Blue Collar Business Podcast
Welcome to the Blue Collar Business Podcast with Sy Kirby. Dive deep into the world of hands-on entrepreneurship and the gritty side of making things happen. Join us for actionable tips on scaling your blue-collar business, managing teams, and staying ahead in an ever-evolving market. We'll also discuss the latest industry trends and innovations that could impact your bottom line. If you're passionate about the blue-collar world and eager to learn from those who've thrived in it, this podcast is a must-listen. Stay tuned for engaging conversations and real-world advice that can take your blue-collar business to new heights.
Blue Collar Business Podcast
Ep. 16 - Boost Construction Outcomes: Aviation Engineering Strategies
Chris Maestri from Garver Engineering shares his journey in aviation engineering, a field filled with both challenges and rewarding opportunities. As one of Arkansas Business's 20 in their 20s in 2022, Chris discusses his role in significant projects like the XNA taxiway reconstruction and emphasizes the urgency of attracting younger talent to address the skilled labor shortage. You'll also hear a personal story about how a helicopter ride with my father, a former British Navy engineer, sparked my lifelong fascination with aviation.
We unravel the complex world of managing airport construction projects, spotlighting the Bentonville Airport taxiway renovation. Collaboration with engineering firms like Nabholz and Garber is essential for compliance with FAA regulations and securing project funding. As Northwest Arkansas experiences rapid growth, we explore how emerging firms can navigate large-scale projects while ensuring steady development through open communication and long-term planning strategies.
The episode emphasizes the importance of effective communication and accountability within aviation projects. Discover why solution-oriented thinking, clear documentation, and technical proficiency in modern communication are vital to project success. We also discuss initiatives like Bentonville's Ignite program, which aim to cultivate the next generation of industry professionals by providing hands-on experiences and technical skills. With insights into the evolving landscape of technology and the unique opportunities in Northwest Arkansas, we offer advice for blue-collar workers aiming to stay motivated and continue growing in their careers.
Sy-Con is a family-owned civil contractor specializing in water, sewer, storm drains, & earthwork.
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Hey guys, welcome to the Blue Collar Business Podcast, where we discuss the realest, rawest, most relevant stories and strategies behind building every corner of a blue collar business. I'm your host, cy Kirby, and I want to help you in what it took me trial and error and a whole lot of money to learn the information that no one in this industry is willing to share. Whether you're under that shade tree or have your hard hat on, let's expand your toolbox. Welcome back, guys, to another episode of the Blue Collar Business Podcast. I've anxiously been awaiting this episode. It's been on the books for a couple of months now.
Speaker 1:I had to beat him to get him to show up today, but we're going to be talking about the world of aviation engineering and, as you guys have probably been following along on the YouTube side of things here at SciCon, we have got to a whole nother opportunity that I never even thought was a possibility for us. We've been working at an airport for a year and a half and all the joys that come with that and the lessons I've learned and the experiences I've learned. My guest today has been literally somewhat of a mentor, but also been the hand that slaps me when I need it too. So it's been an exuberant education lesson for myself, but this man is one of Arkansas business's 20 in their 20s in 2022.
Speaker 1:He's managed some major projects, currently managing the project that we're on out there at KBBT, but he has head up the XNA's taxiway reconstruction, basically navigating everything out there at XNA from CIP plan, like we were talking for a five-year plan ahead of hey, we're working on this taxiway and progressions plan ahead of hey, we're working on this taxiway and progressions. And he's having to take that not only for Garver. He's having to present that back to the XNA airport ownership team and have to deal with them. And his other big role at Garver Engineering, I should say, is procuring grants for the municipalities to ensure they can procure the money when it's time to go to construction and get me involved. So, furthermore, thank you so much, chris maystree from garver engineering. I can't tell you how much I appreciate you being here, bro yeah, thanks for having me happy to be here.
Speaker 1:I am uh hi, anytime I meet somebody like yourself and like myself in their early 30s that are young in this industry but already have experience and knowledge, they stick out immediately. You know what I mean and just from the very quick learnings I had to figure out working with you on this airport project or the now it's three or four projects in length combined it's been crazy. But navigating that man, uh, I have learned a lot from you. Um, in discussion, hey, chris, I got another stupid question. But guys, I'm telling you always, lean, he's, he's educated, I am not and he understands the entire goal of what we're trying to, not just, hey, man, I can't stick the bolt in the hole.
