This episode features the remarkable journey of Georgia State Senator John Albers and his son Will. In August of 2020, Will was rushed to the hospital, where it was determined that he was in kidney failure and would need to go on dialysis immediately. Like many parents who find themselves in similar circumstances, John stepped up and became a direct living kidney donor for his son, but he didn’t stop there. Senator Albers wrote and pushed through the Giving the Gift of Life Act in the State of Georgia—groundbreaking legislation in support of living donors. Join Senator Albers and Will as they share their story of living kidney donation and transplantation, opening up about the emotional and logistical challenges they navigated and how their family's transplantation story has transformed Senator Albers into a dedicated advocate for living kidney donation. Don't miss this compelling narrative of advocacy and hope.
This episode features the remarkable journey of Georgia State Senator John Albers and his son Will. In August of 2020, Will was rushed to the hospital, where it was determined that he was in kidney failure and would need to go on dialysis immediately. Like many parents who find themselves in similar circumstances, John stepped up and became a direct living kidney donor for his son, but he didn’t stop there. Senator Albers wrote and pushed through the Giving the Gift of Life Act in the State of Georgia—groundbreaking legislation in support of living donors. Join Senator Albers and Will as they share their story of living kidney donation and transplantation, opening up about the emotional and logistical challenges they navigated and how their family's transplantation story has transformed Senator Albers into a dedicated advocate for living kidney donation. Don't miss this compelling narrative of advocacy and hope.
Welcome everyone to this episode of One is Enough, the National Kidney Registry's official podcast. Today's episode includes a few firsts for our podcast. It will be the first time that we have not one but two guests, and it is the first time that we speak with a living donor and their recipient in the same episode. John Albers is a husband, father, business owner, firefighter, and, if that wasn't enough, I have no idea how he has enough time to also be a senator from the great state of Georgia. He is also, of course, a living kidney donor, because we only have donors and recipients on this podcast right. Having donated directly to his son, will, in July of 2021. Today both Will and John are here to share their journey with living kidney donation and transplantation. Senator Albers Will, thank you so much for joining us and welcome to One is Enough.
Speaker 2:Thank you, mike. It's great to talk with you today. I love the podcast and excited to share our story. That's awesome, Will, are you happy to be here?
Speaker 3:I couldn't be happier. Thank you so much for having us on Awesome.
Speaker 1:So, before we go into it, because we do have a lot to cover I think it would be really interesting for all the millions of listeners. Because that's what I say if you put it out in the universe, eventually we will get millions of listeners, except for that one guy, Dan, that listens on the Long Island Railroad. But how would a guy from Queens, this kid from Queens who was an NYPD detective, how is he able to meet a famous senator from the state of Georgia? How is that possible? Senator Albers, do you want to start off with how you and I met?
Speaker 2:Well, certainly this guy was born in Queens as well. My background was also a Long Island, new York, but it was great that we got to meet for an awesome cause. So years ago my Rotary Club did a great thing for it called an Honor Air Flight. We took our veterans to DC. We were trying to come up with other creative things to serve those who serve us. So I came up with the idea of doing a Patriot flight. We would take all my fellow first responders police fire, ems, 911 up to New York City to go to ground zero, to go up to the top of the Freedom Tower, to go to the museum and be a part of that experience.
Speaker 2:Well, when I did that, I called the commissioner of the NYPD and told him about my idea and he said I've got just the guy for you. And sure enough, mike, you and I met many years ago, long before either one of us were involved in the kidney world. We dated off immediately. You were so gracious with your time to help us honor our first responders from Georgia up in New York, and you know I don't believe in coincidence from that moment on. Thank you again for being a good friend and doing what you're doing.
Speaker 1:Well, I appreciate our continued friendship and I do remember that. I do actually remember getting the email from the police commissioner's office, because the area I worked in and the police department handled all domestic and foreign visits to New York City and obviously you would be considered a domestic visit. And they said, you know, the police commissioner would like you to help this gentleman out. I remember calling you for the first time. I'm like, oh my gosh, I asked someone at work and I'm like I'm going to call a senator. I'm like how do I act? Because I think, the way I normally act, I probably shouldn't be talking to senators, but I remember, you know, calling you and finding out what you needed from the NYPD and such, and you were so gracious and I was like, oh my gosh, these senators are like real people too. They could be, just be like me and you.
Speaker 2:And you're right, we didn't get off Even firefighters, Mike, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, let's not bring that up. But yeah, no, we didn't fight at all, even me being a cop and you being a firefighter. But I remember, you know you put that on and you know we had many more planned, of course, but unfortunately COVID happened and kind of derailed that, but it was great. And then I remember, you know I'm on LinkedIn and I remember seeing a senator, john Albers, do this announcement that he, you know, donated a kidney to his son. And I assumed there was only one, senator Albers.
Speaker 1:But I was like, oh gosh, I've done this before where I sent a message to someone and it's not really that person. So I kind of just sent you a message on LinkedIn and you responded back with is this the same Detective, mike Lalo, who helped me out with the, you know, the Patriot flight? And I was like yes. And then, you know, we jumped on the phone and you know, and here we are today on our podcast. One is Enough. So that's pretty cool, absolutely. So I want you guys to take us back to August of 2020 and you know, share what transpired with Will's health at that time. I guess either one of you I don't know who wants to start off.
