Very Audacious
An audacious podcast that dares to interpret faith through culture. Embrace your audacity.
Very Audacious
It's Prime Time!
Sean Tripline and Jalen Baker delve into the budding coaching career of Deion Sanders, his exit from Jackson State University, the early success of the Colorado Buffaloes, and how we navigate confidence/arrogance as believers.
Welcome to very audacious, the podcast where we audaciously delve into faith, culture and everything in between. I'm your host, sean Tripline, and we're not holding back, so buckle up for this audacious ride. If you're as daring as we are, don't forget to like, share and subscribe. Let's go. Very audacious, fam. What's up, va? Fam? How y'all doing today. Thank you for being with us here at Very Audacious. My name is Sean Tripline and it is always my pleasure to be in this space with you. Of course, there are there's a lot of things happening in the world, and today we have another opportunity to look at what is going on in this big old world that we live in and how can we glean from these things to better understand the ultimate things, the important things, the things as it pertains to God's faith in life. So I'm excited to be here. My brother, jaylen Baker, is in the house.
Speaker 1:What's up, jay, how you feeling.
Speaker 2:Feeling good, man Feeling good. Football season is in full swing. Cowboys gave the New York area a big spank in the last two weeks. You know how we do it down in a big deep. You know what I'm saying. Feeling sorry for you Grieving for your package. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, y'all, just last week I wasn't going to bring it up to you personally, but I was going to bring it up to you on the podcast I wanted to See.
Speaker 1:that's and that's why. That's why I'm feeling some kind of weight right now, because we've been talking for the last hour. You know what I mean and you ain't saying that one word about my package and now the camera's starting to roll. Now you want to act new.
Speaker 2:That's right. That's right Because I know when the camera cut on you a pastor. So I want, I want, I want to. I want a pastor response.
Speaker 1:Oh, you want a pastor response here, because you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:To them. Sorry Pack is losing to the bad news falcons. That's hilarious, bro.
Speaker 1:All I can say is that God can use the weak to confound the wise. That's all I can say.
Speaker 2:That's your prayer for this season. Hey, you know what? Keep?
Speaker 1:on praying, keep on praying, and my witness and my witness, god, do your big one.
Speaker 1:That's Lord, lord, lord so so I'm not even mad at you. I'm not even mad at you for bringing up you know the package today, because we are talking about Coach Prime today, so we obviously are going to give. This is not a sports podcast, this is a culture podcast, but culture includes everything that matters to us within our society and within our beings, so it's going to come up every now and then. I want to say to the people that are listening to this, though, if you are not a sports fan, this is not one that you want to tune out of, because the issues that we're about to delve into are not limited to the avenue of sports, but really everything that we plan to do in Bay Audacious is audaciously delving into life and faith, using the culture to understand them even deeper. So I'm excited to get into this today. Coach Prime.
Speaker 1:We all know I think we all know at this point Coach Prime Deion Sanders, a great football icon, not just as a player, but now also as a coach.
Speaker 1:If you have been living under a bushel for the last couple of years, he has entered into the realm of coaching. He took on Jackson State University and had did amazing things down in Jackson State turning that program around, but not just for Jackson State but for truly, you know, hbcu as a whole, that entire Southwestern Athletic Association and many schools that felt left behind in the world in which we live. He brought light to those schools and I think that it's important to firstly just state that Now I will say you know, we can kind of unfold this as we get along. We don't have to cover his, we don't have to chronicle his whole story all in the first five minutes. We can get to it as we get to it, jay.
Speaker 1:But I do want to say that there were a lot of conversations well before he arrived in Boulder, colorado, now that he's the head coach of the Colorado Buffaloes but there were a lot of conversations from within the black community, within the sports community. You know, about his arriving at Jackson State University and then also his departure. You know, and I can remember some conversations about him leaving Jackson State that were very colorful. What do you remember from that part of his story?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, I think Dion is such a I don't even know. I'm just going to say he's such a huge personality. I mean, my goodness, I feel like I got to give a quote just to sort of, just to really sort of describe his huge personality. This is what Dion said in an interview. Dion was like yo, have you ever been so clean that you walked in and somebody looked down at you and then they looked at themselves and they had to check themselves because you were so clean? See, I have that effect on people in every room I walk into. And I was like, yeah, I said Dion. I said, as you know, I'm saying so I feel like Dion's personality, his huge personality, it attracts attention, right, it attracts attention for sure. It attracts people, like all eyes on Dion, right, and I think that he wants that. That's literally what he wants, right.
