The First Call: Navigating Cyber Crises with Sadia Mirza

What happens when a company faces its worst digital nightmare? For many organizations, Sadia Mirza is the first call. As a partner at Troutman Pepper leading the firm's incidents and investigations team, she guides clients through the chaos of cybersecurity breaches with a unique blend of legal expertise and genuine empathy. In this revealing conversation, Sadia shares how her globe-trotting childhood prepared her perfectly for the constantly changing landscape of incident response. "I'm just used to having constant change, and I like that," she explains, drawing parallels between her personal adaptability and professional success. This comfort with flux serves her well in a field where each day brings new challenges and high-stakes decisions. Beyond technical expertise, Sadia emphasizes that communication becomes the cornerstone of effective incident response. "I can relate to anyone," she notes, describing how building trust with clients in crisis situations requires more than just legal knowledge—it demands emotional intelligence and a steady presence. Her approach centers on being both a legal advisor and a calming force: "I'm your lawyer, I'm your therapist, we're going to be fine."For organizations seeking to enhance their cybersecurity posture, Sadia provides practical guidance that cuts through complexity. "Cybersecurity shouldn't be any one department's job," she advises, advocating for a cultural shift where security becomes everyone's responsibility. Her perspective on proactive planning is refreshingly accessible: "It's never too late to start thinking about this issue."Perhaps most compelling is Sadia's philosophy on finding wellness amid high-pressure work. Rather than grand gestures, she finds joy in life's simple pleasures—a perfect cup of coffee, baking cookies with her children, or walking through a new city. "Real wellness is being able to find joy in just the simple things in life," she reflects, offering a grounded perspective for professionals in demanding fields. Ready to transform how you think about cybersecurity, leadership, and finding balance? Listen now and discover why having someone like Sadia in your corner might be the difference between crisis and resilience.

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Transcript

Speaker 1 0:20

Hi, welcome back to the Tech Exec Wellness Podcast, the show where we explore how leaders at the top of their fields navigate disruption, growth and resilience, and also tell us stories that ignite the soul. So today's guest I'm very excited about this is Sadia Mirza. She's a partner at Troutman, pepper and Locke, where she leads the firm's incidents and investigations team. When a security incident or data breach is suspected, sadia is often the very first call. She plays a central role in her clients' cybersecurity strategies, from pre-incident planning and readiness to brief investigations. What sets her apart is her 360-degree knowledge of the incident response lifecycle. She not only helps companies recover, but also ensures they present a strong and defensible narrative to regulators, plaintiffs and the public. Her practice also spans privacy, compliance and cutting-edge issues in advanced technology.

Speaker 1 1:11

Sadia is widely recognized as a thought leader. She's a frequent speaker on the national panels, a member of the RSA Conference Law Track Committee and a published author in Bloomberg Law and Law 360. She also holds certifications as a Certified Information Privacy Professional and Certified Information Privacy Manager. She's got just an excellent academic background Queen Mary University of London, stetson University, college of Law and UCLA a BA in English. So before we dive in Sadia, we'd like to know something personal about you. So welcome to the show.

Speaker 2 1:48

Well, it is so wonderful to be on the show and thank you for thinking of me. You know, just by the name of the title of this podcast, when we talk about the wellness podcast, tech Execs like I, this is something that I'm really, really passionate about, so I was just excited to be here.

Speaker 1 2:03

Thank you.

Speaker 2 2:05

So something personal about me, I guess I would share that I and I guess this is something well, I've always known this about me, but I really, really enjoy, love traveling.

Speaker 2 2:17

Really I think that's really when I feel the most alive. You know, getting lost in cities, eating all the food I can possibly eat but then burning it off, you know, with thousands and thousands of steps that I'm taking in, I really, really enjoy that and I, you know, I guess, one of like. When I think about, when I think about that part of my life, one of the most memorable experiences I have is I did, I did a lot of traveling in law school and I will say I loved law school and I think a lot of people don't say that, but it was like the best time of my life. But it's because I spent so much of it traveling and studying abroad.

