Prepare to have your perspective on youth sports revolutionized, as we sit down with the mastermind Jason Colleran, creator of the Kinetic Arm. This episode isn't just another sports talk; it's an eye-opening conversation on the urgent need to protect our young athletes from the rife overuse injuries in baseball. We'll bring into focus the game-changing benefits of the Kinetic Arm, both for the athlete in recovery and those proactively seeking to enhance their performance and extend their sports longevity. Unveil the truth behind the skepticism of new technologies and the cultural shift that's essential for the well-being of the next generation of sports stars.
Your heart will pound a little harder as we candidly navigate the ethical maze of youth baseball, and the sometimes detrimental impact of travel sports on our kids' health. We'll expose the pitfalls of experience without expertise and the dangers lurking behind shiny promises of 'snake oil salesmen' in the training world. Listen to our outright challenge to the traditional training methods, as we advocate for qualified coaching and the imperative for parents to exercise due diligence in choosing programs that prioritize their child's longevity in sports.
Finally, journey with us through the entrepreneurial hurdles Jason has valiantly overcome, all to keep his innovation affordable and true to its mission. With an unwavering dedication to athlete safety, we'll discuss how the Kinetic Arm transcends baseball, finding its place in multiple sports domains. As we wrap up, join our rallying cry for community support and engage with a movement that places athlete health at the forefront. This is more than a podcast episode; it's a call to action for anyone who cares about the future of youth sports.
Prepare to have your perspective on youth sports revolutionized, as we sit down with the mastermind Jason Colleran, creator of the Kinetic Arm. This episode isn't just another sports talk; it's an eye-opening conversation on the urgent need to protect our young athletes from the rife overuse injuries in baseball. We'll bring into focus the game-changing benefits of the Kinetic Arm, both for the athlete in recovery and those proactively seeking to enhance their performance and extend their sports longevity. Unveil the truth behind the skepticism of new technologies and the cultural shift that's essential for the well-being of the next generation of sports stars.
Your heart will pound a little harder as we candidly navigate the ethical maze of youth baseball, and the sometimes detrimental impact of travel sports on our kids' health. We'll expose the pitfalls of experience without expertise and the dangers lurking behind shiny promises of 'snake oil salesmen' in the training world. Listen to our outright challenge to the traditional training methods, as we advocate for qualified coaching and the imperative for parents to exercise due diligence in choosing programs that prioritize their child's longevity in sports.
Finally, journey with us through the entrepreneurial hurdles Jason has valiantly overcome, all to keep his innovation affordable and true to its mission. With an unwavering dedication to athlete safety, we'll discuss how the Kinetic Arm transcends baseball, finding its place in multiple sports domains. As we wrap up, join our rallying cry for community support and engage with a movement that places athlete health at the forefront. This is more than a podcast episode; it's a call to action for anyone who cares about the future of youth sports.
Hello and welcome to the Kingdom coaching podcast, where we discuss the world of club sports through the lens of Christ. I am your host, micah Beaton. Hey, hey, hey, what's going on? Everybody, thank you again for tuning in to another episode of the Kingdom coaching podcast. Today, I'm blessed to be sitting down with the owner, founder and creator of the Kinetic Arm, which is the world's first and only dynamic arm stabilizer. Please welcome, jason Colleran.
Speaker 2:Thanks for having me. The Kinetic Arm is a way to offload stress to help prevent overuse injuries. We see that the arm injury epidemic, injury rates are still going up, so it's time we start offloading stress externally. It's a great way to, even if it just gets them through while they're still growing, while the growth plates are soft and they're having C versus Z, oshkosh lotters, things like that. So it's kind of an arm care solution that they can wear Right and you offer it in a few different models.
Speaker 1:I know you have it in the youth model. It's like the K2 youth sleeve. Is that correct? Is that what it's called?
Speaker 2:Yeah, the K2 youth sleeve. The material is different than the adult sleeve because the arms aren't just hip Correct. We had to get that done.
Speaker 1:Yep, so you have the K2 adult, and then you have is it called, the K1, where it's more of the arm brace. Is that what that one, that model's called, or what is that one?
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah, the K1 is for more, you know, coming off of injury or surgery, so it provides a lot more support.
Speaker 1:Okay. So if someone's coming off of, yeah, surgery, injury or even, would you say, pain in general, if somebody was saying that they're having shoulder pain, elbow pain, would you, if they're an adult, would you direct them to the K1 brace rather than the K2 or we're always going to say, you know, we recommend, you know, getting cleared to throw by a medical professional first.
Speaker 2:Sure, you know, because it's baseball. So people are going to, kind of, you know, throw through the pain and play at all costs.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:It depends on kind of the severity of the issue that they're having. But we have a lot of dads or coaches that just want to be able to keep throwing with their kids or throwing batting practice. Sometimes the K1 is a better option for them.
Speaker 1:Sure no, that makes sense. So can you explain how it works?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so as the arm goes into max external rotation or that end layback position, there's not a thrower on earth that can take their arm all the way back to where we see it passively go. So the whole idea behind it is, if that's a passive range where the muscular system, you know, can't really stabilize the joints, that's where the tension picks up that end range so it can offload stress until you get back into that safer range. So you still have to use all your muscles, you know, to do the throwing, you still get the adaptations that you want. It's just that in that harmful range we can decrease stress to help keep the athletes healthier and, you know, minimize overuse injuries.
Speaker 1:Sure. So in addition to that, what benefits are there to using that arm sleeve If someone's not experiencing any pain? They're just a youth athlete or a high school college athlete that isn't experiencing any pain. What benefits would someone see from your product?
Speaker 2:There's several benefits, even if you don't have pain. So first, one could be use it as kind of a preventative tool, so that way you have less arm stress. So hopefully you know, as far as chronic workload, you're not going to have that pain down the road. We also have athletes that use it, let's say, on their recovery days, if they're pitchers, because it'll cut their recovery time almost in half because they're able to shot and throw without press. And then for position players or even pitchers and catchers, you can make a lot more throws and get a lot more reps in practice without all the wear and tear, because, keep in mind, we don't always know if there's fraying or tearing of that tissue. So the best thing we can do is safeguard against it and make sure that we don't go down that road, because once you do start to have the pain, that's really tough to get it to go away.
Speaker 1:Sure, absolutely, and that's exactly the reason why we purchased it and how we kind of got connected. So my son's 12 years old and he plays baseball and he's predominantly a catcher, but he pitches a lot and then he plays third base a lot, a lot of wear and tear on his arm all the way around. And I'm sitting here looking at it from a parent's perspective, seeing my son playing baseball year round, seeing all this training, all this wear and tear, and asking myself OK, what can I do as a parent to see longevity, to encourage longevity in my son's arm, because he wants to play as baseball as long as possible? If he had to choose between and again, I'm not saying you can't play baseball year round and enjoy it for the rest of your life, but if you had to choose between throwing, you know, let's say, 10,000 balls you know year round for eight years of his life and then not being able to play ever again, you know choosing between that and then throwing you know a couple of hundred pitches and being able to do it for the rest of his life, I think he would choose the latter, and I think a majority of people would too, like offload.
