In this episode, we discuss some of the lessons Stephanie learned after discussing PMS with our therapist. We also tackle the challenges we face turning inward and developing self-awareness - why that is difficult and some of the barriers that get in the way. After an abrupt ending, we decided to continue the conversation next week...
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In this episode, we discuss some of the lessons Stephanie learned after discussing PMS with our therapist. We also tackle the challenges we face turning inward and developing self-awareness - why that is difficult and some of the barriers that get in the way. After an abrupt ending, we decided to continue the conversation next week...
Exclusive offer
Head to askle.co now and use the code at the end of the episode to access a free consult & your first month's product free!
Follow us
B&B Corner Instagram
Asklé Instagram
Stephanie Instagram
Will Instagram
Get in touch
info@askle.co
Hey listeners before we jump into today's episode of the b&b corner, a quick shout out to our startup ask Lee. If you're a mom looking for personalized nutrition that fits into your busy life, is it escalade.co today? And stay tuned until the end for an exclusive offer just for our listeners.
Will Slater:Do you know what for the first time? Maybe for the first How long have we been together?
Stephanie Slater:Like seven years? Yeah, you said like 10 years the other podcast that's not were seven years, maybe seven year itch
Will Slater:in those seven years. This may be the first time we're both right. Hello,
Stephanie Slater:hello. Welcome to the BMA gonna
Will Slater:welcome friends and foes,
Stephanie Slater:friends and foes.
Will Slater:I'm sure I've updated a few photos amongst the audience.
Stephanie Slater:We are your hosts, in case you forgot to do that anymore.
Will Slater:Okay, um, well,
Stephanie Slater:I'm Steph. Anyway, welcome. Well, yeah.
Will Slater:Good to have you here.
Stephanie Slater:Yes. How's your week been? Good, you. Good?
Will Slater:Actually, my weeks been phenomenal. Oh, why not? Me in comparison to Unbelievable.
Stephanie Slater:Why cuz you're not with the kids. 24/7.
Will Slater:Lord, well, that wasn't actually. Oh,
Stephanie Slater:well, I was amazed to know, because I don't know if you enjoy your rude rude man. Cruzi.
Will Slater:As I would say, chill. Excuse you JoyBell.
Stephanie Slater:You want to put a sore? So I know.
Will Slater:That'll do me? Well, you jump over the table and punch me in the nose.
Stephanie Slater:Maybe if I had my period? I would.
Will Slater:Definitely. Well, interestingly,
Stephanie Slater:you say that you mentioned enough. Interestingly enough, that you mentioned that. Because last week we spoke about, we spoke about PMS. And what it was like for me? I did. And that was a revelation while we had our counseling session. And we brought it up because we were concerned, I guess, couldn't understand. Well, not that we couldn't understand. But I guess the moods were so intense. And you know, that kind of thing. Like it felt very out of control and out of the norm and that kind of thing. helpless, helpless. Yeah. And Lucia the way she straightaway without any hesitancy said, Oh, that's your body, calling out to you. And there was no shame. There was no, like questioning, I guess around. That's weird. Like, there was none of that. It was like, Oh, well, your body's trying to tell you something. And I was like, what is that? What do you mean, and I just losing my mind, because I'm getting my period. And then we went on to, I guess, explore how for three out of four weeks, every month, I do a really good job at she said, suppressing my emotions, and being in control and handling it. And then in that week, everything comes to the surface. And it's like, my body hasn't known how else to release that to get me to listen, like we talked about, you know, am I going to get sick because it's like, Well, how else, which is an awful thing to say. But this is my body's way of trying to connect my heart, mind and soul. And it's now literally screaming out. It's crying out literally like all of these things. These are all literal, like it's crying, it's screaming, it's saying, Listen to me, hear me, I'm not coping. And then I have this week, and then I push it all back down. Hence the poem, it's like put it all back in close the lid, you'll be fine. I'm just not listening to my body. I'm not being intuitive. I'm not hearing myself. And it really, it actually makes me quite sad. Because yeah, I'm just too busy suppressing that and saying, I don't have time or space for that. So shut up, like get on with life. This is an inconvenience to me. But I need to listen,
Will Slater:seem so crazy. And so insane that we haven't recognized that to this point. I know. Because everything that happens in your life is well everything, your body is a very good indicator of what's really going on for you. They will scream at you or make you stop at all. You will get sick if you need rest. Your body is is a wonderful.
Stephanie Slater:That's a reflection of what's going on inside you. Exactly.
Will Slater:It's an instructor and signals to you. And you're very intuitive, but Well, I would say I'm not as much as you but somewhat intuitive as well. But for whatever reason, we refuse to acknowledge that that might be a signal.
