Tapes, Pencils, And The Ghetto Blaster That Started Cardio

What if the story of music isn’t just about sound, but about how we hold it? We jump from campfires to gramophones, from crackly vinyl to clean CDs, from bedroom mixtapes to algorithmic playlists, and ask a simple question: did convenience cost us connection?

We start with the thrill of early recording—Edison’s phonograph and the gramophone’s shellac discs—then tune into radio’s power to make songs communal. Vinyl brings ritual and identity, sleeves as art, and turntables as instruments. Cassettes compress that magic into a pocket, birthing the mixtape and the Walkman’s private world. CDs promise clarity and durability, while hi‑fi towers become the pride of the living room. Then the ground shifts: MP3 compression makes sharing effortless, Napster detonates distribution, and iTunes tries to sell simplicity back to us at 99p a track.

Streaming reframes everything. Spotify, Apple Music, and Deezer swap ownership for access, with personalised playlists, discovery engines, and smart speakers putting music everywhere. It’s frictionless and addictive. But we pull back the curtain on payouts, how fractions of a penny reach artists, why podcasters often earn nothing, and what creators lose when platforms hold the keys. We balance nostalgia with practicality, laugh about pencil rewinds and ghetto blasters, and explore what might come next: AI voice clones, VR residencies, and hologram shows that let new generations “see” legends they missed.

If you care about how you listen—and who gets paid when you do—this conversation is for you. Hit follow, share with a friend who loves music history and tech, and leave a review with your first music format: vinyl, tape, CD, or stream. Your stories might make the next show.

Transcript

Saturday Banter And TV Nostalgia

SPEAKER_07 0:00

Hello and welcome to Bonus Dad.

SPEAKER_00 0:02

Bonus Daughter, a special father-daughter podcast with me, Hannah.

SPEAKER_07 0:05

And me, Davy, where we discuss our differences, similarities, share a few laughs and stories. Within our ever-changing and complex world.

SPEAKER_00 0:13

Each week we will discuss a topic from our own point of view. And influences throughout the decades.

SPEAKER_07 0:18

Or you could choose one by contacting us.

SPEAKER_00 0:20

Via email, Instagram, Facebook, or TikTok. Links in bio. Hello and welcome to another episode of Bonus Dad, Bonus Daughter. Today we're going to talk about Music Media.

SPEAKER_07 0:30

We are indeed a Music Media.

SPEAKER_00 0:33

It's a Saturday, it feels really weird.

SPEAKER_07 0:36

Yeah, it really does feel weird because we are actually recording on a Saturday and not a Sunday because I've got to go into work tomorrow.

SPEAKER_00 0:42

It it's it's made me think prematurely it's the end of the week, and that upsets me because I'm like, oh, work tomorrow. Oh Monday, Garfield. I hate Mondays.

SPEAKER_07 0:51

Actually, you say that. I remember when I was a kid, right? And it would get to like Sunday night, and we used to see like when when Pryro Pryro Poirot used to come on. Okay. And that used to come on like sort of like eight o'clock, I think it was. I hated it because it meant that I had to go to bed because I got up for school.

SPEAKER_00 1:06

School in the morning. Yeah. And we still think about that as adults well.

SPEAKER_07 1:11

But I don't but Pyro's not on anymore.

SPEAKER_00 1:13

What is Pyro? Pyro.

SPEAKER_07 1:15

It was like um Hercule Poirot. He was like a French detective.

SPEAKER_00 1:18

Oh, cool.

SPEAKER_07 1:19

Yeah, it was like uh like you know, like Miss Marple, all that kind of bollocks.

SPEAKER_00 1:23

Um don't mince your words.

SPEAKER_07 1:28

Did you did you did you ever watch any? There was anything that you used to watch on telly that used to be on where you used to think, oh, I don't like this because I've got to go to school the next day.

SPEAKER_00 1:36

No, I mean I used to watch Simpsons every day at 6 pm.

SPEAKER_07 1:40

Yeah, you did actually, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:41

And I used to record it, didn't I, if I if I missed it.

SPEAKER_07 1:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:44

I was every single day I used to watch that at 6 pm. That is the only thing I ever remember actually uh like actually watching.

SPEAKER_06 1:51

What Simpsons?

SPEAKER_00 1:53

Yeah, like recurringly, yeah. Mum always had neighbours on.

SPEAKER_07 1:56

Oh god, neighbours do you know that's still going?

SPEAKER_00 1:59

Is it really?

SPEAKER_07 1:59

But it's still going.

SPEAKER_00 2:00

They tried to get rid of it and then for one and then.

SPEAKER_07 2:02

Yeah, they tried to get rid of it and now it's on Prime. So and she still watches it.

SPEAKER_00 2:06

That and Is it still Australian?

SPEAKER_07 2:08

Oh yeah, she's she's obsessed with Australia. I mean, ev she watches everything Australia. It's like Australian Master Chef. We're now on Survivor.

SPEAKER_00 2:15

Is she going next year?

SPEAKER_07 2:16

Yeah, next year she's going. I ain't going.

SPEAKER_00 2:18

You know, I I had a feeling you wouldn't be. I'm not going.

SPEAKER_07 2:20

No, it's it's not that I don't girl trip. Yeah, it's not that I don't like Australia. It's just, you know, it's just I want to live.

SPEAKER_00 2:27

You don't like all the things that live in Australia. There are things that, you know, every animals, not the people. No, the people the people are cool. I like the people. Let's not paint you out to be a racist. No, no, no.

SPEAKER_07 2:37

The people are really cool. I mean, I like the people, you know, and I've actually got family over there as well. But but I draw the line at spiders the size of cars.

SPEAKER_00 2:46

I don't think they're quite that big.

SPEAKER_07 2:47

They are huge.

SPEAKER_00 2:48

But they're not the size of cars.

SPEAKER_07 2:50

They're massive, right? And they want to kill you, and everything over there wants to kill you. I mean, have you seen the kangaroos? Have you seen them?

SPEAKER_00 2:56

Like massive. They are jacked up. They are playing. They are on the right, I'm sure of it.

SPEAKER_07 3:00

Yeah, and they've seen that footage of the kangaroos like in the water where they try to beckon you in to drown you.

SPEAKER_00 3:06

They're like sirens. They are. The sirens of the deep w West.

SPEAKER_07 3:12

It's like, I mean, you you know I'm not a religious person, you know I don't believe in God, right? Oh, we're fully aware of that far. Okay, so let's let's just take, let's just say for for an instance, there was a God, right? There was a God. Right. And and God just went, do you know what? I'm gonna create every single dangerous animal I can think of and put them on one continent, and that was Australia. Right, you think that's what happened? I think exactly that's what happened. He's gone on day six. Yeah, I've really messed up here because these these are some pretty dangerous animals. What am I gonna do? I know, I'll put them all in one place so I can keep an eye on them. And we go there on holiday.

SPEAKER_00 3:46

Maybe the Garden of Eden was in Australia because wasn't Eve tempted by the snake?

SPEAKER_07 3:50

She was indeed. Yes, she was. Have I cracked it? Probably.

SPEAKER_00 3:54

Yeah. Let's go.

SPEAKER_07 3:56

You know the you know the um story of the Garden of Eden that comes up in other religions as well.

SPEAKER_00 3:59

I mean, of course it does. Like the Garden of Eden. They're all a copy of each other. We know this. The that landlord game was the original Monopoly.

SPEAKER_07 4:06

It was indeed.

SPEAKER_00 4:06

Heretic, we we know this.

SPEAKER_07 4:08

Yes, great film. Oh, you watched that, didn't you, with me? With you. You watched that with me, yeah. It's good, it's a brilliant film, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 4:13

Anyway, what what it was better than Parasite.

Setting The Theme: Music Media Through Time

SPEAKER_07 4:16

Yes. Um, what are we talking about? What what's the this episode? Because I've already tangented.

SPEAKER_00 4:20

You've already gone off to Australia. Yeah, exactly. Um we're talking about music media today.

SPEAKER_07 4:24

Oh, we are indeed. And the different types of music media all the way through the ages.

SPEAKER_00 4:30

Fantastic news.

SPEAKER_07 4:31

Have you read this script? No. No, of course you haven't.

SPEAKER_00 4:34

Hey, we're recording two episodes that I have written today. This just happens to not be one of them.