Speaker 1:You know the amount of wear and tear within a year or in a season, just so you can increase the longevity of the game. Because again, it comes back down to the love of the game and that's why I think you're you know, part of the motive that you design this product is, you see, a lot of other issues that are going on in the youth world and we can kind of get into that in a little bit. But the other question I kind of wanted to ask you, along with this and I know we talked about it in our last conversation and we don't need to mention any names here but is there anything else out there on the market that's comparable to this?
Speaker 2:There's nothing, nothing even close. There's some, some devices that kind of work as a mobilizers or range limiters for the shoulder Sure, and we don't want to restrict range there because you know we have to go back. There's the certain positional demands and then, as far as the elbow, all that there are, I mean there's compression sleeves, but right. I mean there's so much, you know so much movement on that superficial tissue that it's not going to provide any support for you know the joints structure.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know some of the conversations I've had. You know I'd be curious to know how many kinetic arms you guys have sold in the Omaha area in the last eight months. If it's significant or not, I don't know, but I feel, like everyone I talk to, it's like you need to check this out. You know, because it blew my mind, especially this year, and I don't know if it's one of those things like when, as soon as you start wanting a specific car, that's all you see, you know or you know what, not like that. But as soon as we bought the kinetic arm, it just seemed like God put all these people in my life that were talking to me about their son or daughter having an arm issue. And I'm like, and I pull up the website and I was like you need to check this out Like I'm not. You know I don't work for kinetic arm. I'm not getting any, any, any. You know residuals from this at all. But my son bought this. You know well, I bought it for my son and he wasn't having any arm pain prior, but he felt like he could go longer, he could throw longer without getting as tired.
Speaker 1:And I would just have these conversations with these parents and they were just kind of some of them are kind of skeptical, like oh, I don't, I don't know, that seems kind of kind of weird. You know, I'm just like okay, but you're also the same parent that was smiling when they were telling me that their son, who's 13 years old, has to get Tommy John surgery. Like you know, and and I know we talked about that and that's that's kind of a funny topic where parents these days are encouraging that, you know, like that kind of like braggie, like showing off the scar of the Tommy John surgery for these young kids and you know, arm pain is almost like a badge of honor and like, fortunately, the coaches and people I put myself around do not see it that way, but there are those out there that do, and so it's. It's been interesting to people that I've that I've come across and said, you know, I've tried to point them in that direction because I think your product is like to your point, there's nothing else out there like it and it's so unique. And so, you know, when I was talking to these kids, you know, we've we talked about it in our last conversation the growth plates.
Speaker 1:They're constantly, you know, developing, you know, and there's so much wear and tear put on these kids's arms and we're not thinking about technology, you know, like you know, knee braces and stuff like that have been around forever, but anything that's related to an arm, all of a sudden we get, we get kind of kind of fearful, fearful of the unknown, you know, and I know there's a few people that that are in my life that I that I respect highly and they don't disagree with this product. I think it's just they're unsure because they they don't know the science behind it. And I feel like that's probably a lot, you know a lot, a lot of that of the people that are skeptical or cynical of your product, which I imagine is probably few, because there's so many case studies, there's so much public, published science out there backing up your product and there's all these high end athletes that are, you know, giving phenomenal testimonies. I mean, I know several of the of the pitchers from the, from the from team team Japan, who just won the WBC this last year, are very publicly using your product and giving you feedback constantly, um, you know, but again, I think it comes back to that the fear of the unknown.
Speaker 1:And I'm, you know, I'm not smart enough to to answer a lot of the questions. I remember getting off the phone with you and you were explaining all the science and you were explaining all this to me and I was like, okay, I think I've got about 1% of what he what he explained. All I know is that when my son puts it on, it makes him feel like he can, he can play longer and, uh, the, the science makes sense to me. It doesn't mean I can always explain it, but I try to, you know, encourage people to go onto the website and watch these videos and testimonials that are from non-paid people, like they're just, they're straight up testimonials.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we haven't. We still haven't paid a single dollar for any of the testimonials on the website. And, uh, the the support from the medical you know community has has been a big catalyst for our growth. Um, and back to what you're saying with people being scared of the unknown. They should be scared of the of what's known. And we know that over 50% of out of the court elbow or shoulder pain at some point during a competitive season. So to hear the kind of I don't want to say it's a stupid comment like well, just learn how to throw properly.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:So you have no way of accurately monitoring how much stress is is happening with every throw that your child makes. And not only that, but how are you monitoring constantly? And you even know what the threshold is of that growth plate or that's being stressed. So they should be more concerned with the known because, um, I mean, there's so much data out there showing, I think, you're 36 more times likely to have an injury. You know if you're throwing wall of fatigue right and kids are going to be fit because they don't want to stop playing. And then you know when the kids do report that elbow or shoulder pain at some point during a competitive season again over 50% and they're 7.5 times more likely to have injury or surgery down the road.
Speaker 2:So the the known is what people should be afraid of. And then seeing that, uh, last year, you know, baseball perspectives reported that there was a an increase of 44% increase in elbow and shoulder injuries and major league baseball from from the previous year, and they're a lot more serious. So the fact that even at at that top level where they have, you know, two dozen medical professionals and strength coaches and biomechanists and all this fancy technology, and they still can't figure out how to prevent preventable injuries. Um, that's what people should be scared of, because it's not, it's not hard to prevent right.
Speaker 1:So why? Why do you think that went up? I mean, that's, that's, that's a crazy number, right, that it went up by 44% in a year. Why do you? Do you have any thoughts on that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think the whole. Um, you know, velocity at all costs and everybody wants to grow hard. So, like a sprint car versus a diesel engine yeah, you're going to go fast and guess what? It's going to break down.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Okay, um, plenty of athletes. You know here in my facility that at one point, through 100 miles an hour and they either couldn't throw a strike, you know which, obviously then velocity gets you nowhere, or arm blew out. And when you hear people talk about, oh, it's the pitch count, it's not the pitch count. And if, if that's their excuse, then that shows how poor and how much they're training or how poor of a thought process they have and just how incredibly bad they are training athletes. Because all the you know the distance running is still done. There's no distance running in baseball. So what is the desired goal of that?
Speaker 2:So I think I told you I had trained two athletes here in the off season, you know, last season at Naz Nunez, mvp of the Futures game, I picked up in the rule five draft by the Angels, Erna the national, sorry. So we're proud of him. And then Tanner Folds. You know, in college she won freshman of the year but he threw 10 complete game shutouts and he had no arm pain. So it's the way that we train to be explosive all out, max effort, explosion, rest, explode, rest.
Speaker 2:So I think, I think there's still still a lot of change that that needs to happen in baseball, but again at the higher levels. You got to remember there's a hundred other guys, you know, waiting behind you to take your place. So it's, it's kind of get back in wonder, well, whose responsibility is it? Because I've talked about and they say oh well, you know, it's not on them, it's not on the strength coaches, the coaches are just their coach. So unless you know, unless they kind of take matters into their own hands the parents for the kids or, you know, adult athletes, then I don't, I don't see it getting any better.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, that's. That's an interesting correlation and I would have to agree with you on that, because we've seen pitchers go few and fewer and fewer innings in major league baseball, which I absolutely hate. That the idea of the starter is almost a thing of the past and it's just an opener. It's just like, okay, you go to any, it's like what, and? But yet we're seeing more and more arm injuries and I'd be curious I don't know if you have any numbers of the percentage of arm injuries, like in the 80s, you know, do you, do you have any like statistics on that?
