Ever wondered how a week of basking under the Barbadian sun could rejuvenate your soul? Cleveland and I, Lindsay, are back from our indulgent escape to the Sugar Cane Club, ready to share how sinking our toes into the sandy beaches and savoring vegan delights helped us unwind and unplug. From the secluded luxury of our resort to the culinary treasures at Tides and Lone Star, we relive every tranquil sunset and mouthwatering meal that left us more connected and content than ever.
This episode isn't just about the bliss of time away; we tackle the tough topic of vacation guilt head-on, challenging you to break free from that desk-bound anxiety. We swap stories of cultural discoveries, dodging roadside gullies while driving on the left, and practical nuggets on how to voyage without breaking the bank. As we champion the importance of fully disconnecting, we hope to inspire you to embrace those precious vacation days for the sake of your mental health and happiness.
Join us as we cap off our journey with a heartfelt recount of travel mishaps and the growth they foster, proving that even amid the occasional tiff, the memories made and lessons learned are priceless. We might even convince you to invest in a pair of grounding sandals or the newfound confidence to navigate foreign roads with ease. Remember, when you're ready to pack your bags and seek your own adventure, safety, preparation, and embracing the culture of your destination can make all the difference.
Please email us at Gettoknowthedevil@gmail.com
Ever wondered how a week of basking under the Barbadian sun could rejuvenate your soul? Cleveland and I, Lindsay, are back from our indulgent escape to the Sugar Cane Club, ready to share how sinking our toes into the sandy beaches and savoring vegan delights helped us unwind and unplug. From the secluded luxury of our resort to the culinary treasures at Tides and Lone Star, we relive every tranquil sunset and mouthwatering meal that left us more connected and content than ever.
This episode isn't just about the bliss of time away; we tackle the tough topic of vacation guilt head-on, challenging you to break free from that desk-bound anxiety. We swap stories of cultural discoveries, dodging roadside gullies while driving on the left, and practical nuggets on how to voyage without breaking the bank. As we champion the importance of fully disconnecting, we hope to inspire you to embrace those precious vacation days for the sake of your mental health and happiness.
Join us as we cap off our journey with a heartfelt recount of travel mishaps and the growth they foster, proving that even amid the occasional tiff, the memories made and lessons learned are priceless. We might even convince you to invest in a pair of grounding sandals or the newfound confidence to navigate foreign roads with ease. Remember, when you're ready to pack your bags and seek your own adventure, safety, preparation, and embracing the culture of your destination can make all the difference.
Please email us at Gettoknowthedevil@gmail.com
This is Cleveland.
Speaker 2:This is Lindsay.
Speaker 1:And this is another episode of the Devil. You Don't Know, lindsay, what are we going to be talking about this week?
Speaker 2:Relaxation.
Speaker 1:Relaxation and vacation. The inspiration for this one, and we should have actually brought our recording equipment with us, but we didn't. But we just got back from Barbados.
Speaker 2:We did. It was amazing and it was very relaxing and I do believe I told you yesterday on our first kind of full day back that I like vacation Cleve better than every day stressed out Cleve.
Speaker 1:Yeah well, vacation's wonderful and amazing, and this episode is going to be all about why vacation is wonderful and amazing.
Speaker 2:And why it's essential.
Speaker 1:And why it's essential, Definitely, Most definitely, Lindsay talk about. I want to specifically, since we're just basking in the glow of Barbados I really want you to share your experience of what I think was probably the greatest vacation so far.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, I mean, I've been on a lot of great vacations with you, but I think what made this one so special was that we both did not work. You didn't even bring your work phone or work laptop with you, which was a great thing, and I actually today got a message on my phone saying that my screen time was usage was down like 72% last week, so it was really. I think it was a real opportunity for us to unplug. We stayed for the first time at like a luxury boutique property with only 50 rooms, and so the service was impeccable. There was vegan food everywhere that we went on Barbados more than I can find in the neighborhood in New York and we were able to just unplug and unwind and relax, which is something that is really hard to do at home.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the name of the place we went to was the Sugar Cane Club and to this day we don't know how we found that place because we it was maybe only two other American couples there besides ourselves, and even they were like don't remember how we found it must be Twilight Zone. One lady said Expedia, and then the other couple were like yeah, just just found it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was. It was really such a remarkable place and it was funny because when we did the drive over there it was down this dirt road with all these half built houses and the two of us were looking at each other like, oh boy, where are we staying for the next 10 days?
Speaker 1:Yeah, and the reason why we felt that way is because we did stay at a lovely place and I'm going to name drop because I like to name drop places that I went to, because I want them all to do well. But if you're looking for a great Airbnb experience in Barbados and you want to venture outside of the sandals, definitely West Rock Villa is a great place to go. But what I will say is that this place was compared to West Rock, which was a nice Airbnb, was a decent size. We were next to a farm. This was like full service for for for significantly less.
Speaker 2:Right, and I think it was also the Easter holiday and so in Barbados the like local Bayesian people that they're called are very religious. So our experience last year we went over the same week was that none of the stores were open from Holy Thursday through Easter Monday, which made it really difficult in an Airbnb, which is why we chose to this time stay on a property that was fully serviced, with housekeeping and fresh towels and food if we wanted to eat there, and it just had a level of service that we weren't able to have at the Airbnb.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that was great. I want to talk about a couple of the dining experiences there and definitely I'll talk about all three. But we went to three places. We went to Tides, local and Company and Lone Star and Lindsay. I want you to describe those meals to our listeners.
Speaker 2:Yeah well, I'm, you know, a vegan food connoisseur, and it is really hard for me. One of the things that stresses you out often on vacation is my inability to find something to eat, and that is not the case in Barbados, which I think makes you more relaxed as well.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, yes, quite so.
Speaker 2:So the hotel when we arrived was serving up rum punch to us and pretty much waiting on us from the moment that we got there and then had us fill out paperwork about any dietary restrictions and basically said the chef will prepare based on your restrictions, which was awesome. So the local and company I love because they have the toes in the sand dining experience where you can reserve a table right on the beach for sunset. They are all farm to table food from the island and really delicious and unique things. I think we had a beetroot hummus, some crispy mushrooms with some kind of vegan dip.
