Ep. 83 - Why Your Crews are Failing at Implementation with Ron Nussbaum

If your crews are working hard but the money still disappears, the leak might be communication, not effort.

We sit down with Ron Nussbaum, a Marine veteran and the founder behind BuilderComms and Builder Labs, to talk about the messy truth of construction operations and the myth that software fixes everything. Ron breaks down why the tool is only a small slice of the solution and why the real work is process, discipline, and leadership buy-in during implementation. We get practical about the three buckets most blue-collar businesses live in every day: sales and estimating, project management and daily logs, and accounting as the foundation for job costing and WIP.

From change order handoffs to “go backs” that torch profit, we dig into how fragmented texts, scattered emails, and siloed departments create money burn and reputation damage. Ron shares the moment that pushed him to build a centralized communication hub by project, so owners can walk into tough client conversations with the full story in minutes. We also go straight at the culture side: the office versus field war, the ego that blocks listening, and why transparency creates accountability that can either grow the company or expose what needs to change.

To close, Ron offers a mindset tool for anyone who feels stuck or burned out: 75 Hard as a mental discipline framework built for high-stress industries like construction. If you want better systems, better handoffs, and a team that actually follows the playbook, this one will give you a clear place to start.

Subscribe for more real-world construction business strategy, share this with a contractor who’s drowning in communication chaos, and leave a review so more blue-collar leaders can find the show.

Transcript

Welcome And Sponsor Shoutout

SPEAKER_01 0:09

Hey guys, welcome to the Blue Collar Business Podcast where we discuss the realest, rawest, most relevant stories and strategies behind building every corner of a blue-collar business. I'm your host, Dyke Kirby, and I want to help you what it took me, trial and error, and a whole lot of money to learn. The information that no one in this industry is willing to share. Whether you're under that shade tree or have your hard hat on, let's expand your toolbox. Guys, welcome back to another episode of the Blue Collar Business Podcast, brought to you and sponsored by our wonderful friends over at PayDerd Support. Uh, the team over there we've used personally in-house at Cyclone Excavation. I can't tell you the precise when you're when you're doing a takeoff, everything is all about those quantities and making sure your quantities are accurate. They take the time, they dive through the job. Um, and and when it comes to the takeoff and quantity uh space, they make sure you understand it. They jump on the phone with you. They walk through it, you can ask questions, you can use these guys as a resource to help build your sales and estimating out. Um, especially if you were like me that didn't have a clue when I was jumping in the commercial lane. Ben and the team over there, they're gonna get you taken care of. Shout out to those guys. Thank you so much for sponsoring today's episode and the show. Furthermore, I have got a gentleman today, guys. We are jumping in the software bucket. We are jumping all up in the software world with this gentleman. And I am excited to learn with you guys today because I probably get this question more honestly, more than I ever thought I would. Hey, Cy, what software is are you running? What do you handle for PM? What do you do for daily logs? What do you do for accounting? What do you do for uh CRM up front? What do you what are you doing here from this transition to there? How do you track COs? How do you track TN? Like I get all of those questions, and it is very hard to sit here and give you a here's your solution, go to this person. I haven't found it either, guys. It's um taking some time to understand what softwares are actually used for, and actually understanding the three buckets of our world and understanding how to implement software within those buckets and then getting them to talk is a totally different beast. But um, those buckets being sales and estimation, there's softwares for that up front. I run separate softwares just to kind of cover the bases before we dive too far off in here. And then I have some other softwares that I run for project management, daily logs, and then we all base it off of our accounting software. I know that sounds very convoluted and very messy, but we have gone from, you know, super low level using Microsoft Office and Teams all the way up to a couple of years of Pro Core. Found out that was not the answer for you subcontractors out there. If you're a Prime GC, there's no doubt that could definitely help you. But that's kind of covering the basis of me. I have brought a gentleman that has not only built a software to help us as an industry communicate better, as we all know that's the largest struggle. BuilderComms is what I'm talking about. But this gentleman also helps with custom solutions tailored to our specific businesses. But you get to a point where you're just chasing the next software to fix 60% of the problem you you you didn't you still have 40% from the last software. And there's really never a solution once you get there. He's also a part of a company and founded a company. Uh, he's gonna correct me when I say this, but at Builder Labs, and essentially building you guys custom software. So, guys, he also does a host of a construction champions podcast, a very high-energy um construction-related podcast sharing other great founders and entrepreneurs, but most importantly, he is a Marine veteran. Thank you for your service, sir, and thank you for joining us today, Mr. Ron Nussbaum. Thank you so much, sir.

SPEAKER_00 4:18

Thank you for having me. That was an amazing entrance, man. I am excited for today, and I'm excited for our conversation and uh everywhere it has to go. Hopefully, we can clarify a couple of things of like just because construct construction can be messy, like the internal operations of it doesn't have to be. As you have found out by figuring out how to piece some pieces of software to other, you can clean this up. You just have to be intentional with it.

Ron’s Path From Marines

SPEAKER_01 4:47

That's a good word about it. And uh intentional, not about during the sales process, but also intentional during the implementation phase. And that's where we've really suffered. Um, you know, when you're running Soline and you're you don't have a certain person to just literally project manage this project of implementing whatever software. It takes time. And that's what I think a lot of these software companies don't tell you that hey, it's not just light switch and it's doing all the fancy things. Like it's all about the data you input for the outputs. And it takes time to realize that. But Ron, if you wouldn't mind, sir, give us a little bit of background um how you number one got into the world of construction software. That's what a lot of folks are going to be asking. Like, is this our guy that's gonna solve all our problems? So give us a little bit of background. Obviously, all stems from your military uh time, I would assume, and and and driving that discipline to get us where we're at today, but if you wouldn't mind.

SPEAKER_00 5:48

Yeah, absolutely. I just want to touch on one thing before I dive into who I am. We were just I I was just helping a rooker put BuilderComs into their business uh two weeks ago. And in the conversation, they're like, they're using a project management software that they just they weren't happy with how the communication functions in it, which is how BuilderComms even came about, is I just wasn't happy with what I had. And I looked right at her and I said, here's the deal. I can give you the perfect solution to fix communication in your business from a software perspective that is built for your business. I'm like, that's only 20% of it. The other 80% is you in the the processes around how you're going to utilize this in your business. So I said, and I'm I'm not your typical software sales guy, as I told her, is if you're not going to do that, you might as well not pay me$97 a month for our software because I don't I'm here to fix a problem. I'm not here to just sell you software. So, as much as I want you to be a BuilderCom's user, if you're not committed to actually saying, all right, we have this piece of software. How do we actually utilize this and roll it out that makes sense for everybody involved? And she was sewed on that because that's what she she was an operations person. She's like, Yeah, that's give me the piece of software so I can actually build the operations around it. And yeah, but that's what you're saying is so critical is everybody thinks that software just fixes everything. What it is is a tool that allows you to fix everything. Because without software, it's really hard to fix these problems in a construction business with just systems and processes. Like you have to have that tool that you can build around, and that that's what a lot of people miss. So, with that being said, Ron Newspab here, uh, United States Marine Corps veteran. I got out of the Marine Corps in 2010 and I ended up on a job site. I had no construction experience prior. I had grew up working on cars in the auto body industry. But when I got in the Marine Corps, I found this ad on Craigslist for a foreman in training role. And I didn't apply because I didn't have any construction experience. And finally, one day I was looking in the mirror and I said, damn it, Ron, if you want to go be a foreman in construction, you're a United States Marine. You can go do this. I applied for the job. The guy that was running the company was actually 82nd Airborne and sat me down. He's like, I'm just everybody I'm hiring is we had a school not fall from us that just turned out construction management degree guys. And he's like, I'm hiring all these guys with construction management degrees. He's like, You're sitting here, and I I mean, I got a high school diploma barely, and uh taught Iraq as a grunt. Like my resume for construction management is slim to none. And he goes, Here's the thing is I've been in some dicey situations with some Marines, and they've always showed up and they've always had my back. So he's like, I'm gonna give you a shot. And I took that shot and put a chip on my shoulder that I was already way behind everybody else, just from a knowledge perspective. But I knew where they couldn't beat me was in my work ethic and my discipline, and I just dove into it as hard as I possibly could. And what I actually found was the brotherhood, the camaraderie, everything I was missing from the Marine Corps, I found on a job site, and it probably saved my life. And from that, I just went as hard as I possibly could. And I've done everything in construction from running the company to running a jackhammer and everything in between. And it all it all just came from a passion to get better myself, but also is I just fell in love with this industry, and it became my everything. And from that, I'm a natural problem solver, and we were going from about 20, it was either 28 or 29 crews to 30. And I I we had a communication problem internally and externally, and I am not one to scale problems. I believe you should fix a problem so you don't scale it long term. And I dove in on communication, and nothing was out there, and I ended up building this little messaging platform for myself to utilize, and I brought that to market, and that became BuilderCom's. We will won a top startup award at the International Builder Show, and it became something, and that was my transition out of construction into software. Uh, so I'm just a Marine that spent 15 years around the construction industry, and now I just serve the construction industry, and I do that through software, and then I host construction champions podcast, which we're on our fourth season and fourth year doing that, over 300 episodes. Uh, we're currently building out the largest database of construction knowledge that has ever existed just from our data and information in these conversations that we've had. So I think that gives us enough to probably dive in.