Speaker 2:I did see a paper that from I think it was from 2006 until 2012, or 2009 until 2016, tommy John surgery or UCL surgery went up. I think it was 900%.
Speaker 1:Since that?
Speaker 2:from 2006, from 2006, you said it was either from six to 12, okay, nine to 16, okay and from nine to 16, that would make.
Speaker 1:That would make sense. That would make sense Because that was, I mean, pitchers starting pitchers were still going deep, but that was kind of like the transition out of pitchers regular going seven innings like they were. It was kind of transitioning out of that time. So you know, I know we one thing we talked about last time, because there's that old timer mentality that I'm going to say is like, well, nolan Ryan didn't use this, like you're right, it wasn't, it wasn't available. So does that make it wrong? Because, Nolan Ryan I mean like you can play that one of game all day If it existed during Nolan Ryan's time, would he have used it? I'd be surprised if he didn't give a second look at it. But that's just well, the yeah in the same.
Speaker 2:You know the people that make that comment. You know now everybody argues about ice and how. There's all this data showing that. You know ice is not the best thing for recovery, but but Nolan Ryan did it. I'd be profan right. We've had, we've seen this guy I think he pitched in the major leagues, kip Gross, and he keeps making these just incredibly ignorant comments on on Facebook that I see in these groups and saying well, if Babe Ruth didn't do it, I don't teach it.
Speaker 2:Well, eight years old yeah was getting drunk and smoking, so yeah, right, yeah, yeah, yeah the coaches, the doctors, have at least quit. You have no business being around baseball. It's terrible.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, and that's. And that's funny because that brings me to my like, my next point, where people are so quick to be fearful of technology but we're not as fearful of of ignorant teachers, you know it. Just, it's so backwards to me, like we, we don't want to see logic and science but we don't want to believe that my son or daughter's trainer doesn't know what they're talking about. Like a funny example I'll give you is this, this one father that I that I met recently he's got a 12 year old son, pretty, pretty, scrawny, you know, little league level ball player, a nice kid and he was. We were talking about baseball bats and training and stuff like that. And he said, yeah, like my son's hitting trainers got him using a BB core bat. And I took a step back on, like a BB core, like they don't make him in anything like drop 10. He's like, no, it's a, it's a drop three. And I was like a drop three. And I'm like that's insane, like why. He's like, oh, it's, it's all about bat, bat speed. And I'm like, okay, like bat speeds important after you have mechanics, right, it's like, again, going back to like velocity, like velocity is important after you have mechanics.
Speaker 1:And here's this dad. He got so offended that I called that crazy. But you know we don't want to think that's wrong, but like he would, you know that'd be the same kind of person that would look at a you know scientifically proven product like your arm sleeve and be like, hmm, I don't know about this. Yeah, babe Ruth didn't use this and it's like what? Like they're, they're, they're so, they're so lack of logic in in your comments there. But that's kind of the world of of travel sports anymore, isn't it, jason? It's just there's so little logic that enters into it. It's it's, it's so feeling and emotion-based, and if it makes the mom and dad or the kid feel good, then that's all that matters, and a lot of that's ignorance.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's a. It's kind of what we see when parents bring their athletes to train. You know it's.
Speaker 2:it's almost like they're living vicariously through them and maybe you know, back back then, like when I was growing up, you know, travel ball it wasn't everywhere, it was. You know, just kind of I don't want to say for those that could afford it, but you know, back then that's how, that's how it was where I was growing up. But now it's like there's. You know, anybody will take your money and tell you it's a select team. So it's almost like a, it's almost like a status symbol for the parents Big time.
Speaker 2:So that again it's unfortunate, because I've had several, several parents come in here with their kids and they'll tell me they played, you know, 60 or 80 games in a summer or in season. I mean that's that's what we played in college. So to hear that that age, I mean that's that's just flat out child abuse. So, yeah, it's tough to hear.
Speaker 1:It is, you know, and the the idea of like fall baseball. I was having a conversation about this not super long ago with a friend of mine and I told him, like, for my son, like who's you know, he's 12, 12 years old. I was like I won't let him play fall baseball as long as he's playing select travel baseball because his arm needs a break. And you know this, this. This gentleman was like he's like, yeah, I absolutely agree, like, at this age, fall baseball is absolutely insane. There comes a point where that becomes like showcase season, you know, and it becomes a little more, you know, concentrated.
Speaker 1:But the idea you know that there's so many teams at you know from, I mean, I think, nine, 10 and up, especially if you're triple A or majors, you're, you're playing 60, 70 games spring and summer and then you go and you play six more tournaments in the fall and I had several conversations this fall with parents that have their sons in in fall ball and again, I'm not bashing it completely, but especially for those kids that are pitching and their regular pitchers and catchers in the in the regular season and they're going and they're throwing hard for another three months Again, like I think of, like the arm. There's so much traction on there and you're just wearing the tread off. And and for what? For for an 11? You fall baseball game. That's going to get your son noticed by who you know. And even if they get noticed, I mean sorry, go ahead.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think some of these parents think the Yankees are going to draft their 10 year old.
Speaker 1:Oh, my goodness.
Speaker 2:But here's, here's as easy, the easiest solution. So I just had family in town from Australia, nephew's 10, maybe 11. And over there they don't have kids pitch until they're 10 or 11 years old. They have them hitting off a machine. So guess what? The game goes faster. They get a lot more reps in kids. Arms aren't getting, and not only that, but why do we have kids using the same weight ball as adults? That would that about as much sense as a kid using a 30 ounce bat. Yep, and people would say, oh, it's ridiculous. It's like, yeah, it is ridiculous. So why are we expecting kids to do that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's do is not but no really think if we eliminated you know kid pitch at that young age, even if it was just for summer ball or for you?
Speaker 1:know absolutely.
Speaker 2:That would help with development a lot more than just, you know, putting kids on the mound and beating them up, because those arm injuries, as you probably heard and maybe experienced once, you have the elbow or shoulder injury, but you have that for life.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah it's. It's crazy because I know we talked about this the the difference between development and deception, and oftentimes they they're disguising deception with words like development. And the thing I talk about a lot with with parents and coaches and kids. You know, as like you're talking about doing all these things and playing thousands of games. You know over the course of you know of your youth, youth career, and you know, just like you know, this is, this is the ticket to success. You know and and I asked them who who are your favorite players in the major league baseball? And you know it's like. You know Shohei Otani, right. You know Vladimir Guerrero Jr, people who are not American, people who did not play travel baseball like we do.
Speaker 1:Like there's a reason and again, I'm not saying you can't get to the show by being an American athlete and by playing travel baseball. I'm not saying that I'd be curious to see the statistics of of individuals that make it to professional baseball and then the show that come from international training. And I look at some of those videos and, granted, I'm not in the DR, I'm not in, you know, cuba and actually seeing what they're doing, but from what I can gather, they're just grinding. They're developing, they're just practicing. They're spending way more time practicing. Then they're playing games like in-game reps are huge, but when you're in-game reps, like off balance, your development, again you're not getting better, you're just getting more consistent with your hat, with with your habits, and that's what I see. Like you have these teams that they practice one day a week maybe, but they're playing five games a weekend. And these kids you know like if you're a good coach, you're really not trying to fix kids during the game because they just have to play. But you know so you're allowed one one day a week to to fix them or adjust them. But if you're, if you know that's not working and then all of a sudden you go to the game and then they're just 60 games in and they're not any better, they're just Comfortable with their bad for their bad form or whatever. You know what I mean.