SPEAKER_07 4:38

Actually, to be fair as well, one of the episodes that you've written I haven't looked at for a very good reason.

SPEAKER_00 4:42

Dum dum dum dum dum.

SPEAKER_07 4:44

Um, but we'll come on to that when it's that episode.

SPEAKER_00 4:45

Yeah, that would make more logical sense. Let's talk about music media, father.

SPEAKER_07 4:49

Okay, sorry, daughter. Uh so yeah, we're gonna talk today about how the way that we consume music has kind of dramatically changed throughout the ages.

SPEAKER_00 4:59

How we munch it.

SPEAKER_07 5:00

Indeed. And in fact, it's kind of, shall we say, escalated. I don't know if that's the right word. Even in the past kind of 20 years of evolved. Evolved is the better word. That's the better word. You you're proper looking at music.

SPEAKER_00 5:11

I I don't know what's going on with you. I feel like you're just using all the wrong words. I feel like the intelligent one among us today.

SPEAKER_07 5:18

It's because it's Saturday and I'm all out of sync. I'm all out of source.

SPEAKER_00 5:21

I'm only intelligent on Sundays. Saturdays are my day. Let's go.

SPEAKER_07 5:29

So music, music has actually been around since the dawn of time, has it not?

SPEAKER_00 5:34

Yes.

SPEAKER_07 5:34

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 5:35

Can you believe there are people in this world that don't like music?

SPEAKER_06 5:39

No, I don't think that's a thing.

SPEAKER_00 5:40

I don't understand. It must be a mental illness.

SPEAKER_06 5:43

Not to be rude or horrible, but I don't think that's a thing.

SPEAKER_00 5:45

I find it really difficult that people that there are people in this world that don't care to listen to music. Like what do they do when it's quiet?

SPEAKER_07 5:54

Oh well, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 5:55

Do they think?

SPEAKER_07 5:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:57

They think?

SPEAKER_07 5:57

Yeah. I had a conversation again the other day about the whole inner monologue thing.

SPEAKER_00 6:02

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_07 6:02

Yeah, and someone just could not believe that I don't have an inner monologue.

SPEAKER_00 6:05

No, neither do I.

SPEAKER_07 6:06

Yeah, it's just weird. I don't know. Um, so anyway.

SPEAKER_00 6:09

We're in the minority of that though.

SPEAKER_07 6:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:11

Loads of people have just gone, huh?

SPEAKER_07 6:14

Yeah. Like you don't hear voices in your head? No.

Before Recording: Live Music And Player Pianos

SPEAKER_00 6:16

No, that sounds like schizophrenia to me. I just I see pictures.

SPEAKER_07 6:21

It's it's bizarre.

SPEAKER_00 6:22

Any whole movie up here without words.

SPEAKER_07 6:25

Yeah. Um so before like the 19th century, so the 1800s. Sorry, yeah, back on track. Back on track. We basically, there was no way to record music. So you had to go to a live performance to hear any type of music. So And when I say live performance, I don't mean like just a concert. I mean it would be, when I say performance, it could be any arena whatsoever. So it could be around a campfire, it could be in the village, it could be.

SPEAKER_00 6:51

So do you think people would go to say like, I don't know, I can't think of an artist of that time because Mozart. Mozart. Okay, let's go with Mozart then. Yeah. You go to a Mozart concert, do you think people in the next day were just like, you know, when you like relive your like festival moments and the next day they're like, hmm? Yeah, I think they did. Like Fur Elise cracking it out in the morning, like Waitan's fifth. Just cracking it out in the morning, like whilst whilst they're recovering from their cocaine high. Fur Elise. Do you think they hum it to each other?

SPEAKER_07 7:27

Actually, did you see uh did I share that with you on Facebook the other day? The uh could be anything. Yeah, they were talking about cocaine, about the uh Coca-Cola when it was when it was first made and contained cocaine and morphine and caffeine and all that.

SPEAKER_00 7:40

Sounds like the best drink ever. Exactly. What a cocktail.

SPEAKER_07 7:43

Yeah, people got a lot of shit done.

SPEAKER_00 7:44

Yeah, I bet they did. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 7:46

Um, anyway, back to music.

SPEAKER_00 7:49

Why do we keep her off on tangent? This is like tangent episodes.

SPEAKER_07 7:51

It's because it's Saturday.

SPEAKER_00 7:52

It's also the first episode of the day. We're not quite warmed up.

SPEAKER_07 7:55

We're not at all. We're really not. But yeah, before so before in the 19th century, there was there was no recorded music or no recorded sound. There was there was no way to do it. You couldn't do it. I mean, there was there was nothing, so you had to go to a live performance of sorts or listen to music live. So there's no production, everything was done completely live. Um I suppose the only way that you could kind of distribute any type of music would be through sheet music.

SPEAKER_00 8:22

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 8:24

You know.

SPEAKER_00 8:24

I know, I know, I can't remember what time we might come on to this. In fact, I think we are. Um the the where they punch the hole in the bit of paper, and then that paper feeds through a machine.

SPEAKER_07 8:35

Oh, like the piano.

SPEAKER_00 8:36

Yeah. Like the piano.

SPEAKER_07 8:37

I suppose you could you could argue that was the earliest form.

SPEAKER_00 8:40

Form, but that's what I'm thinking. Like it was the whole punch, it it was like pre I don't know if pre-recorded is the right phrasing, but pre- Designed. Created.

SPEAKER_07 8:51

Yeah, pre-created, yeah. Music, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:54

Yeah, you're that's the only thing I can think of.

SPEAKER_07 8:56

You're right. So you'd have the piano in the in the room, you'd put the the paper in and it would play and it would automate.

SPEAKER_00 9:02

Yeah, it would automate the keys.

SPEAKER_07 9:04

When you think about it, that's actually a really clever piece of ingenuity, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 9:08

It's a very like that's getting onto like automatron. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 9:14

Fresh cut grass.

SPEAKER_00 9:16

Yes.

SPEAKER_07 9:16

Critical role.

SPEAKER_00 9:17

Right. Okay.

SPEAKER_07 9:18

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 9:19

Um the my experience of that, by the way, that that mechanism is um Mitchell and I went to Alton Towers when the stargazing pods were first opened for the first time. Oh yeah. We went in, I think it was either it was either end of the season or start of the season. I can't remember which way around it was. And there was this, so we were staying in the stargazing pods, and there was like this basically this TP entertainment tent. Yeah. And we went in there and there was a guy with his guitar, like, you know, obviously doing an act of some sort, doing covers basically at Alton Towers.

SPEAKER_02 9:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:48

And um, inside the tent before he played during his intermission and then after, this piano would play by itself.

SPEAKER_07 9:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:54

And I was like, how does that work? And it was see-through, and you could see the paper inside.

SPEAKER_07 9:58

It was so cool. I think the first time I saw one of those was probably like in a haunted house.

SPEAKER_00 10:02

Yeah. You know, because they would, you know, then the I imagine the guy that created that was like, you know, what's a really good use case for this? Let's f people up. Like let's let's let's make them feel like that that piano is playing by itself.

SPEAKER_07 10:14

Let's scare the shit out of them.

SPEAKER_00 10:15

Yeah, I wonder if that was his like use case for that. I bet it wasn't. People are gonna use this too. Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_07 10:23

But you only think about how that works. So you've got to get the spacing exactly right, as well as the actual so that must have been a laborious task.

SPEAKER_00 10:31

Well, no, because sheet music is the same thing, is it not? With the the brakes, the stressors, the beats, the bars. It's the same principle, except you're instead of laying it out uh left to right, you're laying it up to down.

SPEAKER_07 10:43

Yeah, yeah, no, yeah, you're right. You're right. So no. And I suppose you could even mass produce it as well, couldn't you?

SPEAKER_00 10:48

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_07 10:49

So you just put it on like on a like some kind of press. I mean, I don't know if this is how it worked, but you put it on like a press and it jump all the little holes through.

SPEAKER_00 10:55

Yeah, you could do several bits of paper at once.

SPEAKER_07 10:58

Yeah, and almost like a guillotine.

SPEAKER_00 11:02

C sharp.

SPEAKER_07 11:03

B sharp.

SPEAKER_00 11:04

Doesn't exist.

SPEAKER_07 11:05

No, it doesn't.

SPEAKER_00 11:06

Neither does E flat.

