Why Some Bosses Bring Out The Best In People

Let’s be honest: most bosses are forgettable. They’re neither terrible enough to inspire a mutiny nor brilliant enough to earn your loyalty. But the ones who do stand out? They’re either the reason you quit or the reason you stayed. This week, Jimmy and James ditch the usual rant about bad bosses (though, let’s face it, they’ve had a few) to tackle the far trickier question: What actually makes a good one?

Turns out, it’s not about charisma, a fancy title, or even a well-stocked biscuit tin. It’s about clarity—knowing where you’re going and making sure your team gives a damn about getting there. It’s about adaptability, because what works in a crisis won’t fly in a calm. And it’s about trust: not the corporate buzzword kind, but the I-won’t-throw-you-under-the-bus kind. Oh, and asking questions. Why Am I Talking? should be every boss’s mantra (thanks, James’s old boss).

But here’s the kicker: being a good boss isn’t about being liked. It’s about creating an environment where people want to do their best work—even when the system is stacked against them. So if you’re tired of pointless targets, blame games, and bosses who treat you like a spreadsheet, this is your therapy session. No fluff, no jargon, just the hard truths about leading without losing your soul (or your team’s).

Five key points:

• Clarity of purpose is non-negotiable—if your team doesn’t know where they’re going, they’ll just wander into a ditch.
• Adaptability separates the memorable from the mediocre; one size does not fit all.
• Blame is the enemy of progress—good bosses fix problems, not people.
• Asking questions beats having answers; your ego is the least interesting thing in the room.
• Trust is the glue—without it, your team’s just a bunch of people waiting for the next screw-up.

Transcript

Speaker 3 0:03

Hello, I'm James. Hi, I'm Jimmy, and welcome to A Job Done Well. The podcast that helps you improve your performance and enjoyment at work

James 0:15

Good afternoon. What are we talking about today?

Jimmy 0:17

So today, James, we are going to talk about how to be

James 0:22

All right

Jimmy 0:23

Now, now we talked a few episodes ago, we talked about bad bosses, and we slaughtered loads of bad bosses that we've worked for, and ourselves in fairness. But today we're going to focus on the positives, and we're going to explore how we can all go about being a better boss and getting more out of our team as a result

James 0:42

Ah, very good. What makes a good boss then? Oh, no, let me put it this way.? So of the bosses you've had then, how many of them have been good bosses and what sort of things do they have in common?

Jimmy 0:53

We talked about this before, I think in percentage terms, I think a relatively small percentage I would say were really good. A re-a relatively s-small percentage are really bad, and then everyone's just in the middle. So I think for me, the ar-art form here is if you're leading people, how do you take yourself out of the pack? 'Cause, when you're in that pack you might do some things right, you might do some things wrong. But you're just in a pack of people and you don't stand out, I couldn't even probably name half of them. but the memorable ones are the really good ones and the really bad ones. So me, I think the really unhelpful

James 1:30

Yeah, go on.

Jimmy 1:30

hopefully you've got a

James 1:31

I'll have to think quick

Jimmy 1:33

I think it depends because it's very individual and circumstantial. And by that I mean if we are, if you and I are working together, if we're working in a certain situation where everything is ticking along really nicely and very smooth and very easy, you're looking for certain things from your boss. If we're in, in a different situation where the shit's really hitting the fan, we want a different set of actions and behaviors. So I think some of it is circumstantial and some of it's individual. So the things that you like in people might not be the things that I like, and vice versa. So I think where that draws me to, is it depends. The more helpful answer is for me it's about a-a-adaptability. So how do I adapt to the fact that in my team and in the circumstances I'm gonna manage that team, there's gonna be a whole load of variety, and how do I deal with that authentically

James 2:30

Yeah. And I am a bit more positive about it, I'll be honest. So I totally agree there are some who are standout greats, and there are some who are standout just freaking desp- There's one, but we could do a whole episode on him, and we're not gonna go there. Move on, James. Right? But you know who I'm talking about, don't you?

