Come To Find Out
Welcome to Come To Find Out- your resource for all things real estate. You can come here to find out about the current market, terms that you see and hear during a transaction, things to do and not to do when you're in contract. The show will also feature interviews with industry partners and leading experts to help you choose who you want on your home buying journey with you. The home buying, selling and investing process can be so overwhelming, so this guide is meant to make it just "whelming."
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Come To Find Out
Mike Russell's Guide to Surviving Foreclosure and Bankruptcy
Imagine facing a financial storm so severe that it uproots your entire life. Mike Russell, a veteran in the real estate world with three decades of experience, lived through this during the 2008-2009 economic downturn. Mike shares his deeply personal narrative of navigating the treacherous waters of foreclosure and bankruptcy, revealing how vulnerability and self-compassion became his anchors in rough seas. His story isn't just one of survival; it's a masterclass in resilience, offering hope and guidance to anyone grappling with similar hardships.
Listeners will gain valuable insights into practical solutions for homeowners teetering on the brink of foreclosure. With Mike’s expert guidance, we uncover the paralyzing fear many face in financial distress and the crucial importance of maintaining open communication with banks. From loan modifications to reinstatement terms, this episode shines a light on the proactive steps homeowners can take to secure their properties. Mike’s dedication to helping others without charging for his services is an inspiring testament to his commitment to community and personal growth.
The conversation also navigates the complexities of bankruptcy, exploring its potential impact on one's financial future. Mike candidly shares lessons learned from his own experiences, emphasizing the power of gratitude and mindset in financial recovery. By using personal struggles as a driving force to help others, Mike exemplifies how adversity can be transformed into a tool for empowerment. This episode serves as a powerful reminder that financial setbacks are merely chapters in our life stories—chapters that, with the right perspective, can lead to new beginnings and personal triumphs.
To connect with Mike:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/mike-russell-3395baa/
https://www.century21.com/real-estate-agent/profile/michael-russell-P25357887
https://www.facebook.com/Hope4Hardship
https://hope4hardship.org/?fbclid=IwY2xjawHbu6lleHRuA2FlbQIxMAABHQPDMtTicfWl9aP68cZN-z_r1wMtatdN0IS3-YYtla8LpdyfUAUcfY2JGA_aem_fju_mzuQBneRthOdo8FhlQ
Sarah Thress
614-893-5885
First Time Home Buyer course: https://sarahthress.graphy.com/
Instagram https://www.instagram.com/sarah_thress_realtor/
Facebook https://www.facebook.com/SarahThressRealtor/
https://www.youtube.com/@LIFEINCOLUMBUS
Hi and welcome to this week's episode of Come to Find Out. This week we have Mike Russell, who has unfortunately gone through some life circumstances that kind of knocked him down, but I love the fact that he took his circumstances and he turned it into a superpower. So, mike, thank you so much for coming on and sharing, you know, some of your story and a little bit of your superpower.
Speaker 2:Sure, yeah, no, I'm grateful for the opportunity. It's always nice to meet people all over the place, so I'm, I'm, I'm very excited to be here. So let's, let's talk about anything you want to talk about. I'm an open book, so I love it.
Speaker 1:I love it.
Speaker 1:Well, as we were talking about, you know, kind of off screen, you know, before we started recording, you know there unfortunately is a large uptick in foreclosures or people just you know, unfortunately they got into a house and then it appreciated exorbitantly over the past few years and now their property taxes have made it to where their home is unaffordable or their job has changed.
Speaker 1:Any number of things can happen to cause you to miss a payment, and I've done episodes previously on foreclosure and how to kind of avoid it and things like that. But I think it's always very, very powerful to hear from someone who had to go through it. And you know, just knowing that, like you know, stop judging yourself, give yourself some grace and just know that you're not alone. So I just really appreciate that you, you know, have taken this, turned it into your superpower and try and help people know that you know you're not alone. There are ways to get out of this. It's not the end of the world and so you know, I just appreciate you kind of taking that on and making that your superpower.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's. Look, I'm a firm believer that the one thing in life that you can't fake is shared struggle. You know, I can fake a lot of things, but I I can't fake that right, it's, it's, um. It's very challenging to uh fight back feelings of shame and embarrassment and less than and not good enough. Uh, when you face financial crisis. Um, and the financial crisis I certainly faced, you know, I'm sure, with a lot of other people in 08 and 09, you know the country really had the hardest hit economy that we've ever seen. But I can't blame the economy.
