But Are There Dragons Podcast
Two fantasy lovers quite ready for another adventure…and by adventure, we mean podcast! Join us as we–a LOTR vet and LOTR first-timer–take on the works of Tolkien! Welcome to But Are There Dragons, a podcast where two friends pick a book at least one of them has not read and work their way through it a few chapters at a time.
But Are There Dragons Podcast
Season 6 Episode 1: Project Hail Mary First-Time Reader Discussion!
Welcome to But Are There Dragons, a podcast where two friends pick a book at least one of them has not read, and talk about it. For our sixth season, we're reading Project Hail Mary by Andy Weir, in anticipation of the movie starring Ryan Gosling coming out in March! We read the first half of the book for this discussion, Chapters 1-14, and we're joined by Mr. Jessica himself, Daniel aka Random Nomen!
Don’t forget to follow us at But Are There Dragons on Facebook, YouTube, Instagram, and TikTok, and But Dragons Pod, just one t, on X, formerly known as Twitter.
You can find Kritter at Kritter XD on YouTube, TikTok, and X, and at Kritter _XD on Instagram.
You can find Jessica by searching Shelf Indulgence on TikTok, Instagram, and X.
Music credit to: Frog's Theme by Nobuo Uematsu, Noriko Matsueda, Yasunori Mitsuda
ReMix: Chrono Trigger "Theme of Frog's" - OC ReMix
Hello, and welcome to But Are Their Dragons, a podcast where two friends pick a book at least one of them hasn't read and talk about it. I'm your host, Critter. And I'm your host Jess. And we have a very, very special guest today. Yeah, we do. Mr. Jessica himself has decided to join us. Welcome, Daniel.
SPEAKER_00:Hello, hello. I'm honored and feel very special.
SPEAKER_03:Well, you should feel very special. We haven't had a guest in has it been a year?
SPEAKER_01:It's been a long, long time.
SPEAKER_00:I think your last guest was a little bit more famous than me, too.
SPEAKER_02:My last guest was Leia.
SPEAKER_00:Um that's still true.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, yeah, yeah. I don't know. The levels of fame are inconsequential. We're happy to have you here. Um Daniel is obviously Mr. Jessica, but also the DM for our Knights Who Stay Chill DD campaign that streams ideally monthly on my Critter XD YouTube channel. Um, I am currently in hell, so I haven't been on the stream in a while.
SPEAKER_00:It has been a long time.
SPEAKER_03:It's been a long, long time. Um me being in hell was my maternity leave, and uh my son is now 15 months old. So as you can see, it's been a while. Uh yeah, yeah. But anyways, he does a great job as a DM. So if you want to see him in action, you could see him there. Or, Daniel, do you want to plug your podcast?
SPEAKER_00:Yes, uh recently, uh I guess it hasn't been that recently. We started like the middle of last year. Uh um Adam Baum, um, Wolf Brother uh Seven. Seven. Seven. I just call him Wolf Brother most of the time, and myself uh started a podcast called Me, Him, and That Other Guy, and we just kind of talk about uh pop culture topics. And the joke is that one of us is usually the odd man out of the three, that the other two are more into something. So we talk about you know who's the uh who's who's always that other guy.
SPEAKER_03:So what was your last episode?
SPEAKER_00:The last episode um we we did an end-of-year thing. Um uh we we just uh did that and it was just kind of talking about like things we liked about the year and you know looking into the holidays, things like that. And then we just recorded another one about um just starting out the new and what new year and what we're looking forward to.
SPEAKER_03:So nice. Uh question for you was Project Hail Mary on that list of things you're looking forward to?
SPEAKER_00:No, actually it wasn't. I forgot about that.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, but it should have been, but it should have been.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it should have been because the movie is coming up, and I'm very excited about it.
SPEAKER_03:Exactly. So perfect transition, me. All right, so today we are talking about the first half, chapters one through fourteen, of the book Project Hail Mary by Andy Weir, which is going to become a movie starring Ryan Gosling, Ken himself, coming up in March, I believe. So I'm very excited about that. I enjoyed The Martian a lot. That one had Matt Damon, and Ryan Gosling is oh, he's near and dear to my heart because of all the pen, and then also the notebook and all the other things that he's been in. He's just been really dominating, I think. And uh, and so we went with Project Hail Mary as a book because I had read it. I like I'm a sci-fi girly as well as a fantasy girly. I've read it probably about a year and a half to two years ago and really enjoyed it. And Jessica had not yet read it. So, Daniel, you had read it already, correct? Yes, yes. So, first impressions, Jessica.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, I'm so hooked. It is fantastic. So I am less of a sci-fi girly. Um, I am much more fantasies and swords and dragons and magic, uh, which spawned a whole bunch of conversations about sci-fi versus magic in our house. So that was fun as we got into it. But I went into this book completely clean, apart from the fact that uh Mr. Jessica had been pressuring me pretty heavily to hurry up and read it. Um and that if I read it to definitely give the audiobook a try, because um it was another book that the voice actor, the narrator did an incredible job. So I've been eager to watch it. I had not seen the trailers or knew anything about it apart from the name of the author. So yeah.
SPEAKER_03:So Totally Clean, which I love. Yep. Um, and you mentioned the audiobook. I know Daniel, I think I said this whenever I was plugging it, but you were the one that told me that you started it a physical copy and then switched to the audiobooks.
SPEAKER_00:That true no, no, I was all the all the audio.
SPEAKER_03:I don't know who it was. Okay, anyways, great. You read the audiobook then?
SPEAKER_00:Yes, yes, I loved it. I loved it. Yeah, so the narrator um Ray Porter. Ray Ray, I was gonna say it's Ray something, but uh the first I've ever heard uh heard with him. But there's so many characters, uh narrators that can do like different voices, and so much in this one is different accents, but giving them their own character, which I thought was was just an impressive. It's an impressive skill.
SPEAKER_03:So it is Ray Porter, and he did a really good job. And they added some like slight sound effects um to Rocky, and we'll get into that later. But like Rocky to me was like the highlight of it. Um, it just distinguished the alien of it all from the humans who all obviously had different accents accents because it was a global thing. So, like, let's dive into how it started. I wrote what's two plus two, a computer harassing Grace, um, and him struggling to respond. What an opening. Did it hook you from there or did it take a while?
SPEAKER_02:Absolutely, it hooked me from there because it put me in a mindset of also trying to problem solve. What was the point of obviously this was intentional? Why is it questioning him? What, you know, what is the next challenge? What's the next thing that it's gonna unlock by the time he actually can answer, you know, four? Yeah. And it just progressed from there. I will say though, I honestly can't remember, and maybe Daniel, I don't know if you do. I don't remember when the last time was I read something that was not like fantasy. Like I've done, I did a whole Wheel of Time read through. I did a whole Stormlight archive, like I did a bunch of Sanderson, I did my own year of Sanderson, and then I've done Dungeon Crawler Carl, I've done some Avatar, we've done Iron Flame. Did you read Dune? I didn't know I've never read Dune.