Speaker 1:I forgot about that, though. That was the bombcom.
Speaker 2:And then I had a island breadfruit gnocchi, which was fantastic. Um, I love breadfruit. It's kind of a starchy fruit, I guess, that grows on a tree, but so I had a breadfruit gnocchi and it was wonderful. The sunset from there is always spectacular. You can't see any of the other islands, so the sun just sinks into the ocean.
Speaker 1:It was really one of the best dining experiences, and we had our same server that we had last year, lamond who, when we told him about bail reform in New York City, he was like wait a minute, I'm going to do my bad Bajan accent. Wait a minute, you mean you can commit a crime in New York and you get out of jail scot-free? And he's like yes, absolutely.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and then you know, just briefly, the other two places, so Tides and Lone Star, are much more upscale dining establishments, although most people there didn't really dress for it. So we went to Tides on Easter and we did last year as well. They have a lovely library bar where you can have a little snack and a drink before dinner. And then we had this. I don't know how you pulled it off, but you had a table right on the water once again.
Speaker 1:I think at all three places.
Speaker 2:Yes, you really, you know, knocked it out of the park. So next year you can make all the dinner reservations again. But at Tides I had a. They have a whole vegan menu. When I said are any of the starters vegan, he said, oh, let me just give you the vegan menu. And I had a charred broccoli salad and then a really lovely like green Thai vegetable curry with some Caribbean influence, with some hot peppers, and it was fantastic. It was really really wonderful.
Speaker 2:And then at Lone Star, which is probably one of my favorite dinner spots, and then at Lone Star, which is probably one of my favorite dinner spots because it's just the location, again you had a table that was right at the steps down. I don't know how you did it. The sunset was gorgeous. We were able to go there, sit at the bar and watch the sunset and then have dinner. And again I had a different curry there. It was like a heart of palm island curry. It was fantastic. And I don't even remember what I had for a starter. I think like a really delicious kale salad with some spicy sweet potato crisps and there was a little bit of fruit in there and some nuts and it was like an orange maple dressing or something. It was fantastic as well. So you broke the vegan.
Speaker 1:You know code on vacation, but as I said I was, but no, I. I stuck with um, a lot of seafood and everything that I had was was amazing. Um. I'm going to give honorable mentions to the, the salsa, which is the, was the hotel um restaurant and the Chate hotel restaurant and the.
Speaker 2:Chateau, oh, the Chateau bar and the Chateau bar.
Speaker 1:Tell folks about the Chateau bar.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so, but basically the thing about this property that was so unique is that you really wouldn't know it's there driving down the street, and so once you get into this place, I describe it as a Caribbean oasis. You come in and then it's just private, and it was just. It was so strange to me because even though it was pretty full, it was so quiet. It was literally just 50 rooms of people all relaxing and the setup was amazing. There was a nice pool with some chairs in a covered area, some chairs in the sun.
Speaker 2:They had some tables if you wanted to eat by the pool, and they would go and get you food from the restaurant and bring it to the pool, so you didn't have to put a cover up on or change your clothes. It was really full service, um, and then there were chairs and umbrellas scattered throughout the property, so if you wanted to go and lay by yourself somewhere, you could go and be by yourself without anybody bothering you Although I saw the bartenders running over to make sure people didn't want anything. And the Chateau bar was all the way at this one part of the resort where you walked down a pathway next to this gully, where there was all kinds of wildlife and you sat like almost in the jungle on this covered deck and had dinner and it was really so beautiful and they had music playing and you wouldn't even have known that you were at a resort.
Speaker 1:Yeah, don't forget the kittens.
Speaker 2:Oh, there were so many stray kitties there, but they were so cute and one of them, loved Cleve, would climb up in his lap on our balcony all the time until the rescue organization came and took them to give them to good homes. But you know, I think let's just kind of get into it about. You know the importance of vacation and relaxation, Right, A lot of people take vacation and stay at home. But you know, I can't stay at home. That's not vacation to me, because everything that I have to do here is looking me in the face and judging me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I want to. I'll start off with this, which is is why people don't go on vacation, and and and you met me, and when you first met me eight years ago I think, I was like many Americans, many New Yorkers, that I had a reluctance to travel, and many of it, especially for Americans, are cultural factors. There is the guilt factor vacation guilt. Many Americans and I have been one of them, I am still one of them feel guilty about taking time off and worry about the backlog. I'm still one of them feel guilty about taking time off and worry about the backlog. This is me A hundred percent. Worry about the backlog of work that will await them when they come home. What do you think about that? Is that a valid reason not to take vacation or to be worried about vacation?
Speaker 2:No, but I think that's, once again, right. People get in their heads about things, and you and this is a big issue that I've always had with you is that you don't even like to take a sick day. You're good at taking your vacation, though, but you know you have to be able to unplug and recharge, because it makes you a better person, right, it makes you better at the job you do and it makes you more productive when you are there. But listen, most jobs unless it's your own company right, it was there before you and it'll be there after you, so you don't owe anything to anybody but yourself.
Speaker 1:Say, I'm your client and I'm sitting down across from you and I'm telling you, and you're talking to me about the importance of vacation and I'm telling you that vacations are for soft people. They're there for weak people. It's only for the rich. I don't understand why I need to take a vacation. What is something that you would sit and tell that client?
Speaker 2:Well, I tell my clients all the time that vacation is self-care, right? Sick days are self-care. You don't have to be sick to take time off right. Mental health days are important too. But in regards to the financial piece of it, I mean, there's so many options. Barbados is a really, really expensive island. This little gem of a hotel I didn't even really want people to know the name of it, that's okay, america was probably about a quarter to a fifth of the price of the more fancy establishments on the island.