SPEAKER_01 11:28

Yeah, I would assume so, sir. That's uh I gotta I gotta circle on a few things you said. But number one is software's, I tell these, I tell all these software companies that reach out constantly, like, if you're just selling me another software that you think I have this problem, and you think you have the solution to my problem, if you ain't lived my problem, you don't know my problems. The construction trade is very different to any other industry and business I've got now through 10 years of business and clients I've met speaking about it's really opened my eyes how archaic and dinosaur-like the construction industry is uh when it comes to embracing software or anything in that regard, to be honest with you. But when when you're speaking about software, if it's somebody that has built it because there was such a need and they were struggling for it, and they, you know, may not have built it themselves like you did, but got with the team and said, Hey, this has to happen because I know I'm not the only person dealing with this. So let's try and build this thing. And a lot of times it goes like wildfire because people are like, Yes, oh my God, that is such a problem with us. This solves this, this solves that, this solves this. And it's a one solution fixes multiple problems, where people, as we can agree, Ron, that people, including myself, get a little messed up when they go to start picking out software is they think, yes, it's one solution fixes multi-problems, but it doesn't fix all of the problems. And we're hearing you literally go, man, 29, 30 crews having problems communication internally. Hell, I got three and a half crews, man. And we always have problems communicationally internally. Like, and and and and that to say to your point is don't scale a problem, right? Find the solution before you get to 29, 30 crews. I would assume, trust me, I've had the five, six crews. I would definitely assure you fix the problems down here at two and three crews before you start scaling because you do, you scale these problems, and you're like, you're sitting there one day and you're like, man, how did it get to this point? Like, how like you don't even know where to start? And so you start slapping band-aids on things, never going to the core root of the problem. So you can never deal with it and face it to be able to build a new foundation, rip that block out, or that toxicity, or whatever it is. But scaling problems is absolutely huge. But I think that, you know, that young Marine like yourself, you were that's so many people in the construction industry, if they would just look themselves coming into the industry, I would say, like the biggest thing about this show is bringing awareness to blue-collar trades and what they are. I don't care what the trade is, the construction industry will feed your family for a very, very long time. Is it stressful? Is it behind the times? Is it a whole bunch of other things? Yes, but there's people like me and Ron really trying to shed light on these issues so we can hopefully make it better. But to go, you know what? I'm gonna go and learn this stuff. I'm going to force myself, making mistakes along the way to get to up all the way to running a company. Hopefully, that's some people's goals. But man, you're absolutely right. Any veteran, I love hiring veterans when we can. Absolutely. Their discipline, their mindset of, hey, there's a problem, but that doesn't mean we just stop. We've got to keep going. So what do we do about that? And I would just encourage anybody listening, if this is your first episode listening, um, seriously, go apply for that construction job. You're gonna be a grunt, you're gonna, but the attitude that you just had, Ron, of hey, I know I'm gonna be behind knowledge-wise against everybody. So let me stick his chip on my shoulder, let me go learn as fast as I possibly can. And I am going, they won't beat me when it comes to work ethic. And I will be there one day. And so, kudos to you. What an incredible story. But man, who better to learn from than somebody like myself that struggled with it? So, kind of talk about BuilderComs for just a minute. What were the struggle points that you were dealing with? Running 29 or 30 crews. Obviously, we can't anybody that's been in this can only imagine some of the problems you're dealing with. But and and talk about a little bit of the angle of where BuilderComs comes in, fixes some of these multi-problems.

SPEAKER_00 17:08

Yeah, so the core problem was money burn. Like at the end of the day, it's one thing for the communication to be off, but when that communication is causing go backs or reputation damage, is like at the end of the day, like you said at the very beginning, everything's on the basis of the foundation of financial financials. We're all here to make money, and stuff that burns money is a bigger problem than stuff that don't. Like, I can sit here and say that communication sucks, but it's not costing me anything. And like, is it that big of a problem? If for us, it was, and for most construction companies, it cost them over$400,000 a year. Those aren't my numbers, those are other reports out there, a couple hours a day for everybody on your team. It be it just starts to stack. And how we ran our business was we had quotas that needed to be done every day. What a crew was responsible for doing, and I needed that value put in the ground, or else we weren't going to hit our profit numbers. We weren't going to hit what we needed to. So when we have a communication breakdown between the client and us, and a crew shows up, and that client's not there, that costs me an entire day. And then what does it do? I have to then move something and move them back in. It's a missed opportunity. We lose all revenue, all profit for that day, and then I'm paying the crew as well. That is so really stemmed from like how why do I really need to fix communication? And then from a holistic growing and scaling perspective, it was just fragmented data. I needed to know what was going on on projects in like five minutes, not like an hour's worth of research calling a bunch of people to be like, hey, send me your message records from customer XYZ, because they're pissed, and I need to have a conversation with them. And here's what I found. And I remember like when when the night builder comms became a thing in my head, was I was pouring up to this job site, and I had the foreman on the phone, and they're giving me all the information on everything that went what you know, they felt wit sideways. Like, why am I about to get my ass chewed in this driveway? Well, Ron, here's why. A guy in the car, standing there with the home of a couple other people, and they're just letting into me. And I realized I have 25% of the information. I have what my team wanted me to understand about this project to cover their own selves. Not what I really mean. And it's not like I was going to be pissed. It like I just want to know so I know what I'm walking into. So I'm laying in bed later that night, and it just hit me. It's like if I just had a central database where all of our communication, all of our messages lived, and I could go in there and I just organized it per project. So it wasn't like super hard to get in. Like I literally go into a project, look at the client side, the team side. I can see who said what, where we might be at fault, what we're not at fault for, what was promised, what was done. And I could know this information in five minutes without talking to anybody. So that right there became the okay, so this is costing me a lot of money, and I don't like getting my ass chewed. Can I can I produce a solution for this? And I actually went out and paid to have it built to begin with. Before I got into the software development world, I it was like the same thing as Ron as a Marine stepping into the construction industry. This was construction Ron stepping into the software world. All I knew is what I needed, and nobody else was going to be willing to build it because everybody wants to build something complex. And that's what my biggest fight with developers at first was like simple. Like you're going to, I need this simple. This isn't complex, it isn't sexy. I just need it to do XYZ. I just need it to be able to communicate with my team. I need it to be able to communicate with my clients, and I need those separate and all trackable, and I don't want them in a bunch of different channels, I want those channels to live under each project so I can simply get to this. And we got it built, and like I said, boom bada bang, we brought it here, and we it's just great, we've had great reception, and I think a lot of that is just I'm from the industry, we don't do a lot of marketing, like all of our growth is all organic. Like it's I like to say because I'm from the industry, you'll get this, is like the we're the piece of software people talk about at gas stations. Like, that's where like you that's how our growth is, is like we're not out there pumping this in. You're not going to find me in your inbox unless it's about like the podcast or something. Like, we're just not that company and we're not venture-backed. I bootstrap this from day one. We've never taken outside money, which allows me to run this company how I want to run it, and that we don't have to scale this like your typical venture back software company. Is I can do the things that I feel are in the best interest of not just like we want to have a profitable company, like that's always the go. But I can I also want to make decisions that are in the best interest of our users. Because our users are the construction industry, and that's the industry I strive to now serve, and that's where we're at. And I think that kind of covers what you asked, plus a little bit more. Oh, for sure.