Stephanie Slater:And then we've been saying oh, you know, probably the last few months like it's getting a bit worse and and Lucia said Yeah, because it's trying to get louder and louder because you are not listening. And it just straight away stripped me of any guilt or shame and replace that with complete and total understanding and sympathy for me. And Anna called To Action of get back in touch ground yourself, because the thing that Lucha they went on to explain is an I, I've heard of the red tent. And I don't know if our listeners have heard of the red tent. But it was a reference to these biblical days of Jacob and his women where they had to buy more, I think it was go into this refuge during times of menstruation and also birth. And the reason being is because it was such a spiritual time as well. And lutea talked about how. So the red tent then became this, I guess, extended version of what this biblical reference was where women would go in this ceremonial process, I guess, where they would heal, they would support one another, they would teach each other and younger generations, it was women of all ages, they would men straight there. And the whole point of it was when you are menstruating, you're actually so in touch with your inner self, you're so intuitive, you're so connected, you know, it's this really powerful moment. And I don't think I'm harnessing that power. I think, as you said, I'm suppressing it. And I'm pushing it down. And I'm seeing it as, as I said, this inconvenience, but actually, I need to harness that for good, because instead of me screaming and yelling, and punching, and whatever it is, I can be directing that energy to something really fruitful, and and find ways to care for myself and reconnect with that spirituality. Because I am a very spiritual, spiritual person. I am very intuitive. But it's almost like I'm not giving that the credibility it deserves, because it seems almost frivolous. It's
Will Slater:almost like it's your subconscious trying to come to the surface and teach you something, yeah, educate you about something and inform you about something that
Stephanie Slater:someone said that they didn't use. You said, what's it trying to teach you? What's it? What's it yelling at you? What's it screaming at you.
Will Slater:I was listening to a podcast this morning about Rick Rubin from the founder of Def Jam Records. And he was talking about dreams. And he used to always write down his dreams. And he said, It wasn't necessarily in the moment that he understood the message. But he said he would go back years later and read what he had written about his dreams. And he said the lessons or, you know, the hindsight that he could develop out of that and say, If I had the ability to actually understand what my dreams were trying to tell me, at this point in time, it was a great indicator for where I should have gone or things that I should have done, or what I should have done with my life, I think it's probably in a lot of ways very similar. It's your, your subconscious, in itself is actually coming out of you in some ways through the bleeding that your body's doing. And it's trying to send you a message and tell you something. And for whatever reason, you and I, to an extent haven't been listening to that, I
Stephanie Slater:think often though, and it's like, it's a little bit like psychology in consciousness and why psychology wasn't deemed a science for so long. And I'm talking back in like the 70s, or even 60s because it sort of became empirical by the 70s, I guess, because it was intangible, scientific so that you could measure it, right? And so when we talk about consciousness, the stream of consciousness is totally subjective. It's immeasurable. It's based on what you tell me is happening in your mind. And so it was seen as almost woowoo. What I'm trying to get at is, when we talk about the spirituality or our subconscious, trying to tell us stuff and whatever, it feels intangible, it feels a bit woowoo it feels like Well, yeah, cool, but like, You're just saying that oh, yeah, you know, whatever you don't you just don't give it the credibility it deserves. Unless I think you speak to very spiritual people who see such benefit in that and believe in it and see it as, as like scientific, I want to turn back to myself reflect inwards and and listen to myself and hear that as actually, fact for me, like, in that moment, this is what I need. This is what's happening. How do I how do I nurture that? How do I reconnect with that part of myself, because I think when I'm reconnected in that way, I'm a better version of myself as well. Think last week, we spoke about how I pulled out the oracle cards, that's something I want to find again. And anyway, we're putting in place different strategies already, but you'd
Will Slater:be alone in not listening to or recognizing the things that you instinctively or intuitively know or listening to. The things that you're the messages that your subconscious is trying to share with you, I think, as a broader societal issue, our attention in so many places at the moment, and we are constantly consuming information about all sorts of things. We're constantly connected if I mean, even to you do, can you remember the last time that you did nothing? Well, I
Stephanie Slater:was just about to say, Yeah, we're never we're never disconnected. And whenever just sitting and reflecting
Will Slater:ever, there's never there is never a time I'm trying to be more conscious of it. At the moment. I took a bit of a break from all of sort of social media stuff over summer and I've just got them back on mainly for work purposes.
Stephanie Slater:It's really hard with us because we So relied on our phones for doing a lot of our content and stuff like that, that
Will Slater:it didn't I find I just naturally start to look at other stuff as much as I try not to, I'm better than I was pre Christmas. But I'm, I've found I'm going back into it a little bit, I catch myself so often of having a moment of even walking to the gym, or standing and waiting, I was standing this morning waiting for my coffee to boil. And I had this urge to go and pick up my phone. And I thought the fuck you doing, man, just stop, just stand here. Just be. And so we have lost, we've lost that connection to ourselves. And that's listening to ourselves about what we need. And I think if we actually were more attuned to that or gave more space for that to even be heard, we might be able to overcome a lot of the issues that we find ourselves dealing with.
