Be Vessels of Love in the World and Imagine Peace - with Author and Playwright Anastacia Dadashpour

In this conversation, Anastasia Dadashpour shares her profound experiences with death and loss, exploring how these events have shaped her understanding of life, love, and spirituality. She discusses the impact of her grandmother's fear of death, the loss of her daughter, and her father's suicide, emphasizing the connections that remain after death. Anastasia also highlights her work in creating a play about children imagining peace after an apocalypse, reflecting on the importance of love and community in healing and transformation. The conversation delves into the significance of acknowledging grief and the role of death doulas in supporting those who are transitioning.

Love: A Manual For Humanity

Transcript

Wakil 
Hello everyone. We're so glad today to have Anastasia Dadashpur join us. She grew up in a multicultural and acutely political family and was introduced to a multitude of ideas about the functioning of society.

Her curiosity drew her to explore the world and its systems, cultures, histories, and perspectives. She's traveled to 44 countries.

Annalouiza 
She is a proud mother of two daughters, Azariah, who is in spirit, and Isabella, who is her greatest joy. She has enjoyed working in the nonprofit sector, journalism, and human-to-human diplomacy and she continues to be inspired by the profound drive of the human spirit. Anastasia currently owns the Sunshine Sanctuary Boutique Jungle Lodge in Costa Rica, where she hopes people will go to find rest and relaxation. She's also the author of Transcendence, an upcoming play about children imagining peace on earth. Welcome, my friend.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
It's so good to be here. Thank you for having me.

Wakil  
Yeah, so exciting. So glad I can't wait to see the play and yeah, come down to Costa Rica. I can't wait to go there. 

Anastacia Dadashpour  
So many things. The future is untold and exciting possibilities.

Wakil
And so good to have you. Yeah, thanks. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's all a mystery. So glad you're here. Thank you for joining us. We always like to start with asking you about when you first became aware of death.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
It's hard to say. I feel like death was always a curiosity for me throughout my life. I feel like I had a bit of a thin veil between myself and my understanding of, of the other side of life. and I, but I never quite put my finger on what that meant or how it felt exactly until my grandmother who was my second parent, a very, very integral part of my life and my childhood. She passed away in 98. And she was a devoted Catholic woman, very old Spanish family. And like lace on her head when she went into church, that kind of older abuelita.

Annalouiza  
Hmm.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And when she died, she was so scared. And I mean, we're talking about someone that went to church like every day and, you know, was on her knees praying every night before bed. 

So it really gave me pause to think about, you know, as faithful and devoted as this woman was and as good of a person as I knew her to be. She was scared in her last moments, like really, really deeply terrified. And so I thought, a lot about what she felt or what she saw or what she anticipated. and you know, given her very long 91 years of life on this planet, why she would have felt so much terror meeting her maker. So that stuck with me. 

And then I have since lost a child and to negligence at the hospital, so it wasn't a natural death. And my father took his own life with a weapon. So there have been some other big events that have bookmarked my life in very profound ways.

Wakil  
Yeah, Wow. The hardest things, yeah. Thank you.

Annalouiza  
Yes. So thank you so much for sharing that. And this is a safe place for you to share what feels comfortable to you and what doesn't. But I am grateful for this opportunity with you because you have firsthand experience of death that are not what people would deem normal. But how have these deaths influenced the day-to-day life that you have created for yourself? How are these deaths impacting your story?

Anastacia Dadashpour  
I guess it has further thinned the veil for me, actually. And specifically, with my daughter Azaria's death, she died in 2008. And I felt as though because I was connected with her through an umbilical cord, through a physical umbilical cord, when she transcended into spirit, I was still connected to her through an umbilical cord.

And so, regardless of my faith in a spiritual practice or religious paradigm, I knew that she was God. I knew that I had a direct unfiltered link to the divine. 

