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What's the Tea with Ministry?
Welcome to What’s the Tea with Ministry!
Where we spill the tea on the Jesuit and Mercy mission at the University of Detroit Mercy! Bringing you mission-centered conversation through storytelling, reflection, and community connection all over a cup of tea.
What's the Tea with Ministry?
Ramadan: Fasting & Striving for God Consciousness
Step into the heart of Ramadan as we explore its profound significance in the Muslim faith. In this enlightening episode, we engage with guests Oussama Ajerd and Hisham Almadani to share personal insights and traditions surrounding this special month. Ramadan is not just about abstaining from food and drink; it is a time for spiritual growth, charity, and community bonding, enriching lives through shared experiences.
Listeners will learn that fasting fosters a deep sense of God-consciousness, inviting individuals to reflect on their actions, words, and interactions throughout the day. The episode also covers the community gatherings that occur during Iftar, where breaking bread together cultivates connections among diverse individuals.
Join us to celebrate the values of inclusivity and connection that Ramadan inspires!
Welcome to what's the Tea with Ministry, where we spill the tea on the Jesuit and Mercy mission at the University of Detroit.
Speaker 2:Mercy- bringing you mission-centered conversation through storytelling, reflection and community connection. All over a cup of tea.
Speaker 1:Hosted by University Ministry and a student co-host.
Speaker 2:That's us. I'm Anna Bryson University Minister.
Speaker 1:And I'm Kateri Sollers, your student co-host. Today. We're going to be talking with Osama Ajerd and Nisham Almadani.
Speaker 2:Osama Ajerd is a Moroccan-American who currently serves as the youth mentor at the Islamic Center of Detroit, while also working as a software engineer. He joins our team in university ministry as our Muslim chaplain, the first one in our university's history. Osama first began studying Islamic sciences under the guidance of local scholars in Dearborn. Afterwards, he traveled back and forth to Morocco over a few years to further his traditional Islamic studies under the mentorship of scholars, spending a total of four years there. Subsequently, he obtained a Bachelor of Science in Computer Science from the University of Michigan-Dearborn. His time in Morocco led him to receive multiple certifications of transmission and teaching in various Islamic disciplines, including jurisprudence, legal maxims, prophetic narrations, theology, prophetic biography and spiritual development. When Osama is not programming or studying, he usually has a latte in hand and his nose in a book. He loves to travel with his family and explore new cultures.
Speaker 1:Hisham Malandani is a third year but senior standing communication studies major. He is co-president of the Muslim Student Association on campus and a writer for the Varsity News UDM's student newspaper.
Speaker 2:So I want to say welcome to both of you. Thank you so much for being here today on our podcast. We're excited to have you be here and share a little bit more about Ramadan. It's a holy month in Islam and we just really want to provide an opportunity for you to share about it before we actually start Ramadan. So on our podcast, we always start by sharing a cup of tea. So prior to us starting our recording, I offered everyone in the studio a cup of tea and I thought we could just go around, and in the studio a cup of tea and I thought we could just go around and, whether it's the cup of tea that you're drinking now or the cup of tea you enjoy at any other point, sharing a little bit about what your favorite type of tea is. So I'll go first and just say that today I'm drinking lemon tea, which most of the podcast listeners know that I either drink lemon tea or peppermint tea pretty much consistently on the podcast. That's all I ever drink. Kateri, what did you choose today?
Speaker 1:Today I'm drinking peppermint tea. I would say that one of my favorite teas is a lavender chamomile tea.
Speaker 2:Yummy Hisham. What did you pick?
Speaker 3:Yeah, well, first of all, thank you for having us and thank you for the tea I have Trader Joe's Organic Blood Orange Tea. I'm actually more of a coffee person, so I don't drink much tea but this blood orange is going good so far.
Speaker 2:Great, and Osama, I know you didn't choose to have tea right now, but what is your favorite tea?
Speaker 5:I just want to say thank you for having us first of all. Usually I'm split between tea and coffee, but if I'm drinking tea, it's usually just green tea leaves, but I will always add mint leaves or peppermint. I won't get flavored tea, but I'll just get like just green tea leaves.
Speaker 2:Oh, love, love, love it. So the reason we do that just so you know, if you didn't already is we always share a cup of tea as a part of our Mercy tradition. So it's part of the story of Catherine Macaulay, the founders of the Sisters of Mercy. She said on her deathbed make sure the sisters that she was leaving behind sit down and have a comfortable cup of tea. And really the purpose of that was not about the tea, but rather the conversations that happened in that space as they gathered at the end of their days to talk about their work and their ministry, and so, similarly, we like to honor that tradition by having tea on our podcast.
Speaker 2:So, again, thank you so much for being here. We are so excited to have you both, especially as we approach the holy month of Ramadan. As many Muslims around the whole world prepare for this important month, we wanted to take an opportunity to educate our campus, recognizing that we have such a lovely, vibrant Muslim population here at Detroit Mercy. We wanted to educate people on what is Ramadan for those who don't know, and also for you to be able to share your personal insights of what Ramadan means to you with our community. So, basically, to start our conversation at any point. You can both share the answer to a question. You can split it up, it doesn't matter the flow, but we'd love to start with just the explanation of what is Ramadan for those who might not know what it is.
Speaker 3:You want to go for that? I feel like you're more qualified for this.
Speaker 5:I'm not sure. Well, we'll give it a shot. So ramadan again, it's, as you mentioned, it's a holy month, uh, for for the muslim faith, islamically speaking, we have five tenets that we observe, the first being the testament of faith is a declaration that you believe in islam. Secondly is giving and charity observing the, the fast, prayer and pilgrimage. So fasting the month of Ramadan is one of the five tenets which is happening in the next month that is coming up and basically it's outwardly. There's multiple layers to what constitutes a fast. Outwardly, you have to observe you don't eat or drink or consummate a marriage from dawn until sunset. So this is the external factor.
