{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":0.54,"endTime":3.88,"body":"Harbor pilot is a job that dates back to ancient times."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3.88,"endTime":4.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":4.48,"endTime":9.36,"body":"Our global commerce system would shut down without it, and yet I'd never heard of it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":9.36,"endTime":10.14,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":10.14,"endTime":10.94,"body":"Maybe you haven't either."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":10.94,"endTime":11.94,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":11.94,"endTime":18.08,"body":"Grant Livingstone is a retired harbor pilot who worked out of the port of Long Beach in California for 34 years."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":18.08,"endTime":18.82,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":18.82,"endTime":20.66,"body":"At parties, he would try to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":20.66,"endTime":20.66,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":20.66,"endTime":21.66,"body":"explain his job."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":22.04,"endTime":27.52,"body":"When anyone asked me, I would dive into the technical definition of a harbor pilot,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":27.52,"endTime":27.8,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":27.8,"endTime":29.64,"body":"and people's eyes would glaze over."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":30.14,"endTime":33.86,"body":"Luckily, his wife would often step in to help him out in these situations."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":34.34,"endTime":35.7,"body":"My wife finally"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":35.7,"endTime":35.7,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":35.7,"endTime":36.28,"body":"stopped."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":36.28,"endTime":36.74,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":36.74,"endTime":40.62,"body":"She would just interrupt me, and she would lean forward and tell the person,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":40.62,"endTime":41.1,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":41.1,"endTime":42.0,"body":"whoever was asking,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":42.0,"endTime":42.96,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":42.96,"endTime":47.82,"body":"Grant is a valet parking attendant, but he parks ships instead of cars."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":47.82,"endTime":50.94,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":50.94,"endTime":53.12,"body":"And everybody would get it immediately."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":54.4,"endTime":57.66,"body":"So why do you need a valet parker for a huge ship?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":57.66,"endTime":58.5,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":58.5,"endTime":63.02,"body":"Well, because every one of those ships will be docked at a port in a harbor."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":63.02,"endTime":63.68,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":63.68,"endTime":66.28,"body":"And a harbor is a treacherous place to sail."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":66.28,"endTime":67.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":67.06,"endTime":70.78,"body":"A pilot like Grant has to memorize every inch of the harbor."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":71.7,"endTime":71.9,"body":"Where"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":71.9,"endTime":71.9,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":71.9,"endTime":73.64,"body":"are the rocks under the water?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":73.64,"endTime":74.24,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":74.24,"endTime":75.48,"body":"Where are the shallow areas?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":75.48,"endTime":76.12,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":76.12,"endTime":76.98,"body":"Where are the currents?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":76.98,"endTime":77.36,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":77.36,"endTime":78.78,"body":"Where is the wind coming from?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":79.78,"endTime":81.56,"body":"That's all local knowledge."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":81.56,"endTime":81.88,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":81.88,"endTime":86.14,"body":"You just can't expect the captain of an international cargo ship to know."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":86.14,"endTime":86.83,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":86.83,"endTime":89.26,"body":"So that's where harbor pilots come in."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":89.26,"endTime":89.76,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":89.76,"endTime":91.76,"body":"They go out a few miles offshore."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":91.76,"endTime":92.4,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":92.4,"endTime":96.84,"body":"They board the approaching ship and then personally pilot it in."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":96.84,"endTime":97.68,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":97.68,"endTime":100.84,"body":"And when it's ready to leave the harbor, they pilot it back out."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":100.84,"endTime":101.68,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":101.68,"endTime":103.34,"body":"The stakes here are high."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":103.34,"endTime":103.64,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":103.64,"endTime":108.44,"body":"We're talking ships and cargo worth hundreds of millions of dollars that are navigating"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":108.44,"endTime":108.44,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":108.44,"endTime":109.64,"body":"dangerous waters."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":110.7,"endTime":115.22,"body":"Most of the accidents with ships occur when ships are maneuvering,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":115.22,"endTime":115.78,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":115.78,"endTime":118.86,"body":"and there's no place that ships are maneuvering more"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":118.86,"endTime":119.36,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":119.36,"endTime":122.58,"body":"than when they're inside a port with a pilot on board."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":123.36,"endTime":128.32,"body":"And so harbor pilots are among the most highly trained mariners in the world."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":128.32,"endTime":128.979,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":128.979,"endTime":132.24,"body":"Grant has piloted 16,000 ships."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":132.24,"endTime":133.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":133.06,"endTime":135.18,"body":"Most of the time, it was smooth sailing."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":135.18,"endTime":136.3,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":136.3,"endTime":139.7,"body":"But there were also moments of near disaster."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":139.7,"endTime":148.7,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":148.7,"endTime":151.42,"body":"I'm Dan Heath and this is What It's Like to Be."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":151.42,"endTime":152.03,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":152.03,"endTime":156.02,"body":"In every episode we walk in the shoes of someone from a different profession."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":156.02,"endTime":156.64,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":156.64,"endTime":160.4,"body":"A long haul trucker, an ocean lifeguard, a hairstylist."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":160.4,"endTime":160.84,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":160.84,"endTime":162.54,"body":"We want to know what they do all day at work."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":162.54,"endTime":163.5,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":163.5,"endTime":167.98,"body":"Today we'll ask Grant Livingstone what it's like to be a harbor pilot."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":167.98,"endTime":168.46,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":168.46,"endTime":182.98,"body":"We'll talk about how he climbs aboard a moving ship, what it's like interpersonally when he takes over command from the ship's captain, and how he avoided a near-catastrophic collision in an oil tanker."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":182.98,"endTime":183.8,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":183.8,"endTime":184.84,"body":"Stay with us."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":184.84,"endTime":189.7,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":189.7,"endTime":192.92,"body":"You can't just apply to become a harbor pilot."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":192.92,"endTime":193.14,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":193.14,"endTime":195.98,"body":"First, you need a lot of experience at sea."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":195.98,"endTime":196.58,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":196.58,"endTime":199.36,"body":"So you'll likely have worked as a captain on a ship."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":199.36,"endTime":200.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":200.0,"endTime":201.12,"body":"In fact"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":201.12,"endTime":205.5,"body":"Most captains at sea, many of them, after they get their captain's experience,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":205.5,"endTime":205.73,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":205.73,"endTime":207.44,"body":"they aspire to become a pilot."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":207.96,"endTime":208.72,"body":"Oh, no kidding."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":208.72,"endTime":208.91,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":208.91,"endTime":210.06,"body":"So it's like kind of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":210.06,"endTime":210.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":210.06,"endTime":211.2,"body":"moving up the ladder."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":211.54,"endTime":212.18,"body":"It is."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":212.18,"endTime":212.45,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":212.45,"endTime":217.86,"body":"We're not saying that a master's job at sea is a lesser job."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":217.86,"endTime":218.4,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":218.4,"endTime":219.26,"body":"I want to be careful."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":219.26,"endTime":219.68,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":219.68,"endTime":220.86,"body":"It's a different job."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":220.86,"endTime":220.95,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":220.95,"endTime":222.7,"body":"You're comparing apples to oranges."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":223.46,"endTime":224.38,"body":"Does it pay more?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":224.88,"endTime":225.36,"body":"It does."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":225.36,"endTime":225.64,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":225.64,"endTime":229.2,"body":"And you're home far more and the pay is considerably more."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":229.2,"endTime":229.78,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":229.78,"endTime":235.86,"body":"But so is the risk because most of the ship accidents, as I told you, occur when ships are maneuvering."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":235.86,"endTime":236.24,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":236.24,"endTime":239.94,"body":"And most of the maneuvering occurs in ports."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":239.94,"endTime":240.5,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":240.5,"endTime":250.66,"body":"And so as the pilot, you are quadrupling 10 times the risk that you had for collisions when you were a master at sea."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":250.66,"endTime":251.3,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":251.3,"endTime":259.1,"body":"And a pilot on a ship and you're maneuvering these ships, Dan, you get into an accident and it's potentially a career-ending accident."