Setting Clear Expectations For Crews

SPEAKER_01 23:10

And you hit so many, so many important things. And you know, it's funny you say immediately you bring up money burn in communication because what a lot of people don't even understand, and I didn't either, the first five, six, seven years. You're you're just chasing revenue, you're just chasing business, you're just trying to figure it all out, make sure you got repeatable revenue, you got work coming in for next year. Then you start focusing on, man, why do I work so hard all year? And then every year there ain't no money in the freaking bank account. And then you start chasing these rabbit holes of well, we wait a week for material from the time we need it. We we wait three days before we see machines sometimes. We we wait two days for gravel. And I'm like, what are you talking about? Communicate just the not just non-linked communications, and it could be even easy enough as a lot of the guys that are listening that will get this is CO approval. Well, the guys out there in the field created the CO because they caught, they knew what was going on on the job, they they looked at it, they're like, whoa, that's different than what we're supposed to be putting it in. Let's get it back to the office. They did their part, they they got all the uh documentation, all the information, emailed it over, text it, however, you guys work. I would really, really highly suggest you email it back to your estimator. Maybe it's the owner. He gets time, he looks at it, he gets it put together, sends it out the door to the GC Prime PM, whatever, and then he fights and fights for two weeks, and then he finally gets that approval. Well, that link from getting it back down those channels to the field team shouldn't be really challenging. But sometimes it is, and you're like, oh, well, I've had approval on that for a couple of weeks. Well, then they're pissed off because they're sitting there going, Well, dude, I could have freaking done this or that or this and this order, and now it's gonna make my job harder for us to make that money. I understand we've got the approval now, but man, it'd been nice to know two weeks ago, and it's small incremental communicational links that absolutely the 400k is totally believable to the people that have lived it on a multi-million dollar scale because it it's every day, an hour here, 30 minutes there, wait on this here, and all of those incrementals just small 15 minutes stack. And then at the end of the month, you're like, where is this 86 hours of our time gone? Why can't we build for this? And everybody's sitting there going, huh? I don't really know, man. I just I don't know. And so the internal, I want to one 100% before I get on my soapbox of external, but that internal communication from the front of the house to the back of the house, the back of the house needs to be driving production. But the other thing that you said, uh and and churning money churn, money burn with communicational links is setting production rates, is giving that field team an expectation based off the accounting side. And this should be hopefully visible to your whole team in selected windows of, hey, this is how the estimate was, this is the materials, this is the labor, this is what we've got, and we've got that. Now you don't have to give it in that term, but you can give it to the team, and this is what we do internally, have small little pre-cons before a job kicks off. Hey, look, you got 10 days. We gave you three extra days for this tap. This manhole is gonna be a booger, whatever the case may be. You got 10 days. Unless there's a change order sold where we can create more labor, you have 10 days from the time you pull up, mobilize to the time we need to be tested and get out of there. And they sometimes they're like, What? We've only got now most of the time they're like, oh, dude, we're gonna smash that. And we set them up for success. But there's also some times that we set an expectation that's like, ooh, this is this is pretty tight. But when the market gets tight, you got it and know what your A crew, your B crew, your C crew can actually produce so you can get that tight to win those jobs when you need to. And so setting those expectations, those communical communication, that's you're agree. I agree with you, Ron. We're doing this for money at the end of the day, not practice. So we're sitting here going, hey, why is this project whip report look like this? Well, did anybody decide to tell the foreman and the super and the guys out there in the field what the expectations were to begin with? Are we just gonna sit here and yell at them because we're five days over on labor, but we never even told them how many days of labor we got in it? And so agreed with you, Ron, the need for KISS, K-I-S-S, keep it simple, stupid, in the software world for those gentlemen and people in the office who may have degrees, who may have a little bit more uh communicational lingo. Obviously, if they're dealing with your external clients, you would obviously hope so. But at the same time, it's hard to get those two communicating for two separate reasons. Most of the time, field guys are covering their butt and the office guys are covering their butt. But you got to keep it simple. You have to. And then it turns to the owner. The last thing I want to follow up on what you said is I can't tell you how many times I've sat out there getting my freaking butt chewed, walking into the conversation. Oh man, I got I got you, big dog. And then come to find out I got about 20% of the information, and I cannot stand getting blindsided. Look, I'll go into a into a conversation 15 minutes before, give me everything. I don't care if I'll we'll talk about it after this meeting, but I need every piece of information that I can do the best job at protecting us and as a company, your job as you know, as foreman here and me as an owner, and the best reputation that we can have on the other side of this, because I tell my guys all the time, it's one thing that costs us money. That's that's one thing. But if you're costing us reputation, I I have to know that so I can go on damage control because it's years it takes to get reputation built up. And so, yes, leading all of that, all of these things I just said, everything that Ron just said, you're exactly right. Uh something you said earlier. Software is a tool. And now you have these problems that you're just pulling your hair out. BuilderCon sounds amazing from the aspect of just looking at here's my team. And I haven't, I'll be honest with you guys, I I don't use it. It sounds like something that uh we could definitely be invested in, but to see externally dealing with your customers. So is that I want a little bit more explanation at that. Obviously, the owner can see two separate channels um and you talk to your external clients from there. Is that right?

