Caribbean Christmas: Traditions, Folktales, and Togetherness with Kesha Christie

Caribbean Christmas Traditions and an Anansi story with Kesha Christie

In the final Caribbean folklore episode of 2025, Kesha shares some traditions and unique ways different Caribbean nations celebrate at Christmas, including bamboo bursting and Junkanoo, plus some of the favourite food & drink made at the end of the year. Of course, an episode with Kesha is not complete without a folktale and this time it’s Anansi and Sorrel.

Listen to more Caribbean folklore episodes

Exploring Caribbean Folklore with Kesha Christie
Trickster Tales
Anansi's Antics in Antigua & Barbuda
The Power of Pataki Stories in Cuba
A Lizard's Lesson
Making a Deal with Death
The Lady and Her Three Sons

Connect with Kesha

To learn more about Kesha and her work, visit http://www.talkintales.ca
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Walk Good podcast

Children’s Book: Mama Keeya’s Garden

Recipes from past guests

Teri’s Food Therapy Vodka Sorrel Fizz 

Teri’s Food Therapy Brown Sugar Glazed Ham 

3 Caribbean Recipes from Belly Full by Lesley Enston 

Recipes by Keshia Sakarah on YouTube 

Transcript

[music]

Hema 

Hi Kesha welcome back to The Moreish Podcast.

Kesha Christie 

Hi, Hema, thank you for having me again.

Hema 

This is our very last recording for 2025. We're heading into holiday season, Christmas, New Years. Maybe we'll talk about something that pertains to the holidays?

Kesha Christie 

Yes, definitely.

Hema

Before we get started with today's folktale, you have been providing us with stories and information on folktales all year long. And in the show notes of this episode, I'm going to leave all of the episodes that you've been on because we have talked about so much when it comes to folklore in the Caribbean. And I want to make sure that everybody's heard all of the stories, all of the tales, and all of the knowledge that you've shared with us this year.

Kesha Christie 

Oh that's fantastic. Thank you.

Hema 

So let's dive right in. What are we talking about today?

Kesha Christie 

All right. Well, we are near the holidays, and there's a lot that we do celebrate and some interesting things too. So I thought that I would start by sharing a little bit about Caribbean Christmas and then jump into one of my classic holiday folktales. Sounds good? 

Hema 

Sounds great.

Kesha Christie 

All right. Well, let's talk about the big picture. Caribbean Christmas. Now, okay, we know the obvious things. There's no snow, there's sand. But of course there are holiday carols, we have our own little spice, and there's food, food, food, and more food, and it's wonderful. 

But there are certain things that are from tradition and really date back further in our history that we still do today, and I wanted to touch on a little bit of those things. So let's begin by talking about what Christmas looks like. It's a blend of traditions. So of course there are, there's African, Indigenous peoples, Spanish, French, um, a little bit of European. We've got our Indian influences, our Asian influences all together in one place. And they show up in what we eat. They show up in how we celebrate and the time that we spend together. Christmas in the Caribbean is more of the gathering, whereas now in the diaspora, it's kind of the gifts and things, depending on who's celebrating at what time. 

Christmas in the Caribbean is loud, full of rhythm, full of history. You can hear it. You can taste it, dance it, and most importantly, you can feel it. 

But there are also different ways that we celebrate, especially different islands. And I wanted to take a moment to kind of have us travel and hear about some of the celebrations that take place. And some are very interesting. 

So the first stop on our little journey would be to St. Lucia and the Dominican,where they celebrate with what's called bamboo bursting. Have you heard of this before? 

Hema

I have not.

Kesha Christie 

So bamboo bursting is when they take hollow bamboo and they put like some kerosene in there and they light it and it makes these loud bang popping sounds. And so it's to signal celebration. But this particular activity dates back to, I would say post emancipation celebrations where it was that loud, everybody it's time to celebrate. So it's a time to gather and this is how it's done.

And it's also done during special occurrences. Like in St. Lucia, they have St. Lucia Day, which is more in celebration of a Catholic saint, I want to say. Don't quote me. Anyone who knows, please feel free to add to this. But it's the way that they signal their celebration, that and their lights out ceremony. So there is that.

And so if you've ever heard bamboo bursting, imagine the whole island basically saying, yes, it's Christmas time. This is the celebration. 

