Offside with Hawes and Maguire
Offside: with Hawes and Maguire is not your typical hockey show. This weekly
45-60 minute show is a potent combination of humour and genuine hockey insights that pushes the envelope.
- Liam is renowned for his photographic memory, lively storytelling, vast hockey knowledge and sometimes over-the-top passion for the game of hockey.
- Chris is known for his unrehearsed humour, contagious laughter and uncanny ability to make even the most serious debates end in boisterous guffaws.
Between the two, there is an infectious enthusiasm and professional chemistry that is evident from the outset. It can only be described as lightning in a bottle.
Offside with Hawes and Maguire
Brian Kilrea Unplugged: Kilrea's Chronicles, Eddie Shore and Brian's Legendary Legacy
Legendary coach Brian Kilrea joins us to share his extraordinary journey in Canadian major junior hockey, from scoring the LA Kings' first goal to navigating the strict world of Eddie Shore in Springfield. We reminisce about hockey's rich heritage in Northern Ontario, celebrating notable figures like Coniston's Jimmy Fox, Randy Boyd, and Gerry Foley. Oh, did we mention Chris Hawes? Our conversation is filled with personal stories and connections, shedding light on the profound impact Kilrea has had on the sport and the many lives he touched throughout his storied career.
Step back into the gritty world of 1960s professional hockey, where players faced grueling challenges under the demanding leadership of Eddie Shore. With gripping stories of resilience and determination, we uncover the harsh realities of playing through serious injuries and the relentless pursuit of excellence. This segment offers a raw, firsthand perspective on the era's unforgiving conditions, highlighting the incredible fortitude required to succeed and the camaraderie that emerged from shared struggles.
Finally, we explore the blend of talent and tenacity that defined players such as Bill Sweeney and Floyd Smith, and celebrate those who transitioned successfully into coaching, leaving a lasting legacy. With heartfelt gratitude, we wrap up this journey through hockey history, leaving you inspired by the tales of triumph, friendship, and the unyielding spirit of the game.
It's Offside with Haas McGuire. Hey, welcome to Offside with Haas McGuire. I'm Haas, I'm McGuire. Today, as another one of our segments, we like to call shooting the Shot the shot. That's right, it's pronounced shot, not what you would normally say.
Speaker 1:Today, we're shooting the shot with A legend, a legend, a legend, and we'll talk about this. Why don't you introduce who we're talking about? Should we say where we are? Oh yeah, absolutely. We are at Broadway's Bar and Grill, which, by the way, the best, best fact that you know. So, if my you don't miss many meals, eh, bud, no, well, you know what? Not here. We actually, kristen, my wife, well, my wife will actually come and pick them up and bring them home. No kidding, absolutely, we're a very big Broadway customer.
Speaker 2:Well, so is this guy every Tuesday, and we're at the Prince of Wales and Fisher location, right, and we thank them very much for giving us a little bit of space here, because Killer comes in here on Tuesdays, as he told me on the phone yesterday when we set this up, chris, so I feel very thankful that you can do this with us Killer. It's a great spot and I know you're here with a bunch of guys that many in Ottawa would know, for example, terry Marcotte and Dave Shriver here today.
Speaker 3:Donny Brennan is covering the red box.
Speaker 2:It's easy to hear Donny Campbell. Long time journalist and I will formally introduce you, brian, even though you really don't need any. But he's the winningest coach in Canadian major junior hockey history 1193 wins, I believe. Five-time coach of the year in the O, two-time coach of the year in Canada, two-time Memorial Cup winner, scored the first ever goal for the LA Kings, played with Detroit in the late 50s, had a game with the Red Wings and Gordie Howe. Springfield and his association with Eddie Shore is where we're gonna start this interview, chris.
Speaker 1:Whoa, whoa whoa before we start, I want to mention something We've met before. We've actually met on a couple of occasions, and I used, to believe it or not, when I was a comedian your namesake, barr. I used, to believe it or not, when I was a comedian, your namesake- bar.
Speaker 3:I used to perform in the basement all the time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I was there, okay, but. But we met when I was about a 14 year old kid. Okay, I grew up in a little town, you may know it.
Speaker 3:Coniston. And oh, jimmy Foxx, definitely I do. My home is Jimmy Foxx, that's right.
Speaker 1:Well, literally right across the street from my house.
Speaker 3:Really, that's right, my parents owned the house.
Speaker 1:The house that the Foxx's lived in was my father owned at one point prior to them, and so we grew up and so my dad was. He stood for Jimmy, his confirmation as God's like. So we've been around, but I Was the the worst pick. You never made what I'm saying. You know you pick. You know you pick boy, pick Fox. And where are they now? And none of them are playing. I'm still playing. So as far as longevity goes, I just want to say I was the better Jimmy Fox is doing the call.
