Amanda: "I See You". The importance of offering hope and support to Neurodivergent individuals.

Amanda is a Neurodivergent individual who sees people - really sees them!  She has been working within the Neurodivergent space and offering support and services for decades in various capacities.

She brings a wealth of information and hope to a community of individuals who often struggle without notice.  But she notices.  And she wants to do something about it. 

She is a ghostwriter, copywriter, and has the words and heart to help folks reskill and upskill into their giftings.  She has a global community through LRNore, her company, and offers Masterclasses, and coaching to those who struggle with thinking differently in today's world, among other unique offerings tailored to a person's unique mind. 

I'll be updating this when more information is available, but for now, give her a Follow and a Connect on LinkedIn at   / mandafern  .

To join me for an episode to feature the story of your own experiences, head on over to www.sageintime.com/podcast/contact and complete the online form.

To enter into therapy with me, join me on my main website at www.sageintime.com.

#audhd,#asd,#adhd,#neurodivergent,#neurodiverse,#thinkdifferent,#twiceexceptional,#2e

If you live in New York or Pennsylvania and are interested in learning more about working with me in the context of mental health therapy, check out my profile at the Sage in Time website. Unfortunately, I am not able to accept any Managed Medicare or Medicaid, regardless of the branding.

I am a sex-positive AuDHD mental health counselor who specializes in griefwork and relationships, working within the AuDHD space, supporting those of diverse sexual orientations and genders, of those engaged in non-traditional relationship structures, and I offer services to individuals, couples, families, or other systems of multiple individuals.

A special thank you to Melissa Reagan for providing the voice talent over the episode theme music.

Disclaimer: None of the content within the podcast or my website is deemed to be clinical or advisory and is purely for entertainment and educational purposes, even when posed a question in the first or second person ("I" or "you"). Responses are general and hypothetical only. Any content is not deemed to be covered by privacy laws and any participant on the podcast or within other public interaction has given permission for the content to be recorded and distributed.

Transcript

Derek Wittman

Hi, welcome back to the Sage in Time podcast. I'm Derek Wittman and with me today is my special guest, Amanda Fernandez. Amanda hails from South Florida and is here to join me to talk about neurodivergence and her experience as well as some of the really cool things that she's been doing as a result of everything she has going on in her life. So Amanda.

Tell us a little bit about yourself and what inspired you to focus on helping the neurodivergent community in particular.

Amanda Fernandez

Thank you so much for having me today. I'm really excited to be here. And thank you. We met on Reddit. Can I say that? That we met on Reddit? Yeah.

Derek Wittman

I am as well.

Derek Wittman

Of course, of course. mean, it's It's really cool how we met though. It really is. So yeah, we met on Reddit

Amanda Fernandez

It is. So that's part of my origin story. I think it's important to note that because these groups are lifesavers for people within the neurodivergent community. And I'm so grateful to live in the time that we live in. How I was introduced into the neurodivergent community and just, I guess at the time people who were classified as other was from my grandmother and

We have a grocery store down here in South Florida called Publix and she would specialize in job placement for people with Down syndrome or that otherness that was not classified in the 80s and 90s. And sometimes it would be called Asperger's. Sometimes it would be called autism. And sometimes my grandmother would just say they're special. And that's how she would describe these amazing people that I got to meet. And

My experience was so unique because I was surrounded by people who were, you know, walking differently or using a wheelchair. And I thought it was so amazing. It was so cool. And she really taught me to see people for their soul and to meet people where they were at. My grandparents taught me to talk to everybody. And I really took that into my life. When I would work in culinary, the first people I would befriend were

the people in the dishwashing room, know, the seemingly overlooked, the magic hands that get everything done. It was so powerful for me and taking that into my adult life, I have been able to meet the most amazing people in the world, literally around the world. And...