So St. Lucia also has on the 13th, which is actually coming up. so it's called St. Lucy Day, not St. Lucia Day, St. Lucy Day. And it's a light ceremony. So they have, they make lanterns, they have parades, candles, fireworks, you know, all the things to really celebrate this. So this is a Catholic and African celebration of lights kind of thing coming together, And so, and it happens at the darkest time of the year, which of course is our winter for all. 

Hema 

Is St. Lucy Day the celebration of the woman that St. Lucia was named after? Historically, I believe it must have been a Catholic, Christian, saint?

Kesha Christie 

Yes, yes, Yes, that's the day. So for anyone who gets a chance to take a look, they have beautiful pictures on the internet of this, but it's on my bucket list to experience myself. 

Next, we're going to Jamaica and the Bahamas where they celebrate Junkanoo, Junkanoo or Junkanoo depending on who you ask.

So this is a masquerade. It's a tradition where they have characters like, where they say, Pitchy Patchy. There's a king, there's a queen, there is a horse head, a cow head, and usually a pregnant lady. And it's just drumming, music in the streets. And it's like a parade where they kind of dance and they go in between cars. And this parade, big or small, stops traffic. 

So last year when I was in Jamaica, we were just we were going somewhere and they stopped traffic and they come right alongside the vehicles and it's so much fun to…and it was really nice to explain to our kids what was happening and that is of course African traditions, it's got some British humming and so and of course Caribbean creativity just blends it all together. Junkanoo is really storytelling in the street. It's costume, it's rhythm, it's dance. 

And this one is one that's very interesting. Now we talk a lot about snow in the diaspora, but in Grand Cayman, it's sand. And so they have what's called the sand yards. And what they do is they bring in the sand, the white sand from the beach and they put it on their lawns and they build snowmen and they just decorate. And so the homes have sand everywhere. This symbolizes purity, hospitality, and depending on who you ask, they'll say it's the Caribbean winter white. 

And then I guess our last stop for right now, because we could go on and on and on, will be Puerto Rico and Cuba. And they have, I'm going to pronounce it, forgive me, Noche Bueno, Buena. We'll put it in the show notes, type it correctly and phonetically. Someone will correct us, I'm sure. But this is like a Christmas Eve feast. So it's got music and it's got Bomba dancing. And so this is something where they open a gift at midnight. That's that whole open one gift at midnight feeling. And this has Spanish influence, Catholic tradition, as well as our African Caribbean experience with music and dance. So it's loud, it's vibrant. For Puerto Ricans and Cubans, Christmas Eve is the main event with food, music, family, all of it's done until sunrise, and then the quiet begins. So that's our little travel.

And now want to touch a little bit on the food because food is everything, right?

Hema 

Yes. Food is everything. Now, before we get to the food, I love that across the different countries in the Caribbean, as you've just talked about, there are variations on the tradition of how Christmas and the holidays are celebrated. And everything that you've talked about has a historical significance. But what I find interesting is thus far, we haven't talked about anything that has a religious significance. 

Kesha Christie 

Well, what I've talked about are the celebrations that are our general celebrations. Of course, when you look, they do have many of the islands do mass. They do a midnight mass where everybody travels gets up dressed in their best and they go and spend the night in church. There are those celebrations. But I wanted to give us something that was a little more…a little more neutral because there are so many celebrations and these are just a few that I'm mentioning so that we can kind of keep things flowing and quickly get into our stories.

Hema 

Yeah, and it shows the diversity and the influences from around the world and comes through in how the celebrations happen.

Kesha Christie 

Absolutely, absolutely.

Hema 

So let's talk about food.

Kesha Christie 

Okay, well food we've got a lot to choose from. Of course, black cake, our fruit cake, depending on who you ask, but it's the idea of marinating those fruits in rum for months at a time. There is the idea of generations getting together and making the cake. And for our family, we are three generations getting together and making the cake together, so it's there's that, passing down the tradition. 

And of course, up next is sorrel. We can't have this conversation without talking about sorrel. And so that is the red hibiscus, ginger, clove, cinnamon, some with rum, some without and whatever little ingredients in between that we do to make it our own for our family. And it's really an African tradition that pulls through to today. 

And then if we stop a little bit into Trinidad, they've got the puncha cream. It depends on who you ask. They say it very differently, but I'm going to say it in the way that I've heard the aunties thinking about it. And that is like the Trinidadian eggnog, right? But of course, better please don't come for me.

