Rebaptism & How God Saves (Metaphor or Miracle?)

Is baptism merely a public symbol of an inward faith, or is it one of the very means through which God delivers His saving promises?

In this episode of The Study Boys, we react to and analyze clips from Philip Anthony Mitchell and Gina Views as they discuss the nature of baptism. Using their comments as a springboard, we examine what Scripture actually teaches about baptism and ask whether it is merely a metaphor or a miraculous means through which God gives the forgiveness of sins, new life, and salvation in Christ.

Walking carefully through key biblical passages and the witness of the early Church, we explore what Jesus and the apostles taught, how the earliest Christians understood baptism, and whether modern views align with the historic Christian faith.

Whether you're exploring the Christian faith, wrestling with questions about baptism, or simply want to understand what the Bible teaches, this episode seeks to bring clarity by letting Scripture—and the testimony of the historic Church—speak for themselves.

Join us as we carefully evaluate these popular perspectives and ask the central question:

Is baptism merely a metaphor... or is it one of God's miraculous means of salvation?

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:00

He was already baptized. This is his second baptism.

SPEAKER_06 0:04

You only get one?

SPEAKER_04 0:05

I already covered you. Already covered you. You don't trust me. You don't trust it. You covered it.

SPEAKER_06 0:14

I think you can get read. You can read up. You can read up from the baptism.

SPEAKER_03 0:18

I think you can do it after so long.

SPEAKER_06 0:20

It's like renewing your vow.

SPEAKER_03 0:22

You he already for things. They want to get like re-cleaned.

SPEAKER_04 0:26

No. I ask for forgiveness. That's the Lord's prayer. You ask for forgiveness, you'll get re-baptized.

SPEAKER_02 0:33

Baptism does not save anyone. The water does not save the Holy Spirit regenerates soul. Baptism is the outward spot of salvation. It is symbolic. It is a picture. And when you go down in the water, you go down into a watery grave. And when you come out of that water, you come out of a watery grave. You hop out of that pool of the ocean on the bathtub. And you go on to live a brand new life and try never to look back from where you came from.

SPEAKER_00 1:00

The study, the study, the study. Welcome, my bro.

SPEAKER_05 1:17

I hope the collabs go into the audio this time. I forgot last time. We're back. That's all they saw. They saw your hands and your ears. It was silence. And you hit it twice. I forgot all about that. My bad.

SPEAKER_00 1:35

Oh my goodness, man. Technology. Audience, man. I don't know why they went mute, bro. But this time, you know, we're gonna make sure the audience is well represented, man.

SPEAKER_05 1:45

Yeah, the claps were just for us last time.

SPEAKER_00 1:48

They were stingy with the celebration. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. Nevertheless, nevertheless, man, what's going on with you, man? How's your day, your night, your mindset, your mood, all that? Broskey Highs. How's Lex doing?

SPEAKER_05 2:02

Oh man, they're doing good, man. I've been having these uh Mormon missionaries swinging by constantly.

SPEAKER_00 2:08

Oh, wow. What's up with that?

SPEAKER_05 2:09

I don't well, um, I don't know. First of all, these two dudes, they came every now and then, they they would trade off, but now they're sending ladies. It's like two, it's like two sets of different ones. And, you know, as a guy, you're a little more, you know, okay, hey, you know, I'm not saying I'm rude or nothing like that, but but we've been getting in conversations the past couple nights, and um they kept focusing on baptism, like real talk. That's all they kept wanting to talk about is baptism and various things of that nature. So it's just curious how um hearing how cults and people who really aren't in the, oh not even really, who aren't in the faith talk about things like baptism, but then you have people that are in Christendom view it with a lot less reverence and a lot less, a lot less of God, to be honest with you. Yeah. You know, so that right there's been my mind, because literally just last night we were talking about it. I'm like, wow. Y'all, we could talk baptism. That's that's my that's my thing. You know what I'm saying? Like saying, but nah, that's what interesting. Yeah, yeah. That's that's how the time it's been happening outside.

SPEAKER_00 3:13

So can you drop a nut on us in terms of like what's their talking point? What are they what are they fighting for? Why are they bringing that up?

SPEAKER_05 3:20

Because they view baptism as literally the entrance into um their view of salvation, in a sense. So they view it as like kind of like, you know, oh, this is when um God, from their point of view, not sure which one, but starts. This is where it's where it kicks off at. Like they actually view it as some type of divine activity, in a sense, which shocks me. I'm like, oh, I never, you know.

unknown 3:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 3:49

Okay. Wow.

SPEAKER_00 3:50

You know, so Yeah, I didn't know they was on that type of time. I I've never heard that as a talking point of theirs. So that's me either. It caught me off guard.

SPEAKER_05 3:57

It really caught me off guard.

SPEAKER_00 3:59

But that's interesting that they have really hijacked biblical Christianity and they're using our things. Not that other religions in the ancient world didn't have washings and cleansings and those types of rituals, but uniquely Christianity um has beautiful, unique claims concerning baptism and its activity. So, yeah, I never heard them talk in that way. That's wow. That's news to me.

SPEAKER_05 4:26

It caught it caught me off guard now. Not off guard like I like I I missed the pitch. Like, right, right. You coming in the wheelhouse.

SPEAKER_00 4:37

You their part.

SPEAKER_05 4:38

Let's let's do this, you know. Um it it threw me off guard because I always want to talk about who God is and who Jesus is. So the baptism talk threw me off because I wasn't used to it coming from their perspective in a sense. But because baptism is God's work, I still was able to, you know, bing bing. Let's let's delve into these texts. Let's let's get to it. So, yeah, I mean, you know, on that note, man, you want to talk about some word and water?

