Detangle by Kinjal
Detangle is a podcast created by health psychologist and writer, Dr Kinjal Goyal. Each episode is a conversation with an expert in their field, as they dive deep into their journerys and experiences. The conversations are full of insight and a great way to hear, first hand, how the mind plays a pivotal role in almost everything that we do. The guests range from doctors, to writers, to those in entertainment and of course, those from mental health fields.
Detangle by Kinjal
Detangle with Mr Boman Irani
Boman Irani's warmth and wisdom shine throughout this captivating conversation that explores the intersection of acting craft, psychological insight, and authentic storytelling.
The renowned actor—beloved for iconic roles in films like Munna Bhai MBBS and 3 Idiots—shares the unconventional journey that led him to Bollywood in his 40s after fourteen years in theater.
"Actors are lying," Boman reveals with disarming candor, before explaining his paradoxical approach to performance: finding deep truth within pretense. This philosophy permeates his craft as he describes the ability to be "truthful in the lie" while maintaining the psychological discipline to "unlie" himself after intense scenes. Rather than focusing on expressions, Boman emphasizes feeling—allowing audiences to experience what the character experiences rather than merely observing a performance.
His reflections on what makes characters unforgettable offer profound insights for storytellers and psychology enthusiasts alike. "Characters who are dark but show potential for change" create the strongest connections with audiences, he explains, because they offer hope: "If this guy could change, maybe I can change too." This perspective illuminates why his portrayals of complex characters like Dr. Asthana resonate so powerfully across generations.
The conversation takes a heartwarming turn when Boman shares the contents of his "emotional first aid box"—family unity for oxygen, humor for medicine, and forward planning for healing. This proactive approach to happiness extends to his professional relationships, where he actively creates inclusive environments on set.
When asked about character development, he offers a principle that bridges storytelling and life philosophy: "The protagonist is the architect of his own misery or happiness."
Join us for this enriching dialogue that reveals why Boman Irani remains one of Indian cinema's most thoughtful and beloved artists.
Welcome to Detangle, where we untangle the complexities of life one conversation at a time. I'm your host, dr Kinjal Goel, a psychologist and a writer. Do you know who's my favorite kind of guest on Detangle? The one who needs no introduction, and when it comes to Mr Baman Irani, he doesn't need me to tell you about him. Nonetheless, I can't stop gushing about his work, his excellence in the roles we have seen, his love for music, photography, his entire life journey and so much more. Oh, and we have a fiery, rapid fire question at the end, so please stay tuned. Welcome, mr Irani. It's such a pleasure to have you with me on Detangled today.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much, Dr Kinjal. It's so good to be here and it's going to be a lively conversation. I can already sense it.
Speaker 1:Well, I'm really looking forward to this one. So let's just get started. Take us to the beginning of your Bollywood career, sir. You were in your 40s, defying all the preset norms of Bollywood.
Speaker 2:Tell us what it was like for you then. So if you want to go back to the beginnings of my Indian, my Hindi film career, nobody called me sir then. So it's better if nobody calls me sir now. So you can call me Baman, it's absolutely fine. So yeah, I used to do…. I was in theatre for pretty long, in fact about 14 years I was in theatre before I made the transition.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And there were a couple of producers in fact more than a couple of producers would come and watch my plays, and at that point of time I was doing a lot of ad films, so I was getting used to facing the camera. And Ram Madhwani came and watched three of my plays on the trot Three. So I was doing Mahatma versus Gandhi as Gandhi I was doing I'm not Bajira, I was a 75-year-old man and then I was doing King Herod in a musical called Jesus Christ Superstar, which was a song and dance thing. And he said you know, I saw three very different characters and I was just wondering that if I wanted to make a movie, would you be happy to be in it? I said sure, but it was an experimental film called let's Talk, which was shot on digital I mean the digital from back in the day which wasn't a very great quality, but we couldn't afford to do it on film. And here we are, shot this film in seven days as an experiment.
