Master Your Mood - Enhance Your Effectiveness

Episode 2

This week, we are joined by Rachael Edmondson-Clarke, an expert in Leadership Psychology and Biology. Rachael shares some fascinating insights on mood and how it can impact performance.  Listen in to understand what mood means, how it affects you, and how you can manage yourself to deliver peak performance.
 
 Plus, you can learn which of us is the moodiest. 

Rachael is well worth listening to as a speaker and authority on behavioural change. She will help you become 10% better at work!
 
 To find out more, contact Jimmy, James or Rachael.

Transcript

James: 0:03

Hello, I'm James.

Jimmy: 0:05

Hi, I'm Jimmy

James: 0:06

And welcome to A Job Done Well.

Jimmy: 0:08

the podcast that helps you improve your performance enjoyment at work

James: 0:12

So what have you been up to then? What's been new in your week?

Jimmy: 0:14

Well, my week is dominated by both my daughter's birthdays. One was 18 on Thursday and the other one was 21 on Sunday. So it's been presents, balloons, all birthday stuff, including, with the age they're getting to, their birthday celebration was a joint bottomless brunch. So

James: 0:36

mine's much more mundane. I am in debate with my daughter. It's the, general election, actually, a couple of days time, as you and, she's, off on holiday, so she's, Asked to vote by proxy there's a big debate about who should be her proxy me or my wife And she didn't trust me. She said I was going to vote for Nigel and there was no bloody chance I was getting the vote. So she's given my wife her vote by proxy

Jimmy: 0:58

I didn't know you could do proxy. I thought it was just like postal votes and

James: 1:01

you can vote by proxy. Anyway, very excited. got another visitor with us today.

Jimmy: 1:05

Yeah. Do you want to introduce Rachel?

James: 1:07

Well, I shall do that. We are here today, Rachel Edmondson Clark. Good morning.

Rachael: 1:12

Good morning. Hi guys. Thank you so much for having me. It's a real privilege to be here. I know how highly your show is, thought of and rated,

Jimmy: 1:20

part by us

Rachael: 1:21

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jimmy: 1:22

And our partners. Oh yeah.

James: 1:23

Oh yeah. And my mum likes it as well, but very nice of you to say. So. So we have got two episodes that Rachel's gonna help us with. The first one is gonna be talking about mood, and the second one is gonna be talking about emotions

Jimmy: 1:38

They're both firmly outside your comfort zone,

James: 1:40

your comfort zone, James. No, well, why, well, first off,

Jimmy: 1:46

well, first off, why are we talking about this? Why is this important to helping people improve performance and enjoyment of work? And secondly, and probably more importantly, in the right order, Rachel, why don't you tell people a bit about yourself? So They know who they're talking to, other than your name.

James: 2:03

Yeah, I have no name, that's my story.

Rachael: 2:07

thank you. So yes, I'm Rachel and I help leaders to change behaviors for positive results and to do that without resistance. So I work with a large number people, normally in sort of larger organizations. And we work a lot because fundamentally what drives our behaviors and our results is how we think. How we feel and what we believe. So to answer your question, Jimmy, this is why it's so important. If we want better results, if we want different outcomes, then looking at how we feel is an important part of that process. Not least to say, think it's how we then experience life, isn't it? it's true.

Jimmy: 2:51

Yes. Well, you had me at better results. But no, it's a great subject to be talking about and exploring today.

James (3): 3:00

So, let's start then. Here's my first question then. So what is the difference between mood and emotion then, Rachel? How would you define the two things?