Speaker 2:I'll let Will get started on how his health was, and then I'll take it up from there.
Speaker 1:I guess it is his health, so we should start with Will.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'd say in August 2020, I brought myself to the hospital. I had a variety of different symptoms, from cramps to a lack of energy, to. I mean, at that time I didn't realize I had lost a lot of weight, lost a lot of hair because of COVID. You know, just wearing a hat, you didn't really have any social accountability from being outside. And from there we learned that my kidneys had failed, that they were no longer working, and at that point I was placed on emergency dialysis and went underwent a few different procedures and, you know, started our journey into dialysis and getting on the transplant list.
Speaker 2:Yeah, from my perspective. You know we were always concerned when Will all of a sudden was getting very tired. Didn't seem to be his normal self and he's a pretty skinny guy to begin with, but all of a sudden he lost 20 pounds and certainly his mom and I were very concerned. And fortunately, you know, young 20-year-old 20-somethings don't go to the doctor very often. But eventually, when he was vomiting blood and went to the doctor, the hospital, immediately, to the emergency room through ICU, I ran to the hospital as quick as I could get there and I will tell you I broke every COVID rule at the moment. Thankfully, the CEO of the hospital is a personal friend and, being a firefighter and EMT, they allowed me to actually get up into the ICU room.
Speaker 2:Wow, I remember just feeling helpless. You know, no parent should ever see their child with that many tubes coming out of them. All I could do is hold his hand and pray and be there. And I remember when the doctor kind of made give me one of those little head nods to go out and do the hallway. I walked out to the hallway with him and he looked at me and he said John, all his organs are shutting down and we don't know why and we don't know if he's going to make it through the night. And that was really the most horrifying thing I'd ever heard in my entire life. I knew what he was telling me. He told me to prepare myself that my son was likely going to die. It was just. It was a tough, tough moment. I can't imagine a darker place to be. All I could do was go in and just pray and hold his hand and thank God that the doctors and nurses at Cherokee Northside Hospital were able to determine hours later that his kidneys had shut down.
Speaker 1:Wow and Will. Would you put on dialysis immediately?
Speaker 3:The next day afterwards. Yes, they performed I'm going to butcher the name of every surgeon here other than the transplant itself but they started doing it through the neck at first. It's just the easiest, most convenient access.
Speaker 1:And how long were you on dialysis up until the point that you received the transplant?
Speaker 3:Up until the night before? Yes, Then I think about 12 or 24 hours before they have you drain out any excess fluid.
Speaker 1:So if you could tell the listeners. I've seen people on dialysis. There's plenty of videos people could watch on YouTube. But what was that experience like, from the time that you put on dialysis to just before your transplant? What was dialysis to you or for you? How did it affect you?
Speaker 3:Well, there's two different types. The first main type that people think of is what's called hemodialysis, where you're hooked up to a very large machine about the size of a smaller refrigerator. You have what's called a catheter that comes in, it starts in your neck but it kind of pokes out in your upper chest. That has two different tubes and what it does is it pulls blood out and pushes it back in and it just that machine that a hemodialysis machine acts as a filter and a cleanser for your blood that performs the functions of a kidney, which is just a big filter that does that for you. So I did that for the first few months, which everyone has to start with, before I qualified to get put on the different type of dialysis.
Speaker 3:I think the physical ramifications of the hemodialysis are a little bit more stringent because since it pulls that blood out at a fast rate, you feel more exhausted. But then I was lucky enough to have that removed and start what's called peritoneal dialysis, where you just filter basically sugar water in an outer abdomen a few times a day, based on how severe your situation is. And that gave me quality of life because, although I had to do it more often, I got to be from home. I didn't have to go to a clinic and it allowed me to. I mean, if you put on a bag of your shirt, I mean you kind of hide it and go about your day to day life.
Speaker 1:Right. Obviously, dialysis is important because it's a bridge for you to get to transplantation, but I like to say it's really just a bandaid because unfortunately, the statistics show that people do not survive staying on dialysis forever. It's not a cure for someone with kidney disease. So I appreciate you sharing your experience with that and John, we're both dads and I can't even think about what it was like to see and hear that Will was on dialysis and to watch him go through that. Can you comment what it was like as a dad seeing your son hooked up to these machines? And that's really what's keeping him alive.
Speaker 2:It was a combination of joy and heartbreak. The joy was they figured out what the problem was and they were going to be able to save his life. Then it's set in of the. Oh my gosh, my 24 year old son at the time has to go on dialysis. I was there when they performed the procedure to put the cathin and from that point forward, this is the way my mind works and my wife. We're super type A personalities and immediately it's like we can fix this. We can get this done, and as quick as that happened, I asked a thousand questions and started Googling every option and we really went into how do we fix this mode?
Speaker 1:That's perfect, because that's a good segue into my next question is what did you feel when you were told he needs a transplant that's what's going to save Will's life as a transplant how did you react and what kind of thoughts went through your mind?
