S2E8: Karennenhá:wi Goodleaf

Karennenhá:wi (Ierennahá:wi) Goodleaf is a Kanien’kehá:ka from Kahnawà:ke who is a second language kanien’kéha speaker. She graduated from the adult Kanien’kéha immersion program Ratiwennahnírats. She later went on to teach for the next 10 years at a kanien’kéha elementary immersion school and language nest in Ganienkeh. She is a mother of one and because of her strong language foundation she is now raising her daughter as a first language kanien’kéha speaker. Karennenhá:wi is now a holistic wellness practitioner who has studied foraging and medicine making and is also currently enrolled in a 2 year herbal immersion program. She enjoys volunteering for the Native Wellness Institute’s annual youth wellness camp. She continues to support health, wellness and language in the home and community.  

linktr.ee/enweying.oursound

Many people have reached out to ask where they can donate or support revitalization efforts. This link leads to our Link Tree which has a Patreon as well as "Buy me a Coffee" where you can donate to our families cause and initiatives we do to support learning in the home and across our communities. Miigwech

Transcript

SPEAKER_06 0:00

I don't know. I think our um well gonna yeah, anyways, I know it's it's just really, really descriptive. It's a really hard language. I think that's why it's like so important for to bring uh bring up like small children with language right away because as you get older, it's a lot harder to learn. But um uh yeah, overall, I think it's just it's just really descriptive. It's it's beautiful, it's alive. That's why it's so hard to learn because it's it's it's it's alive like anything else.

SPEAKER_00 0:54

Welcome to N Wing. This is a great streets podcast intended for those raising or helping to raise children in an indigenous language.

SPEAKER_03 1:05

A special shout out to the Indigenous Screen Office for making season two of N Winging possible. Get Jimmy Glenn.

SPEAKER_01 1:14

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:15

You know me as an editor.

SPEAKER_01 1:20

Five, four, three.

SPEAKER_03 2:36

Chicky Chiggyuk. Didn't know you could do that.

SPEAKER_01 2:42

Chickyuk. It's uh Kejinong dialect.

SPEAKER_03 2:47

I didn't know you could put ch in front of it.

SPEAKER_02 2:51

Chiggyuk, um dum ta should you go? Kinam Kinamagiya Chicken just uh just teaching my program, being busy, but other than that I'm good.

SPEAKER_01 3:14

Just finishing off our semester and then start getting into the summer semester. And yeah. But yeah. Good today. Looking forward to this to this guest.

SPEAKER_03 3:41

Yeah, you tracked her down um or or discovered her, um and then told me, do you want to share how that all came about?

SPEAKER_01 3:55

So yeah, I was just I don't know how, I I don't remember following her on Instagram. Like I don't know when, but I was following her on Instagram and um I probably typed in something like Gany Geha because my mom's Oneida, part of you know, Hodan Ashone languages, so I have like uh an interest in learning, you know, Hoda and Ashone languages too. So like Onaida, Mohawk, um Gunyage. Um I probably typed that in or something, and maybe her account came up with language stuff on it. And then she posted a story that said something like my dreams are coming true. Um I've created a first language speaker. And so that I don't know if that was the direct quote the quote, but um I was thinking, oh, that you know, she's she must be raising her child in the language and she must be a speaker, and so I reached out to her and asked her if that's what she was doing, and then I asked her if she could be or if she wanted to be on the podcast, because I think she'd be a good guest, and like other than that I didn't really know her. Um but I think that was uh you know, just anyone raising their child in their language, I think it's always an inspiring story in whatever story that they have, like in how they're doing it. So yeah.

SPEAKER_03 5:54

Nice. As you would say. Yeah, this is what episode eight.

SPEAKER_01 6:07

I think so, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 6:09

I really like hearing from moms, like from mothers doing the language. I love hearing from from other people like fathers as well and whatnot, but it's always nice for me as another mother to be able to to relate and learn from other moments and that you know we have as mothers, and then um I I always love hearing from people who speak a sp a different language than us, especially some of the Shoney languages, one because they're a matriarchal system and I love hearing their perspective on things, but also um I think there's a lot of good insight and a lot of knowledge that you know can be utilized or learned or absorbed from culture to culture, especially well, specifically as people revitalize their language and pass it down to the next generation or their children or whoever it is that they're teaching as children in their homes or in their you know, language nest programs or whatnot. I like learning from those guests that we have on, and uh yeah, so I'm I'm excited to hear from her and to hear her story and her journey because we don't know her personally. Um, so it'll be nice to get to know her and hear her story, and so yeah, I'm excited. Um lucky to be able to have booked her to make time for us to share what she has to share. That's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_01 7:52

Yeah, uh yeah, I think I like I want to hear from other people from different languages, and like I said, like each person has their own story of how they're doing it, and I think it's all inspiring, especially you know, like our indigenous languages. And yeah, just hearing perspective because we know people, we speak Anishina Bemwin, so we know people in that space. Um, and I think it's good to hear, you know, like you said, from other languages and you know, learning from one another, being inspired from one another. Um, and then we could also, if people that are listening know other people from other languages, um, that would be good on the podcast. You guys, you know, you can you know contact us, tell us about it, you know, message us. We have Instagram, Facebook page, email, email on our on the show notes you can find. Um yeah.

SPEAKER_03 9:05

Um and I think as nations nations as a whole there could be a lot. I mean, I I know there's conferences all over the world that do this kind of work, but I think it's important, you know. I know that sometimes you when you're learning your own language and then you you hear somebody from a different nation learning theirs, it's like, well, how can that relate to myself? But I think we have a lot to learn from people leading the way in language revitalization work, especially with you know, Ganyage. I'm just keep telling me until I get it right. Um not that I guess not that I didn't take an introductory course already that I should know. Um but I think you know they're leading the way in a lot of things, and they've had they've successfully handed down the language in a lot of ways, and I think there's a lot to learn. And I know other people within our Nishnap Bamwin language circles have said the same thing that you know we we could be sharing more from nation to nation. And so I'm less like I I understand like when people are less likely to listen because it's not about their specific target language, but there's so much knowledge and power within other communities, their systems, their governing systems, their learning systems, their ways of um learning, sharing, building. So uh yeah, it's it's gonna be great. Um probably everybody already knows us. I don't think we probably need to do an introduction today, but yeah, no.