SPEAKER_00:Oh Dune. Really? New Achievement.
SPEAKER_02:New achievement. Uh so I'm just trying to think the last time.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:I'm trying to think when the last time was I read something that didn't feel fantasy. Like Dungeon Crawler Carl is a little bit different. Uh the Cradle series, also I would classify very fantasy band. Um, I can't think of the last time was I read something that I truly felt was sci-fi. Uh so I I kind of had to switch hats, switch gears a little bit. And it was fun to start me off problem solving and puzzling like that.
SPEAKER_03:So I guess one other thing, like you don't read sci-fi a lot. I um I'm not sure I get the first person perspective very much. I'm trying to think of like to me, it like stood out in this book that it's it's from the first person POV. Um it felt good for me to like give context, especially because the Grace, the main character, was kind of discovering things as we were reading him discover them. So, like, how did you guys feel about the POV? Did you like it?
SPEAKER_00:Well, I I liked it because it gave like exposition, like you don't have to do a download of of what the ship is, like he's exploring, and you're exploring the ship with him, and you're exploring the capabilities and things like that. Um, I just wanted to say on the uh the computer questioning him, it gave me like horror, horror story, like like the idea of like when you have to prove you're not a robot to get into a website. It's like uh the ultimate version of that, like pick all the bicycles, and I'm like, oh my god, are we giving robots ideas on our computer's ideas on how to test us and things like that? No, the exposition was a lot of fun, and it's it's a it's a way for you to kind of absorb with the character. And uh, Martian was very much the same kind of way that you're learning through what they experience. And I think it makes sense.
SPEAKER_02:I thought it was a great way to introduce me to the environment um because it was a way for him to uh show his work, right? Like it showed his mindset and how he was making his deductions, um, and they did a sufficient job of dumbing it down for those of us who don't have like a scientific bend of mind.
SPEAKER_03:Right. Well, I guess okay, so that was something I was planning to ask you. It's not too science-y, it doesn't get like it doesn't go too far with the science.
SPEAKER_02:There was one spot where I got a little bogged down where he was um moving the module and he took it off of autopilot, and he had he was put off not by how complex it was, but uh by how simplistic it was. It was just three dials, um, and it was you know, pitch, yaw, and something else. And I was like, okay, I yeah, I'm gone. I'm gone. But cool, I believe in him at that point, and it was far enough in that I felt like I could hold on. And I'm a pro, right, at suspending disbelief and just going along for the ride. So it's the same, same flex.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, Daniel, too much science?
SPEAKER_00:No, I mean that's one of the things I loved about it. I'm I've got a science background, and and that's one of the things I loved about the Martian, and so I, you know, same kind of thing. Um, what I told Jess was I because I'm now listening to it with her as she's going, so I'm just kind of listening beside her. So she just has it going, and I I get to listen again, which I have no complaint about because you know, I'm like, I love the book. Yeah, um, but uh I've told I've told her I'm like because of my scientific background, I know what he's doing when he's doing it. I couldn't pull the formulas up like he could, like, okay, that's this plus this was like, but if you give me a Google, I could pull up that formula and put it in front of me and do the math. And I'm like, oh, okay, this is what he's doing. And and so I I I personally love that. I don't know if it's dumbed down enough, but I I guess Jessica, you you felt like you could yeah.
SPEAKER_02:There was a very brief window in the beginning when we were talking about the things that Nanny bot was doing for him, where I'm like, those are electrodes, they're monitoring this, this, and this. Because I have because of my day job, I have a little bit more in the biology cup. But once we got into like physics and space, oh no, I'm just I'm just cruising along.
SPEAKER_00:But I will give Jessica this at one point before they did the reveal of the of the lab when they could rotate they'd have to rotate it, she's like, How's that gonna work? It's there's no gravity. And I was so proud of her before he even thought of it himself. Then Grace is like, wait, I need gravity for that. How am I? And so I was like, Hey, good job.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, look at you. I love that.
SPEAKER_02:I think for every once in a while.
SPEAKER_03:Um, I think for me, the the very, very beginning, I feel like was very front loaded with science. There was like more than because he's doing experiments that he's like explaining kind of. And I'm not sure I would take away the explanations, just to you know, just be like, trust me, this is real. Um but I do feel like I liked it even better. And I never disliked it, but I liked it even better once he kind of settled in and it became more of like a all right, we're not doing gravity experiments anymore. We're like actually we know the problem and we're trying to figure out how to solve it, right? That was or like when we met Rocky and we're trying to figure out how to communicate with him. That was the kind of thing that I was like, okay, let's go. Because I like the I like the plot furthering, and I get that at the beginning he was trying to like get his bearings, and I understand that he needed to be getting his bearings, but again, like I like it once like for me, sometimes books take a minute for me to be like, okay, let's go. Like, I'm into it now, right? And I won't say that that book that this book was that way because I was into it immediately. But I was like, okay, now that I'm hooked, I want, I want, I want to progress. Um yeah, and so all that being said, this book is based on a flashback model, which is all kind of a part of the first person. He's he's having flashbacks, he's remembering the context of the situation that he's in. How did you feel about the flashbacks? Like, do you like how it's like would you rather it have been chronological, or do you like the flashback model?
SPEAKER_02:Flashbacks generally don't bother me if they're done the right way. In this case, because it is there's more logic to like I feel like I'm wearing my deduction hat, my my detective hat, much more with this book than I do with the fantasy books. I'm like, I don't know the rules. I'm just gonna, you know, wait for the pretty, pretty magic bombs. Um, so with this book, I I like that it's at least a consistent perspective. It's always his perspective, it's just determining whether it's current or past. Um and I honestly it resonated with me that he would just occasionally have stuff floating up from his subconscious. So I generally do like the flashback model unless it's like really abused.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Um and I I like the fact that it makes for at least so far a consistent perspective.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I like it. Daniel. Um I think I think it was a very good conscious choice to do the flashback style, and I'll tell you why. Um, and I didn't realize it until I was listening to it a the second time with Jess. If we did it like a chronological order, it would have felt differently as a story. It would have felt more like Armageddon or Deep Impact.
SPEAKER_02:I was just gonna say it was Armageddon. If you went chronological, it would be Armageddon.
SPEAKER_00:It it changes the feel. So now we're able to I think you can shorten the amount of the story being told because you can you can focus and use those feedback, those uh those flashbacks specifically to what those memories need to be. Instead of if you just did just those memories chronologically, it would be it would be broken. So now we can we can focus more on in the ship and what is gonna go on and and the next page, you know, the next phase of you know beyond what we've read so far. But it it lets it be more about Ryland and about the ship itself, and then you get just whatever you need. You can you can pick exactly what you need out of it.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I found myself the first read, especially, like salivating for the flashbacks because I wanted the context. Like, what is going on like why is he in space? And like, okay, the reveal that it wasn't their son, that he was at a different son. I was like, what you're like it would there was so much going on, and obviously that wasn't necessarily in a flashback, that was one of the science-y things, but like still, it was like there's so many things that I was just the more we found out, the more hyped I was, and I felt like we were getting a lot of information in the flashbacks, and so it just you know, I was just waiting and waiting for them every time.
