Pitch to Pro
Pitch to Pro is the official podcast of Ozark United FC. This will be our platform to tell our story about the club and the special place that we call home, Northwest Arkansas. This is a journey. We want to bring you along for the ride. We'll share what's going on behind the curtain, help educate the community at large about soccer, Our league, and give updates on the progress of the club along the way.
Together, we'll explore and unpack our journey to professional soccer, the magic that is NWA, our community, and talk all things soccer from on the pitch to behind the scenes, telling the story of our club.
Pitch to Pro
Ep. 37 - John Harkes: A U.S. Soccer Legend’s Journey - Part 1
Join us for a captivating conversation with US soccer legend John Harkes as we explore his incredible journey from the playgrounds of Kearny, New Jersey—affectionately known as "Soccer Town, USA"—to the world stage. Discover how the tight-knit community of Kearney, fueled by immigrant passion, played a pivotal role in shaping his career and the broader landscape of American soccer. From childhood games under the watchful eye of his father to the pressures and triumphs on the international field, John's story is one of dedication, community, and the power of a shared dream.
In an inspiring narrative, we also reflect on a pivotal lesson learned from the legendary coach Manny Schellscheidt, which reshaped our understanding of the game beyond mere scoring. This episode offers rich insights into the pathways from youth soccer to pro levels, illustrating the distinctions between collegiate success and international achievements. As we highlight career milestones, we emphasize the importance of community engagement and the cultural foundation within teams. Tune in to understand how balancing on-field success with meaningful off-field contributions can create a lasting legacy in the soccer world.
Pitch to Pro is the official podcast of Ozark United FC. This will be our platform to tell our story about the club and the special place that we call home, northwest Arkansas. This is a journey we want to bring you along for the ride. We'll share what's going on behind the curtain, help educate the community at large about soccer, our league, and give updates on the progress of the club along the way. Together, we'll explore and unpack our journey to professional soccer, the magic that is NWA, our community, and talk all things soccer from on the pitch to behind the scenes, telling the story of our club.
Speaker 2:Pitch to Pro Podcast is proudly sponsored by PodcastVideoscom. Podcastvideoscom is Northwest Arkansas' premier podcast recording studio, equipped with industry-leading equipment. The recording studio and services save you time, money and hassle. They are dedicated to helping you create, record and publish high-quality podcasts for your audience. Be sure to check them out today at podcastvideoscom. Hello everybody and welcome back to the Pitch to Pro podcast. I'm your host, wes Harris, managing Director for Ozark United FC, northwest Arkansas' professional soccer club, playing in the United Soccer League. Today I am super stoked about my guest, a US soccer legend, playing all over the world in all kinds of different competitions, leagues, teams that you guys know. Mr John Harkes, now technical director for the McLean Youth Soccer in Virginia. John, thank you so much, man, for joining me today. I can't wait to dive in.
Speaker 1:No, my pleasure. Wes Great to be on with you, Looking forward to our discussion on many, many, many platforms and then making sure that we get this wrapped up in time for us to watch the Liverpool top of the match.
Speaker 2:I know that's probably the most. I did wear the DC United jersey for you today.
Speaker 1:I love it that is my uniform.
Speaker 2:Every podcast episode is to wear a jersey. So I made sure to bring that one. I love yours even more.
Speaker 1:McAllister on the back.
Speaker 2:He's doing such an awesome job. He's one of my favorites, so how are?
Speaker 2:you. I'm great man, we're doing all kinds of great things, uh, but you know, one of these, one of the things that we do is this podcast to kind of educate people on what we're doing, get people more excited about the game and you know soccer 101, but also talking to people that have been there, done that in other markets kind of like yourself within our league, but also as a player, and experience that growth within the sport, um, over the last, you know, 40 years or so, so, uh, first, let's let's just like start from the beginning.
Speaker 1:Give people a little bit about you, your background, um, and how you kind of found the game yeah, um, so grew up in kearney, new jersey, uh, k-e-a-r-n-y big, big, massive history uh of soccer in that town uh soccer town, usa man yeah, I mean that you know tom mccabe, friend of ours, historian in the game, did a great job putting that together, uh, with and Tony and I, and having three players play on the same World Cup team, two World Cups.
