John Keefer - Need Leads? The Power of Community Involvement in Business Growth

summary

John, the owner of a junk removal business, shares his approach to marketing and building a strong foundation for his business. He emphasizes the importance of community involvement and giving back, such as volunteering and collecting donations for local organizations. John also discusses his unique marketing strategies, including creative decals on his trailer and giveaways on social media. He highlights the significance of forming genuine connections with clients and other businesses in the same industry. Both Branden and John stress the importance of providing excellent customer service and maintaining a strong reputation in the community. In this conversation, Branden Sewell and John discuss the importance of hiring and managing employees in a small business. John emphasizes the need to hire professionals who can bring value to the business and be better at their positions than the owner. He encourages business owners to act as consultants to their employees and create a clear vision, mission, and core values for the business. John also highlights the importance of vetting potential employees and having a process in place for interviews. He emphasizes the need for humility, empathy, and compassion in managing employees and treating them well. Both Branden and John stress the importance of consistency, hard work, and perseverance in running a successful business.

keywords

marketing, community involvement, giving back, branding, customer service, reputation, hiring, managing employees, small business, professionalism, value, vision, mission, core values, vetting, interview process, humility, empathy, compassion, treating employees well, consistency, hard work, perseverance

takeaways

• Community involvement is a powerful way to grow a business and build a strong foundation.
• Creative marketing strategies, such as unique decals and giveaways, can help grab attention and increase brand recognition.
• Forming genuine connections with clients and other businesses in the same industry can lead to referrals and long-term success.
• Providing excellent customer service and maintaining a strong reputation are essential for business growth and sustainability. Hire professionals who can bring value to the business and be better at their positions than the owner.
• Act as a consultant to your employees and communicate a clear vision, mission, and core values.
• Vet potential employees and have a process in place for interviews to ensure they align with the busines

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Transcript

Branden Sewell (00:00)
Hey, I'm Branden Sewell I'm the owner of Seal Pro Painting, located in central Florida. I'm also the host of the Off the Ladder podcast. And we exist to help home service business owners learn so that they can lead well and ultimately live life off the ladder. I'm excited about today's guest and specifically because John is actually in my local market. He is right here in Titusville. So he's another home service provider.

He's in that industry. So I thought it would be really cool to get him on here. And he's got some really cool thoughts and on marketing that I want to dive into. So we'll get into that. welcome to the show, John. Thanks for having me, man. I appreciate it. love what you do. And, you know, I'm excited to be here. Yeah, man. It's exciting. I'll be so like, I think it was what, like two years ago or something. I actually reached out to you like randomly. It was right when we got started.

Yeah, yeah, so I reached out to you randomly and invited you to our VNI. Yeah, and they which is all the way down in Melbourne, which is like 45 minutes to an hour from here. But anyway, we like connected then and then I showed up to this networking meeting and you're there. And so it was cool to get to meet you in person. I see you all over the place. You know, not just your truck, you know, I see your truck everywhere. Sometimes I'll send you your texts.

But I see your truck everywhere and I see you everywhere in our community online doing a lot of cool things. So, you know, anyway, I want to dive into some of that. But if you could really quick for the listeners, tell them a little bit about your story, how you got started, why you got started, how long you've been in business and kind of the services that you provide. Yeah, absolutely. So I am a keeper junk removal here in Tysville, We service all over our county and.

Yeah, the biggest thing for me was that I kind of just got tired of working the nine to five, you know, working for somebody else, then being in charge of your hours, your pay, you know, expecting more than what you're getting paid for. And it was really a big deal that, you know, I just not only wanted to work for myself, but be able to take the necessary time for my family and, you know, really take the opportunity as a business owner to get back to the community.

So, you know, we'll do anything from single item pickup to a full property clean out. We specialize in shed demolition, hot tub removal, boats, cars, you know, you name it, we can probably do it. we can't do it, we probably know someone who can. So, you know, I love what I do and it's a great way to provide for my family. So I'm happy to do it. Yeah, that's awesome. I think a lot of people go into business for a lot of those, you know, reasons that you're talking about, right?

And small business is great. I love being a small business owner. so there's a couple of things that I want to talk about with you is like, and I mentioned this before the show, one is marketing. So you got started with your business. And just from someone who's been in business for going on eight years, seeing your ideas, seeing the things that you do, your involvement in the community is really inspiring.

So I just want to kind of get behind the brain, you know, of you really quick for the listeners and just kind of hear your thoughts on like, what is your approach to your marketing and how to approach like getting those leads and those clients in the door. And yeah, just kind of break that down for us because it really it's inspiring to see how well you've done.

such a short amount of time. Well I appreciate it. Yeah I mean so we started our business back in January of last year so we're just over the cuff of a year and a half and you know I had some some good insight from some friends when I first got started that you know community involvement is one of the biggest ways to grow your business and a lot of people I think start a business where you know they're just they're money hungry which is great but that can't be the only principle and core values of your business because without your community and without your client base

They are where your income comes from, you know, so we a few things that we've done in the past is so when I was in high school, we actually I volunteered SPCA here in the bar at the animal shelter and You know being a business owner. They're constantly asking for donations Well, you know, everyone always sees it as you know money value they have to make a cash donation but as a business owner we're given the opportunity to utilize our time and

equipment and help generate those donations. So once a year we actually try to fill our trailer with donations for the SPCA. We give back to the community. We give back to the animals, you know, and it's great for brand recognition too. You know, so we're actually working on a project right now where we're collecting artificial Christmas trees so that this way the holidays are one of the tough times for people. We all know how the economy is. We all know that you know it's a tough time right now.