Stephanie Slater:I couldn't agree more. And I know that I was and I do it. So I'm not going you do it because I know I do it. But I was pulling you up on doing because as I said, If we pause the TV show to do time straightaway, you pick up your phone or, or you try and do two things at once. Like a lot of people will watch TV and be on their phone. Like it's an awful habit that majority of society have. But you were just always like with your phone. And I'm like, what? You don't need to pick it up right now. I do that a lot. Like I will find myself sitting there and not being comfortable and just sitting in my thoughts because it's almost Yeah, I don't know. It's an it's such an awful habit.
Will Slater:A lot of the thoughts we are trying to avoid avoidance tactic. It's like,
Stephanie Slater:what should we be doing? We should be journaling. We should be trying a meditation in that moment, we should be so so something that I'm doing. And I remember if like quite a few podcasts ago, we'll talk about how I was getting up at 6am 630 then 615 and 6am. And I didn't have an end alarm. Well that's that's kind of going to shoot
Will Slater:you back doing that this week. You definitely need an alarm I
Stephanie Slater:need an alarm about also, I went to bed a lot earlier
Will Slater:waking up though just before your alarm. When
Stephanie Slater:we have been going to bed really really late and setting a 6am alarm I struggle like I'm just not okay last night I was so tired. I said actually said to Well, I can't
Will Slater:really really like for you. It was like 930 not
Stephanie Slater:that's not true, we will go to bed like 1030 which for me is very, very late, like 10 days, too late. I don't want to like that. For me the ideal and it's really hard in summer because it's still daylight but I would love to be bed by 830 reading and then asleep by nine 930. And last night is exactly what I did. I said to you, I think that just needs like we had a bit of a day a bit of a funk yesterday, which is fine. It kind of happens in what we're doing and life. Anyway, I said I think I just need to like watch some trashy TV or something like that. Probably should have been that moment of meditation gone to bed, that would have been better. But anyway, took myself finished an episode of Kardashians it was like 20 minutes, not even 15 minutes. And then I was like I my body. I think I'm just really tired. I'm just going to see. And I fell asleep. It was nine o'clock. And I fell asleep. I don't remember falling asleep. It must have been deep because I remember you coming to bed and things like that. But then you got up at what time were you for 330 or 330. But I was like I love you. Do you remember as I talked to you this morning, so I was kind of awake. And then I went back to sleep. And then I was sort of in this very light sleep rolls almost awake ish. And so I was awake before my alarm, then my alarm went off. Anyway, I'm loud talking now I'm talking nonsense. What I wanted you to tie. What I wanted to say was now a habit that I'm trying to introduce because I was listening to this podcast that said, don't try and remove things without putting something in place of that. Because if you just go cold turkey and taken away, say I'm just not going to use my phone, you're going to be itching for something. It's kind of like stop smoking, put a nicotine patch, like you've got to replace the action. And that's why a lot of people vape which is even worse for you. But it's that action of putting something
Will Slater:out there what I did I most of the time I'm using social media is when I'm sitting on the toilet. Because it takes me you're like three seconds. You just
Stephanie Slater:sit there for half an hour and forget takes time. And anyway, can
Will Slater:I put a book in the toilet? I've noticed that I've never used my phone.
Stephanie Slater:That's good. It works well. But it is. So it's about replacing the bad habit with a good habit. And so for me, now I have a morning instead of using. So what I would do is because my phone is like my clock, I would check the time. And then I'd see there were notifications on it. So I'd quickly go and look into those things, emails, messages, even if it's an Instagram notification. It's like this is awful, what an awful thing to do to my brain. And even my way of thinking for the day like setting myself up by doing that. So now Yes, I check the time. But then I put my phone oh actually sorry. I get my phone and I put a little daily motivation thing at the moment. It's Lewis house is at his house. And he just does little eight minute tidbits. And sometimes they're good sometimes they'll move I listen to that while I'm brushing my teeth. I get myself ready. And then the next step is I want to do I want to wake up and I actually want to do a just a small five minute meditation in bed and then get myself out listen to my thing, but I don't want to be consuming anything in the morning at all. And I do that for at least one to two hours. So that's my new thing. And I'm finding that I feel better like 6am Wake up Don't look at my phone listen to something that gets me in a good headspace today was about abundance and a good relationship with money and it's working. If you have a bad Have it, replace it with something that will be of benefit to you and hope and they will talk about on the podcast try and make it still dopamine releasing, because you are not going to replace. If you hate journaling, and you love scrolling Instagram, you're not going to do it, it's just not going to give you the same impact. So you've got to find something, it's still gonna give you a bit of a dopamine hit. So I think that's tricky. Whereas I have found that listening to those podcasts, it does make me happy because I feel like I'm getting something from it, or I'm learning or I'm like, Oh, I love that I'm gonna bring that into my day. Like it still gives me that. My thing.