Speaker 2:If I'm being honest, you know it was my own decisions. You know there's a lot of self-sabotage involved in what I did. I did not understand money. I did not understand I mistook cash flow for wealth, Never really once taking into consideration that cash flow could go down and suffer, sure, and and I lived day by day, in the moment and I didn't really think much. You know I'm invincible.
Speaker 2:You know I was in my mid 20s and I just thought that it would never end, and the reality is that it ended and, and I guess you know what got me here, what was the turnaround in my life, why I started doing this is because I turned my life around, you know, for the last you know 15 years I guess, but really 10 years my life has really been about recovery in a million different ways, and so that's what got me here is turning my own life around from this financial crisis and the strife in relationships that I created when I caused foreclosures and had to short sale some properties and ended up filing corporate bankruptcy and personal bankruptcy, got divorced and the collateral damage that ripped through my family as a result of that lasted the better part of a decade, and I had to pick up the pieces of that for a very, very long time, and so I understand what this can do to the psyche. You know the financial part's actually easy. It's the rest of it that's really challenging. Finances are not that challenging, you know. Really all you have to do is be mature and you can get an 800 credit score. It's really like that simple in my experience and so.
Speaker 2:But what keeps me here is being able to bear witness to and play a small role in the turnaround of other people's lives, and so for many years in my life, you know, I look at everything kind of like we all have a lifeline, and when you meet someone, you interject yourself into their lifeline in some fashion, and I had a tendency for a long time in my life to create a negative trajectory from that point forward in people's lives, and I just don't do that anymore, and I find great pride and reward in interjecting myself into someone's lifeline and playing a small role in improving the trajectory of their lives from that point forward by helping them make good decisions. That's what keeps me here, that's what keeps me doing this and keeps me wanting to meet new people, hear new struggles relate to new struggles and it's a unique thing because I've owned a real estate company really my whole life, since I was 19. It's the first real job I ever had, and so I've been doing this for 30 years on every level of the spectrum in some fashion. And what always struck stuck out to be more were the sad instances. You know there's, you know when you're, when you're involved in real estate transactions. You have the very excited, jubilant first time homebuyer, you have the leveling up hey, we've made great decisions, we're getting the dream home. What always stuck out to me more and resonated with me more were the sad stories.
Speaker 2:You know I represented Freddie Mac for about a decade listing their foreclosed assets and I would witness lockouts. Now, lockout here in Massachusetts is one of the worst things to witness really ever and it's once the bank buys the property back. They show up, uh, with the sheriff, um and two movers and a box truck and they knock on the door and they say whatever can fit in the truck, you can take, we'll store it for 30 days. Then it's your problem and when we're done, we're going to change the locks and you're out. And I probably witnessed 200 of those you know, between 08 and 13. And that stuck out to me. You know, you really saw the human condition and human behaviors when they're up against it, desperation, and I related to that. I understood what those feelings were. I related to that. I understood what those feelings were. And the unique blend is that you know, after 30 years, I have all the tools and toolbox to be able to help people navigate with banks and avoid the same strife that I did, Because the fact of the matter is no one has to be foreclosed on Nobody.
Speaker 2:The two truths that make it possible for us to do this work anywhere is anywhere in the country. No bank in America wants to foreclose and no homeowner in America wants to be foreclosed on. The rub is they don't communicate effectively. Because when you're riddled with those feelings of shame and regret and remorse and whatever else is going on in your life divorce, death, health, sickness, job, whatever it is double that with the fear and lack of understanding that the true fact is that the very entity that is threatening your home is the one who can help you. The bank wants to help every consumer and that's with any secure debt in America. I don't care if it's a boat, a car, a house, whatever it is. If it's a collateralized debt, the bank doesn't want the collateral. They don't know what to do with it. They want to keep the person that's in it. They want to get them back on track, keep them and get them back in the good graces and continue making payments.
