S2, E22: Detroit-Style Pizza Done Right with Sean Ladle

Detroit-style pizza doesn’t just travel well, it exposes weak restaurant habits fast. If the dough is off, if the timing slips, if the team phones it in, the whole thing falls apart. That’s why I wanted to sit down with Sean from Via 313 and talk about what happens when a sharp, specific food concept grows up and scales without losing the edge that made people care in the first place.

We get into the Via 313 origin story, starting with two brothers from the Detroit area, a trailer on 6th Street in Austin, and an opening night problem that feels impossible until you solve it (yes, they forgot the pizza cutter). From there, we unpack how a cult following gets built, why Detroit-style pizza is often confused with deep dish, and what makes the style so addictive: crispy edges, cheese to the corners, sauce on top, and a texture that hits different when it’s done right.

Then we zoom out to the Salt Lake City food scene and the broader Utah restaurant market. We talk about the “Utah has no good food” stigma, why it’s outdated, and why hospitality and experience matter more than ever when people spend real money to dine out. Sean shares what he looks for in great service, why authentic brands win, and how standards and consistency make scaling possible. We also shout out local favorites and drop a practical ordering roadmap for your first Via run, plus where to find locations and how to follow what’s coming next.

If you like smart food talk with real operator insight, hit subscribe, share this with a friend who argues about pizza, and leave a review so more people can find the show. What’s the one restaurant you’d be genuinely sad to lose in your city?

Check out the DLX 313 at Via313 today!

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Transcript

Opening And The Pizza Obsession

SPEAKER_01 1:30

There's one thing missing here in Austin, it's Detroit style pizza. They uh had a little bit of money, bought a trailer, opened it on 6th Street in Austin. They didn't have a pizza cutter. If you said anything bad about Via, you got punched in the face. Kind of like its own little m mini bike club. Because people were just so passionate about it. That's where Savory stepped in and started the growth. Utah is a food city. Like it is, there are some iconic brands here.

SPEAKER_00 1:50

She's like, oh, there's this like place that's that I've been to, it's good. It's called Via 303, let's go. I'm like, alright, like carbload, whatever. We go, I'm like, oh, every sentiment that I had, I apologize. You are right. There's some pretty amazing things coming up in the future for Via.

SPEAKER_01 2:03

Be who you are, be authentic. Just do what you do really well. I've had probably a lot of nights where I drove home without the music on. Just my sat in my garage for probably 10 to 15 minutes just processing the night before I went inside.

SPEAKER_00 2:25

Because if there's two things that someone doesn't matter how well I know them if they come to me and say either, hey, I've lost like a very significant amount of weight, or I've quit smoking cigarettes, or like, I mean, we can throw that drugs, addiction, whatever that could be in there. And it's always like. I did all three.

SPEAKER_01 2:39

Well, yeah, drugs and alcohol, uh, definitely um smoking and definitely uh being a tub of shit.

SPEAKER_00 2:47

Well, a tip of the cap to you. I mean, so many, I mean it gets even more broad from there with the people that complain about situations, whatever's happening to them, and it's like, well, are you gonna do something about it? They're like, well, excuse, excuse, excuse. Like, all right, well then yeah, good luck. That's the victim mindset, man. It's so true. Like, there's a quote that my stepdad's dad, so like step-grandpa gave me, he gave me like a stack of these cards before I went on my mission once upon a time. He was like, it's this quote from a uh general authority, but it was for every problem under the sun, there is a remedy or there is none. If there is one, hurry and find it. If there is none, never mind it. So I've always internalized that of like, is there a solution to my problem? Cool, let's go solve it. If there's not, I really can't like focus on this too much. There's always a solution. Always a solution. Yeah. Um, well, Sean, I'm excited to talk today because like it's um it's interesting to see Salt Lake's growth in so many different ways. But I think there's often time this

From Retail To Hospitality Leadership

SPEAKER_00 3:40

like area of growth that gets undermined of how many eyes externally look at Salt Lake City, at Utah, the broader picture, and say, hey, we're in, we're gonna invest, we're gonna put things there. Um, and then especially like twofold of having a fund that kind of gets under goes under the radar of a lot of like the other like traditional VCs that you see in the valley, but invest in a lot of traditional food and bev businesses. I mean, they've invested in everything from Swig to Mobetta's to, I mean, V obviously in all of these different ones, but I feel like this investment for them in the savory fund was so much more of like bringing something in than taking something in and making it out.

SPEAKER_02 4:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:20

So I'm excited to talk to you a lot about that today. But you have, I mean, it was fun looking at your background before this, and there's I mean a lot of iconic food places in Utah that um I mean got to be a part of your journey. So, first off, curious of how you ended up in Utah, but then talk to me a little bit about the kind of that road to Via.

SPEAKER_01 4:36

Yeah, no, absolutely. So roughly 25, 26 years ago, I was living in Seattle and uh I was working for a I was actually in the retail business, working for Pacific Sunwire Pac Sun. There was an opportunity to move to Utah to work and to kind of open up this market. So I jumped at it. Uh I grew up actually not too far from here up in uh southern Idaho.

SPEAKER_02 4:59

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 4:59

And uh so I was like, oh, it'll get me pretty close to home. So I did that, uh, quickly realized how much I absolutely despise retail and uh got a job serving tables, and um that was kind of my beginning journey, I guess, in hospitality, and uh bounced around a little bit just uh serving and bartending for several years and uh finally took a step into leadership with a couple different brands. You mentioned a few iconic brands. Uh had an opportunity to work with uh Michael McHenry, who's kind of a local uh restaurateur that's yeah, uh Sunday's Bass. Yeah, yeah, some some pretty solid brands. Had an opportunity to work with him for quite a while, and um you know, this opportunity with uh Via came uh came came along and I jumped at it. Um big fan. I've had this it's kind of like this magnetic attraction to Via since I read about him years ago and saw him on like Food Network. They were winning all these awards, and I was like, this brand is so edgy, yeah, and just just badass. I just want to be a part of it. And uh I saw they were opening in Utah and I was like, oh, I'm so stoked. Cool, super cool. Um actually had an opportunity to meet the CEO and uh chat for about six months, and he he made me an offer and I jumped at it.

