The Owner's Odyssey
The Owner's Odyssey is a business podcast focused on exploring the unique journeys of real business owners co-hosted by Brook Gratia, Paul McCoy, and Zach Jones.
The Owner's Odyssey
Matt Roop | Always Raise Your Hand: How Saying Yes Shaped a Financial Advisor's Path
What do autopsy assistants, nuclear medicine, and successful financial planning have in common? For Matt Roop, Partner at Deerfield Financial Advisors, they're all stepping stones on an extraordinary career journey guided by a simple principle: "always raise your hand" for new opportunities.
Matt's path to financial planning began nowhere near the industry. With a degree in nuclear medicine technology, he found himself working as an autopsy assistant during a period of career exploration – a position that led to meeting his wife "over a dead body" as they joke. When the opportunity to join Charles Schwab's expanding operation appeared in the late 1990s, Matt's willingness to try something new set him on an unexpected trajectory through the financial world.
Following his wife's Air Force career took him from Indianapolis to Biloxi, Mississippi, to Washington D.C., each move providing new professional experiences and perspectives. After briefly joining his family's construction business and later running his own financial practice, Matt found his home at Deerfield Financial Advisors, where he eventually became a partner.
Throughout our conversation, Matt shares valuable insights about navigating career transitions, finding fulfillment through client relationships, and balancing business ownership with personal life. His self-described "small boat philosophy" – preferring deep connections with fewer people over numerous shallow relationships – has shaped both his approach to wealth management and his definition of success, which centers on family and meaningful client relationships rather than traditional metrics.
For Matt, failure isn't defined by unsuccessful attempts but by not trying at all. His story reminds us that the most rewarding career paths often emerge when we're brave enough to raise our hands, seize unexpected opportunities, and build genuine connections along the way.
Hello and welcome to the Owner's Odyssey, the podcast where we delve deep into the transformative stories of courageous business owners who have embarked on an extraordinary adventure. I'm Zach Jones and I'm Brooke Gattia. We're here to explore the real life experiences of entrepreneurs.
Speaker 3:Each episode, we'll embark on a quest to uncover the trials, triumphs and transformations of remarkable individuals who dared to answer the call of entrepreneurship.
Speaker 2:Like all adventurers, our guests have faced their fair share of challenges, vanquished formidable foes and braved the unknown.
Speaker 3:Whether you're an aspiring entrepreneur, a seasoned business owner or simply an avid listener hungry for captivating stories.
Speaker 2:The Owner's Odyssey is here to help you level up. So join us as we embark on this epic expedition. This is the Owner's Odyssey. Let's start our adventure.
Speaker 3:Today we have with us Matt Roop. I said that right, correct, okay, I suck at pronouncing things sometimes. And so I met Matt, because when I acquired Edgewater, matt was working with Edgewater doing kind of financial planning, kind of networking stuff somewhere With some mutual clients.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And then Matt said hey, let's go get lunch. And we've done that a couple of times and I have found it very personable to get to chat and learn a ton about you and not a ton, but enough about you. And then I've now had you working with a number of clients and been very impressed with how well you care for more than just the financial planning part but the person as a whole. So I've really just appreciated knowing you from a kind of business perspective of things. So I said, hey, would you like to come chat with me on a little podcast thing? So I I brought Mr Matt, mr Rupp, I don't know what, the right technical Please not, mr Rupp, turn around looking for my dad.
Speaker 3:So thanks for joining us today, thanks for having me.
Speaker 4:This is my first podcast, yeah.
Speaker 1:At least on this side of it.
Speaker 4:Excellent.
Speaker 3:So tell me a little bit about your kind of story that got you to the point where you're being like I'll be a financial planner. Like what made you. What was your kind of journey that got you to deciding that as not even just a major but a life stage?
Speaker 4:Well, yeah, it was sort of a circuitous path. I guess I wasn't, you know, finance or accounting or business major in college. I was actually a nuclear medicine technology major. So uh, lots of biology and physics and whatnot, chemistry and college, and uh, when you do, I assume it's still the same way. But when you do a nuclear medicine major in college, your fourth year is a clinical year so your senior years a clinical year.
Speaker 4:So you come to my case. I came from Bloomington up to Indianapolis and and spent the year in the, in the Med Center and obviously still some some coursework, but a lot of time in the lab and, uh, worked with great people, I mean my classmates. It was all great. But I pretty quickly realized I was like I don't see myself doing this for the rest of my life and had a buddy who was a broker for and this is circa 1995, had a buddy who was a broker for an old firm that has since been acquired, I think actually by H&R Block called Oldie Financial, and they were stockbrokers. So not the space I'm in now.
Speaker 4:But I'd always been interested in finance, sort of a superficial level. I was decent at math and always enjoyed numbers, but probably liked money as much as anyone, and so I sort of began investigating that as an option and was just, you know, doing some graduate coursework while I've, you know, tried to grow up and figure out what I wanted to do and ultimately went to work for Charles Schwab. You know this was probably you know this is when leading up to 2000, the market had really started to take off and Schwab was really expanding and they were hiring out of hiring into a call center in Fishers. And you know, at the time they're just they're looking for people who you know reasonably intelligent, people that they could train and turn into, you know know brokers, and so I did that um, you know and enjoyed that um, but you know it was in a call center so it wasn't client facing you know, like I, like I do now, um met my wife, um and uh, which is an interesting story in terms of how that happened, but we can talk about that later maybe.
Speaker 4:But ultimately we got married. She was in the Air Force and got stationed in Biloxi, mississippi, so Schwab didn't, I was working for Schwab, schwab didn't have anything down there, but there was a Merrill Lynch office. So I was like, okay, I'll try Merrill Lynch. And so worked there and as a at that. By then they began calling financial consultants and so I worked under a couple guys there who were fantastic, still in contact with with them today and so kind of learned from them and was under their tutelage for a few years until my wife was transferred to Andrews Air Force Base.
Speaker 4:And then I went back to Schwab and was in the Alexandria office and that's when I really began getting at Merrill. I got some client facing time but I was still, you know, pretty young and green and I was a little less green by the time I got to Alexandria and then really began to, you know, work with clients and getting into more of the planning stuff. That studied for my CFP, certified Financial Planner designation and really began doing a little more of the heavy lifting, although you know, looking back on it now it wasn't that heavy. But you know, at the time it was new, it was and it was more involved, and so we stayed. I stayed with Schwab, ended up completing my MBA at George Washington and did that Just want to add that to the arrow to the quiver, so to speak.