Jimmy 2:49

I do,

James 2:49

But,

Jimmy 2:49

do

James 2:50

So I think that if we were to write a list of people that we both worked with or for, and we were to rate them from who was the best boss to who was the worst, I think we'd have quite a lot of commonality. I think... Yeah, I do actually. Well, yes, I'm very certain of that, which is good for this podcast because it means that we will have things we can talk about, which are more than just circumstantial. I buy your point that, yeah, it does depend on the circumstances, but I think there are actually some things that they've got in common. And actually, although we don't need to dwell on it, I think another way of looking at it is if we were to talk about bad bosses, we'd come up with a pretty good list of things we agree with for bad bosses. You know, we would say they were over-controlling. We'd say they were only in it for themselves. They kept changing their mind. They were unhelpful. Those sorts of things. Yeah. Didn't know where they were going. Weak. Didn't stand up to people. So if we could,

Jimmy 3:47

yeah.

James 3:47

on a list of... Well, I don't think it's worth doing, but if we could agree of a list of qualities on bad bosses, then I think actually we could probably agree on a list of good qualities for bosses

Jimmy 4:01

Well, today we promised ourselves we wouldn't dwell in the the misery of bad bosses, so let's focus on that list then.

James 4:09

Well, the first one for me, and it, it's hardly surprising 'cause we bang on about it all the time, but a good boss is very clear on purpose. They're absolutely sure where they want to be going. They're very clear with you where they want to be going, and they... what good looks like. "We're going in this direction." And that's great, but the really good ones, I would argue, do that about something that their teams can get excited about

Jimmy 4:36

On this one we definitely completely overlap on that. I, but I do think it's a, a nuance on what you said. It's the what good looks like as well. So I think, yes, having a clear, bold, compelling vision that they get everyone en-engaged in, that's part of it. Some of the best bosses I've worked for are very clear on what good looks like for me and for what good looks like for my team, think takes a lot of the ambiguity and the, the politics and the trying to figure out stuff,

James 5:04

Yeah. And actually a lot of frustrations at work are when people are clashing over what the purpose is. So I think, I mean, I don't think we need to dwell on that one so much.

Jimmy 5:13

Just on that, Jane, I worked in the same organisation, right, for, for a while. And for the first, I think probably two years, right, we had a clear purpose. had a burning platform, and we had to solve that, and the whole organisation was galvanised a-around that. Year three, we had solved the problem, and we didn't clarify a new direction, the organisation

James 5:39

Yeah

Jimmy 5:40

a little bit. People's different agendas started to creep in, and their politics started to creep in, and the games playing started to creep in and, you know, so things really started to drift. Then when we restated what we were there for, again, back on, So it was the same people, same situation. It just really depended on whether we

James 6:00

Yeah. People collaborate much more if they've coalesced around a purpose, which just means the working relationship better. I early in my career I w- was, worked in research and development, and I worked for a boss, and he was golden so long as you were doing something that was innovative. Well, makes sense when you work in research and development, yeah? He moved on. We then got a new boss and she was only interested in cost savings. Do what you like as long as it was saving the organisation money. What was interesting though was the team. You know, you go work in R&D, it's because you like innovative stuff. It's not 'cause you like cost saving stuff. So everybody... It, it didn't appeal to the team. So I think there are two things to it. Yeah, she was clear about the purpose, but it wasn't something the team could really get behind or were excited about. So it is those two things, clarity of purpose and it being something that people could feel they were doing good with

Jimmy 6:49

And, and just on, on that second bit, James, was that where you built up your or started your allergy towards cost-saving initiatives?

James 6:58

Futile in the extreme. No, Have I told you the story about Forest Mars? Yeah, I've told you I worked for Mars. I'm sure you've heard that bit. But I worked

Jimmy 7:05

You, we spent, we spent the first 12 months of working together and everyone used to take the piss

James 7:10

Yeah.