SPEAKER_01 11:04

Um not right now. No.

SPEAKER_03 11:06

I think we can just got ngu or magi ngwiska that osnago magay.

SPEAKER_01 11:20

Oh, that's what he's been saying lately. Uh God messages magana osnago Nija Nishna Bemwen Kinamagegamgung Piganundiang Gujar, Ingoding uh Masayang Ode Kinamagegamagung, Inje Kinamagazit, Gwis Gikwaj Mik Oh, and uh Dajana Nishna Bemun Kinamagegam Gong Gik Midash Midash Ganad Gai Temagasana on Nishna Bemun Kinamag Mampi G gin and An Gawa Gon Mikwendan Galkidia Minoa Gonguding Pageboa Japanabad Gik Mikanish Anishanja Nishna Bemya get the gin minagasha gikinamagzame minua minua gikita oh anish anishanja shagnashima kinawaya anishanja nishnabemya getta gin ginwa gikit oh kinaweya shaganashimk goin giken zinwa wakidia magidiamba nien minogasha the nishnabem tardame paneg don sastan giki kiki nishnabemwen kinawea shagnashi muk gdin away magna gum shamasagn kokumas kinaway shagnashi muk mi atigo ga kakidia kinoagoa ni minua minua go gakidat oh ni ja nisha k uh nishnabemuen kinamage gumgagawain goin giken zinabach so a couple times within the past week or so he my son asked me asked if he can go to an Anishina Bamwin school. And once was when we were walking to his school, we were talking, and he said he he wanted to go to Anishna Bamwin school, and then another time I was he was going to he was going to sleep and then he asked me why only me and Gushe or his mom and dad why we only speak in the language and no one else does, and I didn't know what to say to him other than I just said everyone like everyone else speaks English and we were we learned to speak Nishna Bayman and I I told that to him all in the language and and so I didn't really know what to say to him other than you know like a how okay but I think it's it's a good thing I think that he wants that that's what he wants and you know sometimes as parents you get you can get discouraged if your kids aren't speaking even though they might understand everything, you know, your goal is like I want my kids to speak and just I think for me I I want them to know the importance of it and that they have it, that they understand it, and that they both go to non-language schools. There's no language class that that are that's offered in their schools, so whatever I can give to them, I will, and then hopefully later on they'll they'll find their passion and and find a way to to learn it themselves. So yeah, that was but it kind of it made me happy that he wanted to like I didn't talk about a school, a Nishna Bemwin at a school, like a language only school. I didn't I didn't mention anything about it, and he just said it himself. He was just like, I want to go to Nishna Bemwin school, or can I go to Nishna Bemwin school?

SPEAKER_03 16:08

So well, one thing I should point out that's been a bit different is well, one, our kids both like to play Minecraft, um, not online with other people, but I don't even know if that's a thing, but they like to play Minecraft with one another, and the only reason, the only reason that I let them do that is because they have really good conflict resolution skills when they're playing. That's personally for me, like I hear a lot of hey, why'd you do that or whatever, and then oh, I didn't mean to, I'm sorry, that's okay. Like, I hear that a lot when they're playing. Like, yeah, there's some times where I have to intervene and help them resolve something, but I like you know, if they're coming to a resolution uh like 12 times in an hour or something where they're playing, they're practicing that I don't know how many times, right? So that's one reason why I let them play. But because there's a video online, um, there's videos online of you know people playing Minecraft in Nishina Bamwin. Um he's asking to listen to that all the time now because he knows that we'll put it on because it's in the language, but it's about Minecraft. So every morning he when we get when he gets up, they generally, you know, get up and they're allowed to have some TV time while they're getting ready and having breakfast and stuff. And in the last, you know, I'd say month or so, maybe a bit more, he's been saying, like, well, can I watch Nishna Baimu in Minecraft? Um, sometimes we do, sometimes we don't, depending on whether or not I want to have YouTube on that early in the morning. But ever since we got back from A-Tech and you brought home the Barbara Nolan t-shirts that we bought, there's been a sh a shift. Now, before we went to A-Tech, we were playing Barbara Nolan's um videos that SPK has helped create. Um What's A-Tech? Anishnaabe Muintech uh conference in Sault Ste. Marie, Michigan, every year that we attend as like an annual thing, and it's a tradition for you and me. But um, like we were look, he was watching that before that. Then we saw the t-shirts that they were promoting. We bought some, we brought them home. I think like the second day we got home, we I put him in it to wear to school. And I did post this on the N weighing our sound IG page, Instagram page, but someone was asking about it in his classroom, and so he was talking about it, and so his teachers who are so supportive and so great and are fantastic at not appropriating our language or our culture, but um supporting it because they sh they know you know how important it is to our household, and for uh other children to be exposed and normalize, you know, different cultures and whatnot. Um, so they looked it up because it was right on the t-shirt and put it on for the whole class and gave Saswayage or our our son a chance to share whatever it is he wanted to share about these videos and about his language and whatnot. And I guess he gave them some teachings about um because they put on Nangus Nangus, uh Twinkle Twinkle Little Star, I suppose. And so I'm what what was shared with me was that you know he shared some teachings about Nokamista Vicki's the grandmother, which is so cute. Um, and then yeah, and then you know, they had a healthy conversation about it at school, and I've heard that, you know, there's been requests from it since, and then the last two to three days that you know he's asked if we he could watch TV. He said, Can I watch TV? Can I watch Minecraft on YouTube, Nishinabe when Minecraft, or Barbara Nolan? And that for me was I was like, oh my god, he's requesting language, and I know he did that before with Minecraft, but I know that that Minecraft was the motivator. So the last couple of days, I'm like, yup, and then I throw on Barbara Nolan. Um that's a huge win for me, because you know, out of all the choices in the world of Disney, Netflix, Prime, all the things, you know, he's asking for Barbara Nolan. So I think part of that is also that his peers took an interest. And we've been saying this, and I heard this again at the conference, but it's um, and I'm not sure if we'll hear it again today, but I keep hearing that the same thing that we've been saying all along, and it's nice to have that reinforce, and that's children rules speak the language that their peers speak, and that's what that's the main motivator. And that also backs up what I've been saying about, you know, when I moved to Austria the first three months, I did not speak any German. It wasn't until I met friends and I wanted to keep up with my friends that I jumped that quickly in my in my speech ability, and it was because they weren't gonna slow down and learn and speak English for the time being when this chick is gonna leave in three months. It was because I wanted to laugh with them and joke with them and socialize with them. So that was my motivator, which again reinforces this. And so there's not too much we can do about that right now. We can't just like plop an immersion school down next to our house and have a bunch of you know children speaking, but it's helpful knowledge to know because all these families that are doing this, it's I think the first time in history that we're learning the language and the way that we're learning it and the way that we're having to navigate it. Um so all of this is, you know, hopefully going to help the future or help us, you know, it's a big trial and error, I think. Like it's a huge everybody just trying to figure it out, you know. So if the more evidence or the more things that, you know, what's the word similarities or recurring themes that we're hearing, I think it's really important for those to be jotted down. And I think, you know, at at the end of having all of our guests on, if you and me wanted to do a recap, I'm hearing a lot of the same things from our guests, like a lot of the same strategies or things that they have noticed with their own children. So I think it would be nice to have that in writing as well. Do an episode on, you know. So far, I think every single person has said that they write down what they don't know and look it up later. That's like a that's been a common denominator between most of the conversations that we've had. Um, and vice versa. So, anywho, we can we can get into it here, but you know, I'm noticing things as we speak to more and more people, and even if it's not the same language, some of the same strategies. Um, so yeah, that was just something I wanted to bring up while we had the chance before um we have our guests join us.

