melanie & kevin miller: “transplanted: in-between the waiting & leaps of faith”

my very FIRST "bouquet episode!" 💐 
(the idea being inspired by kevin, my brother in law, who makes up 1/2 of this episodes' guests!)

trust me when i say that it has always been a dream to have these two on this podcast...at the time i started this project, my sister and brother in law, melanie & kevin, were still living in germany waiting oh so patiently for kevin's green card to go through...a process that from the time they were married, would be a total of 26 months. it. felt. like. FOREVER. in this episode, naturally, we forage (wink) the goodness on the trail of their relationship: from a conversation i had with melanie in a parking lot about a german guy she met online who wanted to visit (a protective older brother's worst nightmare lol 👀), how a worldwide pandemic couldn't keep them a part (i mean, c'mon! perfect romcom material, right?), to them leaving their home just miles away from the black forest to settling in & finding new rhythms here in the states since arriving in early 2024…all that to say, dream fulfilled!

a note: i have spoken with sooooo many friends recently who are waiting on something...a breakthrough, a change (in job, a relationship, etc.), a dream. if that's you, take hope. 💛

Transcript

will 0:24

Hey, welcome to the Wildflowers podcast. Every episode that I do is special, but this one is extra special. This one is my first bouquet episode, which is an idea that I absolutely love, and it came to me literally from one of the guests tonight, which is my brother-in-law, Kevin. And then I've got my sister, his wife, on. Melamine, or whatever the typo of my notes said. Melanie. And I just so excited to have these guys on. This has actually been like a big dream ever since starting the podcast to have them on. But like due to the fact that they were both in Germany this time last year, that wasn't super possible. So this is a a lot of things all coming together to make this happen tonight. So welcome, Melanie and Kevin.

melanie 1:18

Yeah, thank you for having us on. My mother-son.

will 1:21

Mother. His father-daughter. And then Kevin, um, you know, well uh sister sister spouse. No, we could do better.

melanie 1:37

Sound like brother. Brother. Or sister wife.

will 1:40

Um brother-in-law already sounds kind of weird, anyways.

melanie 1:44

Already very removed.

will 1:45

Uh-huh. Exactly. Um, so how I know these two, I mean, obviously Melanie's my sister, known her since late 90s. Um and Kevin came into her life in what year was that?

melanie 2:00

2016.

will 2:01

16? Okay, wow. Okay. So it's been a second.

melanie/kevin 2:04

It's been eight years this year.

will 2:07

That's awesome.

melanie/kevin 2:08

This year. Yeah, that's true.

will 2:10

Okay, yeah. Okay. Um, and then I remember hearing about Kevin in like 2018. Yeah. End of 2018. Um, and I'll tell that story real quick because I just I love it. Um, we finished at work one night, and like I just like looked to my right, and Melanie was standing outside of my door. And like, oh, hey Mel, and she goes, Um, so have I told you about Kevin? And obviously, the last person that's gonna come to mind hearing, you know, Kevin is a German guy, you know, just with a name like Kevin, you know, of course. But um, but you know, lo and behold, on the other side of Kevin was Kevin.

melanie 2:51

And Kevin All Known Love today.

will 2:54

Yeah, exactly. So she goes, like, I what was that? Have I told you about Kevin? Like, no. Did you tell I was nervous? Yeah, for sure. But good job, very, very courageous. Um, no, I don't know who's that. And she's like, Well, that's the guy I've been talking to online, you know. And all the other older brother instincts had it kicking in at this point, like, okay, tell me more. And like, I think it one part that's really cool though, too, about your story is like you hadn't really dated much. And so it was just like all of a sudden there's a guy, but he's like all the way over in Germany. In Germany, yeah.

melanie 3:30

And then he's here, like visiting, like, and by then we were already friends for two years. And like that's um like one of my favorite things about our story, but you probably want to No, no, no, yeah, go ahead. It's just like that we built our friendship for so long.

will 3:45

Yeah.

melanie 3:46

Before we could even like consider dating. I definitely thought it was cute from like the start.

will 3:51

Yeah, totally, right? But it's like a profile pick on his OnlyFans or something, right?

melanie 3:55

Or was it uh yeah, exactly.

will 3:57

It's like like a it was like a a mobile game or something, right?

melanie 4:01

It was like a random chat app where you got matched up and I had gone to find someone with a similar interest, I think, and I think you had faith and I had faith. And in like our bio, and that's what matched us. But that app was notorious for randomly disconnecting and stuff, so it was cool that we got each other's like WhatsApp info. Um, and then started becoming friends.

unknown 4:30

Yeah.

will 4:30

That's so cool, actually. And so it would just pair you up with a person, basically. Like this person has common interests, and so oh that's so cool.

kevin 4:39

And it's without uh photos or without videos or anything, like you really just have this icon.

melanie/kevin 4:46

Age, name and bio, I think. Yeah.

will 4:48

And kind of like a pen pal thing, and you just kinda start talking back and forth. Yeah. Okay. Oh, it's so cool. Okay.

kevin 4:54

And it could be literally everyone, you know, or anyone. Oh, sure.

melanie 4:57

We made jokes for a long time before we ever met, like um so are you a 56-year-old truck driver?

will 5:04

Yeah. Because I know we've known people who've had that situation. Yeah.

melanie 5:08

But I had the instinct to like, that's a video call. Are you working a video call? Yeah. Especially because some of the pictures were really cute. I was like, are you just like some random woman who has like pictures of this cute young German guy?

will 5:23

So you could have sent like your little brother to like have the conversation at first or something.

melanie 5:28

Exactly.

will 5:29

I'm actually eight.

kevin 5:31

Yeah. It's when you told Will when he asked if I'm a love interest or so.

melanie 5:36

I think shortly there was a lot of.

will 5:40

About hearing like the connection of like who I was and everything. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's hilarious. Okay.

kevin 5:44

And then she told me that you asked that.

will 5:46

Okay, totally. I think everyone was, of course, wondering that, like, with you coming all this way. Yeah. Like, but it's cool. Yeah, yeah, totally.

melanie 5:56

Kind of. It's definitely uh not the story I would have necessarily chosen for myself.

will 6:02

No, sure.

melanie 6:03

And uh I'm humbled by it, but I'm also so happy that it's like our story and think it's really cool, like all the things that could have gone wrong, or like even the fact that we could have just been disconnected or whatever, and then we became like a best friend. Um, and then got to the point where we were wanting to date and everything was really cool. Because yeah, like you said, I wasn't dating super much. He actually had a girlfriend for a little bit when we were first becoming friends.

will 6:31

Okay, and talking then on Okay. Yeah. So you had a girlfriend.

melanie 6:35

So it was like truly a friendship, right? No, yeah. It was like half a year later or so. Yeah.

will 6:40

Okay. But you kinda you kept talking even through all of that. Yeah. Cool. Okay.

melanie 6:44

I think I offered to be like bow out a little bit. I'm glad that I think we talked less for sure then. But I'm glad that you didn't like say bye then.

will 6:53

No, sure.

melanie 6:54

Like, yeah, I have a girlfriend, I'm gone.

will 6:56

Right. Yeah. Can't s the the lines are still open enough that that's so cool though.

melanie 7:00

I was bumped.

will 7:02

Right. Yeah. Because that's months in, right? Yeah. Like, okay.

melanie 7:07

Yeah.

kevin 7:07

Which at this point I still saw us more as friends than you probably did.

melanie 7:12

Oh yeah, definitely. Oh sure.

kevin 7:14

And I was less interested in more than friendship.

melanie 7:17

Trying to figure out what would happen when I told my family that I was talking to a guy online.

will 7:22

Yeah, right.

melanie 7:24

Like I felt like it could have gone many different ways.

will 7:26

For sure. I feel like with that being said, everyone responded veryone is really receptive to it, aren't they?

melanie 7:32

Oh yeah.

will 7:32

I probably look a little bit excited. Like oh cool, okay. Yeah.

melanie 7:37

Much better than the scenarios I imagined. Yeah, totally, right. Yeah. Probably my own. It's just like calm my nervous system.

will 7:51

So, um, well that's that's a neat real that's a really neat story. I mean, I think that kind of sitting on this part of your story though is important too, because like that's how you met? Mm-hmm. I mean that's a question you know that like one day like kids are probably gonna ask you, or you know, people ask you like, how did you guys actually meet? And so like so you talked for at least two to three years then. Or it would have been about two-ish years.

kevin 8:16

Pretty much three years before we met in person.

melanie 8:19

Is that what you're gonna say? Yeah, right. Before we met? Yeah, so we don't remember the act exact date we like met, but I think we said we'll call it what? May 15th. 15th or whatever. Like we just because I definitely remember still being in high school, but near the end.

will 8:35

Yeah.

melanie/kevin 8:36

Um I think I knew you before your birthday. Like short before.

will 8:45

Okay.

melanie 8:45

Um, so then he came in May May 13th. Twenty nineteen. Of twenty nineteen. Yeah. The day before his birthday. Yeah, right. Day after Mother's Day, I think.

will 8:57

Yeah, no, that's right, yeah.

melanie 8:58

So it was like yeah, three years of friendship when we actually met for the first time in person.

will 9:04

Okay, oh that's cool. I I feel like actually I didn't know you had a girlfriend for a little while and stuff like that, so some of this is new to me. Oh, that's funny. Um yeah, but like, okay, so then if you've got like an ongoing conversation, and then at what point for you guys is it like, oh, there's actually maybe a thing here? Like, is you it sounds like you know, it's like, oh, this guy's cute. Like, that was always kind of like down there, like maybe something here. So maybe when did it click for you, Kevin?

kevin 9:37

Um I definitely don't remember it exactly. I think it's probably like around somewhere 18 or so. Maybe 2018. Um maybe the end of 2017 and 2018, where it just started developing more and like actually considering like okay, how would that even work? Right. Long distance relationship and then in the future someone has to move. Right, yeah, somehow. Um and then I think by the end of 2018 we started talking about visiting, but by then Mel hasn't even told you guys about me yet. Okay, right.

melanie 10:19

I'm not sure. That new year or something. Or that idea was talked about.

will 10:23

I remember hearing something about that.

melanie 10:25

Yeah.

will 10:26

And you were you like, I haven't even told my family about you. Yeah. Yeah.

kevin 10:30

It was like it kinda has to happen before I come back.

melanie 10:32

That was a conversation a lot of the time. Okay. Like, I don't think you understood my hesitation, which I don't understand my hesitation either, like now.

will 10:43

Sure.

melanie 10:44

But I can also understand it.

will 10:45

No, right. No, I I mean that's funny. I mean, here we are, probably all like like dad and your brothers, like with taken, like playing in our mind constantly. So like you know, Melanie wants to go over to Germany and hang out with this guy she met online, or vice versa. Yes. That's a hard conversation to have, you know. Definitely.

melanie 11:05

So reasonably, so yeah.

will 11:07

Yeah, again, good job actually doing that.

kevin 11:10

And then I think I didn't I didn't really have um much contact with the rest of her family till I actually came here. Yeah.

melanie 11:18

Yeah, I think like a little sibling would like jump on the calls.

kevin 11:21

Ethan or so.

melanie 11:22

They came on the calls, yeah. Okay. A couple different times in the video calls.

will 11:26

Because everyone who was at home might have just been like oh hey around. Yeah. Yeah, okay.

melanie/kevin 11:30

Yeah, and you still live with them.

melanie 11:32

Yeah.

will 11:32

Yeah.

melanie 11:33

Yeah.

will 11:34

That's cool. Okay.

melanie 11:35

So then we met. Should I tell like the whole or should we tell like the whole layout till now or kind of walk through that?

will 11:45

Well, that's actually no, I I love that. We'll keep going with that. We'll shift into like more of the like wildflowers part of like, you know, just for you two as like individuals before we really jump into the story, maybe much more, but like that helps. I mean, just know like that's how you met.

melanie 12:02

Yeah.

will 12:02

So that's how you're here right now on this couch in the studio in the United States, you know.

melanie 12:07

Definitely.

will 12:07

Um, but we'll jump into like um, you know, re you know, recognizing how I know you have gotten connected to which we've done. Um just say quickly, because um this was a really important part that I wrote down, but like um Melnia was like or has been like longtime music collaborator. You know, that's a big part of like I think our friendship, relationship, you know. On top of being siblings, of course, but where it's just like something that's really like tied us together. Like it still remember I think you were literally the one that like encouraged me, like you should really get back into like playing some guitar or something like that. And then like all of my music stuff basically has been born out of that encouragement. So that's awesome. Like that's a cool thing for sure to like recognize about you, and like you know, of course, like you know, living in the same house with other people doesn't mean you're gonna be friends necessarily, right? You know, yeah, but like I feel like somehow we were able to actually like maintain friendship through all that too, and like I just remember like going in like just different evenings with like spend half the night like laying on your floor, just like having a conversation and just talking about things for like hours and hours, and like that's always been a really special part, and so then I think though too, like you not really dating, and then a Kevin coming on the scene has just been like this is awesome, like this is such a good fit. Um, and like knowing you two is like a peacemaker type, and then you get a Kevin in your life who's just like very calm, um you know, by all appearances that I've seen, you know.