Speaker 2:From my perspective, it was just a challenging life that we were going to get through. I had all the optimism in the world we could make that happen Immediately, hoped and prayed it would be me or my wife, hoping that the family match would be the quick and ideal one. But as quick as I could learn everything about that from every medical professional that I knew, I started making phone calls and text messages and emails. I started researching everything I could. I knew that there were solutions out there. People got transplants. It was something I never really understood before in the past because I was never exposed to it, but now that I was, I knew we were going to jump in the pool with both feet.
Speaker 1:So I think I read somewhere Will, what was your initial response when your dad said that he wanted to be your donor? I believe it was no. Is that accurate that you didn't want him to be your donor?
Speaker 3:I told him not even to get tested and I told him no repeatedly. Let me ask you a question because this is important.
Speaker 1:So what was going through your mind? Why did you not want your dad to get tested?
Speaker 3:Well, I mean, on a joking note, I'm like, oh, I'm never going to hear the end of this one. But I guess, on a more serious note, is, I was just naive to the process because I always didn't like doctors, so I didn't do as much research as they did. Thankfully, they took the reins on everything from cooking meals to making me better, which is why I'm here, because I wouldn't have done that for myself. But I saw that I'm on this heavily restricted diet. I can only eat X amount, drink X amount, and I figured okay, well, this isn't the diet.
Speaker 3:I mean, he likes bourbon and steak what can you say? And that's nothing I can have. So my thought was obviously I would have been grateful if he was the match. This is back when I still wanted him not to be. Well, why would I be okay? And he spent 30 or 40 years with this restricted diet, giving up things he likes, when I could just wait a few years and we'd all be okay, because I didn't read up and find out that he'd just be, he'd go back to normal.
Speaker 1:He'd be your same dad, whether he gave you the kidney or not. So, John, what was your reaction? And this is important? So I'm really glad that you're honest Will about how your reaction is, because it's common. It's not uncommon that I hear this. It's just uncommon that you get to have both parties who are willing to be open and honest on the same podcast. So, John, what was your reaction when you said oh, you know, son, I'm gonna save the day, and then I will never let you live that down, of course, but I want to come in there and save the day. And then Will says no, no, I don't want you to be put in harm's way. What was going through your mind when he kept telling you no?
Speaker 2:You know I was as a father, immediately you're gonna do anything for your son. I had to give him both kidneys. If I had to, I still would today. But at the same point, it was very heartwarming that he was that concerned about me too. Right, he was concerned about me in my life and how it might impact me, and you know that's what family does. Family does anything for one another and they think of the others before they think of themselves. So it was mixed emotions, without a doubt. But you know what I don't take no for an answer and ultimately we came to the right conclusion together.
Speaker 1:So you decided to get tested. So what was that process like for you getting tested as a donor?
Speaker 2:Well, to be honest with you, the process needed some improvement. It was challenging, to say the least, to begin the process, and you know, this is something that I have learned along the way my wife and I are both super type A personalities, we're both pretty well educated and we're pretty well connected. And even with all those things, for me it was difficult. So what I'm going through the process now it's to fix it, and for us it was bureaucratic, it was a lot of paperwork, it was a lot of scheduling, it was a lot of miscommunication. It was going to get blood three times. It should have been one time because of unfortunate folks at the labs.
Speaker 2:But you know what we pushed through. I mean, these are obstacles that we could overcome and it took us 11 months from the point we're in the hospital with Will and we almost lost him to getting to Chima transplant, and a lot of people said, wow, john, that's a record 11 months from beginning. That's just a terrific result. I said, well, it'll be terrific when we get that down to two months, which is where we're going.
Speaker 1:So you know it really is transplant center specific. So my transplant center I had the opposite experience when I donated. So I think it took me just under three months from the point that I filled out the paperwork to the point that I got, you know, walked down the hallway. So that was great. But then I hear stories like yours where it takes 11 months, 12 months, 14 months.
Speaker 1:So one of the things that is frustrating that there's, I think, 259 transplant centers in the United States and there's really no uniform process. So it's like 259 states, if you will, where everyone has their own, you know, set of rules and sort of regulations. Of course there are government guidelines right for transplantation, but the kind of like, the nuances and the specifics are very specific to the transplant center. So you know, I go to one transplant center. I, from start to finish, was able to donate in, you know, just under three months, and you know, and it took you 11 months. So I wish there was something or I hope there is something that we can do, maybe together to try, and you know, to fix it, because people shouldn't have to wait that long and watch their son, you know, sit there on a machine.
Speaker 2:Well, I tell you, mike, we're already making great progress there and I just share a brief story.
Speaker 2:We got contacted, will and I, through a mutual friend, about a year after our transplant and, in an amazing non-coincidences I call him this gentleman's son name was Will and they had just had to put him on dialysis.
Speaker 2:They were both, he and his wife, self-employed. They had gotten their first massive bills for $75,000 with the medical care and for some reason they hadn't signed up for Medicare yet, which is really a 101 for anyone who's in legal failure. And they were just you know, emotionally and physically just you know, devastated by this whole process. Well, the first thing we did is we helped them take care of getting Medicare, you know, talk to them about how the process worked and there was goodness on the other side, they were going to beat this, et cetera. Long story short. From the moment they called us, about five and a half months later, he went in and he got his kidney. He graduated from high school a few weeks later and then going to the University of Alabama for his freshman year of college, again without a coincidence, where my younger son is at college right now.