Will Slater:I was gonna make it No destroy. So I'm glad that that's working for you. You seem far more sprightly in the mornings you come downstairs and I had to come and give you a few nudges the other morning. Yeah, the morning housing. Oh, I felt so I'm working downstairs and I'm looking at my clock 6am comes around. And then I can just hear your alarm go off. And I can always tell if you're going back to bed because I can hear this a little bit of a ruffling and then decide that and then. And I know that that last click means that you've snooze, and you've put it back down. So sometimes I come in, I do when you get up. And yeah, I'm conscious now not to come up. During that time, though, because you need to I'm trying to get two hours worth of work done, ideally before you or the kids are up. So it's like 430 to 630 by the time I've got home from the gym, I know that even if your alarm goes off at six, I've probably still got until 630 because you need that little bit of half an hour window to just know
Stephanie Slater:it's also my meantime now self sorted out. Yeah. But it's it's now my thing of like, I align with myself, like I reconnect with myself, I find my mindset, you know, like I do all that I'm trying to set myself up for the day, I find my skincare regime really therapeutic. And when you come
Will Slater:to kids hanging off you or a husband
Stephanie Slater:the above, and then I can come down. Good morning. I never do that I'd never. But I have to have a coffee and stuff like that sprightly
Will Slater:for you is not that's sprightly for you as you speak. You've vocalized something rather than a grunt. Get off me.
Stephanie Slater:Anyway.
Will Slater:So I was looking at your funding before because I was going to put out a bold hypothesis as to why I think that might be challenging which part the constant need to be connected on to be doing something to be active and to be engaged or to be most probably not even engaged. It's just kind of mindless most of the time. I think. And I'll use the word way, because I would think both of us have been working hard at this for a long time. And I think we both value it. But as a generalization. I think we like a lot of self awareness. And I think the reason why we try to be consumed by other things is because deep down I think we're very scared about what we might find. If we look internal.
Stephanie Slater:Yeah, I don't I do. I agree with the sentiment of what you said at the end. I don't agree that we're not self aware. I actually think we're very self aware individuals who are constantly trying to better ourselves and grow. And we actually were talking about the other day,
Will Slater:I'm talking colloquially Oh, sorry, you weren't even listening. I thought you always pulled me up for not listening. And then fucking gotcha.
Stephanie Slater:I thought you said, gotcha that, but then I swear, you went on anyway, whatever.
Will Slater:I said I would put I would I'm going to use the term way, but at the same time, I think, sure, well, then yes. Then yes, I agree. I do a lot of work on it and have for a long time. And we're we're working towards it. But I think colloquially generally, we totally this lack a lot of self awareness. And a very afraid to do anything. Yes. Because we're afraid of what we might find a fear totally stops us. Yeah, your journey inward is not a pleasant one.
Stephanie Slater:No, absolutely not. And I think if just to bring it back to like, the period Tolka PMS is while I was gonna
Will Slater:go to totally, oh, sorry. Well, I
Stephanie Slater:want to talk, I just want to tie that up, like finish it? Well, I'm just saying is that because what when I'm screaming and yelling, and all that kind of thing, we were looking at it in such a negative light, like, Oh, you're out of control, like your home hormones, let's do something about your hormones. You know, like, we were looking at it from this physiological kind of point of view, again, scientific make it tangible, what's actually going on. But really, it was an inward reflection. It was yeah, that's scary. Because what's happening is that your body is saying I can't I don't want to keep going the way I'm going. I don't want to keep if we want to reference carrying the bags, if we want to reference you know, taking care of it. I don't want to keep taking care of people, I want time for me, I want to do this, I want to do that. And this is the week in which I feel competent. My body is allowing me to express that in a way that maybe does. I mean, right now, it's not healthy, but hey, I'm gonna do whatever I can to let you know I'm here. And I just can I just quickly share this because I did think it was a beautiful piece of writing. Because I don't I feel that the fact is, you know, this is gonna get us on another friggin tangent that you'll want to, but we live in a patriarchal society and have for many a year Well, for decades we have, but it's just the way it is. And I think that the way we have repressed women's needs, particularly around periods is enormous. We haven't given it the, what the recognition it deserves. Like, we really haven't we mentioned this before, but when it's just been personal care, like we've been too scared to even call it, you know, period care, or the fact that, like, there's so many talks about making it free, or all that kind of stuff, like, you know, trying to get period care into schools and all that kind of thing, like we just don't talk about, we don't care for it, we don't give it the respect that it deserves, because it is a powerful thing that women go through. And I just love this, I was looking into the whole idea of the red tent and the spirituality behind it and the meaning and all this thing and changing the narrative and making it this powerful thing as opposed to anyway, this woman I don't doesn't have a name, I don't even know if it's a woman, but I would assume it is. But she wrote, so the bodies of women are so deeply connected to the land to the moon, we