Corean Canty (00:02.003)
Hello, hello, hello.

Kandi Gongora (00:05.175)
Hello!

Corean Canty (00:06.742)
Welcome to the podcast. So before we dive in today, since we all have very active and full lives, as you know, I don't like to use the word busy. I think words are powerful. Though I hope you've had time to rest and recharge and do all the things during this holiday season. I'd like to take a moment for us to get present with each other and just take a breath.

So let's take a deep inhale, exhale so we can be here together and nowhere else. All right. So I have my almond milk matcha and my cozy blanket. I'm so excited for our conversation today. What is your current favorite warm drink?

Kandi Gongora (01:01.951)
My current favorite warm drink is there's two. It was peppermint mocha for the holidays, but now I'm kind of getting stuck on white Russian coffee. It doesn't have alcohol in it, so, but it tastes really yummy. And right now I have my peppermint mocha.

Corean Canty (01:20.924)
Oh, I love to be the change and blessed. We're on, we're on the same page with positive affirmations on our cups. Yes.

Kandi Gongora (01:24.167)
Yes, on the same page. That's right. Love them butterflies.

Corean Canty (01:30.802)
Yes. So to kind of get us started, you know, you're one of my favorite people and you've had a big impact on my life. I've talked many times about my corporate journey and you were there for a big chunk of it. We worked side by side. We did a lot of work to create better workplaces. You were there when I got sick telling me to stop working.

You were there as I've transitioned into caregiver and this work that I'm doing now being focused on this season. But over the years, we've had a lot of conversations about all the things we've had to unlearn, many we've unlearned together. Though we have amazing careers on paper, a lot of our career was built off of the shoulds and the have tos and the supposed tos and all the things.

Kandi Gongora (01:58.231)
Yes.

Kandi Gongora (02:12.539)
Mm-hmm. Yes.

Corean Canty (02:24.514)
that society told us we needed to do the boxes we needed to check to be happy and to be successful. And we know from personal experience and all of the people in the teams that we've led that lots of times that leads to people not living their own lives and many times even ending up sick. So I'd love it if you would share a little bit about your journey with the shoulds.

Kandi Gongora (02:25.013)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (02:51.579)
Yes, so I think my journey goes like even when I'm growing up as a young child told you should go to college, you should do this, you should, should all leading to a great career so that you don't have to worry about things financially. And that was my focus. So I did, I did the shoulds, you should go to college, I did that you should really just dive right into life with no breaks, no rest, no thought.

I did those things, worked hard, did everything I was supposed to do, and, you know, didn't think twice about it, didn't think about what it was doing to me or how exhausted I was or not taking a moment, and dove right into the corporate world. And in fact, some of my choices even at school, you know, at university was around what should I do.

Corean Canty (03:40.747)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (03:50.467)
versus what do I want to do? And I played with that a little bit because I switched majors quite a few times because I just couldn't find that perfect fit. And I was looking for one, that perfect fit, because I'm gonna do this rest of my life and this is the path and what's gonna be the best path for me. And oddly enough, I think I got to a really good path, but there was a lot of stress and worrying and changing and spending more time in school because of it.

That I've toyed with business, psychology, education. Those were my three loves and I just couldn't find that perfect fit. So, you know, I tried to make my own path there. And I think then it turned into working all the time, right? You should be focused on your career. You need to build it. Being a woman, I felt like I had to work harder in different ways or I was seeing certain ways that I at first leaned into, which did not serve my career well. And then I...

Corean Canty (04:33.054)
Yeah.

Corean Canty (04:39.788)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (04:47.343)
then I did things differently. But feeling like I had to work hard and work lots of hours and be present with work all the time, pretty much led to my own sickness and not putting myself first. And so also a should was around work and still be a mom and take care of the household, all of it. You can do all the things and you should do all the things. And I did all the things not well.

Corean Canty (05:01.486)
Yeah

Corean Canty (05:11.143)
Yes.

Corean Canty (05:16.182)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (05:16.499)
I think work I did well. Not to say I was a bad parent, but looking back, I could have done things differently. And my boys both have a really good work ethic. Luckily, they have a different mindset around it, but I think they do get a little bit of where they are today because they saw my successes and they also saw things they wanted to do differently. But that ultimately did lead me to my own health journey,

Corean Canty (05:39.51)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (05:46.355)
I was diagnosed with breast cancer at 43. And I fundamentally believe that my stress and amount of work and not taking care of myself, both mentally and physically led me down that path. The type of breast cancer I was diagnosed with is not tied to hormones. They really don't know what causes it other than stress as a component, right? So...

