Working at Vayner Media, Korean in California, Dating Dynamics with Bryan Lee | Ep 84

Today I sit with Bryan Lee. We talk about being in the first 100 employees at Gary Vee's agency, Vayner Media. Bryan shares growing up in Orange County, California. We also talk about social media. And thoughts about dating and Korea.

Timestamps

(1:39) Social Media
(6:20) Working at Vayner Media
(8:37) How Was Gary Lee
(12:48) Moving from NYC to Berlin
(27:42) Growing Up in Korea, Hong Kong, and Orange County
(33:07) Korean in Orange County, California
(41:32) Korean Culture
(47:45) Asian Culture
(54:43) Known on Social Media
(58:34) Better with Dating Over Time
(1:11:00) Getting Recognized in Berlin
(1:18:53) Social Media Tips for Artists
(1:27:43) Advice to Younger Self

Bryan's Socials:
Instagram | Tiktok

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Third Culture Talk Podcast is about people living in different cultures. Different than the culture they are from. Culture meaning, way of life, culture a person raised in, or place of birth. Guests ranges from third culture kids, artists, to comedians, to everyday people. We all are living in changing cultures and have a story to tell

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Music: "Chill Day" by Lakey Inspired

Transcript

00;00;00;00 - 00;00;30;15
Unknown
One thing that I've learned about dating in life is that people are very invested in knowing and explaining their type. Who are you into? Like, what are the characteristics of the kind of person you like without spending enough time knowing who you're the type for? Welcome to the Third Culture Talk podcast. I'm your host Nya Yeanafehn. In this podcast, we talk with people that are raised in a culture different than their parents, home culture, or way of life or nationality.

00;00;30;17 - 00;00;49;29
Unknown
And now they're living in today's culture, which is vastly different than it is of our parents or even back in the day. So let's again, today's episode. Do you rock? And are you rocking the the the black tea in every episode? Kind of nice. That's how we're, like a wise, you know, sweatshirt dependent, you know? Yeah. I'm the only got two colors in my closet right now.

00;00;50;00 - 00;01;06;17
Unknown
Yeah. So there are some creators I've noticed who just always wear the same sweatshirt and every thing that they're in. Which I think is kind of smart. Like, you don't have to worry about it. It's pretty easy. Like, unless unless you're like, you know, dressing up to be a character. Yeah. And sometimes these algorithms. I'm not go algorithm.

00;01;06;17 - 00;01;26;25
Unknown
That sounds. Damn. That's crazy. I was about to talk about my dressing style and how it would affect the algorithm. That is not good. Let's not start the podcast with how the algorithm affects my real life. I mean, at some point you start thinking about, you start, you know, dreaming and thinking about everything in terms of what you're doing for content.

00;01;26;27 - 00;01;43;14
Unknown
Yeah, yeah, that's the dark side of it. You know, you want to be viral, cool, but your dreams are going to be infiltrated by Instagram and TikTok and maybe Snapchat if you're lucky. I try not to think about the algorithm that much though. Like my my thought process has always been if it's good, it's good. No.

00;01;43;14 - 00;02;05;21
Unknown
If it catches on it catches on. Like I'm very honest with myself about anything that I make. If I have high expectations for a video and then it flops, I just think well I guess it wasn't very good. I guess it wasn't very good. Like I know that within the first two seconds I need to get your attention.

00;02;05;23 - 00;02;22;25
Unknown
And if I didn't then that's on me right. You know, like there's algorithm specific details that are like micro adjustments that I'm sure are important at some stage. But my thing is, I got to get your attention. And if I don't, then that's on. That's on me to fix next time. Damn, bro. That's a nice mindset to have.

00;02;22;26 - 00;02;40;10
Unknown
Now that's how to how did you get to that mentally? Because I mean for a person that creates a lot in content. Yeah. You know, you put something out there and it doesn't work in the way you, you know, you expect it to. Yeah. It intellectually maybe. Yes. But for my spiritual and emotional, it's like, Wow, this is not good.

00;02;40;13 - 00;03;07;03
Unknown
Yeah. I have been creating things for long enough throughout my life that I just know that, sometimes my own taste is not going to be the taste of my audience, and that's okay. Some things I make that I know that are just for me anyway. Like some of the most, some of my favorite sketches, some of my best comedy writing that I've ever done.

00;03;07;04 - 00;03;25;25
Unknown
Yeah. Nobody watched that shit. Totally flopped. But I know that that one was just for me. And like, a couple of my friends or whoever, you know, whoever I know is like, clued in on that subject. While there's a couple of sketches that I've done where I think this is for all of you. This is for all of you.

00;03;25;27 - 00;03;50;27
Unknown
Yeah. You know, I know this is something that, like, one of my most popular sketches of all time was something that I sort of wrote, shot, acted out, edited and published all within the first, all within ten minutes. Oh, wow. And you can tell there's like, it's 15 seconds long. There's two characters in this sketch. Yeah. It's just me with my glasses on and my glasses off.

00;03;50;29 - 00;04;09;29
Unknown
And I have bedhead in that video because, like, I wasn't like trying to be polished to be on camera. I just like, got out of bed. I was like making breakfast. I was like, that's a stupid sketch. I want to do that. I want to do that. And I just did it right here. Yeah. And I shot it, did it all ten minutes and you know, it got like, you know, 4.5 million views or something.

00;04;10;04 - 00;04;32;01
Unknown
Wow. Like two, 2 million views. Yeah. Who's counting on me? Yeah. Yeah. When something goes into the million. So you're like, yeah, it's just out there. It belongs to the world. Pretty much. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. But, to the original question, obviously I dwell on it a little bit. Okay. If something sucks. Yeah. Do what makes you you you human, you know?

00;04;32;07 - 00;05;03;25
Unknown
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but I've been in I also, like, professionally, for my day job. I worked in marketing for a really long time. And because of the the stakes being much more concrete in a professional setting where there is sometimes money involved, there's production time. And I have to do all this reporting about it. I had to be very, very frank about the performance of some of the content that I've done in a professional setting, like, okay, there's no one else to blame, like it's on me, right?

00;05;03;25 - 00;05;21;12
Unknown
And ownership is such a big part of being in, like, professional, like, leadership roles that I just, you know, put my hand up. I'm like, that wasn't that good. And you had to to. I'll do better next time. Yeah. That's so interesting. You bring up the part because you worked in marketing for a long, you say over ten years, right?

00;05;21;13 - 00;05;48;29
Unknown
Yeah, I worked in marketing. My entire professional career. 14 years. 14. Okay. So then yeah, you have a different idea of advertising marketing even with social media. Yeah. And you probably you was responsible for like numbers. So yes. One thing for me to be like oh this sucks. And this not based on objective numbers, but for you this like actual like, quantified qual numbers would be like, all right, this didn't hit based on these KPIs we had set for this quarter.

00;05;48;29 - 00;06;13;28
Unknown
Yes. You're fired. You know, I mean, like, 100%. Yeah. Like it is always been. And it was my least favorite part of the job. But having done it for so long. Yeah, I did develop the, the resilience to accept that something that I thought was creatively well executed was not well received, and that the numbers weren't good.

00;06;14;01 - 00;06;36;13
Unknown
And, you know, just do something different next time. But more than that, though, the heart of this thing is like the first marketing job I ever had. I worked at an agency called Vayner Media. What? You worked for VaynerMedia? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So you knew Gary Vee? Yeah, exactly. I was one of the first 100 employees at VaynerMedia.

00;06;36;14 - 00;07;13;14
Unknown
Yeah. So Gary was my was the CEO. What? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So my whole. So. Yeah, that was my first ever marketing job, was at VaynerMedia in New York. And, you know, if you're not for people who aren't familiar. Gary V's whole thing is just, you know, the attention economy, like you're the way that I was taught marketing by Gary is marketing is just intercepting people's attention where it already is and then providing them as much value as possible to create a relationship that makes it possible for you to sell them something in the future.

00;07;13;16 - 00;07;42;10
Unknown
And that's the same thing I've been doing in every marketing job I've ever had. And being taught this, this, M.O. or on marketing just meant that it's all about attention and people are so in this was in, you know, 2011, 2012. And the landscape is radically different today. People are even more wildly overstimulated.

00;07;42;12 - 00;08;02;19
Unknown
And attention is so fractured now more than ever. And so the game is just really, really advanced now. And I just know that I have to keep up. Like, I have to make sure that it's been the same from a professional marketing point of view. How to keep up. Make sure that I know what people are paying attention to every single day, year over year.

00;08;02;21 - 00;08;19;06
Unknown
And the same thing with the comedy that I do. Make sure that it's good. Make sure it's good. The game is really, really advanced, right? I mean, you got to bow out of that. I did not know you work. First of all, anyone who's going to be watching this, they know about Gary Vee. You can't escape that guy.

00;08;19;07 - 00;08;35;26
Unknown
That guy is everywhere. You know, I got his. His book is on my thing, right there. That's how. That's how. And, you know, that's how everywhere he is. I haven't read any of the books. I'm sorry, Gary, but. Well, you talk to me in person. I'm pretty sure he gave you a real, like, behind the scenes. Sure. And so you the first 100, Gary Vee.

00;08;35;26 - 00;08;55;25
Unknown
So. Yeah. Okay, so I got a this is a topic definitely I talk about was he is he the same way as he is on like, social media? Like in person? 100%. Yeah. Yeah. Gary is well, to be honest, maybe some of the stuff has changed, but I mean, because he's been doing this for so long.

00;08;55;27 - 00;09;35;29
Unknown
But Gary is, he has that level of intensity in person as he does online. But, my last, like, my, you know, lasting impression of Gary is that he, despite all of the stuff he had to manage and pay attention to. Yeah, he he knew about me and, everyone who joined at the time, every new joiner got five minutes with Gary, as an intro.

00;09;36;01 - 00;10;10;18
Unknown
And I'm sure he had someone on staff like, remember this stuff and, like, have it on record. But what we had talked about in that intro, five minute sit down, he remembered forever. Yeah. So he remembered what we had talked about a year and a half later when I left the agency. Wow. Yeah. And, it's always super intense, like, always bringing maximum amount of, of, Gary ness, Gary ness, but, yeah, I never felt like he wasn't authentic or that he was putting it on.