Speaker 3:As far as longevity goes, I just want to say I was the better player Jimmy Fox is doing the call for. La Kings. He probably stayed there for a while. He's doing a good job.
Speaker 1:He's doing great. He's actually in the California Sports Hall of Fame now. Yes, he is, and he also owns a venue. That's right yeah he's very successful.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know he's done very well. He was always a nice guy. He actually taught me the toe drag when I was a kid, so he's a few years older, an outstanding junior. My brothers played on that peewee hockey team. I should have brought the picture, I should have posted it. So Randy, jimmy, chris, vino, riel Gervais my two brothers all on one team in a tiny little town of Napa.
Speaker 3:There's also another guy there that was constantly there, Jerry Foley. That's right, yeah, I played with Jerry Foley for many years in Springfield Super individual, yeah. But the funny part was, not only did Sudbury not get any of the Dose Street, I drafted Mario Seri out of Sudbury and Daniel Long out of just on the other side of Sudbury, waldman, I think it was. And so we had five. So when we used to go there, I think we had more fans for us than Sudbury.
Speaker 1:Well, I remember going to those games when you guys would come and visit Sudbury, you know, because everybody loved the success of the other people.
Speaker 3:That's one of the best parts of.
Speaker 1:Northern Ontario, I'll tell you, is that people celebrated the success of other people and really wanted them to succeed once they were on their way. It wasn't easy, though. My father tells the story of how a lot of people were very hard on Jimmy when he was coming up. They didn't like the fact that he was so good and they were screaming at him in the stands and lots of stuff like that.
Speaker 3:Then he moved to North Bay and played for North Bay for a couple of years At 14? Yeah, At 14?
Speaker 1:Yeah, no no he was a phenomenal, phenomenal, Sure, unbelievable. But you know what? We're not here to talk about Connison. We're here to talk about Brian Kilray and some of the benchmark things that you've done in your career. And, Liam, you led to the first piece that most people won't even know.
Speaker 2:No, most don't. And I had the privilege of attending a Bill Kitchen Memorial event with Killer just a number of months back and I grabbed on my phone just a bit of video of you talking, I believe, about 1967 in Springfield, if I've got the year right, when Eddie Shore and I'm going to roll it out, killer correct me on any details I've got wrong, but I think he suspended several players without pay, including Bill White, and I think you spoke up and then ultimately were suspended immediately for speaking up you and somebody else, and then it led to a confrontation with Shore and in there I've got a bit of a gray area at what point Alan Eagleson was called to come down, and you can kind of take it from there, because it's my belief that that conference it's not only my belief. I believe this is a fact that the actual start of the NHL Players Union such as it is today was a genesis of what happened to you in Springfield in 67 with Eddie Shore. Can you shed some light on that?
Speaker 3:Yeah, well, as it turned out, the three players were Dale Rowe, dave Amadio and Bill White. They were the heart of our team and they turned out. The three players were Dale Rowe, dave Amadio and Bill White. They were the heart of our team and they held out at training camp. They all won the $500 raise, which we sure didn't want to give but finally couldn't start the season without these three defensemen. So, as it turned out, we had to give it to them. But, as it turned out, we had a week off. We played a Saturday. As it turned out, we had a week off. We played a Saturday night game and we had a week off.
Speaker 3:Well, after that game, he suspended those three players for a week and it was just magically for that 500 dollars that they held out for a training camp. So, as it turned out, I did speak up. But we had a banquet, a booster card banquet, and when we were told they were suspended, they were upset the you, right now, what's going to happen? I'll go and speak up and he's going to suspend me. That's first turned out. I said I'm here on behalf of the players and representing them, the three players I suspended, and he told me I represent nothing. That wasn't his words. I'm cleaning it up anyway. As it turned, I walked back to address him, but sure beat me to it and he said so what's?
Speaker 3:all this. He said stick around, I got letters for y'all, anyway. So I came in and I said guys, there's no use waiting around, I'll try and talk to him tomorrow. And I said we should leave. So we all left.
Speaker 3:But we went over to a handy bar across the street to talk about it and I was pretty smart for one thing because Jerry Foley was one of the most respected guys on our team. And I said, foley, this is probably going to get bigger than we want. Why don't you be a spokesman with me? And I don't mind doing the talking, but I'd like to know that you're with me. He said, yeah.
Speaker 3:So anyway, before we could get out of that bar, the trainer came in with a letter for me that I was suspended for a different fight. Now we had played the last game on a Saturday night and I had a goal in three assists. So it was a different play. I guess I should have got about 10. I don't know. But anyway, as it turned out, we kept them out and I kept calling meetings morning and night just to try to keep the guys so they understand what's going on. So we did it for a couple of days and finally I didn't realize it would get so big.
