Nurse Essentials: A podcast focused on caring for you
Nurse Essentials: A podcast focused on caring for you
Successfully Transitioning from Nursing Peer to Leader
Nursing is all about relationships. But how do you manage the transition and maintain appropriate relationships with peers when you accept a leadership role? In this episode of Nurse Essentials, Kristen Vargo, DNP, RN, NE-BC, Director of Nursing for the Neurological Institute and Orthopaedics & Rheumatology at Cleveland Clinic’s main campus, shares insight on the topic.
Carol Pehotsky (00:05):
Nursing is all about relationships. And the relationships we have with each other are so important to lift each other up and to provide excellent care. For a nurse considering a transition into a leadership role, sometimes one of the concerns is, "What happens with my work friends? How will those relationships change, and how do I know what to do?"
(00:24):
We're joined today by Kristen Vargo to discuss successful transitions from peer nurse to leader.
(00:34):
Hi, and welcome to Nurse Essentials, a Cleveland Clinic podcast where we discuss all things nursing, from patient care, to advancing your career, to navigating tough on-the-job issues. We're so glad you're here. I'm your host, Carol Pehotsky, Associate Chief Nursing Officer of Surgical Services Nursing.
(00:54):
Welcome back, everyone. Today we're going to spend some time talking about leadership and, and if you're somebody who's not yet in leadership and thinking about, "Is it time to take the next step?", I'd invite you to go back to season one and listen to our episode with Kelly Hancock, where we talked about deciding if a nurse leadership position is right for you.
(01:11):
Today, though, we're going to take that a step farther. You know, somebody who has, has said, "Yes, as a nurse, I'm, I'm seeking a nursing leadership position and, and have been awarded one," and what that's like to go from peer and bedside colleague to now, "I'm the boss," or some form of boss. Right. (laughs)
[NEW_PARAGRAPH] And, you know, in preparing for this episode, I was reflecting on my own journey many, many, many years ago. When I was a bedside nurse in PACU, there was an assistant nurse manager position open, and one of my friends on the unit said, "Well, you should apply for that." And I said, "but I don't want to be the nurse manager." And they said, "Well, it's not. It's assistant nurse managers." Well, what do you think is the next step for that person? And again, haha, look at me now, I'm very much in a leadership role, but at the time, it didn't feel right for me. And at that time, I think, part of it was already this thought of, "What does that look like? What does that feel like? What does that mean in terms of, of collegiality and friendships at work?" And we know that's not necessarily something that is completely intuitive, it's something that nurse leaders need to be intentional about when they transition from peer to leader.
(02:16):
And so, with that, it's my great pleasure to introduce you all to Dr. Kristen Vargo. Kristen is now the director of nursing for the Neurological Institute and Orthopaedics & Rheumatology, at main campus. We've known each other for quite some time. I asked her permission to tell the story, and she had granted it. But the first time I met Kristen, (laughs) she was interviewing for leadership position. And the energy and the enthusiasm and the engagement and the passion behind it, it, it was a very easy choice to be part of the panel that welcomed her into that role. But I, I got the pleasure of watching you transition from peer to leader. So, thank you so much for joining us today.
Kristen Vargo (02:52):
Thank you so much, Carol, for having me.
Carol Pehotsky (02:54):
So, to kick us off, I shared a little bit about your nursing history (laughs), but would you mind sharing with our audience a little bit about your journey and, and how it got you here?
Kristen Vargo (03:02):
Sure. So, I'm originally from Erie, Pennsylvania, where I started my nursing career at a small community hospital. I spent a year there as a nurse.
Carol Pehotsky (03:03):
Okay.
Kristen Vargo (03:14):
And I made it to Cleveland with my husband related to his education.
Carol Pehotsky (03:20):
I don't think I knew that. Okay.
Kristen Vargo (03:22):
Correct.
Carol Pehotsky (03:22):
All right.
Kristen Vargo (03:23):
So, he went to Case Western, and I had no clue when we moved here, by the way. And I was like, "Oh, Cleveland Clinic. I know that."
Carol Pehotsky (03:32):
That looks fun.
Kristen Vargo (03:33):
So, I applied. I was a cardiac nurse back home...
Carol Pehotsky (03:36):
Mm-hmm.