Speaker 1:So anyone who ever says to me and is like, yeah, well, this, this is the process, this is the model of how I get my son to to the show, I'm like, okay, like I would like to see statistically, like how how many more international athletes you know make it to the show, opposed to American athletes that go through the traditional model of Spring baseball of 80 games and fall baseball of 40 games and doing that for X amount of years, and I just feel like you're kind of rolling the dice and I think you need to be, you know, strategical, like you know I just that's that's where I feel right now, like my son's 12 and I. He has big aspirations and I feel like I have to guard him, you know, because he loves the game and I love him and I don't want him to put himself into a position where he he hurts himself permanently, right, or he loses the love for the game. So that's that's a really delicate position for parents like myself To be in. You know, you have these kids and all you know the everyone is going down the same road where we're playing 60 games and Everyone's doing it around you, so it must be right. Everyone's going to these pitching coaches and you know everyone's listening to these people online, so it must be right.
Speaker 1:But like that's not true, just because everyone's doing it doesn't mean it's right if you keep doing the same thing and Expecting different results, like that's insanity. And that's literally where I see a lot of travel, baseball teams, parents, philosophies. It's just, it's insane, like you keep, you keep doing the same thing, especially when it comes to pitching and arm care. It's the same same thought, same same lingo, and you're just kind of like, well, maybe it'll get better, like if we don't start asking different questions, like you know and I want to get into why, why you actually invented the arm sleeve but if we don't start asking questions like you probably did, like how can we make this better, then nothing's gonna change and we're gonna constantly be Just repeating the cycle of of insanity. So, so why don't, why don't you tell, tell that story of why, why did you invent this product?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah yes, I was. I was sponsored to play growing up because we couldn't afford it. So that's, you know, that's a big, big driver behind it, because I Really do feel like this is gonna be the biggest innovation to hit baseball. So from a young age, you know, my arm hurt from, I Think, around 11 years old up till mid 20s and I did everything my coach has told me to do, everything that the you know the trainers told me to do, but I always ended up, you know, with arm pain. It always felt great in the summer, you know, when I wasn't with a team. And Then you go there and you go through the. You know the pointless conditioning of the distance running and then you're thrown after that and now we're seeing.
Speaker 2:You know it's 36 times more likely to cause injury. So just the the lack of thought process. And you know, when I finished baseball I was, I was so sick of just the ignorance and the lack of forward thinking and care about the athletes, especially the children. I wanted nothing to do with it. So I started helping stroke victims regain function, working with traumatic brain injuries, getting people walking that were told they'd never walk again. But then I started getting more kids coming in my office and you know they were having the same arm, arm issues that I was at that age and at this point I learned, you know it's everybody wants to talk about arm care Just because that's where the smoke is done me, that's where the fire is. So that's you know those are the first areas to break down the elbow and the shoulder. But if they have growing pains like seabroose disease, oshkid slaughters, maybe they stub a toe, you know that's gonna change their mechanics and I really, you know I've been around some high-level back in it bio-mechanists Again, I've taught for a physical therapist and orthopedic surgeons, so I have a pretty good grasp of how things function and I just thought well, if you know, if nobody's gonna make a change, that I need to try to make a change, and do that by offloading stress externally. So we know that.
Speaker 2:You know in the 1870s that they started using a baseball glove and before that. You know they're catching up catching a ball without a glove, breaking my hands and fingers. Somebody thought, you know what, we probably should wear something to absorb that force Externally, and this is. It's. To me it's an exact parallel. We have all these arm injuries and elbows and shoulders blown out left and right at every level. Why would we not offload that stress externally? It's the. To me it's the exact same thing and it's you know.
Speaker 2:I just don't understand how people could think you know batting gloves, you know, okay, the sleeves of performance enhancer. Well, so are batting gloves, so are sunglasses, so is a visor hat, you know. So we can grip the ground. But if it keeps your son or daughter healthy and playing that sport, who cares? Even if it gets them through those those developmental years, then stop using it. Fine, you still have to generate force, so you're not gonna build a tolerance to it. It's not taking away from any development, but it's. I think it's something that's definitely needed. I mean, you look at a helmet. How often does somebody get hit in the head with a ball Right?
Speaker 2:often not often yeah, but still you feel the need to wear it as a, you know Something preventative. Same thing with a cup. Same thing with the new. We've got these of gloves, these big sliding myths that kids are wearing. Right so where's the argument? Or you could just learn how to slide properly.
Speaker 2:Yeah so it's Just the lack of forward thinking, even even at the professional level. And again, you know we talk about the lightning in a bottle and velocity at all costs. Mm-hmm. That does it of athletes in here that blew their arm out one to two weeks after leaving some of these. You know trendy velocity based programs, yeah, and it's. You know, unfortunately I'm under 9-1-1, you know, when their doctor or PT couldn't figure out how to help them and it's, you know it's kind of it's devastating seeing that look in their eye.
Speaker 1:Knowing, yeah they're done right and I want to tell I remember we were talking about one of the you know this it was kind of a big story of this one gentleman going from I forget you know what velocity to what velocity, and it was like a big staple or in high school. Yeah, big, big deal, but then he gets like drafted and, and then he blows out his arm right away and but then you don't hear that yeah.
Speaker 2:No, he didn't throw a single pitch in college.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's what it was. That's what it was. That's what it was.
Speaker 2:It's a single pitch in college. He blew his arm out, I think two years in a row. When I was down at Georgia Tech, I asked you know coach Danny Hollis? Hey, I was so and so doing and he kind of looked at me and smirked. He knew where I was going with him. I said well, you know, I see a pinned tweet saying so and so took them from 76 to 94 in high school and I know his high school coach, so I know that right the whole backs that people don't know right.
Speaker 2:But to see them, to see them using that to push their program right and take money from parents and kids without mentioning the dangers and the risks, to me is it's flat out fraud, it's negligent and I feel it's extremely deceptive. Right, I feel like those programs they should. They should have to track you know Everyone that left their program and let's see how long they lasted afterwards, because don't don't tell us about you know the benefits without also telling us about the risk.
Speaker 1:Oh, big time risks are pretty big time.
Speaker 1:I feel, like any trainer you know, with with a product, anything as soon as there's side effects that have come from someone's training method product, whatever it is, I feel like I mean I hate to say it needs to be like under government control. I'm kind of like medicine, but like there's a reason. I mean, could you imagine if, if the all these medicinal commercials Just listed you know like you could cure this with this and it doesn't list any of the side effects, like, yeah, we'd all be buying it, but sometimes those side effects are gonna shy you away and I to your point, it's almost fraudulent. You know, when you have trainers that are using you know the, the, the sexy part of the development, and then they're not telling you what happens afterwards and and that's really deceptive because again, it's just, it's just keeping that same insanity model going, where you're just bringing in parents, bringing in kids making money, making money and hoping that, well, maybe this next kid will be the exception, like that's Hoping isn't gonna do anything. We need to actually use our brains to come up with a solution and the fact is there's.