Jimmy 7:11

James,

James 7:12

Yeah.

Jimmy 7:12

I worked for Mars, Lawther

James 7:14

I have met one of the Mars Brothers, Forrest Mars. It's a privately owned business. And these guys were billionaires, and there's this damn fool Yank wandering around the plant in some It was just the most God-awful jumper you have ever seen in your entire life. It was a crime against style. And I said to my boss at the time, I said, "Who the hell's the Yank in the jumper?" And he says, "Oh, that's Forrest Mars." Oh, okay. Anyway, I only had one conversation with Forrest Mars, and that's where he took me aside and he said, "James, what you don't realise is you don't save yourself rich." And then he turned tail and walked off. That's the only conversation I've ever had with a billionaire, American or otherwise, but that is one of the reasons why I'm a bit anti cost saving. But let's move on. He was a very good boss in that regard. Yeah, he knew where he was going. Very clear. So go on then. We've defined what good looks like. So what will be your next thing?

Jimmy 8:04

You worked in an environment where they wanted more innovation. People want more of this. This is changing. The world is changing. All of those things require a level of experimentation and testing When stuff goes wrong, how do you respond to it? A good boss will respond to it, positively and help the teams and the people learn from what's gone wrong. A bad boss goes and seeks out the villains of the piece and starts casting blame, which immediately creates defensiveness and a complete unwillingness to

James 8:38

Totally agree, and it's not just about innovation. You know, stuff goes wrong. You've got competitors doing things. You've got people in other departments doing things. You can't control it all. You're a fool if you think it would, yeah? You've got the old Mr. Six Sigma coming here, but you've got variation going on left, right, and center. You cannot control it. Stuff goes wrong. I worked for a bloke once who was a Anyway, when things went wrong, particularly if it got to his boss, he'd find somebody in his team to blame. Now, did that

Jimmy 9:09

Really?

James 9:09

God's sake. So how did that go? A, you wouldn't tell him when things had gone wrong, and B, everybody thought he was trying. And there is that thing, you know, about when when you are... Fortunately, I've never done it, but in the First World War, when they were fighting in the trenches, yeah? How many people are you gonna over the top of the trench for? And yeah, this guy wasn't one. So there you go. Don't blame people. Stop looking for villains. So yeah, totally agree with that one

Jimmy 9:31

Just on that, that last point. I think that, willingness to unlock the discretionary effort for a boss, I think that's always a good measure a good boss. If you find yourself running through walls for someone,

James 9:46

Yeah. No, I think that is a very good test. Yeah

Jimmy 9:49

Yeah.

James 9:49

Well, I think a good boss isn't just focused on their bit of the organisation. They stand back and they look at the whole picture, and they're in a better p- position to do that than you are 'cause they are the boss. But on a link to what we've just said, you know, all the activities that happen in an organization, they're all linked. They don't happen in isolation. Yeah? And so if you want things to run smoothly, having a boss who can stand back and look, and understand the bits upstream and downstream, is really all-important. So I'll give you an example. It's a very obvious example. One organization I worked for, I was in charge of complaints, would you believe? Right. So I've got a team handling complaints. They had a target, or, oh, I don't know, some ridiculous target, 80% of complaints had to be hap- handled in 14 days or something ridiculous. We never got anywhere near it. You know, and that'd be very easy to jump up and down on people's heads and say, "Well, why didn't you get the complaints? What, what's stopping you?" The reality is, they were handled by a call center somewhere else, you know, where they'd incidentally put in some cost saving initiatives, and then they just dribbled through as and when they could get by to us. But once you stand back and you look, and you understand the system and understand what's going on, then you can start to act and smooth things out, which the people who are working for you don't have the opportunity to do. So I think that's the the thing I'd say. You know, pay attention to what's going on and look at the wider picture

Jimmy 11:12

Another angle to being a good boss is you start off your career, invariably, you have a deep level expertise in quite a narrow field.