Speaker 2:We sent it to a few festivals and nobody really saw the film but Vinod Chopra, vidhu. Vinod Chopra saw it in his office and called for me and said when I do my next film, I want you to be part of it and that was it. And I said what's the film? He said nothing yet, but when something comes along I'll let you know. I said okay and he disappeared. And then he invited me to listen to a narration of a film which you may or may not have heard of, I'm not sure. Let me know if you've not heard of it. It's a film called Munna Bhai on BBS.
Speaker 2:Ah of course, and it's thanks to let's Talk that I met Vidhavino Chopra. Thanks to Vidhavino Chopra, I met Raju Hirani and we did the film and, strangely, this little film, which nobody wanted to back or support, suddenly became the toast of the town. And here I was. As simple as that.
Speaker 1:Wow. So talking about Munna Bhai, actually that is the one reason I think so many generations are so connected with you. I think that was one role, you know, that was one thing that everybody just felt. I mean, I remember that scene when Dr Asthana would laugh, when he was angry.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:His helplessness, the frustration, the anger, it was palpable. I mean the audience would laugh nervously, not knowing what exactly it is that you would feel Right. And another scene that comes to my mind is the one from Mehta Boys, your. And another scene that comes to my mind is the one from Mehta Boys, your, most beautiful release right now, that car crash when the father and son are talking and they are out of breath with their emotions and everything just tumbles out. It kind of ties the whole movie in that one knot. For me that was the defining moment of that particular film. But when you do such intense scenes, does it affect you psychologically?
Speaker 2:Do you need to prepare for it or do you need to take a break after these scenes are shot?
Speaker 2:Honestly back in the day. Maybe I used to take some time to come out of it and I can understand. I can understand that it is sometimes difficult, but no, I've got other responsibilities, especially for Mehta Boys. I have the responsibility of going checking the shot, making sure what's the next shot, prepping the other actor, instructing him, instructing the same. So I can't afford to be. You have to learn to do the switch on and switch off. For it to be, you have to learn to do the switch on and switch off, because you know, I feel we're telling a lie.
Speaker 2:Actors are lying. It's nothing but pretending to be someone. You're not Pretending to be in an emotion. That is not really personal. It's personal to the character. So you are the character in that moment. So you tell the lie and if you're a good liar, you'll be able to unlie yourself. So eventually, what is truthful in the moment is truthful in the moment. What is truthful in the moment is truthful in the moment. But once the moment is over, I suppose you are being untruthful if you're saying you know, I got stuck in the character. I don't know, maybe I'm not such a great actor.
Speaker 1:I will.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know what I'm saying, right? I genuinely feel one has to be responsible to the moment and you must try and muster up as much honesty in the untruth there has to be honesty in the untruth. You must try your best to be as convincingly truthful in the lie. Wow, where the paradox is coming from here. Absolutely. But that's it. And once it's over, I mean get on with it. Man, you've got a responsibility. If not as a director, you've got a responsibility as a family. I told you to your family, to your friends you can't go sitting and you go for dinner after the shooting is over or the play is over. You're sitting there morose and thinking, oh, I'm still the character. No, I mean, please get on with it.
Speaker 1:Fabulous. Well, that's a very beautiful way of understanding truth and lies. I could read a whole book if you wrote just about unlying your life so well. You spoke about working as a theatre artist for so many years, but when you began that journey, did you ever feel stage fright? Or later, did you ever feel imposter syndrome?
Speaker 2:No, never Stage anxiety, maybe because fright no, Fright has got to do with the sight of an audience and I thrive on an audience, so we can take that out of the equation. Beautiful, the idea that you know you hit the note. It's like hitting the note with the first note of a song. You know if you don't have a chord given to you and you just have to go out there and just hit the note. That anxiety, once I get the sur, you know, and then I'm on, I'm not afraid.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:I'm not afraid, I don't like to…. If I'm afraid, it means that I'm not prepared. If I'm afraid, it means that I'm not prepared. If I'm afraid, it means that I'm not in the moment. If I'm afraid, it means that I'm concentrating on something else. I'm concentrating on success. I'm concentrating on audience reaction. Will they like me? Won't they like me? No, no, no. You've got to get all of that out of your mind. All you've got to do is I just want to be truthful in that moment, because if I'm not truthful in that moment, I'm thinking of 500 other things. I'm letting fear get the better of me, which is not true, because my character is not living in fear, but that's powerful of course, my character is not living.