Kristen Vargo (03:36):
... so thought I would stay in at least an area that I knew. So, I started, you know, in the G building, and then moved, you know, to their beautiful new space and became a floor nurse, and cardiovascular medicine and heart failure step down.
Carol Pehotsky (03:36):
All right.
Kristen Vargo (03:52):
And there, I quickly fell in love with nursing leadership.
Carol Pehotsky (03:56):
Mm.
Kristen Vargo (03:56):
Charge nurse and preceptor, I, you know, I was co-chair of the Shared Governance Committee. And that's what really led me, initially, to leadership.
Carol Pehotsky (03:56):
Sure. Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (04:06):
And then became their assistant nurse manager for a while and really knew that this was the track that I wanted to pursue.
Carol Pehotsky (04:13):
Okay.
Kristen Vargo (04:14):
And then, you know, I like to take on roles that I know nothing about...
Carol Pehotsky (04:17):
(laughs).
Kristen Vargo (04:18):
... in areas that I have never worked. So, as you know, became nurse manager in peri-op, and now I have the great honor to be a director of nursing on main campus.
Carol Pehotsky (04:29):
So, a few opportunities to have some lessons learned, when it comes to transition. (laughs) So we'll dive right in. You know, it's that first big role. Right. And, and you're moving from peer to leader. And like we talked about... That's even, you know, at the Cleveland Clinic we have assistant nurse manager positions where there really is one foot in each world. So that can instantly be awkward. So let- let's go from the start of, "Congratulations, you've got the role." There could be somebody on the unit who didn't get the roles. What does that look like?
Kristen Vargo (04:56):
That can be really challenging to navigate through. You know, there can be some resentment...
Carol Pehotsky (05:02):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (05:02):
... from those individuals that did not get the role. When I transitioned, I was fortunate to be the only applicant.
Carol Pehotsky (05:09):
(laughs).
Kristen Vargo (05:10):
But I think as a new leader, it's essential for you to have a conversation with those, those individuals. And I'm a sole believer of addressing the elephant in the room. (laughs).
Carol Pehotsky (05:11):
(Laughs) There it is.
Kristen Vargo (05:25):
And you know, really saying, I know this can be awkward.
Carol Pehotsky (05:28):
Mm-hmm.
Kristen Vargo (05:29):
And you know, I'm here to be your leader and I want you to feel comfortable with me as your leader. And you know, I'm always one to try and offer support in these situations and say, "I see leadership is where you want to be, like let's work together."
Carol Pehotsky (05:30):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (05:46):
"And help you grow into the role that you want." I think also in those moments, it's essential to set expectations though.
Carol Pehotsky (05:55):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (05:56):
And just ensure, you know, from here on out that we're communicating positively in the unit, and that they are there to support you just as much as you're there to support them.
Carol Pehotsky (06:09):
Really easy conversations to start a leadership career with. You know and, and that transition, I experienced it a bit myself and I've seen it happen to other leaders where, literally overnight, you get the badge, you get the keys and you go from, "We're friends and we eat lunch together and we hang out. Maybe we hang out after work," to "I'm the boss." So, in that short period of time, what, what are some recommendations you have or things that you've done to really, again, so quickly make that transition?
Kristen Vargo (06:39):
Probably one of the hardest things...
Carol Pehotsky (06:42):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (06:43):
... to do. And it's really that transition from peer to likely an assistant nurse manager role.
Carol Pehotsky (06:51):
Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Kristen Vargo (06:51):
I vividly remember this, because when I transitioned to an assistant nurse manager, I had been a nurse for five years.
Carol Pehotsky (07:01):
Okay.
Kristen Vargo (07:01):
And I remember thinking, "Gosh, I am going to have nurses under me that have been here probably double, triple, quadruple, and likely beyond, under me. And now I am their leader."
Carol Pehotsky (07:17):
Yeah. How'd you navigate that?
Kristen Vargo (07:19):
To say it's very hard, is an understatement. But in true honesty, probably, some of the best nurses I have ever worked with...
Carol Pehotsky (07:30):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (07:30):
... on those units. And they were all so supportive. But I think, one thing that I truly struggled with was, "How do you go from peer having all of these great friends that I had just spent the last five years with, bonding, getting to know, you know, spending time outside of work, and now I'm their leader?" And you know, knowing that that relationship will now change.