are like a spiral of cycles within cycles, our bodies ebb and flow we bring forth the generations, we have within ourselves a sort of an ocean in which we nurture our young birthing them in a rush like the tide, we learn about how we are powerful, and we learn about how we are powerless in near equal measure, we bleed and yet do not die. And miracle that is often swept under the rug hidden away and diffused. We are ourselves miracles, and yet we can drown in thoughts of never being good enough and needing to prove our worth. And I just thought, wow, like, absolutely. You know, we are a miracle what women do, what we do through pregnancy and birth, what we do every month before ever becoming a mother, if we choose to become a mother, then what we happens post like, we are a friggin miracle. The fact that we can bleed for a week straight is insane. And of course, that makes us these majestic creatures that we should respect in and of ourselves. I'm not asking you know, whoever but I have to respect myself and listen to my body like shits happening. So listen, turn inwards. Have that week as your special time, your sacred time. Maybe it is the time that you go to the beach every night and ground yourself and meditate like you don't I mean, allow yourself that I really just think so instead of being scared of it. But going back to that fear and what does it mean to turn inwards and to listen? That have been scared of what's happening that week? Because that's how I've been feeling. If I don't understand this, I'm scared of this emotional reaction. Why am I so intense? turn inward? Okay, what am I trying to tell myself? What am I what do I need to hear? What's my body screaming out for? Wow, okay, I want to listen, actually want to sit here and listen to you. You know, I think that would be really powerful. That's something I'm taking on. Today's episode is brought to you by Ashley, our very own health tech startup that's redefining wellness for moms. If you're trying to juggle everything in life like we are, and want a simple and easy way to stay on top of your health. This is for you. Imagine a daily scoop of wellness crafted based on your unique health needs, and delivered right to your doorstep. As clay makes it easy with bespoke supplements tailored to your needs. Ready to transform your health? Is it as play.co and book a brief consult with one of our health practitioners? Stay tuned until the end of this episode for an exclusive offer. Athlete made just for you.
Will Slater:I think that bleeding for a week and not dying is a very powerful statement. Yeah. Like
Stephanie Slater:see you bleed for a week and not die? I mean, I wouldn't like to say but I'm just saying, you know, anyway.
Will Slater:Yes, I think that's as I said earlier, not on the show before the show. I think it's I think it's not even debatable that you're superior beasts to US
Stephanie Slater:based.
Will Slater:That's debatable. Which is why the equality conversation is an interesting one.
Stephanie Slater:Is that what you're taking? Please don't
Will Slater:entering into another enemy territory with a pistol with
Stephanie Slater:the fissile on the grenade under the sorted bar, and I've only got one weapon. We'll find an analogy. And he will just go with it. And then 10 minutes later, you're like, wait a whistle in the analogy. Are we in the actual, like, discussion part now?
Will Slater:Still in the analogy, okay.
Stephanie Slater:But yes,
Will Slater:that was gonna go to another path of self awareness. But I please do the comment that I made was I think that the journey inward is a difficult one. Yes. I don't think we have the time or make the time or spend the time to actually go through that process.
Stephanie Slater:And unless you're spiritual, I will say that I think that many people who have gone on healing journeys will spend figuratively and literally on turning inwards.
Will Slater:That's true. People are on a spiritual journey to do that. Yeah,
Stephanie Slater:but there's not many of us out there. No,
Will Slater:I think there's a few. I have been pushing for us both. I know that you're not as keen at the moment, but to do a couple of nights away for our birthdays.
Stephanie Slater:I went What do you mean I'm not keen. I'm totally keen, who just
Will Slater:brought it up the other day said hadn't thought about it. So
Stephanie Slater:that's it. Bye The idea may not thinking about it doesn't mean? Well, I guess it doesn't mean about prioritizing it. I just had it. I just honestly hadn't even thought about it. But I loved the idea. We've agreed to that. I think it's fabulous. I thought you were you were like, oh, no, this is not the year
Will Slater:that I was gonna mention to you. I think maybe I would like to go. I think we
Stephanie Slater:should. I think you should. Absolutely. I haven't thought about no. It's also just creating space for that. Like,
Will Slater:this is the whole point of the conversation.
Stephanie Slater:Yes, fair. When am I gonna win a microphone
Will Slater:on these knees? Yeah, exactly. What should have happened? Just them. So yeah, that's the point. Yeah. Okay. Go. Create the space.
Stephanie Slater:No, I mean, space beforehand, think about prioritize anyway.
Will Slater:The point is, maybe if you turned off Instagram notifications, you might have this but
Stephanie Slater:I don't have my if I did, do well, hang on. No, I turned them on for ASCII. That's why I didn't I had to write.
Will Slater:Okay, well, anyway, we don't create the space. Yes. And I think it's important that we do, yeah. Which is why I think those two days or so, or two nights are so valuable to actually have this space and to go on that journey inward. And to understand because I think it not only allows you to be much more comfortable with your own thoughts, but it allows you to develop new thoughts, which are paramount to you figuring out what your place is and what life means to you. Am I getting too high level nouns like get or renew expect?