SPEAKER_02:I feel like the writer did a really oh, sorry, Dan.
SPEAKER_00:I was gonna say one of the interesting things about the flashbacks to me was, and I had never thought about it until I read this book, was he needed information, and it's like you can't, it's it's like so many scientific movies or sci-fi movies, you're like, I'm gonna look around the room and I'm gonna, you know, like he couldn't do that. He could only it's like, how many times do you see your name in a memory? You know, like how many times like people like, hey buddy, how you doing, or hey pal, or like your your your significant other might not ever call you by your name. You're like, okay, I gotta get a memory where somebody says my name. You know, and so it's it's that was such an interesting thing of restricting, like he's like, gosh, I gotta think of something, I gotta think of something. Just somebody, somebody show me a piece of paper or something. So that was a that was another fascinating component of controlling it with a with the flashback. It almost that it was almost like tension, because it's like, how long is it gonna take him to just find his name?
SPEAKER_03:Just his name.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Well, intention is a good segue because all I was gonna say was as a net new author for me, having never read The Martian, never read any Andy Weir, I feel like he did a really good job getting you to the point where you were, like you were saying, critter really craving that flashback, like craving that extra um information and context. So, you know, that's really tight writing, in my opinion. It's he did a great great job making you want that info.
SPEAKER_03:I do wonder if he has a space background. I didn't look into it, so I'll like because both the Martian and you know, they're both very science-y, right? So you would like he's out, he could be a science, a high school science teacher, as far as I know, and then he became an author. I don't know. I don't know about it.
SPEAKER_00:I don't think so. I saw an interview with him. He just does really extensive research. He's a he's a research guy. And once he finds something, he just kind of gets lost in that and kind of just follows the flow.
SPEAKER_03:You know, Matt Ross, Andy Weir, yeah. Well done, sir. So speaking of context, it was a big reveal for Grace that he was on a spaceship. Jessica. Yes. Was it a big reveal for you?
SPEAKER_02:It wasn't. I saw 0.4 seconds of the trailer before I was told to cover my ears and go la la la. Uh so I saw a picture of uh Ryan Gosling wake up on what I assume, but also I had kind of inferred it because I've heard a lot of people draw parallels to the Martian and not just because it's the same writer. Uh so I wasn't that surprised that we were on a spaceship. Um, but I'm really, really glad that I, you know, went earmuffs, full earmuffs for everything else because all the other reveals have been huge payoffs. So I've been really glad to come into this book completely uh clean.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. You did some hard work.
SPEAKER_03:I did. Intense, like presenting it. I know the move I think the movie poster also has Ryan Gosling like floating, like in zero G and in something that maybe looks like a space suit. So like yeah, I understand that that was probably something you could not avoid. I think even as someone who read it before the movie ever happened, um, or like ever threatened to happen, I'm pretty sure I knew immediately that he was on a spaceship. Like not that hard to figure out. So also like how boring if he like wakes up and he doesn't know where he is and he's just in some like you know, Truman Show chamber or something. Like, I don't know. I mean that could have been interesting, but I Twitter.
SPEAKER_00:I wanted to ask, I wanted to ask you because you had read this before, you listened to it before. When you heard Ryan Gosling was going to be Ryland Grace, did that surprise you? Because that's not who I pictured at all.
SPEAKER_03:Uh I don't I don't know who I would have pictured, but the moment I found out, I was like, I love that. Because um the humor, like the the dry sense of humor that he has, it worked for Matt Damon, and I think it would work also for Ryan Gosling. Like, have you seen uh Crazy Stupid Love? Yeah, it's so funny in it, and he's like, he's just very oh well, and like uh La La Land, he's just got this like Fall Guy. Fall guy. Yeah, I actually haven't seen Fall Guy. I know here it's good, I know. Um really good. And so, and obviously Barbie. And so there's so many things that he's done that I just he's just he really melts into the character that he is, but almost without effort, he's incredibly charismatic and charming. And I found like I found Grace like I could buy in to Grace being that way, right? Like he he was chosen for the this like huge mission, right? And so, anyways, it was just uh it works. It I think it works. I don't know who else I would have done. I guess maybe like oh oh my gosh, what's the guy? Who's the guy who plays Hawkeye? Clint. Oh uh no, that's that's his name.
SPEAKER_02:Jeremy Renner.
SPEAKER_03:I can see like Jeremy Renner doing it, just because he's kind of like a he's he would be a more serious version. Um, but I could see him doing it too.
SPEAKER_02:So I have a follow-up question then.
SPEAKER_00:Sorry. Can I can I give you my opinion on who I was picturing Nathan Fillion, a little older who's kind of Jeremy Renner-ish, yeah, kind of kind of similar vibes. But when I saw the when I saw the when I saw the trailer for I because I I knew the humor of Ryan Gosling, same kind of thing, and seen him in. I was like, he could pull off the humor, he can pull off the charisma. But Ryland Craig's I'm like, he's not really charismatic, but he is kind of self-deprecating and stuff like that. And then I saw the like the video of them of how they kind of just gave him a kind of like a moppy haircut, and immediately he kind of became this kind of nerdier version of himself. And Rylan is definitely a nerd.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:And and it's like just that one little change. I'm like, oh yeah, I get it now.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, it's wild because like you've seen, I mean, we would do talked about all the stuff where he's like fun and charismatic and oh whatever, but like you know, Blade Runner 2049, uh Drive, right? Yeah. Like he's he could be he can he's a chameleon, I think. Like he doesn't get enough credit, I don't think, for like his work and the breadth of his work. And so it just I just got super hyped. Also, like he's you know, he's not he's not bad to look at. Like that was a fun. I'm there. I'm pretty excited. Uh I'm I'm really excited. Let's I don't wanna I don't wanna anyways, Jessica. You were saying.
SPEAKER_02:All I was gonna ask is have you now seen the trailer?
SPEAKER_03:No. No, I need to, I know, I know, I know, I know, I know, I know. I need I um I'm maybe I'll do a reaction video.
SPEAKER_02:So just so you know, the second I finished chapter 14, I pulled the rewatch the trailers on the big screen TV because I don't they don't go past chapter 14.
SPEAKER_03:I don't know. I don't know.
SPEAKER_00:They do, you'll recognize what's beyond it, but okay. I I'd seen them before and I'm like, there's a couple scenes in there that you're not gonna know what's going on until you read it.