00;10;10;18 - 00;10;29;03
Unknown
He wasn't like, lights on, lights off. Yeah, yeah. Wow. Shout out to Gary. Can you just say something very important? He actually redefined the name of Gary and the things that come along with it. If I heard the name Gary, I think more. I think Gary has an office job, you know, accountant, maybe a whimsical one at some fancy company, but still on the books.

00;10;29;03 - 00;10;45;17
Unknown
That's true. You know, he made Gary into a superstar. Yeah. Yeah. True. Yeah. Hadn't thought about it that way, but that is what their name used to represent. Wow. Shout out to Gary V for making the name Gary more popular again. They is probably will be more babies name Gary you know. Yeah that's that's the wow. Okay.

00;10;45;17 - 00;11;11;14
Unknown
So you worked for and what was it? Can you talk about the five minutes you had? Like what? The things you talked about. Yeah. He just asked me what I cared about, and, I told him that I was very family oriented, and he said, like. Yeah, me too. That's my number. One thing is family. And, that's something that we had, immediate sort of kinship over.

00;11;11;17 - 00;11;40;17
Unknown
And he also knew that I was really into music and, that ended up being important later on because I a year and a half later, when I decided to leave the agency, Gary actually, remembered that I was a big music guy, and he set me up to meet the CEO of one of the music startups that he was an investor in.

00;11;40;20 - 00;12;03;22
Unknown
And I ended up going to, going to that company to work for them. So, yeah. And like the sort of chain of events that started from me working at VaynerMedia to him, setting up that intro with the CEO of a company called Songs which was a music streaming service. And I ended up working there, and then we got acquired by Google.

00;12;03;29 - 00;12;27;06
Unknown
I worked there, and then after I worked there, they paid me a bunch of money to leave, basically. Google. Yeah, yeah. So, I was able to move to Berlin after that because I had a little bit of a safety net from the money that I had received from working at Google, and that's what made it possible for me to move to Berlin without much of a plan.

00;12;27;06 - 00;12;50;09
Unknown
And yeah, that was ten years ago. Yeah. And how was Berlin when you first got here to what it is now like what are some of the differences you've noticed or what were some of the things you experienced? There's a lot has changed certainly, but. Or how about let's start with this. How was Berlin you coming.

00;12;50;09 - 00;13;08;14
Unknown
Because at the time, were you living at before coming to Berlin? I was living in Brooklyn, New York. All these. Okay. So you live in Brooklyn? Okay. What part of Brooklyn? I was living in Greenpoint. Greenpoint? Okay. Greenpoint is, that that would have been a nice little, not to say jarring, transition, but Greenpoint is a little more chill, you know, off the g line.

00;13;08;14 - 00;13;30;12
Unknown
Right? Exactly. Right. So it's a little more chill. Quiet. Not too crazy as, like, you know, Bushwick or, you know, not to as, you know, sterile as, Williamsburg, right? Yeah, I love Greenpoint. Shout out Greenpoint. Yeah. Greenpoint is, though, very good. Polish food, right? Yes. Yeah. So from Greenpoint to Berlin. So how was that coming to Berlin around that time?

00;13;30;15 - 00;14;09;08
Unknown
I lived on tour Strasser when I first moved for three months, which is not, which is not representative of what Berlin is like as a whole. And, I moved to Berlin after I visited for the first time, in the summer. Oh, okay. And in the summer, I was living, I was staying right off of of Pelinka, over Pelinka, which is, you know, pilings of, my biographer aka Canal and quarterback, and I lived and I was staying in such a nice area then.

00;14;09;10 - 00;14;41;04
Unknown
And then I got very lucky with the first place that I lived in in Berlin after being offered to Ostrava. So, I just got, like two very, very beautiful, like, well connected locations where there are so many things happening and it just felt a lot. It felt very similar. It felt very familiar. The things that were jarring were like, being able to pay for entire meals with coins, that was crazy.

00;14;41;11 - 00;15;07;11
Unknown
Like, wow. Carrying around like a fistful of coins to, to pay for things. And I didn't really know what the level of English fluency would be like. Which if I had, you know, when I visited, like I was, I didn't spend much time in like real Berlin, you know, I was just spending time with people who were, just out, hanging out and partying.

00;15;07;15 - 00;15;35;24
Unknown
Right. And so I remember like, going to, they for the first time to buy laundry detergent. And I looked over at the guy next to me and, very shy, very classy. Excuse me. Do you speak English? And do you look at me like. Yeah. What do you need? Which is. Which is an experience many people have had coming here.

00;15;35;29 - 00;15;51;20
Unknown
It's like, never mind dude. Right. Like, is it going to be easy? Yeah. Now you made me feel like a bad person for asking if you speak English. Exactly. Yeah. He looked at me with with such puzzled eyes, like, motherfucker, what do you mean? Do I speak English? It's like some weird abstract of stereotyping and racism. Kind of like, hey, do you speak English?

00;15;51;20 - 00;16;09;10
Unknown
Because I'm saying goodbye. Yeah. Yeah. And like, you know, he was like. He was like a, like a blond German. Guys like, hey, man, he speaks. Yeah. When you need, you spoke to him as have you be speaking to other people, other countries. Do you, do you speak English? And like, it's like, yeah, us USA has been here for a while, I speak English.

00;16;09;16 - 00;16;37;15
Unknown
The thing I will say, though, about my experience in Berlin, and part of the reason why I've stayed so long is that and I, you know, I recognize how it's not totally unique, but very privileged. My experience of immigrating to Germany has been, I describe it as having moved here on easy mode. I have, you know, I was able to find an apartment that first apartment through a friend.

00;16;37;17 - 00;17;14;07
Unknown
I found my next temporary apartment, also through a friend. Nice. And, all of my experiences with the house and about, I had an appointment. They knew my name. And it's the privilege of having come with an American passport. And I think that I, matched the profile of the kind of person that the city of Berlin wanted to have moved here and worked here, and I have no illusions about it.

00;17;14;07 - 00;17;35;27
Unknown
Like if I was coming from a different place with a different background, it would have been different. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it would have been different. And, this became really clear to me I was having a random conversation years ago now outside of a bar, and I was talking to this random group of guys, who were smoking cigarets, and they were celebrating because they're just become German citizens.

00;17;35;29 - 00;17;54;21
Unknown
And it's a group of Syrian guys. And they were describing like, how arduous their immigration process had been. And not that I had, you know, not reflected on it before, but I thought, wow. And comparison like mine is a piece of cake. Yeah. Yeah. So, it's been easy. It was easy to move. It's been easy to live here.

00;17;54;21 - 00;18;16;25
Unknown
Easy to stay here. What kind of visa did you get? Originally. Yeah. So I moved here on, I moved here on a 90 day tourist visa. Oh, you're not supposed to do something. You're not supposed to do it, but like it. They don't recommend it because you're. I sat down and I thought I had a paper calendar, and I was like, ex.

00;18;16;27 - 00;18;43;25
Unknown
Yeah. By this day, I gotta figure it out. It it's not bad. That's so I knew I had a couple of options. I could get a, student visa. Just enroll in class somewhere. A freelancer visa, an artist visa, and the, full time employment one. Residence permit, not visa. So I considered all of them, to be honest.

00;18;43;27 - 00;19;11;15
Unknown
I thought maybe I'll, like, play guitar on the street. Maybe I'll like, you know, just be a freelancer or doing some things. Yeah. Maybe I'll enroll in a class. Getting a job was my fourth choice. I was I just had a job. Yeah, I just got paid to leave. I don't want to. Yeah, I just had a job, and I'm not sure if I want to do that again, because it wasn't expecting to to move here, permanently at the time, but, the clock was ticking.

00;19;11;17 - 00;19;33;16
Unknown
Yeah. And. Yeah, I just got a job and, it was a significant step down from what I was doing in the past. It was whatever was part of the deal, and, Yeah, I figured it out. Nice, bro. Nice. And that's how I actually work. Because, I actually met you via TikTok, and it's you sharing your experience of, like, getting the visa, so that that was really helpful.

00;19;33;16 - 00;19;53;28
Unknown
Yeah, at the time. So just saying thank you very much in advance. But that one time I was like, yeah, how the hell? I mean, what what made you moved? Like, what brought you to Berlin? Like, what was it that made you choose Berlin rather than any other city? I did a very typical, like, American, American Imagination of Europe thing.

00;19;54;01 - 00;20;12;24
Unknown
I booked a two week vacation that was going to start in Berlin. Then I was gonna take the train down to, Prague and Vienna and end up in Ljubljana. That was my. That was the route that I chosen. And I booked two weeks to do it. I was gonna be in Berlin for a couple of days.

00;20;12;29 - 00;20;30;26
Unknown
Yeah, I ended up being in Berlin the entire two weeks. Oh. Yeah. And then a month and a half later, I moved permanently. Oh, you had a good time? You did? Yeah. So? Barely. Berlin. My. My first day in Berlin was my first full day was July 4th, 2015. Yeah. And, it was like the hottest day of the year.

00;20;30;27 - 00;20;51;05
Unknown
Oh, and I came out of the, the, the Airbnb or the, the hostel or whatever. It was so hot. And there was nobody. And I sat down at a cafe and I asked the, the, the person there like, I am sorry. Like what? What's happening? Where is everybody? And she laughed and said, they're all at the lakes.

00;20;51;07 - 00;21;09;12
Unknown
Oh yeah, the lake is a big thing. And she said that as if that's something that I would understand. What do you mean? There? All of the lakes. Yeah. I didn't know the geography of the place. I know that, like, I grew up in always near the ocean. Yeah. And, Say, what do you mean, lakes? And she said, oh, that's where people go when it's hot.

00;21;09;12 - 00;21;31;05
Unknown
Okay. And there was nobody around. So I just sort of like, explored. And then at night I was passing through, I was at Nikon and I again, I just, like, pass by a group of people speaking American English. Yeah. And I just started chatting with them, you know, like when you're on vacation, visiting somewhere, you're like, not yourself, right?

00;21;31;05 - 00;21;49;19
Unknown
You know, you just sort of like, present as, like, the most outgoing, cool version of yourself. Yeah. You have no choice. Yeah. No choice. You gotta. Yeah. And, I just went into that party with them, and I knew one person here that I hadn't met in person who was like, a friend of a friend. Oh. Okay. And then I just, like, figured out.