Carol Pehotsky (08:00):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (08:01):
It is tough for people. It was tough for me.
Carol Pehotsky (08:03):
Yep. Ab- same. Absolutely.
Kristen Vargo (08:06):
And one thing that I remember feeling, when I became an assistant nurse manager is, that I was all alone.
Carol Pehotsky (08:14):
It's, it can be very lonely, for sure.
Kristen Vargo (08:14):
Mm-hmm.
Carol Pehotsky (08:16):
Yep. So, what did you do to address that?
Kristen Vargo (08:18):
I think, you know, talking through other assistant managers on my unit and saying, "You know, this is how I'm feeling is, is this normal?" And, you know, I think them validating those feelings...
Carol Pehotsky (08:30):
Hmm.
Kristen Vargo (08:30):
... was really helpful. And I think, if you are one of these individuals having these feelings, also leaning on your nurse manager is essential.
Carol Pehotsky (08:39):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (08:40):
Because they are, you know, really there to support you. You know, I still had friends in the unit too, and that's okay.
Carol Pehotsky (08:47):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (08:47):
It's just being incredibly mindful of how you proceed with your relationship, and ensuring that everything that you do, going forward, is professional.
Carol Pehotsky (08:58):
It's almost like you have to assess, this is going to sound harsher than I intend, but people who are your friends, sort of inside and out, outside of work, "We have things to talk about, we have done other things, we have engaged in other things where we have other things to talk about," versus, "These people are really my work friends and we only ever talk about work."
Kristen Vargo (09:17):
Yeah.
Carol Pehotsky (09:18):
So how, how did you, sort of, separate those things out and think about, "How do I maintain some of those relationships that really are beyond work friends?"
Kristen Vargo (09:28):
Sure. I think the one thing that I did was not really have one-on-one engagements with...
Carol Pehotsky (09:37):
Okay.
Kristen Vargo (09:38):
... some of my peers anymore. Now, if we were out in a group setting with caregivers, I felt a little bit more comfortable in that.
Carol Pehotsky (09:46):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (09:46):
You know, I was one that was really focused on making sure people felt like I was a fair leader.
Carol Pehotsky (09:46):
Mm-hmm.
Kristen Vargo (09:54):
And one that was not going to have favorites or make decisions, because I was friends with somebody. So that was one thing that I was really cognizant of when I transitioned and something that I kind of still hold true today as a leader.
Carol Pehotsky (10:12):
You have to really be in, I think the theme of the episode's going to be intention, right?
Kristen Vargo (10:12):
Absolutely.
Carol Pehotsky (10:15):
Is it really that intention and those one-on-one meetings with everybody that really talks about boundaries, professionalism, how we move forward together, huh?
Kristen Vargo (10:25):
Yeah, right. Exactly.
Carol Pehotsky (10:27):
So, I, you know, we were joking before the, the mic started rolling, but I would invite our listeners to even think about, you know, you had a great point about shared governance. It's not a separate paid position, but that really also is a leadership position. I have a, a core memory of my very first day as the educator in PACU. And I went down to lunch with everybody because I'm not in a leadership role, and everybody's getting ready to start venting about their day. And I've had to stop them and say, "Ooh, are you going to get ready to say something that I'm going to have to do something about as the educator? And if you're just venting, I should probably excuse myself." And that was the last time I went to lunch with them.
Kristen Vargo (11:03):
Mm-hmm.
Carol Pehotsky (11:03):
So how do you find sort of a new peer group then, or someone else to eat lunch with? How do you manage that loneliness?
Kristen Vargo (11:10):
Yeah, so for me, I was actually a night shift assistant manager. So, if you can imagine...
Carol Pehotsky (11:15):
Even less people to talk to.
Kristen Vargo (11:17):
Absolutely. So, I kind of befriended some other night shift assistant managers, and you know, you find your core group of people that you can lean on. And that's kind of where I found that person that I could talk through things and, you know, we could eat lunch together. And someone that I could say, "Hey, I need help with this situation, like, how would you navigate X, Y and Z?"