Speaker 3:And finally we were getting nationwide. We were getting reporters from New York, boston, chicago, they're all coming down to the communities. So we had a rule no one could do an interview but me. I didn't want to have someone speak and say something that was really going to be detrimental to us. You know, it wasn't very many things we wanted. We just wanted players back and really proper medical, which we didn't have.
Speaker 3:And anyway, finally on the Thursday I think it was Bill White said what about that guy in Toronto? That's not Bobby Orr. He said Al Eagles. I said fine. I said this is above me. So I called Eagles and Eagles said I see, you've got a little bit of a problem down there. I said a big one. He said I'll fly down tonight and brought a fella by the name of Ray Smaila with him. They flew into Hartford that night. Jerry Puller and I went and picked them up, brought them in.
Speaker 3:We had a meeting on Friday, talked to the players and he said we've scheduled a meeting at the shore and he went over to Shore and Ray Smail came back and he said my advice to all you players is go home and I'll guarantee you'll be free agents by the end of the year. Anyway, I said all we want is my hockey. You don't get paid while being home. Anyway, they went and had a meeting with Shore and the quick result was Shore said that he had agreed to leave the team and we went on to play and match a record that he had set that would give us a $10,000 bonus. And we did it, but we still didn't get in the playoffs. But we all got reinstated, we all played and the players got the money. But it was the start of the Players' Association, because the next year it started, the next year in training camp, aligas had come out and we started the first association in LA.
Speaker 2:In LA, because the LA Kings essentially took over running.
Speaker 3:Springfield. They bought Springfield from Eddie.
Speaker 2:And so many of you went to LA in that first season, right, eddie Joyella, bill Flatt yourself. Obviously you scored the first goal. It's so well documented. You scored two that night had a helper as well, I believe. But there was a number of Springfield grads who went to. You guys were some of you were older, but you still went to LA.
Speaker 3:So LA- Well, he started. Bill Boyd and David Matty could have played in the.
Speaker 2:National.
Speaker 3:League. So we got two good defenses right off the bat. One of the keys to getting it off the ground was when they voted for a rep in LA. They voted me as their rep and Terry Sawchuck was our goaltender. So Terry came to me after the meeting and he said Killer, you went through it last year, you don't know the year. He said why don't I be the rep? You could be the assistant vote mate. And he said they can't send me anywhere, they'll probably send you down. So why don't I be the rep?
Speaker 1:I was, of course, pillar they don't I be the rep. I was their first pick.
Speaker 3:So when Terry Sartre came to be a rep for LA and he saved me because the first thing would have been to break the strike, would have been to set. But later on we had a meeting in Chicago when all the teams sent in their reps and again I was voted one of the three reps and Al Eagleson stepped in and said he went through it last year, he doesn't need it again this year.
Speaker 1:We need some names that are here that they can't send down to try to break and that's what happened.
Speaker 3:They got it started and that was the start of the Players Association, even though Ted Lindsey tried a couple years earlier but he didn't get the backing that he needed and they traded a bunch of players from Detroit to Chicago anyone that backed. But that was a start. We started thinking about it and I got talking to Ted Lindsey at the Hall of Fame and Ted Lindsey was very appreciative. I was of him for trying to start it. He was of me for doing what we did.
Speaker 2:I should mention as well the introduction left out a little fact that Killer's in the Hockey Hall of Fame as well, that's right. Introduction left out a little fact that killer's in the Hockey Hall of Fame as well, that's right. Inducted in 2003, I believe, killer, and and deservedly so, and for your spectacular career. I want that noted. Everything he just said this is historic, the actual start of the Players Association as we know it today, now being run by Marty Walsh and and so many people since Eagleson. This is where it all began, the genesis of it in 1967. Killer, you know you say the name Eddie Short. You played for him. You were there for a number of years in Springfield, I think from 59.
Speaker 3:I was eight years there.
Speaker 2:Eight years in Springfield. Like, we hear the name and it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's almost cartoonish. Well, yeah, because he's just, he brings up so many just images of not only he's playing, but then you heard about after, and the movie, the don cherry movies and everything about eddie shore. What could, what could you share with our viewers right now? If I say the name eddie shore, what, what comes to mind for you?
Speaker 3:well, he, was a great teacher because his philosophy was move the puck, don't stand still, just move the puck, advance the puck. And he put a lot of emphasis on our team just quickly moving the puck, so that they always said Springfield were the fastest team in the league. Well, it was me who moved the puck faster. We didn't skate any faster. Matter of fact, I was probably the slowest, me, and Bill Swinney probably the slowest skaters.