SPEAKER_00 6:13

Nice, yeah. I mean, for people who aren't necessarily I mean as familiar with Via as I mean the the the I mean, like you said, the brand, but also the company that like give us a like an elevator spiel on Via where it came from and a little bit of the.

SPEAKER_01 6:25

So Via uh was started by two brothers, Brandon and Zayn Hunt. They're from uh the Detroit area. Um super you know, blue-collar um gritty individuals. Uh uh one of the brothers was living in Austin, and uh uh the other brother uh was in Detroit. And it's like, man, there's there's one thing missing here in Austin, it's Detroit style pizza. And uh they're both going through their you know, I guess different trials of life. And uh, you know, the story goes they uh had a little bit of money, bought a trailer, um, opened it on on uh 6th Street in Austin. And uh the funny thing about the first night they opened is they go to cut the first pizza and they didn't have a pizza cutter. So they actually had to go over to a a competing truck and ask them if they could borrow a pizza cutter for the night. That's hilarious. Uh but it just it just started to compound.

The Via 313 Trailer Origin Story

SPEAKER_01 7:20

They started creating you know raving fans, you know. There was a there was a time, probably the first three or four years in Austin, to where if you said anything bad about Via, you got punched in the face. It was kind of like its own little m mini uh uh fight club. Yeah. Uh because people were just so passionate about it. And you know, they they grew. Um they had three trailers and uh three brick and mortar locations uh in Austin and uh they got to a point where they're like this is probably a little bit beyond our skill set to continue to grow this. So uh that's where uh savory stepped in and started the the growth.

SPEAKER_00 7:54

And that's what I love about a lot of kind of like these iconic restaurants that have popped up in the last, you know, let's say like decade, decade plus, is like before you had these restaurants, they would go brick and mortar, and then brick and mortar, brick and mortar, and scale. Like, I mean, the iconic, I mean, like the chilies, the apple beads, the cheesecake factories, insert whatever mega chain there. But then it's fun to see in these last few years of it, it really is like it's either one of two. They do their own food truck and get a cult following that way, or they work in one of these like ghost kitchens and really like refine or um kind of build their menu and test it out and then go from there. And so it's nice to have like this new infrastructure and like almost like consumption model of people to make that happen. And it also makes like this kind of like grassroots cult following start to happen. And you see those pop up all the time, even in in Salt Lake, and a lot of those food trucks that I mean, even I mean the one that comes to mind is like Cup Pop. Like I remember when Cup Pop started, it was on campus, there's a food truck, and I was like, This is awesome. Like, I never thought we'd have this, and the next thing you know, like it's blown up everywhere. Yeah, I mean, same thing. Well, I guess swig isn't probably the best example of that because for a lot of reasons, but it's it's so it's fun to see how that happens, but especially where like there's been this kind of like stigma against kind of bigger chains, but then there's like this kind of tier of like where it's like, oh, we have this cool following, but and people want it and we're gonna grow it, which is such a perfect, like that's exactly what Via has done. I mean, especially now where I mean how many locations are they up to in Utah?

SPEAKER_01 9:15

Uh Utah, we've got five currently in Utah with uh one under construction. Uh it'll it'll open up on 8th South and 9th East that we're shooting for earlier November. So really excited about that one to have our first kind of semi-Salt Lake Metro location. Um, you know, we've kind of started in the burbs and working our way downtown. Uh it's a beautiful space. I actually got to tour it this week.

SPEAKER_00 9:35

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SPEAKER_01 10:12

Yeah, we're the one with the kind of the red shell on the outside, it already looks like a via a little bit.

SPEAKER_00 10:18

Yeah, I know. Well, because I was driving by, it's always fun because like I live on the west side now, but like a lot of my friends and family are on the east side, so I go over enough where if there's anything new, I'm like, oh, what's going on over there? Yeah, and so it's fun to just see it just continue to grow and like have great things that people want and continue to pop in. And um, oh yeah, because like with Detroit style pizza, like it was something that wasn't even on my radar until end up dating a girl who's from Detroit, and we're sitting there one night and she's like, I'm hungry and I'm really craving food from home. I'm like, oh, what does that even mean? Like, do you just want to go drink a bunch of like like like car oil? Is that how that works? Or like, I don't know. And next thing you know, she's like, no, like Detroit style pizza. I was like, oh, is that the one with like the sauce on top? Like, I don't know if I'm in. She's like, listen, trust me. And so I think it was and like I think the first time we went was actually it was before the there's a half marathon down in like southern part of Utah County, and we're staying the night there because it's just I mean, I don't want to wake up at like four in the morning to go drive 45 minutes and then go run 13 miles. But we get there and she's like, Oh, there's this like place that's that I've been to, it's good, it's called Via 313, let's go. And like, all right, like good carbload, whatever. We go and like, oh, every sentiment that I had, I apologize. You are right, it's amazing. It's like I'm a big quality bread guy, good, I mean, get some cupped pepperonis on there, good cheese, and call it good. But then it was fun, like that was my first experience of it. But then just to keep seeing them popping up, um, I mean, from like a I mean, a leadership in like corporate lens, I mean, what has made Utah and especially like the Salt Lake broader area attractive from your perspective?

SPEAKER_01 12:27

I think, you know, from the outside looking in and growing up outside of Utah, you know, there's this this weird stigma about Utah, right? It's like quirky and weird, and it's it's just a bunch of Mormons and and unseasoned food. I still hear it when I travel, like Utah's got food, and it's like Utah's pretty amazing. Um actually tell everybody how terrible it is because I'm tired of everyone moving here. But um, yeah, I mean, Utah is a food city, like it is there are some iconic brands here. Yeah, and the the bigger chains are starting to notice this, right? And and uh and moving here. And I mean, I think it really started with let's say Cheesecake Factory, right? Yeah, for years and years and years they were like anti-Utah, never go into Utah. We sell way too much alcohol, it'll never work. And then they open here and it's like top performing location, right? And instead they substitute it, they don't sell as much alcohol, but they sell three times as much dessert. I was gonna say there's one thing Utah always comes through on, it's sugar. It works, yeah. But it works and it it's it's profitable and it's a great model, and it's very, very popular. Utah's got a great food scene. I mean, there's so many just amazing brands that have actually started here and grown outside of the state. I mean, and the one thing I know about Utah's is they like good food. And you know, Detroit style pizza is unique and different, um, often imitated um and often confused. Like uh I often hear like, oh, is it kind of like Deep Dish? Uh well, no, no, Deep Dish, like Chicago style pizza, that's something I want to serve somebody if I'm gonna fight them, right? Because they're gonna be like incapacitated. Yeah, you know, it's light, it's airy, it's crispy, there's this texture with Detroit style pizza that no one else can touch when it's made properly, right? Yeah, cheese all the way to the edge, there's no crust, right? And it's just that room temperature sauce on top, just it's it it creates the most perfect bite. Um and then yeah, we have a lot of different flavors and options for for everyone. It's uh it's truly like um I I I I often say I'll take the Pepsi challenge against anyone for bite to bite. I just think that when our pizza is made right and we pair it with like just the most genuine authentic hospitality, it can't be beat.