SPEAKER_03:It's not gonna spoil anything, yeah, really. Okay, yeah. No, I haven't watched it because I've been trying to like I don't know. I it's weird with trailers because as a content creator, I'm always like, maybe I'll do a reaction video, and then then I just end up not watching them until like I happen to be at the movie theater and they come on the screen there, and then I'm like, oh, but how many times do I go to the movie theater with a 15-month-old? Not many. Yeah, though I did go see Avatar, so it was cool.
SPEAKER_02:Oh yeah, so I would recommend the trailers, both of them.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, I'll have to check them out. I am I'm really hyped for the movie. It'll be that'll be one of the ones that I get a babysitter for to go see for sure in theaters.
SPEAKER_00:I was I was just so frustrated that they they they gave away Rocky in the first trailer.
SPEAKER_03:Uh yeah, okay.
SPEAKER_00:Well, you know, but I was more careful about her than you. No, no, I know Rocky. Right away, I'm like, you can't watch, you can't watch this. Yeah. It's the one of the most important, you know, you know, secrets of the whole story is that this guy comes knocking on the window.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. So speaking of, yeah, were you surprised that there are aliens in this or at least one alien in this book?
SPEAKER_02:Yes. I thought that it was brilliant the way that it was revealed, um, you know, breaking through the astrophage line, the Petrova line, um, and then just all of a sudden the ship was there. Everything about how they introduced was just so fun. And I I devoured it. Um, to the point where I was so glad that we were finally recording this tonight because I can't wait to go back and devour the rest of the book. Like I've been might as well tell everybody who's either watching or listening. Like I texted Critter as soon as I was done and said, just so you know, it's gonna be the longest four days of my life. Um so uh no, all of it. I couldn't wait. It was playing in the car, it was playing in the house, it was I was listening to it wherever I could. And then once I had to hit stop, I'm like, well, you're gonna have to watch the trailers with me now so that I could tide myself over.
SPEAKER_01:Oh darn.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. That's fair. So I had I had written, what did I write? Nope, just kidding. I didn't write anything down. Carry on.
SPEAKER_00:Let's say as it was on the screen.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I I mean I just had so many fun reactions at the moment, and I I don't know how many of them Daniel was in the room for or not, because let's be honest. Honestly, I'm reading in bed and I am doing the read-along thing, right? I'm on my Kindle, but I have the audiobook playing, and that's what he's talking about when he says he has to hear it too. And then we're listening to it in the car while we were doing road trips and things. Um there is a moment I on my top five moments that in chapter three, when he names it Astrophage, I was just like, Yeah, cool name, like out loud. And I don't know how many of those things Daniel had to live through, but I had a lot of just little moments like that. And it you know, Rocky coming onto the scene was definitely part of that. Yeah, there was lots of holy shit, holy smokes, holy, holy, oh my god.
SPEAKER_00:I I I loved one of the things I loved about the way that they did right because Ryland Grace is very similar. One of the things you can say about this is the the Martian and the and Project Temer are similar in that they're an isolated scientific, so he gave this its own feel in enough that I I can appreciate both separately. But one of the things that I'm like I loved about it, and and I was like, I would probably be the same way in personality terms is getting to name stuff because it's like he was in he was in he was in the tau tau sedi system and he goes, I call it a tau light. And if you got a problem with that, it's not sunlight, it's like I call it tau light. So I'm like, that's how I would be. I'd be like, yeah, I'm gonna name it that. That'll be cool.
SPEAKER_03:So he's always like, at least I didn't name it after myself. Exactly, exactly, which is true. Although I feel like I'd name one thing after myself, though I don't know what I would have named after myself, if I'm honest. Yeah, that's fair.
SPEAKER_02:So I love that tongue-in-cheek humor. There was one that I did write down, I just found it in chapter eight. The quote I highlighted it humanity's first miscommunication with an intelligent alien race. Glad I could be a part of it. And I was like, yes, that is a great example of why I've been really enjoying this read.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, the humor is a huge part of it for me. That's just like obviously I'm hooked on the what's gonna happen situation, or like I was, at least my oh, bye Jessica.
SPEAKER_00:I'll do my best.
SPEAKER_03:There she is. Okay, I'll put her back. One moment. Which one? Hello. You're just gonna weirdly swap positions and it'll be fine. It's fine, it'll be fine. Um, where we're who's talking? I don't even remember.
SPEAKER_02:You were excited about the humor.
SPEAKER_03:Great. Yes, okay. So I love the humor. I feel like it's an integral part of it. I obviously care about what's going to happen, but I think like Andy Weir, I appreciate like I didn't actually read The Martian, I only watched the movie. And I definitely feel like I should read The Martian now. Same. Um, because I've heard some people say that they prefer it. And I find that like I I wonder if you prefer the one that you read first, just because it sounds like they might be somewhat similar in tone. Uh, you think so, Daniel?
SPEAKER_00:I have learned in my personal experience, if I see the movie first, I can appreciate both separately. If I read the book first, I struggle to appreciate them separately. Uh so I've done that in multiple things. Like if I watch the movie first, I can, you know, I can be okay. Okay, but Martian The Martian I saw first and then I read.
SPEAKER_03:So but between whether you read Project Hail Mary or read The Martian first, like I wonder like some people like uh the book The Martian more than the book Project Hail Mary, but they read The Martian before they read Project Hail Mary, and I wonder, because they're so similar, if it's really just a matter of which one you read first. Because I just find it hard to believe that I would like The Martian better than this one. And part of it maybe is because of the communication aspect that I don't think it didn't exist in the Martian because he's not trying to communicate with alien life, but like you know, the interacting, first contact, like that kind of a thing adds just an element of fantasy to it a little bit that I obviously am gonna appreciate. Yeah. Um so and I'm just a big like I love I don't want to say world building, but like discovering new cultures, right? And I feel like discovering Rocky's culture, they watch each other sleep because they're fully shut down and they can't defend themselves. Stuff like that is just like so cool of Andy Weir to have come up with just this unbelievably weird alien, alien race. So yeah, I I really appreciated all of that. But I do want to read the Martian just to see.
SPEAKER_00:I suggested it's very good. Um, the Martian, I they are similar in many ways, but in other ways they aren't. I mean, the Martian was a study on isolationism, and not isolationism, but on being isolated, and what it uh the effect on a person to be that isolated for that long. And then you had the the the scientific discovery and and and the you know the the the type same type of humor, the the tongue-in-cheek humor is still very much there.
SPEAKER_02:I wonder which one he wrote first.
SPEAKER_03:Martian it was the Martian, Martian, yeah. Project Hillberry came out like 2021 or something. Yeah, I can I could be lying, but it's like it's more recent.
unknown:Okay.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. So yeah. But uh anyway, so speaking of Rocky, uh kind of weird transition. There are very few characters in this book. Very few. Um Strat is probably the second most featured, unless except for maybe Rocky, like Rocky and Strat are maybe neck and neck in this first part. Did you like Strat, Jess?