SPEAKER_07 11:07

No, it doesn't. Or F flat. No, F sharp. E sharp. E sharp doesn't exist.

SPEAKER_00 11:11

You can't have E sharp and E flat.

SPEAKER_07 11:12

No, E sharp doesn't. There's no E flat. There's no there's no thing between E and F and B and C.

SPEAKER_00 11:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 11:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:18

B sharp, so there's no C flat?

SPEAKER_07 11:20

Well, theoretically, E sharp is F. I mean it's Oh yeah, yeah. Yeah, theoretically, yeah. But in the early 1900s, there was a man by the name of Thomas Edison. Never heard of him? Never heard of Thomas Edison?

SPEAKER_00 11:34

No, never. Not once. Not once has he ever come up in conversation.

SPEAKER_07 11:37

Really?

SPEAKER_00 11:38

Yeah, really.

SPEAKER_07 11:39

You've heard of Thomas Edison. Oh no, oh Hannah.

SPEAKER_00 11:46

Did you seriously think I'd never heard of Thomas Edison?

SPEAKER_07 11:51

I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 11:52

You don't know? I feel like that is a poorer reflection on me than it is you.

SPEAKER_07 11:58

Yeah, it really is. And that was in 1871.

SPEAKER_00 12:01

I know. What? I am shocked that you don't realise that I know who Thomas Edison is.

unknown 12:13

Okay.

Edison, Gramophones, And Shellac Records

SPEAKER_00 12:14

It's a weird Saturday for you, isn't it? It really is. This is a weird time for you.

SPEAKER_07 12:18

It really is weird. It's Saturday morning. This is very strange. So yeah, so Thomas Edison in 1877, he invented the phonograph, which could both record and play back sound on tin foil cylinders.

SPEAKER_00 12:31

Yes. So instead of paper, they had the tin foil cylinders instead that had the markers in them. So it was just a rolling. But I imagine the longer the song, the the larger the tin reel. Yeah it would have to be. I don't know what the the coil or I don't know what the word is.

SPEAKER_07 12:48

So yeah, so it's it's like uh it's it's like uh uh the the next lesson. Oh yeah, he's very good. He's very clever that bloke.

SPEAKER_06 12:56

Very, very clever.

SPEAKER_07 12:57

Yeah. And then uh ten years later, there was a guy by the name well oh I say it's a guy, I don't know if it's male or female, Emile Belina developed the gramophone. Remember the gramophone? Uh I don't No, but you've seen pictures of the game.

SPEAKER_00 13:10

Oh yeah, I know what a gramophone looks like. Again, something that I that I'm aware of in this world that apparently you don't realise that I'm aware of.

SPEAKER_07 13:18

Do you remember the old HMV? The dog with the gramophone. Yeah, yeah. Do you remember that?

SPEAKER_00 13:22

The old HMV. I think that's I'm pretty certain that's still its logo.

SPEAKER_07 13:25

No, I mean as in I don't is HMV still going.

SPEAKER_00 13:28

Yeah, but in a one-way or thought, isn't it? Yeah, do you know what HMV stands for? Home movie. Nope. Home Nope. Mmm. Hire Hermit.

SPEAKER_07 13:40

Oh no.

SPEAKER_00 13:41

Her no wrong gender. Harriet Wrong gender.

SPEAKER_07 13:50

You went her, wrong gender.

SPEAKER_00 13:51

Hermione.

SPEAKER_07 13:52

No, switch the other the other gender. Instead of her.

SPEAKER_00 13:56

His his music. No.

SPEAKER_07 14:01

His master's voice.

SPEAKER_00 14:02

Oh.

SPEAKER_07 14:02

Yeah, his master's voice. Because of the dog.

SPEAKER_00 14:04

Oh the dog. I get it.

SPEAKER_07 14:06

Yeah, the dog. Yeah. So create so that was uh 1887, developed the gramophone using flat shellac records. So it's early. It's early vinyl. Early vinyl.

SPEAKER_00 14:21

Shellac sounds like a type of car.

SPEAKER_07 14:23

Yeah. I read that and I thought it said Cadillac. I read that and I thought it said Shellay for some reason.

SPEAKER_00 14:28

There's no eye in there.

SPEAKER_07 14:30

No.

SPEAKER_00 14:30

Shellac.

SPEAKER_07 14:31

Shellac.

SPEAKER_00 14:32

I feel like I've heard of Shellac Records. Shellac.

SPEAKER_07 14:35

That sounds like a really cool um what's the name?

SPEAKER_00 14:38

It sounds like a car, like Cadillac, but Shellac.

SPEAKER_07 14:40

No, Shellac Records sounds like a good kind of like a record company.

SPEAKER_00 14:44

It probably is. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 14:46

Yeah. And that meant that people could then listen to music without live performances.

SPEAKER_00 14:52

They could buy the stuff like that. What time to be alive.

SPEAKER_07 14:54

I know, so that that's as late as 1877.

SPEAKER_00 14:58

1877.

SPEAKER_07 15:00

So there's only 150 years ago.

SPEAKER_00 15:02

1887.

SPEAKER_07 15:03

1887, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:04

Yeah.

Radio Arrives And Vinyl Matures

SPEAKER_07 15:05

Only 150 years. So it's only been in the last 150 years that we've been able to listen to music without a live performance, like recorded music. It's not that long when you think about how long humans have been alive. Homans. Humans have been alive. And then it was like that until the 1920s.

SPEAKER_00 15:25

Whoa. We're not even in your time yet.

SPEAKER_07 15:28

We're not even close to my time yet.

SPEAKER_00 15:30

Well, we're getting there.

SPEAKER_07 15:30

Yeah, okay. So in the 1920s, we yeah, there was commercial radio broadcasts free music to the masses.

SPEAKER_00 15:37

Yay!

SPEAKER_07 15:38

So you would listen to listen to the the wireless.

SPEAKER_00 15:42

Early days Spotify.

SPEAKER_07 15:43

Early days Spotify, yeah. Early days. Except you couldn't skip and put it on.

SPEAKER_00 15:47

Or non did it. Oh, did they have adverts? They might have had adverts. I was about to say, oh they didn't have adverts, but actually they probably did like local ones. Like shoeshine. I don't know. It feels like a thing that they would have at that time. Shoe shine. Shoeshine. Shoeshine. I don't know. Things, yes.

SPEAKER_07 16:02

Yeah. So the the then between the period of the 1920s to the 1950s, that's when vinyl was then created.

SPEAKER_01 16:09

Yes.

SPEAKER_07 16:10

So vinyl records, LPs and 45s. You know L LP stands for long play. Uh EP stands for extended play. Yes, and then singles. Um and it was Columbia and RCA Records who uh introduced those.

SPEAKER_00 16:24

Dum bum bum bada bum bump bump.

SPEAKER_07 16:27

What that also did was improve the sound quality.

SPEAKER_00 16:30

Bam! And people say there is no uh better sound quality than vinyl. Yeah, I I mean hard disagree myself, but I mmm is people like that sound of the Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 16:43

It is it it the sound of vinyl is quite nostalgic, but obviously knowing a little bit about sound production and how the sound it's yeah it's not great. It's yeah. Um but jukeboxes were invented then as well.

SPEAKER_00 16:57

Oh yes. I wonder how many coins it was to play in a jukebox compared to nowaday coinage. Shall I find out?

SPEAKER_07 17:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:05

Carry on.

SPEAKER_07 17:06

Okay, so I remember did did did you have a vi um no? I don't think we ever had a record player when you were alive.

SPEAKER_00 17:15

When I was alive. Um no, I I have I have never owned a record player family. The only person that I know had a record player was my grandmother.

SPEAKER_06 17:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:25

But that's not not mum's mum, dad's mum. To play one song on the first jukebox, it cost one nickel, which is a five cent coin. Oh, there you go. Five cents. Five cents. What is it now like? I think in Ed's Easy Diner it's 20 Ps.

SPEAKER_07 17:39

Ed's Easy Diner.

SPEAKER_00 17:40

Yeah, they had they had sorry, let me explain. Ed's Easy Diner, they used to have uh small jukeboxes on the tables.

SPEAKER_01 17:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:46

I don't think they had any purpose or function, but they played the music on the intercom. So yeah. Yeah. But they're 20p.

SPEAKER_07 17:54

Oh god, we used to.

SPEAKER_00 17:55

Inflation, am I right?