Speaker 4:And then we moved back to Indianapolis I worked for, after my wife separated from the Air Force because we have family here, family friends and went to work for a small boutique firm that you know a registered investment advisor like Deerfield is, and so and that. And then, uh, yeah, just uh, went, had my own shop for about a year different part of the story Um, and then Deerfield came calling, probably 10 years ago and, oddly enough, at the time I was like no, the recruiter called me. He was, he was looking to fill a position with him, and I was like I'm, I'm okay.
Speaker 4:I you know, I I'm good where I am and uh, he's like no, I really think you should talk to him. You know, I think it'd be a good fit for you. So I talked to him and here we are, so and uh, so was your first step into?
Speaker 3:uh, like Charles Schwab way back when, was it more of a like, like your very first thing of a like?
Speaker 4:well, I don't have anything else to do?
Speaker 3:Or were you actually interested in it Cause you went from nuclear medicine, which nothing to do with this side of things? Like, was there any part of you when you were like going to go to college where you're like man finances medicine or were're like heads down medicine and then you're like I hate this, I'm just going to pick something, and you just picked it? Or was there some analysis that went into? This is what I like.
Speaker 4:The Schwab piece.
Speaker 3:Yeah, like the way back when.
Speaker 4:No, well, I mean I think there was an interest and it was again, there was a lot of opportunity just because, given the environment and you know the the way they were expanding and and so I I was interested and but it was.
Speaker 4:You know, there were probably a number of things I was interested at the time you know, as I look back on it, but it was sort of like yeah, that sounds good, I'm interested, it's interesting, so yeah, I'll try it. So I you know, I was still really trying to figure out what I wanted to do. You know, longer term, and so um yeah, it was just it was a little bit of an easy button maybe.
Speaker 5:Yeah, was it a pretty quick turnaround from the point of experimenting and trying that to the point of like, oh, this is what I'm gonna do long term, or yeah, yeah, it really was um, especially once we moved and I got it and and began more of the client facing stuff, uh, at merrill.
Speaker 4:And then you know, certainly once um, you know, once we I went back to schwab and was in the office in alexandria, so that client interaction piece, the face, the face to face, was kind of the final hook, if you will. So yeah, at that point I was, I was in.
Speaker 3:Like this is fun. I get to help people and serve them somewhere in that space of it. And they do say that if you can find something where you feel like you're serving people, there's a satisfaction that comes into it.
Speaker 4:And sometimes.
Speaker 3:I have to remind myself that when I'm caught in the weeds of all the tasks that I'm actually serving people somewhere in there, sorry. So you moved back to Indianapolis and you started working for someone here, but then you started your own kind of thing. Talk to me about that, Like what made you say let's start my own go from a boutique to cause you went from a boutique to. I'm going to do my own little thing for a bit, Right?
Speaker 4:With a stop in between, and that's another piece of the story. So my family I come from a family of business owners, and so my family owned a local construction company here and my dad was an owner, and so he approached me. This was when I was with the boutique firm. He approached me at one this was after when I was with the boutique firm and the boutique firm I was with was fantastic. I had no, no issues there. But my dad approached me and he's like look, I want to retire at some point. We need somebody. Would you be interested in stepping in and then ultimately buy me out?
Speaker 3:That's a big jump construction company, yeah Well and I grew up in it so it was familiar.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 4:And you know I was in a family business and you know they'd been successful and I knew it Again. I grew up in it, and so I kind of wrestled with that for a while and ultimately I did go. But then, you know, it just wasn't going to be a good fit. I mean my help kind of. You know, my dad got exited and I just realized that that wasn't where I was going to need to spend the rest of my life. So then that's when I, rather than go back to the boutique firm the other firm I was with at that point, I just hung up my shingle. I'd had, you know, some clients that I'd continued to work with and, you know, helping on the side, so to speak.
Speaker 3:Um, and then that really took off, um you know, is it scary for you to be like all right, I'm going to put this out here and do it myself.
Speaker 4:It was and, and you know, honestly, I felt, um, it was kind of hard to do it because it was sort of, you know, because the venture with my dad didn't pan out the way I'd originally planned, and again, it was a great experience. I mean, I got to spend a lot more time with him and you know, I have no regrets about it at all, but it wasn't scary. I mean, my wife was working and you know, from unlike a lot, of, lot of people, a lot of I know a lot of small business owners who you know they really put it out there. They're really putting things on the line to start a business. There's a lot of risk involved and from that standpoint, I wasn't, you know, I wasn't, I didn't have that kind of fear or anything.
Speaker 3:Because your other half kind of taking care of family.
Speaker 4:Sure. So I wasn't worrying about whether we were going to get to eat because it was a business venture.
Speaker 4:So, yeah, I mean some disappointment, but I was kind of coming back home so to speak in terms of going back to what I'd been doing and what I knew I really enjoyed and I and I took from the experience with you know, the company that my dad's company is just, you know my, my wife put it best you know that that's. You know, some time that you got extra time, you got to spend and work with your dad and so um and and help him and so um so yeah so it uh, it wasn't scary jumping back in it, but it was. It was a little daunting.
Speaker 3:I mean, our industry is very highly regulated, so it was you know from that, you know all of the rules and all well, just yeah and just dotting all the i's you know compliance.
Speaker 4:Uh, you know dotting all the I's, yeah, compliance. You know dotting all the I's, crossing all the T's, and so it was a little daunting from that perspective, but other than that, I mean I was at ease with it.
Speaker 3:Yeah. And so then the recruiter came, talked to you and you were like I have my own gig, I'm enjoying my own gig, I I don't want to see where I'm going. And you liked the people at deerfield, uh, that's who you went to next right, I got that part of the story.
Speaker 3:Um, was there any part of you in saying, okay, I'm gonna join deerfield? That was like oh, I didn't make this work on my own and disappointment. Or were you like, no, no, I'm really. This is better to do it with people than to try to do it on my own.
Speaker 4:No, I don't think there was I. There wasn't disappointment in that regard. What I really saw was opportunity to you know, kind of get help with the stuff that I did, the compliance and all of the regulatory stuff and the administration administrative stuff.
