Ep 22 - Faith & Quantum Mechanics: Bridging the Unseen with Dr. Timothy Jennings - Part 1

Episode 22

In this thought-provoking episode of The Truth Seeker’s Guide, we dive deep into the mysterious intersections of faith and quantum mechanics with Dr. Timothy Jennings.

How does the unseen world that quantum physics describes connect to the spiritual realities that faith reveals?

Is belief just an act of the mind — or is it wired into the very fabric of the universe?

Join us as Dr. Jennings unpacks how concepts like unseen forces, and the role of consciousness mirror timeless spiritual truths.

Prepare to challenge the boundaries of what you thought you knew — and to discover a deeper, unseen order behind both science and faith.

Transcript

Felipe Aristizabal (00:00.114)
So if I mess up, might just start the question again, kind of repeat it. So yeah, don't mind that. All right, perfect. All right.

Felipe Aristizabal (00:12.156)
All right, well, welcome to the True Seekers Guide. I wanted to, again, thank you again for coming and joining us today. It's very exciting for me because I've been really interested in, once I've been on this process of mind renewal with the Spirit and the Word of God, I really, I was actually dabbling into a lot of neuroscience and quantum mechanics, very little of it, I don't know much, but at least enough to try to see how things would correlate together. And it was just amazing how...

things started coming together in different ways, like being able to see the same truth in different languages or different kind of ways of looking at it. But this is how I came across your show. But today, I wanted to let's get started now. All right, so today, I have a special guest, a special speaker today, Dr. Timothy Jennings. Timothy R. Jennings, MD is a board certified psychiatrist, master psycho-co-pharm- psycho-

My goodness. Psychopharmacologist. Let's start that over. Timothy R. Jennings MD is a board certified psychiatrist, master psycho-com-uh. Ironically, I practiced this word because I was already stumbling on it. Psychopharmacologist. All right, so let's start that. Timothy R. Jennings MD is a board certified psychiatrist.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:11.684)
Psychopharmacologist.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:23.192)
Seco Farm, Seco Farm Ecologist.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:36.84)
Master Psychopharmacologist, Distinguished Life Fellow of the American Psychiatric Association, Fellow of the Southern Psychiatric Association, and an international speaker. He served as president of the Southern and Tennessee Psychiatric Association and is president and founder of Common Reason Ministries. Dr. Jennings has authorized

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:46.2)
Psychiatric.

Felipe Aristizabal (02:05.03)
I mean, has authored many books, including The God-Shaped Brain and The God-Shaped Heart and The Aging Brain. All right. Well, let me just do that one more take on that for you. I stumbled over that real quick. Today we have Dr. Timothy Jennings. Timothy R. Jennings, MD, is a board-certified psychiatrist, master psychopharmacologist, distinguished life fellow of the American Psychiatric Association.

Fellow of the Southern Psychiatric Association and an international speaker. He served as president of the Southern and Tennessee Psychiatric Association and is president and founder of Common Reason Ministries. Dr. Jennings has authored many books, including The God-Shaped Brain and The God-Shaped Heart and The Aging Brain. Well, again, thank you for joining us today. I appreciate that. And I wanted to first go over with you how I came across

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (02:56.43)
Thank you for having me, Philippe.

Felipe Aristizabal (03:03.752)
your information and you and yourself. I was, as I mentioned, was dabbling a little bit into understanding truth for a long time, and this is just very brief. And I got converted over 10 years ago, but the issue was that little by little, even though I felt a really, a really, an awakening in the beginning, I kind of eased back into darkness and I didn't understand why I couldn't feel that.

Basically, all it came down to when I started looking for truth and searching for truth in all different aspects, I found it in the mind renewal and understanding how by the way I was thinking was affecting my actions and that's what I was controlling. So in that path, I also dabbled into neuroscience and quantum mechanics a little bit. And that's how I came across your YouTube channel. And I saw the quantum mechanics and spiritual warfare. I think it was angels and demons and

things that you were speaking about. And through that, it became me listening to you more. I really enjoy what I heard. I really enjoy everything you were speaking about. And I wanted to get you on the show so maybe you can help me understand it better and help others understand it better and clarify a little more of everything. And since then, I've been reading your book, The God-Shaped Brain. I did finish it. Very, very great book. I really enjoyed it. And I'm excited to read more of your books. And I wanted to open with this.

First question, which was, what first sparked your interest in connecting faith with science, especially quantum mechanics?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (04:39.672)
Well, the faith in science, I've been on a journey ever since I guess started college. When I started college, many of my professors in the sciences, pre-med, the sciences, chemistry, biology, and so forth, my professors, agnostic, atheist, didn't believe in God. And so constantly being challenged by the academics with a belief in God, and I'm a rational person, I don't want to believe magic or-

myth or superstition. And so I had an interest early on in my career to formulate beliefs that are rational, reasonable, evidence-based, sustainable. And so I began a journey long ago of integrating my understanding of scripture or maybe even requiring, if you will, my understanding of scripture and science to always harmonize. If I'm misunderstanding and there's a contradiction, apparently, then I'm misunderstanding, I'm either misunderstanding the science

or I'm misunderstanding the scripture. And so I began this journey and I'm still on that journey. And then when I went into my psychiatric residency, I was challenged by my professors of psychiatry who kind of tongue in cheek made a little fun of us, know, plebes that still believe in the myth of the Bible as they were all enlightened and godless and so forth. And that also challenged me to dig in and spend a lot of time researching.

the the science and and the neuroscience and also though the principles that are taught in scripture to again come to a balanced and cohesive understanding and there's nothing i've studied that is ever really shown contradiction rightly understood there's always harmony because my understanding of reality is that there is a creator god who built reality and he inspired the the scriptures and so rightly understood there will always be harmony and then as i began treating patients i

had to have answers that actually work in reality. Platitudes or proclamations don't bring healing. So I needed to understand the operations of the human being biologically, psychologically, and spiritually so that I could then identify when people are symptomatic and struggling to bring to bear in their lives interventions that restore them to wellness and health, which requires, we understand if you want to use a simple term, the laws of health, the laws upon which

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (07:07.102)
life are built to operate. so that's the overview of what I got, why I got interested in it, because I've always wanted to know how reality worked and ultimately I want to be able to bring healing to my patients.

Felipe Aristizabal (07:17.12)
Awesome. Yeah, I find it that truth should be something that once understood, it should be understood and you should be able to explain it. Even if the other person might not completely understand it, the person who does understand it should be able to explain it. And the reason I say this is because sometimes people will say, oh, well, you don't understand because it's by the spirit only. You know what I mean? of thing. And then they kind of close it off that way. people won't. And so I like.

looking at from that perspective, as you mentioned.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (07:48.473)
Well, let me comment on what you just said, because you're right. That's an area of deception. The Bible tells us the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of truth. The Spirit of truth. And so the Holy Spirit will always lead to an enlightenment of truth, where we actually understand how things work. It might be true that we start the journey with a conviction we can't understand, but the Holy Spirit will be inspiring us to reason, to seek evidence, to seek facts. Because if you believe the biblical worldview, the biblical narrative,

Felipe Aristizabal (07:56.146)
Okay.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (08:15.5)
There is a warfare with a intelligent entity who is described as the father of lies, who has no truth on his side. So that side of the war, those entities want to get people to believe things disconnected from objective, measurable, definable truth. And often that goes through emotions and feelings, something that feels really good, but you can't objectively define it or measure it.

Felipe Aristizabal (08:41.262)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, and I just feel like sometimes it's easy to say this is the truth, but it's just got to be something you understand by the Spirit without even trying to somehow explain it. And so I always felt that it wasn't enough for me. You know, it wasn't enough for me. And like you said, I mean, you do have to knock for God to open the door. So you do have to seek truth individually. And most of us sometimes may not. But...

But once you seek it, once the Holy Spirit reveals it to us, then I feel at that moment it's something we can now live, experience, and share with others in that way.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (09:21.162)
And let me take it even a step further. When I believe God wants from us, he wants the maturity of people who have come to understand him, his methods, his principles, and are in free agreement and in fact, adoration of him because we understand. And there's a difference between believing a truth and what you were alluding to a moment ago, understanding why it's true. So think about learning mathematics.

and you go to a math teacher and the math teacher tells you 2 plus 2 is 4, which is true. And you go home and tell your parents, hey, I learned today 2 plus 2 is 4. And the parents say, explain to me why that's true. And you say, because the teacher said so. Well, it's the right answer, but it's a terrible reason.

Felipe Aristizabal (10:02.288)
Right. Right.

Felipe Aristizabal (10:06.824)
And I really think that it really helps us overcome what God wants us to overcome when we understand it, instead of just trying to, meaning like once the truth is revealed in a way and you could see, let's call it in the spirit, let's say, or in ways that you don't see. So the easiest example I would say is if someone is.

very angry and frustrated and angry, and they're in a position where you might see the physical aspect of them attacking you, but you understand in the spirit that they're actually suffering and they're in pain and they're going through something that's causing this problem. And it allows you to, instead of defending yourself as a reflex in our nature, but we can now pray for them and see it in a different light. And it's easier to do that when you understand it, if that makes sense.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (10:58.316)
Yeah, that's exactly right. So there's a difference between understanding addition, subtraction, multiplication, division, and memorizing the correct answers to math problems from an answer key. And many people who, like within the Christian faith, there are many people who study the Bible to memorize Bible answers, but never understanding the principles of God described in scripture that are the reason those are the Bible answers. Yeah.

Felipe Aristizabal (11:24.604)
Yeah, exactly. And that's why I've been enjoying seeking truth a lot, because not only is it allowing me to find true peace and joy in this biblical truth, but then, of course, it overflows to the point where now I could see things better and help others because I have something I can give them, you know, in that case. OK, and if observation affects...

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (11:44.834)
Yeah, exactly.

Felipe Aristizabal (11:51.848)
affect, I'm sorry, if observation affects reality on a quantum level, could this relate to the concept of faith shaping our lives?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (12:02.242)
So for those who aren't familiar with what you, the premise or underlying foundation of that question, within the theory of quantum mechanics, matter can be either a mass at a point in time or a wave that extends through time. And when they've done the studies, for instance, with electrons, electrons can either be a wave or it can be a particle. And it remains in this position of uncertainty in the studies.

until it's examined or measured. And the act of examining or measuring it determines the outcome of what the particle ultimately direction it goes. And so this is what's called the observer effect. The interaction that we have with the world around us has an impact to influence and change the world around us. That's the idea of quantum mechanics. So within our brain, our thoughts, our choices, our actions have a

Felipe Aristizabal (12:38.63)
Mm-hmm.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (12:58.526)
impact to change the neural structure and wiring of our brain which changes the resonant harmonic of our being or our spirit if you will. And so the quantum theory which has been measured scientifically with certain studies is a scientific basis for the freedom of contents and the freedom of choice. That our choices do have impact on how things turn out. Things are not predetermined in some way.

Felipe Aristizabal (13:22.92)
Okay, and one other question I had here was, does quantum theory give us a new way to understand omnipresence or God being outside of time?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (13:36.727)
It certainly gives a basis, we understand string theory, that string theory is that all matter is created of these infinitesimally small strings, and it's the vibration of the strings that actually determine the mass of the matter. And we just want to make sure we stay away from pantheism, which pantheism teaches that God is in all things, rather than the biblical view that God has created and sustains all things. That's a little bit different.

So if you get a piece of wood or a piece of metal, you don't have a piece of God. God is not in all things, even though he sustains all things and can be in all places. That's my view of it. So yes, all things are created by him and for him and all things are sustained by him through these quantum connections, but that doesn't mean that God is in everything. I just wanna put that pantheism idea to rest.

Felipe Aristizabal (14:29.48)
So I guess when you say that, you're saying that his, let's call it his life force is holding everything and is in everything, but his, let's call it conscience is not in everything. Is that a word?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (14:42.414)
Yeah, he's an individual. has personality, identity, has individuality. so, pantheism leads to theories like, you know, we search for the God within us because we're all part of God type thing. so, rather than God as an individual, we have to have a personal relationship with him, just like you might have a person on the Bible using the metaphor of marriage. You can come into union or intimacy or oneness with your wife, but you two are still separate individuals.

Felipe Aristizabal (14:56.209)
Okay.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (15:11.842)
She doesn't, to have love in your heart for your wife does not make your wife actually reside inside you.