Rachael: 3:09

It's a great question. It's not always simple, but I'll do my best to simplify it. So, feelings are essentially signals as to how well resourced we are in both our internal and external environments. And one way to think about the difference is, between moods and emotions, in terms of how we're feeling, is that mood is an internal signal. So, an internal signal such as we might be tired or hungry. So, something that's telling us about how well resourced we are internally. Where as emotions, they can be a little bit easier to identify because they're normally from the external environment, so normally something has happened in the external environment that would trigger us to feel a certain way. And when we are well resourced. Both from a mood and emotional perspective we, we, we feel good and I know I said I'd try to simplify this but I don't want to oversimplify it. Of course they are connected and they do relate. So if you think for example, if you were to feel angry, you might feel angry because that's a signal that you're under resourced because I didn't get to eat lunch before I came here. Yeah. Yeah. Or we didn't have the lovely cake that Jimmy bought us, or, that actually it's an, it's, it's an external environment thing because you think somebody is ignoring you. So there is absolutely a crossover with this. If you think about, if you are hungry or you are tired and something happens in the external environment. you're likely to not deal with it as well because you're not as well resourced from a mood perspective to deal with that.

James: 4:59

So you had a good climate analogy when we were talking this through earlier on, Rachel. So, if I remember this correctly, so it's a bit like the weather. So on the one hand, you've got the climate that you live in. you may live in the Mediterranean and it's and warm most of the time, or you might live in Britain and it'll be a bit cold and draughty. So that's mood, but then the weather that sits on top of that is the emotion. So have a storm in the Mediterranean and you can have a storm in UK just as well. How's that? Was I paying attention?

Rachael: 5:30

Yeah, you were. You did very well. You did very well. I mean, it's a bit like today. So we're obviously in the UK, aren't we? And it's July. So we're in, we're in what should be the height of summer. And it's easy to see by looking outside that it's a fairly, fairly pleasant day and the weather is nice. But it's not so easy from looking out here to identify the climate. so is this a nice day for spring? or is this a pretty cold day for summer? You know? Yeah.

Jimmy: 5:57

And what's the, the kind of importance or value about differentiating between moods and emotions?

Rachael: 6:05

So what we do about them would be different. So that's why you want to first of all recognize what is this? What is this feeling that I've got? Is this coming from a mood perspective, or is this coming from an emotional one? Because what we do, dependent on whether it's mood or emotion, would be different. And how we might either restore ourselves, or resolve if it's an emotion that we're feeling, we would take different action. But all the time what we're doing is we're looking to get ourselves back to homeostasis. A place where we are happy, we're balanced, where we can perform well. And that we're well. Okay,

Jimmy: 6:51

so we're looking for peak performance in our everyday jobs. We think about our moods and our emotions slightly separately, understanding the interdependence that exists, mainly because then the actions that we would take if we recognize that I'm in a bad mood or I feel angry, The actions might be different

Rachael: 7:14

Correct.

Jimmy: 7:15

terms of getting back to a position where I can deliver peak performance.

Rachael: 7:19

Because if you think about, if, if your mood is an internal biological system, signal that something's under resourced, there three environments that you would go to, to look to restore that mood. So, those three environments would be. It could physical environment, so it could be things like daylight, physical movement, things like that. It could be biological, we've already talked about, food, water. Sleep. Being tired. Absolutely. It could be social. That's the third environment. You know, we are social human beings and to be around people that we care about and who care about us is also really important. And of course, those three, those three environments, they all overlap and interlink. So to restore, we might go for a walk in the daylight with someone that we love, where we're getting movement and fresh air and that helps restore our mood. So this isn't, rocket science. A lot of us will know this, but what I find very interesting, with people in the working environment, is that while they recognize that, and they kind of instinctively know the importance of these things, we get into habits where we ignore them, where we work late, or we

Jimmy: 8:39

skip lunch. Skip lunch. It's the classic. I mean, how many times have you had lunch at your desk?

James: 8:44

Oh yeah,

Jimmy: 8:45

yeah, yeah. Let me just do a few emails while I eat my lunch. But I know that a pause and, some fresh air or make a difference before. Yeah,

James: 8:53

it's counterintuitive, isn't it? Because we have this whole sort cultural thing about working harder and faster and you must keep going. And yeah, no, yeah.