Carol Pehotsky (11:42):
Gosh, especially, I can't imagine, you know, you, your nurse manager's supportive, but they're, by and large, not there when you need that in the moment, like, "here's what I'm thinking." But yeah, to have that peer group of other night shift nursing leaders must have been really helpful.
Kristen Vargo (11:55):
Yeah, it was, it was essential. Particularly in those, you know, first year of really, you know, learning leadership, and navigating situations that you never thought you were going to be in. (laughs)
Carol Pehotsky (12:09):
(Laughs) So let's go there, especially because again, these are situations that, suddenly, you're behind the curtain...
Kristen Vargo (12:14):
Mm-hmm.
Carol Pehotsky (12:14):
... and somebody who you literally practiced shoulder to shoulder with a year ago, and you get let in on some things that are like, "Oh, gosh, how do I navigate this?" Or "I didn't know this." Especially when it comes to I, I, you know, I think about going back to that work friend group. Sometimes the temptation is to almost be harder on those folks to not show favoritism. And of course, we would never want to show favoritism. So, as you were getting into some of those tough scenarios, probably eye-opening, how do you navigate that and how do you make sure your objective, no matter what your past relationships were with these nurses?
Kristen Vargo (12:51):
As you can imagine, these can be incredibly difficult situations to navigate through, and often, really tricky.
Carol Pehotsky (12:58):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (12:59):
These were individuals that you had a relationship with as a friend, and now you are their leader. And I remember a situation when I was transitioning as an assistant nurse manager, and someone that I was really close friends with when we were bedside nurses. And they continuously were coming to me with requests that were not appropriate for me to be able to accept. And I remember needing to sit down and have a really difficult conversation with them. And we're talking, this was like three months into my role transition, and I remember my hands shaking, and in that moment, had to have a conversation of, you know, being mindful of requests that we're asking and that I may not always be able to accommodate them, because I want all of our caregivers to ensure that the decisions that I'm making are fair across the board.
(14:00):
And, you know, very, very challenging situation. And one where, you know, this person was quite upset after our conversation, but one that is essential to navigate as a new leader, because if you are not setting those expectations up front, people may try and take advantage of the situation. I think for people considering leadership opportunities...
Carol Pehotsky (14:34):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (14:34):
... you want to have to be mindful that you might be put in these situations.
Carol Pehotsky (14:39):
Oh, you will be.
Kristen Vargo (14:40):
But you also have to prepare yourself of the reaction of how some of these people are going to take difficult conversations, and kind of the emotion that comes with that. Because it's almost like a loss of somebody.
Carol Pehotsky (14:57):
Oh, absolutely. Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (14:59):
And...
Carol Pehotsky (15:00):
The, the relationship has changed irrevocably. Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (15:03):
Absolutely.
Carol Pehotsky (15:04):
So let's change a little bit to, you know, you, you came to our area, and so you didn't grow up in our area, but you did, over the course of your tenure with us, promote people as assistant nurse manager roles who also had sort of grown up in those units, had other relationships. So, so now as a leader of other leaders, how did you help... Especially because you'd had all these really rich lessons learned, how did you help those individuals transition to their first leadership role? And what sort of supports did you provide them?
Kristen Vargo (15:35):
Yeah, so I have always been, you know, a really hands-on leader, particularly, when I have new leaders that are starting. And one thing to really help prepare new leaders I have found is, for them to spend a lot of time with you, particularly new A&Ms, who have not had any rich experiences navigating through the challenges of leadership and having difficult conversations with people. So, one of the things that I always do is ensure that they're sitting with me, particularly, during challenging times.
Carol Pehotsky (16:12):
So, inviting them in?
Kristen Vargo (16:13):
Absolutely.
Carol Pehotsky (16:14):
Mm-hmm.
Kristen Vargo (16:14):
You know, and I now have the opportunity, I'm now orienting a new assistant director too.
Carol Pehotsky (16:20):
Hey. All right.
Kristen Vargo (16:21):
So, it's also including them on things that they may not have had experience with as a nurse manager and seeing how you navigate certain situations. Just this week we were talking about a meeting that we had, and you know, she said, "I really liked that I got to see how you communicated next steps related to a situation, because I wasn't sure how much I could share."
Carol Pehotsky (16:52):
Yeah?