Speaker 2:And the best thing that we can do for people that I, that I, if you act fast enough and it seems as though it's about 300 days, if you're less than 300 or so days behind on your mortgage, so the better part of a year, 10 months most banks will give you something that's called a partial claim mortgage and what that is is they take the arrearage the past due amount and they tack it on to a second mortgage on the back end of the note which allows people to keep their current note in place. And a lot of those notes are at fantastic interest rates. So you don't have to modify and get into a current rate, seven percent mortgage, so you keep your two and a half percent. They take the 30 or 40 or 50 thousand dollars in a rearage, tack it onto the back end at zero percent with no payments due and you don't have to deal with that note until one of two things, three things I guess the maturity of your original note, you know, 26 years in the future if you refinance or if you sell.
Speaker 2:But the average consumer has no idea that this is reality and what we work against on a regular basis is when this becomes public record. All the sharks come out of the woodwork, they all come out and everyone is trying to capitalize on what they perceive to be the misfortune of others and they're trying to buy the house for cheap, force them to sell, force them to file bankruptcy, do all these things that actually just can often make the problem worse and just or it just isn't necessary. And so it to me. It me it's foolhardy to not try every option prior to all those things to retain the property, and banks will do that in a million different ways. The best one is the partial claim mortgage. They'll offer reinstatement terms.
Speaker 2:Some people have 401ks, whatever it is. They can pay off the lump sum reinstatement. They do payment plans on that stuff and, of course, you can do a loan modification if you can afford it at the new rates. So many different tools in your toolbox and I understand what it's like, because there was a time in my life when I had two years of unopened mail on my dining room table. In hindsight I can tell you that the answer to my problem was in that pile, but I didn't want to open it and look because I thought they were just threats and I thought that if I ignored them, I don't know what I thought Maybe the mortgage fairy would come pay off my mortgage. I don't know, but you know there is no such thing. It turns out.
Speaker 1:I was going to say if you found that mortgage fairy, please send them my way.
Speaker 2:No, it doesn't, yeah, it doesn't doesn't work out that way. So so it's just it's. It's a unique blend of personal circumstance why this means so much to me and why it's personally important to me. But then, professionally, 30 years in the real estate business and understanding all these years later, that boy, there were so many solutions available to me If I had just picked up the phone and got engaged proactively engaged is what I see people struggle to do, and it's fear-based and they are paralyzed in fear and so they make no decision. They don't trust anyone and yeah, so the vast majority of the work that I do on any day-to-day basis is I help people get out of their own way, because that's what they're in they're in their own way.
Speaker 1:And that's so true because you know, I think we're all just so, we're all just kind of stuck in our own little world. And you know, unfortunately social media makes it so easy for us to portray that we have this perfect life and everything's great, and you know. So then someone that's struggling, they're watching that social media and they're like, well, Jim over there has, you know, a new boat like and they've got this and that, and you know what is he doing differently than I'm doing? And you know I like, and who knows, jim may be also stretching himself so thin that you know something else is going to happen to him, just like it happened to you. You never know. So I think, unfortunately, we all kind of, you know, like you said, we all get in our own way.
Speaker 1:And I love the fact that you've really done kind of a deep dive and have like a blueprint to help people, because I know whenever I get you know, contacted, it's generally you know the person's like hey, the bank is literally about to foreclose on my house, like can you help me? And at that point, you know, I always recommend that they call their bank. They see what they can do. Some banks are easier to work with than others. Obviously, some want you to stay in the house and some could care less, and so then I just also kind of show them, like this is what the market's looking like, this is what you know, if you're already, if they've already started the process of foreclosure, here is, you know, like a short sale, here are your options. Just you know, because, like you, I want to make sure that everyone has all of their information. And if I can help someone stay in their house which obviously means nothing for me, like I'm getting no compensation at all perfectly fine with me, because ultimately I just want to do what's best for the client, for the consumer, whatever they need, and so if I can help them do that and stay in their house and afford it, that's what I would much rather do than try and sell something that you know, because in a short sale you're not keeping anything extra.