And so that we're trying to collect Christmas trees. So this way come Christmas time, we can actually give out those trees to people in the community completely free of charge. So this way they don't have to worry about, you know, is my kid going to have a tree for Christmas? And we can we already can't even afford the gifts, alone the tree. Yeah. You know, so it's it's a lot of fun because in my opinion, the community involvement keeps you humble. You know, we all want to be successful. We all want to make a lot of money, but.

can't do it without helping your community. That's really good. I mean, hey, what you're doing is obviously working. Because I mean, like I said, I see you talk about doing the donations for the SPCA. So before I started going to the BBA, which here where we're at, it's on the Brevard Business Alliance. And it's just a network meeting that John and I attend together for our referrals and networking. But before I ever came there,

I was actually going to pick up dog food for my dogs and I saw John his truck and trailer set up right out in front of the pet store here locally. And I was like, there he is again. So literally, it's a testament to what you're doing.

that it's working and your brand is being seen, you are being seen in the community. so I think, especially for people, I kind of, I hard -won this a lot with business owners because I did business completely different than how you started, which, you know, I invested a bunch of money into buying leads, which...

know, PS, what did say, Public Service Announcement, PSA, it's a terrible idea. it's really expensive. You're not building a really strong foundation for your business. It doesn't help you with community involvement. It doesn't increase your brand awareness and brand equity in your community. So really, like what you're doing is, is really great. And it's going to build a strong foundation for your business, where I kind of had to learn the hard way where it's like,

you can go in and drop $5 ,000 into buying leads, but you're not going to build that strong foundation. So it's really awesome to see that you're taking this approach. And I think it's going to serve you and your business well moving forward. on top of doing the network meetings and

you know, just doing the community involvement stuff. What are some other things that you do? I know what they are, I'm just curious. Will mention some other things that you do from like a marketing and branding strategy to, you know, bring awareness. Well, see, you know, it's funny because like you were saying about buying leads, you know, people feel like that is the only way to get your name out

But honestly, even something as simple as just being a genuine human being, you know, every time we're at the dump, we try to help at least one person unload stuff from their trailer trailer because, know, that's going to be like, wow, that guy actually took time out of his day to help me out. Wasn't too big of a hurry to where he sees me struggling. You know, so it's just being a good person. OK, so I have to throw this out there and I have to ask you a question. You may or may not remember this. So I was meeting with

the Patrizios, which I think you've been, I referred. We'll be doing that this week. Yep, yep. So I referred that business to you. And by the way, they love you. They're very appreciative for you and your services and all that. But I was talking to Dr. Patrizio and he said to me, he goes, how do you know all these people? And I talked to him about, you know, being a part of these networking groups and things like that. And

And then he mentioned you. He's like, man, I feel like I've heard of this John guy before. And he goes, I'm pretty sure my son took my son or my grandson to the dump. And he saw this guy there who let him pull like, I let his son operate the dump trailer. So, you know, because the kids are always all wide eyed, you know, looking at, whoa, what is that? So.

every time, know, we'll ask the parents, know, hey, is it okay if we let them dump the load and the kid had a great time? you know, because when are you really going to get an opportunity like that? Yeah, yeah, for sure. And so he actually I was over at his house the other day helping him out. He brought that up. He was like, I'm pretty he's like, I know this guy. He's like, I've heard his name before. And, and then he brought up that that thing. He's like, I'm pretty sure it was it was the same guy.

So it's cool that you're able to verify because he wasn't he wasn't a hundred percent positive, but he was pretty sure so that's awesome But yeah, it's amazing how just being like genuine in your service and things like that can you know? Make people aware of who you absolutely so that's really good you represent yourself and your business and everything that you do is the way that I look at it and You know my guys my employees, you know, actually I had an employee bring

bring this to my attention, which I loved is I was actually interviewing him to bring him, you know, on my team. And I have a set of like interview questions that I ask every person. And one of the questions was like, what do you find the most satisfaction and like fulfillment in your work? And his answer was, you know, when I finished that job, being able to be proud of like my name and putting my name on that job because

He said, it's not just you or Seal Pro painting that is seen out in the community. He's like, it's me. It's me. So, know, I go and I do the work and then I'm seen in the community. he's like, so the work that I do and how I show up in my community matters. And so I thought that was really cool. You know, just from like, you know, a standpoint of like the integrity and honesty that it takes to run a good business. So that's good stuff. So.

Ken, are you willing to share some of your other things? Like I would call it like disruptive marketing. And I know there's probably other terms for it and things but would you be able to share a couple of these cool little things that you do? Yeah, so you know, like like what we have on our trailer, you know, so one thing that so we run a dump trailer with our business and one thing that

you know, people tell me that, you know, if you want to gain good clients, you know, you want to grab their attention, right? Same as if you're reading a good book or you're watching a good movie. It's all about the book. You know, so we, we had Jim with Paradise Science and Graphics here in Titusville. They, they made us a decal that says a great start to your day begins with an excellent dump. And so we've had so many people that, you know, that's so funny, you know, and we've got a

Woody and Buzz hanging on the back of our trailers, you know, because from the Toy Story movies when they're hanging off the truck. And, you know, I love it because I don't want to go to work every day and just for it be work. Right. You know, I love the people I work with. I love the clients. And, you know, like you said, it's it takes a lot to run a good business because I'm terrified of a negative review. You know, I'm super proud of the fact that in a year and a half, we've got over one hundred five star reviews.

