92: Am I On a Slippery Slope

Problem drinking or drug use often starts subtly—more days, more excuses, and more bargaining. In this episode, Steven T. Ginsburg and Steve Coughran discuss unmanageability as a simple way to recognize a problem before reaching a dramatic “bottom.”

We explore the “yet” trap—“I haven’t lost my job yet” or “I haven’t lost my family yet”—and why waiting for a crisis can be dangerous. The goal isn’t judgment or labels; it’s recognizing when substance use is making life harder to manage and finding a path toward relief and recovery.

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Helpful Links:
Learn more about Restore Detox Centers
Filling the Void book by Steven T. Ginsburg
Overcoming the Fear and Lies of Addiction e-book
How to Love and Set Boundaries Without Enabling Addiction e-book
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Welcome to the Addiction Recovery podcast, brought to you by Restore Detox Centers. We are dedicated to providing valuable and insightful information on addiction recovery. However, it is essential to understand that the content shared in this podcast is intended for educational purposes only. While we strive to ensure the accuracy and reliability of the information presented, we cannot guarantee its completeness or suitability for individual circumstances. The topics discussed in this podcast are based on general knowledge and should not be considered a substitute for professional advice or treatment.

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Transcript

The Dangerous Power Of “Yet”

Steven Ginsburg 0:00

Do all the yet's in your life need to come true? I haven't gotten divorced yet. I haven't lost my kids yet. I haven't lost my job yet. I haven't been thrown out of the house yet. I haven't ended up homeless yet. I haven't been arrested yet.

Welcome And The Slippery Slope Question

Steve Coughran 0:13

This is the Addiction Recovery Podcast with Steven T. Ginsburg, founder of Restore Detox Centers in Sunny, California. Enjoy your experience. Steven, so great to be back together with you on this episode. The today I want to talk about what if somebody feels like they're slipping into dangerous territory. And what I mean by that is let's just say I drink. I don't drink, you don't drink, but let's just pretend here for a minute that I like drinking and I, you know, I drink maybe two times a week casually when I go out to dinner with my wife and with my friends. But then now I'm starting to see that it's not twice a week, maybe it's three times a week because I play baseball with some of my buddies and we drink then. And then okay, now it's a happy hour that I because I just picked up this new role and now it's five times a week. And oh, now it's six times a week. Is there a point where you start getting concerned when you're talking with people? I imagine you talk with a lot of people about this. Yes. Where you're like, okay, you are on a very slippery slope, or is it just like cut and dry where it's like literally, if you do this one time, you're on a slippery slope? Talk to me a little bit about

The Unmanageability Self Check

Steve Coughran 1:32

that.

Steven Ginsburg 1:32

So I I like this. This is a great talking point. Thank you for bringing this up. There's a lot here to unpack. So I I think, you know, I had a I actually had a phone call in this arena today, and this individual was already at the point where they were realizing there was something they wanted to do about their drinking because they feel like they are drinking alcoholically. That's fine. There's an obvious approach to that. What's what's a more interesting moment for me is people will call me and be like, hey, my wife, my husband, my kids, my employer told me I need to take a look at my conduct. And what's important to me there, because I can't describe or prescribe anyone to be an addict or an alcoholic. Well, how's that possible with what I do with my life? And people know what I do with my life, and you know what I do with my life. How can you say you can't? Because I can't, because that must come from the individual. And here's here's where it all comes from. Is there unman is there tangible unmanageability present and prevalent in your life on behalf of the substance you are using andor potentially abusing? If the answer is yes, you have made your equation, you have identified. If the answer is I don't know, there's more work to be done, there's more ground to cover, there's more to talk about. If the answer is no, you've made your conclusion. But it is the unmanageability that rears its head. We, you know, step one, we admitted we were powerless over drugs and alcohol and everything else, and that our lives have become unmanageable. When that unmanageability is present and prevalent, when we have that spiritual malady, that vast emptiness, and there are not enough drugs and alcohol to fill it up. We have successfully landed in the camp of someone who needs to now seek recovery and can identify as an addict or an alcoholic.