SPEAKER_01 23:39

So all right. Thank you all for listening, and hopefully you'll enjoy this podcast as well.

SPEAKER_03 23:56

Oh, I know it for sure. They're gonna enjoy it. I have a feeling. Uh-huh. We'll wait for her to join us here.

SPEAKER_06 24:14

Nice to meet you. How do you say your name?

SPEAKER_03 24:18

Mashkogwit.

SPEAKER_06 24:21

Mashkogwit.

SPEAKER_03 24:22

Oh my god, this should. Yeah, you got it. And then I hear I'm gonna butcher your name. How do you pronounce your name? Um Garanahawe. Garanah Nahawi.

SPEAKER_06 24:36

Garanahawi. Is that does that sound okay? Yeah, that sounds good.

SPEAKER_03 24:41

Okay. You just correct me or um if I if I mispronounce it because I think that's really important to get that right. Yeah, no, it's perfect. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 24:55

I'm excited. I think I think I'm excited to hear what you have to share.

SPEAKER_06 25:03

Yeah, I chose this time because I thought my daughter will be at school. Might have been easier, but then I couldn't find my car keys this morning. Like they're still lost, so she's home with me. So if you hear her, don't mind.

SPEAKER_01 25:18

Oh, yeah, it's no problem.

SPEAKER_03 25:22

Yeah, so um, where are you where are you living right now? I guess maybe like yeah, if you wanted to introduce yourself and let us know like where you are and what you're doing and stuff, and if you want to use your your language, and we'll we welcome that definitely.

SPEAKER_06 25:42

Okay, awesome. Um, so Gardanahawi jets, the new Ghanawagan is. I'm originally from Ghanawage. Um but I currently live in Ganyang. Um I'm 30 years, 30 years old. I'm Ganyakahaga, and uh I speak Ganyagaha. Um, I've been working in Ganyange for around 10 years. So um I've been working as a language teacher this way. But um, I just recently switched careers like in February because uh I was working in the language nest, but um a few years ago I went to school for uh foraging and medicine making. So um, and I'm currently in school for uh herbal immersion program. So it's just like studying our original medicines and whatnot and trying to bring that back to life. I'm really passionate about that. So I want to make more time for that this year because I've been uh doing a lot of language work for the past decade. So yeah. And then my daughter too, she's four and a half. Um, her name is Agrahwadavit Leave, so she lives with me. Oh yeah, nice.

SPEAKER_03 27:10

Nice. I'm really into um medicines and excuse me, looking at like all of our medicines and their properties and how to use it, but it's tough to do both at the same time, like focus in on one part. I mean, they are they are totally connected and have the a strong relationship. You need one one for the other, but um, but uh I'm like their clan really into all that.

SPEAKER_01 27:40

Yeah. So I'm I'm a teacher as well. Teach in a baby one. I learned it as an adult. Right now I teach I teach adults. That's kind of my what I like teaching, I guess, uh the age group, just to give you kind of a little bit of background of what I do.

SPEAKER_06 27:57

Well, that's awesome. I didn't I didn't um I was more teaching younger kids. I've never taught adults, but it was more like seven to eight year olds. And then I switched to after a few years, I switched to the language nest. So I I never had the opportunity to teach like older people. But um, so it's mostly just been younger ones.

SPEAKER_03 28:19

Yeah, and um what am I doing right now? Oh, I'm so I just finished like one contract doing resource development for a large organization in Ontario, uh Nishnabek Nation and Kenamon, so an education body. And now I'm working in uh in a daycare um kind of consulting and teaching the little ones as well as the teachers and reinforcing the language there and whatnot. But I'm like I've done a couple of things, but mostly been dragged into teaching as as we do when you learn the language, um, or your own language. Um yeah, yeah. So that's a little bit about myself. Um, do you have very many speakers in your community?

SPEAKER_06 29:04

Um here in I feel like there's a lot here in Gunyange. Um a lot of my friends speak, so it's really helpful because they're bringing up their children the same way, like as first language speakers. So my daughter and their children, they all like hang out together, so they all like support each other in that way, so they have their own little like gun geha gang. But they're all like but in it's I don't know, it's really awesome to hear because it's not um it's not like forced, it just comes out really natural, it's just like what they know. So, like to hear them just like they just play in the corner or do something together, and it's all in gonna get. So it's just like really beautiful to see it like unfold so like naturally. And um, so I'm like really grateful for that. Um, a lot of my friends are bringing up their kids in the same way because it could it can be lonely for um like a younger Ganyaka speaker to not um I guess have that type of support of people like their own age. Um but yeah, there's a there's a few speakers out this way, there's a lot of speakers in Gahnawaga as well. Um there's not many like first language speakers left, but there's still a lot.

SPEAKER_01 30:43

So all your friends you said did they learn, they learned to speak or were they did they grow up speaking?