James 11:23

Yeah

Jimmy 11:24

what happens to us, and then you build your reputation. When I for a betting company in-initially, I knew everything about the customers and the events and the stuff that we're doing. So I was successful because I had deep expertise in that. And then all of a sudden, you get promoted to a level where the breadth of what you're looking after, you can't have that same deep expertise that you once made your name on. The change for me with somebody who's, a good boss is, is are they able to do that pivot where, you're going deep on something and all of a sudden you've gotta go really shallow on lots of things? Now, the implication of that is you're not gonna know everything, so it's-- it can be a little bit uncomfortable when you're used to being a deep expert. And secondly, you have to build up levels of trust and ability to ask the right questions of the people who are the deep experts. Otherwise, you add no value. You just get in their way. So I think, yeah, it links to that see the whole picture, but how do you manage that breadth versus

James 12:31

Well, yeah, and so I think that links really nicely to my next point, which is a really good boss asks questions and doesn't think he's got all the answers. It's not about his or her ego. They realise that they don't know anything, and they spend their time asking questions and finding out what's going on

Jimmy 12:49

We just should also plug the episode we did with

James 12:52

That's great.

Jimmy 12:52

Reinberg last year on the power of questions. It's worth having a look at that 'cause that is a really underused skill

James 12:59

one of my bosses, he had this lovely acronym. He said, "James, you've gotta remember the acronym WAIT." W- W-A-I-T: Why am I talking?

Jimmy 13:10

Oh, I like it.

James 13:12

Very similar to what my wife says to me, which is, "Why are you talking?" Anyway, but it's really powerful, right? 'Cause a, a really good boss knows what they know. They should be far more interested in what you know, because that they will, they will learn something. So some really, do you know, simple questions a good boss will ask are things like, "What would make it easier?" or "What's getting in the way?" As opposed to, "Why aren't you doing that?" And it links a wee bit to that point about blame, but just that whole thing about understanding. I a really powerful question I used to use was, "How can I help?" or "What would you like me to do?" And most bosses don't say that 'cause they're f- scared that they'll get lumbered with a whole load of extra work. But the reality is people like to be self-determining. They want to take control of their own destiny. So actually the act of saying, "How can I help?" They invariably say, "Well, it's all right. I think we've got it covered. We don't need your help, thank you very much."

Jimmy 14:06

Yeah. I'd, I'd, I'd argue that with that slightly, James. I, I don't think it's they're motivated by not wanting extra work. I think they're motivated by the fact that a lot of people think they know the answer. The reason they don't ask questions is 'cause they're too busy telling people what they should be doing and how they should be doing it. That, that ego of whe- whether it's born out of arrogance or insecurity, in other words, "I, I'm the boss, I should know the answer, shouldn't I?" It still comes

James 14:35

Yeah, but a little humility is a fabulous thing, right? Yeah, and there's this, well, there's that quote, isn't it? You know, if you're a good j- boss, your job is to make the room smarter, not to be the smartest person in the room. So yeah, how do you get all that information out? And it's about asking questions and burying your ego. So I think that makes a good boss

Jimmy 14:54

And one that we, almost certainly will disagree with each other on, I think you've got to build and maintain relationships with the-- with your team. And,

James 15:04

Ah, you're wrong, mate. They're just a bunch of spreadsheets. You need to treat your team like spreadsheets, and you'll be okay

Jimmy 15:09

But in, in all seriousness, I think, people want to have individual relationships, and their boss is a really important relationship. So ask yourself, you know, stuff about your team members' kids, their partners, their pets, what they get up to out-outside of work? It means a lot when you say to somebody, I don't know, you know, it sounds trite, but, "How's your dog?" You know, "I know your dog's been ill," you know, "How's Bear doing?" It means a lot to somebody. Whether you care deeply about the future of their dog, whether you've ever met their dog, it's almost irrelevant. It is just, being... interest in them as a person because, A, that will matter to them, and B, it creates an environment where they feel like they're

James 15:55

yeah. Well, people want to matter. They need to be relevant. So yeah, I would say to me, but this is important. You're absolutely right. It's very important because people need to matter. And there's another bit to this as well, which is, sorry, a little bit more transactional, but it's very easy to think you understand what your team's motivations are and what their desires are, and who will want this project and who wants to do that.