Jimmy: 9:00

I know this is a bit topical in terms of timing and this podcast might not go out quite close to this, but it's general election in a few days time. And did you see the latest campaign? The Tories who by the time this goes out won't be governing this country. But they they were critical of Keir Starmer because he had said that he was going to finish work at six o'clock on a Friday to spend time with his family. But the way they've done it is like, you've got a part time Prime Minister or if you don't want to do the work, don't do the job And they were really negative about it. So you sort of see that thing, that sort of reinforces it. I'd rather have a Prime Minister that did less hours and performed brilliantly than one that did loads of hours and was shit. It's a bit like my daughter. My daughter's just done her GCSEs. I went into her room and it was, I don't know, half past eleven and she's lying on her bed, she's got the light on and she's still morning at And the best thing she could do is go to go to Yeah, but it's a very similar thing. there's almost a sort of macho attitude, is you must keep going.

Rachael: 10:05

It could be macho, or it could be risk of, you know, feeling that perhaps I'm not good enough, a risk of shame, there could be a number of different things that might drive their behaviour. But it's recognising that, you know, I suppose another good analogy is a peak performance athlete. That peak performance athlete will absolutely train hard but they will seriously respect their rest days. Yeah. Because they know how they are to their performance.

James: 10:30

I like a good rest day. like good rest day.

Rachael: 10:33

A good rest day. good rest day. So it's the same for us, but here's the thing. We actually need to restore sometimes, kind of throughout the day well. So it's not just a, Oh, it's not just a culture of let's make it to the weekend or let's make it to the next holiday, but actually what are the habits, what are the routines that you've got in these three environments that are serving you to restore? We would never let. I'm looking at my, my phone, but we would never let the phone on our battery run low. And yet we let our own personal batteries run really low, and we don't restore them regularly.

James: 11:11

And you saw, I'm sorry, you talk about being under resourced, but in many ways is just biochemical or is there something more to it?

Rachael: 11:21

So yes if we are under resourced from that. perspective, it does impact us at a, biological level. Yes, it changes our chemistry, it changes our makeup.

James: 11:34

And so There was that, sorry to cut across, there was that lovely story about judges and what, I can't remember Oh yes, the Was it in Israel or New York? I can't remember, one or the other.

Rachael: 11:44

It was in the, it was in the States and I won't necessarily remember all details, but They did an experiment where they looked at how likely felons were to get parole dependent on when, whether the judge had eaten or not. Yeah. And they were much more likely to get that parole had the judge eaten. So how this might relate to us is you're going to go speak to your boss. Next time I meet my parole, 30 when he might be hungry before his

Jimmy: 12:18

an insight to everyone. Go after lunch, send them a hamper for lunch, then go and ask for the pay

James: 12:22

for the pay rise. Well, no, but it's a very interesting point, isn't it? Yeah. And actually, I remember I was at. Going out, when you just get to that point when your head's full and you've got another meeting that you have to go to, actually, and we've got a canal in Nottingham, I used to go out walking alongside canal with whoever it was I had to talk to. But even the fact that you've changed the environment and you've gone outside and you've got some sunlight and a canal and it, it just frees your head up and it's, yeah, fascinating.

Rachael: 12:49

Nature's another brilliant one to mention around the physical environment. You know, nature is also really important for us. Yeah. Coming back though, as well, to what you were saying about about when you go and speak to the boss about your pay rise. If we're tired, if we're hungry, if we are under resourced in the mood, which is what we're talking about at the moment, it increases our negative bias. So you might perceive people differently, and again, if you're a leader people, you need to pay really careful attention to this. Because otherwise the way that you see somebody's piece of work or their behavior or what's happening could be biased if you are, and negatively so, if you are under

Jimmy: 13:29

So, let me just play that back. So, if I am under resourced and something impacts my mood and it could be lack of sleep, it could be food, it could be whatever.