Kristen Vargo (16:52):
So, I think having these caregivers’ kind of watch and observe you and how you handle situations, is the ultimate way for them to get education and learn.
Carol Pehotsky (17:04):
Well, and what a great way to, to say, "This is how I expect all of us to carry ourselves," and to do with intention. Again, I keep saying that word, but to be in the conversation and then to brief it afterwards, then you're, as their leader being really thoughtful about, "This is what I said, this is why I said it."
Kristen Vargo (17:23):
Right.
Carol Pehotsky (17:23):
Probably an opportunity to role play afterwards. If, if you were in that situation, what would you do? How could you do this differently?
Kristen Vargo (17:31):
Absolutely. And you know, kind of that role play allows people to do it themselves.
Carol Pehotsky (17:38):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (17:38):
I'm a person, I have to do it in order to be able to successfully accomplish it. And I love that. Yeah. Having them role play back and how they would navigate a situation or have them role play with you before they have a difficult conversation, is also another really great way to ensure they're prepared for a conversation.
Carol Pehotsky (18:01):
So when I think about sort of this trajectory, you know, we all have days, especially back when we were at the bedside, maybe it wasn't the best day ever, and we might've been vocal about that day, about things in the unit, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. It never fails. Everybody remembers those exact words two years later, three years later, when now this person who had a really bad day is now the boss.
(18:26):
So how would you recommend people... We've all had those days, right?
Kristen Vargo (18:26):
Sure.
Carol Pehotsky (18:29):
No, nobody (laughs) is perfect in that. So that will have happened to all of us. What do you recommend for people to sort of acknowledge, perhaps, especially if somebody says, "Oh, well now you're the boss, what are you going to do about this?" Or, you know, "You used to say this." How does somebody navigate that?
Kristen Vargo (18:46):
Sure. You know, I always find that those individuals that, you know, almost are resentful.
Carol Pehotsky (18:53):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (18:53):
It is absolutely essential to pull them aside and have a private conversation with them. And in those moments, active listening as a new leader is essential.
Carol Pehotsky (18:54):
Mm. Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (19:07):
And I try and get to, "Where is this coming from?"
Carol Pehotsky (19:12):
Okay.
Kristen Vargo (19:12):
You know, "Why, why are you feeling this way? Like, tell me more." And to understand how we can move forward as a leader, and as someone under my leadership. Because at the end of the day, you know, having that one person that is constantly...
Carol Pehotsky (19:34):
(laughs).
Kristen Vargo (19:34):
... you know, voicing their feelings negatively, is going to bring the whole team down. And if you're not going to address that as the leader, then it's going to be an uphill battle. (laughs).
Carol Pehotsky (19:47):
It'll not go away.
Kristen Vargo (19:48):
... going forward.
Carol Pehotsky (19:48):
So. Yep.
Kristen Vargo (19:49):
And I think, you know, setting a specific action plan with that caregiver is essential, and outlining expectations at the end, so they know what's expected of them. And unfortunately, if this behavior continues, you know...
Carol Pehotsky (19:49):
What does that look...
Kristen Vargo (20:06):
... you know, as that leader, I have to hold people accountable.
Carol Pehotsky (20:09):
Well, and you know, dear listeners, no matter where you work, there's always a support. You know, I think that's part of it too, is that anxiety, "What if I get into this position?" Or yeah, "I, I probably had some pretty vocal bad days. What if that comes back to haunt me," is find out who, it's your nurse manager, it's your nursing director, who are your people that can help you prepare for those? It's not like, "Good luck, here you go." Nobody wants you to go into those conversations unprepared.
Kristen Vargo (20:36):
Sure. And I think, in those moments, I think people want you to acknowledge, maybe something you might have done.
Carol Pehotsky (20:45):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (20:46):
... previously. And I think identifying that, "Yes, maybe I didn't, you know, react in the best manner during that situation." And, you know, apologizing, kind of validating their feelings. (laughs)
Carol Pehotsky (21:02):
Yeah, for sure.
Kristen Vargo (21:02):
It is a way to move past some of that resentment.