Speaker 2:And you were the two top scorers.
Speaker 3:Well, we were the slowest too, but anyway it was the emphasis on movement of the puck and speed and he was good. He didn't have anything to do with the money he would have been good, but because the money was involved in the big factor, he was tough, Like we didn't have proper hospitalization. He ordered people out of the hospital when they were in for serious operations, and I could use so many different, I could use a couple of my own. We had to get affidavits when we were going through that problem and but one that I remember was that a fellow by the name of Donnie Johns. He was in, he had a skate, so he said can we do it?
Speaker 3:The doctor repaired it and said you're gonna have to stay in the hospital for three or four days to make sure there's no infection and sure call the doctor that afternoon and told him if he didn't get into the hospital that night he would be suspended. Donnie John called me and said what do I do? Well, I said he will suspend you, but I said I think I'd call the doctor so that he's aware of what you're going to do. So anyway, he did, but he took himself further to the hospital because he didn't want to be suspended. I mean, that was just one. Yeah, I mean I got cross-checked by Fern Flammon in Springfield on Saturday night. We had to take a night train, then we took a bus to Quebec for an afternoon game.
Speaker 3:I had sewn back. But after the game I went to Sean and I said I'm having problems and he said you call this doctor and he put me in a barrel and I lost my breath and he said you're all right. So anyway, got on the train and played that afternoon in Quebec, but after the game I was going across the street. I ran across the street, we were going to have a beer and something to eat and all of a sudden I couldn't catch my breath and I was down on all fours. So I got up and I got a cab, went to the hostel. I had two broken ribs and they cracked a third and so when I came back to the hotel, I went to Patty and her coach and I said I went to the hostel.
Speaker 3:And our coach and I said I went to the hospital. I left for two or three weeks. I got two broken ribs cracked dirt. He said I better go get Char. So Char came out of his room and he said first word to me who told you to go to the hospital? I said, I told myself. I said when I couldn't breathe I figured something was wrong. So I got two broken ribs and a cracked knee.
Speaker 3:So I said, if you sit back and visualize, you'll be all right. I played Tuesday, I played Saturday, I played Sunday. We didn't have such things as an injury to take out.
Speaker 1:It's just unbelievable stuff. You hear this in the sweatshops in India or wherever the whippings and everything like that, but to think that this sport was like that. It's unfathomable for somebody who's younger.
Speaker 2:This is the 1960s.
Speaker 3:No, I know this isn't like the 1920s or 30s. The owners I mean the National League owners, for instance, weren't completely literally white either. No right, they did some things, you know. And there was one other story. If you got about two minutes, I'll tell it quick. Right, yeah take your time. I got elbowed in the jaw and finished the game in double overtime. But after the game I had to go to the hospital and I had a double fracture of the jaw here and here.
Speaker 3:So they said it and we had played Lansing. It was too swollen to operate Lansing. They did it Thursday. So I was in the hospital. Driving to the hospital I had the wires and everything and so they let me in Saturday morning but they said oh, we had a call from Dave Shaw. When you're released from the hospital he wants you to go to the ring. So I went down to the ring and I I saw Sean and I said you want me. He said, yeah, I want you to put your equipment on. I want to see if you can absorb pain elevator at the spot where he stood right at the red line and he put Pat Egan on the left and me at the blue line on the right and he said I want you to collide in front of me to see if you're gonna zone paint. So Pat Egan was 190 pounds.
Speaker 2:Yeah, his nickname was Boxcar. Anyway, he was good and anyway.
Speaker 3:So we came up and we hit Schroeder. Egan didn't let up. He hit me. But Shorter said how's that feeling? I said, well, I got a little pain here. That's where I got hit. He said try the other side. So did it again. He went the blue. I went the blue, I came back and hit this shoulder. He said how's that? And I said well, I got a pain over here. I didn't realize I had a double fracture. They never told me. So anyway, I said little thing here, you'll be alright during the line time, walk away. So I came down and I was in the lineup the next night Played the first period.
Speaker 3:Lucky for me, the doctor came in. He was late getting to the game. That did the surgery and he saw me out there.
Speaker 3:I had a plaster cast this way and this way on my head to try to protect me. And he came in and he said that guy's on the ice. So I went to the shore right away. He said if he gets hit he'll be talking to clenched teeth the rest of his life. And he said you'll be under a lawsuit forever. So anyway, I only played the one period they took me out and because Char was such a great humanitarian, I became a Black Ace. I had to park the ice at eight o'clock in the morning to go with the Black Aces till 10. And then with the regular team from 12 to two. So there wasn't a lot of fond memories for sure.
Speaker 2:Well, that sheds a little bit of light.