melanie 13:41

Right now I can be wild, such things.

will 13:44

Yeah, yeah, exactly. The guy who just like slayed deer. Yeah, yeah. So that's kind of what we've got. Yeah, exactly. Uh Kevin the hunter. But um, but no, just recognizing you two as like wildflowers, individuals, but like of course, first bokeh episode, which is super cool because it's like you two as individuals, super unique, super gifted, coming together though, as one. Um, which of course that makes this a really unique episode. But like so I kind of want to ask my typical question of like blooming versus wilting, like what makes you feel like you're blooming, what makes you feel like you're wilting? And maybe maybe as an individual you could answer that question, but then maybe take it a direction of like what makes you feel like as a pair, like you know, we're doing well together um when we're in this state, or so on and so forth, you know. So I'll turn that over to you.

melanie/kevin 14:36

But you want to oh okay, ladies first.

will 14:40

Yeah, okay a gentleman.

melanie 14:42

Yes, thank you. So kind of lady.

will 14:45

He does a little head bow.

melanie 14:47

You didn't see it, but you're just listening, so um no, that's a that's a good deep question. But I think Thank you. When I feel like I'm wilting, it's like um I don't know, I put myself in this state a lot, probably unnecessarily, where it's like just feeling the need to like rush through things and like get stuff done and be productive. And I'm I might get a lot of stuff done in that time. But the way in which it's done and how I feel afterwards leaves me feeling pretty drained.

will 15:21

Yeah.

melanie 15:22

Um and I have to remember like that's not the point of life necessarily, just getting things done and being productive. Um, so I'd say like that's my main place where I feel like I'm wilting and like I'm not living up to my potential. Um there are definitely more scenarios, but that's the biggest one that I find myself in regularly. Like by my own doing, probably.

will 15:49

No, sure.

melanie 15:49

Like mentally, I don't know if it's just like the pressure of the world to just like produce and be and be tired and you know. Um but then as far as like thriving goes, I would say that's where I feel like I can like stop and take a deep breath and do things, even like the simple stuff, like dishes, like mindfully um and like fully present in aware, and it just makes life a lot more enjoyable. Like even like I said, like chores and stuff like that. Yeah, um the next level would be like on a walk. Like we went on on a walk yesterday, we were just looking at like the ground a lot, and like spotting little mushrooms, little acorns, like little wildlife, and that's definitely where I feel like a lot of peace and like the world is a really cool place to be. Yes. And like just kind of small in the best way possible. Like there's a lot more going on around than like what I've gotten done or whatever.

will 16:53

Yeah, okay. Oh, I like that.

melanie 16:55

Just kind of enjoying the nature.

will 16:57

More like being a part of the world than needing to be like the focal point of like everything or your checklist or your Yeah. Yeah, and that's cool.

melanie 17:05

And the nervous system is in check. Yeah. Way more than the other um state, so Yes. Yeah. And then being with people, conversation. Like my work right now. I love like that it's the evening time when people want to come chat, relax, and I can be the person that's chatting with them and stuff. So like having good conversations, meeting new people, learning new stuff.

will 17:30

Yes. So yeah, Melanie's working at a local coffee shop, and like it's been one of our favorite things though too, because it's like we can bop in there, you know, once a week and just hang out with you for a little bit. Um but like you know, I I love that you're saying all that too, because it sounds so very you, which of course I expected that. But like I think you've done a really good job of like you guys, especially as a couple, you know, to acknowledge that. But like you guys have inspired like Joy and I was just like taking like strides toward rest or mindfulness, I think is a really like accurate word for it. But that's something I think you've always brought to the table for me. Um and like and so it's just been cool seeing you two kind of hopefully embody it a lot most days. Yeah, well, just even like the sacredness of like protecting a Sunday. You know, I remember you texting me a couple years ago, um, not on a Sunday, being like we try to have like a no-phone day on Sundays, and like even just the mindfulness of putting that away for hours at a time. Right. For heck, even an hour would be like killer for most people's like just ability to be present.

melanie 18:39

That's so true.

will 18:40

You know, so you doing that's cool.

melanie 18:42

Yeah.

will 18:42

Yeah.

melanie 18:43

Definitely need to get back into that a little bit more.

will 18:45

No, sure.

melanie 18:46

Consistently.

will 18:47

Right. It's about it's a hard boundary to set, for sure.

melanie 18:50

Yep. There's a lot of good stuff on the phone too.

will 18:52

There is a lot of good stuff on the phone. Usually don't focus on that. Oh, I went to set up music and now I'm like deep diving, yeah. You know, whatever maybe whatever you're into like foraging or something.

melanie/kevin 19:02

Exactly. I don't feel so restful now.

melanie 19:05

No.

melanie/kevin 19:06

You've had time to think.

will 19:08

Yeah, how about you can?

kevin 19:09

I don't know.

melanie 19:10

You're focusing on me.

will 19:12

He was listening really well.

melanie 19:14

Yeah.

kevin 19:14

I think uh having introvert characteristics, I definitely will when I'm around people that I like have no reason to be around. Sure. Like I I don't mind being in a giant room for work purposes or so, full of people, you know, like I don't care. But going to a big event full of people where I don't have to be, because I'm getting paid for it or so, is like really uncomfortable for me. And then especially when the people are just not my kind of people.

will 19:50

Yeah, that makes sense.

kevin 19:51

It's I don't know if I can even define that, but like we um this is like very, very Broad, but we met a lot of German people in Germany that have sticks up their butt. Well it's poking on the brain. And so those were people who were around there just like draining you. You know.

will 20:13

Um sticks and butts is okay.

kevin 20:15

Yeah. And so yeah. Yeah. I think that. And just like having, you know, if you like I love to work, I love to create, but if for whatever reason I have work that I don't really enjoy, or that's just dumb, or there's feels useless maybe. Not useless necessarily, but like For example, when you're new to something and you get trained, but you don't learn why you do things, you just learn that you do things. Kind of like I know what you're saying. You just don't have purpose, I guess. Right. And that's uh I think is where I willed. And then on the other hand, blooming is when I, you know, can get creative when I can do some carpentry or hunting or do the stuff I love, like tactical stuff like training, shooting, whatever. Yeah. Stuff like that. Um being around my family and my dogs.

melanie 21:13

Mm-hmm.

kevin 21:14

Um, yeah.

will 21:17

I mean, that's one thing that's cool is like the vibes of both of you match really well, where it's like I think both of you have wanted to like live in the country, have a little space where you can have the dog, dogs, um, the ducks, and just have kind of like a you know, I don't want to say farm, because that's not necessarily like a homestead, yeah. Exactly. That's that's a great word.

kevin 21:40

I think that is why I thrive so much here, because yeah, you know, beside the fact that we couldn't even afford to buy anything in Germany, but like you know, people come and complain if they don't like the color of your fence, and here I have a big deer hanging in my carport bleeding out, you know, it's kind of like no one cares, and if they would, it doesn't matter. Yeah, sure. You know, um so I definitely bloom under freedom. And yeah, it's funny because it sounds very cliche, sure, but a friend of mine who would love to live in the US too, from Germany, um described it one time like being in the US as kind of like taking a deep breath after being underwater. Um and like, you know, when you're underwater living in Germany and taking a deep breath being here. Um and that really is a good way to put it.

will 22:30

Oh, that's cool. I mean, I think that's a really helpful perspective though, too, for someone like myself or people who've grown up here who just maybe aren't grateful for a lot of those aspects. Yeah. Um so that that's cool to hear, I mean, from your perspective.

kevin 22:47

And of course that again is you know said very um superficial, like very broad, like places in the US that suck too, and places in Germany that are great. Yeah. It's not like that's not a thing. Yeah, I get what you're saying. But you know, out here in the countryside of Indiana and living in a pretty proper state. Um it's kind of my dream.

will 23:11

Yeah.

melanie 23:13

Yeah, it definitely made me appreciate stuff about good old Indiana.

will 23:17

Right.

melanie 23:18

People call boring a lot of times, like being in Germany and then coming back here and people just being friendly, willing to help out. Yeah. And kind of just minding their own business, but yeah, stepping in when they need to or to offer and like really highlighted like some awesome things about the the US and Indiana specifically.

will 23:40

That's cool. I always remember, but in 2019 when you came to visit, I just remember Kevin and I were sitting out somewhere, and like someone walked past and I like waved like hey. And like there was this moment of just like silence, and then Kevin looks over and he's like, in Germany, we would never do that.

melanie 24:03

Yeah. Like the little nods we do here and stuff. Yeah. Just acknowledging like your existence.

will 24:08

Exactly.

melanie 24:09

Much more rare. It still happened.

kevin 24:14

Definitely like when you're somewhere deep in Bavaria. Villages, yeah. Mountain village or so, you know, they greet a lot more. They're better friends.

will 24:20

A lot more personal, yeah.

melanie 24:24

It's kind of yeah.

will 24:26

Okay.

melanie 24:26

Yeah.

kevin 24:27

I feel like where we lived was like living in a not so nice part of Indy, maybe or so. Like not nice and how it looks, but like how the people are. Okay.

will 24:37

Yeah.

kevin 24:38

Yep. Or New York, or I mean I've never been to New York, but it's okay here.

will 24:43

Because you guys are in the city, basically, right?

kevin 24:45

Yeah, but it was a smaller city. It was probably like blue and just more popular.

melanie/kevin 24:51

Yeah. We were just at the border of it.

will 24:53

Okay, great. Oh, that's cool. I mean, and kind of naturally I think segued into answering like what that looks like for you guys together, and like I think homesteading, like a great word for that too. That's um obviously been a big thing for you guys, you know, since landing here, which is we'll get more into that later on, but like together homesteading has been like a really big part of blooming with each other, you know. For sure.

melanie 25:20

Yeah. I think like some of our or my favorite memories were like going on walks and foraging, letting Sammy run free. Like that's kind of where I feel really connected and like that's a hobby we share.

melanie/kevin 25:35

Oh, you mean where we bloom together? Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

melanie 25:38

Like that's a big one.

melanie/kevin 25:39

Yeah, outdoorsy activities.

melanie 25:43

Like we're on different schedules right now with our work, and the walk yesterday and like the time together was like very refreshing, yeah.

will 25:53

Yeah. You ever miss living right next to the black forest?

unknown 25:56

Yeah.

kevin 25:56

Definitely, yeah. That's a good thing about Germany. Like you can within three hours you have like a multitude of different sceneries and like really beautiful nature, and like actually like you know, hills and mountains, like you don't have that in Indiana at all. I guess when you go south you have a little bit more hills or so, but like the black forest was just an hour away, and you could actually do like hikes to I don't know, have a altitude difference of a couple hundred feet.

will 26:22

Oh yeah. That's so cool. Now you guys would send pictures sometimes, and it was like no wonder so many like folk tales and like stories were written about this place, because this is magical. And like terrifying to you know what were you gonna say?

kevin 26:38

Uh it like the history of the Black Forest is very um you know, like loaded with mythical legends and kind of magic. And I think they they tried to send missionaries to that area, how many hours hundred years ago? Um, and they just didn't adapt and like didn't pick it up. Wow. It's one of the areas that wasn't so well missionized.

will 27:05

That's interesting, yeah. Okay. Kind of there was a lot of resistance or something, maybe. Okay. They were leaving like little bread trails, like thumbs to like people. Exactly. Don't go into the candy house.

melanie/kevin 27:19

Yeah, that's what I think.

kevin 27:23

Um for wilting.

melanie/kevin 27:27

Oh, true, yeah. Yeah, for only blooming. No. No.

kevin 27:31

Um I think I I can tell that if Mel is struggling with something, it's affecting me a lot.

will 27:40

Okay.

kevin 27:41

Um for the reasons that I just want to make her feel better, but sometimes she just needs the time to deal with it. Right. And I want to fix it, you know, kind of like the man thinking, okay, let's how how can we fix that? Yep. And that's just hard for me. I'm not I wouldn't say that we will necessarily, but it's just like, well, we're definitely not blooming.

will 28:00

Right.

melanie 28:01

Um But I will say situations like that, and then we have like a hard conversation. Yeah. We feel like or like pretty much 99% of the time afterwards, it's like, okay, we feel way more like connected, on the same page. So it's like good that we had to go through that.

will 28:19

Yeah, that makes sense.

melanie 28:20

Almost, but of course it's not fun.

kevin 28:22

When we manage to make that leap like past whatever is causing okay, yes.

melanie 28:28

Usually gotta be like, okay, we're on the same team. Like I'm not I'm struggling, but I'm not struggling like because of you, kind of.

will 28:35

Like the more you communicate, yeah. That it's not a Kevin issue or something like that, maybe.

kevin 28:41

Like I think because of texting a long time before we even met and just building a friendship before we got into a relationship, we developed really good communication.

will 28:51

Yeah.

kevin 28:52

Um you know, not to jinx it, but we haven't had any like intense struggles, like just small things. Sure. And we can come to that back later where when we had a long distance relationship and we had little small things that was really hard because you know you couldn't see each other in person. Right. Um but ever since we were in person then um like I think we're doing pretty good about reminding ourselves that we're a team and we're not like against each other, but us against whatever it is. Um and then along with that we just agree about so many things like lifestyle, food I don't know, whatever is important in life, you know. Like we barely have any points where we have any conflict.