Felipe Aristizabal (15:21.682)
Right. Gotcha. Yes. And the reason I say, and we talk about this is because there's, to me, it's, and this is one of the reasons we're even here on this planet right now, because I look at it like, and I think it's something you mentioned before that I've always agreed on, but it was a nice way you put it. was God can create sentient beings, but he can't create character. Is that right?

And the reason I like that is because it makes it pretty clear that, let's say, in eternity, there is no time, so there is no growth, there is no maturing, there is no... It's almost like once you develop... Once you have a character or whatever that character can be, in eternity, it's that character forever, let's say. There is no change. So for us to even enter an eternity with...

value of eternity and value of life and choosing God free willingly, we had to be placed almost in like a universe of time for this spirit to mature and to grow and to be able to enter this eternity once.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (16:32.814)
So I would describe it slightly differently because the way I see God as creator, he is an infinite being, infinite in power, infinite in knowledge, who is the creator of all things. He created space, energy, matter, life. He creates time. He lives outside of time. My understanding is created beings, we don't create matter. We don't create space. We don't create energy. We operate within that. We also don't create time.

Felipe Aristizabal (16:35.633)
Okay.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (17:02.892)
We operate in the stream of time that God has created. Whether it's here or in eternity future, we still are linear beings who move through time. There will be a past, present, and a future.

Felipe Aristizabal (17:15.72)
So you're saying in eternity there will be a time for us.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (17:19.246)
So, yes, so my understanding is that we never become infinite dots.

Felipe Aristizabal (17:26.064)
Okay, gotcha.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (17:27.726)
So we don't, and so through all eternity future, we are on an eternal journey of growing in our knowledge, experience, appreciation, love, perspectives of all things infinite, which are God. And so whatever we know today, and I know in my own short life on this earth, I have grown in my love, appreciation, discernment for infinite God, but I never become an infinite God. So I will never.

Felipe Aristizabal (17:43.037)
Mm-hmm.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (17:57.327)
close that gap. It's just internal moving forward. Now character though is loyalty, faithfulness, trustworthiness, other centered love, you know, these types of elements. We solidify in that and spend eternity with that mature Christ-like character, but that doesn't mean we have all knowledge. We will grow in knowledge and understanding and even skills and abilities. I don't know how to play a musical instrument, but in heaven I very well may learn one.

Felipe Aristizabal (18:26.77)
Gotcha. That's interesting. I never saw it that way. And so because I mean, I believe also the same, I'm sure, as you as far as we have a new earth and new, new heaven, a new body. And, and but you mentioned something about this that, so for example, there's there is we have a human spirit, we have the Holy Spirit, and then we have the soul in the body. Now,

You mentioned when we pass, or let's call it when we sleep, right? Like Christ says, when we sleep, our body dies. you mentioned, I always thought in a way that our soul and our human spirit would be kind of like together in a sense, in a way, it would be one, let's say. But you were saying that the spirit will go back to God. Would that be the human spirit or the life force spirit or?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (19:23.406)
So here's how I understand scripture. In Eden, God formed a body out of the mud or the dirt of the earth. He breathed into that body the breath of life, and Adam became a living being or soul. Now, throughout scripture, Old and New Testament, in the Old is Hebrew and the New Testament is Greek, they describe humanity with three parts. A body, a soul, and a spirit.

Felipe Aristizabal (19:26.13)
Okay.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (19:53.005)
The body, the Greek word for body is soma. It is the physical part of our being. And I like to use the metaphor of a computer for an operational computer. The body then would be analogous to the hardware, the machine itself. Hardware, screen, all that stuff, our eyes, our fingers, the body, including the brain. The Greek word for soul is psyche, P-S-Y-C, or P-S in the Greek, P-S-U, but it's translated in English, P-S-Y-C-E.

CHE, psyche, where we get psychiatry and psychology, and it means our individuality, our unique identity, our personhood. And it would be analogous to the computer's software, not just the operating system, but all of the pictures and documents and everything that makes your computer uniquely yours. And then the Greek word for the breath of life, excuse me, for the spirit is,

P-N, Pneuma, it's pronounced Pneuma in Greek. We say Pneuma in English like Pneumonia or Pneumatic. The P is silent in English, but in the Greek they pronounce it. And that word in the English Bible is translated, that one Greek word, Pneuma, is translated as wind, as spirit, as ghost, as in Holy Ghost, or breath, as in the breath of life. You breathe in the animating energy. And so in the biblical narrative,

We have, and just like a computer, that would be analogous to computers, electricity, the energy, the animating energy. And so to have an operational computer, you need a hardware, you need software, and you need electrical energy. All three have to be together to be operational. If it runs out of electricity, runs out of power, goes into sleep mode. And this is old and New Testament alike, describe that what we call death, the Bible calls sleep until resurrection. And, and this is quite distinct from the, Eastern philosophies in Buddha.

Eastern philosophies in Buddha taught that the animating energy, your spirit and your soul are actually merged into one entity that at death becomes disembodied and floats around and recycles back into new forms of living. That's Eastern. The biblical narrative actually describes the three parts separate. The body turns back to dust.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (22:13.518)
The spirit, Ecclesiastes 12.7, says, returns to God who gave it. The animating energy returns to God. But the soul, the psyche, the individuality is, lots of text to show this, I'll just cut to the chase, safe with Christ in heaven, stored in what modern language would say, the heavenly servers, the biblical languages in the Lamb's Book of Life. And what does it say? It's stored there, the names of the people, and then Bible names represent character individuality. So the soul is with Christ until...

He brings them with him, says in Thessalonians, and downloads them into upgraded hardware, and they live again at the resurrection.

Felipe Aristizabal (22:49.32)
So at that point it would be like basically when the computer loses power or let's just say the hardware malfunctions and it's not working, then the energy goes back to the source where the energy comes from.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (23:05.102)
In our state, yes, there's limits to the electricity, but yes, in our situation, our life, my understanding is human beings do not have life original to themselves. Our life is given to us by God who created us and then breathed into Adam the breath of life.

Felipe Aristizabal (23:21.522)
So then the software will be uploaded on a cloud, let's say, which is with Jesus, the book of life, like you mentioned. And when the new earth and new heaven arrives and we're given new bodies, it's almost like God is plugging us back up to his energy, to his life with a new hardware.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (23:38.159)
Well, it says in Thessalonians, Paul says, I don't want you to grieve like those who have no hope about those who have fallen asleep. We know that Christ will return and bring with him those who have fallen asleep in him. And the voice of the archangel, the trumpet called God and the dead in Christ will rise first. And so in this one verse, you have the righteous dead coming up out of the ground, but also the righteous dead coming down from heaven described in a state of sleep until that moment when they wake up. So that's why, yes.

Felipe Aristizabal (24:08.327)
Okay. And I had, so I, like one of the things that I've seen, by the way, that's really interesting, I like that analogy with the computer and everything else, because it clarifies a lot.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (24:21.678)
and there's one of the texts that may throw at you. That's in Matthew chapter 10, where Jesus said, don't be afraid of the one who can destroy the body but cannot destroy the soul. Don't be afraid of the one. It'd be like, if somebody's got your computer and you know all of your data's backed up on a cloud, say don't be afraid of the one who can destroy the machine but can't destroy all your data. That is basically what he's saying, yeah.

Felipe Aristizabal (24:32.2)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (24:44.86)
Right. No, for real. Amen. All right. And then is, would you say is consciousness something we generate or something we receive like a radio receiver?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (25:01.762)
no, that's an interesting question. My understanding is consciousness is the product of how God has built our human being to function. So the body that he made in Eden was not conscious until he breathed into the breath of life. But as soon as he animated that the way our brains work, our brains are constructed that we have quantum processes happen in our brains that create consciousness.

and it's the quantum processes that create the consciousness there. that's why, you if you think about Newtonian physics, Newtonian physics are like friction, motion, gravity, the physics of big things, that's the physics of the operations of the heart pumping blood, the neurochemistry, the electrical signals in our brain, and none of that explains consciousness. It is the substructures and the infinitely small on the quantum level that explains

consciousness. so, so, but it's emergent from the operations of the brain itself, as I understand it.

Felipe Aristizabal (26:06.632)
Awesome, no, that sounds right. So you would say it's like a reaction of what God did. When He breathed the life into our body, it makes the soul, and through that process, it creates the conscience. Something like that?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (26:28.972)
Yes, and so the brain itself after it became alive as God gave it the breath of life, generates consciousness, awareness, thought patterns and processes that allow for independent decision making. And this would be the operation of your mind, not your brain, if I can explain this to you. Your brain ultimately does not make decisions. Your mind makes decisions. Your brain operates the...

Felipe Aristizabal (26:51.377)
Okay.

Felipe Aristizabal (26:56.008)
like an interface you would say, kind of like a receiver interface that translates what your mind thinks into this physical world. You would say something like that?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (27:06.562)
Yeah, okay. So if, for instance, if you, if you meet it, meet a girl and, and, she, she, and you fall in love and she lives in France and you decide to move to France to be with her and decide to, to take French, your brain didn't make any of those decisions. Your individuality person had made those decisions. And as soon as you start studying French, your brain begins adapting and creating new pathways.

that will correspond to your proficiency as your language increases, your enunciation, your syntax increases, all of those things happen. We could track your brain structure changing, but your brain structure is only changing in response to the decisions your mind is making.

Felipe Aristizabal (27:46.92)
So in other words, like the subconscious mind in a way.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (27:49.623)
Not subconscious, very conscious. If you fall in love and you make a decision to go learn French, you can make a decision for whatever reason. I want to learn piano. I want to learn banjo. You start taking lessons. Your brain didn't make the choice. Your brain responds to the choice and begins creating new pathways to make you efficient in it. If you decide to take ski lessons or surfboard lessons or anything else you decide to do, your brain begins changing based on the decisions you're making, but the brain didn't make the decision to do that.

Felipe Aristizabal (28:05.019)
Okay.

Felipe Aristizabal (28:16.56)
Okay. So that's why our software is, you would say it's influenced by a spiritual signal, let's call it.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (28:27.854)
So let's talk about what the spirit is. The spirit, as I understand it, simply, and Jesus used the metaphor of wind, because the same word in the New Testament translated spirit is translated wind. Wind, you cannot see it. You can see stuff moving in the wind, but even in a strong wind, you can't see the wind. You can just see the stuff moving in the wind. But wind is energy. Wind moves things. So it's a great metaphor for the spirit. The spirit then is animating energy.

it moves. And a ship on a lake can put a sail up and can be moved by the wind, or a ship can pull its sail down and tack against the wind and resist it. Okay, likewise, the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of God moves or blows in one direction. It blows in the direction of love, truth, and trust. This is where it blows. Right, and we can put up our

Felipe Aristizabal (29:05.896)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (29:18.362)
we align with at that point.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (29:22.912)
individuality, our hearts, our sales, if you will, and we can be filled or animated by a spirit of love, truth, trust. And that's how Adam came into the world. He was animated with a spirit of love, truth, trust, and they had no fear. They had no sin. But then something changed. And what changed was they had a spiritual contamination. Believing the lies caused their spirits to become

infected with fear and selfishness. And so they're not animated by selfless love and trust. They're animated now by fear. As soon as they sinned, they ran and hid because they're afraid. And so fear leads to me first. This is the survival of the fittest drive we see. And so in the world today, there's only two spiritual drivers. The drive of greater love has no man that can give his life for a friend. This is the spirit of God, the Holy Spirit, truth and love. Or the driver of fear and selfishness, the carnal drive, the drivers of survival drive.

And every human being is in a battle to what animates them, what motivates them, what drives them to action. And what you said a moment ago was very powerful when you said, you know, we see somebody attacking us. If we have spiritual discernment, we recognize that they have something inside them and we, and then they're sick. They're spiritually sick. They have fear, they have selfishness, they're acting out in some unloving way. And we want to pray that they have a spiritual renewal or rebirth where they have a new animating energy.

and they are turned from an enemy into a friend.