SPEAKER_02:I did. Uh God help me. Uh and I know listen, I know that a lot of people think that I'm like a bubblegum girl in a lot of ways, and I am. I'm such a vibe girly. I really am at heart. I'm I'm good at vibes and everything. But I love love a hardcore B who gets it done.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:I I can't get, I cannot emphasize enough the respect I have for the civil disobedience of it all. Like this is a situation that calls for X, Y, and Z and extreme clarity, and you just commit to the vision. It's not that she's the scientist, she's not the subject matter expert at any of these topics.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:But she is assembling, she is cutting through all of the haze, the noise, all of it. Um, so yeah, I like Strat. Let me reel that back in a little bit. Yes, I like Strat.
SPEAKER_03:Daniel, Strat fan.
SPEAKER_00:The oh, absolutely. The the world is lucky to have had her because if they didn't, yeah, um, yeah, we they wouldn't have been able to do what they could. It makes me wonder if you could take Strat out of this book and put her in another series, how well she could achieve. Like, if you put her in Wheel of Time, stuff gets done in seven books.
SPEAKER_03:Well, see, I've well, okay, that's fair. I was gonna say Strat is like Moraine is like the strat of Wheel of Time, you know. That's just like no nonsense, like we're gonna do this, but then of course she's like hurting cats trying to get these teenage kids to do what they're supposed to do.
SPEAKER_00:So it's Moraine does not have an aircraft carrier at her disposal to get done what she needs to get done. So exactly.
SPEAKER_03:I appreciated her uh court appearance where she's like, I figured I'd get sued by a bunch of people, so I I wanted to knock it out all at once. Yes. And then and then uh Grace asks her later, you know, are you expecting to get prosecuted? And she's like, Yeah, but like what else? What else am I supposed to do?
SPEAKER_02:I gotta say, and that was when that like clinched it for me, right? Like I was already impressed and that she was just cutting through everything and just getting what needs to be no different than grocery shopping, right? She's going to the shelf, she's picking the things up, she's moving forward. No noise, no fuss, no muss. Um, but that that specific civil disobedience piece. Like, I understand there will be consequences, but this is what needs to be done, and consequences be damned.
SPEAKER_00:I I thought it was interesting to kind of compare her to uh because I love DD, played it for decades at this point. Um, if you compare her to D, she is the ultimate chaotic good character because she's like, I will do whatever it takes for good. She may not before this started, she may have been more lawful good or neutral good because she respected order, but the moment that she was selected for this, she recognized I have to break through and it has to be for the greater good.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. I think I will say that if one thing in this book annoyed me at all, it was how like continuously flabbergasted Grace was with Strat's authority, right? He's just like, What do you what do you mean? Like, how do you just are in control of everything? I swear he said that like a million times. And like, you know, and it was like funny, right? Because obviously it would be an absurd situation, but at a certain point, you gotta get used to it, right? Like, she's in charge, and that's just gonna be that. Like, listen.
SPEAKER_00:Well, at a at a certain point, he's just that he's at the other the other end of the table, and there's other people being surprised, and he just raises his head up, like, yeah, get it.
SPEAKER_02:She does that. Finally, this I think that was the last interaction I saw where he was just like, Yeah, she does that.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, finally I'm used to it. Halfway through the book. Um, you know, we'll continue to be used to it, I guess. Um yeah, so there's Strat. There's obviously the other characters, the uh the environmentalist, can't remember his name.
SPEAKER_02:Francois Leclerc.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, that was pretty brutal. That was a brutal, brutal sequence.
SPEAKER_00:Um he felt like he was betraying his entire life, life's work, but still recognized that it had to be done. That that was heartbreaking almost.
SPEAKER_03:Uh yeah, it was like at first when they were like, Yeah, it turns out global warming actually saved us some time. I did not think it was going to get taken the next level, but it makes sense. It makes sense, but I hated it, right? Like, who wants that? Like, who wants that? It was so sad. I don't know.
SPEAKER_00:And we just paved the Sahara, so that changed things too. So he was mad about that. So he's like, Well, we just paved the Sahara, so you might as well do this too.
SPEAKER_03:What are we gonna do? Although, you know, honestly, no, I know I wouldn't I wouldn't pave the Sahara, but in my head, I was like, wow, having all that renewable energy is actually kind of great. Yeah, minus like not to like obviously without thinking about all the species, it's gonna completely obliterate the ecological effects, yeah. Yeah, which would be really sad.
SPEAKER_00:I liked I like that guy that they met him in prison, the guy that did the the paving of the Sahara.
SPEAKER_03:The Dell.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, because he's like he's like, Well, I didn't kill those people. Well, we're in here for for something else. He's no, I stole the money. Yeah, but I didn't get the money. Oh, I took the money, yeah. Totally is like, oh, I took the money. Yeah, I didn't get those people killed though.
SPEAKER_03:Right. Yeah, the little cast of characters. We didn't meet a ton of people, but they were they were good characters, all of them. I appreciated them. No one no there was no one in it that I was like, oh, uh, this guy again.
SPEAKER_00:I I did tell Jess that I think um one part that I'm kind of calling now for the movie for streamlining is they'll get rid of the uh UN uh scientist, uh female scientist that came in and says you have to do this in in in in gravity for these uh for this equipment and had the idea to to rotate the the the uh lab around. I think they're just gonna that'll just be part of the design of the ship. I don't think they'll character really does so far.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. You know, so TBH, I had already forgotten that happens, so that'd just be like something you could definitely I was like, they'll just they'll just they'll just make that part.
SPEAKER_00:They'll they'll talk about it, but they won't bring in that character. There's no need for that character to somebody else can just have that idea.
SPEAKER_02:They'll use a sentence or two to like do movie magic to to account for it.
SPEAKER_03:No, one thing I do hope is in the movie is the like the early flashbacks, like him with the kids, him with his colleague that they get drinks every week, but then she's like throwing them back completely depressed, like, no, this is a problem, right? And then the like slow realization that turns into dread. Like that is a thing that I think it didn't take a ton of space, it didn't take a ton of time in the book, but it was done so effectively that I yeah, I want that to I want that to happen. And also I just really appreciate that he's a teacher. My mom's a teacher, like I grew up, you know, like staying after school, like waiting for her to get done with her lesson plans. So I like I've I've been in schools my whole life, and just you know, so the fact that he was worried about his kids, oh my gosh, and also the words the reveal that he was like, I really like kids, but I'm single and I don't have any of my own.
SPEAKER_01:Like, I don't like the almost red flag that was actually a green flag.
SPEAKER_00:It's okay. No, okay, it's okay, it's okay.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, that cracked me up.