Speaker 2:My character is meant to be, say, in a particular moment, my character is meant to be powerful. So then, why would I allow stage fright to come in the way, fear to come in the way, wonderful. And rehearsal is meant for you to own the stage. Rehearsal is not there for you to learn the lines. Rehearsal is meant for you to own the moment, to be in the moment, so that I know that I'm not going to be distracted by my audience reactions or what the papers have to say the next morning or, for that matter, what my friends will turn on and say vava, I'm not interested in all that. I'm interested in the truth, in in lying as best as I can I love the direction we've already taken with the truth and the lies yeah, it's, it's what our lives are all about.
Speaker 2:True, true.
Speaker 1:Well, this is something which I've personally been very curious about. As a former photographer, you've enjoyed being on the other side of the lens. You have seen what the lens can show you. But when you went on the other side now as an actor, did it help you in honing your expressions, your acting skills, because you know what the lens sees.
Speaker 2:Okay Expressions is a bad word for me.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:If I'm concentrating on how I'm looking and I am unconcentrating if that's the word from what I'm feeling. So I'm very wary of that word. Oh, my expressions were good. Acting is not about expressions. Acting is about what you're feeling, the truth of the moment. So if I'm concentrating on how I'm going to be looking in a vain way, number one, or how my expression is coming out, well, I find that problematic for an actor.
Speaker 1:You understand correct?
Speaker 2:Yes, no, no, no, this is an actor's perspective. I'm not correcting you, dr Kinjal. I'm saying that what the audience sees is expression.
Speaker 1:Right? No, but I like this perspective. I like your understanding of expression, which is very different. Right, an audience sees is expression, right? No, but I like this perspective, I like your understanding of expression, which is very different.
Speaker 2:Right, an audience sees an expression the audience is seeing. For starters, the audience is seeing an externalization of what you're feeling and as you get closer and closer to the character, they start feeling what you're feeling. And that's the job of the actor, for some form of putting the audience in the boots of the main character.
Speaker 1:Letting them join in your line.
Speaker 2:Yeah, let them get an idea of what you're feeling. Where's the empathy? Audience should later on say, oh, that that was a good performance. But if they're saying, oh, look at him, he's screaming and shouting and acting so well, that's not good acting well, these are.
Speaker 1:These are little things that really enrich the listeners. I mean, from my perspective, what we see, see what we see of stage performers, of actors, of you know everything, from stage to Bollywood. We see some things which are very different from what you're actually feeling. So it's very nice to be able to understand the other side also.
Speaker 2:Of course, of course. So tell me, I don't expect an audience to get it right away. The audience takes its time, of course, and I think the audience gets it.
Speaker 1:You know eventually whether we can say it or not. The audience gets it. They may not have the right words to express it, but, like you said, if they feel it, they know it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and then, maybe for lack of a better way of expressing themselves, the audience will say lovely expressions, and that's fine as long as they felt it, I have no problem when an audience has good expressions.
Speaker 1:As long as they can join in the lie and they can go ahead with it. Absolutely, Absolutely so well. You've worked with nearly everyone in Bollywood. Any favorite co-stars, Any anecdote that had you in splits while filming any particular particular movie?
Speaker 2:Well, I've had fun on almost almost every project, Every single project. Maybe a project here, a project there. You turn and say, you know, maybe I'm not connecting with the people that I'm working with. Maybe there have been just one or two mildly unhappy projects, but by and large, as I said in my introduction, I try and derive and scheme ways to remain in good spaces. So if the shooting didn't go off well, make sure the backup post-packup is great and then the next day shooting might just about go better.
Speaker 2:Wow, If there is someone who's say distant approach, that person Say hey, want to hang out with us. We are going out for a meal or we are sitting around the corner over there playing word building. Would you like to join us? Don't say he's distant, because he will remain distant to you then for the rest of his life. But if you include, then there's a chance that the atmosphere, because you've got to spend months with those people, Then you've got to make a way of making it pleasurable for everyone. I think that's part of teamsmanship, that's part of I mean, I'm not calling myself one but it's part of leadership, To make sure that there is inclusivity even for people who you may feel are distant, let's call them distant. Don't allow them to be distant for too long, because they're on the same team. If they tell you I'm sorry, you don't mind, but I'd like to sit on my own and read a book. Yeah, I respect that. Don't be upset with it.
