E3 - Matt Harvey - Media Literacy Matters!

Chicago journalist Matt Harvey talks about his path towards a career in journalism, his experience growing up in Uptown, his views on media literacy, and his company WeHome LLC. 

An insightful look into how media shapes and also reflects reality, while also perpetuating stereotypes and racial inequity.  It starts fun but gets very deep at the end (around 35 minutes in) so listen and let me know what you think!

Links to stuff discussed in the pod:
Khaliyah X What's My Name - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gy8R1RdLpbI
Matt at the TRiiBE - https://muckrack.com/matt-harvey-11
Matt at the Chicago Reader - https://chicagoreader.com/author/matt-harvey/
A Different Mirror - https://www.zinnedproject.org/materials/different-mirror-multicultural-america

Transcript

Unknown: All right. Hello and welcome to episode three of Next up, Chicago. Today, we have a very wonderful guest. We have Matt Harvey from We Home LLC. The man is a Chicago native, born, raised, bred, grew up mainly up here on the north side in uptown right now. Matt is up to big things and that's obviously why he's on this pod. So what is Matt up to? Rhetorical question number one of the day. Well, Matt is a journalist. You might have seen some of his stuff in The Chicago Reader. You might have seen some of his stuff on the Chicago Tribune. He's also part of the group Tribe Media, right? Oh, yeah. I wrote for the tribe. Hero for the tribe. So you could see some of his stuff there. He recently wrote a piece on an up and coming songwriter and singer Clear X, right? That's her name. Clear X. Shout out to your X. We hope you're doing well. I have not heard your music yet, but I'm going to give it a listen. After they asked me what song chosen to. It's called What's My Name? The One That's okay. And what's my name by? Clear X. Check it out. But outside of being a journalist and outside of being a wonderful human being, this man is a CEO and founder of We Home LLC, which is a creative media studio. And the man is running a magazine as well as providing media literacy, which I think in this day and age would be really helpful with the fake news and just how hard it is to understand what's fact and what's fiction. So without further ado, I introduce Matt Harvey, say some things to the lovely people today. Matt Thanks for having me. Farooq This is amazing. As you know, if you can't see this, but he's got Belgian chocolates out straight from Brussels with him. And I'm I'm glad to be here. I'm glad to talk to you. Yeah, man. I guess, like, you know, I kind of start every year with a similar similar flow. Like, what is it? Tell us a little about yourself, bro. Like, what do you you grew up in Chicago. You. We went to high school together. Fun fact. Whitney Young. Dolphin. Dolphin. Dolphin pride. Yeah. I went to high school, rode the goddamn red line home. Yeah, we are the red line home every day. But, yeah, man, now you're a journalist. You've been featured in Chicago Tribune. You write. You often write for the Chicago Reader. Mm hmm. You've had stints in Chicago Mag magazine. Yeah. So what, like, I guess, why? Why do you. Why did you choose to become a journalist, especially in this day and age, where it's like, you know, journalism is kind of. Yeah, yeah. I get what you. Yeah, yeah, I own. I actually told journalism before it got too dicey, but I started off my, my, my kind of, I guess trajectory towards journalism started in high school actually. Okay. Um, I was not the best student in high school. A lot of people didn't notice this, really, because I kind of tried not to, like, talk too much about it because it was kind of embarrassing. But I was demoted in high school, like, oh yeah. So, like, if you look at you, you, but you have a year, but I don't have a yearbook. Well, if anybody who went to when you lose the damn yearbook, they'll see that I am listed among the juniors for the 2016 yearbook. Yes. What? Yes. And nobody and I. Because I honestly like it was it was honestly embarrassing. So I kept it under wraps, like when everybody would dress up for, you know, picture day. Luckily, not everybody had pictures on their, you know, their senior pictures on the same day. Right. So it was kind of it was easy to kind of just blend in and seem like, you know, if some people were dressed up, it just wasn't my day. But, you know, it was never my day. But I was in a I wasn't a senior, technically speaking. Oh, from I mean, until the maybe a couple of days before graduation really. Like I went to go pick up my cap and gown the day before. I had no idea. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. And yeah. So I was a, I was not a great student, but, um, I had one class, I had a few classes that I excelled at. One of them was in ethnic studies class that. And the teacher was Miss Washington. Miss Eleanor Washington. Mm hmm. Outstanding teacher. Um, we had we've had a checkered history, but, like, you know, ultimately, she taught me a lot. Mm hmm. Um, and one of the things that really kind of catapulted. Me towards journalism was a project we had where we talked about it was we had to basically focus on a case study, right? Mm hmm. And I did this with one of our friends, Pete McCall, who will be. Oh, yeah. Pete. So. So me and Pete were we. We did this assignment together about racial biases in hiring. Hmm. And I took the part where I had to make the essay. I was like, I got this. Mm hmm. I think. I don't know if he contributed anything, really, but I contributed. I did most of the essay, and it was a he was an outstanding student. No, don't get me wrong. Yeah, he was an outstanding which is kind of crazy and I guess, you know, indicative indicative that this was kind of the path for me, the fact that I took up that mantle, but it was like a three page assignment. I end up writing, like, ten pages about this. You just flew? Yeah. I just get so into the research and I get so into talking about it and like. And I remember, like, afterwards when I was, like, thinking about where I wanted. What I wanted to do for college. I was still in the like. I don't know what I'm gonna do. Mm hmm. I was. I was still at that point, and I was like, well, I really like doing that. So it was the closest to that. Mm hmm. And the answer was journalism. I also was in a kind of a phase where I was I loved to watch, like, news channels. I was watching, like, 24 hour news channels, like CNN, MSNBC. I would watch right. Watch Rachel MADDOW and Chris Hayes and and and Don Lemon and all those people. And they weren't the only source of news that I had. But I also like, would like intentionally watch Fox News, even though I knew I didn't necessarily agree with what they were saying. Okay. Just to kind of it just it was I don't know what it was, but it just felt like I should it felt good to do. Maybe it was more so. It was, um. So, yeah, journalism was the thing that was closest to that. Uh, and so, yeah, I, I decided to look at schools with decent journalism programs. I, I started with, like, Mizzou, a lot of people from union went to Mizzou u of I did okay. One But like, yeah, Mizzou, Michigan State was of interest also because Miss Washington had gone to Michigan State. Mm. Bunch of different schools. Syracuse was one. And as you might have noted, you might be like, hey, he's named a bunch of schools that are pretty good schools. Mm hmm. He did started by saying he was a terrible student. That's true. He did say, though, and as you can imagine, I got rejected by other schools. Okay. And the only one that accepted me, that literally the only I got two acceptance letters and one was kind of a rejection. Purdue told me that I could come there, but I got to go to like their extension. They got like a Purdue and like somewhere outside of their actual care, it was like an extension college where they send the yeah, like, like that. I get like that. And, and then University of Kansas said to me and I remember I went to Yeah, that yeah. That was where they had a good journalism program. Mm hmm. And I, you know, went there and didn't do great, but. You could also steal the bad student. Unfortunately, in Kansas. Yeah, I was. I was the bad student. I wasn't those schools. And my thing was that like, there's the partying. Was it just like you were homesick? Was do you think there's a reason for it or you just never could, like put your full focus on that? She wasn't a hard party and I went to Partizanship, but I wasn't like the guy that was coming home like George shit. And, you know, like, I wasn't, you know. Right. I was barely