Carol Pehotsky (21:07):
So on the flip side of that, sometimes folks come into these roles with all this energy of, you know, "Whether I said it out loud or not, I see a million different ways we could improve, and all these things that bugged me as a bedside nurse, I'm going to tackle them all." That's not a great key to success. So, so what's your advice to, to that flipside leader, who maybe appropriately had, has a lot of thoughts about, "Here are opportunities, but it's day one."
Kristen Vargo (21:07):
Right.
Carol Pehotsky (21:35):
How does somebody tackle that?
Kristen Vargo (21:37):
You know, this is one of the biggest struggles I see new leaders...
Carol Pehotsky (21:44):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (21:44):
... kind of face and tackle. So, first, all of us are very overzealous in this organization...
Carol Pehotsky (21:51):
(laughs).
Kristen Vargo (21:51):
... and we often find ourselves doing too much too soon.
Carol Pehotsky (21:56):
Mm. Okay. Tell me more about that.
Kristen Vargo (21:58):
I think new leaders need to be incredibly mindful of what changes they're going to make before they've decided to build relationships, and gain that trust and respect of their caregivers, particularly, if you are taking a leadership role in areas that you do not know the caregivers.
Carol Pehotsky (22:16):
Oh, sure. The flip side, for sure. Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (22:20):
I think having one-on-one conversations with caregivers in that transition is essential. Really learning, you know, "What matters most to you, what are some things that are going well?"
Carol Pehotsky (22:20):
Hmm.
Kristen Vargo (22:33):
"What are some areas that you do see opportunity?" And during these conversations, I've always found it really important to understand how people like to be recognized.
Carol Pehotsky (22:43):
Mm, sure.
Kristen Vargo (22:44):
My current team thinks I'm crazy, because I actually have a spreadsheet of, you know, some of their favorite things. So, if I am recognizing them...
Carol Pehotsky (22:51):
I love it.
Kristen Vargo (22:51):
... I try to tailor it to that.
Carol Pehotsky (22:52):
I love it.
Kristen Vargo (22:54):
But I think, you know, finding a way to connect with individuals during these conversations is essential. And when leaders take this laundry list of those opportunities that caregivers think need improvement and trying to tackle all of them at one time, it is too challenging. I also have found where leaders try and make changes that are incredibly impactful to caregivers, prior to building relationships with them.
Carol Pehotsky (23:27):
Oh, I'm going to come and fix this thing.
Kristen Vargo (23:29):
Right.
Carol Pehotsky (23:29):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (23:31):
... is really challenging. You haven't had time to connect, to build a relationship, and to understand how people are going to react to changes that you're going to make. So, it's not only really difficult for the caregivers, but also very difficult for the manager. And I think finding a couple quick wins...
Carol Pehotsky (23:54):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (23:54):
... and identifying a couple things that are frustrating to the caregivers, is essential to start getting their buy-in. So then when you do need to make a change that caregivers might not necessarily like or agree with, you know how to have that conversation with people and navigate those situations.
Carol Pehotsky (24:17):
And because you've built that relationship, even if they don't love it, they hopefully, some trust that says it's coming from a good intention, it's coming for the right things for our patients, our caregivers, and not...
Kristen Vargo (24:27):
Yeah.
Carol Pehotsky (24:28):
... "I'm going to do this thing because I'm the boss." So, let's, gosh, we're running out of time, but I, before we walk away from the topic, I want to talk a little bit about social media. So, you and I have worked together for years. Let's say, we're, we're Facebook buddies, and now you're the boss. Are you de-friending me day one? How do you navigate some of those things that says, "Oh, my gosh, now you're the boss and you unfriended me?"
Kristen Vargo (24:28):
Sure.
Carol Pehotsky (24:52):
How do you navigate social media?
Kristen Vargo (24:54):
I would highly recommend that leaders don't review their whole entire friend list...
Carol Pehotsky (24:54):
(laughs).
Kristen Vargo (25:01):
... and de-friend all of their, you know, former peers. I think social media is a way that we connect on a personal level, which is important in leadership. Understanding personal things about caregivers is essential to being an empathetic leader.
Carol Pehotsky (25:22):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (25:24):
There are things that I think we need to be mindful of, though. One is what we are posting as leaders on social media and ensuring that everything that we post can be viewed professionally. I think, from a peer perspective, they also need to understand that if you are friends with a leader, you also need to be mindful of what you're posting on social media, you know, most companies have social media policies, and making sure that your posts are in alignment of those policies. Because as leaders, you know, we may have to, you know...