Jimmy 16:16

Yeah

James 16:16

you don't know, you know? If somebody's having a divorce, that-- or they've got... It's very different to somebody having a poorly child. Yeah, their motivations and their actions will be totally different. So understanding about your team is all important. I totally inter- agree

Jimmy 16:30

And equally, you need to let them understand you. So, we tend to try and be this, absolutely perfect, I-- nothing, nothing ever goes wrong for me. I, can handle everything. Show no vulnerability, whereas actually you've got to let

James 16:46

Yeah, no, totally agree A lot of management is about measures, and actually the way you as a boss use measures is all important, I think. So if you use them carefully, I think that can put you in a really strong position, right? And it's your point about understanding. Yeah, using measures to understand what's going on and help test things and try things, absolutely important.

Jimmy 17:13

What? You

James 17:13

Now,

Jimmy 17:14

setting

James 17:14

using targets- No, no. Dig away. Dig away. Yeah. But yeah, targets just bugger things up. I, I... Do you know? Well, the number of times I've had a boss give me a target and it's been, you know, an objective or something like that, and it's some mundane thing, but 'cause it's been written in PowerPoint, you know, and we've got to hit this flipping number, and just that complete lack of understanding of what's going on and just the obsession with hitting the target, 'cause hitting the target makes you look good, right? So using measures all important, but just getting obsessed about targets is a bit pointless

Jimmy 17:52

We did an episode early on about

James 17:54

Yeah.

Jimmy 17:54

gets done, so it's worth, worth checking that out. But would it help your therapy if we did

James 17:59

Yeah, we can do...

Jimmy 18:01

just allowed, allowed you to

James 18:03

Yeah, pointless targets. Pointless targets. But I think the thing here is teamwork is more important than targets. So you're setting people individual targets and individual measures, yeah? But that's not what being a boss is about. The point about being a boss is to coordinate and get teamwork. So I think yeah, understanding metrics and using them to understand where things are going badly and what we need to do differently, all important. But you know, if you care more about the metric than the behavior, then I think you've got a bit of a problem

Jimmy 18:33

Next one is back to that environment you create around your team. In today's world, if you're gonna be successful, you've got to be improving. You can't stand still. There's always relentless need for better performance or new innovation or stuff that's happening in the market. It's never ending. And the only way you can really tackle that successfully is to create an environment where

James 18:57

Yeah

Jimmy 18:57

learn. so that's about, being open, observing, listening to people, looking up, looking out, looking around and learning and, and encouraging your

James 19:10

Yeah, and I don't think, I think so few managers realise that their staff want to improve their lot, they want to get better, and the only way you can do that is by learning. I totally agree. The alternative of course is just to sit on your hands and not bloody do anything, but your staff won't like that. So it is about moving forward in the direction you've talked about and learning, improving stuff, seeing what works and seeing what doesn't. Which then of course leads us back to that whole point about observing, going and flipping looking. So I think that's all important

Jimmy 19:42

Yeah. And, and I think one of the good challenges if you're running a team of people ask yourself how much time you've spent this week sitting next to somebody while they do their work. know what I mean? Just observing what they're-- what's going on, chatting to them about what they're doing,. And, and not just your direct reports, but right at the people frontline serving your customers or executing your process, whatever it is that you're doing. Have you observed them doing their work this week? 'Cause that's where you learn ultimately

James 20:15

Yeah, which kind of.... there's a management guy and he said, you know, the three things of a good manager does is purpose, which we talked about, or direction,