like I was smoke weed every once in a while. Like, I wasn't buying shit. Like, if I if one of my homies had some, I'm like, you know, take some puffs, okay. I simply was disillusioned with school. Um, and I had felt that since high school. And it wasn't until college well, until well after college that I really, truly realized what it was through. But yeah, it was, it was, you know, I was always I went to Inyong, you know, I was, uh, I was the, the gifted kid, quote unquote. I was a smart kid. I was the in elementary school. I was always the I went to same elementary school uptown Stuart Elementary, the one those are loafs the one is now was fun fact they're now condo like luxury lofts and you know it's crazy they have chalkboards in the fucking apartments can you imagine devastating for is not you know the opposite of fun fact it's it's a it's a it's a depressing fact. Yeah yeah. Unless you like chalkboards in your apartment. Yeah. Unless you like chalkboards like no fucking displacement. But, but yes, I, I went there for eight years and it was like my, yeah, my entire elementary school career was, was a student where it was a few blocks from the crib so of course. Mhm. But yeah I was a top of my class every year. I was, you know, I was always a student, they like the was like, you know, he's smart as hell, he sometimes talks too much or whatever they are and you know that, that, that led to them get putting me in advanced things or like giving me extra work or whatever. And I often complete that shit. But yeah, it was a. So, yeah, I was a good student. I was I was used to being told you're smart. My mother was always like when she would brag about me to people saying that I was going to be valedictorian at Whitney Young. And deep down, I probably knew that that wasn't the case. But, you know, she's just saying it because she knows I've been smart in my whole life and she probably has been around, like, a ton of intelligent youth. Mm hmm. So I was, like, super outstanding. But then you get to that high school, and it's like, you know, everybody's smart as hell. And and the kids, the other kids that are smart as hell went to schools that were rigorous as hell. Yeah, they were. They were like learning language, like kid. Most. Most everybody I knew from freshman year had at least one class where they were like the sophomore level. Yeah, like pretty much everybody I knew, they either did geometry or they were in Spanish too, or they were like, You know something? I was, and I took all honors classes, which was cool, but that's only really cool if you pass them all. Which ones did you not pass? Oh, I can't even. I can't, man. I'm trying to remember, like Wolf from freshman year. I can't remember all I know. At some point, I failed chemistry. I failed physics. I've definitely failed a couple math. I I'm trying to think of other ones. There's probably a couple of bullshit ones in there too. Like, how do you feel that, you know, I never felt I felt English one year you're fucking journalism. I'm a journalist. I think about that all the time, and I'd be like, Man, that's so crazy. Like, I failed English. I failed the shit over. It was Mr. Scotty's English class. Well, yeah, Mr. Scotty's was an exceptional breed of hard ass. But did you have him? No, bro. I had. I had doctor for it. And she was a hard ass in her own way. Yeah, but she was. No, Mr. Scotty's. Mr. Scotty's was insane. Yeah, he was very much so. This was the type of teacher Mrs. to with the type of teacher that like, you know, if there was a film, if this this if our high school experience was a scripted movie, you know, Mr. Scotty's would be like the star teacher of the movie. Oh, yeah, because he's the one that gives, like, long lectures in, like, says profound shit in the lectures. And he's like the Robin Williams. Yeah, he's the he's the freedom writers. He's the yeah, he's the Denzel. He's the Robin Williams. He's all of them. Exactly. So yes, Goatees was like in I remember he really early on he said something in his class that like he was like, uh, you know, some of you might not pass this class, but. It wasn't exactly that. I'm definitely paraphrasing. I hope you're perfect. But some like you know, it was basically like if you fail, that doesn't mean you haven't learned stuff or it's not because you're stupid or like it's not because you you might you might take you might fail. And I feel like this is maybe the most succinct way to say, hmm, you might fail this class and take more from it than somebody who passes it. That's fair. And he did that while playing this song that some kid who had failed his class who wrote it was called Like Dawg, because he was big on this too shall pass the poem to you. I was like our opening to our our year and shit like that. And he played the rap that this kid wrote. Uh, it was. It was funny. It was, you know, terrible rap. Oh, it's terrible. But, of course, you know, he's like an old white man and, like, impressive. Like, he was feeling good about the fact that he had kind of an inspired this kid to to a degree, which is cool. Is definitely cool because I will not say that I definitely took from his class. Like, I definitely like one of the, the things that I, I find myself thinking back to the most from high school was this unit we did on. It was like little literary criticism. Literary criticism. Okay. Yeah. And it's like that was a high school girl. Yes. He was teaching literary criticism in high school. And I think he was maybe the only teacher that did that. I never thought of it that way. Yeah, it was it was a lot of interesting things that we learned in that in that kind of unit that I definitely still think about to this day. So in a sense, he was he was definitely right, you know, that, you know, we were kind of scoffing at him saying that like, he would he'd be the teacher that like, you know, the Freedom Rider guy. But he was right about she was. And I definitely feel like if you compare me to some other kids in that class, I probably did more with the English learnings than they did. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, from my perspective, right, this was junior year was coaches. I had doctor for my junior. She's wonderful. No qualms about her. She a great teacher. But yeah, I mean, like, I'm not out here remembering my English class like on something like this was a formative experience in my life. Like, Dr. Ford changed my life. No, but that's, you know, it's good to have good teachers. It's good to have good role models. Obviously, the bad student in me prevailed. Like I would do well in like they're in the class. Like I would, I would I would read well or whatever the hell else I would deliver the hell out of. Like if we were, we read a what was it like, like in five degrees. Oh that. Yeah, I think we watched the movie too. Yeah. We also watched the movie was really good. Yeah, but I would deliver the hell out of the lines when we were doing, like the reading from the play and that type of thing. I'm the Color Purple, the same thing. But yeah, I was I would obviously not do great as a, you know, when it came to like any work we had to do ourselves outside of school. Oh, that's one getting done. No, no, not if it was up to me. I get it done 10 minutes before class. Yeah, as always. Yeah. And I remember I probably skated by and that was kind of like just with, like a maybe a D or C or some shit like that. And I was just a shitty student, like an unreasonably bad to like it's so bad that, like, I like because there were kids in our class who smoked weed every day. I was. Yeah, you know what I'm saying? Like this class and smoke weed every day. Hey, hey. And easy. But, I mean, it's more of a compliment. Honestly, you ended up doing well and yet and went to a good college like. And that like. I was not me. I was like, I wasn't doing drugs or anything, but I just was I didn't I was super disillusioned with school. Like I had 100%. I had every turn where I felt like I was learning something that I didn't give a fuck about or some that I wouldn't use ever. You were like, Fuck, I didn't. I didn't apply myself to it. Mm hmm. And so I wouldn't. I didn't do good. And I didn't. Yeah. And it wasn't like my mom was, like, checking to make sure I was doing homework. She might have asked and I did my, I guess, to the right. And then I was doing basketball too. So like that gave me like I was out to I wouldn't be home till like eight, nine on school night and shit. And so and then I'd have to come home and do like chores and shit and like. So a lot of time I wasn't doing homework, you know, sometimes we'd have eight, nine, I'd get home and then come back, have to get back up and go to school or like working five or six because that was when we'd have maybe we had a game that day. We had like an extra practice in the morning and definitely in hindsight, terrible idea to to do for children terrible idea was to have them out like we'd have practice too in yeah because I was like an hour commute from school so we'd have practiced til like seven 730. Oh. And then like a few of us, like some of the, some kids had cars, some kids would, you know, carpooled. But it wasn't as many kids that lived as far north as we lived, period. And it would like no one on the basketball team. They lived that far north. Yeah. So I was taking the train every day myself. And at a certain point. One of our friends, Cole, who was on the basketball team, would give or would give me a ride, like halfway. So, like, I was still getting home at like eight, eight. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. And so, yeah, it terrible idea to have kids out running and shit. And it wasn't like we were just following, you know, out studying. Right. We were spending physical energy and shit and mental energy and then they expect you to do your own and then yeah, have to do homework and they get and apparently some kids did it. Let me not, you know, make excuses. Some kids did it. You know, some kids succeeded. That shit. I was it wasn't for me. I also had a fucking sleep disorder. So that didn't help. You did? Oh, my God. Yeah. You never. You, like, slept a weird times? No. Yes. Because you were always falling asleep in class and forgot about that. You're. I was slowly nuclear as well. Yes, I didn't sleep disorder, bro. So what was the sleep disorder? It was like a normal day. So I was diagnosed with sleep apnea around like sixth grade. And I didn't have, like, a fucking CPAP machine. I guess they decided it was mild enough that I didn't need all machine, but it was apparently severe enough to still affect me. Um, I had also suffered from narcolepsy throughout my whole, like, childhood. My mother would also often like in my siblings, they would, they would mention like how I would just sleep. Like I would fall asleep when I would be at the grocery store and all these I fall asleep on the bagging bench, you know, at all these. Oh, wow. You know, they like it would be shit like that. I felt I would like if I came home during the day, I fall asleep just on the middle, in the middle of the floor in our apartment. Oh, shit. Happen all the time. So yes, I had a sleep disorder which also made it extra. Not good for me. That makes sense. Yeah. So, yeah. And I also was disillusioned with school, so all that shit piled on top of each other to make up in a very particular breed of bad student. Well, you know, good student. Bad student. You're still alive. Yeah. Fun fact. Matt is a family man. He has a partner. He has a wonderful is too. Yeah, he just made two sneaky Matt. Sneaky Matt on August 18th. Yeah. So, you know, there's we did talk about a lot of fox shit and like how Matt was not necessarily the greatest dude, but that's fine, right? Like, everyone takes different paths and life. Everybody figures out what they want, what they're good at, and either make me feel I've worked through this shit already. I'm okay. Nah, nah, nah, nah. I'm not trying to not trying to make it like that. I'm just, you know, wrapping it up in a bow. Okay. Yeah, but. Okay, so you said one of the reasons that, like, if something didn't interest you, you didn't apply yourself. But clearly that's not the case with journalism, right? There must be some what motivates you? What drives you to pursue journalism the way that you do? Because like for me personally, I love reading. You know, I love reading news, I love reading articles, I love reading people's perspectives. But I could never see myself as a journalist. I don't have that. What is that motivating factor for you that keeps you going? There's a Q There's definitely curiosity is a big part of it. Um, I, I'm a very solution oriented person. Okay. I find, and that's kind of manifests itself in, in those in the, in my career is like I've, I, I just do journalism to try and. Answers shared about the world that I feel like needs to be answered. Okay. So like, for example, my first I, I first ever like journalism, like experience really was outside of that, that class was I did this thing called on the Money magazine. It was like a little internship, I should say. Little was a great experience on the Money magazine. Yeah, on the Money magazine. It was a financial literacy magazine for teens buy homes. It was a couple of people are women are the people that put me on to it and they are there to outstanding women. Kalia little she plug in you know out of this world with what she does heavy into charge heavy you know she she like does she's very much a an impressive person and then Trinity Baker, they kind of influenced me to do it. We like went on a trip one time with this business course, this business class we were both in, and they were like, they're, you know, doing all the Money magazine. And so I joined that. That was the first time I didn't read like actual journals and like I wrote for a magazine. I also helped do production for that magazine. So in doing that, I did interviews with people and like one of the people I interview, for example, is this entrepreneur who went to Simeon Name Bakery, Bakery, Bakery. Simmons He had a Coleman brand. His father actually was in the NBA and I can't and his father owned success, if I'm not mistaken. Oh, he owns success. Yeah. Oh, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A lot of it. Yeah. Success was a big one and they had all the time I don't know if they still, but I hope they are. I think they moved okay. They used to be on like I think 14th and then they yeah. Like around, like around somewhere near McCormick Place. But yeah, yeah, yeah. So, so yeah. And when I did that interview, I found myself this was a high school student who like I did a lot of research for, for him to be a damn high school student. Right. Right. So, like, I'm, I'm, I'm interviewing him for this profile for the magazine and like, I wanted to learn everything I could about him before I spoke to him. Mm hmm. And so I did that, and it was fun to do. We had a good interview. The article was nice. And then I. I went. When I went to CU, I applied to be on the daily Canada University Daily Kansan and the University Daily Kansan was it was the school run newspaper. But it was my first introduction to like, really like being in a part of a editorial studio in a newsroom, like a real true editorial team. That's what I was looking for. Re editorial team. So I had it, yeah. Had editor in chief. I had, you know, we had copy editors, we had the whole editorial process were like, you know, it had to whatever we wrote had to be run up the ladder and everything. And before it got published, so I had an editor named Laura and Laura was a news editor and I was started off doing news. And when I did news, I again was very like intentional about learning as much as I could before I went into an interview. Right. Sometimes to my detriment. Sometimes, like I would learn a bunch and like almost be talking for the person I was interviewing. Mm. And as always, bad, you know, never, you never want to do that. I don't know if there's any potential journalism or aspiring journalists listening. You never, no matter how much you research, don't answer questions for the person. Hmm. You know, just ask them the question and use your knowledge, your background knowledge to, you know, inform follow ups and shit like that. Okay. But, um, yeah, I, but I researched the hell out of everything I was doing and it was the most, the thing I gave them most of my mental and my mental energy too while I was in college. The thing I, I find myself thinking back on the most from college, the thing I found was, I mean, other than my relationship, but, and the thing that I find myself applying myself to from college that more than anything else I did. And so yeah, I did. It was like and your initial question was basically like, what motivates you? What keeps you going? Yeah, it's a it's a it's a thirst for research is a thirst for like learning the answers to the things that I want and want to find answers. So like when it came to reporting on schools? When I came when I was reporting on schools in Chicago. Right. I was like, You're on a bus, right? So yeah, it was mostly like how students felt like about their about their