Speaker 4:I thought, okay, I can still do, I can bring my clients, I can do the things I want to do. And you know I clearly hit it off with the folks at Deerfield and so, you know, it just made sense, you know, and I was surprised actually I didn't again, I wasn't looking to move um and uh, but you know, the meetings I had went so well and it all just seemed to kind of fall into place like it just made sense.
Speaker 1:So um, they made you an offer you couldn't refuse, kind of yeah.
Speaker 4:And you know, one of the things that initially things have changed a little bit, but initially that I lost was some flexibility, because I worked from home. We have four kids so I was, you know, around more and much more involved in caring for them, which was cool. But you know, it sort of have funny how things work out, because when Deerfield came calling they were all kind of fully in school, you know, a little older, doing their thing and and so the timing, uh, really ended up being pretty good for me to to make the move, so, um, so yeah, so I did, yeah, and sometimes I, we, I don't know, maybe it's just me sometimes stress out about, ah, like this isn't coming together.
Speaker 3:But then when you look back on things you're like, okay, that kind of was perfect timing for my life. And sometimes it's not always about orchestrating but just keeping yourself open to the opportunities that come, whether it's like all right, I'm open to joining Charles Schwab and learning something. Do I really like this too? I'm open to hanging out with my dad. I'm sure you brought some of the knowledge, even though it was a family business and you watched it. Being in the middle of it probably taught you a number of things that you brought into running your own business and then even today of like just business kind of knowledge. So each one of those opportunities kind of I don't know it, just it it. Sometimes we try to orchestrate things and if we just step into the opportunities that are here.
Speaker 3:In the end you look back and you're like that kind of worked out nicely and that versus panicking. You know what's our kind of future side of things yeah, I mean deer fields.
Speaker 4:Uh, we're a small business, I mean we're 14 employees so you know that experience and and uh uh with my dad's business there's, there was plenty that I took from that and again, having grown up in it, it felt comfortable coming into. And the previous firm I worked for too was also small. So small business had always been part of my life. Frankly, with the exception of the Schwab and Merrill opportunities, you know, it's been all small business stuff.
Speaker 3:How was the moving around? Did that like impact, or was that just early enough in your career that it didn't really impact a whole lot of where you are?
Speaker 4:Yeah, it was early enough really. I mean, in some ways I think it was helpful.
Speaker 3:Talking to network. You have to meet new people all the time.
Speaker 4:Yeah, a little bit and just really different experiences in different areas. It turned out different areas of the country, different cultures literally. I mean Biloxi, mississippi is a lot different than Washington DC.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, very true.
Speaker 4:Or you know Washington DC area. So from that standpoint it was really, it was neat. You know, we have very fond memories of our time. Well, speaking for myself, I have very fond memories from a work experience those times in my life.
Speaker 1:It's interesting following your wife as well. I've done that following your wife's career and giving up everything, and then moving down to Biloxi and then to Virginia.
Speaker 4:Yeah, which is a unique thing for my family. Which is a unique thing for my family. You know, I was uh, I have a pretty big family on you know aunts, uncles, cousins and grew up in Fort Wayne and a lot of us were there and, and you know, some of us ventured down to, to Indy, obviously, and, um, but uh, going away. I was like the first cousin to really go away and I'm sure there was a lot of like my gosh, what is he doing? What is this woman? Where is this woman taking him?
Speaker 1:And then following her career over, yours was, I'm sure, something else that you had to battle, not maybe personally, but people, family and saying Was that hard for your?
Speaker 4:family that you deferred to her. Well, I think it was hard, for I mean, I'm sure it was. I know it was hard for my mom in particular, for us to, for me to go away. I have a younger brother who was home at the time and you know he ended up moving away too ultimately. But yeah, I think it was hard and so, um, but you know it, we were fortunate that we were able to get back. Frequently they would come down and visit, I mean, you know, and, and the interesting thing is, we never really envisioned moving back to indianapolis, and then we had kids and that sort of changed the dynamic and so, uh, but no, it, it, uh, I I'm a big fan of my wife.
Speaker 4:I was happy to, to, to follow her. She's a, she's a, she's a physician. She was in the medical corps in the air force and has since gone on to do other great things, and so I was. I was happy to support her and and and follow her and, and you know, at the same time I got to have my own little adventure.
Speaker 4:I'd never lived outside of Indiana prior to then, and so got to go to the Gulf Coast of Mississippi and live there for a while which was an interesting change from Indianapolis and then got to go to the other extreme and live in Washington DC for a time, and so it was again very fond memories and I don't regret any of it.
Speaker 3:So you said there was an interesting story with meeting this wife of yours.
Speaker 4:Have I told you this before.
Speaker 3:I don't know, I don't think you have.
Speaker 4:So I graduated. Like I said, I was just taking some graduate courses just trying to again figure out what I was going to do. Next step it wasn't going to be nuclear medicine. Figure out what I was going to do next step, it wasn't going to be nuclear medicine. And there was a posting for a job on a board outside one of the classes I was taking and it was for an autopsy assistant with the forensic pathology department on campus or at the medical center. I was like, well, that's kind of interesting. And I of course had all the requirements really were just anatomy and physiology and that you wouldn't get sick during an autopsy, and that was basically the litmus test for the interview.
Speaker 3:I think I might have gotten sick for an autopsy, but keep talking, yeah.
Speaker 4:So I interviewed for the position and I don't know if they still have the contract. I don't know if they still have the contract, but at the time the forensic pathology department at IU had the contract with the Marion County coroner and actually for a number of the coroners around the state, so they would do all the autopsies, anything that was suspicious, including all the bad stuff, including all the bad stuff, and so so yeah, so I that was my job as an autopsy assistant, or the job of the autopsy assistant was to do the evisceration of the body, taking out the organs and you know, noting things and whatnot in, you know, along with the, with the pathologist who's performing autopsy, and got to learn how to use an x-ray machine to look for bullets and other things, and so but, anyway, I think four of us interviewed for the position and I was the only one that didn't get sick, and so I got the position.
Speaker 4:I worked there for a while. My wife was in her fourth year medical school and did a rotation in forensic pathology.
Speaker 3:And so we met as over a dead body, as she likes to say.