Corean Canty (06:06.574)
Hmm.

Kandi Gongora (06:10.079)
I should have done better to take care of myself. And in fact, I started five years before I was diagnosed, I started putting myself first just a little, where I was working out and focused on my eating, taking time for myself, was in the best shape of my life when I was diagnosed. But it was a little bit too late, right?

Corean Canty (06:28.046)
Hmm. Yeah. So you like me, we, we became moms young. And so we were doing all the things and building these careers and trying to take on everything. And one of the things I realized looking back before I got sick was I had a lot of whispers before the roar. And as you're looking back on doing all the things and climbing the ladder and being successful and checking the boxes.

Kandi Gongora (06:33.779)
Mm-hmm. Yes.

Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (06:48.387)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (06:54.5)
Yes.

Corean Canty (06:57.314)
Do you remember hearing the whispers and kind of pushing them off? I'll get to that later or I'll take care of that later or just after I get this title or get this project done or get whatever it is.

Kandi Gongora (07:02.693)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (07:07.291)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Corean Canty (07:09.23)
keep putting ourselves last on the list until our body doesn't let us do anything.

Kandi Gongora (07:14.539)
I did hear the whispers. There were many signals, even from my sons, right? You know, things they were saying or, you know, thinking about there were times where I knew I needed to eat better, just for example, right? But it was like, oh, you know, I'll do that later. I don't have time. Or just thinking about it stressed me out more so that I continue to make bad choices. It almost like fed into itself. So...

I guess to self soothe from the whispers, right? I wasn't, I was soothing myself versus truly taking care of myself. And there was also, you know, obviously doctor visits or different, because I did get my physicals yearly and there were definitely things around my weight or around my muscle mass that I had lost or different things. But again, I didn't in my mind have the time.

Corean Canty (07:44.266)
Yes.

Kandi Gongora (08:08.467)
I felt like I was too busy and like you just mentioned the word there, right? It was in it really was just this hodgepodge of things that I felt like I should do. I had to do and by the way, I had to do it versus asking for help or even talking to my employer to say, hey, this is where I am and this is kind of I can do all the things I can achieve the same results for you, but I'm going to look at it differently. Should have done that, but I didn't.

Corean Canty (08:11.848)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (08:21.375)
Right.

Corean Canty (08:36.518)
Yes. And so also in those early days of your career, I know you and your husband made a choice for you to be the primary breadwinner as your boys were young. And I don't know if we talk enough about women when they are the breadwinner of the home, whether like me being a single mom and I have to be or choosing to be that because it's what works for your family.

Kandi Gongora (08:41.465)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Yes.

Kandi Gongora (09:03.606)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (09:03.734)
And then the added pressure we put on ourselves to still do it all and not ask for help and make everyone else comfortable so they can live the lives they want to live. And we'll get to ours later.

Kandi Gongora (09:15.991)
Yeah, it's a responsibility. It feels like a responsibility, or we've told that. I'm very fortunate that I have a husband who is truly a partner, but he was told things or he saw the world a certain way that everybody was seeing that he didn't know different. And so I think, I remember one time we had a conversation and this was before we made our choice, our life choice we're talking about. And I'll get to that, but I remember having a conversation

I realized I was doing a lot of things and not that he didn't do things he did, but I did it to myself if I'm honest, like I had to have control of the bills, I need to have control of the financials, I the budget, I need to have control over when we did what in the scheduling. I mean it wasn't like he was not doing it, I just was actively doing it. And I remember one day I sat down because I was so tired and I wasn't, which was another signal, like what am I doing? I'm not doing anything.

Corean Canty (10:08.055)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (10:15.615)
All my work is knowledge work, right? Not manual labor. And I sat down and I wrote out all the things I'm responsible for in my mind that I've given to myself. And I wrote down what he's responsible for. And notice my list was like really long with my hand signals and his was really short. And I sat down and had a conversation with him and he was blown away too. Like he didn't realize all that I was doing. And then his question was like, why are you doing all of that?

And so then we rebalance our list a little bit. So that was a good conversation. But then once, but it was constant getting out of sync. And again, not because of him, because of my choices and what I felt like I had to do or I need to do or be responsible for. I think there was some guilt from all the work I was doing. So then I would be the sports managers, the soccer managers for both my boys teams, right? So because I felt guilty that I wasn't there all the time. Or they need, you know, we were twitching clubs and they needed somebody to be on the board to help.