SPEAKER_00 5:08

Hey, that's fire. I love that, man. And I think we should talk about word and water. I think it's ever relevant, right? Because as you mentioned, other religions are talking about it. Non-Christians have thoughts about it, and Christians have plenty of thoughts about it. And it's it is wild to me how the range of ideas within a in a Christian circle are very vast, but the majority of, you know, the people I think about, the circles I came up in, they are offended at what you just said that baptism is God's work. I mean, I guess I should confess that I was there once. I was also offended by the notion that baptism is God's work, because yeah, it's just it's beat in your head as a kid that this is merely your first act of obedience. It's when you are ready to show God I'm serious, I'm ready for change, I've been through hard things, and I want a fresh start. And this is me doing something for God very seriously and sincerely for the first time. Or if you've already gone through that and you fell off, you made that commitment once before, some kind of way, you got drugged back into old vices, hanging around the wrong crowd, and you just drifted and you've been out there too long, and now you're feeling bad, you're feeling lost, and you like, man, I need to hit reset. And then what they say, I need to get re-baptized. So, you right, I was, you know, that it's it's it's definitely God's work, but it's hard to hear that when you haven't been taught rightly from the scriptures. It really is offensive, bro. Was that your experience too, just coming up?

SPEAKER_05 6:59

Yeah, yeah. Like for me, I um reading the text, I've always knew, had a feeling something's going on here. But in popular American Christianity, it's almost, I'll almost say taboo heresy to actually say it's God doing something. It has to be my work. It has to be something I'm doing to show God how serious I am or to um dedicate or you know, say something in regards to my piety. Yeah, I did this for you, God. So I have come across that aspect of just the shunning of it as if it's no big deal, where I've actually I mean, I'll say like this it's funny that cults and let's just say non-Christians view baptism more seriously than I would say majority of Christendom in the States. When you look at the the just the numbers of traditions, when you go from non-denominational, hold on, we're talking about baptism. There's only one baptism, it's water baptism. So just so you know when we're saying this, I don't, yeah, I feel you guys, man. That spirit baptism's real. Yeah, um, that's a different channel, bro. Um we're talking about baptism. We're talking about the actual one where he says one Lord, one faith, one baptism. The same author of that book is the one who in Acts was saying, What do I do? And Anias was saying, Why wait? Be baptized for forgiveness of sin. Basically washing away your sins. Or the fill up the unit when he was like, Hey man, there's water over there. What prevents me from being baptized? We're talking about that baptism. So time to get sidetracked, but yeah, I've always just reading the text is hard. It's hard to you have to do some some Olympic level gymnastics with the words to remove God from it. And we have some gold medal gymnasts in the faith. And like their brothers in Christ. I'm not talking about the Mormons now, I'm talking about actual in Christ Christianity that get away from the actual what the texts say.

SPEAKER_00 9:05

Yeah. You're so right, bro. You're so and and it's interesting because the the offensive part is deeper than what people may be thinking about. Like, for example, um when people are intentional to let their audience know, listen, this is not magic. This is just a representation of you dying to your old ways and you coming back up out of the water as a new man, ready to push forward and rebrand. You're gonna be a new creature entirely, shaking off your old vices, getting rid of old circles of influence and company that drug you down. You a new man. And the reason why is because it is so couched in um this the sinful part of us. Bible talks about the old Adam or the flesh, right? It's so tied to that old Adam in us that wants to save ourselves, that wants to contribute something, even if it's just a little bit to our salvation. That's the deeper thing that's going on that people are not processing. They're more so focused on, nah, man, this is just the fruit of salvation. This is my first fruit from joining Christianity, moving into a personal relationship with Jesus. Baptism is that first act of obedience, and that sounds very spiritual. It sounds very spiritually mature, and it sounds like, man, this person gets it. But the reality of it is, without sounding too harsh, it's actually a sinful statement. One, because the Bible does not teach this anywhere on any page. And most of these people are so scriptoral, which just means scripture alone. Scripture alone is the final authority. It is the rule and measurement whereby which we determine what Christian doctrine is, what thus says the Lord, scripture, scripture, scripture alone. Yet, when it comes to this, they have built an entire doctrine, an entire church culture around something that you cannot find in any on any page of the Bible, not one jot or title or word or sentence or paragraph or narrative at all, period. It is not there. Because what's really going on behind the scenes, again, is this desire to contribute on some level to what God is doing in rescuing us. And they would not want to hear that. That sounds harsh because the posture of it is no, I'm sincere and I'm ready to show God. But God didn't ask you to do that. That's not one of his laws.

SPEAKER_05 12:06

No, 100%. You feel me? Yeah, and I think a lot of it also is is that's all they've heard. Yeah, that's the innocent part. That's the innocent part. So it it's but when you actually define baptism by what scripture says baptism is and come to it in this for instance, I think everybody knows that me and you aren't Credo Lutherans. I think you can just look at the screen and probably tell that. But when I was challenged, I was like, man, let's go through the text. And this isn't like just a one-off text that people go to when it's run from there. It's text after text after text. It's probably one of the most talked about things in in scripture. Especially when it comes to something Christ commanded. And you see it in multiple books, you see it in Galatians, you see it in Colossians, you see it in Romans, you see it in First Peter, you see it just numerous places to where this can't be some fly by night type thing. Oh yeah, okay. You know, like put it this way there's more passages about baptism than tongues.

SPEAKER_00 13:18

Come on, say that.

SPEAKER_05 13:19

That's all people want to talk about. That's all people, you know, one hot topic, you know? Yeah. I'll say there's more passages about baptism than predestination.

