Unpacking Habakkuk: Balancing Faith, Leadership, and Laughter

Ever wondered how dad jokes could illuminate leadership lessons from the Bible? Dr. Dean and I promise to tickle your funny bone while unpacking profound insights from the book of Habakkuk. In this episode of the Biblical Leadership Show, we start with some lighthearted banter before diving into the serious business of leadership principles found in chapter two of Habakkuk. Hear about Dr. Posey's journey as the interim senior pastor at First Methodist Church of Waco and how biblical teachings can enhance leadership roles in families, sports teams, and communities. It’s about finding that balance between providing valuable insights and keeping things upbeat, all while exploring the transformative power of scripture through the different stages of life.

Join us as we wrestle with doubts and embrace unwavering faith—Habakkuk-style. Together, we'll contrast the fleeting comfort of everyday conveniences with the enduring faith that God calls us to cultivate. We also highlight the difference between happiness reliant on circumstances and the profound joy that faith offers. Learn how asking tough questions can be a leadership strength and why setting goals with deadlines turns dreams into reality. This episode is a blend of spiritual growth, personal anecdotes, and a sprinkle of humor, leaving you with both wisdom and a smile.

Transcript

Speaker 2 0:27

Welcome, welcome, welcome.

Speaker 1 0:31

I'm just going to start it the right way.

Speaker 2 0:33

Welcome, welcome, welcome to another exciting edition of the Biblical Leadership Show. Hopefully that wasn't too loud. They're like whoa, whoa, whoa. Oh my gosh, they're like whoa whoa, whoa. Oh, they can turn it down. Hey, yeah, dr Dean and myself talking a little bit about leadership principles biblical leadership principles. Taking a little bit of the Bible, blend a little bit of leadership in there, throwing some dad jokes in there just because we can.

Speaker 1 0:57

Yes, because it's our show.

Speaker 2 0:59

Yes, how are you doing? I'm doing really really well Good to see you. You're looking good. I'm doing really really well Good to see you.

Speaker 1 1:04

You're looking good, I'm feeling really good, yeah. So let's just start out with some dad jokes.

Speaker 2 1:07

Why not? Why not? Why not right? Why not I?

Speaker 1 1:10

mean it's February, it is. So what's the best way? The best way to make an oak tree laugh.

Speaker 2 1:23

You should know this one, I should know this one, I should know this one.

Speaker 1 1:27

Tell a corny joke.

Speaker 2 1:35

I didn't get the thing. See, I haven't been in the studio.

Speaker 1 1:38

Yeah, you haven't been in the studio to fix the control panel.

Speaker 2 1:40

I know I haven't. I forgot all about it. That's okay, Don't worry about it.

Speaker 1 1:44

I mean, the audience will just suffer.

Speaker 2 1:46

They will suffer my gosh. They're gonna go please.

Speaker 1 1:49

Maybe they can do something on their phone. Yeah, I could probably do that, you know traveling back and forth to Waco every week now and, if you weren't, with our podcast last week. I am the interim senior pastor of First.

Speaker 2 2:05

Methodist Church of Waco.

Speaker 1 2:06

I'm very honored to be down there and so it's fun and challenging and the church that I was at when I was in college, so it was just a great experience to be down there for a couple of months and I haven't had any. They put me up at a house, which is really nice because I'm down there Saturday night through Thursday morning and so some people ask you gosh, you put in a lot of hours. Have you had trouble sleeping? I've had no problem sleeping at all. It is so easy I can do it with my eyes closed problems sleeping at all.

Speaker 2 2:46

It is so easy. I can do it with my eyes closed. Oh, I was in there going.

Speaker 1 2:52

where is he going with this one? Where is he going with this one? The dad joke is longer than the podcast we are talking about. Habakkuk today, but we can just tell some dad jokes, I mean, habakkuk is only like three chapters long it's, a little one, right it's a very little one. But I tell you there are some powerful, powerful leadership lessons, especially in chapter two, and we'll get to those in a few minutes. We got a few more dad jokes.

Speaker 2 3:16

He's just feeling dad jokey today. Just feeling dad jokey today.

Speaker 1 3:21

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 3:22

I am.

Speaker 1 3:23

You know, I'm not a narcissist. I'm feeling dad jokey today.