Being 2E was difficult as we'll get into further, but our brains jump from topic to topic differently. We show our brilliance differently and we also show our struggles differently. And when I was growing up, I was seemingly able to do whatever I wanted and it didn't give me clarity, it didn't give me focus. So I tried a lot of things and I didn't know what to do with this mashup of skills.

Amanda Fernandez

until I entered the global community in 2019 and I started talking to people around the world. And I saw these people struggling with English as a foreign language. saw neurodivergence in a different way and I was introduced to these online groups that were not available when my grandmother was doing job placement. And I got to meet these people on a whole new level. It was so incredible. And so,

oddly enough with my company that I run now with the business, it was largely inspired by my grandmother, but also by an amazing man from Iran, a dentist. He's in his final year in dental school. And we have been, yeah, I know I'm so excited for him. These incredible people around the world that are just trying their best to live

Derek Wittman

Yay.

Mmm.

Amanda Fernandez

of great life and care for their families. And he was struggling with learning English and created a whole new system for himself. And this company, LRNmore actually started as a reading list to help him with his English. And I didn't realize at the time, but I was struggling with autistic burnout. And meeting with him daily,

And seeing him struggle helped me through my burnout. I started to use our sessions as anchors. And then magically Forum reached out to me and I was introduced to a group of people that are also neurodivergent entrepreneurs. And I didn't realize how neurodivergent I actually was, how nonlinear I was.

I had struggled so much through life with communications and feeling as though was speaking a different language. And I was invited to this group, seemingly by magic. was run by an epidemiologist named Dr. Allison Krug.

And it was effortless. We laughed and talked about various topics that plagued us. We were allowed to unmask and some people showed up and had a day where they just had to cry about an issue and there was no problem with it. And we just helped each other through our difficult times in ways that I had never been supported in my life. It was so eye opening. It still, it just...

is one of the most profound experiences I've ever had. And I said, that's what I want to do. That's who I want to serve.

Derek Wittman

you sound entirely grateful to your grandmother and all of the folks that have been a part of your journey. So now if we can step back, you've used some words that some of our listeners may not be familiar with, and they're actually a little bit new to me myself. So we've talked about neurodivergence and 2E and nonlinear thinkers. Can you get into those terms and how they're either similar, different, or otherwise related?

Amanda Fernandez

Okay.

Amanda Fernandez

Absolutely. I'm so glad you brought this up because I have experience as a corporate copywriter and in marketing and outreach. So I meet so many creative people and those creative people might be classified as nonlinear thinkers. They're creative, out of the box. I see around the corner. Perhaps they do have some neurodivergence, but neurodivergence is more of a medical classification. And typically in my experience dealing with so many people,

it is looked at as a disability. So there's still a lot of stigma around that word. Neurodivergence is typically like dyscalculia, autism, dyslexia, ADHD. Those would be classified 2E, meaning twice exceptional, is usually high IQ, the gifted kids and those adults in Mensa, but they're also plagued with

deep struggles from perceived disabilities such as autism or ADHD. There's something extra and that's why they're called 2E because they have two things going on or 3E and they have three things going on. I don't know how I feel about that 3E category. You're getting into just over labeling at that point perhaps. I don't know if I can say that.

Derek Wittman

You can say what you want. Absolutely But I wonder I mean 3e is new to me I actually learned about it through a tik-tok creator who goes by Dr. Joey. She's out of Australia She's with an organization called Neudle Psychology. That's noodle as in pasta or you're using your noodle but spell but spelled N-E-U-D-L-E psychology in case you or anybody else wants to look her up and

Amanda Fernandez

Hahaha

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm.

Amanda Fernandez

Right.

Derek Wittman

kind of, and actually she's how I found my own therapist currently. So indirectly the rabbit holes that we do, that nonlinear rabbit hole that we kind of find ourselves in about two or three in the morning, right?

Amanda Fernandez

No.

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm. Absolutely.

Derek Wittman

So nonlinear thinkers, can you explain that a little bit deeper, I guess?