Hema 

All of these three things that you've just talked about, so I've heard, I haven't done my own research, but that the black cake comes from the British tradition of puddings

Kesha Christie 

Plum pudding.

Hema 

and their versions of fruitcake.

Kesha Christie 

Yes, so it's the British plum pudding that kind of started the process. But you know, as Caribbean people, we add our flair and our vibe, and that's how it goes.

Hema 

I love a good black cake. I don't like the addition of all of the cherries and the mixed peels. I like just the basic black cake, but Christmas isn't Christmas without a piece of black cake.

Kesha Christie 

Very true, very true. As a matter of fact, there is a holiday book called A Black Cake for Santa. And so that was one that I read from read over and over to my daughter to kind of help with the transition from the cookies to the black cake. 

Hema 

And so black cake you mentioned, sorrel you mentioned, which is ubiquitous. You have to have a good sorrel at Christmas. You can have it any time, but also at Christmas time is when you get fresh sorrel. And it's a whole different experience when you're making it fresh versus with the dry.

Kesha Christie 

It is, I'm gonna speak from my own experience. I'm used to seeing it dried in the shops, but when you see it fresh and you're like, this is it, and the texture, and then the act of making the sorrel takes on a different experience. Cause now it's not, I'm just shaking out the bag. Now it's the, I'm washing it and this is how my ancestors were washing it too. And then we're putting it in the pot. You feel like you're doing it together kind of thing. Yeah, it's a whole experience.

Hema 

And then the last one you mentioned, I'm gonna say it in the way that I know it, but maybe this could be wrong, is puncha crema. But also that version of something rummy and eggnoggy, it’s also in many different places. And I think there's something called cremas and then coquitos from other places in the Caribbean that are very similar.

Kesha Christie 

That stems from Spanish influences. So yes, definitely.

Hema 

I interrupted you to talk about food because I got excited.

Kesha Christie 

Well, the trouble is we could go on and on. We can talk about the pastelles, the glazed ham, the pepperpot from Guyana. We could go on and on for a while about it. But here's the thing. Food is a history lesson. Every little bite tells us who passed on what, you know, iit not only stays on our tongues, but it stays on our minds and in our hearts, because food is the one thing that your body remembers.

You know where you were when. There are some times where, I don't know, when I just said pepperpot, I started to smell. And so it's a whole body reaction. That's why that food connection is important. 

Well, when it comes to the celebrations, we always need some stories. But I found it interesting that even during the holidays, we still have, you know, Duppy stories that we tell because let's face it, Duppy walk every day of the year, right? So there's always a story to tell. But I'm gonna share with you today my favourite holiday story to tell, which is an Anansi story.

Hema 

Okay.

Kesha Christie 

All right, so this story is called Anansi and Sorrel. It was Grand Market morning and everybody was getting their things together to sell. They brought apples, oranges, cloth, all the things and everybody had to march past Anansi's house to make their way to market to set up. So everybody was passing by with their baskets or their bringle pack up with this and that.

And they walked past Anansi's house and Anansi looked at everybody. Look at them walking past with all these things. But here's Anansi. Good morning, everybody. And everybody replied, good morning, Anansi. They expected to see Anansi on market. But things were low and things for Anansi dollars wise. So he knew if he went to market, he wouldn't have anything to sell. But as he saw everybody walking past with their yam and their dis and their dat, Anansi thought to himself, I hope they left me a little something. A likkle a something for scuffling. 

So when the crowd had died down, Anansi left his house going in the opposite direction, hoping to find a little something left in the field. When Anansi reached, there was nothing but dirt. Nothing but dirt. Anansi looked and him dig, not a yam, not a potato, nothing left for Anansi. The only thing Anansi found was this vine. And when he looked by the vine, it had this, this red thing on it. Anansi said boi, just this red thing. But Anansi always have a plan. So Anansi decided right there and then that he was going to turn that red something into money, into something. So he wrapped up as much as he could, put it in his pocket and headed to market. When Anansi reached market, now he'd look at all of the things. the apples were so red. The mangoes, the breadfruit, everything looked so good. So Anansi had to think to himself real quick, how is he gonna turn this red thing into money? 

So he walked up to the first place that he saw and he decided he wanted this apple, beautiful red apple. So he said to the woman, hey, me give you my red thing for this red thing here, this red apple. Okay, what is your red thing? Anansi never know fi call it a red thing.