Speaker 1:Wow, that is crazy. Could you just touch base? You mentioned something about Medicare being 101 for people you know who need a transplant. What do you mean by that?
Speaker 2:Well, if anyone is in renal failure, you can qualify for Medicare, and people think of Medicare as well. I'm in my mid-60s and I'm at a certain age and I can qualify for Medicare, right. So you can be one year old, 10 years old, 24 in the case of Will, and you can qualify for Medicare. That can be either your soul or an additional insurance. It is really a magnificent program to truly help people at one of their greatest times of need, whether it be the hospital visits, the dialysis, certainly the transplant and all the follow-ups with that. That's an extraordinary amount of cost, but here's the great news to that when somebody gets transplanted, they return on investments enormously good, not just saving a life, but certainly by the dollars as well.
Speaker 1:Of course. Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up because I think people don't know that. They say, oh, I don't have insurance. But we do live in a great country and I think people do think that you need to be old in order to, because their grandparents are on Medicare. But specifically I don't know if there's any other situations, but I know specifically, like you said, for transplant you could be one year old and you will qualify, or you should qualify, for Medicare to cover the cost. So what was it like when you got the call that you were a match for Will? What had you feel? I could probably answer the question for you, but I'd love to hear it from you.
Speaker 2:I'll never forget it, mike, july 1st 2021, I got the greatest phone call I've ever received in my life when the doctor said John, you're not just a match, you're a darn near perfect match. And I was just. You know, you're overjoyed, you're overcome with emotion. I remember telling Will later that day and, as he had walked in the side door, just hugging him, wanting to know that I was a match. And then what was supposed to be three months the next day got moved up to just three weeks and we we walked in three weeks later to Emory University Hospital right here in Atlanta, georgia.
Speaker 1:So Will. What was it like for you when your dad told you that he was a match? Besides the I'm never going to live this down comment what? How did you?
Speaker 3:feel. Well, I think at that point it was a sense of relief, because it was, you know, even at that point, you know, three months at least it was, I guess, that pre closure of. Okay, you know, this has been horrible, but at least there's, there's that end in sight, Right, and that gave you that extra motivation to. Oh, you know, dialysis isn't anything. You know, I'm going to be back to what I was, you know, two years ago now.
Speaker 1:Did John? Did you get any? Did you get support, you know, from family and friends? Did you share this publicly before you donated or did you wait until after you donated? I'm just curious if you've met any kind of like resistance or people like you know. Obviously it's your son and you want to save your son, but that still doesn't mean people are not baffled by what you did.
Speaker 2:This is a great part of the history of our story, mike, I will never forget. I was sitting upstairs in my home office and Will, who's a much more private person and I'm obviously a public figure came up and said we should share our story and make a public. And I was stunned because that's not Will. And I said well, why do you think we should do that? He said you know, dad, if one person who was sick like me goes to the hospital or goes to the doctor before they're on the edge, or one more person becomes a donor, or one more person you know gets, gets on board with what donations about, isn't at all worth it. And I was just. I was so proud of what he was saying and of course he's in. You know, going through dialysis is such a difficult time in his life.
Speaker 2:So, of all places, I decided to go on to LinkedIn, the social media platform, because I think it's the one that's a little more rational and the other ones get a little crazy sometimes. And I put a request out for prayers and told everybody the story of where Will and I were at, and it was overwhelming. We had millions and millions of people like and hundreds of thousands of people send us direct messages and comments, in fact, so much that LinkedIn sent me a contact that we were one of the top people in the world that week. And it did go around the world and it was so humbling and overwhelming and like. We had people in the wall in Jerusalem praying for us. We had people in St Peter's Basilica in the Vatican praying for us.
Speaker 2:We had a mosque in United Arab Emirates doing a Dalla for us and praying for us, cathedrals in Peru, argentina, all over the country, perfect strangers from Oklahoma wanting to drive to our house and help cut our grass and people sending us prayer blankets from the other side of the country. It was just unbelievable. And then locally, our church, our neighbors, our rotary club, that my fellow senators and representatives, the fire department, people offering to bring us meals, to do anything they could to help it was. It was just truly overwhelming the amount of love, support and emotion that was out there and I realized at that point that this is our calling Right. God could have done this to anybody, but he had that happen to Will and to me, and from that point I knew that we had a greater purpose in solving this problem. Moving forward.
Speaker 1:So, with all those messages and support, you had the time to respond to one old washed up detectives direct message and that was one of the other things I really, I truly do admire. You are a man of your word and you're just so genuine. I was one of those hundreds of thousands or millions of people that liked it, because that's when I saw the story and I was like, oh, I wonder if this is the same Senate average, and you responded immediately, which I was shocked.
Speaker 2:Well, mike, fire fighters have been helping out you police officers for forever now, so this is just part of the force.
Speaker 1:Yes, I know you guys are carrying us. I know I know so. At 5 am on Wednesday, July 21st in 2021, less than a year after the initial life threatening news about Will you guys walked into Emory Transplant Center, which is an NKR center in your state. How did the surgeries go? I'm assuming it went well, because you're both here on the podcast and I've met you guys several times, but Will you want to talk about your surgery, like what the recovery was like after?
