Leadership Ripples with Leah Fink
Every action you take as a leader has a ripple effect, starting with your team, going out to the organization, and even out into to people’s personal lives. Here we offer you the chance to learn from real-life stories of leadership, so you can gain a deeper understanding, and level up your own skills. From communication, to culture, to power and equity, to feedback, to resolving conflict, and more. Join us and make sure you are creating the ripples you want.
If you would like your questions answered on the show, please share your story here: https://allthrive.ca/share-your-story/
To join the show live, go to: https://www.linkedin.com/in/leah-fink-all-thrive/
Leadership Ripples with Leah Fink
36 - Supporting Successful Leadership Transitions
How do you navigate the complicated decision of which staff to promote? Do you focus on seniority, desire, or skillset? Join us as we uncover the finer details of managing staff emotions and expectations during leadership transitions. On this episode, we share the essential tools to communicate career progression early and clearly, ensuring no one is left in the dark. Learn how to support your team’s professional development and maintain their motivation, even when leadership decisions don’t go as planned.
Do you know how to ensure your relationships with your team stay strong, even when you have to make tough decisions?
If you want to be able to ensure healthy successsion planning for your team, you should join us for this episode!
To have your questions answered on the show, submit your story here: https://allthrive.ca/share-your-story
Leadership Ripples with Leah Fink is live every week at 12:00pm MST. Please join us to get answers to your leadership questions! https://www.linkedin.com/in/leah-fink-all-thrive/
Every action you take as a leader has a ripple effect, starting with your team, going out to the organization and even out into people's personal lives. Here we offer you the chance to learn from real-life stories of leadership so you can gain a deeper understanding and level up your own skills From communication to culture, to power and equity, to feedback, to resolving conflict and more. Join us and make sure you're creating the ripples you want. Welcome to Leadership Ripples with Leah Fink.
Speaker 2:Hello and welcome to Leadership Ripples with Leah Fink. Today we are going to be discussing staff stepping into leadership roles, what that looks like and the opportunities created by various roles, how you pick them and how you navigate staff's feelings. After the fact, vd comes in with their story. I have a staff member who's quite upset with me right now. They've been with the company for a while and for a couple months were in a temporary leadership role as another staff was on leave. That staff eventually left and when it came time to permanently fill the role, we went with another candidate. I believe this new person is better qualified for the role and there was still a lot of improvement that was needed for my staff member when they were in the temporary position. They got that feedback at the time. They're taking it very personally that they didn't get the role and some of how they're acting reinforces that I made the right choice. That being said, I don't want them to leave because of this situation. So what can I do? Thank you for sharing your story, bd. It's definitely a complicated situation that you're in and I appreciate that you're both trying to support this staff, put in the effort to keep them with the company and also that you were really intentional about who you put in a leadership position, because, as we know, there are these ripples that we create when we are leaders and when people aren't skillful in those positions, in leadership skills, it can have a huge negative impact. I also empathize with this very much as someone who's been in a similar situation before from both sides. In a previous job I was being mentored to take on the leadership position and when that whole process was going through, a position came available I thought I'd get it and someone else was offered the role and I had to deal with a lot of the emotions that I suspect your staff is probably dealing with feelings of questioning if I wasn't good enough and it didn't feel fair and thinking why would they set me up for this kind of failure. And I've also been in the position on the opposite side of being a leader who was looking at hiring not from seniority but from who's going to be the best fit, and having some hurt feelings from a staff member in that situation. So I'm going to talk about both a little bit of what I did and what my leaders did that really supported in those situations.
Speaker 2:The best way to start is by looking at what was the situation that led them taking on this temporary position, as this probably changed a little based on how you made that decision. So was the original reason that this person got the role was because they were the most senior person in the company or in that team? Were they the one that expressed the most interest in the role, or was there a specific skill that they demonstrated, that you went to them because you thought they might be a good fit for it? So we'll go through each of those, although they all have a similar way that I would suggest dealing with them or working with them. If it was because they had the most seniority, this can be one that we can get caught in.