But we've earned each and every one of those. It's not just like, hey, buddy, pal, can you go leave me a five star review? Because it's not genuine. To me, that devalues your business because it's not a real review. things like that, we've done coasters at a local bar with our logo printed on them. Because how many people go to the bar and sit for five or six drinks and they're going to look down and be like,

Okay, I wonder who these guys are. you know, so it's I Love it. Yeah, I love what I do and you know, kind of like you were saying about your guys, you know, I Want people a lot of times asking for help is hard, you know And I think a lot of people forget that so in order to call a junk removal company, you know You're you're making yourself vulnerable to bring someone in your house and technically see how you're living

Yeah, and so we've dealt with quarter situations and just just crazy situations and that that's a big step to have to make that phone call Yeah, and you know one of my favorite things to tell people is listen. We're you called a junk removal company We're not here to judge. We're here to help. Yeah, you know, it's because clearly they can't do it on their own They don't know where to start. All you got to do is just point tell me what needs to go and we'll get it out of here Yeah, you know, it's I'm gonna natural break I can edit this out and I'm gonna myself

Okay. Yeah.

You

I just realized one of the big marketing things you're talking about about the giveaways. Yeah, yeah, all kinds of stuff. There's even more. Well, I'm glad you know all the stuff that I can't think about right now. All right, so let's look into this. yeah, that's amazing stuff. mean, you know, talking about, you know, how you show up to people's houses. I talk to, you know, people about this all the time.

you know, when you run a home service business, know, people are inviting you into their homes, which is a very vulnerable place. You know, it's a place where they, you know, find shelter. It's a place where they find peace and comfort away from like the stresses of the world, whether it's their job or, you know, whatever's going on school. They're able to come home and find rest. It has everything that they've worked hard for.

you know, so when as a home service business owner, we have this, you know, unique opportunity to be led into like one of the most like sacred, places that most people have. It's their greatest investment. It's something, you know, for most people, that's, it's the biggest purchase that they'll ever make in their life. And so, I think as home service business owners, people who do these services in people's homes,

need to like not take that lightly, right? And to like for me, I feel honored when a customer entrusts us, you know, to provide a painting service for them and to come in their home or work around their home because it's such a vulnerability. So, yeah, 100 % agree with you on that. Something else I wanted to just say is like I've used John's service myself.

So I can attest to you like the level of service. I even remember the last time I used John's service. I'll tell this story really quick. I was in the middle of moving. So we sold our house. We were buying another. We thought we could leave this swing set in our backyard and it's closing day and we're in the middle of moving and I get a call from my realtor and she's like, hey, what are you doing with the swing set? And I was like, well, I planned on leaving it there.

And she's like, you can't leave it. You got to get out of there. This person has no kids. They have no point to like have it in their backyard. was like, I called John. I was like, John, when can you move? He's like, I'm at the gas station. I can head there now. And so I was like, yes, thank you so much. I was like, can you grab us some drinks? Because we had just been like moving south. all like hot, sweaty. And so, you know,

John was generous enough to grab some drinks for us and for my family who was helping with the move and even our movers. You know, we gave a couple of drinks to them too. it just, you know, goes to show like the level of service and being willing to do that. And then, you know, you're all like for me, I can't, you know, speak to like everybody else, but like when I've needed you, you've been like, yeah, I'll be right there. So.

I really appreciate that and just the level of service and so I've just been able to experience firsthand, you know, absolutely the level of customer service. Well, and see what a lot of people forget about is as your business grows, you still need to make sure that you take care of the people that take care of you, know, so even, you know, I'm not like I want to thank you for the fact of having me on the podcast, you know, because not only is it again going to help with brand recognition, but you know, same thing with, you know, when

when people say, well, are you the owner? You know, I'm proud to say, yeah, I'm the owner. If you call this number directly, you will reach me directly. Make sure any questions, concerns, anything, I'm here to help. Because, you know, a lot of times you get Joe Schmo's uncle's handyman service that shows up and, you know, the guy's in a tank top and flip flops and he's like, hey, I'm gonna demo your house. No, you're not, please leave.

You know, but see one of the best benefits of our business is, you know, we really pride ourselves on the fact of how much we keep out in the landfill. You know, I don't know if y 'all have ever been to a landfill. It is absolutely disgusting. It is awful. And you would not believe the amount of trash that ends up there. know, so when it comes to furniture or toys or anything that we can give back to the community, one thing that would try to do differently is

We actually do raffles on our business page. It's a pick a number one, one to 500 and that really gives us an opportunity. We actually just raffled off a tool set the other day. Could we sell it? Absolutely. Is it going to someone who really has no tools at their house? Absolutely. So it gives us the opportunity to have some fun with it. Business doesn't always have to be business. And if you love what you do, you can have fun with it. So I love it.

It's great. love that you said business doesn't always have to be business. like the way that I say this is like not everything that I do in my business, not every transaction has to have a dollar sign. Yeah. And because I understand that some things that we do as business owners have value beyond the dollar, right? So in some circumstances, your

maybe the upfront return is not there. So like, it's like not a dollar for dollar exchange, but it's like, well, what, what kind of return on investment does this make, you know, down the road, you know, so it's like by giving back, you know, and maybe by deciding not to sell that stuff, and instead giving it away, you're you're reaping the benefit down the road, because right, you're

you're showing your character, you're showing who you are as a business owner, what your values are. And that speaks a lot and that could earn you additional business down the road. So I think too often, like I talked to so many business owners and it's it is it's like all about the money. So they have like blinders on to like the possibilities of like, you know, potential opportunities. you know, it's opportunity costs. Well, and see one thing that you and I have talked about

on a personal level is that in business, feel like or it's it's portrayed that you cannot partner with someone in the same field as you. You guys are competitors, so you have to stay away from each other. I think that's that's a loaded bull. I mean, because why why can't you make friends with your local competition? Because if anything, that's going to help further both of you guys. You know, we've got guys in Apopka, Florida, Polk County, Florida, over in Obito in Orlando.

that we've done a homeless camp back in March that was on private property and the guys called us and they're like, we do not have the means to handle this by ourselves when and where. And so that pushed their business so much farther because they had never done a job that size, but neither had we. And too many times people are just told that, no, that is not okay. But why? Why is it not okay to be genuinely good human being and just make connections?