unknown 29:43

Yeah.

kevin 29:44

And if so, then it's kind of like okay, then that's your opinion and that's fine. But like that's not the point where there's a respect where I don't want to make it seem like we never like disagree though.

melanie 29:58

Because then there are people are there are people that are like if you don't ever fight or disagree, then you're like, is your relationship even good? And I'm like, we're just changing the d like description of fighting or like disagreeing. Like we still have our hard conversations, but we've like just came into our relationship in our marriage, like we're not gonna I'm not gonna yell at you or talk to you in a degrading way. Right. Because I just like I respect you so much in our relationship, and I don't want like this thing that's I don't know if that makes sense. It makes sense. Like I don't want to make it sound like we're all like perfect and we all we talk it all out and it's like we have it figured out, but it's like we just won't reach that level. Like that's a boundary we've set, like to not get to that point where we have to raise the voice, but it's like like we've I don't know if that makes sense.

will 30:47

It makes a lot of sense.

melanie 30:47

I wanna make it sound realistic.

will 30:49

Yeah, no, no, I appreciate that too, because I mean, and I know it's like what I'm hearing Kevin say is like when we do get into those moments, there's like there's something we're aiming for, and it is to like be at peace with each other again. Yeah, and like even though there might be something negative that maybe like one of you is feeling it's like that's not you, or if it was, yeah, let's have the hard conversation, and we will only benefit from the honesty of that. Yeah. And so, because do you ever feel just maybe like if there's something negative in external, internal, just even putting it out there is like, oh, it just feels better now that I've like a conversation like that the other night, like two nights ago. Okay, oh cool.

melanie 31:33

Like kind of about like worries we were having or so, and then even just like talking about it, not even necessarily having like, oh, that's the solution. Right. Just like voicing the concern is like, oh, we're actually on the same page. Like yeah, I was kind of thinking that too, but I thought I should seem very faithful and like but I don't have that worry, and it's like, but you're having it too, so okay. Yeah, that makes sense.

will 31:56

Like we're both worrying about the same thing, yeah.

melanie 31:59

Yeah, and kind of like, we're gonna be okay. Okay. Yeah, we're gonna be okay.

will 32:03

Like that's actually that's cool. Yeah, when that can happen.

melanie 32:06

Relieving, yeah.

will 32:07

Yeah.

melanie/kevin 32:08

But with the question, can you think of anything like off the spot where we're wilting as a couple?

melanie 32:16

I I would say right now it's challenging, like being on different schedules. Yeah. But I think we're we're making it work for sure. Like we have Sundays off together only right now.

will 32:29

Right.

melanie 32:29

Um But I think we both see that as temporary. I probably struggle a little bit more with it.

will 32:38

Um And that might also be like working nights winter. Yeah. Like I remember doing that years ago, and just like that puts you in a weird headspace, and so you might be feeling some of that too.

melanie/kevin 32:49

Definitely think so, yeah.

will 32:51

It can be a little bit of a struggle. Like you even mentioned the other day, like um, and I think it speaks into what you've already shared about the wilting part, but it's like when you wake up and you start your day, that's actually like your time off. Yeah. Or like you would normally have after work, kind of.

melanie/kevin 33:07

Yeah.

will 33:07

And so you have to kind of really like be careful not to be like, well, I'm working at home, then I'm going to work. Yep. And then I just go to sleep. Right, exactly. Yeah. Yep.

melanie 33:18

Yeah, definitely like the like my personal wilting thing, like where you just kind of get into like gotta produce, gotta get stuff done.

will 33:25

Yeah.

melanie 33:25

And then you're in that from morning to all night, and it's yeah.

will 33:29

Exhausting.

melanie 33:29

That's probably a big part of where that's coming from for me. Um, but yeah. It's challenging, but we hope that it's temporary and like yeah, I really enjoy my work currently. So that helps as well. There's a lot of cool people there. Yeah, absolutely. You guys come and visit often? Who comes and visits often?

will 33:50

Yeah, totally. Oh, I love it.

melanie 33:51

Yeah. Yeah, if that answered.

will 33:54

Oh, well 100%. Yeah, I know, absolutely. And of course, you know, even digging into it as individuals or a couple, it's not like let's find your weak spots or whatever, but it's just this like recognizing, I think, and that's the beauty of it though, too, is like, and you guys seem to be really on top of it, of just like this is where we are when we're thriving, and we know where we're at when we're wilting, you know, and so again, this being a unique episode in the sense that when you ask an individual that it's like it's just for that individual, but this is like answering for like a whole, you know, a whole couple, a whole you know, that's a whole new dynamic. So true. Great job, yeah. No, answering through that and like cool questions. Is that yeah, yeah, I think it's good to think through that stuff. And like you guys are the type of people who are already thinking about that kind of thing too.

melanie 34:45

So um it's tempting to ask you back, but I know that's it's not the start of the breaking the fourth wall. Someday it'll happen, yeah.

will 34:53

Exactly. My final Wildflowers podcast, I'll be like, and to finally interview myself, you know. No one asked how I was doing. What there what is it? Everybody's always like, Where's he at? They never ask how he is, yeah, or whatever, or something like that. Or I can't remember, I put your name, but no, that's funny. Uh no, yeah, so that's hilarious there. Um, so and we've already gone over like how you both met 2019. So I think where we kind of stopped was like Kevin's coming. Um, and you want to just like talk about maybe like what it was like experiencing meeting each other for the first time after so long. And then like for you though too, there was like the whole culture shock of like not only are you meeting a person that you know you've been talking to or friends with for like three years, you're also interested in them. You're coming over to a country you've never been to and meeting all of her insane family.

melanie 35:56

Like And I think you met like all the family.

will 36:00

Yeah, unintentionally.

melanie 36:02

Like not like it wasn't like I was like, I want him to meet everybody, but it was just like we had events happening where it was like meeting dad's extended side of the family. No, you're right, meeting moms, and it I think he made a joke at one point like why are you having me meet all these people? Like, what are you trying to do?

will 36:19

Like trying to get hitched, man. Yeah.

melanie 36:22

I want you to be approved by everyone.

will 36:24

You need grandma's blessing.

melanie 36:25

Yeah.

will 36:29

No, so no, you're curious. Just uh speaking into like that part of like first time here, what was it like for both of you? You know, you can flip-flop, you know, however you want to answer that.

melanie 36:40

You start though, because you were coming, you started your journey earlier.

will 36:45

Those cars.

kevin 36:47

It wasn't my first time flying in my life.

will 36:50

Okay.

kevin 36:50

And I actually love it.

will 36:52

Oh, it was your first time? Yeah. Oh, it's a little bit. Oh wow. So that was like so many first. Okay.

melanie 36:57

Um and like a nine hour to start, nine-hour flights.

will 37:00

Yeah.

kevin 37:01

Yeah. I mean, yeah, the whole travel day was pretty long. I think from leaving the door in Germany to entering here was probably twenty-six hours or so. I don't know.

will 37:11

Holy cow.

kevin 37:11

But it was that was really enjoyable and super exciting, of course. Right. Um, and then um, so from Frankfurt, Germany, there's no or from anywhere in the Europe in Europe, there's no direct flight to Indianapolis, even though it's claiming to be an international airport.

will 37:27

Okay.

kevin 37:28

Um, so I flew into Chicago.

melanie 37:31

Hasn't that changed now? Because Paris is direct to India, I think.

kevin 37:36

Well then it wasn't then.

melanie 37:37

That that's irrelevant, but yeah.

will 37:39

Sure, no, no. Yeah. Good job. That is interesting.

kevin 37:43

Uh yeah, but that would have been Paris, so I would have had to find a way to get to Paris.

unknown 37:46

Right.

kevin 37:47

Who wants to do that? Um and so Mel was there with Dave.

melanie 37:53

And Levi.

kevin 37:54

And Levi to pick me up in Chicago.

will 37:57

Okay. Yeah.

kevin 37:58

Um and, you know, you go through the steps, the immigration, and get your luggage and all that, and then the gates open, and then you try to find the people in the crowd of people there, and then there they were, and I don't I don't remember what you were wearing, but I remember very vividly how the gate was set up and you were standing there on the right side. And then Um, you know how when you come out of the door, like the sliding doors, then there's this little like fence that kind of like directs you either to the left or right, so you can't just walk out straight.

will 38:35

Yeah.

kevin 38:35

And so I walked to the right, and then this little fence was with a little gate that opened, and then Melanie was there, and we hugged, and it was pretty sweet, but then this crowd of people was coming behind me, so it was like, well, maybe we should step to the side.

melanie 38:46

I was like hugging him, and he was like, Maybe we should step to the side, and I was like, dude. The first time they can go around. No, I'm just kidding.

will 38:56

They're gonna have to suck it out, man. Yeah.

melanie 38:59

But you were wearing like a red plaid shirt and like sweatpants, and I was wearing a blue dress, just so you know.

will 39:04

Oh, nice, yeah.

kevin 39:06

Yeah, I I guess now that you say it, I remember from the album.

melanie 39:09

And I definitely remember like seeing some like older, creepy-looking people and be like, that's not him. And then he came through and I was like, okay, yeah. Perfect. Okay. Um offense. It's me, Kevin. No, I am a 56-year-old truck driver.

kevin 39:25

And I don't know if I ever talked to Dave before.

melanie 39:28

Or to be like, I'm pretty sure he met like everyone on video before, but like briefly, yeah.

kevin 39:32

But not really have conversations. So they picked us up there, and then we went to the dunes, and then home, and you know, like everything looked like Chicago Bell and Starbucks. Yeah, okay. Classics. Um it was like a three to four hour drive. Um probably a little bit longer with the little trip we made to the dunes.

will 39:50

Sure. So like even more traveling, basically.

kevin 39:53

Yeah. And yeah, at this point I was like, uh I feel like probably just arriving. And we were all like, Woohoo. And you know, everything looks like in the movies because most of the movies are made in the US. So everything's like, Oh, that's pretty cool and that's cool and that's cool and the street signs are green, not blue, and whatever on the highway. Right. Um and then we eventually got home and I met the rest of the immediate family. And I wouldn't say I had a culture shock, or at least not in a negative way. You know, like actually appreciated and joyed it all. Right. Um and then met the rest of you guys and it was pretty sweet and dinner together. We had dinner and we met the mom, mother-in-law. Um I think you guys came over too. I think Joy was dinner. Uh eight months pregnant or so.

will 40:51

Yeah, exactly. Um I guess I hadn't really thought too much about how much movies probably did represent a lot of what you're about to see. Yeah. To where it didn't feel like so shocking.

kevin 41:06

Like, even though most are probably made somewhere in California or so, but when you drive, I don't know, in 31 or so, yeah. It's just like this, you know, six-lane street with shops left and right. That's just like so maritime. Um, especially older movies, you know.

will 41:21

Yeah, exactly. Um I haven't necessarily said a GTA in Indianapolis, just yet.

kevin 41:26

But even that looks more like it.

melanie 41:28

The crime rates aren't high enough yet.

will 41:30

No, exactly yeah.

kevin 41:31

Um yeah, just like the overall uh impressions you get, like the style of houses here, the size of properties, you know, like the roads, the cars, like here in Indiana you see like every other car or every other vehicle is a pickup truck. Right. And in Germany you probably see one every two weeks or so.

will 41:54

Oh, it's so funny. Okay.

kevin 41:55

Um yeah, I but I just really like that all. I feel like especially now, but I always felt pretty drawn to it, I think.

will 42:04

Then you move here, and literally the first vehicle you can buy is a pickup truck. Yeah, there you go.

kevin 42:09

And get picked up in one.

will 42:11

Yeah, yeah.

kevin 42:13

But um I drifted off a little bit.

will 42:17

No, you get so that was like the whole trip back home. Um or here.

kevin 42:23

Yeah. And then um just jump in if you want to. Um yeah, and then we just started, you know, doing like day-to-day activities. I think you all guys had to work. Yeah, yeah. And so you would try to find times during your week where you would just join us. Totally. Um, and I remember that um in the young family it was this rule that they couldn't or shouldn't be alone with a um someone like the opposite sex, kind of. Yeah, like the boyfriend or whatever we were at this point. And so we always had someone along. Levi and I were most of the time. Um and that was it was okay or it was fine, I guess, but it was very different from how I grew up. Yeah. Um we did a double date with mom and dad too. Yeah, that was funny. That was really fun. Um so I guess that was actually most the mo uh the the biggest shock, kind of like the different family dynamics. Because I also grew up in a Christian household and you know went to church since I can remember. Right. And were a believer and all that, but just like the the human part of how everything plays out, yeah. How life is just lived. Um I think that was the biggest difference for me.

will 43:41

Yeah, that makes sense.

kevin 43:42

And it was a little weird at first. Yeah, because we had a situation where I just wanted to share something with Melanie, and then we went to a room, then Levi walked in and was like, that's kinda awkward. We never have time to get her. But at this point, Melanie hasn't even revealed to me yet that you guys have this kind of rule. Oh, sure. Okay. Yeah, because I remember why it was so weird to me.