Speaker 2:It's a bit of a trap we have, and our system in general with a lot of companies, I do believe, is backwards, because people are often promoted from how long they've been in the position, how skilled they are in that technical component of that position, and it's less about the specific leadership skills that we're hoping for and more about you have knowledge and time in the company, so I guess you should become a leader, and because this is so deeply ingrained in how many people experience, leadership and organization, seeing that seniority lead to leadership positions. There can sometimes be this sense of entitlement that if I'm the most senior, I should get this position. There is also a piece that's very relevant that a lot of organizations have a salary cap or a reality of if you don't take on leadership positions, that is the most you'll ever make or the most you'll be able to progress. So there's a couple pieces to consider around that seniority and why it can become so complicated and, of course, the best way to deal with this situation is unfortunately a bit in the past, but I do think it's important to go over. So, when people come up with these situations, to work with the staff, you have VD. Hopefully you can keep using this for your future staff and that is that right from the beginning.
Speaker 2:When you get a new staff and you're talking with them about what their hopes are, that you're noting if there are any hopes for leadership. And as you're working with your staff, as you've had them for months or years, and you're doing these regular check-ins about goal setting and what they care about, as soon as you are hearing about wanting to potentially advance to leadership positions, there's action you can take right away and the first thing I would do is talk to them about the reality of the position. So if there is only if there's a team of 20 people and there's only one leadership position that comes out of those 20 people, be frank with them about it, because it can have a legitimate impact on how they're planning on progressing, knowing that there might be different competition because there's only one position, knowing about specific qualifications that might be needed for that position and then, of course, talking about what the ideal skills would be that they're hiring for in that position. You can have this talk right from the beginning, right when they're starting. Maybe, if they're just starting out, their goal planning is still gonna be more about the technical aspects of the job, what they would need to learn to really understand your team and the organization. But if they are mentioning this piece about leadership, I would start understanding what skills they have and what skills would need development right from the beginning and really let them know that. So if you start identifying this piece, you can start looking at the responsibilities they might also be able to take on, and this could include things like shadowing that they could do. Could they maybe be presenting something at staff meetings, stepping into a role. That way, without overstepping boundaries of the position and making sure you're not giving them decisions they shouldn't have, you can still create all of these small opportunities that will not only allow them to see what the position might be like, but also for you to have a chance to see how they'll handle these different situations, what skills they do have, what skills they might need, because part of this is you're going to have to have a lot of frank, feedback based conversations that you're clear and consistent in talking about what really worked well, right, being again specific, making sure you're talking about the details of what really worked well and for what's not working as well a leadership skill that they are really lacking or that they would really need to work on. You want to be really, really clear on that, because the reality is, maybe you're going to get someone who just does not have a skill that's critical for that position and if they're interested and they want to learn and develop that, that's great and you can keep working with them and you'll keep developing it and they'll put in the effort and they'll feel good about it.
Speaker 2:And some people don't want to have that focus. They don't want to put in the effort, it feels like it would be more stressful to have a position like that. It would be overwhelming to have to work on that skill every day. So, for example, some people really don't love organization. They don't like planning, making schedules, all of those pieces, and if you know that your position is going to require a lot of organization, that's something you want to be really frank about. And if they don't want to put in that effort, that's okay. It doesn't mean they're a bad person or can't embrace leadership in another way. Maybe there's another department in your company that they would thrive in, because the role requires more interpersonal skills and less of this organizational piece. And so these are things you can really be starting with from the beginning, because it's not an advantage for them to go into a role that's going to be more stressful because they have to deal with a skill that they don't want to develop for many hours a day. And then, of course, that's going to disadvantage the team and the organization because they won't have a skill that's critical for that specific role.