00;21;49;21 - 00;22;16;19
Unknown
And I ended up going out to a club alone. My first time going to a Berlin club. What kind of club was it? It was, it was not a cool one. Okay. It wasn't cool one. Okay, that's cool. Cool clubs here. It may mean something different. So that's why I went to chalet, which I don't know if that club is even open, but, I, I left the, I left the house at like 2 or 3 a.m..

00;22;16;26 - 00;22;41;24
Unknown
I know, I got to go late and I did a little solo pregame. Okay. And I went in and, I had a good time. Later that that night, I was just in the back wall, just, like, sort of soaking it in, and out of. Just like, in the darkness, someone pops out, it's like, hey, you got a lighter?

00;22;41;27 - 00;23;02;11
Unknown
And I did. Yeah. And, I gave her my lighter, and she's, like, smoking a cigaret. Next. Hey, what's going on? She's like, start talking to me. Roll out. Going. I said, hey, you want to meet my friends? Oh. So I said, yeah, sure. I met her friends and we hung out. And then after that she's like, hey, you want to meet again tomorrow?

00;23;02;13 - 00;23;17;13
Unknown
And I just, like, hung out with this person, hung out with all of her friends and, like, hang out with, like, the the few people that I that I knew. And I was just, you know, making friends along the way. And I ended up staying at her place. She's like, what are you doing? Like, what are your plans?

00;23;17;15 - 00;23;46;27
Unknown
Oh, and supposed to go on a train. I'm going to take, a little, you know, solo trip down. Have you seen the movie Before Sunrise? No, I have, is very much influenced by. By this thing before sunrise is this is this movie where the young American guy is on the train and he's been. And there's a backstory to why he's in Europe, but he meets this girl on the train in Vienna, and they get off the train together, and they had this, like, really beautiful, beautiful experience.

00;23;46;29 - 00;24;05;25
Unknown
So I was in the Before Sunrise mindset. Yeah. So I was like, yeah, I'm down to just, you know, see where things go and see where, where things take me. So, I ended up just being in Berlin that whole two weeks. Yeah. She let you go? She was like, nah, let's, Yeah, yeah. And like, man.

00;24;05;27 - 00;24;36;06
Unknown
Berlin, summer 2015. There's. Oh, bro, you came at the. Yeah. Like there is like, yeah. Magic dust in the air. Yeah. You know, probably literally. And. Yeah. Yeah. Why do I feel so, energetic? Yeah. So I had such a good time that I decided to just come back. My lease was ending in, in Brooklyn, and, I found out that a job that I was expecting to get when I came back, I didn't get.

00;24;36;06 - 00;24;52;00
Unknown
I was at some random person's birthday party when I got the call. So I was like, in Berlin at some random person's apartment when I got the call from New York that I didn't get this job, and this very late time there. Six. Yeah, six hours ahead. So he's actually it's probably had a couple of drinks, and I was like, cool.

00;24;52;00 - 00;25;10;25
Unknown
Thank you for the update. And I think I made I must have made the decision just that night. Like, fuck it, I'll just go. I'll just move and that was ten years ago. And and so like what what how was that like? So that was summertime. And then in that same year, was it like you moved in that same year I moved.

00;25;10;25 - 00;25;37;02
Unknown
So that trip was. Yeah. Two weeks. The first two weeks of July 2015, I moved to Berlin on September 1st, 2015. And so I went back and I had a month and a half of being like, unemployed and just closing up shop in my time in New York, where I'd been for four years and packed all my shit and, yeah, moved to Berlin and yeah, that's an exact same thing on this side.

00;25;37;02 - 00;25;55;16
Unknown
Yeah, came to Berlin and then it was in. Yeah, it came back in around May and then, moved here in, end of August. So that's the, that's like the same time frame. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah I do it. Well no. How did you like what made you think Berlin was the place out of all cities that come to as you start up like this whole your Euro trip?

00;25;55;16 - 00;26;12;15
Unknown
Because I don't know. For me. Berlin, bro, I ain't I mean, you know, most people attribute Germany to war. So that was for me. My brain was not even there. It was just like, yeah, all right, you got the UK, you got Paris. All the, Western European countries and Eastern Europe. That was just no man's land in my mind.

00;26;12;18 - 00;26;34;09
Unknown
I, I'm with you like I felt largely the same. I knew I had to go to Vienna because of this movie. Okay. The movie. Okay. Yeah. And I knew, like, I had to experience being on the train going through Vienna. Right? You know, in case. Yeah, just in case. Some girl walking off by looking at every girl on the train being like, all right, so up for sure.

00;26;34;13 - 00;27;01;18
Unknown
Yeah. That was, that was. She has the same book bag. I won't go. You should watch this movie. Yeah, yeah. And Berlin was the starting place because I knew one person I knew. Yeah, like one, maybe two people. Who were friends of friends of, like, I had a sort of a music project in New York.

00;27;01;20 - 00;27;24;06
Unknown
And, there was a New York group and a Berlin group of this project. And I'd only ever met the Berlin group over, like, video call. So I had their contact information. And so as I. I'll start there because it's the furthest, most north destination I wanted to go to. So I'll go, I'll start there and come down.

00;27;24;08 - 00;27;43;27
Unknown
Okay. Yeah. And so I knew I wanted to end the trip in Slovenia. So that was the route I picked. I ended up doing that trip eventually after I moved like six months after I moved, I ended up doing that actual trip. Taking the trip. Oh, nice and all that. Yeah, nice. Nice, bro. Okay, so to kind of circle back to everything.

00;27;43;27 - 00;28;06;26
Unknown
So you're originally from California, right? So I was born in Seoul. I was born so I was born in Seoul. Yeah. My whole family is from Seoul. Both sides of my family, my extended family still there. When I was three, we moved to Hong Kong. So we lived in Hong Kong until I was nine, and then we moved to California.

00;28;06;28 - 00;28;39;07
Unknown
So, in total, I've lived half of my life in the US and half of my life between. Yeah, Asia and Europe. Wow. Yeah. So you kind of got a good balance, I guess. Well, depending on when. What, me? Yeah. Being America, you got the passport. And also to living. I feel like living in, and in America or the United States of America for people, that it does add like a nice little backdrop to what things are.

00;28;39;07 - 00;28;54;19
Unknown
And then when you move out of it, you kind of like, oh, wow, I can't believe I was living like that way in a mostly capitalistic place. You know? Yeah, I mean, I lived in I lived near LA in San Francisco, in New York. Those are like the three places I lived in the US. Oh, so you had the.

00;28;54;20 - 00;29;16;10
Unknown
Yeah. The. So the different worlds that you lived in. Yeah. I mean, like I and the this is definitely, I mean this in a tongue in cheek way, but I and the coastal elite that they talk about on Fox News, Oh shit. I mean, you mentioned a lot of prominent, companies you worked for, so people are already trying to put you in a box.

00;29;16;10 - 00;29;41;12
Unknown
Yeah. And like, I, you know, I was very I was very lucky. I, you know, I was raised a particular way, like, my parents, were. Yeah, just very, like, conscientious, sort of like cultured people. I went to an international school when I was a little boy. Oh, nice. And, I don't know, I was Asian until I was nine.

00;29;41;14 - 00;30;11;09
Unknown
It's. I know. People in America told me, but, I grew up in a, you know, super international environment, in Hong Kong. It was sort of an expat community there. And, yeah, I live in California. Like where I went to school also was always very international. And that's the kind of of, yeah, community that I've tried to maintain, throughout my life.

00;30;11;09 - 00;30;29;27
Unknown
And that's the same living here as well. Nice. Okay. So that's interesting you said that in terms of like, you not knowing you as Asian until, you know, it was nine here at nine in the United States. America. Yeah. Where you living at the time? And, I feel like that's something always because your family mostly from, from, you know, outside of America.

00;30;29;27 - 00;30;50;14
Unknown
So, you know, that whole thing of, like, what you are is, you know, and is Korea's, very homogeneous place. Right? So there's no like, I mean, maybe the distinctions come down into other places, like, yeah, maybe your job or something else, I don't know. And then we come to America is like, oh shit, I forgot, I am, I am this subsection of, yeah, of an a population.

00;30;50;14 - 00;31;14;23
Unknown
I know, I mean, it's been it's been pretty consistent. I'd say, like, what kind of circle I run in since I was a kid. If we, if we'd never left Korea than yet, I mean, like, everyone I know would be Korean. But when I. So Hong Kong was part of the Commonwealth until 1997.

00;31;14;26 - 00;31;49;07
Unknown
I'm going to date myself here exactly. But my family left in 1998. Okay. So when I was a kid, it was very, much like people from all over the Commonwealth countries. Yeah. From the UK, Australia, New Zealand, and lots of people from across East Asia and Southeast Asia. So is. Yeah. And also you know people from the Middle East, people from like a handful of European countries as well.

00;31;49;10 - 00;32;19;16
Unknown
Like in my, in my class when I was a little kid, my closest friend was from the UK, and another close friend was Chinese Australian wide classmates who were Swiss, Lithuanian or Egyptian. And it was very normal when you look at the yearbook pictures from when I was a little kid, it's like a perfect diversity commercial, you know?

00;32;19;16 - 00;32;37;18
Unknown
Wow. Yeah. It's like the future the liberals want. Yeah. You know, you know, photo. Oh. So, okay, a liberal, Paradise right there in Hong Kong. Yeah. And before vocal Korea and then right there, you moved to Hong Kong or. Yeah. Yeah. And, so that was a nice little crash course of like, diversity before going to America.

00;32;37;20 - 00;32;57;22
Unknown
Yeah, exactly. And where I lived in California was pretty diverse, but like, not as diverse as where I lived in in Hong Kong, ironically. Yeah, yeah. Hong Kong. So when we say Commonwealth, that's like the, the UK. Commonwealth. Yeah. So I guess yeah, everyone's going there. You know, it's like a destination where, you know, it's all exposed to different cultures.

00;32;57;23 - 00;33;22;16
Unknown
Exactly. So that's. Yeah, that was a nice little crash course you went through before going to California. Because where in California did you move to? We moved to Orange County. Orange County? Yeah. The O.C., the OC. So I've seen this on TV, MTV or, you know, the OC, right? Yes. It was exactly like that. I would say the most accurate portrayal of what actual life is like in Orange County is actually Arrested Development.

