Casey Koza: 0:34

Thank you for coming back for another episode of The Hobby Jogger. I am your co-host, Mr. Casey Coza. Once again, joined by my co-host, Mr. Rob Myers. Rob, how are we doing today?

SPEAKER_00: 0:47

I'm doing pretty well. Warmed up a little bit here in uh in the south. Was able to get out for a run. Happy about that. I think we're here to talk about uh you two boys going out to the desert for a little race.

Casey Koza: 0:58

Yeah, yeah, we are. We are uh once again joined by my dear friend, Mr. Will Walmsley, who is in fact heading back home with me on Thursday to go out to the Black Canyons race out there in I guess it starts in Mayor, Arizona. Will, welcome back to the Hobby Jogger.

SPEAKER_02: 1:16

Hey, thanks for having me on. Excited to do it, exciting week, race week, man.

Casey Koza: 1:21

It is, it is. And uh, you know, I would like to preface that by saying that it has been brutal training here in Northeast Ohio. Rob is lucky that he's down in Tennessee. It's been much warmer for him, maybe not for him because it's still cold for Tennessee, but warm compared to what we have had to deal with up here. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 1:41

The invitation's still open. The invitation's still open. I've been inviting you guys for years. Come on down.

Casey Koza: 1:49

Yeah, well, been tough training here uh this winter, don't you think?

SPEAKER_02: 1:53

Yeah, winter winter's brutal in general, but this one, it's not even being able to run on the roads. We had 16 inches of snow and it's not melted away. It's still here. So it's treadmills are going out in zero degree weather.

Casey Koza: 2:11

Yeah, we're we're actually gaining inches of snow, it seems, every morning. I wake up and the car is covered. So yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 2:18

Normal winter for Ohio, it seems like it's here for a couple of days, and then you have an end in sight. All right, got another three days, and it's gonna start melting away. But yeah, trails can't even touch them. I haven't been able to think of touching them in about a month.

Casey Koza: 2:32

Sure haven't. But we're going out to the desert where it's going to be warm and sunny. Hopefully, hopefully, no snow this year. Last time I was out there, it did snow a little bit, had a nice little race delay for the 100K. So let's start off there with the 100K because we are going to get to view the 100k live and in person. Get to see the carnage as it unfolds. Uh, I I know what number one thing I'm looking forward to, Will, and it's what I look forward to every Ultra is seeing the Carnage at Black Canyon City at about the 50k mark. I haven't experienced it yet. You have not experienced it yet.

SPEAKER_02: 3:12

Uh I've heard from you, and it makes sense. Uh, this has to be the most competitive golden ticket race, and everybody just tries to be in golden ticket position, so you just see very competitive field. Everyone just goes out hot. That's the way you want to see a race.

Casey Koza: 3:28

Yeah, for sure. They do race at this. There is no uh there's not gonna be someone out front time trialing this race, I don't believe.

SPEAKER_00: 3:37

Yeah, that first downhill is probably my favorite section of any race that I've ever run when you're just going down forever. I mean, at the beginning there. Now it was freezing, the mud was frozen. That was quite challenging. It's also the coldest I've ever been at the beginning of that race two years ago. But uh the sun eventually came out.

Casey Koza: 3:57

Yeah, and it does. It does warm up quite a bit, quite quickly, especially once you get down past the Bumblebee station, I believe it's called. I should know that. Uh yes, it's Bumblebee. Uh but yeah, definitely, definitely heats up. Will, what are you looking forward to in the 100K race?

SPEAKER_02: 4:16

Well, one, a good buddy of ours, Amen. Uh, it's fun seeing one of our local marathoners. He's done some trail races. I mean, he's done our buckout 50k. He did a race out in Switzerland last year, and now he's signed up for 100k out here. Um, he's been putting a lot of work, so it's great seeing someone that I look up to in the running community here in Ohio, and he's gonna be going out trying to compete out there. Um, real excited to see that. Um yeah, it's just a competitive race. I mean, you got Francesco Poopy coming from Italy, Eli Hemming, uh, a lot of the biggest names in the sport, just right on the same start line. On the women's side, you have Terra Dower, Riley Brady. Uh, they both two fastest times on this course, and I don't know if anyone has them as the favorites for it. That's how crazy it is when you have Jennifer Lichter and Molly Seidel, like it's it's a deep field.