Yeah, you know, how is it any different than you or I reaching out to a real estate agent? How many real estate agents are in the state of Florida? Thousands, you know, yeah, we've got, I don't know, 10 ,000 realtor just from Brevard County. it's, you know, again, it keeps you humble because if you're willing to call someone who does the exact same work you do to clients in your demographic. Yeah, no, I mean, doesn't have to be me.

Yeah, for sure. I talk to people about that all the time too. I actually have one of my former employees when he worked for me and he wanted to go start his own business. So I helped him start his business, him everything that he needed to do, helped him get it started. we're here right in the same market. We both live here, work in Titusville.

And I refer jobs to him all the time. You know, because here's the thing is like, I know his name is Matt, and he's a great guy. I can vouch for his character, right? So at the end of the day, I want whether I earn somebody's business or not, I would want them to be taken care of. Right? So I don't, if they choose not to go with me, like bummer, but at the same time, please go with somebody who's going to do a good job, you know, have integrity.

and make sure you don't get scammed or taken advantage of. So at least when I refer Matt, let's say the person's time frame doesn't work with mine, they need it sooner, or maybe their budget doesn't work with mine, or whatever the reason is that we can't work together, I'll refer them to Matt. And I have that confidence. could feel good that I know that even if they don't work with me,

They're at least going to work with somebody who's going to take care of them. And so that's a big focus for me. I just recently had that happen. This lady had us come out and give her a quote. And, you know, I followed up with her and she was like, know, the price is just more than I thought it was. I was like, look, at the end of the day, I was like, I just want to help you out. Who are your quotes from? Maybe I can help you. I know a lot of the local guys. I could tell you who's the best option, you know, based on.

who these people are and what I know. So she gave me who they were and I was like, this guy, can vouch for him. I know he's, he's been in business for a long time here. Local guy does great work. can trust him. And so she hired that guy. So well, and see, the thing is, too, I tell all my clients, if they're looking for a referral, I'm not going to refer someone that I wouldn't have to work at my own house. Right. Because there are too many of these fly by night guys that, you know, yeah, you know, someone could do a full trailer load.

50 bucks, but is it going to end up on somebody's back road, you know, because they don't want to take the time to dispose of it properly. You know, and I use it's funny because I used to work for a company that, you know, which I won't say names, but their motto was your job as a general manager is to reach into the client's pocket to take their money. And I think that's awful. You know, that's a horrible way to look at doing business because yeah, you're going to get

Quality maybe but you're not gonna get quantity. They're not gonna want to come back, right? You know, and if I had someone that gave me this whole spiel about why I needed to choose them You know when I walk up to a client's house, the first thing I say is you know, hey, thanks for having us out You know, what do we got going on? Wow, you have a beautiful I love your property, you know, you want to form a connection, you know, because it's not just like thanks for calling me out. Yeah, it's 500 bucks You want to pay me now or?

You know, and it doesn't need to be cut and dry, you know, because a lot of people forget to form that relationship with their client. And I think, you know, with this being an off the ladder podcast, you you talk about, you know, what are you going to do to get off the truck? My biggest thing is I have a very hard time with delegation, you know, I, because I love the work that I do. And so what I like to get off the truck eventually. Yeah. You know, I'm sure everybody does because, you know, my wife wants to take all these vacations and I love to be a part of

But I want to make sure that if I'm to get off the truck or get off the ladder, then I have a crew that is going to offer the same level of quality, if not better, than I would. And until that happens, this is my baby. Because this whole business is able to provide a life for my wife, my two kids. And we're already seeing a change in the way that we're able to live because of the level of service that we're willing to offer to our

Yeah, you know and growth is as long as you don't let off the gas, know, you're gonna just You get what you put into it. Yeah, and a lot of people, you know, they start a business and they're like, alright cool I've got business name. I've got LLC. I'm insured Give me money, please and it doesn't work that way You have to put in the effort and you know too many guys wait, you know, they'll go like a year and then it's you know Business is slow. You know, I haven't haven't gotten any phone calls. Why?

What are you going to do to change that? Who are you going to go talk to to get your name out there? And now like we're at the point even at just in a year and a half that I'm seeing people tag us on Facebook and it's like, I don't even know who that is, but I really appreciate the support. So it's people are going to see the level of service and quality to a customer. That's good. I like that you make the point that like people refer you who you don't know and or who don't, yeah, who you don't know.

And I think that's a testament to like what you do in the community, right? So I know that there's been businesses that I haven't actually used maybe their service or a product, but I know their reputation. And so maybe I'm not referring them based off of my personal experience, but maybe I'm basing it off of like, heard a friend say that they did amazing work, or maybe I saw them being involved in the community or giving back and I was like, wow, that's something I could

I could get with. Absolutely. And I can refer them and feel good about that. So it's not always about getting referrals or whatever from people that you have done service for directly. that's really what that like, it's like a domino effect, right? Everything that you do has a compounding effect on your business. And so, really, when you're starting out and you're trying to get business in the door,

Every little thing makes a difference and helps build that momentum to really push the train forward if that makes sense. once you get it going, it gets easier. And that's how momentum works. It's hard in the beginning, but if you push and you don't fight up and you just keep pushing, build that momentum. It really builds over time. So it definitely pays off. You talked about the getting off the ladder thing or getting off the truck.

