Blue Collar Business Podcast
Welcome to the Blue Collar Business Podcast with Sy Kirby. Dive deep into the world of hands-on entrepreneurship and the gritty side of making things happen. Join us for actionable tips on scaling your blue-collar business, managing teams, and staying ahead in an ever-evolving market. We'll also discuss the latest industry trends and innovations that could impact your bottom line. If you're passionate about the blue-collar world and eager to learn from those who've thrived in it, this podcast is a must-listen. Stay tuned for engaging conversations and real-world advice that can take your blue-collar business to new heights.
Blue Collar Business Podcast
Ep. 19 - How to Build a Landscaping Business That Thrives in Any Season
Join us as we welcome Eric Hill and Amanda Rhodes from Fay-Ark Lawn Company to the Blue Collar Business Podcast, where they share their remarkable journey in the landscaping industry. Eric, who started his business as a high school side hustle, reveals how he turned it into a multi-million dollar enterprise with 16 employees, overcoming initial skepticism from family. Amanda's fresh perspective, introduced in 2022, has been instrumental in streamlining operations and enhancing customer engagement, exemplifying the power of a unified and supportive team in achieving business success.
Discover the critical role of company culture and integrity in blue-collar sectors like landscaping. This episode takes you through the ups and downs of building a positive work environment, with insights on avoiding stagnation and implementing growth-oriented strategies. Personal stories highlight the continuous effort required to keep employees invested in the company's core values, with integrity emerging as a key focus. The narrative underscores the importance of leadership in maintaining a vibrant culture and the impact of structured meetings on productivity and decision-making.
Eric and Amanda also shed light on the challenges of integrating new software and strategic marketing in a rapidly growing business. Learn from their experience of implementing a new system in just 90 days, boosting efficiency and margins significantly. The discussion covers the importance of unique branding and creative marketing strategies, with anecdotes illustrating the significance of bold decisions and accountability. The episode concludes with a focus on building community and engaging with the podcast audience, emphasizing safety, kindness, and humility in both personal and professional realms.
Sy-Con is a family-owned civil contractor specializing in water, sewer, storm drains, & earthwork.
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Hey guys, welcome to the Blue Collar Business Podcast, where we discuss the realest, rawest, most relevant stories and strategies behind building every corner of a blue collar business. I'm your host, cy Kirby, and I want to help you in what it took me trial and error and a whole lot of money to learn the information that no one in this industry is willing to share. Whether you're under that shade tree or have your hard hat on, let's expand your toolbox. Welcome back to the Blue Collar Business Podcast, guys, sponsored and presented by Sycon Escavation and Utilities. We do have a presenting sponsor now. It should be on the screen for your viewing pleasure, and you can be too, if you think of somebody in the blue-collar working space that might would like to get their brand product service out there in a broader spectrum. We have had some intriguing numbers here as of late and the audience is growing and I can't thank you guys enough.
Speaker 1:Today. I have got all about landscaping and we've been talking about, we've had concrete, we've had engineers, we've had financing guys. We've been all over the blue color market, but one that everybody seems to is I know you guys will agree everybody wants to jump into and think they can do a better job than you with a wheelbarrow and an S-10 and they think they're a landscaper. So we're here to talk about that today. But we're also going to talk about their success, because they've been in business like myself, not 10 plus 20 plus years working and guiding and it's kind of cool that my sister is also involved through all of this and it's going to be a very loose conversation. Um, their success I've been praying for it, watching it. Um, they've been doing it right, focused on culture, focused on core values the things that, as you guys know, I'm very concerned with at psychon.
Speaker 1:And, furthermore, guys Eric Hill and Amanda Rhodes of Fay Ark Land Lawn Company. Thank you guys so much seriously, thanks for having us. Absolutely, I know. Thank you for this wonderful opportunity here in podcast videos, comm studio. They got to join me here in Rogers, arkansas. Luckily they're local here to Northwest Arkansas. Yep, how I've been following along with the Fay Art story. Senior Trucks. I thought the branding was very well. You're very well branded. There's a gentleman here that has a podcast here that would definitely agree with y'all's branding and the approach and pushing the branding and, as you guys know, I've done a lot of branding myself and a little later to the game than you guys were. I mean, you started off right right from the get go making sure everything matches, and you guys know, I see you guys all the time. There they are, oh, there they are, oh there they are, and so it's it's really really cool, but really cool.
Speaker 2:But tell us a little bit about you guys and how you got started yeah, so I started this in high school 2018, so we're in business a little over six years now. Start mowing grass just for inside money. Same thing through my senior year is just I was just looking to make some money and get through school. I was going to go work for my dad who owned Hill Electric. That was my plan.
Speaker 1:Really Yep.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay, that makes a whole lot of sense. Okay, yeah so I grow it through senior year, I have wrist surgery that fall from a football injury. After I graduate and after I healed up, my dad's like, all right, it's time to go get signed up for school, all that stuff, do something. I went and got signed up for electric school, filled all the paperwork out and told them I'm not doing it yeah. So because just in my heart I didn't feel like it's what I wanted to do, yep.
Speaker 1:So and you grew up around it too dude yeah, Like your whole life was sparky pliers and Klein tools. And yeah, I know all about that with mechanics and snap-ons and yeah, so I could only imagine.
Speaker 2:But yeah, continue, yeah. So I've learned a lot from them because I mean, they've owned a business for over 20 years but decided to do this and see where I'd go. They were frustrated with me, concerned because they're my parents Of course they are.
Speaker 3:What are you going to do in the winter.
Speaker 2:I said well, probably nothing because I don't have much of a customer base, but we made it through and I lived at home at the time and had no expenses.
Speaker 1:Hey man, I was there answering the same questions. Dude, I get it yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so fast forward in 2020, 2021, and all the way to today, like it's just been fast growth, yeah, and I've managed a lot of it by myself, and that's kind of where Amanda came in is like it was 2022, and we were running five crews at that point, which me managing everything in the office and all about it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, all that stuff it it wasn't working stuff.
Speaker 2:I mean, I wasn't getting back to customers, and that's kind of where you start to feel like a hindrance to your own business.
Speaker 3:It's a terrible feeling 100, yeah, man, but and at that the office is the spare bedroom in the back of the house. I feel you Been there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so because unless it rained, I wasn't doing any office work unless it was sending a quote or sending a bill so sales is everything and collecting that money is what makes this thing go, and that's the exact same focus. I wish I had more focus on sales up front. Anyway, sorry to keep cutting you off, yeah.
Speaker 2:So it. I wish I had more focus on sales up front. Anyway, sorry to keep cutting you off. So it's been fast growth and today we've got 16 guys. We'll surpass a little over 3.3 million this year. That's freaking awesome.
Speaker 1:So in six years? In six years, dude and wow, that is epic.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we've been very blessed, to say the least, and I just got you.