Speaker 2:That's his brand, that's his brand. So when Dion goes to Jackson State, right, obviously he wants to be a great coach. Obviously he wants to lead their program to great success and he also wants to elevate all HBCUs, as he said that he wanted to do. Right, and I think what's interesting about Dion, especially in relation to this podcast, is that Dion's a Christian, he's a devout Christian, he believes in God, he believes in Jesus, right, he believes in expressing his faith in a very public way, right. So at Jackson State when he arrives, he literally says God calls him, collect and says go to the state university. Right, and I want you, dion Sanders, and all your notoriety and all your fame, I want to use you specifically to elevate all HBCUs. Right, and he kind of does that, right. He kind of does that like, like Jackson State University HBCU football program. They're on ESPN playing football games. College game day is going to Jackson State University to highlight that program in ways that has never been highlighted before. So he's bringing that, he's bringing that notoriety right. He's there for three years, has great success, his last season there he's undefeated. And then, right, boulder, colorado calls right. And he takes that job directly, like really, before he even finishes out the season with Jackson State. So he accepts that job and is like I'm out of here, I'm basically I'm gone.
Speaker 2:Right, and what's interesting about this decision trip line is this right, he literally said yo, god called me to elevate HBCUs. Right, and you know, one can argue that that started. He started to do that, but he definitely didn't finish a job. You know what I'm saying. Like he definitely now that Deon's not at Jackson State, they're no longer on ESPN, you know, being televised anymore, right, the notoriety that was once there because he was there is now gone. Right, and now HBCU football programs has been relegated to what they were before. Right, which they're taking a backseat to every other program, football program in the country. So it was definitely an unfinished job. So I think that. So I think communities, right, particularly communities in Jackson, are looking at primetime and, like yo, you said God called you here to elevate us and every other HBCU and you started to do that. But, bro, you do that here. The first opportunity you got to coach at a Power Five or a more elite, well-funded school, which is Colorado University of Colorado, right, so I think that's where the conversation begins to be a little nuanced.
Speaker 2:Right Is Deon's public proclamation that God called me here, that God wanted me to revive HBCUs, and then he just dipped, literally just dipped right. I heard one person say. I heard one person say you know, god probably wanted 10% of that Colorado salary and not 10% of that Jackson State salary. So I don't blame God for calling you to go somewhere else. You know what I'm saying. Oh, come on. But I think this is what happens, right? I think that when you have that kind of sort of that's sort of theology of vocation that we can talk about, right, people can begin to question like okay, so if God called you here, and now you're saying God called you here, what does that say about God? You know what I'm saying. So it's a fascinating and very complex conversation.
Speaker 1:You know, one thing I appreciate about you and your words is that you are very, very clear to point out how complex this is, and I really see. You know, of course, if Prime Time were on this podcast and we could only dream, right, if he were on this podcast he would say what he said on 60 Minutes, right? Which is that you know, I wouldn't say that I was here too short or whatever else he'd defend. He'll defend that point, right? I will say that the complexity of all of this definitely has to include that there are different levels in which he impacted Jackson Mississippi. You know the program there at Jackson State.
Speaker 1:You know, one interview he did was 60 Minutes, which is one of the ones I watched. He pointed out the fact that you know, the facilities at this school was, was, was not even on the par of a public Texas high school, you know, and and you probably went the one right and he basically said that you know what, what we were dealing with. And the reporter said are you talking about, like you know, the football thing? He said no, I talked about football. Save him talking about the school. He's talking about the whole, the whole thing.
Speaker 1:You know, and then that might be, you know, hyperbolic, I don't know. You know, because I've never. I've never gone to, I've never been to Jackson State before. A brother at my church Actually played basketball At Jackson State and he's one of my colleagues. That movement Monday leaves our movement life ministry, so he could speak more authoritatively to that issue.
Speaker 1:But the fact that he brought in so many corporations to the school, the fact that he, you know, got money into that program that had never, would have never been there before, one could make the argument that on some levels, you know, he's leaving Jackson State in a better situation. Then he came to when he arrived there, you know, three years ago, of course, how we define what success is and accomplishing God's commands and desires for our lives. You know that that that enters into a great you know, and I think that I think that your, your thoughts, my thoughts and many others who are not necessarily, you know, hyper critical of Coach prime, but definitely observing, you know, these different components, I think one of the elements you have to deal with this. He's so loud about, you know, his faith. He's so loud and definitive about God, said this guy. He not only said that God called me collect, he said God called me to collect, so I had to pick up the charges, you know.
Speaker 2:That he's hilarious and.