Amanda Fernandez

Sure, so in my experience, a nonlinear thinker is that big, broad, visionary thinker that you may have on a team that just sees a big picture or it's someone who doesn't think like A to Z. You get there A, B, C, D, E, F, G. That would be a linear sequence, right? These are people that connect the dots in different ways.

Derek Wittman

Mm-hmm.

Amanda Fernandez

I would say big overarching ways like perhaps we can get into a little bit of a 2E flow and show what that's like when we talk about entropy. I'm very drawn to this idea of entropy. And nonlinear thinking, a great way to put it is it's like the ocean. So the ocean has currents and waves and whirlpools and riptides and it has stillness and Zen and chaos.

Derek Wittman

you

Amanda Fernandez

You know, it can fuel hurricanes or it can inspire poetry. It has all of these amazing dynamics and yet its purpose is to regulate our climate. We're all drawn to the ocean in some way and it seemingly works together. All of these amazing components. And I view nonlinear thinking like that. Like you may see all of these different components from all of these different pieces around the world. But at the end of the day, there's that one.

anchor that keeps you grounded to your supreme purpose in life. And most linear thinkers know what their purpose is, and they follow a pretty straight path to get to it. And a nonlinear thinker may have twists and turns that modern society says, well, that's not quite how you get there. But we know that there's more than one way, you know, to make an apple pie, as they say, but

Derek Wittman

Absolutely.

Amanda Fernandez

I think nonlinear thinkers are still seen as like kooky and creatives and they're actually assets and can work well on teams with linear thinkers because they're so wonderful at seeing what's between the lines.

Derek Wittman

And we do notice the people, the situations, the elements that other people might overlook. We can play at that nonlinear big picture level where we can get stuck and lost in the mud of the details. And it feels overwhelming sometimes.

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm. For sure.

Amanda Fernandez

I think...

Absolutely, and I think that's the difference between the nonlinear and the neurodivergent, right? So a nonlinear thinker might experience overwhelm, but it's not quite the same as having that burnout that say, for instance, autistic burnout is so it can feel so soul crushing.

And a nonlinear thinker may not have the same perceived disabilities as someone who is presenting as neurodivergent. So I always recommend that somebody who feels like they may be neurodivergent, that they get support by either peer to peer coaching or talking to someone that they trust who also presents that way, because it can really open up your eyes to

the reality that you're not broken. You're just communicating in a different way and you need support because there's still a lot of stigma around neurodivergence, especially in certain countries. And many people do not want to get a diagnosis so they suffer. There's so much pain in our community. And when we find each other, we are able to turn that pain into power.

Derek Wittman

It sounds really deep and even loud in a silent way, guess, is how I'm.

Derek Wittman

hard to notice but when it's there you can't you can't ignore it.

Amanda Fernandez

Absolutely.

Derek Wittman

So you've talked about the idea of being seen but not heard And in fact, you and I have actually chatted about that a little bit. So how does that manifest for neurodivergent individuals, particularly in areas like medical care, schooling, and the workplace?

Amanda Fernandez

Uh-huh.

Amanda Fernandez

We had such an amazing conversation about this. Do you remember? We were supposed to meet for a half hour and we were like, hey, we have to go. We have to cut this short.

Derek Wittman

Be that.

Derek Wittman

Hmm.

Yes, we did.

Amanda Fernandez

It was so wonderful, but yes, this is a big, big topic. I know in my personal life, I have seen this from school to medical, especially when I had my son. Oddly, my dentist is very neurodivergent friendly. And if I tell them, for instance, I had a dental cleaning and the dental hygienists, not a uniform, the paper apron that they wear, the paper gown was rubbing against my hair.

and it was worse than the drill. Yes, I was clenching my fists and I was trying to get through it and I finally had to say, I was like, I don't know how to tell you this, but your clothing makes me wanna rip my skin off. You know?

Derek Wittman

I believe it.

Yeah, I can hear that.