00;33;22;16 - 00;33;44;20
Unknown
I don't know if you seen that show. Are you serious? Is like that like, people are very there are some truly, like, out-of-touch rich people. In in yeah. In the the cities of Orange County that is just that much more so than like the O.C. that like teen soap. Yeah. Drama show much more than the Real Housewives.

00;33;44;20 - 00;34;13;21
Unknown
Also, that's also kind of kind of true that I think, more than the movie Arrested Development is has some, you know, really, outlandish characters and plot points. But this general feeling of, wow, y'all are so out of touch. Like you really just live in this, like, strange bubble. That's very true. So you, I had some friends that were like you know, Rich are a part of that community that you know, certain experiences.

00;34;13;21 - 00;34;34;19
Unknown
You're like all right. No not everyone does is not everyone goes on a speedboat, you know, to the islands. And like I didn't really understand it at the time, but as I got older, I recognized that, well, I probably, like, went to school, with a bunch of kids whose, like, parents voted for Reagan. Yeah. I mean, that's the name you get as you make more money.

00;34;34;19 - 00;35;10;17
Unknown
You tend to want to keep it, you know? Yeah, people who voted for Reagan and Bush and, just like in my home town, the number of registered Democrats finally outnumbered registered Republicans for the first time in the past, like five years. Yeah. So even though California has been a super majority Democrat, state for a long time, Orange County has been staunchly conservative, even though it's one of the coastal coastal communities.

00;35;10;22 - 00;35;28;01
Unknown
So things are changing there. It's a lot, a lot more Asian people there than ever. I like to joke that, there's an Asian kid bullying a white kid at my high school these days. I just fucking know it.

00;35;28;03 - 00;35;50;03
Unknown
That's just so interesting. When, like, the bullying is flipped in a different way, it's not like it's happened. Not only do I think that's happening. Yeah. Even, like, media depictions of bullying. This is only. I've only ever seen this once. There's this Netflix show called Cobra Kai. Oh, yeah. And in the first season, one of the bullies is Asian.

00;35;50;06 - 00;36;09;00
Unknown
I'm like, that's how much culture has changed. And that's the diversity we're looking for. Diversity and bullying. Not only one racial have the bullying should be all racist, right. Because that's what true equality is. Yeah. Oh all racists then do some type of marginalization of like, you know, based on your, clothes or your shoes or your body type, equal opportunity bullying.

00;36;09;00 - 00;36;25;25
Unknown
Yeah. It's not it's not about your race. Is about the shoes you're wearing today. Yeah, exactly. It's about how high your pants were on your legs and not touching your shoes. It's about the, the Dragon Ball Z shirt you was wearing, and it's, 2024. There's more. There's more Korean supermarkets than, like, regular supermarket. It's my hometown now.

00;36;25;27 - 00;36;50;22
Unknown
Yeah, yeah. We won. Like, yes. Hollywood. I don't know. I still victory it it's a we would it's a we won it. It's like oh that's that's shit different. You know I don't know why. This is the first time in my life that's so cool. As somebody who looks of age and it should be like we won.

00;36;50;22 - 00;37;08;21
Unknown
It's like, yeah. Oh, you look like you can't debate that. There's. You walk into that, you walk into the H Mart. So I took that shit. Yeah, it's my hometown. And you see like the you see all the, the non Asian people confused. Yeah. You know, and I look at them like who is the man who's the minority now.

00;37;08;21 - 00;37;32;13
Unknown
Bitch. You dot bro I ain't gonna lie to you. I don't think it happens often for Asian people to outright say like, yo, we got this. We own initiative. Like, oh, but they they're not. Things are changing so much though. Like, I go back often. And, I was in a like this, like, bougie, like organic food supermarket with my mom.

00;37;32;16 - 00;37;56;15
Unknown
And we're in one of the aisles, and we speak Korean to each other. Yeah. And, we're looking for something. We're talking. And out of nowhere, this elderly white lady comes up to me. She says, excuse me. And my fight or flight is, like, switched on immediately. Yeah, because I know I've been through this a lot.

00;37;56;15 - 00;38;27;12
Unknown
Okay. Live in the OC, living in the OC. I'm prepared for literally anything to come out of her mouth. And I'm super on guard. I look over and she says. What language are you speaking. I mean you know what. Okay go ahead and this is how I knew culture has changed. She said, I said, oh we're speaking Korean.

00;38;27;15 - 00;38;49;00
Unknown
She says, oh, it's so beautiful. It's so beautiful. What? You were the way you were speaking. Oh, it's such a beautiful language. And I put my guard back down and I smiled at her. I wasn't like, about to be. I wasn't about to be, to be a combative regardless, but, Yeah. I said, oh, thank you.

00;38;49;03 - 00;39;11;07
Unknown
That's that's really kind of you. And. Yeah. Yeah, well, okay. Have a nice day. And that was the end of the interaction. But I remember when I was in high school, and someone from, you know, that generation shouted at my brother and me to go back to China, you know, same city. Same city. Yeah. Yeah. Do you have my sister?

00;39;11;09 - 00;39;26;13
Unknown
Do I get offended when someone I mean, okay, because I mean, it's not accurate country. So they're just like, oh yeah, of course. But like when you're when you're 14 years old. Yeah. If I had like yeah, you're not processing all the levels of ignorance. You're like, the fuck did you just say. And it probably was the first thing I said to you are yeah.

00;39;26;13 - 00;39;49;08
Unknown
This happened at like and this happened at, like an arcade. Yeah. Oh, I was a kid. I was a kid. And, Yeah, my older brother and I were at this arcade and this. Yeah. Older. Yeah. This older, like white man. Yeah. Yelled at the both of us to go back to China. That is so why I've been like, yo, what's going on?

00;39;49;09 - 00;40;06;08
Unknown
That's the kind of place we're talking about, man. Okay, okay, okay. That is weird. That kinds of change a lot because. All right, look, one thing at us, and I mean, this is this is never right, but one thing at a supermarket and public at someplace where, yeah, older people pulls a B in, but in an arcade where kids are and you're you're you're here with us.

00;40;06;08 - 00;40;25;02
Unknown
I'm a kid. Being a kid. Go back to your family. Yeah, it. Yeah, we are kids. We're in development mode. You're here talking about telling two Korean kids to go back to their country. You need help? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I'm telling you, man, there is an Asian kid bullying a white kid at my old high school. For sure.

00;40;25;09 - 00;40;43;00
Unknown
For sure. The times have changed in the in the right way. You know, it's like it's like a it's like a nice little karma thing that's happening. People haven't been measuring this as, like an in, like a quantitative, index of social change, but it counts a quantitative. Well, you gonna have some I would agree. Yeah. You know what?

00;40;43;00 - 00;41;00;25
Unknown
It could have been that white ladies like, like, languages speaking Korean. Oh. Thank you. She's on our phone tapping like, okay, there's two Korean people at this H mart that were pleasant. So that means that it has going down the bullying. I mean, the government isn't taking these statistics, but if they did, I think they would find out all his defenses down.

00;41;00;25 - 00;41;16;24
Unknown
Bullying is going down. She was looking for you to start. If. I mean, come on, you're supposed to keep the numbers up. There was an ear. She had an earpiece in. Oh. She did? Yeah, she had a earpiece. Yeah. Somebody is watching her observing, right? Yeah, yeah. And the guy seeking shoppers in, H Mart, so just mean, like, it's like.

00;41;16;25 - 00;41;39;00
Unknown
Yeah. Secret camera show. Yeah. She softly put the, the rice in the bag. You know, she's not. But we were not in a Korean supermarket, right? Yeah, we were in, you were in, like a. Yeah, we were in a sprouts. Yeah, but not great. Yeah. No. Oh. Like what? Like, because I was in Georgia not too long ago, and, like, a carrier, like hella Korean people and most people to know about that.

00;41;39;00 - 00;42;08;16
Unknown
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Korean people. Here's some education about the Korean diaspora in the United States. We're we're all in California. But so we're all in like LA Orange County. And some in the Bay area but not quite as much. Bergen, new Jersey, flushing Queens and Atlanta. Oh that's where all the queens went. Yeah. So like la OC.

00;42;08;18 - 00;42;25;16
Unknown
New Jersey, New York and Georgia. Why is that. I don't know. Yeah I don't know I mean Korea know about the cold in California you know like since way back. I mean even when the riots happen and stuff they know that that little thing going on there. But then yeah. Yeah. Atlanta. That was surprising. Yeah.

00;42;25;19 - 00;42;43;02
Unknown
I'm talking about a lot like a where my mom was living like all stores was all in Korean. Oh, that like, it would be like Super Mart or like, not supermarkets, but like outside malls or whatever. Yeah, yeah. All Korean markets. Yeah. I'm like wow, okay. This is a you know, because you in Atlanta, are you thinking like, you know, home southern and shit or whatever when you saw CNN you but.

00;42;43;02 - 00;43;07;10
Unknown
Oh wow. Yeah, yeah yeah. Koreatown in some of these places like genuinely Korean. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. You got everything in Korean, Korean doctors green like, pharmacies like. Yeah. The whole infrastructure of just Korean. Got to have a Korean church. God and God, I have that. Yeah. Koreans. Koreans love church. Yeah. Well okay. That is I've seen on TikTok and stuff.

00;43;07;10 - 00;43;24;05
Unknown
I follow this guy actually, he does like a lot of impersonations of, like, a Korean mother or some type A cop, a guy's name, John Moon, John Moon, very hilarious. And he's so good. I, I've been I don't maybe learning or stereotyping, I don't know. Yeah. But, he does the thing about church and stuff like that. And was that something big like,

00;43;24;08 - 00;43;53;27
Unknown
Yeah. Oh okay. So the, the I, I'm pretty sure this is true. The biggest congregation, the biggest congregation in the Presbyterian Church outside of the US is in South Korea. So Koreans are very, very Christian in general. There's plenty of Korean Catholics, but there's a lot of Korean Protestants. And yeah, you know, we brought that culture to the US as well.

00;43;53;27 - 00;44;15;10
Unknown
So, yeah, there's a lot of, yeah, Korean churches. Wow. Korean, Korean church is a one of, I don't know, like the five core pillars of Korean American, culture. And most people will not know that, you know, I mean, obviously with different, you know, places and different cultures and things, there's different religious, you know, correlations. Yeah.