SPEAKER_00 30:08

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Before we dive into that, so see, this is why like I'm not your your typical software whatever person, because I just I do it I love this in this conversation, like the just like you brought up the two sides being siloed, like production and office, and it's like this war, and that has to end. But what I wanted to to dive into was when you're talking about the expectations with the crew, like so. We had expectations, and we we were performance pay before performance pay was a thing. Like, I'm talking over a decade ago, so our foreman it made the most sense for them to understand why, like their livelihood was tied to what we were putting in the ground, and we wanted to get them to make the most they possibly could. Like, we paid our guys very, very good just because we understood the numbers and we could say, as long as we hit this percentage and labor, I'll pay a bonus to the foreman all day long to stay under that. So we had it tied to other metrics, and for we had four transparency with the guys, is like this is why. Like, I understand you think it's a stretch, I think it's a stretch, but I'll tell you what, you get it done. We're both making a lot of money on this, and the customers are going to be extremely happy because they wanted it done in this timeline. Now, are you gonna probably have to work a little bit later? Yeah, as the foreman, it's your job to rally the troops around that and bring your guys together and just get this done, and then we all benefit from it, it becomes a great experience. So that's that's one of the reasons why we were we had that transparency and set these timelines out there, is because their pay was directly attached to their performance on the jobs, and when we set them up right, they could just be rock stars all day long. And it allowed us to be able to have some conversations when stuff wasn't 100% right, and it was like this is gonna be a tight one. Do you want what like it it probably needs two days? But if we take this into two days, no one's making money on this. Like, do you want to just try like if you guys get it done in a day, you'll make money. The company was we're just be it or it'll work for us, but it you just gotta have clarity. You can't be afraid to have these conversations. Like, I'm a black and white kind of guy, it's what leadership hated about me, but it's what everybody or everybody that's ever worked for me loved about me. And like, I'm just gonna say it how it is, and we're gonna get it out there, and we're not we're not going to to worry about it. Like, so when you're setting this stuff up, like have a reason to say these numbers because, like, when you talk to your guys about this, if you don't have something to tie it to, or a reason, like they're just gonna think this is just like the company trying to make money, like they're all the big man needs us to put it, needs us to do a$20,000 job today because he's got a new boat he needs to buy, have some other reasonings to it so they they understand that kind of stuff. Like it's not hard to have these conversations, everybody's real people, and I think we lose sight of that. Is like just because you might run the company, does that necessarily make you any different than the other person that's standing over there that's running your job site for you? They probably understand it better than you do at this point, and then to the last note about like you walk in there and take any conversation. So I used to relate this to my guys because of my past experiences in the Marine Corps, and like I would go in these situations and just get my butt raved, and I would come, I I would then I get on the phone, I'd be like, Hey, not cool, man. Like, literally, so you're telling me like if we were in Iraq and like uh a grenade went off was got thrown over here. Like, are you throwing me on top of that? Because that's what you just literally did. Like, I'm I'm more upset with you right now because like to me, that's an integrity issue. Like, if stuff went wrong, have the conversation with me. You know me, like, I might be pissed, but I'm not going to be like taking you out back pissed. Now I'm like, well, let's go to the tree line. Like, I'm irritated because you just literally threw me on a landmine because you just didn't want to say, Hey, you know what? John broke their toilet instead of telling me I have no idea how the toilet got broke, I think it was their dog. Like, so then I walk in there and then they don't even have a dog and they're looking at me like I'm crazy. Like it it we it's really like communication is conversation, and that's one thing that I have learned is like I I built this software to fix communication, but as an industry, we need to learn how to communicate better with each other before we even start to look at like how do we communicate externally, because like if we can't talk to each other in the business, it it's you're you can't fix it with a piece of software. As much as I would love you to pay me to use builder comps, if you're not willing to address your internal communication and how you and your team and the different departments talk to each other, a piece of software is not fixing that. And like that, like I said, I can give you the tour to fix it, but you have to be willing to say this is something I want to fix, dude.

SPEAKER_01 36:00

Nail on the head there, sir. Because you know, you were saying, Hey, yeah, great software is about 20% of it, but 80% is implementing. If you're not willing to look, you have to have in the underground game. I can't speak for every trade, but this is pretty common practice. Accounting, production, and estimation have got to be talking on a weekly basis, and they have got to be talking freely, not throwing darts and bombs at each other and throwing grenades across the room. And trust me, I have sat through the three-hour billing meetings when we didn't know how to properly agenda, you know, agenda size a meeting to stay direct and driven on the points that we're trying to get to. I've been there and they're, oh, they're I hate it as much as everybody else did, but I had to sit there through it, right? So to get on smaller communication bytes, bits, and pieces, and not just leaving one meeting for the week, touch points, having that estimator stop by the account. Hey, is there something that I need to be focusing on? Up we just are doing this literally starting Monday. Uh, just a 15-minute phone call over lunch where uh bookkeeper, PM, estimator myself, is there things I need to be focusing on for the team that are critical path that I need to be ready to handle through the week? Is there something from uh accounting that oh he put a stop pay order on they're not doing it? Like we need to know that we don't need to just have guys out there for the next three or four days. So it's those critical little touch points. And what that does is it builds confidence in your team. Because if you just all right, we're doing a billing meeting or we're doing uh a sales meeting for two hours and we all just pile together and it's somebody just look at this, look at this, look at there's no retaining that there's two ways of communication, it's telling freely what you need to do or uh what this the idea or suggestion is, but there's also listening. That's the other part that I think the construction world gets so twisted. Everybody's talking, ain't no doubt about it, but ain't nobody listening to nobody. And so when you sit in a room for two hours, I I have found success in that problem of an owner going, hmm, man, I really suck at this. And it's putting that ego aside and going, hey guys, tell me where we're we're where we're breaking down in this communication. Because what you're doing, if you just want to have the ego, you're just pissing money down the drain. Literally, the longer it takes for you to grab those people and go, hey, can we go grab some lunch and just talk like human beings? Because there's some big tensions here. We've got to figure it out. But you're right, it starts at that ownership, that executive level, or however you're set up. There has to be a key person to literally buy in. And normally it's ownership or executive level that have to buy in. They have to be unwavering through the implementation period to even get to the accountability standard of how we're going to set accountability meters to make sure that we are hitting these communicational links. And as soon as tension arises again, okay, let's pause. Let's find out why. It's not because of uh he put an exclamation point in an email, it's because he said this to me the other day that pissed me off in the sales meeting, and we've never really fixed it since then. So I've ignored all his emails for two weeks, and now there's a big pile up, and now boss is pissed because we can't get anything out the door. So, like, that's real life, and that's what happens every day within these construction companies. And if there isn't people like yourself, Ron, throwing a huge dart against the wall and going, that is the problem, is because this is siloed, this is siloed, and we're lockjawed fence, freaking razor wire, moats, the whole nine. You're not coming in my space. This is my part of the business. Well, you're you're just leading yourself ultimately to fail. Now, get get six months into those small, not even go one quarter with being intentional, like you just shared, Ron, and being intentional about stopping and pausing and going, hey, how's today been? Have we have we had any issues? I care, and I don't care about what's going on. I care about that issue. It's big to me at my level, but it's also big to this whole entire office. How are we doing? Is there something I'm doing? Is there something since that point I have changed? Is there something I can, however, I can present myself as the answer, I will, because I'm always going to immediately take fault. And owners, do it. Watch how your people change within 90 days, small touch points, 15 minutes, confidence building meetings of hey, and also to share a little something in that meeting, praise publicly, criticize privately. Hey, Dylan, man, you we hit our two million dollar weekly goal last week of bids when there hardly isn't any bid invites in the door. Dude, that was huge. Way to go, and then just leave it at that. And then the next meeting, hey, uh admin lady, I saw that all our reporting's up to date, and I got my weekly report an hour ahead of schedule normally. It's the little things, guys, that build these communicational confidence blocks that you need to actually. I and the only reason me and Ron can sit here and smile and laugh about this is because we've lived it. We know, and it sucks in the middle of all of the chaos. Nobody goes home happy, nobody can go win at home when they're pissed off all day. So let's set each other up for success. But then you could absolutely add a tool like Builder Scum to get you there.