James: 13:42

Too much alcohol.

Jimmy: 13:43

Too much alcohol. When I'm looking at either my teams or I'm approaching my boss, I could already have a negative view on that interaction, on that piece of work, on that meeting, or whatever. So, you know, back to the reason for this podcast, helping people improve their performance enjoyment at work. If you're going to do that, you're never going to improve your performance. You're never going to do well, are you? Because you, you're always going to be, slightly in a bad mood, aren't you? You'll

Rachael: 14:10

You'll be fighting. Yeah. You'll fighting really hard. Yeah. And you know, I I I can tell you that there's a lot about mindset these days, isn't there? And positive thinking and, and I was in that place as well. And of course, being the specialist that I am in leadership psychology, I have a massive, massive passion for all of that. But there was a time in my life where I was relying so heavily on the mindset side things to master my emotions, to, keep positively moving forward. And I was ignoring what we're talking about here, the internal signals from my mood. And it was just like trying to push water up a hill. It was so hard because I was taking so much of my executive brainpower and my resources to try and think positively and do the right things in that situation. So it's, it's fundamental and it's why I wanted to start the conversation here with mood first. Because although we all know I think it's really important to that that rest, that, you know, quality nutrition, drinking the spending time with people that we love, getting outside, moving your body. We know all of these things, but how regularly are you doing it? And if there was one area, for anybody that's listening to if there was area that you knew that actually, if I made a change in this area, it would significantly shift. I think most people intuitively know where they need to make that adjustment.

Jimmy: 15:48

I think that one of the troubles though, are, people are looking for a silver bullet. people will be listening to this and thinking, wow, this is, fantastic stuff. I'll do this. What's my silver bullet? Actually, the reality is it's, this is a, a game of small incremental gains. So you could sit here and you've just described a whole load of things. I know I need to exercise more, move more, eat better, drink more water. It becomes the dangers. It becomes a bit overwhelming. So presumably it's better just to pick. one small change in your life and build that change until it becomes a habit as opposed to right I'm going to change everything about all my mood all the time because that just becomes too much doesn't it?

Rachael: 16:30

I think it's about being aware because our mood does change of From, you know, kind of throughout the day and throughout different phases of life So I think it is about being aware and understanding what will serve you most in that moment. And tuning into that. And yes, it's about consistency. It's not about a silver bullet. is about consistency and it is those small things, those things that become habit that become routine that you just do day in, day out.

James: 16:58

So what are the different types of mood then? So it's all very well to talk about mood, but that's, it's bit nebulous. What, is it possible define the different types of mood that we have?

Rachael: 17:10

Yeah, so I suppose It can be tricky with mood. It can creep up on you. We were joking before we came on air, weren't we? That that Jimmy's the one that can spot if you're in a bad mood. I think he was just, I

Jimmy: 17:21

just It's not just me, I not whole world can spot when James is in a bad mood,

James: 17:25

My daughter had a go at me the other night. And she said, you're in a bad mood dad, go out for a run.

Rachael: 17:31

Ah.

James: 17:32

Rather, it's exactly your point. Yeah.

Rachael: 17:33

Yeah, yeah. Often the first sign that I have that I'm in a bad mood is that my children, who are five and eight, do something in the morning on the way to school that on another morning would make me laugh or I just think, oh goodness, what have you, and I snap at them.

Jimmy: 17:48

Yeah.

Rachael: 17:49

And that's sometimes the first signal that I've got that, oh, I there's, there's, there's something, there's something that I've obviously gotten a little bit better, but that at identifying it. So I partner with a fabulous organization called CHX performance. And one of the ways that they help people to recognize and monitor their mood is with it's called the mojo app and it's 60 seconds. It reads your mood. We've used it just

Jimmy: 18:13

just before we've come here,

Rachael: 18:14

air, haven't we? And there's six components. to that which have been used in clinical psychology and psychiatry for more than 50 years and those components are proven to be clinically predictive of health and performance and they are tension, anxiety, vigour, fatigue, confusion and depression.