Speaker 3:Now let me ask you, if I can ask a question and if you don't want to answer it, you don't have to.
Speaker 1:So Alan Eagleson rides in on a white horse, let's say and he helped you guys start the Players Association. Where did everything go wrong for someone like him? You saw some of the stuff so what happened?
Speaker 3:Al Eagleson and Bobby Orr, the best of friends. Matter of fact, he brought Bobby Orr down when we were having that four day strike. He brought Bobby Orr down and Bobby Orr gave the team encouragement. It was great for the team. But later on it was Bobby and Al Eagleson who had a split and they had a follow-up over a couple of things. And then Harkin Katniss went with Eagleson and that's where a lot of things went wrong for Al Eagleson. But at that time Al Eagleson did save us Because if he doesn't come down, it was way over my head.
Speaker 2:You needed legal advice.
Speaker 3:So he came down, got us to the point where, and then short sold the team and so then everything else became easy. But there was one story I didn't tell, and I'll finish my story. You guys didn't tell we're at home this night. During the strike, the four days that we were on that we didn't practice or even go to the ring. And I had a call. I'm sitting watching TV, judy, my wife Judy answered the phone and she said Brian, it's Mr Campbell for you. I said, oh, hello.
Speaker 2:Clarence Campbell, president of the NFL.
Speaker 3:Clarence Campbell, president of the NFL, and his words were how are you and how nice are you? He said if you don't get, are you? I already said to him, if you don't get those players back on the ice tomorrow morning, you'll never play a game the rest of your life. And instead of worrying, I got mad and I said and if you hadn't been using Eddie Shore as a threat all these years, we wouldn't be in this situation now, anyhow else. So I called Eagle the next day and Eagleson called and told them that if he wants to interfere in any way, he'll attack his contract. But that was the threat that I should have been scared of, except my temper just got better Instead of saying yeah, yeah yeah, well.
Speaker 3:But anyways it turned out not all. Clarence Campbell did a great job for the National League and it was a call from the shore to try to get the players back, but anyways it turned out. It did work out for the best and all the players got their money and Eddie Shore retired and we went on.
Speaker 2:Historic beyond belief. I know we've got to move on to the Ottawa 67s and we don't want to keep you too long, but I have to ask you something Now. This could be a tough question as well. Killer is something I've never asked you, and you mentioned Bill Sweeney, who was so talented by American Hockey League standards. This guy's a hundred point. You know he's on the Springfield team that one killer. A guy like Bill Sweeney, survives, thrives and plays so well in the minors, has a brief cup of coffee in the NHL. Floyd Smith, who was there all those years too and a 40-goal score, ends up going on to have a pretty decent career in the National.
Speaker 3:League. Besides, it was just a match, wasn't it? Yeah?
Speaker 2:Like why Floyd and not Bill?
Speaker 3:in the National League. Like where? Why Floyd and not Bill in the National League? Well, bill was tough to control.
Speaker 2:Bill had his own rules. Okay, I've often wondered this, because his he had his own rules and he stopped at his own time.
Speaker 3:So it was tough telling a team they had to be in for a curfew and see the guy go the other way. But on the ice he was second done. He was the leader of our team Three years in a row over 100 points. Three years in a row over 40 goals. Three years in a row we won the Carver Cup. There was no doubt that Bill Sweeney was a talent, but you have to the National League knew that if he played there he had his own rules. He was owned by the Rangers and I think they had an exhibition series over in Europe and I think he was doing well point-wise. But I think they had a couple of problems and they remembered it.
Speaker 2:And name the Crystal Noel, and then I'll show it back to you, buddy, because I know you know the name Ted Harris. I've often asked Killer about Ted Harris because he was on those teams as well. I mean Noel Price, ted Harris. Look at your D. That was there, bob.
Speaker 3:McCord, bob McCord, ian Kushner. Like this is murderous.
Speaker 2:We had an ass-right team. This is absolutely and tough tough tough D, oh tough.
Speaker 3:We all grew about three inches. We weren't. The forwards weren't tough, but if you tackled tangled with us, we had those guys and they could all handle it. And to this day I still think we had Bob McCord who was actually he boxed. He was tough, but there were so many tough guys, no question about it, but there were so many tough guys. Teddy Harris was the toughest, teddy Harris was the toughest and Teddy Harris and John Ferguson. One year Montreal got eliminated and four straight. The year before the next year they added Ted Harris and John Ferguson and the other side of the cup.
Speaker 3:What does that tell?