So him say, just my red thing for your red thing. Them both red. That's all you need for know. She said, no tell me what it is. Anansi didn't know what to call it. So Anansi is trying to figure out how he's gonna get himself out of this with the apple. So Anansi talk about this, him talk about that talk about all the things and came back around. My red thing for your red thing.

And again, the woman is setting her things up. She said, and Anansi, what is your red thing? And Anansi couldn't figure out anything else to say. So Anansi took the apple and start fi run. The woman turned her can't believe and Anansi took her apple and she said, wait thief thief. Well, now everybody's ears perk up. Can you imagine somebody gonna come Grand Market man if they come theif? So everybody started to take off after Anansi.

Anansi dip left, them dip left. Anansi dip right, them dip right. And dip and dash and dip and dash and them running through market for get to Anansi. 

When Anansi was running past a lady who was getting ready for make her hominy corn. Now the pot was bubbling viciously, ready to receive. And at the same time, Anansi took out the red thing out of him pocket and fling it over his head. It rolled through the sky until ploop, it ended up in the pot.

And that pot was bubbling viciously. It grabbed hold of that red thing and it started to turn the whole pot red, red like blood. This made everybody stop in their tracks because the woman said, my God! Look pon de blood in my pot.

Everybody stopped for a look. Well, Anansi stopped running and he walked back to the pot and he said, wait, wait, wait, don't mind it. It's just not ready yet. Well, Anansi looked quick, took a quick look around and saw the things that the hominy corn lady have. And so he take up some cinnamon and drop it in the pot. He takes some ginger, throw it in the pot. There was some clove and him throw that in there too. And a couple of other things, man, he find an orange peel and throw it in there too. Why not, him say? He stir the pot and stir the pot and stir it.

Why? Anansi was satisfied with it. The cloves were floating on the top and the orange peel slowly started to take on that red colour and Anansi thought, boy, it just about ready, you know? Anansi take the cup from the hominy corn lady, fill it up and took a sip. That good. But it needed a little something. So Anansi takes a sugar and thing and mess it up just a little bit. You know how we do. 

And so Anansi said, wait. Anybody want to try? Anybody want to try? Well, since they see a Anansi drinking, it must be good. So somebody take a sip. Boy Anansi, that nice, it refreshing, it's real. It's so real. Well, Anansi light came on real quick and him start selling per cup. And Anansi asked for the dollars and get the money and him give a cup.

And this went on and on until word spread throughout the market. And Anansi have this something, man, it's so real. And Anansi take himself and say, yeah, it's so real. When the pot come all the way down, and not a bunch left, Anansi said, wow. 

So everybody said, wait, Anansi, the so real finish, the so real finish. And Anansi said, that is not the name. That's not the name. How you know, say?

Anytime we Jamaicans get a little something, we often make it we one right? So Anansi take them so real and turn that into sorrel. And so every year from then till now, everybody making them sorrel. Some add a little more ginger, others add a little more rum. But it don't matter, anywhere in between, when you get it, it have that rich colour and that great smell, and boy you just take a long sip and you know say yes Christmas is here.

Hema 

[laughter] First of all, Anansi is so wicked.

[laughter]

Kesha Christie 

That he is.

And well, and Anansi can be wicked, can be a trickster, but this is one of those times where he brought something to us that we still use and drink today.

Hema 

Yes, and all of it is harmless. All of it is harmless, but it's so funny.

Kesha Christie 

Yes, it is. is.

Hema 

Now, let me ask you, what food, drink, activity is a must for you at Christmas?

Kesha Christie 

For me, it's sorrel. I like to make sorrel, and I like seeing my daughters and my nieces and nephews kind of get involved with it and in the making of it. For me also, it's black cake. Making black cake with my mom is like one of the things that I really love to do because it's that you can have a recipe, which there are plenty of recipes on the internet, but watching my mom kind of feel it, you know what I mean? She's just adding things until, bloops, bloops, that's right. Or she'll mix and be like, no, that don't feel right. Or let me add a little more of this. And just watching her put it together, it's like, how much did you put in there? You just put, you know, tell the ancestors tell you to stop until you feel the love. And I'm like, wow, we can't measure that, but it never fails. 

I tried doing the recipe and yes, the recipes are nice, but that extra lovely warm feeling from  filling from your toes to your heart, to your head comes when you get the cake that's, where that extra little attention is put in. So for me, black cake makes it Christmas.

My mother's black cake makes it Christmas. 

