Unveiling the Legacy and Craftsmanship of Zodiac Watches with Mike Pearson

Ever wondered about the unique balance between affordability, innovation, and heritage within the world of watchmaking? Get ready to embark on an exciting journey through time as we sit down with our special guest, Mike from Zodiac Watches, and unveil the intricate craftsmanship and rich history of the iconic brand. We delve into Zodiac's 141-year old legacy, from its innovative designs to the renowned Seawolf collection and the various ownership transitions it has experienced.

In this captivating episode, we'll scratch beneath the surface, shedding light on what sets Zodiac watches apart from others in the market. You'll gain insights into their meticulous design process, striking a unique balance between valuing community feedback and respecting their Swiss heritage, all under the umbrella of American ownership. The journey continues with a sneak peek into the future of Zodiac, discussing their plans for global expansion and sustained innovation.

Wrapping up our conversation, we shift gears to explore the challenging world of watchmaking with Oliver Goffe, founder of Spinnaker Watches. He uncovers the inspiration and hurdles behind creating their popular Prodiver collection and provides a glimpse into an upcoming launch. This episode isn't just a must-listen for watch enthusiasts; it's a tantalizing exploration of the blend of art, science, and commerce that forms the foundation of a successful luxury brand.

Be sure to check our Zodiac Watches:
http://zodiacwatches.com

Transcript

Blake Rea: 0:00

What's up everybody. Welcome to the Lonely Wrist podcast visual edition. All of that. Today we have a very special guest, my brother Mike from Zodiac. Welcome, buddy.

Mike Pearson: 0:12

Thanks very much. Nice golf clap Very, very appreciate it. It's great to be here. Thanks for inviting me on, really looking forward to this.

Blake Rea: 0:20

I knew we had to have you on. Just love what you guys are doing at Zodiac. I'm really excited for the future and so it's kind of a no-brainer for us. I think both of us are fans of Zodiac For sure, what you're doing with the brand, so, yeah, it's a pleasure for us.

Mike Pearson: 0:38

I think that's one of the main things that I think the community and doing podcasts and so on and so forth People want this to matter. Again, I think we've shown that we've got the right direction for it. So if we can look after you guys or support people's ideals of what Zodiac should be, I think we're on the right track.

Blake Rea: 0:55

I think you're your head Seth's in head, so should we do. We don't do the rich, rich checks all the time, but maybe we should since, okay, we've got Mike and he's always got some good stuff, zodiac, nice, so obviously I got this one. Oh, I've seen that one too.

Mike Pearson: 1:16

Yes, it's a six dashboard, five when a little bit colorful today.

Justin Summers: 1:20

That's pretty much just got a lot of no Zodiac yet You're working on it Justin.

Mike Pearson: 1:26

we know that we do.

Blake Rea: 1:29

He's here in the flesh, so a lot of our audience probably already knows about Zodiac, but for those of those listeners who don't, would you mind filling the gaps for them?

Mike Pearson: 1:42

Sure, it's a heritage brand for many, many of the watch community, but it's also quite a new brand for a lot of the recent lovers of watches. It's been around for 141 years. It was family owned for a century by the Calam family. Everyone will know it for its most famous watch, which was in 1953, the Seawolf. I'm a big believer that it's nice to kind of see the 70 years before the Seawolf to understand the strength of the brand. It was some of the first moon phases. Some of the first pioneers of GMTs are always innovative, very different with design, and the Calam family for that century really were fantastic at what they did. The one thing that I found more and more appeal the layers of the onion off. They were very different. What's quite similar to what's today, to what was then, is they didn't want to be the norm. They wanted to build it themselves on the parrot themselves and they also wanted to be quite affordable or attainable for most of the community or most of the watch by the public. That's what we're trying to do, what we're doing with a price point now in today's relative differences in terms of numbers, Also the fun we can have with materials and colours. But in the 80s, like many brands, the Quartz era happened and Zodiac, to its credit, tried to keep up with some of the first electronic watches. But the Calam family fell out of love and ended up selling the brand, Unlike some other brands who kind of went by the way and just went out of business, then brought back to huge fanfare, Zodiac was sold and also sold to people who didn't really look after it. So in many ways it's never gone away. But it was in a very, very different state to what its heyday was of the late 70s where they were making a quarter of a million watches a year. It was owned by one company through the 80s and, like I said, that was a very small part of its history in terms of how it was looked after the 90s. It had some symmetry with Taghoyer, the distribution and the distributors who owned the right. The watches look quite similar, but there are also some really funky 90s designs that came out there.

Mike Pearson: 3:41

The big shame, I think, for the 90s is that we lost some of the IP or some of the naming rights, some of the iconic watches. So Seawolf Aerospace went off to Breiling and I think they did the right thing. They saw a great name. They took it, but in 2001, it was owned and bought by the Fossil Group. The Fossil Group did what Fossil does and they made some really fantastic fashion watches. But it had a name for you and I, and probably your listeners and viewers, Maybe it deserved a little bit more in terms of how it's made, where it's made and so on and so forth.

Mike Pearson: 4:12

So what we've done in the last especially the last eight years, but I think more targeted the last couple is to look at ourselves not as being owned by anyone, but being custodians of the name. We're treated very differently to the rest of the family. In terms of the Fossil family, we're built, obviously, in Switzerland. We're powered by our own movement and so, 141 years later, we are looking back to what's right about the name. And if you look at some of the vintage collectors, they're looking at us and going okay, you've got a chance here, show us that it matters again. And it's really wonderful. And for me, knitting those two communities together is a point of pride and that's why I've been doing so much of this storytelling. But it's an icon in many ways, especially the Seawolf.

Blake Rea: 4:55

Yeah, ironically, I don't think most people know this, but so the Seawolf at one time was selling for more than the 50 fathoms.

Mike Pearson: 5:05

Yeah, well, it was more.

Mike Pearson: 5:06

It was a very different watch because the case back was really robust, so it could go down deeper than the 50 fathoms.

Mike Pearson: 5:12

It was a lot stronger in terms of aesthetics to anything that was out at this time, and many dive watch, many brands who wanted a dive watch in their collection, looked at the aesthetics of Zodiac over anything else that was out there. And if you look at the sharp tooth hands and numerals of what the Seawolf looked like, we don't have to go back to a time. We go back to our own back catalog and the Seawolf stands very strong and I think because of that strength and the way it was built, it was also, in the end, trusted by a lot of militaries, especially the American side, and that's why, especially here in the US I don't know where you listeners are, but I think I'm sure a lot of them are here there's such a pinch to what it was, because it was trusted by a generation that used it as a tool, and that's that's some really good stories that we've been finding out as well. So either the sons or the people who still own their original watches or the families have taken those stories on it's. It's awesome.

Blake Rea: 6:05

Also another one that I've heard and maybe you could dispel the rumor. But the Zodiac killer obviously used your logo.

Mike Pearson: 6:14

Well. So he used a logo that looked like, obviously, the sights of the gun and that's how it kind of went to, within the Zodiac nickname and so on and so forth, what our logo is. If you got my cup here, just so you see, it's actually a Norse symbol for time telling. So if you look at go back to the zenith of the world, or you look at Omega, he's always looking to the stars. There are romanticism to it. Obviously, with what he was doing and what he did, the press took the name and away it went.