Speaker 5:But that external and physical Fast is supposed to have a spiritual effect on you and, as God Told us in the Quran, fasting was prescribed upon you, like it was Prescribed for the nations before you, so that you maintain God consciousness. So the spiritual benefit that you're supposed to attain Is God consciousness, because any the spiritual benefit that you're supposed to attain is God consciousness Because any moment you want to do something. You're used to drinking tea in the morning or opening up the fridge multiple times a day. As you're opening it up during Ramadan, you realize no, I'm fasting, so I need to close it. You also are conscious of what you say, because you're not supposed to use vulgar language, you're not supposed to indulge in idle talk, you're not supposed to backbite and everything. So it includes or it creates in you this god consciousness that you're cautious of every movement that you do during the month of ramadan. So that's a 30 second elevator yeah, yeah, the short version explanation.
Speaker 2:I love it. I think also, just thinking about the piece of constantly being reminded of god throughout the day in your movements is a really lovely way of looking at it. Even for myself, as someone who fasts in the Catholic tradition, I don't necessarily view our fasting as different, but I don't necessarily know if in my fasting I'm thinking about that, and so that's something to review as I approach Lent, which is more of our fasting season.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Why is Ramadan important in Islam?
Speaker 3:Well, okay, To give like a I guess, personal perspective on this kind of jumping what Osama already said Ramadan is just more than you know. People think it's like you're abstaining from food and water, and that's really it, but it's way more than that, Just this whole idea of God consciousness. I think Muslims really emphasize having this idea of what we call basmala. So, like we do everything, we say basmala before we do it, which literally means in the name of God, which literally means in the name of God, so whether it's before we eat, before we start praying, before whatever it really is. So this whole mentality of God consciousness, I feel like it's elevated during Ramadan. And I already forgot your question. I apologize.
Speaker 1:Why is Ramadan important in Islam?
Speaker 3:Yeah. So it just gives you that. It's like a heightened feeling of God consciousness, that everything you do, like literally every step you take during that day is you know you kind of have God on your mind first and you do it for the sake of God. So it's just a way to like spiritually reconnect At least that's how I view it. So it's more than just just you know the food and the water that you eventually get used to. You know you don't get hungry anymore, you don't get thirsty anymore. But yeah, it's just that God consciousness that kicks back in you it's very intentional can I add something?
Speaker 5:yeah so so, throughout the Quran, god, allah, always tells us God loves those who have taqwa, taqwa means consciousness. Multiple times throughout the Quran God loves those who have taqwa, taqwa means consciousness.
Speaker 5:Multiple times throughout the Quran, god loves those who have taqwa, but it's not something that is easy to attain. It's not like you wake up one day and you say I want to have God consciousness. So Allah, subhanahu wa ta'ala, out of his mercy, gave us a month. That just eases the whole process for us and, through prophetic narrations, we have the prophet telling us one of the ways that it becomes easy is the first night of Ramadan, that it comes in the gates of paradise open up and the gates of the hellfire close and all of the devils are chained and there is an angel that is calling to all of humanity, to all of Muslims anyone that wants good let them approach forward.
Speaker 5:It's just a month where fasting not just becomes easy, but this whole process of attaining consciousness becomes easy, because everything that you do uh, we discuss sometimes about having communal meals and enjoying a meal with family, but throughout the day, uh, part of it is that you're really hungry and you're really thirsty. So part of consciousness is that you realize there are people that might have, might be living this kind of condition throughout their year, not just in the month of ramadan. You're consciously choosing to not eat, but for other people. It's, it's a reality, it's a difficulty that they have to go through, and this is just one aspect of consciousness that you ask yourself how can I carry this outside of the month of ramadan, that I'm not just over indulging in food and making sure that I share with others?
Speaker 2:Beautiful. You both mentioned it a little bit, but can you talk about the practice of fasting in Ramadan, because it's probably a little bit different than I imagine fasting is in? Obviously, I know from the Catholic perspective it's definitely different. I think Catholic fasting often is like we abstain from certain types of food at certain times of the year or certain days, like during the month of Lent. We don't eat meat on Fridays or during I shouldn't say the month of Lent. Lent is more than a month. It's not a month, it's a period of time. During Lent we don't eat meat on Fridays or on days when we're called to fast. It's not fasting from sunup to sundown, rather it's fasting, having either like one meal throughout the day rather than traditional three meals. So it's definitely a different practice. So can you share a little bit more about the practice of fasting in Ramadan with us?
Speaker 5:So there's, I think there's a lot of part of the fest and there's a cultural part of of the fest.
Speaker 5:The law part is before sun, uh, before sun, before dawn, you have to stop eating and drinking. So usually, uh, culturally speaking, a lot of families will wake up super early, around 5 am, and share a meal together. Again, this is supposed to be a light meal. You're not supposed to overindulge, but culture sometimes dictates otherwise, that you end up having uh meat and chicken at 5 am in the morning. Then you have heartburn for it, which should not be the case. But so before dawn, you, you stop eating until sunset.
Speaker 5:So as of now, as of today, dawn is 6 18 in the morning and uh, sunset is at 6 pm so you're we're talking about approximately 12 hours, which is not bad because there are times when it reaches to 17 hours of fast, but during this whole period there is no drinking, no eating whatsoever until you break your fast. That's the the law part Allah has discussed this.
Speaker 3:When you were talking about Lent, I was just thinking of the theme of sacrifice in terms of fasting. So you said you give up meat, for example, or you give up things that you usually have a lot of, or you usually tend to love.
Speaker 3:I guess it's very similar for us in Ramadan, although we technically do abstain from everything.
Speaker 3:It is, um, at least how I view it.