Speaker 1:I know you guys to your own question earlier. Hey, what are you going to do in the winter? You guys do do quite a bit of snow removal too. A ton.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:We do it on and off. We've got, of course, bigger gear, wheel loaders et cetera, but man, I've lost my butt every single time I do it. I'm not set up to do it, I don't have the snow plow attachments and every time I go to buy them it's a dry year and we don't get any snow and so, and again, I don't have the admin staff. Now I do. Back then I did not, and we did a little bit last year for some inner working clients. But have you been able to do the snow removal thing profitably?
Speaker 2:it's because we it's not budgeted, because that's a toss-up if it snows here understood it's. It's not in the budget, so technically, technically it's basically all yeah, all profit because, it's not budgeted, so and most of that equipment's paid for.
Speaker 1:I would assume.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, that's freaking awesome because snow, it turns into reinvesting more into snow and then having a little bit of cash to have a jump start in the spring. So it's been great, except when you don't get paid by oh, but people on certain things that we're still fighting from last year, and that was literally the biggest argument I had about doing snow removal.
Speaker 1:We did like this is 21, 20, I can't remember we had two snowstorms within a week. We got dumped on and we just stayed an entire week, kept machines running, but I had so many breakdowns with skid steers and with skid steers and again not having the dude. They make such cool snow removal equipment nowadays that you can be efficient and literally one guide around and I've got three or four guys going around shoveling and it just didn't ever work out for me.
Speaker 2:It never did right.
Speaker 1:But that's really cool that you've already. You've already got your gear paid off sitting there. That way when it does come winter there is a chance in that december to february slow period you can just bam go get it, yeah and that and stack.
Speaker 2:That's so cool man and so we got a few mowing crews yeah, well, so in 2020, 2023, I made the decision um it's 2022 that we're going to sub a lot of our mowing and in 2023 we subbed all of it 100 of it and 2023 I lost focus, a lot of what the goal is here. We did, we did all projects um got into dirt sifting, we lost our butt butt on that and I just I wasn't focused. I thought we could make money doing anything and truth is you can't you make money on what you focus on.
Speaker 1:You bad buddy. That is knowledge right there.
Speaker 2:By the end of 2023 is like all right, kind of is say, january 1st of 24, it's like here's our goal, here's the plan. We're sticking to it. If I say any other crazy idea that I'm gonna go do like stop you.
Speaker 1:I will stop you because I'm telling you dude, I know you're living, you're talking about myself, over here I was the same way, and I just went through 24, and not only did I I didn't necessarily lose focus of where we're going.
Speaker 1:24 was just such a freaking brutal year in general. Um, from where we've been, you know, going since 16 and this year, first time we've ever seen a revenue dip, um. But at the same time, there was things that I lost focus on, number one being sales, and sales has to be your number one focus. But I was definitely developing a marketing plan and I'm pulled in so many different ways. And then I lost my project manager in July and I really had to just go to the core of the onion and go this don't taste good, but I've got to fix this or I'm not going to be anything. And what am I doing here? What am I doing there?
Speaker 1:And literally, very publicly, with my team, you know, letting them look up the skirt, kind of say and go hey, guys, I've steered the ship wrong and we're going to flip this around. I need your help. There's some guys that are going to lose faith, et cetera, but that's all part of it, man. And guys that are going to lose faith, et cetera, but that's all part of it, man. And so to be honest about that. Is a big thing, don't?
Speaker 1:skip over that I mean. There's guys that go years unfocused and years of no growth, stagnant. I know a utility contractor that did a race out to $2 million and did $2 million for 15 years. That did a race out to $2 million and did $2 million for 15 years and now they're sold out and made a very, very, very good exit, but there was 15 years of stagnation, of no change.
Speaker 2:No, change no developing no growth, no, nothing. No. Growth for your people is the biggest thing in that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I agree, I completely agree. And we were talking about culture for your people is the biggest thing in that. Yeah, I agree, I completely agree. And we were talking about culture and culture is a big thing. And the cool thing is is that you know we're sitting here of an age that it's a little different than what we were offered, you know, in the job marketplace Absolutely, you know what I mean. There wasn't a place I could go.
Speaker 1:I kind of caught some hate about a little bit of know your purpose within a video we did on Cycon's YouTube channel. Literally, I was just. I just hated the environments that I worked in. It's not that I hated the job, hated the work. I actually enjoyed it and found passion in it, but at the same time, the environments and the things that I went through just to be an employee wasn't okay. But as a business owner sitting across the table from you guys, I can sit here and say I've swung so hard to obtain culture that it has cost me quite a bit of money going the wrong way, chasing the wrong Yep, so go ahead.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I'm just going back on what we are now. So we have two mowing crews, two flower bed maintenance crews, so nine crews total two irrigation trucks and then two landscape trucks.
Speaker 1:Jeebus buddy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so we're pretty I say even but we're trying to grow maintenance because we want to serve our customers. We'll obviously get enhancements to make their property look better on top of that, but that's our focus and then installing quality landscape projects and then maintaining them after that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're not only getting the service after the sale. That's the biggest downfall in the blue-collar sector in our world.
Speaker 1:Especially site work. Exactly, yo, dude, my guys. In our side it's landscapers that follow up. I could list off quite a few that are here locally. It's a joke. And there is no delineation line of here's where we stop and we take a little bit of pride and backfill up against the curbs and the sidewalks where you don't have to eat six or seven extra loads of topsoil that wasn't budgeted, and then you go back to the contractor and they're like well, I don't know what to tell you.
Speaker 1:The site guy said he was, he was perfect you know, and I know you guys have dealt with that argument, but that's crazy nine working crews well and with the property maintenance.
Speaker 3:You know, when we looked at that and we looked at the sub work we were putting out there, what we were getting back, I looked at this in the office and I'm like I'm getting complaints. You know our standard out there is going down because our stuff are not bought in our culture.
Speaker 1:No, they never will be.
Speaker 3:No, and we can say I can make phone calls and yes, ma'am, yes, ma'am, but the truth is my clients and our customers are not getting what we want to give them you bet. And so bringing that back in-house, working on training, making that 100% like it has to happen.
Speaker 2:A focus. It's a focus, absolutely. They want to see the brand, they want to see the black truck sitting out front of their house or out front of their business. That's the invoice they pay, yep.
Speaker 1:And I've learned the hard way myself a little bit on that. Not, I learned the hard way myself a little bit on that. Not as much because mowing.
Speaker 2:I mean, how many customers are you serving a week in that capacity, or monthly? How about that?
Speaker 3:I bet we're at like 100-ish customers but like 140 properties. But again, that's our winter sales, right? I know that's guaranteed for my guys. We're feeding families, we have men who are wonderful leaders of their home and we give them the best we can environment so that they can grow, they can learn, and they're absolutely bought in our culture. They speak our core values. As a matter of fact, our guys brought us a core value. We had four that we stood really strong on and this spring they came to us and they said look, guys, we want to add one in there. And we heard them out and the word that they chose was integrity.
Speaker 1:That's so cool.
Speaker 3:We thought that was amazing and awesome.