Speaker 1:You know, uh, I've got to be able to, um, present those questions to them and I hope during this conversation today we're going to navigate and talk about navigating some project delays between installers and engineers and, uh, we've talked about that in length here on this show we're also going to be talking about the skilled labor shortage and attracting this younger generation, like I was just mentioning, the early 30s. I mean you can learn so much in your 20s as you won an award for doing so. I preach about it on this show all the time you can use your 20s to obtain some crazy experience. Tell us just a little bit what you covered in your 20s there, in the last little bit here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so lots of learning, like you said, and I think that Garver's done a really good job of giving me a platform and a chance to see a lot of things early that people don't get to see, maybe in their 20s or even later in their career, I think. Even specifically within our aviation team, we have a unique opportunity to work very closely, face to face, with external clients to potentially lead teams, et cetera, and train people up below you. But it's been awesome. Aviation is very unique and it has been an eye-opening experience to come back to it. Like I mentioned right before, I didn't start in aviation right after school. I had a couple years doing structural engineering and then got pulled back to Garver from a previous internship boss, mr Adam White, and appreciate him for that Shout out yeah, it's been awesome. Great opportunities, great municipalities in northwest Arkansas that we get the opportunity to work for and with, and really cool to see aviation explode as much as it has, especially in the last four or five years.
Speaker 1:Oh, my god man, it's uh, it's crazy. I live um another airport not the airport we're discussing that we're working at, but I live out closer to that more corporate walmart uh airport, I guess in beaver lake and um, it's more of the big jet traffic. But when I say that VVT gets some big jet traffic not quite like that, but no, the aviation side of things really, I guess, caught my eye over the last three or four years. My dad was in the British Navy and he worked on Seaking helicopters and on the HMS Ark roll on aircraft carriers and he's always had this crazy obsession with airplanes and helicopters. And so his 70th birthday, roughly three or four years ago, he had a bout of cancer. Me and Sarah flew up there. It was actually during COVID, it's a terrible time to fly and yeah, um. So flew up there, had to do what we had to do, but we took him up in a helicopter um over muskoka, which is northern ontario.
Speaker 1:I know I'm getting way off track here, but um, by the roots, I sat in that helicopter with my dad. I grew this feeling in this aviation. You know, I'm like I kind of want to do this and more aviation. You know I'm like I kind of want to do this and more. I started looking into it. I'm like, well, this is time travel. This is like a fathomable time travel.
Speaker 1:You can be in Dallas, nashville and St Louis or any three trifectas very quickly with jet, travel through the day and run projects all over the country. And I'm like, quickly, with jet travel through the day and run projects all over the country. And I'm like does that even compute in most people's heads? So I have definitely obtained this little bit of aviation obsession, as you have witnessed over the last year and a year and a half we've been working together. My first topic of the day I think you could talk about in length for most of the show but how is AI changing the aviation industry? As you've been, how long have you been on just the aviation side now?
Speaker 2:It will be six years in January. Yes, so we've seen a lot change over the last five, six years. Ai specifically, I mean it hasn't come into play directly just yet, but it's kind of out there on the horizon ready to make its jump, at least on the engineering side of it. I think we've seen a lot more technology improvements, maybe on the construction side so far, huge Be it. Gps-related equipment.
Speaker 2:Uh, we talk, yeah, like like you throw a, you throw a model in your dozer now and it can go grade the whole site for you. If you set it up, that's right, then we do, which comes with pluses and minuses. Right, you gotta, you gotta make sure that everything gets input correctly on the front end, or you're, you've just got something going off in space, essentially. So, sir, there's, there's a little more back checking maybe involved on the front end, but definitely some efficiencies that you get out of it on the back, and literal automatic efficiencies, yeah, and if you learn to do it on one site, hey, it's pretty much the same thing everywhere else, over and over and the ai battle.
Speaker 1:I guess it's not quite ai, I guess I referenced that a little bit wrong, but it's just the new wave of technology in general that you've probably seen over in the last five, six years has changed I. I know on the installer side of things it's like I didn't do gps. We've had a gps program for about two and a half years. As we moved into commercial. You couldn't come out there and do an airport job without it. Actually I think it's requirement of Garver for you to have your own GPS. But testament to you guys, I know I've been preaching all the time about GPS, gps, gps, but it is now Time is to learn is right now, while everybody's still kind of fumbling around what is actually transpiring. But then if you can obtain it on the installer side of things and actually start using it to my dozer and mr sam shout out he can sit there and click on that file and he is very, very good at it, because you also mentioned you have to input everything correctly the first time and he was like hey, I was on a job a year ago. He's like hey, come here, look at this, and we, we haven't had this eye machine very long uh, which has the capable of doing fully auto hydraulics. And he's like, hey, come, look at this, you want everything right here to drain, like at a point two, and you won't even see it to your eye, and I'm like this whole site. He's like, yeah, rain's coming. I'm like, no, can you really do that? He's like, yeah, and it was amazing, and just the, I wasn't ready for it, like I'm, you don't have any operators, though on my side of the thing of the coin, I guess you would say that can set hubs.