SPEAKER_00 13:30

Say that, Broski.

SPEAKER_05 13:31

But people focus on those things. I I I guess it's the cool factor. I don't know what it is, but throughout history, baptism has been viewed as per the text. If you want to say solar scriptura, even people who don't hold solar scriptura hold what the text say. So in a sense, they are kind of solar scriptura. Not to poke not not to poke my uh my my Catholic and Orthodox uh peoples that he says, but yeah. But on a real note though, throughout church history, you won't find church fathers, you won't find people in general having this view that baptism is just uh you know, you oh it's important to do, but it doesn't do nothing. It's you. It's your piety, it's you, you're a stand-up dude, stand ten toes on it. How you stand ten toes, I'll get baptized. And if you mess up, because it's no big deal, forget the text of one Lord, one faith, one baptism. Go do it again. This is all your works.

SPEAKER_00 14:33

All your works, bro. And it's so interesting too, man, when you think about the the actual grammar that the Holy Spirit has inspired concerning baptism, it's very specific, it's very detailed, it's not vague at all. It is explicit and it's it's informing us, not only informing us through God's power, it is acting upon us. So to resist that act, to resist that revelation, it's it's not good at all. Like, for example, Colossians 2, 11 through 12, real quick, bro, it says, In him also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ, having been buried with him in baptism. That is that is informing us, acting upon us, letting us know, revealing to us that we have been crucified, excuse me, circumcised with circumcision without hands. I guess you could say crucified, right? We've been killed. You're in his death, but you feel me? But it says we have been buried with him. That means we died. He he crushed us like Jesus underwent. In fact, our baptism is in Jesus' bodies. It goes on to say, in which you were also raised with him through faith. So it's not magic, it's faith, this gift that the Holy Spirit brings to us, and faith is trust in God, not just mental ascent, like some traditions say, mental assent to the facts. No, faith is trust in Jesus' words. So baptism gives us what Jesus says it gives us. Says that in the powerful working of God, not us, not ourselves working, but in the powerful working of God. This is God's power working, who raised him from the dead. This is not metaphorical language. I got one for you. You feel me?

SPEAKER_05 16:56

Take it up, bro. I got one. We can go back and forth with these. Like I said, it's numerous passages. Let's go to Galatians. Galatians 3, 27. Actually, let's start back a little further. But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian. For in Christ Jesus, you are all sons of God through faith. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you all one in Christ Jesus. Now you might always hear that last part no Jew no Greek, no male no female. He's tying that you're in Christ. You're being baptized in Christ. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ, which goes back to your text in a sense. Like these passages are all over the place where it's showing an actual activity of divine God making things happen through the word and the water. We we're king in word and water because it's God's word that makes it not just water. He's tying his promises to this physical means. And who are we to say, ah, that right there, I'm not solo scriptura today. But when we when we get to the global flood, solar scriptura, it gotta be a global flood. Six day creation, gotta be six-day creation. Oh, you're baptized into Christ. Well, uh spirit baptism? Nah, bro. The baptism everybody's always talked about, always did. I think that's on me. The text doesn't say that. You know? I know you got another text. I know you got another text.

SPEAKER_00 18:52

Nah, I'm just thinking, bro. What does Paul say? This is the powerful work of God. That's the part that people should hone in on. Baptism is God's power. It is Him working, acting on us, using water joined to His Word. It is, it is the word that is the power of baptism, and he uses water. And it's interesting. I know you probably got another text you want to read, but I want to say this too. In this, you feel me? In this case, I want to say it's so interesting. I just recently I was talking to a pastor, and he's one of those types of pastors who is he's sort of he's sort of open-minded. He's not directly offended by these ideas personally, but he doesn't feel it necessary to come down on one over the other. He sees it sort of as fluid. So he's like, no, I appreciate what Lutherans bring to the conversation. I appreciate what Rome uh brings to the conversation and the Orthodox, and I appreciate what the Baptists. I think each tradition brings something central and important. And he goes on. And he's like, but honestly, the most important thing about our faith is the practicality. What God is into is us trusting him, and as a result of that trust, now living out our faith in the world with all of our days. And so for him, baptism is something cool to discuss, to sort of hear the different understandings from the different traditions. But when it gets down to it, when it gets down to the Christian life, he doesn't see it as practical. He doesn't see it as attached to the Christian life. Therefore, he keeps it distant. He keeps it at bay. But it's good for good discussions, good for waxing eloquent, talking about that theology stuff and tradition. I love that mental exercise. That is that is a good thing. But it's just not on the ground practical. And I do think that is the second place people stumble is when they hear that God is using baptism to actually regenerate, to actually wash away sins, that is actually his work.

SPEAKER_05 21:18

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 21:19

They haven't slowed down enough to understand the implications of that. The most relevant, the most practical thing there is related to our everyday lives. And that was a difficult part of the conversation to get him to understand, okay, bro, we are the baptized. It's not a past event. We have been marked and identified in this action of God as the ones who are now in Christ, who have experienced his power, who have been circumcised with the circumcisions, circumcision with the So that's him marking us as his sons, as his daughters. That's our identity as we do life. So if I'm tempted by sin, rather than just giving into the sin, I say, man, I have been marked in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. I am not at liberty here to do what I want to do. Why? Because I am the baptized. If I'm suffering through disease or ailment and I feel God has forsaken me, maybe he's punishing me for not reading my Bible in six months, not sharing my faith in two weeks. And I say, Yeah, I can't pray to God. I can't just up and pick up my Bible all of a sudden now because I'm down bad. No, in your baptism, he made a promise to you, not based on your goodness, based on his promise, based on his word that you are his son, you are his daughter, he is with you. That is your baptism in action. God's word in action, his visible word joined to water, it's the most relevant in every expression, bro. So the text that we're reading, I want to hear the one you're about to read, because I'm like, bro, this is the most intimate language that describes placing us in Christ and keeping us in Christ, removing us from the darkness, bringing us into the light.