Speaker 2:But I've had some great experiences in my career with everyone. I mean, we had a great time on Three Idiots, Anything that Shah Rukh has ever done with me. We've had a ball when we've been with Ritesh and Farhan. Ritesh Deshmukh is great. Farah Khan is great. Mr Bachchan, on a given day, on any given day, can tell you stories that are so enthralling, so enthralling and so funny, and we're all listening. We're fans. So we listen with so much, Of course, yeah, and we listen with so much of excitement because stuff that happened maybe in Cholio or a Diwaar or some you know, come on. But he makes it so funny, he makes it so personable. I've had great times.
Speaker 1:Super. So there's a movie which you had done long ago called Vakt, and there was this dialogue which kept repeating throughout, when you said Yeh, toh kuch bhi nahi hai. My kids still crack up with it.
Speaker 2:So the writer had a friend who used to keep saying that.
Speaker 1:Oh really.
Speaker 2:Whatever, yeh toh kuch bhi nahi hai. I've got one leg up on you in anything that you do.
Speaker 1:But that really stuck. I don't know Somehow it just stuck. It's a family thing. Now we all know this, we'll all say it at the right time and we'll just laugh as if you know, it's just a little joke.
Speaker 2:I forgot to add Anupam Kher in the list of people. We talk about life, we crack jokes, we play games, we play lots of games. I think games are a great way to unite and make a circle of chairs. That's what it is. Make a circle of chairs. Believe me, it doesn't go wrong.
Speaker 1:How lovely it's, so visual. I mean I just want a seat at that table, if I can. It'll be a fun table to be at. Well, you conduct workshops for aspiring actors, for storytellers.
Speaker 2:What do you?
Speaker 1:think is changing in the younger generation, and what do you think is changing in the younger generation? And what do you think is?
Speaker 2:something that is still the same? Ah, okay, tough question. In the younger generation, there are some actors and some directors who are extremely hardworking.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:And then there are some who come into the business and I hate to say this and their priorities for them are right. You come to be stars, and I say great because they succeed. So there will always be a mix of people who have a certain kind of approach to their work or their professionalism or, for that matter, what they want out of being actors or being part of an entertainment business. That's fine. Off late I'm seeing young actors, really really masters of their craft, and there used to be very few back in the day when we used to have parallel cinema that we had. We had the Nasiruddin Shahs and the Om Puris and Mr Kares and Paresh Rawal, who you know come from the theatre and the NSD world, but the rest were stars.
Speaker 2:Let's say that that's great. It ran the industry and got. But now I think there are a lot of these actors and trained actors, let's put it this way trained actors who are finding a place in this industry and they work very hard and they realize that their place has been achieved and they've established themselves simply because of their craft. The dependence on other things is less, you are thrown in the deep end and you're an actor, now deliver, and we have some wonderful people around us and they're showing the way, and they're showing the way, and they're showing the way.
Speaker 2:Lovely and I'm very, very proud of these people, very proud to even know them, even work with them.
Speaker 1:Super, and as someone who always has loved storytelling, what do you think makes a character truly unforgettable in cinema?
Speaker 2:Wow, difficult question. Sometimes the most vile human beings become unforgettable.
Speaker 1:Well, true.
Speaker 2:And then sometimes, maybe the most whiter than white don't become most forgettable. There's your answer. Whiter than white is not exciting. However, for me, to have a character that is dark but gives people hope that he may change, those are unforgettable characters for me Interesting, those are unforgettable characters for me Interesting.
Speaker 2:For me, a character that is dark and doesn't get his comeuppance, I find a little. It's a very personal thing, of course, but characters who are dark and maybe see the light give the audiences a bit of light, a little bit of hope that you know if this guy could change, then maybe I can change too. So I think unforgettable characters are ones that you can relate to, you can hate, but at the same time they are characters that make you feel. Maybe even if it's anger or love, I don't know what it is the emotion has to be strong, otherwise there's no point in having those characters. You can't be telling a story. He should be evoking some kind of a response, like in Khosla Ka Khosla.