Speaker 1:We were just on site discussing that yesterday. That's right, um, you can't go ask them to go set hubs. They laugh at you. You don't even know what you're talking about. They can run a laser I'm talking just a rotary laser, sure, and and shoot elevations, but going and setting hubs, that's a thing of the past, literally. You, you aren't teaching anybody else. So, um, on the gps side, I know you're surveying. Drones are a huge thing. Are you guys doing drone surveys? We do?
Speaker 2:um, what garver does offer drone surveys, which is awesome. I think we've got a couple different types of drones actually for different situations LiDAR so we do have a drone with LiDAR now officially. It gets a little bit funky when you're working around airspace, of course, for me, but we use it in a lot of other applications too. But LiDAR has been amazing. Amazing not just in flat work but in vertical stuff too, like working at xna. For instance, with the terminal project we had some guys go demo a a handheld lidar system and they just walked around the mechanical room at xna, which has pipes galore as you could only imagine, and they scanned the whole room in 10 minutes and it got updated into a model that you could look at physically on a computer screen in about the same time. So it was like almost instantaneous in the realm of someone physically going to study that room and having that data was, is, is.
Speaker 1:The man hours you cut, yes, just off of procuring the information, not alone past that. But wow, that's impressive because I didn't even think about it in the vertical implications, honestly, I mean just from the simple fact of we're really looking hard into the drone because the way we can quantify things and kind of pre-engineer design almost with our Magnet Pro, obviously it's. People have called me and go I am looking at this piece of property, can you tell me how much earth I'm going to have to move for 120 by 400 or whatever the case may be? Sure, and I'm like no, I can't. I need an engineer to draw me a little bit of stuff Now with our GPS program. Now I'm not talking about getting a full site design, but I can get an understanding of the site conditions and go give you an estimated you know quantity within reason, to get them a budgetary numbers. You know when they're making that real estate a transaction.
Speaker 1:But, like Chris was saying, there is literal drones now that we can run out there and instead of going and taking a shot every 10, 5, 10 feet, I don't quite know but 30 minutes, you can run five acres with a GPS plotted out drone that goes back and forth and back and forth and it quantifies the dirt below it.
Speaker 1:I'm like that's insane, right. But then let's take it a little bit further. Kind of what Chris was mentioning is what do you do with that data after you get it in? Well, now I've cut credible man hours off, have ran into the drone, didn't pick up the right invert or sure right uh, manual lid rim, etc. I've already been down that road with a different engineering service. But, um, the capabilities. Once we have that information from that drone straight into magnet and then procure some quantities, I can turn around and model that from a drone to one person in the office, get a quantity waiting for an answer ready to come back, 15, probably away from really being a model. This is insanity and we've only done this in what three to five years probably it's gotten really big since then.
Speaker 1:yeah, I would say I mean, it's probably been around for much longer than I can admit, but it's noticeable to a guy like me at three to five years. You know the last three to five years. But something that you mentioned on earlier the aviation community around here has exploded, not just at VBT. We have have xna out here. As you mentioned earlier, xna is now a national airport, correct? That was pretty cool. Were you any part of that, or?
Speaker 2:not, not the redesignation of it no, okay, all right.
Speaker 1:Well, I want to say, you know and check there, but literally when I first started flying into x and a, there was a1 and a2 and a3, I think, um, it was 2000, well, it's 1999, 2000, somewhere right in there. Um, flying back and forth from canada, oh yeah, and there was literally downstairs or the two upstairs, and now I just I just came back from a quick brief trip and um from canada and I walked back through the airport and I'm looking around and I'm like, oh my god, how many gates do we have now?
Speaker 2:I guess active gates are 14, 14 that they use, and there's three more that don't get used very often.
Speaker 1:So 17 if you're counting them all. The facelift it's getting is so cool, man. Yeah, it's amazing, it's really cool. We were almost a part of this. We were working with Nabholz very closely. But I called the pre-contract man and I said, yeah, it's probably a little too much for us to chew off right now. I don't want to designate just to this job for the next two years. But, man, the the whole facelift. Now you have to go upstairs and um, but talk about managing just a quickly here. How do you not just draw etc for the taxiways and having the progression of that but managing the construction of it?
Speaker 2:give us a brief rundown of where it starts, how involved you are, because you're fairly involved, but kind of touch on each role that you do through a construction like taxiway b that you're doing right now for from the airport side yeah, so it varies from project to project and client to client, but we'll take in most instances, um, we'll take a project that we designed and we went and took to bid public bid in most situations and from that point we're helping the airport review bids, recommend award, submit a notice of award to the low bidder and then construction really kicks off. We're working on getting funding for that construction with the FAA in most cases, or the state, and from there we handle pre-construction meetings, all the submittal reviews. We also Famous submittal log. I'm telling you that's right, that's right. There's only one way to keep track of them. That's right. We lose it pretty bad if we didn't have that submittal log.