Speaker 2 3:27

Yeah, yeah, I am I you know I'm not a narcissist. I'm way better than that oh my gosh, he is just on a roll. If you don't know, we talked about this. Well, I've talked about many times. He's got the. He's got a jad dad joke spread here. He's got his show prep over here. He's got his 365 calendar that his kid gave him. We've got some books on the table dad jokes, they're all dad jokes.

Speaker 1 3:50

I got more dad jokes than show prep.

Speaker 2 3:52

He is exactly right.

Speaker 1 3:54

That is my show prep. Yeah, that is his show prep.

Speaker 2 3:56

So I have the show prep. He's got this stuff down after hanging out with it for 40, 50 years. Yes, exactly right.

Speaker 1 4:04

Oh, but you know it's interesting because you can look at the Bible with a lot of different filters.

Speaker 2 4:10

Right.

Speaker 1 4:11

You know, and when we look at it the way we've been looking at it now for gosh a year and a half and looking at right now if you're just new to the show we look at every book in the Bible and what are the leadership principles we can learn from that particular book? Habakkuk's only three chapters long, but it's especially in chapter two, verses one, two and three, some powerful leadership lessons. So you could just read it, just to read it, like you're reading through the Bible in a year or you're doing a Bible study. You might not pick up because you're not looking for it Right, and that's what we're here to help do is to look at that. And you might be a leader of your softball team, you might be leader of a scout troop, you might be leader of your bowling league. If you're a leader of your family, I think these principles are for you and so we enjoy it. You might not enjoy the jokes, but we do.

Speaker 2 5:13

We enjoy it.

Speaker 1 5:14

We very much enjoy it.

Speaker 2 5:14

We have fun with it. Yeah, we do. That's when we started out. We said we're going to have fun with this or it isn't worth it. We were both trying to figure out how to keep it lighthearted and stuff and not go down where it's too serious. I mean, we want to give you great information but at the same time we don't want to go through some of this. We want to leave with some positives. Our thing is sort of set up like chapters of the Bible. Sometimes we go dim and gloom and then we always end with the positive right, the hope. We get the glimmer of hope at the end, right?

Speaker 2 5:47

It depends on who you ask.

Speaker 1 5:49

It's like if that's hope I'll take the bad stuff.

Speaker 2 5:56

That is true, all right, so what about this chapter? Habakkuk, habakkuk yeah. What is this one? You know the way I understood it. It's like a conversation between the prophet and God.

Speaker 1 6:12

Yes.

Speaker 2 6:13

That's the way it's sort of set up right in a way.

Speaker 1 6:15

Yes, it is, and so he's having this conversation. And the main thing, if you look at it from the biblical point of view, is having confidence in God, no matter what happens, have confidence in God.

Speaker 2 6:29

Yeah, he was stressed out when God gave him the answer they were going to come in and change things around. He's like, well, wait a second. I don't know if I like this answer.

Speaker 1 6:40

But let's just look at chapter 2. Yeah, but let's just look at chapter two, and I familiarized myself right before the podcast. But this is chapter two, verses one, two and three. I'm just going to read them, then we're going to comment on them, and if you are in a place where you can look at this scripture later, I would encourage you to do so and glean at least one or two leadership principles from this particular chapter. So Habakkuk writes this. I will take my stand at my watch post and station myself on the tower and look out to see what he will say to me he's talking about God and what I will answer concerning my complaint. And the Lord answered me. Write the vision, make it plain on tablets so he may run. Who reads it? For still, the vision awaits its appointed time. It hastens to the end. It will not lie. If it seems slow, wait for it, it will surely come. It will not delay. So let's just go back to verse 1. I will take my stand at the watch post and station myself on the tower.

Speaker 1 7:48

So, he's talking about the tower around the city. You know, back then, just like castles, they had watchtowers, and so the purpose of a watchtower was to watch, to see if the enemy was coming or if there was a friendly force. They would know this is a friendly force and so they're always watching for something to happen and they're aware of that, they're tuned to that and I think a good leader that's what a good leader they're like a watchman on the tower, a watchwoman on the tower. They're looking to the future to think what is coming down the road, maybe worldwide, maybe in my organization, maybe in my line of work. If I manufacture clothing, what's happening in the clothing line? If I'm in the grocery business, and right now, with the egg shortage and the price of food, how am I going to accommodate that? So you're always watching out in the future and not shifting your vision, but shifting, maybe, your strategy and saying, okay, this is coming up, we see this is coming up. How are we going to adjust and accommodate what's happening?