Speaker 3:It's like partially a sacrifice of um, giving up things that we again tend to overindulge in, and it more often than not leads to harm or leads to negative things, whether it's, you know, physically or mentally, spiritually, all of that um, but yeah, just like, in terms of like, the actual practice of fasting. It's basically what osama said we, uh or I shouldn't say we I tend to just sleep in sometimes, um, because it's difficult to wake up that early. Um, but yeah, no, if we do wake up, you know it's a very light meal, um, just you know, and make sure to at least drink some water, because that can get pretty difficult if it's a long fast, especially if it's a very light meal. Um, just you know, I make sure to at least drink some water, because that can get pretty difficult if it's a long fast, especially if it's a sunny day. Um, yeah, and then the rest of the day is just kind of, uh, usually, again, you're trying to be mindful. So it's, it's more than just the food aspect and the water aspect. You're trying to keep your mouth clean in terms of, like what you say and like you know, being nice to people doing more charity, just you know being a better person in really any way that god commanded that you can that you can be yeah
Speaker 5:actually we have a prophetic narration where the prophet says whoever is fasting but does not abstain from indulging in indecency and vulgar speech, then the only reward they have for that day is that they were hungry and thirsty. So it's not just about not drinking water, not eating food, but you continue in the same habits, you're not going to find that spiritual benefit that we're discussing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a call of change in behavior as well. Not just I didn't eat or drink anything today, even though that's're discussing. Yeah, it's a call of change in behavior as well. Not just, not just didn't. I didn't eat or drink anything today, absolutely.
Speaker 3:Yeah, even though that's an achievement of itself. Yeah.
Speaker 2:As somebody who last year I was like I'm one day during Ramadan, I'm going to, I'm going to fast the way all other Muslims fast. It was very, very hard, hard, and I imagine it like day one is probably the hardest. So for me to just do one day was probably the hardest, but if I had continued, I imagine it would have been easier in some regard. Still challenging, not to say that it's simple Um, one of the things that I didn't write down as a question, but, um, I think is important because I know it's a question that comes up for people when they hear about what fasting practices look like in the month of Ramadan is are there exemptions to people fasting? Are there times where either people aren't fasting for medical reasons or other variety of reasons? Could you share, in those cases, what that might look like for people who are exempt from fasting?
Speaker 5:yeah, so actually, like-wise speaking, like Islamic law-wise, fasting could fall into different categories where it's obligatory for you to fast, where it's an extra activity that you're doing outside of the month of Ramadan. You can choose to fast throughout the year and it's just basically extra credit that you're getting, and there are times where it's actually prohibited for you to fast. So obligatory is the month of Ramadan. It's an obligation to fast. Prohibited is during times of celebration, during eid it's prohibited to fast.
Speaker 5:Another prohibition if that fast is going to actually bring you harm, going to bring you physical harm, you should not fast. It becomes basically it's a null fast. There's no reward that comes with it. Sometimes we have this idea no, I need to fast because everyone is doing it. But from an islamic perspective, from a law perspective, it's about what, what. What is what is considered a fast? If you're not going into it through the right parameters that were set, it's not even a fast to begin with. So if there's a harm that is gonna come to you, it's it's nullified to begin with. And there are certain scenarios where it's not null. But you have the choice if you can't fast, so during the month of Ramadan.
Speaker 5:If you're traveling, for instance, you're going from state to state, you're going to another country, whatever the case may be, as travel in itself, it becomes very hectic Lugging your luggage, finding your. So in that case you don't have to fast, but you just have to make it up outside the month of Ramadan, when you're not traveling anymore. But if you're ill, and it's especially For instance, my grandma is diabetic she needs to take her insulin shots throughout the day and needs to have food, so she does not fast and she's not required to make it up whatsoever.
Speaker 2:That's fast and she's not required to make it up whatsoever. That basically suggested great, no, thank you. I just know that there are, of course, occasions where it's like you said it's prohibited or it's yeah, it's it becomes null because your intention or the reality of you fasting is going to cause you harm, which why god would never want to intentionally cause you harm and from our love speak, from our tradition speaking.
Speaker 5:Preserving the body takes priority over performing worship. So if it's a choice between the two, I'm going to perform a worship. I'm going to bring my, my body harm. No, like you, preserve the body got it important.
Speaker 1:Love that. How do you manage fasting like the? Just how do you manage it?
Speaker 2:yeah, from your personal experiences and perspectives I.
Speaker 3:I don't want to you to sound like I'm bragging about it, but at this point I feel like it's subconscious. I think I've been fasting since I was like seven.
Speaker 1:Is there an age that you're allowed to start?
Speaker 5:Usama is there an age. So again, law-wise you should start after hitting the age of puberty. Traditionally, sometimes we start earlier. Just because I remember I started really young. I started when I was in second grade, I think. No one told me to fast. My grandma was like actually telling me to stop, like just eat. But the days were kind of short and everyone is fasting. I'm like, no, I want to be included, like I could eat, but like I want to share the meal when everyone is sharing it.
Speaker 5:So you just sometimes I used to do like a couple days a week, not the whole month. Yeah. Then you just pick up the habit and yeah.
Speaker 3:So I definitely didn't hit puberty at seven, but I've been fasting since I was seven. So at this point I feel like it's just, it just comes kind of to you. Of course there are hard days, you know. There are some days that you just wake up and your mouth is dry and you just want to drink some water, but you can't um, or you just wake up and you're hungry and you gotta you realize you have to go another 12, 13, 14 hours without food, um, but yeah, it's something that you kind of get used to over time.
Speaker 3:So I feel bad. I can't really just kind of give you like tips on how to like manage it. Um, I don't want to go back to the, you know, concept of God consciousness, but I feel like that can kind of help sometimes in terms of, like you know, if you reconnect and think of the reason that you're doing this and you know like think about, you know, beyond the desire of the meal that you're going for, I think that can always help you maintain your like willingness, like renew your intention and just kind of keep you on that path of I'm doing this for a reason and it kind of just wakes you up. I don't know, sam. If you do something different For me, I prepare myself.