Speaker 2 2:51

And I have this one memory where me and my best friend, we were studying abroad in London but we traveled to Istanbul for like a weekend trip and we were strolling the city super late at night night and we were by all means lost and I remember we were on a street corner and at one point we really had no idea where we were and it was dark and I felt like a moment of like OK, this doesn't feel. It was like a feeling of how did we get here? But I looked around me and I realized we were surrounded by, by mosques, and it was like at every corner. We were standing in the middle and there were four mosques around me and you know, I had never felt so lost but so safe in my life. And so it's just, you know, we went in, sat in a mosque and then ended up finding our way home, but it was just like. It's just like. Those are the moments that I remember. I really look back.

Speaker 1 3:38

That is so cool. I want to, I want to pick your brain about this. So what's some of the cuisine that is memorable to you that you come back to the States, you're like, oh my goodness, I was here and this was fabulous, and this place is just at the top of my list when I travel there. Melissa.

Speaker 2 3:54

I have so many, but you know what I am truly like. I love a delicious coffee and a really good croissant. Like those are. That is when I am the most happiest in life and I swear this isn't even something from like law school, even in the U S, when I was in law school, like I just like I get out of bed to have a really good coffee and give me a croissant and I'm the happiest person in the world. And so every time I travel now I'm just on the lookout for like the best bakery. No matter what city I'm in, I'm just trying to get to like a local bakery and have coffee or tea and then whatever buttery filled pastry thing they want to give me is what I'm looking for.

Speaker 1 4:29

That sounds so delicious. Actually, while we're talking, I've got a cold brew here, but I do love a hot latte or an espresso. Do you have a favorite coffee that you have to have when you land somewhere?

Speaker 2 4:41

Absolutely. It is a hot Americano with steamed half and half in it. And then I realized when I travel, like on the other side of the world, like in London, there's no such thing as half and half, which really it doesn't exist right. So then I go through this whole debate about what it is they need to put in my coffee, but here in the US it's an Americano with steamed half and half, and then anywhere else it's just an Americano with steamed milk.

Speaker 1 5:04

Essentially, here's a question for you. When you're traveling, do you prefer to check?

Speaker 2 5:13

out local spots versus chain coffee shops. You know what it depends. I think, if I can now I do like so much research about where I'm going. I'm open when I I just came back from a trip from London and there's the chain. Olinstein is a chain out there in the UK that's really popular and it was my most favorite coffee shop Like and I would go there recently discovered, maybe a few years ago, like I had a there's a place in California called Moon Goat and they had opened up a pop-up under our office building and I remember I got a cup of coffee from them and I took a first sip and I literally just I felt happy, like I smiled, I'm like, oh my God, this is what coffee is supposed to taste like, cause it was just so smooth. So I go around trying to recreate that moment everywhere.

Speaker 1 5:50

I love that and you know, for years I wasn't a coffee drinker, until I got into sales and then my peers were like, well, we got to have coffee in the afternoon to get through the slump. So I went out with them one day and my first coffee no kidding was a white chocolate mocha. And I've been hooked ever since.

Speaker 2 6:06

Okay, yeah, that's dangerous, that is a dangerous addiction. But yes, that also sounds very lovely.

Speaker 1 6:13

Oh my goodness, I was super skinny back then and I just remember reading later that a venti white chocolate mocha was like almost a thousand calories. Not going to do that again.

Speaker 2 6:23

Almost. This is a whole different podcast. I swear to God, I've been on a diet since I was like 12 years old at this point in my life, knowing calories, counting calories forever that's a big part of my life, nice.

Speaker 1 6:34

Now, before we move on to cyber, you've mentioned wellness right off the bat with steps. When you're traveling, do you make it a point to get out for a walk before you start the day, or is it something you do in between or after? What is that like?

Speaker 2 6:48

No, I think, Barb. My recent trip to London well one, I just love tracking. I love knowing what I'm doing, like I track my steps, I track my calories, I track my sleep, I just love tracking myself.

Speaker 2 7:00

Apparently, this last trip, what I was doing when I got to I feel like it's something that I've recently come to appreciate, just being outside a lot more, um, and so what I was doing is our, our office in London was in, um, like East central London, and what I would do is I would take the tube to, like, oxford street to where, like, selfridges was Um, and then I would walk all the way over to the office before I got, and that would be like my path to work and so, and that's a pretty far walk, that was thousands and thousands of steps and so, like I was just getting it in wherever I could, but mainly because I like scrolling, like I like scrolling, I like having a coffee in hand and kind of walking. It was just, it was more, it wasn't. I guess it was exercise, but it was just me being happy and kind of feeling free, and then I'd go and I'd get my day started.