SPEAKER_07 17:56

When I was when I was a kid, we used to have uh so we'd have like the high-fied towers things. So you'd have a record player on the top, yeah, and then you would have you'd have an amp, uh, tape deck, sometimes two tape decks. Uh then you'd have the equalizer as well with the you could do the manual equalizer with the EQ. Um travel based. Yeah, all and the and radio would be that and all be massive, great big thing in the cabinet.

SPEAKER_00 18:20

But the record player You definitely had one of well, I don't know about the record player on top part, but I do remember a long unit of things.

SPEAKER_07 18:27

You could you could buy them in separates, like separate ones and build and build your own, as yeah, sack them and build your own, or you bought them as uh bought them as one.

SPEAKER_02 18:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 18:34

Um, but I remember the the record player. I mean, that's the other thing as well. The record players that you buy now, I mean, they seem really flimsy and really, really rubbish. But obviously, when I was DJing and I had my uh Technics 1210s, I mean, that was a solid direct drive turntable because you just get you get belt drives and direct drives.

SPEAKER_00 18:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_07 18:53

So direct drives, the difference between direct drive and a belt drive is a direct drive will because you've got 45 and 33 and a third RPM revolutions per minute of the of the of the vinyl. So if it was a single, a small one, you'd play at 45. Right. If it was uh an album or an LP, it would play at 33 and a third.

SPEAKER_00 19:13

So small.

SPEAKER_07 19:15

Now a direct drive meant as soon as you turned it on, it would start at that speed.

SPEAKER_00 19:21

Right, okay.

SPEAKER_07 19:22

It was like straight in at 45 or 33 and a third.

SPEAKER_00 19:25

Right.

SPEAKER_07 19:25

Now, if you had a belt drive, which new marks were, and I did have a belt drive at one point, they went and wound up to that speed. Oh so when you were DJing, I mean direct drives were like you would you would hold you'd beat match, yeah, and then you would just let go, and you know it would be in that in that that same speed. But with a belt drive, you couldn't so of course it immediately went out of time straight away. So you used to do what so what you would do, and that's when you'd have your headphones and you'd do it, and then you'd be listening to that, and you'd then old star like Yeah, I get you. Yeah, but what I used to do is I used to give it a little push. It never worked, but you know, it's just just trying to have it. Just out of having, just give it a little push. But yeah, that was the the old the old vinyl. I mean, I love I mean I love mixing on vinyl. Love mixing on vinyl. But I remember when I was a kid as well, when we would have the singles, like the 45s, some of them would have a bigger hole in the middle, and you just have a plastic insert to put in the middle of the actual 45 to actually go onto the and you pop it out and use it on another one and another one. But because you know in jukeboxes you've got the bigger section in the middle. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, so it's like that.

SPEAKER_00 20:42

Oh, I see, it was like a converter.

SPEAKER_07 20:44

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. But yeah, you never really kind of grew up with vinyl, did you?

SPEAKER_00 20:49

No, not really. It was it was before my time. Yeah. I i it uh vinyls had well and truly passed bad time because the the first thing I re ever remember playing music on was a tape.

SPEAKER_07 20:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:59

Yeah. Tape in the car. And even then, even having a tape in the car, I was definitely more CD revolution than I was tape. Tape was again towards the start of my childhood as opposed to the end. So yeah, CDs was my like the first media music media I ever bought was a CD.

SPEAKER_07 21:17

I mean there really is something about going into a music shop and buying a big album. You know, it's just I just remember you go to Andy's Records in Lincoln. It was Andy's Records in Lincoln, and you I I remember going in there and buying They Might Be Giants. You know, Flood on vinyl.

SPEAKER_03 21:34

I'm your only friend, I'm not your only friend, but I'm a little glowing friend, but really I'm not actually your friend, but I am. Is that song? No.

SPEAKER_00 21:42

Scandalous. I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_03 21:47

Make a little birdhouse in your soul. Say, I'm the only being you have it. Put a little bird house in your soul while you're at it. Leave the night light on and find the birdhouse in your soul.

Cassettes, Mixtapes, And Portability

SPEAKER_00 21:59

I do know that.

SPEAKER_07 22:00

Yeah. Oh yeah, I remember going and being really excited because the new They Might Be Giants help them come out. I remember walking out of Andy's records with a big carrier bag with the I bet you used to line up and cue for that shit.

SPEAKER_00 22:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 22:11

And you used to go in and like pick the records and then go and play them in the in there, there'd be record players in there as well that you could play.

SPEAKER_00 22:17

Do you know what Mitchell and I did this week? We waited for something to land on Spotify.

SPEAKER_07 22:21

Oh, was it the there was some that was something who just released a new album?

SPEAKER_00 22:26

I mean, for us it was Fickle Friends, and I don't think you know who they are. Uh huge fans. Um but yeah, like we we didn't have to go to a store or anything, we didn't the comfort of our own home. We just briskly on our phone.

SPEAKER_07 22:40

Well, because where I lived in Sleaford, we didn't have a record shop.

SPEAKER_00 22:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 22:43

So I literally had to get on a train to Lincoln to get it. So that was yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:49

Dedication.

SPEAKER_07 22:50

Yeah, I used to love I used to love record shop. Just go in the shop and just file through all the the vinyls. Just something. I think that's what it is. I think it's just that nostalgic kind of the flipping through. Yeah, I would like a record player, actually.

SPEAKER_00 23:02

Yeah?

SPEAKER_07 23:02

I would like one, but I don't think like I say, I just don't like the I wouldn't like to buy you one because I wouldn't know what's good quality. No, I mean if I was to get one, I would get like a a decent techniques.

SPEAKER_00 23:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 23:13

Yeah, technically I mean, but they gotta go for a thousand pounds each, they do, I think at the moment.

SPEAKER_00 23:17

So not in my budget.

SPEAKER_07 23:18

No. Um so moving on from vinyl.

SPEAKER_00 23:21

Let's go to tape.

SPEAKER_07 23:22

We then had tapes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:24

It it it's crazy to me that tapes it says the tape revolution was the 1950s to the 1970s.

SPEAKER_07 23:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:30

But I still remember tapes in the nineties.

SPEAKER_07 23:32

That was when tapes were kind of started first coming out. I mean, you think the vinyl, it says there's 1920s, nineteen fifties, but vinyl was still around in the nineties.

SPEAKER_00 23:40

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 23:41

You know, same with tape. I mean, at one point there was you could get it on vinyl, tape, and probably yeah, you get you could have all three. And some some things I did actually have in all three mediums.

SPEAKER_02 23:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 23:54

Like the levelers albums, I had the vinyl, I had the tape, and then later on I bought the C D as well.

SPEAKER_00 24:00

Why?

SPEAKER_07 24:01

Yeah, exactly. And now I yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:02

And now you have it on Spotify.

SPEAKER_07 24:03

Now I have it on Spotify, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:05

And you like songs.

SPEAKER_07 24:05

Yeah. But the thing, oh, the thing is about tapes. Well, I think about pencil and the pencil. Pencil, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:12

Yeah, yeah. I remember they were really easy to f up. Oh, they they're just out of all of the mediums, compared to even vinyl, I guess vinyl, they were like, let's try and make something smaller and compact. I kind of get where they were going with. But I like how they went back to kind of that disc shape.

SPEAKER_01 24:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:30

Because they went for the tape and they were like, ah, yes, we have we have made an error here. These are awful.

SPEAKER_07 24:35

Well, we used to have I mean I I never used to have them, but there were there were things called eight tracks as well. And they were they were like these cartridges that you would slot into the top of a machine.

SPEAKER_00 24:46

Oh yeah, they they that doesn't ring a bell to me at all.

SPEAKER_07 24:49

Um my grandmother had eight tracks.

SPEAKER_00 24:51

And I assume it contained only eight tracks. Yeah, so not a full album then.

SPEAKER_07 24:57

Oh Frank's and Archer. Oh, I see, I see. Um yeah, so but yeah, the the pencil in the in the tapes. Yeah, I remember I remember doing that as a kid.

SPEAKER_00 25:06

My karaoke machine growing up. Do you remember Bird's Cottage?

SPEAKER_06 25:10

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:11

I had a karaoke machine, that was tapes. I think it was tape in the bottom, maybe CD on top.

SPEAKER_07 25:17

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 25:17

I seem to recall that, but the karaoke actual thing was a couple of things.