Mike Pearson: 6:41

In terms of folklore, we do things that are very much distancing that, distancing ourselves from it, even to the point where the Fincher movie came out, where he wanted to have our watch in the movie, we said no because people passed away. But obviously people know it for certain ways. Or you could even pivot and look at in France and they make some really cool Zodiac ribbed boats. So people don't even know sometimes that it's an own watch brand. They think we named a watch after a boat. So it's just all folklore, where you're from, whatever you do. But we, we understand why that that name kind of happened at that time. But yeah, there's 141 years of history, so we try and jump over it. Also, we're so respecting, you know, who passed away.

Justin Summers: 7:22

You guys are definitely going to go around longer than the Zodiac killer was. Yeah.

Mike Pearson: 7:27

So, maybe he was a fan.

Mike Pearson: 7:29

It could have been, yeah, the great watches, but yeah, well, they think that actually you know what we did.

Mike Pearson: 7:37

We saw on last year or earlier this year, I don't know so much going on, we saw that the person they thought might have been the Zodiac killer was caught, so that you know, and they found it after he, after his passing. So hopefully that's all gone away now and but you know we have to roll with everything that kind of comes our way, good and bad, and like I said, when we were sold in the 80s and we went through different ownership groups, that could be considered bad in terms of business and watch style. But I'm a big believer in owning the good and the bad and just acknowledging it. Some people will try and shove it under the carpet either bad designs or bad movements or, you know, bad customer service. But it's part of the evolution, it's part of learning and you know we've owned the brand from 2001. But this iteration of Zodiac has really only been going for the last five to eight years in terms of who's been given the task, and then obviously I popped on board a couple of years ago. So been fun.

Justin Summers: 8:27

You guys definitely have been putting on the gas. I've noticed that for sure. I'm interested, mike, what do you guys feel like Zodiac part you know as a brand in terms of your designs? I know generally I like to. Yes, sir, yep, I know that generally you guys like to lean on. You know very extravagant colors. You know you stick to the Super Seawolf design and things like that. But what do you think sets you guys apart?

Mike Pearson: 8:49

I think a couple of years ago I would have said just color. I would have you know and that's not disrespect to anybody who was designing them but we did color very differently. But I think what we did do at that point was listen to the community and the gentleman called TJ McKnight who's handed the Zodiac reigns, alongside a guy called Ryan White who's the creative director for Zodiac. These guys will have the ideas and then they'll send it to Switzerland. The watchers are creative, which is brilliant. Now there's obviously a little bit of a bigger team all over the world. But they'd listen to the community and they said what do you guys want from us? And they went through some iconic colors, such as the orange and blue that you would have found in the 70s, or looking at the Bakelite blue that we did in the 60s, some of the old GMTs, but obviously we can't say the word aerospace, but we can have our design with that green triangle. So what I'd like now is the fact that we can dip into our history and heritage, but we can also then throw pink and polka dots on it and people go, ok, I can still see a Zodiac through that. So I think what sets us apart is that we are obviously very Swiss, with a Swiss heritage, but we're owned by an American company who's obviously associated with a lot of different trends or colors or materials and we can tap into that, unlike anything I've seen in my 17 years in the watch industry and I think that's very different that we can keep the fun, keep the heritage. Now we've got our own movement, which we'll get into more and more in terms of really having a movement which we can trust, we can really proud about, and we don't have to rely on the supply chain of anybody else and we can be part of this price point, which is very business boring thing to say.

Mike Pearson: 10:21

But you've got to find where you fit, because if you're a five grand watch, you're against a third of the industry. If you're an eight grand watch, you know you're going against the big boys. After that you've got to be something really special. So for us you look at what's entry level? You go Seiko and I've got loads and I love them, and then you start looking at Hamilton's and T-Sows and then entry level Orris or Quartz, taekwere. Where do you find a place within that? That matters.

Mike Pearson: 10:44

So we carved out within this very large group of place where we can take the hit on the margin, make a watch as best as we can, but still keep it at a point, a price point that's good for everybody. And I'm under no disillusion that 12 to 15 hundred bucks is a good chunk of change, but it's still attainable Way everybody. And if you are a collector, sometimes that type of price points great to add in for a summer or a winter or a vacation style Watch or yeah, it's not gonna matter. And for me I love that we've got that ability. So it is four or five prong attack. But I think we're kind of floating around the middle there with design, iconography, fun and then price point with the movement.

Justin Summers: 11:25

I think you guys do an exceptional job and, just for everybody listening as well, I've always thought that, personally, zodiac has some of the best bang for your buck watches that are created at the market, so I think that you guys kind of nail it right on the head and yeah.

Blake Rea: 11:38

You don't get a lot within that price segment, like you don't. You don't get a lot of unique design elements, like you know. You have a ton of watches in the sub seven dollar range. You have one thousand to you know made twelve hundred dollar range where you start to get a little bit of innovation, a little bit of technology. But then once you start getting above that, I mean you just don't really get any unique designs within that price segment. So you know, I do, I do agree.

Mike Pearson: 12:07

I think it's relatively it when you find that price point as well. And this is I mean I'm especially when I left the watch industry for a couple of years, especially that we all did during cove it. But I Loved finding these micro brands that you would have found them, the one around windup shows, and I've got very close to the teams over if Farah or Vertex, or looking what Nick was doing at fears and all the different independent Well, william Woods here, for example, a lot of British brands. I obviously went back there for a bit, but what I found was most of those brands are not in a retail setting.

Mike Pearson: 12:37

So the tough thing with a zodiac point of view is that we build our watches to make sure we go into a retail store or on a retail partner that can be sold online, and so you think about how you build that price point with margins within that.

Mike Pearson: 12:49

It's a very difficult place to be to appease the money people who are above us. But, like I said, we feel like we have to because if we just live online we can get buried with the next story or you know. So watch can come out with another fantastic Collaboration with one of their brands, which is grand, but for us if we don't have a retail partner or have the ability to go into retail, then sometimes we can get lost and we we're not everywhere just yet. We've we built enough watches to now be in places that we weren't before. But that's it's always about when you're looking to how to build a brand. For me, price points huge, but then obviously we've got people above us who want it to be profitable and we kind of we're on that line within the price points that the customers will see. But we're also on the line where our Seniors will go. Are you sure you don't want to raise prices, but we feel like the right thing to do so.

Blake Rea: 13:38

How so? Obviously, I'd say arguably. Fossil has probably one of the best distribution Outlets, like, like they can get watches out there and people, they can get them in people's hands. You know they've got such a huge footprint for distribution. But in my opinion at least, maybe I'm in the wrong places, but I haven't seen zodiac following that same retail distribution. Is there a strategy behind that or is it just kind of?

Mike Pearson: 14:07

You know you're the first. You've done too many podcasts. You're the first person that's brought that up, because our congratulations on that. Thank you, because we can go into and I say this again with all the respect we can go into the maces and dillards of the world, or Each and every single country has a place that you could find in mass shopping areas where we have a footprint that we need to fill. What you're finding with a lot of the industry now is that they're going yeah, they want to find a Swiss brand or a mechanical brand to fill gaps like that, and I don't want to be in there if you are going to that's again, I don't want to sound like those snobby people, but I don't want to be mystery represented. I don't want to go in there next to certain brands where we might not look great or they might not look great. So the lovely thing that I find with the independent scene and I'm talking about your great retailers that are out there is that the they know how to sell you. They will be able to construct your story in a retail setting, on their social, in their website, at an event, best than any mass store could be, especially at this, this stage and for me it was really important that we found in each state, for example, one store that could be a beacon for our brand. And right now we're getting there and the last couple of years We've we've ramped up. We don't have anywhere in North Carolina, we don't have anywhere in Vegas, which is brilliant.