SPEAKER_00:Well, I I I was gonna say this earlier when we were talking about the flashbacks and the effects of them. Um it gives the ability to give yourself give the character more depth. Uh because you get to see these specific moments. Because if you don't have those, then you're just what's he's doing in the ship and what's he's you can only learn so much about a character in a in a room by themselves with an alien creature. You only learn so much, but if you see them around other people, so that flashback gives that depth of character that you wouldn't be able to achieve otherwise.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and one of the flashbacks in particular, um, he realizes that it's a one-way trip, right? And we found that out early, early on, that it was a one-way trip. I that would be really rough, like psychologically, right? You know, obviously they took into account we can't have them awake for this long because psychologically that would be a problem. Um but I just I don't know how I would have reacted to that. Like how like you know.
SPEAKER_02:So I have a secondary reaction for that. So, yes, the coming to terms with and the conversation around, I actually highlighted it, right? Besides, we're already asking these people to die. We shouldn't ask them to suffer emotional torment for four years, too. Science and morality both give the same answer here, and you know it. Like uh, that was kind of a heart-wrenching thing to read. However, and yes, it's terribly sad that he's on a one-way mission that is a suicide mission. Like, it is it is sad. I promise I'm human and have emotions. I was sideswiped by the fact that once he met Rocky, now there's another living being who potentially has to perceive his passing or loss. Like there is now somebody else who is there, and one of them's gonna lose the other at some point, even if it's just due to old age.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah, which is not likely to be due to old age. Yeah, but you're assuming Rocky can't go back, you don't know that.
SPEAKER_02:No, I'm just saying I don't know what will happen, and I'm like, either Grace dies, which is the most likely scenario, or Rocky leaves, or Rocky dies.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Somebody's leaving somebody.
SPEAKER_03:Will parting be sweet sorrow in this case? Like, well, well, how will they part? When will they part? What's gonna happen?
SPEAKER_02:So once I came down like half a tick from the excitement of meeting Rocky and and them working out their own language and counting and all of these things, which are beautiful and fun to experience, I was like, Oh my god, there's some there's another being that's gonna experience this loss with him. And I don't know how I feel about that.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Um, one of the things I like about the whole thing, uh the Question of like what would you do if you found out that you were on this suicide mission for a good cause? Um, I think you have to look at Ryland Grace as an everyman character. He's not a jet pilot, he's not an astronaut, he's like a he's not an army hero that you know is the ultimate patriot. Um he's a science teacher. And so we get to recognize we get to experience a story of like that could be me in that in that shuttle because I didn't have the coma thing, the genetics that was required. So that being an everyman character lets us be that much closer to the experience than if we were looking at a an ultimate hero, like a like I said, a an astronaut that you know is is the is the classic hero. He's still a hero, but he's an everyman hero.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, he wasn't like this is maybe too deep of a cut for some people, but have you seen Interstellar? Yes. Okay, so man, actually, Matt Damon's character, ironically, um, whenever like early in the movie, they kept talking about him as like the best of us. He's the best of us. He did this voluntarily, he wanted to do it, right? Like he he he he knew he might die and he didn't care, all that stuff. And like to me, that it's just it's not as believable as Grace, right? Who is there and is like, oh damn. Like, you know, like uh like he's not just this, I'm happy to do it. He's doing it, but he's not happy about it. And that's that's more realistic. It's uh you relate to him a lot more. So yeah, you're totally right. He's definitely more of an everyman than this, like the world.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah. If Captain America like volunteered to do it, you believe it. It's Captain America. Of course, he's gonna suicide himself to save those, save the world. But my science, my sixth grade science teacher who was kind of weird and had asthma, you know, I'm just interesting.
SPEAKER_03:You know, like okay, cool.
SPEAKER_02:And also, I feel like that's another tip of the hat to the author, right? That he did a good job of every interaction that advanced grace to a point where in the flashbacks where you're like, Oh, so this is how he got here. Um, you know, Andy Weir did a good job of like teeing that up. Like it's completely plausible. It all tracks, it all makes sense, you know, that he went from literally just being a super secret consultant to all of a sudden he's the dude in the in the suit.
SPEAKER_00:In the chair.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. So at this point, are we like do we like Grace as a person? Like we would we be would we get a beer with Grace? Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:I think he's probably one of my favorite protagonists in a long, long time.
SPEAKER_03:Really? That's cool.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I'm trying to think the humor, the intelligence.
SPEAKER_00:Um he's believable.
SPEAKER_03:And yeah, I think the enthusiasm too. Yeah, he's in this horrible situation, and he's still got this desire to learn, this desire to discover.
SPEAKER_02:He has a full fangirl moment. Like he has his own fangirl moment. You know, science is his fandom right on. Yeah, and you know, he's like, holy smokes, I'm about to have, you know, encounters of the third kind, and and I get to be the one that does that. And he gets to nerd out about all that science.
SPEAKER_00:Listen, uh, I I have I I I started uh with an engineering degree and and I've moved on to other things now, but I will tell you that there is nothing quite as satisfying as working out three pages of calculations and you get to the right answer at the end of it. It's its own euphoria. So I can understand the zest for science of like, oh my god, I actually got the right answer, and here's all of my notes to show like to prove my work.
SPEAKER_02:So it's like, yeah, so it's and I know enough to go, and there's a formula for that.
unknown:Carry on.
SPEAKER_00:That's true, that's true.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:Um there's something else I was gonna say there. I can't remember what it was, but uh just a zest for science was what I was gonna say.
SPEAKER_03:So yeah, I was a fan of that for sure. I like him. I do like him. I think he's a cool down-to-earth dude.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, I I remember what I was gonna say. Um, we were talking about the flashbacks too. Um I thought it was so funny, and I I think I mentioned it to Jess as we got about halfway through this. Was he is a science teacher who doesn't curse.
SPEAKER_03:And even I love that.
SPEAKER_00:Even the amnesia, he didn't curse. He still never, and it's like, oh, is that so like ingrained in your personality that it's just hardwired in of you know, no cursing? He's like, Oh, I just say shucks, or I say darn, or yeah, I thought that was that he realized it in in his um self-exploration.
SPEAKER_03:It's like, what's going on? Like, I can't curse. Yeah, why do I talk like this? And we figured it out eventually.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, so that's the end of my notes. Um, Jessica, did you have anything else that you wanted to talk about?
SPEAKER_02:Um, we touched on, I just had two other bullets for my top five moments. Um, so as Grace and Rocky are getting to know each other, the jazz hands remain. Oh my gosh, I know gave me so much life. They gave me so much life. I can't, it's so precious. Um, and then the other one is uh sad, but uh the the real the reveal about Rocky's crew. So I again this is one where I think Daniel was in the room for. Um, and he, you know, the narrator made a comment about uh Rocky wanted to stay and watch, and Grace acted like that was weird. And he's like, Don't you want to go back to your people? I'm like, You assume he's got people. Um, and so that was kind of having rapid fire real time where I'm talking back to the narrator.
SPEAKER_00:You don't know.