Speaker 2:Now, this is one I can relate to, because when I was hiring for a leadership position for my team, I ended up choosing a staff that was not the most senior when a more senior staff had applied for the role, and part of the reason for this was he was missing a skill set that would be critical for the role and he did not have an interest in learning it. He knew that it would be a really stressful thing and hard and a challenge for the role and as we went through after the situation, we were talking about the emotional impact I'll talk about how to handle in a minute and going through this whole process, one of the things that we came to was he really did explore his own desire for the role and how he would really interact with this skill that he didn't want to develop and would stress him out, and eventually he did get to a point where he recognized you know what. I actually don't know if this role would have been the best for me. Now he did eventually end up leaving because in that position there weren't a lot of opportunities to advance past a certain stage, but it wasn't immediate. He didn't leave because he was upset about this. It was down the road.
Speaker 2:After he'd fully advanced and learned everything that he could from that position, he'd taken full advantage and chose to leave on a better note and until that time, he was a fantastic member of my team who knew a lot, was very senior and contributed in a great way. So, vd, if your staff was hired on seniority and, let's say, this part didn't happen, you didn't have that discussion. You haven't done that leadership learning throughout the whole time, and they only started doing it when they were in this role. They were out the whole time and they only started doing it when they were in this role. They were put into this role. Now they've started this leadership development.
Speaker 2:Now you're working with the emotional impact of this situation and these were also steps that I took with my staff. There's specific things you can do to support this side. So when I was on the other side, when I was trained for a position and then ended up not getting it, something that I really appreciated from my leader who had been mentoring me was the chance to first of all share and have my experience. My emotions validated that they genuinely cared that this had hurt me, upset me, that I was not enjoying this experience, that it did have an emotional impact. They let me share that in a very open and accepting way.
Speaker 2:The other thing I got from them was a very sincere apology and they weren't apologizing for who they hired and trying to make excuses and bring all that in. They recognized the impact that this had on me, especially from an emotional space, and they specifically asked me what they could do to make sure that our relationship stayed healthy and that I felt okay in this situation With that time to process it. They gave this space. They gave this whole process some space and it was only after that that we started having discussions that broke down what specific factors went into the decision. They did make any places where I could keep developing my skill and where I might've been a little bit lacking there they didn't go into. Well, I know you feel bad about this, but this, this candidate had blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So you need to do, first of all, this piece of emotionally supporting and validating, recognize and apologize for the impact that you had on them, not for all those other pieces, but just for the impact that this had on them that might have on your relationship and then go into some of those pieces about what they could still be working on if they are interested.
Speaker 2:And another thing that really helped me is that that leader, who did not end up hiring me for that role, spoke to the person that they did hire and made it very clear of what had happened and made it that it was a really intentional process that we went through together, into developing the relationship with me, into making sure that we felt like we had a strong connection and also giving me the space to express where I was challenged by having this different person as my leader and we continued to work on the things that I'd been working on and continue to work towards this role in the future, and I didn't end up staying in that role and I did, down the road, get that position. So it worked out very well for me that they put in that effort ahead of time to validate, support and continue working. Vd, I recognize that in your situation I don't know if this person that was hired into the position in a full-time basis has been with the team already, was another person on the team or they were external. But I think recognizing and having them support this person is a really important part of the process Because recognize that your staff will be stepping back from some opportunities and things that they came to expect you get more information.
Speaker 2:As a leader, you have a different sense of how you impact the workplace. There are things that they might feel that they're losing and when they have this relationship with you, with this new leader, they can still keep finding these spaces where they might be able to step into things Without crossing the boundaries of their position. Maybe there's certain things they can continue to take on. Maybe there's ways that they help still become a mentor for some other new staff in a way that's appropriate, and maybe, if this person is from outside the company, this person that got the full-time position maybe the person that didn't get the position could be their go-to person for asking questions about the organization, right? So, creating a little bit more balance within this power dynamic and a lot of what I just discussed I know there was a lot of different thoughts in there would be fairly similar if this was the person who expressed the most interest in the role, if this was the person that volunteered and said I would really like to do that, and whether or not they were the most senior person.