Speaker 5:I'm very, I'm really into coffee, so I don't want to like when. When Ramadan comes and we're taught in our tradition that Ramadan is not supposed to be a month, you just take a vacation, you don't indulge, just so you fast and you just go to sleep. So what I do is usually, before Ramadan, I will start fasting and I will go like on a caffeine detox kind of thing. Oh, important.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I do not do that. I could imagine cold turkey not having caffeine would be really hard.
Speaker 5:So I'd rather have that feeling before Ramadan, especially on weekends days that I'm not working, so when Ramadan comes I'm better prepared. Then it's a lot of planning, including the whole family together. So I remember just yesterday we were together for a family gathering and we were already discussing what days are we going to have iftars together. So we're just making sure it's in everyone's calendar. So you don't. You don't commit to anything else work-wise. I try to, and usually my every place I was at. They're very understanding.
Speaker 5:So either I start work earlier or finish a bit earlier and like work from home, or, whatever the case, I can get like an hour nap after work, which is, it's a very crucial uh crucial need a crucial need, but basically setting these things ahead of time and knowing how your day is going to be in the ramadan just makes it super easier instead of just taking each day as it goes so I already have a plan like I wake up at this time, this is my family time, this is my work time, this is my nap time. Then this is time when I go to the mosque and everything. So it helps a lot and not really.
Speaker 3:He's a lot more responsible than me. He's got like that, you know head of a household.
Speaker 2:He's got a few years on you. He's got a bit more life experience. You know something to aspire to.
Speaker 3:That whole caffeine detox actually reminded me I used to, just this past Ramadan. I used to wake up and sometimes, even if I don't drink water, I wake up and make a shot of espresso and I just drink it, just to get that satisfaction of having a coffee.
Speaker 2:Um, so yeah, just quick, you're like just get it in just perfect all.
Speaker 5:I need exactly the thing is, during Ramadan, like you get so tired because, again, it's not just about fasting during the day, but we're called to do a lot of spiritual activities at night, whether praying, whether reciting the quran and so on, so you're not getting more sleep at night by any means. Yeah, so what ends up happening is, regardless how much caffeine I drink after, after iftar, I'll still go to sleep. It's I'm so exhausted like I'll drink a cup and just go to sleep.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that actually, uh, perfectly goes into my next question, which is what are some of the common practices or rituals that take place during Ramadan? So you were talking about how the evening becomes a time when there's a lot more spiritual activity. You're going to the mosque for prayers, different things. Can you talk a little bit more about your experiences with some of those practices that happen in Ramadan outside of fasting?
Speaker 5:So I can talk about maybe the mosque aspect, the communal aspect of fasting. So I can talk about, like, maybe the mosque aspect, the community aspect, and uh hisham can tell us a little bit about, like uh sure, communal aspects like sahur?
Speaker 3:festivals and whatnot. I don't go to those, the dear boy not a fan uh, but usually it's.
Speaker 5:It's the day will be an evening break and fast, either with family or sometimes at a community level, where there's an iftar at the mosque, then praying Maghrib prayer. The evening prayer, then between iftar and the next prayer, is about an hour an hour and 15 minutes, so that's the time that you have to relax. That's when we have Isha prayer and we have night prayer.
Speaker 5:And those can usually last about an hour and a half, but those are usually done at a community level. You can do them at home if you want. It's actually preferred. If you have enough strength and motivation to do it at home and you're not going to slack off, it's better that you do them at home with your own family. So, like again, bringing Ramadan to the family. If not, you do it at a family and it's usually beautiful recitations. There's programs at that time, from after the, after the, the prayers, we have basketball games for for high schoolers to middle schoolers, like you think of it. There's. There's tea being passed out, free food or snacks, whatever, but it's just a time where the whole community it's one of the few, few occurrences when it's 11 at night and a school night you will see everyone just running around around the mission that's very fun you do get that burst of energy.
Speaker 3:I mean, you kind of did talk about the communal aspect there, but, um, yeah, it's, it's just. I mean I personally like, I love that like night prayer after as long as like, even if you're standing for like an hour, it's just, it kind of passes by quickly and it's again it's like another like spiritual boost, um that you get um. But yeah, after that it's just a lot of like. You know, the night is truly young during the one it never ends and like so many times you just don't sleep. Um, that's a bit of an exaggeration. You do sleep a little bit, um, but yeah, no, like a lot of community events, um, whether it's just sitting down, um having a cup of tea, just as we are right now, um, uh, what we call halakas, or like lectures, um literally anything that you can think of. Uh, it's usually inside the mosque, uh, but some things do happen on like a bigger scale, so like we do have um suhoor fest, which I I forgot how it exactly runs um but a lot of food trucks in one area.
Speaker 5:Yeah, it's like a dearborn thing.
Speaker 3:I, I think um a lot of a lot of food trucks just come and it's overpriced and it's a lot. It's crowded. I don't like anything about it, but it's definitely it's something that a lot of people go to. Um, but yeah, that community aspect is just highlighted, so it anything that you do is with people and it's more, I guess, of a blessing that that whole gathering is there.
Speaker 5:For me, one of the things I love, like whenever I go to the mosque for prayer and it's time to break the fast sometimes I'll break the fast at the mosque is that you will see people usually come in with like a lunch bag or like just plastic bags that they have some dates and some samosas. This is usually usually very common things to break fast. But they will not bring one or two to eat. They will bring like 20. No one is going to be able to eat 20, but they bring it with the intention that they want to like include everyone to their right and everyone to their left.