Speaker 3:no-transcript, absolutely. So we got there nice and early, which is good, because I hate IBS, so I wasn't awake enough to get too mad at him when he missed the first few times. But then I have a great mom who told the person you know what, we should just knock him out long before you even need to go in there. And I woke up much later that day and they thankfully I got delotted works. There's a reason you can't buy it. And you know, a few days later, I think the third day, I got to go home and I was home at lunch. So oh my gosh.
Speaker 3:overall, I think the recovery, I think it went well. They wanted us to start walking more and more. You know afterwards, I think the first day I made it to the stop sign, which is three houses down from where we live in back and I rest a lot more than I should, but I think the recovery went quite well.
Speaker 1:Wow, and John was yours as good as Will's.
Speaker 2:It sure was, Mike, and you know. Just so this goes down to one of those things you can't make up. Once we got wheeled down for surgery, I went in first, as you can imagine, and then the power went out at the hospital.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2:Which is really truly amazing. So they couldn't start our surgery on the generator. They were really bad storms so it got delayed a little bit. Of course I remember none of this because I was knocked out at the time, so we got out a bit later that day. But they want you, you know, shortly thereafter to get up and walk around the floor and ring the bell, which I know many of us did. Well, you know, I'm like one of these people that if you give me a goal I'm going to have to do it four times. So I lapped a four, like four or five times, and didn't realize you were supposed to ring the bell. So I rang the bell five times at the end. But we got home, you know, I recovered very quickly. Within less than a week I was sitting back down in my office downtown working.
Speaker 1:And Deila absolutely Back Senaturing, right Back doing the things that Senators do.
Speaker 2:I sure was, I sure was. It recovered very quickly. You know listen to the doctor's orders, you know make sure we didn't lift anything too heavy. But I'm 100% fine, normal Everything's the same and with the exception of this, this, this medical terminology may have heard of my called age. That's the only thing that's really slowing me down in life. It's certainly not being a part of the One Kidney Club.
Speaker 1:Wow, that is. You know that's. I will say that of course, not every single donor story is exactly like yours and mine, and it is, you know, major surgery, and you know there are, of course, risks involved. But you know you, for your son, I'm sure we're willing to accept the risks which, in both of our opinions because you've had conversations are just so small compared to how you can change, you know, or save someone's life. So you know it's, I love hearing that. I'm glad it seems like Will might have recovered a little bit faster than you. I'm not not that I'm keeping score, but he, absolutely, I give it.
Speaker 3:I give it to him. He, he lapped the floor. They said ring the bell and I did not feel like ringing a bell. I didn't feel like going back downtown a week later I I definitely milked the doctor's orders of arrest.
Speaker 1:That's funny. There was a I didn't have a bell on my floor, but you know they made me, you know, walk around the floor and there was a gentleman because it wasn't just specific for for transplant. So there's an older gentleman I think his name was Frank, if I'm not mistaken like like older, like probably like early 80s, I think he had a hip surgery and you know, I saw him walk around and it was my time to walk. So I went you know I like talk to people so I said let me go out there with my IV thing and I'll start walking with uh, with Frank. So I told him about you know what I did and he's like oh, I'm here for hip surgery I think it was the second one and Frank was lapping me and my wife was in the hospital like laughing she's like you're getting lapped by, like an 80 year old guy who had hip surgery. She's like you know, you're such a baby, like you know walk faster.
Speaker 2:You know, mike, I got to, I got to say one more thing about where Will is today, because he, will, was always, you know, so, super skinny, uh, and now, you know, I think he works out six or seven days a week. Right, I mean, he, he, he, I think he's eaten more food since the transplant that he did the first 25 years of his life and, uh, you know, uh, his family and me included, are just amazed at just how strong and how healthy and how terrific he is, you know, and, and, of course, he's onto his life. He's 28 year old man, you know, living, living his best life, as he should be now, and nothing can be better for a parent than to see your, your, your child, grown adult, be thriving.
Speaker 1:It's, yeah, it's, it's, it's truly is a miracle. On, transplantation is just amazing. I mean, I'm still, like, fascinated by it. I I obviously deal with it in my my current position, uh, every day and I'm just, I'm just floored. You know, literally taking an organ from somebody and moving it into somebody else so you know they can have a um, you know, a better life is just remarkable. Uh, I want to talk to you about the bill that you introduced, um, known as the giving the gift of life act. Uh, what does a legislation specifically do and and how does it support living donors? I do know a little bit about it because, um, you again, you are a man of your word and you said you had something in the works and and when you were getting this bill uh passed through the, the Senate and Legislative of Georgia, you asked me to come down with a few other people to testify, and I did so. Can you talk about the um giving the gift?
Speaker 2:of life act. Thank you, it is again. This is part of our calling. I knew when this was uh, when we were healthy and had been post transplant, we need to do something. And well, when I talked about it many times and giving gift of life act, uh, does two really mean things. The first thing it does it assures any one of us who are living donor, no matter what you do or how you donate, that you can never lose uh or be denied health insurance and here's the great news for us living donors we live longer than the average person does, uh. And the second part is is it raises up and now gives $25,000 of a tax exemption, uh to the folks that are the living donors.