Speaker 2:However, the difference is, I think, that it was locally owned, yes, and so it was not aiming to be a luxury resort, but, you know, as a result of it being locally owned and the level of service I think it's elevated itself to being, you know, the same as, or if not even better than, those you know $1,000 and $1,500 a night establishments on the beach.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the importance of um, of personal attention. Remember the night that the head housekeeper came out and talked to us, Um, and that actually was a genuine moment that we and we had a genuine conversation.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she wanted to make sure that everything was okay in the room and even the housekeeper dropped a bite a vitamin bottle and broke it and she came to find us on the resort property so that we could know that she dropped it and she was so sorry.
Speaker 1:We were like whatever, we're on vacation and the receptionist when we checked out, she came around and gave us the most genuine hugs about the importance of mental health day. And a mental health day, he said, is something that serves as a reset and allows individuals to reflect on their behaviors and their thought process and make necessary adjustments. I can tell you, as I was gummied up in the sun oh my goodness, with my glass of rum I was I reset completely. I think we went down. I had knee pain, I had hip pain, I had back pain and after two days I had no pain, zero pain.
Speaker 2:Right, well, I think I mean we've talked about this before, right, that a lot of physical pain is in the head, but you know so a lot of the physical pain is actually related to mental anguish that people have. But it was also you're giving your body a rest, you're giving your mind a rest, and that is really important.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's super important. Um Joyce smarter uh, who's a? Who's a?
Speaker 1:Psychotherapist wrote an article in psychology today in which she talked about the importance of vacation and mental health days, because they improve your mental health and your physical well-being. And it's funny, because one of the reasons why many Americans don't take vacation also, too, is not only this cultural perception is that folks can't afford vacation. I'm going to tell you guys straight up most Americans only vacation for five days. We've stayed here, this place, for 10 days and it was under $3,000, right? So if you are the and that was with the breakfast plan included if you are the average American who only maybe goes to the islands for four days or five days, this place is going to be a song for you, right? And so there is no reason that you have to perceive vacation as a luxury.
Speaker 1:Also, to work ethic and productivity and this is something that I've struggled with. There's this strong cultural emphasis on hard work and productivity in America, and sometimes it's perceived that taking time off means that you're not dedicated to work. I actually sat in a meeting two weeks ago where one of my colleagues went to Italy for for two weeks and my boss was like what you know, nobody checked this with me. And then the person that that person reported to was like he doesn't have to check it with you, he's got the time off.
Speaker 2:Right, but doesn't that just go to show, right, what like a toxic society we live in? You know, you take all of your vacation and I remember one of your colleagues even said to you oh how long are you going for? Just the weekend. No, a weekend is not vacation. The weekend is the weekend is not vacation. The weekend is the weekend.
Speaker 2:Um, the other reason that we do 10 day vacations or two week vacations is because to get there it takes a day. I mean, barbados is a five hour flight, so by the time we got there it was 2 PM. Then you rent a car, you wait there, then you drive an hour to your nice little remote property and it's four o'clock before you arrive, right? So you've essentially lost the entire day going home. Same thing, you lost the entire day. So if you go for 10 days and you lose two, you got eight days. There's your week of vacation, right? Your week plus one day, which is why we, you know, if you go for four days, like some of the folks that were there with us, I mean they really had like a two day vacation.
Speaker 1:Yeah, remember the family we met. They went to. They were going to O2 and they were only there from a Thursday to a Sunday and I was like what?
Speaker 2:He was like oh, you're staying a long time. I was like, no, we're staying on vacation, right? That would be so stressful to me that it wouldn't even feel relaxing.
Speaker 1:One of the things that you said that and I'm and I actually researched this while looking up the show Um, and it's one of the problems that I have at working in corporate and you don't have working for yourself is the United States is one of the few countries and guys I'm thinking about running for office. I'm going to. This will be my stance I will make federal laws that mandate vacation time, but get this the United States is one of the few countries that does not have a federal law which requires employers to offer paid vacation days and, because of that, many people don't really have the option of the vacation, because there are jobs that only give you. You know, I'm lucky to have a job that gives me 20 days off, um, but there are jobs that the most work for myself and have unlimited days off.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but there are jobs that literally will only give you five days, and what was amazing about Barbados is the amount of British people that we met and Lindsay, I'll let you talk on this- we were there for 10 days and I was so jealous of the people that were there when we arrived and were still there when we were leaving. How about? How about I'll say well, I'll say I'm making up the name, but you will never know because you are there. I know who you're talking about. How about Nigel? Nigel, who was?
Speaker 2:there for like 17 nights 17 nights and really the people next door to us who were very, very funny and engaging, they were there for two weeks. Everybody is there for a long time and I think that's the difference, because the hotel is very British, it was us and the Europeans, and all of the Europeans were there for really extended times. And it's interesting because the hotel actually offers extended stays and they advertise that they really want you to come and relax and they want to make sure that you have a fantastic experience while you're there. I remember one night I went to dinner and none of the vegetables were vegan and I was like, oh, they all have dairy. And he was like, oh, no problem, hold on. And then 10 minutes later they came out with a whole roasted vegetable tray for me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, amazing place.
Speaker 2:Right, I mean it was like they really cater, but you know, that is. The truth is that and I said that to you when we were there is that America doesn't promote enough vacation and relaxation for people, and that is, you know, another reason that I don't like living here eventually.
Speaker 1:Well, my plan was damn you, whoever in Oregon won the power ball. My plan was to win the power ball. I mean we had we sat at at. We sat at Artie's last night with our friends and we, we, we promised money out.
Speaker 2:We were apportioning money, not me. I was just ready to go buy a house in the islands, but no, really it's it is. It's. It's so important to take a trip and to relax. And I think I said to you while we were there and I wonder what your thinking is on this is that I haven't slept that well in years. I mean, you slept like a baby. I slept like a baby. I was sleeping 10 to 12 hours a night and I was not even like having a trouble. If I got up to go to the bathroom, I would come back right back to sleep. And you said to me I have never seen you sleep like this. Why don't you sleep like this at home? At home, you're up all night.