Stephanie Slater:No, but I agree. I, well, we sort of said earlier, we never switch off from anything. And so because we feel really uncomfortable with that, because what comes up? Maybe it will just be a beautiful creative sort of experience. And just don't
Will Slater:think that's ever going to be the case. Well,
Stephanie Slater:I don't agree people, like writers go away. And when they have writer's block, and then they come in and some ideas, she's like,
Will Slater:I don't think it's a pleasant experience. So the inside of us is fucking awful.
Stephanie Slater:You're such a Negative Nelly,
Will Slater:I don't think that's negative. I think that's very my based in reality, that's what I realized
Stephanie Slater:is that some people will have time away. If you go away every year, one year might be really tumultuous it might be I've got so much. So many demons, I want to explore things I want to whatever. And sometimes you might see it and it just become really meditative and beautiful. And as you're doing that creativity flows and abundance. And you know, like, What do you mean, every time you go where you're going to do, you're such a Debbie Downer.
Will Slater:I'm not a Debbie Downer at all. I'm very positive and optimistic. The way that I'm suggesting that people do this, I just don't think that it's easy or pleasant. But I think we we all have a dark underbelly. But I think
Stephanie Slater:he can allow that talked about that. I think he can allow that to present itself however it does. So sometimes it will be quite a beautiful experience. It might be there are many spiritual, again, spiritual people, that you might go out this call to your angels and have these beautiful messages. And it's like, wow, okay, like I could sit there. And I've had the awful experience with the period as in the PMs and screaming and yelling and all that thing, and then maybe actually sit and listen, I have really kind messages that are coming in and saying, you know, whatever it might be like, I don't think it has to be maybe doom and gloom,
Will Slater:my theory and my experiences. So far, maybe
Stephanie Slater:a reflection of you.
Will Slater:Maybe I'm the only fucked up person in society. But I don't think that's true. I think if you look at Carl Jung's work, he would argue that there is a shadow self, and we're debating closer is exactly what we're talking about. No, it's
Stephanie Slater:not.
Will Slater:What are you talking about? Oh, that's what I'm talking
Stephanie Slater:about. You're saying that anytime you go away, it's going to be an unpleasant experience where you turn inwards, and everything's going to be bad?
Will Slater:Well, I think in order to, in his words, in order to live a whole life and a full life, you need to be friends with your shadow self, you need to understand it, and you need to accept it.
Stephanie Slater:And you know, it doesn't have to be an awful experience.
Will Slater:I would argue that your shadow self is a rather confronting thing to go down and delve into and understand. I mean, you you're the version that you show to the world is the positive, pleasant version that you want everyone to see. And everyone to think this is this is who I am. This is who that person really is. Will love a person that's on this podcast, this is who I am. But that's not entirely true. There's a whole other side to me that is, oh, I know, dark and awful. And I think what not I think the evidence is clear that everyone has that everyone has a version of themselves that they show to society when they walk around and they have a smile on their face. And they say yep, everything's great. How are you? I'm good. Deep down. There is another side to them, which is the total opposite and my argument about the comments that I'm making about so If awareness is that people don't understand that side of themselves. And they try to avoid that side of themselves, because it's scary to confront that. And so they fill that time with social media and all sorts of other distractions. And so my point is to take a journey inward, is by its very nature to confront that version of yourself to try to understand it. And by understanding that you can therefore then live a whole life, a full life. And I know you're looking at me like shut up. This is uninteresting.
Stephanie Slater:That's, that's no, that's absolutely not
Will Slater:to look at me about,
Stephanie Slater:I think you're doing what you sometimes do, which is you're not actually hearing what I'm saying. And you're being very definitive in that this is what happens. And this is what happens when you go in was an Young's work is like this in order to be a whole person, not debating any of that at all, to what am I missing. So what I'm saying to you is that you mentioned we're not talking about now the filling your time with Instagram, that we're saying the two nights away, how important that is for inward reflection, to meet maybe for the first time your shadow self, or to reconnect with your shadow, self, whatever it might be, as I said, whether it's the first time or the 10th time isn't necessarily always a dark, depressing time. You could meet you could have met your shadow self and know about it. And maybe now you're trying to make friends with it. And maybe this experience is you're trying to put a beautiful spin on it. You're like, okay, that's how I that's that shadow self. How do I utilize it and make it powerful? In a way that is good? And that's what what's his name? What was that documentary, which we loved? Oh, my gosh, come on. Work with me. The comedian, Jody Hill, Danielle Stotts.
Will Slater:That was very good. Okay. Brings you psychologist. Yeah. What's
Stephanie Slater:that? What was it called?
Will Slater:It's called stoats.