Speaker 1:It was crazy From such a small, maybe 40,000 population at the time in that town 36,000 maybe, and it just a lot of people. What they don't know about this 36,000 maybe and it just, you know, a lot of people what they don't know about this, wes is that the game goes back in Kearney, way before us in our generation. There are so many. There were other players that played, you know, on the World Cup teams for Kearney and not a lot of people know that and people don't really talk about that much. So, from my perspective, I love the history of the game. I am very respectful of the people that have, you know, worked really hard and tirelessly to build the game in our country. I always have time for people like that. It's a big respect for me for different coaches, players that have had their own journeys, you know, and had given us opportunities to step in and, like you said, build things. And you know I love, you know, the fact that I was able to, at four years old, start playing with a recreation team you know the U7s and with my brother's team that my dad let me play, probably legally. My dad coached me all my youth career up until I went to UVX. He didn't touch us when we were at Kearney High School because at those days, back in the day, kearney High School and the high school game was that's where you got recruited to go to college, whereas now the platform's changed. In some states it's it's club and in some states it's still. The high school programs are really strong, it's based on what you have, uh, but my dad raised my brother and I and my sister debbie.
Speaker 1:Uh, my mom was always supportive and really incarnate. It was a very unique kind of situation where you know you've heard this saying it takes a village. You know well, we had the village we had, if it wasn't my parents taking me to a game, or it was somebody else's parents, or we were jumping in this van or we were hitchhiking down to New Jersey State tryouts. It was crazy. We just did everything we could and there wasn't a lot of outdoor kind of structure, it was just more or less find yourself and survive in the game.
Speaker 1:And, you know, one of the biggest things that I remember from my youth days was that my dad had had so much passion coming from scotland and he played himself. My mom both you know came from scotland as well. Um, in the town of carney it was a lot of scottish, english and irish immigrants at that time that had come over for work. Um, there's a couple of industrial textile companies called the clark thread company and they started some of the uh really semi-pro teams back in the day and even competed in the open cup. Um, it goes back as far as the 1800s in carney.
Speaker 2:Wow, uh which is crazy and uh, yeah.
Speaker 1:So for me it was like here we are, we're on this journey and, um, it was done, you know, way before us. So you have to have that understanding. And, um, my, my parents were very supportive, loving, you know, didn't have a lot, it was a very blue-collar town, hard-working town, um, but I did grow up with a very optimistic approach and enthusiastic approach to the game and to people. I love collaborating and sharing ideas and meeting people and understanding what their background is and where they came from and what makes them tick, you know. So soccer connects you in all ways and I was very fortunate to grow up in the game and have that success. And, you know, have those opportunities because, you know, soccer just really gave me a chance to go to UVA and have that success. And, you know, have those opportunities because, um, you know it, soccer just really gave me a chance to go to UVA, uh, university of Virginia, one of the top schools in the country, uh, to get an education but also to play and compete for Bruce arena and Dave Sarakin and grow up and mature and, uh, and then have an opportunity to play in the Olympics in 88. And then, you know, 90, 94, world Cup. So, yeah, it's a long journey but, um, I had a lot of people supporting me along that and a lot of people that, um, through my ups and downs and my childhood you know immaturity and mistakes and everything else, they still believed in me and gave me love and so that helped push me on to the next levels and yeah. So when I retired from playing, it was more like I was involved in media. I loved commentating on the game, I loved bringing a different perspective and you know, from my experience for six years playing overseas in the UK and England and the Premier League and everything and working at Sky Sports over there, it seemed natural for me.
Speaker 1:But I was always coaching. I was always coaching youth and my son and my two daughters and my wife's a footballer as well she played pro overseas when I was playing in England and my wife's a footballer as well. She played pro overseas when I was playing in England, which was kind of unheard of at that time. So it's ingrained in us in our family. I never forced my kids to play, it was just always there. And you know, the number one thing for us is like do they have good character? Are they humble and are they, you know, nice people as they grow up. And then the sport and everything else is bonuses, you know. And so my son ian's playing. He's a pro, he's going into his ninth year, uh, he'll be with san jose earthquakes this year.
Speaker 1:My daughter, lauren she went to clemson university, uh, under eddie radwanski, great coach, um, and she learned a lot and played really well there. And then she went to Creighton and did a, uh, master's program there and played under Ross Pauly, another great coach, another great leader and she went over to Denmark and played pro and enjoyed that and, uh, now she's back here working for us club soccer down in Charleston. We just, uh, just moved her down there last weekend. And my youngest daughter went to Elon University, played D1 there as well, and then she went overseas and got a master's program at Oxford University, smart Cookie and she graduated there and is working for a company in London. And so my wife's a Catholic school principal and has been a coach, you know, and a former player. She's a great leader, a great mentor for kids and yeah, that's kind of a nutshell where we are.