Mike Pearson: 15:22

To talk to you guys today, but the idea, the idea is I am, I Want to go to the places that want us back. I don't want to just shove it in there to feel like it's going to succeed. So I want a partnership and I've said this before at a Few different podcasts. I don't want to come across and walk into anyone's door or have our team call up anybody. We want someone to find a good kinship. So we won't cross anybody's door unless we're invited, just like a vampire. So but once we're in, we're not leaving.

Mike Pearson: 15:51

So it's, it's, it's a massive thing and you know, away from the US, my first three months was telling all of our distribution partners, because fossils got partners, they've got me in every different country and I told them the story, I told them the plan, told the movements and I got all excited and the end of it I says but you can't have it yet, because if we don't get it right in America and the UK, which that first ports of call, then we won't have the good habits to go into Germany or bigger, into Latin America or, yeah, the Middle East or Asia. So we're really cognizant of how many we make. We cognizant that zodiacs come and gone a couple of different times because it was built in certain ways or we didn't have a core collection to tell. But the strategy of where we go is the most important thing, because for me those 18 inches of glass or a good social or a good website blog are the difference between a successful brand or not. So it's a really good question.

Justin Summers: 16:48

Yeah, it's definitely a great question. Like, appreciate that answer to Mike. I'm gonna switch this gears, kind of talk about more of the seawolf. I know you guys get a lot of praise for that watch. I know you have many different models and I'm sure that will speak about different things. Yeah, I know it's probably the most iconic, but how have you guys kept the collection for the seawolf thriving over the years? And, you know, can you kind of walk us through the significance of the design and the series of seawolf?

Mike Pearson: 17:12

Sure, I've got. This might not be great for podcasting, but I'll try and describe it as well as I can to help you out. So we, like I said, we lost the name seawolf in the 90s and so any dive case we call super seawolf. Super seawolf was a saturation diver in the 1960s and because that was attached as three words instead of one true trademark, we can use super seawolf in everything. So what we do is there's a super seawolf skin, it's a super seawolf compression pro diver, gmt world timer. There's a lot of super seawolfs but if you look into the collection it's a subtle tiz. So within the skin diver and I'm holding it up for the video it's got the blurry thing. I'm sorry but you'll see those Shark 2000 numerals.

Mike Pearson: 17:54

39 millimeter, our compression watch, our super seawolf compression is the biggest part of our collection. That's where we were a little bigger at 40 millimeters. That's where we have a ton of fun with color. We have a lot of innovation in terms of diamaterial. Last year we did meteorites, we did ceramic casing. You know we've got a lot of plans for this. And then the super seawolf pro is Our way of kind of nodding us forward 300 meters, iso certified, chronometer certified. So within that, those three ranges, we've got three different sizes, three different ideals, three different levels of quality, but they all, if you look at them, feel like a zodiac should in terms of moving it forward. Then the next bit is making sure that no one gets confused. So with the GMT in the world timers, is that's the aerospace or the world timer from the 70s? These are iconic designs and so I think some people have to sometimes look through that name to see what the watch is. But we're kind of dealing with the debt the hand would dealt with and that's that's probably going to change subtly over the next few years. But the seawolf name itself for right now is the right thing to do.

Mike Pearson: 18:58

This year, 70 years of the seawolf, we we didn't want to do what a lot of other brands might do at the heritage anniversary and Add a bigger movement, add a different material and say, right, here's 15 grand zodiac, because everyone would laugh us out the building. So what we've tried to do is improve the quality, improve the loom, improve the, the iconography of the story and Putting it out there. So people know that when you're looking for zodiac, the first place you might want to look at is the skin 53 story and we've now got it in black in a steel bezel. We did a blue, we did a bronze variation recently with hopeberry and we've got a couple of the colors coming out. The rest of this in the end of this year one, a really cool material, and one that we're going to do in a really fancy green, which I'll Say the color now because we've kind of teased it on our social media that these things are coming. But material wise, we've not told anybody what's coming at the end of the year.

Mike Pearson: 19:49

But compression, super seal, compression is where the funds at. It's also where we're going to be. I think we're going to be Launching this podcast around the launch of this watch. So I'll tell you about it when you, when you ask. But the movement in terms of how we grow and how we get better we're, we're showcasing that kind of innovation inside the compression watch because it's a design and a size that suits everybody and that doesn't just include us three on the screen as girls, people of all different shapes and sizes. It's just a really good size. So I'd say the compression is a really good place to kind of start.

Blake Rea: 20:25

I'd be curious if you could, to walk us through like the whole design process. We, we got this. This is the first time. Well, the second time we've asked this question, we've asked it to fairer, which had a killer answer. Oh, can you walk us through like the journey that a watch goes through before you know, from idea to Rest?

Mike Pearson: 20:50

yeah, I'll give you my. I'll give you my perspective on the outside as a non-designer. I think rich might look at it a bit different, as it's his brand, but what we've got is a really cool team. But I mentioned his name earlier, ryan white, and there's a gentleman called TJ McKnight Myself. Those guys got a gentle, john John Brett, who looks after you know, making sure we hit margins and make sure we can source certain materials at certain prices, and, in all honesty, we starts, as it should do, in a room, around a table, with some ideas of where we want to take a Collection or a model and also what the innovations can be.

Mike Pearson: 21:22

So let's take I'm not gonna tell you what's coming, but let's take an idea. Just kind of call it watch X. That's gonna be for 2025, and so what we look at for 2025, we've got an idea what the innovation of the movement could be, and then what we have to do is go back to STP, which that movement company that we own, and then we talk about what, what their capabilities are, and then we kind of see If we can marry that with design. So we can start with an idea of the past, start with an idea of innovation, which is, I think, that's the right thing to do for zodiac at this time is to maybe hark on some of the older models and then push it forward, and then what we can do with that is then map out a timeline of designs. We will have a really lovely kind of Sit around the table who likes what's the idea is your options of five different styles, and then we kind of we vote in it, we talk about what's right, what's wrong, what we could do better, and then the Swiss team will then get that kind of information and then draw up final ideas. And then it comes through in terms of materials, so on and so forth, and then we we've got that all together with our movement manufacturer.

Mike Pearson: 22:28

If you then takes something that's part of a collection today, and how do you move it forward? That's a lot simple, a lot simpler. We can talk about colors and materials and we can talk about vessels and styles, but then that is a cognizant decision. Are you going to just add more colors? Because they're quite cool and quite fun? And I still think right now, yeah, because there's a lot of colors in the rainbow and we can go to town with any type of iteration, but for me, the longer point of it is where do you want the brand to end up? And I think the the long, the long answer, short for me, is that we want people to respect the fact that we are looking after that name and how has that done in our community, is to innovation.