Amanda Fernandez

And I was so scared to say something. I was so terrified that they would be offended. And so I think that's a larger issue. That's even a bigger conversation. I don't know why I was so scared just to say, hey, do you mind if I move my hair tie because it's rubbing against your gown? I didn't know how to say that.

in a non-offensive way at the time, because at the time I was just struggling with a sensory issue. But so that's a pretty minor issue. But we talked about like going into child labor, like childbirth, or just the fact that perhaps you're passing in school, but verbally you're telling your parents, hey, I'm struggling. And they say, well, you got this. Your grades are fine. You're still in your extracurriculars.

Derek Wittman

Hmm

Amanda Fernandez

You have friends and you say, yeah, but I'm dying inside. I need help. And the feedback is you may need help, but you don't need help like someone else needs help. So deal with it.

Derek Wittman

Yeah.

Derek Wittman

Yeah, so when I think of, know, your grades are good or excellent, you're struggling socially, but you're doing all these things, you know, we're friendly, maybe not deeper friendships. There's a loneliness that comes with that too, isn't there?

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm.

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm.

Amanda Fernandez

I think that's, sorry to cut you off, go ahead.

Derek Wittman

Thank

No, you're fine. Can you share a little bit of your own experience with

Amanda Fernandez

I would say the loneliness is profound. It is an extraordinary loneliness that you cannot describe to someone else who hasn't walked in that world.

Yeah, it's deep. And I think many gifted people in general deal with that. Many high IQ people deal with that loneliness, having to explain yourself all the time or having bosses say, wow, I didn't think you even needed support. You seem so competent. I didn't even think to check on you today.

And it's like, well, I need that. I need people to check on me.

right and hearing you're so competent. Yes, because I'm over performing.

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm.

Right. Yeah, exactly. Or you're over masking. Right? Yeah, so masking for many people who are not familiar with that term, it's where you're not your authentic self because you've either been coached or social interactions have taught you how to be a certain way within certain groups.

Derek Wittman

Yes

Derek Wittman

to remain safe emotionally.

Amanda Fernandez

Yeah, exactly.

Derek Wittman

And I'm learning more and more that as we were raised, some folks in much more traumatic environments, as far as their sense of security and attachment than others, that even that masking experience and feeling like we're responsible for other people's emotions.

can actually be traumatic, can add to things like hypervigilance. There's studies with PTSD where we're learning more and more that it's not just the war veterans. I mean, it is war veterans. It is people in LA this week who are losing everything. Those are traumas. Those are significant traumas. And I think we can...

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm.

We have an easier time empathizing, I think, rather than the people who suffer in silence without the media coverage.

Amanda Fernandez

I would just like to touch on the empathy because you brought it up and I don't know about you, but many people that I've met within the neurodivergent community, there's a perception that we are not empathetic and I actually have so much empathy. It's a problem. And I went to therapy because I have extreme empathy to the point where it

was becoming a problem for me. was taking on taking on other people's emotions and other people's problems and internalizing it. And it's again, like most things we're touching on today, it's a broader issue, but there's a reason why the suicide rate is so high amongst the neurodivergent community, especially when you add in high IQ, it's just through the roof. So

We see this in the Reddit groups that we're in. There are many people who talk about this. We were just talking about there's a person whose service dog unfortunately just passed away and they said, couldn't I have gone with them?

Derek Wittman

Absolutely.

Derek Wittman

Absolutely, I remember that.

Amanda Fernandez

Yeah.

Derek Wittman

And I think any of us who have dogs can relate to that or cats or I mean, that's a partner. It's ironic you mentioned service animal, but earlier last year, one of my guests actually trains and works with a service dog organization. we talked about how they're classified. It feels uncaring, but they're classified medically as medical equipment.

Amanda Fernandez

Yeah.

Amanda Fernandez

Mmm.

Derek Wittman

I mean, imagine if we didn't have a ventilator or an oxygen supply or medication for diabetes or something else. That's how important our service animals are.