Speaker 2:But everything you can think of from a construction standpoint, keeping track with the contractor. On the Bentonville project that you're on right now, obviously we don't have a full-time construction observer, but in a lot of cases with bigger aviation projects we've got someone on site from Garber full-time You'd have to and that's got eyes on it and he's he's our eyes in the field. We've got our at least a project manager in the office, if not more than that, dedicated to that project, because they're the bigger the project, obviously, the more effort associated with it. Keeping track of quantities payments um. All the all the red tape associated with faa funded jobs oh my god. Tracking and certified payroll reviews um, we're still waiting to get you on board with some of those.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've done, we've done the certified payroll before and we're, we're prepared for that.
Speaker 2:But oh, we're getting there. Our I mean our our biggest goal in that is making sure that our client, whether that's a city or an authority that owns the airport, meets all of the grant assurances that they have to meet to continue to get funding in the future, and a lot of that is just required for us to be that involved to make sure that they check all the boxes correctly. Now there's airports that have the experience and handle that themselves, but in general for the general aviation airports in Northwest Arkansas, we handle a lot of that.
Speaker 1:Well, northwest Arkansas I mean I was just talking about the largest airport in the area I mean 20 years ago just having three gates. So you guys can understand this. If you don't know Northwest Arkansas is growing at a rate that is insurmountable, really, to think about. Every direction you point is growing, um, but BBT is growing, um, which is directly in the middle of Bentonville, and Bentonville is the home of Walmart. I know I've said that a ton on this show, um, but it definitely um portrays its light out there and in Bentonville, Um, if you haven't been to the area, it's, it's stunning. It's a great place to raise a family. I shouldn't encourage anybody else to move here. But at the same time, xna has always been.
Speaker 1:I really wish we could have been a part of it. I'm glad we didn't. I'm glad we didn't, and I know you are too At this stage. You know what I mean. You are too at this stage. You know what I mean and I'm very honest with where, where we're at, because only nine years in, to take on something to that magnitude was almost literally insanity. But I'm so glad we got the opportunity to work with an engineer specifically designed around aviation at an airport, because it is so different with dealing with a civil engineer on a development like I need to get that point across.
Speaker 1:This isn't just something you walk from a subdivision and just, oh, we're just gonna throw you know, a couple roads in the ground out here. Ain't no big deal. Let me tell you something. It is a very big deal and there it may not be an faa funded job, but it may be an faa specspec-guidelined job. I mean, I don't normally put sand for any type of betting backfill, but on this certain project it was required because the FAA guideline superseded, etc.
Speaker 1:There's been some learning curves but, chris, I got to tell you. Thank you very much because you have been very quick to pick up the phone and go hey man, look, if you don't understand, or shoot me an email. If you guys don't understand what's going on, give me a ring, let's work through this and cause you want to get me up to speed. You don't. You're not leaving me in the dark, but I think that also um to your role you just explained is for the airport, you care about the end outcome, no matter who the contractor is, which is good and bad for me at some points, but at the same time.
Speaker 1:If I want to be able to bid on the work next time, guess what? You've got to be out there procuring grants, making sure the airport's doing what they're doing, working with their active plan for five years, six years, like you mentioned, and that's busy man number one. But then you actually get to construction and, uh, I've got to tell you I've ran a lot of engineers and a lot of projects, but you guys are thorough, bro, thorough and it may have something to do with the aviation as well.
Speaker 1:But, um, at first I truly was like man, not used to it, just like going down to fayetteville for the first time and probably don't know as much there but working any other town. Then you go to fayetteville. It's a very, very big learning curve, but and it was appreciated. But I'm kind of leaning into our next kind of topic here. But how can project managers like myself, chris, um, whether they're the owner of the company or whether you have you, tell with my former project manager, um, which is what it is.
Speaker 1:But at the same time, how do we effectively communicate delays back and forth to you and manage expectations in the face of oh my God, this just happened, chris. What do I do? And what I mean by that, guys, is there's a way to approach your engineer. Okay, his goal and your goal, at the end of the day, is to keep the customer happy, so they can do more work, so we can keep making money. But at the same time, there is a way you can format this to help efficiency to resolve the problem. That's what I'm looking for for discussion out of you sir?
Speaker 2:sure, no, I think I think, um, getting with your engineer first is a key part of that.