Speaker 2:But make sure you do a lot of the same things. So have you done the work with them ahead of time to make sure that you were developing these leadership skills? Were you giving them feedback during that process as well to make sure that they were developing them and continually growing in a positive way process as well, to make sure that they were developing them and continually growing in a positive way? And, as you're working now on this emotional support piece for them, are there any ways that you can still highlight or focus on the interest that hopefully they still have for some sort of growth, for some sort of leadership, because you can recognize with them and emotionally validate for them that they did show a lot of interest, they had some sort of passion or something they were seeking, and how can you still be embracing that, how can you still be supporting them in that piece and maybe that's continuing to drive towards that role in the future and keep developing those skills that they need. Maybe it's going in a slightly different direction based on how they're feeling now from this whole situation.
Speaker 2:Finally, if it was a specific trait or skill that you saw in them that made you think it would be a good fit for them as a leader, I would definitely also talk about that in addition to the earlier points that we spoke about and especially if you shared that thing with them, that hey, I'm putting you in this position because this specific skill or trait. So you could either do this by sharing appreciation wait when you're giving feedback about how much that skill or trait did help them when they were in that role and how much you appreciate that and how much it's still helping them, obviously in their current role or you might need to address that something did go sideways, wasn't the way that you anticipated and it didn't actually help them in that role the way that you were hoping. Maybe you misread a little bit of that and once again, you can take accountability for that. And so, speaking with them, maybe you saw them as having really good interpersonal skills when they were in their previous role and you thought it'd be a great benefit to have them support the team. But once they were on the team, once they were in this leadership position, maybe they became a little bit more awkward in their interpersonal skills because they didn't handle that dynamic shift as well, or maybe they had a problem holding some of the boundaries they now needed to hold with the leadership role. So those are things you can discuss and really explore with this person because you want them to understand this piece.
Speaker 2:And then, coming from all of this, as we're talking, as we've done this emotional validation, as we're looking to the future, you want to still be addressing the specific strengths they had with really great positive feedback. If you haven't listened to our previous episodes about feedback, first of all, I would go and do that, because there are some really specific and helpful ways that you can interact with feedback that will help this situation. And one of the things I want to be very you want to be very careful of is, as you're giving this positive feedback, make sure that you're not doing it in a way that could feel placating. And so, first, you want to make sure that you've done this emotional work, you've listened to them, you've validated them, you've acknowledged this impact that it's had and done any relationship repair that need to be done. You've asked how to support them in the future. Because if you don't do that and you start going, oh you're so wonderful, oh you're so great, it's just going to feel like now you're patting them on the head when they didn't get this position. It's going to feel very fake to them.
Speaker 2:But the reason I want to talk specifically about positive feedback is the other thing that can happen in these situations we're approaching this, they're going, yes, I want to continue moving forward, I want to continue working so I might get this position next time. Then we start going into feedback and constructive feedback and we say, okay, well, we're really working on this skill, so let's keep picking it apart and making sure it gets better. And we sometimes lose that piece of making sure that we are giving this positive feedback for the things that they were doing well, that they are doing well and how they've been progressing. So make sure that you continue strengthening that relationship, that you keep that piece up as you're still going through this growth process with them. Now, of course, this is a big piece.
Speaker 2:It was a lot to talk about VD. I'm very much looking forward to our conversation where we can go even deeper into how you can be probably emotionally supporting the staff to really rebuild your relationship so they don't end up leaving. And as a reminder to all our listeners, if you do share a story or a question with the show, we would first of all love to have it and, as a thank you for that and to make sure you get your question fully answered, I provide a follow-up call where we can go through all of those details, and because I so much appreciate you guys sharing your questions and I want to thank you so much for listening to me, learning with me, exploring all these pieces and being really intentional about how you are supporting the succession process, that you are really growing the leaders that you are going to need for your team. And, as we close for the week, remember to ask yourself what kind of ripples am I going to create this week?
Speaker 1:We hope you enjoyed the episode. Make sure to subscribe, comment and connect with Leah at.