Stephanie Slater:Oh, the actual documentary is called stops. Yeah. And that's psychologist
Will Slater:psychologist name is? I don't think
Stephanie Slater:whatever he talks heaps about like he did please come watch it. Yes, you should definitely should. He talked a lot about shadow self and the work you do with your shadow soft about then it's not that it's ever going to turn into this positive, but it's making friends with it. And it's finding ways to harness the good in that shadow self. So if your shadow self is really ego driven, or insecure, or whatever it is like that, you know, that version of you? How do you find ways to utilize that to be to become that hole that you talked about? Like that is who I am. So okay, is my insecurity, a way for me to learn about those, like whatever it is? Do you know I'm trying to say? So my point is that I don't disagree with anything that you're saying other than when you go into that, because I think what you're doing is your you're almost making this fear based, you're saying go in, it's going to be scary, it's gonna be awful. Don't expect it. I think there will be moments when it is that when it's hard when you're probably cry when you'll be scared when all of those things. But I think there's also going to be times where it can be a really beautiful transformative experience where, as I said, you make friends with it, you journal about it, you find ways to connect with that version of yourself and not hate it. And that's what Jonah Hill did. He talked about that shadow self of him being that scared fat boy. And these are his words, like he said that, and how he, you know, turned that around and found a power in that and, you know, became whatever it was I can't we watched it quite
Will Slater:quietly. I agree in the sense that I think that is where people get to, but I think the journey to get there is but
Stephanie Slater:what did I have to what did I say to you? If you're meeting for the first time, your shadow self, that's probably going to be quite hard. You're going to find out things about yourself that you're not going to like, and you're probably going to want to run away. You're probably gonna say, Screw this. I know I booked two nights, but I'm staying for one. And I'm getting the hell out of here at 10am.
Will Slater:What I did last time I went away. Do you remember? Yeah, you did. But
Stephanie Slater:was that because you were scared? I thought you told me it's because you miss me and the kids. I didn't miss you. And
Will Slater:I wanted to come home the night before. Yeah, I missed you and the kids. And I was part of the part of the reason why I missed you guys is because it was a fucking scary experience. And I wanted to leave the night before because all I wanted to do was be back at home with you and the kids, because that was a comfort, absolutely loving, warm, enjoyable place to be. And I was trying to run away from what I was learning. I ended up staying the second night and I left at like 4am or something I was home before you guys even woke up. I was three hours away. So that's, that's my point. It is a scary experience. And I don't I'm not trying to say that to put fear in people's minds. I'm trying to say that to set a level of expectation that if people are prepared to go on that journey to understand themselves deeper, I think by its very nature, they have to understand parts of themselves that they're not going to like and I think to work their way through that is going to take more than if it's a trip away or if it's whatever sort of reflection you want to do. However your method is whatever your method is, I think it's going to take a considerable amount of time to understand that part of yourself. So for you are then able to get to a point where it is sitting with the angels and Rosie and I'm learning all this stuff. And this is all wonderful. And um, but let's just
Stephanie Slater:also, because this is very you in that you see things as one way. And that was your experience. And I think you need to recognize that people are going to do this journey their own way. So the way I choose to meet my shadow self expose myself to that version of me sit with it is going to look very different to the way you ask sort of a person that's like jump in the deep end, sink or swim. And I ain't bringing floaties and I'm gonna go hard. And I will get in the ring with that shadow self, and I'll get beaten the crap out of until that's you like, that's how you are zero or 100.
Will Slater:I think that's true, although I don't think that's just my experience. I think even. And it wasn't taught, he wasn't talking in this explicit context. But the podcast I was listening to with Rick Rubin, who has worked with some of the best and most of the best artists that have ever lived in the last 40 years. And he was saying that art, creativity often comes from most of the time, comes from deep, deep, dark places. He was saying the reason that AI won't be capable of generating art, the same way that humans do is that they don't have lived experience, they don't have a point of view, they don't have a position on things that based on the human experience, and art, creativity comes from often terrible things that people know about themselves, that they try to express in beautiful ways that people resonate with and love and understand. So I don't think that it is just exclusively my experience.
Stephanie Slater:Yeah. Why did I roll my eyes at you? And why am I giving you a smirk right now? Because again, you do what you do, which is you haven't you have your blinkers on. And this is what it is. This, I'm telling you now, I've listened to the podcast, this is what people have said, How many people have experienced this data? And I'm telling you that Yeah, I hear you. But the fact is, it's going to be a deep, dark experience, it's probably not gonna be pleasant. I'm not disagreeing. In fact, I agree. What I'm asking you to do is take your blinkers off, and to accept that there are going to be varied experiences of how people tackle such a process. And it's not some people will choose not to go that deep and hard. It's like any addiction. And it's graduated exposure, like these are all things that therapy utilizes some people, I'm gonna use a very basic example, I've got a spider phobia. For most people, you're going to do graduate exposure, all you got to do is show them a drawing of a spider. That's it, just a very basic drawing, then you're going to show them an image of a spider, then you're going to put a toy spider in their hand, then you're going to go out and watch a spider on its web, then you are like, give me the spider on my face. Let it crawl around. And I'm going to sit with those feelings.
Will Slater:And that's a true you just gave you just gave a wonderful idea.