melanie 44:02

No, I told you.

kevin 44:03

No. Anyway, she didn't.

melanie 44:05

Did the background check dad made you get not leaving?

kevin 44:08

That was that was later.

will 44:10

That was after, wasn't it?

kevin 44:11

Um that was after.

melanie 44:12

Oh, to tell me, oh yeah, true.

will 44:14

So when everyone was still sic that Melanie was like your green carn baby.

melanie 44:18

90% sure I told you about that, but anyway. She didn't.

will 44:23

Um so um back to wilting and talking through recording.

melanie 44:30

Yeah, to have a hard conversation now. Yeah, is it recording? Yeah.

will 44:34

Yeah, but it was just Yeah, that so that more the family dynamics it was a culture shock than even the United States.

kevin 44:41

Well, so we have to actually we have to rewind because the reason why I came here is um, you know, we were texting and becoming friends or really good friends, and kind of like talking about okay, is there potential for anything? Yeah. Um, and at this point there was a girl in my church who was who expressed, I guess, interest in me, and I liked her too, but I was like, hey, I actually already have this girl in the US setup to like it sound so nongealant.

melanie 45:11

To like you pin yourself in weird songs, right?

will 45:13

That's maybe the German way of expressing it.

kevin 45:15

Yeah, just blinding. But I told her that um I couldn't really like sign it. Move on with her or like even try to develop anything before I've met Melanie. That's kind of what I don't know if we agreed on that or if I just set it up for myself. Kind of like it wouldn't be fair to her, also especially because we already had the uh plans and like I think I even had the flights booked and stuff like that. Okay, right. Um which were really cheap back then, I think 600 euro there back. Anyway.

will 45:48

Um good old days. And so that was part of the potential of coming here was like, is there something here? Yeah.

kevin 45:56

And like we didn't really consider long distance uh dating or anything, but just to kind of like, you know, actually finally meet each other in person. And also, you know, for me, have a vacation at US, because I've never been there and I've never flown in general. Um so that's what brings us then to being together here and just doing like chill day-to-day activities and going out and shooting.

melanie/kevin 46:23

Yeah. Um and so on.

melanie 46:26

And then we by the time it was over, you asked my parents about dating. Yeah. Um so then we did we did long distance for how long?

kevin 46:39

So actually Dave said that he would thought would have thought it would have been weird if I wouldn't have asked him. He said something like this. Like, why would you even have come here, you know, kind of like um like so he you know before he saw the potential for that, I guess.

will 46:56

Okay, oh yeah, totally. Right. Uh well I think yeah, like I said earlier too, it was like everybody was kind of like Is this a thing here? Like and I think hopeful is a word for it too. Like Yeah, definitely. Yeah, and especially after getting to meet you too. I mean, it was like, you know, this could be a good fit. Of course, I think even uh it's hard to judge after even a couple weeks, honestly, but like you know, it was still just like and then that's what was cool too, is like out of that time of you coming here, like I think then like the individual relationships with family members and people that you met while you were here kind of sprung forth.

kevin 47:31

Yeah.

will 47:31

You know, from that time, which was cool. Um okay, so yeah, so what was that like having that conversation? Like getting into that point where it's like, okay, I've been here for two and a half, almost the three weeks, I'm getting ready to head home.

melanie 47:44

Yeah.

will 47:44

Have this conversation, like it sounds like that was kind of a big a big deal.

melanie 47:50

Yeah, I honestly don't remember the details super well.

will 47:53

No, sure. I mean you uh you got the blessing. Yeah, it's like sure.

melanie 47:58

And then it was kind of daunting at the same time because it was like he left two days later after that conversation or whatever.

will 48:04

Like this I remember, yeah, because we went to the dunes, I think. Like I ended up tagging along because Joy had a shoot, and I was like, well, I wanna go along for this. Um, but it was just me. Um and I think you guys have kind of shared, like, yeah, we got like the blessing.

melanie 48:20

Yeah.

will 48:21

And that was like, you know, that was really exciting. Yeah. Yeah.

melanie 48:26

But then those days were kind of hard actually. Like at the dunes, it was a little bit like I f I feel like I remember you being kind of mopey.

will 48:34

Getting ready to go back, yeah, it's sad. Yeah. I remember that. I remember being sad. Yeah. I remember feeling the sadness of the world. But goodbye. Yeah.

kevin 48:43

I kind of remember we had a hard conversation there about something.

melanie 48:47

Probably going into like long distance or whatever. Yeah.

will 48:51

Yeah, okay.

melanie 48:52

So then we basically kept our friendship slash relationship up and you know, like had the title long distance on it, but it honestly was like very challenging mentally to even like basically it led to us deciding to take that title off of it and going back to being friends. But we still liked each other. Yeah, okay. Or before Ethan and I went and visited him.

will 49:21

Yeah, end of twenty or beginning of twenty twenty.

melanie 49:23

Yeah, it was end of twenty nineteen, going into the new year.

will 49:26

Right.

melanie 49:27

Yeah. Um, but it's it's weird how much like that title put a pressure and like a challenge to it.

kevin 49:34

Um I think for me the most challenging thing was that even really minor conflicts, or yeah, not even conflicts, like just hard times or talks couldn't be resolved by just hugging each other. Like that resolves or has resolved for us uh so much for us. And yeah, and then you do a video chat and it's a six hour time difference, and then it's lagging, and it's like, what did you just say? And then she says it again louder, and then it you know only half of it comes through or so. Yes. And that made it especially hard.

will 50:08

Totally.

kevin 50:09

Yeah. So that was a lot. I think that was one of the main reasons why we're like we don't want to be in a position where we like like she said, have this pressure on us and don't have the tools to fix it. Right. You know.

will 50:24

Yeah.

kevin 50:26

Such as physical contact, as in hugging.

will 50:29

Right.

melanie 50:29

Or just like holding hands while talking about something hard like that, even already is like a release, I feel like.

will 50:36

It's crazy how much that resolves.

melanie 50:37

Yeah.

kevin 50:38

Like when you have a a hard conversation and you know, these moments where you just like don't talk for five minutes, but if you're on a video call, it's like, did you freeze? Yeah. Hello, are you still there? Are you sleeping?

will 50:50

Exactly.

melanie 50:52

So then yeah, Ethan and I visited and got to meet his family and basically the same kind of style, but in Germany.

will 50:59

Yeah, right.

melanie 51:00

Hanging out with um yeah, Ethan Raphael went along with us a lot, his little brother. Cool. Um and no, that was cool, and we didn't really decide to like start a long distance relationship again then.

kevin 51:19

But then it was kind of like mentally we were really reserved for each other. Yeah. Like we agreed to not, you know, even try to look for something else or so because we obviously loved each other, but we didn't want to put any title on it. Yeah. For like mental. Um, makes a lot of sense, I guess. Yeah.

will 51:36

Yeah, I I think that's cool. You guys actually kinda came to that conclusion on that. Like, let's just take this pressure off. Yeah. But like we can still just like care about each other. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I no, you're right. I do remember kind of talking through some of that with you too. Yeah. On this side of things, and like oh, yeah. That's hard.

melanie 51:53

It was freaking challenging. Yeah, and then little did we know when we left mid-January, Corona was coming.

unknown 52:01

Yeah.

melanie 52:02

Because he was apparently planning a surprise visit for April 2020. Right, yes.

will 52:07

Okay.

melanie 52:08

And someone told me about it, who wasn't supposed to. Mom.

will 52:15

You didn't have to say I knew. Oh, you knew, yeah. I could have just left it.

melanie 52:18

Um.

will 52:19

Love you, Mom.

melanie 52:20

So then it was kind of like I think it was before I even or we even knew that it wouldn't happen. She kind of told me about it.

melanie/kevin 52:29

Oh, okay.

will 52:30

So then you remember that. So then it was like doubly disappointing then when you're like it was a surprise show and you can't do it.

melanie 52:37

Covid killed it. No, I think she told me. She was like, he was gonna come visit you. Oh, yeah. Okay. And that's like I told you. I think that you shut you, yeah. That's weird. Sorry.

kevin 52:46

Anyway.

melanie 52:46

He was gonna come surprise you in April.

kevin 52:49

And March 13?

melanie 52:52

Yeah, is when it all shut down. Yeah.

kevin 52:54

Okay, yeah. Entry was uh locked.

unknown 52:58

Yeah.

will 52:58

Locked down. Crazy, that was almost five years ago.

melanie 53:01

Isn't that crazy?

will 53:02

Yes.

melanie 53:03

Ugh.

will 53:04

Okay. So you that's it was never real.

kevin 53:08

Yeah. All an illusion. Exactly. Podcast is getting flagged now.

will 53:12

Yeah. Exactly. Gonna get that uh Joe Rogan uh whatever he's got going on his.

melanie/kevin 53:19

Oh, what's he got going on? No, I'm just joking. He's got a lot going on.

will 53:23

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Are we going to be able to do that?

melanie 53:25

We're a conspiracy theorist now. That's what we are saying. I'm just uh I mean I have my tinfoil hat on.

will 53:30

Exactly. I thought that was for warmth.

melanie 53:32

Seriously, though.

will 53:33

Um no, no. This no, this is great. And so I mean, I think like it's cool. I mean, it makes it so cool to see you here now, especially knowing all of the struggle behind what it's taken to get here. Yeah. Um, you know.

melanie 53:49

Like a freaking worldwide pandemic. Yeah. Was a part of it. It's still kind of crazy to me. Yeah, oh exactly.

will 53:56

The airport's all just completely shut down. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Okay, so yeah, so you basically deal with that disappointment through all of 2020. Because you don't see him until It was 14 months. Yeah, which is insane.

melanie 54:10

It was crazy.

will 54:11

It was like January to the following March, right?

melanie 54:14

Yep.

will 54:14

Okay, so January 2020.

melanie 54:18

March March 2021 or something.

will 54:22

Okay, yeah. Okay.

melanie/kevin 54:23

Yeah, because we were two days short of three years.

melanie 54:27

Yeah, when we moved back, yeah.

kevin 54:29

Okay, oh right. That's right. So we eventually decided that we don't have a long distance relationship, but we want to be a person.

will 54:37

Yeah.

kevin 54:38

To see if out of that relationship potential there could be an actual like marriage potential, and then try to figure out ways how we could be in person, and it wasn't really an option for me to quit my job and try to come there. Um because generally it would have been harder to get there anyway than for her to come to Germany, and I, you know, had a really good position. Right. But I just wouldn't just quit on the chance of getting together. Yeah. Um there you go.

will 55:10

Yeah.

melanie 55:11

So then we like talked about it and I started looking for families to be an all-pair for, like the live and nanny, and then and real quick, this is where the whole crazy blessing starts basically. Of how details worked out.

kevin 55:26

Yeah, like oh yeah.

melanie 55:28

Help me remember them though, okay. Now you've like set me up. So we're connected with a family and we got along really well. And I was like learning German at the time because I had to take a test to be qualified for the opair visa there.

will 55:46

Um I don't mean to interrupt, but wasn't there cool stuff even with like the family where like he was a pilot and just so happened to be here in like Indianapolis like one of the weekends, so you got to meet the dad.

melanie 55:57

So yeah.

will 55:58

Right. Did I jump ahead? No, no, no, you're good. You're good. Okay.

melanie 56:01

I was I'm like going there, so that's nice.

will 56:03

Oh, okay, okay.

melanie 56:04

Um so basically I took the the German test in February. I don't remember. Um, and you actually you and Dad drove me there. Yeah, because we were going to a job. Yeah, you guys were going to a job, and I was going to the test. I was freaking nervous.

will 56:20

Totally.

melanie 56:20

Didn't find out if I passed for like weeks. For a long time. Right. Even this that that's crazy.

kevin 56:28

So you were in Germany, yeah.

melanie 56:30

Yeah. Hold on.

melanie/kevin 56:32

Oh.

melanie 56:34

So, still in the middle of corona, I try, we all go to the airport to send me off to move to Germany to try and date this guy. Um, at the check-in counter, they tell me it's impossible. Like, because if I would fly all the way to Germany and they would turn me back, it would be on the airline. Like, it would be their fault.

unknown 56:56

Right.

melanie 56:57

They would be liable. So we're like, okay, I think I'd had gotten the insurance because I think you kind of wondered if we kind of thought maybe there would be an issue.

will 57:07

Yeah.

melanie 57:08

So, but it still was really expensive. We rebooked the next for the next week. Way more expensive. Like double the price.

will 57:16

So short notice, right? Yeah. So okay.

melanie 57:18

And in that week was didn't we record even in that week? Probably a little bit.

will 57:23

It was crazy, yeah.

melanie 57:24

We recorded some stuff.

will 57:26

Yeah.

melanie 57:27

His um the au-pair, dad, was landing in Indianapolis, and we got to meet Molly and I went and met him in downtown. He's super cool. Um that was crazy. Like the chances of that.

will 57:42

Right. Like the comfort of just like, oh, I know the person I'm literally going to like live with.

melanie 57:47

Very helpful.

will 57:48

Yes.