00;44;15;13 - 00;44;41;25
Unknown
Like the correlation between Korean, Korean culture and, the religion of Christianity or Presbyterian. Yes. Is very I mean, was that, how do you even come about that? It's because of the, the the long standing Korean and American relationship. Because of the war and, you know, it's the same reason why, like, Koreans love baseball.

00;44;41;27 - 00;45;04;25
Unknown
And, like trying to think of another example why you can find corn dogs at street food, at street food stalls, you can find corn dogs. And oh, Koreans have like elevated the corn dog is as a as a thing. Yeah. Like you can get a corn dog in which the entire batter of the corn dog is French fries.

00;45;04;27 - 00;45;21;25
Unknown
What? Yeah. I've never had one, but you can get a corn dog in Korea at a street food stall in which the entire batter is French fries. Wow. I mean, good thing you can't have it, because, I mean, your life is going well. I mean, look, let's be serious. If somebody is eating that, their life is not going all the way.

00;45;21;25 - 00;45;40;11
Unknown
Well, for sure, right? Yeah. You, you know, you know, things are not going up when you're at a line for a song and the batter is in French. I don't even know how that's even possible. Yeah, I don't, I don't know either. But you know what? He just mash French. One thing about Koreans that I'll say is that when we put our mind to becoming the best at something, we do it.

00;45;40;13 - 00;46;18;07
Unknown
You know, we just like, pick and choose which things to become the best that, like, pop music, we're like, we're going to dominate pop music and, like, dancing and, reality TV shows and, movies about revenge and, and, revenge and like, beauty and skin care. Oh, yeah. Y'all got that, plastic surgery and, what else do we decide to just dominate at, there is another one I'm forgetting.

00;46;18;09 - 00;46;37;26
Unknown
Super dramatic TV shows. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so those are things we become super good at. Food, obviously. Yeah. The food brain. Food for the brain. Fried chicken. The best food in the world. There's another example. Koreans are like fried chicken. Not even our thing. But, like, what if we became the best at this? Yeah, yeah.

00;46;37;28 - 00;46;50;13
Unknown
And then just put our mind to it and did it. Yeah, I heard I heard they got that, because I think something about, like some, the servicemen that came from during the war. Yeah. Like, you know, I guess some black news in the South is just how we do it. And it's like, all right, cool.

00;46;50;13 - 00;47;09;15
Unknown
Thank you. And then, you know, they and a bunch of Koreans are like, this is really good. What if we became the best at this? I saw an article from a while back that like, there was a, like a baguette, global baguette baking competition. And Paris Koreans want it. Damn. Why exactly? They're like, we'll take whatever this thing is that you do.

00;47;09;17 - 00;47;35;02
Unknown
If we decide to become good at it, we become the we will become the best at it. Right? But, that doesn't make for, like, a particularly chill culture. I've been hearing about the news about some of these pop stars and, the way they've been, you know, super is super not cool. Yeah. But, really good at baking bread now, which is weird because Koreans also love bread, even though, like how good bread beach is bread.

00;47;35;02 - 00;47;54;29
Unknown
But like Korean said, become good at it. Yeah, yeah. And that is and also to with maybe maybe not Korea. And again this is me pulling from TikTok. So you know, don't come at me. Is that this also in terms of like, Korean, maybe not Korean society, but some Asian, societies and Asian culture is that of like, what's it called?

00;47;54;29 - 00;48;21;10
Unknown
It's called like, not high order, but kind of like, high communicative, like in terms of, like the way of formal, formally speaking. Yeah. That would you mean not formally speaking, but something in which, like. All right, the same vibes in certain Asian cultures that are they may not be understood by, say, culture in America or somewhere else, i.e. the way you may look at somebody or like, if you're in a meeting setting that you don't get your cup of water to somebody first, that might be some disrespect.

00;48;21;10 - 00;48;50;25
Unknown
This is very Korean, okay. This is I would say, yeah, maybe the most Korean thing of them all. Is this, like, obtuse, like the even, like people who are like, really, really from Korea are social situations like, this is confusing. I don't know, like, I don't know how to best order the social hierarchy of everyone in the room.

00;48;50;28 - 00;49;17;09
Unknown
I couldn't imagine working in Korea like I speak the language, but I would have so much trouble navigating just like, oh my God, like who? Like who is in charge? Who's drink is supposed to be poured like, at what point in knowing someone, do you, switch from the formal to the informal way of speaking? Like, dating in Korean seems difficult.

00;49;17;11 - 00;49;53;05
Unknown
And it's presented a lot of real challenges because as I just saw this, so I don't know how true it is, but Korean airlines used to have a lot of trouble with safety because the staff was having a hard time properly communicating danger because of the way that there's this rigid, hierarchical way of speaking to your to your higher ups that led to a bunch of, you know, unforeseen like unfair, unpleasant outcomes.

00;49;53;07 - 00;50;18;22
Unknown
And so they like, redid it. So they were like, we can't keep doing this. And also this is an example I know a bit better than the airline thing. In 2002, Korea and Japan co-hosted the World Cup and the Korean national team, which is historically fine but not like amazing, finished fourth in the World Cup, which is that's never going to happen again.

00;50;18;23 - 00;50;45;25
Unknown
Yeah, right. And we had this legendary Dutch coach, named Nicholas Hiddink, and he came in. And one of the things he had to change was just the social structure of the players, because all of when they were like having meals all the older players would be on their own table, and all the younger players were not even be able to like, interact with them because so formal, so rigid.

00;50;45;27 - 00;51;17;00
Unknown
So he was like, you guys, this is fucking not going to work as a football team. So he changed a bunch of those things. And that's something that is like an ongoing challenge of modernizing the social fabric of Korean society, because there is so much inherited rigidity. That I think is like one of the main things is like holding people back, like it's so difficult to know, titles and, processes for different situations that is interesting.

00;51;17;00 - 00;51;33;25
Unknown
Yeah. Okay. Because there's also a lot of cultures struggle that to us, I mean, you know, obviously is more notorious maybe in Korea and other, you know, Asian cultures or whatever of that rigid type of social order. Social order. Yeah. Even in African culture too, like this, things of like, yeah, there's a table for the big people and the table for the small kids.

00;51;33;25 - 00;51;50;27
Unknown
Yeah. No interaction or like, men and the women, you know, the here to sit over there, even with how you eat your food. Is he with your left hand or something about. Yo. What's wrong? Like we use our left hand to wipe our ass, right? Are you right? I don't want that. Even shake your hands. Right. It's kind of like if I shake him with the left hand, I'm like, oh, let's do that again.

00;51;50;27 - 00;52;08;23
Unknown
This right hand or, politics even. Yes. Which it kind of puts people in a, it puts a country in a difficult position because obviously modernization is that, let's break that down. Yeah. Then he's been so involved in the whole culture of it that that's kind of what the, kind of defines it to some degree. Yeah.

00;52;08;23 - 00;52;28;14
Unknown
So I was like, where's the balance? Right. I'm sure there's like, yeah, I'm sure that there's a generational sort of disagreement between people who want to keep doing things that the way there were done and, you know, younger generations were like, it's 20, 25, man, we gotta you gotta stop doing these super outdated, like social order things.

00;52;28;17 - 00;52;57;05
Unknown
Of course, there's like, positive outcomes and that you can't, you know, there's, there were productive, outcomes from having these social, social norms and ideas. But, you know, it's within moderation. Yeah. I mean, and the moderation part is, difficult. I feel like young people or people from the diaspora needs to come back. But to what you were saying earlier, like, yeah, you had to go back to Korea and live there and to date and to work.

00;52;57;05 - 00;53;17;22
Unknown
I mean, you know, like you can't go back. You've been in Berlin for ten years. Your brain is to free. I couldn't do it. I love you know, I think it's it's so cool how much people care about Korean stuff. Yeah. And it's wonderful to visit. Like, I recommend it to to everybody. I couldn't live there.

00;53;17;24 - 00;53;35;01
Unknown
Yeah. It'd be. Yeah, it just be. I'd love to spend more time, but. Yeah. To, like, make a life there. Dude, I can I can barely imagine living in the US. Oh, yeah. I mean, do you ever think you will live in New York? Because you been here ten years in Berlin? You everything you can live back in the USA for sure.

00;53;35;03 - 00;54;01;22
Unknown
It would, you know, you'd have to be. And when we say the U.S like, for example, I'm not that interested in living in another part of Germany. I'm not that interested in living in practically any parts of the US equally. You know, like people talk about the US. And just in general, people talk about cultures in countries, in such broad strokes.

00;54;01;24 - 00;54;22;17
Unknown
But like, I've only ever lived in California and New York, and it would be hard sell for me to live in any part of the US. And I've only ever lived in Berlin and Germany and likewise like I would be a hard sell for me to live somewhere else in Germany. And so I think about moving to the US and yeah, it would likely be one of the places I've already lived.

00;54;22;22 - 00;54;42;29
Unknown
Yeah. I mean, you can't go back once you live in New York or like California. Yeah. Those places. And then even living in Europe, just knowing how things, you know, are here and then, you know. Yeah. Especially now, I mean, with the U.S and what's going on. Yeah. Yeah. Particularly uncool time right now. Very, very, very, very uncool.

00;54;42;29 - 00;55;01;22
Unknown
Yeah. So you're also known a lot for your social media stuff, most notably, some of your skits, of being in Berlin, you know, going to Berlin for the first time or, you know, be on a first date with the man in Berlin. The la. The life of the Berlin man. There you go. Yeah. You have so many.

00;55;01;22 - 00;55;38;12
Unknown
And, Yeah, you started on TikTok, right? And then that's where. Yes. So I started making content, just telling stories about my experiences, much like we're doing now. Of what it was like to be someone who lived in California and New York and to to live here. And I gave out some, practical information about how to find an apartment, for example, I realized that there is, yeah, a large industry about this stuff already.

00;55;38;14 - 00;56;12;17
Unknown
My first. Get my first sketch about Germany and the US went viral, and I thought, okay, there's something there. And I've been writing comedy for a really long time without anywhere to put it. And so it started with that and, eventually started to sharpen, the, subject to just like the toxic Berlin man. Yeah. And, yeah, it's a, yeah, it's, character that I know very, very well.