Speaker 5:So sometimes I'll just go after class or like uh, after school, or I was at work, so I'm in a rush, I don't take food with me, I go on and just have a date. Next thing you know I have like five sambusas and six different dates from people and a bottle of water that you generally never have to worry about. How do you break your fast? Someone will offer you something.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so many times you walk into a mosque and I mean this happened literally every day I walk into a mosque there would be a table that is full of dates, of all kinds of fillings and all other foods. It's just people buy food and just leave it there. It's for people to whoever maybe didn't have a chance to have a meal or were in a rush to get to the mosque. You just pick up and eat it and again it's that community like everyone looking out for each other kind of thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that sounds really nice um, what is the role of charity during ramadan and how can others get involved?
Speaker 2:you kind of already were segwaying with, with people bringing all different manners of food for breaking fast, but what else?
Speaker 5:definitely more than money. Right, it's, it's. Charity has many forms. We have a tradition that, uh, the that Ramadan is the month of generosity. It's a month where we expect generosity from God.
Speaker 1:What month does Ramadan happen in?
Speaker 5:So it's in a lunar calendar. So it's the ninth month in the lunar calendar, so it keeps changing. So this year will be the first day of March, most likely, then next year will be like the 18th of February, then it will keep going back like 10 days.
Speaker 2:I remember when I first started at the university it was still towards the very end of um or the very beginning of summer, very end of the semester. So I remember thinking, oh, now that it's moving back, the days are getting shorter, so fasting is getting shorter. It's getting a lot easier, you're like only 12 hours, you know, like in the summer it's like 15 hours, Um and so that I always find that interesting when we compare like lunar calendars to the Gregorian calendar that we operate most of the world in noticing how things shift and that's how similar to ours, why Lent and Easter sometimes shift.
Speaker 2:is that not necessarily the lunar calendar that we're operating from, but ours also shifts. That's why it's never exactly the same day.
Speaker 5:For me, even that shift, I feel, has a spiritual benefit that you don't become just idle't. You don't become, uh, just idle, or you don't become just so dependent on a routine that, at any moment, something will come and tell you like, no, you need to focus on god, you need to focus on your relationship, on your worship right now. That's what happens with prayer, that's what happens with ramadan, like, yes, you have a career, you have a thing, and no one is telling you to stop it, but you need to take a moment and also worry about your spirituality yeah, it's probably also interesting to like to experience ramadan at all different points in the year throughout your life so
Speaker 2:like it'll be in the summer, it'll be in the winter, it'll be in the spring, um and at the different phases of life that you're in.
Speaker 5:So I think it's 30 or 33 years. It does a whole cycle, not mistaken. Okay, wait, that's like such a perfect number.
Speaker 3:I will say a couple years ago, I think it was during finals week, and so that was pretty bad yeah that's not fun. But yeah, no, that does sound right. I think every 30 years it goes through a whole cycle.
Speaker 5:Even as I was going through university, I would say I was appreciative of professors. They would be understanding. They would not schedule exams too early. If there is more than two exams in one day, one of them would actually switch the exam date. So they were very understanding about that. Students are going through Ramadan Very cool.
Speaker 2:Sorry, we interrupted the question about charity and what does charity look like during the month of Ramadan, and it can also be in Islam in general.
Speaker 5:So there is two types of charity and Islam.
Speaker 5:One is called zakat, which is basically, I think in it's basically in Christian faith is tithing or giving tithing yeah so for us, it's 2.5 percent of unused wealth, like liquid assets, and that's mandatory for you to give, but there's also extra charity that we're pushed forward to give whenever we see that someone is in need, as opportunities come to serve different causes.
Speaker 5:As I was mentioning, ramadan is a month of generosity because we're expecting that we receive generosity from god that he forgives us, makes, allows us to attain this consciousness that we're talking about, spiritually uplifts us. But if you want to receive generosity, you also need to be generous. You can't just expect to receive and receive without giving, and we're told in our prophetic traditions that our prophet was generally generous throughout the year, but that generosity will be taken to another level during the month of Ramadan because good deeds are increased. It's an opportunity to just do good. So if you come to any mosque during the month of Ramadan, you will witness generosity firsthand. We're not just talking about food, but there's causes that will come to fundraise for, usually during every night, whether local, whether global, whether it's for food justice, whether it's for such causes as legal funds to serve those that don't have lawyers, whatever the case may be for housing projects, for education projects.
Speaker 5:It's generally the month where fundraising happens, because people are just willing to give more and more, and it's a month where from my own community at least, I see you'll always notice people like thinking about their extended families whether here, whether back home it's like oh, what can I offer them? It's a month of Ramadan, like usually. There might be some added expenses. Right after Ramadan is Eid celebration and they want to get some stuff for their children, so how can it be of support?
Speaker 5:So, it's just that, again, it's because of that consciousness even the idea of giving is increased during the month of Ramadan.
Speaker 2:Wonderful. Are there any special traditions that the two of you have in your families, whether that's your extended family, your family unit that you operate in, now that you all like to have during the month of Ramadan? An example um, for my family, around christmas, which is our largest holiday, uh, we have a tradition of always having a special meal on christmas eve, like the night before. That's always been my family's traditions, like we always have our, our bigger, like more celebratory meal the night before. Are there any traditions that you all have in your families around ramadan?
Speaker 3:um. My family is very small, first of all, like I think it's quite literally four of us now um it's okay, so I'll be your family yeah appreciate that um, so we don't really have anything that is like exclusive to our family.
Speaker 3:Um, I can kind of give you some of the cultural things, so like um on aid, for example, like the day right after amadan ends, uh, we do this thing and again, it's a lot of cultures. I do this. It's called idea, which is um. Do you want to help me translate it here? It's like it's like eat gift. It is an eat gift um, usually a monetary gift, um, and really no matter, like how older, young you are you kind of outgrow this at some point but no matter how older, young you are, um, an older person, usually like my dad and the family, will give everyone um, an aid gift, um, so that's one thing, um.