Casey Koza: 5:15

Yeah, I I it women's field super exciting, and I it is a very deep field. There's some uh ladies there who have won some some pretty big races. Uh Molly Seidel, as you mentioned, uh Olympic bronze medalist coming into the trail community. I'm super stoked about it. I think she's going to win. Uh, how how do you feel that she'll fare going the 100k distance?

SPEAKER_02: 5:44

I mean, you you've been you you've been texting with Jeremy and I. And uh, I'm excited to see how she does. Because the transition from roads where road marathon, you're able to take a threshold pace and hold it as long as possible. This is gonna stretch you out from that two hours and 20 minutes for her, and now she's having to run about eight plus hours. It's gonna be a little bit different type of racing, and then you add some elevation, some technicality to it. Um, it'll be interesting to see how she does because the nutrition is gonna play a bigger role. I definitely think she's gonna be in contention. Uh, I think a golden ticket here for her is very, very likely. I'm not ready to say she's the odds-end favorite to win because there's other girls here that are super fast day and just a lot more experienced. I think it's a very, very tough transition to go from roads to now more than doubling your race distance, almost tripling your race time. That's very, very difficult. So um, I'd still think like Jen Lichter, she's stepping up to the 100k, uh, Envil Kasparin, Terry Dower, uh Riley Brady, like all of them. I can't pick on who I would say is the favorite, but uh I'm gonna go with Riley Brady right now because right now they have the course record, and I'm I'm gonna pay respect to that. The more and more I like I think about it, uh I'm gonna go with Riley right now as my favorite.

Casey Koza: 7:16

All right, you got you got Riley as your morning line favorite. Uh Rob, do you do you have any opinion on the women's field here? Have you had a chance to look it over?

SPEAKER_00: 7:26

Uh just glanced it. I tend to agree with Will though. I mean I can't make a pick, but you can't go wrong with that record.

Casey Koza: 7:36

Yeah, yeah, of course, right.

SPEAKER_00: 7:38

I mean, right Riley's got it, so can't pick a kick against Rick.

Casey Koza: 7:42

Yeah, yeah. Riley is uh, you know, tough runner. You know, been here before, been very successful in this course. However, I am an MFer, a Molly follower. So I have Molly as my favorite. I think she has a ton of race experience. I understand it's not a threshold for two hours and 20 minutes, but she also never gets to just go out and time trial a race. She's had a lot of in-race experience that I feel will carry over. I think you may see her with a little bit different race strategy come Saturday, where she sits in with the other females, none of which are as fast as her. I I don't think that's, you know, she's she's an Olympic bronze medalist. So I think she can sit in with the other females in the race and race them more towards the end, maybe push them, stretch them out towards the end through the more technical parts. But that's why they run the race. They don't run the race with me, Rob, and Will discussing it.

SPEAKER_00: 8:46

I mean, has she been posting any of her training? I mean, it's it's two different sports, you know, road to trail, especially that course. And I wonder what her training's been like.

Casey Koza: 8:56

Uh she she definitely has. She she set the course record for a race. 50k. Yeah, 50k in Texas. I forget I know the race, and I'm blanking on it now. But uh she didn't Bandera. Yeah, Bandera. Which used to be a golden ticket race at the 100k. Uh no longer the case. But yeah, she's uh she's she's she's really been uh training in the desert. She's from the desert, lives in Flagstaff, I believe, correct? Well, I don't know. Yeah, I don't really know either. I she does a lot of training around there, it seems. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 9:32

If she lived out there, I mean she'd be out running on the course.

Casey Koza: 9:35

Yeah, she she did have a training run on the course a few weeks ago.

SPEAKER_02: 9:40

So a lot of athletes have been out there. Uh yeah, you see Francesco out there. I mean, seeing her on the Wayman side, Deona Doan, uh, you know, the Laurel Highlands course record holder, Florida FKT, one of our dark horses that we're following. She's been on the course.