00;56;12;19 - 00;56;40;23
Unknown
Would you ever would you ever consider yourself a toxic man at some point in your life? I have been in therapy on and off for ten years. Okay. Yeah. So, yeah, there has been a lot of, Yeah, a lot of, stuff to to, resolve and go through. And it's an ongoing process. People ask me sometimes like, how what how do you know all this stuff?

00;56;40;23 - 00;57;09;15
Unknown
And part of it is, yeah, I know it because I have experienced some of this and, you know, I've have, friends who are good at expressing their, their experiences and their feelings about things, and, yeah, having dated in Berlin and having dated in New York and having had relationships and all different kinds of, of experiences, I take a lot of mental notes.

00;57;09;18 - 00;57;29;21
Unknown
And so there's plenty of material to, to mine for. Wow. Nice to say. Yeah. And dating in Berlin is definitely, interesting on his own. Yeah. I mean, take a little quick detour on that one. What's the difference you have noticed between dating in Berlin and New York City? It's hard to say, because I was so young when I was dating in New York.

00;57;29;24 - 00;57;58;03
Unknown
And I didn't really know myself. So it was just, I don't know, I sort of just calamitous, like, there were there were very few, good experiences. And I, Yeah, like, I was not happy, you know, most of the time. Yeah. And not happy in New York City or everything in general. New York. Okay. Yeah.

00;57;58;05 - 00;58;27;26
Unknown
But when I, you know, when I moved here, like, I. Yeah, I've had, my best relationships and also just been able to figure out what it means to be in a relationship. And I've made mistakes and I've also, made some, you know, some some good things happen. And, it was a product of just getting older.

00;58;27;26 - 00;58;45;12
Unknown
Anyway, I'm in my 30s, and it's not something that I would have figured out. In any place when I was in my early 20s. Yeah, that's a good point. That's a good thing you bring about in terms of like over time you start, you know, becoming better at like this whole dating thing. Yeah. Because I mean for one let's be serious bro.

00;58;45;12 - 00;59;00;04
Unknown
Like you probably even know what you want it, you know. No. Yeah. No. They did some things where you probably you probably didn't know what you want or you thought you wanted. You got anybody. Oh, actually, this is not really the whole thing. This is actually just one little piece of it or like, oh, I actually, you know, need some different.

00;59;00;06 - 00;59;17;28
Unknown
Dude. I was a, I was a disaster of a person for a long time, you know, like like I can be honest and critical of myself. Like I held things together, you know, and people are, pleased about external people, like, oh, like you had a career and you moved to a new country and you've had done all this stuff.

00;59;17;28 - 00;59;50;13
Unknown
But, internally, it's always been a work in progress. And it's, you know, ongoing still. And, yeah, I, still have a lot to learn. And, and truthfully, this experience of writing this character and seeing how people respond to this character has also been quite educational. And, each time that I write a really, really toxic episode of what the Berlin man does, there's people in the comments who's women in the comments that say, not toxic enough.

00;59;50;13 - 01;00;21;15
Unknown
I've gone through worse, which is like gives me pause. Like, what do you mean? This is an exaggerated, unrealistic example of what this man might do. And you're telling me in real life, worse shit has happened? Yeah, like I made a, sketch recently about how it's the morning after a night with the Berlin man, and, he gives the the woman a goody bag, a goody bag of, like, useful things to take away with her because he's kicking her out.

01;00;21;18 - 01;00;43;27
Unknown
And the number of women who said, oh, where's my goody bag? I was like, a goody bag was alarmingly high. You should not want a goody bag. You should want a man who doesn't kick you out of a house in the morning. You know who who isn't treating you, like, like an expendable object to just, you know, throw onto the street.

01;00;43;28 - 01;01;04;18
Unknown
Well, look, Brian, the bar is in hell right now. In Berlin. So, good. Like Brian life. It is a good even. It was just mention. Yeah. It was like, yo, what? Why not just. You even have to give it to you. You just even say if a girl was like, here's a goody bag. I mean, it would be kind of weird for girls, I agree, but maybe I'll be like, what I did.

01;01;04;18 - 01;01;31;29
Unknown
I did like most. Well, most women ain't even hearing the word goodie bag for sure. And if they did, they probably should get out the apartment immediately because I don't even sound like a great thing. You know, I I'm very aware that the bars in hell, know, for ten years. You know, I went on a first date once where the girl was telling me that she was having a good time because I listened and asked the questions.

01;01;32;01 - 01;01;53;24
Unknown
And I thought, that's literally the definition of a conversation. Yeah, but that's all it takes for you to think, wow, this is great. If you like. Didn't say a bunch of random shit when you give me a chance to talk like you asked me about things and I told him things and he, mentioned those things later on in the conversation, like, that's crazy.

01;01;53;26 - 01;02;12;08
Unknown
And oh, wow, this day is going great. You haven't mentioned polyamory once, you know. Yeah, exactly. You haven't mentioned polyamory. You haven't asked me if I want to go to Kat for our second date. You haven't asked me if I want to go to Bali. You haven't asked me if you want to, just go back to to your place immediately.

01;02;12;10 - 01;02;49;17
Unknown
You haven't. Yeah. Like lied to me, obviously. About anything so far. Yeah. The bar is is subterranean. Yeah. But. Yeah. Yeah. That some things dating in Berlin. Here. You. There's some things specific in Berlin you all experience in other places. But another thing that you did the original question, like, I feel a lot like. And from what I've heard, I feel like I'm dating the Berlin man is probably very similar to meeting the London man and the Brooklyn man and the Melbourne man, and the la man.

01;02;49;17 - 01;03;15;28
Unknown
Like I think, it's a lot of similar stories, of. Yeah. Avoidant, toxic. Yeah. Yeah. I feel like the, I feel like the, the toxicity in New York City is more clandestine, like, it's more like in the shadows. I hear you. Yeah. And then Berlin is out in the open like the things that I heard from other women like that they experience.

01;03;15;29 - 01;03;33;28
Unknown
Yeah. It's things where I'm like, well, like how I'm thinking, like, whoa, dude. So you had to go do some investigative thing to find it, you know, on the first day you like. Yeah. What is it? Maybe a question for the audience. Is it better for you to just say outright, I'm kind of a fuckboy, like you're this is what you're going to get.

01;03;34;02 - 01;04;00;18
Unknown
Like, I'm asking you directly that I want to be in a polyamorous relationship, and we'll see if you buy it rather than in New York. Someone's like doing it, you know, on the low, and you find out later, I think each has their pros and cons. The, the, I think the pros and cons of it happening upfront license the like for one, that's jarring because you're like, well, what is it about me that this is being you feel comfortable?

01;04;00;18 - 01;04;16;23
Unknown
They just say this, you know, I mean, could that does. Let's be serious. I mean, it's like, all right. Like, if somebody is telling you there's some view that I have of like, I yeah, this is whatever. Then also, you know, where does it go from there? You just, you know, you can't even have a good time after that.

01;04;16;23 - 01;04;32;28
Unknown
It's like, if that happens in the first ten minutes and you just order food and a drink, it's like, well, this night is wack. But if there's a lie, at least it's like, you know, this, like a nice little we know we're dead there. We find some things out. Every day is new, the story is more, and the story is great.

01;04;32;28 - 01;04;51;05
Unknown
And then you get to a bumpy road that leads to the story. In the beginning was like, oh, wow, do some trees. And oh my God, it was a nice whimsical buildings. There's cobblestones, right? And then, you know, polyamory, they're like, whoa, all right. The pages are a little different here. Yeah. Wow. This is okay. This is the first arc of the story.

01;04;51;07 - 01;05;08;16
Unknown
That's the arc now. Whereas in this, in the the first part of you knowing about polyamory early in a date. Yeah, that's like some weird Danish film movie where the, the arc is in the beginning and and now you're just trying to come to the resolution by the end, you say, oh, wow, your dad and mom didn't hug you.

01;05;08;16 - 01;05;36;06
Unknown
That's why you want to do polyamory. You want to be hugged by multiple people I didn't know. I think the at the end of the day, people being transparent and communicative because there is someone for not everyone, but there is someone for most people, right? Right. So one thing that I've learned about dating in life is that people are very invested in knowing and explaining their type.

01;05;36;09 - 01;05;58;15
Unknown
Who are you into like what are the characteristics of the kind of person you like without spending enough time knowing who you're the type for. Oh you know what I mean. Yeah. So like okay you can say, oh I like this kind of a girl. I want to look for these qualities. But you also have to know who's into you, who's gonna find you interesting and attractive.

01;05;58;17 - 01;06;19;22
Unknown
And people need to find each other between, you know, knowing both of those things better and being open about. Wow, this is what I want. You're what, you're what I want. I'm what you want. And we can be honest instead of, like, trying to merge the gap with lies. Yeah, yeah, let's not say lies. Let's just see what this is.

01;06;19;22 - 01;06;36;19
Unknown
Withholding of information, you know, like. Yeah, I would love to give you this information, but not right now, you know? Right. Like, we've got good cheese spread, you know, can't be bored. Right. This is not the best time to bring out this polyamory stuff. Yeah. Let's do it when there's hamburgers and some drinks and some wine. Yeah. Have you ever.

01;06;36;19 - 01;07;02;24
Unknown
Have you ever been on field? No, I have not, bro. And anytime I hear that app or something, it's like, they tell me about, I'm like, yeah, I'm good. You see, you see some interesting, preferences that I've had to Google because I didn't know what those acronyms meant. Gg I had to Google that shit, but.

01;07;02;26 - 01;07;35;16
Unknown
People are putting it out explicitly that this is what I'm into and you're into it, or you're not. And, you know, wait, there's plenty of toxic, stuff happening on field. But in a way, I felt like that is. Yeah, more, of a, yeah, a solution. People do. Yeah. Straightforward with I feel like Berlin is a place where people are more upfront about stuff, you know, like there's there's such a, society and community here that allows you to be very open to like, some of your thoughts and wants and desires and stuff.

01;07;35;16 - 01;07;54;12
Unknown
Where. Yeah. Yeah. Even some of the things I've heard people say, like, again, somebody can just tell somebody, hey, how you doing? How things been with you? Yeah, I'm doing great. I'm an employee by, me by. Okay. And your name is like, you know, just out front you, but. Oh, you know, that was new for me.