circumstances. Cause I like the students. I like the. The schools weren't up to par for the most part. Mm hmm. This is specifically referring to around the time when students were coming back from COVID. Okay. And they felt like they were being put in harmful situations in terms of like like there was kids who were reporting, like, the water coming out brown and found, oh, you know, teachers not wearing their mask and not enforcing enforcing mask mandates. Okay. Stuff like that. Right. And so, like, I gave everything I had to trying to expose their point of view. The students. Yes, the students point of view. Because, again, in the in the pursuit of trying to solve this problem or solve in any way, I can't find out solutions to this problem. You could find everybody's perspectives as adults about solutions except for the students. If you looked up any news article around that time, there are very few that gave real like maybe they got one quote from a student. There are very few that actually gave real effort and energy towards hearing these students out. And that was something I felt like, okay, this is probably a big part of the solution. Right. Like if we keep hitting our heads against the wall, trying to figure this out, okay, what are we not doing that we could be doing? And so, like, how old were these students that you were interviewing? I mean, I was interviewing I interviewed a few second and third graders. Like I interviewed I'd swear interview everybody from second grade to senior year in high school. Yeah, everybody's huge. And their parents and the parents. Yeah, it was, uh. Yeah, it was just important to me to get that perspective out because I felt like that perspective was what would help solve this issue. And what you find a lot of times is that would help solve the issue. The thing that most people are thinking about, especially of the issues, one that's persistent. Hmm. You know, it means that some somebody is overlooking something here. And so in this instance, you think they're overlooking the students? They were 100% overlooking the opinions of students. Mm hmm. And they still do to this day. I mean, you ask students what they feel like they should be learning in school. Right. And we often think they're like, there's no like you kids know, you know, especially like high school. There's no high school, like I said, when I was in high school. Mm hmm. I knew I didn't want to learn some of this. I knew I wasn't going to be a chemist. I knew I was going to use physics. I knew that, you know, all these courses that they had me doing, they didn't you know, the the thing I could use most was English class. Right. And yeah. So, like, there was there was that disconnect there, too. Like, people, adults feel like kids have no they have no frame of reference for things, are they? Because they are young? They don't they don't have the big picture in mind or whatever. But we know enough to know what we don't want to do or not going to value. Right. That's fair. At the very least, we know that and we might not get it right 100% of the time, but we at the very least know what, like things that like you knew something you wanted to apply yourself to. Right? I mean, you knew something that you would like to be focused on, something you'd like to learn, even if it was within the subject you were already learning, knew that there was something maybe in particular you'd like to focus on. And that's the type of, you know, we don't give at least that I feel like we need to give them at least that amount of credit to be able to say, Well, I'd like to focus on this or I'd like to learn this, you know, so that was a yeah, that was a big one for me, the students. And yeah, it's finding solutions for like things like building community in the city, like the way the city spends money, like those type of things. You're like, well, real focused on those are those are gigantic. Yeah, gigantic problems. Yes, they were big. They were big for like they were. I did like. Yeah, I covered pretty much everything. Yeah. But you also did like arts and culture and music. But you were when you did that beat, right? It was more like just showcasing and spotlighting. Or were you applying also like somewhat of a critical lens? Yes. So I did a little bit of both. Okay. Um, but most of what you'll find in mine is like me finding artists who I found interesting, who I felt like were maybe making a difference with their community. Or maybe they. Or just simply artists that I found outstandingly I enjoyed, right. Listening to what they. They put out. Mm hmm. Or I enjoyed looking at their artwork. But, yeah, the arts and culture thing. I also applied a similar kind of philosophy to like, I wanted to focus on things that weren't being focused on enough. Mm hmm. So most of the people that you'll find me doing interviews with are people who have never been interviewed before. And that was something that it definitely added a sense of value to the like. You could see the difference between somebody who had been interviewed a ton of times, who I was talking to versus somebody who was being interviewed about this for the first time. And so, like, what's the difference? Do you think? It's like they're more genuine because they're more like they have less experience or what is like? How would you describe that? It is so like the is kind of they're the people who have been interviewed a ton of times. They kind of seem jaded. Mm hmm. They kind of feel like they've been asking every question. And so oftentimes with with journalism, there's this annoying part of interviews where you do kind of have to ask, like, the basic questions Sometimes you try to find different ways to word them, to make them interesting. Right. But you have to get certain basic information out so that you could at least, like, look at this and, like, know that this is fact. These are facts about this person. And when you have to do that in interviews, a lot of times, and especially early on, I had this issue before I kind of, you know, figured out my, you know, my my my tactics. You had this issue where you would start interviewing people and have to ask them these basics, and they get kind of dry because they are. Here we go. Right. Right. They're like, here goes. Yeah. But I knew that I had done a ton of research, probably more than the last person they interview. And I was going to ask them something that I knew they hadn't been asked before. And and it's not to toot my own horn. It's of like I really gave up put in effort for this. I absolutely tried to, you know, turn over every stone with these people so that I wasn't asking the same things they'd been asked in a previous role. And so that was one of the major differences. Like they kind of seem jaded once they have done it a ton of times. Like I would go to music festivals, for example. Oh, shit. Yeah, you got to like I did Pitchfork 2018, I want to say. And you just interviewed people and I was yeah, I see that pitchfork interviewing a bunch of people in like the thing is that you come up to them and try to interview them. They don't, they don't really care for real. They don't they're not. They're half listening. Yeah. Because you're like the 50th person with the microphone has come up to them and ask them questions. Right. I mean, there's a bunch of people at Pitchfork doing music coverage for. So that's that's one of those examples where you see that. But with local artists or artists that hadn't been really, you know, spoken to yet, you'd really get you'd get them like really opening up to you'd get them really like, you know, breaking down like things that not just inspired them to do the music that they do but like kind of inform the way they look at the world or like, you know, you'd get a real meaningful answer to like why this art means something to them or why this song means something to them. Or like you get a real vivid, detailed story about how they came up with this record and like, you know what that studio session was like and you know how they met these people that they, they, they'd worked with. Like, it was, um, that was the most, the most interesting part of it. And then afterwards they gave a fuck, you know, like they, they'd post like their pictures with this the article, they'd post article on their social media. They, it was imprint. They post pictures of the newspaper. They, they, you could tell it mattered to them. And that did something to me at least. I felt like I saw that it was doing something for the music and arts and culture scene in general. Right. So, like, it just kind of energized