Speaker 3:Aside from that, uh, something more religious, usually on like the 27th night of Ramadan, is um, uh like a very special night which we call it um. Again, it's more religious, but it's a day that we all make sure that we're all at the mosque, because there are some days that, for example, like if I have school the next day and it's really early, sometimes I skip the night prayer, um, you know, I stay home because I need to sleep. I need to catch up on sleep. But that night specifically is like, like, no matter what is coming up on the next day, in the next week, next month, whatever it is, we all make sure that we're at the mosque because it's just such a special night, um, for really muslims all around the world. So, um, I would say those are really like the only two. Again, they're nothing like exclusive to our family.
Speaker 5:Um, there's something that really everybody celebrates I'll just add on the idea part it's funny because, like, as you're growing, you go from an age where you're receiving the money until an age where you're expected to give the money and and to be honest transition but now, like I give money, but my son receives money which he's a year and a half, so he doesn't receive money I receive that money, or me and his mom receive that money.
Speaker 5:But, you will see, because it's a large family gathering and everyone gives. Usually the attention is on kids. It's a day to make them happy. I remember you'll never see kids with that much money outside of Eid. Sometimes it's ridiculous amounts. I remember one time I had like a large bill and I asked my cousin this is back in Morocco. I'm like, hey, can you go get me change from the store? This kid looks at me and is like don't worry, I got you. And he just takes out a whole stash of bills. He's already got the money from Eid.
Speaker 3:he's already got it I can give you some change if you need. See, that's the benefit of having a larger family. When I was younger, when I was back in like saudi arabia, for example, or syria, I would have more family there, so you'd have more people to give you money.
Speaker 5:So you get more money um yeah but traditionally speaking, like using my family at least, or my smaller family, we have two kind of traditions like a spiritual one and a food one.
Speaker 5:A spiritual one right before Ramadan, me and my wife always set our goals, what we want to do one of them is we try to recite the Quran throughout the month of Ramadan to finish and whenever one of us finishes, we'll sit together as a family because it's time of blessing you just recited the speech of God and one month, and we just pray for ourselves, for our families and for our community. Food one is I must have samosas in Ramadan. I have samosas and I love smoothies so like those are a stipend in our family table, but all kinds of samosas my wife already started like rolling Ramadan samosas, so like we're talking, cheese, meat, potatoes and peas.
Speaker 2:All the yummy things.
Speaker 3:We used to do that actually, literally. Samosas are for some reason such an essential part of the meal. It's like date, samosas and soup If there's nothing else. If you only could eat those three, I think everyone would be happy. I would be thrilled if I had a meal that was just made of samosas and actually, like you know, when you fast for so long, you don't even um like you think you'd want to eat a lot, but once you start eating you, you kind of get full really quickly this is your stomach, doesn't?
Speaker 3:really accept a lot of food when it's been without food for so long. So it's like so many times I I think of like what I want to eat when the time comes, and then I have a single samosa and I have a little bit of soup and then I realize I'm kind of full, so a lot of it doesn't go to waste, but it's just you realize that that kind of desire just immediately disappeared.
Speaker 5:The other thing that we usually sometimes do is we have community potlucks or friend potlucks. So, as of now, I have group chats that they already decided on the days for their potlucks and whose house it's going to be in, which is nice, because when you have friends from different backgrounds and different cultures and each one has this special dish. Different food. So you might not eat huge amounts, but you're eating a little bit of every culture.
Speaker 3:We even did that on campus last year actually, and it was yeah, I was gonna, I was gonna ask are we?
Speaker 2:are we planning to do an iftar during ramadan with msa and?
Speaker 5:definitely, definitely. Do you want to tell them the date?
Speaker 3:oh, we have a date already we, we are confirmed for the 17th actually.
Speaker 2:Okay, perfect, well this goes out long before that, so perfect, then people will know the 17th yes, we're gonna have iftar on campus.
Speaker 3:It won't necessarily be potluck, although people are more than welcome to bring food. It's just we, we already like have food coming in, but if you know, if someone wants to bring something, they're more than welcome to great, that'll be fun.
Speaker 2:I enjoyed, I really enjoyed going last year and this is an open invite to everyone on campus, it's not just for muslims to eat, of course, uh if you want to fast, just a little bit at least you can like have that hunger for the food you're
Speaker 4:welcome, but you don't have to eat before us do not eat before.
Speaker 1:No, no we would never do that. What time is it at and where?
Speaker 5:this is going to be approximately. That time is going to be around 7 30. Yeah and uh. What's that building?
Speaker 3:uh, it will be ballroom studio in the ballroom. Okay great.
Speaker 2:We want to take this opportunity to also ask you you know we wrote the questions, but are there things about Ramadan, or even, as we, after Ramadan, we approach Eid, that you want to share with the community, as you have this opportunity on the podcast Are there other things that you want to share with our wider Detroit community about Ramadan or Islam or anything? Really, this is your ground to do so Well, he's a preacher, so I'll let him take this one our wider Detroit community about Ramadan or Islam or anything really this is your ground to do so.
Speaker 3:Well, he's a preacher, so I'll let him take this one.
Speaker 5:He's a preacher. The only thing I would say to the community at large. Usually every mosque during Ramadan will have continuous iftars, but they even make extra special iftars to include the entire community, even for non-Muslims to come.
Speaker 5:I would say if you ever see an event like that pop up, like in your news feed or social media or invite or friend tells you about, make sure to go to it. Firstly, like the food is always delicious and secondly, the community is very appreciative of that because it's meant. It's generally meant just a time, like we're sharing tea right now, just to share a meal and being in those organizational committees that sometimes it's. It's appreciative when we see new faces like oh, so-and-so, you're just coming to have iftar with us. It's nice. So if you see that on your social media, make sure it's okay you'll have some voices, for sure, oh yeah, it's part of that generosity, like it's.