Ending Silos And Cookie Jar Thinking

SPEAKER_00 41:47

Yeah, well, so that's that. So, I mean, it's an elephant in the room because I'm gonna tell you there's a lot of people listening right now that are like, oh, I don't have a communication problem. I talk to them all the time. And I'm like, you probably have more of a communication problem than people that are buying my software because you don't even realize it. Because it's it's literally an elephant in the room. What I found out really quickly was like people don't understand this problem, like they don't even they don't even grasp this the whole problem, and that's a problem with the construction industry because of what you said. It's this ego. We have an ego in the construction industry that's like we're we're natural fixers, like we fix things, so we just think like we are the solution to everything, and nobody else can tell us any different, like, and that's wrong. Carture stems from you. So I'm gonna go back to like what you were talking about there when you're like everybody's trying to get their piece of the whatever I like to call it the everybody's trying to everybody thinks that everybody else is trying to get their hand in their own cookie jaw, like that is the general conception, but the problem is what no one realizes it's the same damn cookie jaw. I mean the same one that all of our hands should be in because it's what feeds us all, it's what feeds the ownership, it's what feeds the growth of the company, it's what feeds the employees in their families, but everybody's holding on to it like it's their own cookie jar. And they're like, No, you from accounting, you can't have your hand in my cookie jar. The accounting person's like, get your hand out of my cookie jar. And then you look around and there's only one cookie jar, and everybody's just passing it around, protecting it like it's their thing, like we're all on the same team. And like, that's the environment, and that comes from leadership. So if if you have a team that feels like somebody's trying to steal from their cookie jar, you as the owner, they think you're trying to steal from them. That's what they think. Like it does like culture just stems down to however that owner operates. And if that owner always thinks everybody's trying to steal from them, you're gonna have all these silos because every department's gonna think, oh, sales is doing something shady. That's what production's gonna say, and then production's gonna be like, Oh my goodness, this is insane. I can't believe he sold this job, he's just trying to screw me. I can't even get to my kids' soccer game tonight. But it that was that the intention, you know what? I think the intention of the sales rep was probably to sell a good job that could be installed, and the company could make money, the guy could get the job done in a reasonable amount of time. He probably don't even know that he effed the job up, right? And then the accounting guy's like, Well, where's my money at? And then the production team's like, Oh, oh, he's concerned about money. Well, that's his job. Like, aren't you concerned with laying pipe? Because, like, that's your job. So, like the different KPIs, like it's the we have to just bring everybody together. We're on the same team. Like, everybody is trying to make what's in the cookie jaw work for everybody in the company, not protect it for themselves. And it is such like I've I have gotten it's been a privilege of what I've been able to experience in the last five years of my life after working in construction. I've had the privilege to work with amazing construction companies. And the thing is, is I see this every time I walk into a new shop. It's the same problems. And it all stems from the fact that the as the leaders of the company, we're not willing to just look in the mirror and call a spade a spade and understand that the problems that we have are direct reflections of who we are and how we operate as a business owner. And like I said, we could, I mean, we could be on here for hours. I love this stuff. Like I construct business is like I've done it from the lowest level to the absolute highest level, and I'm willing to talk about it from any angle. And I just love this stuff.

SPEAKER_01 46:11

You know, I think we're also we're talking about a different level of communication that maybe some of the guys are sitting here listening to, too, is you know, we're talking past, you know, you were talking about pay for pay. A lot of folks don't even know what pay for pay is. And I am trying to get Sycon to a point, profitability-wise, that we are doing pay for pay. Like that is the ultimate goal, and it should be for everybody because everybody's happier, everybody's making money and company, the people, and but I think the one thing that we maybe are just kind of skipping ahead is that this all happens with visibility and transparency of the money. And I for years was like, oh, I can't, I can't let them know this, I can't let them know that. I can't, oh, then they're then they're gonna think this of me, and then they're gonna think like, dude, that's natural. You're you're you went from being uh$50,000,$60,000 a year employee W-2'd somewhere, now you've got hundreds of thousands of dollars running through your bank account, it's naturally to be scared that everybody's trying to take something from you. Like it's it's human nature, but I need you to understand the faster you understand the business numbers, and the faster you actually realize how much of the piece of the pie is yours, and you can get them all concentrated on putting cookies in the cookie jar instead of trying to chase around and keep a lid on an empty jar because that's all you're freaking doing when you got that going on, like you got to worry about putting cookies in the jar. You know what I mean? And and the only way you do that is focusing on profitability. And once you figure out how to get the production team focused on their parcel and portion of the control that they have of the profitability. Hey, estimator, you set how much gross net net can be down, but you you give us the opportunity to go make the money. Okay, you sold the job. All right, these boys here, you are the ones that are going to be concentrated on hitting this net number and the accounting. Let us know when flags are hitting through the job. Let me know as soon as I hit over material. Let me know if I'm over on rock so I could get out there with that foreman and make sure he understands because hopefully he's already throwing a red flag because he's working off the same work in progress report that accounting is driving. And I think that's a whole nother level and a whole nother conversation. And that's more in that accounting software bucket. And I've got a gentleman coming here in a couple of weeks. So we are going to dive off into exactly what SciCon has gone to. In November, I went away from QuickBooks for the first time in 10 years to a different accounting software that carries the same document from the estimate all the way until we bid the job, build the job out 100%. Punch list done, testing, retainage is getting built. It's all set off of one accounting document that starts that work in progress report. So the production team can control and actually maybe have the chance of swinging that job if we're going in the red. Okay, if we know about it, quicker we know about it, the quicker we can deal with it. But that visibility and transparency within your from ownership all the way down to your labor has got to be there if you even want to remotely get into some of the things that me and Ron are talking about. Because I the you guys know I'm super honest and vulnerable with you. I was that guy. I was that guy that thought, oh, they can't see this, they can't see that, they can't, and all you're doing is freaking zip tying yourself to the wall where you can't move, and then you're concentrated on growth, but then none of your team, they're just concentrated on their piece of the puzzle because they don't understand that it's all a puzzle together, and you're all worried about the same puzzle moving forward. And so you I agree. Um, you said earlier, you really have to check yourself as an owner and the ego thing, there is not another subcontract uh trade out there that carries the ego of a dirt guy. I'm telling you, I just navigated of carrying, we we don't do our own in-house earthwork anymore. And because man, when I sat there and looked at numbers on earthwork projects, like I couldn't have, and don't get me wrong, we were first that was three years of doing it. That's kind of where you take your licks, you're learning in any trade. We had our learning, but man, we're around dirt all day long, every day. Like we're ditch tickers, we should be able to figure this out. We did on a couple of projects, but man, the margins were thin on everything. The freaking expenses were through the roof. It takes 500 grand worth of dump trucks to even keep your equipment. Like, it didn't really make a whole lot of sense to me when it's so saturated and all over the place. But um got a little far off into the weeds there. But literally, it's all about looking at those numbers, not just you. I love it when my project manager comes to me and goes, Hey, we got a problem right here. Dylan had this number in. Uh uh Gage is out there, he's already at this number. Well, how are we tackling and what are we doing? And it's because of starting at those small 15-minute touch points of building Jesus' confidence because that guy didn't have any confidence. I'm so proud of everybody on the team of where they're at, but it's small steps, starting with the owner, and you're sitting there going, wait a minute, so I've caused all the problems to get to this point, and now I'm the I'm the solution to get us all out. Yeah, bro, and it sucks and it's embarrassing and it's shameful and it's hard and it's brutal. But guess what? When you are sitting there on a random Tuesday and things are clicking along, and you click on your email and you're like, wait a minute, two months ago I had to be like that guy. Now you're sitting back here reading, you've got good documentation on your daily log, on some project management software, whatever the case may be. And you're just like, whoa, whoa, we just definitely climbed a hurdle and you ain't got nobody to celebrate. That's the hard part. You can go to your team and go, hey, look, look what we did. You kind of look like a moron, but you got to sit there and celebrate with yourself and go, man, look at this small victory, small victory, and keep stacking and keep stacking and having 15-minute touch points and build that communicational internal where it's just completely unbreakable. They know how I'm thinking, I know how they're thinking, I know how they're thinking, and we can just move with that intentionality and trust each other, but always verifying one side of the bucket so we don't walk into that butt chewing from lady on the driveway because we only had 25% communication. I just wanted to hammer that home. I know we may have lost a couple of you guys. You know, if you're telling me, Ron, that you guys were doing pay for pay 10 years ago, you're right. You were way ahead of the times. It's just now becoming a very big thing. Of course it is. The model works on so many different platforms for labor, for super, for PM, for estimator, for ownership. It works across the board. But it takes everybody focusing on the communication and the profitability for every single contract, for every single job throughout the year. And it's it's tiresome to keep that up. But with tools like Ron has developed and helped other construction industry leaders develop, it's making it a lot easier to have that visibility.