Speaker 1 7:45

I'm sitting here listening to you and I'm thinking back to my days in Chicago, when I lived in the city. I had a car but I was always walking everywhere getting groceries, going for coffee, going for brunch. And I live in the South now and I have to have a car and I have to go out before the sun comes up and gets really hot or after sundown so I can enjoy the cool weather. Yeah, I've got some great memories just thinking about your story.

Travel, Wellness, and Work-Life Balance

Speaker 2 8:10

Melissa, now I'm in Houston, so it's like there's no walking happening. There's no walking happening over here, like, and we actually now it's cooling down, not it's. I say it's cooling down, I swear to God, it's like 90 degrees outside right now. But, like I will, I'll take a walk with my husband and kids in the evening, but there's not really. You're not really walking somewhere right to get to a place. And so now what I've done we recently got a treadmill and I put it in like our garage, so I'll just wake up in the morning and just at least get my steps in that way, because it's also just a nice way to start the morning. I feel like you know, I realized back in, actually when I was living in California, sometimes I'd feel so stressed about something, but the moment you go work out, burn some calories, sweat a little, it just it made you realize like, okay, wait, that thing isn't that, isn't that stressful. It just kind of puts things into perspective for me.

Speaker 1 8:58

Exactly. That is just getting away from your desk, getting outside walking, and I always joke around and say touch grass and trees, you'll feel better. But it's so true, it's so good.

Speaker 2 9:09

Yeah, yeah, I agree.

Speaker 1 9:11

All right, so let's dive into cybersecurity. Was this your path? I mean, did you always want to do this and how did you get into it? Specifically with privacy and incident response, which is another beast within the cybersecurity domain. With privacy and incident response, which is another beast within the cybersecurity domain.

Speaker 2 9:26

So this my life, I can only describe it as a series of wildly fortunate events, good luck and, I assume, some blessings. Like this is not anything that I had, not anything that I had planned for, so much that, you know, when I graduated law school, I went to law school in Florida and then I moved back to Orange County, which is where my parents were, and my first job out of law school ended up not being, you know, not not a law firm, but I ended up at a business called CoreLogic. And the reason I ended up there is because I remember I was sitting in my parents' apartment and I looked out the window and I saw the CoreLogic building and I was like, oh, I wonder what they do. And so I looked them up. They had a job opening and I applied and I got that job and it was just through, you know, things like that that ended me up in this opportunity at Troutman. And I will say it was it all worked out the way I think it was supposed to work out, and I really love the work that I do.

Speaker 2 10:17

You know, when it comes to, a lot of the work I do is helping companies respond to security incidents. So there is a lot of, you know, stress and pressure that comes with that. But when I think back to my life, I feel like it makes total sense as to why this works for me. And it's it's because, growing up as a kid, like we moved around every two years, maybe every one and a half year, it was always like we moved states, we moved countries, like they were big life moves, and it was because my dad used to be in the hotel industry working for the four season, and so we just I'm just used to having like constant change and and and I like that.

Speaker 2 10:52

And I think it's becoming a problem though in my life, because I'm always seeking constant major life change and never just like content with what's happening at the moment apparently. But like that really does fit incident response, because it's like you're, you're given a set of facts, you help the client get through it and hopefully you know that's the end of it, and then you move on right, you move on from there and so it's, it's fast paced, you're moving, go, you have multiple clients, you're not dealing with the same, you know some litigation matters go on for years and years. I just feel like, okay, I can, and so it just it suits me as a person, this the work that I found for myself.

Speaker 1 11:29

There must be a reason the universe put us together because, again, every time you're explaining like parts of your life, I'm like, oh my goodness. I resonate with that Because you know, I think with technology specifically, you've got you've got the internet. That came out years ago. Now we're looking at AI and everything. So it's always evolving and I love that you look to grow and to do different things. That's so cool.