Speaker 3:It's an open door, so anyone's welcome, really, even if you non-Muslim and a lot of countries back home do this, they just do open meals and literally anybody who wants can come and have a meal, muslim or not, whatever your religious affiliation is especially here a lot of non-Muslims, so really it's an open door. All the mosques.
Speaker 2:Anything else that you want to share with our community, about anything that you felt like we didn't ask you, that you were. Like I really wanted to share about this thing, try to fast for one day. Yeah, I would say everyone should try. I did try last year and it's definitely challenging. I woke up for Sahur. I don't know if I woke up at the correct time. But I tried, I tried. I was like I'm going to drink a lot of water and a protein smoothie and see how it goes.
Speaker 5:The other thing is, if you try to fast, make sure to have fruits or vegetables that are rich in nutrition and water For me. I used to love whenadan would come in the summer because I would have a lot of watermelon that was my. Like a cantaloupe watermelon that was my. Sometimes I don't even eat food. I'll just eat those and I'm okay for that for the rest of the day I can now finally.
Speaker 1:I used to hate watermelon, but now I appreciate the benefits that it gives me.
Speaker 2:Well, great. So, as I shared before we started recording, we always ask these two questions of all of our guests which is, what is your favorite part of the mission of the University of Detroit Mercy, and then, what motivates you to live out that mission? So we'll start with the first one, and whoever wants to go first can go first. You guys can decide. Um, but what is your favorite part of the mission of Detroit Mercy?
Speaker 3:Uh, I don't want to be too basic, but I'll say the inclusivity part of it. Um, I mean, just sitting here at this table, we have four different people from four different backgrounds. Yeah, it's just something that I appreciate and I guess kind of that second part of that question what inspires me is I'm part of that diversity. You know, like as many of us Muslims are here on campus and as many Muslims are in Dearborn, hamtramck, whatever it is, we're still a minority in this country at large, um, like a very, very tiny minority. Um, and even being arab, like you know, I feel like I'm part of two minorities, being an arab american and being a muslim american. Um, and so, yeah, like I I kind of know that experience.
Speaker 3:I know the experience of moving abroad and like having a new start and that cultural shock that you kind of get, um, and I see people and I keep meeting people that are just going through that phase of their life. You know they're having it. I think I'm, uh, I'm grateful to have had it when I was 10. You know, I moved to the united states when I was 10 and I was still pretty young, so I was able to, even though I didn't speak any english. At that point I I was still able to. You know, they say your mind's a sponge when you're younger, so like I was able to learn the language a lot quicker.
Speaker 3:I was able to, like assimilate a lot quicker. But, um, there are people that are my age right now, 20 who are just moving to the United States, just learning the language and just having that experience for the first time. So what inspires me is being part of that experience in the past and kind of wanting to be that comforting person, the transition person for other people. Um, and yeah, this, this ties into universities just care for inclusive inclusivity, diversity, especially in the wake of, um, all of these uh dei um controversies with the government and all of that. I think it's a lot more important to talk about nowadays. I agree.
Speaker 5:For me, I would say it has to be faith, because the values that the university lives and their mission is through their faith. I remember one of the first conversations that I had when I was interviewing for the position to be in part of ministry is that we don't tell people, leave your faith outside, but we tell them, like, walk with your faith to the university, to the campus. And I like this because I generally feel, whatever the person's faith is, whether you're Muslim, whether you're Christian, whether you're Jewish background, whether you're Hindu, all of these faiths have one thing in common. I remember one of the teachers once summarized that it's like faith at its essence is worshiping the creator and serving creation, and all faiths share this understanding. So if you're coming together and not leaving faith behind, but you're saying the reason that I'm part of this university, the reason that I'm serving this mission, the reason that I'm part of this university, the reason that I'm serving this mission, the reason that I'm not just keeping this mission to my campus but to the metro Detroit area, to Michigan at large and to humanity, is because of my faith. That will change so many people's ideas of what faith actually means.
Speaker 5:Because faith, personally, I don't think faith is just something, it's just a personal relationship that I have at the mosque or have at home between me and my deity, and that's about it. No, faith is something that should be enacted in every transaction that I have, whether it's at school, whether it's at a supermarket, whether as I'm driving, and when you have a university or an institute that focuses so much that it's not just about academia. It's we although, like you, push for you for your academic standing to be uh, to be rigorous and everything, but also huge parts of the person's development is through faith, because it goes hand in hand. Yeah, it's just, it's a beautiful thing, great thank you both for your answers.
Speaker 2:So now we're moving to one of my favorite parts of our podcast, which is our lightning round. It's not too many questions, I promise, and they're they're not meant to be hard, but kateri and I will go back and forth asking the questions. Right now we're going to determine between the two of you who wants to answer the question first. Okay, so I'll ask the question, you'll answer hisham, you'll, and then Kateri will ask the next question. And again, it's meant to be kind of rapid fire. They're meant to be quick answers and you don't necessarily have to provide explanations, obviously at the very end. I already warned them that one of the questions was what's the best advice you've ever received? That one usually, obviously, is not the quickest answer. It usually involves some sort of story. So feel free to expand on that one. So let's begin. Sweet or salty foods Salty.
Speaker 3:Salty.
Speaker 1:What was your first job?
Speaker 5:First job. This is weird, but I had a job for one day. I was a busboy.
Speaker 4:Okay, we'll have to ask why it was only one day in a minute.
Speaker 3:I think cashier, unless I'm misremembering.
Speaker 2:What is one food you could not live without? Like, if it disappeared.
Speaker 3:I'll answer for him, samosas.
Speaker 5:Samosas, Ramadan, but burgers. I don't think I could live without burgers.
Speaker 3:Well, my mind's freezing.
Speaker 5:Rice. I take that back Rice.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, that's my answer White rice, I'll say white rice, okay, what is?
Speaker 5:your favorite holiday tradition, I would say Eid. It's like the morning of Eid, especially if you don't get much sleep, you still wake up, have breakfast as a family and just either receive or give money.