Speaker 2:The character was dark and he was a pathetic character because he did not have the respect of his son and that made him interesting. Imagine if the son's angle was not there, that he did not want to change. Because he wanted the respect of his son. He did not start wearing golfing shorts. He said he just did it to impress his son. But he's impressing the son wrongly, but he's crying, you see. So he looks pathetic actually, which means that I hope he understands that there's more to it than wearing golfing shorts to impress and find respectability. That makes the character interesting. For me. In Three Idiots the character becomes interesting simply because he's boring, but at the same time he allowed himself to admit to his mistake, of course, to admit to his mistake, of course. And the moment he admits himself, admits to the mistake, you say okay, I like him because he was. He showed change, he displayed courage to say that you know. Thank you.
Speaker 1:Do what?
Speaker 2:you want.
Speaker 1:So you can love them or hate them, but can't ignore them Simply put, yeah. So well. Handling criticism is such a big part of being in the public eye, but have you ever been affected by this now, especially online? You have a good online presence. Do you ever face trolling?
Speaker 2:comment here or comment there but nothing significant nothing significant in that sense. So people might turn on and say I didn't like, that's okay. You have every right to not like. You paid good money for it but nothing vile, really just no.
Speaker 1:Okay fabulous. Is there something about your field of work? Good money for it, fair, but nothing vile, really Just no, not at all. Okay Fabulous. Is there something about your field of work, whether it was theatre or movies, that nobody taught you and something that you wish somebody had taught you early on?
Speaker 2:Hmm, wow, that's a good question. Well, so many things. But then, at the end of the day, uh, if you're a good observer of humanity, of people, of human behavior, behavioral science, um, your peers, your seniors and people who are making mistakes, you learn by observation. You know, they say, when you write a character, character is not described in words, it's described by his actions.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:So you have to be observing the actions of others, including artistic choices, including behavior choices, including behavior, including decisions on careers, on your career. You got to learn from other people's pluses and minuses. So basically, what you're doing, you are observing human nature. Absolutely that's all I know. There's nothing else that I know in this world. But but I have developed a keen sense of observation. So, while I did not go to film school or drama school which I would have loved to have gone and met some wonderful people and maybe I still rely on the observation of humanity, I rely on that very strongly.
Speaker 1:Fabulous. I think it can be extremely powerful if you're doing it so proactively, when you're so aware that you're doing it and you're doing it as a regular practice. It becomes second nature, which is amazing.
Speaker 2:It is second nature and I've learned over the years not to be judgmental. Of course that's the person who is. He has his own set of issues, his own set of flaws, and the flaws emanate from his own set of wounds, not idiosyncrasies. Idiosyncrasies making it simple for the other guy. His own set of fears and the person's reactions are emanating from fears or wounds and they become flaws. So you have to make concession for that. I'm not trying to sound like a nice guy. I don't need to tolerate it, but I don't become too judgmental Because we do have our own flaws. We have our own flaws and they come from our own wounds or your experiences that make you angry and you want to react and you want to be reactionary and over the years and with age, I think things change. Of course that's it.
Speaker 1:Lovely. Well, I'm going to ask you my favorite question on the show. I ask all my guests this question because I want to know the answers from everyone. We've all heard of a physical first aid box, right? Something in which we keep our painkillers, band-aids, whatever for minor cuts and bruises. What if I were to ask you to keep a mental first aid box, Something that would make you happy immediately, Something you could just open and find joy For those days when you're emotionally run down and you need a little pick-me-up? What would your personal emotional first aid box look like?
Speaker 2:That's a good question actually.
Speaker 1:Thank you?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So my emotional first aid box would be I'll open it if I'm emotionally run down. I rely on the unity of family. I just say what are you guys doing today? Why can't we just meet up? It's a very simple thing let's meet up and let's plan something.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Plan. Looking forward is a great… Pick me up. Yeah, looking forward, why don't we do this and let's do this and let's…. Planning is a good remedy, a good piece of first aid. And secondly, humor is a great medicine. It is. It is Because when someone's down and said, don't irritate him by cracking jokes, I think sometimes nine times out of ten the joke actually lifts the person. True, so I depend a lot on humor. I've got into trouble because of it. That's not required at this time. There was no badly timed joke. I said but yeah, yeah, but I tried, and that knows. And 10 minutes later that person will appreciate that I was trying to pick that person up.