Wakil  
Hmm

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And I was getting downloads like crazy and she had a mission for me and she was like, this is where you need to go and this is what you need to say. And this is how you need to say it. And this is who you need to talk to. And it was very, very, very clear. I mean, she was like, here, you're my puppet. You have a human body and you can do the things I need for you to do. And I'm up here kind of orchestrating the whole plan. And I was like, okay. I know, and for some reason, somehow, that made the impact of the loss a little more palatable because I felt like I was part of a grander scheme. I was being used by the divine in the best possible way that I could with my skill set. So, yeah. 

And then my father, I, you know, I've had the best relationship with my father that I ever had after he passed out of his, I was like, great, know, was that whole physical being part of you that didn't really work for our relationship. But once he was in spirit, was just like such a pure divine, you know, pure love. And so I was able to really rework and reconfigure a lot of what had transpired between us in our physical relationships here in this plane.

Wakil  
I really love that sense that there's a connection after our beloveds leave that can be just so strongly felt and so guiding, so much of a guidance. We talk a lot about the guidance of our ancestors, and ancestors can come in many forms. So that's beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. That's profound, very profound.

Annalouiza  
It is profound. is, and it's, it's a gift, Anastasia, that you are able to articulate this with us today. Because oftentimes when I, I sense that when there's a loss that doesn't, isn't deemed natural, right? End of life, nineties, old age, that is deemed like the good way to go. But other types of deaths, society doesn't want to talk about them. And the folks who are left behind feel such an immense loss and also cut off from being able to talk about it. 

Wakil  
Yeah.

Annalouiza
And so you feeling divinity in both of these relationships, they were bodies who passed on, but their soul, the spirit, the divineness continues with you and around you. And I think that's such a gift to teach, right? That it's not over. We're still in relationship. 

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Absolutely, it's really wild. And the more I've learned about ancestral DNA relationships, the more I'm like, wow, you know I am truly the sum of my parts. For the better or the worse, I have colonization in my past, the Spanish family in New Mexico...

Wakil  
Yeah.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
... which I'm not proud of. I think there's a lot of shame that got filtered through the ancestry, but also a lot of pride, you know, and connection to culture and tradition. And so it's not just those who I know or have heard of, it's all of the multitude of parents, grandparents, et cetera, that goes back beyond, right? 

Annalouiza  
Eons. Right.

Anastacia Dadashpour 
How long do we talk? I mean, we're all one, really. 

Wakil  
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, back and back and Wow. And forward. And then we can start thinking forward and forward. It's all connected. Wow. Beautiful. Beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. That's such a profound knowledge and thought. Something to hold with, something to hold for all of us. We like to also ask more about what your current work is, what you're working on. And again, you know, how it's a informed by this, what you're talking about.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Well, as you mentioned, I own a beautiful little hotel in Costa Rica in Montezuma. And I went to Costa Rica in 2020 right after my father died. You know, of course, COVID was so intense. And then the elections, regardless of blue team, red team, were so intense for the country. And then my father you know, shot himself. And I had to literally go and pick up the pieces unexpectedly. 

And so I've been, my graduate work was looking at democratization in the Middle East. And so I was very, very aware of what democracy means. And so after the 2020 elections, I was terrified. I mean, my fuse had been, I was so scared, that it was just over, over, over for the United States because the pillars of democracy had been depleted to such an enormous degree. 

Wakil 
Yeah

Anastacia Dadashpour  
So I went to Costa Rica as soon as I could. A friend of mine was like, look, you just need to take a mommy break a little bit, like, you know, go for a week or 10 days or something and just take a deep breath. And I did, I went and just sat on the beach and I respirar, I breathed in with the ocean, I breathed out with the ocean. And I did that for a week and then another week. And then those weeks turned into three months. 

Wakil  
Mmm.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And my family came to visit me, my daughter, and I really healed myself with, you know, being as neutral and susceptible to the beauty and grace of the jungle and the nutrient. Rich air, water, food, life, pura vida, like really brought me back to health. 