Speaker 1:If there is anything extra, you know you're going to walk away with zero dollars. Yes, you've wiped away that debt, but you are walking away with zero dollars, whereas if you get into, let's say, you miss your first couple of payments and you're feeling that stress and that overwhelm even the first payment you're about to miss call your bank, talk to them, see what you can do. And then this is the advice that I give people. I always say call them, see what they can do. If they can't do anything, we can look at the market and let's figure out what makes the most sense for you and your situation. So I love that you've kind of taken some of that guesswork out. So do people just reach out to you and say, hey, like I saw your story, or you know how do you work with people?
Speaker 2:So it excuse me. So we operate off a very basic service agreement. It's the same deal. We don't charge anything for what we do, and the service agreement really just lays out the expectations of us, and those expectations are really the most important. One is to produce supporting documentation in a timely manner. That's really where we lose some people throughout the course of the year is they get disengaged, and so it all starts with a phone call to the bank together and, you know, giving authorization for me to speak on their behalf with the bank, and I negotiate the best terms that are available.
Speaker 2:It's a relatively simple thing, and it's you know. You find your way to their assistance application and you fill out the assistance application with the guidance of the consumer, and then we follow up every three business days, because that's where the rub is. You know. You said some banks are easier than others. I've yet to find the easy one, but it's. But listen, there, it's just. You know. Everything is, you know, five to seven business days out. You send a piece of information and it's gonna be five to seven business days before the bank even acknowledges that it exists. And I've grown quite skilled at creating applications that help people retain their property. But even still, I don't think I've ever submitted one one time and had the bank deem it complete. There's always something more. They need Always, no matter what you do, no matter how many boxes you think you checked off. Oh yeah, we got it, but this is, we need this as well. You know, whatever got it, but we need this as well. Whatever it is, there's always a litany of things, and that's really what we do. The work that consumers can't bring themselves to complete. The vast majority of the people that I meet started one oh, we did that or we sent it, but then it's the follow through that really keeps everything together is you have to get these applications to what the bank calls certified complete status and only then will they send it to underwriting, put it under review and kick back some options. But it doesn't work without getting to that certified complete, and so that is really you know.
Speaker 2:I would say the most valuable thing we do is we are an emotional barrier. Right, and just as an example, I can't talk to Comcast about my own account. I can't do it. I hate them. Every time I get on the phone with Comcast and I'm trying to like upgrade my DVR or do something like I'm ready to kill them, upgrade my DVR, or do something like I'm ready to kill them? Obviously not really, but, and so I understand. That's exactly how the consumer feels when they're dealing with the bank and they said I sent you that and they're like what do you mean? You don't have it, I said, and the emotional angst that is created is cannot be addressed, it can't be fixed, it's yours, it's I don't feel that emotion with these banks. It's emotionless to me. It means nothing to me that that communication is tremendously simple and this is like everything in life breaks down to sales. Right Is be charming, be complimentary, be cooperative, don't raise your voice, voice and great things will happen. So I'm able to do that. My team is able to do that without having this emotional baggage that other people have, rightfully so, and so our ability to stay in touch, follow through, see it to the end, will generate a results letter in six weeks or so from the time we start. The end we'll generate a results letter in six weeks or so from the time we start, where the bank issues results and every bank.
Speaker 2:You spoke about something. So here's a universal rule in banking with real estate nationwide. Every bank has this seemingly arbitrary figure and they all hold true to it. If there is an auction date scheduled in the future you've actually had an auction date scheduled they will not entertain any assistance options where they play a role in the assistance of doing something with the asset, either retention based or non-retention based. If there's less than 37 days until the auction, that's the sweet spot.
Speaker 2:So you have pillars to operate within, and so if you're less than 37 days, the bank is not going to help you. They're not going to help you. Even they won't even entertain a short sale. Not enough time to review the short sale package. So you have pillars that you have to operate in. You know like can't be more than 300 days behind in order to get some really great assistance. Can't be within 37 days of an in order to get some really great assistance. Can't be within 37 days of an auction to get any assistance. And so there's a sweet spot, and so that the value of not letting mail pile up on your dining room table is immense. And along the lines of what you're talking about is you're afraid of them, and I get it, but they are the ones who can solve your problem. So pick up the phone and have active, engaged discussions.