SPEAKER_00 14:30

Totally. And even when I went, because I knew this was happening, so I was like, I I mean, if I'm gonna talk to Sean about Via, I gotta go to Via, and so I'd show up like, all right, like what do I need to get? And she's like, Well, if you're like ready to play ball, like let me let me take care of you, kind of thing. I was like, please do. Because like that, I always hate showing up to restaurants and like making a decision based on my own bias, but it's usually like, hey, what do you recommend? What did you have for lunch? What did you have for dinner? What does everybody order? Like, or that's kind of like the thing that everybody orders inside. And it's always like some sort of special. But she's like, Okay, well, first let's get you. I think we got like the charcuterie board to start, which is like, okay, cool, like charcuterie board, good. And then we had the uh, oh, it was like the street corn pizza.

SPEAKER_02 15:09

Yeah, the electricity.

SPEAKER_00 15:10

And I was like, I was a little uh skeptical at first, but then when I took it by, I was like, okay, yeah, I'm in. And then because of my indecisiveness, I was like, I don't really know what to get.

Why Utah’s Food Scene Surprises People

SPEAKER_00 15:19

Because like I could do pepperoni, I could do a little bit more meat. This like kind of like like uh fig jam sounds good. She's like, listen, if you can't try all of them, because it was just me, I'm not gonna order like four pizzas. Uh she's like, it's uh what's called the DLX. Yeah, DLX 313. And it has like the four like most like most popular ones, so it's nice to be like, all right, let's let's try this out, have a little bit of everything.

SPEAKER_01 15:39

Yeah, I mean they're they're popular, but I would say they're they're just kind of the staples. They're they're they're kind of what got us to where we are. I mean, I again I travel a lot and I wear my VA gear everywhere, proud, damn proud to wear it. And people are like, oh, my favorite pizza is the Cadillac.

SPEAKER_02 15:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:55

Right? And the Cadillac has a cool story. It actually wasn't a limited time offer back in the day, early on, and so like 30 days on the menu. It was so popular that when we took it away, people like rioted. They lost their mind that that pizza got taken away, and we had to put it back on the menu.

SPEAKER_00 16:12

And for those who don't know, what's on the Cadillac?

SPEAKER_01 16:13

So the Cadillac is gonna be uh prosciutto, which is just awesome, great bite. It's got fake preserves, um uh it's got a balsamic glaze, of course, our amazing cheese, uh, and then it's got gorgonzola, which just adds a pretty unique bite to it. Yeah, it's got a lot of like flavors that all complement each other really well. It does. They just it's just such a great bite. And then it also has my personal favorite, which is the Ambassador Bridge. Um, that's got our um natural casing pepperonis or the cut pepperonis, it's got our house sausage, uh, a little bit of uh minced garlic, and then we finish it off with whippricotta that we make in-house, and it's just I have dreams about it. Like PG 13 dreams, but dreams. It's so good. Wake up like you're just like I think pizza. Our most popular pizzas on there, that's the Detroiter, that's our double pepperoni. It's got our uh our smoked pepperoni underneath the cheese. That's that's how they that's how they do it in Detroit. They kind of hide it from you. Uh it's got our natural casing pepperoni on top, and then just our house sauce, our D sauce on top. Um, we sell more of that pizza than anything, and it is so good. Like that's that is a staple.

SPEAKER_00 17:17

Like, I always appreciate like as I've gotten older and had more pizza, like it wasn't until I went, like, I mean, Prince Street in New York, where I was like, oh, I see these cup pepperonis. Like, this is a tell me more. Yeah, but then once you get the uh go to Vienna, it's like, oh, well, you want normal pepperoni and those like natural case and cup pepperoni? Like you get both, like, I'm in.

SPEAKER_01 17:34

Yeah. We have yeah, we also have uh jalapeno pepperoni that's awesome. So there's there's a you know, we got it, we got we definitely have the options, yes. Uh but the DLX, we finish it off with uh another just iconic pizza, which is the Bobo Brazil. Yes, uh, that's kind of a spicy pizza, sweet and spicy. Uh it's got calabres, sausage, red pepper flakes, and then hot honey. That probably is a crowd favorite. Rarely, like I take it to a lot of catering events, and people are like, oh, I don't know. And then they try and they're like, oh my gosh. Yeah. Right? Uh plus it's just a cool story that Bobo Bobo Brazil is actually named after uh the first African-American wrestler in the WWF, now the WWE. Uh, and the brothers were just obsessed with them. So really cool. There's actually uh a lot of little like old school wrestling um Easter eggs throughout the brand, like on the pizza box underneath, there's Sgt. Slaughter. Um it's just really cool. I think that's why I mesh so well with the brothers, is just because we grew up pretty similar um and uh had like a weird obsession with 80s wrestlers. Yeah. So pretty cool.

SPEAKER_00 18:39

I mean, I always love when people throw like a little bit of themselves, like give the brand a brand instead of make it like I mean, quiet and just not as I don't know, unique as it could be. Yeah. I mean they sound like they sound like cool guys. Like they like there's people I meet that found businesses and like, alright, cool, like operating margin, gross margin, cool, like the the boring business stuff, but then they're like, yeah, we wanted to have 80s wrestling and everything, and we're gonna start a food truck, and we forgot our pizza slip cutter, and we just want to make good pizza.