SPEAKER_02:You don't know, you're making an assumption, and then he reveals that his whole crew has died, um, and that they, you know, they all died. The the eventual reveal that they all died due to radiation exposure, and that Rocky was protected because he was down, you know, behind the astrophage and provided as an essentially a shield. Um, and that was pretty heartbreaking. Um, also when when Rocky started to shut down, like the I thought it was precious though, watching over you while you sleep. And I just I thought it was precious. I like no notes on that, but also the fact that I'm like, there's probably a reason, and then sure enough, the author provided us a reason that like they legitimately shut down, and so they stand guard and watch over each other as they sleep um for reasons.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, yeah. Rocky was just delightful. I he was so much fun. Like the jazz hands for yes was really good, like the um, you know, sad, sad, sad, sad, like excited, excite, excited, excited. Like the the way he like repeated things when he wanted to emphasize them.
SPEAKER_02:Um all of that's the communication was just and the music notes for the audiobook was just brilliant.
SPEAKER_00:That was one of the reasons I wanted you to do the audio was because it was the the music notes m kept you in the in the in the story because you're like, oh, you're hearing it.
SPEAKER_02:Fun fact the first scene that I got to that Rocky was in and actually uh spoke, uh Daniel asked me to pause and he's like, What does that look like in the book? And so I showed him on the Kindle, and it's just music notes.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, okay. I actually I have the physical copy and I didn't look. I didn't think to look. That's funny. Yeah. So I wonder if the music like I now I don't know how to read music, but I I bet they're like right, you know.
SPEAKER_00:I bet so. I bet so. Yeah. He does the research.
SPEAKER_02:I can recognize half a dozen notes, but I I don't have an ear for it or anything.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, yeah. No, I love that in the audiobook for sure. Highly recommend it if you're deciding between reading the physical copy and the audiobook because they literally they'll play they talk about how you know Rocky he can't um he can't see. He he's got like sonar or whatever, like he's totally different in the way he sees and perceives things, and so his communication is like very musical, uh, which is really cool. And that's translated into the book uh the audiobook, which was lit. And I basically only read audiobooks these days, and so I don't know any I wouldn't have known that you know it was gonna be different, but it was it added to the experience, I think it did having it in the audiobook. Yeah, I think the go ahead.
SPEAKER_00:Sorry, I was gonna say the the um comparison of their scientific process and evolution. Yeah. It's like, oh, we you guys are so far ahead of us. He he just assumed they were so far ahead of him. He goes, Oh, wait a second, you don't know this, but I know this, and you never even had a reason to know this. So this whole part of your scientific understanding is missing. And that's like it's really kind of cool to see their not competition but comparison.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, like they had never been to space, you know, like they had created xenonite, which is like wild, yeah, impossible for us. So there were so many it and it was explained so well, right? Like we are more advanced than them in some ways, they're more advanced than us in some ways, and uh, you know, let's work together, make it happen.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Uh that was what I was gonna actually speak to just from a little bit of a different perspective. That one more way in which Rocky was impressive is that they do that without any um visual input, and uh having having never done like extraplanetary travel, like this was their first time sending a ship out into orbit, and they still got there, and it was just even more impressive.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. And the explanation for it too, like there's a there's a limited number of civilizations that like don't have enough technology technology to just win and have enough technology to send a ship as far, right? And that's it.
SPEAKER_02:And I think that's that's like the showing the work piece, like yeah, that explains it to somebody like me who hadn't really thought it through.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:It totally worked. One of my oh sorry, I was I was just gonna say one of one of my favorite um one of my favorite parts of this. There were so many I I loved every single part of it. I there was I uh like no notes, I just can't think of anything I hate, but it absolutely hooked me when they started the the anthropological connection between the two languages and like what's the process because it's like I felt myself like how would I do it? Like, oh, you start with one, you start with me, you know, like that whole thing, and and them walking through that. I was I I could not get back to the book fast enough. Like I was doing it in the car, and I stayed in the garage one time for a while, and she opened the door to look for me when I was reading it a long time ago, and I was like, There's a really cool part, I'm not getting out of the car yet. So I gotta find out what happens with Rocky.
SPEAKER_02:I like the fact that Grace a couple times was like, Rocky's better at this than I am, like he's already done this, this, and this.
SPEAKER_03:And yeah, uh that was that was really a great take from the photographic memory, except for that he can't see, so yeah, his processing power is just way, way, way higher than ours. Um but we have computers to make up for it, so you know.
SPEAKER_00:And he can't understand computers, he's amazed by computers.
SPEAKER_03:Yep, which yeah, it's cool. It's just I love the comparison between the two peoples, civilizations, whatever. Um it was a really, really neat. Uh Andy Weir has a fan in me for sure after reading this book the second time, well, halfway through the second time. Um for sure. So are we out of your notes, Jessica? Are we we are?
SPEAKER_02:Um, can I make a request?
SPEAKER_03:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:As we go into the next segment, can you go first?
SPEAKER_03:Absolutely. I'll go first. Okay, so um on But Are There Dragons every episode, we pick an MVP from the read that we just did. So for chapters one through 14, we're going to pick an MVP and a runner-up, which is hilarious because there's so few characters in this book, but there's enough that we could pick an MVP and a runner-up because we're doing two sections of Project Hail Mary. We will take the scores from this first section, look at the scores from the second half of the book, and we will ultimately pick a book MVP. But for now, we just have the first section to do. So since I'm going first, I will tell you who my runner-up. Do you want me to do the runner-up or just straight up MVP first? Reveal the MVP. Runner-up. We usually can do runner-up. We do, I just didn't. I know what you're running up. Okay, so my runner-up. See, this is the one that I'm the most torn about. My MVP is clear, but my runner-up MVP is between. Well, it's gonna totally give away who my MVP is. It's between Grace and Strat. Because, okay, because Grace, like, is fun, he solves some problems, whatever. Um, you know, he's the guinea pig at the beginning, all of that stuff. But really, the person who made that S happen is Strat. So you know what I'm talking myself into it. Strat's my runner up. Strat because she is a get-ter-done kind of a gal, and without her, none of it would have happened. And Grace, she she kicked, she dragged Grace kicking and screaming into this project at the beginning. Multiple levels. Multiple levels, and so I feel like she needs some props. And I have every confidence that Grace will get more love next time, next read. Anyways, okay, Daniel, do you want to get it?
SPEAKER_00:Oh, I go s I go second. Who's your runner-up? Um, my runner-up, we haven't spoken about this character, but I find them very important uh for the spin drive technology. And it was the Russian Dimitri that developed the spin drive. Because that spin drive is used in multiple parts of the ship. Okay. Like for for navigation, for propulsion, for everything. And I and it's like he's one of those that even even outside of his scientific knowledge, his connection with and friendship with uh Grace in the early uh flashbacks kind of helps you understand Grace better because they kind of nerd out together, you know, across two languages. And it's I think I think Dimitri is a very important character that doesn't get a lot of credit.
SPEAKER_02:Okay. Okay, that helps. Thanks, guys.
SPEAKER_00:Jessica.
SPEAKER_02:So you're chosen? No, so I had my MVP all locked up. No problem.