Jimmy 20:23

Yeah

James 20:24

space, and resources, how do you know you're getting people the right resources if you don't know what they're doing? Being close enough to understand it without telling people what to do, absolutely all-important, which kind of brings us back to the whole point about learning. But you don't get the learning, of course, if you haven't got an environment in which people trust you

Jimmy 20:45

And equally, you've got to trust people that, A, they can get on and do their job, trust their capability. They've got to trust you on how you're

James 20:54

Yeah

Jimmy 20:55

to things. So back to your point about the boss who, you know, always threw somebody under the bus. Well, he had zero trust with his team. You know, they didn't trust him to not throw them under the bus. So funny enough, they'd never

James 21:08

Yeah, and you know, you then get, we're getting to the other thing, my other trigger word here, which is performance management. But you know, if you can't trust your staff, if they are useless, get rid of them. Don't hang back, just get shot of them. But you need to be in a position where for your team you got, have people, you hire people that you can trust and you can let them go on with it. 'Cause you haven't got time to be doing everything else

Jimmy 21:29

Yeah, and, and just one small point, James. We've done two episodes on performance management, and it's still, it, you know, tri- deeply triggered. So I don't think the

James 21:38

Well,

Jimmy 21:38

of doing podcasts

James 21:39

could do a targets and performance management double header. Moving myself away from it, it's this thing about treating people fairly and just respectfully. I... Oh, here's a story for you. We had, one organization I worked for, they had a stupid rule. There were lots of people traveling everywhere, and the trains get delayed, and there was the whole delay repay thing. You can claim money back on the train. So HR put out a rule, right? Which was that if you were delayed on a company paid for train, you had to

Jimmy 22:13

Yeah

James 22:14

make the reclaim, and then you had to

Jimmy 22:19

No,

James 22:20

use that reclaim for company business. No, I'm not, right? So I kid you not, this is what they... That was the, that was the expenses rule. And I had a guy come talk to me, and he said, "I don't travel as much as you do, James, but I've got 200 quids worth of vouchers 'cause I keep getting stuck in Manchester at 11 o'clock at night when I'm trying to get home." And I just looked at him. I said, "Well, go and spend the money. Take your wife somewhere. You have that money." 'Cause it's absolutely out of order for the company to think it's okay that if you're sitting there at 11 o'clock at night on some bloody train that's not moving, and you're going to all of the pain, yeah? Yeah. W-

Jimmy 22:58

Yeah

James 22:58

the company's got the rights to have that money? That very act of treating people fairly does a huge lot for what the teams think of you

Jimmy 23:06

You can get your money back for your ticket. Does that suddenly make your company more successful and more profitable? 'Cause I guarantee you, the £200 that you got back from his vouchers versus how

James 23:17

Oh.

Jimmy 23:18

pissed him off,

James 23:19

yeah, absolutely.

Jimmy 23:20

200

James 23:20

It's very easy. That whole point about, well, trust is, you know, very easy to dissolve some trust by pissing people about. So which leads us quite nicely onto, I think, my next one, which I've talked about in the past, which is the whole management umbrella. Yeah, so a good boss, I think a really good boss stops people from getting wet, but they should know it's raining. So it's just that whole balance of shielding off the corporate excess and shielding off the oh, organisational barons who are jumping up and down, whilst at the same time getting people to realise it's a bit painful. So I think that's quite an important role of a good boss

Jimmy 23:57

Yeah So where does that lead

James 23:58

Well, I don't know. I suppose you've got to pick your, your favorite things, what would your summary be?

Jimmy 24:03

Well, the interesting thing going through this episode is, there's loads of stuff out there about, good bosses and bad bosses and all this sort of stuff. So we're, we're just giving today our take on what we think makes a good boss.

James 24:16

on, just before we go, let's not decry it. Between us, we've had the thick end of 70 years worth of working for people. So, you know.