Speaker 1:I'll be honest with the people. Let me be honest with the people as a as a sports fan and primarily as a football fan, I don't watch college football. All right, we all know that there's two teams that I'm likely gonna watch, and that's the Green Bay Packers and the Philadelphia Eagles. One because I'm a devout fan and the other is because I'm a son of Philadelphia and I need and I like to know what's going on amongst my peoples, right? So both for the NFL, I don't watch college football, you know, and really, before attending, you know, villanova, I really didn't have. I Never went to a school that had a major Sports program, right, yeah, so so that's just not part of my DNA man, I was up like 1, 32 o'clock in the morning watching football before church Because D I was on.
Speaker 2:TV because he was on TV and so, and it's like for me, so I think that I am hyper critical a little bit of Dion, right, because I think, for me I Understand. Because so when Dion says that these facilities are not on par, these facilities, that that the school itself is is not, is heavily underfunded, right, we have to remember that he's at an HBCU, right, and the reality of race, racism, classism, right, or at work here, right, and it's like HBCU's historically Were built because black Americans were not allowed to attend other prestigious institutions that were better funded, predominantly white institutions. So they so so, so, so, so our communities have to be our own Institutions to edgy, so, so, so, so that folks in our communities had access to a higher education, right, and because the wealth disparities, the education disparities and the class disparities exist when black people open up institutions, of course we're gonna be behind, right, because we're behind in so many other areas, so, right. So I think when, so, so, and the people of Jackson are aware of these because they literally live it out. So when Dion tells those folks in Jackson, right, that God called me here to elevate this school and all HBCUs, they know that he has the gravitas and the reputation to, in some ways, sort of to close those gaps, like you were saying, right to bring on, to bring on endorsement deals to To, to, to, to, to to um, to allow folks to donate money in ways that they haven't donated before To HBCU, because he's Dion Sanders, he's Dion Prime time Sanders.
Speaker 2:So when they heard Dion say that God called me here, they heard someone say, oh, we finally got one of our own from our community, someone who has made it who's a, who's an NFL Hall of Famer, he's a millionaire, he's got the reputation, the gravitas to, to truly come here and Enclose that gap, right? So when you make that kind of theological proclamation, right, and people believe you, people are hanging on your every word because you are this hyper charismatic figure that people listen to that people believe in and and and and you're, you're making a moral claim, a theological claim, that I have been called here to close that gap. You gotta be careful, man, you gotta be careful. Got got thing for me, right? Dion knew full well he wanted to go to a power five school. He knew full well he wanted to compete at the highest level and win a national championship. And he knew full well, he couldn't do that at Jackson State, right, like, like, like, like you can, like you, you're not good, you're just not gonna be able to do that at a happy day right, At least at least 20 years, Even if he stayed there for 20 years maybe
Speaker 2:it will take that long, right. So it's like Dion knew this from the beginning, yet he still made those proclamations and promises right. And my only thing is yo, I don't like yo. You should have those aspirations. If you want to go, do all that kind of stuff, do it. But we do have to be careful with our words right, especially with, like, our words about God. You know I'm saying God has made you a great coach, god has made you a fat, but but it's like yo, you gotta be because people are listening and people believe you and you can break People's hearts. You know I'm saying, and so I think I am a little hypercritical of his language in that way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, and that makes sense. That makes sense to me. I will say, I will say, while I can definitely concur with, especially from a pastoral perspective, but from any, from any Christians speaking and making claims Of God, that one has to be careful that you are, as I heard growing up, don't be prophylion. All right, make sure you prophesying, don't be prophylion.
Speaker 1:One thing, one thing that I, you know, that's, that's one thing that I certainly can understand. I think for me, though, deep down in my heart, I just never believed it. I just, I just, you know, me Like I can go as deep as I, go deep with the deepest of them, right, but when he was talking man, I just never believed. Oh okay, and and I likened it to like, I likened it to growing up. You know this is gonna take a turn, like growing up listening to Missy Elliot, you know me.
Speaker 1:And man, when I was a high school listening to Missy Elliot, my mom did not like me listening to him. Hip hop artists she, she, she threw away my gyro album. I'm still hurt to this day about that man. Yeah, I was. I was messed up a few months after that, but but I understood why mom didn't like me listening to John wool and Missy Elliot because of the content of the music. Yeah, I always thought that it was hilarious that they would get on TV when these awards and say I want to give honor to God.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I said y'all lying.
Speaker 1:Listen, I knew I was wrong listening to it. You knew you was wrong when you said and then God ain't got nothing to do with it. So for me, like when I listen to, I listen to coach Tom, I'm like, oh, I mean like part of me wants to believe the, the spiritual narrative, and part of me wants to see the opportunity for redemption on a serious note, but at the same time, brother, I just really struggled to really take that serious in a very intentional and spiritual and theological way. Now the brother I mean, he's famous for using, though, that bombastic language as a tool to accomplish things that, frankly, only he, in certain areas, has accomplished.