Speaker 2:Right Like we play a role and we hit on it as Garber in all of our pre-construction meetings that we want to be in every conversation or anything that has to do with decision making, whether it's delays or change of scope, et cetera within a construction project, we need to be part of that conversation so we can help potentially translate from the contractor to the city or the municipality that we're working for and make sure that they can fully absorb what the implications are of any of the decisions that might be made.
Speaker 2:And I think what goes along with that is just coming with as much information as you can provide. If there's a delay, why is there a delay? Or maybe not even why there's a delay, but what are we going to do to speed ourselves up in another area to mitigate the issues that we may have with that delay? So I think we harp on this a lot, even internally with our engineers. It's like come with solutions and we'll talk through a few different options and we'll pick the best one. Um, it always makes that process go faster if you're able to come with some ideas on how you might fix that issue?
Speaker 1:sorry, I'm sitting here right and I'm like, oh my god, you're able to come with some ideas on how you might fix that issue. Sorry, I'm sitting here writing. I'm like, oh my God, you're preaching it. Dude, bring freaking solutions. Oh my God, don't just go, chris, I don't know what to do. Something happened, whatever may happen. Well, I can fix it, but you got to tell me, number one, what's the freaking problem. That would be helpful and not just verbally. Guys, I need to be unbelievably transparent right here. Verbal is nothing in our world if you don't know, up until this conversation, yes, me and Chris will probably verbally talk about it on the phone, but he or I for both parties are just going to sit there. Hey, chrisris, per conversation we just have. So that way I can come back in two weeks and go. Well, chris said for my phone call so, um, If I've got a problem and I preach this, I preach this to my guys Do not call my phone and go.
Speaker 1:Esquivator just broke down. I don't know what to do. Buddy, you want to set me through the roof? Hey, esquivator just broke down. I've reached out to so-and-so. He can't get to it, but I got so-and-so, maybe going to be here tomorrow. Until then. I reached out to Heath. He's got a rental coming on the way. That's what I want. Okay, sounds good, Approved.
Speaker 1:Not saying yes, that's some of project manager's duties, but as a superintendent of the project you can't just call me and just go, I'm out of problems. Well, they do a lot of often times. But preach, I preach all the time. Just bring me a solution. And, by God, if you're waiting for me to answer the phone, sometimes you just got to make a decision and they know the decisions they can make within the parameters, just like you were talking about the implications of the absorbance of whatever's happening. They know exactly where that line is give or take, let's put it that way. But I do lead. I let them lead with quite a bit of grace. I mean honestly. I let them make mistakes. I want them monetarily within reason, because our mistakes are very expensive normally. But, dude, it's not that hard to bring a solution.
Speaker 1:But before I get off topic, I'm going to send Chris an email. I'm going to hey, here's my problem. Verbal, we talked about it. Here's the elevation gonna. Hey, here's my problem. Verbal, we talked about it. Here's the elevation shots. Uh, here's my pipe. Here's this in question. You're not drawing it out for him or anything, but you are providing him information that he can put it in a drawing and he can make sense of it. That right, there is going to, in my opinion, from the result side. I don't know about your side, but I'm gonna get something back a lot quicker than it would be. Hey, send a survey team out, not eat all this. Take some shots. Here's my problem, here's the data to support my problems.
Speaker 1:And I think, chris, this if we go this route, uh, it's probably gonna cost us a little bit of money. We can figure that out, but time wise keeps us on track and a lot of times you're gonna be like uh, this is the one, especially in aviation, because what I have figured out, there's always a strict timeline. Um, first contract was 75 days. This one, it's been kind of up in here, but it was a 45 day contract and we got majority of our work that we were able to do within the timeline, but it was. It's been fun navigating the relationship out there for sure. Um, nothing bad by any means.
Speaker 1:Guys, I need you to understand I'm not any anything in my undertone. It's been more me learning how to handle these solutions and problems and who to go to, when to go to them. But, man, you've been, seriously. You have been fantastic, not just for me but for my team, for my wife, when there's questions on pay estimates, because let me tell you there's a big difference between a normal pay estimate and an aviation estimate within reason. So you've been super helpful there. But, man, do you not agree? If I give you elevations, what can you do with that? Rather than give, give us a little bit of insight here. Hey, I got problem, chris, fix it. Or here's some elevations. What are you going to take that information?
Speaker 2:yeah, I mean it's more information the better always elevations, pictures, texts, etc. Um, but yeah, it's so much easier for us to just if you can give us something as specific as an elevation or a location of a of a pipe, for instance, we can throw that in cad and we can do some actual analysis of it instead of instead of somebody throwing a tape right on I don't know a relative to the trench that you're digging in or something along those lines, with spoils, scatter rain and all of it. It's hard to understand exactly what the issue is there. So I think the underlying tone of all of that is communicate, communicate, communicate.