Amanda Fernandez

They're absolutely crucial, not only for the neurodivergent community, but service animals in general, especially if you were to jump to a different topic and talk about foster children, how powerful is that? Just children reading to their service animals, having a friend, circling back to that profound sense of loneliness. I know for me, my animals were everything when I was growing up. Cats, dogs, I don't remember a time in my life

Derek Wittman

Mm-hmm.

Derek Wittman

you

Amanda Fernandez

where I didn't have another being to care for and to talk about things with, just talk about life with these amazing animals and that they're so patient and kind. And they showed us humanity even though they're not human. It's just, when I think about these animals and how important they are, it's easy to see.

how somebody who's also feeling that loneliness could just be destroyed when these animals who we outlive year after year, you know, they come and go into our lives. So that's one thing that I do work with within the neurodivergent community. When I have clients that I coach, it's about finding, we talk about anchors a lot, but it's about finding that anchor within yourself. So you're not tied externally to these things that keep you here in this world because what happens when they leave?

You know, that's when you, yeah, you may want to leave or devastating consequences can occur. And I learned that from crisis text line. There are, you know, therapists, crisis text line, the national suicide hotline. These are important resources that are still taboo to talk about in many circles and communities.

Derek Wittman

Absolutely.

Derek Wittman

Mm-hmm.

Derek Wittman

And we know that, you know, if you're working on a crisis text line or a suicide hotline or, you know, even for other providers of any kind of like mandated reporter stuff. One of the things that we latch onto is, hey, what are your, what's your safety factors? Who, what's your support like? Well, we don't have much support. I've got a friend here locally and she works with mobile crisis unit and she'll say,

You know, I find folks that really need to go in for that three day to 72 hour evaluation and they don't want they have nobody to leave the animal to so they won't go. And we can't make them go. But, you know, so sometimes I think we get in our own way. So coming back to because we did get off and I think that's that's my doing a little bit.

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Derek Wittman

But what can those systems, medical care, schooling, or in the workplace do to make neurodivergent people feel truly seen and valued?

Amanda Fernandez

Yeah, well to close that loop, you know, especially with the service animals and just offering better services, but also asking, you know, I don't remember a time when I went to, like I started a new job and HR asked me, what do you need to feel supported? The onboarding was so different. The onboarding was about payroll and about benefits and about your new job. But I don't think my doctor has even asked me that.

Like, do you feel supported in your life? You know, for your body care, you know, are you also taking care of your mental health? Like these systems don't really talk to each other here in the United States. I'm fortunate enough to attend Cleveland Clinic, like I go to Cleveland Clinic and so they're a little more connected.

The doctors talk to each other. They have a virtual chart. All of the departments have all of your notes in one place. So it's amazing, you know, but it's still lacking in many areas. So for instance, my dentist isn't listed there. I wear glasses and you know, those records aren't there, but it's a start. so within these systems, like, especially when we're talking about medical systems or schooling, you know,

for support, I think it's often overlooked the simplest, most direct way is to ask. Have an ask campaign, ask your people what they need and they will tell you often. And if they're having trouble articulating that, then you can bring in a liaison like you or myself and the communications, the messaging, especially if someone's nonverbal.

It's crucial to have somebody to help you draft an email. It can be something as simple as an email. The overhead fluorescent lighting is really bothering me. Is there another office or another option or perhaps I can have a hybrid schedule? It's more common now to have those schedules. So it's not as big of an ask as previously. Obviously, if you're working in a hospital setting, you can't control that there's

Amanda Fernandez

fluorescent overhead lighting. Most facilities have that, but maybe they shouldn't. In Europe, many facilities don't have that fluorescent overhead lighting. So.

Derek Wittman

Well, think, I mean, I think we're moving from a design perspective even to more LED options as opposed to the fluorescent, which I don't know about you, but I can hear the buzz, right? Kind of personalized a little bit.

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm.

Amanda Fernandez

I can hear the buzz. love that tagline because it drives me crazy when somebody leaves an older television on. You know, the tube televisions.