Speaker 4:So love blossomed in the morgue. That's great.
Speaker 3:So that's that'd be awesome. Like, you're like going to a party and you're like how'd you guys meet over Over a dead body and then just walk away and just let that be the thing, yeah.
Speaker 4:It's a little unique. It wasn't at a bar, it wasn't at church or the grocery store we met in the morgue.
Speaker 5:That's the epitome of it can happen anywhere.
Speaker 1:Yes absolutely.
Speaker 3:Opportunities come everywhere from that side.
Speaker 4:And that was a really neat experience in that position Obviously not something I was going to spend my life doing, but it allowed me to earn some money and it was unique and I did have an interest in that too, but not from a career standpoint necessarily, but not from a career standpoint necessarily. And so, yeah, it ended up being obviously a really good experience, because that's where I met my wife and you rave about her every time.
Speaker 3:I see you.
Speaker 4:You say awesome things about her.
Speaker 1:I'm a fan, that's good.
Speaker 3:How long have you been married? What is it 40?
Speaker 1:years.
Speaker 4:No.
Speaker 1:Do I look that old? No, you don't Not at all. 26 years.
Speaker 4:No, Do I look that old? No, you don't Not at all. 26 years. Yeah, it's like your kids are old enough so well, that's fun.
Speaker 3:So what do you feel like in all of this journey? Have been the hardest part of it.
Speaker 4:Hmm, yeah, and that's a tough one because I mean, I'll be honest, I feel like in a lot of ways, I've lived a pretty charmed life.
Speaker 3:I think Is that weird, knowing that, okay, I've kind of had a really good life and there's been other people around me who've had harder lives, and is there been any reconciliation with that piece of?
Speaker 4:thing? No, because it's not like I haven't worked hard but, you know the hard work is. I've never had what I felt like are significant setbacks.
Speaker 1:I guess that makes sense.
Speaker 4:Maybe that's a different way to put it, but the hardest thing was probably when I became an owner at Deerfield. I had to put on a different hat, you know, and you're you guys are obviously familiar, um, so that's probably been the most more challenging thing and and kind of looking at myself and as an owner, um, and you kind of have to I felt like I really had to.
Speaker 4:I've had to take a look at myself and really come to grips with what I'm, what I am good at and what I'm not good at, Because you know, with some things that I'm, you know what about me allows me to be a good owner and what about me makes me, you know, gives me opportunity to be a better owner, and so so what is it that makes you a good and or better owner?
Speaker 3:I'm getting deep, sorry, no, no, no, it's fine.
Speaker 4:And it'll be interesting if anybody from the office when they listen to this, if they agree with me.
Speaker 4:I'm not. I'd say I'm a pretty easy guy to work with. I think, from a management perspective, where I struggle the most probably is just people management, because obviously I have a supervisory role so I tend to be somebody who's like I'll just do it. So the delegation piece is tough, which obviously as a manager you really have to be able to do that well. Another shout out to my wife. I think she's excellent at that. It's a skill I wish I could take from her. But I'd say that's probably my biggest. That's been my biggest. My biggest challenge is just really trying to step into that more and become a better um.
Speaker 3:Is the delegation a like? I can do it faster. You don't have patients for training. Uh, is it um?
Speaker 1:Quality. Uh huh Quality.
Speaker 3:Quality of like. Hey, I like. What is it that pauses you on delegating?
Speaker 4:but quality of like, hey, I like. What is it that pauses you on delegating? It's usually because I can do it and move on to the other things I need to do.
Speaker 3:You know, instead of you know, recognizing the value of training and the time that comes into it Right.
Speaker 4:I need to hand this off and give someone else an opportunity to do it and just know that you know it's going to be okay, right, and that it's really the best way to go forward. Because, I mean, the reality is, if you don't, if I don't delegate some things, then other things will suffer. If I don't delegate some things, then other things will suffer. Or I'm not done at 6 o'clock and then it's 8 o'clock because I've taken this on when I should have passed it on to someone else, and now everything else just bleeds into everything else.
Speaker 5:I think that's a common struggle too for people that are top performers in, you know, kind of very solo roles, like as an advisor.
Speaker 5:you know, you're a team of one. You know, outside of the administrative piece of things or whatever it might be, you're having one-on-one conversations. You're kind of responsible for you know developing the game plan in a very kind of solo way to so to incorporate other people and you know start to delegate those things when you have been performing at such a high level is you know to kind of uh, go from an A plus student to you know, whatever the average of everyone that you're delegating to is and that can be a tough, you know, kind of.
Speaker 3:Do you struggle figuring out how to get what's in your brain out to other people? A little bit, yeah.
Speaker 4:And it's not. It's never been a confidence issue in, in our people. We've been blessed with fantastic people. It's it's strictly time.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's what I feel a lot I'm like okay, I brought someone in and I just don't have the bandwidth and I apologize, usually all over the place when I'm doing it. I'm like okay, I know I need to show you how to do this, I'll show you this and I have to go over to this.
Speaker 3:It's pure bandwidth of time that training someone takes, but you value them and you want to not have them sit there and twiddle their thumbs and be bored, because you want them inspired and bringing stuff to the table, um, but it's a lot of work and finding the balance, but there's also a patience and a grace to yourself in the midst of it too, of like, well, yeah, I can I only can do this today, but I'll get the rest of it over to you.
Speaker 4:But I, yes, it is very difficult figuring out how to add that to the plethora of things you have to do in the midst of it, and so I think the sort of I don't want to say a breakthrough moment or a moment of clarity was when I realized that that is a big hole in my repertoire, like I kind of suck at that, and once I sort of recognized it and embraced it, then it actually made it easier for me to tackle it rather than just denying it and and say, eh, you know it's, it's, it's not a problem, you know, just you know.
Speaker 3:That is interesting. Like we, we don't. I did that with a doctor's appointment. Like I've gone to a functional medicine person cause I get two o'clock. I'm like dead tired and I'm sitting there meeting with her and she's like, yeah, do you take vitamins? And I'm like, no, I don't take vitamins, I hate swallowing pills. She's like, well, maybe you should start that, that might help. And there's a bunch of other stuff that goes into this.