SPEAKER_06 30:51

Um they weren't, I don't think they were first language speakers. No, they weren't first language speakers, but they had um a lot of people in their family were first language speakers, so they grew up around hearing it, but um they learned through uh I guess through their family as well, and then they would take like adult immersion programs, and they were just like in immersion schools growing up, but um yeah, nice, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 31:23

We can get into that, but it's we're noticing like children generally want to speak the language that their peers are speaking, so it's incredible that there's like you have your chaotic naturally and organically supporting each other and giving them that motivation to want to speak with one another. That's that's unreal. Um, I wish that there was more of that here.

SPEAKER_01 31:51

Yeah, it's awesome. Oh, I was just gonna ask what your language was like growing up. Like, did you grow up around it and did you always want to speak it, or was it just like a thing that everyone did?

SPEAKER_06 32:03

Or well, I was raised by my father and he wasn't he wasn't a gun I guess speaker. I didn't I didn't have a fan, I didn't have family that spoke. But um I I guess he was the one that saw like the importance of language because he didn't know how to speak and he knew how hard it was to learn, like especially as an adult. So he made sure to put like uh me and my siblings in um like uh elementary immersion schools. So I was in immersion school until like grade four and then it switched to English. But um, yeah, growing up, I I was always surrounded by like first language speakers, like as teachers, but I mean they were still after me, like stop speaking English, like they're they're getting after me to speak Ganya Geha, but I was always like around it and hearing it, and um, I was able to speak back and I understood it all. But as I got older and after grade four, when you switch to English and you're only learning Ganya Geha like an hour a day, it like made a big difference in my life. Like I um I started to realize that I couldn't respond like in Ganyakeha. If somebody talked to me, like if somebody older came talk to me in Ganyakeha, I would understand everything they're saying, but I couldn't speak back. I would answer in English, and I had like that fear of like, whoa, I don't want to make a I haven't spoken in like so long. I don't want to make a mistake, I don't want to like embarrass myself and like stuff like that. But um uh after high school I took an adult immersion program, and so that's where I um became more advanced in like speaking back to people and understanding more and whatnot. But yeah, we didn't have a we didn't have a Ganegaha speaking family growing up. So it's honestly uh that's why it's it's so um I guess awesome that my daughter can speak now because um our family couldn't speak. So now it's just like awesome to see that she's the first language speaker and yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:16

It's amazing. So the the adult program that you went to, what was that called?

SPEAKER_06 34:22

And um sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off. What were you gonna say?

SPEAKER_01 34:29

I was just asking what was that like that experience?

SPEAKER_06 34:32

Um it was it's called uh Radiuana Nierda. It's it's a two-year um immersion program. I really enjoyed it. I wish it it was longer. It was like a mixed age group too. So you got older people or younger people, or it was uh it was kind of challenging because I was like going to school and then going to work and it was really overwhelming. We all and we're all older too, so we all like were kind of afraid of making mistakes and like whatever, but we were all starting in like the same kind of boat. So we all um, I don't know, we all became friends quickly. So um, and our teachers made us comfortable and created a safe space for us to make mistakes, and that's just how it goes. If you want to learn, you have to be able to accept that you're gonna make mistakes, and it's okay because that's how we learn. But um, it was a really awesome program, and I recommend it to everybody. Okay, but they do a lot of like they incorporated a lot of like land-based learning things, and um a lot of people that well, I grew up uh going to Longhouse. My daughter goes to Longhouse with me too, but I notice a lot of people that take the program, they don't like um some people they they don't go to ceremonies and stuff, but um, once they take the program and they start to understand our language, they feel more confident and um I guess more connected, and then they start going to Longhouse and they start going to ceremony and they start doing all these good things and like they feel more uh uh I guess comfortable and safe going because they I they've created that connection with language. So I always find that super awesome when I see people that that haven't gone before and then they start going, and um so yeah, that's what I that's what I noticed. That's that is really awesome about that program because like language and language is like ceremony, like everything's connected in that way, so that's just really awesome.

SPEAKER_03 36:38

Yeah, that was sort of my experience too. I grew up so disconnected and no one in my family, like my parents, like my mom is non-native, but my dad didn't speak, like it wasn't passed down. But once I started learning language, I felt comfortable enough to enter into ceremonies, even though they weren't my community or I didn't know what the ceremonies were. But just because I knew the language, I could understand like the purpose and the reasoning and the spirituality part to go and feel comfortable in those spaces because it was ingrained right into the words, right? So I I also kind of resonate with that in a sense because like that's what made me feel welcome to like be by myself and walk into um a walk like an open ceremony and participate. It's just well, I know some of the teachings are right in the language, so that's awesome. Yeah, so that's cool that uh you know you've noticed that that that's um common theme.

SPEAKER_01 37:42

So when you um like did you know you wanted to have kids and speak to them or like in the language, or like you said you had friends that around your age, did you all get together and we're like, okay, we're gonna have kids and we're all gonna speak?

SPEAKER_06 38:02

Um well it didn't go like that, but um I think well the the thought when the thought first crossed my mind, I was still in the Navy Wind and Nirates program. And but mind you, when I when I was in that program, I was like 19 years old. So I was still really young, and um there I was still living in Gaunawaga, and um there were some first language speakers, like younger, um younger, younger ones, but um being brought up, but uh the people that were raising them were like a lot older than me, so I never saw somebody like my age raising a first language speaker or anything like that yet. And but like that's when the thought first popped in my head, like, oh, that would be cool. But I I had I guess I had a lot of self-doubt though because I didn't have a family that spoke and I figured it would just be me and all this and whatever. But once I once I graduated um from Radiwan and Near Dats, that's when I started working in Ganyanga right away. And from there I met one of my friends. I didn't know her yet, so the ones my friends here in Ganyanga, so I didn't know her yet. And um, her name is Tageahne Hearn, and um she was her son was around I think three years old at the time. He must have been around three years old when I first met him. And I remember going up to her, asking her something, and then I asked him, and then like he responded in Kunigeha, and I was like, what? Like, because he was so like advanced for his age, and she was like around my age, she's only like a few years older than me, and like I was so like inspired and amazed by it because I was like, hey, we're like same age, and you're able to raise your baby in just the language, and like it was kind of like like an aha moment, like to like see it to believe it, kind of, and sometimes you need that to be able to uh I guess believe in yourself. Some people you just I don't know, you just need to see it to believe it. But um her her older sister as well, um, she raises her kids as first language speakers as well. And so um it was just I don't know, that was around the first time when I started to be like, oh dang, maybe I could maybe it is possible for me to start to raise my uh my children with like language in the home and to be first language speakers. But yeah.