01;07;54;12 - 01;08;11;07
Unknown
So I feel like there's a lot of components in Berlin where you can be open. Yeah, even down to the extent of. Yeah, well, I don't even know what that GTD thing is. I feel like, you know, this, it means good giving and game, which I then had to Google as well to figure out what that even mean.

01;08;11;07 - 01;08;28;02
Unknown
Yeah, that sounds crazy. If you had a Google within the Google, the acronym exact, the acronym was not good. The actual explanation of the acronym wasn't good enough. Yeah, the Google the acronym definition. Yeah, it was too. It was too abstract both times. But, so what is it? I mean, is it I don't know, I don't remember anymore.

01;08;28;02 - 01;08;43;07
Unknown
I think it means like, you're like a very accommodating, like you're like, sort of down, Oh, back to the you listen and you don't, you know, you don't say, go to valley raft. Okay. This is like the same thing, I guess. I don't know, man. I don't I'm not on it. I'm not on I'm not on any dating apps.

01;08;43;07 - 01;09;13;10
Unknown
Yeah. And, I I'll never do it again. You'll never do that again. Yeah, yeah. I talk shit about dating apps log because it's, it's good material. But yeah, it's not for me. What what makes dating apps not for you. I found it to be overwhelming, and over overwhelming. Haha. My man. Okay. Yeah. He's like, to me, the options I was okay, I need I need to, I need focus on my priorities.

01;09;13;12 - 01;09;18;26
Unknown
Yeah, I.

01;09;18;29 - 01;09;38;18
Unknown
You do? No, that's not the Covid answer. It was getting too overwhelming. It was just too many likes. I just didn't know what to do. I just had a focus on myself and my career. What a great flex, I love it. Sorry I had to call it out. I should have just not said anything. No, it's not man.

01;09;38;20 - 01;10;01;14
Unknown
It's. It, it is. It is a little bit of that. It is a little bit of that. But also just the the universal experience of dating apps, of being shown every person. They're not real people, right. You're just being shown this like curated abstraction of a person, which is, you know, which is what regular life is truly. You go on a first.

01;10;01;15 - 01;10;26;21
Unknown
You don't know that person. Like we said, are they being honest or are they telling a good story? But the dating app thing I found to be like because I maybe it's unique to me after having had this experience because I write comedy and because I write a represents version of myself in a way, because I write a character, filling out a dating app profile is like, I'm just writing a character again.

01;10;26;21 - 01;11;00;15
Unknown
I'm writing a character just like I was writing it for a standup bit, or for comedy sketch, or for some other scripted show. Like, I'm not writing me like, this is just, yeah, another character and I. Yeah. Had I, you know, that gave me some pause like oh interesting. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. That makes sense. Yeah. Because at the end of the day, I definitely am writing a version of myself into the profile and like, reading other people's profiles, like seeing how they present themselves.

01;11;00;16 - 01;11;19;11
Unknown
Like it got to be too much. Like, I don't really want to spend all of this time and energy trying to figure out what's right and like at this age, like I'm not trying to go through. I'm not trying to go through the field, you know? I'm not trying to meet everybody. Yeah, yeah. So I yeah.

01;11;19;11 - 01;11;36;08
Unknown
No more dating apps for me. Yeah. And also have been it would be tricky to write because you're known as this guy. And imagine I see you in the app. They might try to interact with you as that guy. Right. So that becomes very interesting of like, oh, you're the oh my gosh, you did the night out there Berlin guy or something that that like this is not a flex.

01;11;36;08 - 01;11;56;04
Unknown
It's just like part of the story. Okay. I get recognized in public enough times just because in Berlin, not because I'm famous, but because I write, I make content that is so specifically about Berlin. People that are sort of in our demographic have mostly seen those videos, you know. Yeah. I seen a show. Yeah, I was in America.

01;11;56;05 - 01;12;19;16
Unknown
It's crazy. Yeah. So people when they it happened yesterday as I was walking down the street and this person has been stopped and said, oh hey, oh I recognize you from the videos. And whenever this happens, I always just like and this isn't some kind of like, grant courtesy. I always introduce myself. Yeah. Oh, hey, I'm Brian, what's your name?

01;12;19;16 - 01;12;37;12
Unknown
And we have a little conversation. Nice. But that's, like, not an accomplishment. It's like, you don't know me. You don't know me. Well, because I have, like, it'd be weird. Or if I'm like, yeah, you know me. Like, you saw my name and face on the internet and like, no. Which, by the way, they did. Yeah. But like, I'm introducing myself as if it's the first time you've ever seen me.

01;12;37;12 - 01;12;53;28
Unknown
Because it is. I guess so, but it is. Yeah. They like you. Hey, how you know my name is Brian? Anybody? I talk to you already. All right. So. Yeah. Yeah. So I want to actually get your autograph and, you know. Yeah, that that that has never happened. And man, like, it never. That's not that's not what I do it for.

01;12;53;28 - 01;13;15;15
Unknown
And that's never the point. Like, of course it's it's like goofy. It's fun. Like, I think it's I think it's a very, goofy experience for two people to have. But, introduce myself, I if like, I mean, I want to know their name and we'll have a chat. I'll chat about, like, what they what they saw.

01;13;15;15 - 01;13;38;03
Unknown
Like, if they liked something, you know, all that stuff because knew how to turn this into a real human interaction. I'm not like, oh, you know who I am? Because you saw a character I play on. Yeah, yeah, well, good for you. I mean, good for you for that. And and being in Berlin, where that can happen cause, you know, in America that you try to do that, they will look at you stupid like you do know that you just,

01;13;38;06 - 01;13;56;08
Unknown
You're not. What do you mean, you're you're not. Yeah. You're just an abstraction of something that I saw in real life. That as far as is going it. And that's pushing it, you know? But at least you're here where, you know, the interaction could be more wholesome. Yeah. Yeah. So all right, so you social media, you know, you well known for so and also to TikTok, Instagram.

01;13;56;08 - 01;14;24;27
Unknown
I don't know if you do YouTube as well. One day. One day. Yeah. YouTube is another game. I'm totally another game. Yeah. What are some of your tips for someone that would like to get more reach or more views on any of these social, it's very interesting question. Many people would like to know. It's a performance, right?

01;14;24;29 - 01;14;50;15
Unknown
Everything you put on the internet is a performance, and you have to treat it like a performance because if I went into writing or like acting out a sketch as if it's really me, and it's not gonna be interesting in the first two seconds, like, for example, I've had many, experiences where I would write the sketch and then I'd change it.

01;14;50;15 - 01;15;14;12
Unknown
So I put one of the best jokes, one of the punchlines in the beginning, if I'm telling a story in real life and I want to tell you about something funny that happened, I want to build up to it, all right? And, you know, standup is more forgiving. You can you can, like, have a much bigger, longer, more drawn out, what is it called, like, setup?

01;15;14;13 - 01;15;41;18
Unknown
Yeah, much longer setup. And then drop a killer punchline after a minute. Social media punchline. First three to 10s. Wow. Like I've had to rewrite a bunch of sketches. Oh, my God, no one's gonna watch this until the end. I put the funny bit in the second part of the video. No one will watch this. I have to stuff the funny parts in the beginning and treat it like a performance.

01;15;41;18 - 01;16;10;28
Unknown
It's not real like you are playing a character, even if you are representing yourself. And, oh, this goes out to like, I've watched a bunch of content that people have made who are new to social media and, people need to be much, much more incisive and critical of what happens in those first two seconds versus five seconds.

01;16;11;01 - 01;16;40;09
Unknown
Like, you need this to be interesting. Something needs to happen, or else I'm gone. Why would I stay? There are so many amazing, amazing comedians and content creators on social media, and you're competing for people's attention against them. And frankly, I would rather watch them. If your things are going to be interesting in the first few seconds, you know, and that's how people feel, and that's how the algorithm feels.

01;16;40;09 - 01;17;04;12
Unknown
At the end of the day, the algorithm isn't like that complicated. Do you have something that captures my attention that convinces me to stay or not? Yeah. Because if you look at even the the data on, on Instagram or TikTok, the drop off of when people are so sharp, it's yeah, it's like a even for viral videos that thing go still goes is sharply down.

01;17;04;13 - 01;17;17;06
Unknown
So that's that part like be make sure it's performance. Don't tell the story as if you would in real life. Make sure that it's very catchy in the first couple of seconds.

01;17;17;08 - 01;17;50;13
Unknown
Have something interesting to say. Everyone does. I mean that everyone does have a story. Everyone does have something interesting to say, but people get very caught up in like, this is very true of marketing and advertising as well. And I tell I've told many, many people over the years, stop writing like you're writing an ad because we've seen so much content, we've seen so many ads, we've seen so much marketing, but we're bombarded by marketing and branding, and people think they don't believe in marketing.

01;17;50;13 - 01;18;17;01
Unknown
Branding. Believe me, you know, in your entire life you're being bombarded by marketing and branding and advertising and targeted media. Stop writing like you were writing an ad just because you've seen an ad before that that model, that concept you're trying to replicate. Stop being good a super long time ago. Write for the exact audience, like write for the project.

01;18;17;01 - 01;18;41;13
Unknown
Write for the prompt that you're actually trying to address, rather than trying to write a comedy sketch, then trying to write an ad, trying to write a, an intro or like whatever, like actually do the thing that you're trying to do instead of trying to copy this, like, mental model you borrowed from somewhere. That's a good point about the mental models and borrowing it because there's so many out there people get confused.

01;18;41;13 - 01;19;02;02
Unknown
Yeah. And like sometimes a way to make it especially for people that watch this and are also artists, you're always trying to find ways to make it on social media as everyone is. Yeah. All right. Two more questions. Yeah. So one is about, one thing I think a lot of artists struggle with is I think of like, ads and things like that, and also to social media and what it like.

01;19;02;02 - 01;19;29;12
Unknown
So you coming from the marketing world specifically like Gary Vee and Google Ads places. Yeah. What are your thoughts of like ads and social media and like the combination of. So I think it's a shame that people who just want to be artists also have to be marketers. Just facts. Yeah. That sucks. And I don't consider myself an artist like I, call you all bro.