SPEAKER_07 25:20

Yeah, yeah, it was. Yeah, it was, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:22

And it had uh a microphone with it, maybe two microphones with it. Yeah, that was cool. Yeah, so cassette tapes. Yeah, that my first car had a cassette tape, even my first car had it was an X-reg.

SPEAKER_07 25:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:34

At Peugeot 106.

SPEAKER_07 25:35

Yeah. But they did use they and I remember as well, because you would um because how you would how they would be able to record because you used to buy blank tapes as well. And we did that. I mean, that's the first kind of form of pirating.

SPEAKER_00 25:46

Yeah, because I seem to remember like uh Uncle Terry specifically owning, like he used to record like the top what, 40 or top 100 hits or whatever.

SPEAKER_07 25:55

We do that on the radio on a Sunday.

SPEAKER_00 25:56

Yeah, so what's cool about that is you get to hear all of the old adverts as well. It's really cool. But yeah, something that is just kind of lost on the younger generation.

SPEAKER_07 26:05

And we used to make mixtapes as well.

SPEAKER_00 26:07

Oh, I made mixed CDs, not mixed tapes, but mixed CDs for sure for the car again. Um when I went from my Peugeot to my KA. That was when the CD changer thing came in, and I was like, I'm gonna make myself some like so I had a rock mix and I had a rather than having a playlist, it was like rock mix of like 15 songs. And yeah, I remember burning your CDs on the um I still got a load of CDs, like blank CDs. Yeah, I I found a load of mine the other day actually as well.

SPEAKER_07 26:35

But on the tapes, you used to have in the top, and on the top of the tape, there was like these these little flaps and you used to break them. When you break the flaps, it means you couldn't then record over them. Yes. But what you could do was use cellar tape. Yes. Cellar tape over the top to record to re-record over them. But I yeah, I remember if you were really lucky.

SPEAKER_00 26:56

Once it's been burned, you can't, can you?

SPEAKER_07 26:57

No, see there are one trick poney. There were rewritable CDs. Oh, there were rewritable CDs. There were rewritable ones. Damn.

SPEAKER_00 27:04

Um but they were more expensive. I can't remember that being a thing.

Walkman To CD: The Digital Door Opens

SPEAKER_07 27:07

Yeah, I think so. But the I remember the tapes. If you I mean if you had like on your on your hi-fi system, you had two tape decks, you could put one tape in one and then play that tape and record. So you that would be pirate, you know, essentially.

SPEAKER_00 27:19

Yeah, that's you yeah, copying the tape.

SPEAKER_07 27:23

I remember doing that.

SPEAKER_00 27:24

Um I bet you old pirate, you.

SPEAKER_07 27:27

Yeah. Uh so we went from tapes to then the digital age, which was in the like the let's go on to tapes, because have we not been talking about tapes? But keep go back to tapes because when you think about vinyl, yeah, vinyl, you're stationary, aren't you? You're in the room, you can't move around listening to vinyl.

SPEAKER_00 27:49

Yes, I see where you're going with this. Yes, yes, yes, yes.

SPEAKER_07 27:52

But the tapes, what happened with tapes when they came out?

SPEAKER_00 27:54

Oh, portable.

SPEAKER_07 27:55

I know, portable. So you used to have you can have ghetto blasters in the like in the 80s. The old boom boxes. The old boom boxes with guys people cycling around. Yeah. And then you'd um I remember break dancing in the you know, the breakdancing case in the 80s.

SPEAKER_02 28:08

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 28:08

And you'd have like a boom box. How freaking cool is it? And then everyone would be dancing around the round around the ghetto.

SPEAKER_00 28:14

Well, I wouldn't give just five minutes just to watch one of that.

SPEAKER_07 28:17

It's called ghetto blasters.

SPEAKER_00 28:19

Ghetto blasters. In fact, what Why was it called a ghetto blaster?

SPEAKER_07 28:23

Well, I I do know actually, when thinking about it, it's actually Is it the connotations of being in the in the ghetto?

SPEAKER_00 28:29

In the hood, in the ghetto?

SPEAKER_07 28:30

Yeah, I think that's what it was. But I think one of my favourite um one of my favourite 80s films, uh a film called Say Anything.

SPEAKER_00 28:37

It's just a slang term for a portable stereo system, yeah. That's where it came from. Um Boom Box.

SPEAKER_07 28:43

Yeah. But I remember one of my one of my favourite films of the 80s was a film called Say Anything with John Cusack.

SPEAKER_00 28:49

Is it the one with the outside of the window? That's exactly it.

SPEAKER_07 28:52

That's a really fun and that is one of my favourite scenes where he's just standing outside of the window playing like playing with the playing with the boom box.

SPEAKER_00 28:58

The ghetto blaster, the term emerged because of the boom box's popularity in urban communities.

SPEAKER_07 29:02

Yeah, there you go. Yeah, there you go. But then moving on from the ghetto blasters and the boom box, we then had the Walkman.

SPEAKER_00 29:09

Of course, yes.

SPEAKER_07 29:10

Yeah, the Sony Walkman. Yeah, and you could clip onto your belt, and you'd have the little orange first iPod headphones. Essentially, yeah. It's the first iPod. Yeah, and it was the it was the first way you could actually move around listening to uh to music. That's crazy. I remember Walkman. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:26

I don't know if I don't think I had a Walkman, but I do remember either I owned it or my cousins owned the CD, the portable CD player.

SPEAKER_07 29:35

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:36

It was obviously it was round like a CD player, like a disc, and you could have your headphones in and walk around the house with that.

SPEAKER_07 29:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 29:43

But yeah, then in 1982 it was, 1982 was the we call this the dawn of the digital age.

SPEAKER_00 29:51

The dawn of dawn.

SPEAKER_07 29:52

And it was C D's.

SPEAKER_00 29:54

C D's eighty two.

SPEAKER_07 29:56

I remember, and I think it might have been Saturday Superstore. With Philip Schofield and Sarah Green. Um that long ago. Canceled Culture. Yeah, kids kids programme. And I remember that when the CD was first coming out, um, or it might one might might have even been Tomorrow's World. No, I think it was Saturday Superstore. But they they spread jam on the CD. Right, because the whole point of the CD was because tapes got ruined and they said CDs were indestructible. And they wiped it off and then played it. And then played it. Actually, before CDs, there was the laserdisc. I'm just remembering.

SPEAKER_00 30:34

Yeah, I don't I I think laser discs were around such a short period of time that I never saw them.

SPEAKER_07 30:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:39

I don't ever remember laser discs being a thing.

SPEAKER_07 30:41

No, I mean I I never knew anybody who had one.

SPEAKER_00 30:44

Were they just uh were they only in like commercial settings as opposed to domestic?

SPEAKER_07 30:48

But they were in domestic, but they yeah, they're just like basically like 3D TVs, they just stayed around for about a year and a bit of a fad.

SPEAKER_00 30:54

A fad, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 30:55

Bit of a fad, a bit of a fad. Like the like the beta Betamax versus VHS.

SPEAKER_00 31:00

Well, yeah, but we read we know that the VHS was way more popular because of the porn industry. So I'm wondering if CD's in a similar situation.

SPEAKER_07 31:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:08

Well it kind of well, yeah, yeah. Not porn specifically, I just mean like, yeah, it was just easier to mass produce.

SPEAKER_07 31:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:15

Cheaper to mass produce.

SPEAKER_07 31:17

But they were yeah, they were they were better quality, they were more durable, and they were I mean they weren't indestructible, but they were they were hardier than what tapes were.

SPEAKER_00 31:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 31:26

So people did move. And then I remember you could be and also I think as well, they looked better because they were like mini vinyls.

SPEAKER_00 31:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 31:33

So it was like a safe space or like a save a space saver.

SPEAKER_00 31:37

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 31:38

And I remember you used to walk in like see people would have racks and racks with CDs.

unknown 31:44

Damn.

SPEAKER_07 31:44

And you get different types of racks. So you'd have like um almost like uh like a bookshelf with CDs in. But then you had these racks as well where you would slot them in.

SPEAKER_00 31:54

I remember we had the spot you want, didn't we? Yeah, I remember that.

SPEAKER_07 31:58

Yeah. So that was yeah, and I suppose that's when but you kind of you had CDs, didn't you?