SPEAKER_03 40:42

Nice. You spoke about a language nest um that you've been working at. Was that something that you I guess you said you worked there for 10 years?

SPEAKER_06 40:52

Yeah. Um, I started working with uh when I first started working in Vinyanga, I was working with like like six, seven, eight-year-olds. And then um once I had my daughter, I switched over to the language nest. So um most of the women here would take their children to the language nest. And um, that's what my friends did as well, the ones raising their babies as first language speakers. They took their children to the language nest as well. But yeah, my daughter, she was going there, uh, but she just recently switched to um she's in like nursery now. In our in the language nest, we had it was a few teachers in there, me, two other teachers, and there was like two first language speakers in there. So I thought that was really important to always have uh first language speaker in in the classroom. Well, if you have the opportunity to have a first language speaker, it's really awesome because they're so small, so they get to hear that old language that is kind of, I don't know, it gets lost along the way. So it's really important to have that like that old dialect in I mean for them to hear. And it's really funny because I have a uh a Gahnawagi dialect, so it's a lot different than well, not a lot different, but it's different from an Agwasasne dialect. So I say, like, I I would say Garanahawe for my name, but in Agusasne they would say Galanahawe. So my daughter, I was I was one of her teachers, so she would grow up like in my house, like saying, I would say R is like Anawagi dialect. And then in the language nest, there was um a first language speaker from Aguzasne, and she uses her owls. So my daughter, I thought she would favor my dialect, but no, she's like she's from Agazasne. I was like, what? I mean it's all the same, but yeah, she's she talks like she's uh no. But yeah, it's it's really funny. I'm like, I don't know, but yeah, it's an awesome. I don't know. I find language genes really awesome, um, especially for mothers too, because it gives them that support system of they have other um or well, mothers and fathers, because fathers can go as well. Any parent, you know, or even an auntie and uncle or whatever, if you want to bring somebody, but you get that support, like we're all there for the same reason, you know, we all want our to bring our children up and ourselves as well, um speaking the language, and um, it's like a level where it's like easier, simpler words. So a lot of people feel comfortable going to language, language nests because it's starting from um like a beginner level. So it's it's easier to you're learning along with your child. So it's really awesome, and I I recommend everybody do it.

SPEAKER_01 44:07

So everyone there, um like it's a child and a parent or guardian that has to go there, like it's not just someone just dropping off their kid and then um it just it well it it was originally like that, but now it switched.

SPEAKER_06 44:27

I mean that it was originally it was um it was originally like a language nest, but now it it switched into like if you have the if because everybody is like so busy with their jobs and stuff, so it's like if you have the opportunity to go or if you have the time you can go, but um yeah, they just recently changed how it works, but and is it completely like English free or do they still um um use it use English? Um right now it's no, it's it's all kanikaha. Nice, yeah, it's all it's all gunikaha, it's not um um even when like the teachers like speak to each other, it's um all in Ganyaka because that's important too to um like if you're speaking to your child, that's one thing, but for to hear them speaking, for them to hear you speaking to somebody else is like a whole other thing too, because then they hear that language and how to I don't know, talk to each other in that way. It's it's it's a whole other thing. So it's like my friends too, when I would speak to them, especially when they were really small, like we speak in Ganyat Geha, like out in public or if we're in front of them, because then they hear you. And um, I've realized that like my daughter, I didn't know well, because she only speaks to me in Ganyat Gaha. And um, I didn't really know how much English she knew because she doesn't speak English in our in our home at all. So I um we went away this summer to Oregon, and um she was um, I mean, we go there often. So the last time I had gone there was um, I guess the year before that, and my friend's mother was all like, oh, talking to the other kids, like, oh uh, be mindful. She doesn't speak, uh, she doesn't speak English, she only speaks Mohawk. So just be mindful, whatever. And then um, so this this summer I went there and we're she that's what she told her. And then like I go in the other room and I can hear her speaking English. I was like, what? I was like, I didn't even know she could speak English. She said a whole sentence. I was like, oh my god, I'm in the other room, like almost crying. But I mean it's awesome. Like, you want your kids to know like all these languages, but I just I didn't know because she doesn't speak English to me or like around my friends because she knows that they speak, so it's like you're creating that relationship with your child and like kind of setting that tone, like, okay, she I I never spoke English to her, so she doesn't speak English to me or or my friends because she knows they speak kanygaha, so she speaks kanygaha to them or her friends, she knows. But if she knows somebody, uh well, fast forward to now, if she knows somebody doesn't speak kanyaka, she'll like come run up to me and we're like out if we go back to Ghanawagi or something, she knows like somebody doesn't speak um kanyaka, she'll come to me and be like, uh mama, they don't speak uh kanye geha. I'm gonna switch, I'm gonna talk English to them, okay?

SPEAKER_04 47:58

And I'm like, okay, go ahead.

SPEAKER_06 48:01

But she'll come and like tell me, and I'm like, okay, go ahead. But um, but yeah, but it's that's what I realized is like if you're if you speak English to them, they're gonna think you don't know how to speak kany gaha. So they're gonna they're gonna try and do that because they want to feel they want you to feel included, they want to feel included and whatnot. But if you choose to speak kanigah to her, she's only gonna speak kanighaha. But yeah, that's something I've realized.

SPEAKER_01 48:32

It's amazing to me to like the kids know that, like they just innately know that and they they know the show the social implications by not understanding. So yeah, that's just yeah, just knowing that they know how to change, switch switch a language.

SPEAKER_04 48:54

Yeah, that's they're very smart if you didn't know Ozawa, a little too smart.

SPEAKER_03 49:16

Yeah, that's been a common theme that we've um been hearing recently that I know Ozawa and I could do better on. Um is like, you know, our our kids speak to the dog a lot, but that's because I speak to the dog in the language, but you know, convenience-wise, sometimes like well, all the time Ozawa and I are speaking in English because I'm like, you know, daily life stuff, and I'm like, you know, turn the off into what-da-da-da, right? So that's something that like is a common theme that we're like, yeah, we should be doing that more, way more because it's it's it normalizes it, right? And I don't know why way back when I thought they're like, if we speak English, they won't know what we're saying. Well, no, I'm just teaching them English. But I'd be like, you know, da da da da, and then that got into a bad habit. But um in my head, I'm thinking, oh, they won't, like it's a secret language, they won't know because we speak the language to them, right? Um, but that's yeah, that's really awesome. Like, um, I think that's so sweet that she comes up and she's like, they can't speak to her.