Mike Pearson: 23:06

But we can only do innovation if we've got the, the Movement factory or the movement facility on the same wavelength as us, and then can we find an old type of style that will fit with our new innovations and the materials that we want to use, and then it has to come together and we also have to talk to the people upstairs to see if this type of price point and this type of open to buy we're allowed to do as we keep going, because we have to think in a business sense, probably three to five years Head going forward, which means how many are you going to make of each model? What type of targeted marketing are you going to need for that? What type of Areas of the world you think will be in and will we be a successful when we go there? So there's a million and one different things, but it does still start like everything should around a table with an idea and then it has to go from there. So it's.

Mike Pearson: 23:58

There's a lot of facets to it. There's a lot of design that I'm not a part of, but we can throw ideas in there and then we can guide what we think in terms of the brand direction. But it's. It's a beautiful process to see, especially you know the years and years that I've been doing this watch industry. I've been the voice in the mouth of it, which has been great. But to do it now within zodiac and to see in a very open, planned environment and a really open dialogue style, you get a chance to really see all the different people that can help you and that also comes from, you know, being owned by, like I said, a very large fashion brand company who can help us in terms of oh, you want this material, we've got these connections.

Mike Pearson: 24:36

For a big example of that one would be the meteorite dial we did last year, where they helped us find the broker and then we had to find the broker who would help get us this piece of meteorite. Then we had to go to the factory and learn how to slice it properly and put the acrylic over the top so nothing crumbled away. So it always looked beautiful and we didn't want to have any waste and we found a really good technique. So then we could make three designs out of that one piece of meteorite. We did so. They help us, they know how to use every scent correctly. But, like I said, at the end of the day it's something quite beautiful where you get around the table and you just talk what do you want?

Blake Rea: 25:11

the watch to be. I would argue that, you know, being owned by fossils is a huge advantage to Zodiac, because fashion is always thinking about the next idea, you know, and the watch industry is always stuck on old ideas, you know. So you know, the big guys up front, up top feel it seems like they let you guys really have fun with the brand because they come from fashion and they're like, hey, we want to think about the next 20 years, 30 years. We just don't want to repackage a watch, so you're holding on to the core design elements, but you're still having fun with that.

Mike Pearson: 25:54

I completely agree and, like I said, coming into this company a couple years ago and seeing it, it's wonderful. They treat you like an adult, you know they treat, they're there. There's no like. You know they, they trust you, which is really wonderful.

Mike Pearson: 26:05

And I think the difference between the fashion side and then what we are is that fashion sometimes comes and goes and changes. We want to always look good so we can lean on that fashion ideal and you know the kind of materials they can offer to us or the avenues of openness to add into Zodiac, which means you have that really good marriage of looking good but also being of a moment. But I've got watches that too far away to run and grab. But we did like 10 years ago that still look good today because Zodiac has a certain aesthetic from yesteryear. We should always resonate, like you see how I'm just dropped my kids off at school today and you see the teenagers they're wearing the same clothes that I did in the 90s, like it all comes around again, right so yeah, bootcut jeans, but yeah, you're rocking that buddy, you're looking good.

Mike Pearson: 26:49

But with watches themselves, I think there's a nuance to it and we just want to be a little different and I think thank you very much saying that. I think it's the right way to look at it, that the fossil can help us and you know, when I first started it, I was never apologetic about it. But people say, oh, you're in by the fossil fashion, right, but the more and more is around, the bigger, the bigger parts of our company in terms of the management and the ownership. You know it goes. What? What was your first watch, mike? And I'm like well, actually it was a fossil. Then you have Stormwatch, then you do a big Nike in Adidas and the more and more speak to a lot of our colleagues or people that are like yourselves in the enthusiast world and blogging and so on and so forth. Their first watch could have been something like a fossil as well. And what I realize that when you get older and I'm talking about old guys and girls will get there in a few years time but your last watch could be something like a fossil as well, because you're getting it bought for you as a gift in between is where we get the choice to buy what we like. I mean, people always talk about Christmas and you know the big buying season. It's very rare that you buy something like a zodiac for somebody else, unless you really do really know them. But when I buy a watch or I get a watch, I buy it myself because it's for me and I think most of our community does so as long as we can keep filling in those gaps of choice and that means being a bit innovative, being a bit different I think it's grand.

Mike Pearson: 28:10

I sold a watch to a guy who walked straight into a store. You know he was oozing money, you know he just pulled up in his McLaren and you know he went and bought this really expensive, so I think it's a 25 000 dollar briling, for it was amazing. You could just see he's like boom, I'm just gonna just swipe my card. But he had these orange sneakers on. I said, hey, man, look these sneakers. They've got a watch name color and he goes oh yeah, throw it in like it's just because the color or it could be that on the other side, you know, a younger guy or girl goes. Actually, I've always wanted this because it reminds me of that. The other one it's my palette. I'm saving up for it.

Justin Summers: 28:43

I think that's a lovely place that we can be in terms of all that I love that you guys, your watches, always have such wrist presence, in my opinion, like they just ooze personality, which is one of the personal reasons why I love them. You know some you've got some old boomers and things like that. They're like, oh, we don't want watches and things, but I always lean into that with you guys and I think that that's a really cool aspect. I'm curious, mike, about the you know kind of like the craftsmanship and the precision that goes into making zodiac watches. I know we probably talked a little off the stream about that, but can you tell us a little more about the craftsmanship of your watches?

Mike Pearson: 29:17

yeah, so about a decade ago Fossil bought a place that was for Fossil Swiss. We owned a Burberry at the time. Our Marnie's got a Swiss part of his collection as well, which I think sometimes gets missed really good watches, and obviously we owned zodiac as well. At that point we could make cases and crystals and we could make dials and hands, but in terms of movements we didn't have too much that we could rely on ourselves and so we were, like many small brands, buying into. At the beginning. You could find some of the Fossil brands. For example, would buy in Mioto movements or Seiko movements, which is great, we love them in this community. But in terms of zodiac it kind of had to be Swiss. So we were buying into, we were buying Valjouxs and we were buying proper chronographs and put them into cases, and some people didn't realize the value of zodiac, basically because of what was on the inside. But then you'd find entry-level ETAs, solitas, stopros for GMTs and all of them are the right movements for the watch we were building. What we wanted was to look after ourselves. So we bought STP, swiss technology productions and the design of their three handers and, in all honesty, if we had all the money in the world. We could have 37 different calibers with STP currently, but we are Fossil Group, you know, handing the money down or they're doing it correctly. We have to prove that we are growing, to get the investment back in, to push it into a certain collection, narrative marketing or, for me, the innovations with technology. So that's coming now, and what we did with STP at the beginning was that we had a really solid design, I think, component-wise. They weren't brilliant, I mean it was, it wasn't bad, but it wasn't like it is today. And so what we've done gradually is build the quality of the inside to be a level where we don't need Solita or StoPros anymore, and that's what's really exciting about.