people to care about this. Mm hmm. And and I saw it in the sense that, like, they would hit, like, once an artist put out a wrote a profile about somebody, say, I did a story about this poet named Quinn. Quinn Riley. And she's an outstanding poet. She had this outstanding poem named Wendy, which was the one that came that there was a sent to me and I think she sent it to me actually. But after I did the story about Quinn, you know, it would be other artists that would come in my DMS. Like, hey, like, you know, it gave an energy to these other artists or like be like, I know that person. I know. Quinn Right. And. Quinn is in the goddamn Chicago reader, and they're like, Let me talk to this guy. And that means that I can be in the goddamn Chicago Reader. And like, it was breaking down that barrier of, like, artists feeling like they had, like they weren't so low on the totem pole that they couldn't be on newsstands across the city. That's fair. You gave a voice to people who are, like less recognized. And that has that definitely has an outsized effect, for sure. For sure. Like, you know, just in general, like, it makes more sense. Like you're small time, you're in the fucking Chicago reader. It's a huge deal. Whereas you've been on MTV or you've been featured in New York Times, like you don't give a shit. Like you're already tired of all these people. Yeah. So I guess the I guess it's catch them while they're young. Yeah. And not jaded. Yeah. Yeah. That's interesting, because I wonder if you're going to keep those connections, like, say, they blow up. Oh, yeah, I do. So, like, Quinn is the kind of shit that her for a lot of her focus toward education. She still I think I believe she still writes poetry. I definitely of read books of hers, her chapbooks of her, since we did our interview. Mm hmm. But, yeah, other artists that I interviewed, they. They become, you know, bigger stars like Kid Kane is a great example. K Kim was somebody I definitely was his I believe it was his first interview ever. DeVry Every first print interview kid, a kid can end up being like he's in paper magazine and he has a Barbie doll. He has a he's a Barbie doll. He has a kid Kim Barbie doll. She at the time, he was a 15 year old openly gay rapper from the South Side. Wow. And he was he was he was outstanding in his his delivery and his he was really I'm sorry. He was really good for a 15 year old, first of all. Mm hmm. But he was definitely a like, you know, art. He's he's pretty graphic in the things he's saying. So a lot of content. Yeah. You know, he was very openly gay in his raps, too. And then she was like, you know, he it was out like when I saw his solo, I got it, you know, like it was. Yeah, he came up. Yeah. I was like, I gotta talk this motherfucker. Yeah. So I reached out to him to do an interview and shit like that. And we. We did this story for the radio was amazing. I love it. Yeah. So, like, he's somebody who's, who's gotten, you know, a lot bigger since we we interviewed somebody else who I could think of as, like, a O.G. Steve-O. I first spoke to O.G. Steve. I knew I knew Steve since he was in high school. We we hoop together. And once in a while, it fell apart. And he was he was rapping. He was a NIU and he was I mean, he was, you know, bubbling up around the time around 2018. Mm hmm. This was when I was an intern at The Reader, and I was I would speak to Steve, and I spoke to Steve for the for the interview, and I was like a quick like, you know, I made sort of like 20 minutes, 30 minutes. A few years later, I'm speaking to Steve. I'm in a studio session with him for 2 hours. We were talking for a full feature story for the tribe and it was it came out great. And then right after that, Steve performed that lyrical harmony, you know, so he's he's somebody again who's, you know, grown a lot since we so yeah it happened in his quarters he is doubly dope to see and stump still somebody I'm in contact with Q Kim like is more so like I don't talk to him that often but like when I see some dope shit that he's doing up there and, you know, write props or whatever, absolutely clear acts who you mentioned in the beginning, she's somebody actually who I didn't interview when I first wrote about her, but I wrote about her. E.P. called X back from my blog back in, like, 2016. Mm hmm. And yes, she or maybe that was later, maybe was 2017. But it was a blog that I had called the Major. And yeah, I interviewed her for that. So like that I will it is dope to see that the development because now she you know, she's saying get the sky game in a ball game and oh, she has his new single, There's Fire and she's done radio interviews and stuff like that. So it's crazy. Yes. Cause, you know, like moves exclusive of growth. Yeah. So. Okay, speaking of growth, right. We're going to talk about your growth because you've gone from we've crossed the gambit of Matt telling us he wasn't. A good student to he, you know, found his love for journalism, pursued that he just told us about all these dope people that he's interviewed who are now thriving. And this man, you know, it's like the butterfly effect, right? Like something happens. And then down the road, it's an outcome of that. You know, his his writing definitely played a factor in that. And so now, you know, you're a freelance journalist, your family man. You've had a lot of success and you've built a pretty large network. You're now moving into being a CEO, an entrepreneur. Right. With We Home LLC. Mm hmm. And it's a creative media platform, right? Yeah. Yeah. And so what is your aim? What? Why why are you deciding to dove into this venture? It's, again, this kind of solution oriented thing, me trying to like I feel like there's a lack of community. And I think a lot of that lack of community is driven by the media. Interesting. Yeah. The lack of connection that we have between people is very much influenced by media. It's something that you learn a lot by the do like research in media literacy. And I realized that the tribes or the tribe we report to Black Chicago. So like all the stories we reported on were in some way tied to how they affected black Chicagoans. Mm hmm. So I interviewed a lot of black folks. And, I mean, there's pretty much 80, 90% of people I interviewed. I interviewed a lot of black Chicagoans. And, well, what I would find almost universally was a complete misunderstanding or just lack of knowledge about what were my job was what the editorial process was like. You know, you get people asking, like, whether they'd get to, you know, if they could they could review what I write before before we put it out. There's not a thing. Please don't ever ask a journalist that Donna should make sure it is important that you are certain that they're your words are correct. So I always invited people to, like I would whenever I got a lead for a story first prize would get that link with the person, the people I interview for their story right before I posted it. Anywhere else, they get it. A text message from me. Mm hmm. And I wanted to make sure it was really important to me that they, you know, that at the very least, like, know that you're not going to get to decide what gets said. Right. But you get to decide whether it's accurate or not. Like if I said some if I'm quoting you, I want to make sure that I'm not mischaracterizing what you're saying. Course, because it doesn't you know, it doesn't serve me in any way to to mischaracterize what you say, because then it makes my story kind of fallacious and it allows you to poke holes in in how you can go on social media and be like, this guy lied about such and such and said, you know, I'm saying, yeah. So to avoid that and to just bring people in on the process, because if something is so important, like you're giving your voice to these stories you're the reason why these stories are able to be written when you are the person being interviewed and you have to understand that value in that. And so, yeah, people didn't understand, like their role in that. They didn't understand like, you know, I'd have to explain to people how things get published, where it's going to be published Right. I had to under like let people know that I, you know, I was under the supervision of an editor. So like this, you know, it won't be literally everything you say. Like, you know, some stuff will be here, like taken out here and there. So that lack of education or understanding was like. I could see especially do 2020. And working in media to the things that were going on in the uprisings then and being a reporter on the on the ground. All these at