Speaker 2 9:01

Yeah, and that's sort of what I got out of. It is have faith in your long-term visions, even when your short-term visions are struggling a little bit. Right, so there's going to be chaos, there's going to be things, but if you stay the course, you know where the ship's headed and that's where you're trying to get to. You know. I always reference it to you know, everything's great in business if you're on the superhighway. If you're on the superhighway, you can cruise down, everything's going. But here's the thing oh, somebody's got to go to the restroom or we need a little snack, and then you get off the road and the next thing, you know, you get back on and you're on this little gravel road taking you down. Well, that takes a long time, but eventually you always wake your way back to that super highway where it goes smooth. So have that. I'm going from here to El Paso and that's where my destination is. And if, wherever we end up on the way, we're going to get to El Paso, you know, and that's sort of the thought.

Speaker 1 9:54

Yeah. And so you have your vision. You know what's going to happen, what's going to look like in a year or two. And then you have your goals. What steps are we going to take to make that vision reality? But then you have your strategy. How are you going to accomplish those goals? And your strategy might have to change. You might have to rearrange the priority of your goals because goal number one might not work right now.

Speaker 1 10:19

You might have to go to goal number five and be that your priority. So the leader is always on the lookout to say okay, are we on the right course? Are we doing it right? Is because of what's happening in the market or whatever? Do we have to adjust things? And a good leader has the courage to make those adjustments when necessary. Now, obviously, you can't predict stuff like COVID, right? But you can have a contingency plan.

Speaker 2 10:48

Yeah, you need to have a risk plan in place with any business. You need to research what a risk plan is and put it in place.

Speaker 1 10:55

Yes, and so to me, that's the very first thing we see from Habakkuk. It's in chapter 2, verse 1, that they watch out for the future to see what is coming, and then, you know, the next thing that we see from Habakkuk is in verse 2, it says so. The Lord answered me write the vision. And so the question is is your vision, is it written down or is it just in your head? It would be interesting to do this for your organization. Get all of your and you can comment on this because you've done it a lot in your talks Sit down with all your people and give them a piece of paper and say, okay, write down the vision of our organization and see how many of them say the same thing.

Speaker 2 11:51

Well, most of them don't know the vision, they don't know their vision statement, they don't know their mission statement, they don't even know the goals or the core values of the company. I'm like, well, how do you know what you're coming to work for and you're working to the greater good of the company? I mean, you're just coming for a paycheck if you don't know where the company's headed. If you don't know where the company's headed and that's one of the things you've got to look at you know and you have to have that in place as a leader, but you've got to make sure everybody knows it as well.

Speaker 1 12:17

Yeah, so I don't know how you do that in your organization. Some have the vision written down on the wall, some have it on their business card, some have it on their stationery, some have it on their emails. But write it down, I mean, it doesn't need to be if it's in your head and not on paper. It needs to be somewhere so it's visible. And then, before the show, I was talking to Tim about this very same thing. I preach for a long time and I have a message that I feel that God put on my heart to share on Sunday morning. I'm not sure that what people heard is what I intended to say, because they could be going through a crisis in their life. They look at it, they hear something different than what I said.

Speaker 2 13:04

Sure, it's where people are at right, exactly right where people are at.

Speaker 1 13:07

So the question is, if you don't communicate it on paper, if you just communicate it verbally, are the people who are listening are they hearing the same thing you're saying? And it's like the old game. What do they call that? The telephone?

Speaker 2 13:23

game or whatever it was you sit in a circle and share something and pass it around. Pass the little sentence around and it's totally different by the other end.

Exploring Faith and Joy

Speaker 1 13:31

And so the question would be have your people and share what they heard you say to make sure everybody's on the same page.

Speaker 2 13:43

Well, just think about the Bible. If this wouldn't have been documented, how this would have changed over years. A lot of this would have went away. It would have been changed and modified to fit different people's agendas. Even the Bible in itself, I tell people, if you go back and read it maybe you read it when you were 20, it's going to read totally different when you're 40 or 30 or 50 or 60, because you're in a different place and you're going to pick up on different keywords based on where you're at and a place in life.

Speaker 1 14:16

That is so well said, and that's one reason I encourage people to always keep reading the Bible because you could read the exact same passage last year, but because you just retired, or you just got a new job, or you just got married, or you just lost a spouse, or whatever, you might read the exact same words and it means something totally different to you, and so that's a really, really good point.