Mike Pearson: 31:03

Now we have, you know, a design team, which is fantastic, but the craftsmanship that you ask of, if you ever and this is any of your listeners if you are ever in Switzerland and you're in VLBN and you see the Cartier Golf Factory or you, you know you can see the Rolex Factory not too far from there in different parts that they make, but you are more than welcome to come and see, see our facility. We talked at the beginning about the matrix, some of the computers that you just see that you know that scene where Neo first gets his powers, you see space and then you see everything. We're at that place where we've got space. We're only making about 15,000 watches right now. So with this facility the craftsmanship is gradual, it's organic, but we've got the room to grow. And then, across the way, we've got Swiss technology productions that are just pumping right now. We've got so much ability and that's when they approached me about joining the movement was a massive part of what I want this brand to be, because if we've got our own heartbeat, we can go back to what the Calam family originally did and we're doing a watch this October that's designed, actually with Ariel Adams of a blog to watch. He helps with design. He did a design with us a couple of years ago. It was a Aquamarine dial. It was great, but the design of the movement we thought was a really good place to start. So do you mind if I show you, because I think this is coming out. So this is probably one the first podcast that we'll see this.

Mike Pearson: 32:24

We're doing a watch called the pineapple dream and this dial I mean I'll send you all the images and obviously I'll try to send you a watch to review. But the dial is looking like the sunlight coming through pineapple leaves. It's so great, it's got lovely texture. And then there's obviously the yellow that goes through to the deep pineapple leaf. Green on the back it says a grab a slice of the good life. It's all fine. But if you were looking at what the idea was I mean the tropics, yeah, it's all fun, we do color, let's do a bold color. But also it's an old sign of wealth where any of the old English travelers of the day if they went to the tropics and they brought back a pineapple, they would carry it around the streets and say, look, I'm doing really well in life. And then there's a you know, not to a bit of that as well.

Mike Pearson: 33:08

But I think, more than anything, it's fine that this watch will be the first that we're going to add an stp1-21 movement to just a number. But basically we've taken our movement and we've added a silicon hairspring to the inside, so it's anti-shark, anti-magnetic, and we then have the ability to add that into all the models that are coming out for the future. We can ice a certifier, we can obviously can still now chronometer certify it, but that movement with those types of capabilities mean that we're not asking for saletes, we're not got our hands out in the supply chain waiting so we can grow at a right, at a not a rapid rate, but an appropriate rate by ourselves for us, and we can also make sure that the community can trust us as well, not like they can't now. But I think, like I said before, over the past few years there might have been some ups and downs in terms of how we're building, but I think with this movement we can really really strive forward quite powerfully and be quite excited with it, and it'll also be a base for what will be for our own GMTs, like I said with SOPROD, and that would push us on to what the next part of our evolution will be.

Mike Pearson: 34:12

But crash miship. It's a beautiful thing. You could be like. I send you a video of you know, swiss Alps and you can see white coats and people walking close with, looking closely with loops. All of that is there. But what I think a lot of people might not miss or might miss is that we really care about that side of it and that can sometimes get overshadowed with color, but it's definitely within the watch and that's why this particular launch, for me is really exciting because it pushes us forward.

Blake Rea: 34:39

That's a beautiful watch and thank you for showing I definitely need to see it in the flesh me and Justin. We'll see if we can get our hands on it.

Justin Summers: 34:47

It's so fun. Yeah, they're great in hand. By the way, the Zodiac watches man for everybody listening like you. Just have to get your hands on one next time that you can go to a watch, you know, expo or something. Pick them up. They're fantastic.

Mike Pearson: 35:01

We got a clip you know, even the clip's nice. You know you can hear it's a lovely action. On the bezel we've got these lovely five-link jubilee star bracelets. We have this really cool the video shoot. We've got these dive extensions in the clasp so if you are a diver it sits and fits well. But if you do like a nice big salty sandwich it'll fit you on a on a warm day as well, and there's quick release on it as well. So throw a tropic strap on there and have some fun with it, which is great. There you go.

Blake Rea: 35:28

Something that I guess would be a great segue is we do our homework here. Obviously we have a new one right, so we we do our homework right. Stp, you know it took me down the rabbit hole of STP. Stp I mean I could be wrong. Just ballpark has anywhere from like 15 to 17 I'd say approximately movements. Like they've got a pretty extensive portfolio of movements, and so you kind of tease that just now a little bit. But my question, and probably another one has never been asked, is when are you bringing some of those movements into Zodiac? Like I saw some really awesome movements with power reserve indicators and sub seconds and you know is when's that coming?

Mike Pearson: 36:14

Within the next five years. I think right now I mean what we all speak quite quickly and we work quite fast in terms of what's now, what's coming. But I think for the wider world, especially away from our community, so many people are just still discovering what Zodiac is, and so we are running with that instead of walking. And I think what's lovely is, like I said, you can see on the website now 15 or 17 different calibers. We have the ability to make up to 37 different ones, and that's across the spectrum. The only movement by the end of next year that won't be STP will be the, I think, the SW 500 510 from Solita with 62 hours of power. That's in our, our chronograph, our C-chron, and I think we are. We bought a thousand of those movements, so we've got a couple of watches out now and we've got another iteration that we could come out with in the next couple of years. But after that we have to look forward and no matter how much you know those movements are on their website to make, it still takes a year and a half to put everything together to then be in production on a bigger scale. So the, the wheels are in motion for two particular movements for 2025. We've got a really fun one. It's coming next year. That kind of appeases all the vintage watch collectors out there, which I'm really excited about.

Mike Pearson: 37:29

But more than anything for me, looking to 25 and beyond is when I think we'll be at a place where we deserve those movements, so the name can can hold up to it. Because right now, if you picked up, let's say, a power reserve and we're not doing a power reserve for a few years but if you picked up a power reserve today and went, oh cool, I don't think it really would change anything. I think if you can pick up a three-hander dive watch or a dive star case and go with this material, this power reserve and this price, think we're in the right place. But if you then add these applications and the prices are edging towards three grand, when we're not right to be there just yet, you might confuse people where we want to be, and I don't think we're ultra complicated just yet.

Mike Pearson: 38:11

The Zodiac really never has been at its height, but it did do some different things. So you look at the astrographic and those mystery dials. I mean, the complication wasn't the movement, it was the way those discs were designed to not hit each other and have that aesthetic of floating hands. Those kind of things are really exciting for our community. And then there's a few movements which I won't say, which are really, you know, I love. So we've got some good things, but, yeah, great question again, blake.

Blake Rea: 38:37

I noticed too. Like you know, you never really notice and understand the quality of the watch until you own one. So I talked to you before pre-stream about how I got my first Zodiac and then our lead into the question or the point I was trying to make here. But you know, there's very few watches out there that just pop off your wrist, you know. And Mike was walking in to wind up and just this bold white watch. It's just like smack you in the face, like, and he was just going around and everybody was trying to like pull his arm off, you know. And so I had my mind I'm like yo, what the hell is that, you know? And then Mike and I we got acquainted and then very quickly I knew I had to buy one. So at day one I was showing Justin, I was like dude, justin, what do you think? Man? He's like dude, do it. And then that's simple, right, I love one. I thought it was going to be a gift, you know, for somebody, but I just ended up keeping it.

Mike Pearson: 39:47

I did buy it for somebody else, I remember now, yeah, I put one on now, that's the one I was wearing it.

Blake Rea: 39:52

was I wearing the orange?

Mike Pearson: 39:53

that day.

Blake Rea: 39:54

I think you were wearing the watermelon.

Mike Pearson: 39:56

Oh yeah, of course, this is the one I probably like the most, but you, that looks great on you that.