SPEAKER_00 32:04

I had CDs, yeah. They were the first media I bought, but I to think of I mean, I think people would uh people do display their vinyls and see and uh vinyls now more so in modern day as as more of a wow, like I don't know, more of a what's it called, a decor piece.

SPEAKER_01 32:21

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:23

I guess CDs back in the day they took up so much room, DVDs took up so much room, but it but it was almost a feature, like you had a C D uh uh column or whatever because that was the decor at the time, like that was a part of the the look of the house.

SPEAKER_07 32:40

It also showed off because we've showed off what you got, I suppose. Yeah, and all we mentioned this before in another podcast, like where music is part of an identity.

SPEAKER_00 32:47

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 32:48

So it did, it's like you were and it was almost like showing your musical tastes and your musical identity by your CD collection.

SPEAKER_00 32:54

See, I wouldn't look any I wouldn't I wouldn't let anyone look at my like songs. I've I've I've just got so much of a mix in there.

SPEAKER_07 33:01

Yeah, but you would judge that yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 33:06

Um and then of course MP3.

SPEAKER_07 33:09

Yeah, I mean MP3 was 1993.

SPEAKER_00 33:12

We owned a couple of MP3 players growing up.

SPEAKER_07 33:15

Yes, we did.

SPEAKER_00 33:16

Mum recorded my seven times table on an MP3 that she had so that I could learn my times tables.

SPEAKER_07 33:21

I mean MP3 is still a thing. It's still a little format.

SPEAKER_00 33:25

Well well, we tend to use MP4 now, don't we?

SPEAKER_07 33:26

Yeah, well uh no, MP4's video as well.

SPEAKER_00 33:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 33:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:30

I mean this yeah, I was gonna say the podcast is filmed an MP4.

SPEAKER_07 33:34

Yeah, well the sound.

SPEAKER_00 33:35

But the sound is MP3?

SPEAKER_07 33:36

No, these are WAV files.

SPEAKER_00 33:39

Wow.

SPEAKER_07 33:39

Better qual better quality vibe. So I can exactly so I can export as an MP3, but I don't export it as a WAV file. Yeah. Nice. So they were much smaller. I'm I remember, yeah, so that was 1993, the M first MP3s came out. And again, I remember that's still not alive yet. Yeah. I had a couple of I knew a couple of people who would like make a real big point about, oh look, I've got an MP3 player.

SPEAKER_00 34:06

Really? Yeah, it was like oh I've got what I remember the first iPod you ever got was when you got made redundant from Warworths. Oh. And it was that little one that had a built-in, this sounds so crazy to think about, had a built-in USB.

SPEAKER_07 34:18

It did, you just plug it into the PC.

SPEAKER_00 34:20

Take off the bottom end of it.

SPEAKER_07 34:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 34:22

But how I think I think, and I'm this is a memory thing. I think it was 128 28 megabytes.

SPEAKER_07 34:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 34:30

A megabyte.

SPEAKER_07 34:31

I don't think it was that much. I think it was like 32.

SPEAKER_00 34:34

No, I think uh first iPod? I I don't really know.

SPEAKER_07 34:40

But yeah, then because then after because the MP3 players kind of got went by the wayside because of the iPod.

SPEAKER_00 34:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 34:47

It was the iPod that took over. I did have an iPod, I've still got an iPod classic somewhere.

SPEAKER_00 34:52

I know you oh found it. I found it. Oh god, can you remember what this was the one?

SPEAKER_07 34:56

That is the one.

SPEAKER_00 34:57

Um I mean that one specifically is uh one gigabyte, but yours definitely wasn't. Yours was uh yours was much lower. I think it's 128 meg.

SPEAKER_07 35:05

I think it was, yeah. Damn. Can you remember what happened to you?

SPEAKER_00 35:10

I do. Do you know what? I've not thought about that in years, and that just came into my head as well. I bought an iPod, or thought I was buying an iPod off eBay, and that was when eBay was kind of first a thing, I think, you know, uh buying and selling on basically um a massive um auction site, essentially that's what you're still around today, obviously. But yeah, I bought my first I remember like saving up all my money and wanted to get this particular iPod, and I remember this iPod's colour was really appealing to me. It was like a it was kind of a burgundy actually, which is really not what I'm wearing today. It was like a burgundy colour, and I thought I thought that was so pretty. Um iPod didn't do a burgundy colour iPod because this wasn't an iPod, it was a it was a counterfeit iPod that basically was just a glorified radio inside an iPod casing. Yeah. And I got scammed.

SPEAKER_07 35:59

You did. You were so upset about it.

SPEAKER_00 36:01

I was because I was I felt like you feel quite violated when you're scammed like that. And I was just a kid, and I got I mean I got all my money back, but it was just like the heartbreak of I've I've messed up. I've done so much. I was, I was. I was so excited. And then I got for anyone that's like iPod nerd, I then got the purple chromatic one after the. You did, didn't you? Yeah, yeah. And then when that died, I had the green one.

SPEAKER_03 36:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:26

Chromatic one, and then I got the tiny little shuffle. I never was an iPod touch gal. Yes. Never had a touch. I always had, I was very much focused on my iPod was for music and music only. Yeah. I was very in that vein. But the oh, the chromatic had the oh, the clock face where you could, mmm, oh that that's so good. Sometimes it didn't work and it was actually really shit, but it was oh, what a time to be alive.

SPEAKER_07 36:53

But then when you think like, you know, like iPods, so the iPod classic that I had, I had my entire, it was that big. I had my entire music library on there.

SPEAKER_00 37:02

How many gigabytes was that?

SPEAKER_07 37:04

Something ridiculous like 160, I think it was. I mean, I mean it doesn't sound that ridiculous now, but do you put put in the iPod Classic? It's still at home somewhere.

SPEAKER_00 37:13

Classic iPod.

SPEAKER_07 37:14

Um should sell it really, because that's probably worth a bit of money.

SPEAKER_00 37:17

It might have been 160 gigabyte.

Napster Shock And The iTunes Pivot

SPEAKER_07 37:19

Yeah. It was the big one that I had.

SPEAKER_00 37:20

Yeah, it was 160 gigabyte by the looks of it.

SPEAKER_07 37:23

That's the And I remember just downloading all the tracks and putting them on there.

SPEAKER_00 37:27

Yeah, there was everything. That was like the family iPod. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 37:30

That was it had everything on there. We could put playlists on there and also But to be honest, what did we use it for?

SPEAKER_00 37:36

Who actually listened on it? For what though? Where like around the house? Like how did you did you ever plug it into the car or was that before the car? No, I just put it on Because in the car it used to be like orcs to orcs. Yeah. And then Oh yeah, no, it did just plug it in the car. Did you? I don't remember that. Yeah. I don't remember. Yeah. But you must have done. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 37:55

So I had and then so then really, I mean it then it was pretty soon after that that the iPod then itself became obsolete.

SPEAKER_00 38:03

Yeah. Because of the introduction of So iTunes, iTunes yeah, legal digital downloads 100 uh 101. 2001.

SPEAKER_07 38:11

Actually, let's go back I was five. Let's go back a couple of years. Ah, okay. And the introduction of the website that completely revolutionized, changed, and also killed the music industry. The music industry, and that was Napster.

SPEAKER_00 38:26

1999.

SPEAKER_07 38:27

Which was file sharing.

SPEAKER_00 38:28

We're now in my time zone.

SPEAKER_07 38:30

Yeah. Yeah, the whole file sharing kind of thing with Napster. I mean, that absolutely destroyed music.

SPEAKER_00 38:37

I mean, that's probably where pirating really took itself off to another level.

SPEAKER_07 38:40

Yeah, that was pirating on a nuclear scale. Yeah. Um, I mean, there was another website called SoulSeek as well, where it was the same thing. And but when you think about it now, you were sharing files with other PCs. So people would dial into your computer and essentially steal your music, and you would allow them.

SPEAKER_00 38:59

It's crazy. Yeah, we we don't allow generally we don't allow people to our computers anymore.

SPEAKER_07 39:05

Yeah, um crazy. So that yeah, and then in 2001, so it's two years later, iTunes were like, Do you know what? This is the way the music industry is going.

SPEAKER_00 39:13

We can make some money out of this.

SPEAKER_07 39:18

Yeah, the digital downs. Yeah, actually, because it wasn't streaming originally, was it? It was downloads.

SPEAKER_00 39:22

No, no, downloads, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 39:23

You would buy the song and then.