SPEAKER_01 19:05

They are absolutely two, like just the most genuine and authentic guys you'll ever meet, like quite successful, right? I mean, 27 restaurants, they're investors in tons of other uh you know um brands, but you know, V is awesome and it's it's really awesome because of them. They're just like two of the absolute coolest guys ever.

SPEAKER_00 19:26

Yeah. I mean, looking at the future of I mean, actually going back to like the because I always hate that trope of that people come in with the Utah's like, oh, Salt Lake has terrible food. And there was a ton of like, yeah, you're right. Like, I mean, go other places, and I mean I would never say come to Salt Lake specifically for food because you I mean you put it against like the outdoors, it's gonna lose. But to say, like, oh, there's nowhere to go, there is no good food, it's like, well, have you been out recently? Have you tried anything new? Have you given anything, or like, do you are you at least willing to reassess your bias or like try something without the bias? Because there's so many great, like, it's fun to see this kind of new wave of entrepreneurs be like, hey, I want to make this restaurant, I want to do this, or I want to do that that hasn't been done. Because there's like a lot of old heads that have been around forever and created some like great places, but then there's these people who amongst kind of like these big names, like the Cheesecake Factory came in when City Creek finally uh was built and let them in, but then that they're willing to go head to head against them. But like Salt Lake is so supporting of its own community that they're like, yeah, yeah, like we're gonna go to Central Ninth every morning for breakfast, go get a breakfast sandwich, or we're gonna go to Mateo, or we're gonna go to like all these like tried and true places that people stuck their neck out so much. And like it's it's always hard for me because like there's the thing I appreciate about food and restaurants is it's so almost like this hyper-focused capitalistic environment, especially in Utah, because people spend their dollars pretty specifically, and like so there'll be a restaurant that'll go out of business, and I'll hear someone be like, Oh my gosh, I can't believe that this place went out of business. I'm like, Okay, like when was the last time you went? They're like, Oh, it's been like three or four years. I'm like, well, like, you know? Yeah, and so I that's one thing I've championed people a lot recently, just as like, I mean, restaurants are struggling kind of across the board. I'm like, hey, like, pick like two or three places that if you saw that headline, you would be devastated and like you would hate that, and you would not like it would be like a hurt to like a place that you would like to go or like fills that like emotional food void, yeah, and go support them because that's that's how we keep that community. But then it's like also the other edge of the sword is whenever someone goes out of business, it opens up a space for someone else who's maybe been sitting on that idea forever, been thinking about finally creating their own thing to be like, all right, well, I think I want to get into the arena and make my own choice. So it's kind of nice to have Utah where it's like this balance of kind of like these huge changes, which actually is very timely because like the chili's on four south, which is like one of the most iconic like chains in Salt. Like

Detroit-Style Pizza Explained Simply

SPEAKER_00 21:39

I was trying to explain it to someone the other day. I was like, Oh, I can't believe that chili's going out of business. Like, it's just a chilies. I'm like, we don't understand, like growing up here, I went there all the time. And it was because my dad, my parents were divorced, and he's like, Oh, we'll go to Chili's, and I would always get baby back ribs and a uh virgin margarita. And college we'd always go there, blah blah blah, whatever it could be. Um, so there's like the appetite for that, but then there's appetite for these like kind of homegrown places, but there's still like this opportunity for and like what a lot of people love is this kind of like more like hyper-focused or like kind of newer age chains as well.

SPEAKER_01 22:10

Yeah. No, it's uh I mean it's a it's there's such an awesome food scene here. I mean, and then it it is so it's terrible when a when a good uh restaurant goes out of business. Like I remember when like Molchus Molcha salsa closed on 33rd South. That was I cried, but I ate there like five days a week. Yeah, that was my absolute favorite like after the bar spot, right? Um I've had some just amazing meals there, right? Uh post post-partying uh meals when they were awesome, but you know, I feel like good brands figure it out. Yeah, right. And one thing that's that's unfortunate in a lot of brands is they just they kind of dumb down the service and they try to be for everybody, and that's that's be who you are, be authentic, right? If like you do this style of pizza, stick with that style of pizza and just do it really freaking well, but you don't have to add New York style and grandma style and all the different styles to try to please everybody, yeah. Like just do what you do really well, and there's a lot of brands that are doing that right now, like really doing it well. Like you mentioned Mateos, like holy wow, like what a what a great, you know, everything is just unbelievable, right? I think of Santos Tacos, like oh like every time Monarca, like Monarca is just like I I get hungry thinking about it, right? Monarca is just I just know what I'm getting every single time I I go there, I know exactly what the experience is gonna be like, and they're doing it right, right? And that's the thing that's the thing that unfortunately I think gives these these uh these jokers from out of state that say Utah has like this terrible food scene is just the inconsistencies that a lot of brands execute. It's like just do what you do and do it really well.

SPEAKER_00 23:48

Exactly. Right? Like protect your core, don't try to do things that you don't like. I mean, even with like mocha salsa, like that was such a because I grew up closest to there, and we'll go there in high school and we'd you go get in line and you go see friends, you go parking lot, there'd maybe be a fight every other week or something, something stupid. But you'd get to buy your food. Had to be like, oh hey, it's you again, how's this? Anyway, blah, blah, blah, flipper card, have a good one. See you in a week or see you tomorrow, whatever that could be. But I remember when they went out of business, when they told them, like, there were lines going around, like people were waiting for like three or four hours just to finally have their last Molcha salsa and say goodbye to Hector. And so it's like that sort of like um support that they give is so great. But then it's it comes down to, and I was reminded of this because I was recorded with um uh Jordy and Max from Thieves Guild Sidery. And when because I was talking to them, because I don't know if you've been there, but it's like such a specific experience because it's like a DD, like medieval tavern, like lean so much into what it is. But you go there and you're like, oh, if this wasn't here, these people wouldn't be out. Yeah, and it gives them this kind of place to do it. And talking to them about the idea, I mean they're working with kind of a mentor and they're like, Do we really want to lean this much into this? And the guy's like, absolutely, don't simplify it, don't make it for everybody, do this. And that's been like a lot of their success. And so, in the same way, it's like if Via would be like, Hey, by the way, we're doing like uh birya tacos now, or we're doing like something, or we're gonna do New York pizza or deep dish. You're like, that's kind of like not what we do, and we don't want to like we can't please everybody, we're not just gonna be this hyper-reactive brand to what is just I mean, the most the new trendy thing. It's like stick to our core, stick to what we know, make it fun. So then when it goes away, people are like, hey, listen, I'm never coming back unless you bring the Cadillac back because I need that prosciutto and fig jam.