Speaker 1:At home you're perimenopausal. At there you were like hmm, you were like 23 again.
Speaker 2:Oh, I had a great. Yeah, I mean I slept, I relaxed, yeah, I really really enjoyed it. I, you know, I did get a lot of emails from work and I just ignored them and I still haven't really opened the computer.
Speaker 1:So I started looking at my work emails, but I'm still in vacation mode even right now as we speak. Um, I have. I thought I was going to have a thousand, I had 396. Um, and I'm. I was like, yeah, I'm back, um, but let's move on to our next topic. I want to talk about safety concerns. You know I'm on vacation vacation.
Speaker 1:I'm in a curse out right now and hopefully he's enjoying himself. Oh, I'm sure he is, and we talked with one of our friends, eric, at the bar last night and he we were all travel, talking about our international travels last night and he's we were all traveling, talking about um our international travels. He talked shared trips of himself in barbados when he was in the air force, uh, in ghana, and so safety is um a very big concern. Lindsey, what do you, what would you tell somebody who? What do they need to understand and be prepared for whenever they travel anywhere?
Speaker 2:I think it just depends on where you go, but you should research it ahead of time. You know there's certain places, obviously, where it's not safe to be out and about. There's certain places where it is safe but you need to be more aware, and then there's places like Barbados where it's really safe all the time.
Speaker 1:White people walking around with impunity.
Speaker 2:That's what you always say right and so it is. You know, just be smart about where you go. I actually never feel uncomfortable at Barbados, never walking down the street in town.
Speaker 1:I want to.
Speaker 1:I'm going to interrupt you for a second because you're going to talk because one of the pet peeves, um, is driving and driving with me, um, and you were very vigilant and very concerned about, uh, about your side, because, guys, in Barbados, not only do you drive on the left side, but then the steering wheel is on the right side, so for even the British people who drive whose steering wheel is on the right side, it was a total freak out. So if you are somebody who's like big on spatial awareness, like Lindsay is and I am not I am definitely not spatially aware Lindsay is. She's great at puzzles and definitely not spatially aware of. Lindsay is she's great at puzzles, and so it was very concerning and alerting to her, and this is going to still be on the topic is one of the things that's dangerous about driving in Barbados is not other cars, but people walking around in the dark.
Speaker 2:And, yes, and island people. So they are walking in the street because and this is what scares me there are these giant gullies on the side of the road with no grates over them, so just a two or three foot hole. That is for I guess I'm assuming water drainage, right, if they have heavy rain, so that the roads don't flood out, but in the newer areas they have grates over them, which I'm like, at least, if you drive over the grate, you're fine, but if you don't drive over the grate and you drive over the hole, right, I mean, that's the end of the rental car, the end of me, because I'm sitting there looking at these holes. And that was a big point of contention with us on this vacation as well, and I was terrified driving there.
Speaker 1:But what I want to say is, on many of those nights and this is to go back to your point about for white folks feeling safe there were nights that we would pull up on somebody who's walking in the road White it was like, oh, oh, this is like and it's and I would never recommend walking in the dark at night in 90 percent of even the safe places that we go to. But this place is that safe, this is that that safe where I we saw families walking up.
Speaker 2:I think it's very, very safe there and it really they pride themselves on that. You know, another thing I noticed and I didn't even say this to you, but I thought about it today because we were taking a walk with the dogs today and someone walked right by us on the Avenue here smoking a joint in the middle of the afternoon and I thought you know, barbados is like the only island where you're out and about and you don't smell weed everywhere.
Speaker 1:Did you notice that? Yeah, I did notice that. I 100% noticed that.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I think you know it is the safest place that I think we've traveled to. Right, and we go to the British Virgin Islands often. We're going for a couple of weeks, coming up and but I will say that I don't feel as safe there, for example, as I do and BVI is are very, very safe, right, tortola, virgin Gorda, very safe islands but I don't feel as safe there as I do in Barbados, and maybe it's because everything is really kind of located on the beach, so if you're sitting there for dinner you're almost sitting in the sand and some places you actually are. So there are people walking around and you know, hanging out and swimming and then coming up and eating, and there's really no, I had no fear and I think that's also such a part of the relaxation, right, because your nervous system is not activated.
Speaker 1:Yeah, when we were at local and company. In the sunset you see families still walking up and down the beach, well after dark.
Speaker 2:And the parents just eating dinner and the kids are running around and jumping in the water and it is, it's so safe yeah.
Speaker 1:Even though there was that moment at Rico's at the beach that you weren't there, where I saw a young lady who I thought was looking for the bathroom, and asked her because this my hospitality self automatically kicks in because I see I have what I call bathroom face, and so that's what I thought she had and I was like, ma'am, are you looking for the bathroom? And she's like no, I'm looking for my son. And I was like oh that's, I can't help you there. Fortunately, she found the little boy, grabbed him by his arm and then dragged him back over to the table. I think she handcuffed him to the chair as she continued her libations. But that was interesting, but it is, but it is.
Speaker 2:It is so safe and that's the thing, right it is so safe that you don't even worry about your little three or four or five year old running around and finding other kids, as long as you know where they are, you know that they're fine and you know we have come to realize, right, you immediately develop relationships with the local people and it's really so lovely and they have. They're so welcoming to tourists and it is really honestly like I feel that it's probably the safest place that I've ever been.
Speaker 1:The second safest place that we've ever been is and I want to talk about this piece because it was. I'm going to talk about language barrier Right Was Guadalupe, which was very, which was the first place we stayed, which was Le Jardin Malanga in Guadalupe was similar to to where the property that we stayed at, and it was this enclosed area that you had a chef on on staff um, but how did you overcome? For somebody who, like, might want to go to, and even for some people, barbados might be a tough place to go to, because you got, you know a lot of Americans aren't, aren't used to accents.