Speaker 2:And you might say, gosh, why is this important? Well, you know what this is to help people who might be taking off some time of work for doctors, appointments for having the transplant surgery done, et cetera. Uh, am I helping people and sending people? You're darn straight. I am. Of course I am.
Speaker 2:This is the greatest return on investment ever measured, because, in first and foremost, we save people's lives. Nothing's more important than that. But when running the numbers, I calculated a 62 to one return on investment because once the transplant's done for whether it be will or everyone else out there those doctor bills which are not just the cost of dialysis and going to the doctor, it's inevitable trips to the hospital, in the emergency room all of a sudden go down to a fraction of almost nothing. Right, the costs are very low Uh. We get people back into society, give them a chance to live their full life, to work, to help other people, and since that uh, through the help of you, mike, uh and so many other people, we're taking that around the country, and you were instrumental in making that happen in New York.
Speaker 2:We recently just uh got Michigan done Uh, and we want to stop until we have all 50 of those plus uh working with my federal counterparts for several bills uh on the national level to help as well. So our work uh is really just begun as we continue to streamline the process, support the families and the people involved in this, educate people, and here's what my goal is. I want to flip the list, and flipping the list means not only is nobody waiting to get an organ, there are people waiting to donate an organ.
Speaker 1:That would be perfect, that would be amazing. That's. That's the goal, right, to have people just lined up saying you know, when does someone need a kidney Cause? I'm ready to, I'm ready to donate, uh, that would be ideal. Well, yeah, our work is definitely not done and we're going to continue, I think, until we, until we flip that uh list for sure. So, you know, one of the things I I love about the giving the gift of life act is that it, like, naturally works alongside of the NKR's donor shield program, which supports, uh, you know, uh donors. Right, we have a lot of supports and protections for them. So, if an individual were to donate in the state of Georgia at an NKR center, donor shield helps remove some of the the roblox and barriers, and then you have such a great you know law in place that, um, really makes it an awesome state to donate, uh your kidney in for sure, right, absolutely.
Speaker 2:Uh, you know what NKR is done. Uh, getting to spend time with you and and Garrett and other members of your team is extraordinary. It's really inspiring when you see so many people that are involved in this who either have a direct connection, an indirect connection or sometimes no specific connection, but they have a heart for this. And, as we've gone around, uh to speak to countless people, will and I got to go out to the transplant games in San Diego, uh, back in 2022. Uh, it was just. It was again inspiring and humbling to see there's thousands of people just like us all trying to do good.
Speaker 1:So the bill was signed into law less than two years ago, um, but do you know how Georgia residents have been taking advantage of it? Do you have any? Are there any data or statistics to you know? Support that uh living, uh kidney donation has increased in Georgia, or is it too soon to tell?
Speaker 2:Well, I know the overall numbers have increased, uh, as I work with both Emery and Piedmont Hospital. Uh, obviously, folks like yourself, lifelink, other great organizations that are involved in this. I don't know exactly how many people have taken advantage of the tax exemption at this point, because it takes a few years for those numbers to get through the cycle. However, in all the places that we have gone to speak either individually or together, I can't tell you how many people come up and talk to us. Uh, it's so often that I'm on the board of directors for the Georgia Transplant Foundation that uh people will contact uh Will or I directly and we'll talk them through the whole process and help them get there and make sure they know everything from Medicare to the giving the gift of life act to other contacts, just having the basic support of somebody who truly understands who's gone through this process, either from the recipient or the donor's perspective.
Speaker 1:All right. So, john, you've also lobbied US Congress to pass the Living Donor Protection Act. Do you know how that initiative is going, or do you have any information on that?
Speaker 2:Certainly. I got to go up to DC on a couple of occasions now, both meeting with representatives from NKR and KDO, american Kidney Foundation, national Kidney Foundation really to bring an army of people up to Capitol Hill to meet with US senators and US representatives. The talks went great. Every person I talked to signed on to the bill, which was exciting. Unfortunately, the wheels in Washington work extraordinarily slowly.
Speaker 3:Not in Georgia.
Speaker 2:No, we get things done a lot faster. Certainly, it's been mired down way too long. I feel like we're on the cusp of doing that. But part of the different parts of this bill that are important are not just some of the similar things we pass on the state level, but this is also fixing the problem we have with transporting organs.
Speaker 2:Back after 9-11, 2001, there was guidance from the TSA to not allow organs to be what would typically put in the cockpit of an airplane and they were told to be put in a cargo hold.
Speaker 2:Well, during that time, sadly, hundreds of organs were either damaged, misplaced or the timing precoded them from getting to their intended target, and that's unacceptable.
Speaker 2:Even if one had a problem, it's unacceptable. So we've been working with the airlines and the TSA and obviously the US Congress, to fix that and get them back up in the front of the airplane, make sure that airplane has priority takeoff, priority landing. Somebody is there either to take the organ right on the last minute and right off the airplane or, if they're on the airplane, how do we get them through security quickly and then get them right out of that airplane. So there's a lot of work has been done and it is my hope and prayer. We can do that, but we're going to need an army again. So, everybody listening to this podcast today, I want you to get involved, because people who represent you need to hear from you and hear from you personally. Don't just send an email, don't just make a phone call and leave a message. Make sure they see you eye to eye and know how important this is to you.