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":259.1,"endTime":259.7,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":259.7,"endTime":263.74,"body":"That is a lot of liability to keep in mind when you're going to work"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":263.74,"endTime":263.74,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":263.74,"endTime":264.42,"body":"every day."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":265.08,"endTime":270.48,"body":"One of the challenges of being a harbor pilot is that you're not piloting the same ships every day."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":270.48,"endTime":270.81,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":270.81,"endTime":273.12,"body":"You could be working with very different ships."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":273.12,"endTime":273.9,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":273.9,"endTime":276.72,"body":"So Grant's son, as it happens, is an airline pilot."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":276.72,"endTime":277.07,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":277.07,"endTime":278.06,"body":"He flies Boeing"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":278.06,"endTime":278.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":278.06,"endTime":279.4,"body":"767s."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":280.12,"endTime":287.44,"body":"And I told him, imagine if your job as a pilot was to land and take off at an airport."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":287.44,"endTime":288.16,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":288.16,"endTime":296.72,"body":"You're going to stay at Los Angeles International Airport and you're going to take off in this plane and then the next plane coming in, you're going to land it."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":296.72,"endTime":297.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":297.0,"endTime":298.759,"body":"And some of them are 747s."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":298.759,"endTime":299.72,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":299.72,"endTime":302.22,"body":"Some of them are A-Bus 300s."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":302.22,"endTime":302.46,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":302.46,"endTime":306.08,"body":"Some of them are twin-engine cargo Cessnas."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":306.4,"endTime":307.64,"body":"That's a great analogy."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":307.64,"endTime":308.08,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":308.08,"endTime":308.2,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":308.58,"endTime":319.64,"body":"It is not easy, Dan, to go from a ship that's 300,000 tons and 1,200 or 1,300 feet long."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":319.64,"endTime":320.07,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":320.07,"endTime":327.52,"body":"You get off that ship and they put you on a 300-foot cargo ship that's very lightweight and small."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":327.52,"endTime":328.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":328.0,"endTime":332.62,"body":"You really have to always reset that relative motion."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":332.62,"endTime":332.82,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":332.82,"endTime":336.5,"body":"It's one of the most difficult things for pilots that are training."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":337.42,"endTime":346.12,"body":"Harbor pilots are great at their jobs, partly because they're the cream of the crop in terms of skill, but also because they get so much more practice."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":346.12,"endTime":347.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":347.06,"endTime":350.66,"body":"Grant said that when he was at sea, before his harbor pilot days,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":351.2,"endTime":359.0,"body":"We were going to various ports on the East Coast and South America, and it took us two months to do a round trip."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":359.0,"endTime":359.32,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":359.32,"endTime":369.08,"body":"So once every two months, we went to that foreign port in South America or that port in the United States."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":369.08,"endTime":369.89,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":369.89,"endTime":376.94,"body":"So once every two months in that particular port, we would dock and undock the ship once every two months."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":376.94,"endTime":377.67,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":377.67,"endTime":384.28,"body":"The pilot in that local port may be docking and undocking five ships a day."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":384.28,"endTime":384.84,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":384.84,"endTime":392.12,"body":"So that pilot not only has much more experience than I do as a captain visiting the port,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":392.12,"endTime":393.18,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":393.18,"endTime":396.66,"body":"he has much more knowledge of the port, but he also, or her,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":396.66,"endTime":397.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":397.06,"endTime":404.68,"body":"they also have much more ship handling experience, and that's key for piloting."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":405.24,"endTime":405.94,"body":"But before you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":405.94,"endTime":405.94,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":405.94,"endTime":411.84,"body":"can pilot a ship, you have to get on it, often while it's still moving."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":411.84,"endTime":412.6,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":412.6,"endTime":414.26,"body":"And that can be an adventure"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":414.26,"endTime":414.26,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":414.26,"endTime":414.68,"body":"in itself."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":415.46,"endTime":421.3,"body":"So we approach the ship, pilot boat captain who are highly skilled boat operators,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":421.3,"endTime":421.84,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":421.84,"endTime":428.14,"body":"and specialize in putting a human being next to a ship so they can climb a rope ladder."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":428.14,"endTime":428.72,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":428.72,"endTime":429.5,"body":"And it's tricky."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":429.5,"endTime":429.9,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":429.9,"endTime":432.94,"body":"And when the weather's rough, it can be life-threatening."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":432.94,"endTime":433.18,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":433.18,"endTime":440.82,"body":"And there's been, unfortunately, still to this day, too many pilots losing their lives trying to board or get off ships."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":441.4,"endTime":444.8,"body":"Wait, so you board by climbing up a rope ladder?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":444.8,"endTime":447.1,"body":"A rope ladder, it's called a Jacob's ladder."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":447.98,"endTime":453.36,"body":"And the height he's scaling on the ladder varies depending on the ship and what it's carrying."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":453.36,"endTime":454.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":454.0,"endTime":455.38,"body":"Take an oil tanker,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":455.38,"endTime":455.42,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":455.42,"endTime":455.96,"body":"for example."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":456.4,"endTime":460.1,"body":"When those ships are loaded, it's a very short climb to the main deck."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":460.1,"endTime":460.38,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":460.38,"endTime":463.26,"body":"So the pilot ladder might only be 12 feet."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":463.26,"endTime":463.52,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":463.52,"endTime":464.18,"body":"That you have to climb."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":464.18,"endTime":464.26,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":464.26,"endTime":465.5,"body":"But when that ship"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":465.5,"endTime":465.5,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":465.5,"endTime":472.58,"body":"empties, now they might come out in a ballast draft of about 30 feet, let's say."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":473.12,"endTime":473.26,"body":"Whoa."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":473.26,"endTime":473.43,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":473.43,"endTime":475.8,"body":"I mean, so you're like climbing a three-story building."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":476.18,"endTime":477.5,"body":"You're climbing 40 feet."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":478.14,"endTime":479.22,"body":"That is crazy."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":479.58,"endTime":479.84,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":480.36,"endTime":486.96,"body":"I mean, that's the best technology that our Earth has to offer right now is you've got to like precariously climb a rope ladder."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":488.18,"endTime":490.66,"body":"It's considered routine by the ship."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":490.66,"endTime":490.79,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":490.79,"endTime":492.4,"body":"We're just going to put the pilot ladder out."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":492.4,"endTime":493.22,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":493.22,"endTime":495.38,"body":"But it hasn't changed, Dan."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":495.38,"endTime":495.38,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":495.38,"endTime":501.0,"body":"I joke and I say that there's two technologies that are the same from the 1800s,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":501.0,"endTime":501.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":501.48,"endTime":503.98,"body":"toilets and toilet tanks and pilot ladders."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":503.98,"endTime":504.88,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":504.88,"endTime":506.04,"body":"It hasn't evolved."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":506.72,"endTime":510.82,"body":"I mean, I just can't believe there's that many listeners who have processed this,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":510.82,"endTime":511.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":511.0,"endTime":515.64,"body":"that our global economy absolutely hinges on overseas shipping."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":515.64,"endTime":516.62,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":516.62,"endTime":520.84,"body":"And every overseas container ship eventually makes it into a port."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":520.84,"endTime":521.62,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":521.62,"endTime":528.5,"body":"And every time they come to a port, there's somebody climbing a rope ladder to get them in so they can unload."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":528.5,"endTime":528.7,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":528.7,"endTime":533.68,"body":"I mean, it's like the whole global economy hinges on you going rung over rung."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":533.68,"endTime":534.42,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":534.42,"endTime":535.94,"body":"That's a hard thing to get your brain around."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":536.36,"endTime":536.78,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":536.78,"endTime":537.86,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":537.86,"endTime":547.16,"body":"There's about 55,000 ships, maybe even more now, but let's say 55,000 ships on the ocean moving every day."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":547.16,"endTime":548.02,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":548.02,"endTime":555.62,"body":"And of those 55,000, some are on a four-week transit, some are on two weeks, some are just days."