Speaker 2:You know it's listen, there isn't a relationship in the world, in the human existence that I've seen, that effective communication doesn't solve. Effective communication remedies all struggles in all relationships. It may end relationships, but effective communication is needed.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, and I love. Excuse me, I wish I would have met you sooner, because I had a gentleman that came to me and he was trying to sell his property and it, you know it obviously needed a lot of work. He was behind on mortgage, he was behind on keeping up with the house, all the things, and so we were working on doing kind of a private sale because he had found someone that wanted to do it. So I was just trying to help facilitate it so that he, you know again, could get out of it without, you know, a huge ding on his credit and to be able to purchase something you know sooner, because obviously a short sale looks way better on your credit than a foreclosure. So not as good as just selling it, but you know it is better. So but I had a gentleman that you know, like I said, when he came to me he was so far behind. He had called the bank and submitted forms and asked for assistance hundreds of times and he and his wife were just so fed up with the entire process that they just thought they had no hope. So I was like, well, let me see what I can do. I reached out to the bank and I said would you entertain a short sale? I have someone. I know you already have it, you've already set a date for the auction, but I would love to get this out from underneath all of us sooner than that and allow him to walk away with just at least some dignity.
Speaker 1:And so we went through the whole process. They kept telling me yep, yep, yep, that's totally fine, we go through it all, submit all the paperwork, everything we come to like days before closing. And they were like, oh, actually it's going to be a hundred thousand dollars more that your buyer is going to have to bring. So, sorry, that's what we're starting the auction at. And I was like what? And so the buyer was like, well, I'm not coming up with an extra $100,000. Disney didn't even appraise at that, so I don't know where they got their number, but yeah, so unfortunately, that one did end up going to auction and it was very sad because, you know, they came in and put the locks on it and he had to have everything out before the auction. Otherwise, like that was it. You know, while I'm not, I don't niche in it, it is something that I come across and I'd like to always be well-versed in how to help people where they are in that process.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a yeah, 37 days. That's kind of the sweet spot, you know, and it's, and it's understandable to a degree. You know, the bank has given you, uh, in their mind, um, plenty of rope, right Is, is their belief, um, and and there, there just isn't really any effective guidance out there in the world on how to navigate banks. Um, and those are just things that I've just learned, you know, over the course of a career, right Is you? Just, you're involved in all this stuff, you see it, and I'm curious in nature, right, I'm tremendously observant and I'm very curious, and so every time I see something that a bank does, I want to find out what right. So what is what? What's up? Does every bank do this, does? Why did this happen? And I'll call my attorney hey, talk to me, go look this up. Why did this bank choose this length of a cure, a right to cure and all this kind of stuff? And so it's just, I'm observant, I'm curious, I want to learn this stuff. I, I'm observant, I'm curious, I want to learn this stuff. Um, I look at it like a map, like it can be figured out, you know, figured out, and then, if you can operate within the parameters and the boundaries that these banks set. And then you have state law, of course. That, um, that comes into play too. And so I have some connections, some, some relationships that I've made, uh, state offices over the course of my career. Um, and these, these guys I don't know how they do it they have a direct line to somebody important at the banks. They can stop a foreclosure in three minutes, you know, and um, and so there's always a way to buy time to extend things, and it's a function of being creative and resourceful. Um, there are some. Even if there's an auction scheduled, you know we can get those delayed. I don't. I'm not a big proponent, I mean, I know. I know a lot of bankruptcy attorneys. I know a handful that I trust and I'm always looking for more that I trust.
Speaker 2:Bankruptcy is a tool, but it's just like foreclosure it's a public record on your credit report and filing bankruptcy in hindsight. For me, it was one of the biggest mistakes I ever made. I didn't have to, I chose to, and there are people in the world who have to. I just wasn't one of them. I took what I thought was the easy way out and I regret it. I regretted it. It made the next five years of my life tremendously challenging, more so than it needed to be.