So I want to dive into that because I like your perspective and I think it's good to like, I think people who are listening to the show will be able to relate to that because they're probably in that same, some people who listen to this might be in that same season of their business, same position. And so I just want to talk about like things that, you know, I've been able to learn and, you know, just kind of hear your thoughts on it, but.

What I found and it's been through like time, obviously I've been in business for a while. But I found that something you said really like, you know, resonated with me because you said, I want to find people who do it as good or better. And so what I found as a business owner is that my guys are better than me. And that's what I look for.

And I tell actually tell guys when I hire them and I bring them on I said I expect you to be the professional in your position, right? And I expect you to be the expert in your position I expect you to bring value to this position that I can't bring And I expect you to be better at it than me because why would I hire you? if you're not right and and so I actually say

I want you to almost like act as a consultant to me in your position. So whether that's bringing better ideas, helping to be more efficient, correcting me on things that I get wrong, and that takes humility because you can't grow in that way if you have too much ego. So you have to be, obviously, you have to be proud of your business and want to build something that everyone's proud of.

But you also like, I don't know, I guess I just, I just realized like there's, Pete, like people out there, other people want to do something that they're proud of. They have skills and abilities. I'm not the only one and other people can do great work and provide a great service. but it does start with me. Right. So I would say like for you, when you're looking into that, that journey of bringing people into this amazing thing that you've built.

It starts with you, right? And you have to be able to communicate like, well, what is your vision for your business? What's your mission? What are your core values? And if you're really clear on that, you can communicate that to somebody else. And then you have to vet those people and make sure they have that same vision, the same mission, the same values. And then having a process for finding, like me, I used to not have a process.

And now that I do it goes so much better but like an interview process, right? Right. So like we have a process for vetting people that we're gonna bring in like we ask them very specific questions to find out about their character Right and to understand who they are so that when we bring them in it's not just like bringing warm bodies in it's it's vetting them and saying like, okay I just interviewed this person. This was the answer for all these questions and

do they check these boxes? If they don't, see you later. You're not a good fit. If you do check the boxes, great. Let's take the next step. So it does start with you and just understanding who you are. But it's not impossible to find those people. Well, and see, it's funny that the way that I always compare it to is with you and I both being parents. It's almost like your employees are kind of like your kids in a sense. And you're trying to mold them.

on the values that you expect from them for something that is like, you know, it's yours, you know, so if I'm going to pass the torch, so I can take some more time for myself or grow the business or meet with with people that are going to further the business to benefit everybody, you know, are you open to new ideas? Are you you know, it's like you see the videos of like a parent yelling at their child.

You might get your point across in that instant, but it's not gonna stick, you know because with a young child You know, you have to get on their level. And so if you have an employee that just even say they're using a tool wrong Okay, they might break the toy or a toy they might bring a tool. But you know, they might break a tool but Are they gonna learn from it? You know and crazy enough we had a situation today my spotter buddy of mine He was backing me up through a client's gate

But I always say I would rather do damage to my equipment than to a client's property. And we broke the tail light on my flatbed. But the client was happy. We got the work done. And what is a $10 cover? And my employees want to pay for it. And that's what I look for is with that level of service, you have to mold them.

You can't yell at them and expect them to like I love what I do. I love my boss You know for my guys every day. I pay for lunch Every day when we go to gas station in the morning It's get whatever drinks snacks whatever is gonna fuel you to get you through the day so you can give your my clients and your clients 110 % effort Doesn't matter right you know and that's that's huge is that you know we all have worked a job

that we just could not wait to go home. But for me, I can't wait to go home so I can go to sleep. But I absolutely love what I do. having a good crew to work for and work with you is, because that's the thing is, they don't work for me, we work as a team. And I think that's one of the biggest differences that a lot of people, want employees to work for them, not with them. How many businesses do you see out there that have a suggestion box?

You know, and it's something as simple as that. People like myself and like yourself, we just want to feel valued, you know, and when people see that we are able to bring those values to the table. Personally, that's what I look for. know, yeah. Okay. You can do a project for a hundred bucks, but are you going to tear up my yard? Are you going to leave my house looking a mess? Are you going to damage something in my home and then you're not going to cover it? Yeah. If I make a mistake. Yeah.

None of us really want to own an expensive mistake or something that could make us look bad. But what kind of person are you? What kind of person do you want to be? You know, what kind of person do you want your kids to be? Yeah. You know, so I think a lot of it boils down to that. Yeah, that's good. Having a healthy perspective on, you know, I just I think it's like, I call it like emotional intelligence, you know, it's understanding like what motivates people.