melanie 57:48

Um, so then we tried again the next week, and they tried to say no to us, and we all just kind of stood there. Do you remember that? Oh, big thing. We were all just like looking at the guy, like, you gotta be kidding.

will 57:58

What are we doing here?

kevin 57:59

Also, within that week, though, param got a letter from the German Federal Police confirming that Melanie's good to enter.

melanie 58:06

Yeah, giving like saying Melanie I almost said Miller, Melanie Young is allowed to enter Germany at this time.

will 58:12

Yeah. Um real official.

melanie 58:16

Like, yeah.

will 58:17

But so that's when he was still trying to hold you up at the desk. It's like, dude, Germany's literally like accepting her. You're the problem if you don't take her. Like, yeah.

melanie 58:25

So he we finally are like, wait, can you like disconnect yourself from it? So you're literally just sending me to Chicago.

will 58:32

Right.

melanie 58:32

And they can't deny me their luggage in this situation. Yeah, seriously.

kevin 58:36

Because it was a different airline then, I think.

melanie 58:38

Yeah, because then it switched over to Luftanza.

will 58:40

Yeah. Which was the German airline. Exactly. Okay.

melanie 58:43

And then like after that, everything went so smoothly. There were like no questions asked at the Chicago airport. The border was really chill. I was like, did you forget a question?

will 58:53

Like, yeah, right.

melanie 58:54

Are we actually good?

will 58:55

Right.

melanie 58:56

Um sorry, I'm getting a little cold.

will 58:58

No, no, no, no.

melanie 58:59

So then I went and met the mom and everything, and we had really good chats and stuff. Um But I moved there without having my test results.

unknown 59:10

Oh, okay.

melanie 59:11

For for the German thing. So, like, if I didn't pass, it wouldn't I wouldn't have gotten the visa.

will 59:17

They've sent you home.

melanie 59:19

Yeah.

will 59:19

Okay.

melanie 59:20

I couldn't I couldn't have stayed that way at least.

will 59:22

No, right.

melanie 59:23

If we would have decided to get married or whatever, maybe I could have stayed. So I kind of forget about that.

kevin 59:28

I think you got it within like one or two weeks after getting there, because I remember going to the office real quick after and putting all your paperwork in for the visa.

melanie 59:38

Yeah.

kevin 59:39

Like within.

melanie 59:40

But it that was like such a like wow.

will 59:45

Yeah.

melanie 59:46

I'm so thankful. I passed.

kevin 59:48

So then Mel was there for six months as an au pair, because that's how long her visa was uh valid.

melanie 59:54

And seven technically, but yeah.

kevin 59:57

Yeah. And as soon as she was Was not as soon as she was there, but we I um I not promoted proposed to you in May. Yeah like a day or two before your yeah one day before your birthday. And as soon as we like made that decision, we put in all the paperwork to get married, and it literally all went through the week, like within the week of when we scheduled. When we got married on the Saturday. Oh, like I think we got that three days or so.

melanie 1:00:35

Approval like two or three days before.

kevin 1:00:37

Like you have to put in, you know, it's different in Germany. You have to put in a lot of paperwork and get it all approved, and then we also had to get her birth certificate translated and uh by an like certified trans interpreter. We had to have interpreters for the wedding, like for the official part. Yeah. Um and all of that was just like so like um just like yeah, just unsure.

melanie 1:01:02

Like and it was perfectly timed. Um but it was like we moved forward and God was like delivering on it, and it was kind of like leaving that room like deliver, like come on.

will 1:01:13

But always like right when needed, yeah, that kind of thing. The perfect time, yeah.

kevin 1:01:17

And then uh we got married, and with that Melanie got the uh permanent resident permission, which was I think the first one you got is for three years, and then you renew it for five or ten years, something like this. Okay. Um and so she got that for three years.

melanie 1:01:36

Yep.

kevin 1:01:37

Um So then we lived in Germany for Then we lived in Germany and a month after getting married to put in the paperwork for getting my green card.

will 1:01:48

Right.

melanie 1:01:49

Um And that took twenty-six months till we moved from yeah, from when you say it like that.

kevin 1:01:56

I know. Like I check my mailbox every single day. Oh, right. Uh we work with a pretty good lawyer here from Indianapolis. Yeah. Um and I feel like they had may have been some things where he could have worked faster, but you know, I don't know how many hundred clients he has, of course. Right. Um, and then there are just so many procedures in the whole system if you want to do it legally, that just take their time. Um and eventually it all worked out, and we got the interview date, and you know, like really nervous and excited and got there in the morning, and then it's like as if you walk to a like ticket counter in the train station, they're like, Okay, you're Kevin Miller, uh just out in the open.

melanie 1:02:39

Yeah, like in a big hall with like you think you're gonna go to like a private like office and all these intense questions, and they're gonna separate you and ask you different questions and make sure they line up. Nothing like that. It was ten minutes talking to this really sweet lady.

kevin 1:02:54

Wow. And then she was like, Congratulations, you will get something in the mail, and then uh you have to leave your passport there, and you get the passport bag with the visa glued in. Cool. Um, if you're not in the US, because we did it all in Germany, so you don't get a green card if you're not physically in the US. Okay. So I got the immigration visa.

melanie 1:03:12

Um And that was November twentieth. Our original interview date was November twenty-eighth, last year, twenty-three, twenty twenty-three. Okay, really. And then they moved it up. Yeah. Which is like so rare. I think our lawyers were like, we usually only see it scooted back. Yeah. Like farther away. And they moved it up eight days.

kevin 1:03:30

Cool, okay. I don't remember all the details of the whole green club process, but there were some things where we were like, oh, is this gonna work? And then it just all worked out. Like, I'm obviously I'm here.

will 1:03:39

Yeah. Yes. Oh, exactly.

kevin 1:03:41

That was just crazy.

will 1:03:42

That's so cool.

kevin 1:03:43

Um, yeah, we just had a lot of time in Germany, just the two of us without her family around, and my family they didn't live far away, but we weren't as close. Right. Um, so we just had a lot of time to develop our relationship individually, and that was great. And then Um after I had the visa, started a preparation of like quitting the job, quitting the apartment. Right. Uh we lived with my parents for four weeks before we flew in. Um and so then we have our dog that we intended to bring and we wouldn't or we didn't want to do a um layover flight. You know, because she stays in the transit zone, and so we we didn't want to do more to her than absolutely necessary. Right. Um and so we booked a flight for somewhere in February. And um since Chicago would be our airport that we go to, uh the problem was with them that they don't allow pet transports in the cargo of the plane. Okay, you know, you can only take them in the cabin. Oh, right, okay. She's too big. Yeah, that doesn't really work for any other dog that in Chihuahua. No.

melanie 1:05:04

Um it was like December of March 1st or something that they don't allow that or something.

kevin 1:05:09

Yeah, like Chicago has the rule, I think, because of like weather conditions and all that, they just say it you can't, no matter what the weather is actually like. Okay. Um and so that was kind of a struggle to figure out, find out, and I had like so many Indian or other um customer service reps from all kinds of places, and they were all pretty incompetent.

will 1:05:30

Not because they're in the not as good as yours.

kevin 1:05:32

Yeah. Yeah. They were just like, oh yeah, you can do this, and then I booked the flight, and then no, and actually you can't do this, but you already have the flight booked, and then eventually I got a very competent gentleman um that helped me out, and then we booked the flight again for March 1st. Right outside of that window. Yeah. Yeah. Nice. So two weeks before all the airlines started striking for better pay. Oh yeah. And they would have been on strike for the original flight date, had it worked out. And they were on strike one day after our flight. So the one day that we were flying, they did a break in the strikes.

will 1:06:12

What on earth?

kevin 1:06:13

That is like that is surreal.

will 1:06:15

That's so freaking cool.

kevin 1:06:17

And we were pretty nervous with like the dog in the box and will it fit the Did we meet all the standards and all the things? Yeah, the requirements, you know, because like we can't send her back, we have to go today. Right. Also because my I mean my visa was still valid for a couple more months, but we just were like really ready.

melanie 1:06:32

Yeah.

kevin 1:06:33

Um and then they were like, yeah, if you drop off a dog here at this like special cargo, you can also just check in your bags. Like that is one big thing then. And so it was like the smoothest like our check-in we've ever had.

melanie 1:06:47

Yeah, and getting to the US was so like immigrating was actually so smooth too. Yeah. Like we thought it would be like hours extra on like getting in. I'm like, we should always like immigrate when we travel, because it was so smooth.

kevin 1:07:00

Like they really just wanted to see the the suitcases in like a second X-ray because you know you I don't know why, but they wanted that, and then they had um like animal control officers there, and we were kind of like, okay, they have to check the vaccines and all that, and the guys were actually like petting our dog because they all thought she was so cute.

will 1:07:19

Yeah, cool. German, German Germany.

melanie/kevin 1:07:22

Yeah, exactly.

kevin 1:07:24

Um so that was just like afterwards, it's kind of like the dad really just happened. Yeah, and also for me, because we've been in the US twice in uh 2022 and 2023 for visits after we were able to travel again. Um and I was kind of like, okay, yeah, we're working on it, but like, you know, almost every day a coker would have been like, Have you heard anything about your green card? And all this, like, no, maybe soon. Yeah, hopefully soon, I'm in the next step, whatever.

will 1:07:48

Yeah, you would just probably get tired of people asking you. Yeah, it's sweet.

kevin 1:07:52

It's like uh nothing's happening. I mean they were all like you know, rooting for me, but it doesn't help. No. And then walking through the gate, getting our dog, getting his suitcases, because I lost them on the first trip in 2022. Yeah, okay. Oh yeah, right. It was just like, man, we're finally here.

melanie 1:08:11

Yeah. That was so sweet. That was that was crazy.

kevin 1:08:15

Like we're sometimes talking about it halfway serious about writing it down as our journey because it's actually definitely remember this all.

will 1:08:27

Well, here we've got it recorded.

melanie 1:08:28

Yeah, we'll go back and listen and transcribe it all.

will 1:08:31

Oh, I know, seriously. Yeah. No, I remember when you guys visited in 22. Um, you were a surprise. And that was so cool. Because I hadn't seen you since 2019, the first time we met. And you're talking like almost well, just a little shy of like three and a half years later. Wow. And so that was like crazy. You got to meet Lincoln. Um Wilder had just been born. Yeah. So it was just like it was just that was like so special.

kevin 1:08:58

Because I never met Lincoln either.

melanie 1:08:59

Yeah, because she was really highly pregnant.

will 1:09:01

Right. He's born like three weeks after you left, I think, or something crazy. It was like so close.

melanie 1:09:06

Yep.

will 1:09:06

Um that that to me, that will always stand out as just being like like that was freaking awesome. I mean, just that that visit, the gift of seeing you again, and it's like the Lord had already carried you through so much at that point, even like you had been married a year. Yeah, yeah.

melanie/kevin 1:09:23

Yeah, exactly.

will 1:09:25

And now you're at three years married.

melanie/kevin 1:09:27

Yeah.

will 1:09:28

Which is so cool. What's up? I know it's cool.

melanie 1:09:30

Do you want a blanket?

will 1:09:31

I know it's cold out here.

melanie 1:09:32

Um Do you want this one behind us?

will 1:09:35

Uh yeah, actually, I might take it.

melanie 1:09:37

I want a dead one.

will 1:09:38

Do you want it? You can take it. Do you need one then?

kevin 1:09:43

I'm pretty good. Okay.

will 1:09:46

It's real chilly in the It's the prize of a podcast. Garage studio out here tonight. Yeah. I almost took us inside, but we'll we'll stick with the garage fine.

melanie 1:09:55

Um That's a long story though. You don't want to skip any. Right.

will 1:10:03

Well, in your time, just to speak, in your time in Germany, you're waiting a little bit more. Didn't you guys like set a boundary? Like, we're literally only gonna check this email like once a week.

kevin 1:10:12

Yeah. We we s so the first one of the first steps um with the green card process is once they accept your application, you get this code. Okay. And then with this code you can look up your status on the USCIS website. Okay. And so that status moved from applied to approved to whatever the steps are. Um and that, you know, I also checked like every day.

melanie 1:10:43

No, at first we started doing it like on Sundays.

kevin 1:10:46

No, I think we we did it like really regularly, and then we got to the rule. Oh yeah, do it like every Sunday kind of stuff. I don't know if I'll stick to it. I've checked it during the day too.

melanie 1:10:57

Yeah, I stuck to it because I I don't remember that code name.

will 1:11:01

Well, I'll have like a package coming, and it's like it's supposed to be here today, and then it's not, and it's like updating every 10 minutes. Yeah, oh yeah. It's like that's a lot of people.

kevin 1:11:10

Especially because at some point by the time they have give you timelines, and we should have heard by that time. And just like two days before, they extended the timeline another like three months or so. And it was kind of like what? Yes. Um, and then I contacted our lawyer and he was like, Yeah, it just happens. Like they give themselves more time so that they're not liable. Like, you know, you can't claim anything. Right. Um, so yeah, that was that thing. I also like when I had downtimes at work, I like would go on Google Maps and just look around Indiana and the US in general, and all these start dreaming, send me random properties and stuff. Yeah, that's cool. Yeah, but I think like the whole um from her coming to Germany to the point where we went back to the US Um taught us a lot of patience. Yeah. So it took really long.