Speaker 2 14:44

Yeah, and one of the things Habakkuk here I put down as a key takeaway. Habakkuk teaches us it's okay to wrestle with doubt, but ultimately we must trust in God's plan. Even in times of uncertainty, faith sustains us and joy is found in trusting God, not in our circumstances, and I thought that was very powerful A lot of times. How many times people look at where they're at or something's going on or they don't have enough money to put food on the table, whatever it is, and a lot of times you have to have a little faith and faith. Is this this magic thing that you know people have to, you know, accept? I guess in a way right, because a lot of people it's one of those things you can't reach out and touch and you have to assume that you have faith or you don't have faith.

Speaker 1 15:38

Well, we have faith, you know, and we're sitting here in the studio and I have faith that the person that put the electricity in this room, when I turn on the lights, the lights are gonna come on and not burn down the building, right, you know, when I was driving here to the studio, I had faith that the person that made the car I drive, the brakes are gonna work and the steering is gonna work, and so we—but that's a different type of faith.

Speaker 2 15:59

It is.

Speaker 1 16:00

You know that's a temporal faith, and what Habakkuk is challenging us to have is have eternal faith, have faith in the eternal and not just the temporal. And the other thing that you said I think is so powerful there's a difference between happiness and joy. Okay, the word hap actually, if you go back to it, the root word it actually means circumstances, and so so many times our happiness is dependent upon our circumstances, and the amazing gift that God offers through His Son Jesus is a joy that goes beyond our circumstance. So we could have joy in the eternal, but our circumstances might not be great right now, and so that is something that, if you ever need to talk to somebody about, reach out to us. I'd love to have that conversation.

Speaker 1 16:56

And we all go through difficult times. The question is are we relying upon to be happy Because we can't be happy all the time? We're going to have some difficult times. The question is are we relying upon to be happy Because we're not. We can't be happy all the time. We're going to have some down times, and Habakkuk was very familiar with down times.

Speaker 2 17:09

Yeah, he was.

Speaker 1 17:09

He really was.

Speaker 2 17:10

And you know. And then in verse 2-4, it says the righteous shall live by faith and get back on the faith. And I thought that was very unique when and we sort of talked a little bit about it but we didn't go down that path when God told the plan about Babylonians coming in and straightening things out, but they had worse morals and worse stuff going on than where they were at right we see in the Bible.

Speaker 1 17:38

It's like why did God use a kingdom that was so bad to come in and destroy a kingdom that was bad?

Speaker 2 17:46

I mean why, you know?

Speaker 1 17:48

And eventually we see that, eventually that all of that evil we see it in the end of the Bible all that evil at some day will be destroyed. God will have the victory, as someone said you know, I read the end of the book and God wins. Yes, between now and then there's going to be some challenging times and sometimes we have to suffer the consequences of other people's bad decisions. The question is is our life dependent upon our circumstances, or can we rise above that and have a different option? And that's to me the joy of Christ is giving us that security and that joy, even when our circumstances are not great right now.

Speaker 1 18:33

And Habakkuk is, I think, priming the pump for that, because he's saying, like you just said in verse 4, the righteous shall live by faith, and faith in an eternal God. That our security is in eternity, not necessarily here on this earth.

Speaker 2 18:49

Yeah, and he had to ask hard questions because he sort of pushed back on God a little bit and said wait a second, wait, wait, wait, wait. And that sort of ties me into leadership, that leaders, that we seek understanding or clarity in something. It's not a weakness but it's actually a strength. If we don't know exactly, you've got to get to the message and go tell me more about this, right? Because he sort of gave a little pushback in my research and said wait a second.

Speaker 2 19:17

I don't know if this is a good idea, right yeah?

Speaker 1 19:21

So let's just go back to verse 2 and 3. And so we look at verse 3, and it says For still, the vision awaits its appointed time. So if you have a goal, but the goal, as someone said, if the goal doesn't have a deadline, it's just a dream, right? So if you have a vision, which is great, okay, but your goals should have some type of timeline on them.

Speaker 2 19:45

And need to be wrote down, like we talked about last week. Exactly, right, it's got to be on paper.

Speaker 1 19:49

right, it's got to be written down, it's got to be on paper, it's got to be a deadline, and then you hold people accountable to that, and a good leader does that, and so's a good leader does that, and so what a great lesson from Habakkuk, and I think those are things that we can apply to today, no matter what organization we're in.

Speaker 2 20:10

Well, I think I'm going to have to hold you accountable to give us a couple of dad jokes to wrap this thing up.