Felipe Aristizabal (30:53.928)
Yep, and I think that analogy of the sailboat and the wind and the lining is an amazing analogy. It really helps with what we're doing with the Spirit. And that you also touched on Adam and Eve. wanted to ask you, now I know, for example, we know that God is the creator and we know that the, let's call Satan, he created being. not in any way, shape, form.

a threat to God in a way. Let's say that. Like, I could imagine if God wanted to disappear Satan, he'd just blink an eye, you know, or whatever. So the point is that some people believe, OK, well, you know, Adam and Eve chose to sin, but why did God put the tree of good and evil in the garden? Why do He allow the snake to come in? I look at it more as if, and not in a dualistic way, but more of like we can't have free will or choose God without there being a contrast.

or the character that we're speaking about, growth, can't be grown without us actually leaving the garden and going through this whole process that we're going through. Because I believe it's still the evolutionary creation of God that's happening as we speak still today. Do you see that in any way?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (32:06.798)
I think you've got a really good core point that you're and it's absolutely true. Remember the tree was the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Not the tree of knowledge of evil. It was a tree of knowledge of good and evil. Now this is not, as I understand it, it was not the tree of didactic education. It was not the tree of cognitive comprehension. This is in the Bible, the tree of knowing through experience.

Felipe Aristizabal (32:18.375)
Right.

Felipe Aristizabal (32:25.041)
Okay.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (32:33.418)
And so they had a choice at that tree and it was put there for their maturity and development because you're exactly right. Without, without free will choices, without thinking, without making your own decision, you can't mature, you can't develop, you're just a robot, you can't love. And so the tree was put there in my view, for them to exercise their understanding, their ability to think and power of choice for them in God's will to know loyalty, trust, faithfulness, love, to reject the lie and know through experience.

maturity of character in Christlikeness. They could have known that by saying no to the lie. However, if they chose to believe the lie, then what did they know? They know fear, they know selfishness, they know guilt, they know shame, and they know all the horrible pains, and thus now they know, not by understanding, but by experience, evil. And so it was a tree of reality. Make your choice what you're gonna know in your being, and that's where they corrupted their spirit from a spirit of love and trust.

They infected their spirit with fear and selfishness and we all inherit that because that is the only animating breath of life they have to share. When they reproduce, they create beings in their image and we're born with a spirit of fear.

Felipe Aristizabal (33:47.144)
And that's why I said earlier that, you know, because at that point, God was like, well, now that they've eaten from partaking from the tree of knowledge of good and evil, we can't let them eat from the tree of life. And they kicked him out of the garden, almost saying like, because they have chose this, made this choice. Now, this is a disease or a poison that they have that if we allow them to eat from the tree of life, it will bring it into like, let's say eternity or the or that kind of.

Does that even make sense in any way?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (34:19.598)
So again, my view is that the tree of life was provided in my view, my view, life comes from God. He breathed into them the breath of life. And then he created them because our life comes from God. But we have to eat fruits, nuts, grains, vegetables, food that comes off trees in order to sustain the life that God gave us. And so we don't have the tree of life, but we still have trees and other plants God made that produce food that sustain our life.

Felipe Aristizabal (34:29.97)
Okay.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (34:48.556)
My view of the tree of life was simply a tree that had a particular type of nutrition that prevented aging. There would be no decay. There'd be no aging. It's all dead. And God removed it and didn't allow them access because it wouldn't have prevented Cain from crushing Abel's head. It wouldn't have prevented a nuclear fission at Hiroshima and Nagasaki. It wouldn't have beheading. It would have just prevented aging. And if we had a tree, the Fountain of Youth, Bavaria Fountain of Youth on this planet in a world in which

Felipe Aristizabal (34:57.19)
Mm-hmm.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (35:17.836)
this sinful carnal fear driven stuff controls, who do you think controls that tree? The righteous or the wicked? And so my view is in God's mercy, remove the tree. So there will not be these very evil, desperate people that live basically without aging on this planet. The most wicked, even if human law doesn't bring them to justice, will eventually age out and die. And so I think it was an act of mercy in a world of sin to

to limit what the wicked could do, but I didn't see the tree as magic that provide eternal life. Eternal life comes from Jesus Christ and from God.

Felipe Aristizabal (35:54.056)
Well, I was just going to say that some people believe that the tree of life is Jesus Christ in a way of saying it symbolically also, like that the tree of life was Jesus and it was brought back to us through and only through Jesus. Would you say that would be accurate?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (36:11.832)
Well, I actually think there was a real tree that had real fruit that just prevented aging. It provided perfect genetic and physiological so there was no decay and you didn't age at all. But ultimately life didn't start there just like when we again eat food, it provides good nutrition and keeps our bodies healthy, but life doesn't start with the food, it started with God.

Felipe Aristizabal (36:30.748)
Gotcha. Now that makes sense. Amazing. That clarifies a lot. And do you believe free will exists in a deterministic or a probabilistic universe?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (36:43.224)
So tell me what you mean by deterministic or probabilistic.

Felipe Aristizabal (36:47.432)
Well, is it that our free will is already determined? Is it like that our choices are already made for us in a way or is it not?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (36:57.454)
So I want to be sure we're talking the same thing, because my understanding of determinism is we don't have free will. That's what determinism is. That everything is already preset, and it's fate, and it doesn't matter what you do. It's just only the illusion of free will. And if that is true, then there is no love. We're just robots. It's a simulation.

Felipe Aristizabal (37:04.005)
Right.

And no matter what, always going to choose.

Felipe Aristizabal (37:15.56)
and it defeats the whole purpose. Right, and I agree with you 100 % with that. It would defeat the whole purpose of everything, of everything that we're doing.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (37:23.02)
Yep. So, so I actually don't believe, believe that at all. I believe that, that we have free will and God foreknows our choices. He has foreknowledge, but, foreknowledge is not causality. He doesn't cause our choices. We still freely exercise them, but he knows them because he lives outside time. He's not constrained to time. but we,

Felipe Aristizabal (37:32.22)
There you go.

Felipe Aristizabal (37:37.884)
Okay.

Felipe Aristizabal (37:43.91)
Right. Right. He sees it all as one picture. We still have to wait to be revealed as time goes by. And yeah, that's exactly what I believe. I think that that's why for me, when you understand truth, things have to align with these things. If not, it's not true. And that helps me keep truth, truth. But he sees everything that we do and we're going to do.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (37:49.654)
Yes.

Felipe Aristizabal (38:12.454)
but these choices are still our free will to choose, correct?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (38:17.014)
That's exactly right. Now, you know, there are certain ideas within Christianity that we don't have free will. It got predestined, some for salvation predestined, and they take a text in Romans, those God foreknew he predestined to be conformed to the likeness of a son. Okay. And the key to understand.

Felipe Aristizabal (38:32.034)
Mm-hmm. Right, that he knew him before the birth and everything. Correct.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (38:36.62)
Right, and so the key to understanding that is the word forenew, because God lives outside of time. In life eternal, in John 17, is that they might know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ in the last cent. All those who come back into intimacy or knowledge of God are predetermined to be conformed to Christ. We're healed, we're saved. And so it's simply saying, those who God in his foreknowledge come into that intimacy with God, he's predetermined, that's what's gonna happen.

Who decides whether they have that intimacy or not? It's not God predetermining it. It's us deciding whether we open the heart to God or not.

Felipe Aristizabal (39:14.054)
Well, I guess that's where we lie also, like you said, some people believe that, like, and some people could see it differently, but let's say they say, faith, the faith in Christ or the faith you've been giving as a gift. You know what I mean by that? Like when they say that from, I think it's in Corinthians or something, like that grace through faith is a gift, you know? And so some people can interpret that as even our faith is a gift, right?

But I mean, you could always say that everything is a gift. mean, our whole life, our intelligence, our everything is a gift. So, I mean, from that standpoint, it doesn't really make it where just the faith is also a gift, like as far as that we don't really have our own belief. It's the belief God gave us. You know what I mean?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (40:07.342)
So it depends again what we mean by the word faith. In the Greek New Testament, there's one, the word is P-I-S-T-I-S, Pistis, it's translated into multiple English words. One is faith, one is belief, one is trust, another is confidence. One Greek word, four English words. And so my understanding of looking at the weight of scripture is that the best English word for the biblical concept of faith is actually trust.

Felipe Aristizabal (40:36.264)
Yes.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (40:36.824)
It's actually trust. Yeah. And so, you know, we, have trust and trust in God, but we can also, you know, everybody places trust or faith. They're all, everybody's exercising it. Some people put their faith or trust in science. Some people put their faith or trust in money. Some people put their faith and trust in people. Some people.

Felipe Aristizabal (40:59.496)
What about the faith in Christ? that only, know, because some parts of Bible will say like the Holy Spirit will, if you believe in Christ, it's because it was revealed to you by the Father.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (41:10.31)
So ultimately that is true. Spiritual things are spiritually discerned. The Holy Spirit is the spirit that is bringing truth to hearts and minds around the world. And those who have hearts that love truth, love to grow in, and I'm talking truth, they have hearts, I wanna know more, I wanna grow in truth, I'm a finite being, and they're open to be led into truth. All of those beings are ultimately led back to Jesus Christ through the work of the Holy Spirit.

but there are some people who don't want truth. And the reason I don't want truth is because certain truths we all have to face about ourselves under unpleasant truths. And ultimately, if you follow the spirit of truth, as it leads you back to Christ, it will also lead you to the place where you have to surrender your life of sin and selfishness, and you have to die to the old life and be reborn with a new heart. And that can be a uncomfortable and painful experience to look in the mirror of our own shortcomings and acknowledge we messed up.

and acknowledge we have a problem. And so some people resist that.

Felipe Aristizabal (42:10.14)
And how would you explain, let's say, do you believe God is, do you believe God will give everyone an equal opportunity to know truth, like in their lifetime? Because obviously we get into the point of people maybe dying at 15 or 10 or, you know, at an age where you didn't even have enough time to process anything, you know?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (42:34.642)
So I guess what you mean by opportunity, salvation is available to everyone. Everyone. Salvation is available to everyone. But one could make the argument that a person who lives 969 years, Methuselah, has way more centuries of opportunity than all of us who live to only be 100 at the most. One can make that argument.

Felipe Aristizabal (42:39.463)
Okay.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (43:03.278)
But salvation is not based on longevity. Salvation is based on your heart's response to truth and love. Your heart's response to truth and love.

Felipe Aristizabal (43:10.354)
So you believe we all get an equal opportunity to be chosen, let's say, or does he just choose some people and others not? And then if he does do that, is it because he knows what their choices are going to be in their heart or?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (43:24.306)
So when you say he chooses, I guess I need to clarify your question. You're saying God is choosing who's saved and who's lost?

Felipe Aristizabal (43:31.816)
Well, you know how to said many will be called, but few will be chosen. Sorry. So does he call everyone or just select?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (43:41.151)
It depends what you're talking about, calling for salvation or calling for mission. See, many people confuse the callings in scripture. know, Jacob was called for a mission, Esau was not, but Esau was still called for salvation. The Jewish nation was called for a mission, but throughout all the Old Testament, they were to be a nation of a kingdom of priests to evangelize the whole world. My house would be called a...

Felipe Aristizabal (43:45.009)
Okay.

Felipe Aristizabal (43:55.494)
Okay. Interesting.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (44:08.408)
house of prayer for all peoples, it says in the Old Testament. And so the call of salvation is to the whole world. The meat shall inherit the world. For God so loved the world, not God so loved the Israelites, the whole world. So the call of salvation is for everyone, but God sometimes calls individuals or groups to certain missions for the purpose of evangelizing the world for the call of salvation. Paul says in Romans 1, verse 20, that God's divine nature

Felipe Aristizabal (44:27.282)
Gotcha.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (44:36.63)
and eternal power is seen in what he has made so that men are without excuse. They're without excuse because God has revealed himself in the way the world works and the laws written into reality. And then he goes on to say, because there's no division or chapter verses when he wrote it, in chapter two, starting verse 12, he said, those who have not heard the law, the Torah, but do by nature the things contained in the law,

or a law unto themselves, showing the laws that have been written upon their heart. And so the new covenant for the saved, is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel after that time says, Lord, I will write my law in their hearts and minds. No longer will a neighbor say to his brother, know the Lord for they all will know me, which is eternal life. And so Paul's making the case that those who not, live in a part of the world, who have not had the opportunity for an evangelist or a missionary to bring them the word of God in writing and teach them

directly about it, but they've responded to the eternal truths of God's nature as revealed in in nature 120 and they respond with a heart of love and trust Then they have the law of God written on their heart and they are still saved by Jesus Christ Even though they haven't yet heard about Jesus Christ

Felipe Aristizabal (45:40.113)
Okay.