Speaker 1:It's not that we have to reinvent anything, because you've already got that out there for pitching and you know I, I would agree that this, this is gonna be Not gonna be. It is. It's already huge for the, for the baseball world, not just for youth but through through major leagues, and I would love to see, you know it, become way more Endorsed than like, to your point, than sliding mitts. You know there's nothing wrong with these, but like again, like they're all performance enhancement things, and you know we, we, we need to be less skeptical About that stuff and more skeptical about people. I think you know and you know what I tell people with it that have been like skeptical when I tell them about your product, I was like, for a youth, it's a hundred dollars, that's one pitching lesson. What do you have to lose? Like, literally, it's a hundred dollars, like that's it.
Speaker 2:We'll gladly give a full refund if you're not satisfied with it. That's another thing too, right? I think people like that. You know we do stand behind the product. Yeah, I spend hours on the phone each day, hours answering questions from parents and coaches, you know, just trying to help out. So it's one of those. You know people don't care how much you know until they know how much you care right.
Speaker 2:Then I think when they start to hear the why behind it and then also the science behind it, they kind of say, like damn, that that makes a lot of sense. Right, again, you and people are gonna fear you know what they don't understand. Yeah, and again, I've taught for you know Pts that have you know they're doctorate. So I've taught for you know plenty, plenty of. You know PhDs and masters and exercise science, exercise fizz worth a peak surgeons to work with pro sports teams and they don't learn about resistance mechanics.
Speaker 2:So it's frustrating sometimes because you know you take so much time to learn about internal performance and external performance and then you get in front of some medical professionals, like out when I was in front of the Tampa rays, you know I, the pitching coach, rick Knapp, loves it. He used it to get Luis Petino back. You know pain-free, no shoulder issues. Now all the sudden he's back in the major leagues with the White Sox. But standing in front of I think it was about a dozen. You know they're bio-mechanists and pitching coordinators and to me I love it.
Speaker 2:It's like a firing squad, you know bring it on because I want, I want the tough questions, I want you to try to pick it apart. And I told them. I said you know, you've had Plenty of injuries last year, plenty of injuries the year before. So either none of you are qualified to be here, mm-hmm, and that's why the injuries are happening, or you guys are great at what you do. You've tried everything, you've got all this technology. So it's probably time you started offloading stress externally, because you've tried everything else.
Speaker 1:Yep, it's not working again.
Speaker 2:But then there's still then there wasn't, you know, wasn't much interest from them. So it's, it's. It's interesting to see how people think they're experts in their field, but if they're in this very narrow academic spectrum, that's just a piece of the whole pie, right? I mean it just. It sets everyone back. So we we call it the intellectual de-evolution of baseball.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I like that intellectual de-evolution. It's really true. Yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's. It's extremely unfortunate, you know, because I'm I'm somebody who I would say I'm pretty forward-thinking and I'm not I'm not a huge tech guy, but I'm always looking for Something that will make my life easier. Realistically, I Feel like the 20 year old version of myself would, you know, kick myself in the nuts for saying that, or my grandpa would too.
Speaker 1:Like it's not about making life easy, but I was like, you know, the thing that's most important to me is time, and if I can find things that give me more time back, then I'm gonna invest money in it, because that's the most most valuable thing to me is time, and so it's it's. It's the same way with with technology, with With baseball development. You know, I see so many, so many parents. I mean, how many times we buy new $400 bats Because they need to have two every year, jason, you need to, one for a fast pitch or one for a slow pitcher. So you're spending six, eight hundred dollars a year in bats, but you know you don't want to get. You know you're not gonna go ahead and get real development. You know, or you're gonna, you're gonna be skeptical of of products like yours, for no, for no real good reason.
Speaker 1:I, I know there's, there's definitely snake oil out there. You know, we, we've all seen products that come on the come on the market for a short time and you know it's like buy one, get one free, and like it's, you know, guarantee to do this. And it'll have, you know, endorsements, like paid endorsements, not testimonials but paid endorsements, big difference. And People snaps those up and it's, it's kind of that quick, you know, quick, sexy appeal, where it's just instant gratification, like instant success. I guarantee your swing is gonna be perfect and you know, in 30 days or less you're gonna get, you know, 10 miles an hour around your on your batting swing, you know, and and in two months, if you use this, this training tool and just stuff like that, and there's, there's, there's just so much ignorance out there, you know. But as parents, I think we can all agree that our hearts are in the right place for the most part. I, you know, I'd say there's some that are living vicariously through, through, through our kids.
Speaker 1:But development is, is on the forefront of of our thinking, like all the time, and I would love to see your product just, I mean, I mean it'd be, it'd be awesome I'm sure it'd be a dream of yours for it to be endorsed by the major, like baseball Association, just to have that logo like publicly endorsed, because I feel like at that point that would be the like, oh okay, and that's sad to say.
Speaker 1:But I feel like products that do have that stupid little emblem just good or bad. They're gonna just, I mean and it's not about dollars and that's something I want people to know too is your product? Isn't something you just like crafted in your basement with some extra material, like, if you look at it, like there's a lot of research and a lot of data that goes into that, like tens upon tens of thousands of dollars and I know we talked about that and and the idea that why is your product so affordable? Because realistically, a product with that much Science behind it should be, not, should be unaffordable and that that's the truth of it, right, jason? Like there's so much science and effort that's gone into developing this product that it should be costing five, six hundred dollars. I mean, I look at that. What's that? One bad training tool, the click-click boom you know I'm talking about.
Speaker 2:Gosh, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Really cool. I mean people swear by. I think it works really good, but that's five hundred dollars. People, people don't bat an eye at that and that's not new. I mean like that is. I mean I'm not saying there's no thought that goes into that product, but there's not near the amount of research or data that goes into that product, that went into your product.
Speaker 1:And I know we had talked about, like your, you know your youth career being a sponsored athlete. You know not having as much, you know Disposable income when you were a kid and that kind of fed into making this affordable for for parents and athletes, to To offload stress, because you know, like you said, it kind of made you sick what the youth sports had kind of turned into. But you know it's, you're not trying to get rich off this. You know if that was your goal. I know we had talked and we're not gonna mention any names but we had talked about some companies that had come to you and I'll privately and wanted to. You know like Take, you know take over your product, pay, pay for it and give you a cut and and so on and so forth. But you know your, your values in conviction have outweighed the money time and time again, and I think people need to know that that you're, you're not out there, you know, and in the form of development, trying to just, you know, money grab.
Speaker 1:You know, because that's that's how it is for so many people, it's just strike while the iron's hot, you know, sell as much snake oil as you can and get out and just move like that's not what you're doing. You're, you're here to stay, you know. You, you are physically and mentally and emotionally and financially invested in in Baseball. You know, and you're, you're doing this not only for the kids but baseball in general. And you know, I just, I commend you tremendously for that, because there's nothing, I've seen, nothing like this. You know, and not just from pitching but from hitting, running, fielding. There's no, there's no tool I've seen for baseball development that can give such a Edge and and long-term advantage To a kid over anything else. There's nothing I've seen, and so I just Gosh, yeah, I love it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thank you. We did one of the One of the companies that did want to buy in or buy us out. They wanted to double the price.