Casey Koza: 10:00

Yeah, I've I've I've definitely been on the course uh a bit, and it's it's the first 20 miles is super fast. There's no doubt about that. I mean, right up Molly and is you know, Allie as far as a speed race goes. And I now that you mentioned Deanna, I I do need to apologize to Deanna. Uh last year at Laurel Highlands, I know like during the race, I saw her go by the first aid station. I was looking at the results. I was like, ah, Florida runner, no chance out here on this course. I think the highest elevation in Florida is around 200 feet, which that's 263. Yeah. What is it, Rob? 263. 263, which is not even as high as the the hill to get the the elevation to get onto the actual Laurel Highlands trail from the parking lot. So I was like, ah, no chance. She is very good in the heat, but I figured, and then she breaks the course record by I believe 20 by 26 minutes, and the course record holder was Leah Gingling, a very accomplished ultra runner.

SPEAKER_02: 11:10

So I myself first women to go under 13 hours.

Casey Koza: 11:15

Yes, first woman to go under 13 hours on a very difficult course. So I am giving uh Deanna Doan, who has agreed to come on to the show for the following episode. Thank you, Deanna. I am throwing her in my uh fantasy top picks because I believe she has a puncher's chance to win the race, especially the back half of that race, which gets a little bit steeper, a lot more technical, which she has proven to be able to do out at Laurel Highlands.

SPEAKER_02: 12:11

We're just looking at the start line right now. We haven't even talked about Lin Chen and Flower.

Casey Koza: 12:16

Well, Lin Chen is currently signed up for two races, I believe. Yeah. Uh Tarawara, hopefully I said that correct, likely did not, and Black Canyon 100k. So she is not in my top 10 because I don't know her travel schedule.

SPEAKER_02: 12:30

So it's real difficult to run the same you know, races on two different continents on the same day.

Casey Koza: 12:36

A little bit difficult. Not saying it's impossible or that Lynn can.

SPEAKER_02: 12:40

I'm gonna say it's probably impossible.

Casey Koza: 12:42

Probably. Uh, one name we haven't mentioned, which I think we probably should have, awesome story too, by the way. Ann Flower out of uh Colorado Springs. Yeah. Yeah, she's I I don't want to say relative. I wouldn't say new to the sport. She's you know been running it for quite a while, but seems to have recently gained a little bit more notoriety. She was our 50-mile national champion, I believe, last year, won Leadville, uh, both the 50 and 100 mile version, and marathon, actually, and uh was a 100k winner at Hatalina Jundred, not hundred, 100k, that's a mouthful, back in 2024. Have you been following Ann Flower at all, Rob, or Will?

SPEAKER_02: 13:34

I mean, new Hoka athlete. Uh definitely excited seeing her results from last year. You know, it's definitely on the radar.

Casey Koza: 13:42

Yeah, for sure on the radar. I also have her in my top five as well. Smart. Very smart. Rob, have you filled out your fantasy picks yet?

SPEAKER_00: 13:52

No, I'm actually looking at it right now on my phone. Multitasking.

Casey Koza: 13:55

We're just kind of a mishmash of men's and women's field here. But one person who I know I will be rooting for in the men's field, other than our good friend Amon, who I also give a puncher's chance to uh due to his marathon speed, is Eli Hemming. Uh, you know, just got beat out for a golden ticket last year. I read something, I don't know where. He was battling something with the Heat last year at this race. So hopefully he's got that all squared away. Definitely have him in my top three. How about you, Will?

SPEAKER_02: 14:29

Yeah, it will be interesting because you got Hans Troyer. Uh yeah, Francesco Poopy. Uh, he's been out there running on the course with my brother. Yeah, and then it's always a possibility that there could be someone that's entering last minute. Um, like Adam Peterman's been out, did a training camp on the course. He's currently signing for the 50k. Could he bump up? You know, he's not currently in western states. Uh I'm sure he's been training with Zach Perrin out in Montana. You know, that that'd be fun seeing him in the course. You know, a guy that's won Western States, as accomplished as he is, still coming back from injury, looked really good towards the end of last year. Uh I'd love to see him bump up, start racing. Hans Troyer, new name that's really hot.

Casey Koza: 15:21

Uh recent signing by Hoka, correct? Yep. Uh formerly an ultra athlete, I believe.