Speaker 2:you yeah, yeah, do the math, do the math. I want to share that with you because I know you know the name, ted Harris, and. I've asked Brian many, many times about that D and many other players on Springfield. But these guys all went on the National League and had outstanding careers, like Ted Harris, stanley Cutler, gold Price on the 66 winner with the Habs yes, he was, you know, and Bob McCord played the show. I mean, there was a lot of these guys all. How did you?
Speaker 1:But there was so many Kent Douglas rookie ofookie of the Year in 1963, which we're all going to speak about Tough holy lifting Claude.
Speaker 3:Schmidt did well.
Speaker 2:Jimmy.
Speaker 3:Anderson ended up being coach Kenny Schenkel.
Speaker 2:Larry Hillman.
Speaker 3:Well, yeah, and then Ken Schenkel ended up general manager. He drafted Mario Lemieux in Pittsburgh, so we had an abundance of talent as well as guys that knew the game. It was no secret, we had a pretty good team. Terry Reardon was the general manager of Baltimore when we won one of the three Coler Cups. Terry Reardon said that if we played in the National League, we would make the playoff team. He made that statement.
Speaker 2:Wow, yeah, wow. I never heard you say that before and you know, in that too, chris was Don, cherry was in that mix. Sure he was. Don was one of the originals.
Speaker 3:Was he in that mix? He was tough and he could hit and sure. For some reason I always picked on Don, but didn't matter.
Speaker 2:And Don never cared about points. He played defensive hockey and he was course has spoken so fondly of you so many times. You had the junior hockey showcase there for years, right? You and Bert would go, and Graves was there too, right.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, don did a lot of things for a lot of groups, individuals that needed help. Never charged me when, anywhere, everywhere, and never charged. And there's one story I'll never forget we were doing a prospecting in the kitchen and somehow after the banquet, I would say two or three classes must have gone out of school early and they come down all looking for autographs. And this was 2-2.30, they started flooding and they did the rake. Don Cherry stayed and signed every autograph till every kid left with an autograph Never left, I'd say we stayed there till 4 o'clock.
Speaker 3:It was an incredible night and he still is. He does a lot of things that go unnoticed.
Speaker 2:And so sad about his daughter passing away suddenly as she did, and I know how close he is with his family, as we all are. But I mean that was public because Cindy was a great lady and has his Tim, his son, who the Bruins helped years ago medically, so it's a close-knit.
Speaker 3:Well, the funny part was why Tim felt so bad was that when Tim was born he had a kidney bone. Cindy gave one of her kidneys to, to Tim Dawn, so they certainly had a bond between them and Don and Rose at the time and now Luba, they're a strong family. Absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 2:Got something before we slide to 67?
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, I want to kind of transition to your question. So your playing career is coming to an end, you have ahead of you, without the knowledge of the future, a Hall of Fame coaching career. But that period of where you're thinking, okay, career's ending, how did you feel? Like like I would think that there would be, I don't know fear, I don't know what. What were you feeling when you decided or when you kind of I don't want to say tripped into coaching, but when you finally got into coaching from a player's career, well it was uh, my own choosing.
Speaker 3:I was out in Denver. I joined them all in January, At the same time Bill and Kimmy the not-home guy.
Speaker 3:We both joined them and finished the year in Denver, but we were starting the restaurant business in Henry and they had asked me would I run the restaurant for them? And I said yeah, sure, I said when I came back. So I came back and I was designing this restaurant because they had bought this one. It was the episode of Beck Spark with no knowledge of running a restaurant. I was a customer for all those years. Anyways, it turned out, I'm running this restaurant, I get a call from Denver and they offered me more money than I ever made on a car track before and they said
Speaker 1:if you'll come back, we'll give you this.
Speaker 3:I said I can. I gave my word to Nick Morris, Bill Morris, Jimmy Scott, Bob Wilson, Gary Applin.
Speaker 3:There was this group that had this restaurant in Glenbrook last year. It's funny, when I stay with the restaurant and Tommy Ray, the school teacher in Ottawa, was helping the 67th, I end up coaching a minor league team, the West Ottawa Golden Knights. I said you know what? First off, I started with Tykes Billy, my son, and we just had fun doing it. And so, as it turned out, tommy Ray asked me if I could coach his midget team in the West End.
Speaker 3:So I coached his midget team in the West End for a year and then there was a foot went in the wrong pocket and passed away and we ended up playing the Russians to that historical day and I was a coach of that game. I was back in Coliseum that year. I was coach of the City of London. It was at that time that Leo Boylan and Roslyn Kirill both had resigned from the 67s, so they asked me if I'd be interested in coaching. That's how I got started, so I wasn't cut on my career didn't it.
Speaker 3:I wasn't cut short, but it was my own. I retired because I was at the end and I lost a stride that I couldn't afford.
Speaker 2:Brian Smith was on that team too. Was he on that Denver team, denver yeah, oh yeah, I enjoyed it.