Speaker 2:But you know when bankruptcy attorneys out there there are a bunch of them that when they see these public events a notice of intent to foreclose they start hounding the consumer and you know they push them. You know, give me $4,500 and file bankruptcy. And it's tough because you know, when you own real estate and you file bankruptcy, it's typically a Chapter 13. It's a cure and maintain program, and what a lot of people don't understand is that, yes, it will put a stay on the auction proceeding, but in a very short period of time 60 days from now, you are going to be expected to make your current mortgage payment plus a payment to the bankruptcy court every month, like clockwork, and so rarely, in my opinion, is it the great move. Every case is different, of course, but I just I think that it behooved everyone to investigate every single opportunity short of a public event being recorded to the credit bureau in your name.
Speaker 2:I think that was the best way to do it and the hard thing yeah, go ahead.
Speaker 1:No, I was just going to say now, um, if you look back cause you mentioned that, you thought that was like the worst thing you could have done. So now, with the knowledge you have, obviously you did the best you possibly could with the knowledge you had at the time. So, completely you know. Again, I want to make sure that everyone knows that, like, none of this is coming from judgment at all from anyone and no one should ever feel judged, you know, because we all have these circumstances. I mean, I think there's a statistic out there that, like everyone's like three paychecks away from being homeless. You know, or not everyone, but you know there are a large majority of people are, you know, three paychecks away from being homeless. But so I just wondered, like you know, you mentioned that you wish you hadn't done that. Now that you have different knowledge, what do you wish you hadn't done that now?
Speaker 2:that you have different knowledge. What do you wish you would have done instead? Negotiated, negotiated my way to terms that were acceptable, you know, and that's and I? I never even tried. I never even tried.
Speaker 2:I saw it as a rip cord, like you know, bills piling up everything, and the first thing I'll say is that, um, in my experience, the very last bill that a family or a household stops paying is their mortgage. If you stop paying your mortgage, you have some other delinquencies. That's the last one you protect. You know you protect that with everything you can. One you protect. You know you protect that with everything you can. And and so I, I would have just negotiated, I would have opened up dialogue.
Speaker 2:And the reality is and I say this to people all the time I wish I knew somebody like me back then, but I didn't have anyone that I could, that I didn't, and maybe I did and I just didn't go looking. But the reality is, I didn't have what I thought was reasonable guidance anywhere to protect me from these things, and so I, like I said, I filed a corporate and a personal bankruptcy and that made it. You know, you become unbankable in traditional lending for an extended period of time, and it was a time suck for me, and five years of my life I essentially just spent in a hole, waiting for my credit to repair on its own, just as a result of time.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so that's rarely required in my opinion, and you know, no bankruptcy attorney in the world wants me to say that, but I just, you know, I. I know of other ways prior to that.
Speaker 1:And I love you know again, that's why I say that you have developed your superpower, because I think that if more people took the hardships that they went through and, you know, remembered what it felt like going through that, and knew that they didn't want anyone else to have to feel that, I think that, you know, our world would be so much better off. So, um, you know, I I think you deserve huge kudos for, you know, having the, the vulnerability to say, hey, look like I screwed up. This is what I did, and I want to take this and turn it into um a way to help others so that they, you know, don't have to feel the, you know the angst and the hardship that you felt, and they don't have to wait you know, five years sitting in a hole, you know, waiting for it all to to kind of, you know, flush out so that they can move on with their life. So, you know, I I really appreciate that you do that.
Speaker 2:Um, thank you, I'm grateful for you to say that. Listen, that that's what recovery is all about, right, when you, when you recover in a way, um, like I have you, I just, um, I, I pay it forward to the next man or woman. That's the deal, that's the bargain, right? That's the fair bargain that I made. That's, that's all, that's all I want to do, and it's and you're right, and it comes from a place that I don't listen.
Speaker 2:It's impossible for me to judge someone. I've yet to hear a story that that made me cringe, like whatever, like, we all make choices in life and a lot of them are the wrong ones and they have consequences. A lot of those consequences don't show up until later and you're not to be judged for that. You know, and struggle is a chapter in our lives. The only reason it ever becomes the whole story is usually because of us ourselves. We make it the whole story, but it's really just designed to be a chapter and no one avoids it, and if they, if they say they don't they avoided it, they're lying.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that goes back to your social media story. There's a reason that there are multimillion-dollar businesses that literally all they did is buy a private jet fuselage, so it can be parked in a warehouse, so people can take pictures of it, making it look like they were in a private jet. There's societal norms, you know. Societal pressures in America are on next level, for men and for women, you know, and for men typically it's. You know, you have to be wealthy or you suck. Women you must look perfect or you suck. And that's just a story. It's a lie. It's a lie. It's not what it's about. It's not about money. It's not about anything. It's about, you know, I don't know how, about waking up in the morning, being happy?