Corean Canty (11:05.305)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (11:13.263)
build the club, I'll do it, even though I have a full-time job, right? And so I felt like, I think guilt came from that too. But when my oldest son, who's now 30, was 12, he, one morning we were getting ready for school and he dropped in the floor with a full-blown seizure and that changed our lives. And again, was a signal, but it changed our lives tremendously forever, but also for the next few years, we had to make some choices.

Corean Canty (11:16.895)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (11:41.475)
because we could not get his seizures under control and it was keeping him out of school and having a life. And we sat down and at that time, we had a great conversation. You know, my husband and I around like, what are we doing? What are we doing with our lives? You know, here, this is a wake up call for us. Our son needs us. We're not home. We take care of them in the mornings and get them where they need to go, but then we're off on our careers. We both worked an hour away.

Corean Canty (11:54.222)
Mm.

Kandi Gongora (12:07.339)
Like what are we what are we doing here? Are we are we building a family and a life? Are we chasing something else that's really not here to serve us? So we had a great conversation and The choice was made that one of us needed to be here for him. I love my career I love the company I was working for I love the work I was doing He was you know, it was a job, right? And so he was willing to leave his career we felt like it was the best choice for us overall and

Corean Canty (12:13.399)
Yeah

Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (12:37.271)
But even after that decision, things got out of whack for me again. You know, he was home. He took care of a lot of things that I no longer had to worry about. Getting the boys where they needed to go, taking them to and from school. That was one less stress for me. And then he actually started his own career, his own business that worked around the boys schedule and his life. Like he literally executed it really well. He was, he did the thing that we all should do. Yeah.

Corean Canty (12:52.662)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (13:02.818)
designing his life, yeah, for him. And what did you feel your time with as he started taking on some more of the things at home, freeing you up? What did you feel that extra time with?

Kandi Gongora (13:05.911)
And we didn't even see it, you know? Like he just did it.

Kandi Gongora (13:19.964)
More work, more work because then in my mind I was like great I can get to work earlier if I have to stay at work later that's awesome because I don't have to rush home to beat the daycare timing and different things like that. So he took the right path unconsciously which is fascinating now when we look back at it. I you know help people develop and I coach people but I didn't.

Corean Canty (13:20.983)
Ha ha ha!

Kandi Gongora (13:45.423)
take care of myself and I got right back to the same path. I just added more work and that just freed me up to do more work and be there more often or not have to worry about it. Travel wasn't a big deal. Like it just freed me up for more stuff versus freeing me up for maybe time for myself or more time for my family. So again, I was chasing something and doing what I felt like I was supposed to do with the added pressure of being the sole breadwinner.

Corean Canty (13:57.987)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (14:12.035)
Which by the way, he never put, my husband never put that on my shoulders. He instantly within six months was starting his own business. He made up the, within the year, he made up the income, if not more that we let go of. It worked out, right? Without me controlling it, honestly. But I still didn't see that signal and I still continued down my path.

Corean Canty (14:27.914)
Yeah.

Corean Canty (14:33.994)
Yeah. And I think the key word that you're saying is the one thing that I think happens to a lot of us in our careers, especially in the Western culture is the chasing, the chasing of the success symbol, the chasing of all the things that we're told. This is the title you should have. This is a salary you should have. This is a house you should have. This is what success looks like. This is what happiness looks like. And so many times we spend decades chasing it. And then on paper, we get it.

Kandi Gongora (14:43.935)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (15:03.055)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (15:03.794)
And we don't have the happiness that was promised. And we don't feel good because our bodies are worn down. And we look back and there's all these moments we've missed with family and friends and children. And many times we feel stuck. And a lot of that has to do with kind of the mindset we've been conditioned to believe and the habits that we build around all of these conditioned ways of success that drive our behaviors for decades.

Kandi Gongora (15:06.756)
Mm-mm.

Kandi Gongora (15:23.736)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (15:34.16)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (15:34.186)
What made you start to want to shift that and look a little bit more at the life you want to live versus the life you were supposed to live?

Kandi Gongora (15:46.395)
I've had bits and pieces of it happening my whole life just because I'm interested in development, in psychology, in behavior. That's just a natural interest of mine. So I've taken courses, I've been coached, I've done different things, taken assessments. I think the first big breakthrough though for me was...

Kandi Gongora (16:09.347)
And my last role, I went through an executive education course and it was good, it was really good. But I had a coach and they did this extensive assessment work, 360, all kinds of assessments. And there was some great feedback from people who I worked with that led the coach to think about like, what's getting in the way here? What's getting in your way? And we found...

we drilled it down to the inner critic. Now a lot of us have an inner critic. I did additional work outside of that coaching because then I became fascinated with like, what's this inner critic and what is it doing? And you know, really there's sabotage in me in many ways. And so I did more work there and took it all the way back to root cause of the root. I love doing root cause analysis. And it was really tied to all the way back to when I was six days old and I was put up for adoption.