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":555.62,"endTime":556.52,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":556.52,"endTime":561.24,"body":"Those 55,000 ships are heading for a port, and they've left a port."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":561.24,"endTime":561.74,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":561.74,"endTime":565.26,"body":"And they disembarked a pilot, and they're going to board a pilot."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":565.26,"endTime":565.72,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":565.72,"endTime":573.2,"body":"So those 55,000 ships have 110,000 pilot boardings that they've got coming up in the next few weeks."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":574.12,"endTime":579.68,"body":"Grant climbed a Jacob's Ladder up the side of a ship thousands upon thousands of times."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":579.68,"endTime":580.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":580.48,"endTime":583.1,"body":"And he fell off three times."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":583.58,"endTime":586.72,"body":"The worst fall I had was from about 15 feet."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":586.72,"endTime":587.15,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":587.15,"endTime":587.96,"body":"And it was at night."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":587.96,"endTime":588.62,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":588.62,"endTime":590.16,"body":"And I've got boots on."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":590.16,"endTime":590.34,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":590.34,"endTime":590.9,"body":"I've got a radio."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":590.9,"endTime":591.52,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":591.52,"endTime":592.88,"body":"I've got all this weight."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":592.88,"endTime":593.2,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":593.2,"endTime":595.46,"body":"And I had a pilot coat."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":595.46,"endTime":595.77,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":595.77,"endTime":601.64,"body":"So it looks like a big winter coat made from vinyl that you would wear and something that"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":601.64,"endTime":601.64,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":601.64,"endTime":603.18,"body":"would be good in the cold or the rain."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":603.18,"endTime":603.8,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":603.8,"endTime":603.98,"body":"Well,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":603.98,"endTime":604.31,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":604.31,"endTime":607.4,"body":"in those days, they were called neutrally buoyant."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":607.4,"endTime":607.56,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":607.56,"endTime":612.12,"body":"Now, I didn't know that when someone told me, wear your float coat."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":612.12,"endTime":612.29,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":612.29,"endTime":618.24,"body":"I assumed that if I went into the water, it was going to pop me to the surface."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":618.24,"endTime":618.84,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":618.84,"endTime":626.06,"body":"And when I fell, I hit the water and I just kept going down because of my boots and all the weight."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":626.06,"endTime":626.23,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":626.23,"endTime":627.3,"body":"But I wasn't concerned."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":627.3,"endTime":628.04,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":628.04,"endTime":630.54,"body":"I'm a scuba diver, so I'm comfortable under the water."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":630.54,"endTime":630.55,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":630.55,"endTime":631.56,"body":"I wasn't worried at all."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":631.56,"endTime":632.46,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":632.46,"endTime":634.78,"body":"I have no idea how far I went down."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":634.78,"endTime":635.46,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":635.46,"endTime":637.84,"body":"Maybe 12 feet, 15 feet, I don't know."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":637.84,"endTime":638.2,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":638.2,"endTime":638.8,"body":"Maybe further."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":638.8,"endTime":639.56,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":639.56,"endTime":642.74,"body":"But when I got down there, nothing happened."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":642.74,"endTime":644.72,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":644.72,"endTime":646.32,"body":"I stayed right where I was."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":646.32,"endTime":646.62,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":646.62,"endTime":651.56,"body":"And I had expected the float coat to bounce me to the surface."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":651.56,"endTime":652.26,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":652.26,"endTime":654.38,"body":"And I have no idea why I did this."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":654.38,"endTime":654.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":654.48,"endTime":656.78,"body":"I put my arms straight out like I was flying."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":656.78,"endTime":656.86,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":656.86,"endTime":659.92,"body":"I don't know if I thought there was, it's these things you do."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":659.92,"endTime":660.04,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":660.04,"endTime":660.8,"body":"I'm holding my breath."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":660.8,"endTime":661.14,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":661.14,"endTime":661.78,"body":"I'm looking up."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":661.78,"endTime":661.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":661.92,"endTime":665.4,"body":"I can see a vague light, but I'm not going anywhere."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":665.4,"endTime":666.34,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":666.34,"endTime":670.64,"body":"And as I'm holding my breath, I realized, oh, crap."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":670.64,"endTime":671.88,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":671.88,"endTime":673.14,"body":"You better start swimming."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":673.14,"endTime":675.76,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":675.76,"endTime":680.54,"body":"And I started kicking and swimming, but you've got this massive float coat on."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":680.54,"endTime":680.89,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":680.89,"endTime":684.4,"body":"So your arms aren't free to move like you were scuba diving."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":684.68,"endTime":684.76,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":685.16,"endTime":686.6,"body":"You know, just had a mask and a snorkel."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":686.6,"endTime":686.86,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":686.86,"endTime":698.94,"body":"So I had to kick and I had to really kick hard, but I didn't want to expend too much of that oxygen because I wasn't sure how far it was to the surface."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":698.94,"endTime":699.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":699.0,"endTime":702.7,"body":"And I just remember thinking, oh, there's the surface."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":702.7,"endTime":703.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":703.06,"endTime":705.12,"body":"I'm about to, oh, no, that wasn't it."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":705.12,"endTime":705.24,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":705.24,"endTime":705.6,"body":"Okay, there."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":705.6,"endTime":705.9,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":705.9,"endTime":707.28,"body":"No, I've got to go further."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":707.28,"endTime":707.84,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":707.84,"endTime":712.98,"body":"And when I finally did get to the surface, I had no more air left."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":712.98,"endTime":713.18,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":713.18,"endTime":716.48,"body":"And I hadn't panicked yet, but I realized,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":716.48,"endTime":717.04,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":717.04,"endTime":718.64,"body":"okay, this could get serious in a hurry."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":719.4,"endTime":723.52,"body":"Was that the closest to panic you've ever been in your career?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":724.14,"endTime":725.06,"body":"Oh, no, no, no, no."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":725.06,"endTime":726.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":726.06,"endTime":727.8,"body":"No, that was the minor panic."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":727.8,"endTime":728.6,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":728.6,"endTime":730.46,"body":"The major panic was yet to come."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":738.26,"endTime":745.36,"body":"What happens like once you get up the ladder and you're talking to the ship's captain, do you sort of take over?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":745.36,"endTime":745.55,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":745.55,"endTime":746.42,"body":"Is that awkward?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":746.42,"endTime":746.67,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":746.67,"endTime":749.26,"body":"Is the captain miffed that you're one-upping them?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":749.26,"endTime":749.4,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":749.4,"endTime":751.04,"body":"Or like what happens in that interaction?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":752.1,"endTime":753.5,"body":"Yes, yes, and yes."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":753.5,"endTime":755.02,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":755.02,"endTime":756.16,"body":"It can be awkward."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":756.16,"endTime":756.49,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":756.49,"endTime":757.96,"body":"You get on the deck of the ship."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":757.96,"endTime":758.32,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":758.32,"endTime":761.06,"body":"Now you're on the main deck after you've climbed on board."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":761.06,"endTime":761.36,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":761.36,"endTime":764.12,"body":"Now you walk to the house of the ship."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":764.12,"endTime":764.21,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":764.21,"endTime":767.34,"body":"That would be the living quarters and the offices."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":767.34,"endTime":767.72,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":767.72,"endTime":770.22,"body":"It might, in most ships, it's on the stern."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":770.22,"endTime":770.98,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":770.98,"endTime":772.68,"body":"Now, that might be eight floors."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":772.68,"endTime":773.16,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":773.16,"endTime":779.58,"body":"So now you go into the house and you go up eight decks, eight floors, and you arrive on the bridge of the ship."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":779.58,"endTime":780.1,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":780.1,"endTime":790.2,"body":"Now, in Long Beach, we really emphasize, please be cognizant, that as a pilot, it's the master's ship."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":790.2,"endTime":790.74,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":790.74,"endTime":791.8,"body":"It's not your ship."