SPEAKER_05 23:18

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 23:19

Like, it don't get no more weighty and at the same time practical. It just doesn't, bro.

SPEAKER_05 23:24

Yeah, nah. And then, like I mentioned before, and not to harp on the like the spirit versus water baptism, but I do want to mention this text right here because it's one of the first examples is to of baptism in scripture where it says Well, Acts 8. And as they were going along the road, they came to some water, and a eunuch said, See, here is water. What prevents me from being baptized? And he commanded the chariot to stop, and they both went down into the water. So the simple ordinary means is what God is using. And there's no reason to remove the simple ordinary means. There's no purpose. Like God says this and he wants this for a reason. And we say amen. We say amen to that. Because in baptism there's so many beautiful, glorious promises. I mean, one of the biggest ones that people, I mean, they don't really debate on it. More so people just breeze by it, but it's the classic Acts 2, 38 through 39, where it says, repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ, for the forgiveness of sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Yes. The reception of the gift of the Holy Spirit if you're a Christian, you have the Holy Spirit. Now, is this saying that God can't give someone the Holy Spirit by other means? No, it's not saying that, but it is saying uh it's given here. This is where it happens. You don't have to guess, you don't have to wonder, you don't have to ponder. Look, be baptized, receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Oh, oh, okay. I can look to my baptism and know God has me. I can look to my baptism and know I've been washed, forgiveness of sins. Like there's so many, I hope you guys see that there's so many passages that are just passages about baptism and things going on in baptism. And that's why we Christians in general, the historic church, the Nicene Creed, that's why we're all lit about it. It's actually God saying, look, you don't have to look within yourself. You don't have to sit there and wonder, uh, I backslid and I I don't feel as fervent as I did yesterday. Oh man. Gosh. Looking inside of yourself with a weary heart, just questioning and doubting. Like the name of what we do, Ex Academy. Outside of you is where you can find that assurance. Outside of you is where you can find that comfort. And outside of you is where God places a baptism and says, Look, I baptized you there. Yes, the pastor there. Yes. He can't put you in Christ. Only I could do that. God's making these promises to you. So, nah, it's a beautiful thing, man.

SPEAKER_00 26:34

It is, bro. And this last thing before we get into a clip, it's funny how we both are so passionate about these things, man. I love you, bro. You feel me? It's so interesting, too. And I understand the stumbling block. Part of the stumbling block, too, is that we're using the word baptism. And when you grew up as a biblicist, where you have this sort of skewed view of the Bible where you use the Bible in a way that's sort of odd, and you like, okay, the Bible talks about Jesus as our Savior. So you're stuck on this sort of exaggerated thing we've done in culture where we talk about Jesus and the cross. Jesus and the cross. That's the primary emphasis. And and amen, right? Because Jesus is the one who saves. Who's gonna deny that? You cannot. He is the one who saves. Father sent the son, the son saves. But the stumbling part is when you hear Peter's words, baptism saves. And then we start talking about what baptism does. Because they've been like myself too, because you come up just thinking, no, it's about Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, which is true, you struggle to understand how Jesus is using baptism. So when the phrase flips from Jesus saves to the Holy Spirit-inspired words, the baptism which corresponds to this, a real saving that Noah and the eight underwent, now saves, baptism saves, your mind, your brain, your kind, whatever, it can't handle it. It's it's program overload. It starts smoking it's about to pop because it sounds offensive, like you're now shifting the glory from Jesus to baptism, like you're now shifting the glory from Jesus to man's works. And you're stuck because you won't relinquish the re the concept that baptism is not man's work, that it's God's work, you're trapped there and you're also trapped on the other side because the Holy Spirit inspired the words baptism saves. That is a struggle for people. So when we keep talking about what baptism does, it's scratching your nails on a chalkboard to those just in generic American Christianity or all over the world, wherever, because they're not realizing that baptism is God's word. The way we talk about it, the way those conservative reformers talked about it, was his visible word. God uses these visible elements because he's catering to us as humans who have senses. He understands that for us to receive necessary comfort as human beings who have senses, he gives us something tangible, something visible to lay our eyes on. You can feel the temperature of the water hitting your skin. You remember this action in time, but it's not just a raw action apart from God's word, like some random ritual. It's his promise tied to the right. So that you know the thing that I said I was gonna do, which is save by Jesus' power, his resurrection, Peter says, This is how I am accomplishing that thing that I promised to do. He promises it. Let's say the the thief on the cross, uh, excuse me, not the thief on the cross, we can talk about him later. But Jesus accomplished what he accomplished on the cross. How do I get that? Right? How do I grab it from that historic reality and now apply it to myself? Can he do it through a sermon? Yes. Can he do it through the private reading of his word in the Bible, his written word? Yes. Can he do it through his visible word? Water joined to his word, the visible word again, baptism? Yes. Each are expressions of his word. In multiple ways, God expresses his word. This is where we have to camp out for those who resist these ideas, and you have to resist the temptation to fight back and see if this holds in the scriptures. See if this holds according to the way the church is always taught about this concept and these particular verses we're reading.