And the activity of making sorrel. And really the generations, because now I'm there helping. I'm with my mom. My daughters are with my mom. Well, now they get voluntold instead of just volunteering. But still, it's something that will stick in your memory. And when you forget the recipe, you'll remember the feelings that you had while you were making it. And it comes back to you.

Hema 

I've never made black cake myself. It is, I love to bake, but it is one of those things that again, my mother never had a recipe, my auntie who made it never had a recipe. They just, they do it by feel and by eye. And it's not the easiest thing, in my opinion, to make and get right because the texture is unlike any cake that you might get elsewhere.

Kesha Christie 

It is. I remember years ago when I first started on this journey of adulting, I was living on my own and I was like, I'm gonna make black cake this year. I'm gonna show my mom that I can make it. And I made it for my grandfather. And he was so wonderful. It turned out the texture was black forest cake texture. So you know you did it wrong.

But I didn't, I wanted to show him I could still do it. So I was like, hey, grandpa, I brought this for you. And he was so lovely. He opened the tin and I had it wrapped in the foil the same way it's supposed to be. And he was like, oh wow, this, this, it felt like light, but he opened it up. He took a slice. And when he cut it open, I looked at it and I was like, that's not it. But he didn't tell me. The taste is there, is what he said.

And I just took that. But at that time, I was like, listen, I need to get back in the kitchen with my mom so I can get it right. And a few more times in the kitchen with my mom, now I could do it on my own. But why? Just watching her like a food chemist put it all together is the fun and the joy in making.

Hema 

It is, if you haven't had black cake, some people will call it fruitcake, and some people will put in some of the extras that go into it, like the mixed peel, like the cherries, like these other things. But to call it a fruitcake really does it disservice to what it is because fruitcake for many people denotes this cake that nobody really actually enjoys and wants, but you get all the time at Christmas.

Black cake is something very different. It is unique in the way it's made and the way it tastes. And it does have that more pudding-like texture than a cakey texture. 

Kesha Christie 

Absolutely, and if you get it once and it's got these big chunks in it don't be discouraged because some things you need to try twice. Get it from someone else, but what I found is that when people like when auntie so-and-so make it, don't offer them Suzy's cake over here because it's like no, it's your team auntie Suzy or nobody.

Hema 

Yes.

Kesha Christie 

But yeah, it's like you said, the fruitcake, my face automatically went, ugh. But when you hear the blackcake, you almost feel the rhythm.

Hema 

Yeah, yes. I mean, listen, it is alcohol soaked. So if that is not your thing, maybe black cake isn't for you, but it is definitely a part of a Caribbean Christmas for sure.

Kesha Christie 

It definitely is.

Hema 

Now, another thing that we haven't talked about that I associate with Christmas is pone or cassava pone. Do you, is that something that you also associate with Christmas?

Kesha Christie 

It is associated with Christmas, but it's not my Christmas thing. But I mean, and it's that as well as parang music, right? Some people are like, ain't Christmas until you have parang. And I'm just like, you know, it's one of those things. Love it all the same. It's just for me, it's not my must have at Christmas, but there are other households where you know from you ring the doorbell, you know it's parang all  night.

Hema 

Yes, cassava pone again, I thought of that because it does have that sort of pudding-esque texture. That and parang for me is a part of my Trinidadian memories of growing up in Canada, but in a Trinidadian household as part of Christmas.

Kesha Christie 

I love that, love that.

Hema 

When it comes to New Years, Old Years, do you have any traditions?

Kesha Christie 

Gosh, yes. Well, it's the basic, right? So for our family, it is the tradition of cleaning house. Not that your house is messy, nobody's saying that, but it's that deep clean, rid yourself of the old, donate what you need to donate, put away what you're putting away, all those things. Because my mother used to say, many members of my family say, but my mom's the closest to me. She used to say, don't let New Years come and find Old Years dirt.

And so now you make sure the whole house is clean and in order. And it's really, when you do that, you're bringing in the good vibes. You're bringing in that new positive energy into your home for the new year. And when we say clean the house, I'm talking open the windows in dead of winter. Get that fresh old air mixing, get it out.

You're lighting your candle or your sage or just kind of give it that whole thing, that whole cleansing physically and spiritually or however that works for you. And just letting in that new energy flow in, that is the main tradition. And it's really spending time together. 