Speaker 1 20:14

Well, I think I can do that yeah.

Speaker 2 20:17

I mean we got a few dad jokes. This is a short chapter, but hey people like that but they might not like it. Dad jokes are going to come up here for the next five dad jokes from Dr P, but we got it Okay.

Speaker 1 20:29

So why could the computer not take its hat off? Why could the computer not take its hat off? I don't know why could the computer not take its hat off? Because it had caps lock on.

Speaker 2 20:45

I will get this working by next week, is that?

Speaker 1 20:48

a promise to our audience, I will replace this our control panel.

Speaker 2 20:52

Well, you know, we usually have buttons, you know the drums, the trombones and all this stuff, yeah, the groans.

Speaker 1 20:59

I think our audience is missing that one the most.

Speaker 2 21:03

They do right, you know.

Speaker 1 21:04

So when I'm down in Waco, the church is providing me an Airbnb, which is real nice of them and it's a little house. It reminds me of the house that Diana and I first lived in when we were in seminary. But you know, the other night I had a dream it was the weirdest dream that I was eating a giant marshmallow.

Speaker 2 21:23

Giant marshmallow.

Speaker 1 21:24

Yeah, and I woke up and my pillow was gone. Oh, I would have so gave you the moan on that one.

Speaker 2 21:33

I don't even know if that's worthy of moan. Maybe the silence the crickets would have got that one.

Speaker 1 21:38

Cricket, cricket, cricket, cricket, cricket, crickets would have got that one Cricket, cricket, cricket, cricket. Well, you got something in there, I know you do.

Speaker 2 21:48

You know I've got a lot, but I looked at a few. I'm like, well, I better not say those. That's for a different podcast. Okay, so here's the thing why did Beckett stop worrying Because he learned to faith it till he made it.

Speaker 1 22:05

Faith it till you, make it right he faithed it till he made it Okay. So everybody should go to the dentist at least once a year. Yes, you know, I was told a long time ago by a dentist. You only need to brush and floss the teeth you want to keep.

Speaker 2 22:19

There you go, that works. That's pretty smart.

Speaker 1 22:22

So the dentist I go to, he bought a new boat.

Speaker 2 22:26

Guess what he named his new boat.

Speaker 1 22:34

I'm really thinking on this one. I don't. The Tooth Fairy, oh Tooth Fairy. Where is that groaner button?

Speaker 2 22:39

I was thinking like tooth ache because most people with boats think the best time about a boat is when you buy it and then when you sell it. You know their favorite times of it because they're painting the booty the whole time. So I was thinking toothache.

Speaker 1 22:52

Toothache. Well, it could be, you know, like someone would say I've never owned a boat. But someone said the best day of your life is when you buy a boat, or the worst day of your life is when you buy a boat, or the worst day of your life when you buy a boat and the best day of your life.

Speaker 2 23:04

When you sell it or something like that, it's like nope, nope, nope, that's the way it works, I'm not going to do it. All right, you done, I'm done. You got one more. Give us one more. I've got so many more Give me. You're amongst the working. You got to leave the stress out of your life, right? You're not retired right now for another couple months.

Speaker 1 23:29

What do you call? I'm a retired pastor, but I'm working right now.

Speaker 2 23:32

So what do you?

Speaker 1 23:33

call a retired minor.

Speaker 2 23:38

Like a minor, or a minor Like a coal miner. What do you call a retired? Yeah, I'm just making sure, yeah. What do you call a retired? Yeah, I'm just making sure, yeah. What do you call a retired? Yeah, like a minor young person, no a coal miner.

Speaker 1 23:46

What do you call a retired coal miner?

Speaker 2 23:50

Don't know.

Speaker 1 23:51

Doug.

Speaker 2 23:54

Oh, don't get me into name jokes.

Speaker 1 23:55

I can go a long ways with name jokes.

Speaker 2 23:59

We had those growing up man. Anyway, check us out biblicalleadershipshowcom, and you know, check us out. Go down and see Dr Posey, he'll be talking church down at.

Speaker 1 24:14

Waco, yeah, First Methodist Church.

Speaker 2 24:16

Waco, first Methodist. Watch him online at what is that Waco?

Speaker 1 24:21

First Waco, yeah, first Waco, yeah, first Waco.

Speaker 2 24:24

But check us out A bit of a leadership show, dr.

Speaker 1 24:27

P. Take us away. Hey, make it a great day. Thank you.