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":791.8,"endTime":792.1,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":792.1,"endTime":794.58,"body":"You are the invited guest."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":794.58,"endTime":794.9,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":794.9,"endTime":796.38,"body":"You're walking onto a ship."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":796.38,"endTime":796.54,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":796.54,"endTime":799.04,"body":"It's a different culture, possibly a different language."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":799.04,"endTime":799.86,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":799.86,"endTime":805.0,"body":"And we need the captain's trust, and the captain needs to trust us."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":805.0,"endTime":805.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":805.48,"endTime":809.62,"body":"And if there's something wrong, and when I get on the bridge of the ship, Dan,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":809.62,"endTime":809.67,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":809.67,"endTime":812.12,"body":"I say, Captain Dan, welcome to the port of Long Beach."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":812.12,"endTime":812.78,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":812.78,"endTime":814.16,"body":"My name's Captain Livingstone."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":814.16,"endTime":814.78,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":814.78,"endTime":818.74,"body":"We're going to be taking you into berth 245 today."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":818.74,"endTime":818.96,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":818.96,"endTime":820.48,"body":"Our orders are port side two."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":820.48,"endTime":820.61,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":820.61,"endTime":821.2,"body":"Is that correct?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":821.2,"endTime":821.68,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":821.68,"endTime":822.62,"body":"Captain says, yes."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":822.62,"endTime":822.74,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":822.74,"endTime":824.5,"body":"I say, Captain, is there any discrepancies?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":824.5,"endTime":825.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":825.06,"endTime":830.12,"body":"Is there anything wrong that isn't working that would affect the maneuvering of the ship?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":830.12,"endTime":830.64,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":830.64,"endTime":835.56,"body":"And the captain will go through a pilot master exchange with me, and it's on paper, and it's"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":835.56,"endTime":835.72,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":835.72,"endTime":837.32,"body":"all now documented, right?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":837.32,"endTime":837.56,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":837.56,"endTime":838.46,"body":"Everything is liability."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":838.46,"endTime":838.97,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":838.97,"endTime":843.36,"body":"And the captain will say, no, the rudders are working, the bow thruster's working, the"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":843.36,"endTime":843.62,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":843.62,"endTime":847.36,"body":"main engine is working, everything is working as far as we know."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":847.36,"endTime":847.45,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":847.45,"endTime":851.7,"body":"And then I'll say, okay, Captain, in about 20 minutes when we get close to the port,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":851.7,"endTime":851.88,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":851.88,"endTime":860.82,"body":"We're going to have tugboats standing by, and I need you to put one tug on the port bow, take one tug line, one tug line on the starboard bow, one tug line center lead aft."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":860.82,"endTime":861.32,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":861.32,"endTime":863.92,"body":"And that's just in the first five"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":863.92,"endTime":863.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":863.92,"endTime":864.34,"body":"minutes."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":865.54,"endTime":868.14,"body":"Most of the time, things go smoothly from there."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":868.14,"endTime":868.64,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":868.64,"endTime":871.64,"body":"Grant would pilot the ship through the harbor and to the port."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":871.64,"endTime":872.12,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":872.12,"endTime":874.32,"body":"But then he's got to dock it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":874.32,"endTime":875.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":875.0,"endTime":880.7,"body":"And imagine trying to parallel park a car that's the length of 90 cars."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":880.7,"endTime":881.1,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":881.1,"endTime":884.76,"body":"And now imagine that car is a boat and it's on water."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":884.76,"endTime":885.5,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":885.5,"endTime":888.08,"body":"The tolerance for mistakes here is low."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":888.58,"endTime":892.86,"body":"When I was in the training program, the senior pilots would tell me,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":892.86,"endTime":893.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":893.92,"endTime":898.94,"body":"don't forget, you can crash in the last ship length and ruin the whole job."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":898.94,"endTime":900.24,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":900.24,"endTime":905.64,"body":"You see it on cruise ships a lot when they're docking or big oil tankers docking."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":905.64,"endTime":906.56,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":906.56,"endTime":910.58,"body":"They're doing a quarter of a knot, but then they hit the end of the dock."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":910.58,"endTime":911.12,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":911.12,"endTime":913.68,"body":"So you're doing half a mile per hour."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":913.68,"endTime":914.01,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":914.01,"endTime":916.48,"body":"You're barely moving, but you're not stopped."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":916.48,"endTime":917.16,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":917.16,"endTime":920.6,"body":"And you're on a ship that weighs 120,000 tons."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":920.6,"endTime":921.34,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":921.34,"endTime":929.3,"body":"And so if you've got 120,000 tons moving at half a mile per hour and it collides with a dock or rocks,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":929.3,"endTime":930.1,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":930.1,"endTime":933.78,"body":"even though it's only half a mile an hour, there's going to be a lot of damage done."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":934.8,"endTime":939.1,"body":"Grant had at least one close call that could have ended in disaster."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":939.1,"endTime":939.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":939.92,"endTime":943.82,"body":"Remember a few minutes ago when Grant said almost drowning after falling off a ladder"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":943.82,"endTime":944.02,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":944.02,"endTime":945.32,"body":"cost him minor panic?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":945.32,"endTime":946.26,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":946.26,"endTime":949.6,"body":"Now we're going to find out what major panic looks like."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":949.96,"endTime":957.18,"body":"I was bringing in a 1,200-foot, it happened to be an Italian flag oil tanker."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":957.18,"endTime":957.52,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":957.52,"endTime":960.8,"body":"And this was just after three years of piloting."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":960.8,"endTime":961.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":961.0,"endTime":964.66,"body":"So in my three-year training program, I had done 3,000 ships."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":964.66,"endTime":964.98,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":964.98,"endTime":966.96,"body":"Now that's a high number in three years."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":966.96,"endTime":967.46,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":967.46,"endTime":969.28,"body":"So I was well prepared."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":969.28,"endTime":969.38,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":969.38,"endTime":971.3,"body":"we're bringing the ship in"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":971.3,"endTime":971.78,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":971.78,"endTime":973.2,"body":"we're approaching the breakwater"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":973.2,"endTime":973.78,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":973.78,"endTime":975.84,"body":"once we get inside the breakwater"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":975.84,"endTime":976.12,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":976.12,"endTime":978.2,"body":"we have to make a 90 degree turn"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":978.2,"endTime":978.72,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":978.72,"endTime":979.34,"body":"to the right"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":979.34,"endTime":980.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":980.0,"endTime":982.38,"body":"I have to pass between"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":982.38,"endTime":983.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":983.48,"endTime":984.92,"body":"two ships that are anchored"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":985.28,"endTime":988.1,"body":"But just as they're starting to make the turn"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":988.1,"endTime":988.16,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":988.16,"endTime":990.12,"body":"to go between those two anchored ships"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":990.12,"endTime":990.38,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":990.38,"endTime":991.72,"body":"fog rolls in"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":991.72,"endTime":992.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":992.48,"endTime":994.5,"body":"And now I can just"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":994.5,"endTime":996.08,"body":"see past the bow of the ship"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":996.08,"endTime":996.64,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":996.64,"endTime":999.34,"body":"and I had just initiated"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":999.34,"endTime":999.36,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":999.36,"endTime":1001.3,"body":"a slow turn to starboard."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1001.3,"endTime":1001.46,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1001.46,"endTime":1002.42,"body":"Those ships were"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1002.42,"endTime":1002.42,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1002.42,"endTime":1005.44,"body":"still well on my right side. And the captain looks at"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1005.44,"endTime":1005.44,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1005.44,"endTime":1013.2,"body":"me and says, why don't we stop here? And we'll just wait. And we'll see if we get better visibility."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1013.2,"endTime":1013.76,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1013.76,"endTime":1018.26,"body":"And when we can see, we'll pass between the two ships that are anchored. I said, good idea,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1018.26,"endTime":1018.44,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1018.44,"endTime":1023.68,"body":"captain. So I said, stop the engine. And the officer on the bridge stops the engine. And I said,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1023.68,"endTime":1024.