James: 18:36

we have just used this app and it's very interesting, you've We'll put a link through on the podcast notes, but you've just spent 60 seconds answering the questions. And I've got to say it was absolute rubbish because the app said that Jimmy was more vigorous than I am. yes.

Jimmy: 18:50

And everyone that knows us will know that as well.

James: 18:53

you go. Yeah. Lies, dumb lies, and statistics. But it's it was

Jimmy: 18:56

fascinating. The show you're listening to right now brings you insights to help you improve performance and enjoyment of work.

James: 19:06

It takes a long time to produce, but we think it's well worth it. It's all in the name of helping you getting the job. done well.

Jimmy: 19:13

All we ask in return is that you share the link to this show with someone that you think would benefit from it. And if you haven't already, Click on follow the show wherever you're listening to this podcast right now. Anyway, let's get back to the show.

James: 19:31

And what about so you haven't. Happiness. I would have thought happiness is a mood. Is figure in there at all or not?

Rachael: 19:39

Yeah, so I suppose it's an interesting one happiness. It's a high energy mood state, happiness. Yeah. It's something that we get as human beings when we're faced with an excess of resources. And it, allows us to sort of, you want to capture as much of that resource as you can, but it's a short lived phenomenon. And it's not a component of health or performance. So I think contentment is where resources are met. Happiness is where we've got excess resources. So human beings, tribal, you think about it. We've got an abundance we've had the big kill we're, we're happy about that. So, but it's not something that's going, no, it's not going to keep. No, that's not something for us to, sustainable performance over a long period of time if you see what I'm saying yeah that makes sense sorry

Jimmy: 20:36

if That's all sensible and all logical and like you said, when you described it earlier, you said like, you know, drink more, I know all those things. Everyone

Rachael: 20:44

does, yes. And

Jimmy: 20:44

When we know intuitively and we know it works, when we try, why don't people do it consistently then?

Rachael: 20:51

Because there's a lot of instant gratification with things and other distractions. And I think it does, it does take. some conscious effort to decide what are going to be your habits and routines that support you well. And here's the thing, and I learned this from my health coaching, what's right for one person is not what's right for another. my partners And my partners at CHX have this great saying which is become a scientist of yourself. So how much sleep you need Jimmy versus me versus James might be different. How much water you might need to drink could be different. I would encourage everybody to become that scientist of themselves. To think about what is the particular area that they know that if they were to change that would Significantly help. And to focus in there, as you said before, because you start to change everything all at once, it overwhelming and we, and then we don't, and then we don't do it.

Jimmy: 21:58

it. And also you don't know what things you've done that make the biggest difference. So you think it's everything, when actually it could be one or two things that are really, where you get the real bang for your buck. Just do them more and lean heavily on them rather than I've done 26 things to improve my life I've got to do all those 26 all the time. Maybe not.

Rachael: 22:18

We get so enveloped in. the urgency of life and what's happening, you know, the busyness of our work lives, our family lives, the things that are going on. And it's easier to take the instant gratification hit the scrolling on social media, perhaps late at night. So, that's not helping your sleep. To it could be the glass of wine at the end of an evening. Yeah. So the other, the other thing, the other little tip that I would share is Instead of cutting out try crowding out. So let's just say you know that I probably drink too much coffee Yeah, don't try and cut the coffee out Actually crowd it out and be free Before you have your cup of coffee, have a glass of water. And then you're quite, and then if you still want cup of coffee, once you've had the glass of water, then have the cup of coffee. there's lots of little, tricks. And I think James, you may have said to me, you've read this book and it's a great one and I would recommend it called atomic habits by James Clear. And he, he gives some, he gives some wonderful, very practical strategies that are really helpful to help people build new habits. So that's a great resource