Transparency Creates Real Accountability

SPEAKER_00 53:55

100%. And the the transparency is what scares people. I think that's what scares people with some of the communication. When I start talking about bringing this all into one place and not having it fragmented anymore, it brings in a point of accountability to who is doing what they're supposed to be doing and who is not. Because now we have a record of all of this. You can't just say, oh, that's some lost Slack channel that got deleted, or that that's on my personal phone and not my work phone. And you like you start to bring transparency to the communication in the company, and that scares people because now, even as an owner, you now it because if there's transparent, what is there always there when there's transparency? There's accountability. So if you're going to do something that provides transparency to everybody, now we have admin settings, so don't let me think like not everybody sees everything, but people start to see stuff, and there's transparency, and that brings accountability, and it brings accountability to owners and leaders and everybody within the company because now we have documented records of who's saying what and what conversations are actually happening between the clients or between the teams, and it it can be scary, but it shouldn't it be because when you bring transparent transparency and accountability into a company, there's only one thing that can happen from it, and that's growth as long as the company's set up right. Now, if you're if you're a complete dumpster fire, like it's going to continue to be a dumpster fire. That's why I say I'm only 20% of the solution here.

SPEAKER_01 55:44

Yeah. No, I think this is such a this is such a great topic around any type of software. Like you, you not just communication, not just accounting, not just PM. It's all about the inputs going into it, you holding their feet to the fire. That means you going in checking. And I'm terrible about this, but hey, Mr. Project Manager, this is the expectation. I want five truck maintenance sheets, and I want five daily uh maintenance inspection sheets on every piece of equipment. And if not, you send me an email on Friday letting me know who completed what, so that on Monday we're talking about it because we can't have a half million dollar piece of equipment going down that just that just swings an entire job. And you understand that because you see the expectation set by the estimator, and you know we only have this certain amount of profit on this job. And oh my God, we've got to cover this rental that we weren't prepared for on something that we didn't take care of. And that's just unacceptable. And so you you I think what a lot of people, and including myself on the early years, are scared of. They're they're scared of replacing themselves, and like you don't have those excuses to hide about hide around. Oh, well, that uh so-and-so talked to me the other day, and that was on text, and uh, so we're we're good. So, okay, you're good. You're good, so you don't have to go have a difficult conversation that equals more profitability back into the company, and your people see that. Your people are like, oh, you just want to be kind of a lazy sack and not go deal with this hard problem after I've done all the work for you. All you have to go and have a conversation, but you'd rather lay down and just take the$2,500,$10,000 hit, whatever it is, maybe even more. So it it really exposes you as an owner as it should. It's the best thing possible for you to get exposed and understand that you have problems as an owner as well, and that you've got to start dealing with these as hard as it is. Doesn't matter the compounded created problems that you allowed, that you set forth in your company. Now you've got to start and sometimes it takes the one good person leaving. Like you think you've got it all together. You've got you got all the five, six, seven crews, and you're just rocking and rolling, and people are and you don't hear about nothing because you're not touch pointing and you're not getting in there and asking the hard questions and and listening to what they have to say to make the change, to start the change. And then all of a sudden, boom, uh big big dog PM leaves, or estimator leaves, or accounting person leaves. And at that point, then it's like, oh my gosh, man, they were the best thing ever happened to me. What am I gonna do now? Oh, whoa, with me. Well, dude, they've been sending you freaking alarm bells for a year, you just weren't listening, and and and and it just causes this, I guess, replacement sinking feeling like we're gonna get replaced. Hey guys, let me just in just just for just a second. That's the whole point. Like, literally, that's the whole point. You started this business venture. Yes, I don't care if you want to be in the middle of it working in the business, that's fine. But rest of the on-the-business stuff still has to be taken care of with systems and processes and people, so you've got to kind of pick and choose. Do you want to be in your position every day? Well, then hire people around you, but you cannot be a roadblock and a bottleneck and expect growth out of your people and chastise your people for not getting there when you're not leading, when you're just sitting there being a boss. And so I have done that by personal experience. It's a terrible feeling. When people start leaving, you're like, you start scratching your head, and you're like, oh my God, could the problem be me? Yeah, stupid. The problem can be you. Wake up. It's time to freaking like put the boots on. You remember when we started when there was nobody there? Well, there's nobody here now. Get it together, peel back the onion, get into the core of the onion and fix it down there. It's gonna take some time, it's not fast. These problems, these problems were slow and progressed and compounded the whole time to this point. So, guess what? It is going to be a slow grind getting that. I I I last thing, I kind of compare it to like an aircraft carrier turning around because I've been in the middle of this, living it, right? It's like you have this floating mini city and you've been full steam ahead going the wrong way. And then all of a sudden you're like, oh, I want to go the other way. Well, you're hundreds and hundreds of maybe even thousands of miles the wrong direction. So you start this huge turn. Well, guess what? You ain't got no gas to make the turn because the wave and the tide and everything's crashing against the side wants to keep you going down that other direction. But I'm telling you, you've got to find the gas, you've got to find the fuel within your team to keep making a round in that corner. And eventually you get facing the other way and you're like, hooray, we've made it. No, stupid, you're a thousand miles the wrong direction, and you still got to fuel that thing, this huge, floating mini city that you've created all the way back to the starting line to get back to level ground zero to start moving forward. And we have uh made the full full turn and we're about halfway back there, but we're we are 100% trying our damnedest every single day. But now with the continued buy-in of the owner, man, you've really got me going here, Ron. The continued, you know, ownership buy-in through month after month, day after day, grinding. Your team sees that they value that. They're like, oh, our leaders got our grit back about him again. Okay, this is the guy I followed to start with. And he got a little comfortable, he got a little lazy, but guess what? He's fixing to lead us into this next mountain, this next hill climb. He's saying it's gonna kind of suck. You know what? I'm with him as long as he's leading us, and watch your team get bought back in just that quick.