Justin Summers: 40:01

I love it. I love it. When I came into Vegas I wore that because I specifically asked Blake. I said I know this is brand new. I said I need to wear that for a day. Let me rock it. He goes okay. So you know, he puts on one of his 80 other watches. He gives me the Super Seawolf and I wrapped it, man, and everywhere that we went we just hit the stops in Vegas. We made our rounds and Blake of course has, you know, clients and friends and stuff like that, the industry introducing me and they all loved it. Man, I mean, they gobbled it up. They were like that is such a cool looking watch and I was like, isn't it? It's not mine, but it's fantastic.

Mike Pearson: 40:37

I mean we've done watermelon well for a couple of years and then we did this one and yeah, I think we kind of owned it a little bit more now. But I think the one thing I like about going to craftsmanship and to talk about how we do things I mean this is a slightly bigger Zodiac it's 41 millimeters, but even the back I mean ceramic is porous. People get a little worried about having ceramic because you can break it.

Mike Pearson: 40:58

We added in that tug on To a board, yeah, and then we also fortified the lugs. So the strength of what's in here is great, and we also chronometer certified these. We took the extra cost on, even though everything's within chronometer rating. Only a few models a year do we choose that maybe deserve the certificate, and we did it with this one because it's such a unique material for Zodiac. But we did it right and this is our way of saying. A lot of customers will go oh, could you do Mother of Pearl? Could you do diamonds? Could you do a ladies watch? I think we've always said Zodiacs are everybody, but this definitely screams whatever you want the watch to be, and I think that's why ceramic's been really good this year for us.

Blake Rea: 41:35

There's a flavor for everybody. And yeah, you actually literally just alluded to what I was about to say, because I saw people on the release like I think you paired and I watched came out like literally like the exact same time as wind up and people were saying like, oh, it's ceramic, like, why ceramic, like isn't it gonna break, and all that. And I was like you know, I can actually jump on and actually talk about this now because I own one. But I was like dude, it's got a steel core, you know Like in that. You know that thought. Clearly you guys were thinking about that when you guys were developing the watch and ceramic it's.

Mike Pearson: 42:13

Last year we did it in black and so it was easier to kind of come up. But when you did it in white, I mean obviously we did the steel but on the case back and it was easier to see and to show, but we had to make people. I think, especially as we grow, craftsmanship aside, I think we have to be trusted and so when we try and do things we wanna be a little bit cognizant that people would look at us, maybe with a view to the rest of the community, the rest of the brands that they could choose. So certain watches we could go a little bit bolder in color. Or in certain models, especially like with the Pro Divers, we turn up the loom and we get the best that we can. I'm still trying to keep it at that price point.

Mike Pearson: 42:47

And then, with the Meteorite, again going back to that model, doing a 800,000 year old dial for under two grand with an in-house movement. It's not a movement that changed the world, but it's ours. But that was where people were. I mean I had a guy rocking up to me wearing his Rolex. He goes how much is that? I think he had a Meteorite dial and it's. You can't compare the two, but it still has a material and a value to certain people and perception, and I think that's where Zodiac has its chance to kind of stand out.

Blake Rea: 43:14

And obviously Meteorite is not something you produce in a laboratory, like every single dial is unique to that specific watch.

Mike Pearson: 43:24

I learned a lot about that trade show and there was a jewelry specialist who writes all about. I wish I had my name to tell you, but he concentrates on Meteorite jewelry he was wearing he was dripping in it and he goes how did you get this quality? I don't know. We just went to a brokerage from Sweden. Is it good? Is it's one of the best I've seen for a watch. I'm like that's amazing. Maybe we should have charged more, but it's that we charged the right thing at the time, so we're really proud of it.

Blake Rea: 43:51

Yeah, I'm super happy with my Zodiac, justin, you're coming in soon. The only thing that I've ever really thought about is the steel buckle.

Justin Summers: 44:01

No, I know.

Blake Rea: 44:02

What do I expect? Where's my white ceramic buckle man?

Mike Pearson: 44:05

I know, man, the great thing with the dial is that you can have a DLC and we've got certain materials. You've also got to think that when you are doing buckles, especially for straps, I mean, every single individual piece has to be made bespoke, and if we're only making a certain amount, there's certain things that we have to be cognizant of to keep the price point where we are. So when we did a bronze watch, we made sure and that was still going to be on the steel buckle as well but I always believe that that's what you buy. Everything else around it is shoes, belts. I mean we all throw it on a NATO. We're going to choose our own off-market strap because that's what the community does. But I do agree with you. But that would end up making the price a tiny bit more to a point that would be noticeable just on our back end, and we thought it was worth it just to kind of highlight the dial and the case with the strap more than the buckle.

Blake Rea: 44:53

Drops. Society hasn't really bothered me, but I was, you know, on the wrist.

Mike Pearson: 45:00

Yeah.

Justin Summers: 45:01

I see particular man, so I'll kind of reach back in the pocket. In terms of like technology and innovation, mike, what are some of the advancement that that zodiac has introduced over the years? I know we talked about stream a little bit, but can you give the viewers some insight into that, how you guys have innovated over time?

Mike Pearson: 45:21

Yeah, again it kind of goes back to the small points we talked about. You know, when you pick up a bracelet, things like that, and you see the, the extension in the class for you Know that it's a quick release or it's even the small things where we've smoothed the inside of the, the five-link bracelet, so it doesn't catch on guys hairs on their arms. You know the small things that we think that way. Or when you're looking at a dial and you know there's a pronounced Color difference in terms of dial to hands. We even make sure that with the, the loom on the hour to the minute hand, sometimes there are slight differences. So it's it's everything that makes it bit unique.

Mike Pearson: 45:54

But I think we really pushed the boat out when we came out with our pro diver. Our pro diver, like I said earlier, is our more hefty watch, 300 meter dive watch. But it was the ice certification that we got a chance to kind of buy a movement that could do it. But now we're going to be able to have our own within that collection going forward. But it was all about the bezel. I mean, I'll see if I can find one here. Here we go.

Mike Pearson: 46:18

So this is one that's now sold out. We only made, I think, a hundred of these, and Then we then Kobe'd happen and we lost out as a supply. It's very hard in this video, but the loom on this it's nuclear, like when that goes up.

Mike Pearson: 46:32

There's not, there's no loom like it and it was so hard to make. And that's why I think and it was costly for us to kind of Get it going, which is why we said let's do a hundred of each color, and Then Kobe happened and we lost our vessel supply that these types of innovations are now what we're known for, because if you're gonna see us with color, then you see us in you know Condescent light and you see us Blowing out of a wrist shot because of the loom. I think that's a really good place to be because you know we still are sub two thousand dollar watch, so we're not gonna say, right, this has got x, y and z movement capabilities. Yeah, we've got 42 to 44 hours of power. That's a good amount of power. We don't have in house 70 hour power reserve just yet, but that'd be someone we'd like to go.

Mike Pearson: 47:13

If we're not there just now, what can we do? And aesthetically, we just try and be a bit different. So, yeah, appreciate that question, but I think it's the subtle to. It's the subtle things you can sometimes miss when you're reading a review, compared to what you find when really picking one up and trying it on, even our lugs. I mean it's not a fat watch but the lugs are so wonderfully surrounding of the wrist. You can get the 39 millimeter skin to the 42 millimeter Prodiver and it sits and fits really well. Small thing that I love, but I think that's a really important thing for the community as well.