Speaker 3:But it was this moment of like. I wasn't willing to look and see what the problem is and like and just face that true like thing and that's not even business, that's side things. But it's so very true that when you're able to just acknowledge, okay, this is something I'm not very good at or it's a weak point, that point in time you can address it, versus if you're just like, no, I don't have this problem, like sort of thing, you just it just continues to be a problem. So the kind of the humbleness I think it takes to be a business owner and switch into that hat takes us. You have to drop your ego to be a good one. I feel like it. And it's hard to drop your ego and just be like all right, this is what I'm not good at. This is what I need you to be.
Speaker 5:Practice that radical self-awareness.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and just face the things that swallow your vitamin pill sort of. Thing.
Speaker 5:Do you feel like there are certain tips or tactics that once you did say, okay, this is something that I need to put some active work into, or practice into being a more effective delegator or leader, or whatever the term may be? Is there content that you've absorbed, or people that you've talked to, or certain things that you've worked through that you feel have been particularly helpful or transformative for you in that space, or is it just consistency and practice?
Speaker 4:yeah, I think consistency, um, I I try I read a lot and so, uh, in my, my reading regimen, if you will, I, I I always try to have like two or three books going and one of those books is some kind of I try to make it some kind of self-help or self-improvement type book, and so that's kind of my weird way of keeping that front and center.
Speaker 3:If you will. What's your current?
Speaker 4:book. Well, I'm kind of between books.
Speaker 3:Which one did you just finish?
Speaker 4:I just finished the. What was it called?
Speaker 3:I hate when people put me on the spot. Yeah, people put me on the spot.
Speaker 4:I'm reading a book called I Heard you Paint Houses, which is about Frank Sheeran and the Jimmy Hoffa thing. Interesting. What was the name of the book?
Speaker 3:It was the 5 am Club, oh so this is the group that's like wake up at 5, get all this stuff done before like 11 am it was kind of a weird book it was it, you know it was yeah yeah, yeah, so, um, and then there's a I pretend I can wake up at 5 am and I yeah, never do, but sorry, I'm gonna spy.
Speaker 4:I always say I'm an aspiring morning person. But um, yeah, so the 5 am Club. You know books like Seven Habits or Atomic Habits. I really enjoyed that one. Just things like that. Just keep it like. I'm always aware, but you know, when you're reading things consistently that remind you, for me that's the best way to kind of keep driving that into my brain yeah, I think the more frameworks that you have and the more language you have to kind of, you know, look at it from different perspectives and that kind of stuff.
Speaker 5:That's a great way to kind of reveal your own short sides and you know, find actionable steps to to kind of move away from them.
Speaker 3:So when you moved into being a business like a partner, how did your stress level change with that? I mean I'm assuming the expectations changed. Did that change your delight at all in the work that you're doing, Did it? Did you feel a heaviness that came on as you went to that, or was it an excitement, Like kind of what was the feeling that you went through?
Speaker 4:Well, I was flattered, first, First and foremost, that my now partners, you know, had the confidence to, you know, offer me an opportunity to become an owner. So I was, and didn't really see that, coming to be honest, not for any particular reason, just hadn't really considered it. And so I was flattered that they felt that they had the confidence in me to partner with them. And then, I don't know, it wasn't, I didn't feel a heaviness, I was really excited. It was a different hat, as I said earlier, and so I was just excited at the challenge and the opportunities.
Speaker 4:And we'd gone through a couple of transitions internally. You know, we had a someone leave and we've got an office in Chicago, so the person that left was in Chicago, and so we were, you know, battling not battling that, but just, you know, making sure that we had continuity and all that. So, and then when I, you know, when I came on board, the owner or the founder was exiting. So that was a process too, and so there had always been these things going on. And then, leading up to, you know, my becoming a partner, we'd sort of tackled all those things and we were, I felt like we as a firm, and then, for me personally, we're in a brand new spot. All this other stuff was behind us and it just felt like there was this great opportunity in front of me personally, obviously, and for us as a firm. So, yeah, it's been fantastic. So yeah, it's been fantastic.
Speaker 3:I've really enjoyed the new challenges and, of course, love the people I work with and have enjoyed.
Speaker 4:It makes a difference when you have the right people you work with and it's fun to you know. The conversations are obviously a little different now than when I was not an owner A whole different set of meetings that I'm part of now, when I was not an owner, a whole different set of meetings that I'm part of now. But yeah, I would say it's excitement was sort of the prevailing feeling once it happened.
Speaker 3:Do you find that?
Speaker 4:you have.
Speaker 3:how is the balance in your life? I'm trying to figure out how to phrase that question, Like do you feel like all of a sudden, now you're a partner and you're working a ton more as a partner, or are you like? No, this journey and how I've gone through it, has I've still been able to kind of balance. And how do you fill your cup even outside of work side of things?
Speaker 4:No, I don't feel like I've. I don't feel like the balance. I feel like I've been able to maintain balance. Um, you know, we've done some hiring and some things to uh cause, cause the partner piece kind of coincided with a, a um sort of a renewed focus on growth and we've experienced growth and so that's necessitated some hiring and so, you know, I've been able to kind of maintain the balance still work, still work a lot. I think that you know the the beauty of of the way we work, or you know how we work, is we can kind of do it anywhere, right, Obviously, we had a lot of a lot of client facing stuff, but COVID really changed things a lot for us because we always had the capability of doing remote work and Teams meetings or Zoom calls, and that sort of COVID forced us to do it, forced clients to embrace it too, and then a lot of clients figured out, hey, I really like this. Yeah, so Do you really like it.
Speaker 4:The remote use I do.
Speaker 3:I do, I love it, I mean it allows.
Speaker 4:You know, and in my which you know this my wife retired recently, uh-huh. So which sort of retired? She retired from her previous job, she'll she can't sit still, no, she can't sit still.
Speaker 4:So she's going to do some consulting stuff, but certainly wait, significantly dialed back from what she was doing. But, you know, and then all of our kids are now in college or beyond, and so we have, you know, we're empty nesters, we have the opportunity to travel a little bit more, and so, um, yeah, we're going to do that and so, but I can do that and still work and feel connected, you know, get restored and rejuvenated, while also staying connected and being very productive, and so I'm really thankful for that. That's been a blessing, that's been a blessing, and so, yeah, I think that's allowed me to.
Speaker 4:Really that flexibility has really been good for me to maintain that balance.