Speaker 1:Over communicate? Yes, you have to, and it's not a bad thing, don't get me wrong. Chris is probably like me. Don't want to talk to anybody after five o'clock, because that's what we do all day long and whether you know I was, I had a note to talk about that. You're moving along here. How do you actively communicate? You're basically dealing with five or six, whether it's the city themselves or the airport ownership. I don't quite know, other than my experience here at BBT. I don't really have an understanding. Talk a little bit about how you navigate, obviously, deal with all types of contractors et cetera, but from an aviation side, how do you deal with the ownerships? And maybe a conversation of, hey guys, we don't have this covered, of the cost, of the implication of this. What do we do in that percent or essence of going back to the team and going, hey, we already have a solution for.
Speaker 2:Sure, I mean, sometimes you just things happen, things get missed every now and then, and you got to have tough conversations with your clients or your contractors and at the end of the day, I mean, it's everyone working together to get the best product. So being willing to have those conversations, I think is really important when you're in a specific situation like that. If something were to be missed, yeah, but I think, just understanding that everyone is a person and they have a goal in this project too, you just got to step back every now and then and think we all have a common goal here, right? So let's get to that common goal and let's work together to get there. You're going to have tough conversations along the way. You're going to have tough decisions that have to be made, whether that's with the engineer to the contractor or the engineer with the client or the city that we're working for.
Speaker 2:But again, it's all about getting the project done and doing it right, and we've got to find ways to get there. If there's costs associated with it, hey, let's talk about it. How can we save in other areas of the project to to account for the additional costs that we had in this area? I think it's really important to have those open and transparent conversations with everyone, and that's not just something that needs to be had with the, the city. Everyone needs to be part of those conversations to to get to the answer and continue moving forward.
Speaker 1:Well, not only that, man, if you're open to having conversations with your contractor a lot of times, if you're dealing with a good contractor, they're providing you viable solutions it's just how you're going to interpret it and put it on paper and then translate it up, just like you said earlier. That translation that you guys do in your role is crazy, because you I mean you're having to procure the funding, you're having to deal If one little thing goes wrong. It's all on you guys. You know, I mean there's there's a lot of glaring responsibility there, but from what I've seen, you do it very well and the Garver team does it really well and, yeah, there's some things that I'd love to change about him. But at the same time, you guys do your job very well and I wanted to highlight that on this show.
Speaker 1:One of the other things I guess we'll move on to my guy as you have seen it, especially in the contractor side of coin, I guess you would say, but I don't know if you guys would necessarily deal with so much on it. This is me assuming. That was a total assumption when I say this, but I don't think you would deal with it as much on the engineering side, about procuring the next generation. Like yourself, you know, you've been there through your 20s myself as well. But how's it been on the engineering side?
Speaker 2:And how do you think we're going to go about attracting the next generation? Yeah, that's a great question. Shameless plug for my wife, morgan. She's actually a career and technical education teacher at Grimsley Junior High, really. So what most people think is like, you know, family and consumer, science, culinary, home, ec type stuff. There's a lot more to it than that. There's teaching kids what jobs are out there, not just at the junior high level, necessarily, but Bentonville does a really good job with their Ignite program. They have an aviation-specific Ign ignite program that teaches kids about jobs in the aviation industry, not just not just flying planes either. I mean they, those kids, get drone certified. A lot of jobs they get to. They get to look into game composites and actually help with building some of the aircrafts. So you got to have mechanics, you got to have installers, you got to have builders, um, and it's not just. It's not just all aviation related. That's what I'm hitting on right now.
Speaker 2:But that's a lot about what you do so yeah, opening that sphere to kids when they're young to know what's available, like when we were going and growing up, it was you got to go, was you've got to go to college. Yeah, you have to go to college and you're going to have to have those people. But it takes all kinds of people and if it was only engineers sitting in the office, nothing would ever get done. No, sir, it would not. We understand that, we understand that fully, and we've got to have good partnerships and build up that younger generation to be interested in heck, maybe not just engineering, but just in construction in general, and maybe they'll find their niche in the field instead of working in the office and actually designing it.
Speaker 1:I didn't even know about those programs. So shout out to Miss Morgan, that's so awesome. I didn't even know about those programs, so shout out to Miss Morgan, that's so awesome. I was actually doing a show in here a couple weeks ago and walked out the door after a show and there was a gentleman standing in the lobby. His name is Rodney Ellis. Shout out, no idea. And I told him I want to be all a part of it. Be looking for episodes to come out on Saigon excavation and utilities YouTube page because it's fixing to be hidden.