Speaker 2:Right because they said you know, worth it and people would pay it. And I said, well, that's, that's not why I'm doing this, not, the point is to help kids. I'll keep athletes safe. So, you know, it took three, almost four years to get the first good working prototype. So I pretty much put everything I had into it and we're still, you know, not raising the price just to, you know, make it a money grab. We've we've had some interesting offers. You know, we we turned down A sharp tank as well. I think we talked about that. But yeah, again, I didn't want to go on there and have it seen as a gimmick and devalue the product right.
Speaker 2:It's something that actually works. And then you know we've got physical therapists saying that they, they see this as kind of ushering in a new era of sports performance. And you know, wearable technology, that can all flow stress from your, your, I guess, your, your tissue, your connected issues. So, from them, from the joints, so, yeah, we're gonna, we're gonna keep the integrity up. You know, keep evolving the product and and try to, you know, keep, keep making the most quality sleeves that we can that are gonna last as long as you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that's huge. And I don't publicly endorse a lot of things unless I agree with a product and agree with the owner. And that was why I reached out to you in the first place, because I just wanted to have a conversation with you about your product and why you invented it and so on and so forth. And just those conversations about the integrity and character that you have in your product is just like I can't talk enough about it. And I think another good point too is it's not just baseball and softball, and that's what I tell people. It's not even just throwing. I mean, you look at tennis players.
Speaker 1:This kind of arm sleeve is going to help so many different types of athletes. It's not just exclusively for baseball and softball and that's what I was like. It's like quarterbacks. How many quarterbacks have arm issues? If you're using your arm something to consider, especially when you're a youth, before you have injury.
Speaker 1:And when I was young, like my son, he pitches and catches and there was a time where my ignorance played into it and I didn't see the issue if he was catching for a game and then pitched later in that game. I didn't know my sheer ignorance to it. And then coming to find out from some really solid people in my community that come alongside and is like that shouldn't happen. That's really bad, and I'm just like, ok, well, regardless, I want to get him. I want to protect his arm, I want to protect his head, so I get a quality helmet. I want to make sure I have grandchildren, so I make sure he's got a quality cup. I want to make sure he's protected because he likes to crowd in there in the plate, so he's got an elbow guard, he's got all the things to protect him.
Speaker 1:But, to your point, like I know on your website and your videos and when we talk, the most important thing is you're throwing. Because if you can't throw I mean if your arm goes out then unless you're Shohei Otani, you're just going to be a DH, which I think he'll come back and he'll bitch. But anyways, I mean, you're throwing is what it's going to keep you in the game, and more parents, more teams, more colleges need to be exposed to the product, and I don't know if you have, like a retired uncle that you could just send around as to universities or something that's kind of like what I imagine. You just need somebody going around, not selling them out of their trunk per se, but just taking it because I know you, this isn't your full-time job.
Speaker 1:It's a full-time job but it's not your only thing. You've got so many things going on that you can't be out there pushing this constantly and I'm just like, yeah, we need someone out there just going to universities, going to different big clubs, like USA Prime, like Rawlings Tigers, like these big national clubs, and showing them that and saying this is really going to help you and help your kids and, quite frankly, make your team stand out amongst the others. So I don't know, is that something you guys have talked about? Or maybe you're doing already and I'm just unaware of it.
Speaker 2:We've thought about it. It's still just my wife and I. We have an assistant now that helps with fulfillment and customer questions. But the psychology of it's interesting because I've got a sports performance center in Atlanta so I've had Charles Barkley, matt Rine, I mean I've had dozens of really well-known, high-paid athletes and world champions in multiple sports. But when I reach out to the surrounding high schools they say, oh, we've got it under control. Oh, really, so I have these guys traveling across the country to come train with me or solve a biomechanical problem so the
Speaker 2:medical staff couldn't figure out, but you have it under control. So it's like if we go to these universities you almost kind of put yourself in the same basket as everyone else trying to pedal their products, which makes it really difficult. So it's almost like they have to hear it from someone and then they have to seek you out. So if someone else gives them the app, versus you reaching out, and then the coaching staff changed over so I'll say their name at University of Georgia. But several years ago I went out there and I'm showing them and the athletic trainer I already got warned about him and how he was kind of a know it all, which is fine, but he said I don't like the technology used to measure it. It was a modus sensor. I said, ok, great, what do you suggest? And he of course didn't have anything to say.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so offered to leave a couple for them to try out. And wouldn't you know, at that season I think they had two Tommy John surgeries, two shoulders blow out and probably some more arm injuries that we don't know about. So it's just interesting. And I think my wife's gone. She used to do medical device and pharmacogenetic sales, so she's very, very smart. She's gone and she'll see how sometimes they get intimidated because they don't understand musculoskeletal mechanics and how the sleeve would offload shred.
Speaker 2:But then when I talk to a mechanical engineer they're like that makes so much sense. Here's a free body diagram, here's the vector stick ball and I'm like, yes, why in sports does nobody understand this? But again, it's just there's such a low standard of knowledge. Well, for coaches there's really no standard. I mean, let's be real, you've been doing it a while. I've seen coaches I played from the past that probably had no business coaching and now they're still coaching somewhere else. But as far as the strength staff or the biomechanists, there's really no standard and there's no incentive for them to continue to learn because it's not rewarded.
Speaker 2:So, I mean personally. I think if there's injuries, let's say in an organization, we'll just say in a pro or college organization. I think if to me one arm injury is a failure because you're not taking care of those players, so to have more injuries, to me that's like years ago the White Sox. They were asking their players not to sprint to first base. There was a sports ale share article about it. Fire everyone, your whole staff. They're all terrible. If you can't keep athletes healthy enough to run to first base, you're failure, that's it.
Speaker 2:And it's probably a communication issue. I'm sure there's a ton of egos in there, but it's interesting that at the highest level there's still that issue where they can't even figure out why they're wrecking all these hamstrings. To me it's quite. I know what they're doing.
Speaker 2:I have some no people know what's going on. But it doesn't get any better at the college or the high school level, and especially in the travel ball. I mean most of the travel ball. It's just the fact that they've monetized it and people make a career out of it and do the business.
Speaker 1:Like a phenomenal career. I mean people, I mean there's. I would love to see a statistic of how many millionaires have come out of the youth sports market, because I mean it would blow people's minds to know how many people are now millionaires. And we're not even talking about people that just are big time know-it-alls. We're talking to even just like local club owners. You know, I think of the club owners here in just Omaha. It's like there's a lot of millionaires that have gotten millions just from that alone.
Speaker 2:That's wild.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but I think to your point though, people, pride is such a terrible thing. Pride can be, it can be your best friend, but more times than not it's your demise. And that's what we see, where pride, kind of like, blinds us from seeing. Logic and I think that's what you see especially in athletics is the idea that I've done this long enough. I can't tell you how many times I've heard that, like I've been doing this long enough, I don't need to hear anything else. I'm like, as soon as we make those comments, it's like no, I don't need to learn anything else, we stopped learning. That's again. So to your point of gosh, what did you call it? The evolution, de-evolution, the intellectual de-evolution.
Speaker 1:Yeah, intellectual de-evolution, like that's exactly it. Like we got a bunch of people that are afraid because either one they didn't come up with the idea, which I think is probably a big part of it. Like they didn't come up with the idea. Who is this Jason guy? He didn't play professionally, he didn't do this. Like I didn't come up with this idea. But so my pride's gonna get in the way it's gonna allow, it's gonna block me from seeing logic and yeah, it's really sad. I had a different thought. Have you ever brought your product to Omaha for the College of World Series?