Derek Wittman

the high pitched sound, like, yep. Yeah.

Amanda Fernandez

Yes.

Mm-hmm. It's a wine. And so why that's relevant is because some of the older facilities have older televisions and they have medical equipment that I can hear. so, again, tying it back to the medical issues, you know, some people just don't want to go to the doctor because it's such an unpleasant sensory experience for them. And I've never heard that brought up.

You know, why are you avoiding the doctor? Why don't you want to go to the dentist today? You know, for me, drilling is my least worry. I actually enjoy going to the dentist. Like I said, for me, it's other things, but going to my regular doctor who used to have an older television in their waiting room that was at high volume all the time, I would avoid going to the doctor. I actually changed doctors because of it.

because of the television in their waiting room. So imagine that, yeah.

Derek Wittman

I believe you. Yeah.

And we don't say anything because we don't want to ruffle feathers, make waves, sound crazy. Right? I'm hearing this noise. And for somebody who on the other end of that conversation not hearing that same annoying whine. And it's not annoying, not only annoying, it's uncomfortable. It is physically uncomfortable, isn't it?

Amanda Fernandez

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Amanda Fernandez

Absolutely, it is like nails on a chalkboard, which is something most people, you know, they can relate to. But also dealing with neurodivergence, since there is a neurological component, it's not just communication. And obviously it could be a spectrum of disorder. There are issues physiologically as well. So for instance, we talked about when I went into labor, I told my

Doctor, I said, I'm going to going to labor early. I can feel it in my body. What do I have to do? And my doctor said, you still have a couple of weeks before we even give you the information. Just make sure you're pre-registered at the hospital. But I didn't have their emergency number. And I absolutely went into labor early and I had to show up at the emergency room. And it was so horrible. The experience was so traumatizing.

for many different reasons, but I chose to have a natural birth. didn't have an epidural or anything. And the doctor was in the room, the emergency room doctor who was on call at the time and just kept repeating it. Could you imagine for four hours, five hours, six hours, somebody's just saying, well, you should really get that epidural. We should get you prepped for that at the Dural. Do you know what's going to happen if your child gets stuck and you have to have a C-section without that epidural? And I just.

kept asking, can you turn the light off because the lights are too bright in here and my gown is open. So I didn't want the epidural. And the focus was on that. The focus wasn't even at that point. Like I was not a sick patient. I was a patient that was bringing life into the world. And I felt there was little, very little humanity in that room present.

Derek Wittman

No.

Derek Wittman

will second that feeling because going back to what was her statement, unseen and unheard, we just want somebody to listen, to pay attention, to validate, to be told we know better.

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm.

Derek Wittman

at your level of intelligence. Sounds crazy, doesn't it?

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm.

Amanda Fernandez

Yeah, absolutely. Just your level of body intelligence. Everyone has an intelligence within their own body. And when you start listening to your body, especially if you eat in a clean way and you're very in tune or empathetic, oftentimes empathetic people have deep feelings within their body. They know what's happening before it actually happens and they can articulate it. Some people also do not react well to anesthesia.

Derek Wittman

Uh-huh.

Derek Wittman

Yes.

Derek Wittman

Yeah.

Amanda Fernandez

or they have a very high tolerance. For me, I have a very high tolerance. I'm like, you better just start drilling, because it's going to take a while. But I would also, sorry, I just wanted to also touch on that we're talking from adult experiences. However, in waiting rooms, I have absolutely seen this in the children's experience too. So neurodivergent children are even less heard.

Right.

Derek Wittman

And, go ahead.

Amanda Fernandez

Absolutely.

Derek Wittman

So, and you see that you mentioned your son, so I'm not going to talk specifically about him, but when you're present with him in those spaces, you do notice the unseen and unheard children there too.

Amanda Fernandez

I feel that going through the experiences that I went through in life have made me a better parent. My son has been an accelerator for my growth in many ways, and I'm so grateful to him. But I do absolutely notice those little things that maybe I would have overlooked if I didn't grow up 2E or if I didn't have a child who was so kind and so caring and just wanted to do kid things.