Speaker 1:We spent I spent an entire day down there with all of those classes and then I went in and there were 65 students chris in the night class. These are graduating seniors. They're graduating with osha, 30 certifications, cdls, heavy equipment experience. They have a 308, a d3, a 120 grader, all with trimble on it. That's awesome with trimble on it. So we're going to go back. Um, he's from our office. He's going to go spend some time with using this GPS and really start harnessing. I was preaching at him get that tremble in there. You have no idea what that'll do for your life. Learn it. And I mean. There was several girls there, younger girls, 17 year old senior girls that can flat run a machine Like I was impressed. You know, don't get me wrong, they ain't going to go dig a ditch tomorrow, but for the amount of time they've had on this equipment it kind of blew my mind. But I went and spent a lot of time and I'm very involved moving forward. There'll be lots of things coming, so be looking for that. But I agree, man, when we were in school my mom straight up knew this old boy wasn't going to college. Actually, that's why I'm an LSU fan. I wanted to go to vet school.
Speaker 1:When I first moved here, before I even moved here, my grandfather had a little dial-up. He used to play internet jiggers. That was his thing. I got on MSN back. Msn back then it's canadian, so bear. Anyways, I typed in their large veterinary school. So I was nine or seven or eight and louisiana state university popped up and I was like that's where I'm going. It was dead set in my mind.
Speaker 1:Then I got down here and I just happened to live in springdale, right next to arch rivals, uh, heartsaw razorbacks. They made fun of me for it even more. The canadian redheaded stepchild looking ginger guy. Yeah so, but just purple and gold. That's right, I mean I just I just added to the list of why people should hate me.
Speaker 1:So, um, I navigated that for a while, but my mother knew pretty quickly. I mean, school wasn't hard for me I'm not being any way, but school wasn't hard. I could get through it very easily to keep mom off my back on A's and B's on my report card and but I knew I wasn't going to go pay to sit in a classroom, sir I a fact. And so when I came out, man, um, I did. I worked for some municipalities and then I jumped over to the contractor side of thing and I know we're definitely straying here but on my story time.
Speaker 1:But, um, I, I knew for a fact. Um, straight out of high school, I just job hopped trying, trying to figure out what I was good at and it wasn't working with my hands. Oh my God, dude, I can't hit a hammer and a nail to this day together. So I picked it. But, man, I could only imagine, if I had that opportunity, that those kids have having a CDL coming out of high school, havingha 30. I'm still trying to get my guys, some of my guys, to sit down for 30 hours and do the schooling that I pay for and everything. Super frustrating anyways to have that on your resume up against guys that still don't have it, that work for me right now like um. So I think that's kind of my requisite for what I think is going to attract the next generation. But we've got to get down into high school and fight this. College is the only way thing. Man, we need more contractors, as you were saying right before the show man we were talking earlier.
Speaker 1:Northwest Arkansas, crazy growth. But with growth it means more, more companies, which means more contractors, etc. And it's been a very big race to the bottom as everybody makes entry to the market and this year's been crazy. This year was crazy, but, um, going off a little bit of a tangent there. What new skills do you think speaking about, about these young blue-collar workers, these skilled trade guys, what do you think they need to be adapting to right now Say, they're coming out of high school, et cetera towards these new technology changes. I was sitting here talking to those kids tremble, tremble, tremble. Not every kid's going to have any type of opportunity with some type of technology, with that Sure. What other skills do you think they can adapt to?
Speaker 2:I think you can even take it even further down than that having a skill of adaptability, because that's what you're going to have to do. You're going to have to have that to progress or succeed in this world. Moving forward with how fast technology moves, I mean it may be trembled today, but in two years from now it might be something bigger and better that you're just going to have to continue to learn and maybe the base understanding is the same as that previous technology, but it's always going to get bigger and better and you're going to have to continue to improve understanding of what you're using, or you're not going to be able to use it as good as the next guy, cause somebody is going to learn it quickly quickly and they're going to retain it.
Speaker 1:That's the biggest thing with my guys is that I'm teaching all the time whether they retain the information. I know that's in so many different industry levels but um, retaining the information. Communication goes both ways. It's talking and listening and I preach that to my guys all the time. But being adaptable is huge.
Speaker 1:No, that's hitting the nail on the head there, because I can't tell you the amount of situations I've been put in over the last nine years. I had to be adaptable, whether it's walking into a room full of upper echelon people that I don't feel like I should necessarily be in the same room with, or it's communicating with my Hispanic guys that we've got an issue on site Like you have got to be adaptable to any situation, especially if you're going to hold responsibility as you move up in the career scale. Being adaptable and holding yourself accountable and others accountable, but mainly yourself, wouldn't help the situation majorly. But man, being adaptable, you're right 100%. The other school I would say that I think Mr Computer Whiz Catman here is probably skipping over is.