SPEAKER_00: 15:31

Yeah.

Casey Koza: 15:32

Uh if I am not mistaken. Yeah. So yeah, this, I mean, uh every year, well, the last few years, I should say.

SPEAKER_02: 15:40

Oh Anthony Costales, he won it back in 23. Remember when he put a move on Tom Evans and hearing Tom describe like it was just a move, couldn't match it, couldn't do anything. Just one of the best moves Tom Evans has ever seen. Uh, he's back, he's running.

Casey Koza: 15:57

Anthony Costales is back, a very accomplished runner. I looks like he took a little bit of time away, maybe from the sport or was injured. He got injured. Yeah, had a had a good showing at Western States uh a few years ago, finishing third there. Did win the Black Canyon 100k previously, and took fourth over in a UTMB race. Uh CHE is Switzerland, I believe, for some reason, correct? The abbreviation. That'd be Switzerland, yes. Yeah, it's odd. I'll have to do some research into why CHE is the abbreviation for Switzerland. I don't know that off the top of my head, but yeah, finished finished fourth over there. So yeah, very excited to see him back super fast. I believe was a a fast marathoner before coming over to the trail world. Uh you know, has quite a bit of speed. So yeah, it's gonna be super exciting. Now, Will shifting away from from the elite athletes, moving over to us hobby joggers. Jeremy Pope could not join us. Uh, frequent guests of the show, usually in tandem with you tonight. You're here by yourself, but he's also going out to Black Canyon with us. We have quite a group uh from Ohio going out there to enjoy the Black Canyon, and most of us are running the 50k, uh very fast 50k. Uh, what are you looking forward to in the 50k? Other than obviously running it for the first time, but what are some things you're looking forward to?

SPEAKER_02: 17:36

I mean, uh the warm weather, I'm definitely looking forward to that. Uh, I mean, for myself, I'm looking to just finish strong. Like this, to me, I'm in Boston marathon this year, and it's kind of like all right, great opportunity. My sister just had a baby, so that's like perfect time, get a nice long run in. Um, yeah, and it's just fun. I've heard from you on it, and yeah, we've got a huge contingent. The more and more I look at, I'm like, there's more people from Ohio that our group that's going out that we're gonna know, even when our local races are going on. Uh, like you, Pope, David, Stephen Capes, Alex Phillips, Matt Parker. We got Amber to sign up for it. Trying to get a couple more people that are gonna be out there to sign up for it. On the 100k, you got Aamon, Lauren Crissan. Uh oh, previous friend of the podcast, too, Michael Weinsheimer. Uh, him and his wife, Suzanne, they're both signed up for it.

Casey Koza: 18:39

Yeah, it's it's a great time to go out there. Rob, unfortunately, not signed up this year, has a busy schedule of races ahead. So, Rob, we will miss you while we're out there, but we'll send you lots of pictures of us in the sun and heat. Don't worry, appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00: 18:52

Wish I could have done both.

Casey Koza: 18:53

And yeah, Will, I somehow I don't know how this spiraled into just a massive amount of people from the Akron area going, but yeah, quite a few of our friends are now signed up. Andor, uh, you know, met a guy at the the shoe store, Brennan, uh, last week. Uh, we're trying to talk him into to signing up. Well, hopefully we have a little bit of success.

SPEAKER_02: 19:16

Yeah, yeah, a lot of him and yeah, we'll we'll see if we can talk into it. They're already out there. And why why not? There's yeah, it's gonna be a fun race.

Casey Koza: 19:26

Yeah, it is. And and I one of the reasons I wanted to go back is what a good job that Ara Vipa does with the race. They do, they truly do. I they're I you know Laurel Highlands is my favorite race, and I speak about that uh with nothing, nothing but the highest praises. But the guys at Ara Vipa, uh Jamil, and I don't know who else runs it with them. I'm sure there's a whole team, but they do just a tremendous job running their races as well. And it's really a a first first rate show, so to speak, that they put on there. And really for the hundredk, it's great viewing as well. There's a lot of access into the aid stations, they're not super far away from each other, so it's uh it's all very drivable. You're not out on some remote canyon, desolate road up, you know, 6,000 feet or whatever you are for western states.