Speaker 2:I've never been scared of places because you have reminded me from the beginning of time when we met, that I walk around, also like the other white people who walk around with impunity on vacation, and you're like you should be scared and I'm like, nah, not scared, I'm not scared. And he's like you're a target, then you should be looking out, but I'm not. I'm not scared when I'm away. I mean, of course, I don't go to places that are scary, right? I mean, I've also been to my row, which is a tiny, tiny Island in the Grenadines, right, and I stayed at a place called Dennis's hideaway. That was like $46 and 50 cents a night and it has one little road that leads from one beach over the Hill to the other beach and that's it. There's no school on the Island, there's nothing, and everyone leaves and goes to another Island for school and for doctors and dentists and things, and that place obviously was very, very safe. I mean, most people don't even have running water there when you don't electricity, which is wild, right, you don't even think about that in this world, but it makes for such a peaceful, peaceful place, and I think that's the other part.
Speaker 2:Right Is that we in Barbados didn't bring our phone anywhere. We would go to dinner and I would just leave the phone in the room and I never felt like I was missing anything and you'd be like, oh well, just bring it if you want to take a picture. And I'm like, yeah, I got a picture in my head Right, like I can remember what this is. And I think for us, we both had such a great vacation and we reflected so much on how much our relationship has changed over the years and how, how we've, you know, become so much closer and how we've both worked on ourselves and that we've come to this point where we can really enjoy each other's company and go away and not be, you know, bickering and at each other's throats, and we don't sit on the phone and ignore each other and we really. I think part of the enjoyment of this trip was that we really got to enjoy each other as well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, what I wanted to talk about, you make that naughty face. What I wanted to talk about specifically, and that was before we, before you, before you went on that, the little that little tangent. No, no, but it was fine. It was a good tangent. It was a good and important tangent was overcoming a language barrier Right, and I know.
Speaker 2:I know in Guadalupe. Yeah, that was hard for me, yeah.
Speaker 1:But you overcame it and what I remember the night that the um we went to and no one in Guadalupe speaks English, but remember the night that the host I remember her forever, the little black lady. We went to the French restaurant and we remember her forever, the little black lady. We went to the french restaurant and we she thought that there was something wrong with the food because I was that was my remember cleve back in the day would just eat and I immediately ask her to check. Do you remember?
Speaker 2:that I would.
Speaker 1:I don't remember which restaurant you're talking about oh, but there was a little restaurant where it was a. It was a you'll I. If you don't remember the story, that that's fine. It was a little restaurant where I remember the owner. They were only and it was one of the best food that we, that we had. But they were only open one day that week or two days that week and the owner came out because we ate and it was like a half hour, we didn't sit and I immediately asked for the check and she came out and asked in French was the food? Why were we leaving so fast?
Speaker 2:Yeah, because In French, was the food. Why were we leaving?
Speaker 1:so fast.
Speaker 2:Yeah, cause you're annoying with that. That's everywhere we are.
Speaker 1:I don't do that. I don't do that anymore.
Speaker 2:No, this was very relaxing. You just sat. It didn't matter if they came over for an order or not, and that was one of the things that was so lovely, because, yes, you, you, you always do that and that always drives me crazy, wherever we are.
Speaker 1:You'll, wherever we are. You'll be like, okay, we have the check, and I'm like I don't want the check, I want to relax, yeah. But what's funny is you might be scared to go to someplace where the people don't speak your language. But nonverbal communication goes a long way, and you, that's right. Bonsoir, bonsoir and, s'il vous plaît, les auditions, s'il vous plaît. Oh, I was referring to the ATM and I was.
Speaker 1:I was referring to drinking more rum. And then the last piece that I could think about on this is fear of the unknown. Right Start small. What do you think about that If you're scared to travel, like I had? A colleague a couple of years ago went to Thailand and she always wanted to go there, and then she was like, ah, you know what? Honestly, I didn't have to spend $10, dollars to fly because I could have stayed somewhere local. So what do you think about starting small if this is your first trip?
Speaker 2:Well, I think that we're very lucky to live on the East Coast, because people on the West Coast they have the like the, you know that part of Mexico, like Cabo, and all of that, the Pacific Coast, and they have Hawaii and all of that the Pacific coast and they have Hawaii. But we're very fortunate here that we don't need to fly 10 or 12 or 20 hours to see a beautiful beach. And so, you know, I don't. I mean, yes, would I love to go to Thailand? Sure, but am I just as satisfied going to Barbados? Absolutely, because all I want to do is relax.
Speaker 2:And so I don't think, if I, I'm not a person who wants to go on vacation and do all this cultural stuff and then come back and need a vacation from my vacation because I work really hard. So my goal for vacation is I want to go on vacation and just enjoy the vacation, right, I mean, we didn't do any. Last year, we took a rum tour with the train that you wanted to do in barbados this year. I was like, well, do you want to go to like another place? And you were like no, yeah, so you don't need to go around the world to go to the beach, because the beaches are really beautiful.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know, four or five hours from new york yeah, I I think about um our personal history and how I went from. I think the furthest uh vacation I had had prior to you, and maybe in the 10 years prior to you, was Ocean City, maryland.
Speaker 2:I think you went to the Bahamas.
Speaker 1:No, I said the 10 years prior. Like it was Ocean City, maryland, that was the, that was, that was that was it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've never even been there.
Speaker 1:And then, for me, you, when I first met you, you, you, you, you, you trained me well. Because when I first met you, you, you, you, you, you trained me well. Because when I first met you, I remember you had photos and you're talking about all these crazy destinations and I was like what no? And so we started off small and our startup, small was, key was Key West and you were scared in Key West, right.
Speaker 2:But the moral of the story here is that, like, don't be scared, right, Because that's what this whole podcast is about. Right, step into your fear, book a trip somewhere. I'm not saying like go to Jamaica or the Dominican Republic and like walk off the resort and decide you're going to go for a local meal, right In places where it's very clear that it's not safe to do that. But what I am saying is go to a place that's safe, right, do your research, look at what is safe and what is not safe and just go and enjoy yourself. And you know and it was so interesting because most of the people where we stayed did the all inclusive plan and never left the resort, I mean, and that is like the key to relaxation. If that's what you want to do, then just do that. We ended up staying because we're going to the well, we're going to the Tortola and we're going to Anagata this summer for almost two weeks. Right, I know you still don't know how I got you to commit to that I had to go back.