Carol Pehotsky (26:02):
It's the social media version of my lunch story. Right? If I see it, I have to do something about it.
Kristen Vargo (26:06):
Correct.
Carol Pehotsky (26:07):
Yeah.
Kristen Vargo (26:07):
You are absolutely correct.
Carol Pehotsky (26:09):
So, no shortage of challenging situations that one navigates through. Is it worth it?
Kristen Vargo (26:16):
Absolutely. You know, there's always those defining moments in your career that when you think back...
Carol Pehotsky (26:24):
Mm, mm-hmm.
Kristen Vargo (26:25):
... truly make this job in leadership worth it. When I think about, you know, uh, defining example of what truly makes it worth it, I think back to a situation when I was a nurse manager, and a caregiver that, you know, was struggling quite a bit, and one that I had the opportunity and mentor and coach, and you know, we were in a situation where either we were going to see improvement, or unfortunately, this caregiver was no longer going to be able to work with us. But after a heart-to-heart conversation, you know, I finally saw a 360 in them, and one where this caregiver showed immense improvement, and is now still a Cleveland Clinic caregiver and doing incredibly well. And I think, you know, now being a director of nursing, I have the opportunity to see so many exceptional caregivers excel. And being able to recognize these caregivers on a daily basis is truly fulfilling. And seeing the work that they do is absolutely amazing. And, you know, that's what fills my cup every day, and you know, really keeps me going as a leader.
Carol Pehotsky (27:43):
To think that, yeah, there's even one fingerprint of yours on that, is such a privilege to be able to say, "Maybe, I had something to do with that but look at them now."
Kristen Vargo (27:43):
Mm-hmm.
Carol Pehotsky (27:50):
"... and how they've grown."
Kristen Vargo (27:51):
Yeah.
Carol Pehotsky (27:52):
No shortage of (laughs) opportunities to navigate through, but you shared some incredibly helpful insights with us today. Before we call it a day, I want to move on to the speed round where our listeners get to know you as an incredible human being, as well as an incredible nurse leader. So, your first question is, what's something about you that surprises people?
Kristen Vargo (28:14):
Probably my love for animals. I actually am an avid volunteer at the Cleveland APL...
Carol Pehotsky (28:21):
Oh.
Kristen Vargo (28:22):
... which I don't get enough time to do much anymore since having my daughter, but it's a true love of mine. Actually, it's a love of my husband's too. So, this is, you know, kind of our connection too. But we have like an absolute true love of any animal there is on this planet. And oftentimes, if we are traveling, we make our way to probably that city zoo at some point in time (laughs).
Carol Pehotsky (28:48):
Any exotic pets in your household or? (laughs)
Kristen Vargo (28:50):
No, not at all. Just, you know, a big old furry hound. (laughs)
Carol Pehotsky (28:55):
I mean, that's great too. And what's the best advice you've ever received?
Kristen Vargo (29:00):
I think not to take yourself too seriously is probably the best advice I have given. Uh, Carol, as you know, I'm pretty Type A and sometimes can be...
Carol Pehotsky (29:10):
(Laughs) Plus, plus plus.
Kristen Vargo (29:13):
You know, it can be incredibly serious and really have high expectations for many people around me. But I think at times, you need to laugh at yourself sometimes.
Carol Pehotsky (29:23):
Well, thank you so much for joining me today.
Kristen Vargo (29:25):
Thank you, Carol. I appreciate it.
Carol Pehotsky (29:30):
As always, thanks so much for joining us for today's discussion. Don't miss out, subscribe to hear new episodes wherever you get your podcasts. And remember, we want to hear from you. Do you have ideas for future podcasts, or want to share your stories? Email us at nurseessentials@ccf.org. To learn more about nursing at Cleveland Clinic, please check us out at clevelandclinic.org/nursing.
(29:57):
Until next time, take care of yourselves and take care of each other.
(30:04):
The information in this podcast is for educational and entertainment purposes only and does not constitute medical or legal advice. Consult your local state boards of nursing for any specific practice questions.