SPEAKER_06 50:24

I I really admire that. Something I I did realize though is that when like bringing up bringing up a first language speaker, only using Gunyakahan home with or and like teaching small kids in a language nest is that there's like a delay in um I guess how much they can speak compared to like English speaking children. I've noticed that like because our words are a lot longer than English words, that there was a little bit of a delay in her speaking. I remember I went to um, I went, I brought her to the park once, and um she was really, I don't know how old she was at the time, maybe like one or two or something. And um, there's this little boy there, and he he spoke a lot of like English, like a lot of words, and I was like, holy speaks a lot. And like I was like thinking like the difference between like raising a first language speaker, there's there is a delay because of how long our words are and how descriptive they are. So a lot of people get discouraged, like that they're not speaking like really young, but it's because our words are so long and descriptive. So there I noticed that there was a delay in how um fast I guess she was able to speak at a young age. So, and then I was talking to other first language speakers, like older ones, and then they said that it was the same way for their children growing up too, that there's a delay because of how long the words are, like how many syllables there are compared to English, because English is a lot easier to learn um because the words are so short. But I thought that was I thought that was uh I don't know, I guess an important thing for people to know so they don't get discouraged. Uh but yeah.

SPEAKER_03 52:17

And I'm guessing similarly, like I feel like this is true for a lot of indigenous languages, but um is Mohawk um a verb-based language, like you know, a lot of verbs versus nouns.

SPEAKER_04 52:33

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's true.

SPEAKER_06 52:40

I don't know. I think our um well gonna get anyways, I know it's it's just really, really descriptive. It's a really hard language. I think that's why it's like so important for to bring uh bring up like small children with language right away because as you get older, it's a lot harder to learn. But um uh yeah, overall, I think it's just it's just really descriptive. It's a it's beautiful, it's alive. That's why it's so hard to learn because it's it's it's it's alive like anything else.

SPEAKER_03 53:12

Yeah, the Schnappin one is the same, like everything is generally a description of like the way our five, or sorry, the way our senses interpret the world and the relationship that we have with it. But with verb-based stuff, you use like millions of conjugations, like there's millions of ways of like me to it, it to hurt, da-da-da. And it that takes a while to get to know versus English, where you just can move words around however you want in a sentence. And I think you know, we say delayed, but Western society like gives us this timeline that is like, well, they should be speaking by this, whatever. And our son, he didn't start speaking until he was about three, right? Mont or Ozawa. Yeah. And we were in COVID, so it was like we were only speaking the language to him at home for the majority of the time. So one is that they had less act exposure to people in general to hear more language, but um yeah, it like the speech pathologist or whatever therapist was just like, no, he's fine. He's just speaking the English. That's it's not a language problem. It's uh it's like because he's speaking the shnob, or he's hearing it and he's probably going through the same thing, right? Like our words are like the whole sentence is one word, right? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 54:37

It's a lot more, a lot more descriptive. It's funny when some people are like ask me for a word sometimes, and I'm like, well, where? Who? Why? Like you have to ask all these questions. Like I'm like, I can't just answer it like that. You gotta tell what time of day I'm just but yeah, it is uh it is pretty hard. And so your your son is you said your son is is he three or he's five now. Our daughter's seven. Oh, okay. And our son is five, yeah. Oh, okay. So my daughter's my daughter's almost five too, because she was she was born during COVID as well. So it was kind of like um we weren't really going out and about and like seeing all kinds of people too. So it was kind of like um it helped her with her language, I'd say, in a way, you know, as isolating as it was. But you know, it was it helped it helped in that way. Um, but my daughter, we've always lived alone together though. It was it's always just been uh me and her in the household since she's been born too. So she's never heard like there's never been like English in the home at all. So she's um we had that as well.

SPEAKER_01 55:55

Did you did you feel confident in your level of speaking?

SPEAKER_06 56:01

Like um, to well, yeah, I did. Um what do you what do you mean?

SPEAKER_01 56:15

Just because we talk about like as adults, when we learn the language, like there's so much to learn in the language, right? How to conjugate and all of that. And um, I know for some people they don't feel like they're uh at a high enough level to speak only, say only in Ganyageha. They might oh, I don't know enough, so I don't I don't want to speak at all because I don't want to teach them the wrong the wrong way of speaking.

SPEAKER_06 56:44

Yeah, yeah, I know what you mean. Um well with her, I feel like because I was because I was uh a language teacher already and I had um done adult immersion programs, I had a I mean well I have an advanced level of language, but um from when they're from when they're really young, I feel like it's a more of a beginner level. It's like uh they're so small, but I did notice that I was using words that I never really I had to go like research words because I didn't uh it's all about your environment when like your language, your lingo, and what you know, it's like what you're surrounded with and what you surround yourself with, and that's your everyday language. But then me, I have this new baby, and I'm like, I don't know these like I don't know, like breastfeeding words or like stuff like that. Like I've never I've I didn't know those those words, so I had to like call somebody and ask them and then write it all down and then figure it out and little things like that. But um, for the most part, it was a little bit like mostly just commands in the beginning or like things like that, but it was a little bit easier. Nahora? Okay, got so kiddie see. She um, but yeah, so it was a little bit um I felt like I had confidence in that way, but now because I've been teaching um, I guess younger ones for so long that now I feel like I feel like my uh fluency has like decreased in a way because I've been teaching like a lower level for so long that I feel like now she is she is so advanced that I feel like I need to take like a more advanced course or something to um I guess support her in that way. But she has um the class she's in now, her nursery class, she's being taught by a first language speaker too. So she gets all of that. So I'm like really grateful for that because I'm I'm not a first language speaker and you know, I don't I don't know it all, not perfect. So she gets to hear that all day. So I'm really, really grateful for that because sometimes like even even like I still make mistakes and I um but I'm open to like people correcting me, and I think that's like a we have to be open to people correcting us if we want to, you know.