Speaker 2 11:52

Yeah, no, honestly, and like most of the extent, but I need to get a grip on how much change I'm like searching for At this point. I've lived in I swear I think I've lived in 30 different homes and my, my oldest daughter, who's 10, I was counting up like how many homes she's lived in. She's lived in 10. So like she's moved 10 different times, but like I, I love it. And you know, everyone always asks me like what about your husband? I'm like, well, I'm sure he loves it. I'm sure he loves it too, because he could have put a stop to it, but he doesn't.

Speaker 1 12:23

And I mean, it's been fun but I think I need, I need, I need to control it. No, that makes sense. Let me ask you this, though you know, because we're getting into the story of you, Sadia, and you've got this diverse background and perspectives Do you think that helps with incident response work, when you get a matter in the door?

Speaker 2 12:41

You know, I think that my so yeah, it is a really diverse background. I grew up in a lot of different neighborhoods, I attended a lot of different schools. I met people from all different backgrounds and I think what's true about me is that I can relate to anyone right. There's something I can find in common with just about anybody and I think it's made me like I can communicate really well, I think, with clients and I can get to know them. I think I can generally get clients generally like me as a person, and that's important, especially in incident response, because I think there does need to be this kind of a relationship between you and your clients when you're dealing with these types of matters. They need to trust you and I think that they need to like you, and so you know, to me, communication is a really is the most critical part of incident response, and I don't just mean, like you know, how you communicate about the incident, but it's the people you bring to the table and how they to handle the response and how they're interacting and communicating with each other.

Speaker 2 13:49

Panics, under stress, you know the, the and your tone. You know you can you can hear that in your tone. You can't bring calmness to a moment of chaos. The communication aspect is so important and I feel like that. That's something that I've been able to develop. Regardless of who picks up the phone on the other side, I can usually bring them to a spot where they feel a little bit calmer, and it's through communication. Right. It's just getting them back to look, it's going to be okay, we're going to get you through this and getting them to trust you, and I feel like a lot of that is just. I've been exposed to a lot of different types of people.

Speaker 1 14:15

I love that empathy and that comes through in your voice, just having that calm demeanor, because I've been on some of those breaches from a sales perspective and it is the most it's just the most chaotic time for the client, the law firms there. There's so many different players, like you said earlier, and somebody has got to kind of be in control and command of all of the emotional feelings that are going on at that time.

Speaker 2 14:37

Yeah, exactly, and I think right, I think empathy is the right word, like you have to be, you have to be in command, but you also have to realize that this is the worst day of your client's life for a lot of people, right, they've never dealt with something like this, and so you have to be able to. You have to, you have to be able to communicate that you understand but that it's going to be okay. And I feel like sometimes you know a lot, of a lot of. I think the problem with incident response right now is that you know, sometimes attorneys are handling too many of them and they just kind of faint them out but you forget, like, just because we're doing hundreds of them, it doesn't mean that your client has been through it hundreds of times. They really need you to take the time to let them know a little bit it's going to be okay, whereas you might already know that, but you got to. You have to spend that time building that relationship and earning that trust.

The Path to Incident Response

Speaker 1 15:23

That's awesome to have somebody like you in the corner when you know it hits the fan, so to speak. So is there one case that sticks with you? Is there a highlight in your career thus far where you're like, oh my goodness, this case just was epic and not in a good way.

Speaker 2 15:38

Yeah, you know what there is. There is a moment that sticks with me and we recently this was and I'll say I know I know it's happened more than once, but like there was a client who we handled a response on behalf of and I remember she, like, even in the middle of the incident, like and she said it multiple times, she just constantly repeating it I'm just so grateful that I met you, because I don't know how I'd get through this without you and Melissa. I know she was not talking about my lawyering skills, which are great, we'll put that on the record, that's awesome. But I think she was really just referring to the relationship that we had built, because, truly, when, when something like this happens to my client, I want them to know that I'm going to be there, like it doesn't matter if it's, you know, 2 PM or 2 AM, if they feel stressed, you just need to pick up the phone and call me and we can talk through it. Like it doesn't matter how many times you need me to repeat something or explain it, because it is tough for them and they're dealing with a lot of different pressures, a lot of different stakeholders Like, and I want to be that one that and I always explain when I get on calls I'm like I'm your lawyer, I'm your therapist, we're going to be fine, we're going to get through it.