SPEAKER_00 39:25

They were like 99p, 89p, 79p, depending on how big they were.

SPEAKER_07 39:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:30

Albums were cheaper than your physical copy. They were like 299, I want to say, something like that. Two to five ninety nine, maybe.

SPEAKER_07 39:37

Our first EP that we released, Wake Up, was you could digitally download that. You didn't stream it, you could you could yeah, you could buy it. So I'm I remember people buying, because that's why we released one of as a single for the 74p, I think it was.

SPEAKER_00 39:52

Yeah, I think it was because it then you could download and then you owned it. That's right. Now on Spotify you you don't you loan it, you st you loan it off Spotify, you you stream it. I mean, yeah, you can save the downloads to your phone, but you can't once you've deleted the app you don't own it. Your downloads are gone.

SPEAKER_07 40:10

Again, it's well, it's like everything, it's all streaming services, isn't it? You don't own any media anymore.

SPEAKER_00 40:15

No.

SPEAKER_07 40:15

I mean, it is literally money for old rope. Yeah. For for the for the companies. Yeah. For the artists, the artists get scammed.

SPEAKER_00 40:23

Yeah, absolutely not. Absolutely scammed. Which is why Taylor Swift famously took all of her stuff off streaming services, you know. She was, you know.

SPEAKER_07 40:30

I mean, I had we had um I actually got an email yesterday from uh emu band saying that my royalties have just come in. Oh, how many pence for this quarter? I I reckon it uh it'll be it will be peanuts. Two P. Because it's 0.01 pence per stream. I mean, sorry.

SPEAKER_00 40:46

Yeah, it's just not good. It's not good.

SPEAKER_07 40:48

And I know we've said this before as well. It's like this, and even like our podcast, we don't make any money from podcasts. No, no, even you would think people streaming this would make us money, but they don't pay podcasters.

SPEAKER_00 40:59

We we get literally nothing for this podcast. Yeah, Spotify, we we if anything, we're out of pocket because we pay for Bud Sprout, we pay for I pay for like my editing, yeah, the software. Yeah.

Streaming Economics And Artist Pay

SPEAKER_07 41:11

Um and Spotify do not pay artists, bearing in mind as well, this is the other thing. So so a mus a a song, don't get me wrong, what goes into making a song is expensive, it is a lot, but it's three minutes three minutes of what of of what people digest. This when we do it 45 minutes, it's and Spotify are selling that to people, and we get nothing.

SPEAKER_00 41:35

Nothing.

SPEAKER_07 41:35

Like, not even a fraction of a pence. No, nothing. Get nothing, absolutely nothing, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:40

Nothing at all.

SPEAKER_07 41:41

I think there needs to be a revolution here.

SPEAKER_00 41:44

Should we start our own service?

SPEAKER_07 41:46

No, no, not start our own service. I think Spotify needs to be held to account and start paying the cre creative people more money.

SPEAKER_00 41:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 41:52

That includes musicians as well. Podcasters, podcasters, wink, wink, nudge, nudge. And also voice actors and audiobooks and there's a lot of audio. Pay them more money.

SPEAKER_00 42:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 42:04

Pay them more money anyway.

SPEAKER_00 42:06

So i tuned with 2001 streaming services. Spotify came in at 2008. Yeah. How old was I in 2008? Do you know?

SPEAKER_07 42:12

Uh nine, ten, twelve?

SPEAKER_00 42:16

Twelve.

SPEAKER_07 42:16

Twelve. I'm not very good with numbers, you know that.

SPEAKER_00 42:20

I was 12 years old when Spotify came into it. I don't remember having Spotify at 12 years old, though. Uh I think I had a Spotify more in my adult life.

SPEAKER_07 42:30

We we had Apple Music to start with, and I think it's because Did we? Yeah, we did. I think it's mainly because I remember that. Because we had everything on Apple anyway because of the iDo.

SPEAKER_00 42:40

Made sense, made sense. Ooh, I had another streaming service, Deezer, before Spotify. So is Deezer still a thing?

SPEAKER_07 42:48

Deezer still a thing. I had a Deezer account as well. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:52

Was that a musician thing?

SPEAKER_07 42:53

It yeah, it was so when you when you DJ, when I was DJing, what started um DJing again not that long ago and when I did my radio show, remember the um live and unsigned radio show that I used to do for unsigned artists? Yes, yeah. Yeah on the I couldn't Spotify wouldn't connect to virtual DJ Deezer was before Spotify 2007. But Deezer did. So I could use the tracks from Deezer for the radio show. But not Spotify. But I couldn't use Spotify because Spotify wouldn't connect. Similar to now with my new decks, which I still haven't had set up, by the way. Bone of contention at the moment.

SPEAKER_00 43:28

Um Domestic.

SPEAKER_07 43:31

Yeah. They so Spotify, if I was to use uh record box for it, Spotify won't connect, but these will and Tidal will as well.

SPEAKER_00 43:39

Mmm interesting.

SPEAKER_07 43:41

But Spotify won't.

SPEAKER_00 43:42

Because Spotify are dicks. They are indeed. They are indeed. Find us on all the streaming platforms.

SPEAKER_07 43:48

Even though you're probably listening to us on Spotify. Do you know what? Honestly, it really just goes to show you, doesn't it, what slaves we are.

SPEAKER_00 43:57

We are, yeah. Yeah. We could make a stand, but we can't, because then we wouldn't be heard.

SPEAKER_07 44:02

Exactly. That's that is the they've got us by the shorten curlies.

SPEAKER_00 44:07

They do have us by the shortened curlies.

SPEAKER_07 44:10

But yeah, then of course your phone, everything goes through the phone now.

SPEAKER_00 44:13

Yeah. You know, you don't have a separate uh thing to play your music on. You can play it on your phone.

SPEAKER_01 44:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:20

Now you can connect a speaker to your phone. So the old days of that ghetto blaster boom box outside the house is now pink. So a little handheld.

SPEAKER_07 44:28

I mean, in our house, we've got the Sonos beam.

SPEAKER_00 44:32

Yes.

SPEAKER_07 44:32

Uh as a basically to for watch the telly as a as a a soundbar. Yeah. Then we've got another Sonos in the kitchen, one upstairs, and I also have a roam. So that was if we were to go outside, we can take it outside as well. Oh, I see. And you just connect it via your phone to any it's like a a click and it's done.

SPEAKER_00 44:50

Our house is powered by Google. We have three. Yeah. It turns on my lights.

SPEAKER_07 44:53

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 44:55

It turns on my music, everything.

SPEAKER_07 44:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 44:58

But also the thing is with streaming services as well, you don't have to go looking for songs.

SPEAKER_00 45:03

No. So I did um they're pretty much handed to you on a platter. They really are.

SPEAKER_07 45:08

I mean, I I put on uh I put on a track the other day, and of course, I wanted to listen to that one track. Then I just left it playing, and then before I knew it, it was like two hours later, and I was like, this is really a really cool playlist.

SPEAKER_00 45:22

Release radar's good. Yeah. Uh Weekly Discovery's good. Um, or Discover Weekly, can't remember what it's called. I like Spotify's playlist that it makes for you.

SPEAKER_07 45:30

Well, the DJ one.

Phones, Smart Speakers, And Algorithmic Playlists

SPEAKER_00 45:32

No, no, no. You can go on and be like it you could type in the word instrumental, because I do this quite a lot. I'll I'll type in instrumental, and then it's like instrumental playlist made for you, and it bases it based on your music taste, but only instrumental tracks. Oh, okay. Spotify's been doing it for years, but yeah, there's loads. So I could put in workout, for example, and it's like workout hits for you, and it and it's made it for you. Um, another one that I like to type in sometimes is cheesy hits, cheesy hits made for you. So it's all like my cheese, not like the global cheese. My cheese. Um, my throwback playlist again is based off of my music taste, etc. etc. So yeah, you can make your own playlist still, but Spotify created ones are pretty good, and then they just chuck in some random ones that you you might like this.

SPEAKER_07 46:15

Uh well, what I was gonna do for your mum and Anya is when I finally do get my deck sorted out, is I was gonna make their running track list. Uh so like a mix do you like a mixtape? Essentially do a mixtape, continuous mute but between the certain BPM of what they want for their um for their running, depending on like if they want a slow run or a quick run to say well.