all these protests. Uh huh. That this stuff that we were putting out wasn't just this. This wasn't just stuff, you know, for. Our pleasure as journalists, too, right? Because we always wanted to be writers and we always wanted to be in a newspaper. This stuff was informing how people view the world. This stuff was like politicians are quoting this stuff when they are making policy decisions like, you know. It's not unusual to hear of a mayor or a presidential candidate mention something is written in an article as as like, you know, backing or evidence for the need for some policy measure. It's it's it's the things that like when you're voting, when you talk to voters, what are they referring to? They refer to the things that they read in news or seen in news. Hmm. You know, and, like. And then you also get people referring to things that they've seen in person. And a lot of that is also influence what we see in news. Right. So one of the big things in media literacy is understanding how cyclical our understanding of the world is, right? I mean, fucked up. It's like there is a level of like so media reflects real life, right? So like when you watch a show, for example, I'll use like entertainment media. You watch a reality TV show is supposed to be capturing the reality of somebody. Right. So when you capture that reality and you broadcast it to a bunch of people, people start to, you know, say, for example, Real Housewives, a Real Housewives of Atlanta, for example, even better because they're black. And I can use that to really illustrate how like one of the biggest things is that if you aren't around a group of people in your everyday life where you the perception you have of them is majority informed by the things you see in media about them. So if you are some white person living in the suburbs or even a white person in Chicago who doesn't have a ton of black colleagues or friends, right. Your perception of black people is do like the Real Housewives or like, do you know, maybe MBA or hip hop drama or like, you know, stuff, that type of stuff. If that's your majority depiction of that group of people, even if you aren't concerned, because a lot of it is unconscious bias adults. Yeah. But even if you aren't conscious of it, you are often when you meet another black person thinking in your head that you know they are going to be somewhat in some way like these housewives or like these in some element of their being. Or if you see in the news that say. These black kids get into a fight somewhere, you say? Well, it is a subconscious thought a lot of time. Well, that's why would them housewives be doing you know I'm saying like. So that that the of what often happens in to contrast good contracts that if you watch an Orange County. Uh huh and you are a white person lunar suburbs and you are surrounded by a bunch of you know you see a bunch of white mothers all the time. You know that. That's pagan. These are characters, right? So they don't necessarily, uh, they don't become the entire your. Your entire understanding of what white women are. Fuck. You have a bunch of white women in your life who are not that. Wow. And so what happens is, you know, and this is this applies to the black people who watch this stuff. You watch. And I was just it's funny. I was just on TV talking about this very thing. You have black kids who will. There. Take a break here from Chicago, from. From living in poverty in Chicago. Like myself. Mm hmm. If all you if, you know, you realize at a certain point when you're poor, then poverty is the biggest issue in your life. Right? You realize that when you can't do certain stuff, when you're having a hard time going places or like you can't give stuff, you see other people getting it. Poverty is the number one problem of your life as a kid. I mean shit throughout your life. As long as you're poor. Uh huh. And if you see that the only people who have solved your biggest problem. Uh huh. Are rappers. People on Real Housewives athletes. These are the only people in your life who you see have solved the biggest problem in your life, which is being poor so that you follow. You're going to act like them. You're going to think that this is how you should act. And it could be even a subconscious thing. But to you, you think the way G herbo makes money is how I should make money. Wow. The way the way Mufg and Phaedra Parks makes money is how I should make money. And even though favorite parts of it. And the thing is that you don't get enough of the full detail of them. Right? You don't get the detail that visa passes fucking. It is an outstanding lawyer. She's not just some lady on Real Housewives, but when you watch Real Housewives, you get that Phaedra Parks is just a, you know, a sassy housewife. Mm hmm. She's an outstanding lawyer with the whole career. Right. Right. When you when you see, you know, hear g herbo rapping, you aren't getting the fact that herb had a very specific experience of living ourself and have it and feel the need to carry guns to school to keep yourself safe. You do not need a gun in school. Right. You don't in life. Yeah. You. Nine times out. Well, ten times out of ten. There is no kid that needs a gun at school. That's fair. That's. But you can understand that his lifestyle was 100% different because of other people in his family who were involved in shit, which made him a target. You know, the lack of the again, the lack of of seeing other people embedded in the, you know, hers probably like me. The only people we saw growing up who were wealthy in real life or who had money in real life. So drugs. Right. So, you know, like I knew the mafia from the hood who would come around every once in a while in my my big brother looked up to him. And so I saw him as somebody who was, you know, and I guess I was intelligent enough to not go that route. And, like, I had other opportunities and other people saying that I could do more, which is also very important. Of course. But if those are the that's what you see is like the only thing that could get you out of this. That's what you do. So, of course, my brother saw him. This guy who he grew up seeing, you know, do this. And he decided to you know, he decided to follow in his footsteps. And that's not to say, you know, my brother is great now he's a father and has and, you know, is working on himself and has a career truck driver now, which is outstanding, but as well. Yeah. And that's kind of like that's a lot of it becomes cyclical, right? Like, you know, G Herbo is informed by like stuff that he sees or lack thereof and then other kids see jihad will be like that and like they say, Well, I got to be like her. And even though you talk to her, Herbie will tell you, always go. Gangbanger Bring a gun to school, right? He's not going to do that. That's just his life. That's what he experience. Yes. And unfortunately, he became, you know, so, yes, it very cyclical, these things. And they they end up being like how we vote. They end up, you know, influencing how we treat other people. They influence how we talk to other people who we give opportunities to, who we see value in the communities we care about. Yeah, all of that stuff is yeah, it's cyclical in it and a lot of it is the cycle is perpetuated by the media and I want people to understand that. And so I've kind of dedicated my. Career to educating people on that. Well, you see, like you spoke very eloquently on a lot of issues. We also spoke very plainly in a way that like it's of course, what you're talking about are very complex, complex subjects that are happening in the background at all times. With the way you spoke about that, you know, it really relates because it's true. You know, like if you have no black people around and the only representation you have is like, I don't fucking know, like Real Housewives of Atlanta or the NBA or rappers. Yeah. Like, obviously you're going to think probably cognitively biased. You're black. Maybe that's how they all are, right? Just fucked up. Similarly, like for me, right? I'm Asian. I feel like I've benefited in a weird way because everyone thinks we're the model minority. Yeah, right. So for me, it's like I slip under the cracks because it's like, oh, he's Asian. He, he can't even heard of fucking a fly or whatever. And I'm like, well, no, like I'm myself, I do my things like, yeah, there's this Asian. He's fucking crazy, there's that Asian. They're fucking crazy. But we all, for some reason, are cast in this one. Like, I think like I'm reading a different mirror right now by I think his last name is Takei. And I'm reading