Speaker 1:I honestly had to go back and look at my work calendar and be like I put in two weeks and I and I did, I actually did yeah.
Speaker 2:So you know, and we're going to be doing that this summer and I said to you, we're going to be in Tortola. We don't have a pool, we're staying literally on the beach in a tiny apartment, which is another bargain right, you have to look for these kinds of places but we're staying in a tiny apartment on the beach. So I said we're going to be at the beach for two weeks and we're going to Anagata, which is supposed to be spectacular, right, never been. And all the times I've gone to Tortola, I've never taken a trip to Anagata, and so I'm super excited that we're going to be spending a couple of nights there as well this summer, but we're going to be on the beach. So we were like you know what? Let's just relax by the pool, right? It's just like whatever your body needs, just do it, do it Right.
Speaker 2:The other thing I'd like to say is I also got my new grounding sandals, which I love the earth runners, because I'm very much into like, connecting to the earth, and walking barefoot is supposed to be the best thing for you. But I can't do that in the Bronx because it's gross. So I, you know, in the Caribbean I could walk around barefoot all day long, which is so funny, right, but it's just something here is just so gross to me. Even in our own yard I'm just like it's the Bronx. So you know, I was able to just kind of you know really kind of connect with myself, connect with nature. We were in the ocean, we were in the sand, we were out for dinner, we were in the pool, we we took walks, we went into the gully that day. Right, there was a monkey ran in front of our car, right, I mean it's, it's such a beautiful place. But connect with yourself and just do whatever you want to do, listen to your body.
Speaker 1:Yeah, um, it is important to definitely have backup plans If they, if, if, in case something goes wrong. Uh, I know when we went to Calabria, remember that couple that did you have a backup plan on this? Trip did not um, but I am. But no, these are some. I don't make backup plans well but this is listen.
Speaker 1:If you are a crazy psycho like cleveland, who was originally from the projects of brooklyn, new york, and eric talked about it and we've talked about eric, is like yo when I was, I'm from when I'm in. I don't care if I'm in ghana, I don't care if I'm in barbados, I don't care if I'm in californ. I'm always from the Bronx, bro, and so, always being that mentality where I'm always from Bed-Stuy, it is important to have a backup plan, which is have a map on you in case your electronic devices fail.
Speaker 2:We do not have a map.
Speaker 1:I know Well, this is because you had me on total vacation mode Know where the embassy is, or at least have the phone number to the local embassy, the embassy.
Speaker 2:They have an embassy there. Yeah, of course it's an american.
Speaker 1:I have no idea because I didn't create this backup plan that I should have made but not only that. Like it's probably in bridgetown and that's so far, we're not going there and the other thing that you should definitely have which I didn't have, have either Um, but next time I will um is the local emergency numbers, like I think, and I think and you've never had that on vacation, never had it never had it. But no, these are things that you should have, if you, if you have a fear of vacation if you have a fear if you have a fear also.
Speaker 1:Uh, and I hope that my son does this. I'm actually going to check in with him shortly.
Speaker 2:No, you're not, because he's away with his girlfriend and we know what they're doing, so leave them alone. Talk to him when he's back.
Speaker 1:I told you. On the reverse hand, you should let folks know where you're staying, do you agree?
Speaker 2:Well, yes, when it's your kids, yes, but nobody knew where we were. Because they don't need to? No, because we've grown.
Speaker 1:We've grown AF, and you should not necessarily post my. One of my children, who's a female, is going to be going away out of the States and yeah, we just told her don't post your whereabouts, yes, and that, yeah, so that's what we told her and that's what a colleague also advised her. I actually told her to take a post down talking about where she was going to go and a male colleague reached out to him on the side and was like no, no, no, you're a single woman.
Speaker 2:No, because, also, you know, that's. Another important point to bring up is that once someone said to me also, if you have a house right and people know that you're gone, your house becomes a target Right. If you advertise yourself all over the place, you know, I mean, we're already back now. We're already back now, and most of the time when we do an episode, we've already done what we said. We've done because, you know, because of the way that the recording goes. But I do think that it's it is important to be, you know, to be aware and to have that recognition. And, yes, we did tell our lovely daughter to, you know, just, you know, use caution. Our lovely daughter too, you know, just, you know, use caution. And she did tell us where we're going, where she's going to be, just like. Uh, you know, the other son told us where he's going to be, because it is important for people to know where you are. And so I want to close this out I don't have to tell people, cause I know that you'll kick someone's ass.
Speaker 1:Cause we grown air and you know what You're funny, cause you did say the advantage of being married to a black man in black countries.
Speaker 2:Everybody thinks you're a local.
Speaker 1:Yeah, even Rashidi at the bar was like man, until you talk, man, I was like who is this new? Who is this new? Who is this new guy here? But yeah, I always immediately make friends. And even Tony, I think there was a couple of the black guy there.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:But even Tony, you know, we, we, we made instant friends with so many, with so many people and everybody. There was genuine yeah, absolutely so.
Speaker 2:I think, all in all, the most important message from this is just that relaxation is essential, unplugging, disconnecting essential and just being with yourself and, you know, being with your partner. I think it was such a great benefit to our relationship. I mean we had a good laugh talking about how far our relationship has come. But then it also made me think. Like you know, we kind of got word that a couple of our friends here in our neighborhood are not together anymore and I thought, like you know, relationships are fixable Right, and we can do a whole episode on that, but relationships are fixable but both people have to be willing to participate in the work. And you know, I did say to you on vacation one day, remember. I said to you like oh my God, like look how far our relationship has come. And you started laughing because you said I thought of the same thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I thought of the same thing and, to be transparent, even though this was 99.99999.5% of a good trip, we did have a little bit of a blow up one day going to the beach, because Lindsay and I have to respect and as I think about it and I've had other conversations, and it's not because other men have said it- I know why you're saying that, because it was all other men, that said it.