And my father died and left me a little bag of gold, you know, not actually, but you know, like he left me his legacy. And I through a mysterious series of events was offered to buy a hotel and I was like, okay, A equals B and I'm here and I'm gonna put A and B together and I'm gonna buy a hotel in Costa Rica. 

Annalouiza  
Hahaha.

Wakil  
Hmm

Anastacia Dadashpour  
So it was very mysterious, but I have, I feel like it does carry my father's legacy and he is the protector of the space. He's there, his ashes live there. And so that is a space that holds a lot of potency and potential and the creative spirit is very, very strong there. 

Wakil  
Wow, wow. That's so beautiful.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
So yeah. And then in addition, I just finished a play. I was invited to write a play about I'm a writer. I had already written a book. It's called Love, a Manual from Humanity. And it's based on me asking myself thousands and thousands of times over decades, what is the end of the story in Israel-Palestine. And again, my graduate work was looking at conflict resolution and human rights in the Middle East specifically. And so I have traveled quite a bit in the Middle East and studied it academically and interviewed innumerable amounts of people that are much smarter than myself about, you know, how does this story end? 

And I channeled a book that is called Love, a Manual for Humanity, which is the end of the story is we have to really be kind, loving human beings ourselves and in the world and towards others. 

Annalouiza  
Mm-hmm.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And we need to live that and be that. need to be vehicles and vessels of love. Period. We're all humans and we all have our issues and our problems and our traumas, of course. I don't ask anyone to forget who they are or bypass what's true for them, but also training people to be in the space of love. And then pushing that out into their lives, into their work, hopefully, know, bankers who are banking as love.

Wakil  
Mm.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And politicians who are, you know, making laws in love and parents and teachers and diplomats and every single one of us in this world, you know, if we do that in the essence of love, then we change the world. 

Wakil
Yeah.

Annalouiza  
Mm-hmm.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And we change the story of what's currently happening here on October 7th, 2024...

Annalouiza
Mm Hmm

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Into a different story.
 
Wakil  
Wow. May it be so. Yeah, Insha'Allah, Insha'Allah. Thank you for that. That's beautiful. 

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Inshallah, that's right, yes. 

Wakil
One of the things you said really reminded me of a story I read of the indigenous people. I think the Mayan indigenous people would take their people who were in mourning to the ocean. They would walk them down to the ocean. And because the ocean has that, what you talked about, that healing power to just be...

Annalouiza  
Mm-hmm.

Wakil  
... to take all of your sorrow, all of your pain and all of your, and just hold it, you know, and you can put it all there and it'll hold it. that vision of you being on the ocean and yeah, just breathing with the ocean is very, very sweet and beautiful. Thank you for that and for all you're doing. I can't wait to read that book. It's going in the podcast notes.

Annalouiza  
Yay, yeah I know me too

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Yay, I love it. I wish I could just give you a book. I'm going to have to order it. I took all of my copies down to Coast That I had to do a book signing down there. And so I literally gave my very last copy here in Colorado away, unfortunately.

Annalouiza  
That's okay, I can bring some back.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Okay, great. Okay, great. Or I could just reorder some, you know.

Annalouiza  
No, I really, there's a couple of pieces with what you just shared. the, you know, full transparency. I really want to cry for a while and you're offering of, of letting me go and stay at the sunshine sanctuary. I just, I think about it raining and me crying. I just, I, I, I also am needing that, that like spiritual washing.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Hmm.

Annalouiza  
You know, millennia old water just taking what is no longer of service to me and just taking it back into the ocean. So I really appreciate that. That's that was your calling. And that's definitely what I'm feeling these days as well. 

I also want to tell our listeners that you and I met when you were doing a dinner to introduce some Palestinians in our community who were talking about the work that needs to be done in the Middle East. And that's, that was my first introduction to you. think 2017 was, was way back. And, know, just noticing that that thread of the Middle East has launched you into your life's journey and brings us on October 7th, 2024 and thinking about those who have passed for the last year, like thousands upon thousands upon thousands of innocent lives have been taken. And I just want to bear witness to that. And it's been your life's work, so I'm sure that that means a lot more to you in your daily life than, well, it should mean to most humans on Earth these days.