For myself, I got in the habit of making vision boards. And so I like the idea of the cutting and the doing all of that together just before midnight, because it's like, now it's done. Let's see where it goes. And sometimes you don't get the chance to really do the hands-on cutting, and it might be electronic, but you're keeping the tradition because you're having that forward thinking. And it gives you that momentum into the new year.

Hema 

Do you call it New Year’s Eve or Old Year’s Night?

Kesha Christie 

[laughter] Oh my goodness. Okay. So if I'm talking to folks in my generation, I'll call it New Year’s Eve. If I'm talking to our elders, then I'd say Old Year's Night. Just because they say it differently, it means the same thing, but I feel that Old Year's Night has that more historical essence to it.

Hema 

And it means the same thing. It's either New Year’s Eve is the eve before the new year, or it is Old Yea’rs, it is the last night of the old year. And for me, Old Year’s Night brings up the connotations of the older generation. Certainly people in the Caribbean, I don't hear a lot of people here in Canada saying that.

Kesha Christie 

You're right, you're right.

Hema 

IAnything else we want to talk about for traditions around the holidays?

Kesha Christie 

Well, we did talk a little bit about going to service. And so a lot of people gather and they spend time in church. You'll see the history of Christmas lights. I am a lover of the Christmas lights. But the act of having light, and whether it be lanterns or actual Christmas lights, is something that doesn't just sit here in the diaspora.

Caribbean islands, they have lights everywhere because it's that little thing that I feel like it's that little hope, that little belief of something new coming that just carries on and it traveled from history into our current day. It just looks a little bit different, right? LED lights. It looks a little bit different, but the idea is still the same, is holding onto that little light, that little bit of brightness and it carries into the new year. So those are some things that we still carry out. 

And there are things that the act of gathering as family, your family is bigger during the holidays because you consider more, you bring more people into that circle of family, friends and acquaintances. You kind of bring them into that fold to really celebrate the hope, celebrate that newness, celebrate togetherness. And what I like about the season is that people are more open to that care, that comfort. They're more open to sharing it willingly. So I do like that spirit that we have during the holiday season. 

There's so much that we could talk about, but we'd be talking forever and ever. Just about the food, the traditions, the language, the music, and just histories and influences. There's so much, but again, the Caribbean is so diverse. So going back to what I said earlier, this time of year is where you get to taste it, hear it, feel it. And it's something that we openly greet and share with those that we meet, strangers on the road, we're saying, happy Christmas or whatever that is. 

And I find that now that Christmas is changing, Christmas in the diaspora seems to be more about who can get the more gifts than others or things like that. In the Caribbean, it was the time. It was now you're giving your time and that was the best gift of all. And so I'm hoping that this year, while we're out busy doing the preparations for the holidays, that we will stop and remember that your presence is a gift, your undivided attention. Pull out the board games, put down the phone, and have fun.

Hema 

I wholeheartedly agree. All of the things, all of the food and the family and the friends and the fun of just coming together and enjoying each other's company is holidays, Christmas, New Years of my past, of my childhood. 

Before we wrap, this is our last conversation before the end of the year. What do we have to look forward to you and what's gonna be on your vision board for 2026?

Kesha Christie 

Oh wow. There is so much happening that I'm so grateful for this year. Becoming a TEDx speaker and my new children's book, Mama Keeya's Garden is available. So those are some of the things that were on the list for last year. For this year, it's really being able to share with community, um, about who we are, finding that boldness in our uniqueness, finding our voice,

where we're at instead of trying to wait till we've gotten to a certain spot. I want to be able to assist, help with that. And that means there'll be performances, there'll be workshops, there'll be  different things to hold onto either in person or online. And really just to be, watch the ripples. When we have conversations, there are ripples. When we have hold events, there are ripples.

And just to see how far those ripples can go and how many people we can touch with our energy and the spirit in which we share our history and our stories of who we are and how we came to be, they're important. And I wanna continue to be able to share that and welcome everyone to come on the journey with me.

Hema 

I will leave, as always, ways to connect with you in the show notes. I'm going to leave some links to some of the past episodes that we've done together and probably some links to Christmas and holiday recipes that I've found from other people that I've spoken to because this is the time of sharing, of being joyous. 

And I want to thank you so much for joining me this year on the podcast and sharing your knowledge. And I wish you the best Christmas and New Years, and we'll connect in the new year.

Kesha Christie

Thank you so much for having me. It's been a blast this past year and happy Christmas to you as well and happy, happy new year. Looking forward to all that is to come.

[music]