SPEAKER_02: 20:20

It's are all the aid stations just right off the I-17 there.

Casey Koza: 20:24

They're not too far off, I don't believe. Like one of them for Bumblebee, we have to kind of go over and down a little bit into like a canyon, but I I don't believe they're very, very far off of I-17. Yeah, they're all pretty close.

SPEAKER_02: 20:40

Yeah, that's where I'm like from Arizona, didn't get any running until I moved to Ohio. Never been on this portion of Arizona Trails before.

Casey Koza: 20:48

Really? Yeah. Didn't didn't you and Jess run like uh something out there? Cave Creek Thriller. Yep. That was not out in this no, no, I think that was McDowell's. That was okay. So which we're kind of closer Cave Creek area. Got it. Okay, yeah, I do not everything's Phoenix there to me. So yeah, I know there's Scottsdale and Tempe and uh whatever else, but yeah. Phoenix metropolitan area. Yes, the Phoenix metropolitan area. It's it's all just Phoenix to me. We're staying in Northeast Phoenix, I know that. So but yeah, I'm I'm again, I'm I'm just really looking forward to it. What a great great situation we have with all of our friends going out there. Uh you know, unfortunately, again, Rob can't make it. I get it. Uh, but we got David with us. Uh he's running it for the second time. We did get our friend Amber. Uh, we're promoting the sport. Will, you know, getting new people involved into the ultra running scene. We talked her into running the 50k. I did promise her, uh, Rob, that it is in fact all downhill. So it is.

SPEAKER_02: 22:03

Isn't that how you talked everyone into it uh one or two years ago for the first time?

Casey Koza: 22:07

Yeah, that's exactly what I said. So I thought I'd go with the same move and you can do all your training on the toe path. Yep, yep. And I I I did do my last long run, which was like five weeks ago on the a lot of it on the toe path. So it was all downhill, right? It it there's a couple uphills, uh, more towards the middle to end of the race, but yeah, it's mostly all downhill.

SPEAKER_00: 22:29

I don't know that makes it that much easier, but I'm just happy it's a 50k now. The 60k was awful because you you could see the finish line and you ran past it, went down to the river, turned around, and then ran back. It was just torture. Like there's the finish line, and I have to keep running.

Casey Koza: 22:46

Yeah, yeah. I didn't hit a cactus, so I was I was pretty happy about that. Not happy about the The the last 10K were yeah, I'm glad they changed that. Uh I probably would not have run it if it was 60k again. Just did not like the end on some hot mining road or whatever it is they're doing out there. I don't know. But yeah, so I I definitely agree.

SPEAKER_02: 23:09

You know, as you're saying this, like not having been out there, I'm like, uh, one of my mentors, you know, back when I was in high school and college, he signed up for the race too. Sean McGeever, the uh leads young life in the Paradise Valley, Cave Creek area, is a head leader for that. He signed up for the race and he was sending me intel, did the last like uh half marathon of the course. It's like, yeah, I read it just briefly. I need to look at it a little bit more.

Casey Koza: 23:34

Yeah, the it gets it's you know, I I know this is at least coming out before uh Black Canyons, but the course is really two different courses for the 50k and and for the 100K, for that matter. It's the first 20 miles and then the last 10, which sounds like yeah, no kidding, idiot. But the course dramatically changes from 20 to 30, I feel, Rob. And I know you ran it. Did did you feel the same way, other than the mining road for the out and back part for the last 10k?

SPEAKER_00: 24:06

Oh, a hundred percent. It was like two different planets. I mean, you're you're running downhill, a lot of switchbacks. You get to that aid station, the one that's right before Bumblebee Ranch, and then all of a sudden it's just really punchy hills that you're going up and down and up and down and kind of going along the side of the hill. But yeah, two different courses. Yeah, felt like a different course.

SPEAKER_02: 24:27

One thing Jim has said is like on those uphills, it's like a quick switchback, so then you lose all your momentum right before you start climbing.