And, you know, having being capable of empathy for others helps you to be a better leader. And I think that's what you're describing. I think I think it was Gary B. I heard he said this. said, when you forget what it was like to have a bad boss, then that's when you become one. You become a bad boss. Right. So, you know, I think back to when I was the employee of

somebody else and I remember, you know, the way that I was treated and what it made me feel like and what it made my time feel like invested in that place. I just remember those feelings, right? And so what I try to do is not forget that. And then I try to apply that in how I treat my employees. I was right. So I was just talking to somebody else, another guest on the show, and she's a mental health

professional. And she also owns a home service business. But we were talking about mental health and we were talking about the challenges of like working with people who have like people are nuanced, like not everybody's the same, not everybody takes the same. And I think that's another thing as a business owner, when you bring employees in, you have to understand that not everybody is just going to like come to work and you know,

People have stuff going on outside of work. Yeah, they have lives. have families that might be hurting or struggling or things that are affecting them and their personal lives. And having the ability to be empathetic and compassionate in those situations, I think is really important. And again, that's something you can't put a dollar sign on. So for me, I can't tell you how many times I've lost money.

or have taken a hit. But I've always tried to keep this as a value for me. It's like people before profits. Yeah. And just try to treat people well. all that to say is like, you can grow a business, you can find great employees, but like treat them well. Yeah. You know, and, and treat them like they're humans. And I don't think anybody is exempt from mistakes like including myself. I tell my employees all the time.

I was like, if my success and the ability to be a business owner was based on my ability to do everything right, or to be perfect all the time, I said, then I should just fire myself. I was like, because I make mistakes, I make wrong decisions. I don't do the right thing sometimes. And it's not like, you know, just like purposely, but sometimes I just mess up, right? As a business owner. so I have to have grace for myself.

And I like obviously I'm still in business after eight years. So I've given myself grace a lot of times So I try to do the same for my employees. I try to give them You know room to fail and fall down and make mistakes, but it's like okay. Well, how do we handle that mistake? You know, maybe we did damage somebody's property Do we try to justify it or shift blame or do we buy? Replace something or do we take ownership and we've had to do that. We've had situations where

there is a gray area like was that really us or was that somebody else was that already broken or was it us? Can verify that my team you know did this damage and at the end of the day it's like okay we're gonna step up we're gonna own that we're gonna take care of it and then you still have happy customers because you know you take ownership. Well and you and I have touched on that before is you know too many people want to pass the blame because it's it's obviously the easier option. Right. You know but but what is that going to do for you and your business?

What does that do for you as a human being? you know and so I want to touch on what you just said about mental health Being a business owner. Everyone thinks they just see the work that you do and they just think my god You have so much money. You must love it. I 100 % love what I do I've said that multiple times already, but it is hard to be a business owner I mean, I swear I will be great by the time I'm 30 next year, but

You know, it's between meetings and emails and networking. You know, there are days that I will leave my house at five o 'clock in the morning to get a huge jump on the day for a job that we have an hour away. So we'll knock those out. So we have the rest of our day back in our main service area. But, know, it doesn't end when you get home. You have to respond to emails. You have to send out invoices. You have to mark payment, you know.

So as much as you try to get done throughout the day, you know, you still have to learn to delegate because, you know, what can I take off my plate to spend more time with my family? And that's kind of like what you talked about about getting off the ladder. Yeah. You know, and so like for me, even last night, you know, I got home about five thirty. I had been gone since five thirty in the morning and all I wanted to do was sit down. Is that the easier option? Absolutely.

But my kids haven't seen me all day. I haven't seen my kids. My wife hasn't seen me all day. She's been home with the kids all day. You know, so my wife obviously deserves a break just like I do. And I think having a huge support system like I have at home, you know, my kids are such great kids and they love with their entire heart. You know, and my wife is huge for the business because

Does she do much involvement with the business? Not necessarily, but she not only homeschools our kids, but is a stay -at -home mom and makes it to where I can run this business the way that we need to so we can have that growth. Because I know my kids are taken care of. I know that they are well fed. I know that my kids are getting a fantastic education for, know, compared to what's out there now.

You know, I really think that without my wife and my kids being the support system that I have, you know, yeah, you could be in front of the community as much as you want, but it's when your day is done, it's not done. Yeah. So having that support system is huge for growing a successful business. Yeah. Because trying to do it alone is hard. Yeah. You know, and that's that's really ultimately like a big part of why I started this podcast is because

I mean, to be honest with you, I have so much respect for guys like yourself who are out there and you're you're grinding, you're putting in that time and you're doing it. There's so much that you're taking on yourself. And that's heavy, that's a lot, it's hard. But what I also, I try to bring perspective to the table and it's like, hey, these are some steps and maybe a leap, take some of that pressure.

Because it is the tarp but you know, here's what I'll say too is and you know, we mentioned this like, you know before we started the show is It's not for everybody like what I'm talking about might not be for everybody But you know if you no matter what? However, you choose to run your business you have to find a way to like stay full, know, like

You've got to because I mean, the reality is, like burnout is real. You are you are a human. There's only so much you can do. There's only so much you can take. There's only so much that's like worth all of that. Right. Like I tell people all the time there. was talking to somebody yesterday and they asked me, they're like, well, what if you could take on and do this business and do more? And I stopped and I said, look, I said, you could tell me I could make 50 ,000 more dollars today.