through the part about like just overall. George Takei. George Takei, I think. Okay. George Takei is the Star Trek. Oh, good. That's what I'm then. I mean, I see him writing a book, but Ronald Reagan Takaki, I will put it in the in the show quotes. But anyway, you know, he talks about how like America is always been this division between white and other because that's just how it's always been. And it's tough, bro, because like, you just think about how complicated these dynamics are, you know, like you think why people want to feel bad about the shit that their people did. No. You think that, like, Asians want to feel this way because of whatever? No, like. Like, I mean, overall, like, you know, if I'm just calling a spade a spade a spade, like, fuck, dude. Like the the black the African American experience, the black experience must be just is so complicated. You guys have had to, I don't know, like, because I don't want to speak out of pocket. But just from my understanding. Right. I want to hear you. It is so. It's just such. You know, because it's what bothers me is like it's like a permanent kind of scapegoat. You know what I'm saying? Like, no matter what happens, no matter what you guys do, like, it's always like there is that trauma and there is that history that we never reconciled as a country. Mm hmm. And, well, we are digging further and deeper into like I like to think about it this way. Like segregation ended less than 60 years ago. That is absolutely nuts. Like to think about how fresh the wounds in this country are. Like Japanese people were interred in camps in camps in America only 80 years ago. You know what I'm saying? The Rodney King riots happened 30 years ago. Yeah, George Floyd happened three years ago. There are so many just things boiling to a head so quickly in this country. And I think, like, it's not really about race. It's never been about race. It's more about class. Yeah, and I think you're right with media literacy, right? You control the narrative. And so you we get this racial based picture, you know, it's like they are these people. They're these people. They're that people. But we never really come to look at it and go, well, you know, we're kind of the same class like that dude is broke. I'm broke or he's middle class. I'm middle class. That's what the Irish did, bro. Like the Irish were always placed in the same. And right after the Civil War they were placed in the same box as free as as newly freed men. Mhm. And they couldn't get any jobs because they were like they were considered like the sub and they, the way they got out of it where it was they were white like how dare you. Like. Yeah. Just to think about how fucking crazy that is. Yeah. At that point, you know, you can't blame them because it's become a survival Typekit. It sort of. Yeah, it becomes like you. Well, you know, what do I have in common with the ruling class? At least I'm white. I'm so let me try. And, you know, maybe I'll fucking work on my accent and, you know, try my best to sound like an American, whatever the hell else. And then segregation and that Jim Crow happens and that type of shit, you know, it becomes much easier to be white of any, you know, breed because they didn't say it. They didn't say American whites only. It was whites only. Yeah. So yeah. That was a and it's a. It's a very, uh. Definitely a checkered past, but it's definitely a type of thing. We're like when you don't do what needs to be done to reconcile that shit. It kind of just. You know this thing we're like. They just want you to get over it. And you hear this all the time and not the first black person to say this, but like they want us to just get over it. But there's no like there hasn't been any real reconciliation. Yeah. Like, you know, redlining is something that could happen to you. Like, you could be denied housing in a specific neighborhood because you were black. As recently as when my mother was a child, you know? And so like and that's my you know, my mother was a child, not her mother. Your mother when she was it, you know. So, like, you have to think about and be like, well, if and I'm 25, so there's another 25 year old somewhere whose mother was not able to family probably you know, they tried to live somewhere in Chicago, was denied access to that and had to grow up somewhere shitty because they lumped us all on to certain areas in areas where they, you know, often didn't invest a ton of resources. Of course, they powders on top of each other and like and that was just their story. And that that's the reality for like so many black people. So me, you know, when you when you get young black people who are just extremely upset about this shit and like the reality is that media literacy is not something that's accessible to really anything. I wouldn't say there is any race. Yeah, there is. Like particularly at media literacy, you're like very media literate. No. Yeah, I agree with you. It happens too. I mean, should you think a rural right, rural white people are some of the worst friggin, you know, victims of being preyed on by media? And that's what ultimately like when I talk to people about media literacy, the way I put it, is that my goal is to help people be in control of their relationship to media. It isn't to make you stop watching TV because I still watch shows, you know, certain show. I don't watch a ton of them. You know, it does. It does. Once you learn more, you do become a little you start to scrutinize what you watch a little more, a little bit more, you know, a selective about what you consume. But I want I want you to be in control of that, because if you don't know how media works, then you will be allowed you will be preyed upon, because ultimately they're trying to get out the media's will is the money that we make is is to advertising dollars. Right. You need the eyes, you need the clicks. So the way the easy way to look at is you're the product. You, the viewer are the product. The people producing these shows are selling you as a collective of people to these advertisers saying you pay us fucking, you know, however many millions and we can provide you a couple million viewers and the advertiser will share. Great. And what the media will do because that's the case is put out whatever they feel like the most viewers will look at. Mm. Because that will make them the most money. Right. I mean another thing is that, I mean a lot of this, you know, the more you learn about it, the more you'll probably start to question capitalism and that type of shit. If you are a critical thinker, you probably will start to, you know, question the way that our society is is kind of run economically. So no, absolutely. And I think like for a healthy democracy and just better a healthy populace, like you need to have an ability to critically think. And obviously, you know, I think we're both in the same boat that the education system, the way that the system is designed, is not meant to make you critically think, you know like obviously like school. You know, I think a big reason why a degree is such a big deal for like big companies is because they realize like, oh, you can do X, Y and Z for four years with a carrot in front of your head. Then that means you could probably keep a care in front of your head. So your 30 keep scared ahead and so you're 40, but you can go down. But that's all good. But realistically, right? Like we're not breeding people to think critically. Like there has to be a desire of your own. You have to do it on your own accord. Yeah. So that's good that you're like bringing all this light. I want to wrap this up in, like, kind of a nicer bow because, again, you know, dark and. No, no, no, no, no. This is why this is this is why we're talking this is all beneficial for everybody. You know, I want to wrap it up in a nicer book is I only know, maybe like four or five fathers around my age group. And you are one of them and you are like them. There's one other guy. He's in Ohio. His super family man goes to church. There's no there's lit. I admire that. Yeah. Also, you know, we were sitting on the Irish this is kind of this is super tangential. But he is married he he married a black girl. He's Irish. They have a beautiful daughter named Noemi, you know? And, you know, it's funny. Before the I think it was Lovelace or the Lovelace, you know, before that case, like marriage between the races was illegal, which is just absolutely crazy to think about just how much how stupid all these things are and how we're still working towards. Towards parody is so stupid and it becomes so obvious