01;19;29;14 - 01;19;49;08
Unknown
Well, yeah, but like, in, I had to. In a way, I'm making an artificial distinction here. But at some point in my life, I had to decide for myself that I want to be in entertainment rather than arts. And I, I just made it. I agreed with my like internally, I made an agree with myself that I am pursuing entertainment.

01;19;49;08 - 01;20;15;01
Unknown
I'm not pursuing art, which liberated me to do more of this superficial, more promotion oriented marketing stuff with conviction. Because if I thought of myself really like as an artist, I would feel way less comfortable doing all the other stuff because my point of view would be, I'm an artist, like, this is some serious shit, like I'm doing some that's important.

01;20;15;04 - 01;20;39;26
Unknown
Why the fuck do I have to do marketing? But when I made the decision, I actually know I'm not doing art, I'm doing entertainment. It's much easier to to connect than, oh, you're doing entertainment. Marketing is a part of it. Being an artist, I would feel like now, fuck marketing, I'm an artist, you know? So it's an artificial distinction, but it needs to be done for myself to be more comfortable doing that other part.

01;20;39;28 - 01;21;07;18
Unknown
So, yeah, part A is that it sucks that people have to do marketing when they just want to do art. The part B is. Be born to generational wealth. Next time, if you don't want to do that, yeah. This this is, talking with people that been in the industry of, like, marketing and stuff for real, because you probably seen some people that had, artists like, first thing and then not succeed.

01;21;07;23 - 01;21;25;10
Unknown
Now you can see this is suffered, you know, especially in a live in New York City to some people that I know that, like, extremely funny, but you don't know how to market themselves and it's a shame I'm talking about they will blow somebody out the water, comedic wise. Yeah. Center wise. Yeah. But they don't know how to market themselves in a way to put them in front of people.

01;21;25;10 - 01;21;48;03
Unknown
Yes. Enough people to make a living from that to continuously get that cycle going about. You see me on stage so I tickets boom, bigger venues, all this stuff. Yes. Yeah. So that's a good that's a good word to say. A difficult one. Yeah. And you know it like, I don't want to sound too critical. I've seen over the years.

01;21;48;03 - 01;22;12;12
Unknown
What, like friends of mine have, like, tried to do when they turn their, when they, like, try to market their art. And what they end up doing is what I said earlier. They try to do, they try to write an ad, you know, like they just think, oh, what I'm doing now is marketing. I gotta do marketing, don't do marketing, do art.

01;22;12;12 - 01;22;31;16
Unknown
But just in the in a way that's native to the platform, you're trying to do it on. You know, I've seen some really corny things that like really talented artist friends of mine have done on social media. I'm like, this isn't you at all. And you're trying to like, you're trying to just copy someone that you think works because that's what marketing is supposed to look like in your head.

01;22;31;19 - 01;23;01;24
Unknown
You're not actually doing your thing. Your talent, your art is not being represented in this corny thing at all, you know? So if you're a really talented creator, if you're an artist, your creator, right? And just figure out how to bring the quality of your art to the platform in a way that feels native to the platform in a way that doesn't feel like you're trying to be like a weird guest to the platform who's like an explorer, like, oh, I've never been here before.

01;23;01;26 - 01;23;26;08
Unknown
Yeah, act like you've been here before. You know, like people have such weird opinions about social media that are that are valid in the broader context, but about promoting their work. Just figure it out. Act like you've been here. Yeah. You know, make stuff that is cool. Your art is cool. It should be presented in a way that is cool on the platform itself.

01;23;26;11 - 01;23;44;07
Unknown
And I know they're not even proud of those ads, are not proud of that content. Like, dude, your content is ass because you're trying to copy some shit that like, you don't even believe in. And we can tell, like you, you've no conviction in this thing you've made. Yeah, yeah. Oh, man. We're going to industry, bro. You probably very, like, keen to just knowing what works and what doesn't to the man.

01;23;44;07 - 01;24;04;09
Unknown
Yeah. One of the percent. Where can we get I mean say working with Garyvee bro. Because you know I consume his stuff and he's very like yeah I mean supportive but cutthroat at the same time in terms of what's working, what's not. Yes. And, what was like some like what were the top three things you learned from Garyvee, like in marketing and advertising?

01;24;04;12 - 01;24;32;25
Unknown
One of the top things is something that I've mentioned before of just attention is attention. No matter what, like people get, people get very intellectual about a new social media platform or a new format or a new medium. Oh, we got to really crack the TikTok problem. We got to really like, figure out, like short form video.

01;24;32;28 - 01;25;09;22
Unknown
We got to figure out how to do all this stuff and like. Attention. The nature of attention has been the same. The the entire time you were trying to figure this out. You know, are you able to get people to pay attention to your thing in the format that they're looking at the thing on or not? You can go read the industry reports about how the algorithm is changing about whatever, and you can waste all of your time doing that instead of just thinking about, okay, how do I get people's attention in general?

01;25;09;25 - 01;25;30;12
Unknown
You know, people get clouded. They get like confused about the fact that the end consumer is just a person. It's not a number on a screen. It isn't the, A page of a of a, of a slide show a person is watching your thing or consuming your content, experiencing your creation at the end of the day.

01;25;30;14 - 01;26;18;18
Unknown
So attention is attention regardless of how revenue the format is. Yeah. Yeah. And the other one is yeah. Make sure there's value in the thing. If you try to sell someone something without any context, the likelihood of them buying it very, very low, very very low, very low. The analogy, the obvious one is you know, you meet someone and you can try to ask them immediately if you want to, if you, if, they want to go out with you or if they want to sleep with you or whatever likelihood of them saying yes much lower than if you had made the relationship and showed them who you are and gave them a compelling

01;26;18;20 - 01;26;40;05
Unknown
reason to want to go out with you. And it seems very, very dumb. But that's what we're doing. At the end of the day, we're forming relationships with people on the other side of the screen. And yeah, giving them a reason to to watch and giving them a reason to care about what you, make. And if you're trying to sell something, care about what you're selling.

01;26;40;07 - 01;27;06;23
Unknown
That's why so many brands are relying on creators. Because why the fuck would I care about some brands? You know, the the gap between brand and consumer has been getting thinner and thinner every year since forever. And now it's, like, practically, you know, invisible this gap. So people want to have relationships with brands and they do that.

01;27;06;23 - 01;27;24;18
Unknown
Sorry. No one wants to have a relationship with a brand. So if they want to do that, they have to give a person to have that relationship with. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And the final thing this isn't so much a Gary thing, but this is how I feel about marketing in general. And people make decisions based on incentives.

01;27;24;20 - 01;27;41;29
Unknown
So is there a reason for me to do whatever action it is that you want me to do. Yeah. And make sure you get them. Good one. Those are some some top three ones right there that hopefully people take away. So it might be hard to digest. But I definitely much needed especially for artists.

01;27;41;29 - 01;28;06;17
Unknown
Yes for sure. So okay, this is for the last question. So, you've been through a lot of different experiences in your life, right? From moving to different places, starting from Korea to Hong Kong to, to, you know, the Aussie. Yeah. Even, you know, San Fran and, you know, Brooklyn, you know, so many different places, even you living in Berlin for ten years, which is like a very long time to live in some place that you, you know, that's very different than the US and other places.

01;28;06;17 - 01;28;45;19
Unknown
Yeah. If you go back to your younger self in any part of that journey will be the number one advice you give to yourself. Well, the number one advice I would give to my younger self is to choose creativity 100%. Instead of choosing percentages, fractions of multiple things. Because the mistake that I think a lot of young people make is I don't want to pursue creativity because it's dangerous.

01;28;45;21 - 01;29;10;27
Unknown
It's not as safe as getting a job or whatever. You're gonna have so much time to get a job, pursue creativity when you're young, whole ass creativity instead of like half ass and creativity and money. For example, if you want to make money, just go work in finance almost 100% sure that you'll make money, right? If you know how to do the things that they ask you to.

01;29;11;00 - 01;29;33;16
Unknown
Don't try to do art and something else like do art. Even if your parents aren't rich like I, you know, I joke about enough, but do that to try and build up your voice and your, like, body of work as much as possible, because you can take that with you forever, right? You can take your, skill and point of view and your body of work into whatever you decide to do in the future.

01;29;33;16 - 01;29;55;13
Unknown
So I tell myself to, yeah, choose creativity 100%, younger. And then figure out what happens from there. That's a good that's a good advice, right? Yeah. Especially choosing creativity first. Yeah. Before the corporate, grind, grind you down, you know, a bit, especially in these places in New York and San Fran. Yeah, but, bro, this has been dope.

01;29;55;13 - 01;30;17;10
Unknown
Anything you want to mention? I don't know, like, you got anything? In the works? Yeah. Please. Well, thank you for your support. If you've ever watched anything that I've made, it's like it's just a thrill that, like, people, it's a thrill that people have ever watched anything that I've made and, like, had a laugh about it.

01;30;17;10 - 01;30;53;00
Unknown
It's still, gives me a great amount of joy. Thank you for supporting me and following me. You can find me at Brian in Healy on Instagram and TikTok. I love to perform more standup this year and, writing my own show. I love to write more scripted like longer scripted series types of things. And, yeah, I'd love to just be more on camera more as well, moving forward and, sharing, my experiences and sharing, you know, good times with the world.

01;30;53;02 - 01;31;10;08
Unknown
Nice. And anyone who comes out outside, you make sure you introduce yourself first, you know, don't put the legwork on him. So he has to say his name, even though you know his name already and you acting aloof, you know, saying your name. So come up to him properly. All right? This is Brian Lee right here. You got to make sure, you know, he's got to travel a lot of places, and you did a lot of therapy, you know, through.

01;31;10;09 - 01;31;29;27
Unknown
And he's not toxic anymore. Yeah, right. About my therapist. Yeah. Shout out to the therapist. Wherever that person is in Berlin and Berlin. You okay? Of course it can't be. No. Outside. That's the, therapist outside of Berlin trying to solve Berlin problems. Yeah. Can't even happen, but. Yeah. All right, well, bro, thank you very much. So much for having me here.

01;31;30;02 - 01;31;38;16
Unknown
Thank you very much. And, guys, thank you for listening and are watching for the Third Culture Talk podcast. I'm your boy Nya Yeanafehn, this is Brian Lee and I'll see you guys in the next one. Peace.