Speaker 2:I love that man, all right man I rambled the whole first section, sorry about that Never apologize, john.
Speaker 2:I mean, those are the great episodes right when you get to really know people and I love this medium for that. But you talked a lot about you and your family and your town and the engagement within the game and how you know it's good to hear around the help that and, to use your word, the love that you had surrounding you on your journey through it. Chris Martinovich, our co-founder, has a great saying from his coach, manny Shelscheit, in college First A-licensed coach, I believe, in the US but he used to say if you love the game, it'll love you back.
Speaker 1:Yeah very true, and I was very fortunate to know Manny Shelscheit and got a great story about him. Actually, he was the rival team in Union, new Jersey, and it was my dad. We were playing with my dad's team and then my dad was probably looking at me from a perspective of like, how can I push John and what? And? And he asked me, that guest played for manny, which was, you know, the union lancers were like the rival to carney thistle fc and I was like I'm not playing for them. And he was like, oh yes, you are this weekend. I was like what, I wasn't playing for manny and uh, I don't know if you want to hear the story, but I learned a great lesson from Manny Shellstein.
Speaker 2:Let's hear it, man, I'm all about it.
Speaker 1:So, manny, just for a lot of people listening out, there was the old school, like you said, the first A-licensed coach, I believe, in this country. But he German backgrounds, his influence was caring about the people, such a great manager of people, and uh, he was kind of like you know you, always you were in awe of him. Almost you were scared of him, you feared him because of the way his stature was, you know, um, but we knew he was such a great manager and my dad wanted to get me a new edge to myself, I guess, and so I went and guest played with manny, uh, in a tournament on the weekend. It was just a one day thing because he had two, two games already, and then it was the third day I was going there and, uh, I started for his team, which was great, and uh, I ended up scoring and we were, we were up one nil Right towards the end of the first half. We were up one nil in the beginning of the game and one of their players equalized and Manny, at halftime there was one one and we were talking and he was asking, like players, accountability, like what do you think about this play and stuff like that.
Speaker 1:And then, as we came back out, I wasn't selected to go back in. I thought I'm a guest player, that's fine, I'll just take what I get. But then the rest of the game I didn't play at all and I was wondering, wow man, what the heck happened there. And I think I was about 14 at the time and, uh, I couldn't understand like why I'm like that, how come you didn't let me play if I guess that's a question for Manny, not me and I was like, oh, I'm not calling the coach, you know, so there's no way. And I it just kept troubling me because I was like I want to compete with this group. It was so good. And I and I said, okay, no matter what. And I waited and waited but it was about two in the morning and I couldn't sleep and I finally woke up and I went through the other room and I shook my dad I go, dad, I know why. And my dad knew why?
Speaker 1:It was because I let the guy run through and I didn't transition to fend in the midfield and that was my player and he wanted to give me a chance to speak out and say that, but maybe I was too immature or young at that time and I didn't. I said can I call Coach Shellshite in the morning? He's like my dad's like, yes, you can, he goes good for you. Go back to bed.
Speaker 2:So I did.
Speaker 1:And I called him and I said you know, we had a long talk and when I said I think I understand why I didn't get a chance to play second half, and I presented it to him and he goes aha, so you've been thinking about the game, he goes. That's what I was trying to get you to do at halftime and I'm like, sorry, I'm just so competitive I couldn't think about it. But ever since then he made me change the way I play in the midfield and I became a more true number eight, box and box midfielder, not just attacking and creating. I was at that age. I started adding defensive to me posture, grittiness and coming out of New Jersey, out of Kearney, I had to do that to survive and so he pushed me to add that even more, made me focus on it. So he changed me as a player, without a doubt.
Speaker 2:That's such a cool story, man. I love those. That's such an awesome story, yeah, so how talk a little bit about uh and you and you kind of touched on this with kind of how things have changed a little bit. But talk a little bit about your pathway. Like everybody wants to understand and talk, or you know, how did they get to where they got to within their playing career? What was your? Because it's very different, you know, then versus now. In a lot of respects, some of it's the same, but there's a and not everybody's is the same right. There's multiple pathways, but there's a uh, and not everybody's is the same right. There's multiple pathways, but what? What was?