Steve Coughran 3:28

And let me just throw something out there, and and I want your like honest opinion on this, because like I've heard you say that over and over again, which I love, you know, because you just like repeat the truth over and over again. Is you just like make it very simple. So your test is okay, if there's any unmanageability in your life, I would imagine that most people probably don't have good judgment, right? Or their judgment is skewed in this area. We're like, oh, I can manage it. It's no big deal. I can stop anytime I want. I drink six days a week. If I wanted to cut it all out, Steven, I'm good. But it's false, right? Here's here's just a test that you know I thought of when you were saying all that. You know, in life, like I'm sure you've been there before, I'm sure you as a listener have been there before, where you're like, I don't know if this is right. And you're like, I'm gonna go ask somebody. So maybe it's like an ethical moral dilemma that I'm struggling with. And I'm like, Steven, you know, I don't know. Like, do you think it's right? This isn't true, okay? But let's just say it's true. If I said, Steven, do you think it's okay for me to go have dinner with this friend of mine? She's a girl, she's really struggling in her marriage. I mean, it's dude, it's like my wife knows about it, it's fine, like nothing's gonna happen. We're just friends. Do you think that's inappropriate? Just by me asking that, if it's inappropriate or not, don't you think I already know the answer? Like, if you have to question something like that, and this is at least for me, I want to hear your perspective on this. But for me, if I have to question it, maybe the answer is yes, it is wrong, right? And so the same thing with manageability. If you have to question, like, is hmm, I don't I don't know if this is unmanageable. The answer is probably yes, it's unmanageable. What's your perspective on that?

Steven Ginsburg 5:32

Uh, my first perspective is yes. So just standing in agreement, which is enough. But then what it comes down to is because it's all spot on. It's all we already know the answer, but it's about the individual finding the answer. Yes, with my help, yes, through us processing, okay. But they arrive at that answer along with me for themselves, because that's a real legitimate claim to stake, where you're like, yep, it's it's it's real. I have to face the truth here. There's an issue. Okay, now we can now we can now we got something to look at. Now we can get to work or not get to work. And you know,

Bottom Lines And The “Yet” List

Steven Ginsburg 6:12

do all the yet's in your life need to come true? I haven't gotten divorced yet. I haven't lost my kids yet, I haven't lost my job yet, I haven't been thrown out of the house yet, I haven't ended up homeless yet, I haven't been arrested yet. I mean, if you need to do more research, that's what we call it, and get out there and like where your bottom starts, where you stop digging, have at it. Uh, but if you are ready and you have arrived and you've found your way to that conclusion, let's roll up our sleeves and surrender and go to work and start getting into the solution.

Steve Coughran 6:45

Yeah, and what I really like about what you just said is the person has to arrive at that.

Steven Ginsburg 6:52

Absolutely.

Steve Coughran 6:53

Because like I remember when I was drinking a lot, like I was drinking a lot back in the day, like in my early 20s, and I was smoking dope and stuff and is just being an idiot. And thanks. Um, you know, I show up to like family functions and have like vodka and my glass, you know, just being being dumb, right? And it was totally obvious. I thought I was being all sneaky, putting eye drops in and like chewing gum. Like it was so obvious, right? And so I remember my brother-in-law, he took me out to lunch. We went to Olive Garden. So that's been Olive Garden ever, but I remember this. We went to Olive Garden. He sits me down, we're talking, you know, catching up. And then in the middle of our meal, he says to me, dude, I'm just really concerned about you, and I'm really concerned about your drinking. It caught me off guard, to be honest. I was like, what? And you know what I thought? I thought, wow, you are really kind and loving, and you have my best interest at heart. I'm just kidding, I didn't. You

When Loved Ones Confront Us

Steve Coughran 7:53

know what I thought? Screw you. Who do you think you are? You're judging me for my drinking. What about you? Look at you, like, look at you, and blah blah blah. Then I picked out one of his flaws and I lost it. And I left that lunch, my face was red, my blood was like, you know, gonna burst out of my veins, and I was just so pissed off because I'm like, dude, you don't call me out, you don't judge me. And that's how I responded. I'm not saying everybody's gonna respond, but guess what? I did have a problem, but he couldn't tell me I had a problem. I had to go down a dark rabbit hole for another year before I could arrive at that decision in that answer my myself. So I love what you said there because I'm sure until somebody comes to that conclusion themselves, they're not you you can't help them.