SPEAKER_05 31:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:24

If you have an interpretation of these verses that has escaped the minds of the church fathers, the conservative reformers, you have some new invention, you need to abandon your interpretation. That's what we're we're calling people to consider these things more seriously, not for mental exercise for what you just said, bro, but the comfort of the conscience, the peace, the assurance, the realization that I'm forgiven at any point in the day, in the week, in the year, in my life, I refer to his work, his promise that he delivered in baptism, bro. So, yeah, man, already, already. We we in it, we in it, man. Let's see, it's it's interesting to see what people are saying out in the culture, um mainstream, but that have encountered these things from church to hear how they're talking about this, bro.

SPEAKER_05 32:16

Right, yes.

SPEAKER_00 32:17

It's gonna be interesting. Let's get into that first clip.

SPEAKER_04 32:21

He was already baptized. This is his second baptism.

SPEAKER_06 32:25

You only get one?

SPEAKER_04 32:26

I already covered you. I already covered you. You don't trust me?

unknown 32:31

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_04 32:32

You don't trust that you covered you.

SPEAKER_06 32:36

I think you can get re up. You can re-up on the Bible.

SPEAKER_03 32:39

I think people do it after so long.

SPEAKER_06 32:41

It's like renewing your vows.

SPEAKER_03 32:43

Yeah. You uh he already died for our sins.

SPEAKER_04 32:47

They want to get like re clean. No, I ask for forgiveness. That's the Lord's prayer. You ask for forgiveness, you don't get re-baptized. I think, I mean Y'all here get baptized twice.

SPEAKER_06 33:00

I have it, but I know a lot of people.

SPEAKER_04 33:02

What sin is y'all doing?

SPEAKER_00 33:05

She's going in, bro. She's going in.

SPEAKER_05 33:08

I love the passion. I I I love the passion, but these are common conversations with people that they they see getting re-baptized as no big deal. And I I love the zeal where it's like, what? What you mean? But like, she was a minority even there in that conversation. It's it's it's viewed in mainstream popularity, Christianity in the States as such a casual thing that that is, I would say, the dominant view where it's no big deal. Just re-up, as he said. Just, oh, you get washed again. As she said, he's covered you. Trust his word, he did it. It's there. Forgiveness.

SPEAKER_00 33:48

You know? That's a fact, bro. And I thought it was so interesting, too. So, one, this is a mainstream podcast. This is not a Christian CH group at all. These are mainstream personalities. And clearly, I believe her name is Gina, I want to say. Clearly, she's a Christian, she's a sister in the Lord. Um, now people may know her and say, well, this, this, this, and this. But I mean, my goodness, is she not demonstrating trust in Christ the way she's going on here? So, anyway, I think it's so interesting that, bro, is like, yeah, it's just like renewing your vowels. And I and your vow, I think that's so interesting because that is how people talk about baptism. In fact, we've heard a popular pastor liken baptism to a wedding ring. And so for him to, you remember that? So for him to keep it in that same category shows this is how people are thinking out there because this is what pastors and teachers and Sunday school teachers have taught for generations upon generations that that is what baptism is. It's just you pulling yourself together, being sincere publicly and privately. And if you fall off, it's let me renew my vows, man. You know, or if you did not fall off, it's like, you know what? I've been married for X amount of years. Let me just show my appreciation. I'm approaching 10 years. Let me just let the world know I'm still locked in, just still my love. To lack in baptism to that is very telling. All of it says this one thing that it is our work, that it is our sort of, I guess, sacrifice to God. It's an offer to him that he may be pleased. Look, God, look at the ritual and right I'm doing for the first time or for the second, third, fourth, fifth, sixth, whatever, because I am ready again. I am serious. And that is just not the language of scripture, even just from the verses we read. Very interesting. But you're right. I love her passion, bro. She's she's standing. Yeah. Anyway, they go on and on and on. It's more the same. Uh, we can go to another clip and just sort of yeah, hear how this is being popularly discussed in the culture from Christians and non-Christians alike.

SPEAKER_02 36:16

Let's go. No, they are not plural, no, in the name, singular, one God who reveals himself in three old equal persons. God, the father, God, the son, God, the Holy Spirit in the name, singular. So, what about people who's baptized and act in the name of Jesus? Don't matter if it's not a formula, just baptize them in the name of God Almighty. Jesus is God, baptize them in the name of Jesus. I want to be baptized in the Holy Spirit. Do that too. Don't matter. Baptism does not save anyone. The water does not save the Holy Spirit, regenerates soul. Baptism is the outward sign of salvation. It is symbolic. It is a picture that when you go down in the water, you go down into a watery grave, and when you come out of that water, you come out of a watery grave, you hop out of that pool or the ocean or the bathtub, and you go on to live a brand new life in Christ. Never to look back from where you came from. It is the picture of the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ.

SPEAKER_00 37:20

Woo! A lot was said, man. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 37:25