Blake Rea: 47:46

So I mean you kind of alluded into the pineapple, but are there any other collections or series watches that some of the enthusiasts should be excited about here around the corner?

Mike Pearson: 47:58

Yeah, I'm not actually going to say this one, just in case it. You know, you, you have a schedule and thing. You want to put it out. But I will say, if anybody can Go to the wind up in New York City, have a look. Just before that, we're coming up now a couple. We're calling this just the middle of September. A couple weeks from now we're going to New York to do an event with Warner Wound and it will appease every single one of us who are Fond of the 90s put it that way.

Mike Pearson: 48:25

And if you remember to watch, we did a few years back that had the save by the bell nickname, because I have the coloring of Remember. That was crazy, graphic, green and it was so, so cool. It was very, very much a child, children of the 90s. This one taps into that, but with a lot more R&D. And I'm just going to say that when you say about what's innovation and I say loom, that's going to be the collection, that will just go. How the heck and why the heck did you do that? But it'll make sense and it's not just one watch, you can buy one of each. There are two colors and as soon as you know why we've chose those two colors and you can pick with the one. You mean we're not saying you have to buy both, but it's it really will be. I need that color or that color actually as a friendship group or a partner. It'd be great to have both. So we hope you like it. But it's nuts, like absolutely nuts.

Blake Rea: 49:15

You're to hear first.

Mike Pearson: 49:18

I Mean you'll want to come to the party when you hear what it is, but it's. We've already got a small space that we can do it in. So it'll be be of a moment, but we hope that people go and do what we're doing after they say how many of those are you planning on producing?

Mike Pearson: 49:33

So this is going to be a bigger one. This is going to be a think 300 of each color. Usually when we do it with anybody, we do 82 or 182, but with the R&D that goes into how this was made and you'll see it when he comes out. In terms of case, dial, bezel, strap, packaging, it's all of it is nuts. Again, it's you. When you look at the watch, you'll see a seaworthy. That's the, that's the basis for going off of and that's a big thing for us. But when you look at the coloring and the technology that goes around it, it's so fun and, in all honesty, has to be looked at as fun.

Mike Pearson: 50:09

And we talked about the very beginning about fighting margins to make sure it's right, worn and wound and the wind up. You know crowd, you can't put to a too expensive of a watch Because it's just not gonna work. It's got to be there of a moment to have fun. So we have really, you know, fought hard to make sure that we yeah, not just profitable, but we've really cut our margins to make sure we can fit within a price point here, because we really believe that if we go too High the community might not want to spend that money, not because he's not worth it, but because we know that that crowd this time in our evolution. It's the right thing to do to kind of hurt ourselves a tiny bit. That won't hurt us because we're in my fossil, but it's the right thing to do to keep the price point for the community.

Blake Rea: 50:50

I've noticed personally. There's kind of like an impulse price point. Anybody sub six hundred dollars Usually, can impulsively buy a watch. Right, I see it, I love it, I'll buy it. You and that price segment where people have to at least think about it, yeah, but I'm also glad that you're doing enough, because me personally, that's how I ended up with 80 watches as 10 podcasts we can put all those together. But you know, it puts you in this weird predicament where if you produce 50 or if you produce 75, you're like I have to impulsively buy this watch. I'm not sure I like it, I like it, I like it, I love it, but I'm not sure how it will fit into my collection. And that's what a lot of collectors don't think about, it they fall, fall into.

Mike Pearson: 51:37

So you do this, justin. What did you buy? The blomp on swatch, did you go for that? I?

Blake Rea: 51:43

Went to the, the launch, I was 30th in line and Again I was just like I don't really care like it. I literally knew I could come back to the swatch store the next day and pick it up. And I went back to the next day and I was like the only one there and they didn't have any. So no, meet me in Vegas. I could easily pick one up. And then I turned around and I met my buddy who worked at Rolex. He sold me all my Rolexes so we, like you know, went and had a little bonding moment there and he was actually getting back to left Rolex and now he's coming back into the industry.

Mike Pearson: 52:18

But but no moment. I have a couple of the swatch watches the moon, the moon watch and I walked in there and the only one that had was Mars and then the sun and they're disgusting. But I love the fact that I have them because there are other moments. So my wife likes yellow, so she'll wear the yellow one, but I didn't buy it for any other reason the fact that I'm in this industry and I like the moments that they breathe. I think when you are looking at the price point and this, I can say the price I think it's 15, 95 of this worn and wound collection, but it's still good. It's a chunk of change you have to think about, but it's not going to hurt you. If you're going into that environment, you kind of know what you're looking at. It's going to be around the $2,000 mark and below, and anything above. That is going to be something that it's going to be really special that you've sought out. This is in that sweet spot.

Blake Rea: 53:02

So well, you produce enough of them where the buyers don't have to fall into that pity party of buying a watch where they're like, oh shit, there's only 50 pieces, yeah, I have to buy this now or I'm not going to get it. But you'll produce 500, 700, 250. And Zodiac is such a niche brand, you know that you'll have an opportunity usually hopefully, to get one right. You know where I can.

Mike Pearson: 53:30

We're actually going to share the responsibility. So you know you don't want to put too much pressure or a burden on a retailer, right, I mean one around a bigger company, but you know they still have certain budgets to have to keep it in. So we're going to take a small proportion of the allocation and put it on to Zodiacwatchescom, because it will help share the narrative and so because if you put it everywhere, sometimes you can get diluted. But that's their watch, but we're supporting them. So we'll be on our website and our social media, even if they sell out. There might be a couple left on Zodiacwatchescom, but we'll be able to say this is one on one. This is why this is how it's made, this is why it was made and what it's made of. And for me, you know you want to elevate your partners and I think that's why they're such a great partner.

Mike Pearson: 54:11

We've done it with Haudenki, we did Huckberry recently. We've got some really great partners. But we have to be very, you know, thoughtful in terms of how we grow, because we can't do 20, 30 watches anymore, because we have responsibilities and we have to grow right. So it is always a big conversation of how many you make of each watch. But now we've got enough retailers, we've got enough of a presence. We kind of stepped up a little bit and it's quite scary to grow that many watches or to put our watches out there, but I think we've got, you know, the community to understand why we're doing this. It's good.

Mike Pearson: 54:42

I mean, we gosh, we did a watch a few years before I joined. We did this watch, we did the World Timer and it was great. But unfortunately there was a misspelling of the word Singapore, and so we've made a few hundred of these and they got sent out, and so we tried to do the buyback, or, you know, send back to the vendor, we'll look after you. And everyone went nope, we like that, we like that. You messed up and we're going to keep this. So you know, and that was the first time we stepped into doing a lot and somebody missed the spelling of a word. So you know, there's all the pressures in the world. So this is us kind of going out there against them. We're ready to, but it's a great project, you'll love it.

Justin Summers: 55:22

They said where is a sign of poor at?

Mike Pearson: 55:25

I was poor like a poor drink, so I ended up being fun, that's awesome, poor one for a God bless you.

Justin Summers: 55:33

I'm not to look it up now, I'm not to find it, so Sounds like the new release is going to have some stay in power for sure, especially if you guys are talking about doing a. You know 300 of each color and stuff too, so I'm excited about that. I'll be keeping my eye out. I'll go ahead and start kind of rapping. Enough that, that's okay. Mike, I know we're approaching an hour here soon. I've got one last question for you. If that's okay, go ahead. How do you envision the future of Zodiac within the next, you know, five to 10 years or so?