And if it meant that I was going to have to sacrifice the few hours that I get to spend with my son in the afternoon, I would tell you keep your $50 ,000. Yeah, because at the end of the day, there's not a price tag on that. Right. There's not a there's not a price that you can put on me being present. Right. And so there to be honest with you, like, I think somebody some people might listen to this podcast, and they might think, Branden's like talking about getting off the ladder. So they

You know, you can grow and scale your business and make more money. Well, like that happens, but that's not like I make more money in the business so that I can get my time back. Yeah. Right. So the money and the resources, it actually is not so much about me personally making more money from my business. It's really more about like there's more money there so that I can hire more people and delegate more tasks. And so

There's actually a guy that I respect a lot. He's kind of like a grandfather in the house washing business. And I had him on the show and we were talking and I just asked him, I was like, I asked him for his insights into like, his business and all that. And one of the things that he said to me that really stuck is he said, know, Branden, a lot of people think that it's about making more money. And he said, the reality is, like,

I've had the same salary for like so many years like and it was a very modest amount It wasn't anything super crazy and he said but that's what I was willing to do I was willing to sacrifice like let's say the extra 30 40 50 thousand For the lifestyle right of being able to like be there with his family and be present and have some freedom

And so really, that's what Off the Ladder is about to me is that freedom and getting your time back. And that's not for everybody, like I said, for some people that like extra 40, 50 ,000 is what matters to them. And that's fine. But I just like to bring the perspective like that's not what motivates me. Well, and like you were saying, too, as a business owner, you know,

I don't know how everyone else is, but when I first started my business, you do a job for $300. You're like, I made $300. No, you didn't. You made $50. Your business made $250. And that was, think, one of the hardest learning points for me as a business owner is, I have to pay myself like an employee. that's not all my money. And so I'm realizing, and we pay ourselves a healthy wage to not only live off of, but to grow the business.

Yeah, and you know the hardest thing is like you said, you know Sometimes business owners can get caught up in the lifestyle because I need new equipment. I need this Yeah, but do you need it or do you want it? Right? I want to be successful, but I may not need that equipment right, you know because a lot of businesses you see fail within the first year because they get so caught up in

gosh, I'm leaving a $10 ,000 job, how fast can I spend it? Rather than how much can I put into reserves for the next six months? Yeah, you know, and, it's funny, because when I went full time with my business, you know, we were pretty much breaking even on bills. And, you know, it's like, the first week of being full time, I thought did not ring once, you know, my wife kind of made a joke, she's like, so can you go back and I know, no, everything's gonna be fine. Yeah, you know, but it really

You have as a business owner, at least for myself, you have to be motivated to want to do and be better. Yeah. You know, and, that is, it's very draining sometimes because you're constantly trying to, and ADHD helps, you know, but having the mindset of what can I do differently? Cause like you said, you know, yeah, if I'm making $500 ,000 a year, I'm still personally making the same amount.

But the more money we make, the more people I bring on so I can take a step back. And that's, I think, something that's really hard to grasp because you see all the money coming in and you're like, I want more. Of course you want more. And if you don't want more, you're crazy. But it's being a business owner is so beneficial because the more people that you add to your team, it not only increases the value of your team, but that's another person that is

benefiting from the fact of your success. So the more employees you have, you're putting food on that family's table. You're giving them a livable wage. And like I touched on earlier, the economy is not what it used to be. And I'm 29 years old and it's even I'm just like, wow. And you're talking about helping clients and sometimes even losing money. But when you outweigh the pros and cons,

Sometimes just being a good person and helping somebody out is worth that two three four hundred dollar cut on on the on the end bill You know because everyone's on a budget I'm on you know, if someone gives me we had a client that we're doing a trailer rental for tomorrow and she's like yeah Home Depot quoted us thirty one hundred dollars just to install three ring cameras I said you need to go back and get an itemized the seat

and actually have them explain to you why you're being charged this much money because that's absurd. You know, and everyone is so focused on the dollar that some people just forget to be a good human being and understand that maybe if someone's catching attitude with you, it's because they have stuff going on in their personal life. Your job is to help them, but you also can't work for free. Yeah. And that's where as a business owner, have to be able to draw, draw that gray area of where do I stop? Yeah. Because there are people out there that will take the opportunity to take advantage of you.

just for being a good person. Yeah. Yeah. It's tough. Yeah, it is. It's really tough. You know, like, it's funny that you bring that up because it's it is it's like a hard thing to balance sometimes. Like, you know, you know, you want to be kind, but you also don't want to get taken advantage of. And I'm actually going to have somebody on this show soon. And we're going to really dive into that and how you make those decisions and how do you really how do you draw that line and how do you

because I think we can wrestle with that mentally. It's like, well, I want to hold true to my values, but I also feel like I might be taking advantage of right now. Yeah. So kind of trying to walk through that mentally and how we process it and how can we create standards, right, where we say like, hey, like, this is our standard, this is what we charge. But then how do we justify that gray area, right? So

Maybe, you know, like the reality is, is like, we do have to be profitable. We do have to pay our bills. We do have to be able to like, you know, make a profit so that we can grow and sustain the business and, all those things. But in those moments where we have these like, you know, opportunities to say like, okay, well, I'm going to, you know, I'm going to do this job. Like, maybe it's for free or maybe it's for half off or maybe knock off this money. But how do you justify those things? And like, we even talked about employees like,

You know, we want to be empathetic towards our employees and what they're going through. And we want to, you know, be able to have compassion for people. But how do we create, like, have a standard? like, because like, I think about myself, like, I've been through hard times, and I've never, like, asked for an excuse, right? I still, I've gone through some of the hardest days in business where

You know, I'm up at three o 'clock in the morning pacing in my bedroom, can't sleep and wondering how I'm to get through the next day. But guess what? The next day still comes and I don't get a pass, right? I still have to put on my shoes, get up, get dressed and go to work and manage this business. can't, I don't have the option to say like today's going to be a hard day. So I'm going to stay home and call out. It's like I got to, I have to show up anyway. So it's like,

I know that for myself and that's the standard that I have for myself. But I also know not everybody's me. Maybe I have employees who don't have the ability to do that. I don't want to like, like, well, I do it, so you have to and have no empathy. But at the same time, how do you create a standard? And how do you say like, well, hey, I got you, but you know.