Jimmy 24:22

We know our stuff, but we have definitely had some horrors and we've had some very good bosses. So, you know. And I'm, I'm just saying that there is like a volume of material out there if anyone wants to explore it more. They're knock yourselves out. So go on, James, what were your top takeaways from today's

James 24:37

I, I think the one that's really important for me is a bit biblical, but, you know, treat people the way you'd like to be treated yourself. Nothing very clever about it, but that I think is a really important thing the second thing I think is, is just ask, don't tell. Because you know what you know, but if you ask people, you'd be amazed what you can learn. Get people the things they need to do their job. I mean, a lot of being a good boss is just about getting people the resources they need, and also just the ability to stand back and look at the big picture and, yeah, help people negotiate their way through the organisation. So those would be my four things

Jimmy 25:14

I think they're good things. I would have

James 25:15

No, there's a go. You're gonna disagree with me, are you? Go on

Jimmy 25:18

Yeah? Well, no, not, not actually disagree, but I think you should treat people as they

James 25:23

Yeah. All right. Very good. Yeah

Jimmy 25:25

to be treated. Because if you take you and me, we're completely different, right? And we'd like certain things If you always treated people as if they were James Lawther, Jesus Christ, that would

James 25:34

Yeah, right

Jimmy 25:35

a little while. You know what I mean? So, so it's back to my point

James 25:38

understanding, yeah

Jimmy 25:40

People as individuals. I think the second thing for me is just I'd agree. I think creating that real sense of direction, getting people bought into that sense of direction, I think is massively important. One area this is a, a passion of yours,, which is just understand how the environment impacts the people that are working for you. 'Cause I think we overestimate or certainly I've been guilty of overestimating the importance that ha- that people have

James 26:07

Yeah, yeah,

Jimmy 26:07

the system

James 26:08

yeah. Yeah

Jimmy 26:08

around them, and the system around them can boost them up or stop them dead. But unless you are conscious about that, you can get people as geed up and ready and capable and fired up as you want. If the system complete takes them off their knees, they're not gonna get very far. So I think, understanding that environment and the fourth one for me was really, listen more, tell less

James 26:32

So Final thoughts. I think really, and I would say this, right? But it's all about the system. So I just think as a boss, your job is to create an environment where people can do their best work. I've said it before, I'll say it again, but that's the job. It's not to tell people what to do. It's about creating that environment

Jimmy 26:49

Yeah, and, and like I said, Jones, that was one of the points I brought out. I, I guess I have a bit more of a view that it's a balance between, getting people fired up and capable and, and the system itself. And if you can do both of those, you'll be golden

James 27:03

Super. So we don't need any feedback on how good we were as bosses. Thank you very much. If you've got those sorts of comments, you can keep them to yourself

Jimmy 27:10

Which, which part of the good bosses was that? Is that

James 27:13

Okay.

Jimmy 27:13

open?

James 27:13

I was learning.

Jimmy 27:14

that was

James 27:14

I'm too old to be learning now. Yeah.

Jimmy 27:17

Well, it's all

James 27:17

So all right, yeah, there's no port- portal work for me.

Jimmy 27:20

you're all

James 27:20

Cool.

Jimmy 27:21

All right.

James 27:22

Speak to

Jimmy 27:22

Thanks everyone.

Speaker 27:23

We cover a whole host of topics on this podcast,

Speaker 2 27:26

from purpose to corporate jargon,

Speaker 27:28

but always focused on one thing, getting the job done well.

Speaker 2 27:32

Easier said than done. So if you've got unhappy customers or employees, bosses or regulators breathing down your neck,

Speaker 27:41

if your backlogs are out of control and your costs are spiraling, and that big IT transformation project that you've been promised just keeps failing to deliver,

Speaker 2 27:50

we can help. If you need to improve your performance, your team's performance, or your organization's, get in touch at jimmy@ajobdonewell.com or james@ajobdonewell.com.