SPEAKER_00:Was I supposed to be my MVP or my backup? Was I supposed to be just your runner-up? Okay.
SPEAKER_02:So, but I was very wishy-washy about my runner-up, and I feel like I am perpetually saying this was such a hard choice. It was, okay. It was. So I was between Demitri and Francois Leclerc as my runner-up. Um, Dimitri, because of obvious the obvious significance of his spin drive and the how it scaled the project up so that it could actually make it into outer space for, you know, the very important next leg. And then, but I'm I really want to do Francois Leclerc because even though it was so heartbreaking and soul crushing for him to damage the atmosphere and the earth to give humanity a chance, he he came through. And so I feel like I feel like that deserves some props. So Francois Leclerc is my runner up.
SPEAKER_03:Okay. Okay. Are you comfortable doing your MVP first or do you want me to?
SPEAKER_02:I will be fine doing my MVP first. Uh so this is gonna come as a surprise to no one that uh my MVP for all of the reasons uh is Ava Strapped. Uh, because let's face it, I've got a girl crush on her. She was incredible and continues to be incredible. And I can't wait to see where we go from here. But uh for all the things that I said earlier, times like 10. We could never have done it without her. She cuts through all the BS and red tape. And even though she's not the subject matter expert, she goes, What do we need? Gets the thing and makes the thing happen. And and has that vision and is executing it.
SPEAKER_03:Okay. Props. I mean, I love Strat. All right, Daniel.
SPEAKER_00:Uh, I'm gonna just go real fast. I picked Strat as my MVP as well for all the same reasons. Okay. Um, minus the girl crush, but uh but uh yeah, just respect for the world needed that hero. Um that's the hero we deserved, or what what's the term? Uh it's not the hero we wanted, but it's a hero that we deserve.
SPEAKER_01:We deserved, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, or we needed or something like that. But uh yeah, it's yeah, and putting it in perspective and getting the obstacles out of the way and and just making stuff happen.
SPEAKER_02:And just being able to look at things from a global perspective, right? Like she did not every every time that Ryland's grace is uh in awe that she's you know commanding aircraft carriers and this and that, she's not letting typical boundaries diminish her view of the world is my asset pool.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, yeah. And she is a delegation queen. Like literally, she pulls the people that knows what they're doing, and then she's like, like, will it work?
SPEAKER_02:You know, like okay, that's it. That's all I need to know.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, you need to be at the airport because you're with us now, you need to be at the airport in three hours. Yeah, just let all your stuff go. I think the other thing that impresses me about Strat, and I just realized it as I was you were talking, Jess, was she has ultimate power and it didn't go to her head. And how few people that's an interesting character because so many times in literature, the person that gets absolute power gets corrupted absolutely, and it might happen, but as we see so far, she's immune to that somehow.
SPEAKER_02:She's not commandeering Air Force One to go to Vegas, she is eyes on the prize, and that's a rare thing in stories.
SPEAKER_03:Have you seen um that's really an odd specific thing? It is okay, yeah, totally. Um, okay, so my are we my MVP? All right, I picked Rocky. I picked Rocky um because I thought about it. He is not only super like smart and effective, like he was the one that united their ships, right? He gave Grace like a ton of options of like, what wall do you like? Right? And he picked and he noted the one that he liked and he made him a whole thing. Like, and we ended this section with him like, I'm coming on board. Like, I created something where I can come on board. And I meant to ask you, like, would you have been as eager as Grace to be like, come on over, like, come look at our tech?
SPEAKER_02:Like, I think by the time it came up, yes. Yeah, uh, I think that in the beginning, like when he first kind of balked at him coming to watch him sleep, I I that kind of resonated with me. Like, you're gonna come into my sleeping quarter.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Um, I don't know how I feel about that. Uh, but by the time they got to that point and they realized that there is such a difference in in what level they're operating at from a technology perspective, I wouldn't have hesitated at that point.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And he's just so dang smart, right? Like he's he's an engineer and he's Own right and is clearly making things out of thin air.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:You'll see that more. I think the only reason why I wouldn't do Rocky this early is because he does so much more than later.
SPEAKER_03:Fine. Well, I mean that's no, I know, I know, I know.
SPEAKER_00:Um just in a general sense, his best stuff is to cup.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, well, I think for me it's like it's a combination of the fact that he's very effective, brought them together, all that stuff. Um, also but like my MVP, it's not just like most valuable player type of a thing. It's like I loved him the most. Oh yeah. And so, and he's just like adorable. Jazz hands, like all of that stuff. He's so so cute. And so, yeah, he was my favorite part of the book, and so I figured he deserved the MVP spot.
SPEAKER_00:There's no wrong answer. Uh that I was just giving you my opinion on second. I I would wait and do it later, but I'm not gonna. You're not wrong. I'm not gonna be on the second show, so I have to. You're not wrong. That's true.
SPEAKER_03:So that's true. Okay. Well, we have loved having you on, Daniel. What was it like being on the podcast? Be nice. It was awesome.
SPEAKER_02:There'll be a survey. There'll be a survey later. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:What is that survey monkey that I have to like uh one to five? Um no, it was it was amazing. I I hear uh often hear you guys kind of um as you're recording, so I get to kind of experience this and it was great. And you two are amazing uh human beings anyways, and getting to share in this was pretty awesome. For an amazing story with two amazing people is a pretty amazing opportunity. And I will stop saying amazing.
SPEAKER_02:Amazing.
SPEAKER_03:Amazing. Uh well, honestly, it was such a pleasure having you on. Um I like was this this the your first appearance on Butter Their Dragons? Am I okay? Well, what took so long? No, I think I'm glad that you did come on on this one. I think it was a really good discussion. You did great, and uh we'll have to have you on again for other cool.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely. Anytime. I will clear the schedule.
SPEAKER_03:Perfect.
SPEAKER_02:Note to self, find more cool stuff to talk about.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I think we've got some in the back of our heads that we're we're gonna be getting to pretty soon. So yeah. Alrighty, cool.
SPEAKER_02:So as we wrap up episode one of season six, uh, our next episode should drop with the second half of Project Hail Mary on January 26th. That is when we are gonna be discussing the second half of the book. Uh, we hope to have another guest star for you that day, fingers crossed, uh, Jassians. So, you know, keep your eyes out for that. But we look forward to seeing you on the 26th to talk about the book as a whole. So, with that, we're gonna say thank you so much for turning in to our first episode of season six of Butt Are There Dragons, brought to you by your hosts, Jessica Sedai and CritterXD, with our special guest, Mr. Jessica Daniel himself. Please don't forget to follow us at But Are There Dragons on YouTube, Instagram, and TikTok, and Butt Dragons Pod, just one T on X. You can also find your hosts on social media as CritterXD and Shelf Indulgence. That's it for us today. We'll catch you on the other side of Tao City. Bye.
unknown:Bye.