Speaker 1:yours like Um, I mean, you know, look, I mean it was back in the day. That platform was completely different. Like I said before, it was like you know, we were getting picked out of high school. You know people were coming to watch us freshman year. You know, on the varsity team we're a sophomore year. You know it was like state champions. We were in the state finals four years in a row. We went undefeated in our. I was in my junior year, I think 24-0. And you know people were coming to watch us play at the high school level.
Speaker 1:My dad coaches in the club level. You know Thistle Football Club, thistle FC, which still exists today and is running really well, and the next generation of people that grew up in that club are managing it now really well. So great players. And you know it was just, it was different. You know the structure was different, uh, but at the same time, what would never change, I think, is that if you're good enough, you're going to be seen and and whether you know you had to have patience through that process, you know, and you had to go through the whole odp. You know some of the old school first platforms of odp back in the day that's how old I am um, and state state tournaments and tryouts and all that stuff. It was great. But yeah, it came down to, of course, talent. You've got to have talent to get recognized. But that's not everything.
Speaker 1:And even today, when I'm coaching in McLean as a youth club in our community, or whether I was coaching at FC Cincinnati or coaching at New York Red Bulls with Bruce Ring or coaching in Greenville in the USL as well, in League One, it was always about doing the honest, hard work. I mean the players that put the work in and put the extra training in and the detail-oriented training and that really showed and it really helped you kind of grow. And I think I was always, it was always ingrained in me to to do that. You know, I didn't know anything else but to be honest and work and fight and compete and help out my teammates. It was never just about me, it was always about a group you know of people, um, so you know I I think that was more or less you know that edge that I always had, um, I think I've always had that edge and also being a builder and starting up clubs and building clubs from the ground up, because I have that kind of that, that crittiness, that edge about me to prove to other people around the world that the americans can do it.
Speaker 1:You know that we can grow our own leagues, like we went for an absence after the cosmos fall, didn't? I was a ball boy for the cosmos and I? I got to interact with a lay and kreuf and georgio canalia and santiago formosa, who came from carney and made it as a pro, and uh, so that was like I was right there, I was in the backyard, it was 20 minutes from my home, you know, playing at Giant Stadium and uh, I always wanted that, but there was that absence when that folded, the NASL folded and there was nothing for us and so there was no professional leagues unless you went indoor. It was kind of obscure and specific towns or states across the country had teams and not everybody did. It was a smaller kind of platform, but I wanted to continue to grow and become a better player and uh, I think that that edger was kind of pushed me to say, like you know, we can do it as an american, you know, and uh, I still have that to the fate and that's why you see me going to the usl and you know, becoming the sporting director and the head coach and growing the game and giving players opportunities and coaching staff opportunities to you know, to grow in the game as well, I think it's fantastic.
Speaker 1:I love that part, um, so I'll continue to do that if I get the opportunity. So but I think that's kind of me in a nutshell, like how did I get connected to the game? I love it, it's, it's in my blood, it's everything, um, you know you throw a ball out there west. You know this, and players and families and kids and so inclusive everybody just comes together around a ball. That's the best thing in the world all right, it is, it's um.
Speaker 2:it was actually uh, matt mcconaughey. When they he got interviewed about his involvement with aust FC, he said something that really stuck with me and I love it is the way that he put it was it's the world's universal handshake. You just throw a ball down and you say you don't say a single word, you don't need to speak the same language. You throw a ball down and it's let's go, let's have some fun, let's play some footy, and you're going to get that in 90 of the of the corners of the world. You know, um, and then I that that's my favorite thing about the sport is the way that it connects people and brings people together in a whole host of different uh ways, not just players, but um, and impacts communities for the better. So that's awesome, man, man, I love that.
Speaker 2:Talk about you. I mean you're, you're one of the few that's made it uh. And talk about your experience playing in. You know you've played in MLS, you played in the Premier League, you played in Olympics, you played in world cups. Talk about what that's like, man, and and I don't care where you go, but um, you, you you've hit one uh, you, you have one of the most famous goals in in Premier League history, uh, at Sheffield um Wednesday to be specific, uh that that that could go very wrong for a certain subset of that town. Um, but anyway, talk, talk about what it's like being a professional player. I mean you always for people listening and players. There's obviously a difference between making it to, you know, the collegiate level or the academy level now and you're on the cusp of breaking it into the first team, and then the difference between making it that far and then those players that are really, really great that get to have that chance on the world stage yeah, I mean it's it's.