Speaker 1:And now you have to put that disclaimer out there even though it's not true, Because I am a good driver, I have driven for a living but we there was one day where we went to the beach that I got activated because the whole time Lindsay was, ah, I can't, I can't, I'm, I'm not a. I'm not good with people who backseat drive me, but I do understand from having conversations with other people. And then I'm thinking about how you are very spatially aware I was very you're good at puzzles. I am not I'm sure I was. I was driving with you in the car the other day and I was like let me be Lindsay and Barbados and look at the side of the road and you didn't even tell me that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I just was like you were watching, right, and I was like, oh okay, this can be a freaky experience and it wasn't because other people did it, it's because I did what a good husband does and what my mom, mama Jean, says treat your wife like yourself, right. And so when you were drove me to white planes, I was like, let me be Lindsay and see what she sees and the way she sees it and how she sees it. So it wasn't the conversation with Tony, it wasn't the conversation with Dom, it was me in that moment, internalizing and channeling you Right. And to co-sign on your point, one of the good things about vacation, if you love one another, is it is 10 days of bliss with my wife, right.
Speaker 2:Well, you were pretty rude that day at the beach now that you brought it up. But the issue is not even that, Because here if you go off the road a little bit, you go off the road a little bit. You go off the road, but there, if you go off the road a little bit, you lose the car in a three-foot rain ditch and then I die and you're just sitting there and the car is going to go on its side. You know that right, it was never going to happen though, right.
Speaker 2:But. But that's, that is the. That is the truth in the matter. Right Is that? You know it. It's, and I think, also right. When you drive here, I don't worry about what's going on outside, because that's the normal side of the road to drive on to me. So for me, it's just the difference. By the end of the trip I was actually fine.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Because I just stopped because you were so mean to me. That day at the beach I cried a little bit and it was you were very mean, you're very mean. I love you very much, but you are very mean I'm.
Speaker 1:I love you very much, but you are so well. I realized. I realized I was activated. Yeah, I realized listen.
Speaker 2:Yeah and then I told you when we came home that I, for a little bit I didn't even like you that's okay.
Speaker 1:It made me laugh. I know it did.
Speaker 2:I said I didn't even like you a little bit. I wish I did.
Speaker 1:I wish I'd known I. Well, I did stay up and play, I watched start. Well, during that moment that you didn't like me, I got to catch up on all my TV shows. So sometimes a little bit of an argument. I tell this to my clients too. So that messed up your day how? Because she wasn't talking to you Like you got to do other things. But I love you very much and I'm sorry. This is an on-air apology for our millions, thousands.
Speaker 2:And I'm sorry that I didn't like you for a few minutes. That's okay, but it changed.
Speaker 1:It changed. I got to watch it. No, and it did.
Speaker 2:And that's the truth, right, because and we were talking about this today too, and we'll do a whole episode on this but we were talking about this with our friends, right, it's like you don't always have to be right and I said to you that day, when you were so nasty to me, is that like I knew it was me? It was like my own activated nervous system. And I said to her you like, you don't know what it's like to sit on this side, and because it's either a rain gully or like a 12 inch curb, so it's like if you hit either one, the rental car is done.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I got right either one, it doesn't matter, and it's like the only time I feel safe is when you're going up those crazy mountain roads, which is flat.
Speaker 1:But. But here's the thing. And if you guys are thinking, because we talked to our friend Dom last night, he was talking about that he won't drive outside of the country.
Speaker 2:And it's not like.
Speaker 1:Italy, right, and he's talking about Italy. And it's not like even Tortola, the British Virgin Islands, where you're driving up hills, that you will go off the side of a cliff. Right, tortola, there are turns and Dominic was talking about it in Italy, too, where there are turns on a mountain and a tour bus is coming down, and you were like what am I supposed to drive off this cliff? Right now? Barbados, the infrastructure there is great.
Speaker 1:Do you know, in most places, except for that one crazy back road to the beach that we took that day but the infrastructure compared to the bronx, I would say barbados, potholes, the to the bronx, new york ratio potholes, barbados, uh, the new york wins and it's in that, in that new york has hundreds of potholes that destroy you and not to mention right barbados has what's called the dollar bus, where you pay the one Barbados dollar which is like 50 cents US, and it's this crazy yellow bus.
Speaker 1:Remember the guy like it was a couple of them on the highway. The bus didn't even stop.
Speaker 2:It doesn't even stop, but you pay 50 cents US right, so a dollar Barbados coin and you get in this bus and it will take you anywhere on the island. But it's not bus stops because it's called the dollar bus. So they do have the formal bus system that has real stops. But then they have this dollar bus and you just jump on and jump off and when I say jump off, that thing doesn't even stop the door opens and people come like jumping out and then the thing doesn't even.
Speaker 2:it just slows down to like a roll and they jump out and then it just keeps flying along. They come at you at full speed around curves. You're just like I don't even know, and I think that's what those other folks took at the hotel.
Speaker 1:It was like that was a wild ride, yeah.
Speaker 2:Right, and so I mean that's like where your fear is Right. But I wouldn't be scared in that, because I'd be like, oh, the driver does this every day, all day. But I'm scared when you drive. I know you're a safe driver and I will say it right here, right now we have never had a problem, except for that incident in Tortola where we had the accident, but that was but he hit me.
Speaker 2:Well, sort of. But anyway, I think it's just you know when you go away, you just have to be aware of your surroundings, you have to know what you're getting into and you just have to have a little bit of a knowledge, which you can get from Google. Yeah, yeah, right, I mean, if you Google, it'll tell you where is safe and where is not safe, because this department of state right For New York and for the country they tell you where is safe to go and where is not safe to go.