SPEAKER_01 25:29

Yeah, 100%. And the the Lote pizza is similar. I think it's gonna be a pizza that probably makes its its way onto the menu just because it is that good. I mean, you got to try it, it's awesome. I love to add uh you know some fresh jalapenos on there, spice it up a little bit. That's my tip, yeah. But man, that pizza is such a great bite.

SPEAKER_00 25:46

Because I'm a sucker for uh like if I go, my recent guilty pleasure has been um if I'm going out and I'm like, okay, like hey, it's time to call an Uber, I'll usually hop on some sort of like pizza app and be like, okay, uh, and my go-to pizza is like Hawaiian add jalapeno, and if they have hot honey, I'll add that too, because I love like that sweet and spicy. So then it's nice, I'm like, okay, pizza ordered, and then it's either A, I get home and there's a pizza on my doorstep that just got there and like perfect, or I get home, get into comfy clothes, and it's like, oh ding, like pizza's here. Um, so yeah, but like the elote one was definitely the one that snuck up on me the most because I like definitely trusted her. I was like, yeah, like let's like definitely wouldn't be something I ordered, but I took a bite and it was one of those like touche, tip of the cap.

SPEAKER_01 26:27

That's that's kind of been the like the reaction across the board is people are like corn and pizza, a lote? Like it doesn't make sense, right? And then you take that bite and you're like, okay, yeah, it's kind of a unicorn. Yeah. All right, it's it's really good.

SPEAKER_00 26:42

And I mean, I I guess like I would assume there's a lot of people that come into Viet are like, oh, I've never had Detroit style pizza or someone recommended me. And I mean, do you get a lot of those people where they're like, oh, like very pleasantly surprised at something I've never tried before because it's just such like a unique type.

SPEAKER_01 26:56

Yeah, in my role, I I pretty much see every every single review that comes across, right? Positive and negative. Uh, and the amount of reviews that we get that are just like, this is the best pizza I've ever had. Like, there's just something about the texture, right? That you know, traditional New York style or Neapolitan style, they just don't have, right? It's just that that cheese to the edge, the sauce on top, and then just the texture that we're able to create with that kind of light, merry faccia style crust, it's just next level.

SPEAKER_00 27:25

Yeah. And then thinking about, I mean, you kind of hinted at it, but curious of because you can't eat Detroit style pizza every meal and every uh day, but

What To Order And Why It Works

SPEAKER_00 27:34

what are some of your other places that you're either excited about or frequent? Because it's like one or like those places where if someone would either be from here or come in and be like, hey, I want some really good food, where are you going?

SPEAKER_01 27:43

Yeah, so anytime anyone comes to town, I always tell them they gotta hit up the park cafe for breakfast, right? Sean and his crew are just again very genuine, very authentic humans, and then they serve the best breakfast in town, right? It's just next level. Um, I think that there's a lot of brands doing it, doing a lot of things really well. Like I kind of mentioned Michael McHenry earlier. I think Sunday's best is a great brunch spot. I think his restaurant, Oak, is is really special. It's kind of a little secret restaurant out in Draper that just is doing it right. I mentioned Santos Tacos, uh huge fan. I mean, what those guys are doing with tacos is unbelievable. Well, they started as a food truck too, right? Yeah. Uh and the the unique thing about I guess us and Via is most of these brands start as food trucks and then go away from it, right? We're actually still opening food trucks. Cool. Um, so uh we actually have a mobile food truck that can go to events. We just did uh kind of an EDC style event called Ilfest in Austin that had like almost 40,000 people over three days. Uh we had our food truck there and and crushed it uh and it was awesome. Um we have several trailers at different bars, and then we just took over uh um the kitchen inside of a brewery in Austin called Fast Friends. It's right on I-35. Um coolest space ever, three levels, it's got a speakeasy, really cool, um, really cool space. And then we just took over the kitchen, kitchen there. So Via kind of I mean, we're kind of everywhere, we're just popping up everywhere, but we're not we're not just stuck to being brick and mortar, we're not just stuck to being trailers. Like, we just want to get we know that when we get our pizza in people's mouths, they're addicted.

SPEAKER_00 29:17

Yeah, it's just it's that good. And I'm excited to have one a little closer because like there's something of like this mental block between like me and like going past 33rd South, which is as like stupid as it sounds. But like to know, and I go to Ninth and Ninth enough for like so many reasons, or just go over to visit friends, family all over the valley, and I'm like, if that's there, it's like all right, cool. Like now I can go get my Detroit South pizza in in an even easier way. But I like what you mentioned about like especially Michael McHenry and Sunday's best, because like for me, like a lot of breakfast and brunch places, it's like really hard to differentiate yourself. Like there's only so many different foods that you can make or like make different takes on it, but he's really taken the whole, and like what you're alluding to is like the experience side of things to the next level where like you don't go to a place like his and be like, oh, like all right, like brunch hard, like okay, and especially with the new location downtown where like they have the whole upstairs um and been, I mean, honestly, there for like night more nights and like weekend events and parties, sort of things that I've been invited to as much as I have like brunch downstairs, so it's kind of like this multi-use space, and he's such a fun um character and personality to have around. And also with Oak, I remember the first time I went there, someone's like, Hey, we're gonna go out to like I was visiting friends out there, and like, oh, we're gonna go to this place called Oak. I'm like, Oh, like okay, like sure. We pull up and I'm like, okay, like pleasantly surprised. Then we sit down and eat. I'm like, how is this like here? And I didn't even realize, but we've been back a couple times and it's always always a good experience.

SPEAKER_01 30:38

It's a solid experience, it's great. You know, I was really uh excited to hear about like some some of the bigger brands are deciding to take a risk on Utah, right? Because they're seeing the success. Like, so Uchi, who's massive in Austin, uh, is coming to Utah, I've heard, which is pretty incredible. I mean, it's I think it takes a couple months to get a table right now in Austin, if you were like to ask for a reserve to try to get a reservation. So uh getting them out here, and then you know, hearing down the road that in the next like five years we could have a dim Typhong. I mean, come on now.