Speaker 2 16:48

And you know, having her say those words, I could hear it in her voice, like her shaky voice, that she meant just having someone you know like, and not me, like my team, right, this is. We have a team that does this with me, and I feel like we all, we all approach it the same way. Having us there with her was what got her through it and what gave her the ability to sleep at night and like.

Speaker 1 17:12

Those are the moments that I remember. You're seeing the worst of the worst out there with some of these data breaches. How do you stay? And you're a parent too, right, so you're not going to show them emotionally like, oh my goodness, this is really bad. How do you bring that forth to the client, to where you know that it might be really bad, but you want to kind of keep things under control. How do you do that?

Speaker 2 17:32

So, you know, I think from my perspective and I guess there's a few different ways we could answer this question, but just in terms of, like you know, how do we stay on top If the question is like, how do we stay on top of it when there's all this like high pressure, right? Yes, number one, I am a firm believer of, like making lists, making a to-do list of things that need to happen, like I know right, and making sure nothing's missed on our side, like I want an action item for every matter, what we're going to do next and when's it going to be done by, and who's handling it. Just, there needs to be organization when it comes to a response. I'll also say that I think that in incident response, there's a lot of moments during the response phase where you have to make a tough decision, like there's basically a fork in the road and you got to go one way or the other and the client doesn't know what they want to do. And I am a North Star when it comes to incident response and whenever we're faced with a situation like that, how we ultimately decide which way we should go is, you know, I always tell the client that you know, months from now, weeks from now. Imagine that we have to explain the decision that we made at this moment to a regulator and imagine how that decision is going to play out in their ears. Are they going to think that we did something just to prioritize the business's needs, or are they going to think, or are we going to be able to tell a story that shows, no, we prioritize, you know, the needs of individuals who may have been impacted by the incident and the consumers, and that's who we were concerned about.

Speaker 2 18:56

Whenever we have a tough decision, that's not a star, it's how is it going to sound or how is it going to look when we have to repeat the story back to someone else. And I think, if you can have that perspective, it really makes the decision-making process really easy. And a lot of times, the decision that's good for the consumers is also the decision that's good for the business. So it's not like you're being pulled in different directions. There is usually some kind of middle ground that just makes sense, and so that's been, I think. But in order to do that, you also have to understand what happens in you know, in regulatory investigations, what happens on the litigation side, so that you can advise your clients like okay, well, these are the things that they're going to look at and they're going to think about. So let's figure out how we can make sure we have a really good story to tell.

Speaker 1 19:40

Is what do you like better? Do you like being in the fire or preventing the fire?

Speaker 2 19:44

You know you got to really love both. I think if you're, you got to really like both because you know the prevention piece you're only going to be good at. The prevention piece is if you know what's happening in the fire, right, like it doesn't make sense for you to be doing these like a tabletop exercise if you've never really been part of an incident. An incident response evolves, right, it's very different. The incidents that were happening 10, 15 years ago are very different than the incidents that happened today. So I think you, in order to be very effective on the proactive side, you also have to be very you know you have to be doing the active incidents regularly. But yes, of course I love doing the proactive work.

Speaker 2 20:22

I love doing tabletop exercises and I right now we've actually been talking to just internally, we're planning on doing a lot more of them in 2026. And that's ultimately the goal. But you know it's it's nice to do those because you get to play out these various different scenarios without the added pressure of this happening and when you do them correctly, like I've seen tabletop exercises done in many different ways, but I'll just say, like there's, I think there's certainly a right way and a wrong way to do that. Different, whole different podcasts we can talk about this on, but when they're done effectively, I really like you. Can the conversations go on for so long and businesses really figure out? Oh my God, we wouldn't know what to do at this moment and thankfully you get to think about that and then figure it out before it actually happens and, if so, how do you contain that?

Speaker 1 21:08

How do you deal with the? You know, turn that off at the end of the day.

Speaker 2 21:12

Okay, that is. I wish I could tell you something different, but anyone really in this space knows it's very hard to turn off right, like there. I am constantly, most important, going to sleep, thinking about. You know what happened in a response. What you know was that what steps have we taken? What else can we do to help improve the story that we're going to ultimately walk away with?