Stephanie Slater:I'm not done. You are what we call flooding. in Psychology. Flooding is when you don't do graduated steps. It's when you throw them in. It's when you get this spider on the face and you feel it. And you sit in it until your nervous system regulates itself. Now, I don't like flooding. I don't want to be flooded. I want to be gradually exposed to it. I want to take my steps and condition myself to I'm at a point where I feel really strong and comfortable. So for me, my first experience isn't going to be the deep dark, harrowing. confront me base on so I need you to be open to you can still explore that version of yourself in a way that feels safe and feels safe. I think that's the word that feels safe to you. The way you do it would not feel safe to me. You're okay with that those emotions are. When I say comfortable to you. You're okay with being you just do like that you like that intensity that works for you and always look at you. I'm going to get up at 330 That's what I do. I like no matter what, no matter how much I cry that I'm time poor or whatever. I'm not getting up at 330. I don't want to get up at 330. That's ridiculous. 330 is a sleeping hour. Sorry, for me. For you. Perfect working time. Good on your mate works for you. I just want you to be a little bit more.
Will Slater:I appreciate that. Do you know what for the first time? Maybe for the first How long have we been together?
Stephanie Slater:Like seven years? Yeah, you said like 10 years. The other podcast was like that's not where seven years make seven year itch?
Will Slater:Yes, the seven years you round up obviously. So 10. In those seven years, this may be the first time where we're both right. Because usually I'm right. On the odd occasion, you're right, but this might be one of the few times where we're both right. I agree with you. And I concede, and I do think that people should have gradual exposure. I am extremes. I'm not interested in gradual exposure. So I definitely will jump in the deep end and say what happens. And I enjoy that. It's. So I agree with you. And I do understand the theory of gradual exposure in psychology. And I think that that is 100% accurate. So everything I just said, for whichever level you are at, you should do what is appropriate for your level of exposure that you are seeking. However, however, but as you like to say, and at the same time, the only way to overcome that spider phobia is by having a spider right in your face eventually, eventually, the finality of that, to overcome that you have to do that. If you have a fear of flying, being in airplanes, chat at boss flying, yep, you should do definitely gradual exposure. But ultimately, the only way you overcome it is by getting in an aeroplane. No one's denying and flying. Yes. So my point is still right, in that the only way to develop that level of self awareness is to deal with confront and accept that deep dark side of yourself that exists. Should people go and do that on their first expedition? No, but some of us,
Stephanie Slater:so it's actually time. Right. And you're just conceding both
Will Slater:right. My point is that it is my everything that I said is still it is a deep way. You're
Stephanie Slater:gonna go away then. Yes. Okay. Good on. Yeah,
Will Slater:I am. Good. And I, yes, I'm gonna go away. And
Stephanie Slater:tonight, regarding maybe,
Will Slater:maybe I feel more comfortable sharing this after convincing your mother that is a good idea. But I'd like to use psychedelics to support me in that process of my inward journey. Yeah. Maybe I'll see if anyone wants to join me. God. But
Stephanie Slater:actually can I wasn't sure if we were going to share that you're not going to do that. No, I don't I don't know whether Yeah, I didn't know whether we were going to share that or not. But what I was also going to say is when you choose to go away, yes, you you've taken psychedelics and you've gone you've almost done what's the word I'm looking for? It's definitely not as Shall I show Asana? What's the thing that you do? Oh my gosh, come on that you've won our iOS? iOS got that it was coming. It was some star thing. That's
Will Slater:exactly the same just with a different medicine. Yes.
Stephanie Slater:I know that's what I was getting to just the word had escaped me. So you, you do that you choose to go on your journey and you put yourself in this situation you manufacture the situation through psychedelics didn't even say manufacture but what about translate like you create the you create the environment, facilitate Thank you. I didn't have my mushroom, it's funny. You facilitate the environment to allow yourself to have that intense inwards reflection inward reflection. Not everyone will want to do that because that that is going to be quite an intense
Will Slater:experience. Because the way I do it is taking quite a high dose of psilocybin mushrooms and then blocking out all other senses. So literally lying down in a dark room with
Stephanie Slater:that many because they just oh, just because they finish that sentence. Or maybe do not have time left
Will Slater:to come back. Okay, we're getting kicked out of our studio. We thought we had a book for two hours and that's okay. Anyway, so I don't think we meant to get there today. Why
Stephanie Slater:don't we know we weren't but why don't we I think the psilocybin and all that is really interesting conversation. Let's save it for next episode because I reckon people will be really interested in this. So we're
Will Slater:gonna love you and leaves on my way you weren't interested in
Stephanie Slater:I am I am. Okay. Now we are we are we are. Well, it's okay. We gotta run guys. We're getting interrupted. But thanks for joining us love you. Thank you for listening all the way to the end of the b&b corner, brought to you by ASCII as a way for us to say thank you. We are offering the first 50 mums, a free consult and your first month's product free. All you need to do is visit escalade.co. Schedule a consult with one of our practitioners and enter the promo code, baby consult. Take your first step towards personalized wellness with Escalade today