Why Implementation Takes So Long

SPEAKER_00 1:01:55

Well, we we we have to have clarity on the outcomes. For some reason, in construction, we believe, and it's not, it's because like if you okay, if you're on a a project and there's a problem, you solve the problem, it's fixed, you move on. It it but we we take that same principle and we think that's how it works within the business, and it doesn't. We have to have time, we have to understand those timelines and all this. So, like we were we had a hiring crisis at one point in time. Oh, yeah and like it was like how and what we figured it was us, of course, like we're the problem, culture sucks. How do we fix this? Deep dive into it is like we're like, this is gonna take like two years. Like what we went into it with the expectation of like this is a long grind, this is not just something that we just show up one day and we say magic words and it's fixed, and we never have to revisit it. It is showing up and having a plan and how do you do this? And it's 90-day implements, it's having those meetings, continuing to move that ball uh every day for years until you finally recover, and it didn't take us the entire two years that we originally thought, but like we those were the expectations we set for ourselves, like we had clear expectations, it wasn't a 90-day initiative, like you just can't fix things in a company in 90 days. You you have to understand this is going to take time, and you can evaluate it. Like, we're all smart, like you can look at the situation and start to figure out is like how long did it take us to get here? Realistically, like, not what you think. Oh, I did something two weeks ago and it's what caused this. Like, realistically, where was the first break point in what's currently happening? How far back was that? Because it's probably gonna take at least double the amount of time. So a year ago, you're probably two years into fixing it because it's gonna take you a year just to get back to that that break even kind of perspective where people are even ready to go where it really needs to go, like pee like, and that's the problem is we we always start with every like as owners, we can start with the end in mind because we understand that nobody else does, but what do we do? We immediately start with the end in mind, that's that's sell them on where we're going, like that we need to sell them on where we could be in the next 30 days, so you need to take like here's where we're going and break that all the way down, put your out of the timeline. This is gonna take us two years to get here. What does each what does the first 30 days look like? What does the first 90 days, the first 180 days, the first 360 days? Like, where do we need to be at? What are those stops along the way that means we're progressing towards where we are? And that's the message you give people. You don't give them the entire roadmap because you know what? They're gonna get in their truck and they're gonna leave because they're gonna be like, Hey, no way I'm doing that for the next two years to get to where this guy thinks he wants to be. I'm gonna go down the road to John's, where John likes to hang out at the bar after work, and I enjoy that. Just paint the small picture to where they can get, and then you get there and you just continue going. But in your mind, you know this is a long road ahead, but it would benefit everybody, it'll benefit everybody in the business, it'll benefit all your customers, it'll benefit you as being the owner, but we can't look at everything as like, oh, I can fix this tomorrow. You know, early on, we found 70% of our users were first-time software adapters. And then the number and number one question I always get from people outside of the construction industry when I'm at software events is man, that's a really hard industry to get adaption in, isn't it? And I'm like, Well, when 70% of your users are going from pad and pen to using a piece of software, it can be a hand hoarding process. Now, the people that have used software before get builder comms and they're off to the races, no problem. But that's not the majority of our customers. And here's how I describe it, and this relates to when you're trying to implement something new in your business. When I am talking with a customer that's never used software before, and they ask me, How long is it going to take to get this up and going? There is not a direct answer to that for any company with any piece of software you're going. To implement whether it's small or big. I've been through a couple of different software changes within a company. But here's what it's like: let's say you for the last 15 years have been driving down the road to work every day, and you come up to this stoplight and you take a left. And then all of a sudden Ron News Palm shows up. And I'm like, dude, you should take a right at that stoplight. It will save you 10 minutes. How long do you think it's going to take before every day you pull up to that stoplight and you actually take a right and you don't take a left? That is what it's like implementing software into your business. It's also what it's like anytime you try to change behavior of people. It's a long haul. You got to realize this is how we've done it for a long time. We've always gone left at that light. But now we want to go right. I cannot expect every time somebody comes up to that light, they're going to instantly go right. And I can't expect that everybody is going to get to the point where they're going right more consistently than left at the same time. It just doesn't work that way. And when you're doing anything from implementing software or implementing new procedures in your company, that is the battle we fight. Is just how we've always done it. And the problem is, is leadership, pretty much what we do is like we take TNT and we blow up the left-hand turn. So then when they come up to that light and they go left, they fall off a cliff and die. And it's like, well, that's a little extreme. Like we're asking them to change their behaviors. Like maybe we should put some caution tape out there to help them go right instead of like just blowing up left as an option at all. And understand it's going to take time for them to get to the point where they go right and they save 10 minutes every day. And I talk to owners about this because owners are typically my biggest bottomet because they've been going left for 30 years. It's not their project manager who's only been going left for five years. It'll only take me like 30 days to get him going right. The owner who's been going for 30 years taking a left, it can take a year to get this guy to go right every time. But like that's just that's how we have to look at it.

Where To Find Ron Online

SPEAKER_01 1:09:39

So accurate, man. Like, this is exactly this episode is one of the reasons I built this show. Like, I don't want the people listening to this show in our trades and building America right now, today, plugged into their headset. I don't want them to lead a bunch of people a thousand miles in the wrong direction. I don't want them to have to make the aircraft carrier turn. Eventually, statistically, most of them are going to have their own aircraft turn uh at some point building a business because we just don't get it right the first time. But there's not as many folks like yourself in uh, you know, the construction champions podcast and here the blue collar podcast, like there's not many people going, man, the construction industry needs some help. Who's helping these people? And then you go start looking and you're like, man, there's really not a whole lot of people helping these uh unless they're selling the software, unless they're it is appears to end great. And and it's because just like you said, 70% of your users are coming from pen and paper. There's there's there's a company that I got on one of my projects right now, been in the dirt game here locally, 55 years, still on pen and paper. And he's like, hey, he's asking me all these questions about this and that, and I'm not an anymore an ego-driven person where I can't. I mean, this I respect the crap of this guy. This guy's done it for 55 years. He must have all the answers. No, he's me five years ago doing it in in utter chaos, and he somehow made it 55 years. Don't get me wrong, really prestigious gentleman. He's done a lot of work around here. Don't let me don't let me shy that away. He is a genius within his own bread, but literally the people below him have never really just taken it over where he could be replaced, and there's systems and there's things to follow. Like, even to clocking in, we're still on time sheets. Like, man, labor tracking is everything. But, anyways, let's not let's not get off of in that regard. What I'm saying is is these resources are here to help you guys. Like, everything that me and Ron just talked about is what every single one of you are going to run into at some point. And when you this is such a great, and I'm so Ron, I just want to applaud you. Thank you for being just so vulnerable about it. Like, hey, don't come running to my software thinking I'm gonna fix all your communicational links, because that's not it. That's not it at all. I would agree with you, you're probably maybe even 30%. Let's put you above average um with the other softwares that are out there, but it is 100% on you owners taking back the curtain and going, I'm hoping you're only in year two or year one, where you're sitting there going, man, he's right. I am being super hidden about this. But you don't know what you don't know, guys. Like you don't know until you do it and you do it wrong, right? That's why these resources, that's why I started this resource and and the YouTube stuff, and that's why Ron started champions, uh, the construction champion podcast. Like, they're out there. You got to go find them. They're a little harder to find nowadays, but at the same time, they are we are trying to help you guys. I don't want to hear, si, I'm a dumpster fire. I went the wrong way, I don't know what to do. I grew sloppy fast, guys. I know all about that. And when you start getting million-dollar assets involved, it gets really out of whack really freaking fast. And then you, oh, you got 10 pickups, and now you need 15. And oh, you're buying all these, anyways. I can go off on a totally different spectrum, but how cool is it to, you're right, softwares are out there for tools to help these guys, but it's all about what you put into it for what you're gonna get out of it. And if you've got a bunch of broken, fragmented data going into this, it's just gonna be another sloppy nightmare and nobody's gonna hold it accountable. Nobody, oh, this is cool. We bought a year and we've used it for four months, and it tells us nothing. Well, owners, that's on you. And and I'm serious, if if you're not bought in with your team about making these changes and focusing up and going a different direction than what you're just used to doing every year. Um, I'm telling you on the I'm not fully on the other side, but man, I'm freaking close. And I'm telling you, it's worth it. It's worth it for your team, it's worth it for your sanity, it's worth it for what the company you have built from the ground up. It is a lot of hard work. It is a lot of brutal, embarrassing, shameful moments that you allowed things to get to this point, and it's really hard conversations, but those people will respect you going, hey, I didn't know. I just heard this on a podcast the other day, and we are screwing up a whole bunch of stuff. And I'm gonna dig into the weeds. Hey, maybe reach out to Ron. Hey, reach out to me. I I talk with a lot of you guys weekly. Like, I can't, you're doing the right thing by reaching out and asking for help. That's one step past that ego of going, oh, I got it figured out. Well, just keep doing you, big dog. Like, you you'll end up here at some point, frustrated and pulling your hair out, whether you just exit or whether you go bankrupt or whatever the case may be, you will be here. And so truly hope you guys in the in three years below, five years below, really heated a warning here. And if you are in the middle of compounding that problem, stop it right now. Bring the team together, do a 15-minute touch point. Hey guys, I'm gonna revision and focus up here. I feel like I've constantly, if there's a repeatable problem, that means two times of the recurring thing in 30 days. You need a system, you need a process, you need a procedure for how to deal with that said issue because there's no reason that same reoccurring issue should be floating all the way to the top and you having to deal with it every time. That's just that's not what we're trying to do here. You're gonna pull your hair out, you're gonna uh just like you said earlier, you're gonna scale problems. And that's that's not what you want. And you'll get to a compounded point and you'll be looking and just desperate for anybody to walk in and go, hey, this is your solution. And you'll be like, Okay, this is it, guys, here we go. And then six months down the road, you're like, Man, what a fool I look. I spent$15,000 on this, and we can't even freaking get half the stuff into it. And so just heed the warning. Man, Ron, I have got one final question here, but before we get to that final question, then I ask everybody here on the show, where can we find you? If these guys want to reach out, obviously, you're repping a podcast. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:35