Speaker 1:Will I think you're getting involved in that as well, getting priority for that.
Speaker 3:Yes, we've been very, very lucky, through our connections, to have had meetings with the airlines and I initially started this conversation with. I started first with the FAA, just wondering whose code section is this? Is this a law? Is there a reason that they stopped going in the cockpits? At which point we landed that? The final answer was the TSA and every other three letter alphabet soup agency out there, and I think what we landed on is that there is no code section or specific law prohibiting organs from going in the cockpit or advancing security measures. It was just a post 9-11, I think it's listed as a best practice or highly suggested. So we've had a lot of very, very productive meetings, both with federal agencies as well as different airline brands, to see who might be the first airline who wants to take a hold of this and hopefully the dominoes will fall and everyone will take after that first one.
Speaker 1:Well, that is good to hear because I'm sure you guys know that the National Kidney Registry offers all of its donors the ability to donate remotely. So transporting kidneys safely is absolutely critical to us and our operations team. So we definitely champion your efforts and anything that we could do at the National Kidney Registry to help support that. I'm saying that publicly and you have it on tape. Please let me know and we'll be more than happy to help, because it really is a crucial component of the National Kidney Registry. Success is being able to transport a kidney from point A to point B. So I would be remiss if I didn't share that.
Speaker 1:Your family's response to Wilms Medical Crisis is very similar to the response that our CEO, Garrett Hill, and his family had almost 17 years ago. You both experienced living donation and transportation process firsthand and saw opportunities for improving that process. So what are your hopes for the future of living organ donation here in the United States? I know that's a big question, but I know we touched on it a little bit. But if you can expand on what your hopes are, both you and Wil, that would be great.
Speaker 3:Go ahead, wil. I think the overall thing I would like to accomplish is educate people in a way to where they understand that to donate although yes, is a big decision and shouldn't be taken lightly doesn't have the medical effects that you think it might. I mean.
Speaker 3:I would take a good example. I was watching a Netflix show a few months ago and just the way they talked about transplantation of course I'm biased and I've know the process very intimately I was like, no, that's not it at all. I think, unfortunately, unless you're in our position where you need one or you know a family member that's reached out and you do your independent research see, you know the word transplant is this big scary. You only see it in a movie or TV show and I think my overall countrywide goal is to educate people and realize that, unless you have another underlying health condition, there's no reason you can't end up like my dad and live a full and healthy life.
Speaker 1:Well, that is a great answer because, john, one of our goals for this podcast is to normalize living organ donation, and so do you want to touch on that or expand to what Will said?
Speaker 2:Certainly, I mean, it will bring up such a critical point of education. Right, this is a part of life, no different than anything else, that we all experience as we go through life, and we can all help solve this problem in different ways. Right, each one of us is a different tool in our tool belt. And if you think about what I was mentioning earlier about flipping the list, you know today, you know depending on what day you look at it there's somewhere about 100, 115,000 people who are in need of a life-saving organ. But if you think about, you know the 330 plus million Americans, right, and the exposure we have to people who can be living donors, we could wipe that list out so quick. It would be amazing. And then again, when people are waiting in line, saying hey, I'm ready to donate as soon as that person needs it, I think it'll just be an extraordinary way to show the humanity. And really that's what America is all about.
Speaker 2:Right, we rally together and we support people, and I liken it to my background as being a firefighter and I want to have the same approach. You know, if somebody has a house fire and you know law enforcement, fire service, ambulances, we all respond right and we all have a job to do. And, as a firefighter, once we put that fire out, we immediately do things like okay, we've got to protect and preserve their belongings, their furniture, put tarps in their house, we give them contact information for our recovery team to come in and help them, we give them resources to get them to temporary living quarters, to work with their insurance company, and the whole goal is to make sure they can get back into a safe, wonderful home as quickly as possible. Well, if we can do that there with first responders, we could be the same first responders to someone who's in need of a life-saving organ. And that, I think, is going to be the thing that makes all of us ring the bell together and say we've accomplished something extraordinary in our time.
Speaker 1:So something just came to my mind. I've been on a couple of committees with the American Society of Transplantation and a bunch of other stuff and we've often discussed that transplantation doesn't get the coverage, the funding behind it as other issues diseases, illnesses and not to take away. I'm not looking to remove money from any other illness that gets funding, but it seems that just transplantation is just not in the government's purview. It seems I was actually at a conference, so I was at a conference. A gentleman was up on stage who used to be part of HRSA for like 35 years and I'm so glad I heard this with my own ears. I mean, he actually said up on stage in front of hundreds of people that when they went in these committees and they talked about doing PSAs or the government getting behind educational maybe TV spots or something to educate people on living kidney donation, they actually all collectively said no, we don't want to touch that because we don't want the government to be seen as we're trying to get organs out of people or incentivize people to do a surgery. That is just completely unnecessary.
Speaker 1:This is the guy who was in the room with these HRSA people confirming what I knew that the government, not the state of Georgia, but the government in Washington DC. Even within those circles, it still seems barbaric. It still seems, john, you're crazy, although you wanted to help your son. I'm certainly crazy for wanting to donate to a stranger. So how do we fix that? Because transplantation is just. I mean, you see the Senate hearings that are going on with the deceased donor organs. It's just not really on their radar. So how do we get it on their radar?