once you learn about it, you're like, Oh my God. Like, Are we serious here? But anyway, to wrap it up on a nice note, your father, Matt Matthew Harvey Jr. Stinky Matt. Mm hmm. How does it feel to be a father? Like, is there, you know, just give us, like, a little perspective on that. It's, uh. It's amazing. It's really cool. Like, is, uh. It is definitely the, you know, for a long time, being a journalist was, like, the coolest part about my identity. And I think to a lot of people from the outside, it definitely still is. Or being a writer more so. But to me, I've become a bit identified. So much of being a father and like, taking care of my son, like. Like. The reality is that, um. When babies are born, they are not human. They are human. Like, they're not a person. Right. Okay. They're person. Like the moral sense in the sense they're like, you know, you value their life now they're born. You know, I'm a I'm kind of I'm a pro-choice guy, but once they're born, you value and fuck out of their life. Right. But they don't know how people think. They don't know what people do. All they know is how to circuitry and crime and all that. That's all they know and do. That's true. And so it becomes your responsibility to not only protect this person, because, of course, like, there's the things of like protection and provision, but you have to teach them everything about being a person. And that means shift from walking to talking to of course, then it becomes more complex shit like discipline and respect and, you know, just decorum, you know, like learning and being curious and and all these things are like it. I am never like I told about like I didn't apologize or to a lot of shit in high school. There is nothing in my life that I have applied more of myself to. And, you know, it sounds obvious, but it is very true that nothing in my life I would buy more of myself to them than fatherhood And and I mean every bit of myself, every bit of my physical energy, my mental energy, my emotional energy is is, you know, baked into this kid. That's true. And so that with that being said, like, it means that there's is definitely a heightened level of responsibility. You know, I have an understanding that like my behaviors and thoughts and emotions and everything else will impact him in. Impact how he grows. Mm hmm. Means that I have to think more about that shit, because, I mean, the the. The thing with a human is that worst case scenario, you create a person that grows up and kills people. You know, I'm saying, like, it's really high stakes when you really think about boil it down to Jesus Christ, you know, cause you have these crazy I feel like I had to think about it like this. Like this is like you have to boil it down to the nitty gritty. The worst case scenario is that my kid grows up and becomes a fuckin serial killer or a serial rapist or some shit. Right. So, yeah. So you start from the point of let me what do I have to do to make sure that doesn't happen? Right. And then you start to be like, okay, that's the bare minimum. What do I what do I want him to be like? What do I like? Do I want him to be? And there's an instinctual part of it where you be like, I mean, I'm putting all my effort into, I want this kid to be like me, right? You want to succeed. I want him to be like me. So, like, in that sense, you feel like I have to do whatever I need to to succeed because I know that I want to be able to look at my son and know that he could persevere through shit, that he can take on challenges. Like I want to be able to know that my son could can learn to like he can go in and apply herself to learning a new thing, that he can be affectionate to people. He can be empathetic towards people that he can be, you know, that he can make friends well, that he can talk to people with Mm hmm. Like, these are all things that you. You want them to be able to do. So you have to be like, well, he can only do this shit if I if I show him how to do it. And so you have to do it. So it makes it a lot easier to like to resolve to like, you know, be solution oriented instead of, like, dwelling on problems or like being, you know, super like heavy into conflict. It's so much easier to not focus on bullshit or, you know, to care about my health, my physical health or shit like that, because I want him to care about his physical health when he grows up. I want him to care about, you know, I want him to be able to take on challenges in person. We all want him to be able to be creative in his thinking and in, you know, if he has an idea to go in triumph, I can do that idea. Mm hmm. As long as he's not harming nobody. Um, and I. And so when that. When I. So that's what it's a it's a lot of it's taken every part of me. It well, it it sounds like, you know, but it yeah, it takes every part of me to do this. And it also is like it requires me to grow in myself, to be a better person, to be in every in every sense of the word, to be a better person. So yeah, that's is a it's a cool experience, is fun, is a lot of challenging. This shit is hard. I would not recommend any following 25 year old. I repeat, I would not recommend any 20 anything year old. To go out and decide to have a child. It is something that I did by mistake. Quite honestly, when we first found out, I tried my damnedest to not have the motherfucker. But, you know, I was in a very committed relationship with his mother and we were deeply in love. And so we decided to fucking work shit out to make it happen. And it has been the biggest challenge in both of our lives. It has caused big challenges in our relationship and we continue to work those things through because we are good communicating and we want him to be like that. And that's and that's really important that we you know, when you find a partner to be aligned or shit like that, the things that you value like, you know, those, those type of things are super important and not thought about enough. And yeah, so Dev, we don't do that shit until you're ready to give your life to somebody else. I wasn't necessarily ready, but it has made me it has given me the challenge to get ready and. Yeah. I feel like I'm doing a pretty good job already, quite honestly. Well, I mean, I don't know, man. Like, just from, like, third party perspective, you seem like you have a vivre. You know, you have, like, a purpose for life. And who's that joie de vivre? It's like a joy for life. Yeah, you know, so I think. What is that? There's barbarouses. There are no mistakes. Only happy accidents. Mhm. Yeah. That's a good way to put it. So let's, you know, be happy as happy accident and stinky Matt as wonderful. I was at Stinky first birthday party. I had a great time. Great is good. Keep bringing people together. Who knew two year old birthday parties could be so fun. But yeah, man, I'm happy for you though. Like it seems like things are going pretty well. Yeah. Yeah, they. They're going well, getting better. And that's all I go for, brothers. All I'm trying to do is just to get better. I want to leave this motherfucker a little better than when I came in, and, uh. And I mean that mostly about my life. Not really the world. Fuck the world. Mostly just out of hope. I like to end out better that if I get started. So that's. That's what the biggest goal is. I think you're only contributing positively to the world, with your journalism, with you being a good father, with you having a good relationship, and just bringing a voice to people who may not necessarily have had a voice. You know, you're doing good work. And that's why we brought you on here, right? Like I wanted to showcase that the awesome shit that you're doing, you know, like you are very accomplished for 25 years old. And so for any listeners, if you're interested in picking this man's brain, Matt Harvey, writer, a contributor to the tribe, contributed to the reader, wrote for the Chicago Tribune. You might see more of his stuff coming out there soon, but yeah, take a look at his stuff. We Home LLC create a media platform trying to bring media literacy to more people so that we're more aware and better prepared for what may, may lie down ahead in the future. But I think we're going to wrap this up with the nice little bow tie. So like and subscribe to Next Step, Chicago. After this episode, we're going to be interviewing Marco Garcia, Amateur Boxer. So stay tuned for that and have a lovely day. Oh let me the can I can I plug we home mag dot com yeah yeah plug yourself up we home we home mag dot com w e m e imgur.com and subscribe to our newsletter once you get there. Link in the description.