Speaker 2 21:29

I think what's you know and I know I talk about this quite a bit about just the balance in life, like for me. There's moments where you have to be all in when it comes to work. Right, you just have to be all in. Then there's going to be it might be a week, it might be two weeks, right, where you just know that your job commands your attention. But then I think it's really important to take a pause and say, okay, look, I've given, I've given a lot to work right now. Right now I have some breathing room. Let me turn it off and focus on the other part of my life, the other really important non-billables, right my kids, my husband, and just knowing that when we talk about work-life balance, it's not a 50-50 split, it's just recognizing that sometimes work is going to command more of your time, but then you have to make sure to give back that time to your family when you can.

Navigating Cyber Crises with Empathy

Speaker 1 22:14

Now that makes sense. If there was any one message that you could give to every executive that listens to this show, how would you get them to think differently about incident response? What would that look like?

Speaker 2 22:25

What would I tell them? One, you know it's never. I think a lot of clients who call us to do proactive work, they kind of get on the call and they feel a little bit embarrassed that hey, you know, we haven't really thought about this. It's something we'd like to do. It's not embarrassing, call us, because that's the situation for a lot of clients. You're not too late.

Speaker 2 22:46

It's never too late to start thinking about this issue, and so I would say, if it's not something that you have actually been thinking about or having conversations across the entire business, not just like the legal team or not just the security team, you need to start that discussion and you're not too late. I think you should just start moving forward with it with the ultimate goal of making you know cybersecurity shouldn't be any one department's job. Right, it doesn't. Cybersecurity doesn't just belong to the security team. It's not something that just legal should be concerned about. It's something that everyone has to be involved in and there has to be like this, this culture of cybersecurity in the organization.

Speaker 2 23:24

And if, if you don't feel like people talk about this on a regular basis and there's not training, you know things like this that are happening on at that scale, then I think it's the best thing you can do is start just pick up a call. You know, call us and we can figure out whether it's beginning with your incident response plan, reviewing it, making sure you have one in place, or even know you know if you had one tomorrow. Who are you going to call, like? I think that things as simple as that that you can put in as like Band-Aids you don't have to go having a tabletop exercises takes some time and preparation, but just even knowing who you would call so that, if something were to happen, you can be guided down the right steps.

Speaker 1 24:01

So where we are right now with AI and other emerging technologies. What excites you most about cyber privacy and leadership, like where we're heading? How do you feel about that?

Speaker 2 24:11

Well, you know I had mentioned about doing a lot more tabletops in 2026.

Speaker 2 24:16

And it's because I think you know, cybersecurity, hopefully, is on the forefront of everyone's mind right now because there's's so many, there's so many incidents happening.

Speaker 2 24:24

Right, like every single day we're hearing about a massive, a massive incident, massive attack, millions of people being notified, that hundreds of thousands of people are being notified, and the truth is, when that happens, there's like a ripple effect. Right, the litigation starts rolling in, the inquiries from regulators start rolling in, rolling in, the inquiries from regulators start rolling in, and so I think we're starting to get a lot more interest from, like, the C-suite board members and focusing on asking questions about what are we doing from cybersecurity, which hopefully might make it easier to start doing the proactive stuff that we discussed, like do more of the planning, doing more of the tabletop exercises, because they understand now, with you know, some of the settlements that businesses face coming out of these incidents. That is expensive, that is very expensive, and so you could get ahead of that by doing some planning in advance and hopefully you know the day that an incident happens, it's not going to have such a large impact on the organization.

Building Trust in High-Pressure Situations

Speaker 1 25:18

Yeah, that's something else and I think the minute we feel like we have a grasp on resiliency, there's something else that happens. Like you said, it's an ongoing evolving process For women and young professionals looking at a career in cyber and privacy law. What's the advice you wish someone would have given you early on?

Speaker 2 25:38

You know, melissa, it's not advice that I wish somebody had given me, but it's something that I think worked out for me and it's what I share with all the women, the girls on my team and anyone that really asks. And there is this saying I think it became popular after Ruth Ginsburg's death about women too often marry their glass ceilings, and the idea behind that statement is that the glass ceiling is really only as high as your husband allows it to be. And I think I think some women hearing that might might take offense to that statement. But I will say, in my eyes, like I, if you are a woman who really wants kids and a family, I believe that there's so much truth to that statement where, especially if you have a job that has so much stress, like you can't have a job that's very stressful and then also come home to more stress.