James: 23:28

So I feel the urge to summarise that a wee bit. So you've got mood and mood is in a way, it's almost like your internal landscape. Have you got the resources that you need? So in a way, it's a bit like a project. You know, you set a project team up and they've got all the right resources, they're more likely to succeed So, and another, there's dreadful Americanism, but we talk about setting people up for success, but actually they set themselves up for success internally. So that's what it is. I think the next bit then is really, however, to be conscious of it and to know yourself. Yeah, now we talked about an app. Are there any other ways you could know yourself? What else could you do without necessarily

Rachael: 24:06

Just by literally asking the question. As simple, as simple as that. So if you notice that you're feeling something, that maybe you're feeling tired or angry or whatever that feeling is, ask yourself, is this mood related or is it emotion? So is this because I'm under resourced in one of these

Jimmy: 24:32

think, I think answering questions around the three environments, because you laid them out, isn't it biological? So how are you feeling physically, so things like, daylight, the environment that you're in, moving, are you sat down, and social, how do you feel about the relationships, the people you're with, you know, the engagement that you've had, the empathy that you're being shown or not, it's so, I just think asking yourself questions on those three dimensions how are you feeling, how are you resourced, Presumably that would help you understand. Are you under resourced in any of those areas? And, yeah, I, I bet that, like I say, everyone's different and working out which ones of those make the biggest difference to you would also help. And

Rachael: 25:17

I would stress with the social environment that the restoration comes from being with people who we care about and who we know care about us. So that's, and that's what we're talking about here. Not necessarily our relationships with anybody and

Jimmy: 25:32

no, no, it's just a specific group.

Rachael: 25:34

those. Yes. About those that we know them, don't we? Those relationships that restore us.

Jimmy: 25:41

And then we were talking we've understood it's internal, it's mood, we understand how it impacts our performance, and we build awareness. And then it's picking the activities that help restore, and presumably those are, to a degree, individual, but some of them will be quite generic, won't they? So, getting enough

James: 25:59

sleep. Yeah, but it will be individual, won't it? Because I'd like to go for a run. Yeah, and not everybody likes to go for a run. quite straightforward. You ride horses. Yeah, I imagine that has a effect. Yeah, you ain't got me on the back no horse. very much. Yeah, so it will be individual, but it's knowing what those things are.

Rachael: 26:13

And remembering that those three environments are also intertwined. So you can benefit from restoring with all three of those environments. at the same time, like we were talking about, you go for a walk with somebody you care about, means that, and stop and have some lunch on the way, you are, you are doing all three of those things in, in one go.

Jimmy: 26:35

And I think the interesting thing for me though, is I think as a society. We are addicted to hard work and doing as a solution for performance

James: 26:48

Go harder. Go

Jimmy: 26:49

right? So it's just like, you know, plan A is I work hard, plan B is I work harder. And that's what people get caught in. Whereas actually, if you think about these things that resource your mood, that directly impact your performance, Actually, you have to take time out from your work. So you have to break that addiction to the way I am going to perform at my best this week is I'm going to work really hard and put the hours in. to let me stop at a certain time. But I used to do that in my last job. I knew the quality of my work dropped off. Depending on what had happened during the day, roughly around six o'clock ish. Half five, six o'clock. So I used to finish at the point where my work started becoming really shit, I used to stop. And I could see it, I could, I could see it in, you know, in the stuff I was writing. Just stop. But It's counterintuitive, because most people are like, let's just push on, I'll work till 8, 9 o'clock, I've got all this stuff to do. Well, the quality of your work isn't good enough,

Rachael: 27:47

isn't good enough. Here's where I'd encourage people to become that scientist of themselves. So, recognise it, you see the quality of your work drop, you're not getting out the email or the report or whatever it is at that level that you want to. So, recognise it, step away. Do something to restore and come back and see, how does that work for you? This is what I

Jimmy: 28:11

I'll finally say, it definitely did work, because what I used to do, is I used to finish at 6, I used to go to the gym, have some food on the way home, and when I got back to my flat, I used to just, if there was any really crucial tasks, you know, you've got to get out of that day, I used to do them. All of a sudden, I was doing them really well. Funny that. I didn't get them out at 6. 30, I got them out at 9 o'clock at night. But I've restored myself by then, so it definitely works.