Felipe Aristizabal (45:52.71)
Hmm. OK. Yeah, that's it. It's interesting. I've always looked at it that way. I was wasn't sure ultimately if it was, you know, an accurate way of looking at it. But but with everything we've been talking about, it lines up with truth in many ways. And as far as I have to believe, God is a just God and he's going to equally give everyone an opportunity, even if I because I do. I also believe that our choices God will use, even if it's.

So if we choose to love, then we grow fruit of love. If we choose fear, and let's just say fear in this case, then we would be almost like the fertilizers for the people who choose love to grow fruit. So like he uses everything in a sense of this is for our spiritual growth and for the people who do choose love or choose him.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (46:45.236)
I would agree with that. want to add to it though. My view after the fall, this is my view and I can make some case from scripture for it, is that whenever you see anybody choosing love, and you're critical, it's our choice. It is our choice. But we're only enabled to make a choice for love because of the working of the Holy Spirit. As soon as Adam and Eve sin, God said right there in Eden, I will put enmity, talking to the serpent, I will put enmity between you and the woman.

Felipe Aristizabal (46:48.712)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (47:03.58)
Gotcha.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (47:12.354)
Okay, so God began intervening with his Holy Spirit to give us a conviction of sin and a desire for a better life, to be free of the fear and the selfishness. And so whenever you see somebody acting in love, it's evidence of the Holy Spirit working on them and maybe working on them before they're fully converted and they're in that battle of decision and they're doing something in genuine love and that leads them to mature more in love and eventually they give their heart completely to the Lord. But my understanding is we're only empowered in our fallen state to...

to really choose love because God's intercessions through Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit.

Felipe Aristizabal (47:47.528)
Okay. And do you agree that for a believer, once we are, or at least once we accept Christ in that sense, make that decision or belief, that is crucial for us to start to, which we can call it the spiritual.

battle, the spiritual warfare, it's crucial for the believer to start this warfare and understand this warfare and renew the mind and the spirit for him to live in that victory or let's say in this case align themselves with the spirit and to be in the same harmony or frequency, let's call it.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (48:21.742)
100 % and let's talk about how that works. And this will bring together the physical and the quantum. My view of God as creator is his laws are the laws that he built reality to operate upon. Like the law of gravity, laws of physics, laws of health, but also the laws that govern operations of our mind. One of those in scripture describes as the law of worship. Second Corinthians 3, 18, by beholding we become changed. Paul says in Romans one, they,

they exchange the truth of God for lie and worship things made with their own hands and their minds have became dark and depraved and futile. In psychiatry and psychology, we call this modeling. We actually become like neurobiologically and then characterologically what we spend time adoring, esteeming, valuing, watching and engaging in. So as we choose to believe something, as we make a choice, I believe this, I like this, I prefer this, I want this and we choose it, it actually causes

changes in the substructure of our neurobiology, it's called tubular molecules, the tubular molecules change its confirmation and alignment. And that change is a resonant harmonic in us. And as we choose more and more truth by truth, I choose this truth and I apply it to my life. I choose as the Holy Spirit enlightens, we choose it and the Holy Spirit then empowers us to succeed. We are actually truth by truth changing.

the neurobiological substructure which changes the resonant harmonic, we come closer into tune with the Holy Spirit, meaning we're more sensitive. We hear the impressions and meanings of the Holy Spirit easier and easier with time. Conversely, if we choose the vile, the vulgar, the exploitive, the manipulative, the ugly, the deceitful, if we choose that to identify with, to prefer,

That changes and gets into the substructure and we become less and less and less able to hear the Holy Spirit and more and more in tune with what the Bible calls demonic spirits or evil spirits, spirits of exploitation, abuse and ugliness.

Felipe Aristizabal (50:24.252)
Yeah, that's... And so basically the way I used to explain it in a way to help people understand was, let's say, truth, God, is a radio station. And the only way to align with this signal is to go to 77.7 FM, for example, which is, let's say, Christ, you know, and through this exact frequency is the only way to clearly...

be able to receive that truth and align yourself with this truth, meaning that some people might get to 77.6 or 77.5 or 76 point and then still hear some of the truth, but it's distorted or it's not clear enough where you still get, but the way to do it is because I used to see Jesus before, which I think was my problem was as an external Jesus in the sense that I used to see him as part of the stories and someone that I could never be or things like that or be like, but.

once I started realizing this truth, I realized that Jesus is not just like, how do I tune into this frequency? He's something internal that's showing us how to transform from within. And with it through His guidance of the Holy Spirit, we can transform from within. But it's the only way to align to this frequency of God, of truth. Would that be a way to explain that?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (51:41.027)
Yeah, anchored in the inspired record of truth. The Holy Spirit leads you always back to the Bible where he's recorded it. And so remember, tested the spirit by the word. And Jesus said, unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood, you have no part with me. And the word was made flesh and dwelt among us. So it's an internalization of truths and truths as revealed by God and his word and nature and science enlightened by the Holy Spirit. As we choose those things, yes. And then we become empowered and the Holy Spirit dwells in us. I think you're exactly right.

Felipe Aristizabal (52:08.838)
Because a lot of things people don't realize, when we really get to know Jesus' character, I believe he's like the perfect prototype for the renewed mind and the new Adam. And everything he spoke about was aligning us that way, which is hard to see. To me, everyone I read, whether it was Greek philosophy, Confucius, Buddha, like,

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (52:20.398)
100%. Yes.

Felipe Aristizabal (52:34.064)
They all had similar, like I said, sometimes they can get close to the frequency. It's maybe not the actual frequency, but they can get close because they're using spiritual laws, which no matter what, they're always going to be what they are. And but I realized that Jesus, to me, the things that stood out most was that he had the complete frequency where like basically no one ever said, love your enemy or turn the other cheek like that. You know, it's it's one of the few things that stood out from for Jesus, because I'm like.

It was very difficult for me to understand in the beginning. fact, before I understand this inwardly, loving your enemy and turning the other cheek seemed a little ridiculous, logically. And now when you understand how things work and what these negative thoughts and negative things affect us on a spiritual level, a biological level, on all levels, you realize that, that, you know, he literally

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (53:26.158)
That's right.

Felipe Aristizabal (53:31.364)
with those things, loving your enemy and turning the other cheek, he completed the whole truth. Like there is no one like that that gives us this entirety of truth that aligns with.

energy, frequencies, science, and everything else where others don't. Where in the sense that, you know, it's more like, just let this thought happen and let these things happen and it's okay and whatever. Instead of like, no, take the thought captive, submit it to the obedience of Christ. And it's a whole different process that he really just gives us the complete beautiful truth of why we're here and what he's looking for, what God is looking for.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (54:07.758)
I agree completely. I couldn't have said it better. Well said. I agree. Perfect integration.

Felipe Aristizabal (54:13.134)
Awesome. And then I was going to ask you, do you believe, I'm sorry, could the concept of quantum potential explain how spiritual transformation is possible at any moment?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (54:23.478)
Yes, absolutely. And so this is what happens. The Holy Spirit brings truth to our minds in ways we can comprehend it. And then we are left free to decide yes or no on it. Once we have enough understanding that we understand the choice on any subject matter, because we're finite beings. And so after we choose one truth, you'll find there's another truth and another truth and another truth and another truth. It just never ends.

Felipe Aristizabal (54:36.176)
Okay.

Felipe Aristizabal (54:41.928)
Mm-hmm.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (54:52.898)
But as you choose the truth, it makes a, again, actual change in the sub-structure of your brain. And truth by truth, molecule by molecule, we are actually being transformed by the spirit of truth enlightening our minds that we are then free to choose. If we say no to the truth, we actually kind of stay there for a period of time. We're not immediately lost by saying no to a moment of truth, but...

We aren't able to progress until we say yes to that truth. We're kind of stuck. And typically we'll enter a period of uneasiness, restlessness, our conscience won't be at peace, we've been at sleep, good. And then we reflect back and we'll say, I'm resisting, the Holy Spirit's leading me somewhere and I don't wanna go, I'm resisting. We might end up in the belly of a whale, okay, because we're resisting where the Holy Spirit's leading. But when we say yes, finally, then we receive divine.

Felipe Aristizabal (55:37.65)
Yeah.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (55:46.127)
power to succeed in the choice and we're being transformed truth by truth. And that ultimately leads us to a point of conversion. What is conversion? Conversion is when we actually in our identity or individuality surrender our sense of self into trust. And we say, give you my life. I trust you with my life. You have won me enough with enough truth. I've seen enough now.

that I find you, Jesus, and I trust you with my life. Then, right, that can happen in a moment. And if that happens, you will have a spiritual renewal. You will have a warmth, a peace, a burden of guilt and shame lifted. You will actually have a very positive and you will shift, you will have a motive to...

Felipe Aristizabal (56:20.826)
even over our logic in our.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (56:42.466)
to be honest, be loyal, be faithful, be loving, you will have a new animating energy of the Holy Spirit of love and trust will be what you're, but this is where many people fail to understand. Even though, and that happens in the substructure, that's the quantum entanglement, that's the new animating spirit. But that new animating spirit with the new desires to live the righteous life is still operating on a brain that has habituated built in patterns of old, unconverted,

living. And thus we will find ourselves after conversion for a period of time, Romans chapter seven, the things I want to do I'm not able to do and the things that I don't want to do sometimes I find myself doing. what a wretched man am I, I'm grieving in myself because this is not my heart anymore. Well then why am I doing it? Because you have a new heart with new motive but you haven't habituated the new practices yet.

to in certain situations reflexively you respond quickly or reactively with the old learned habits and immediately as soon as you're ready you grieve and go, who's gonna save me from this body of death? And then you go to Jesus, you find his grace and you begin practicing the new habits and over time your neurobiology rewires and changes.

Felipe Aristizabal (57:57.276)
And I think that's the key word there for me. It's practice, right? Because a lot of people say like, I don't have to think about what I think about or do this and do that. It's like a practice. I'm doing some kind of a new age thing. It's just all Christ by spirit and faith. And I feel like they're separating something that's the same. And it's almost like, yes, we are new creatures in Christ and we're given the Holy Spirit that guides us as a new creature. And now we...

We are searching different things. Our heart and our spirit is wanting new kind of food, new kind of things, and it's more sensitive to things. But, you know, we still have to partake. We still have to fight this spiritual battle daily and make the choice daily to believe God every single day instead of believing our own desires or things that sometimes can arise from either external influences or our own old patterns of thinking, let's say.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (58:54.018)
That's exactly right, and I think the metaphor of Jesus saying, eat my flesh, drink my blood, we eat every day to stay healthy. You must partake of Christ every day. Paul said, I die daily. It's not he's converted every day. It's every day he starts by surrendering his life to Jesus and receiving the new life of Christ for his animating energy to love and trust every day, because the old fear will still tempt you, but you're no longer identifying with that. You're, you're, you're

Felipe Aristizabal (59:07.982)
Mm-hmm. Surrendering.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (59:22.318)
crushing that through love and trust.