Steven Ginsburg 8:46

That it's a thousand, it's just a thousand percent. You just can't, no matter what. And it's just it's it's the nature of the beast, it's how this works, it's what we do, and there's no there's no negotiating and there's no middle ground. And it's amazing. And I mean, Steve, we we could spend hours on the phone. The different times I've met with people, the different phone calls I've had. I I was literally on the phone before this, before this podcast session we're doing right now with a family whose adult child is using cocaine, and that the their adult child's response was I'm not going in for treatment, like I've got I've got it under control, like I'm gonna figure this all out. And I said to the guy's dad, I'm like, hey, like when you're ready, I'm here. I know how this is gonna turn out. I'm praying he doesn't die because there's so much fentanyl and cocaine. Please be careful. Are you UAing him? Are you and like I understand where your son's at, but like I'm here when you're ready? I mean, that was in real time before we started this call.

Steve Coughran 9:52

Like you have so many of these conversations, you help out so many people, but they have to be ready. So here's my last question for you before we we wrap it up. Is there a way to accelerate them getting to that point where they do believe or come to the conclusion that they are on a slippery slope and they need to be careful or they need to get help? Is there a way to accelerate that? Are there things you say? Are there things you point out? Is it like, hey, I'm gonna bring you here or take you there? Or like I mean, what have you found? You've talked to so many people, Steven. Like, how do you get them to that conclusion faster so they're not like me? Some person who takes another year of pain and suffering to arrive at that conclusion.

How To Speed Up Readiness

Steven Ginsburg 10:37

You know, so you know, it's a great question. And there's there's so many different variances to the answer. But one element I will often discuss with people is is I'll literally say to them, like, don't like, aren't you aren't really honestly, Steve? This is one of the most familiar paths. I'm like, aren't you like honestly exhausted? Like, aren't you tired right now? Aren't you sick and tired of being sick and tired? Like, why can't we just for the heck of it? Nothing else is working. Couldn't we just pursue some level of relief? No matter how it all turns out, couldn't we just step back together and take a look at this and pursue some level of potential relief and identify in some way, shape, or form how this is affecting your life and the people you love? And so many times when you offer them that avenue, like, aren't you tired? They're like, you know what? Like, because they because they feel safe and they have a vulnerable moment. You know, yeah, I'm tired, like I'm exhausted. Like, okay, like let's like let's get you some rest. I mean, seriously, man, the relief that I experience with people, the relief I feel when they finally accept that they'll get some help. It's just overwhelming. And this disease is so awful, so maniacal.

Listener Email And Closing

Steve Coughran 11:53

Yeah, absolutely. I love that. And I want to hear from you. We want to hear from you. And I want to hear from you on this specific topic because this is something of interest, because I think it's so valuable for us to hear your perspective. Are there things like maybe you've been on the side where somebody said something to you that has helped you to arrive at the conclusion yourself? Or maybe there's things you've said to other people or ways you've mentored people or just loved people into getting them to that spot where they could get help faster. Because I think a lot of people out there are suffering, they're in pain and life's hard. Like we're all in pain sometimes. That's the whole point of life. Deal with hard things so we could grow and progress, but we don't need to suffer unnecessarily. So if you have any insights, any wisdom you want to share with me and Steven, we'd love to hear from you. Hello at restored detoxcenters.com is the email. Shoot us a message and we'll get back with you. Stephen, great to be with you again today.

Steven Ginsburg 12:51

Steve, thank you so much. We'd love to hear from you. We are for you. We love you if you're out there. Please email us. Please call us. Please, everyone, have a safe and sober day.