Speaker 3:It was a great finish. Some good guys on it, like I said, brian, bill and Deneen. But then, as my dad always said, things are cut for the best. And who ever thought that I'd come back, run a restaurant with no knowledge and then Coach and Miner just types? And then I made it to the team and then go and coach the 67's and it's been a lifetime association. I'm still with them and I started until last year and I'm just happy that I ended at 6-7.
Speaker 2:What's your proudest thing with the 6-7s, would you say Killer, in that multi-decade association? There's so many to choose from. Is it even fair to say one?
Speaker 3:Well, yeah, one would be winning the Memorial. Cup in Ottawa, I mean our hometown.
Speaker 2:I mean.
Speaker 3:I was born here and they always said you can. I mean our hometown, I mean I was born here and they always said you can't coach in your hometown. The fans are great to me from day one, and so winning the Memorial Cup here in Ottawa, our fans I don't think that could be taught, except when I was in Dunkirk Dome. Yeah yeah. That would be the two highlights. I don't think that could be taught except when I was a young adult. That would be the two highlights of the hockey side, not my marital side?
Speaker 2:No for sure, but you hit a home run there. You've got an amazing wife and an incredible family. I met you formally actually at Billy's Stack, the first time that we actually met.
Speaker 3:That was many years ago it was at Dells.
Speaker 2:Lake. It was at Dells Lake. You're 100% Bangla. I remember coming up and talking about guys that were in junior. At that time we were friends of mine and you pulled no punches about something there ability or lack thereof but killer kid you mean, this isn't you know, I don't know how you're going to answer this but I mean your longevity of success, the years that you were able to keep the 67s winning. You got a handful of losing seasons in almost three decades of coaching. What, what would you attribute your success to?
Speaker 3:well, we had some great assistant coaches that sort of got overlooked and I had three, basically three, chief scouts Jack Ferguson, joey Rowley, patty Higginson, for whatever reason. They found players that could play in the fifth round, the eighth round, the tenth round, and we always end up with good players and good teammates, and so I can attribute a lot of my success to the people that were associated with the club.
Speaker 1:So let me ask you on that, and the players and the players, of course. And to that end you were saying, you had good teammates. So I'm going to ask you three people Toughest player you ever had, most talented player you ever had and the best in the dressing room.
Speaker 3:Very quick. Well, the most talented is a question that I'll sidestep, only because Bobby Smith and Doug Wilson were both multi-talented, different positions. Bobby still owns the record for points in our league 192, over Gretzky, over Gaby, over everybody. So, Bobby Smith, Doug Wilson came he was the only guy I ever saw come from the blue line, not screened, Just a tremendous defenseman. So they were probably the two In the dressing room. That would be tough because we had so many guys. But there was one guy that he wasn't the most talented, probably wasn't the toughest, but he stuck up for every player, and that was David Bell.
Speaker 2:David.
Speaker 3:Bell was a defensive force and there wasn't a player on that team who wouldn't do whatever David Bell said and, as a leader, Nick Boynton. We won the Mario Cup and I'll never forget. We got beat this game so that we had the play, and all of a sudden we got into the Mario Cup and Nick Boynton was our captain at the time and he told every player when we lost that day. He said we're going home and he stood up in the dressing room Everyone, every player. When we lost that day, we said we're going home and we stood up in the dressing room Everyone, we're going home and we're going to come down here tomorrow. And every player we listened to every day. And the next day we were lucky enough to win an overtime win. So there are three phases, different things, like you were saying.
Speaker 2:And where would you slot in a guy like Lance Calvary?
Speaker 3:Well, he was one of those guys that was an inspiration. He never thought there was a name he shouldn't write. He was one of those guys that I always came writing. I'd go down to the rink about 4 or 3 every night, just go over there and line up, have a cigar and then go over there and line up. I couldn't beat Lance Galbraith in the dressing room. I always liked to be first when I was a player. As a coach. Couldn't beat Lance Galbraith. He was one of those guys that everything was for team. So five years with us, a lot of games, but he was a diehard, wasn't the most talented but, certainly he gave us all everything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and for me, my final foray with Killer here would be to say or maybe, killer, if you could offer up a comment about how incredible it was post-game to be in the room with the garbage bag full, usually a bunch of, not the bag but the garbage container, a lot of cans of beer in there, filled right to the top, usually a lot of Molson X. I just want to put that out there, usually a lot of Molson X. I just want to put that out there. And the amount of guys that would come in to say hi to you from the other teams, from their scouting, the officials, the NHL superstars, hall of Famers that would come in that room post-game, including some of the guys who you meet here on Tuesdays at Broadway.