James: 28:35

But that's only one part of though, isn't it? Right, so that's how you manage yourself. But what about how you manage your team?

Rachael: 28:41

That's a great question because I think first and foremost, role modeling it is the best thing that you can do initially. And secondly, it would be about how you support your team to restore on a regular basis. So giving permission to, let's say let's take this meeting and let's do it on the telephone while we walk and talk outside. Or let's take this meeting and go and get some lunch together. And I think the, the second thing that I would say would be around conversations. When we did this app earlier and we looked at our moods and we looked at our mood profiles, the three of us, It's a great way to start saying, well, what do you want? What do you need? How can I support you? What does this mean? And just to start having those conversations. And the more that we check in with one another and just when we say, how are you, and we don't just give the flippant response, but maybe we ask the question twice, you know, really, how are you? And as leaders, we role model answering with authenticity, you know, gosh, well, I had a bit of a tough day yesterday, or I'm a bit tired today, or what would really help me would be if we could just get straight to it today. Then. I think we start to encourage more open and honest conversations about what we, what we need from one another and then providing and supporting one another with that, making safe have those conversations.

Jimmy: 30:18

And that's important because I think the leaders set the, tone and the culture, is, it's all about the hours and the hard work. And that's how most leaders behave in fairness, you know. And it's like in my example, it's a good one for backing up restore yourself and then your work quality goes up. But equally, it's to make sure that when people get an email from you, nine o'clock at night. They don't think that's that they've got to do the same. And actually they realize you finished at five o'clock, you had four hours off and then you've done an email. So it's not about just doing hours. You have to set the tone. As you say, this is understood and appreciated and people can restore themselves. Without fear of reprisal,

Rachael: 30:56

and it's, and it's okay for people and for leaders to send emails potentially when they want to send them and when it works for For you with your flight, but have the conversation. It comes back having the conversation and saying to the team, do you know what, I might send you an email such and such time, cause that works for me. I get a burst of energy. I find I have that flow just later on in the evening when I've been to the gym and before I go to bed and I might want to utilize that, please don't feel you have to respond to me at that time. That just works for me. So it's, it's absolutely having those conversations and role modeling your own. Well being. is really good.

James: 31:36

So fascinating conversation. I'm going to just summarize that. Just, if you want to improve your moods, two things that you should know then, really is understand yourself, be aware, I quite like your idea of being a scientist on yourself and understanding what works for you and what doesn't work for you. But then equally as important, if you're running a team, know, just be very conscious of what the mood of your team is and what you are doing which restore

Jimmy: 32:00

mood. And, clearly, the reason why we're talking about it is there's a clear correlation between your mood and your ability to perform in your job.

James: 32:10

Very good. Now, that ends, I think, this very exciting and informative episode, but we have another one talk about emotions coming up shortly.

Jimmy: 32:18

up shortly. Excellent. Looking forward to that. Thank you

James: 32:20

very much for coming and talking us, Rachel.

Rachael: 32:22

Thank you,

Jimmy: 32:23

us, Rachel. Rachel.

32:25

We cover a whole host of topics on this podcast from purpose to corporate jargon, but always focused on one thing, getting the job done well. Easier said than done. So if you've got. Unhappy customers or employees, bosses or regulators breathing down your neck, if your backlogs are out of control and your costs are spiraling and that big IT transformation project that you've been promised just keeps failing to deliver, we can help. If you need to improve your performance, your team's performance or your organization's, get in touch at jimmy at jobdonewell. com or james at jobdonewell. com.