Speaker 3:Yeah, promise not copying him, but it's also eight. We just don't have a lot and, as muslims, I was gonna say there's two eads.
Speaker 5:There's two um current favorite book that you're reading or recently read I'm currently reading the autobiography of malcolm x for the like third or fourth time. I'm'm still loving it again.
Speaker 3:Favorite is difficult, but I'm currently reading Destiny Disrupted. It's a history book. I'm just getting more into history.
Speaker 1:Cool. Who's your hero?
Speaker 5:This is going to sound very basic for a Muslim audience.
Speaker 3:Oh no, my hero is the Prophet. I have the same answer.
Speaker 2:You know, it's okay to have the same hero and it's okay if it's going to be the prophet.
Speaker 5:Okay. Second hero say my dad. Okay, if you want to like take it I don't have.
Speaker 3:I'm still going to say my dad.
Speaker 2:Okay, favorite place you've traveled to or been to?
Speaker 3:We're going to Morocco, which is beautiful, if I take that would be top one. Number two would be the Sultanate of Oman oh, okay that's beautiful mine would be Medina, the city of the prophet you out Muslim'd me yeah if you could learn a new skill or talent, what would you want it to be?
Speaker 5:uh, just to be honest, exercising and being consistent with exercise, I can't, I can't maintain for more than one day it's hard to stay consistent with exercise um, I guess if I was more consistent in cooking.
Speaker 3:I just can't't.
Speaker 2:Yep, no explanation, no explanation. So that's fine. What is one goal you have for yourself this Ramadan?
Speaker 5:This Ramadan is like spending more time with family. Previous Ramadans I'm very involved in my community, like as youth mentor, and so like I get called to do a lot of stuff outside, so I want to make sure that doesn't burgeon into family time.
Speaker 3:I would say staying connected beyond Ramadan, because unfortunately that's been like a difficulty for me Like you know, Ramadan is great I'm connected, but then after that it just kind of dwindles away. So my goal would just be to stay connected post Ramadan as well.
Speaker 1:What's the best advice you ever received?
Speaker 5:Oh, that's very difficult. Do you want to go first? Hisham, I don't have an answer. Is it the advice I received from a person from a book? Because it's.
Speaker 2:It is up for interpretation, so it could be a particular favorite verse in the Quran that you find inspiring. It could be from a hadith, it could be from a person that you've met or encountered in life. It could be from your grandma I don't know.
Speaker 5:So my dad is like I receive a lot of advice from my dad, but a lot of it, like sometimes, is situational-based. But a hadith that comes to mind right away is is be God conscious wherever you are. And the hadith continues is like make sure that you are aware and you're close to God during times of ease. He will be connected to you during times of difficulty. So, basically, maintaining this balance throughout life, like there's times that we're going to have a lot of blessings in your life, but make sure you're still God conscious at that time, using those blessings to help and serve others. That way, like when there's and it's bound to happen sometimes, whatever that difficulty is, you're just having a rough day, there's going to be other people for you and you're still going to maintain that connection with God.
Speaker 3:That's a good one. I'll go off a hadith as well, even though I don't know the full one, but the part of it that I want to focus on is in Arabic it's, which literally means like extend the greeting. I just think that goes a long way. I don't know. I feel like in a time where we can be so connected easily with social media, yet we're also so like secluded from everything.
Speaker 3:Yeah, a greeting goes a long way and to me, a greeting, um, it's more than just saying hello to somebody, it's more than just saying salam to somebody. Um, it it's kind of like a sign of safety. It's like it's like saying it could well, because, especially for us, um, our greeting is a literally means beast. Be upon you, um, and the way I was thinking about this yesterday, it's it's not only peace be upon you, it's also like peace is on you.
Speaker 3:So it's kind of like me saying, when I say someone, it's me saying that I've kind of like I've told you you will be safe with me um and so I I think that just kind of Like I've told you you will be safe with me, and so I think that just kind of creates that one, and when I especially when I hear it from someone else- it puts me at like some level of comfort with that person and kind of breaks that ice without having to you know, to the whole icebreaker. Yeah, so I think a greeting goes a long way, yeah.
Speaker 2:Great. Those were both wonderful pieces of advice. That really formally ends our our formal time together. I guess I'll call it Um. I want to just say thank you to both of you for being on the podcast, for uh, sharing about your own personal traditions with Ramadan, but also from a larger perspective, of what it is um helping educate our community. If they don't know, um, or even just they if they do know what Ramadan is helping educate our community if they don't know, or even just if they do know, what Ramadan is, maybe they learned something new. So I appreciate you both being here today and taking the time to record this podcast with.
Speaker 3:Kateri and I Thank you for having us. Thank you, thank you for having us and the tea was great.
Speaker 2:Good, I'm glad. And, yeah, I wish both of you a wonderful and meaningful Ramadan as we get ready for that month.
Speaker 3:Thank you so much.
Speaker 2:And, yeah, I challenge everyone, I'll do it again. Challenge everyone to try fasting one day, whether it's in the month of Ramadan or outside of it, you know. Give yourself a challenge to see what that experience feels like.
Speaker 3:And if you do eat sahur, do not eat anything salty, because you will regret it.
Speaker 2:Okay, nothing salty.
Speaker 1:Good advice, Personal experience You've been listening to what's the Tea with Ministry. If you enjoyed listening to us today, be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode. Also, be sure to follow us on social media at UDM underscore ministry or check us out at what's the Tea with Ministry podcast on the Detroit Mercy website.
Speaker 2:Thank you to our guests Osama and Hisham for being in conversation with us today. Thank you also to all those who made this podcast possible, especially the Communication Studies Department, our sound engineer, michael Jason, our music composer, dan Gregg, marketing and communications and the whole Detroit Mercy community.
Speaker 1:We look forward to sharing more of the mission with you next time. See you later.