Speaker 3:Well, terry Marcotte used to follow us, and Donny Brennan he's covered. Dave Shriver yeah, they used to come down and I'll never forget one of the Hall of Famers.
Speaker 3:There was many, I couldn't name them all, but one. One time, bobby Hall was in the room and so I sit beside him and he started telling a couple of stories and he, he said, after about one or two, he said I said, I said, I said, I said, I said, all these guys are trustworthy. I said all these guys are trustworthy. No one ever tried to sneak a column in or everything. And I think because of that, all the players that came in, whether it was ex-national leaders or whatever, they'd come in and feel free and they told any story that we enjoyed. They just took over. Was there a rhythm too?
Speaker 2:You know the Ottawa European Sports Club. I think the Hams had played a huge role. Oh yeah, Gordy and Bruce, long time dear friends.
Speaker 3:He was an assistant coach at the time and I didn't mention, you know, Bernard O'Brien, Gordy Hamill, Peter Nye and Vince Vaughn. They were basically the four. They didn't get the credit, they looked after little things. Sometimes it doesn't hurt.
Speaker 2:Well, sitting there and I'll finish by saying, sitting there with your Uncle, ken and Connie Brown and some of those guys that were stalwarts from this city, not only in National League but in minor leagues and hockey all around in the 40s late 30s, your uncles Hack and Wally as well deserve credit as well for their time in the National League. And man, this has been awesome, yeah, aw.
Speaker 1:It's been fantastic. I want to say two things before we finish, and it's not to blow smoke up your ass or anything like that, but having been the success that you've been and then having to retire, do you ever go I can do that better or do you ever have a thought that you can help? And certainly in the 60s? You mean watching hockey today. Watching hockey today as a coach, you see all the different types of coaching styles that are out there and I know from when I was a kid, and you know this Jim Fox was not an original 67, right, he was a Spitfire right and he hated it.
Speaker 1:He gave up his love for hockey until you came along, and so I guess it's a two-part question. One, what was your secret sauce magic for guys, because everybody seems to have the same opinion of you and what do you think the progression of coaching has been today?
Speaker 3:that is different. Well, I just you know, when players came to us I wasn't there. Whatever happened in the past, I didn't care. I mean, we knew last time we had a problem before you did. It's what you do starting now. And we tried to treat everybody the same, Wanted to make sure.
Speaker 3:We came to Ottawa, played for the Sixth Heavens, had fun, and when you leave, when your time is up, that you can look back and say I learned a little and I had a lot of fun. And I thought that was the philosophy that worked for me, because the players did for me. They had fun and I had more fun. We had our times, but there had to be fun involved and when I see today's game, everybody is you know they got their coaching because of their success and whatever. The only thing I can say that if I was to help somebody would be that sometimes they don't advance the puck and you know when you're coming up the blue line that sometimes they don't advance the puck and you know when you're coming up the blue line and you may be two or three or four strikes behind you gotta wave your hand at him.
Speaker 3:Give him the push, drive the defense off the blue line, because if you don't he's gotta stop. And now he's lost his momentum. So when I watch a game I said oh, he's a little too late. I mean, I realize coaching is tough with the individuals now and the money that's there and everything else. So any coach that's coaching today is earning his money, because it's a different world that's for sure, that is for sure, I'm going to take a snippet of what you just said.
Speaker 1:I'm playing men's league tonight and I need that. Move the puck again. Guys are watching these things. You know that bowl, they drop the puck back and they try to do it. Guys are 60 years old and they're trying to do that. It's like buddy, just head man. The time just hit man the pocket. You got taught that I mean, and I know why that guy should stop like he's beating it.
Speaker 3:He may have his winger beat his major, he may beat it. So if you don't either give him the puck or shoot it in, let him get it first. No, so when you hold on to it now he he's out of the play. Basically, that's right, he's stomped. So now you only have this side to play?
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly. Well, you know what? That's exactly my argument tonight. Get the dressing room. I'm telling them and I'm saying this from you I hope it works bro Well.
Speaker 2:I hope it does too Well listen, we never got to mention guys like like Tank and Stump and so many others that were instrumental to you. I know that Lone Ranger, dave, of course those guys, I know they meant so much to you. But you know, killer, I can't thank you enough.
Speaker 1:Chris, no, I really appreciate it. It's been a pleasure. And I hope that we can maybe do this another time to talk about more things, because I know that you have a hundred thousand more stories.
Speaker 3:I read your book, guys, your book. Yeah, I got a little story said someone couldn't tell yeah even on a webcast.
Speaker 1:Maybe we need to get those. Anyways, thank you very much. This has been offside with haas mcguire. I'm haas, I'm mcguire and that's mr kilroy.