Felipe Aristizabal (59:24.604)
Right. Yeah. And so because I was a person that

I was, I thought I was just, let's say, saved or accepted Christ in my heart a long time ago, but somehow I quieted my spirit again by making. So the best way I could explain it is I think there was, I forgot who said this analogy, but it was a good one. Let's say, you know, if you have a plate of garbage and another plate of really delicious human food, and then you have a pig and you tell it, and you let it free to choose its food, it's always gonna go to the garbage as that kind of creature.

magical ability to turn that pig into a human instantly and then tell it to get the food it will go to the good food because if it was eating the bad trash food at that moment that human would be like, you know disgusted and and want to switch so being that that's how our spirit works in a sense that through a new creation now that sin we're more sensitive to and we understand it more but can it be quieted through wrong choosing even if we go against that eventually suppress the spirit and then be lost

Because I felt like that's what happened to me. When I accepted Christ, it was almost like a spiritual feeling that I almost like I was renewed instantly, I would say. And I felt that way for a good year or two. But eventually, because I wasn't fighting spiritual warfare daily and feeding myself the right way, and not just feeding myself by reading the Bible, but applying it in my mind through my thoughts, and that's what I mean by that practice, that because I didn't do that, and so little by little, I suppressed

spirit enough where I was living in anxiety and stress again for a long time until I was searching truth again and I realized what I had missed and now when I've applied this truth internally

Felipe Aristizabal (01:01:10.384)
with that spirit that's already been there, it's almost like you formed the canal for the water or the spirit to flow, or you align, in your case, with the sail, with the wind, for you to go in the right direction. And through that, I was able to experience something I never even experienced before. And some people believe that if you just...

accept Christ in the beginning, as long as you stay reading the Bible and going to church and doing external things like that, that you can remain in the Spirit sometimes. But from my experience, without the transformation, without renewing the mind that way and constantly spiritual warfare, there was no true change, really. I couldn't, at least I couldn't maintain and persevere there because in the beginning, when we accept Christ, it's almost like when a baby's born,

they have the ability to hold their breath on the water as a survival mechanism so they can survive in the beginning stages of infancy. But as soon as that baby grows, you have to reteach it to hold its breath on the water. And it's almost like the spirit gives us this survival mechanism in the beginning because it sends us to the body. It sends us to the word of God. So through there, we can mature from spiritual babies to maturity in the spirit.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:02:24.602)
I think you said some very important things and the Bible does use the again metaphor of wind and breath as the spirit and can't and so if you use that example we can breathe good clean air or we can breathe polluted air so we can breathe in into our souls or spirit the Holy Spirit pure love and trust and truths of God's Word or we can take in you know vile things additionally

Felipe Aristizabal (01:02:38.6)
Mm-hmm.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:02:54.442)
If we breathe every day and we're healthy, you can hold your breath and jump underwater for a little bit of time. But if you don't get above water and breathe some more fresh air, you're going to be in trouble. And, and I think there's a good object lesson there that it isn't enough to take one breath of the Holy Spirit and stay healthy. have to be constantly in relationship and breathing in the Holy Spirit.

and Jesus Christ daily to really stay vibrant and healthy. You will get spiritually sick if you don't.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:03:29.564)
Yes, okay. And that's what I felt like I was. I was spiritually sick for many years until I was able to search for him and his truth was revealed in such a way that I realized it was more of an internal thing that I was allowing my mind to do whatever it wanted. I was just not.

aware of the influences from the outside world and the things I would listen to and the things I would see and the things that I and that was affecting my heart and my let's call it subconscious mind so much so that it affected my external life and then I had no victory in spirit and nothing and in other words now when I did apply this and renewed my mind and spirit and took every thought captive and and replace things like fear and doubt with love and gratitude and and replace all these different things and and negative

opinions with mercy and empathy and all these things started changing. I started experiencing something even greater than what I did in the beginning because I could understand it. I could see it. And then now I'm experiencing peace and joy on such a level every day, not because my external world changed, but because my internal world changed.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:04:36.194)
That's right, no that's right. And the devil, two spiritual forces. Heavenly, which is truth, love, freedom. Evil, which is fear, selfishness, shame, guilt, exploitation, manipulate, this type of spirit. And if you look, anytime you are perceiving increasing animating emotions of fear, anger, rage, hate.

If it's a stirring up inside of you, that is not the Holy Spirit working. That's some other forces trying to get your spiritual world contaminated. And that can be from a variety of things. It can be from propaganda. It can be from a evil person doing harm to you and to tempt you to be resentful and bitter rather than gracious and forgiving.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:05:15.356)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:05:31.56)
Mm-hmm.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:05:32.027)
It could be from unhealthy lifestyle where you do things to harm your brain with substances that make it harder for you to actually assimilate and appreciate you. Sleep deprivation, working a double shift job so you're always fatigued and tired and you'll find that you're more irritable and snappy at people. Okay? And so the devil will attack our body, he will attack our relationships, he will attack our belief systems, but the whole goal if you look at it is and then

is to inflame fear and selfishness rather than love and trust.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:06:06.022)
And I think that's where, because we hear about a lot of, let's call it, guess, New Age ideas of thinking positive, right? And I feel like that's where it changes, because a lot of the thinking positive can be influenced by a lot of our own selfishness. know what mean? We can think positively for ourselves. But what makes the difference is that we think biblically.

truth wise and that we're thinking not for ourselves but for God. Would that be the difference?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:06:36.974)
100 % 100 % Yep, because because the power of God in the scripture, it's it's a combination of love and truth. Pure sinless love, which is what Adam and Eve had in Eden was broken by a lie. When they believe the lie, it caused them to have broken love and trust and incited fear and selfishness. So so pure love, even in a sinless world can be broken by lies, but love

founded on truth now. Now that's why it is a combination of the Holy Spirit is a tribe of spirit of truth and love. It's the two together that is empowering.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:07:16.904)
I think what resonated with what you just said now was that you mentioned also kind of like if you're in a relationship and you're love with your spouse or significant other, if someone comes and lies to you about this spouse, this person cheating on you or doing some horrific thing, even though it's not true, but this person was convincing enough where you believe it, it will affect your relationship, right? Is that what you were saying?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:07:39.18)
It'll affect your attitude. Your love and trust will be broken. You will have fear now if you think they're cheating on you and you won't trust them. And you'll want to take protective measures to not get hurt by them, all based on what? A lie. Yeah.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:07:50.854)
lie. And let's move on to this part where it says, do, that I want to ask you, how do thoughts and choices, our internal energy, impact not just our brains, but potentially our physical health and spiritual condition?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:08:05.742)
And that's another great question, because we are integrated beings. So the thoughts you think change the emotional and spiritual energy and also the circuits of the brain that fire. That's why we're to bring every thought to captivity to Jesus Christ. For instance, if you apply for a new job and part of it, they do some blood screening on all the people that come in and you go in for your follow up with whoever did this.

and they tell you a lie, but they're in a lab coat and they've got the report in front of them, they tell you a lie that you're HIV positive, but you're not.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:08:45.774)
That lie, what happens is if you believe that lie, what happens? First off, have, yeah, but what happens, you get fear, you get anxiety that activates your amygdala, activates your stress circuit, your blood pressure's gonna go up, your heart rate's gonna go up, you're gonna probably get nausea, lose your appetite, you might not sleep well, you're gonna start ruminating, and then you're gonna start, well, I've been faithful to my spouse, I don't do IV drugs, how did I get this? I haven't had a needle stick at work, where did this come from? My spouse must be cheating then.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:08:48.786)
Which has happened, I'm sure, even by mistake, you know, but.

Mm-hmm.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:09:14.892)
My spouse must have given me this. And of course it's still a lie. You're not HIV positive, but if you think you are, you see the cascade that this goes down, the damage that happens. Okay? And so on a spiritual level, God, did you let me have, how did you let this happen to me? And you can have a lot of worry and doubt about God in your life and your spirit is not at peace. You're not saying I trust the Lord at this moment. You're questioning the Lord's will at this point. And so all of this from...

from one idea or a lie. It changes physiologically, neural patterns change, physiological things happen in your body. If it persists and you don't resolve this, it will react back upon your brain causing inflammatory markers in your brain which will cause genetic expression changes, which cause protein production changes, which will lead to depression. If it's chronic for years, if you have chronic worry, chronic anxiety for years, it increases your risk of dementia as you age and obesity and diabetes.

and other things because your body is responding to chronic stress coming out of your mind.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:10:16.466)
So what is your take on epigenetics as far as with what you just said as well? I do you really believe that that is one of the reasons where we can develop not only spiritual problems, but on a level where even tumors or dementias or Alzheimer's or things like that?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:10:39.916)
So for our audience, may not know, epi means above, like epidermis, the top layer of your skin. Genetics is the genome, that's the DNA in our cells. And so the epigenetics are the study of the molecules that sit above the DNA telling which genes to turn on and which genes to turn off. so in everybody's body, in your body, you have the same chromosome, same DNA in all the cells of your body.

but your heart cells are different than your skin cells, which are different than your brain cells, which are different than your retinal cells. All these cells have the same information, but they look different and function different. And that's because there's a set of genes sitting above that library of information telling which genes to turn on here and which genes to turn off there. When we have children, we pass along not only the sequences of information, we pass along the epigenetic markers that we have added or removed from our DNA.

based on our own life experiences. so, and the reason we're able to do this, my understanding is God created us in his image and he created us with the capacity to create beings in our image. And so as we make choices in life, we are epigenetically modifying how our genes are being expressed and they will pass down three and four generations. And that's, and so we do healthy things, we pass along advantages, we do unhealthy things, we pass along disadvantages to our children.

down three and four generations. that is not, that's foods we eat, substances we put in our body, God we worship, behaviors we engage in, our genes are constantly being modified because of this. that's what epigenetics. Now, did I answer the question or did I just go off on a definition? I'll answer the question.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:12:23.592)
No, that's good. I mean, because with that being said, mean, is our free will affected by the choices of our parents? In a sense.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:12:34.732)
Not our free will. No, no, just, no, not our free will. Just our starting point in life is affected, okay?

Felipe Aristizabal (01:12:41.436)
Meaning like, let's say you have someone who has healthy parents and you were born with a good brain and a healthy pattern of thought. And then you have someone who was maybe taking heroin when they were having the baby and so on. And so the baby's born with problems in the brain where they can't really.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:13:04.654)
Okay, it depends on what the problems are. Can a child be born with a brain that can't think? Can there be so much damage that they're in a vegetative state at birth, or they're so mentally compromised they can never actually learn a language or think, they're kind of almost a vegetable? Well, yes, then their free will choices were taken because they never actually developed an identity or personhood. But for the vast majority of people,

Felipe Aristizabal (01:13:10.322)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:13:15.41)
Genetic predisposition is what I was looking for.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:13:34.081)
that are born in this world, still have individuality and still have person or power of choice, but they may have more struggles in life than they would have had had the parents, grandparents, and great-grandparents led healthier lives. So a child born of alcoholic parents will have a greater vulnerability to addictions than children who didn't have addictions in their family history.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:13:59.58)
And even the capacity of understanding, I would say, would be even limited because of this, you think?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:14:05.998)
So IQ can be limited, but IQ does not impact free will choices. I had an aunt who had an anoxic brain injury at birth and she was in the era of her life mentally retarded. And yet she could still love people. She could learn. She not learn to read and write, not learn to do math, but she knew our names and she could learn how to care for herself.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:14:11.643)
Okay.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:14:33.558)
and she gave her heart to Jesus and she was kind and she volunteered at a local ministry where she helped sort clothing for the homeless and so forth and so on. So she could still develop character that was honest, loyal, faithful, true and kind even though she could never pass a Bible studies quiz.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:14:51.368)
But that also tells us the importance and the power of our thoughts. Meaning if our thoughts shape our actions and habits and character, then destiny and then our family, even what we pass on, there's a huge effect. I mean, even looking at the story of, let's say, David, when he David sinned, you know, he wasn't just the one affected, but his family line, you know, was affected just from that decision that he made.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:15:14.67)
Well, so it was affected, but his decision didn't cause the outcomes. His decision had impact and those individuals, Absalom and others down the line made their own decisions on how to respond to that behavior. But David's decision didn't cause them to make their decisions. We're all responding and they could have responded as you've suggested with grace, forgiveness, kindness, love, rather than fear, anger, selfishness and trying to manipulate for self.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:15:44.456)
But at the same time, even if, so if God already foreseen said, this is what's gonna happen to your children, for him to say that, he either knows their choices that they're gonna make, or they're gonna have to make those choices for that to happen. I don't know.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:16:01.742)
And this is where people struggle, again, between foreknowledge and causality. You have a time machine and we jump into the future and watch the next Super Bowl, the whole thing, you and I, and we come back here today so we know exactly every play, every interception, every touchdown, the final score, we now have foreknowledge of what's gonna happen. Are we causing it?