SPEAKER_00 31:08

That's that is my favorite restaurant of all time. I'm actually going to Seattle. So I used to live in Seattle as well. And then um my girlfriend has never been there, so I'm like, oh, let's go show you where I live. And like, by the way, there's one place we're going at least once, and it's every time I like my friends, whole family in Portland, Seattle. I mean, everywhere there is a din time, if I'm in town, I'm like, even if I'm going alone, I'm going there. Like, that is that will be like a tears to my eyes of like we made it as soon as there's a din type in Salt Lake.

SPEAKER_01 31:32

Agreed. I mean, it's just that it doesn't matter what city I go to if they have a din type fungi, I'm there. Yeah, right? Same as you. It's just the experience, the food, everything about it, and yeah, the fact that Utah's gonna have one, Salt Lake City, Small Lake City, yeah. Come on now. Pretty awesome.

SPEAKER_00 31:49

There's um like one of my friends, he runs an account that's mostly like Asian food reviews, and it's been fun to like because like I love food, especially Asian food from a previous relationship that got like just opened up my world of everything. Um, but it was like I was out when I moved back to Seattle, I was like, Oh, I want dim sum. They're like, well, there's not really a great place, and now there's like a couple places, and especially like he did a post once talking about how Korean barbecue specifically, there was this like little pocket in West Valley where there's like kind of six within a three-block radius because it's like where like almost like kind of like a not Korean town, but maybe like Korean suburb. And so it's fun to see. I mean, similar to like the founders of Via being like, Oh, I'm in Austin, but we don't have pizza, I'm gonna make a place that's mine. There's so many people that have come and been like, Oh, I want this pizza and it's not here. I mean, the same thing with like Villaggio, and that's how how he started it. Same with Mateo, and he's like, I want Italian food, I'm gonna bring it from my family from Italy, and I'm even gonna move them out here from Moderna, and we're all gonna do this together. And I love that Salt Lake is a place where they can really like wrap their arms around that and say, like, yeah, like we're we're in for it too. But then it's like on the other side, when I I hate when I hear naysayers be like, Well, there's no good food, and I'll be like, Well, where have you been? Like, tell me what like what's new, or like there's always like this pessimistic view on everything, and like just give it a chance, or give something a shot, or like branch out. Yeah, like I'm I'm a big believer of that one, so then the more that we can get the best food, then the more happy I can get.

SPEAKER_01 33:11

Agreed, and there's there's there's so much variety. I mean, just in pizza alone, obviously, I'm I'm very partial to via 313, but I mean, like Victor's pizza, I'm a I'm a big pulp fiction guy, so I was instantly drawn to it, but it's really good pizza. Yeah, and you mentioned Bellagio's amazing. Like, there's just there is so much good in Utah that when I hear people uh it's like when I hear someone say, Oh, the food, I couldn't taste it. Well, I the first thing I want to say is like, did you test yourself for COVID? Like the food tastes really good, right? Um, but I mean, yeah, keep hating. We'll just we'll Utah will just keep crushing it.

SPEAKER_00 33:46

I mean, especially when like the amount of development going on, like that's a big positive side. Because like there's sometimes like around downtown, like the way they built a lot of the apartments has been like a lot of retail space at the bottom, and a lot of it's gone like vacant for years. Like even just south of us, because we're at Edison House, just south there's an apartment building that's like three retail spaces and nothing's ever been in there. But however, there's like I mean, Central Ninth, for example, they

Authentic Brands And Local Loyalty

SPEAKER_00 34:09

put in like the Maven district and some other things, and they're like, Oh, who knows what's gonna happen. And now you can't go like more than a third of a block without having some sort of new drink food or some sort of concept. And like Sugarhouse from where it was 20 years ago to now is a completely different story. And I so I live in marmalade, and it's been fun to see how that started to grow it. Like, there's I like that it's become kind of this like more dense kind of like townhouse area. Like, there's probably at least eight to twelve townhouse developments there right now, and there's at least five more currently under development, which is nice for a lot of reasons. But it's also been fun to see kind of all like that start to be like, oh, we're gonna put these restaurants in here, and then well, like the one that just opened semi-recently is Taverna, like more like a New York style pizza place there. That I'm like, I needed a pizza place like nearby because it's like always hard. Because if I'm gonna get in my car, then there's like, okay, now I can go anywhere. What do I want to do? And it gives me like decision analysis paralysis, like a cheesecake factory menu. But then there's like one that's like really simple menu. Because like I'm a I'm going back to that actually. I'm a sucker for a simple menu. Like you take me to Cheesecake Factory, I mean, especially the first time I'm like, I can't do this, this is too much. But then you go to like an in-and-out, and like, yep, I want a burger, I want fries, maybe I want a shake. We'll call it good. Um, so yeah, simple is always better execute. And also, just like there was a I actually want to call it out because it was such a good experience. I was trying a new sushi place, and like that's something I don't usually branch out too much. It's either like Takashi Sapa or tsunami, just depending on where I'm at. But I had some friends talk about mint sushi in sugarhouse, so I went and I was like, it was good, like it was really good sushi. Like, I wouldn't say like it was out of this world, but it was like a good be like, okay, if I'm in sugarhouse, I want sushi to go there. But like the service was amazing. Like, I always hate when it's like service industry sometimes gets looked down upon of just being like a job or like dead, whatever it could be. But I'm like, if you're gonna do it, at least do it well. Like, like if you're if you especially because it's tip-based, like add value to my experience, and I'm always happy to tip you. And so this guy's like, I'll take a Sapporo. He's like, Oh, actually, if you're gonna have Sapporo, if you spend two more dollars, you can get this beer, and it's like 10 times quality more ingredients. I'm like, Yes, that sounds great. Or he's like, Oh, well, if you like this role, if you don't know what to get, this one's really good. But I usually get it, sub this and do this, or the guy in the back, blah blah. I'm like, Yes, this is exactly it. So it, I mean, it takes more than just having a good brand and good menu, but having the right people that are there to show it off and and make sure the customers are taken care of. 100% thousands of that.