Speaker 2:No, I think we're gonna look into it next year, because the previous I think two or three years, I mean we had people calling and emailing asking if we were there. But again we've got the Sports Performance Center as well so. I think we're gonna try this year.
Speaker 1:Awesome.
Speaker 2:But back to what you were saying about as far as the training. I mean, I was a strength coach and trainer for 10 years and then I got to these two courses for manual muscle testing and then all about the physics of resistance mechanics and I realized after 10 years of doing it I thought I was great and I did not have a clue, but I was an athlete, so for someone to tell me that because they threw a ball for 20 years, it means they're qualified.
Speaker 2:I've been flushing a toilet for over 30 years. It doesn't make me a plump Love that. So there's things like that. But then if someone tells me, oh, my trainer's been doing it for 10 years, then I'm right away. I tell them listen being in kindergarten for 10 years doesn't make you a 10th grader, that's exactly right so that's where you stop your level of education and learning and thought process.
Speaker 2:You're actually sliding downhill because you cling to what's simple and easy and reproducible and that's why, like we see this in the fitness business, it's the things that are easily reproducible that make the most money, and then something that's simple doesn't sell, because simple doesn't sell. So then we've got all these motion capture apps. Well, it's kind of like having a mechanic watch your car drive down the street and tell you exactly what's wrong inside the engine or transmission. It's not physically possible. So everybody's excited to have these degrees and biomechanics and kinesiology, things like that.
Speaker 2:So you look at motion capture or if you're just watching, you see how things are moving but you have no clue why they're moving that way. So to have that extra skill set and know that makes it even harder to try to have those conversations, because they're like, well, if we look at them on video and it's like, yeah, that's great. But what you don't understand is I just had them on the table. He has no truck rotation, he was throwing side and I see that a lot with you know big name orthopedic and physical therapy groups. When their patients come here, all they did was stretch and smash the arm and then they clear up the throat and guess what? They have no idea what the original mechanism that caused that injury was or the re-injury.
Speaker 2:So we'll see. It's a foot issue, a hip issue, a trunk issue, and so it's disappointing. You know, in the medical field as well, that just because you know they're a physical therapist, they think that they're qualified to help these athletes. So you get run through insurance bill. You know they're not gonna until you have to pay for it and then all of a sudden it's not worth it, which it probably wasn't to begin with. But I had a physical therapist who's you know, he's got his doctor and he recently told me, said I think the DPT program is the worst thing to happen to physical therapy and it's kind of like you know, for strength and conditioning there's the CSCS and you know they're pretty likely to you know heavily give their opinion and it's like wait, hold on.
Speaker 2:If everything you know, if you think a barbell is the extent of you know, conditioning and training, you just quit, just absolutely quit, because the heavy, symmetrically loaded lifting which was causing a lot of the tightness, that's ruining mechanics and it's also giving way to the mobility programs we're now. Imagine if you go out and sprint, do you loosen up your shoelaces, so why would we stretch and try to destabilize the structure before we're supposed to perform. Not only that, it can shut down, it can cause muscle inhibition in as little as 15 seconds, which means you're not as strong, and then also, going across, we'll get impingement. So we don't even think about what we're doing to the tissue quality. We've got these massage guns and foam rollers and the cross balls. It's like if I punch you in the shoulder, do you think that's good or bad for when you go to throw? Probably not good. But we continue to do these things because, again, it's what everyone else is doing. So I always say well, a lot of people still smoke cigarettes. That doesn't mean it's right.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Pretty stupid when you think about it but that's what's going on at all ages with conditioning? I hate to see it. I feel like people are getting ripped off.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, it's true. I loved your analogy about how I've been flushed in the toilet for 20 years. Doesn't make me a plumber, because that's something that I don't use. The plumber one like that, but I use something very similar. But there's so many people out there that are like that coaches-wise. I think a lot of people that have played ball, even at a high level and I'm probably going to catch some flak for this have no business coaching.
Speaker 2:I see it in other sports too.
Speaker 1:Big time.
Speaker 2:Again some of my clients and people. I train with some of the top athletes in the world and they have no business trying to give instruction, because they don't understand they don't know how to do it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, you can play it but you can't always coach it and there are exceptions, for sure.
Speaker 1:You know one of my son's catching instructor who caught, you know, in college, caught professionally. Phenomenal instructor, but I mean he's the guy who's constantly seeking knowledge and getting wisdom from other catchers Phenomenal person, you know. But there's a lot of people who you know would use their credentials of playing minor league ball major league ball, as you know as the end-all, be-all to why you should bring your son or daughter to me and that's not good enough. That's just not. I mean, I look at Tiger Woods' dad. Tiger Woods' dad, not a good golfer, but yet he raised and trained the greatest golfer you know known to man. I mean, same with Venus and Serena Williams. Their dad didn't play tennis but he was a student of the game and trained the best tennis players you know known to mankind, arguably. But it's just, I see that and I just, but somebody parents put so much weight in like, oh, my son's pitcher, my son's, you know coach, you know pitch for this team, or, you know, was a shortstop for the Cardinals. I was like so Like, I played golf in college and I, you know, was on my way to try and make it professionally, but I could not coach it. I would not coach it Because I don't know how to Some people are just are gifted at being, you know, I'd say, like analytical, engineering mind and being able to break things down to where they can coach it. Just because you can play it doesn't mean you can coach it.
Speaker 1:Parents need to understand that just because your coach or your trainer that your whole community is using, has been doing it for X amount of years doesn't mean anything. You know, and at the same time, you need to be Lyria people that are brand new, but do your due diligence. You know I would be. Do questions, yeah, ask questions, and I'd be looking for references of people that they've trained and where they've gone. You know, like, where are they at 10 years from now? You know, like, have they gotten hurt? You know, like, where are they? You know, like, not in six months from now, not a year from now, but 10 years from now. Do they hate the game? Are they still playing with conviction? Are they hurt at all? Like, where are they? Parents need to do more due diligence. They need to do their homework more. But again, time is money and we just want to entrust that someone, since they're a professional and they have a website and they rent space, of course, for the account.
Speaker 1:Then what's that?
Speaker 2:Or all you need is a social media account.
Speaker 1:That's true. You don't even need a website anymore. You just need an Instagram account, yeah, facebook account, whatever, and you rent space from a facility that you don't own and you could be here to get here today, gone tomorrow like a snake snake oil salesman, you know. But we just want to. We want to believe and, you know, have hope for the best. You know, it blows my mind in a society of people that have so many issues, putting faith and trust in a God who died and raised from the dead three days afterwards. We can't wrap our minds around that. But we're okay putting our entire faith in some shmuck we found on the yellow pages to teach my son how to throw a curveball. It just blows my mind, like the contrast there. It just like just makes no sense to me. But you know, I feel like we can just keep going round and around and, you know, just keep talking about.
Speaker 1:You know, the issues in the club sports world, and the biggest one constantly comes back to development. You know, and people want kids to be developed. But more importantly, I think a lot of people they just want the money. They want to get the money so they can get out and they're not sticking around long. You know they don't have a long-term investment, and I think that's what really separates you and your product and just what you're doing in general. You know, and you're doing so much more than just your product.