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1024.06,"endTime":1028.78,"body":"slow astern. And we put the engine slow astern and nothing happened."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1029.98,"endTime":1036.5,"body":"Slow astern is a command to put the ship's engine in reverse at around 25 percent power so basically"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1036.5,"endTime":1036.74,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1036.74,"endTime":1041.54,"body":"they're trying to slow down to avoid the two anchored ships that they're facing at this point"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1042.459,"endTime":1050.88,"body":"And i say okay half astern. Nothing. And then the phone rings and the italian captain picks up the"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1050.88,"endTime":1051.04,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1051.04,"endTime":1056.86,"body":"phone and he starts yelling in italian into the phone. it's the chief engineer. The chief engineer"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1056.86,"endTime":1056.88,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1056.88,"endTime":1066.1,"body":"tells him we lost the engine. And I look at the captain, and he knows that we're slowly turning"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1066.1,"endTime":1066.44,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1066.44,"endTime":1072.36,"body":"to one of those anchored ships, and we have to stop now. And I said, okay, Captain, no problem."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1072.36,"endTime":1073.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1073.0,"endTime":1077.92,"body":"Let the starboard anchor go. Both anchors are ready for an emergency. We were going to use"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1077.92,"endTime":1077.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1077.92,"endTime":1084.1,"body":"the starboard anchor to anchor the ship. We were doing about three knots. Not ideal to let the"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1084.1,"endTime":1084.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1084.06,"endTime":1090.58,"body":"anchor go on a 1,200-foot ship doing three knots, but in this case, with no engine, we better let"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1090.58,"endTime":1090.68,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1090.68,"endTime":1097.18,"body":"that anchor go. And he said, that's right, Mr. Pilot, okay. And he calls the chief mate on the bow,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1097.18,"endTime":1097.18,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1097.18,"endTime":1102.04,"body":"and he says, let go of the starboard anchor. The starboard anchor won't let go. Now, that's not"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1102.04,"endTime":1102.34,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1102.34,"endTime":1108.72,"body":"terribly unusual. Sometimes the anchors, after being at sea, they're on the bow, they've got all"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1108.72,"endTime":1108.66,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1108.66,"endTime":1114.68,"body":"that salt water, they get rust, the brakes get stuck. He started to panic again, and I said,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1114.68,"endTime":1114.82,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1114.82,"endTime":1119.72,"body":"Captain, Captain, it's okay, let go the port anchor. We've got another anchor, let it go."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1119.72,"endTime":1120.38,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1120.38,"endTime":1126.38,"body":"He gives the command to the bow, let go the port anchor. The port anchor will not drop."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1126.38,"endTime":1127.46,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1127.46,"endTime":1128.92,"body":"Now that is unusual."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1129.78,"endTime":1134.78,"body":"And this whole time, you're kind of drifting toward one or the other of those,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1134.78,"endTime":1134.86,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1134.86,"endTime":1139.02,"body":"and you can't even see where you're going or how much room you have left?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1139.44,"endTime":1140.04,"body":"Not yet."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1140.04,"endTime":1140.94,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1140.94,"endTime":1147.3,"body":"And just about at that point, I look up, and just coming out of the fog,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1147.3,"endTime":1147.3,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1147.3,"endTime":1149.66,"body":"I could see the port side of the anchored ship,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1149.66,"endTime":1149.87,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1149.87,"endTime":1154.94,"body":"and we were headed dead midship on that ship at nearly a 90-degree angle."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1155.01,"endTime":1155.78,"body":"Oh, man."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1155.78,"endTime":1156.23,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1156.23,"endTime":1158.28,"body":"And you can't stop. You don't have any anchors."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1158.62,"endTime":1159.32,"body":"You can't stop."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1159.32,"endTime":1159.88,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1159.88,"endTime":1162.94,"body":"We told the captain, I said, blow the danger signal"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1162.94,"endTime":1162.96,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1162.96,"endTime":1166.44,"body":"so that we alert the ship at anchor, there could be a collision,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1166.44,"endTime":1167.3,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1167.3,"endTime":1173.96,"body":"the danger signal in international waters is five blasts on the ship's whistle."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1173.96,"endTime":1174.96,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1174.96,"endTime":1179.9,"body":"Any mariner at sea, when they hear five blasts on a ship whistle,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1179.9,"endTime":1180.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1180.48,"endTime":1181.44,"body":"you're going to get their attention."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1181.44,"endTime":1182.02,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1182.02,"endTime":1186.04,"body":"If we hit that ship, Dan, with a half-loaded oil tanker,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1186.04,"endTime":1186.1,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1186.1,"endTime":1190.28,"body":"in those days there was no inert gas in the cargo tank."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1190.28,"endTime":1190.4,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1190.4,"endTime":1194.44,"body":"So it was half crude oil and half crude oil fumes."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1194.44,"endTime":1195.26,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1195.26,"endTime":1198.64,"body":"And there were about nine huge tanks."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1198.64,"endTime":1199.6,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1199.6,"endTime":1211.36,"body":"And so if we hit that ship, very likely the spark, if you had encroached on one of the tanks, very likely you would get a massive explosion."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1211.36,"endTime":1211.94,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1211.94,"endTime":1214.62,"body":"And there's going to be a lot of people dead."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1215.38,"endTime":1216.88,"body":"And this ship, I mean, just"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1216.88,"endTime":1216.88,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1216.88,"endTime":1220.9,"body":"to linger here is just, I mean, this is a 1,200 foot ship."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1220.9,"endTime":1221.08,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1221.08,"endTime":1224.08,"body":"That's like the size of the Empire State Building."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1224.08,"endTime":1224.28,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1224.28,"endTime":1226.6,"body":"That's like as long as the Empire State Building is tall."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1226.6,"endTime":1227.22,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1227.22,"endTime":1231.1,"body":"And you're trying to stop or correct the movement of that thing without any anchors"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1231.1,"endTime":1231.1,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1231.1,"endTime":1232.26,"body":"and without any engines."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1233.1,"endTime":1234.3,"body":"And without panic."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1234.3,"endTime":1234.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1234.92,"endTime":1238.26,"body":"And, you know, you're talking about almost four football fields."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1238.26,"endTime":1239.42,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1239.42,"endTime":1241.26,"body":"You had to be panicked at this point."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1241.26,"endTime":1241.58,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1241.58,"endTime":1242.76,"body":"I started to panic."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1242.76,"endTime":1243.3,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1243.3,"endTime":1246.7,"body":"Everybody on the bridge of the ship is now yelling in Italian at each other."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1246.7,"endTime":1247.2,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1247.2,"endTime":1256.16,"body":"And I could feel a wave coming from my feet like cold water was rising up from my ankles to my knees."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1256.16,"endTime":1256.78,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1256.78,"endTime":1262.46,"body":"And so I recognized I was starting to panic and I couldn't see any solutions."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1262.46,"endTime":1262.94,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1262.94,"endTime":1271.36,"body":"I could only see headlines, massive tanker collides, massive explosion off downtown Long Beach and damage and deaths."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1272.2,"endTime":1278.54,"body":"Grant knew he needed to calm down. He turned away from the chaos on the bridge and closed his eyes."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1278.54,"endTime":1279.14,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1279.14,"endTime":1284.14,"body":"He remembered breathing exercises that Navy SEALs used called box breathing."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1285.06,"endTime":1287.72,"body":"And when I turned my back and"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1287.72,"endTime":1287.72,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1287.72,"endTime":1293.06,"body":"looked down, closed my eyes, and I did the four deep breaths, deep exhales,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1293.06,"endTime":1294.2,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1294.2,"endTime":1301.04,"body":"I promised myself when I turned back and looked over the bow, I would do the first thing that came to mind."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1301.04,"endTime":1302.32,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1302.32,"endTime":1327.58,"body":"Now I've stopped the panic. I've slowed my breathing. I've slowed my heart rate. I turned back around. I looked over the bow of the ship. Now we're very close to the other ship. I looked up and the rudder was still hard right. So the engine's not running. The rudder is still hard right. And it occurred to me, try putting the engine ahead."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1328.36,"endTime":1333.22,"body":"So remember, Grant had tried putting the engine in reverse, but it didn't work."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1333.22,"endTime":1333.73,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1333.73,"endTime":1338.12,"body":"And his epiphany here is that he could try putting the engine ahead."