Speaker 1:But still be engaged. Where's your burning desire to go and visit?
Speaker 4:Oh, yeah, well, there are a number of places I'd really like to go right now. This will speak to you. I'm really high on my list is the, the, the british isles. I'd really love to go see. Uh, I've never been to england or would love to go to england, scotland, ireland, wales, um, uh, I'd love to see australia a little, a little unnerved by all the tiktok videos and the animals that are in australia, but yeah, you know um, they supersized all the, all the bugs and, oh my gosh, it's like, uh, it's like a jurassic park.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it really is um, and then uh, bora bora has always been, or the maldives has always been, very appealing, it's just uh you know, you know, the huts over the water which seem to be creeping into the Caribbean a lot too. It's not as unique as it. That concept is not as unique as it used to be. But yeah, those are. We've begun talking about maybe going to Italy. We have some friends that just went to Italy and, of course, loved it. So, yeah, those are kind of top of the list for now.
Speaker 1:But Very cool.
Speaker 4:We've done some, some, some hopping around in the States, you know, kind of we call them workations where we we just especially this time of year.
Speaker 3:Go somewhere warm yeah, work remote yeah.
Speaker 4:We went to Phoenix, went out to Palm Springs, which I kind of fell in love with Palm Springs, I love it out there and literally worked. I mean I tell the story the first time we did it my wife was still working in her previous position. We went out there and we would get up. Of course it's three hours difference. We would get up at like 4 am. We stayed on indiana time. We get up at 4 am and work.
Speaker 4:Of course it was dark out there, but we'd work until one or two and then we'd go hiking and you know, do the things out in uh in in palm springs, and the resort we stayed at had a nice hot tub and pool, so we'd do some physical activity, come back, hit the hot tub and then we were in bed by like eight o'clock but it was yeah, and you know it was.
Speaker 4:It was six degrees back here and it was 70 out there. So yeah, we still got to, you know, unplug and you know kind of get some restorative time out there and still be productive and not feel completely disconnected, the complete disconnect thing. I don't know if I could do that Sometimes it's hard Not having access.
Speaker 3:Yeah, because you're like, okay, come back to a giant pile of stuff, and so sometimes it's easier to maintain a few little pieces and find that balance of things while you're doing it.
Speaker 4:Yeah, my wife always said when we would go on vacation she would, if she it actually helped her relax, if she could just check things a little bit, you know not spend hours and hours, but just, you know 30 minutes to run through email, just to make sure that you know the house isn't on fire. Back, you know, back home.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:Actually allowed her to relax more, and that's always resonated with me.
Speaker 3:It's kind of interesting how that works. So what do you feel like in all of your journey was the most helpful thing that you learned that positioned you and maybe it's not a most helpful, but what is it about your journey that positioned you? Well, to be like, I'm a partner and now I'm kind of running, not running but like I'm part of that running Um.
Speaker 4:I think it's funny. It's funny you ask that Cause we were my wife and I were both talking to our son about this you always raise your hand, like if an opportunity comes up, always raise your hand. You know um and and accept the challenge right, don't, don't shy away from new opportunities. Always be willing to kind of put yourself out there and and do something different. You know, I wouldn't put it on quite the same level, but even you know me moving to Biloxi, that was kind of put myself out there.
Speaker 4:It was a change, you know, and the interesting thing is my I was kind of putting myself out there. It was a change, you know. And the interesting thing is my wife and I didn't just kind of an aside, we didn't. We met in February of 2007 and we were married by April of 2008. So we got married, we'd known each other for, you know, 14 months and then moved to a completely different city together.
Speaker 3:Did you get married that fast? Because she was in the military.
Speaker 4:No, okay, no, because we actually were.
Speaker 3:You just really liked each other.
Speaker 4:Well, yeah, and she had actually. So she finished her fourth year in May of 2007 and moved to Biloxi.
Speaker 3:So we did the long distancing for a couple months, yeah, for a while, and I do hear that from you guys as you're talking through your journey of like you, just you stepped into every opportunity that seemed to present itself and just been like okay, let's just do this and not fretting and just going okay, let's just do this and not fretting and just going, all right, here's an opportunity, I'm going to try it and see where it leads. And that's kind of you know, you're always raise your hand, always.
Speaker 4:And don't look back too. I mean I've always been, I don't know for better or worse, been able to just kind of move on right. Like, done with that, moving on, and you know know, take what what I can from the previous experience but learn, don't beat yourself up right
Speaker 5:just move forward, yeah where do you think that mentality comes from? Is that a parenting thing or something innate to your dna, or something you learned along the road.
Speaker 4:I don't know, I mean it. It's a good question that not perseverating on the bad stuff, if there's any bad stuff behind you just moving on, because if you think about it, obviously it can drag you down. So maybe that's it, I don't know.
Speaker 3:Good question, I don't like to sit in my emotions, so I don't want to sit there and reflect on all of the things that might be hard. I'm like, I'm done, move on Like I got to find a different emotion that's easier to handle. I don't know if that's healthy or not, but I definitely think you know, I know that that's part of me. So well, at the end of these things I like to do a little. We call them lightning round. That turns into long round.
Speaker 3:I don't know, the short long round, somehow the short long round somehow or another, where I just ask random questions and just kind of see what your answers are. So, all right. So my first one is you're at a networking event. What drink are you drinking?
Speaker 4:Oh, what time of day.
Speaker 3:I don't know you. You, that's part of the question, like me, like in the morning it's a, a Bloody Mary, and then in the evening you know whatever.
Speaker 4:I'll assume it's an after hours thing, probably a bourbon neat.
Speaker 3:Okay, my other half does old fashions all the time.
Speaker 4:I like an old fashion too, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm a wino, although my doctors have told me that's probably why I'm not sleeping very well at night. So trying um little. Things that happen as you get older, uh, all right. Favorite person to follow podcast instagram book tiktok about australia uh animals of australia.
Speaker 4:I'm not strange to say on a podcast, I don't listen to a ton of podcasts. I I will say I, I don't know, I'm probably going to ruffle some feathers. I like Joe Rogan, because of the variety of people that he has on, not necessarily, you know, be just being a political. He has some really neat people and I think, from a diverse, a diversity of guests standpoint. I've found his podcast to be interesting.