Speaker 1:Cause I know we talked about, like you know, like my son and I was like I would really love to get your take on his arm angle and everything like that, and then you were just like well, you could just bring him down, like people, people fly on out and like we can, we can run him through the whole ringer. And I think that's something else other parents you know should be aware of too, like if they have real concerns of their son or daughters. You know arm slot and you know pain or whatnot, and they don't trust you know the people around them, like you're available, like that's what you do. So what would that look like? If you know, if I'm a parent and I live in an area where there's medical professionals who I'm just not trusting, I'm not getting the answers I want to, but my son or daughter, they want to continue to play the game and I'm just I keep running into brick walls. What advice would you give them?
Speaker 2:I would, I would. Oh man, that's a tough one, because usually it's. If it's an arm issue, you know we can say like okay, you see, on motion capture, your arm slots down. Is it just this green? A humeral joint? Is it scapular elevation? Is it lateral flexion, you know, at the waist. So I think finding someone that's well qualified is a very subjective word.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:It has an understanding of how things function from the ground up. Because, like, let's say, your son rolled his ankle and I've had this with a professional pitcher you know, if you rolled his ankle on his rear leg, he's probably not going to have the same amount of ground reaction force that you know he used to. Or you know they have CPSRR, oskar Schlotters and I think what we talked before. I told you the story of the mom who brought her son in and he was having arm pain and you know he was throwing against the wall with, I think it was a tennis ball and I said, look, his lower half isn't moving, you know, as he had any growing pain. She said, oh yeah.
Speaker 2:So I told her, you know we need to get on the table and do positional testing to see you know what can hold a positional contraction and what can't. But first, everybody's concerned with range of motion, but all that tells you is range of motion, so we need to find out his available range of control, whereas neuromuscular system can actually, you know, support the joints and the structures that we need to throw. So and then she said well, I think what he needs is a pitching instructor. It's like what do you not understand about if this stuff is going? It's not working. Well, throwing is going to cause arm problems and the pitching instructor's definitely not going to.
Speaker 1:They're not going to understand it.
Speaker 2:yeah, you know what they do. Yeah, so that's a tough thing. But I would say for parents, ask questions, you know, question everything If they can't answer something. And that's the thing you know here in my facility we'll never say anything that we can't back up with a research paper or prove, you know, right there with a digital dynamometer or some other means. But definitely ask people questions and remember too that just because somebody coached in college or coached at the professional levels I mean again, we just saw that elbow and shoulder injuries were up 44% at the major league level. So that's just a reminder that just because they coached at that level doesn't mean they're qualified to work, you know, with your son or daughter. So again, there's fitness industry. There's no barriers to entry. So if they've got a decent personality and maybe some good jokes and can hold a conversation, they think, oh well, they're nice.
Speaker 1:That's exactly right. Yeah, here's a blank check. Yeah, take my son's passion for the game and just do what you want with it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's it. That's the cool, trendy instructor and. I see it all the time with trainers, and that's why we don't have a lot of trainers here in my facility, because it's not the place for that. They're not here to be a psychologist or a call them inter-trainer. We're not doing the circus stuff. So if you come here, we're serious about it and we're going to find out what the root cause of the problem is and we're going to fix it.
Speaker 2:So if they're going in and just kind of going through the motions and having fun, I mean, if that's how you want to spend your money, that's fine. But yeah, I would encourage the parents to ask questions and say, okay, you said that they're not throwing properly, why do you think that is? And if they don't think that answer is sufficient, then go somewhere else. Because if you don't find someone better that they can do a better job and take better trial, then that might be the only opportunity you get.
Speaker 1:If you blow the right arm out and they're right-handed and there's not a tree that you can just magically go to and just get a fresh arm starting over from scratch, you just really can't do that. I don't know. I mean, if there is anything I can do to kind of help push this along so we can see this endorsed by more colleges, more teams, more athletes, to where this kind of becomes the standard, much like ICE was the standard, and then heavy balls are the standard, and what's the new one? The water, water balls, the water, the water balls. Oh jeez, yeah. So I know we don't want to get on that one Now. We've talked about that, but how those things have kind of become standard training tools.
Speaker 1:I really this isn't even my product. I don't know why I'm so passionate about it, but I just am Jason, because I see what it's doing for my son and I see what it's going to do for baseball, because I love baseball and I don't want it to have this lingering taste in people's mouth of deception and pain, because that's what I see a lot For. You parents out there listening like you literally have nothing to lose, nothing to lose, especially for a youth athlete. You buy the youth sleeve it's $100, try it out for a month If you don't like it. If you're not convinced your kid feels different, send it back, call him, but I don't feel like you're going to send it back.
Speaker 2:We've had some parents too say well, my son said it's not helping. There's been three or four and it's like do you let your kid dictate like drive your car or tell you whether or not they're going for?
Speaker 1:it Right.
Speaker 2:But it's because all the teammates aren't wearing it. But as it's starting to grow and they see it's more normal, we've actually had a couple of those parents reach back out and purchase it, because then-.
Speaker 1:That's funny.
Speaker 2:Little Jimmy's friends have it. Now all of a sudden he's the one that doesn't have it. But we heard a dad in person do it. The kid said he tried it out, said, dad, this feels great, I really want to get it. He goes well. Who else have you seen wear it's like? Hey dad, this is a new product, it doesn't matter. What is it since? When is what everybody is if all the other kids are jumping off the building? You want? Your kid to do it too.
Speaker 1:We need to get you down here to Omaha, though. I mean, I think College of World Series, man, they got the Slumbuster, which is the biggest youth baseball tournament in the Midwest Just huge. And I just I see all these vendors this last, you know, these last several years, and I'm just like man, a lot of this is junk, you know. And I just was like, yeah, you need to come down, you need to get a booth, We'll do it. Yeah, definitely need to do that. You know, we'll do a special podcast too when you come to town so we can actually do it in person too. But yeah, so no, this has been great. Jason, I appreciate your time. I know you got a lot more going on right now and I know you got to go attend to your wife too. Man, I wish her the best man. Nothing like being sick around the holidays.
Speaker 2:So yeah that. And then we got the ABCA out in, out by Dallas, and I'll be speaking for an international coaches group there. And then the next week is the Texas high school baseball coaches association, so I'll be speaking there as well for that trade show. So we've got yeah, we've got a lot of, a lot of good stuff coming up.
Speaker 1:Love it.
Speaker 2:Hopefully it'll get to meet all the good people and keep protecting arms.
Speaker 1:Love it. I love where your heart is. Jason, I appreciate you. You keep doing what you're doing. We'll yeah, we'll connect to the future. Well, that's all the time we got for today's episode, guys. Again, a huge shout out to Jason over there, the kinetic arm, for taking time out of his day to just spend a little bit of time with me and talk about arm care and and a little bit about the world of of travel, baseball and ways we were actively working to make it better. So again, guys, if you haven't checked them out yet, check them out on Facebook, check them out on Instagram, check them out online. Their website is thekineticarmcom. Again, guys, you are a huge blessing to me. You'd be an even bigger blessing if you would Drop me a comment like it. If you, if you like the podcast, share it. We want to get this information out there to to as many people as possible. So again, guys, you blessed be blessing. Go on, get out there. Well, see you later.