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1338.12,"endTime":1338.5,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1338.5,"endTime":1343.52,"body":"It's sort of the same logic as that old thing where if your stick shift car doesn't start,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1343.52,"endTime":1344.02,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1344.02,"endTime":1347.38,"body":"you get some buddies to push and get it rolling before you try again."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1347.38,"endTime":1348.3,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1348.3,"endTime":1350.98,"body":"Grant had realized that the forward movement of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1350.98,"endTime":1350.98,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1350.98,"endTime":1354.1,"body":"the ship might allow him to start the engine."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1354.98,"endTime":1359.14,"body":"And when the mate put the engine on half a head, the engine started."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1359.92,"endTime":1363.68,"body":"But wouldn't that just make you go faster toward the ship?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1363.68,"endTime":1363.78,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1363.78,"endTime":1364.86,"body":"I don't think I understand yet."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1365.18,"endTime":1368.14,"body":"It would increase the movement ahead."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1368.14,"endTime":1368.54,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1368.54,"endTime":1374.62,"body":"But with the rudder hard right, I put this massive right swing on the ship."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1374.62,"endTime":1375.32,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1375.32,"endTime":1381.36,"body":"And when it started to swing, because the rudder's hard right, I asked them for full ahead."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1381.36,"endTime":1382.4,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1382.4,"endTime":1389.98,"body":"And when I put that engine on from half to full ahead, it increased the rate of turn to almost 30 degrees per minute."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1389.98,"endTime":1390.74,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1390.74,"endTime":1394.72,"body":"And it increased the rate of turn because we were only doing three knots."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1394.72,"endTime":1395.56,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1395.56,"endTime":1401.76,"body":"So that's like you're in your car and you're doing about three or four miles an hour."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1401.76,"endTime":1402.14,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1402.14,"endTime":1404.96,"body":"And you put your wheel hard left and you hit the accelerator."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1404.96,"endTime":1405.44,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1405.44,"endTime":1407.94,"body":"And the rear end just spins right out, right?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1407.94,"endTime":1408.52,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1408.52,"endTime":1409.46,"body":"That's exactly"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1409.46,"endTime":1409.46,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1409.46,"endTime":1410.6,"body":"what happens with a ship."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1410.6,"endTime":1411.3,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1411.3,"endTime":1418.9,"body":"I got the rate of turn going so quickly, we were now parallel to the"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1418.9,"endTime":1418.9,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1418.9,"endTime":1419.5,"body":"other ship."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1419.5,"endTime":1420.44,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1420.44,"endTime":1422.6,"body":"Our bow was at their stern."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1422.6,"endTime":1423.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1423.48,"endTime":1425.0,"body":"Our stern was at their bow."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1425.0,"endTime":1426.02,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1426.02,"endTime":1428.78,"body":"But now the bow is going to clear."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1428.78,"endTime":1429.21,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1429.21,"endTime":1432.38,"body":"But now I've got the rudder hard right, full ahead."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1432.38,"endTime":1432.61,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1432.61,"endTime":1437.7,"body":"And now our stern is going to slam into the port side of that ship."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1437.7,"endTime":1438.36,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1438.36,"endTime":1443.8,"body":"And I realized it's still going to be a collision and a bad one."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1443.8,"endTime":1444.72,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1444.72,"endTime":1446.6,"body":"Not as bad as head on."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1446.6,"endTime":1447.36,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1447.36,"endTime":1453.24,"body":"I told the quartermaster on the wheel, I said, shift your rudder hard left."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1453.24,"endTime":1453.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1453.92,"endTime":1455.26,"body":"I left the engines full ahead."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1455.26,"endTime":1456.18,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1456.18,"endTime":1466.26,"body":"And just before our stern hit the side of that ship, the hard left rudder stopped the stern and started lifting us away."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1467.34,"endTime":1469.9,"body":"So Grant's ship basically fishtailed,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1469.9,"endTime":1470.64,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1470.64,"endTime":1472.68,"body":"just missing the other ship."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1472.68,"endTime":1473.56,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1473.56,"endTime":1478.66,"body":"In fact, it was so close that the pilot station that was watching this whole thing on radar"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1478.66,"endTime":1479.58,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1479.58,"endTime":1480.76,"body":"actually thought they'd collided."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1481.32,"endTime":1486.28,"body":"And the vice president at the time, Captain Graham, called me on the radio and said,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1486.28,"endTime":1486.96,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1486.96,"endTime":1492.5,"body":"Grant, we've notified the emergency services and the Coast Guard about the collision."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1492.5,"endTime":1493.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1493.06,"endTime":1498.28,"body":"On the radar, Dan, at the pilot station, the two images had merged."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1498.28,"endTime":1498.58,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1498.58,"endTime":1503.22,"body":"We were about 40 feet and parallel off the other anchored ship."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1503.32,"endTime":1504.22,"body":"40 feet."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1504.88,"endTime":1509.5,"body":"I know that because there was a tugboat tied to my port bow,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1509.5,"endTime":1509.66,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1509.66,"endTime":1514.0,"body":"and there was just enough space for that tugboat not to get crushed."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1514.0,"endTime":1514.9,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1514.9,"endTime":1521.84,"body":"And when I called the pilot station and I said, Captain Graham, we did not hit."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1521.84,"endTime":1522.22,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1522.22,"endTime":1523.12,"body":"There was no collision."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1523.12,"endTime":1523.29,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1523.29,"endTime":1524.0,"body":"He called me."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1524.0,"endTime":1524.17,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1524.17,"endTime":1526.66,"body":"He said, no collision."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1526.66,"endTime":1526.97,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1526.97,"endTime":1531.18,"body":"And I said, no, you can cancel the emergency services."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1531.18,"endTime":1531.57,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1531.57,"endTime":1532.6,"body":"We did not collide."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1532.6,"endTime":1539.18,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1539.18,"endTime":1543.04,"body":"And that one was three years into my career."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1543.04,"endTime":1543.25,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1543.25,"endTime":1549.74,"body":"And that made me reconsider how I handled emergencies and what kind of training I should have."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1549.74,"endTime":1550.28,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1550.28,"endTime":1552.0,"body":"And the pilot station as well."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1552.0,"endTime":1552.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1552.06,"endTime":1561.68,"body":"We all looked at that and said, okay, we need to up our emergency training to deal with panic, to deal with these kinds of extreme cases."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1562.98,"endTime":1566.06,"body":"Walk us through the daily rhythms of the job."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1566.06,"endTime":1566.17,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1566.17,"endTime":1571.68,"body":"Like on a given day, how many hours are you working and how many ships will you dock and so forth?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1572.66,"endTime":1575.48,"body":"It varies from port to port around the world."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1575.48,"endTime":1575.71,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1575.71,"endTime":1579.7,"body":"And so in Long Beach, we work a seven-day shift."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1579.7,"endTime":1580.18,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1580.18,"endTime":1584.82,"body":"So we're on duty, on call for seven days, and then we have seven days off."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1585.42,"endTime":1585.92,"body":"Wait, but does that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1585.92,"endTime":1585.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1585.92,"endTime":1588.16,"body":"mean you're on site for seven days?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1588.16,"endTime":1588.22,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1588.22,"endTime":1590.04,"body":"Like you're sleeping in a back room or something?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1590.58,"endTime":1595.88,"body":"If you're working, so you're going to think you guys are so spoiled."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1595.88,"endTime":1596.82,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1596.82,"endTime":1600.42,"body":"We are at home on our seven days on duty."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1600.42,"endTime":1600.76,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1600.76,"endTime":1602.18,"body":"We're at home until they need us."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1602.18,"endTime":1602.68,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1602.68,"endTime":1603.26,"body":"But we have"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1603.26,"endTime":1603.26,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1603.26,"endTime":1604.66,"body":"to be able to answer the phone."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1604.66,"endTime":1604.74,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1604.74,"endTime":1610.62,"body":"We're like, you know, and we've got a pilot station that's very much like a fire station."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1610.62,"endTime":1610.88,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1610.88,"endTime":1611.82,"body":"We've got bunk rooms."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1611.82,"endTime":1612.