melanie 1:12:07

Our whole relationship has taught us a lot of patience. Yeah. Right. Even though some of it was at my own hand. Like I'm scared to tell my family to corona, to twenty-six months waiting to you know like almost eight years of waiting on something.

will 1:12:20

Yeah, basically.

melanie 1:12:21

Yeah.

will 1:12:22

Yeah.

melanie 1:12:22

And now we're kind of in a season of waiting for other things, but it's like you're realizing like, oh, life is waiting. Okay, we're not special. Yeah.

kevin 1:12:30

But I also um build a lot of trust, I think. Yeah.

melanie 1:12:34

Like with those little like details. Yeah. Like the strike and then it just feels like God's like, nope, okay, you're good to go. Like we'll I'll pause that for today.

will 1:12:43

Like, oh seriously. Well, I think if you take a step back and look at it, it looks like a lot of waiting. But like I think you guys have done a good job of like being present at every step of it. Which is that's a big deal, too.

melanie/kevin 1:12:57

Yeah.

will 1:12:58

You know.

kevin 1:12:59

Like I knew for myself, I always said the day I set foot on the American ground, I won't think about the time I've waited anymore, and I haven't since then. You know, like it doesn't matter if I would have waited five years, I probably wouldn't have thought about it either.

will 1:13:11

Now it's like a blur, like a past life almost or something.

kevin 1:13:14

Yeah. Um yeah, especially I I don't know about you, but for me it builds a lot of trust because I you know grew up believing and all.

will 1:13:22

Yeah.

kevin 1:13:23

Um, but like to this day I want to be in control, and I guess it's probably what everyone does that is somehow a believer, like still trying to be in control somehow, but I don't know, it's kind now it's kind of like how can you still not just trust? Right. Like for me.

melanie 1:13:40

Oh, I agree.

kevin 1:13:41

Um like there are things you you know, like where I think like God gives you control, like, hey, if you want the job, maybe you should apply. I'm not gonna have the manager come in and be like, hey, I don't know you, but you'll get the job. Right. Like he still wants you to do your step, I think. Yes. But like, hey, and then he makes it work out or not. Yeah. And you can be happy with both, and like I think that helped me a lot. Um and I think also helps in regards to blooming or wilting, like um, he's like um like growing that how do I say that poetically? Yeah, sure, sure. Without just saying like growing the faith or the intrusting him, like you like naturally bloom not because it's good versus bad or so, but because y it's like the trust. Yeah. Like you can also bloom in bad things, like you know, we had to cancel a flight and all that. I was like, man, this is so annoying, but it worked out like so much better in the end. Like ridiculous.

will 1:14:48

Yeah, that's so cool. Yeah, um, just I don't know. I remember talking to you guys at different points too, and like you started working at like the flower shop just because you're like, I'm going crazy. Yeah. When I'm just at home here, and like so you guys did a good job of doing that and like setting up life, and I think it now like kind of looking back and realizing as you're saying a lot of this, the way that it gave you kind of some of the space to form who you are as a couple. That's huge. But like it's really cool now to see it kind of like all coming to fruition, like yes, like your feet literally hitting the ground, and it's like, alright, here we go. Like this is who we are, this is where we feel like we were supposed to have been this entire time, and now we're here.

melanie 1:15:34

Absolutely. It's interesting looking back though, because there are things I like cherish about that time.

will 1:15:39

Yeah.

melanie 1:15:40

That I think I could see it then, but it was a little bit blurred by like the hopes of being here.

will 1:15:45

Yeah.

melanie 1:15:46

But there are things like our pace of living was just a lot slower, and like his job was like our main providing thing, and I worked like a mini job at the flower shop, and like just it was slow and a really healing time for me personally, like in processing stuff.

will 1:16:03

First time kind of living outside of the house. Yeah.

melanie 1:16:06

In like a very peaceful environment.

kevin 1:16:08

I remember you were considering looking for a place really close to when you actually came to Germany.

melanie 1:16:14

Yeah, yeah. I felt like at the point where I should get into a different space. Anyways, yeah. Yeah, anyways. And then um it was like there are things now that I'm like, I kinda missed that about that season.

will 1:16:28

Right, yeah. But like it won't be that way again, but like how sweet. Yeah, like it was that way for that time.

melanie 1:16:36

And um, but life I must say, life here feels a lot more like full and active and like we're settled and stuff. Like that was a big thing in our apartment. Like, we couldn't you didn't want to buy anything you really liked because you're like, then you have to consider oh we gonna ship this and move this over or leave it here.

kevin 1:16:55

We only traveled with two suitcases each and we sent two bigger packages, like yeah, with like two. Yeah.

will 1:17:04

Um and a dog, you send it a dog in a box, but that's all we brought with us. Right.

melanie 1:17:09

The main thing I was sad about like giving up was like my herb collection. We had four.

will 1:17:13

Oh, yeah, because you dried out a bunch of stuff, yeah. Seriously. Because you guys did a lot of foraging while you were over there, eh?

melanie 1:17:21

Yeah, because we lived like a five-minute walk away from awesome forests. Yeah. Miss that a little bit too.

will 1:17:26

You feel like you are still h like have a hankering for something like that, or finding little bits and pieces of it nearby, or yeah, yeah.

melanie 1:17:34

Yeah. Like our walk yesterday where we went, there were like pines that kind of remind me of the Black Forest, and it was like definitely that's the nature is a big thing I miss about Germany and like loved, and I think we appreciated it while we were there a lot, but like, I feel like life was just like a lot easier there.

kevin 1:17:54

Sure. Because a lot of things are regulated to your good.

will 1:17:57

Okay.

kevin 1:17:58

But also a lot of things are regulated that restrict your life a lot.

will 1:18:02

Like Yeah.

kevin 1:18:04

Like the the place that we bought here that we live in now, I don't know if we could have ever afforded that. Sure. Even with my good job. Uh maybe if Mel would have had another like full-time job that pays well, you know. Yeah, okay. Um and then stuff like that. But on the other hand, um I don't know, something that is a culture shock here is that when it's raining at night you can't see anything off the road and you're just praying that you get home safe.

melanie 1:18:30

Like, the reflectors are pretty bad.

kevin 1:18:32

Like the the road like the lane markings or so, like you just can't see anything. No, sure. Um especially if someone's driving towards you with lights on and all that. Right. Then it's just like, how did that even happen?

will 1:18:44

Speaking of faith. Yeah, Lord giving home. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

kevin 1:18:50

Um yeah, but uh how do we get to that?

melanie 1:18:53

Oh no, you um the things you uh messed about or liked about Germany.

will 1:18:58

Yeah. Which I think it's cool to be able to acknowledge there were really like genuine parts of that experience.

kevin 1:19:03

Well we also jumped over is like to a certain point I was very fifty-fifty about living in Germany or US. Oh right, yeah. Because I've never spent more time in the US other than you know, the first visits. Um and I had like a safe job um with like a federal government where I had a lifetime position. Right. I had retirement like pretty safe, you know, and all these things, really good health insurance and all that.

melanie 1:19:30

And like if he ever got injured or anything, they would take care of him.

kevin 1:19:33

Yeah.

will 1:19:34

Like no question.

melanie 1:19:35

No question that like, yeah.

kevin 1:19:37

Um so that was kind of like life's safe here, you know? Yeah. Kind of like that, but that's the thing, like it is safe, but it's also like like bro, just safe in a cage. You know?

will 1:19:48

Okay, right, yeah.

kevin 1:19:49

Um and then the more we talked about it and the more I think you know Germany also has changed, especially during COVID.

will 1:19:56

Sure, you saw kind of a lot in the restrictions really like Yeah.

kevin 1:20:00

Oh yeah. And then the more time went by, the more I got drawn towards being here.

will 1:20:07

And yeah.

kevin 1:20:09

Not to sound cliche, but like to you know, like I feel like in my heart I'm more American than German. Yeah. And like the in the like true meaning of being American, of like, you know, like being self-sufficient and free and, you know, all these things.

will 1:20:28

No, I think I've said that about you. I think you're more American than I am. I was born right down the road, you know, you were born across an ocean, but whatever.

melanie 1:20:37

I think something else about the American culture is like you I I just feel faith more. Like I think when we visited a couple of times, you mentioned how people were just like, God bless, like just putting that out there. Oh yeah. Like and those little things. It like adds up and it makes you feel just like more like thinking on God. I don't know. Yeah. It's kind of like like it's just out there. It's just open, like, God bless you. Or let me pray for you.

will 1:21:06

Or like so cool.

melanie 1:21:08

Like the other day at work I had a coworker who was struggling, and she's like, Can you just pray for me? And like I stood there right there with her and prayed, and like having that just like more present is like it's really uplifting for sure.

kevin 1:21:20

And that's oppressed. Believing it or not, but just the values it's you know implementing in people's lives. Or like schools or whatever, right? Are just like good values. Yeah. Um, and that's something that's definitely going downhill in Germany.

melanie 1:21:37

Just feel more encouraged. It's kind of random, but like it's awesome.

will 1:21:41

Even again, I think that's like a good outside perspective because I think there's a lot of people who've been here for a long time and say, like, how it's declining so rapidly here. Right. But then like you compare it to maybe other parts of the world that are maybe doing well in other ways, but it's just like you know, we're actually got some stuff. Decent ish, you know.

kevin 1:22:02

Yeah.

will 1:22:02

Which is helpful.

kevin 1:22:04

Yeah.

will 1:22:04

But I like what you're saying though too, because you really spoke into like the and I kind of talked about this a little bit on the last episode, but or Scott did, but like the n the freedom that we have here and basically the way that you have this like this ability to kind of step into like taking those different things up the mantle of like bearing the responsibility of your own freedom and stepping into that, and like that is a bigger responsibility to kind of step into. Um like your job. I mean, it probably feels like I don't know, for a minute there you didn't really know how that was all gonna go. You gave up a lot of security. Um, but I'm just kind of segueing this though too into like you know, already since you guys have been here, you know, you worked with the with the family business for about six months or so and you had like financial sponsorship through uh mom and dad. Yeah, which is cool just coming in with all of that kind of setup.

melanie/kevin 1:23:00

Shout out.

will 1:23:01

Yeah, a little shout-out, exactly.

kevin 1:23:04

Yeah, and it leading into basically like you guys now, you know, both at your different places and that's the thing, like uh back to my friend that said that uh taking a deep breath thing. It's like of course it's riskier here, like you know, you get injured in a job accident, whatever you're not as taken care of, but doesn't the risk and the um you know higher risk, higher potential reward inspire you to be your own best? Like I I would say I have a good work ethic, but I definitely slacked sometimes because I could. Like, you know, there's not much to do, so I was sitting around drinking coffee for eight hours that would never happen here, depending on where you are. But like um that inspires you to because you're responsible for yourself to you know get the best result possible. Which then yeah uh bears fruit for you know other people involved or affected by it or yeah, you know?

will 1:24:06

That makes a lot of sense. Like a little less safety net. Yeah. It may be in ways where it's like maybe like medical insurance and stuff like that, where we could stand probably here to have a little bit more of a safety net. Yeah. But there's like it sounds like from what you're saying though too, there's a lot of reason. Like stay inspired, keep like keep fighting for yourself, stay healthy, and stay yeah, heck yeah.

melanie 1:24:28

Eat well, like exercise, there we go, yeah. Like exactly if if that's your option, you probably don't want to have to use the option. So kind of going towards like the self-sufficiency, maybe building community, like if something happens where you can be supported in a different way.

kevin 1:24:46

Right. Also, just how how much easier it is here to have a small business.

will 1:24:51

You know, like Yeah, totally.

kevin 1:24:53

If you have something really small in Germany where you make like less than I think 21k a year, you can just put it on your taxes. Um but any other thing, like you know, how you can just do a power washing business here, so you probably have to have a couple certificates in Germany to do that. Okay, like have some big insurance and all these things. Right. Um just you know, no one's coming to save you if you don't care. Right. But also no one's gonna be in your way so much.

will 1:25:23

Right. No, I get what you're saying. A little less regulation in general.

kevin 1:25:27

Try different things, yeah.

will 1:25:28

Yeah, totally. Well, with I mean, with that being said, that's like a perfect way to like move into like you guys have these different jobs, but you've got these different passions, like and I feel like um, you know, smooth and heimschutz, like those are really big aspect of you guys, and I think it's cool because they're pretty emblematic of the two of you in a lot of ways, also. Yeah. Um you want to talk about that?

melanie 1:25:53

Yeah. Um, so yeah, you mentioned it earlier, like I'm working at the local cafe, which I really enjoy, and then on the side of that, studying herbalism.

will 1:26:03

Yeah.

melanie 1:26:03

Right now, and that was inspired by different things for sure, but by Smooth, um, which is like my natural-based or natural tallow-based herbal skincare. Um, and just kind of the desire to like to know more about what I'm giving people, and um I I kind of got off track with that. No, you're good.

will 1:26:30

A little bathroom break, we're okay. Yeah, no, that makes sense.