I know people are going to hear and be like, yeah. Like I love the way he starts off by emphasizing the beautifulness of the Trinity. How it's the name of the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit. How it's it's God. You know what I'm saying? Like we're talking about the Trinity here, you know? Yeah. And you're feeling the passion. And this is the way it's usually talked about. But then it just takes your eyes off of God, and it ends up being this is your act. This is what you're doing to show your works, your this. And it removes all the passages we read about God doing this, God doing this, and it goes to the water. The water is not what saves, and it's the Holy Spirit that regenerates. No one disagrees with that. But from the text I read earlier, you receive the gift of baptism. You receive the gift of the Holy Spirit in baptism. How are you separating these? Be baptized for the forgiveness of sins. How are you parsing this out to make this about me coming out the pool, the ocean, all the examples? And now I'm to go forward, not looking back. That's all my work. And guess what? I am gonna look back. I'm just being honest with people. Like, you're you're you are gonna sin. You are gonna sin the same way you did maybe a week ago, maybe two years ago, maybe ten years ago. It's still looking back, no matter it might be 10 minutes. Your trust is in Christ, and that's why it's extra outside of us, because even when you do fall and you do look back, you can say, But God, He's the one who promised this, He's the one who promised to wash away my sins, He's the one who claimed me, He's the one who marked me. I can cling on to that and not worry about all the other added man-made acts that are being tied to it and just focus on His promises rather than removing his promises and making it all about me in a sense. But like I said, I do that what we just heard is I'll say typical. What you hear talk about baptism in in American Christianity. And I love the focus on the Trinitarian aspect of it. I love that focus on it. But let's not remove God right after you say that. Let's keep it in the Trinitarian aspect of I'm being baptized into Christ. The Holy Spirit, I'm getting as a gift. I'm being united back to the heavenly. And now that I'm in Christ, I'm reconciled to the Father. Let's keep let's keep that Trinitarian energy and let's keep being 100% scriptural when we talk about these things because the passages don't really align with the route you're hearing, typically about baptism.

SPEAKER_00 40:20

Yeah, that's real, bro. And and and and man, it's so true. I do think we oversell what like and you get baptized and you never look back again. It's such a dishonest statement. It's such a maybe well-intended, pietistic statement meant to um, I guess, paint God in positive light. Like when you get baptized, now spiritual power is at work and you won't look back. Such a dishonest statement, one that's not born out of scripture. Paul doesn't talk this way. Paul says, When I want to do good, evil is it's there. It's lurking around. He says, Man, I keep doing the things that I don't want to do, even when I try hard. Then he erupts in this lament. Oh, wretched man that I am, who can deliver me from this body of death? Why is Paul low-key frustrated? Low-key irritated, agitated by living in this sinful flesh, if you never look back. This man was taken to the third heaven. This man has performed miracles. This man has met Jesus face to face on a road to Damascus. If he can still be tempted in his flesh and look back and look back again and look back again, so much so that he cries out, Lord, help me. Such a dishonest statement to tell people that the result of this first act of obedience is to never look back. It's dishonest in relation to what the Apostle John tells us. He says, He who says he has no sin is a liar and the truth is not in him. Now, obviously, Philip isn't saying we won't sin again, but his language lends itself to this concept that if you have a true encounter with God, the type of experience that is is one that will cause you to never look back. It's just dishonest and it's not born out of scripture. But you're right. I do love the Trinitarian focus. I love how he's that he's helping people realize that there's one God, there's one being, right? Singular name, but three distinct persons, Father, Son, Holy Spirit. So so to couch it as a Trinitarian work is true. It is right, but it is it is unfortunate that that the sort of strays, and not just him, anybody with this outlook. You you stray from a biblical confession and then you bring in the cultural consensus, which is this is just a picture. This is a picture. The language even gets dishonest and disjointed, and the imagery becomes disjointed because he says, this is a picture of you going into the water where it's a watery grave. No, you're only calling it a watery grave because you have to. Your confession of what it is is not saying it's a watery grave. Your confession of what you say baptism is, is a moment for you to show your sincerity. That's you need a different picture then. You need a picture of somebody in a gym at four in the morning exercising to demonstrate my sincerity, my commitment to never look back to my old self. You're using the wrong picture. Water baptism is not the imagery that matches your words. So it's it's it's it's even disjointed there. And the reason why it's disjointed is because you have this tradition of Christianity that you're forced to use. You have to use the words of Scripture. So you say them because you have to, but yet you deny them by coming up with some other explanation that is not born out of scripture. Scripture does not talk about baptism as a picture. Where are you getting this from, sir, ma'am, whoever? Where are you derived? Give me one text that would lead me to think this is only a picture, uh, some imagery of a watery grave. Only makes sense if you're doing what Paul says you're doing, which is dying.

SPEAKER_05 44:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:54

That only makes sense. The grave is where we go to die.

SPEAKER_05 44:57

Yeah. You feel? Yeah, no, as you're saying, though, like because scripture talks about baptism tying it to being united with Christ's death, they turn it into make-believe time in a sense. Like, no offense, but that's kind of when you're saying this is just a symbol of it. Here's another text. All right, another baptism text. How can we who die to sin still live in it? Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death. In order that just as Christ was raised from the dead, by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life. So they take this and they hold parts of it, the newness of life. That's an actual fact. But then all the stuff before it, you're you're baptized into his death. You're united to him by baptism. All that becomes maybe. You know, make-believe time, but the last part is the that's not how this works. If you're going to read that text as being the text that we're standing on for newness of life and the Holy Spirit and being united to Christ, you have to accept how He says God is placing it and placing you in Christ. How God is uniting you to Jesus' burial to be able to be part of the resurrection. You can't, you can't just highlight the last three words, newness of life. That's and then the other parts be like, you know, well, you know, that's just imagery. That's just imagery right here. No, like Paul wasn't playing when he wrote this. Like, he's literally in a jail cell. You know what I'm saying? Like, this isn't, this isn't, you know, Halloween dress up. What do we want to say this says right now? And I'm not saying Philip means it that way or any pastor means it that way, but when you just didactically break down what they're saying, they're taking all the activity of God in there. Like, it's literally saying you are baptized into Christ. Like, who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death. There's something going on there. And if you look at the accumulation of all these texts we're talking about, it's hard to if you take if you take scripture seriously. I'm not even gonna muddle words with this, you you have to eventually look back and say, man, like they're drilling home a point here that this washing of regeneration really is the washing of regeneration.