Speaker 2 26:29

Like your, your significant other, your spouse, that person has to be your greatest supporter, that is your champion in life. And like, if you don't, if you find anything different than that, someone who's not equally dedicated to seeing you advance, I think it's going to be very hard for you because this job is tough, right. It takes a lot of your. It takes a lot of hours. It takes a lot of commitment. It's not a secret Incident response takes a toll on your mental health too, and so it's having someone who is supporting you making it easier for you. Like you know, for me that's my husband takes the kids to school every day and brings them home, and he's also helping with homework, like he is the greatest husband and like the greatest supporter I've ever asked for, and so, like without that support, I would not be anywhere where I am today.

Speaker 1 27:16

That's really cool. So here's a question Did he were y'all married when you got into incident response, or is that something that evolved later on? I mean, was he aware of what this crazy world of IR is?

Speaker 2 27:27

No, it evolved. It definitely evolved. When we first, when we first got married, I had a much lighter job I was teaching Pilates, I would be home at like 3 PM, but like it evolved into this and but I think you know part of part of my story story to coming out of law school, I think I had already always felt like I missed something by not going into a law firm right away, like I felt like I never made use of my law degree and it was a hole that I felt or a gap I felt in my life.

Finding Joy in Simple Moments

Speaker 1 27:56

And so when I finally got the opportunity to join Troutman, I think he knew like how important that was to me and so he really just like, okay, you know, run with it and let me, let me run, and, like you know, held down the fort as I was doing all that. That is a great spouse. I have one like that myself.

Speaker 2 28:12

Yeah, no, honestly it is, and sometimes I feel like I don't like you know, if you ever heard, I can't let him listen to this podcast Number one.

Speaker 1 28:20

Okay, well, make sure we don't tell him.

Speaker 2 28:21

Weird words that I'm saying, but like sometimes I feel like I take it for granted, but deep down in my heart, like I know, that that's you know, when we talk about my success, it's truly his success and everything that we both I wouldn't be here without the work that he put in.

Speaker 1 28:37

What's a practice, a mindset or a belief that makes you stay well, keeps you well, while leading in this crazy world of incident response and cybersecurity all this other chaotic things going on?

Speaker 2 28:49

Yeah, you know it's something that I've been thinking about. One I don't have all the answers, so sometimes the women will reach out to me like Sadia, how do you do it all? And I don't hate that question. But my immediate response is guys, I am still trying to figure it out. I'm out here equally struggling. I'm still trying to figure it out.

Speaker 2 29:06

But recently I've come to appreciate that real wellness. I think what that means is being able to find joy in just the simple things in life. I think social media has made us think that happiness looks a certain way, or that it costs a lot of money, or it's like these really big grand things that you have to do all the time. But and if that's what your expectation is of happiness or wellness, I think you're always going to be in a dark spot, which is a whole nother conversation about why I think social media is so unhealthy, so unhealthy, but like you really have to just be able to realize. Like joy, I think, is you got to find it in the simple things. I think it's not. It's easier said than done. Like for me, what I'm trying to you know I talked about like a good cup of coffee. Like that makes me happy. We take I take for granted the time that I spend I can spend with my kids, but I'm trying to do a lot more of that, right, like just being able to spend time with them and not worry about work. We should find joy in that spending time.

Speaker 2 30:06

You know, I moved to Houston to be closer to my family and my parents and so, like I want to, I'm trying to find more joy and just those things that are like day to day. But at the end of you know, when I, if I look back on my life, those are the things that I think are going to matter. So it's just doing more of that, and also one way that I've been trying to do this is like I've been. I think you have to be intentional about it, melissa. Like not just like, okay, I'm going to.

Speaker 2 30:30

You have to really try, just like anything else in life, and if you want to be successful even being successful at being happy, I think it takes work. And so, like with my kids, we recently bought we bought a cook a baking book. It's called a hundred cookies, and what we've done is like, okay, we're making a like every week, we're going to bake a recipe in there and then we take a picture of what we baked and we all taste it and we rank it and we put the photo in the recipe and you know, at the end of it I'm going to be so happy when we have this collection of, like all these cookies that we bake together and pictures of us and like our ranking, like those are the things that I think are going to be fulfilling in life and what I'm trying to focus on.