Felipe Aristizabal (01:16:22.428)
Gotcha.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:16:23.47)
Okay, so God foreknows it, but all those players still have to go out there. Those plays have to be called, they have to run those plays, they still have to make those touchdowns and receptions or fumbles. They still are making those choices in governance of themselves to make those things happen. We just now know it. That's how God's foreknowledge work, he knows it, but he's not causing it.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:16:31.432)
It has to get to that point again. It has to get to that. Right.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:16:41.234)
He's not causing it, gotcha. All right, and let's move into the Christian theology in the quantum world. If reality is shaped by unseen forces, how does that align with Paul's teaching in 2 Corinthians 4.18? What is seen is temporary, but what is unseen is eternal.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:17:00.354)
Yeah, so I guess you have to define what's he referring to there. Is he actually referring to the things on the infinitesimally small quantum world, or is he simply talking about the world that, because of sin, is hidden from our eyes? Prior to sin, Adam talked to God in the cool of the day, face to face, but since sin, the angels and the heavenly beings are hidden from our view. So is he talking the quantum elements there, or is he talking the heavenly realms and the eternal realities that

are hidden from our view because of sin. I think he's talking about the heavenly realms, seeing Jesus face to face, being able to have a conversation with Gabriel like you're having with me. I don't think he's actually talking about the quantum world right there.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:17:39.304)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:17:43.012)
Okay, excellent. And could heaven, angels, or spiritual, or the spiritual realm exists on a higher frequency or dimension that quantum physics hints at?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:17:56.441)
So my view of the quantum is again the animating energy. Is the animating energy love, truth, trust? Is that the motivator? The converted people, the love of Christ compels us. This is an energy, it's a motivating force. Or is it fear and selfishness? That's the spiritual quantum. So when you think quantum, think animating energy, movement to action. Whereas...

Felipe Aristizabal (01:18:01.682)
Okay.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:18:21.53)
Okay. Amazing.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:18:25.358)
What was the other aspect of the question?

Felipe Aristizabal (01:18:28.328)
Could could on a higher frequency or dimension?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:18:32.478)
so, so, so that, but then there's another piece. Why aren't we seeing the angels? Why aren't we seeing heaven? My view, again, this is all speculative at this point, but my view is that we are passing through time at a different rate than the angels. And the reason I say that in the heavenly beings, Peter gives an illusion to this when he says, when the Lord a thousand days is like a year and a year is like a thousand days, or excuse me, yeah, a thousand years is like a day and a day is like a thousand years.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:18:56.712)
Mm-hmm.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:19:01.472)
And so, so my view is the reason we don't see those beings right now is because God has created an artificial bubble of reality around this world of sin that is passing through time at a different speed than the rest of the universe. And that's why we don't actually see them now from time to time, they will step into our time dilation field, where you occasionally have an angel in the Bible speaking to Mary speaking to Daniel and so forth. They're stepping in, but then they step back out. So

Felipe Aristizabal (01:19:23.208)
Mm.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:19:30.286)
You know, this is all speculative on my part, but that's why we don't see them because we're in a different phase. And if it's true, then you can understand Jesus' meaning. I return to the Father, but I'm coming back quickly. It's very possible in heaven, while 2,000 years have passed since on earth, it's very possible only two days have passed in heaven.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:19:32.84)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:19:50.428)
Gotcha. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Does the resurrection of Jesus hint at mastery over physical and quantum laws?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:20:02.958)
Well, I think it certainly does. but I think the whole life of Jesus and what you see in the Bible, my view of, of, you know, God's creation of Adam and before his fall, Adam was given governance over the planet, over the planet as the governor until his fall. And then you see some interesting things throughout scripture. And I think that when God restores human beings and this earth, remember the meek shall inherit the earth, this earth is going to be the home of the

of the righteous and all things to be restored. think we will be restored to the abilities Adam was originally created with and he lost when he was co-opted by Satan. Satan got some abilities to act on this planet that he didn't have until the fall. So some interesting things. One, walking on water. I think we'll all be able to do things like that in the new heaven and the earth. think Adam could have done that. There's a story in the Old Testament of Elisha.

and the axe head that he causes to float, if you remember. I think that being able to use some type of telekinesis or something to move things with one's mind or thoughts, I don't think that'll be a problem for the righteous in the hereafter. But a couple of two interesting stories. One was when the Holy Spirit teleported Philip in the Book of Acts. Do remember the story of Philip being teleported by the Holy Spirit? But Satan teleported Christ in the temptation in the wilderness, suddenly they're on top of the temple.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:21:19.12)
Mm-hmm. Yes.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:21:28.846)
How'd they get there? You call an Uber? No, Satan and his temptation. So Satan as the usurper had some authority that I think Adam previously had. And I think we'll have that ability when the earth is, these are thoughts that I have, but yes.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:21:44.552)
So by us believing Satan, we handed our authority that was given to us by God to Satan for that.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:21:50.221)
Yes, and then Christ reclaimed all of that and he's waiting for the end and he is now, you know, the second Adam, the new head of humanity is Jesus Christ now. And so you see in the life of Jesus, him exercising authority over nature, peace be still, stopping the storm. Okay, as the second Adam, he's exercising that authority, walking on the water.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:22:00.124)
Right.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:22:11.73)
Yeah. And how can Christians practically apply these concepts to renew their minds and overcome destructive thought patterns?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:22:23.278)
Yeah, no, that's a great question. And it is what you You already described it. I will tell you did a beautiful job of already describing this. Okay. It is internalization on a daily basis of the word of God and then reflective contemplation in prayerful conversation with God about the truths. And how do I apply those truths to my life? And so it's not enough to comprehend the truth. As many people get get get miss miss this. It is not enough to recognize Jesus Christ as Lord.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:22:30.152)
Appreciate it.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:22:53.398)
If you remember the demoniacs following some of the disciples around, or shouting out, or even Jesus, we know who you are, the son of the most high God. They knew, cognizant, it's not enough to comprehend the truth cognitively. The transforming power is when you choose the truth to apply to your heart. And it's a daily internalization of Godly truth in a love trust relationship with Holy Spirit that you are.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:23:02.022)
Mm-hmm. Right.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:23:13.128)
Exactly.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:23:23.788)
Reflecting and thinking and choosing to apply it to your life. So let me, my view is the truth comes from God, not from us. The love comes from God, not from us. The desire or the conviction comes from God, not from us. The power to succeed comes from God, not from us. The choice comes from us. And we don't receive the power to succeed until we actually make the choice.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:23:32.84)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:23:53.17)
And that's what I try to tell people, like, it's so easy to know what we can control because we know the only thing we do control is that choice. That's the only control we actually have. Everything else is outside of that.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:24:04.556)
And many people make, I see this as a psychiatrist, that many people want to be free of the circumstances, pain, suffering they're in, but not the cause of the suffering. So an addict wants to be free of the liver or lung or legal problems, but they don't want to be free of the addiction, the substance. Or a woman in a dysfunctional marriage,

Felipe Aristizabal (01:24:15.112)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:24:29.768)
Exactly.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:24:33.964)
wants to be free of the beating and the verbal abuse and the fear and the stress, but she doesn't want to leave her husband who's abusing her.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:24:45.628)
Right. And this goes also back to like, let's say, you know, there's no condemnation for those who believe in Jesus Christ. A lot of people believe that if we believe in Christ and we choose to believe in Christ, that we can live in a...

not a life without victory, let's say, still stressed, still anxious, but still have salvation. Whereas if the person who applies this spiritual warfare and is more of a disciple, let's say, and actually applies this internally and lives in this victory and these fruits that they would just be in the kingdom of God, this position, let's call it, or a higher position as far as in the kingdom. Is that something that you...

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:25:30.19)
So Jesus wants us to have what he called the abundant life. Or you can use the multiple metaphors of scripture, maturing or growing up in Christ. You know, we're reborn as an infant in Christ, Hebrews chapter five.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:25:42.536)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:25:45.896)
Well, I guess can some Christians stay infants and just barely make it into salvation while others mature?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:25:52.525)
That's right. That's right. And that's correct. And you read Romans, excuse me, Hebrews five and six, you will see about that infancy and childishness in Christianity. You're still a member of the family, but a child, and this is the point, a child in the family may be loved, may be part of the family, but you can't trust them. You can't rely on them. They're a child. And God wants us to grow up and he wants us to be like Daniel or Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego and

many of his friends who've matured, that we not only love and trust God, but God can call on us because he can trust us.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:26:31.24)
Right. And I guess we, because a lot of people take it back to the thief on the cross kind of situation where like he just asked for forgiveness and God said, you'll be in heaven with me today. And kind of that situation where just belief alone in him could save us. Where as if sometimes I look at it like it could also have a conflict there for me, because in a sense, there needs to be some sort of character change or maturity for us to even enter the next

part of the new world.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:27:01.646)
So you're exactly right. Paul said in Romans 14, I think that's verse 23, whatever is not a faith or trust, depending on your English version, is sin. And the root of sin is breaking trust with God. They believe the lies and they broke trust in Eden. That's the root. And so the thief on the cross exercised faith or trust. I trust you, Jesus. Okay. Then if you're in a saving relationship with Jesus is that I trusted you when I was 12.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:27:15.784)
Gotcha.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:27:24.803)
Mm, okay.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:27:31.054)
Now I can do my own thing and I'm not going to follow you anymore. Or if I trust you, is it a daily journey of trust?

Felipe Aristizabal (01:27:37.768)
And I guess it goes into there as far as like, hey, the parable about him offering one coin, I forgot the actual coin name, for work, for a whole day's work, and then all of a sudden the people who came later in the afternoon got the same pay, but yet they didn't have to work all day kind of situation.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:27:59.577)
Yep. Right? Right? And then many people look at that from an earthly standard and they think, well, that's not fair. That's not fair. But the day's pay is salvation. That's the pay. You get saved. If you come at the last hour, get saved. Thief of the Cross got the last hour. But those who come in the morning, this is what many people don't understand. Those who start working in the morning have all day to work with the master. So it's not about the work, it's about the growth and the fellowship with the master.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:28:12.008)
Exactly.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:28:19.889)
Okay.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:28:28.736)
And so those who give their heart to Jesus early in their life, they have a life of growing experience, knowledge, friendship, love, value, appreciation. Whereas the thief on the cross, the thief on the cross, yes, he got the salvation, but he hasn't developed any deep experiences, knowledge, maturity yet that's to come.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:28:28.829)
Gotcha.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:28:34.77)
hearing aids.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:28:47.4)
And do you believe based on that maturity, are we placed in different levels in the afterlife or let's call it the new world, new heaven?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:28:56.994)
You know, I haven't really looked at that question. think God is the God of reality. In whatever levels they are, they'll be reality-based levels based on our capacity, maturity, insight, journey, where we are. he calls a person for a particular, know, whether you want to say sing in the heavenly choir or not, whatever that calling is, it would be corresponded to the abilities one possesses and has developed.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:29:24.68)
Okay, all right. And I kind of got off there a little bit because I wanted to ask you those questions. But so.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:29:34.29)
Can understanding quantum theory deepen our faith instead of shaking it?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:29:39.087)
100 % in my view as I've studied into this it makes perfect sense because we have a god of reality who built reality and still governs and the operations of reality and it makes sense to our Operations of our being that we are physiological beings with a body We're psychological beings with a mind and we're spiritual beings with animating motivational energy all three are true and God wants to cleanse all three he wants to at the

at the second coming, this mortality puts on image, we get a perfected body. But right now we can have a new heart and right spirit. We can be reborn in the inner man with animating energy of love and trust and develop a mind that operates on truth. That can happen now.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:30:24.496)
Okay, awesome. What role does love play in transformation, neuroscientifically and spiritually?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:30:35.286)
Well, true altruistic love is the only power that can really free us from the domination of fear. If we want to live a victorious Christian life, it's through the power or empowering of the motivation of love. And I give this example. Imagine crossing the street and you look up and a truck is about to hit you. What emotion do you experience? Well, fear. And let's say you're out with your firstborn child, two, three year old toddler.

You get a little distracted, you look up, your toddler's in the street, a truck is bearing down on them. There's just enough time, if you act right now, you can shove them out of the way, but if you do, you get hit. What do you do? You shove them out of the way. And as you see your son or daughter hit the grass on the other side and you know they're safe, what are you experiencing? Relief, joy. Wait a second. In both circumstances, you're getting hit by a truck. In the first, there's only fear. In the second, your love has cast out your fear.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:31:20.957)
relief.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:31:30.606)
Mmm. I love that example. Really nice.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:31:32.655)
Okay, and then Newberg and his group did research on people 65 years of age and older. And they had to meditate 12 minutes a day on the god of love for 30 days. Prior to the meditation, they measured the size of a particular part of your brain called the anterior cingulate cortex. That's where you experience empathy and altruistic love. And they took baseline measures of heart rate and blood pressure, which is a measure of stress, which is activation of your amygdala or fear circuitry.

and they did standardized memory testing. At the end of 30 days, meditating 12 minutes a day on the God of love, they could measure growth in the love circuits of the brain. They were stronger, they were larger. And the way our brains wired, when your love circuits are active, they send a calming signal down to your fear circuit, and they had lower heart rates and blood pressure, and they also had 30 % improvement in memory testing all within 30 days. They had another group then, these are 65 years of age and older, meditate on an angry God, a punishing God, a distant God.