Speaker 2:Mike, people don't know what they don't know. The way we're going to change them is to have everyone contact their legislator. They have to tell their unique story, your extraordinary story of giving life to somebody you didn't even know out of the blue, whether it be Will and I or all the other countless people that have done this, Because if you don't know the story, you don't understand the magnitude of what it is. Nobody got put on the kidney transplant list because they smoked cigarettes for 50 years and they got lung cancer right. That's a direct cause and result. This was nothing that Will could have ever done different in his life. So this is a very real way that we help people, and the more we tell that story, we get people to seek to understand, whether that be through face-to-face conversations, whether it be television shows now there's a couple of movies out about this I think will change your hearts and minds.
Speaker 2:And look, do I want to incent people to give organs? You don't straight, I do, Absolutely. Well, I mean, we incent people to do all sorts of crazy stuff in this country, Mike. We incent to people to stay home during COVID, Then we incent to them not to stay home. Then we incent people to farmland, Then we incent people not to farmland. We incent people to drive an electric car or buy a bigger 5,000-pound car, right. So we incent people to do stuff all the time. Why wouldn't we want to incent someone to save a life and save a 62-to-1 return on investment? That's the biggest no-brainer in history. But it's going to take all of us to be persistent and we will win.
Speaker 1:So Will, before we wrap up, because I know that both of you are very busy there in the great state of Georgia and I don't want to take up too much of your time. Is there anything that we didn't cover or any last words that you'd like to share?
Speaker 3:Sure, I think, just to compound on what my dad just said, when I thought of transplant beforehand, it was an 80-year-old man. It wasn't. There's no way it could be a kid. There's no way it would be me. It's definitely not children. I'd never heard of a living donor. I didn't even know that was possible. I thought this only affects the older generations. And if, by a tragedy, someone passes away and they were an organ donor, I had no idea that you could opt out of it on the license or that it was an opt-in. I just knew that I had had it and might have accidentally clicked a box when I was 16. So I think part of that education is also finding a polite way to explain to people that there's a four-year-old in a children's hospital that has the same issue as someone who's older someone to me in my 20s or 30s that it doesn't discriminate based on age or race or gender. It's a very all-inclusive problem.
Speaker 1:John, what about you? Anything that we didn't cover that you want to cover, or do you have any great parting?
Speaker 2:words. You know, mike, I've got a future guest for you and her name is Sierra Pape. She is a young lady in high school right here in Atlanta, georgia. She came to me earlier in 2023 because her uncle was an Oregon recipient and her pastor, unfortunately, was waiting to get a kidney and passed away and she felt compelled to do something as a high score because she was getting ready to go get her driver's permit and what she wanted to do is make sure that in every health class, starting in the eighth grade, that students in Georgia would be exposed to what Oregon Data Nation is, that they could be a living donor, how they could get signed up through their driver's license and be a part of this problem. The other day we brought it in front of the state school board both she spoke and I spoke and they agreed to and they will be passing it officially. They put it on their consent calendar here in February, right before donor day, and that is going to be part of the curriculum for every student so we can expose them.
Speaker 2:Think about how many young people now that we can get on the list and then we'll have a big donor day celebration. Usually that's on February 14th, but we're going to do it on the 15th here in Georgia. So I'm inviting my friend Mike down to come join us for donor day, if you can make that happen, and meet some of these wonderful folks, and I hope you can get Sierra on a future podcast, because this is truly outstanding. And lastly, mike, I just want to thank you, I want to thank Garrett and the NKR, all the wonderful things you all are doing and I know you'll continue to do. Our work is not nearly done. This podcast is a great way to reach people and, if I can be of any service, if anybody needs the assistance for Will and I, please reach out to us, hit us on the website, call text, email, whatever your preferred method of communication is. Keep the faith, stay positive. We have wonderful, wonderful opportunities to break through this problem and ultimately help so many generations ahead of us. Thanks again.
Speaker 1:That is awesome. So I am definitely going to look at my schedule and I hope to be able to make it. I'm glad you changed to date because my wife's birthday is February 14th, but I'm sure she'll be more than willing to take a trip, since she's an organ donor as well to the great state of Georgia. So maybe you know what? Maybe I'll see if she can get off for work and she can come down as well.
Speaker 2:Perfect, we'd love to have you.
Speaker 1:Senator Albers Will. I can't thank you both enough for being our guest today. If listeners would like to follow Senator Albers and his legislative undertakings in Georgia, you can visit his website at senatoralbers a l b e r s dot com. Senator, please keep us up to date on your continued efforts with the other states and Congress as well. We look forward to hearing about all the great things that you and Will are going to be doing, as always.
Speaker 1:I want to thank our listeners for joining us today. We love to hear your feedback on each episode and we'd love to hear that you are spreading the word. That one is enough. If you're looking for more information on living kitty donation or you'd like to start the process of being screened as a potential donor, please visit kidney registry dot org. You can learn more about the podcast by visiting kidney registry dot org. Slash one. When you're there, you can sign up to be on our email list so that you'll be the first to know when we drop a new episode and, trust me, you want to be the first to know.