It brings me such joy to see him doing kid things. And so when he's telling me, I don't like this chair, this chair makes me itchy. Can I stand up next to the chair? I'm like, yeah, of course. I even brought a book. Do you want to read a book with me? You know, instead of forcing him to sit in that chair, which as like eighties kids, know, you're like, you sit in the chair until the doctor sees you. And then you sit in the room until the doctor sees you and you're going to be on that paper, no matter how loud it

I don't sit on the paper. I don't, I don't. I'll sit in the chair and wait for my primary to come in. Absolutely. I'm like, I'll move up there if you want me to, but minimize it. It's not gonna happen. So you're noticing more than just taking care of your son. You're aware, you're a part of the community and you're a resource even when folks don't.

Amanda Fernandez

Now you don't sit on the paper.

Amanda Fernandez

Yeah.

Amanda Fernandez

Yeah.

Derek Wittman

don't see that you're resource. Which, which adds to the really next question. You said you're not the hero of your story, but more of a guide. if I can even say your story, you said this story, more of a guide. So how do you see your role in helping other people transform their lives?

Amanda Fernandez

Okay.

Amanda Fernandez

well, I love people so much and I really have a soft spot for anyone who's been overlooked in life. And I feel like there's a distinct lack of empathy, but not just lack of empathy. think there's a distinct lack of cross-training when it comes to dealing with people, especially neurodivergent people that have life issues. So for me, I'm.

just a safe place to land. offer, I hold space for their brilliance. And truly I've met some of the most remarkable, remarkable people and they are heroes in life doing amazing things. And Robin Sharma has a beautiful book called The Everyday Hero. And that's what I see when I encounter anyone, anyone in the world, but especially neurodivergent people.

They are the everyday heroes. They're showing up with struggles and with joy and with happiness and with strife, and they're trying to live a better life for themselves. Anyone who seeks out support, I feel is so brave. And I want them to have their moment, especially if they didn't have those moments growing up. I'm there to offer them the space to unmask, to try out the things that maybe somebody vilified them for, you know, to fail, just struggle a little bit.

You can struggle with me. I'm not going to judge them. I'll support them. And then if they want to struggle out in the world, they've already done it once and they know that, you know, nothing's going to burn down around them. They're not going to lose their home if they write one bad email. And it might seem silly to say those things.

But those are ruminations. Those are very real anxiety inducing thoughts that many people, especially with OCD struggle with. What's going to happen when I fail? Well, you try again, but not everyone lives in a safe place in their mind or in their physical reality. So I literally, like I said, I just hold space for their brilliance and I allow them their moment to shine.

Derek Wittman

That sounds like a real gift. For you and for them.

Amanda Fernandez

Yes, absolutely.

Derek Wittman

So I've worked with clients over the years, many of whom would probably identify as being neurodivergent if they were aware of it at the time. Many have not. One of the big struggles that I'm seeing secondhand as well as through some interpersonal relationships is, how did I make it this far and why am I crashing and burning now?

And this might be, you know, first or second semester of college. This might be later on as a middle-aged adult. This might even be in our 60s or 70s. So what do you want to say to those folks?

Amanda Fernandez

hey.

Amanda Fernandez

I would say that you don't have to live your burnout, that you're just on the other side of breakthrough because especially 50s and 60s, see this, you didn't have the support you needed. That's available now. What an amazing time we live in. It is, but you have to change that mindset. You have to flip the mindset. You have to imbue the room with energy. You have to give them that positive energy because these people grew up in a time where they were even more unseen and unheard.

It is.

Derek Wittman

you

Amanda Fernandez

We say we were seen but unheard. They were unseen and unheard then. And imagine if you were autistic and drafted into the war and you had sensory issues. I can't even imagine.

Derek Wittman

Hmm.