SPEAKER_03 59:16

Um yeah, that's unreal. As if she gets a first language speaker as a teacher, and then like you know, you felt confident enough and um yeah, like confident enough to to just to do it and to be humble enough to know that like you may not have every single thing, but that you can go out and find that and do your best to implement it in the household. Like that's incredible because I know I've I've experienced imposter syndrome for like I my language level was probably not where it needed to be when I started, but I just wanted to give them whatever I could. So that's like it's like just incredible.

SPEAKER_06 1:00:00

that you know you're you're able to do that and she has that access at school as well and then comes home to it and it's reinforced in the home like um that it really is moving yeah well I think I was a little I think I may have been uh a little extreme with it though I'm just gonna know but tell me I want to hear about it because that's good I need like how can I get that okay I had a well when she was first born in the hospital even with I um yeah I gave birth to her in the hospital and I was like telling the nurses and the doctor I was like oh um would you mind like would you mind not talking when she's born because uh I don't want I don't want the first language she heared to be like uh you know someone else's language so they're gonna talk in our language you know and um so she got so they yeah they respected that and they're like yeah they're quick way so she had uh so yeah they respected that and they're like yeah sure so the first language she heard was our language and um and then when we uh just like when I brought her home and yeah from the from day one was I was already speaking couldn't you get her to her and whatnot but like raising her I noticed that um like with with TV like she didn't really watch TV that often uh I didn't I didn't really let her watch it but if if she did well I mean well she was always outside anyways for the most part but um if she did watch television it was always like non-verbal shows I don't know if not like Tom and Jerry but like stuff like that like you know what I mean but like things like that she would watch so I feel like kids only look at the pictures anyways but um for a while yeah just like stuff like that or she would watch like Dida Dunguari it's like a a television show so she really enjoyed that and you know that supported her her language journey as well but um I feel like television is like a is like a like it's an inspiration to children because they're watching that every day and they kind of want to be like whatever's going on on the TV. So if they're hearing that English that concert English they're gonna want to mimic it. So yeah she didn't watch a lot of TV I mean now she does she's she's older now so but like the beginning years like of your child's life are the most important because like that's when they're gonna decide what they're gonna which language they're gonna favor. So I was really strict about like television even toys like I'd buy more like natural toys like wooden toys and like not ones that were like singing English songs but um yeah I found um those things were were important too is there a lot of resources I think like well that one television show no quarter everybody loves that show um that one but for kids not really like any other shows I don't really um I don't know because I'm like thinking like there doesn't I mean like I'm thinking about long ago we all we did was speak there wasn't like anything like fancy there wasn't any like all the like computers and all these things and it's like as simple as just speaking and I think we like try to complicate things sometimes but when when you get down to it it's literally just we just need to be consistently speaking to them.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:04

I don't know if later on after the podcast is over or whatnot but if you have a couple of those nonverbal shows if you ever think of them and want to write them down that might be helpful for um that might be helpful to share as well just we tried doing something similar where um where we it was either in the language or we tried to have things on that was similar like pingu or you know something that there's no real like language being spoken um or we would switch it to a different language like if people gave us a toy that spoke like we'd put it into Spanish instead of the English limit as much yeah Monty or Ozama was always like trying to like fiddle with the to turn like the buzz light year into Spanish instead of English or whatever right that's so funny.

SPEAKER_06 1:05:03

Yeah um I noticed too that um uh she I'm just trying to think back to when she was really young I wrote I wrote a list of what I used to do just to remind myself I remember my um I remember when she was really young my father he doesn't speak so um when I was I'm like he knew that I was like trying to bring her up like a first language speaker and always talking to her so he she was teaching him words now so it was like bringing language to like my family my extended family and so he was trying now to like learn these things um from her to like encourage her to speak and you know make her feel included so I thought that was really awesome too and know what that's quadago okay what's a quadago hugging but um what else was I gonna say um yeah I don't know it's just really beautiful to see something I don't know it unfolds so naturally because I've never I don't know I've never experienced that before so I've only ever seen it in like a school setting and then I don't know just to see it unfold so naturally in your home is just like one of the I don't know I guess like one of sounds awkwardly but like one of the greatest things I've ever like been able to be a part of you know like I don't know it's just awesome.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:56

Okay.

SPEAKER_06 1:06:58

Um so when you're another family is that did that like encourage them to use more language yeah I felt like it helped um well my my siblings as well um they were in like immersion school too but they don't like they don't speak but once she was born it's like hey you guys better speak better speaker so they do so they do and they they they encourage her and they they want her to feel like you know included and um but yeah I noticed too that um I don't know I thought it was really awesome I felt so I felt so proud my I went to I would bring her to um the doctors like for her checkups and whatnot and it was here it was in Ghana. So she'd go every I don't know year every few months or whatever and um and one of her it you found it all on us let's do um her nurse was uh talking to me and it was how I didn't it was our our last uh visit at the doctor's office oh yeah it was our last visit at the doctor's office like in the the well baby clinic or something and uh she she would switch to like a private doctor or something now and so I was talking to the nurse that I I've seen her like over the years and um kind of built like a little bit of a relationship seeing her like often or whatever. And um she told it was our last visit together so I was like oh no I'm not gonna see you anymore and she's like you know she's like I felt um really really inspired that you and your daughter only speak ganikaha to each other and so I decided to take like a class now to try and learn Ganekaha now it's just like it's only like once or twice a week but I was like oh my god that's so awesome like and I felt like so proud of her and like I was so happy that like my daughter inspired her to be able to like to take that you know that healthy risk and that step to learning language and you know it's a lot harder to um do that once you get older I feel because you you don't want to make a mistake you want to do this so it takes a lot to just be like okay I'm gonna go and I'm gonna start from scratch and I'm gonna do this and I was so proud of her and happy to hear that she went she felt inspired by her to go and do that. But yeah I thought I'd share that.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:33

That's beautiful that was that was my next question anyway.