Mike Pearson: 55:58

I think it's got to be a little bit away from just our American eyes over here, because we see our retailers, we see our partners. I would love to think that we've got an organic-ness now where we can. Then I think within the next year or two we can start looking at Asia and further a field. And you know I get texts all the time on Instagram saying, hey, you coming to Germany yet? But you know it's really important. I tell them that if we don't do it right now, you'll never want us again. So for me, the big part is to be a little bit of everywhere but still feel quite small and quite niche. And then you know, obviously I want to be respectful of what the brand used to be for the collecting community, but my biggest thing in the next three to five years is to have, every year or two, innovation. I really want to be different. I don't want us just to be known as color. I want us to be known as color fun, but also never standing on our laurels, and I think that's where we're heading towards. So I'm very excited for the next few years.

Mike Pearson: 56:56

Fossil have supported us and I think, even though we might be the smallest part of their company. I think they see us as probably some of the best of it. And you know, today I'm quite proud that I'm going to head after this to the airport and go to New York and you know we've been nominated for an award as one of the best brands of the year. And you know, do we deserve it? Do we deserve it? No, but just to have somebody say that you're on it, that's a really good thing.

Mike Pearson: 57:18

So the people who have posted that you go and see if you lose, if you lose, have a nice meal. But you know we'll be out there with the community. We definitely a community brand and you know we'd be very open and any questions that you or your listeners or viewers might have, just just put me down on on Instagram and you can shoot me a DM. I'm always open for a chat and I think that's that's a big thing for the brand as well. We not just me, but everybody who works with we want to feel like we're not just a brand that you can find a press release. We want to be accessible and if we can feel that personal or that kind of friendly feel, I feel like we've done a really good thing for the brand and the industry.

Blake Rea: 57:57

It's great and we love you. Obviously, we love the brand, we love Zodiac. It's very rare that you purchase a watch and you feel like you're a part of a family instead of more of a community. You know so. You know, we haven't known each other very long, obviously, but immediately, just the energy and the passion and everything is sucked me in. You know, see this way it.

Mike Pearson: 58:23

you know, we all find what it means a lot to me as well.

Mike Pearson: 58:26

I mean people by people. But we also know that there's a lot of choice out there and you know, if you've chosen to spend your money on us, it's not a transaction, it's a say thanks. You are part of the brand that you are. Now you know on this podcast, or you're walking down the street, you are walking billboard, and so we've got to treat you as a way of saying thanks. You're part of our growth and that's a humble mentality, but I think it's sometimes missed in luxury. Luxury is not about money, it's about experience, and I think that's where people and friendships matter. So I appreciate you saying that. I feel very, very similar to you as well. So thank you.

Blake Rea: 58:57

Having a billboard in Las Vegas is a good place.

Mike Pearson: 59:00

Absolutely right. We just got to find a partner there as well, so I can come more and party with you.

Blake Rea: 59:05

So I have. So I used to work at a retail at over 30 brands and we specialized in mostly the high end stuff. But I have a lot of resources here in Las Vegas so I could definitely get some contacts for you and push them to you.

Justin Summers: 59:21

You really are.

Blake Rea: 59:22

We can really talk about this more off stream. But yeah, tell us right now your business dealings. Yeah, yeah, but no, I've got.

Mike Pearson: 59:31

I've got so many partners. We, in all my watch career, the places that you know we're not in, like I said that kind of joke about being a vampire and not crossing the door Like you guys, go into retail stores and it's amazing how many times I get a call from a retailer or an email or a DM and say, hey, someone just asked about your watch. What are you? And because the retailers are very busy people and they have 30 brands that you say and they could be some big pressures from the swatch group or the Rishman group and sometimes the independence can slip through. But if the community are going into the stores and asking, it's amazing what it can spur in terms of our side as well.

Mike Pearson: 1:00:07

We opened up a really brilliant store in Massachusetts recently Royal Jewelers and they just saw us through social, through what we were doing on LinkedIn, and then they came to see us in Vegas at a trade show and now they're one of our best retailers in the country and it's just basically through seeing a good picture that someone said actually this is brilliant and that resonated with the owner and the buyer. So we're all in this together. So I really appreciate anything you guys offer, good or bad, I'll take it. I don't mind it kicking every now and then.

Blake Rea: 1:00:33

It's actually kind of funny. So you know, a brand like Oris I mean a Bohemith right they only have like I think they only have like one location or maybe two locations in Vegas, you know, which is weird, because when I was working there people were like oh, do you have Oris or do you? You know, do you have Christopher Ward or it's like? No, I don't really know of any place that sells Oris. You know there's only like one, one dealer, and so it's a weird market if people come here, spend stupid money and so it leaves this huge kind of gap, you know, in the market, because you get a lot of people that are asking for more of these smaller brands where you can get more for your money than coming in and asking for an IDBC or Panerai or Vashran or Launga or Rolex or Pratek right. So we need you here. We need you here, you know for sure. So we're ready.

Mike Pearson: 1:01:27

We're ready, have credit card, we'll travel. So that's the same. Within North Carolina. I mean, I've spoke to some of the watch communities down there or even the states that sometimes get lost in. You know, I lived in Michigan for 10 years and we just opened up with direction jewelers in Birmingham, michigan, and that's a really wonderful hub of old money, new money.

Mike Pearson: 1:01:46

Yes, just on the outskirts of Detroit. Birmingham's great, but a lot of the community sometimes I'm saying this and brand-wise sometimes might miss it, because you have to only go to where is LA, new York, south Florida, texas there's some big stores as well, but everyone everywhere has got an appetite and, like I said, we don't make many watches but you do want to really feel them. So that's why windups are great, which is why these podcasts can fill gaps and you know, if you are having a tough time finding it again, shoot me a DM or try to find something, some way of having you hold it or at least see it. But there's always somebody in a community that wants to meet up for a beer right and show their watches.

Blake Rea: 1:02:23

Yeah, yeah, next time you're in Vegas, beers are on me we're going to link everything below. We'll link your Instagram, if that's OK, so people can communicate with you directly. We'll link, of course, the Zodiac website. Yeah, any final words Again, I know we've just really cracked over an hour here and you know I just want to be respectful of your time. So here's your last opportunity to say something directly to our listeners, viewers. We've got more listeners than we do viewers, but that's all right.

Mike Pearson: 1:02:51

Well, blake, justin, thanks for the opportunity to let us chat and, like I said, this is a big part of my love of the watch industry and the community. So we know that we've been around for a long time. We know that some people might have legitimate questions about what the brand's been for the last 40 years, but we're in your unsafe hands. We are doing the right thing by the name and if you ever need anything, we're always available. So I think with us, if it's not the next watch, there'll always be something coming out, but it's never going to be boring. So thank you all.

Blake Rea: 1:03:21

Thank you for coming. Mike, get your ass to the airport, of course. Everybody thanks for listening. Glad we were able to have Mike on. This has been one that we've been trying to schedule for a while and finally his an opening came, and here we are. So until next time, thank you for listening to the Lonely Wrist. We love all you guys and we'll see you on the next one.

Justin Summers: 1:03:43

Thanks everyone, Thanks Mike, Thanks Mike, Bye-bye.