Speaker 1 31:07

I love that the cookie making together. It brings the family together. Do you feel that it brings a lot of happiness into the home doing that every you know weekend or?

Speaker 2 31:18

Yeah, it brings a lot of mess into the home, but it also just brings it's a thing that we have now Like and it's, I think, a thing that my kids are going to look back at and remember. Like, oh, we used to always bake cookies with our mom and take a picture. It's something. It brings happiness to me, thinking that that's going to be a memory for them when they grow up and you know they love to do it too. It turns out. It turns out our kids love spending time with us, which is really hard for a lot of parents, but they do like, really like. My kids love it when I actually am doing things with them, and so it does.

Speaker 1 31:53

It does bring a lot of joy, that is excellent, and this is why I love highlighting people like you on this podcast, because I never thought about that and I'm over here writing a note.

Speaker 2 32:07

Maybe I should try baking once a week and being intentional and being present. That just sounds so cool. Yeah, honestly, and you have to like I wasn't. That's what I think. If you didn't try to plan for these, like these simple things, the days are just going to slip by and they're just you're never going to do it. So I feel like you have to find the simple moments that can bring happiness and things you're going to remember.

Speaker 1 32:23

Love that. I love that so much. I am so glad that you made time for me today to come on the show, because I think this is always a great opportunity for people to see you, for okay, there's Sadia there on the website, but to come on to the show and just talk about what makes you great, yeah.

Speaker 2 32:42

To be honest, I don't know, am I great? I don't know, melissa, I don't know. I'm just like I say, I am so like, I love what I do, I'm so grateful for where I got to my career and I still, I guess I still struggle right With what with just trying to balance everything. And so you know I was, when you reached out to me to talk about this, I was like, oh my God, me me to talk about this. Yeah, I'm so happy to do it. Um, but I guess the other thing I'd I'd want either and especially on my team, like the girls, were like guys, we're all struggling, we're all just trying to do our best and, honestly, we just have to accept that our best is good enough.

Speaker 1 33:17

I'll say this before we end, but you're not the first guest that's talked about it. But I've gotten off Facebook. I've gotten off Instagram because to me it was. I don't think it made me feel inferior, but you only see the great things that people are doing. And there were parts in my life where I'm like, well, maybe I should be further along in my career because so-and-so is doing this. So I got off and I got to tell you my mental health is like perfect, well almost, but yeah, it's better.

Speaker 2 33:46

Yeah, there is a lot of you know. When it comes to social media, I am torn just because I feel like at this point, like especially with everything that's going on in the world.

Speaker 2 33:54

But you feel you know you feel guilty for not being on social media. You feel guilty for being on social media Like there's really no. I feel like we're in a really tough place right now when it comes to that. So it's just, I think you got to figure out what boundaries you, what you need to protect your mental health, but like I'm not off social media for so many reasons right now, but like I can choose who I'm following and what type of news and things I want to suggest, right, so that that helps.

Speaker 1 34:20

Yeah, even with LinkedIn, I try to keep it. You know, just hey, this is my insights on this or whatever. But back when I had Facebook, it was always my dogs, my dog's picture, their holiday pictures. This is what they wore for Halloween. Yeah, I'm really boring. I didn't really have a lot to put on.

Speaker 2 34:39

Well, my entire LinkedIn is just pictures of my kids at this point. But there is, there is value in that. I feel like there is something to say about, you know, letting people know, even in the professional space, that you have a life that's not just, it's not like, separate. It's who I am, it's who it's part of me, and so I think it's really important for, especially when you've made it like you know, I feel like if there's younger associates at the firm, I've had many of them reach out and they're just so happy because they're thinking about family planning, and I feel like they can see someone that has kids and you don't have to ignore your kids to be successful, and so, like I think it's even better when men are posting about their kids, like that's really important to them, right, and so I think it's important. Like social media serves a purpose, I I think it's just figuring out the right way to use it.

Speaker 1 35:24

I love that. So many whiz bits today from you, Sadia.

Speaker 2 35:28

I don't know. I remember I'm very skeptical about anything that I say, but I appreciate that.

Speaker 1 35:34

No, this is great. This is great. Thank you very much for spending time with us. Please remember to subscribe to our podcast on various platforms, including Apple, spotify. No-transcript.