Speaker 1:I know I can't even say it's a skill anymore because they come out of high school typing and whatnot. But guys like in their 30s, I still have some guys that have a hard time sending an email. Sure like professionalism through an email and and literally being able to send an email, receive an email. And and literally being able to send an email receive an email. I know it sounds elementary, but make sure you've got that down before you hit your thirties, cause it's. It's a.
Speaker 2:It takes a little bit longer to train you but so, yeah, payback to the communicate, communicate, communicate earlier. Dude, you have to Knowing how to do it well is very important.
Speaker 1:And listening, man, listening to the right communication, because, uh, everybody's out there bumping their gums. You know what I mean. Um, that's, that's also been a hard part for me over the years. Um, in the I was, I was just sitting here thinking is there anything else that I didn't, I didn't capture in the aviation you'd like to share industry before that you'd love to share with the audience that maybe we hadn't even thought about. Before we close out here, I wanted to give you an opportunity you know.
Speaker 2:Nothing specific comes to mind, but if you haven't convinced everybody on here to come, visit Northwest Arkansas and see just walk outside and see the aviation community that we have here awesome planes they're around often. Aviation community that we have here it's unbelievable Awesome planes they're around often. The people that are flying here care about not just aviation but also the community around them, so they're very respectful of everything that they're doing, and you don't get that everywhere. But combine that with everything else Northwest Arkansas has to offer and you've got a pretty special place.
Speaker 2:I didn't think that when I first, uh, or was even going through school, that I'd ever be involved in the aviation industry. But here I am and it is. Uh. It's been very, very fun um to learn it and and really dive in um. Working with contractors as close as we do, working with cities as close as we do, getting a little peek behind the curtain of what's coming up in the next 5, 10, 15 years, potentially as some of our larger airports, has been really eye-opening and happy, happy to be part of it. So anybody that gets the opportunity needs to come and and check it out it's, and it's not just the, the, they.
Speaker 1:They have two. What are the older birds? They're vbt one's a spitfire and one is a have a corsair. Corsair, I can't ever remember. Remember that. But um, older world war, two planes they just flown. They fly them often. I mean we'll be out there and it's not an everyday thing by any means. But a plane like that you don't fly every day. But they'll get them out and we'll just be standing there working and there they go. And I've actually got some video of it but need to get that out.
Speaker 1:But real quick here, guys, if you've loved this episode and what me and Chris have been talking about here, make sure you guys check out bluecollarbusinesspodcastcom. You'll find all our episodes. And if you're listening to us on a streaming software or platform, make sure you give us a good rating and give us a follow on that platform. So I appreciate you guys there. But one last thing for you, chris, before you go. I ask every single person on this show before they walk out the door. I ask them what's a takeaway for the blue collar worker, skilled tradesmen and women that are sick and tired of being stuck in the mud, and that's not just a literal sense, but I'm talking about mental, emotional, physical, if you say as anybody in the skilled trades are just stuck.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't know Find a way maybe to get a win out of every day. I think that that helps me get through. I mean, we're very busy, obviously, on the engineering side, y'all are extremely busy on the contractor side, but if you can find at least at least one success, um, each day, it helps me come back to work the next day and feel like, feel like I can keep going. You know, and sometimes that pile gets so high that it seems a little bit overwhelming, um, but if you can feel like you've gotten at least something done every single day that you're happy with and progressing on, then it makes it a whole lot easier to keep going.
Speaker 1:Dude, thank you for that and I'm serious. That is so true how you eat an elephant one bite at a time, that's right, and our plates do pile up very quickly and you don't answer just a day's worth of emails. You're two weeks behind trying to play catch up. But no, I really appreciate your time. I know you have an extremely busy schedule.
Speaker 1:Like I was saying, I highly anticipated this episode because we have worked so closely together, worked so closely together, and I think it's so big for our industry just to show a working engineer and working installer sitting down and having a conversation and discussing anything, I don't care, other than the project itself and showing that we are two normal human beings and we understand the common goal. And there's a lot to be said for that, because there's a lot of engineers that are not like that and, um, there's a lot of installers not like that or, um, there's a lot of stigma about us and how things have always progressed and this is how they always did it. Well, I'm not really looking forward. Using the past mindset, the whole construction industry needs a little bit of a little bit of an overhaul in general. So, but seriously, chris, thank you so much for joining me today and if you guys have loved this episode and more, you can find everything on bluecollarbusinesspodcastcom.
Speaker 1:And until next time, guys, be kind and be humble. If you've enjoyed this episode, be sure to give it a like. Share it with the fellers. Check out our website to send us any questions and comments about your experience in the blue collar business. Who do you want to hear from? Send them our way. We'll do our best to answer any questions you may have. Till next time, guys.