Speaker 2:I mean even at Colorado, bro. That team has been a morbid program for the last 20 years, right, and they for the first time in like probably like 10 or 15 years, sold out. They had, like their season ticket sales went through the roof.
Speaker 1:Wait, wait, wait, wait, jake, before you finish this statement right here, their merchandise went up 819% their sales, their sales Because of one man. Because of one man, and maybe it may be covers of his sons and Travis, but one man brought them all there, right? Yes, it is Instagram, social media, following 10 fold. This was reported on 60 minutes, right? And you already said the season ticket sold out. That's unthinkable, so go ahead and continue.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so the celebrity of Dionne Sanders is unquestioned, right, like people, like in the charismatic nature of his leadership style, is not questioned. And I would even say the acumen of his coaching is unquestioned, cause look, I'm not going to sit up here and say that. And this is interesting too, cause I think, for Dionne, right, he wanted the credibility that a power five school like Colorado would give him. Cause he cause I think he genuinely believed no one would respect him as a football coach if he won at HBCUs, right. So for him he was like I want to compete with the Nick Savings, right, and he would. He would put a culture thing right, like he's, like people that look like me, black coaches ought to be able to compete with the Nick Savings and the Davos, and these are the most famous and successful college football coaches that are out there. Right. And just just, just, just just for context, there's never been an African-American head coach that has won a college football national championship, right. So Dionne has those aspirations, which, again, they are great aspirations, right. But as a pastor, to your point, right, you just I just cannot, I just cannot respect someone who will look the people of Jackson Mississippi it is something particular about that place right, that place of Jackson right, where those people, right, they, they, they struggle to have clean drinking water, trip, yeah Right, like you know what I'm saying, like those people, like those communities are just in dire need of, of not only access to resources but hope, right, and Dionne Sanders gave them hope. He gave them hope right, like he was a hope, like he gave them hope right and they believed it. They, like those people, believed him. You know what I'm saying. And for him to look them in the eye and and and, and you know, obviously I'm a pastor and until you vote God's name, you know what I'm saying. Until you vote God's name, and it's like, yes, I think for a lot of us, they probably weren't in Jackson. I mean, you know what I'm saying. I was like, oh yeah, that's just Dionne being Dionne. You know what I'm saying. He's being himself, obviously, whatever, whatever, whatever. But those people because it might not be Boulder, colorado, triple I, but guess what?
Speaker 2:Jackson State University football games sold out every week. Every week, this stadium was sold out because those people were going there to support a man in a program that said I choose this place, a place that has been forgotten A place that has been, that has been, that has just completely been like that, has had their back turned on them so many times. This dude, dionne, dionne, proud Times, he chose us, so therefore, I'm going to support him. This football team, this university, this program and, for that matter, all HBCUs, right, it was such a moment for the culture, right, and he just was like y'all, I'm out, I'm out, I'm out. You know what I'm saying? So it's like ugh, it's hard, it's hard, it's hard.
Speaker 1:So let me ask you this, though, because I want to, I want to play a little bit of Devil's Advocate here, please do, please do. And my question regarding the mission at JSU and then him leaving, of course, you know they had an undefeated season last year, right? Oh yeah, how does winning play into this equation? Because, despite of everything that he said, despite of all that he's sold, you know, we know that before he was ever a coach, he was a competitor, and we both know that he made a statement relating to his going to Colorado, where he wanted to be at a team that went one and 11 last year. Because, again, how dramatic of a statement would it be to take a team at the bottom of the barrel and bring them to a place where they're not just competitive but a contender? You?
Speaker 2:know, and this is what he said about. This is what he said about God, and I'm gonna let you go. He said God wouldn't relocate me to something that was successful. He had to find the most disappointing and most difficult task, and this is it both of Colorado.
Speaker 1:And in some ways, you know, I think about that narrative of competition. Like did he peak too soon at Jackson State? Did the undefeated season happen too fast? Like can he actually thrive in a space where he's expected to win, or is he someone that needs to feel like he's the underdog? Now to give you a perfect example you know you brought up the Green Bay Packers earlier and I very pleasantly bypassed that.
Speaker 2:My God, my God, my God.
Speaker 1:Aaron Rodgers, who just went to the Jets and just got hurt, the fourth play of the first drive on Monday Night Football famously lost his season. Potentially, they talk about he might be trying to come back for the playoffs. I don't know, but the point is here. Aaron Rodgers makes a statement, something that I knew about him as the quarterback from the Green Bay Packers. He makes a statement that the minute that you count me out, you know what I mean. All I need is that 1% of unbelief so I can prove y'all wrong.