SPEAKER_01 36:29

Yeah, I'm beyond passionate about service, hospitality, and experience, right? Yep, you've hit on it, uh you've hit on a lot of times. Um, you know, a lot of the restaurants, unfortunately, that have perished or gone out of business, it's because I got too comfortable, right? And they allowed they allowed people to just check boxes um and take orders. And and people go out, they want an experience. Like it's expensive to dine out anymore, right? Like I want more than just to eat, right? I want I want an experience. I I want to I want to know that the person serving me the food cares about it. Yeah, that they actually love what they do. And uh it's uh it's becoming rare, but the restaurants that are winning that are that are that are absolutely crushing it, it's because they have a culture where the teams actually love what they do and they love who they work for.

SPEAKER_00 37:13

Yeah, I mean, especially someone like you who like you see every review that comes in, like the good, the bad, and the ugly, and know how to course correct and the bad and the ugly, but then being like, oh cool, they like this because it was a great experience, great product, keep moving. And like one of the easiest examples of like something just like like fumbling the bag so badly it was like Cafe Rio. Like I was thinking about, and I did a post about it the other week about like the original 33rd South location. I mean, you walk in, everyone's yelling free meal, everyone's yelling extra meat, it's packed, it's amazing, and then I mean they get complacent, they sell off a part of the company to private equity, then all they care about is margin, and now you're like, this isn't this is nothing like what it was, and so sterile.

SPEAKER_01 37:54

Yeah, I think at some point there will be like a Netflix special about the demise of Cafe Rio because in its prime when it was brand new, I mean it was it was iconic. I mean, it was you you nailed it. I mean, I can still smell and taste like what it was like in the beginning, right? But then you had Costa Vita that came along and was like, you know what? We're gonna create a similar brand and we're just gonna take better care of people and make better food. Yeah. And now nine out of ten people would choose Costa Vita over Cafe Rio all day long.

SPEAKER_00 38:21

Yeah, throw me in that camp. Like, even there was one time when I was in Seattle, they put a uh a cafe Rio, it was somewhere up north. It was at least like a 45-minute drive to get there. But I was like, I'm craving Cafe Rio and I want it. And so I drive all the way up there and I have it, and I was like, no, like this isn't they ruined it, and I was just so like, you know, like when you get so excited for something and it just flops, yeah. And I was like, that sucks. I'm gonna go like and I have a 45-minute drive home of just like sheer disappointment.

SPEAKER_01 38:46

Yeah. There's a brand in Austin called Cabo Bobs. Um, similar to similar to Cafe Rio, like it has some Cafe Rio vibes, but it's uh, you know, it's a tri similar style style restaurant. They're serving Mexican food, but it has that that old school vibe. Like you walk in, everybody's screaming and yelling, except they're all wearing tie-dye shirts and they're a bunch of stoners. Yeah, but they're literally serving, I think, some of the best food in Austin. It is so good.

SPEAKER_00 39:13

And that's like, I mean, similar to that is like the central ninth. Like I'm like the amount of times I've gone in and like they're always blaring music and just like being them apologetic self. There's one time I was in there waiting for a sandwich, and there's this like definitely like older couple in their 60s, and it was kind of like definitely like a pearl snatching and like purse clinching moment. I was like, Yeah, it's probably for you. Um, but there's the amount of times I walk in and I'm like shazamming a song or like saying what up to Max, and that just like it's but then everybody loves it because it's I mean, gray food and just people being like, Yeah, here we are, take it or leave it, and you'll go scroll through reviews, and someone's like, Well, the music was just a little loud. It's like, yeah, well, I'm going sorry. Yeah, like that's well, because there's like a post I saw recently where it's like if you want to find the best, I think they use coffee in this example. It's like find the most, it's either like two or three star reviews. Because it's like if they're like, Well, I just I couldn't like I didn't like something about it, but I can't say something bad about the coffee, or like that's the coffee place. Because they may have like this location may not have been the best spot, or like the guy may have been a little rude, like which experience hopefully it catches up. But like they're like, but I can't give a one-star review because the the coffee was so good. Yeah, and so it's like that's where you get a good product, but then like we talked about, get a little experience on top of it. And yeah, gotta have the experience,

Service And Experience Beat Just Food

SPEAKER_00 40:24

right?

SPEAKER_01 40:24

And there's gonna be times where you don't want the experience, right? Like, I just had a rough day, I want to have my AirPods in. I just want to go in, get some food, I gotta stay alive, and that's great. But when you're going out with friends, you want a server that's knowledgeable, that's gonna tour guide you through the menu, right? That's gonna tell you, I like that, but I like it this way, right? Uh, like at Via, um, I'm a big fan of double cutting our pizza. It's just easier to eat, right? The big slices are just a little bit much. I usually end up wearing it. Uh, but if I double cut it, I make it a little bit extra crispy, I always add hot honey. I get a side of ranch because I I'm not from Utah, but I'm pretty much a Utah now, so I love ranch with everything. Yep. Um, you know, but uh you just gotta have those little those little unique things that that take it to I guess the next level, right? Right. Um so we encourage our teams to always tell a guest what your favorite is. Yeah, right? Like you eat here. I mean, the great thing about our teams is that they eat there every day. Like everyone that comes in when they leave, they take a pizza with them because um, you know, they like what they like what we do.

SPEAKER_00 41:21

Our food's good, it's cravable. Totally. And like what you said about like if you want to go out and have a night out, you want it to be a good experience. Like, even recently, I won't tell where I went, but was at a restaurant at a friend in town from Nashville who hadn't been here in a while. It's like boys are getting together, six of us, and like just like flopped. Bad experience, like took 30 minutes to even get an order for drinks, took 20 more minutes to get them, and we were there for like, I mean, it was it was like a good that we were there for three hours, but it was always like we didn't need to be like waiting or like for everything for three, like two hours and then eat for the last hour. And it like was just kind of like a bad like rain cloud over the night. Yeah, whereas like if it could have been a little better, it would have only made things better and made I mean that whole experience better. And those are the places that thrive and succeed are the ones that can make people come back because it's a positive experience and positive food.

SPEAKER_01 42:08

Yeah, and everybody's gonna have an off night, yeah, right? It's it's the industry, like um, you know, I you know, being in this industry as long as I have, I've had probably a lot of nights where I drove home without the music on, right? And just sat my sat in my garage for probably 10 to 15 minutes just processing the night before I went inside, you know, and that's that's just the industry, you know. But uh we we power through it, we identify, you know, why was the night like that, and we fix it. And nine times out of ten, it's just people. You gotta surround yourself with the right people.