Where's that how you create that? You know, I think you get what I'm saying. How do you manage the situation? So this person is going to come back on the show. They've been a guest. They're a mental health professional. We're to talk through those things. And I think it's going to be really interesting and insightful. But anyway, we're coming down to the end of the hour. And I want to be respectful of your time and kind of bring this to a close.

You know, just as we wrap this up, is there anything that you'd like to talk about, maybe something you're passionate about or some just final closing thoughts or value that you'd like to share with the listeners on business and it could be about anything? You know, like I said a little bit ago, the first year is the absolute hardest as a small business.

And too many people want to throw in the towel and just call it quits because listen, there have been times where, you know, I'm looking at the business account, I'm looking at my bank account and I'm just like, something's gotta happen, you know, and it's so nerve wracking. It almost puts a pit in your stomach where you feel like you're gonna be sick. Because when you have that goal to provide for your family, you know, like you said, know, everyone has hard days, 100%.

but you can't be lazy as a business owner. And there are some days that I have to be up at five o 'clock in the morning and I really don't want to do it today. But how many people am I going to affect by not bringing 110 % to the table? And sometimes you do have to think until you make it. And that's hard and energy drinks help. But it's, don't throw in the towel. See it through. And I've always struggled with, I started a project and I'm bored.

you know, but when you actually find something that you're good at and find something that you enjoy and you know, even bringing joy to other people, you know, you have to outweigh the good and the bad. And I have some friends that are small business owners and it's tough out there. Yeah, for sure. You know, and and they're ready to throw in the towel. And it's like, if you throw in the towel now, all the steps that you have taken forward were for nothing. All the people you helped were for nothing.

You know because good people are hard to find we get so many clients that are just like I'm surprised you showed up I'm just like I don't see why I have bills I have to pay of course I'm gonna show up, so many people don't care Yeah, you know and how many times do you call a contractor and they're just like yeah, okay? We'll be there tomorrow between five and seven Never get a call never get a text message never get an email you never get an update and and that's wrong

You know, because just like you're saying about valuing other people's time, know, yeah, if people are setting aside a time now if you're running behind because of unforeseen circumstances Totally, totally understandable. Yeah, and we have even had situations where like you said if you mess up you gotta own it, know And I completely had a lapse of judgment on how long the job was gonna take and we were late for an appointment Immediately the second we walk in the door before I even give you your price and let you know we're taking 10 % off. Yeah, and they're shocked

Because that 10 % is not worth losing your business or a bad review Yeah, you know and and I think that that's just something that a lot of people need to understand that we're human You know whether you're a business owner successful unsuccessful, you know, we like you said we have things going on that if you Cannot keep yourself humble you're gonna fall into a pit fast. Yeah, and you know, you're gonna sink. Yeah and

You just got to keep pushing through. Like you said, the next day is going to keep coming. So how hard are you going to hit it? Yeah, that's really good. I think that's a lot of really good insight. I think the reality is there's a lot of people out there who, like you said, they just don't want to put in the work. Yeah. They don't want to put in the consistency and push through the challenges. And I think at the end of the day, being a business owner,

It's really about just its consistency. It's hard work. It's showing up And and it's being persistent and implementing right? So like you're gonna you're gonna evolve over time. You're gonna learn you're gonna grow There's gonna be information that some people in this Podcast you hear it and you're like, wow, that's exactly what I need to do This is the change that I've been needing

and the gap between where you want to go and where you're at is your ability to like decide I'm going to take action. mean, can't people won't do that. No, and you can't be afraid to grow because I know when I first started like seeing where I am now is nowhere as bad as I thought it was going to be. mean, it's stressful. Of course, it's growth. It's stressful. But, you know, I'm like,

I can do this. I can handle it. know, so even seeing the growth that I'm hoping for within even the next year, I'm kind of nervous, you know, but that's where that delegation is going to come into play. And you know, the only way that you're going to fail is if you don't try. Yeah. And even if you do fail, that's okay, because you still try. And I think there's so much. It's so twisted that people think that if you fail.

It's because you were meant to fail. You're not meant to fail. You maybe just approached it the wrong way. Yeah. You know, but you cannot give up. And as a business owner, there, there are hard days where it's just like, I just want to be done. You know, because yeah, I don't want to work for somebody else in a sense, it is easier. You know, you clock in, you get you get a lunch break, you get to sit on their dime. Yeah, but

How is that really gonna help you have the time that you not only should have with your family, but you deserve? And that's where I enjoy the freedom of being a business owner, but as long as you enjoy what you do, you have to be able to it your all. Yeah, that's really good. Well, John, thank you so much for your time. Thank you for your valuable insights. Like I said, it's inspiring to see what you're doing with your business and to see how much you've been able to accomplish in such a short amount of time.

So I think John's really a testament. Maybe you're listening to this and either you're you you just started your business or maybe you haven't been in business for very long. I hope that you're inspired by John's story. John is just he's he's a great guy. He has a great business and he's doing some things and they're obviously working. So hopefully you get some insight from this show. If you're watching the show on YouTube.

I would greatly appreciate it if you would like this this show like this episode comment on it share it with somebody so that they can I gain some value from it and then subscribe to the channel and Turn on the notifications so you can see future episodes If you're listening on Apple or Spotify or any other major podcast platform Please rate and review the shows that will help the show get in front of more people and lastly if you need any

resources for your business, check in the show notes below for some affiliate links and things like that that could help to service your business and help things run better, more efficient. And I do get credit for when you sign up, so I do appreciate that. That supports me, business, and the show so that we can keep bringing value to you. Thank you so much for listening to the Off the Ladder podcast, and we'll see you next time.