Speaker 1:To come from your team man. That's really cool man, and it's hard. You'll have guys that are completely bought in the system. Just from my own experience, that will fade from the system, they will and they'll lose that rejuvenated spirit. Let's go take over the world. So it's a constant culture thing. Right, it's not just here's culture and this is how we're going to move. It's a constant working and I've seen you guys' LinkedIn posts about how you guys are integrating with the team and sitting down with the team things that I wish I did a little bit more of, because I know the system integration that you guys are performing. It's probably going over pretty well.
Speaker 3:Honestly, it's probably for my mentor. She's amazing and she helps give me amazing ideas or help me round out the ideas I'm wanting to implement. I want team builders for my guys, but I don't want to Google one. I want one that's going to mean something to them, that is relatable in our industry.
Speaker 2:You bet.
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 3:I know Eric's in his office with his mentors doing the same kind of thing.
Speaker 1:You have to.
Speaker 1:We want to deliver the best for them, and it's a weight that nobody really talks about too, because there's a lot of bad entrepreneurs out there. Right, and don't get me wrong, I take my hat off to any entrepreneur. I don't care how you do it. If you run a business, hats off to you, because it's not freaking easy. It is easy to do it wrong, it's hard to do it right, and especially adding something like culture in the mix of it. But nowadays, that's what people want to be a part of, and if you don't have something for them to, per se, to buy in especially a younger company like both of ours are under that decade mark they have to have something they can sink their teeth in and know that the future looks bright, and that's exactly what you're providing within that, and you, you guys, spoke about core values kind of talk about those for just a second so they're on their, take ownership, love others, be positive, always be growing and integrity.
Speaker 2:So like kind of where it was like all right, we got to have these, like we'd always, like they're always on a paper, like we're changing them, but it's like we have to operate off of these because it's just beyond like one, two people to manage.
Speaker 2:We can't sit there and manage every single crew nope those core values manage our company and I'm kind of where it stemmed from is like in the last year we had a hard talk with all of our guys and and we just we went through everything that's going wrong and it's like here's where we're messing up, here's how we are fixing it in the office. New software has helped with a lot of it, shoot, I think we got down to six people besides eric and I.
Speaker 2:We got down to six people in our company yeah, because, because it was again, people didn't fit, we just, we just weren't having it, even if they're great at the work, we fired a great irrigation tech. And it's like he doesn't fit in our culture.
Speaker 1:I totally get it. And you can have those workability conversations and direction-changing conversations, but two or three of those and there's zero effort being applied there. What are you going to do at that point? You're just wasting your own time. So good on you for cutting that cord, because there's a lot of times that I can tell you within my, my tenure is just I didn't cut the cord fast enough and it is a hundred percent now a higher slow, fire fast mindset for myself. I'm literally looking, got a few positions that are going to be open up, that are extremely, extremely key roles in the next couple of months, and I am now looking, taking 30, 60, 90 days and going to start putting feelers out there, because I have done the opposite of higher fast and fire slow and man, it just not only does it kill your pocketbook, kill margins, it kills morale because now the good ones don't even want to excel because they're dealing with toxicity of these bad ones. You know what I mean.
Speaker 3:And I've done that. They don't trust us to take care of it because we let it happen.
Speaker 1:Exactly, and they're waiting on a lot of times. Sarah has to remind me. And they're waiting on a lot of times I, I, sarah has to remind me they're waiting on us to lead Like we're leaders. And and it's funny, because we have to provide this grace right, no matter what, as, as the owner, you got to provide this grace and you're just some days, you just look at them and you're like dude, how long you been here? This is like day one stuff. What are we dealing with? But then, any time the role is reversed and you're like hey, man, I'm learning too.
Speaker 1:You're like what are you? Isn't this just like the biggest irrigation outfit in the country? Like what do you mean? You can make a mistake and it's just. No grace is given whatsoever. You're supposed to know everything and I'm like man, if I knew everything, you'd hate working here.
Speaker 3:So I'll be completely honest with you, we really focused on that. When we got down to six people, we had a big meeting with each other and just looked at this and said it comes down to core values, and Eric talked it through and through. I'm very lucky to have a wonderful boss that knows so much and is so strong as far as that goes with the business, and he really helped me develop my skills as far as being a support system for operations and, you know, production or whatever that looks like on my end, and we took it to heart. We started listening. We listen to podcasts all time. Um, we have certain ones we listen to each week that we both know we're a part of, so we can get that meat out there, talk about it, converse about it.
Speaker 1:That's cool.
Speaker 3:And the biggest thing that I think we did do was we made the core values a part of everybody's environment. We didn't just talk about it anymore. We put them on little cards that were three by six. We laminate them, we stuck them on the dashes, we put them in their faces, they're in the books, they're on the drive. I mean, they can't get away from it. Right and they are bought. Yep, that's it right there.
Speaker 2:You like it, they all got them in their wallet.
Speaker 3:That's cool Every new truck, every new you know employee important. It starts with the first phone call of hi, I saw your ad, my name is so and so you and at that point. We've got questions and everybody is transparent, like everybody knows what those questions should be well, that kind of actually leans on.
Speaker 1:This little bit of note I wanted to touch on you. You say you just went down to six, but you're also saying that we're at 16 now. What hiring strategies have you guys been using to find those reliable, culture-filled people?
Speaker 2:I'd say like at first during COVID 2021 was really hard. It seemed like we were rolling different guys every week, so I went through probably 40 people, I think in 2020, 2021. And it's just like I need someone to weed eat, like that's what I need, and kind of end of 2021, we got our first solid guy, first solid foreman Understood and older guy and he's a 21-year-old kid running around in a mower trying to tell him how to do his job when he's done it for six years.
Speaker 2:I get it and he's like if you talk to him now, he's like yeah, I didn't know what this kid was thinking, but I stay here and he's, he's believed in you a little bit, and he's, he's seen it through and he's like he was skeptical of it, because it's like man a lot of people talk about this, but it's one of the hardest things to do ever.
Speaker 3:We have a guy who, so we've expanded down into Fort Smith this year and we're doing lots of growth there. We have a guy who came on our plate maybe through a mishap of leadership on our end.
Speaker 2:Bad manager in the spring, but came with him because he was from the previous company.
Speaker 3:Bad manager in the spring but came with him because he was from the previous company. He was the guy who was always the helper in the back for this person that we had brought on and was always in the background, always the crew member, and we just saw his heart. His heart matched our culture, his values matched our culture. And so I say, like that's how we talked to him. I was like we choose you, we want you to step forward. You know, we want to make you a foreman, we want to do these things. We exited the other guy and he tells us all the times like I only stayed because of the culture and like I know what this is for me and my family he's like I'm a better man because of what I'm here and that's right, that just blesses us so much yeah, of course it does.
Speaker 1:It's your only pat on the back that you guys are really receiving it and his family is beautiful.