Wakil  
Yeah, yeah, for paying attention.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And I so deeply feel that we're connected. I feel like everyone is feeling this.

Wakil  
Yes.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
I mean, of course I am feeling it. I'm watching the news and paying attention and talking to people. But I think in the collective, we're feeling it. And I think it's dense. I remember someone saying to me a long time ago in 2001,  when 9-11 happened and she was an elder at the time. And she said she could just feel herself kind of like heralding souls into the right direction. She was holding space and helping souls find their way through whatever portal spirits go through. And at that time, I didn't totally understand what she said, but I remembered her saying that, believing her that that was true for her.

And now, you know 23 years later, moving into my matriarchy, also feeling that the intensity of knowing what collective suffering feels like. And when many, many people die in a day or in a moment, it does shock the system, it shocks the productive. And so, you you say you need to cry and yes, I thank you. I think our tears are necessary and help us feel human really, you know, because each of these people, they have lives and aspirations and blood. I recently asked a diplomat, how do we value the weight of blood?

Annalouiza  
The collective.
Mm-hmm.

Annalouiza  
Mm-hmm.

Wakil  
Yeah. Yeah.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And I didn't get a satisfying answer, but you know, each drop of blood holds the same weight, you know? And so there's a lot of blood that has been shed over this last year. I've been having conversations with people about shifting timelines and this gets very etheric, but, or esoteric.

Wakil  
Yeah.
Wow.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
But perhaps, you know, our prayers and our devotion to kindness, our devotion to love, our devotion to a future that collectively enables us to be joyful and happy together on the same planet, it does shift timelines. Then we live in a world where we inch closer and closer to peace every single day. And we, with each breath, with each night's sleep, that we dream a new...

Annalouiza  
Mm-hmm.

Wakil  
Yeah.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
... consciousness, a new reality, we, you know, push the envelope just a little bit. And so, you know, perhaps in my lifetime, maybe in my daughter's lifetime, I'd like to see it personally, selfishly, I'd like to be alive on this planet when people are like, you know what? I understand what you're saying. You have a valid right to life as do I. So.

Wakil  
Hahaha.

Annalouiza  
Yeah.

Wakil  
Yes, yes, yes, yes. Wow, wow. man. I pray that is true. I mean, you folks are a little less far down the road than I am. So you might make it and I might not. But, you know, it's that idea. We plant the seeds. We keep planting the seeds. We keep planting the seeds and the forest will grow and the fruit will come and someone will hopefully be able to benefit from it. 

I do want to note for our audience that we're recording this on October 7th, which is why that date is so profound and so deeply felt right now for the three of us. So, yeah, thank you so much. Wow. What a wonderful conversation. What a wonderful thought. Wonderful thoughts.

Annalouiza  
Yeah. Well, and I'm still, still in that vein, Anastasia, you have been working on a play about children see finding peace, making peace, but after the apocalypse. So I feel like we should talk about this.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Amazing. Yeah, I think I got distracted with my book, but whatever way I was actually going is what's happening now, 

Annalouiza  
Yeah, it's all good. It's all connected. This is how it is.

Wakil  
Yeah.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
...which is I'm in the middle of... I love it. I love it, it, love it. So it's called Transcendent. And I haven't traditionally learned how to channel, but words come through me then I write them down and I realize they're way better than I could ever have made them or the collection of them, the information that comes out.
And so my book was channeled. have a second children's book, The Sun Published, that was channeled. 

And then I haven't channeled anything because it just comes by itself. It's not called. But this play came, I was invited to write a play and then I was like, gosh, don't know what I would write about children imagining peace because I don't know what peace looks like. And I can't even imagine it because I'm not conditioned to see that world with my brain. 

And so it came through and it came through post-apocalypse. And so the story is there's 12 children who survive Armageddon, which there is a place in present-day Israel that is called Armageddon. On the eve of people talking about nuclear weapons being thrown around the planet, you know, that's where we're at.