Speaker 3:You know, again, setting any controversial comments aside, you don't have to agree with them to find him interesting. Yeah.
Speaker 4:I appreciate his curiosity. I think, he's genuinely curious too, which leads to having lots of other you know sort of atypical guests. It's not the same, you know. You watch Fox news you get the same kind of guests. You watch MSNBC you get the same kind of people you know his. I feel like he's he's done a good job of mixing it up.
Speaker 3:you know again, any other controversies aside, Are there books that you say you read a lot of books? Is there a particular artist that you artist? Author. Author. Thank you.
Speaker 4:It could be artists too, I guess. No, I like the science fiction genre.
Speaker 4:I'm a big fan of science fiction, always have been, so I read a lot of science fiction books. I like Ken Follett. I was hooked by his first. The two books of his that I first read were Pillars of the Earth, and I forget the name of the other one, but it was a sequel to that. Fantastic and different not science fiction, historical fiction. And different not science fiction, historical fiction. And then there's a century trilogy which he's I don't know how old it is at this point, but I just started the first book of that, falling Giants. So no, there's not. I would say if there's an overarching thing, it would be science fiction. I really do enjoy science fiction, but not a particular author.
Speaker 3:I read a lot of Stephen King growing up, Just books like therapy a little bit. I don't know therapy for me sometimes.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I mean it's sort of an escape.
Speaker 3:Not that I'm looking to escape, but it's just interesting to enter different worlds. Your mind just needs to release to something different and then, when it can, it can come back to things creatively, and so that's not necessarily escape. I think that's healthy. Well, it also helps me get to sleep.
Speaker 4:To be honest, it actually helps me remove myself from the work stuff, and so I can kind of quiet my mind to actually go to bed.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, that's a. We've talked about sleep many times and stuff, so how late is fashionably late.
Speaker 4:Um well, I would say, depending on the event, but five minutes I'm not a big fan of. You're never late, I've never.
Speaker 3:I'm the one who's late.
Speaker 4:When we connect for things you're always there before me it's not bad.
Speaker 3:Five minutes, maybe ten, I've had people say one minute past is. You know you are five minutes early or you are late, sort of thing. You have to give A little grace.
Speaker 4:I was going to the ophthalmologist the other day and got behind a an accident that had just happened on 31, and there's nowhere to go. And like that's not my fault, it's not anyone's fault.
Speaker 5:I think everyone that's answered that way has had some kind of military involvement.
Speaker 3:Where they're like five minutes earlier.
Speaker 1:That is very true, that'll change your whole attitude around those things.
Speaker 4:On that point, my watch is always set to military time. And the clock in my car is set to military time. I got used to it, so some things stick.
Speaker 3:I turned mine to military time when I was in London because that's how everything is there and I couldn't. I could never do the math in my brain fast enough, so I was like I'm just going to put it on that and just start operating that way. What's your biggest pet peeve?
Speaker 4:Jesse's hard questions. Yeah, this will sound kind of weird Pillows on the floor, like our kids like if they knock a pillow off and it's on the floor and they don't like I don't, there's something about that.
Speaker 3:Like.
Speaker 4:I put my head on that.
Speaker 5:Somehow I knew that was going to be the next thing out of your mouth Like I put my head on that.
Speaker 4:I don't want it on the floor. I mean, you know, I think you know we keep the house pretty clean. But come on, I don't know, that's, that's a, probably a weird one. But we have two. First thing that comes to mind.
Speaker 5:We have two dogs that love to just like tackle our pillows when we're not using them and I have the same it's like come on, man, I'm gonna sleep there.
Speaker 3:You got your slumbery all laws all over.
Speaker 5:Yeah, don't be sitting on it and licking it and whatever else.
Speaker 3:What You're going to hate me for this one? What's your personal motto? Always raise your hand.
Speaker 4:I don't know, just go with it, don't sweat it. Yeah, I can see that about you. Roll with it, yeah.
Speaker 3:Just flex, kind of chill, like we're just going to flow, like the situation is not going to rile my feathers up, which yeah. Yeah, and that's not to say things aren't urgent, but I can totally see that about you. Yeah, and that's not to say things aren't urgent, but I can totally see that about you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I've never, at least for myself, exuding urgency or feeling urgent and the sometimes which you know, maybe it's just an unfortunate or unfortunate byproduct, but that's, it's not apathy, it's just, you know, control what I can, I control what I can control yeah, no, I found that I was working with the software people and I was frustrated because they're taking forever to do some stuff and I'm like, okay, it's not worth getting all bent out of shape, and sometimes you just go all right, here's the situation we're in, we're just going to flow with it and the world's not going to fall apart. Yes, and so, yeah, I get them.
Speaker 4:The sun will rise tomorrow, right.
Speaker 3:What color do you think of when you think of a business owner?
Speaker 4:Let me get to the psychology navy blue like the business.
Speaker 3:This is so crazy.
Speaker 4:It is so crazy yeah sorry, I don't know.
Speaker 3:I've asked this question to a lot of people and they walk in and they give me an answer and they're wearing that color and so no one said navy blue yet. But you are, in essence, kind of wearing that Navy-ish, navy-ish a bluish type. Yeah, it's almost gray, I guess. But yeah. Navy blue.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I don't know, I think of business. I still think of and this is kind of old school I just think of like a, like a wall street banker and a Navy blue suit with a red tie you know, white shirt and you're, so you probably also have that Wall Street-ish stuff around you.
Speaker 4:It's interesting how not Wall Street we are, though, like you know, wall Street is I'm not picking on what you said, but it is. You know. I still have had people say, oh, so you're a broker Like I'm not a what? No? We don't sell anything.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 4:I don't sell anything, right? I don't know. Some things die hard.
Speaker 3:Well, people come to me and they think I can help them do their financial planning. I'm like no, I don't. That's a whole different world of math and thought pattern and strategy. And, yeah, I can give you my opinion, but it's not the right opinion all the time. So talk to someone who is thinking like that Um, but what's your superpower?
Speaker 1:Picking up pillows.
Speaker 3:Picking up pillows, I'm really good at picking up pillows.
Speaker 4:Really good at picking up pillows. Um, I don't know pillows, I don't know. I'm just. I don't say this. This isn't like self-loathing. Sometimes I think, when you ask questions like that, I'm just not a very interesting guy Like I don't have a super path.