Speaker 1:That is fantastic anything that we can teach these guys and gals outside of the workplace to be better personal individuals. If you come to work at psycon, excavation and utilities and you're here for six month period of time and I somehow didn't have some type of personal effect on you or the crew, didn't? We failed you and I feel terrible about that. And there's dude. I've rolled through the guys. I can't tell you how many old heads that I've had to deal with that are so quick to throw a hard hat when I have, you know, maybe an idea, when they were training me and now they want a paycheck from me. And when I started getting out there on the utility sites and doing site work and it is a, you think a dirt guy, you think Q-tip, white hair, New Balance shoes and overalls, out there spitting dip and telling you which way to direction, to drive the truck and that isn't not what I'm trying to be anything about.
Speaker 1:That's like exactly the opposite. I want to bring professionalism and and it sounds a lot exactly what you guys are wanting to do. I mean, there's so many landscapers out there, right, and to be set apart within a high niche industry is hard. It's hard to do. So. Building into your culture number one for your own people is major and it's going to show within your quality and I got to quickly tell them myself earlier this year. I lost the sense of our culture the first six months of this year. I was being told I didn't have my eyes open. I had my blinders on trying to handle ownership items ownership items really be hyper-visual in have my eyes open. I had my blinders on trying to handle ownership items ownership items really be hyper visual and about my time and where I'm associating it and how I'm spending it. But it wasn't focused enough on the field and I had a guy back in February.
Speaker 1:He's like smack me around. He's like, hey, man, look, you started this and this is all because you were out there. You're trying to look at it 60 days from the time it happened and then ask the question. You need to find out when it's happening, why it's happening, and then spend two hours teaching the entire crew as to why this can't happen, Find the pattern Exactly, and so that's what I have spent a ton doing. But while trying to focus on culture too is extremely difficult.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know what I mean it is, and so we have foreman meetings once a month, and a lot of it was because we had a new software we were onboarding and they had a lot to learn. But it's turned into a meeting where we get to hear from them what they are seeing.
Speaker 3:So, it's just a check-in. Yeah, that's so good. It costs us, it's definitely structured and we've learned a lot through the meetings as far as what not to do. You know we to be transparent. We used to discuss things that they would bring to us new, you know, and we realized we maybe not need to do that and we do that in our meetings and that way we maybe not need to do that and we do that in our meetings, and that way we can provide them with the support they need.
Speaker 3:Um and going through the same thing putting them together in a division instead of sitting wherever you want. I mean, there's little things that we've done to tweak the meetings that have just caused so much production, like it's really been free, yeah, you don't want to I, they're very I'm king of a two-hour meeting. It's really bad.
Speaker 1:We're chatty, it's so bad and to not go into a meeting with an agenda and this is what we're talking about. This is why and this is why we need a decision by this date is completely counterproductive to what we're trying to do. And begin with, and then by two hours is up, they're sitting there.
Speaker 2:No, they're asleep, they don't even care, like they don't remember. We're super bought in. Yeah, we're like oh my God, I got all this new stuff I got to take care of.
Speaker 1:Like what is this? What is that? Billy needs this Exactly. No, we can't have Jesse upset, you know, and you're like, oh my God, and they're all their problems on you, and then you've got to sort through them.
Speaker 2:But well, that's the whole thing. Take ownership. They're taking ownership of their crew. They are over their crew. So whatever happens with them, it's because of them. We're here in the office to support them and, like that's what we are, we're support to the crew because without them, there's no business.
Speaker 1:That's right.
Speaker 2:And we want them to be as effective as possible, work in the best environment as possible, even though it is landscaping and some days suck with the weather. But if they're happy and our customers are happy and we're on budget, everything flows 100%, man, 100%.
Speaker 1:And not only that. Customers are at the end of everything you just listed. You're going to be happy and your customers are going to be happy at the end of the day, and it is a fine line. It is a lot of extra to deal with. At the end of the day, you're just like mow the dang yard, bobby Freaking just mow the yard and don't miss anything.
Speaker 1:Please just do it right if you don't mind, and take a little bit of pride. But we can't pay them to care and we can't pay them to take pride in it, and that's a lot of why I was pushing into the marketing stuff with being an underground contractor. Ninety-five percent of what I do gets covered up to never be hopefully seen ever again. And so to push a little bit more pride and quality, you stick a camera down a ditch and they're like, oh, what is this thing People are going to see? And then they start to see the result of what this camera is doing in the ditch and they're like, oh, this is kind of cool. We don't want it to look like crap and it just changed everything for us.
Speaker 1:But anyways, you've mentioned software a couple of times. Man, I have struggled Boy howdy couple of times. Man, I have struggled Boy howdy. Have we struggled with software implementation and onboarding. We dealt with a massive program called Procore and a lot of the local GCs are on it. We're pushing into the commercial site, we're a game, and I'm like, oh, we got to have it so it'd be seamless with our customers. They can request on there, let's go, let's go. Expensive little dude and didn't even have a scheduling tool, didn't have like mandatory tools that we needed exactly that you would love our software.
Speaker 3:I need to get you on that we are currently using.
Speaker 1:Builder strand is what we're using and we've had some success. Uh, we're doing some different stuff on the sales side, but what software are you guys using? Tell me a little bit about it.
Speaker 2:It's Aspire software, so Service Titan owns it. Basically, it's the landscape version of Service Titan.
Speaker 1:Gotcha.
Speaker 2:It is, I think, 100% the best software in our industry. Hands down Sponsor yeah, it is incredible.
Speaker 3:Well, so they're amazing. We're in contact with them all of the time. I couldn't ask for better support. Eric and I tend to have wild ideas and want to implement fast and hard, because that's how we operate for everybody here. We are fasting hard all the time.
Speaker 1:You have to.
Speaker 3:So when Eric brought me this software, I had never integrated a software before and I started researching it and I was like, okay, you know, this is going to job cost for us. This is going to break numbers down, this is going to be so great for growth. And then we both looked at each other and their normal onboard time is, you know, six plus months and we looked at each other on our timeline for what we wanted.
Speaker 2:And you laughed at it. We said we have 90 days.
Speaker 3:Yeah, because it was like December, and we're like we've got to have this rolling by spring. Yeah, we have to have it rolling by spring. So March 1 was our deadline and our implementation manager, tandra, was amazing. She laughed at me multiple times. She heard me out when I cried in frustration.
Speaker 3:There's just a lot to it, but it was so incredible because I was able to take every piece of this business and put it somewhere so that we could have an operating software that worked for our customers. They worked for us and made it simpler.
Speaker 2:Handles the whole thing.
Speaker 3:Right, we have found all of the breadcrumbs, you know, all the pennies on the table that we were missing for job costing or indirect labor or maybe just time standing around. I mean, we've refined our rollout in the morning to 25 minutes and for a landscape company of our size.
Speaker 2:that is incredible Because it was 45 minutes the year previous.
Speaker 1:And then come and go Because over McDonald's, trust me, I get it.
Speaker 3:No more coffee stops. Bring it with you.
Speaker 2:It's just refining waste and it's helped highlight that Ice. Yeah, like we have. Like it's helped highlight that Ice. Yeah, it's made us like all right.
Speaker 3:We brought ice in the house.