Casey Koza: 24:35

Yeah, is that accurate? Yeah, there was no yeah, you you you you had to like, yeah, exactly what Jim said. You had to like stop so you didn't get to use any of your momentum and switch back and go, it yeah, it's it's don't look at the elevation profile and think it's just like this all downhill, all out. Because it is like there's a lot of tight turns. I don't want to say I wouldn't call them they are switchbacks, so we'll say switchbacks, but yeah, you kind of come back over and uh don't take the cut, don't go through the the the field there.

SPEAKER_02: 25:16

But yeah, it is heroes like to say take the cut. Yeah, I don't suggest Island Desert where there's jump in Choya.

Casey Koza: 25:23

No, no, you do not want to get hit by a jump in Choya. I knew nothing about the jump in Choya before I went last time. Maybe I wouldn't have. It's a like terrifying plant. Um haven't slept since. Yeah, haven't slept since. But yeah, I it's don't be fooled by the the elevation chart. And I I actually saw Eamon uh the other day down at the shoe store. I had to go pick up a couple things uh down there at Second Soul, right? Get all of my pre-race goods. But yeah, so I told him I said that the after the first 20, it's a whole different course. It's not it gets technical, it's rocky, you know, you you go up these little punchy hills, and yeah, you have to like stop and come back over across, and it yeah, it does does take you out of your rhythm.

SPEAKER_02: 26:08

Looks like most of the elevation gains in the second half, too. It's not much for a 32-mile race, it's about 2,000 feet of elevation gain. I think it's about 4,000 descent across point-to-point race.

Casey Koza: 26:22

After about 50k is is definitely the longest climb of the 50k uh from Bumblebee up top to I forget the name of the aid station across the street. Um but yeah, that's the big climb. It's not that bad. It's not I didn't I don't remember it being steep or anything or too terribly difficult.

SPEAKER_02: 26:43

Most of the climbs, I'm just looking at the elevation profile. It looks like everything's right around four or five percent, so it's pretty runnable, but at that point, you've got 20 miles in your legs right before you start that climb.

Casey Koza: 26:55

Well, and in in it does feel like somebody took a baseball bat to my quads after that 20 miles. My legs were I I I remember I said whoever was there brewing, I forget, but I was just like, hey, uh, I can't wait for this climb. I can't wait to finally go uphill for a sustained amount of time to kind of take the pressure off my quads because I'm in a lot of pain right now.

SPEAKER_02: 27:23

How uh how rocky is it, the second half, rather that last half marathon, half last 10 miles? Does it get pretty rocky? I'm looking at one picture here, and there's it's almost like PA rocks.

Casey Koza: 27:35

Yeah, I remember it being considerably rocky. A bunch of yeah, where I was, I forget what shoes I think I had the Tecton 2s on. So they did kind of protect my toe, but I was happy that I had them on because I was kicking a lot of rocks, very similar to Pennsylvania. Um, but nothing, I don't remember anything steep. Is that how you remember it, Rob?

SPEAKER_00: 27:57

Yeah, it was rocky, but not technical. You know, it was still very runnable, but you definitely have to watch where you're placing your foot, right? Because you are gonna kick a few rocks along the way.

Casey Koza: 28:07

Yeah, yeah, definitely kicked a few rocks. I will be sure that we get the uh all of the uh you know our scouting report from Jim before we shove off for the 50k will.

SPEAKER_02: 28:20

You uh dialed in your nutrition yet?

Casey Koza: 28:22

Yeah, I I actually um so I ran the Laurel Highlands 50k the fall, and I was that it went about as good as it can nutrition-wise for me. I've I've I'm locked in. I I finally got that solved uh to my satisfaction, and I felt great after it, uh, during it the whole time. So I I'm just gonna continue on with um I use the never second powder and all of the flasks, two scoops and a gel every 30 minutes. So I I didn't go super high carb, Rob. Okay. Hey, that's still playing.

SPEAKER_02: 29:00

That's what 90 grams?

Casey Koza: 29:01

Yeah, that's 90. I'm a little bit bigger though. I'm 185 pounds. So I think it goes to scale. I I don't understand when I hear these people that are, you know, 120 pounds that think they need, you know, 190 grams of carbs. I feel like, and I'm no scientist or nutritionist or anything, but I feel like the body can only absorb per pound so many. I could be wrong, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00: 29:26

Yeah, I have stepped it up lately. I started uh go through about 500 calories an hour and around 100 grams of carbs, and I've noticed a huge difference. I don't know if I'm absorbing all of it or not, but it's definitely different than I I normally do. Um and I've noticed a ton of energy, which is I don't know, I'm gonna double down on it.