melanie 1:26:33

Um so it felt like the desire and need to kind of learn herbalism to help people, possibly in deeper ways than just care. But so that I can, you know, do Smooth better. Um Absolutely. That's something that's been a little challenging. You have all these ideas before you like are actually living it, and then it's just been a lot of a slower start than I hoped.

will 1:26:58

Sure.

melanie 1:26:58

But hopefully building up for like a better start for Smooth. Yeah, I think that's a good thing. So we filed in like April for the actual company. Yeah. But we actually haven't produced any final product yet.

will 1:27:12

Right. But You've because you've been busy.

melanie 1:27:16

We've been working, we've been yeah, just trying to maintain and stuff and like um a lot of other good things. But I'm excited to like do it and do it well. So like we've partnered with a local Christian family owned farm for the tallow, the Howard's the Maple Valley farm. A little shout-out for them. Nice. Um they provide the tallow that we're gonna use, which is like beautiful, grass fed, um happy, healthy cow tallow. Cool. And then sourcing herbs as local as possible, foraging um for certain ones that where I can. That's fast. And um just excited to get that out there into the world and then hopefully develop on that with the with the herbalism education. Yeah. And maybe see clients in the future for deeper stuff.

will 1:28:10

Right.

melanie 1:28:10

Yeah.

will 1:28:11

Like you said, not jumping it right into it might be giving you a lot of time to make make it do your homework on some of the you know the herbalism stuff, which is cool too, because I feel like herbalism has never really been like a foreign thing to us. Right. Um, because like our grandma's super into it and like the you know, the young side of the family. Yeah. Um, but how neat that you're like kind of taking that on yourself too with that in mind.

melanie 1:28:34

That developed a lot in Germany too. Yeah. Noticing different little weeds. I say that with quotation marks around, and then it's like, oh, this will actually nourish your body. Right, exactly. This can heal this, whatever.

will 1:28:47

This is my CPS.

kevin 1:28:48

Yeah, exactly. I feel like that's where it developed. Yeah, that's where it started developing for you.

melanie 1:28:52

Yeah.

will 1:28:53

Okay, yeah. From what I remember.

melanie 1:28:55

Yeah, I think you have to spawn. I did a walk with Karen here, actually, Karen Burke. Oh, yeah, that's right. Okay. Keep them coming. Yeah, exactly. Um, and that was just really cool, because you're just walking where you are you still walking, and you're like, oh yeah, it's a bush. It's a bush. Right. It's a weed. And then she's like, This will do this, and you're just like, What? What the heck? And then I went back to Germany and then I started seeing Yarrow around. And I was just like, I know what that is. Right. I know what that will do for me. And like, that's literally where my dog just pooped.

will 1:29:29

Like, it's just growing there, like it all just looks like grass until you like until you know a little bit and you're like, whoa. Yeah, the world just got a lot bigger. So I love that. Yeah. Well, so that with that, you know, I feel like that's really cool too, because then you've got all of your foraging, yeah. This herbalism that's all going into it, this recognition of all those little things around the world, but like, and then literally sourcing only like local good stuff for the actual smooth production. Yep. Which that's huge, huge selling point to something like that. You know, full of all this other extra like preservative crap or something like that.

melanie 1:30:06

So no, and the people who care for the cows that give us the awesome tallow and like just want to bring that to people and just keep stuff in our local environment and support another local business with my local business, you know?

will 1:30:19

Yes. That kind of thing. Not trying to be the next Amazon No, no. Uh uh.

melanie 1:30:25

That's not the rule. Yeah. That's what I'm running away from. Exactly.

will 1:30:29

Yeah. But that's good.

melanie 1:30:31

A little yeah. You're probably gonna get like cut. Yeah. Can't post this.

will 1:30:35

You just have to randomly like shout out something that's slightly controversial out just to make it interesting. Are you still listening? Yeah.

melanie 1:30:43

That's awesome.

will 1:30:44

But yeah, okay, so yeah, smooth. So is do you feel like uh there is any like I have a timeline, I'd like to have some product out by this, or maybe do another open house, or is it just like, let's just keep taking the time to study and like, you know, work on this when it feels right?

melanie 1:31:01

So that's a good question. I have oils that are like ready to go. Nice. So hope oil with whole herbs infused. I have tallow, I need to just render it. Okay, yeah. I just need to take a loop of faith and invest some money into some jars and labeling, and then I would be ready to do like a soft launch. Maybe a little pop-up. Yeah, pop-up shop thing. Uh no. But yeah. What we're referring to with the pop-up shop is we did one in 2020 when we visited. And that went really well. That was awesome.

will 1:31:39

Yeah, totally. I think it all got bought up, right?

melanie 1:31:41

Pretty much, yeah. Yeah. By now, yeah.

will 1:31:43

Oh, you're crusty customers. Yeah, they're all moved now.

melanie 1:31:47

Um so yeah, hopefully beginning of the year.

will 1:31:50

Yeah, totally.

melanie 1:31:51

Beginning of 2025.

will 1:31:53

Well, I think one thing I found is really cool about it is it's like a super uh solid like tattoo bomb.

melanie 1:31:58

Oh yeah. Yeah, that's what we used on ours.

will 1:32:00

Yeah.

melanie 1:32:01

Glad you like it too though. Yeah, totally. We've been doing treatments this week, because like you were saying earlier, not on the podcast. Right.

will 1:32:09

Oh my goodness, yeah. But this time. Oh yeah.

melanie 1:32:13

Not to like toot my own horn, but no, you guys are glowing.

will 1:32:17

Yeah, straight up. It's the cold.

melanie 1:32:21

Um But yeah, no, it's just exciting. It's less a lot in different ways.

will 1:32:27

So you just get to share. Yeah.

melanie 1:32:30

I just want to share it with the people.

will 1:32:31

That's really cool. And then there's uh my shout out for Heimschutz, which is uh Kevin's home defense, is we literally got to be like the first customers, like, you know, a couple months ago and like have you go through the whole pro or you know, a version of the program with us um in our space, and like you know, like of course we've used Smooth and Amazing ten out of ten product. Um but like Heimshitz, um I think it's been it's what's that?

kevin 1:33:04

11 out of 10.

will 1:33:05

That's what I meant to say. Yeah, totally. No, it's it'll it all comes together, you know, it's all symbiotic or something like that, somewhere.

melanie/kevin 1:33:17

Yeah. That's not fair.

will 1:33:18

Um but yeah, so we got to do that, and that was like awesome. But like, yeah, if you want to speak into that a little bit. Of course I'll tag you guys' stuff on this because I want people to see it, you know.

melanie 1:33:28

Also, what are you doing as your work too? Maybe a little bit. Or do you not want to?

kevin 1:33:33

Um, it doesn't matter. Um, so yeah. Coming from my law enforcement background in Germany, where I served in a um specialized unit, or you could even say special force for the last seven years. I just love anything tactical, like how to clear a room, how to arrest someone driving, standing, sleeping, how to breach, how to shoot, everything.

will 1:33:58

Yeah.

kevin 1:33:58

Like I just thrive. That's actually something I'm really like blooming when I can do that.

will 1:34:02

Okay.

kevin 1:34:04

Um and so I always wanted to do that, and due to my citizenship status, which is a green card holder right now, I cannot become a law enforcement officer in Germany, uh in Indiana. Um there are like three states in the US or four where you can become a law enforcement officer or like cop or whatever, but you can't do any federal job.

will 1:34:26

Okay.

kevin 1:34:27

You can't do anything in Indiana just because of how the laws are here.

will 1:34:30

Sure.

kevin 1:34:30

And you can't even do like an instructor like at the law enforcement academy or so because they have to go through the same basic program which you have to be a citizen for. Okay. Um and so I didn't want to lose the connection to that uh topic or matter, and um I just wanted to continue doing like tactical things. Um and so the vision was, you know, to win the lottery and then build this like 500 acre training center where all the special forces from the US would come, but I just don't have the money for that. Not yet. Um and so my idea shifted a little bit from doing that for agencies to doing it for uh people like private households. And so there are already quite some training opportunities around where people can come to and you know pay their hundred bucks or whatever. Um and so m what I'm doing or want to do is to go to people's places and train them within their home so that they don't have to try to translate tactics from a sterile training situation somewhere in the training center to their own home, but can actually like learn it in their own home. Yeah. Um downside is a little bit you can't really, you know, shoot with marker ammo or so, like you don't you know don't want to have paintball spots all over your wall. Exactly. But the upside is that um what I do is like an assessment of someone's place, including their property, including their general area, like their neighborhood, their yeah, depending on what area that is, yeah. Go a little bit wider or not. Um like with you guys, I did the main roads around too that are you know ten, fifteen minutes away already. Yeah. Um do an assessment and then analyze it and give it a score um based on different factors, and then tell you, okay, your home is by the Heimschutz score um five out of ten or whatever. Right. And then give you the ideas to improve this. So for example, there are things you can't change, like you can't move your house from this neighborhood to another one. Right. But you can, you know, install cameras or whatever.

will 1:36:52

Yes.

kevin 1:36:53

Um and then what we've done, I mean, we were there, um, is to But they weren't you weren't the people is to um to give you a scenario of say a home invasion. In this case, like with the different levels of training, what we did is just the basic defense training. If you do a higher training, it would include like medical emergencies or riots or tornadoes or whatever.

will 1:37:26

Yeah, totally.

kevin 1:37:26

Um, and then give you a scenario, let you just see how you do, if you survive or not. Um, and then do the training with you, like doing how to tactically clear a room, how to, you know, do it this fastest way, the safest way, what are the advantages of your home if you have you know brick wall somewhere, it's better than the paper wall next to it. Um what are entry points in your home, what are you know weak points in your home? How should you move if you have to go get your child? How should you enter your home if you know you hear your your wife scream somewhere, or whatever? Right. And then train you and then um do different scenarios, you know, kind of just basically like home defense training in your actual home. Um and like I said before, that comes with like a big um assessment of it before what state your home is in and what it could be in, and then yeah, that's kind of like the vision for that. Um I'm still working on developing different training programs because doing law enforcement for so long, um the tactical training is very natural to me. Right. And while I have some knowledge and skills in like medical po medical trainings or you know, situations I still have to actually like study them more. Yeah, okay. So it's still uh in the in the creation phase, but like the basic level can be booked already. Yeah, totally.

will 1:38:57

Um worth it.

kevin 1:38:59

Thank you.

will 1:38:59

Yeah, um, I think that was the biggest thing. My biggest takeaway was like loving how tailor-fit it all is. I mean, and of course, knowing you, yeah. There's that element, but it's like literally that you'd come into a space, assess the space with the information you've been given, but also being present and just be able to like what I my main takeaway is I think I told you was just like I feel more comfortable in my own home than I did before. Or like you just, you know, and because we just moved here beginning of this year, and so it was just like, you know, who's around us? And part of like your questionnaire was like, what's like what would you rate yourself of like even knowing neighbors right around you? And part of it was like, Oh, I think we've actually done a decent job of getting to know some people, but here's where we could improve, you know, just as like an example. And like I think that just that alone as of that aspect of the service alone of how like like you were saying, how custom fit it feels like to your own situation is just like Huge. Like, of course, if I ever moved anywhere else, it would be like, hey Kevin, okay, round two, you know. It's like we gotta do it again, you know.

kevin 1:40:08

Yeah, so that the that's kind of the the slogan to prepare, to protect. Yeah. Um, and you know, like not everyone knocking on your door deserves to be shot. Right. But no to be able to do m to make the right decision in a critical situation is Yeah. Um yeah. The point of it. And I think we just talked about Heimschutz as if we as if everyone knows what it means. It's a little like heritage is uh actually a German word. Um and basically means like home protection or home defense.

will 1:40:48

Like Germany.

kevin 1:40:50

So heim is like home or like yeah. Schutz um technically it would mean the fence. Okay. But um yeah, protection.

will 1:41:05

It's it's it's very close to it. U T C. Okay, cool, cool. Yeah, no, thanks for clarifying that so you could something like I already know what it means.

melanie 1:41:18

And smooth is just Kevin saying smooth with this cute dreading accent. Just in case you're not gonna do it. I love that. But yeah, we'll have your skin.

melanie/kevin 1:41:25

What was your person before?

melanie 1:41:29

Do by moo or something silly like that, yeah.

will 1:41:31

Oh sure, sure. Like get skin by cows, yeah. Yeah, totally. But I like it. Well I love this. I mean, I love how like uh resourceful, creative, entrepreneurial the both of you are, and like just hope that there's a lot more in those endeavors for sure. Oh yeah. Um but yeah, like I said, I'll tag those up there too, because I want people to, you know, obviously hearing your story about like this is a really big part of maybe the direction you're headed. Yeah.

kevin 1:42:00

So yeah, and mentioned wildflowers 10 gives you 10% off.

will 1:42:04

Oh nice we didn't talk about that much, K. Code Wildflowers 10, yeah. First move too, sure. Uh Wildflower. Yeah, no, seriously, that's cool. I love that. Yeah. Prove you actually listened, you know. Yeah. If you made it this far.

melanie/kevin 1:42:20

Yeah. I just discount you know, a lot of tactical work.