Annalouiza  
Mm-hmm.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And so this play starts with 12 children, they're Palestinian Christians, Bedouins, Druze, African Jews, Ashkenazi Jews, Sephardic Jews, you know, Samaritans, like, you know, the whole collective, children from Gaza, children from the West Bank, like, I really tried to encompass, who is living in this area that we call, you know, between the Jordan River and the sea. 

And these children find each other and realize that there is no identity. Once your identity is wiped clean, once your people have destroyed each other and there is nothing left that, and you start a new, then you, you start from an innocence of creation. 

And so throughout the play, the children you know, are wearing various colors, symbolizing their previous identity, pre-apocalypse. And then throughout the play, you know, their ragged clothes are mended to be wearing white. And at the end of the play, everyone is wearing white. And they reimagine through their innocence, their parents and their families and their communities coming back to life. But through the purity of their imagination, through their consciousness. And so they bring the world alive again. 

So there's kind of like this resurrection experience, this death and resurrection experience of the planet and of civilization. And I am kind of hoping that when we get it out there in the world, people are like, whoa, whoa, wait, we don't want to do that. Can we choose another timeline on that? 

Annalouiza  
Yeah.

Wakil  
Wow.

Anastacia Dadashpour 
Can we choose another option? So I'm pretty inspired by that in this moment.
 
Annalouiza  
Beautiful. Just with your words though, I was in your story already and I could see it. I could see these children mending their clothes and to finally it's quilted into this innocent, know, lightness of being.

Wakil  
Yeah, that was very moving. I haven't even seen the play and I'm already deeply moved. Thank you. Wow.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Well, I'm excited. I'll keep you posted on who and how and when we're going to make it all available.

Wakil  
Yeah, perfect, beautiful, thank you. Love to introduce you to our last guest too, so you guys can compare notes about doing plays.

Annalouiza  
Beautiful.

Annalouiza  
Yes.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Amazing, please do because right now me and my collaborator are in the very beginning stages of taking an idea and making it real. so any assistance we welcome, please contact me.

Annalouiza  
Yeah. Notice to all playwrights out in the world.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Right.

Wakil  
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I loved his last thing he said to us, if you know any producers in New York or London, please let us know. Beautiful. Yeah.

Annalouiza  
London or near.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Yes, yes, yes, please. I'll end that in.

Wakil  
We always like to kind of think about the challenges that you go through in the work you're doing, but also where you find support, where you find what practices or connections or community or whatever, what is it that keeps you going day to day, really? It helps you stay centered and grounded.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Um, you know, what has probably been most effective, for me is dance. I have always been a dancer throughout my life and, there's an amazing community here in Denver, an ecstatic dance community. And I have been, that's like my church. That's my workplace. That's where I go to just transform whatever is happening through movement, through breath through like the imagination that happens in the microsecond of creation. 

And so I've been doing that a long time. I'll be honest, Annalouiza and I have spoken about the tragedy of American society not being able to really hold death. And so that's why I really so deeply support the work that you both are doing thank you a thousand times over. Because I just, felt that it was so foreign. It was so alien to experience something so shocking and devastating. And in all of my three experiences that I've shared, people got it to like almost like a zero degree. I mean, like not, not even at all. 

Annalouiza  
Yeah.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And that was an additional secondary shock around, know, having your community evaporate...

Wakil  
Yeah. Yeah.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
...completely in the moment where you need people the most. And so I guess it's really just come down to my relationship with Source, my relationship to the earth, my relationship to myself, my relationship to my future, my relationship to my desires and my legacy, what I'm here to do, my relationship with maintaining my relationships with my deceased beloveds. But in terms of support, I wish I could say I had some. And I had some. I did have some, but not much.

Annalouiza  
Yeah, I'm here for you now,

Wakil  
Not enough, yeah.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Thanks, babe.

Wakil  
Hahaha.