Speaker 1:And as a Packers fan, I saw that when people started talking smack about Aaron Rodgers. Oh, he's about to be washed up, he's about to be on decline. Oh, look, they just drafted Jordan Love. What that dude do? He got two MVPs in a row after they drafted Jordan Love and he thrives on that narrative of being the underdog, someone that some people don't believe in, despite of having all the MVPs and a Super Bowl ring. So in some ways, when I think of Deion Coach Prime, I think about his competitive nature. And did he peak too soon at Jackson's?
Speaker 2:You know, I will admit Tripple. This makes me think of an even bigger question, and I'm really still thinking through it, and so I apologize if I'm just sort of just.
Speaker 1:Say it half-baked man, just say it.
Speaker 2:So my thought about this, right is the relationship between God and sports. Right, the way in which we use or we try to involve God in sports, can I agree, especially at the highest level. Right, people are like that competitive drive in nature is a thing, obviously, right, these dudes didn't get to this, this, this, this level, without being like, without being like fiercely competitive, right, but for me, I just don't know if God Operates out of that same drive when it comes to His will and his mission for him. Right, I think I think about my own self. Right, I'm a pastor at a church. Right, and if someone calls me tomorrow, right, it says yo, jalen, we think you're a talented pastor, talented preacher, talented with like, you think we're great with people. And here's this church of Whatever, 500 to a thousand people. We want you to inherit this place and go there. Right, god has called me to Jacob's. Well, that's very clear. That's very clear. I feel that call.
Speaker 2:Yeah very intensely right.
Speaker 2:Yeah he's calm in Jacobs. Well, he's called me to those people, right? So if I accept that job, right, it's not just about me. Now I've left the people behind that. God has called me to that. I've been relationships with that, like there's it's so deep in that way, right? So if God offers me that, so someone offers me that job, I go and pray and God tells me I have not called you to that promotion. I've called you to this church, right? And I think we live in a society that that that so celebrates promotion.
Speaker 2:But forget about calling invocation, right? Because look that, that, that, that news, that new promotion. It may give me more money, it may give me more access, it may give me more opportunity, but all that kind of stuff, right, but, but. But. But then God might tell me, if it's right, where to happen me, right? So, jaylin, I should question look around you, right. Do you have everything that you can possibly ever need? And my answer would be yes. Look around you one more time, dylan, didn't you pray for this to happen? Did not? Did I not answer a prayer when I gifted you these opportunities that you already have? So now what I'm asking you to do, jaylin, is to honor me and the calling that I have on your life. I'm asking you now to trust me, to say and say to stay where you are, because I've called you there, right, I've placed you there. I want you to honor me, trust me, over that promotion, right.
Speaker 2:And that's where, and that's where I think this all gets very complicated. Right, because I'm not called in this moment to be competitive, right, in a worldly sense, it makes complete sense for me to take the promotion, get more money, get more notoriety, get more silly, all that kind of stuff, right. But it's like that's not, that's, that's, that's not the framework that I'm working out of. I'm working out of the framework of calling purpose, destiny and God's will, right. So when Dion Evokes that kind of language, right, we're all assuming that he's working out of that very same framework, right, and not this framework of competition that you, that that you fairly bring up. You know, I'm saying I think it's a completely fair point. You know I'm saying but when you bring God into it, bro, it changes the framework a little in every way, and that's where I think he just he was, he was playing with some dangerous words there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I don't get me wrong, even though I'm playing devil's advocate number first of all number one. You're preaching. Okay, I need to get some, we need some music on this podcast and and I'm gonna put this together. So when you go on your preaching tangent like that, I'm gonna have a ham and beat three organ come through, all right. So so you could tune up and sing.
Speaker 2:Lord have mercy.
Speaker 1:So Now to your point. Let this be a lesson to all of us. And then I'm gonna pivot, though from after the lesson. I'm not some of her period, I'm cool, I am born pivot. But let this, let let this point be a lesson for all this discernment that you just preach, because when you evoke the name of God, it comes with the weight of God.
Speaker 2:That's just the reality.
Speaker 1:You can't use. You can't use God in a way that you're making God to be a substance that you can just kind of interchange, taking it out whenever you get ready. You can't, you know, subject a God in that way. So we've got to be careful. Use that sort of language, the language of God. That is heavy language and it's loaded and it comes with many rightfully, comes with many Expectations, right. So when we say that we can't throw it around now, of course Many people do this and in our pre-conversation you know, many people do this all the time, and the differences between Me and Deion Sanders is people don't care what I say, but they care what the answer is right.
Speaker 2:So I mean so many of us have.