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1612.06,"endTime":1612.7,"body":"We've got a lounge."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1612.7,"endTime":1612.96,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1612.96,"endTime":1613.64,"body":"We've got a galley."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1613.64,"endTime":1614.24,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1614.24,"endTime":1619.22,"body":"And when you are working, when you do get called down, quite often you're staying at the station."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1619.22,"endTime":1619.98,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1619.98,"endTime":1620.5,"body":"And"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1620.5,"endTime":1620.5,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1620.5,"endTime":1623.62,"body":"especially if you know that you're going to do another job."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1623.62,"endTime":1623.96,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1623.96,"endTime":1626.52,"body":"And so you've got seven pilots."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1626.52,"endTime":1627.4,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1627.4,"endTime":1632.82,"body":"They're on a rotating basis where the number one pilot is going to do five ships."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1632.82,"endTime":1633.12,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1633.12,"endTime":1636.68,"body":"And then they get at least 12 hours off, and it's usually 24."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1636.68,"endTime":1637.38,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1637.38,"endTime":1640.66,"body":"But it's a similar kind of a rotation wherever you go."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1640.66,"endTime":1640.8,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1640.8,"endTime":1644.98,"body":"You've got X number of pilots, the number one pilot on the list."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1644.98,"endTime":1645.54,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1645.54,"endTime":1650.86,"body":"They're out there working, and they're not going to stop working until they do X number of ships"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1650.86,"endTime":1651.16,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1651.16,"endTime":1653.34,"body":"or they reach X number of hours."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1653.34,"endTime":1653.68,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1653.68,"endTime":1655.22,"body":"14 hours is the limit."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1655.22,"endTime":1655.82,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1655.82,"endTime":1658.06,"body":"We're under the same federal guidelines."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1658.06,"endTime":1658.62,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1658.62,"endTime":1659.8,"body":"We're a federal pilot service."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1659.8,"endTime":1660.34,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1660.34,"endTime":1662.86,"body":"We're under the same guidelines as airline pilots."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1663.84,"endTime":1668.22,"body":"And kind of a routine docking might take what, two or three hours?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1668.78,"endTime":1669.1,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1669.1,"endTime":1670.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1670.0,"endTime":1671.28,"body":"And it depends on where you are."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1671.28,"endTime":1671.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1671.92,"endTime":1678.04,"body":"So if you're on a long river transit, Mississippi River, Houston Ship Canal, San Francisco, going"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1678.04,"endTime":1678.16,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1678.16,"endTime":1684.6,"body":"in the San Francisco Bay, going up into the Benicia and up into towards Sacramento, that"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1684.6,"endTime":1684.84,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1684.84,"endTime":1686.6,"body":"might be eight hours, 10 hours."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1686.6,"endTime":1687.66,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1687.66,"endTime":1692.94,"body":"And very similar on the Mississippi River, very similar in the Houston Ship Canal in"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1692.94,"endTime":1692.96,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1692.96,"endTime":1699.36,"body":"Texas, or it could be just a short transit docking the ship. But I'm going to, let's just call it"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1699.36,"endTime":1699.47,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1699.47,"endTime":1702.7,"body":"three hours on average if you take everything into account."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1703.94,"endTime":1706.94,"body":"So Grant, we always end our episodes with"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1706.94,"endTime":1706.94,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1706.94,"endTime":1714.1,"body":"a quick lightning round of questions. Here we go. What is a word or phrase that only someone from"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1714.1,"endTime":1714.11,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1714.11,"endTime":1716.94,"body":"your profession will be likely to know? And what does it mean?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1717.86,"endTime":1722.92,"body":"Securite, securite, securite. And that is a call,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1722.92,"endTime":1723.28,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1723.28,"endTime":1729.7,"body":"a broadcast on a VHF radio. Every ship and every shore side business that deals with ships"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1729.7,"endTime":1730.18,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1730.18,"endTime":1737.22,"body":"has VHF radios. And when a ship is coming into a port or when a ship is moving,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1737.22,"endTime":1738.04,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1738.04,"endTime":1746.02,"body":"the proper terminology is securite, securite, securite. This is the Maersk Gartner. We are"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1746.02,"endTime":1746.2,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1746.2,"endTime":1752.1,"body":"getting underway from berth 134. We'll be outbound for sea. And securite, securite,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1752.1,"endTime":1752.38,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1752.38,"endTime":1761.56,"body":"Securite means important marine broadcast, and it's related directly in degrees, which most of your listeners will know."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1761.56,"endTime":1762.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1762.0,"endTime":1765.94,"body":"It's related directly to Mayday, Mayday, Mayday."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1765.94,"endTime":1766.78,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1766.78,"endTime":1773.86,"body":"And Mayday, repeated three times, means emergency broadcast to follow."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1773.86,"endTime":1774.01,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1774.01,"endTime":1781.6,"body":"So if my ship is sinking or I've had a collision, I get on the radio, I broadcast to all listeners, Mayday, Mayday, Mayday."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1781.6,"endTime":1782.1,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1782.1,"endTime":1786.26,"body":"Anybody on a bridge of a ship or a tugboat or a boat that hears mayday, mayday, mayday,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1786.26,"endTime":1786.76,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1786.76,"endTime":1789.34,"body":"they know that's an emergency broadcast."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1789.34,"endTime":1789.71,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1789.71,"endTime":1790.74,"body":"So now they're going to listen."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1790.74,"endTime":1791.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1791.48,"endTime":1794.24,"body":"When I say securite, securite, securite,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1794.24,"endTime":1795.11,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1795.11,"endTime":1800.14,"body":"they, anyone listening on any other ship, tugboat or boat in the harbor knows"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1800.14,"endTime":1800.7,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1800.7,"endTime":1803.86,"body":"it's an important marine movement broadcast."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1803.86,"endTime":1804.22,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1804.22,"endTime":1807.8,"body":"They're going to expect to hear about the movement of a ship."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1809.06,"endTime":1812.96,"body":"What is the most insulting thing you could say about a harbor pilot's work?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1813.44,"endTime":1817.64,"body":"So we should do such a good job that we make it look easy."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1817.64,"endTime":1818.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1818.48,"endTime":1824.84,"body":"When I do a really difficult job and I've used all of the skills and the experience I've had"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1824.84,"endTime":1825.22,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1825.22,"endTime":1831.0,"body":"and it goes absolutely smoothly and when I get done,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1831.0,"endTime":1831.14,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1831.14,"endTime":1836.56,"body":"now I've gathered up all of my experience and I'm so proud of myself."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1836.56,"endTime":1837.34,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1837.34,"endTime":1841.34,"body":"I made it look easy and the captain looks at you and says, well, that was easy."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1841.34,"endTime":1843.22,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1843.22,"endTime":1846.54,"body":"That's when you go, no, it wasn't."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1846.54,"endTime":1846.81,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1846.81,"endTime":1849.42,"body":"And you're not going to say, at least I don't."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1849.42,"endTime":1849.51,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1849.51,"endTime":1850.56,"body":"I don't say, easy."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1850.56,"endTime":1851.5,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1851.5,"endTime":1852.58,"body":"Captain, what's the matter with you?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1852.58,"endTime":1853.06,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1853.06,"endTime":1855.46,"body":"That's the hardest darn job I've had in six months."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1855.46,"endTime":1856.46,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1856.46,"endTime":1863.54,"body":"That's the, it's when you do your job so well that people say, well, that was easy."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1863.54,"endTime":1863.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1863.92,"endTime":1865.36,"body":"You got an easy job."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1866.1,"endTime":1869.9,"body":"What is an aspect of your work that you consistently savor?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1870.58,"endTime":1872.84,"body":"I am a sunset fanatic."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1872.84,"endTime":1873.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1873.48,"endTime":1880.16,"body":"A ship at sea with the sun going down, when that sun goes down that day, it'll never happen again."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1880.16,"endTime":1880.48,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1880.48,"endTime":1881.54,"body":"It's a singular event."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1881.54,"endTime":1882.56,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1882.56,"endTime":1885.14,"body":"And each sunset is unique."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1885.14,"endTime":1886.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1886.0,"endTime":1891.62,"body":"And there is a sense of beauty and peace for me."