SPEAKER_00 46:34

Sadly, Spotify can also do that for you as well, because you can put in the BPM and see this is just it's taking away all the creativeness out of it. It's creating all the fun. It's taking all the fun out of it.

SPEAKER_07 46:42

And I'll create them as uh as an MP3 and send it to them. I'm still gonna do that though for them.

SPEAKER_00 46:46

Still do it for them because it's to do with their uh their headwear, isn't it?

SPEAKER_07 46:51

It is exactly, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 46:52

Um So what's in for the future of music media?

SPEAKER_07 46:55

So it's um well, AI. I think AI is gonna be the one thing, isn't it? Actually, yeah, and I Becca came over last night. Right, so Becca was over. Becca also plays DD, yeah, and she is an amazing musician as well. Um she might be oh no, I can't say that. That's a secret. I was gonna say something then and I was like I'll tell you afterwards, I'll tell you afterwards, but that is a massive secret I nearly let out let out then.

SPEAKER_00 47:24

That's okay, we can edit this.

SPEAKER_07 47:26

That's fine. Uh but there is uh she I played her one of those DD AI tracks. Oh yeah. The fireball one, yeah, yeah. And I said, I feel dirty playing you this because this is AI, but I actually really like it.

SPEAKER_00 47:40

Yeah, it is good. It is good. Um you've you've written down here VR concerts and holograms, but that's all that's not a future thing, that's a real life thing now in the sphere.

SPEAKER_07 47:49

ABBBA have already done it, haven't they? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:51

Oh ABBA have already done it, but now there they have performances in the sphere because guess who's in who's got residency next year in the sphere?

SPEAKER_07 47:58

Who?

SPEAKER_00 47:58

No doubt.

SPEAKER_07 47:59

You're joking.

SPEAKER_00 48:00

No.

SPEAKER_07 48:01

Really? Yeah. What the the the full the f the original band?

SPEAKER_00 48:05

I mean, Gwen Stefani is is promoting it at the moment, so presumably? I don't know.

SPEAKER_07 48:11

Really?

SPEAKER_00 48:11

Go go go look it up.

SPEAKER_07 48:13

Oh amazing. Go look it up. Song, end the podcast now.

SPEAKER_00 48:17

Immediately goes to find out, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 48:19

Really?

SPEAKER_04 48:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:20

Um I always keep up with the sphere because obviously because I went to Vegas this was it was this year. It was February this year. Um I always keep up now when I look, I was like, oh, I wonder who's at residency there.

SPEAKER_07 48:30

Oh amaz. I love no doubt. Absolutely love no doubt.

SPEAKER_00 48:33

She has not aged going to find out.

SPEAKER_07 48:34

No, she hasn't. She really hasn't. Um but yeah, uh, what do you want to think about VR? The the first kind of hologram that I know that popped into my head is Gorillas with David Damon Album. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 48:46

Yeah. Is that in key? Yeah, kind of, kinda, kinda. Um I can't do that.

SPEAKER_07 49:00

But I mean you could oh they you could go down a little bit of uh because they have I think they have done this with artists who are no longer with us. Yes, create hologram versions then. So I mean you could essentially go and see go and see Queen in concert, like as a hologram, or Michael Jackson's show, or you know, because we've done the music legends now, haven't we? So it's some of the names that came up in that.

SPEAKER_00 49:25

To be fair, that would be pretty good to see. She was more like beauty queen from a movie scene.

SPEAKER_07 49:31

But it is all gonna be, I think the future is gonna be AI, technology, that kind of thing.

SPEAKER_00 49:36

Especially for the dead ones. I I can kind of understand why it's a thing.

SPEAKER_07 49:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 49:40

For the living, I'd probably rather go see the living.

SPEAKER_06 49:43

Yeah, absolutely. If they're still living. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 49:46

But yeah, um, I'm not against seeing a holographic content.

SPEAKER_07 49:50

No, I'm not against it. I'm not against it, but I do get to experience it again. It it's strange. Again, I I have this argument with myself all the time, and I've mentioned it on this podcast numerous times as well. I am so I so flip between one and the other when I was a big thing.

SPEAKER_00 50:05

I do and I don't though, because I can't help when I was born. Uh Queen was long disbanded before I was born. Oh, yeah, no. So how can I uh how can I experience that experience in a in the same setting if it wasn't a hologram?

SPEAKER_07 50:19

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:20

You know, I I think in that instance, to me, that just feels like I I'm not missing out on a very cultural, yeah, prolific thing. Like LiveAid, Queen Live Aid, for example, is like apparently one of the best concerts of all time, but I will never experience that because I wasn't alive.

SPEAKER_07 50:35

That's not that's not my fault. Yeah, I watch I watched that on telly. Yeah, exactly. 1986, I think that was.

SPEAKER_00 50:42

But you would have seen it live.

SPEAKER_07 50:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:44

I could watch it now, I guess. I could watch the live production, but imagine me being able to experience that almost as lifelike as possible. Like that's pretty that's pretty good.

VR, Holograms, And The AI Future

SPEAKER_07 50:52

The thing is, well, when you say that, when you say about experiencing it, you know it's already happened, so you know what to expect, but when we watched it, we didn't know what to expect, and it was But you say that, but I've only ever watched I think I've only ever watched maybe Bohemian Rhapsody.

SPEAKER_00 51:06

I don't think I've watched the whole set.

SPEAKER_07 51:08

Yeah, I know, but you going into the set knowing that it was such such an amazing set. I guess. You've already got that preconception.

SPEAKER_00 51:14

I guess, yeah, no, I get you, I get your point. I get your point. Whereas you don't see it. Isn't it better to have experience experience it than not experience it at all?

SPEAKER_04 51:23

No, it is better to experience It's just better to have loved than loved than loved to have loved at all.

SPEAKER_00 51:31

Why did you just turn into Mrs. Doubtfire?

SPEAKER_04 51:34

That wasn't Mrs. Doubtfire.

SPEAKER_00 51:35

Hello dears. Hello dears. The people uh people want to get on with their tea. It was the drink that killed him.

SPEAKER_03 51:43

Oh, wasn't he alcoholic?

SPEAKER_00 51:44

No dears hit by Guinness truck. Um it was a drive-by fruiting. Oh god. We should probably end the podcast there so people can get get on with their days. Yes. Um their journey to sleep or journey to work or whatever you however you're listening to this podcast. I don't freaking know how you listen to our podcast. How do you consume us? How do you munch us? We want to know. Um no, we actually do know because we we get the stats of how you listen to us and it is Spotify, so actually on.

SPEAKER_07 52:16

Yeah, actually completely. I just got my phone.

SPEAKER_00 52:18

Father, we're trying to end the podcast episode.

SPEAKER_07 52:20

I know, I just I just thought I would just mention. I thought I would just mention if you're giving stats. I'm gonna give some stats.

SPEAKER_00 52:26

Why? We do that at the end of the year.

SPEAKER_07 52:27

Do we? No, but I just wanted to say how many but do you know 51 countries. 51. 51 countries.

SPEAKER_00 52:35

Well, thank you, 51 countries.

SPEAKER_07 52:36

400 country cities.

SPEAKER_00 52:39

Well You can't upset anyone.

SPEAKER_07 52:40

All countries are cool. Do you see what I did there?

SPEAKER_00 52:43

I do see what you did there.

SPEAKER_07 52:44

I see what I did there.

SPEAKER_00 52:45

Just just what's the what's the first one your eyes land on that you're like, oh, no, obviously. Singapore?

SPEAKER_07 52:52

We are so Singapore's cool. So the top countries are UK, United States, Singapore.

SPEAKER_00 53:00

Singapore's in our top three.

SPEAKER_07 53:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 53:02

Damn. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 53:03

Next one. Ah, the next one. Okay. I do apologize for everything I said about your country at the beginning of the episode. It's Australia.

SPEAKER_05 53:18

Australia is the fourth. Then Brazil, Canada, Paraguay, Ireland.

SPEAKER_00 53:24

So everything in the country wants to kill us, but they we're their only reprieve. And we just sit on them.

SPEAKER_07 53:31

Thank you, Australia. We love you.

SPEAKER_00 53:34

Bye-bye. Thanks for joining us on Bonus Dad Bonus Daughter. Don't forget to follow us on all our socials and share the podcast with someone who'd love it. We are available on all streaming platforms. See you next time. Bye-bye.