Speaker 1:Many of us have done this, but, and in a very less Consequential way, then, how we, you know, sometimes think about. You know the issue. Now to your point about, about pastoring, though. Let me say this because Part of my reasoning for never truly believing coach prime when he made his appearance in Mississippi as some sort of like advent, like you know, I am coming to Lift up the people.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean, I have arrived, yeah.
Speaker 1:I have arrived. The reason, part of the reason why I did not truly buy in to that particular portion of the narrative is To two individuals Shiloh and Shador, even though in those for me, I have always seen his presence at Jackson State and his presence in coaching in general as a connection to, or an outgrowth of, the careers of his sons and and his care for them as a father, and and. And I want to say that there was a quote that I did write down when A reporter was asking coach prime about the players and and why would he talk about Travis Hunter and his son, shador Sanders, about potential Heisman runs and why would you set them up for that week too? And oh, by the way, for people who don't know what he's doing in Chicago, they undefeated, they three or no. I just wanna make sure I catch up everybody who has not followed this they're undefeated so far this season. Why would you, with this success, also put them in the limelight in this way? And this is what he said. This is what he said where, for where my kids that play for me did not choose a university, they chose me.
Speaker 1:And a truthful statement, and I hope in a second we can get to the balance. How do we balance out statements that are on the edge of confidence and on the edge of arrogance, not just yeah, you know. So we can talk about that. But I do believe that there's something to be said about whatever he had intended for Jackson, whatever he intended for HBCUs and the Southwestern Athletic Association different conferences that represent HBCU schools.
Speaker 1:I believe that his first community that he was concerned for were his own kids and then, by extension, the players that gravitated towards Jackson State, including Travis Hunter, who had already committed, ironically, to Florida State, because he was at Florida State, who committed to Florida State and then switched to Jackson State. Very dramatic and drastic change of singering in terms of Florida State being one of those sort of institutions that produces NFL players perennially, whereas Jackson State has produced a drafted NFL player in 12 years. So I think that there's something to be said about that. I will say this, though, for all the credit that Coach Prime gives him. So one detail that I just uncovered that I did not realize was how many students actually left Colorado upon his arrival.
Speaker 2:No, no, no, no, no, no Tripp line People that he asked to leave.
Speaker 1:Asked to leave.
Speaker 2:Asked to leave. He didn't.
Speaker 1:Just oh, oh wait, wait, wait, wait To be clear. To be clear, no one at Colorado is gonna say, oh, a NFL legend is just pulled up on the scene, and I think I'm gonna go for my local community college or I'm gonna go.
Speaker 1:You know, nobody's saying that. You know what I mean, let's be clear. Nobody's saying that. So he shows up on the scene and, to me, that detail did something. To me, though, because I didn't realize that 50 players exited because of his arrival, and he said that the reason. You know that he would ask them to leave and he would encourage them. Please do yourself a favor and enter the transfer portal, because a lot of y'all not gonna be here. That, to me, says something about what he's actually trying to do, which I think is care for his sons more than anything, because if you really want kudos as a coach, if you really want to establish, you know, the sort of a legacy of a perennial coaching expert and someone who's won on great grand stages if you take the bulk of those Colorado guys that went 111 and you went eight games with them, you know what I mean. Like so you're three or no, with different players, though you know same brand but different people.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, and it's yeah good. I'm sorry I didn't cut you off.
Speaker 1:No, no, no, you're good man, you're good, okay, and it's.
Speaker 2:I think that's again and I keep breaking it back. I think, right again. Because he's such, he's this bold Christian, right, I think it does mean something when this Christian guy, this father, right, goes into a program and prioritizes winning over kids. Cause, look, as much as we want to professionalize college sports, these are kids. These are 18 to 22 year old kids, right, yeah, kids who are like. And Colorado is a state university, right, so a lot of those players are from Colorado, right, they dreamed of getting a full ride, scholarship to their home university, right?
Speaker 2:So he walks in and looks those children, right, those these 18 year old, 19 year old, 20 year old, 21 year old kids, right, it says, because you're not good enough to win for me, you gotta go right. And it's just like dang bro, like. And again, I'm a pastor, so obviously I'm not an elite athlete, I'm not an elite coach. Yeah, I've seen you play, I don't. You know what I'm saying, so I would. I'm gonna say something. I'm gonna say something. I'm gonna say something to you, but you know, the spirit has a way of holding my tongue. My God, my God, yo, but no, so, but I, so, but, but, but you, but you're right, you are, you are right, so you're a point, I'm not, so it's like I'm not there, so it's. But the thought of me going into a program and looking these kids in the face and being like yo, bro, and not in prime, is so funny. Right, he recorded the whole thing. He recorded them, him asking the, he, he, I watched it today, man, he recorded it, bro. So it's just like the, the, the savagery. But it's also like fam, you're, you're, you're, you're purporting yourself almost as this pastoral figure. Right, god has called me here, all this kind of stuff, right?