None of these positive changes happened. Only a God of love was healing. So we have neurobiologic evidence as well as the experiential evidence that love is actually healing to our being. That's the motivational energy. That's the spirit of love that comes only from the Holy Spirit.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:32:48.052)
The, I was gonna ask you this before, know we're, I wanted to see how our time was looking, but yeah, I think we're a little over 2, 2, 2.30? Okay, all right, so let's start with this. Oh, okay, so it's only been an hour 30. Okay, so I got confused there with that. Is it possible, let me just ask this better. Is it possible that we can call miracles,

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:32:58.126)
Yeah, it's 235, yeah.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:33:15.912)
I'm sorry, is it possible that what we call miracles are simply higher laws of reality that we don't yet understand?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:33:23.534)
Yes, yes. Yes, yes, I think that's true on all levels. I think that the most profound miracle that people don't necessarily notice, but it's still the applying the law of truth, the law of love, these are design laws as well, to hearts and minds, is the miracle of a person in rebellion against God living a sinful life, being one to love and trust and being reborn and living a righteous life thereafter. That's a miracle.

But it's the miracle of applying the laws of God to their heart and mind.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:33:57.576)
Yeah, in a way, let's say we say good thoughts or heavenly thoughts are producing a higher vibrational frequency in us, right? And sinful thoughts and bad thoughts, fear and all these are producing a lower vibrational frequency.

A dead body vibrates very low, a healthy body vibrates high. If we are able to align with God's truth with this renewal, it's almost like we vibrate at such a higher vibrational frequency where it almost can produce a sense of healing to someone else in a way. Looking at from that standpoint, do think that would be accurate?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:34:43.694)
Yes, no, that's exactly right. We're spiritual beings. We have animating energy and we can use our spirit, our animating energy to be a blessing to others. We can bring cheer, we can bring encouragement, we can bring love, we can bring affirmation, we can bring an atmosphere and we can pray for people with positive focusing our loving desire for their welfare that is measurable in various studies. And so yes, absolutely, as we align with the Holy Spirit and then share that love with others, it has a very positive effect on other people.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:34:48.36)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:35:14.15)
Yeah, not just around us, but everyone around us. I mean, not just in us, but everyone around us. All right. And do you think we're on a brink of a new reformation where science and faith converge?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:35:17.058)
That's right. Yes.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:35:27.694)
Yes, I think we see that happening. Yes, I've read some very interesting and listened to some very interesting things by a brilliant guy named Stephen Meyer. And if you haven't watched some of his stuff, watch some of his stuff, but brilliant. Science, honest scientists across the landscape of science are recognizing that the godless theories are unscientific. Across the landscape of whether it's astrophysics, whether it's physics,

whether it's quantum, whether it's mathematicians or information managers, the science is it is not possible for this complexity that we see to have formed randomly on its own because life as we know it requires three elements. It requires physical matter, it requires energy, but life as we know it also requires one other thing, coded information in the genetic material of all living organisms. And there is no godless

unintelligent theory that corresponds with information coding. If you have information coding, it requires an intelligence to take symbols, zeros and ones, letters of an alphabet, genetic molecules, it takes intelligence to organize them to code information. And so there is no godless explanation for the really thoughtful about this. There has to be an intelligence that codes it.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:36:56.392)
So with that being said, you would say that with our new findings and quantum mechanics and everything, it's easier to see more evidence that there is an intelligent God than if there wasn't, let's say.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:37:07.758)
100%, 100%, yeah. And then that will lead us back to the ultimate question in scripture, is he good? Is he worthy of our trust? I can promise you, Satan never alleged there was not a God and we evolved from slime in heaven. That was not it. The allegation was God's not good and you can't trust him.

And so as the science comes back, there's an intelligent God. Then the next question is what kind of being is he? How does he run his universe? What methods does he employ? Is he a coercive, dictatorial, judicial, punishing God? Or is he a God that Jesus revealed, self-sacrificial and loving? I mean, how do you understand him?

Felipe Aristizabal (01:37:52.114)
Yeah. Okay. And this other question here on the philosophical point of view, if Jesus were speaking to our generation, would he use metaphors from quantum theory?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:38:08.302)
to the people. Jesus spoke in a language that people could understand. So if we're talking about people who understand what I'm doing, there's no doubt in my mind. He's talking to people in the cities. He'd probably be using cars. But yes, he'd be using the metaphors of our life today.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:38:11.88)
No.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:38:17.404)
That's it.

Kind of like when Paul said, yeah, kind like when Paul said, to the poor, I am poor to them and I speak to them to, yeah, okay, awesome. And this was gonna be more of this last question, because you answered the main questions I was looking for, but this is more of a personal question for me. What are your thoughts on the Ethiopian Bible? Meaning that it's, I know this is a little off, but this is more personal for me in the sense of that it is supposed to be the,

the oldest canon that exists as far as that. And a lot of people believe that it could be the Bible that has all the books. Not to say, of course, because obviously we know that it has all the books that we have, all the 66 books in that Bible as well, so it doesn't take away from ours. But would you say that some of those books are also need? Well, I wouldn't say needed because I don't think they're needed. I think the 66 books is perfect in completion what we need. But are they biblical in a way or Holy Scripture?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:39:19.896)
So my view, if you look at the whole trajectory of the Bible story arc, after Adam and Eve sinned, Genesis 3.15, right there, before they're even cast out of the garden, God promises the Savior, the seed of the woman who's coming to crush the serpent's head. Jesus is promised right there. And Revelation later tells you he's the lamb of God slain from the foundation of the world. And so from that moment, the whole story arc of the Bible is the coming Messiah.

And this is why the Bible's focus is where it is. In the first few chapters of Genesis, it's the whole world, and we focus on the whole world and the worldwide flood, because we don't know where in humanity Jesus is coming. But right after the flood, God tells Abraham, it's through your descendants, the seed is coming, the promise is coming. And it's not your descendants through Ishmael, it's through Isaac. So we don't focus on the descendants through Ishmael, we focus on them through Isaac. But it's not through Esau, so we don't focus on Esau's descendants, it's through Jacob.

And the Bible keeps narrowing. And then it's not through all of Jacob's descendants. By the time Jesus is born, we've actually narrowed it down to Judah and Levi, two tribes. Ten have been dispersed through the Assyrian and other occupations. And so the Bible keeps narrowing its focus, not because God doesn't love all the peoples of the world, but because it is through this particular branch of the human family that Messiah is coming so God can save all the peoples of the world. This is the Bible story arc. And because of that,

God has not only was bringing Jesus through this branch of the human family, the Jewish nation, the Israelites, were blessed with the oracles of God, the prophetic penmen who were inspired by the Holy Spirit to write the scriptures that would then contain the God-inspired message of the plan of salvation. And the entire Old Testament narrative, if you read it, Satan is constantly attacking this people to try and stop the plan. He attacks them.

certainly physically with all of the various battles and tribes and others that were trying constantly and God protected that. But more importantly, he was constantly attacking them spiritually with false prophets and false prophetic writings, constantly. And so my view is God protected the 36, the 39 of the old and then the rest of the New Testament for the 66 complete.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:41:40.526)
in the 27 of the new, so we have 66 books of the Bible, but he protected that to the degree. And so that's what I think is the inspired record. We have the Pseudo-epigrapha, we have the Epigrapha, the New Testament Epigrapha. These, in my view, from the false prophets. And you read in Jeremiah, read in Isaiah, Balaam, and many others. They had their false writings, and they had their false prophecies. And Jesus dealt with one of them in the New Testament. You can find this in your New Testament.

where Jesus condemned them for their practice of korban. Korban was when they would declare their property as dedicated to the church upon their death and therefore they wouldn't use their property to care for their parents in that culture. He condemned that. Where does korban come from? It comes from the Mishnah. Jesus is saying you put the Mishnah over the scriptures and he condemned it. No, these are the 66. If you have other writings, they have to be tested by the 66 and only those that are

proven true and consistent with the 66 should be accepted. And in my view, these other books have been proven false and should be rejected.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:42:45.744)
Like, what about like first and second Maccabees and judges?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:42:48.544)
Exactly the epigraph is the the apocrypha the pseudopocrypha and and the New Testament apocrypha These are all in my view proven false and in fact Jerome which was sent by the Catholic Church and in the early part of of of Christianity to make a new Latin translation of the Bible went to Jerusalem to learn Aramaic and Hebrew and to translate directly from the text that they had there the Old Testament and when he did his translations he found

that the Apocrypha did not meet the standard of the 39 books of Old Testament. He petitioned the Pope to not include those. the papal seat said, no, too many people, too many traditions. We rely on these. We're going to include them. he refused. Jerome refused to translate those books because he did not believe they were inspired.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:43:41.648)
Okay. And because, and you know, I hear a couple things from it, like, for example, that sometimes do kind of tell me something like, for example, like, in the, I guess in the beginning, when they put the Western canon together, it was through, they say through Constantine, and then the Council of Nicaea, and then through the next hundred years or so, I think that was being formed into this canon. Some people believe because of

the Councilman I see in Constantine that this was just adjusted and some books were kept out. And then the reason I go back to that is because then of course they'll also use parts of the Bible like...

When, for example, when the Pharisees were talking to Jesus saying, hey, know, if this man has a wife and they didn't have children and then he dies and then that wife marries another man and then another man, another man, who is she going to be at the resurrection? And Jesus says, you guys don't read the word in the Holy Scripture. And he says, because you're going to be like angels and so on. But I don't find any of that in our 66 books.

of being like angels referenced there that he's talking about implying that we need to know that scripture, let's say, or that we should know that scripture. And then, of course, they also reference, what was it? think... Yes, correct. And then...

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:45:01.506)
He said you would be like angels, neither marrying nor giving in marriage.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:45:07.808)
yes. Thank you. I missed that part. And then also in Jude, obviously the parts from Enoch, because I don't believe in Enoch two and three. They're so out of, wow, whack as far as alignment. And even Enoch one, I mean, it's more like a prophecy. I'm not saying I think it's Holy Scripture or not, but it just has some insight that could be symbolic. But at the same time, it's being referenced in Jude. And then I think it was a Peter. forgot which other one.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:45:36.814)
So people claim it's referenced because there are a couple of very, very small verses that are found in both. But what people don't tell you is that Jude may have been referencing a third source, and so did Enoch. And that they're not quoting Enoch at all, but Jude is referencing another source that was lost to time.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:45:39.25)
Okay.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:45:48.284)
Okay.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:45:57.115)
Okay.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:46:05.454)
that was inspired and as part of the deception, the Book of Enoch also quoted from that other source.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:46:12.966)
Okay. Would you know what that source would be or like?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:46:16.786)
No, this was lost in time. My view of the Book of Enoch is that it is contrary to what you read in Scripture. Why would any reasonable human being think that intelligent beings from a different planet, place in God's universe have the capacity to procreate with human beings?

Felipe Aristizabal (01:46:45.36)
No, no, and not for a joke.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:46:45.55)
They're not even made of the same substance we're made of. We're carbon-based life forms.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:46:49.638)
Right. And then when you look at the other part where we talked about Jesus saying that you're to be like angels not having procreation abilities, then

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:46:55.692)
Yes.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:46:59.926)
No, this is again, my view of the book of Enoch, it's a fantasy novel of fallen angels because we were given procreative powers created in the image of God. Lucifer in my, in my understanding rebelled because he was jealous of the creative powers of Christ and he wanted to take Christ's position. He wants to be a creator. He's not a creator. And so when we have this ability, he's very jealous of it. And I think this book is a fantasy novel of his wishes, hopes and dreams, but

Felipe Aristizabal (01:47:05.564)
Okay.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:47:10.568)
Mm-hmm.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:47:29.262)
There is nothing that I can find anywhere that would, whether it's science or whether it's scripture, that suggests angels can actually procreate with human beings. We're not even the same species.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:47:41.576)
Or even the lines that were put in Enoch and in Jude, let's say, could be like a verbal tradition thing that was handed down that then they added to the book of Enoch as well, you're saying, right?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:47:52.665)
So have you ever read in things like the Time Magazine, or Reader's Digest, or a newspaper, quote from the Bible?