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1891.62,"endTime":1892.42,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1892.42,"endTime":1899.42,"body":"I will catch every sunset I can on the bridge of a ship. If I'm moving a ship and the sun's going"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1899.42,"endTime":1899.64,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1899.64,"endTime":1907.66,"body":"down and I'm not docking that ship or undocking it, I take a few moments, like a zen moment for me,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1907.66,"endTime":1908.08,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1908.08,"endTime":1913.54,"body":"to go out and quietly watch that sun just as it dips under the horizon."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1914.72,"endTime":1919.0,"body":"What do you think it was about you that fit this work so well?"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1920.42,"endTime":1921.16,"body":"I think"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1921.16,"endTime":1921.16,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1921.16,"endTime":1939.1,"body":"it's the artistic ship handling. When you hit that artistic level, that sense of satisfaction, I can't stop coming back for it. It can be routine and it can be paint by number and it can be step by step."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1939.1,"endTime":1939.2,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1939.2,"endTime":1942.0,"body":"and there's many times where that's exactly what's required,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1942.0,"endTime":1942.38,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1942.38,"endTime":1944.06,"body":"but there's other times, Dan,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1944.06,"endTime":1944.44,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1944.44,"endTime":1948.1,"body":"where it can become an artistic movement"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1948.1,"endTime":1948.58,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1948.58,"endTime":1952.42,"body":"of this massive object floating on the water."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1952.42,"endTime":1952.9,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1952.9,"endTime":1954.94,"body":"And when you get that right"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1954.94,"endTime":1955.6,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1955.6,"endTime":1959.36,"body":"and you realize the movement of the ship"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1959.36,"endTime":1959.64,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1959.64,"endTime":1960.78,"body":"was flat out artistic,"},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1960.78,"endTime":1961.76,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1961.76,"endTime":1964.24,"body":"I would keep coming back for that, obviously."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1964.24,"endTime":1964.7,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1964.7,"endTime":1966.86,"body":"I came back for that 16,000 times."},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1966.86,"endTime":1966.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Grant","startTime":1966.92,"endTime":1968.04,"body":"I didn't get tired of it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1974.96,"endTime":1978.02,"body":"Grant Livingstone is a retired harbor pilot."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1978.02,"endTime":1978.62,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1978.62,"endTime":1981.78,"body":"He spent 34 years at the port of Long Beach in California."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1981.78,"endTime":1982.66,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1982.66,"endTime":1987.18,"body":"He recently published a book called Shiphandling, the Beautiful Game"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1987.18,"endTime":1987.46,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1987.46,"endTime":1990.68,"body":"with his twin brother, Captain George Livingstone."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1990.68,"endTime":1992.02,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1992.02,"endTime":1994.14,"body":"Okay, the rope ladder."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1994.14,"endTime":1994.44,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1994.44,"endTime":1996.84,"body":"We have to talk about the rope ladder."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1996.84,"endTime":1997.54,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1997.54,"endTime":2004.08,"body":"First of all, lest you think that harbor piloting is some kind of archaic anti-technology profession, no."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2004.08,"endTime":2004.98,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2004.98,"endTime":2009.3,"body":"Grant told me about this portable piloting unit, the PPU that he uses,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2009.3,"endTime":2010.16,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2010.16,"endTime":2015.94,"body":"which is sort of like a fancy laptop that maps the progress of your ship through the port in real time."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2015.94,"endTime":2016.44,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2016.44,"endTime":2019.9,"body":"It's showing you your location from overhead with a half meter accuracy"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2019.9,"endTime":2020.41,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2020.41,"endTime":2024.26,"body":"and projecting out where you'll be in two or three or six or nine minutes."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2024.26,"endTime":2024.98,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2024.98,"endTime":2028.14,"body":"So, no, this job is full of fancy tech."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2028.14,"endTime":2029.04,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2029.04,"endTime":2032.1,"body":"But the best tool for the job isn't always the newest."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2032.1,"endTime":2033.04,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2033.04,"endTime":2034.58,"body":"Thus, the rope ladder."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2034.58,"endTime":2035.78,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2035.78,"endTime":2041.08,"body":"Isn't it reassuring in a weird way that, in a world of AI and drones and automation,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2041.08,"endTime":2041.56,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2041.56,"endTime":2046.12,"body":"that global commerce still hinges on a bunch of humans climbing ladders,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2046.12,"endTime":2047.579,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2047.579,"endTime":2049.84,"body":"navigating the perils of ports,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2049.84,"endTime":2050.54,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2050.54,"endTime":2053.3,"body":"coordinating with ship captains who've come from all over the world,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2053.3,"endTime":2054.0,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2054.0,"endTime":2060.8,"body":"preparing for emergencies, and yes, carefully scaling rope ladders to take temporary command"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2060.8,"endTime":2061.22,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2061.22,"endTime":2063.28,"body":"of hundreds of millions of dollars worth of cargo."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2063.28,"endTime":2064.12,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2064.12,"endTime":2068.2,"body":"Folks, that's what it's like to be a harbor pilot."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2068.2,"endTime":2070.56,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2070.56,"endTime":2074.78,"body":"By the way, this episode brought to mind two others that you might be interested in."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2074.78,"endTime":2075.179,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2075.179,"endTime":2080.32,"body":"If you want to hear more about the kinds of products that are loaded up on those container ships"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2080.32,"endTime":2080.32,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2080.32,"endTime":2084.76,"body":"that Grant is valet parking, check out the Toy Distributor episode."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2084.76,"endTime":2085.5,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2085.5,"endTime":2089.32,"body":"It's especially relevant in our newly tariff-centric world."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2089.32,"endTime":2090.28,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2090.28,"endTime":2096.34,"body":"And also we heard how harbor pilots need to have obsessive knowledge of their local ports,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2096.34,"endTime":2097.02,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2097.02,"endTime":2100.08,"body":"and that reminded me of the London cabbie episode"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2100.08,"endTime":2100.79,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2100.79,"endTime":2104.12,"body":"and the test that they have to pass to qualify for their role,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2104.12,"endTime":2104.43,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2104.43,"endTime":2109.1,"body":"which has been called the hardest exam of any kind in the world."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2109.1,"endTime":2109.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2109.92,"endTime":2110.48,"body":"Check it out."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2110.48,"endTime":2111.8,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2111.8,"endTime":2115.76,"body":"A shout out to recent Apple Podcast reviewers and Spotify commenters."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2115.76,"endTime":2115.96,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2115.96,"endTime":2116.46,"body":"Thank you all."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2116.46,"endTime":2116.88,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2116.88,"endTime":2121.72,"body":"Here's a recent one we enjoyed from Cuz Tumbleweed with the headline,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2121.72,"endTime":2122.1,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2122.1,"endTime":2123.62,"body":"The Best Gift to Our Family."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2123.62,"endTime":2124.46,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2124.46,"endTime":2124.78,"body":"They said,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2124.78,"endTime":2124.78,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2124.78,"endTime":2129.38,"body":"In a time when it's not always easy to engage in thoughtful conversation with my kids,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2129.38,"endTime":2129.88,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2129.88,"endTime":2132.32,"body":"this podcast provides the perfect opportunity."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2132.32,"endTime":2132.94,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2132.94,"endTime":2137.42,"body":"We eagerly await each episode to drop and hit pause many times throughout each interview"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2137.42,"endTime":2137.46,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2137.46,"endTime":2138.94,"body":"to chat about what we heard."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2138.94,"endTime":2139.54,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2139.54,"endTime":2146.08,"body":"The kids learn so much without realizing they're learning and love listening to a podcast that doesn't talk down to them."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2146.08,"endTime":2147.1,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2147.1,"endTime":2149.02,"body":"What it's like to be fills all of us up."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2149.02,"endTime":2149.36,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2149.36,"endTime":2154.04,"body":"And I often hear applause from the backseat as an episode wraps."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2154.04,"endTime":2154.66,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2154.66,"endTime":2156.18,"body":"That is beautiful. Thank you for that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2156.18,"endTime":2156.66,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2156.66,"endTime":2159.36,"body":"This episode was produced by Matt Purdy."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2159.36,"endTime":2159.92,"body":" "},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2159.92,"endTime":2161.82,"body":"I'm Dan Heath. See you next time."}]}