Speaker 2:No more stuff Ice at the shop, water at the shop. We're going to take care of them, but you're not going to waste time.
Speaker 1:Yep.
Speaker 2:You're going to go here to get on the job and do your job, but we want to take care of you.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And our gross margin is up I, I think, 8.5% compared to last year.
Speaker 1:That's freaking awesome so from.
Speaker 3:March to now seven months.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's just the software, because it tracks everything. It tracks time from the time they get in to the time they leave, and we can allot that in any certain place.
Speaker 3:And I have multiple support classes each week. I have my office manager on, I have my irrigation guy on my field supervisors on a production call every Thursday. These people I'm giving them every access to the support and the software so they're getting on live. The folks who are help building and refining and taking our questions and they're the people behind the emails. I have them on text Like they are so supportive. I really don't run into anything. My strategy really in my office is I'm the sticky note queen and everybody knows it. If there's a problem, I write it on a sticky, I put it down, it goes into my note and as soon as that meeting starts I'm asking questions and we're live and it's fixed.
Speaker 1:Well, let me tell you something. Procore's implementation did not go like that. I don't know Nothing like that and we literally restarted the program three different times, Still paid for it for the second year. It was almost 20 for the second year because it goes off employee count, et cetera, et cetera, and it just was not for us. So we made some massive switch-ups and it was just so hard for the guys in the field. I read something on LinkedIn. I know we're all involved pretty hard on LinkedIn. I read something on LinkedIn. I know we're all involved pretty hard on LinkedIn. Basically it was if you want bad information faster, more repetitively, have a crappy system of getting that in. You know, for the guys to be able to.
Speaker 3:Data deserves to be documented.
Speaker 1:Well, it's not about work you can do. It's about work you can document you've done and get, especially against customer bases and especially with high invoice counts that you guys have.
Speaker 1:Like I have nothing compared to that in a monthly spectrum and like you have to have that documentation, because what are you going to do? Drive behind 40 mowers a day, Like I mean I would assume it's 20 yards a day or 30 yards a day or whatever it is. I mean you have to have some level of QC with that amount of invoicing and transactions happening and customer-based reports etc. But man, how does it transpire for your field guys to get the information that you want into the office where it is live enough that you can catch a job tracking or a labor tracking issue or a maintenance issue or whatever it is, because they reported it and you can go back and look and and then you can start moving forward. Uh, on it. But no, our software implementation did not go nothing like that it was terrible and I can't tell you.
Speaker 1:Be blessed, because a lot of the guys I talk to, especially more in the dirt and site work world, it's very tailored, just like the landscaping world. It's the industry we have high invoice count. I couldn't even imagine what all the things that you guys need, but you couldn't either on this side. And it is so specifically tailored and you're trying to find this system that not only works for the industry and your local industry and matches the market, but at the same time you want the results that you want out of it. So it's like it's so hard to find and then, once you do find it, well, you've got to deal with some con of oh well, it's not easy for the customers to view, or it's oh, it's not easy for the guys to input their daily logs, and that's the most vital information that you want out of this hole to begin with. So I was go ahead.
Speaker 3:Okay. So it has to work for the customer, it has to work for my guys out there in the field and it has to work for us in the office. Aspire covers all those things. The customer portal that comes with the software system is incredible. We are able to do image carousels so that we can kind of update seasonally. It's interactive. They can put in a request, they see all their proposals, their invoicing, they've got cards on files. Everything is so quick.
Speaker 1:Wow, I didn't even think about. Yeah, you guys are dealing with credit card transactions. You have to.
Speaker 3:As much as the residential customers like it. My AP guys from all of the commercials they love that because when they get asked a question from their boss they are quickly pulling up that portal and they're like absolutely. The visit date was here. It's timestamped and the guys can see everything that they need to leave a visit note. We've made that mandatory, so there's a visit note for everything.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:That's so cool. So we have a group text that we have with the field supervisor, the office manager, myself, eric, and then the foreman. So if there's a problem, immediately we're all aware and whomever is responsible for that jumps in and the rest of us trust that they're going to take care of that. If we see a lull, we'll kind of jump in.
Speaker 1:But we allow everybody that space Accountability is everything right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and communication through that, Because how quick we've grown roles get mixed daily and weekly. Multiple hats, buddy, yeah, and it's part of growth. So we streamlined communication as best as we could in the situation we're in and then once we add another position, it'll change. But as long as everyone knows what's going on and the customer's being taken care of and it's all going right, it's all theirs At the end of the day, it's that sale and are they happy?
Speaker 1:And Google reviews I would assume you guys have a ton. That would be the number one focus I would be focusing on from a marketing aspect high invoice Is there a way that we can, you know, send that to them? If I was doing I've thought about this a hundred thousand times and there's companies that I use that send me a ping after the service is done. Shoot me a Google review, shoot us a review here. I know it sounds a little redundant, but at the same time you want them when they're happy to give us a good review and when they're pissed, maybe the review. You might save yourself a customer. You know what I mean. Hey, one star, I was pissed. Boom, you actually got them to actually talk to you. Whether it's public or not, it sucks. But at the same time, it's not about mistakes we make, it's how we handle them and that's kind of where I'm heading.
Speaker 1:Next is the competitiveness of landscaping. Well, first, before I move into that, if you guys have loved this episode and you've loved every other episode, I hope you guys have checked out bluecollarbusinesspodcastcom. That's where you can get in contact with us about sponsorships. You can see the rest of our episodes. That is all. I think 16 or 17 that are now live and coming more and more in the tank and every single Wednesday coming at you live, coming more in the tank and every single Wednesday coming at you live. So if you guys are on a streaming platform, if you wouldn't mind giving us a like or a follow, depending on what podcast streaming platform you are on, but don't need a subscription, you can head to bluecollarbusinesspodcastcom and check out the audio visual anything from the webpage.
Speaker 1:So back to it. The competitiveness in the landscaping world, other than the culture within your team. Yes, that is 100% going to drive quality. That's going to drive other things. What are you doing marketing-wise? What are you doing outside to gain those customers? And if we've made mistakes, say with subcontractors et cetera, how are we correcting those?
Speaker 2:It's taking care of the customer if we screw up.
Speaker 1:Like if we screw up.
Speaker 2:we're going to fix it because we are going to screw up, Things happen.
Speaker 2:Mistakes are made by human yeah we're going to fix it and the money doesn't matter because it's staying behind your word, but marketing-wise, like, our website is built very well and it's my best man he's done our website since day one and um, so it's it's nice because I know, like we've set it up and that that and google um, like google my business, we rank very high on um because of seo. That that's probably the most important thing. Yep, other Other than our trucks.
Speaker 1:Because 100% dude.
Speaker 2:Because, like, it's not about marketing, it's about branding, because, like, if you see a black truck in their landscaping, you know it's us.
Speaker 1:You bet I call it the lightning bolt. It took me forever to figure out that it was like the state of Arkansas Took me a little bit so I got that from like from the University of Arkansas when they did that for one of their logos, that's where I got it from. That's awesome, and why did you go?