Speaker 2:But my, my, my first aid box is is this thing get family around you because you need, you need oxygen. First, breathe, so family. And second, what is the medicine? The actual pill that you're swallowing, and I use humor and a little bit of, a little bit of planning. So if you say that you know your health is down, what do you need to do? I said, took this pill, I I got, took the oxygen. And now I've got to say I got to think of my future. So there it, it is all in the first eight box.
Speaker 1:It's so beautifully metaphysical and yet I can just see it. I can see colors in it. It's so visual and it's just so out there. Well, I'm going to put you through a rapid fire question round. Just a few questions. Answer quick what's your favorite book?
Speaker 2:Every week I have a favorite book, so let's see, yeah, in front of you.
Speaker 1:Sorry that one is the Hero with a Thousand Faces. Yeah, your favorite movie character.
Speaker 2:You're going to get very upset, but I'm going to say this Bring it on Hannibal. Lecter from Silence of the Lambs.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't know why I like that character.
Speaker 1:Unforgettable, like you said.
Speaker 2:I have a breakdown for that, but that's for another kind of session. But why I like him? Maybe I mean try to justify my liking for him.
Speaker 1:Okay, your biggest pet peeve.
Speaker 2:Bad manners.
Speaker 1:The one thing that you believed in but no longer do.
Speaker 2:One thing I believed in.
Speaker 1:I can't remember, actually, Okay we'll save this for another episode.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:Your most prized possession.
Speaker 2:Okay, we'll save this for another episode. Okay.
Speaker 1:Your most prized possession. I don't have anything physical to say. Oh my favorite. Okay, we'll give it to you.
Speaker 2:No, because what my prized possession is my Blu-ray collection.
Speaker 1:Hmm, interesting. Well, there's so much that I want to say when we close the episode, but before we come to an end, I want to throw the floor open to you. Is there a question you would like to ask me as a psychologist?
Speaker 2:Um, yeah sure, when people come to you for a consultation, hmm, is there a chance you might in the third or fourth session? There's no hope for this person to change.
Speaker 1:Well, now it's my turn to say that's a difficult question, because it's very hard to say that, yes, everybody can and should change. There are certain people who have personality flaws, certain people who have psychiatric illnesses.
Speaker 2:And that's different.
Speaker 1:Right. So it's the personality flaws that we kind of steer clear of after the third or the fourth session has been done and you feel that they don't want to change. And you, I mean, there's nothing much you can do. But surprisingly, if a person wants to change, there's very little that can be done to stop them.
Speaker 2:So it's the want, it's the choice it's like an addiction, no right so I mean you stop smoking when that person does not want to give up smoking. People are comfortable in the skin of being having those personality flaws. You can't do anything about it.
Speaker 1:Right. So when a family member brings us a patient and says okay, change them now, that is our red flag. But when somebody says look, I'm suffering with this personality flaw. Can you help? That is when we really, you know, put in everything and help them change. So I hope that answers.
Speaker 2:To a certain extent. Yes, well, you know. Just to add to that, you know, in screenwriting you mentioned spiral bound is what I do I teach, I enjoy teaching. I think that's a great go-to.
Speaker 1:Oh, yes, of course.
Speaker 2:That's a great go-to for me on a personal level. But when we write for a character, all the luck let's call it luck that fall in the character has got to do with this phrase that we repeat very often. When something bad happens to a character, we say make sure the character does it to himself. The phrase is the protagonist is the architect of his own misery, stroke, happiness. Eventually, you can do what you want to help the character, but, as the goodbye book says, god helps those who help themselves. So even for a character, you can't write a character that is. You know, it's all bad luck, bad luck, bad luck, bad luck.
Speaker 2:Unless the movie, thematically is about bad luck. But I don't believe that, because sometimes you may have a streak of bad luck and then it's up to you to change. It's up to you to change absolutely. It's up to you to bring and this new word that people keep using manifested, manifested. It's very boring to hear it, but yeah, that's right, your positivity can change bad luck also. So in a film there will be only one, one event in the entire film of two hours where there's an external bad luck. The rest of it, all the bad luck that has befallen this character has to do with his own actions.