Annalouiza  
Yeah, you know, it's true. And this is the part where Wakil and I are really committed to this work because so many of us have death experiences, even, you know, and what is it like near-death experiences that people don't understand or working in as a death, in the death cares world. Nobody wants to talk about it. It's too unsettling. And so it's such a shame to our culture that we can't even just bear witness to it and just, you know, look you in the eyes and just be like, I love you, and I'm here for you. And yeah, so I understand that I understand you.

Wakil  
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And we talk a lot too about what is important, the importance of recognizing what's useful and appropriate and what isn't when you're working with someone who's grieving for whatever loss, you know. We did a special podcast just about that. And both of us have had experiences of both. 

And I think one of the big things that came from that is forgiveness for messing up because you're going to mess up and forgiveness for those who say things that don't necessarily help, you know. But, again, just that, that being aware of that and really thinking about that, considering carefully before you act or speak, is this about my need or about the person who I'm speaking to? 

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Wise.

Wakil  
And yeah, so it's so important and hard. It's difficult. It's hard to do that because we all have our, we all have our own needs, know. And we want to make sure that people notice that we're nice people. And that can get in the way of our really considering, is this really about me or about the person who's suffering? So I'm so glad you now have Annalouiza next door.

Annalouiza  
Yeah.  Yeah. And others too, you know, 

Wakil
And I'm farther away, but...

Annalouiza
Wakil and I, yeah, Wakil is definitely our support as well. You know, the other piece I was just thinking about, I always go back to one of our guests, Patty Bueno, way back at the beginning of the first season, but she, how she explained it. I will never forget. We have losses every day, be it, as elemental as the loss of that breath that I just took, it's gone.

As the trees have now shed, are beginning to shed their leaves, there is a very formidable loss that we're having. We're ending our summer, we're going into autumn. There is a loss of ideas and marriages and job opportunities. And there's so much loss truly around us, but nobody is taking the moment to just bear witness to it and say, I, I just lost a really good friend. She's no longer speaking to me and I'm really sad by that, right? Like, my gosh, I'm so sorry. 

But she said, the more we practice noticing these small losses, our container to fill the big ones, our container will be stronger to fill the big ones, like a death. Like it's just a different kind of loss, but we'll be sturdy enough to take those losses. And I really appreciate that because it reminds me that oftentimes our community, we...

It's almost like a spiritual bypassing. like, we have to be so positive and so, you know, onto the next great thing and we're going to make it. And we've got this that we forget that death has impacted our, our collective or our personal stories. And, you know, there's no space to acknowledge it or to hold it or to just be silent with it as a community. yeah, that's, that's the learning we all have to work on, I think as, as, as a society these days.

Wakil  
Mm hmm.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And again, the idea of death doula is so brilliant and profound to me. mean, holding space for the person entering the transition. I mean, how magnificent. 

Wakil  
Yeah.

Annalouiza  
Yeah.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
I truly, I think that's some of the most awe inspiring work I can really imagine. I mean, truly. And I'm not just saying it to the two of you. I felt that way for a
very long time. I met this man, a burning man of all places, we're having these wild adventures. And I remember him saying, you know, that he was practicing this type of Buddhism where he was intimately connected to death in every moment. 

Wakil  
Hmm.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Like, death was his guide. And at the time I was like, Whoa, that is really creepy. I was like, okay, you're my neighbor. like, got the old guy. 

Annalouiza  
Yeah.

Wakil  
Hahaha!

Annalouiza  
That's so funny.

Annalouiza  
Yeah.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
But it landed in me as something I needed to think about quite a bit in my life. And since then, I've thought, you know, what an amazing transition. Like, what a profound opportunity for the next level layer, you know, dimension, whatever is next. mean, doing it well, doing it consciously, doing it with intention and doing it in your body, you know, without the spiritual bypassing piece of like, I'm just, you know, I'm gonna let go but like actually physically, you know, 

Annalouiza  
Mm-hmm.