Speaker 2:black. My first truck was black and I don't know it's different. That's why.
Speaker 1:Yep, Because it's very smart man.
Speaker 2:We've got to stand out from every other company that has a white truck.
Speaker 1:Yep, and every other landscaping construction guy. There's the same gentleman I talked about earlier. I've got to give Mark Zweig a shout-out here. He is a literal genius when it comes to the consulting and he talks about the purple car a lot of times and he had an engineering environmental. We deal with a density requirement, so basically they come out and test that we compaction testing okay. So, um, they were a environmental firm reaching out to uh zweig's consultant firm and talking about, hey, how do we stand out from the rest? And they consulted back and forth and he's like, hey, paint every freaking vehicle, you got purple. And, and they're, you know, of course, converse back and forth. And he's like, hey, paint every freaking vehicle, you got purple. And he and they're, you know, of course, converse back and forth. We don't really want to be purple, etc. Etc. He's like telling you and they stood by, and they did it. What it did do is how about my guys that are sitting in the track? Oh, sitting out there on the job site and comes across a general contractor? They had shown up in these purple cars so much they became the purple car. And so when you're sitting there talking to a general contractor and like, hey, dude, where's your density tester at? Oh, you got one for the job, call the purple car dude. And they, every year, doubled in growth, tripled in growth from what he had told in the story, and it's a testament to that.
Speaker 1:And, man, I've wanted to do a little bit, something different than white. It's eaten me alive. But at the same time, I'm on this cost with the marketing that we're already doing digitally. I haven't adjusted anything locally. We have a great local presence within the cities and the entities that we have, but how do I start standing out as these out-of-towners start coming in? And that's exactly where I'm going. Presence within, you know, the cities and the entities that we have, but how do I start standing out as these out-of-towners start coming in? And that's exactly where I'm going. Is I want to be the orange trucks or I want to be the whatever it is, the black truck? You said it earlier. They want to see the black truck pull up. You're exactly right, they do and they see the. You know, fay Arc on the logo of the invoice and in your portal, and it's plastered over there. And so if— it's consistent all the way through Exactly.
Speaker 1:And I think that's, I guess, admirable that you were so focused on ensuring that you were taking a little taste of all of the industry, that you subcontracted your mowing out and you started mowing. Is that you're back to mowing within in-house, correct? Because of the customer relations that we had for a little bit? And, dude, I've been the same way Subcontractors. They just don't care like we do. And it's back to culture, right? I? I got a pretty good feeling that your subcontractors aren't carrying the cool little core values in the back pocket of where they go. You know what I mean. So, um, we've kind of been all over the place. But when? When did hardscaping kind of come into the mix? I guess through the last couple of years.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'd say 2020, 2022,. I think is when we started doing a couple and it's just documenting, like if we do a retaining wall, we're going to get pictures of it, and that's, I guess, another part of marketing is having quality pictures of our jobs and quality videos and having that like for us, for residential people. We show our jobs and we show prices on our website.
Speaker 2:Transparency, man yeah, is everything, all the way through, because if they know, hey, this is going to cost 10 grand, and I want something close to this, I'm going to call them yes and people um shop us out because we're too expensive for the tire kicker, and then just they're shopping for the cheapest price 100 because we don't want that no, you don't want to be the cheapest price and you don't, as I was referring to the black truck or the purple car.
Speaker 1:You don't want to be the cheap guy, because if you're the cheap guy, they expect cheap. But they expect you can't have cheap, fast and quality all in the three, like you got to have somewhere and I pay, you know, or I talk with my customers, I'm like you're paying, yes, I do utility and I push the dirt. That's what we do, right, but it's all about time, it's not about money at the end of the day In my world and I try and sell them. Hey, I'm selling you a product of time. When I tell you I give you a six-week schedule, I mean a six-week freaking schedule. And I know hardscaping retaining walls. We actually did a retaining wall in the north end of Bentonville that I probably won't tackle again. Honestly, it went pretty smooth. It was just lacking so much engineering information that we had to make all the guessing work and make it work. But are we doing any pool features kind of go off in it? What are we doing feature-wise in the landscaping world?
Speaker 2:what's kind of the? Mark that you see moving forward um, maybe what you'd like to get more into and we'd like to do more patios, like more, like larger outdoor spaces yeah um some more water features. We've done a couple. They look good um don't plan to get into pools.
Speaker 2:Don't want to get into anything crazy oh my god because then it just it adds we want to take care of people, right, but we don't want to get off into like with the dirt sifting off into pools, because that's a whole nother division, or into fire, fire features or what outdoor kitchens. It just things could change, but right now that's not what we want to do.
Speaker 1:Do what you're good at. Yep, and it took me a little bit of time. I failed a couple of different ventures within PsyCon that I should have never even remotely thought about. Didn't have the numbers to support what I was going and doing, to replace whatever this or that or um, let's make sure my beautiful wife's not going into labor. Uh, okay, we're good, we're not going. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I said I you never know.
Speaker 1:So, uh, guys, if you don't know, me and Sarah are literally any day fixing to have baby number three inbound. So that's what I was referencing. You know, landscaping I it's funny, I kind of one of our first jobs I got to talk about. You know, uncle Endel, yeah, learning on the skid steer and I just I kind of always thought it was unique to see the things at the end of the project and just the customer's smile you know what I?
Speaker 1:mean within the landscaping world. It's very personal when you start doing those outdoor spaces and it becomes very meticulous yes that's where I was going with that, that and I miss that a lot from the residential. I was just talking about this last week where they would offer up I don't get a set of prints and, hey, go build this. It was this mushy concept of, hey, this is what I kind of want and I know you guys get that more or less than anybody.
Speaker 2:Like we could do better on our designs. But, also it leaves that open end for the creativity and we have a great enough foreman to kind of work that with our residential customers.
Speaker 1:That's so cool man.
Speaker 2:So it's yes, we should probably design certain things better, which we have in our software too, which we can also start doing now that we integrated this fall, but it leaves that open end. Right Because like there's that personal touch and just small things that change 100%. Yeah, it is fun. Some customers are hard, but I mean it's part of it.
Speaker 3:It's probably my favorite thing to go out and meet with a client for 30 minutes and I come back and I'm like, okay, we've got three years worth of face work and we're going to da, da, da, da da. Because if you can see the family, if you can meet the voice behind the paycheck, right.
Speaker 3:And stop looking at it like that We've had clients come to us and when we meet with them, you know, inside we're just, oh my gosh, this is such an amazing opportunity. God, where did this come from? Thank you, thank you, like we'll be good stewards. And then you meet with them and they've been so jaded. People look at their paycheck, they look at the house and then they're just da, da, da, da, da, and we're like we're not here to do anything but help you achieve that end goal, and then we want to maintain it for you. We want to be with you and grow with your family. Um, and we've picked up quite a few of those. We call it fine maintenance. Um, we have a horticulturist, uh, foreman, on site and that is who's dedicated. So we have one team, one crew something kind of new for us as we're going into 2025 and they know everything about that property every shrub, every tree and they will take care of it in the appropriate time, the appropriate season, and so it's guaranteed because they have families running around.