SPEAKER_00 47:51

Yeah. It's very, it's very clear, bro. And and and another text, I think, really spells this out. Um Ephesians 5, bro. Beautiful text, 25 and following. It says, Husbands, love your wives as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, who's the her, the church, that he might sanctify her, the church, having cleansed her, the church, how by the washing of water with the word. This is what we're saying. How does he how does he cleanse, how does he sanctify his church? By the washing of water with the word. Goes on. Verse 27. So that he might present the church to himself in splendor without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish. How God present his church holy and without blemish, right? Spot, no wrinkle, he does it through the washing of water with the word. This is how we sanctify it, this is how he makes his church holy. Water and word. This is baptism. This is not an opinion. This is how the church has understood this text since her inception. You cannot revisit scripture nor the following generations and find an interpretation of this text that is not understanding it, exegeting it, explaining it as baptism, declaring it, proclaiming it, applying it. It just is what it is. It is baptism. And the the the language here is very strong, very specific. This is how God is doing his work of bringing the benefits of what Jesus won on the cross 2,000 years ago to us in all our respective time periods and generations and eras. This is what he's doing. This is how he's doing it. This is one of his means of grace. Baptism is his word, and it's important for us to grapple with that. And uh, this is the thing that, you know, we just have to highlight with what Philip is saying, is because while he wants to credit God for being powerful and big and working, he snatches that credit away when he talks about baptism here, not in his entire ministry, but in this particular discussion, when he removes God's work from baptism and then lays that on you to and then I don't like I moving on to the next video clip. I don't like that there's this casual, you know, just doesn't really matter what name you baptize in. You can baptize in the name of the Father or the Son or the Holy Spirit. It doesn't matter, he says. And and we reacted to um another one of his elders on his staff that has a similar sentiment where they they're Trinitarian in their theology, so they get the benefit from having a truth. But other people, you know, it's it's okay. You can think something different. It's like, why? Why are you taking that position, bro? Jesus didn't say, uh He gets a great commission.

SPEAKER_05 51:26

Well, it's funny because he puts so much emphasis on in the name. Singular, not plural, singular. Bro, you're standing on it, stand on it. And then you go to, you know, you can baptize however you want to. You can do Jesus' name, Holy Spirit. It's like, yo, bro, what you just said is probably why it's so important. Beyond the aspect, that's what Jesus said. Okay? That's that's why we should do it that way. Okay?

SPEAKER_00 51:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 51:55

But he kind of shows the importance of it. It's like this is who God is. This is the God that is claiming you and marking you. So why go from that to, you know, dilly-dally? Just say, I baptize you in God. That's not how Jesus said it. And even the verse I read earlier where it said in Acts, I baptize you in the name of Jesus Christ. You really have to really just bend logic to think that Christ, the passage where he says baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, is at the end of Matthew. So this is the end before he ascends. To think that in that short time period that they just decided, eh, we're gonna do it this way because that's why it's important to know Acts is descriptive, not prescriptive. But even if you don't view it that way, right, and you want to view it as prescriptive, back then they'll ask people, by what authority do you do these things? We're do we're able to do this in the authority in the name of Jesus. That's why we're doing this. Jesus commanded us to baptize. That's who's given us the authority to do this. And then you baptize in the name of the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit, as your Lord told you. So, and I just want I just want people to realize how many books and scriptures we have rattled off in regards to baptism. Like, this isn't just one chapter in a book. Like, we have touched numerous books. Some books we even mentioned, we just said the verse in context. Flam, you you jumped into 1 Peter 3.21. I mentioned Titus 3.5 when I was talking about the washing of regeneration. You went to Ephesians, Colossians, I went to Romans, Acts, and Galatian. Like we're dancing all through the text. So this isn't no casual small thing. It's littered throughout scripture. And if you want to know what baptism is, don't take my word for it, don't take Flame's word for it. Just go to the text. Go to the text and just read the text. Don't go in there. Don't go to the bottom of your MacArthur study Bible and hear MacArthur's words. He wasn't there. Okay. Don't don't go to whoever, you know, commentary, the sophists. Now read the text and then you say, okay, how is this viewed in history? How is this viewed from the first century on? You'll see they all held to the strictest letter and interpretation of those texts. And then you gotta come to a point where you're like, why am I denying these beautiful promises that God's giving through these means? Why am I denying it? It's almost like in the book of Numbers, where God says, hold the staff up of a snake, and whoever looks at it will be saved, will not be bitten. You had to be a plum fool to say, nah, man, if God wants to save me, he's gonna save me. God don't use these things. I'm not even looking at that thing, man. I know you say God said that. It's written in the text, bro. No. That's not how it works, bro. If God says, look at it, bro, I'm trying not to blink. I'm I'm all I'm all staring at that staff. I'm not playing these games. When God says, yo, um, be baptized for forgiveness of sins, let's do it. Even if you don't understand it, it's so many texts, eventually you have to bow the knee and say, okay, look, I don't get it, but God said it. A lot of things I don't understand. I can't go outside and make a man out of mud, but yo, check it out. Adam was real. I mean, you know what I'm saying? Like, so that's real. I don't want to sit here and rant, but this is this is my jam. Like, as you can tell, the Mormons were in trouble last night. But yeah, um that's good, bro.

SPEAKER_00 56:03

Let's get into this last clip, man. On that note, my goodness, let's do it.