Speaker 3:But I mean you can probably go back to your personal motto. Like you're not easily riled, yeah, I would say that.
Speaker 4:that's that. That's probably. I was going to go to that, but I was trying to think of something pithy for you.
Speaker 3:No, you don't have to.
Speaker 4:But yeah, I think, yeah, my ability to just kind of move on, you know I don't dwell, I just, yeah, I try to, I don't stew.
Speaker 5:So maybe that's a superpower, there's a fearlessness or a courage to that as well, just in everything that you've said today of just like, whatever the next opportunity is, you know it's, yeah, it's a brave Like unique to, to be able to just seize that at every you know turn and not be second guessing yourself or, uh, you know, overcomplicating.
Speaker 4:It could be perceived as denial too.
Speaker 3:Avoidance, we're going to go with a positive flip. End of it, yeah. I like that. Um so last two questions.
Speaker 4:What do you define as success? Well, I would define my success. I think it's very subjective and obviously it's happiness and whatever makes you happy. For me personally, it's my family, it's my friends and, I think, the relationships that's to me, that's what makes me successful in my life. It may not be successful to other people. It may not be successful to other people, but I think that's the relationships I have with my kids and my wife, my family, my friends, and I'm a small boat guy, as my friend Heidi coined the term. You know we're all kind of like boats, right? My friend Heidi coined the term.
Speaker 4:you know we're all kind of like boats, right? If you equated us to boats and the number of people you like to have in the boat, I'm a small boat guy. I'm probably a canoe. My wife is more of a cruise ship right. Like she likes lots of people. So in my small boat I have very strong relationships of which I'm very appreciative and makes me happy and I think makes me successful, yeah, so kind of a cop out no, it's not, it's actually very beautiful of success is cultivating deep relationships in your life.
Speaker 3:And I see that in the work you do, because and I've mentioned this to you and I mentioned it to people I refer you to like you care about them and where they're going in a much deeper fashion than like let me just plan out your stuff, like let's you want to sell your business, like hey, let me help you analyze the sale with you.
Speaker 3:Like let's talk through that fear factor and kind of all of those pieces, and so I, um, I value, I, I value that in you from a business perspective. Um, I think it's very that being your definition of success emanates and how you can connect with people and and do things, so I can see that about you.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I was actually going to say I think that's carried through to my practice is getting invested in clients and not just the superficial stuff, like you said, just really understanding who they are, what makes them tick, what's important to them. You know, getting the opportunity to do that makes me feel successful, you know, because you know it equips me to be, you know, a better advisor and give them better advice, and so I really enjoy that piece, that investment in who they are. And we've been blessed at Deerfield with multi-generational relationships we've had with you know. We're now, you know, working with the grandkids of clients, and so that personal aspect is very important for us as a firm and, of course, me personally. And so, yeah, that's. I think you know we're not the biggest firm in town. We're not, you know, by any metric.
Speaker 4:But I think we're all pretty, you know successful in that regard Um just those deep relationships.
Speaker 3:So then, on the flip side of it, that's not always a direct opposite. What is the um, what's the definition of failure for you?
Speaker 4:I think not trying is a failure. I mean I think trying something and in a traditional sense failing can be a win, right? I mean again I mentioned we were talking to our son about this like raising your hand I mean the failure is not in not succeeding at something, you know, a particular task or whatever. To me and my wife shares the same sentiment not trying is the failure. That doesn't mean you do everything, but if you're presented with something that you really want to do but you're afraid of failing, then that becomes a failure, right, the fact that you don't really try it. So to me, I never fault people for trying something that they really wanted to try, like their heart was in it, or it's just something they want to tackle, and then by any other conventional measure they fail, measure they fail. You know you did it right, like you tried, and that's. There's a lot of success in that, because even the failure you know, we all know you learn probably learn more from your failures than your successes.
Speaker 3:Yep Very much All the time.
Speaker 4:Daily.
Speaker 3:Yeah, exactly. Well, thank you very much for joining and telling us a little bit about your journey, thanks for having me.
Speaker 4:This is fun yeah, I, it's.
Speaker 3:One of my favorite things to do right now is just to sit here and chit chat with people, but, um, we do like to give an opportunity, if there's anything you want to kind of plug or tell people how to find you or various different things. How might they find you? Uh?
Speaker 4:yeah, sure, I mean we're um uh, probably the easiest way to learn more about us is our, our website it's just deerfield fa for deerfield, Deerfield FA for Deerfield, Financial Advisors, Deerfield FA dot com. And yeah, I mean we're just if people have stumbled across us and didn't get the full skinny on who we are. We're a full service wealth management firm.
Speaker 4:We do I liken what we do to being personal CFOs. So, as I told somebody the other day, if it has a dollar sign in front of it, we can. You know we work with people on it. So we and we work, we kind of work as the quarterback of for folks' financial team and it can include CPAs, state attorneys, you know, insurance brokers, things like that. So we really pride ourselves on working collaboratively with people, other professionals again, all working towards the same goal of helping people achieve their near and long-term goals. So any interest, check us out on the website. Should I throw the phone number out there 317-469-2455, call the office. One thing I will say is when we get most of our new business comes from referrals from existing clients. But on the off chance that we get somebody that just happens to call in or finds us, on the off chance that we get somebody that just happens to call in or finds us on the website, we're real intentional about kind of vetting out who the potential client is and who they might work best with.
Speaker 4:There are six advisors now. Six, seven advisors, sorry, we're all a little different, right. Um, six, seven advisors, sorry, um, we're all a little different, right, like we all. We all have, uh, we all do a great job. Uh, I will say, but we do. You know, from a personality perspective, we're all a little bit different and, and you know we do a real good job of trying to match folks with um, um, you know the right, the right person, the right personality, because that's obviously important. We're heavily involved with clients. I mean we, we touch clients probably more than you know most other professionals, just because you know, throughout the year it's, you know we're not seasonal or anything, and so you know it's important that you mesh well with your, with your advisor, and so we're very intentional about, um, you know, trying to make sure that, uh, you get with the right person.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so it's very cool. Well, thank you very much.
Speaker 4:Thanks for having me.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we're very grateful that you're on this. Thank you, bye.