Speaker 2:So, automatically, our frame of reference is love, grace, mercy, and look, these terms may not be for sports, maybe sports, maybe these terms don't belong in professional sports in a way that we would use it in a church. Right, and that could be a hot take. But I'm thinking through it, right, cause this is like maybe, maybe, maybe, for for prime time to win, like he's doing now. Right, he cannot show the grace and mercy and love that you will not, probably will show to those 50 young men that we will come in, like we'll be, like, you know, we're going to bring in our own people, but there is just no way we're going to ask 50 players that have worked their entire lives to get a full rod scholarship to their dream institution, which is going to ask? Which are going to fire you? These are not employees, these are students. You know what I'm saying. This is not an NFL, right?
Speaker 2:So it's like, so it's like, dang prime, you're doing, you're doing stuff that seems like goals, against the grain of a pastoral presence that you prepare, that you purport yourself to be. And that's where the struggle for me comes in, right, it's like do what you gotta do to win, fam. But, bro, tone it down, tone it down. That's all I'm asking you to tone it. Tone, tone the rhetoric down, because it's beginning just to sound like rhetoric. It's beginning just to sound like talk, right, where, like I said, people take you seriously when you say these things, when you're the celebrity that he is. So it's nuance, it's fascinating and I don't know. I'm thinking through, I continue to think through it all, bro. I really do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and I really respect your perspective on this because you know, when I remember Deion as a player, when I first started watching football in the mid the mid 90s, you know he was with the Cowboys and you were Cowboys fan. So when you say that, you're saying that from a position not of a hater, not of someone.
Speaker 1:you're not saying this like a Giants fan or Eagles fan or Redskins I mean Commander's fan football team fan. You're saying this is someone, so and I absolutely, absolutely hear you 110% Like. So here's what kind of baffles me Not baffles me, but really wow. When, pushed on that very issue, someone asked them and said you know well, deion, how would you respond if a coach came and told your sons that they might want to brush up their resume? Time to go. And one thing I'm going to say, one thing that I respect, about Deion Sanders and there are other personalities who are revered and reviled. You know that they live on both sides of that fence and there are other people who I disagree with a lot more than Deion Sanders who are, who fall to this category. And one thing that I will say is I respect consistency. Man, I love me some consistency. Deion looked him with a straight face and said if they said that to my sons, I would tell my sons you're supposed to be an asset and not a liability. They shouldn't be saying that to you.
Speaker 2:But this gets to your point earlier, right? So I think Deion is saying that in a mindset of one. No one would have ever said that to him, because he's like the best quarterback to ever play the position through the roof. And we can get into the town of Deion. This dude was playing two major sports at the same time.
Speaker 1:This dude was playing an.
Speaker 2:NFL game and literally went to the World Series to play on that team. He wasn't like a player, he was in a starting lineup. So no one would ever say Deion's a liability. So he's speaking from that kind of talent and confidence.
Speaker 1:So obviously Athletic privilege.
Speaker 2:Let's call it that Athletic privilege he would expect his kids like bro, you come for me, of course you Like. Why would you be an asset or a lot instead of a liability, right? So it's like I wonder if there's just a lack of empathy that he just doesn't possess because he's Deion Sanders. You know what I'm saying. He is who he is, right Like. He's someone who is like extraordinarily talented and elite in a way that maybe no other athlete will ever be in many ways right. So I think that's what's interesting about the two and it speaks to your point early about competitive drive right, deion Sanders' competitive drive is so off the charts because of who he is that I think it can in some ways cloud or Well, I would say that I think it informs his theology. I think it informs his theology the ways that I think can be harmful to some while also being very helpful to others. Right, which gets to the nuance and complexity of it all.
Speaker 1:And whether it's harmful or helpful is definitely entertaining Because, man, I have been glued to the on a Saturday, I don't watch football on Saturdays. You know what I mean it's gonna be to be sitting at home checking the TV guycom trying to figure out when the Buffalo's playing like what? It's unbelievable.
Speaker 2:It's a turnaround of epic proportions. This team won one game. They were I don't know if irrelevant doesn't do it justice to what that program was.
Speaker 1:And the team that they beat in week one was the opposite of irrelevant. Tcu was in the championship game last year.
Speaker 2:They were in that yeah.
Speaker 1:They were 21 point favorites. So for those, all right, let me bring some people into this conversation. All right, tcu was a 21 point favorite. Three touchdowns and three extra points is 21 points. All right, they were betting that he was gonna beat that he was gonna get beat by the number of points many teams scored throughout an entire game, and yet they went into that game and pulled out and did the unfathomable. So that within itself is really is mind blowing. Now I'm gonna say this, though when we think about and you've talked a lot about his language, referring to what God has called him to do and to this point as it pertains to winning, if his theology is winning, he's delivered.