kevin 1:42:26

Yeah. Um But I have a very strong sense for people's right to defend themselves. And that's also something that, you know, coming from Germany where pocket knives are forbidden in some cities. Right. Um now they stab each other with screwdrivers, you know. Like oh, good job. What do you want to forbid next? Yeah. Um just coming here and there's, you know, it's like big debate with like second amendment and right to bear arms and whatever, and I don't really want to get into that, but like the I think it's just a God-given right to defend yourself against any kind of threat. Yeah, totally. Why would you have to back down or let something happen, you know?

will 1:43:09

Right.

kevin 1:43:09

And so I think that's that's kind of like my motivation behind that. Yeah. Making some money too.

will 1:43:15

But um, I love that.

kevin 1:43:18

To like give people the tools and like you said, confidence and comfort to actually act.

will 1:43:24

Yep. No, exactly. I mean, because like in your shoes too, and like mine, it's like, yes, there is that personal protection element, but like you also have people around you to protect.

melanie 1:43:35

Yeah. Oh yeah.

will 1:43:36

And I think you know, when once you start realizing, like, you know, and I've probably rather said before, but I remember a few years ago, like talking with a young single friend, he was just like, you know, why why carry a gun? And I was like, dude, I don't like I don't carry for me. Carry because I have a wife and a little kid at that time. And he was like, Oh, yeah, I would too.

melanie 1:43:58

Yeah.

will 1:43:58

He's like, you know, it's sure you can do a lot of things just for yourself, but like, you know, not that that isn't a worthy cause. I'm not trying to say that, of course, but it's like, you know, the beauty of like I think what Heimschutz has to offer the Second Amendment or any of that is like you have a right to protect yourself as an individual. You're worth protecting. Yeah. I mean, I think that's the beauty of it though, too. It's like um, so yeah, thanks for sharing. Thanks for sharing the vision of both of those, and just like I it's just cool too, because I see the ways that they're like one is like very like natural or herbal and one is very like tactical, and just this like but I seeing the way that those two things are actually so you guys and like come together and actually like fits really well together. So you know it's just like this is cool. Um yeah, any other word on either of those?

melanie 1:44:47

I th I think I stay tuned. Yeah, stay tuned. The freedom to protect yourself and like that if stuff would start to go down, like that you would you know attempt to protect the people around you, even if they're strangers, and like what that says to like those people. Right. Like, I don't know, just because that's what I often think. Like, if something would happen, I'm looking at who's with me in that situation. Like I want to protect those people too, those innocent lives that are maybe being threatened and just like like just that value to people. Hopefully, that's my heart behind caring. Yeah, like you know, and like wanting to be a ready person, and everything is like who do we have around us and like the value of their life and everything. Yes. That's kind of random, but no, no, I love that.

will 1:45:32

I mean, well, even just the the health element of like smooth for doing it all natural and things like that is like I I see you, you're worthy of taking care of. I think that's like such a and and then the division of Heimschutz is like this is literally love your neighbor. Yeah. I mean, just uh its core. Yeah. Which is so cool. Um, no, that so that totally fits. Yeah, yeah.

melanie 1:45:57

Just kind of like, oh, I just want to have it for because I like guns or whatever.

will 1:46:01

Right, no. You're not you're not that person, that's for dang sure. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. With your uh what is it, the uh the Dixie flag or whatever on the back of your pickup? Yeah, on the petty. Yeah, yeah. Better go take that down. Yeah. Yeah. Um well yeah, I think um just with all that in mind, is there a wildflower that resonates with you and why?

kevin 1:46:29

So I've been thinking about this since I listened to the first podcast.

will 1:46:33

Nice, you knew this day would come. Yes. About last year. Yeah, October ish.

melanie 1:46:41

It feels much longer. I've been thinking about this, actually.

kevin 1:46:44

Um, I think that's not anything. What's that? Because we were still in Germany and didn't know about our interview even. Oh, right, yeah, right. Um You needed something to think about. That being said, uh there's none, you know, I kind of identify myself with.

will 1:47:05

Sure.

kevin 1:47:05

That's kind of what the question is. Um I I would just say dandelions. Okay. Because I think they're like overlooked really easy. Like, you know, it's the one you know, like one of the first flowers you know, and so it's like nothing new anymore, but they're actually such amazing flowers, they're so beautiful. Yeah. They're so healthy, and like every part of it is pretty much edible. I don't know about the stem, but probably with health benefits too. Yeah. Like they're um they're really great and they have a really cool name. Yeah, they do. You know, it's not just Lily or Dana.

will 1:47:43

My wife's name is literally Lily.

melanie 1:47:45

What are you saying then?

will 1:47:46

What are you saying about Lily?

kevin 1:47:48

Sorry, Lily. No, but you know, it's a pretty unique name. It's just like really, like, you know, you you if you had just had like a green field or so, you can see a den line from like super far away. Right. Just because it's so bright and it is a trippy name, you're right.

will 1:48:01

Yeah, yeah. It's literally got a lion in it. What's that again?

melanie 1:48:07

They're like the first bee food too. Oh, okay, wow. So they come out and they're like that's what they can go to because they bloom pretty early and they bloom again in fall. That's something cool too.

kevin 1:48:17

I just like them because they're like so simple you think, but they're actually so amazing.

will 1:48:21

Well, I like it too, because I mean it's like we view them like you said earlier, Melanie, it's like like a weed.

melanie 1:48:26

It's like the main thing people are trying to use, whatever it's called.

will 1:48:28

Like weed killer on, right? Or whatever. Yeah.

kevin 1:48:31

When they have the leaves upgrading salad or the blossoms.

will 1:48:34

Right. Yeah, seriously. Foraging salad.

melanie/kevin 1:48:36

Yeah. The roots are awesome for living. So I would say that. Mm-hmm. It's a good one.

will 1:48:45

Gotta put a ball over my face. Yeah. Exactly.

melanie 1:48:50

I guess it's my turn.

will 1:48:51

Yeah.

melanie 1:48:52

So this question challenges me because learning about herbs and seeing weeds as like treasures for a few years now, it's almost a little bit like, oh, I see myself as a wildflower is a feels a little against my nature.

will 1:49:08

Sure.

melanie 1:49:08

If if you could. I don't know. So I would say in the same way that he doesn't necessarily resonate. I don't want to be like, I am Yarrow, but I love Yarrow. It's the first herb I learned to forage and identify. The leaves are amazing. I have it tattooed on my arm.

will 1:49:25

Right, yeah, I was gonna say it's literally on me now.

melanie 1:49:29

Um it's healed like a lot of things, it's relieved a lot of like symptoms for me by drinking its tea. The flowers are freaking adorable. Leaves are like that's my like it's everywhere. Like once it starts growing, it just like is perennial, it just keeps growing. Um yeah.

will 1:49:48

No, I love that.

melanie 1:49:49

I would have that if I can go back and know how to forage for our wedding, I would have that as my bouquet. Uh huh. Like just straight up yarrow.

will 1:49:56

Yeah.

melanie 1:49:57

Um it's really good for the blood and your body and everything, and yeah. It's awesome.

will 1:50:03

The healing element is huge, right?

melanie 1:50:06

Yeah, and it kind of just it works for like a lot of different people, a lot of different constitutions and body types and stuff.

will 1:50:13

Right, totally. Yeah. I love that. Those are well of course my brain works like this, but Kevin's being like Dandelion is like lion, like protector. And then hearing this like um Yarrow, healing, peacemaker, you know, it's like that's you. That's it's just like that's awesome. That's so you guys too. So very nice. Yeah, oh yeah, exactly.

unknown 1:50:37

Yeah.

will 1:50:38

I love that how prepared you came to I know. I've been thinking about it.

melanie 1:50:41

I think a few weeks ago he was like, I'm Dandelion. And I was like, Oh, okay.

will 1:50:46

Yeah, exactly. And then I was like, I think there's a Witcher character named Dandelion too, isn't it? You guys are not alike, that's for sure. Okay, yeah. Like a bad guy. Yeah, that's right. Okay. He's just kind of like a fluzy type character, I think.

melanie/kevin 1:51:04

That's cool. Uh yeah.

will 1:51:07

Anything else? I think that was kind of like it's like my last question, my wrap-up question.

melanie 1:51:12

Uh um We gotta do like a part two because I feel like our story was like a main conversation. It was. Which is awesome.

will 1:51:20

But I think part of what I'm realizing now too is like it could be interesting to even do like an individual take on things as well at some point. Yeah. You know, depending on the road. Yeah, exactly. Give you guys a little more time to, you know, evolve.

kevin 1:51:41

We've through just uh situation, like being in Germany waiting and all that, we just learn to slow down. And I think you talked about something like this in your first episode, like you know, like acknowledging wildflowers that you know you think are weeds or whatever. Right, totally. And then just take the um situation or like the phase of life you're in and be there a hundred percent. You know, yeah, like you're there anyway, so just be there completely.

will 1:52:13

Right, yeah.

melanie 1:52:13

Find the beauty in it.

will 1:52:15

Yeah, yeah.

melanie 1:52:16

Yeah.

will 1:52:17

No, absolutely. No, thank you guys for sharing your story too. I mean, as I was writing this up, it was just like I think your story felt like the most natural, like, obviously, like way of like going about you two as a book bokeh episode, but also just like there like you guys said God's worked through that story so much. And like I know even um like having Ika on last year and just like her story of them being separated for like three years after being married. I know she found like a lot of comfort in like you guys' story of like, you know, the long distance, but then also like waiting to get here, yeah. And now you're here, and now they're here. And there's just so much like I don't know, like I don't think that you could properly put into words now the longing or the pain felt at those different times of just like, uh, why has this not gone through yet? Like 26 months of waiting is like so long, but like here you are.

melanie 1:53:19

The moments of wondering if it would even work too.

will 1:53:21

Right, yeah.

melanie 1:53:22

Like will we get approved?

will 1:53:23

Oh yeah.

melanie 1:53:24

Kind of.

kevin 1:53:26

Yeah, because we we exceeded the estimated time by USCIS, like the official estimated for our like case. We exceeded that by like 12 months or so. Felt pretty wrong. Yeah. Yeah.

will 1:53:40

Oh no when we're not worthy. Yeah. Then you have like this less than 10 minute interview with a super friendly person. Yeah, it's like we're not the problem. It's in the right place. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

melanie 1:53:52

But I think hopefully it will like be a beacon of light for other people in seasons of waiting and stuff, because like you said, like now we're in another season of waiting in a different way. But it's like that's just a lot of life. It really is, yeah. So it's like to not focus necessarily on where you want to get, but like then if you do that, life moves really fast. It does. Like you end up in December 9th or whatever day it is today.

will 1:54:17

Right.

melanie 1:54:17

Like without seeing the beauty around you and like noticing the little things and stuff, so just kind of trying to find the balance of looking forward to what's to come, but like also being okay with being where you're at.

will 1:54:30

Yeah, totally.

melanie 1:54:31

Or like how now I can recognize things about our season of waiting in Germany and kind of miss it even.

will 1:54:37

Yes, exactly.

melanie 1:54:39

Like cherish what you have in front of you.

will 1:54:41

Yeah, totally. Um yeah, again, acknowledging you guys doing a good job doing and like being present in the waiting, but like that's yeah. Yeah.

melanie 1:54:50

Don't miss the laggy phone calls we had with you either. No. You say a joke, and it's like, wait, what?

kevin 1:54:57

I was like, oh, did you not like the joke?

melanie 1:54:59

Yeah, yeah.

will 1:55:01

Exactly.

melanie 1:55:02

I really vividly remember that.

will 1:55:03

So that's funny. And just being really sad for like the next 20 minutes. You okay? Oh, you didn't like my joke. Yeah, exactly. Now those are always fun phone calls too, because it's like, how do we fit like the last month of life into like a two-hour phone call?

melanie 1:55:21

Yeah, like with a six-hour time difference and yeah, oh right, exactly.

will 1:55:26

Yeah, seriously. But yeah.

melanie 1:55:28

Now we're face to face.

will 1:55:29

Yeah, it's beautiful. Cool. So many, so many things come to fruition just right now already. So thanks for being willing to come on here and share and just acknowledge, you know, everything's that you've gone through and getting to be here.

melanie/kevin 1:55:42

Thanks for hanging.

will 1:55:43

Yeah, totally.

melanie/kevin 1:55:44

Actually, really fun.

will 1:55:46

Good. Was that was that easier than you thought it was gonna be? A little more natural?

melanie/kevin 1:55:49

Definitely not as nerve-wracking at.

will 1:55:51

Okay, good.

melanie/kevin 1:55:51

Yeah. Yeah, maybe have a little space eater next to it.

will 1:55:57

It's right there, man. It's thankfully one of these warmer December days, but my goodness, it is cold out here. It is cold.

melanie 1:56:02

I'm seeing our eyes are breath.

will 1:56:05

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Uh yeah.

kevin 1:56:07

But we're also thankful for that, right?

will 1:56:09

Mm-hmm. Oh, really? There we go.

kevin 1:56:12

There it is.

will 1:56:13

Well, thanks so much, you guys. Alright, peace out.