Annalouiza  
releasing.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
The yes, wild and so wow, because one of the things I remember this man saying to me is he said as the best you can do in the portal of your death. And I'm not getting my words exact, but like the highest realm of awareness that you can achieve in that moment of transition will affect your other lives, how you reincarnate, you know, what you've shed energetically on this plane in this life. 

And I was like, okay, well, I guess in that case, it's worth taking the time to really, really prepare for this moment. It's a pretty big, moment.

Wakil  
Yeah, yeah.

Annalouiza  
Beautiful. it is. I love that. Actually, there's a Buddhist book around here too, that I had when I got really sick back in like 1999. And it was the meditation was about watching your body just fall apart and just being aware of it. Right. So for like two years, that's all I did because I was like determined to like watch my body do whatever. but even to this day, I, and I noticed this. 

I was going to a conference of the day and I jumped on my bike and it ran downtown. And because Denver seems to be really like nutty on the streets these days. I literally like half a block away. I'm just like, okay, if a car hits me. Okay. This is what it is. I'm going to like eject my body's gonna like fall over and it's going to hurt, but, but you know, don't hold on. It's okay. You can, you can really, so I'm practicing like letting go too.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
Uh-huh, uh-huh.

Wakil  
All the time. Yeah, yeah, 

Annalouiza  
Right. Like I'm just like, it's OK. It's OK. Like it's going to be fine. That's my that's that's my little practice.

Anastacia Dadashpour
Beautiful.

Wakil  
Wow. Yeah. I love that you brought up death doulas. We can use that as a promotion for a podcast we're going to do, one of our premium podcasts, just talking to death doulas. Cause we want to know what is a death doula? What do they do? How did they get there? How did they find that calling? What was their guidance and what do they want to share? What do they want to give? I think that's a good. 

Annalouiza  
Yeah. And there are all kinds of death Doulas too.

Wakil  
Yeah, I went to a conference last week and handed out a hundred cards or something. And suddenly we've got like seven or eight death doulas in a row that want to talk to us. 

So, but great, you know, we'll do them, we'll put them all together. So it's great, but you're right. It's such a, just having that, being aware that there is such a thing now is really, really beautiful and really possibly a good change.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And also just being aware for those of us left behind...

Wakil  
Mm-hmm.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
... watching the ascendance of our beloved, the changing, the shifting moments, like I have a very dear friend who is a craniosacral therapist and she was holding her father's legs as he ascended. And she said the craniosacral pulse was pulsing through his body, even though his heart had ceased to be pumping. The craniosacral fluid was pumping through his legs for like 40 minutes afterwards. And you know, hear that people can hear you for time, a period after they're no longer alive.

Wakil  
Wow.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
So there's some kind of neurological. So I just, think it's interesting teaching those of us left behind how to hold space for like the full potentiality. It's not just a moment. It's a period.
 
Annalouiza  
Mm-hmm.

Wakil  
Yes.

Annalouiza  
Right. Yeah. 

Wakil  
Yeah, yeah. Wow, such great work, such important work.

Annalouiza  
Yeah. You're so fun to talk to.

Wakil  
Yeah, yeah, we could go in a long time. Thanks so much. We always do like to make sure we ask if there's anything that you wish we had asked you.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
No, I have delighted in this conversation. It's been really rich for me to be here with you both.

Wakil  
Yeah, yeah, we loved it as well. I'm looking forward to it. We will certainly let you know.

Annalouiza  
Yes.

Anastacia Dadashpour  
And let's keep the prayers going. guess the one last thing I would say is really, really heartfelt prayers. May we shift the timelines and may we emerge victorious in peace. I mean, truly, because we can, I know we can. 

Wakil  
Yes. Let's do the love thing that you talked about. 

Annalouiza 
I'm in.

Wakil
Alright. We'll do it. Well as usual we always like to end our interviews with a quote  or poem. And Anastacia has brought us this beautiful quote from Rumi. So I'll start:

"Goodbyes are only for those who love with their eyes. Because for those who love with their heart and soul, there is no such thing as separation."