Does that mean because they quote the Bible that it's an inspired source?

That's the Book of Enoch.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:48:10.32)
Yeah, yeah, and that's and that's a good way of explaining that because I've always thought and and there was only a few things of course this whole corners of things or whatever they were he was talking about a whole bunch of different things that was very weird but as far as he did speak about Jesus and his coming and the Messiah which was a was was which was nice but Enoch well whoever they say

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:48:31.192)
Who's he? Yeah, but the book of Enoch was not written by Enoch.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:48:35.536)
Right, right. Whoever they said, you know, whoever wrote it, because obviously it wasn't Enoch who wrote it.

So it just seemed like because of when it was written that it was still kind of pointing at the Messiah in that sense. That's the only reason. But when you read Enoch two and three, it's just so out of it. Like, it just seems like not only fan fiction, but just and I agree. And that's what I'm saying that Enoch one could be as well. But the other ones are more like Enoch is Jesus. Like, you know, it's almost like, what is that? You know? But but I agree. I mean, it.

It doesn't really add to my salvation or the gospel, the truth in any way. It's more like maybe I thought in the past also that it could be just information on maybe how to put things together as far as the stories and things that weren't maybe elaborated in the 66 books that we have or explaining things that maybe we're missing. if you believe that it really does contradict or like, in this case,

demonic because it's it's it's

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:49:37.708)
And this is the goal of, and this is why I gave the example of the, of the Corban. If, if Satan can't get his false prophets to write false scriptures that we accept as part of the Canon, if God protected that, then if he can get us to read those things and then read back into the scripture, the things coming from these. so we're testing now the scripture or interpreting scripture based on these other books.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:49:44.36)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:49:59.206)
Mm-hmm.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:50:05.25)
we're still bringing in the demonic rather than saying, wait a second, I've got to test this book by the scripture and I can't find that in this book. So no, that's a rejection.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:50:13.266)
So we're distorting truth in a way, which is still the initial sin, right? And so, okay, and then, well, what about, I mean, obviously in Genesis it talks about the sons of man and the sons of God, you know, so your take on it is these were just how the other take would be the sons of God were the chosen people and the sons of men were the line of...

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:50:36.462)
So the Bible defines the sons, the Bible, if you look to the Bible, the term sons of God, you'll find it in several places. One, all the loyal beings who are not in rebellion in the book of Job that came before God were called the sons of God. Satan, who'd been walking to and from the earth, he's not called the son of God. He's not loyal. Then if you look at the genealogy of Christ, it goes back, you know, from Christ and his whole genealogy in Matthew, the son of Seth, the son of Adam.

the Son of God. At creation, Adam was loyal, so he at creation is the Son of God. And then Paul writes in Romans, those who have the Spirit of Christ are sons of God. That's Romans 8. Okay, so having the Spirit of Christ makes you a Son of God. So the term Son of God is a terminology for all those who are animated by the Spirit of God or the Spirit of Christ. And so fallen angels who are in rebellion cannot be

sons of God. So it cannot be that the sons of God are fallen angels. It can be David, who was a man after God's own heart, who was a fallen human being, but did not rebel against God, was struggling with his own problems, but he didn't go after foreign gods. He didn't worship Molech or anything else while he was in his struggle. He's a son of God who very well may have gone off with somebody he shouldn't have been with. In fact, he did. And so I see that as the faithful of God or the sons of God.

having sex with the daughters of men, who are in rebellion, and having these people who ended up being giants in the land.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:52:13.628)
Like pretty much they're messing up the bloodline that God is trying to keep pure in a way, right? At that point.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:52:21.506)
Well, there's, there's an aspect of that, you exactly, it's more about, it's more about the character. What, what corrupted Solomon? What corrupted Solomon? When Balaam was, was paid to help corrupt Israel, what was it? He tried to curse them several times and God stopped him each time, if you remember. But then eventually Balaam gives advice to the Kings that were hiring him that worked. What was the advice? Send your women in to seduce them.

And that is what you have described here. Joining your heart to unconverted and corrupt people. That's what corrupted Solomon, that's what corrupted Israel, that's what I believe is being described here.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:53:09.074)
So what would be your take on the Nephilim at that point, the offsprings?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:53:13.134)
Yes, so my view is that these were the anti-diluvians. These were the people living before the flood. These are people who had a vitality and life force well beyond those of us since the flood. They lived 900 years. And so I think they were physiologically much larger and stronger anyway. so whether they're physiological giants,

or this is the giants of, have you heard people in our culture today say, no, no, that people like J.T. Getty was a giant of industry. Okay, have you heard that? This giants of industry? So my view is that these people became giants of apostasy and rebellion against God. And they're the ones who led to the building of the Tower of Babel later and all of this type of God. were giants of,

Felipe Aristizabal (01:53:46.632)
Like a king, ruler, giant.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:53:55.654)
Yes.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:54:11.15)
And in Genesis 6, right after this, they said this, what do you have next? That the world is in terrible rebellion, violence and violence all the time and destruction against God. And so I believe these were the giants of rebellion against God that came from these unions.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:54:28.11)
Awesome. Yeah, because so with this being said, and even the fact that you exclude, let's say, Enoch as that way, you don't believe that demons are and I think you mentioned it also before, I went one of your videos that demons don't they're not, let's say, spirits without a body look into inhabit some kind of physical

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:54:53.87)
So that's Eastern philosophy. The Bible does not teach there are any such thing as intelligent spirits with individuality and identity. The Bible teaches that you're animating energy and it can either be a spirit of love and trust or a spirit of fear and selfishness and your individuality is your soul. Eastern philosophy has merged the two and they have disembodied spirits with individuality still floating around.

and they worship their ancestors and these other things. So this is all Eastern philosophy, which is not biblical theology. And so, many Christians have accepted this type of an idea, but it is not actually in Scripture. And as Scripture, again, tells us that in Jesus himself, in Old and New Testament, that when the body dies, a person dies, the body turns to dust, the spirit returns to God, and the soul is in a state of sleep in the Heavenly Islam Book of Life Waiters. So there's no such thing. And the idea here,

are that these Nephilim, as some people teach, had spirits that were unauthorized, so to speak, by God, and thus they had no place to reincarnate, no bodies to have it anymore, and thus they float around looking for bodies to have it. This is all fiction. There's nothing in scripture that supports that.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:56:06.162)
Well, so what would be your take for the audience as far as demon possession, demonic possession?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:56:11.726)
So it goes back to your frequency thing. So you used the radio frequency thing a minute ago. So what happens if we have a radio that's broadcasting a weak 15,000 watt signal and we turn up a signal a mile from it at 100,000 watts? What happens to that signal? Are you still able to hear that or does it get overridden? And so as we choose to internalize into our brains and our hearts,

Felipe Aristizabal (01:56:17.49)
Yes.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:56:33.691)
Overroom.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:56:39.97)
By our choices, the vile, the disgusting, the rebellious, the deceitful, it neurobiologically changes us. And it changes the harmonic frequency that we're operating upon. And as we keep down that trail, we come more and more in harmony with the spirits of fear, selfishness, villainy, and so forth, to the point that one day they can override our natural spiritual energy, our quantum matrix.

and they can actually through the spiritual quantum energy take control of the operations of our brain and body.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:57:18.632)
So through the frequency.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:57:22.594)
That's through quantum linkages, yes.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:57:24.636)
they can, in a way, control us, in a way. But it's not because they're physically living inside of us like this being. It's more of a...

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:57:26.848)
If we align with them. If we align with them.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:57:35.084)
When you ask the Holy Spirit into your heart, do you have another entity physically occupying the cells of your body?

Felipe Aristizabal (01:57:45.64)
No,

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:57:46.574)
You don't. You have a power operating on the quantum matrix of your self. Yes, that's right.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:57:53.256)
Alignment, okay. That makes sense. Well, that's awesome. Thank you, man. Again, this has been great. I could talk like this for hours, because this stuff interests me a ton. So hopefully we could possibly do future episodes as well and touch into some other deep subjects.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:58:15.598)
Well, thank you for having me, Philippe. It was very interesting. I think you've got great insights and I think the Holy Spirit is definitely leading in you and your ministry. So you just keep that daily journey you're on. It's wonderful to see.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:58:27.144)
I that, thank you. No, it's the Lord of God. He has truly been transforming me from within. And that's what I continue to try, not only to be on this journey, but to overflow it to others. like you said, now when we understand it deeply, we see it in the spirit like, wow, I see people suffering like I was suffering. And it's not because they want to suffer, it's because of the ignorance of that darkness that's causing that suffering. So as much as we can be light to them, it's...

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:58:51.469)
Mm-hmm.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:58:57.052)
really our purpose in the body here. Now, what do you think? And I know we're ending here, and I just want to have one last question as far as the body that I mentioned now. Do you believe that I take it like, let's say, the church, the body, the bride, is it, I look at it from a point of view of it's not a building, it's not just even the people that say they believe in Christ.

But it's the people who have the mind of Christ, or at least attempting to have the mind of Christ, that are aligned with that mind that are part of the body. Because I look at it like they use that analogy of the body being a body that has different functions, but it all follows one mind.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (01:59:32.879)
Yeah, and that of course that is Christ. He's the head, right? Yeah, I would agree with you. And I sometimes refer to it as the church invisible. And the church invisible being all those people that you just described as having their hearts and minds aligned with Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit operating within them, those quantum linkages that they are sensitive to the movement and they in their own journey are every day assimilating truth and moving forward in the truth as they're able to comprehend it in love. And then their part and they're being cleansed, it says in Ephesians, he,

Felipe Aristizabal (01:59:35.314)
Correct.

Felipe Aristizabal (01:59:40.775)
Right.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (02:00:01.836)
He cleanses us with the washing of the Spirit and the Word. So it's always through the Word of Truth that changes that substructure, changes that harmonic frequency. It's always going to be leading us to cleanse us through the Word in its application in our life.

Felipe Aristizabal (02:00:05.544)
Exactly.

Felipe Aristizabal (02:00:16.039)
And there's where having that mind of Christ or trying to align with that mind of Christ, it aligns us even if I'm here and someone's in China, and there we can talk in the future, we can explain how that's also the entanglement, basically, how that would work as far as how the body would work. Because even though we're so separated,

because I have his thoughts now produce his actions, and then his actions are aligned with his will, which would cause the same thing for the next person, which makes us one body, right?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (02:00:46.744)
Yeah, no, exactly right. have certain principles or methods we operate on. you are a person who lives in harmony with the laws of health, as long as we all understand the basic same principles, then there is no disagreement. When you go anywhere in the world, you don't want to get a sunburn, you'll use sunscreen, you'll want to eat healthy foods, you don't want polluted water, you want clean air. I mean, it doesn't matter your background, when you understand the laws of health, everybody...

wants to operate on those same principles, whether their situation allows it or not, it's different question. But your heart wants those healthy things when you comprehend that's the way it is.

Felipe Aristizabal (02:01:22.382)
Awesome. All right, awesome. I've been, I read this, I finished this book, I'm going to be reading more books. I know you got some books out. Is there anywhere you would like to send anyone if they want to find more about you or about your ministry?

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (02:01:34.734)
Yes, comeandreason.com. Come and Reason, lots of free resources. We ship many resources for free. We have a store they can order and most of our materials are free. We ship anywhere in the US at no cost. So, yep.

Felipe Aristizabal (02:01:49.288)
Awesome. Well, again, thank you again so much. It's been really exciting and I really hope to have this again in the future. Hopefully with what we have, this should be one episode. If not, I might make it into part one, part two so people have the tension spans won't be so lost. yeah.

Timothy R. Jennings, MD (02:02:06.861)
And after you get it up and posted, send me a link and then we will push that out on our platforms as well. All right, thank you. No, no, I enjoyed talking with you today. You have a good day. All right, bye-bye.

Felipe Aristizabal (02:02:13.576)
Amazing. All right. Thank you so much. Did you have any questions for me or anything before we go? Likewise, take care. a blessed day.