Speaker 3:They don't want 50 crews or different men coming no, they do not.
Speaker 1:They do not.
Speaker 3:It's one voice, one face. These kids are comfortable, the wife is comfortable, the husband's comfortable.
Speaker 1:You bet, and that's a big thing, that's. I mean, you're opening not only a whole new door there, I mean, that's crazy.
Speaker 3:We're extending our culture.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's exactly where I was going with that. It's like you're not only milling and you know stirring up this culture, but you're, you know, trying to bleed it over in your customers. But what I'm trying also to with your customers, they do get to see that same gardener face or that same mowing face throughout the entire year and you become 100% attached to them. Invested Invested is a good word right, and you want to see them succeed. And as long as they're caring about a little bit about your yard, maybe doing a little extra every time, my yard guy, his biggest thing is I just want to do a little bit more every single time. Right, and he gets up my driveway, so that's kind of cool.
Speaker 3:It was really nice the other day. I was going to tell you it's really good.
Speaker 1:It's crazy when you own a dirt company, you would think your driveway wouldn't be literally 28 feet out of a mountain.
Speaker 3:And then you live on top of a mountain.
Speaker 1:It is crazy.
Speaker 2:It's very hard for someone to fix that.
Speaker 1:Yeah we did? We had a couple of days there through thanksgiving and we had mr sam out there and before everybody came out for thanksgiving. But there's a video of that on psycon's youtube channel. Actually, guys, thank you so much. Is there anything else that you guys wanted to mention before I move on? And we haven't kind of covered.
Speaker 2:I mean just be honest with your customer too. Transparency goes both ways yeah because when I'm doing sales and they're like well, this landscaper told me I need this, and it's like, no, you don't. You don't need to spend $20,000 to redo all your drainage in your yard. Let's fix these two things and you get gutters and it's $5,000. And it's five thousand dollars and it's all fixed. Yeah, and just like drainage and grading that we deal with on new construction, especially just because, just because builders are and they're throwing them in.
Speaker 2:Yep, but we're fit. We're getting called to fix it and to make it better, and it's not.
Speaker 1:It's not just the builders. It's the developers that uh are. I can think of two or three of them that we've been a part of. They just stair-step the lots. It is what it is. They're not ever thinking about a yard. They're probably going to keep that out of their contract anyways at the end of the game, so that's crazy.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So just be honest and do what they actually need. Don't take advantage of people. Serve them like God wants you to serve them. Take care of your employees. It's all simple things and they're not all easy to do.
Speaker 1:No, man, you listed off some very, very challenging, easy said hard to do topics. My guy Last thing for me here who covers sales, mainly you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'd say I do 95%, like she's gone on a few.
Speaker 3:This year it just kind of fell out of the plate where I took some permaculture courses and got certified in that and there's just been some properties that have kind of come through and so I've been able to help navigate those sales while we're building a fine maintenance division. That's not something we have put into our maintenance at this time.
Speaker 2:I don't know every single plant. I don't either, bob, but it's been like when she was at the nursery it was learning from her. Yeah, and then YouTube.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So, like these customers that care, they care all about these plants. She's going to go do the sales because they care Like Amanda Bailey. Put her on Amanda's schedule going to go do the sales because he's like amanda they care about bailey. Put her on amanda's schedule. They care about plants they don't like. I'm going to give them the best solution but if, like you know, that's what they care about in our value, she knows it better. Why not? Yeah?
Speaker 3:bailey, you know we really refined the vetting process as far as when we intake customers and we want to get to know them a little bit, they want to get to know us. It's them somewhat. If it's just about a price, yes, we understand that and we can reciprocate that. But we have so much more that we give into the process and the experience, I would say, of just becoming a customer affair. There's an experience because you come in and you're meeting with a few really important managers and they're making sure you know where to go and how to navigate these next steps with us. And then, at the end of the guys, when they're done and project's finished, we have a post-implementation plan. We're following up. There's a thank you email that goes through Marketing Pro with Aspire, which is amazing.
Speaker 1:That's really cool and it's automated.
Speaker 3:So we've taken all the little things that we used to do and bog us down daily into the point that we're overwhelmed. We know what we need. How do we execute it? We put it in our software and then we go out and make sure it's implemented in that field.
Speaker 1:Literally 100%. Are you seeing as you're moving and growing through the next couple of years, are you going to maybe implement a little bit more sales departments, since you are more channeled and focused on what you are tailored to do and what you built a business?
Speaker 2:on, we are, and the next step is adding an operations manager. We're going to start. We're going to talk to our team about that in the next formal meeting and then after that we'll start the process of that for next spring and then kind of from there it's going to be growing sales because we want to triple in the next five years. It's a big goal, especially when you see it on paper.
Speaker 1:Oh my God Well of course, so yeah, so I and it's getting operations so much growth. Yeah.
Speaker 2:It's getting operations stable, having 100%. I'm just getting all that off my plate where I can sell more and then being able to lead, lead everyone, help everyone, grow.
Speaker 1:So dude sounds like you guys have. You've got plans and goals and directions and you've got that kind of figured out and as long as you're laying that out time and time and time again, for a good team, you're going to have good results every time. I mean, don't get me wrong, mistakes can be made, things are going to happen, explosions are going to happen. All of this is going to happen, but you take it in stride and you take it as a team and you figure out solutions together and it sounds like you guys are nailing that. So I wanted to showcase that today here at the Blue Collar Business Podcast. You can check out all our episodes at bluecollarbusinesspodcastcom. The last final question I've got for you guys and since you're literally we have gone in depth about culture today what's a takeaway for the blue collar guy? As you've grown up in a sparky household, you can definitely relate.
Speaker 2:And on a farm and farm kids.
Speaker 1:You've had workers who are sick and tired of being stuck in the mud, and that's not just. You know the guy down in the ditch who's literally in the mud.
Speaker 2:I'm talking about in the mud up here, physically and mentally and emotionally. For me and I feel for most of our team, it's like, first through faith, Like you've got to have something you believe in more than just what's on this earth. Because if you don't have that, and like if I didn't have that, like my focus would be money and if that's my focus I'm not doing like it's not for the right reason.
Speaker 1:A hundred percent sure.
Speaker 2:Because my focus is to serve people and help them grow. So the whole reason this company is going to grow as big as it is is because we want to give as much opportunity to the people to company is going to grow as big as it is is because we want to give as much opportunity to the people, to the great people that we have come work here. So that's why we do it.
Speaker 3:I'd just say Stay in the gap, be in the game. Don't stay in the gap, but be in the game.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but figure out your goals and figure out what you want to do and don't be afraid to take a jump. Whether you've been at a company and they've got a crappy culture and you've been there for five years and you're scared to go somewhere else just because we've seen people like that, they're like well, I, I don't want to leave here. And it's like your culture in the current company that you complain about sucks, but you don't want to leave. It's just the jump.