Speaker 1:You know from that if the theology just might be winning. You know somebody, slap your neighbor and open up the book, the epistle to T-Pain. All I do is win, win, no matter what.
Speaker 2:I mean to that point.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he delivered on that theology.
Speaker 2:They said can I take it further?
Speaker 1:Got money on my mind Money on my mind Got all money, got all money. So I mean, he's working through a paradigm that none of us really have ever experienced, right, and he said this is what blows me away. Ask the question are you the change agent, are you the ultimate change agent? Was what was asked to Deion. He says I make a difference. I truly make a difference. I make folks nervous, man. I get folks moving in their seat. I get folks twiddling their thumbs. I get them thinking and second guessing themselves. You know, have you ever been so clean Now, this is part that you read earlier have you ever been so clean that you walked in and somebody looked down at you and then they looked at themselves. They had to check themselves because you were so clean? I have that effect Now when somebody I'm like man.
Speaker 1:He said that I probably looked at myself like let me make sure I'm coming correct. I'm sitting on my couch minding my business and I'm becoming self conscious about my own stuff because I don't quite got it like prime. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Hey, man, ain't none of us do, bro, ain't none of us do?
Speaker 1:When we think about that, you know that sort of let's call it confidence, let's call it that. And you, you know, I know you and others, and in certain points I'm including the number, so that's definitely borderline, if not blatant arrogance. You know, I want to bring up one verse that I think everybody who's ever been to Vacation Bible School has heard in life at one point or another, and that verse comes from Philippians and it's very clear I can do all things through him, who strengthens me. I can do all things through Christ, who strengthens me. I'm gonna say number one ain't not wrong. We're having confidence. But when we think about biblical confidence, what is needed here, when we think about this verse because if you put Dion, I make the difference. You know I'm a change agent you put that next to Philippians 4, 13, I can do all things. You know you can find a common thread until you get to the preposition. And the preposition through, through, through, through, through.
Speaker 2:Got me right there.
Speaker 1:Tell it, trr, you through I can do all things through Christ.
Speaker 1:So I think that for our application, because in every podcast, no matter how juicy it is, we want to make sure that there's some difficult content that we can kind of take away and think about how does this apply to our lives? You know, for me I'm encouraged to enter into this, to this thought process and this dialogue, this binary between confidence and arrogance, knowing that God is not shamed by my approaching and showing up in spaces with an utter confidence that all things are possible, right. But biblical confidence is always pointing outward, it's always pointing to the God who strengthens, it's always pointing into something that you know that God chooses to use the weak to confound the wise, because God's strength is made perfect in our weakness. So I want to say you know to me and to everyone else listening, that I pray you grow in your godly confidence. I pray you grow in the fact that that there are some Jackson Mississippi's in our lives, that we need to look at those circumstances and believe that change can happen, that we believe that we can make a positive impact.
Speaker 1:but it's not because of our goodness, but it's the spite of our depravity that God is able to work good through us.
Speaker 2:So that's my only, my only comment Amen, that's the whole word. Man, I really appreciate that. I think, and I will push folks, man, to like when God calls you to a Jackson Mississippi, see it through. See it through. God will provide everything you need, that you need for your family, for your life. If he calls you there, he will provide right. He's called you there to do something very specific and very, very unique, very, very unique right. And again, god is not against promotion, god is not against elevation. God is just for his will for your life, right, and he will see it through to completion so that it will work out for your good and for the good that he will do through you. So just don't, so don't, don't be afraid to go against the grain and turn down a promotion to remain rooted in the calling that God has on your life.
Speaker 1:Amen, Amen. I love it. People, thank you so much for being here for very audacious. This has been a fantastic experience and I pray that you will find something in this that will compel you to share this with someone else. Make sure that you like this video if you're watching this on YouTube. Even if you're not a YouTube listener or viewer, go on YouTube and like or subscribe to us. Let the world know you're down with the cause of entering into culture audaciously, with a, with a tenacity to be able to approach these things through the lens of faith. I believe that this is something that we are truly blessed by and will continue to be blessed by J. Thank you for being here, man.
Speaker 2:Hey, this was fun today, man. We had a good time, man, y'all have a good one, all right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, see you all soon. Like us on Instagram, all the apps, and we will see you next week. There's a lot going on. I think Kirk Franklin might come up pretty soon. All right, there's a lot happening right now. I'm looking forward to it. I'll see y'all soon. Take care.
Speaker 2:Let's go, I'm.