Speaker 2:Yeah that's, that's real well to me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I totally agree and I mean honestly, you know, after going through my divorce, you know I've kind of turned that into my superpower is, you know, helping women going through it. But as a result of that, you know, I mean it's been over a decade now. So you know, since all of that took place, but you know, since then I've gone on this like spiritual journey of just trying to figure out, you know, like just just who I am, what I want to be, what you know, what is my purpose. You know things like that and you know one of the biggest things that continues to come up is just mindset. And you know being grateful for what you have. You know, whenever you're grateful for what you have, then more things are. You know you attract more things into your life. And so you know, I think, even whenever you're having those bad days, there's always, always something to be grateful for, always.
Speaker 1:So you know I, you know to your point, you know trying to work on that mindset. Don't let this be your. You know, just make this a blip in your story. This is not your story, this does not define you. You know we all make mistakes, they all have consequences and that's okay. Let's learn from them, let's move on, let's find three things that we're grateful for every single day, so that we don't get stuck in that story and that doesn't become who we are. It doesn't. It's not who we identify as, it's just something that happened to us, that we learned from and we moved on from.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I couldn't agree more. The spiritual component in people is lacking in general terms, from where I sit. And it's not about perfection, it's about progress for all of us. That's what it's about.
Speaker 1:Exactly Progress over perfection.
Speaker 2:No question. And you can't you know if you, if you focus a little bit of time on being grateful and having some gratitude, it's impossible not to see the progress. It's impossible.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely so. If someone is listening to this and they're thinking, holy crap, he just literally explained everything that I'm going through right now. What would they do to work with you? Like, how would they? Yeah, call me 508-501-9214.
Speaker 2:Call me. That's my cell. Call me anytime we can schedule an intake and just kind of go over your story and what situation you're in. How long has it been since you were current, what have you tried and who's your bank? Since you were current, what have you?
Speaker 1:tried and who's your bank. It all starts there, you know. Perfect. Yeah, I love that and hopefully everyone has been able to see, like I have, that you genuinely care about people. I mean, I literally just met you right now and I can already see. You know, we're not even face to face and I can already. I can feel your energy and you are. You know you're such a giving person and you have a servant heart and so you know all of that came through. So hopefully anyone listening gets that and they realize that you are not that ambulance chaser that's trying to take advantage of them. You're not trying to sell them a whole load of crap that they don't need, you know. You just genuinely want to help them. So I love that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, sure, I'd be honored to just bear witness to it, if not just play a small role. Like I said, that's all. If I can turn my life around, absolutely anybody can.
Speaker 1:I believe, that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I believe that too. I love it. Well, thank you so much, mike, for taking time out of your busy, busy day. Uh, you know, come on kind of walk us through. You know being so vulnerable and, uh, you know, making sure that everyone knows that. You know this isn't, it's not a unique problem. Uh, lots of people face it and you know, if you can just face it head on, you can name it and then, you know, work with you, uh, that you know is going to make a world of difference in their lives.
Speaker 2:Appreciate it. Thank you very much.
Speaker 1:I love it and I will have um anything in the show notes that, uh, you know I'll put your cell phone number in there. Any social media you know, any website links, anything like that will all be in the show notes for people to be able to reach out.
Speaker 2:Awesome. Yeah, you can go to my site and learn about me. Yeah, easy I love that.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much. So, please make sure that you rate and review this episode, because feedback is the greatest gift you can give. Also, make sure that you rate and review this episode, because feedback is the greatest gift you can give. Also, make sure that you are sharing this with others, because that is the greatest compliment that you can give Mike and myself. And make sure that you are following along so you never miss another episode. Thanks so much and we'll see you next time on Come to Find Out.