SPEAKER_00 42:37

Totally. And like that's the hardest thing for restaurants to do is like consistency. Um for a lot of I mean, so many different variables that can happen in all sorts of food and experience in a restaurant. Like to be consistent is so hard. Like you go to a newer restaurant, you're like, oh, like the I ordered the same thing, but it this is not even close to the same thing that I were before, or I had a different server server and it felt like an entirely different restaurant, or even the night of the week. And talking to a lot of restaurateurs and entrepreneurs that have opened up locations, it's like the first restaurant's one thing, but then to be like, oh, well, how do I open up the second one without losing that quality or that consistency and the right SOPs and like making sure everything's made the right way? Like that's where a lot of people struggle. And it's either you put it in place before or you learn learn later.

SPEAKER_01 43:19

But yeah, scaling restaurants is pretty challenging, yeah. Right? Yeah, how do you how do you serve the same pizza in downtown Salt Lake that you do in Denver, Colorado, or Austin, Texas, or Houston, Texas? It's challenging, right? It's it's really comes down to standards. Like, does your team hold the standard? Right? Um, what do you allow to happen? Because whatever you allow becomes the standard.

SPEAKER_00 43:40

Yeah. Like it came up a lot in a lot of brewers I've talked with, like Hopkins, I mean TF, even like Mount West Cider, it's like like because I think I was even when I was talking to Isaac Winter, who now he's the director of um distilling for all the constellation brands, but was at High West for a while. And he kind of like tripped and stumbled into like the brewing industry and worked at Red Rock with I mean like Kevin Temple and a lot of the guys that started, but he's like at first, he's like, it's not us just like sitting around drinking beer all day and like making beer, and funny he's like most of the time we are scrubbing things clean to make sure that it is ready for the next batch. So put on some boots and some overalls and grab a brush because that's like usually where a lot of the consistency comes in from.

SPEAKER_01 44:22

It's science, yeah. Right, yeah. I love what uh what Chad's doing over there at Hopkins. I think Hopkins is great, I'm a big fan.

SPEAKER_00 44:28

Like it's it's one thing to have good beer and like a cool place. And I mean, most places like, yeah, cool, we'll have our program of food trucks, have them come by, which is fine, but like to double down and be like, but we're also gonna have our own kitchen, and hopefully that brings you just as much as the the the beer does, and they're one that does it really, really, really well.

SPEAKER_01 44:47

Well, yeah, and you think about just I mean, the the trials and tribulations of traffic, I mean, the the nonsense they went through for the past several years, just trying to get people to be able to park or even able to find them. And you know, it's a beautiful building, an awesome space, and and you can have the best product, but it was it was pretty inconvenient to get there. But Chad and his team figured it out and just you know kept the lights on, which is awesome to see.

SPEAKER_00 45:09

Yeah, it's it was good to see how much sugarhouse wrapped their arms around. I mean, especially like going back to that example of pick a couple places you couldn't live without and go support them. Cause like even hearing the I think it was

Consistency, Standards, And Scaling

SPEAKER_00 45:19

the end of last month, quarters there, um, close up shop because I mean, all of it's to do to with that. I mean, that whole street where um Scoville's is and like Silverside Delhi, like those have all turned over multiple times because of that. And and it's like one of those variables like you can't do anything about road construction. Um, that's a variable you can't control. But to see people be like, we know it's hard, we know it's inconvenient, we know it's difficult, but like I'll show up.

SPEAKER_01 45:44

Yeah, we love you. I'm gonna vote for you with my wallet. I'm gonna continue to vote for you with my wallet. Just take care of me, right? And be consistent.

SPEAKER_00 45:51

Yeah. Um anything else you want to make sure we covered? I don't think so, man.

SPEAKER_01 45:55

Cool. I love it, man. Thanks for uh thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_00 45:58

Yeah, no, Sean, I want to wrap up with the uh two questions I always ask everybody at the end of each episode. And number one, if you could have someone on the Small Lake City podcast and hear more about them, their story, and what they're up to, who would you want to hear from?

SPEAKER_01 46:09

Someone on the Small Lake podcast that I want to hear more about. I I think uh I think Sean from the Park Cafe I mentioned earlier, he's one of my favorite humans, and I would love to learn more about Sean, man. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 46:22

I mean, say like there's I don't know if I could like if I were to go walk around downtown and stop, you would be like, um, scale one to ten, park cafe. I don't think I could have anybody below an eight. And if they did, they're like, oh, I don't even know what you're talking about. Like, yeah, like if they're below crazy. Yes. Right. Like it's one of like is the iconic breakfast place. It is. Um, and then lastly, if people want to keep an eye on via or see, I mean all the specials or just keep an eye on things, what's the best place to find information?

SPEAKER_01 46:51

I mean, social medias are great. Social media is a great platform. I mean, we're pretty active on uh on uh on the uh Instagram and such, but uh, I mean we have an awesome app which is just uh in the in the app store. Uh we just partnered with it with a new partner, which actually is they do a really good job. So it's a great app. We're able to message you and communicate with our uh with our uh with our fans and you know share what's what's on deck and what's coming up. There's some there's some pretty amazing things coming up in the future for Via. I'm really excited about it.

SPEAKER_00 47:18

I mean this alone makes me crave pizza probably in the next 48 hours, uh especially via. But and then also if people where are the current locations because we talked about the eighth and ninth one that's opening up soon, but where are the other locations in case people are somewhere?

SPEAKER_01 47:31

So in Utah, we're located. We have a location on University in Oram. Uh we're on Lehigh Main Street, uh, we're out in Riverton. Um, we have one at Southtown Mall and one at Fashion Place Mall.

SPEAKER_00 47:41

Cool. So if you haven't had Detroit South Pizza, I know where to go. If you haven't had Via specifically, go check it out. We've given you some ideas of what to order or start with. But in case you need more, then someone there will take care of you. Absolutely. Awesome. Well, thanks so much, Sean. Thank you. I'm excited to keep crushing it and excited for more people to find Via.

SPEAKER_01 47:58

Yeah, thanks. Thanks for having me.