300 episodes, and I think I think you're gonna be on as well. I think that's the meeting plan uh uh from your team that I have talked to is you're supposed to be either you're on the schedule or will be on the schedule. Uh, so you can find I'm pretty much everywhere these days. I point most people, you just go to LinkedIn. If you're not a LinkedIn person, go to construction championspodcast.com and that will link you to BuilderComs, Buildable Labs, you all my social media, everything on there. And it's a great place to go, it's a great resource for everybody to utilize. So I don't want to leave you with everything, just go one place and check me out. If you do social media, go to LinkedIn. If you don't do social media, go to construction championspodcast.com and we're good to go from there.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:31

I'm really hoping most of the audience um has been building LinkedIn. I've been talking about we had Aaron Witt on uh first episode of this year, and we briefly talked about LinkedIn and how big of a weapon it is for these guys, like your PMs, your estimators, like they're there, guys. Get posting, just tell your story, who you are, what you're doing, why you're doing it, and how you're doing it, and talk about the mistakes, talk about the success. Just post on there. But go find Ron, he's a great follow on LinkedIn. We've been following each other for quite some time. Um, but I I agree, I also post daily on LinkedIn because it is such just tell your story. But uh nope, that's really cool. I've got uh one more takeaway, sir. Maybe you gotta reach back into those construction times, or maybe that man standing in the mirror when you were just talking about getting into the industry. But I ask everybody on the show, you know, it's so common for the construction industry guy, whether it be a laborer, whether it be a foreman who's burnt out, whether it's a project manager who's just tired of the 87,000 phone calls a day, whatever it may be, we get stuck mentally, man. We get stuck physically, emotionally. Um when when those points came in your life, share a little piece of advice that uh has helped you along the way for all our listeners today.

75 Hard For Mental Discipline

SPEAKER_00 1:18:57

Oh my God. Well, you got to dive into who you who you are as a person and understand that you're tougher than any situation that you're gonna be presented with. And that's just what they are, is their situations. And I'm gonna tell you what Ron Newsbaum does today, and this started probably four years ago when I first found out about this program, and I'm in the middle of putting together a podcast, challenging the entire construction industry to go do this. Is if you are stuck, if you are feeling like what you just said, go do 75 hard, it would change your life. It changed my life. I was in a position where I had gotten, I don't like to say weak, but like I had gotten complacent and I found out about 75 hard and I did it. And I it brought me back to how I felt when I was a Marine. And now I consistently revisit that. And you know what? We are in an industry that is full of stress and pressure and all of this stuff. And everybody 75 Hard is not a fitness thing, it's a mental discipline thing. That is what it takes to run a construction business, it takes mental discipline, mental fortitude. That is what 75 hard will stretch you and push you into doing. And it just takes 75 days. As long as you get it right the first time, it'll take 75 days, could take you a lot longer, but I've done 75 hard, I've done the live hard, I've got the tattoo to to commemorate it all. It is something that I truly believe everybody should go do. And with that question that you just asked, is if you are in one of those places, take 75 days and invest in yourself. It doesn't cost you anything to do. Everything is free with 75 Heart. It's like I said, I am anti-predatory and all of the stuff that's out there. 75 Heart is completely free for you to show up and do for 75 days, and it will completely change your outlook and change your life if you let it.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:10

I've watched a couple of guys uh shout out to Will. He's uh my content creator, he's been with me almost three years. He um he did 75 hard, he's done it twice, actually. Had a couple of foremen uh no longer work here, but they've also done it, and I've seen it firsthand how it can change their discipline, their mindset, the way they look at things. I I should probably pencil that in. I should probably do it myself.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:38

Absolutely. Hard truth is they probably left because you're not doing 75 hard. You know, it adds people's mind and what you want to be around and what you find acceptable, and that might have just added some clarity for that. 75 hard. I mean, it's like builder comms wouldn't be here without 75 hard. Like, there's a lot of things that transpired out of my life out of the first time I ever did 75 hard. And one of the biggest things was was just an understanding that I am one of the baddest dudes out there, and I have the mental capacity to do great things, and I shouldn't let others chain that stuff down, and like that's what people are searching for is the ability to say, Oh, I can do like it's an accomplishment to do it. Most people that start out 75 hard would never finish it. And it I like I said, I'm in the middle of putting together an entire episode to challenge the entire construction industry to do a round of 75 hard in 2026.

Con Expo Thanks And Closing

SPEAKER_01 1:22:48

Well, I better pick a time because I'm gonna have to uh probably accept that challenge. I need to, it would be uh it would be it would just be such a confidence builder for myself to hear you speak about it and every time I've watched these guys through it. So um, Ron, what a what a great episode. I can't tell you thank you enough for joining us today to have somebody that has the same mental uh messaging and the same concentration for our people and these companies that are out there that need to help. They just don't know what they don't know. Don't beat yourself up today, guys, saying, Man, man, this is all so obvious. Well, it is because we're sitting here talking about it because we've lived through it and it sounds so obvious, but when you're living through it, it's not. And so don't beat yourself up too hard. Start small. Um, maybe, maybe we uh maybe I do something through the show on 75 Hard and and talk about maybe live it with some of the audience members and see if who makes it through, who doesn't. But what a challenge today, guys. Ron, thank you so much for joining us. Guys, I just wanted to tell you also the guys that I met out there at Con Expo last week. Obviously, we're back in studio. Um I'm with Ron here, but at the same time, I met so many of you that listened to this show and the amount of handshakes and the impact and the and the and the message alignment that you guys have with this show. I cannot express my gratitude enough. Um, I wanted to shine some light on the folks that spent the time last week running me down uh at Con Expo. We were on the move and some really big things coming from that show. If you've never been, you've got to line up to go in 2029. It is a room full of construction industry leaders um from project standpoints to manufacturers of equipment and GPS and uh products, tools, software, it's the whole nine. You guys have to be there. And I look forward to shaking more hands in three years from now. But um, guys, until next week, I really appreciate you. Uh drop a like on the episode, drop a rating on the and or share it with somebody that might need to hear this. And uh till next week, you guys be safe out there. If you've enjoyed this episode, be sure to give it a like, share it with the fellas, check out our website to send us any questions and comments about your experience in the blue collar business. Who do you want to hear from? Send them our way. We'll do our best to answer any questions you may have. Till next time, guys.