I can't believe.
Aunty M:I didn't get a hair or makeup person for this.
John:That needs to go right at the beginning of the episode. They wouldn't even let me take a shower.
Mom:Why would you get hair or makeup?
John:I heard one of you got paid. Which one was it?
Aunty M:I didn't get paid.
Rob:I'm waiting for that stipend yeah, well, thanks again for listening and, as always, hannah, thank you very much for being a wonderful host.
Mom:You're the hostess with the mostess.
Hannah:I shared my mic, so there's nothing to be said for that.
Rob:All right, make sure to send us a text and we'll catch you next time.
Mom:Bye, wanderers, bye, bye Wanderers, bye, bye, bye Ta-ta.
Hannah:Thanks for listening. Today, wicked Wanderings is hosted by me, hannah.
Rob:And it's produced by Rob Fitzpatrick.
Hannah:Music by Sasha N. If you enjoyed today's episode, don't forget to leave a rating and review and be sure to follow on all socials. You can find the links down in the show notes. If you're looking for some really cozy t-shirts or hoodies, head over to the merch store. Thank you for being a part of the Wicked Wanderings community. We appreciate every one of you. Stay curious, keep exploring and always remember to keep on wandering.