Casey Koza: 29:48

Yeah, this was the the the fall classic was the first time that I I truly did take it serious and stuck to the you know the quote unquote plan and like I forced it down, but I was still full stride at mile 23. I think that's where I put up my fastest mile. And actually at the end, I was like, man, I I could have done a lot more if I had a little bit of you know belief that this system would work. So yeah, I guess I guess Will, I did step up the carbs, not to the super high level, but up quite a bit. What is what is your strategy gonna be?

SPEAKER_02: 30:22

Uh wearing a vest having two flasks on me that should have about 60 grams in them uh each, so two scoops in never second. I'm not too worried with this just being a 50k worrying about salt intake. If it was 100k, absolutely, but I think there's enough reserves to where I'm not too worried about it. But then most of my other calories, I'm planning just to use gels. So we carry quite a few gels on me.

Casey Koza: 30:53

Yeah, I I know for me, I I'm gonna start out. I'm I'm wearing the belt. I I've gone to the belt now. I'm a belt guy. Okay, I'll carry one flask because I'm not stopping at the first aid station. So plan is to not stop at the first aid station, empty flask in and make it to aid station two, where I'll have a couple flask or I'll have a flask with me to get me to to the mile 20 and then get a handoff of fresh flasks.

SPEAKER_02: 31:19

Good thing with the belt pro tip, I will say, on this. Uh I know 70 degrees is what it looks like in the forecast for Sunday. Doesn't sound hot, but coming from where it was 10 10 degrees for the past three weeks here, it's gonna feel hot. Tuck your shirt in, and then you can dump ice and we'll hold all the ice all around you.

Casey Koza: 31:41

See that we learned something today, Rob. Well dropping knowledge. Let's go. That is actually a very good seemingly something I should have thought about, but didn't because I don't know why, but did not think of that. But I'm I'm guessing that was a Western states trick or maneuver that you saw in person.

SPEAKER_02: 32:03

If I had to Yeah, I saw someone do it where they accidentally happened upon it. Like, oh, this is actually pretty nice, holds it, keeps it there.

Casey Koza: 32:11

I like that. It's so simple, Rob, and it's just never really even dawned on me to do that. So hopefully there's ice out there because I know at Bumblebee, if it's hot, or the one after that, now that I'm looking at it, Gloriana, mine is the aid station after that, where you have eight miles to go to get to the finish. That's a long way. Uh yeah, gonna need that cooling if they have ice. I don't know. Might not be cold. Hopefully, it isn't hot enough yet by the time we get there. So hopefully I don't need that. Because you're right, Will. I am not ready for the heat. Uh I've been bundled up all winter, freezing my ass off here in Ohio.

SPEAKER_02: 32:50

So yeah, I'm planning on you know, having two flasks just topping off with water every single aid station because I haven't had to use much water during the winter here. But I mean, I'm a heavy sweater and 70 and dry. I'm like, better to have too much water.

Casey Koza: 33:06

Yeah, for sure. Much better to have too much water. Don't want to run out of water in the desert. Not a good feeling, and I think that should what I should wrap into here, Will, is the shoes we will be wearing. Hopefully, you're wearing them because we do need to do a shoe review, but we will be wearing and reviewing the Hoka. Hopefully, I say this correctly, the Hoka Rocket X Trail, correct?

SPEAKER_02: 33:34

I mean it's French, maybe Roquet. Roquet. I'm gonna go with the Rocket X.

Casey Koza: 33:39

Yeah, Roquet. I just want to make sure it wasn't the French version of the shoe that we were.

SPEAKER_02: 33:46

I think you got that one right.

Casey Koza: 33:47

Yes, good.

SPEAKER_02: 33:49

No, I'm planning to wear that mostly because most of my comfort and training has been on the roads, and that one seems like uh, I mean, it's a road shoe with a trail out sole, so I'm hoping it snaps real quick and easy.