Speaker 1:It reminds me so much of Ayn Rand, and you know the way she constructed characters even at that time.
Speaker 2:I mean Albert Bork is an idiot. I mean he needs to see you. He doesn't understand what's good for himself.
Speaker 1:True, and I think it's just so amazing that you know, throughout this, what we've had right now, this conversation, I have experienced something which I didn't know about you. So if I were to ask you something people don't know about you is that you have this rigorous commitment to happiness which is you're not chasing it, you're not trying to find it, you're trying to create it. You're not even you're not creating it for yourself, but you want to create it for everyone around you, because no one can be okay unless everyone's okay. So there is this intense commitment to happiness which is very proactive, which is amazing. I mean very, very rare to find. Yes, everybody wants it, everybody looks for it and people claim to find it in some spot of their lives. But this is amazing. I mean, I would trump this over rigorous curiosity.
Speaker 1:Also, I mean just go ahead and be happy.
Speaker 2:I tell you something that maybe people may not know of, but I would have loved to have been in the world of psychology.
Speaker 1:Really, now you've drawn me in completely. Tell me more.
Speaker 2:I would have loved to have been sitting and, you know, doing a nice study, a case study, and then help, you know, breaking down a person's psyche. I think it would have been very interesting.
Speaker 1:I think you're doing it at a different base, but you're doing it all the time. You're doing exactly what a psychology does, you know on the other side of the table, but you're doing it in real life.
Speaker 2:Good, that's nice to know.
Speaker 1:Yes, so this has been so amazing. Thank you so much, baman, for your time. I cannot tell you how excited I am to share these snippets, these pearls of wisdom, with my listeners. We've all seen you, as you know these wonderful characters on screen. We've known you as this absolutely lovable person. Let me tell you, when a lot of people asked me because I'm very excited about my finale episode a lot of people asked me who will be in. You know season four, and when I mentioned your name, there was such an outpouring of love and respect, just with your name, I said you know, this is what I want when I've worked as much as you have, even the few people who might know me, if they can respect me so much, I mean, that's it. These are goals.
Speaker 2:What more does one want? Thank you, absolutely. I'm so glad we connected after Mehta Boys. You watched Mehta Boys and send me a message, and that's how the connection took place.
Speaker 1:Yes because, I love the movie.
Speaker 2:And if you look deeply into Mehta Boys, not you. If one looks slightly deeper, it's nothing but psychology.
Speaker 1:Yes, and that's what made it so special for me, because I could see that somebody is seeing what I see all the time and, you know, presenting it in such a format that it's just shareable psychology. I really want psychology to be a part of everyone's conversation.
Speaker 2:I've consulted psychologists and taken interviews. Yeah, yeah, on behavior. Uh, the, the rooftop sequence where the father questions the, the mason tell me yeah, it's nothing but psychology. Why is he doing that? Why is he wanting to prove his son wrong?
Speaker 2:right it shows a, shows a side of a parent's, parent's behavior, psychological behavior towards he's prepping his own ego, you know, propping his own ego to. So that you know I've always told you that you're a bit of a loser. You can't be in the kadia may say what he has to say, but I think you're a loser. So a lot of it came from that. It came from one of Freud's papers called the Family Romance. Oh, so you see the whole romance happening from childbirth because of, you know, he and his son jumping on the bed and breaking the bed and teasing the mother, to the animosity that took place in the years that the child is becoming a man. And I think all that has got to do with a little bit of psychology.
Speaker 1:How beautiful, thank you so much for this, though, because everybody got to do with a little bit of psychology. How beautiful, thank you so much for this, though, because everybody got to experience something because of all the efforts that you put in, which is a gift. I mean, I think every movie well-made is a gift, and we should just take it as one and appreciate it.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much, dr Kinnik Well.
Speaker 1:I'm so grateful for this time, and we wish you all the very best for all your future projects.
Speaker 2:Thank you ever so much. Thank you for making this a very special episode.
Speaker 1:Thank you.