Speaker 1:I mean it's it's um. It's hard to explain that. It's like the it's a it's Everybody uses these cliches, but it is a dream come true to play at that level, to represent your nation, is absolutely an incredible honor. And from the first time that I got recognized to go and play for the youth national team or in the Olympics, in olympics in seoul, korea, in 88, even you know to the first time that you play for your national team, senior national team, it's just like the most proud moment and but it's also, you know, the humblingest moment, because you know there's so many other people that could be there and and they want that jersey and that opportunity too. But so you know you've got to take that and and run with it and do the best you could to always add to your game. And I, I constantly ask players that all the time. Now, at the pro levels, it's like, you know, even the youth levels, it's like what are you adding to your game? And they're like what? Like you're a good player, but what are you adding? What are you working on now? And they're always like I don't know, like, well, somebody else is always working on their game. So you got to do that, you know, and that I think that's part of my growth.
Speaker 1:When I was younger, I was always trying to do different things and be creative and artistic and have imagination. But I mean, I guess I always had that grittiness to compete and win challenges and defend well and you know, and, and be hard, you know, not to, you know to shy away from any tackles or anything like that. So, um, but I always thought too, though those those moments that I've had, and you know, you mentioned the goal of the year that I received against Darby County for Sheffield-Wisea. It was in a cup match and we ended up going to the League Cup final and beating man United that year at Wembley. That was in the first seven months that I was in England, so it was crazy, but I always knew that I'm very lucky to have that platform, and I better use it for positive change, you know.
Speaker 1:And to have that platform, and I better use it for positive change, you know, and um, to have some positivity in somebody else's life. And you know, if I could, you know, connect the game or put a smile on someone's face, or go do a visit at a hospital or leukemia lymphoma society, like I, was very fortunate to use soccer and that platform to be able to reach so many other people. And, uh, soccer and that platform to be able to reach so many other people, um and uh it the minute that you lose that and you lose yourself and what your purpose is. So I've kept that with me all the time and I still do those things. And charity, uh, you know, begins in the home, but charity is very critical for everybody to do and take part in. So I think, think I love the game that much and it's awesome to grow it at different levels, but it's always so good to give back and to give into your community. It's the most important thing for everybody and if you can do that, then you're doing the right things.
Speaker 2:I love that you're doing the right things. I love that and I love that about um, the league and and how, in particular, usl uh is such a grassroots based league and very, very, very active. All the teams are in their, in their communities in different ways, um, and it's not to say that you know other leagues, uh, don't do this because they do um, but it's, you know, it's so, so important for the overall model within usl um and it's the. It's something that everybody across the board, along the organizations to the players, to the technical staff, are super passionate about, and when you can find that that sets everybody up for something special right, I agree, and you look at Ozark, and, and you know what you and, like chris, you know martinovich and everybody like their, their vision, you know.
Speaker 1:But their mission statement is to be a community club. You know it's to really represent the community the right way and to have those opportunities, and both for both genders, for the, for the men and the women, for the boys and the girls. It's critical. So it's establishing that culture is the first thing to do, and that's not easy. It is not easy and people say it and they can throw out the buzzwords, but the action that you take is critical to back that up. Knowing how to manage that along the way is critical as well. You can't get ahead of yourself, you can't get caught up in the wins and loss columns if you're not winning off the field for sure. That's important. I'm excited for you guys and what you're doing. You know it's always art united, it looks like an amazing project. Good people you know as well as I do. You're only as good as the people around you. And, uh, when you look to build it the right way, like that, with the right people, it's fantastic such a great.
Speaker 2:I love that. Thanks, john. Well, I think we'll leave it there for part one of our convo. Uh, john Hark's US soccer legend. Thank you so much, man, for joining me for this episode of Pitch to Pro. Uh, for everybody listening, remember that you can find us at pitch to procom or wherever you find your your podcast Apple, spotify and until next time, northwest Arkansas cheers. Thanks for joining us on this episode of the Pitch to Pro podcast. Be sure to tune in again in two weeks for the next installment and check out the Stoppage Time series for a recap of today's episode. Be sure to find us at Pitch to Pro on YouTube, instagram and everywhere you get your podcasts. Until next time, northwest Arkansas cheers.