Derek Wittman

I can't either. Not at all.

Amanda Fernandez

So, yeah, these people, just tell them with so much love and compassion for them that you're just on the other side of your breakthrough, you know?

Derek Wittman

you know as well as I do sometimes we get we don't know how close to the breakthrough we are and we finally unfortunately end up or fortunately end up calling those hotlines and somebody kind like you is gonna say a couple more days you don't have to make any decisions today

Amanda Fernandez

Yeah.

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm. Yeah, I'd also like to say that you're not the chaos in your mind I I actually don't like to use that word people say we're gonna turn your chaos into calm and we're gonna la la la You don't have chaos in your mind. You have brilliance that must be unlocked you have trauma that needs to be sifted through you have life issues like everybody else you're normal because you have life issues and

You know, being able to talk about that, asking for help is so incredibly brave, whether it's career coaching or therapy or signing up for a service animal, like, you know, just standing up for your needs in life, especially if you grew up at a time where you were not able to do so, or you grew up within a religion like the trad wife movement. That's huge right now. You know, imagine that you've never had a bank account.

You've never held a job. You find yourself single after raising a family and you're 50 years old and you don't know where to start. How brave is it to walk into an unemployment office and say I need help? I don't know what to do.

Derek Wittman

I imagine most people that walk into that employment office are saying the first line and most of them are are silently suffering with the second one, not saying it. So any final thoughts, are there one thing or two things you want listeners to take away from our conversation today? What would it be?

Amanda Fernandez

Mm-hmm.

Amanda Fernandez

print.

Amanda Fernandez

Hmm, that you have not wasted your life, that you are worthy of love, that even though I teach re-skilling and up-skilling within the neurodivergent community, it is actually something bigger and broader and there is help for you if it's something as simple as learning how to write an email for yourself or having public speaking experiences so you can command a six-figure raise.

There's help for you. And now you live in a time where you can anonymously jump on Reddit and get into a community. There are people like us in that community. I show up daily. We met there. We are there. Post your question. Yeah. Post your question. Ask, raise your voice. You have to raise your voice because you have a world of possibility waiting to be seen, honored and adored within you.

Derek Wittman

Mm-hmm.

weeks ago. Yeah, ask your questions.

Amanda Fernandez

There are people who want to help you. Absolutely people want to help you and love you.

I mean, that's absolutely beautiful. So how can people connect with you and learn more about the work you do?

Amanda Fernandez

well, I'm on LinkedIn, Amanda Fernandez. Obviously you can email me at Amanda at LRNmore.com. I'll give you that information for your show notes. And I'm, I'm on Reddit as you know, but anyone who's interested in serious and significant change, I always offer my network to them. So connecting through LinkedIn is very powerful. However, I do also have.

high ticket coaching offers. So it is so much fun. We can go through, I call it the CopyQuake Lifestyle Accelerator. And that literally teaches you how to elevate your voice either through speaking or writing. So you can command your lifestyle, whether you're trying to break into copywriting and get out of your nine to five, because you don't want to work in an office anymore. Or if you enjoy working in an office, you just want to

get to the next level. I help people with their communications in general. So you can always email me that I don't like to, I don't have a website right now because I think it's a little bit impersonal for the services that I offer. So right now I'm only offering my services on a requested basis through email, but that will change mid year 2025. And of course you are welcome to all that I do. And then you can report back.

to your audience.

do that. Thank you so much. Amanda, it's taking a while to get here. I say a while, I think on the other hand, it happened pretty quickly. But really just thank you for your time this afternoon. I'm going to beat you to it. I'm going to say I hope the weather is still beautiful in South Florida. It's not where I am. And you can laugh about that for the rest of your time block today.

Amanda Fernandez

Hahaha

Amanda Fernandez

Yes.

Amanda Fernandez

Yes, I'm going to go for a walk and laugh about it right now.

Derek Wittman

This has been incredible. Thank you again. 

Amanda Fernandez

Bye-bye.