SPEAKER_06 1:09:36

So like you know something that was really rewarding or something that you know was such a um a special moment in your learning journey and your household um immersive household journey um we kind of just answered anyway unless there's something else that you have but that's that's amazing because they're you're reaching out and you didn't even mean to like you're extending into community right yeah I was I was really happy for her time do what okay why so I don't guys have your daughter do you have any um so say for those that are learning or continuing on their learning as they're helping raise their children in the home with language or wherever however they're doing that um maybe not children maybe you know whoever they're they're taking care of their nieces or nephews whatnot um you have any like I don't want to say like study tips or like ways of reinforcing your own learning or anything like what was like most helpful for you in your journey or things that you continue to do that might help others um you know when they hit roadblocks or when they're you know wanting to start say that's a big question so you can take a minute or any like uh resources or um you know any kind of things that you use that you would recommend if if you don't have any um you know suggestions off the top of your head um I feel like it's hard because everybody's situation is different and we don't all live the same lives so it's it's hard to guys go what do I say did you have to say that Nanda um yeah so I feel like everybody's everybody's living a different life and we're not like we don't all have the same um situations we don't all have the same resources we don't all have like the same amount of children or some we don't like we all have different circumstances so it's a hard it's hard so I feel like we can um we just have to do what we can or whatever's available to us and um and just try our best like there's a lot of like online programs now that I see people posting which might be easier for people that have like not a lot of time or not a lot of um they're working a lot or they have a lot of kids and and it's just like an hour a day or um once or twice a week but I feel like um for me what really helped me the most was just biting that bullet and doing that two year immersion program because it really like it really um helped with my language a lot. Like if I if I didn't take that program I don't think I would be raising a first language speaker right now because that's how much I learned from that program. And I'll always be grateful for that program as like like overwhelming as it was like balancing life. It was really rewarding in the end and um they do have like different resources at um at the KOR at a wana they sell different like books and whatnot that you can use to like learn at home or even just like reading the dictionary too we have like more dictionary stuff and just like there's like phrases and words and stuff like that. And like if you if you really don't have time because I know it's hard like life gets busy and we're all trying to balance everything but I feel like um just taking that first step and saying like I'm I'm willing to learn or I want to learn is like a big it's a big thing.

unknown 1:14:11

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:18

So do you maintain um like do you talk to like who else do you talk to nowadays?

SPEAKER_06 1:14:26

Like just your friends or do you have like phone speakers that you are in contact with just a main I feel like um when the kids are around we all speak Kuniga. But I mean we still speak English to each other too but um I think I um if I don't know words I'll write them down in a journal and then I'll if we're hanging out me and my daughter and then she asks something and I don't know how to say it I'll write it down and then I'll go and call somebody or ask somebody or I'll ask her teacher her teacher's actually my age too so and she's a first language speaker. So I'll I'll go and ask her like how do you say this or um but that's one way that I um try to continue to advance my my level of speaking but um I eventually would like to start taking like a night course or something just to keep up with her because it's like um I don't know I guess I just didn't expect her to like be that advanced at such like a young age. So it's like oh dang I gotta I gotta take a class now or something but I mean I speak really well it's just I uh I want it to be like really correct and you know this uh but yeah those things but it's it's hard to it's hard to find balance right now too because I'm in school for like medicine and whatnot. So it's just about uh I guess doing what you can yeah yeah so um I guess we'll start wrapping up I think like what you shared was just awesome and you're just you're raising your child and she's a first speaker like that's just like amazing like just amazing accomplishment um is there anything that you wanna add at the end or anything you want to promote not really I guess I'll just say that um it doesn't matter how much language um you know as long as you're trying and you know doing your best then that's awesome like um you don't need to like raise a first language speaker like you just whatever level you're at and as long as you're trying then that's super awesome and it's like really great and to just um I guess get over that fear of making mistakes and just um believe in yourself and you know we're all worthy of learning our language we're all worthy of learning our ceremonies and you know um don't ever let anybody tell you you you're not because you are and um you know creating that relationship with um language and ceremony is so important and it gives our children like the confidence they need and you know um that connection to who we are as people and um just to encourage everybody to you know take that healthy risk and because it's so rewarding in the end to feel that connection is just I don't know it's really awesome but um I also do realize that in order for like people to want to learn our language and our ceremonies and stuff we also need to like focus on like um a lot of like healing in our communities and um create more like safe space for our people to be able to um want to learn these things and yeah just create more opportunities of healing for our people because when we're coming from a hurt place we're not really wanting to learn or do these things you know we're not really like focused on that so I feel like we'd have more people learning language and ceremony if we're taking care of them in that good way to um I don't know just to feel okay you know we need to do that good work as well if we want more people speaking if we want people in the long house and whatnot and just um being good to each other you know it's as simple as that just being good to each other and um yeah having a safe space because then we're willing to make mistakes and then if we're making mistakes then we're learning so that's uh that's uh I think all all I have to say I don't know I probably I forgot a few things but I'm just uh no it's awesome no that was really like there's a lot of powerful words there that I'm taking and putting in my bundle like you know my little invisible bundle of like uh of tools helping through life I have one too take that healthy risk of like oh that's quote book material right there everything you know you said some really awesome things but I'm like oh I really like the way you put that take that healthy risk and start saying to people my other advice is never go to Costco in the weekend of asked to don't go but it was really awesome to meet you guys thank you for thank you for asking me to come on and um it's it's really inspiring work you guys are doing and you know I'm honestly not uh not very extroverted or anything you know I'm more introverted so it's like um but I feel like it's important for um I guess for me to share with other people that it is possible for you know like I come from a family that doesn't speak so some people just need to see it to believe it just like I did you know I I felt like I needed to see it to believe in myself when I saw my friend so like this gives people the opportunity to hear um uh the different tools I've used to help hopefully encourage others to speak language and and the home and whatnot. So thank you guys for for having this podcast. It's really awesome.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:00

Yeah Chimie Gwitch and the way to you as well like it's it's really um it's been really inspiring and really um really amazing and like kind of filling my heart up hearing a lot of the things that you have to share and um I'm yeah really grateful that we got to meet you and when Monty you know told me about what he saw you know like raising a first speaker or like oh my gosh maybe you need we need to get her on and to share her story and um motivate others just the way you motivated us and um yeah it's really nice that we can come together to to share our journeys together and the work that that we're all doing. So I say a big uh thank you to you and everything you're doing for your just your your children and your community and yourself. I think that's all we have so thank you very much and we hope you have an awesome day awesome week awesome year you guys too that's an honor on anything check up in the way thanks so much for listening to our podcast and waiting our sound to reach us by email find us at our sound period podcast at gmail.com you can find all of our links to IMEACH Instagram etc at our link tree which is linkrperiod e slash no dot our sound our theme song was done by myself being my copper clay and artwork completed by the shee men my younger brother Brent O'Shamp