SPEAKER_01 56:07

Does baptism save us, or does Jesus save us? Well, that's a false dichotomy. That's an either-or fallacy. Let me explain why. I think all Christians would agree, I certainly hope all Christians would agree, that Jesus alone saves us. He is our rescuer, our redeemer. We don't somehow help Jesus out, he alone provides salvation to us. Well, how does he do that? If Jesus alone saves, well, then how does he get that salvation to us? Well, we know that he gets it to us by the preaching of the gospel. And I think all Christians would agree with that. Paul says in Romans 10, faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ. When the word of Christ is preached to us, the Holy Spirit works faith in our hearts. So I think all Christians would agree then that the Savior Jesus gets that salvation to us by the word, by the preaching of the gospel. Is that the only way that he gets his salvation to us? No. Think of baptism as the gospel, the word that's wet with water. That's all that baptism is. It's the word of God joined to water. And that's why in 1 Peter 3, Peter says, Baptism now saves you. Water is not saving you, rather, Jesus is saving you by putting his powerful word in the water of baptism. So Jesus has these delivery systems, tools, whereby he takes what he's accomplished for us historically, our redemption, our salvation, and he gives it to us in the here and now. He gives it to us through our ears as we hear the preaching of the gospel. And that word works faith in our hearts. But that's not the only way he does it. He also does it by putting that word into water and washing away our sins, as Paul describes it. What happens in baptism according to Paul in Romans 6? He says, All of us who were baptized were baptized into the death of Jesus. We were co-crucified and co-buried and co-resurrected with him in baptism. This isn't just simple water, it's certainly not magical water, it's word water, if you want to call it something. It's gospel water because God in baptism puts his powerful saving word into that water whereby he delivers to us the saving actions of Jesus Christ. So Jesus alone saves us and he gets us that salvation through the preaching of the gospel through baptism. These are his gracious delivery systems whereby he takes what he's accomplished for us in the past and gives it to us in the present.

SPEAKER_00 59:14

Beautiful, man. Beautiful. What a way to wrap it up, right?

SPEAKER_05 59:18

I'm about to say, oh, hope everybody had a lovely night. He summed it up right there. Like he he kind of what we did, he rambled through a few scriptures as he's just talking. And if you read the little text at the bottom, if you're you listen to audio, you won't see it. But on the screen, you'll see he actually mentions the text that he's referring to, the passage number. Like he's just talking about it because they're ordinary means. This is the ordinary way that God has delivered this to us.

SPEAKER_00 59:49

Yeah. Yeah. That's true. And you know what's so interesting in closing? I think because we live in a sinful flesh, always um trying to contribute to our own salvation, still sort of trying to climb the tower of Babel, still sort of trying to determine for ourselves what's good and what's evil. We're always stretching out to that default, right? Like you unplug the clock, it goes right back to 12. Our default is trying to save ourselves. It's so interesting with these other mysteries in Christianity: the Trinity, the virgin birth, Jesus being fully man, fully God, there's no way for us to lay claim on that for ourselves. So although those things are mysteries, there's no way for the old Adam to figure out a way to lay claim of that. Then we approach another mystery, very much of the same ilk, something that's beyond our logical reasoning, right, with this baptism, but ah, there's a way for us to lay claim to this. And we find that loophole where we can finally take one of God's mysteries and lay claim on it for ourselves. It's like, you know, like girls be double dutching in a hood, and yeah, you looking for that right time to jump in the rope. It's like that's what the old Adam is doing, and you find that. You know what I'm saying? You jump in there with baptism to say, yes, I'm in there. This is my work, my first act of obedience. You see that default thing happening in us when we jump in there and deny everything that our brother Chad so beautifully describes. So, nah, shout out to him. Um, in closing, again, my second closing, if I could just read these beautiful words from my dear brother, the first reformer, um Yonka George, is just he wrote this in 1519, um, the holy and blessed sacrament of baptism. It says, Therefore, this whole life is nothing else than a spiritual baptism that does not cease until death. The one who is baptized is condemned to death as if the priest, when he baptizes, were to say, See, you are sinful flesh. Therefore, I drown you in God's name, and God's name condemn you to death. All your sins along with you die and perished. Wherefore, Saint Paul in Romans 6:4 says, We have been buried with Christ by baptism into death. The sooner a person dies after baptism, the sooner baptism is completed. For sin never ceases entirely while in the body, while the body lives, which is so completely conceived in sin that sin is its very nature, as the prophet says, indeed, I was born guilty, a sinner when my mother conceived me. Psalm 51:5. There is no help for the sinful nature unless it dies and is destroyed with all its sin. Therefore, the life of a Christian from baptism to the grave is nothing else than the beginning of a holy death. For at the last day, God will make that person altogether new. Beautiful. Similarly, the lifting up out of the baptismal water is quickly done, but the thing it signifies spiritual birth, the increase of grace and righteousness certainly begins in baptism, but continues unto death. Last part. Indeed, until the last day, only then will everything that baptism signifies be complete. Then will we arise from death, from sins, and from all evil, pure in body and soul, and then we will live eternally. Then we will be truly lifted up out of baptism and be completely born and will be put on and will put on the true baptismal robe of immortal life in heaven. End quote.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:24

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:25

So y'all already know the study boy. Make sure y'all comment, subscribe, share the video, hit that hype button, have an open discussion with your peoples about baptism. Play this particular episode, find others that are going in further because this is a beautiful reality for the comfort of conscious. Um God's visible work. All right, man. Any closing remarks? I'm done. I'm done. Bro, bro.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:52

Halfway through um the quote, you you kind of crossed me over. I thought you were done for a second. I was about to say, hey, and you just, and then I was like, oh bro, go, go, go, hit that. Let's go. You feel me? Yeah, man. That was beautiful.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:09

That was beautiful. Man, the study boys. Let's see y'all next go round. You the study, the study, the study.