Speaker 1:As an American, yeah, and that's something I was going to say in the, in the safety portion of it. Uh, I think I hope he's okay, but, like there's a YouTuber your favorite Arab who went to Haiti for some reason, um, and immediately promptly got kidnapped Um, you know, being in the hotel by yourself as he posted his last YouTube video was like oh man, we're in this amazing luxury hotel, but because the country is closed to most people except for me, I'm going to enjoy it, and the next day he got kidnapped. The State Department does have travel advisories, right, and what's funny is, for many countries, the United States is listed as like a level two, which is like travel with caution.
Speaker 2:But I always say to you we live in the Bronx right. Bronx is like one of the poorest and probably most dangerous places in the country. It doesn't scare me like it does to go to these other places, maybe because of familiarity of it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, but the most. But make sure that you research and you and you try and you understand where you're going before you get there. Make sure that you research and you and you try and you understand where you're going before you get there. I'm going to close this, this, the show, out with this and I want to give Lindsay you are the travel expert. I think, when we finally get out of here, that you are going to finally start Lindsay's travel agency.
Speaker 2:No, because I'm about to buy a house in Barbados and I told you you can either come or not.
Speaker 1:But what are some recommendations I'm going to come, what are some recommendations based on your experiences, what are some recommendations you can give to first time travelers to Barbados, to Guadalupe, to the British Virgin Islands or to anywhere that you've been to?
Speaker 2:Well, the biggest thing is number one do your research Right. Find out like, where on the island is safe, where might not be as safe, and also what? What are you looking for? Right? There's a. I think the Americans who go to Barbados go to sandals. I would never, you couldn't, you couldn't get me into sandals If you put a gun to my head. I would never stay at one of those places. I can't stand them, you know.
Speaker 2:Look for the local experience, right, and if it's safe, go for it Right. I mean, that's that's the whole point of going away is to expose yourself to the culture you know that is there and to expose yourself to the local people. And you know that's one of the things I think that we both agree on with going to Barbados, and even when we were in Guadalupe as well is that you meet the people and the people are friendly. The cuisine is authenticados. And even when we were in Guadalupe as well, is that you meet the people and the people are friendly. The cuisine is authentic. Right, In Barbados, it's not burgers and fries right.
Speaker 2:When we go to Tortola and I love Tortola, you know that is one of my favorite places on the planet, but Tortola is very Americanized. Now, when you go out for dinner in Barbados, like there is no burger and fries, there's no chicken nuggets on a menu for kids, it is like local, you know. So, look for the experience that you want, right, if you want an American experience in the Caribbean, then go to Sandals or go somewhere that you can get a burger and fries, right. But if that's not what you want, then, like, look for the experience that you want to have Cause there were.
Speaker 1:there were some interesting things. They had the banana soup, which I've never had before oh yeah, we had a baby banana soup.
Speaker 2:That was very good.
Speaker 1:There was the pickled banana salad.
Speaker 1:Oh, and remember that pickled corn salad the pickled corn and these are all things that, if you are. We talked about our friends that live here on the island who didn't even barely like the vegan place we talked about and I know dad watches, listens to the show so we talked about. We talked about dad and you're like dad would never eat this, um. But uh, you know he could go get his egg. You know he could go get his eggs scrambled in the morning with his bacon and sausage. But yeah, that is part of uh of it is understanding Don't go someplace that you're going to not eat the food right, I would definitely, oh, absolutely we.
Speaker 2:Our place was very British, though, so it was like beans on toast for breakfast, you remember, and like I think you had some like fish mash for breakfast or something like, but I pretty much ate like beans and mushrooms on toast every day for a week.
Speaker 1:And then, and once again, like I said, and as we wrap up this, uh, the whole episode, um, what are some guides or what are some like? So, when you go to the British Virgin Islands, and oftentimes many of our friends ask us like how do you find these amazing places or how do you find these deals? Uh, what are some guides or or some resources that folks can use if they want to go to the BVIs, if they want to go to Guadalupe or if they want to go to the Barbados?
Speaker 2:Well, back in the day, it was like Fromers and Fromers and Fodor's, and remember when I met you, I would show you the Fodor's book. You would go and buy the new issue of, like the 2024 Caribbean guide. Right now, I mean, everything is on Google. The other place that I find really interesting things is if you look for people who have gone there online. I mean, that's the biggest resource right now, right, is I Google often about places, and that's how, in Barbados, I found this hotel we stayed at because I Googled.
Speaker 2:I like boutique hotels, I want really good service, so I Google for that, and then I Google places with local food or vegan options. Um, barbados is kind of like a world in itself because of the like. I've never had breadfruit gnocchi in my life, but I've gone all over the Caribbean and breadfruit is very common in the Caribbean, right? There was also a place I was telling you about that has breadfruit bowls, right, where they scoop out the seeds and they like, cook the breadfruit in the actual shell and then fill it up with curries and things, right, and so it's just like you have to know what you want and look for it.
Speaker 2:For me, I want a local experience, and so that's what I look for. Yeah, but if you want to go somewhere, I mean you could go to Jamaica or the Dominican Republic if you want you know Americanized foods and you can go to like. When I went to Jamaica, they had like a hibachi place, a Mexican place, a sushi place at the hotel, a steakhouse. That's not what I'm looking for when I go on vacation, but I'm an adventurous eater and I love to try local things. And also in the Caribbean, for me there's a lot. There's like a big, very, very big, like Rastafarian influence, and most of the Rastafarians are vegan, right. So I find that the local spots have more for me than you know, kind of the you know bigger establishments that are catering to the tourists.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's. That's a hundred percent true. Um, with that being said, this is I think this is another one in the can. This has been Cleveland.
Speaker 2:And this is Lindsay.
Speaker 1:And this has been the uh, another episode of the devil. You don't know if you liked what you heard. Please tell your friends and your family, subscribe to us and rate and review us on iTunes or Spotify or whatever platform.
Speaker 2:You are listening to us on, and if you want to go to Barbados, you can go to the Sugarcane Club Resort and Spa.
Speaker 1:And if you have any questions, email us at gettoknowthedevil at gmailcom. Bye.