Speaker 2:Whether that's going to start your own business or going on a date whatever it is like, just take the jump and like stuff, bad stuff's going to happen, but nothing's going to happen if you just sit there.
Speaker 1:That is right, dude. Don't sit in the middle of the road and not make any decision, because you get your run over both ways, and if you can just make a decision and stand firm in it, you might get run over only by one or two cars instead of 10 a day and find a mentor who challenges you somebody who holds you accountable?
Speaker 3:who is not in your business and not your boss, not your office manager, not anybody around you?
Speaker 2:find somebody neutral someone, someone not biased.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, gonna tell you the truth and help you grow who can put you in your place but also say you know what? Maybe this is a different way to think about it and help that 100%.
Speaker 1:There's some very, very, very key role people that have helped me get to where I'm at Iron sharpens, iron, oh yeah. And you know, there's some advice that I've listened to and there's some advice I'm like, oh wow.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:We're going to go complete opposite direction, cause I see where that's got you, you know. And then there's some others that have literally completely exited and are are literally just trying to help me be better, and those are the people that I cling onto their their time very, very gravely, because they have all the money in the world. They don't care about my money, they don't care about their money. They care about time, and if they're giving me their time to sharpen me, to mold me, they have already seen something in me or they wouldn't be wasting the freaking time on me.
Speaker 3:You know it takes a lot of boldness and a lot of bravery to run a company, especially one of millions of dollars. You know you both sit in a situation where you're putting food on tables before you put it on yourself and you know you're doing a lot to invest there.
Speaker 3:But you have to lead by example and you have to be prepared to make really big decisions. And I can, I mean I'll honestly say like I've watched Eric weigh pros and cons and watched how he's made decisions. There's times I don't always agree and I'm like tell me why. Explain it but I never learned and grew into my position. I didn't want to just be an office manager. I wanted to be here and grow with fair and support. And I saw his vision.
Speaker 3:I saw campaigners man early um, and I've I've watched that, I've seen you make hard decisions and you tell me, you know he he's like don't be a brat. Like da da, da, da da. This is what I think, or this is why he thought this, and I'm like dang, I never knew that piece. So this does make more sense, or that gives me a better vision for how I know I need to grow my internal team to support those guys out there.
Speaker 1:And that's a testament to good leadership too, but not only that.
Speaker 2:Being open with your team is so huge, man, because if they don't have information that you're making decisions on as the owner, how do you expect them to understand anything going on A hundred percent? Because if you just tell someone go dig a ditch, you got to be done in a day and it's a hundred degrees, do you think they're going to be done?
Speaker 1:in a day?
Speaker 2:No, but if they understand, hey if I get this done in less than a day, I get a bonus based on this margin because we're under budget. That's right.
Speaker 3:Teaching the guys numbers was the best thing ever. Yeah, 100%.
Speaker 2:Like we're open about all of our numbers. You have to be they check them.
Speaker 3:They'll ask us hey, I saw my numbers of this blah, blah, blah and. And we're so quick now that they're on it. I can tell and we can tell, if we had a job this week that was going to be a little over, but it was not any fault of the project or the foreman, it really was us and logistics with a truck, yeah. And we reached out and we're like hey, you know, just so you know this is not on you, we'll affect this, but we'll make sure we go alter that.
Speaker 3:And like we're getting your time no, you're absolutely just fine.
Speaker 1:I've thoroughly, thoroughly enjoyed today. Um, I've been looking forward to this. Honestly. I've seen so many people do the cutting grass thing quote, unquote and run it for years just him and and Jim and Sally in a truck. I know of a guy and his sister that has literally mowed around here for 25 years and he's a farmer on the side and does it just in, you know, during the spring. And I've also seen operations, like you guys. I know one of y'all's competitors that made an exit.
Speaker 1:I know him very well and just to see the levels the two levels that it can be done at and the one you're choosing to do, kudos, seriously kudos, and keep it up because it's really, really hard. It's really hard and a lot of people don't even understand the hard I'm talking about and the decisions that you have to make, freaking daily, not like, oh, I got to make a decision about this year. It is okay, if I don't make this decision, it's going to hold that job up, which kills the quarter. That means I can't bill out that Cover that. Do this investment. We're not even recovered from snow, I mean literally it's all day long.
Speaker 1:But you got to literally love it and keep it moving forward and deal with your flaws and your mistakes um, mentally and talk about them as a team, portray them hey guys. It nothing. Nothing has done me more service within PsyCon to sit here and look at my guys and go, hey, dude, I was wrong. And man is it hard to say. But when they see you say or show, hey guys, I was wrong, this is how we're going to do it and you take off that other direction. They're right behind you as fast as they can go, because they're just like blown away, like that dude just said what now? Boss is never wrong know.
Speaker 3:It's so much easier for them to take ownership in their smaller situations because we're talking grand mistakes that we've made this year with just certain hirings one hire was 90 grand. We lost, yeah, I think for nine weeks every to each other. It was like 16 weeks Frustrated.
Speaker 2:It just drug on and it's like, yeah, our numbers would be better this year. We learned so much from it. Like, do I wish it happened. No, but do like.
Speaker 1:Thank God you got the education.
Speaker 2:Am I glad that it happened and the person that we landed with now is like a thousand times better, yeah, and like it's set up that division to grow for years.
Speaker 1:And it's just funny we were just sitting here talking about the rat race and the mind games that we have to play and we will settle. A lot of times, especially when you're growing as rapidly as you are, you'll settle for an employee just to handle it, so you can keep dealing and moving on this giant mess of ball of crap that you've got to deal with, just so they can go to work, and sometimes it doesn't even make any sense.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but you have to have that hard conversation and you have to trust whoever is in that second chair with you. You know Eric trusts me to look at him and say how many more weeks are we going to pay for this? Do we continue this. Now we need to cut the cord and vice versa. If it's on my end, our insert like internal, he's going to say the same thing to me. I'm going to trust that.
Speaker 1:You have to and that's the only way you guys are going to succeed. And from the information you guys have given me in the audience today, it sounds like you guys are well on your way. Don't get me wrong. Um, it's always glitz and glammy and that's why I've kind of hinted around at how hard it is, and and so have you guys. But I really appreciate your time, guys. Um, if you've loved this, that literally brings us here to another hour hour and 15 minute podcast. I hope you guys have been joining listening weekly, every Wednesday. Catch them all at bluecollarbusinesspodcastcom and, if you're here at the end and you're on a streaming platform, if you wouldn't mind giving us a rating and giving us a follow on whatever platform you listen on. And until next time, guys, y'all be safe, be kind and be humble.
Speaker 3:Thank you.
Speaker 1:You're welcome, thank you. Thank you, guys. Yeah, if you've enjoyed this episode, be sure to give it a like. Share it with the fellers. Check out our website to send us any questions and comments about your experience in the blue-collar business. Who do you want to hear from? Send them our way. We'll do our best to answer any questions you may have. Till next time, guys.