Casey Koza: 34:02

Yeah, for sure is. I I had the chance to wear it one time so far. I uh I can't remember if it was snowy. I don't think it was. I just wanted to make sure it fit. Fit well, fit very good. Uh special thanks to Michael down at Second Soleil, who actually made me measure my foot. For a lot of years, Rob, I didn't know my real foot size. Can you believe that? How off were you? Uh, by about a size. Really? Full size, not even half a size. No, well, it's different because I just I always just wore the same shoe that I've worn since I size I've worn since high school, because I liked my shoes a size small playing soccer. So I always just wore a size small shoe. And we were talking about shoe sizes. He's like, what size are you? I was like, nine. He's like, eh. He's like, why don't we measure it? So he took me aside, measured my shoe, got me the proper measurements, and now I wear a size 10. Wow. Yeah, so go to your local shoe store. Whole new world. Whole new world that I'm in here, Rob. So go to your local shoe store, preferably second soul, down there in the valley, and have Michael or Eamon or any of the reps measure your foot, make sure you are wearing the correct size shoe. Yeah, there's also another local store out in Worcester, the aid station, right? Uh, there is um coming soon. Um, Rob, I'm gonna have to I'm gonna have to check. I it is on social media, right? Yes. Okay, yeah, that's correct. So we can talk about it. I know we were not allowed to talk about it a little bit before, but yes, our good friend I didn't know we weren't allowed to talk about it. What's that? So I didn't know we weren't allowed to talk about it. Well we weren't until but I then I remembered it is on social media, the aid station running store. I I believe that's what it's called. I should have looked because Will surprised me with this, so I didn't. But Mr. Jeremy Pope and Stephen Capes, who we will be hanging out with in Arizona, are opening up their own shoe store in Worcester, Ohio. So please check them out as well if you're ever out that way. And tell them the hobby jogger sent you. There's no discounts, it'll just make me feel better about myself. Yeah, good on you to bring that up. Will I forgot, and I know we're gonna do an episode with Jeremy about it. So yeah, good to see and good to hang out with those guys. Maybe pick their brain a little bit about shoes while we're out there.

SPEAKER_02: 36:35

Like that. See how your local store connects with community, builds up Ronnie.

Casey Koza: 36:40

It does, it really does. Yep, and and good to support local small businesses. I know I I do uh I order shoes from Michael down there at Second Toll whenever I can. So I appreciate everything that they do, especially measuring my smelly foot fresh out of a pair of old Cliftons. So thank you very much again for that, Michael. And uh that's about all I got for this episode. Will anything to add before we go?

SPEAKER_02: 37:07

You know, uh it we we know Molly Sidell's in the 100k. We didn't mention Des Linden in the 50k, another Olympic athlete. So it's interesting seeing some of the biggest American names, uh, biggest American road names making their attempts going into it. It's exciting.

Casey Koza: 37:25

Yes, and the only time I will see Des Linden is in the start corral, and maybe a glimpse of her as she is getting off the track as I am starting. So really cool to get to share a start line with Des Linden of you know, an amazing career she has had up to this point. Gonna be exciting to see what it is that she does here at Black Canyons, which I'm sure is crush it, and I will likely pick her to win the women's field in the fantasy.

SPEAKER_02: 37:54

I feel like Vice here at any point other than the start line, something went terribly wrong. Because even if everything goes right for me, she is a much, much better runner.

Casey Koza: 38:04

Yes, yes, she is. Well, that is for sure. She is an elite, elite runner. So yeah, it's gonna be very cool to share a start line with her. Something only happens in trail running where the elites somehow are starting near me, Rob, which is kind of cool. Make sure you ask for an autograph. I'm getting a selfie. I'm a selfie guy. I'm not an autograph guy, I'm a selfie guy.

SPEAKER_00: 38:25

It's just amazing to see the crossover to trail running. These elite athletes coming over from road.

Casey Koza: 38:33

Yeah, yeah, it's it's awesome for the sport, and I am there for it. So, yeah. You got anything before we go, Rob? No, good luck, boys. We appreciate that, and uh, thanks again for joining us for this episode. If you see Will or myself out there at Black Canyon, please say hello and have a great race out there. Till next time. Thank you.