And even though I had a wonderful family, wonderful childhood, I still never felt like I was enough. I knew from the very beginning I was adopted. My family was very open about it. They celebrated it. I know that they wanted me, right? So all the things, there's so many great things about it, but I wanted to prove my worth to them. I wanted to be worthy. I wanted to be good enough.

I wanted them to get their ROI. As crazy as that sounds, right? I don't know. That's just, you know, I wanted to prove myself. And again, they did not, they did not create that environment for me. And my brothers would tell you I'm probably more loved than they are. And they're the blood children. But I, you know, it had nothing to do with that. It was how my mind processed it, how I looked at it. Once I realized that was the driving factor.

Corean Canty (17:34.831)
Mm. Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (17:58.519)
I really dove into that and questioned that more and realized that I had nothing to prove at all because they accepted me fully. They wanted me. In fact, I was probably had a leg up than a lot of people where the families didn't expect the child and they just had to deal with it. I'm very thankful that my birth mother made that choice. And since then I've got to meet her and that's helped me continue to heal. But that work I did, I realized it

Corean Canty (18:03.701)
Hmm.

Kandi Gongora (18:27.111)
but I didn't make a lot of change, sustainable changes. So that work started there. And then I think, and like I said, many signals, but when I was diagnosed with breast cancer, game changer for me for sure. At 43, I was, like I said, in a good shape. My sons, my last one was graduating. He graduated a month before I was diagnosed. I was looking at a different season of life. And so...

Corean Canty (18:30.318)
Hmm.

Corean Canty (18:52.173)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (18:53.303)
I was even thinking like, oh, well, maybe now I can back off work a little bit. We can travel some, just thinking through what could be next. And that really stopped everything. And I worked the whole time during treatment. I saw that as a badge of honor, which is terrible. I, yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (19:10.071)
Thank you.

Corean Canty (19:16.26)
Hmm. Oh, let's pause on that for a moment in this idea in our society that like, I'll sleep when I die, hustle, grind, badge of honor culture is actually killing us. It's actually the cause of the exact opposite of what we want to achieve. We work so hard because we want to have this amazing life.

Kandi Gongora (19:25.387)
Yes, yes, yeah.

Mm-hmm. Yes.

Kandi Gongora (19:36.345)
Right.

Corean Canty (19:39.442)
yet it destroys us from physically even being able to have a quality of life. And it's interesting as you're in the middle of fighting for your life and trying to heal your body and learning that you have this form of cancer that you can't blame on your hormones or you can't blame on some of the things that we tend to.

Kandi Gongora (19:50.235)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (20:04.71)
look for when we get sick of the like the why am I get sick? What could have I done different? And knowing that stress is a big cause of that, yet still, it was like, but I can work through it. And I did it. And like, we're proud of that.

Kandi Gongora (20:08.259)
Right.

Kandi Gongora (20:18.647)
Right.

Kandi Gongora (20:22.979)
very, very proud of it and, and celebrated even like by your, by your friends, by your family, not so much, My husband did not agree with that, my method, but it's on our story. He's more evolved than I thought he was all along. But I think, um, but you know, even my bosses, my, you know, it, and literally, I mean, I obviously, I took the day I had the infusion. I mean, this is how bad it was. Corean, I scheduled my

Corean Canty (20:32.95)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (20:51.475)
my chemo around what would be less disruptive for work. And I do want to say, I do want to say this, like there is a balance of not being in bed feeling sorry for yourself and being active while you're going through treatment. And that's so needed. And that's what keeps you well, I believe, and keeps you motivated and keeps your mind good in a good place. But there's also that extreme of, okay, I'm going to schedule my chemo on this day because this day,

Corean Canty (20:57.272)
Mm.

Corean Canty (21:05.599)
Yes.

Kandi Gongora (21:20.463)
The next day I'm not sick and that's Friday and I can be at work and then the next two days are the worst, which are the weekends. So I'll just go through the worst on the weekends and then Monday I'm back at work again. And so I save the best for at work.

Corean Canty (21:32.618)
Yeah, but I love how...

Corean Canty (21:37.682)
Yeah, it's like we don't realize that there's so many other slices of life than just work. We're conditioned that like that's the main thing. And how many times have we talked about the work-life balance fallacy? There's no such thing as work-life balance because that means work and life are separate. And they're not, there's only life. Work is one slice of it. But we're so conditioned that work is the thing. And we do as adults spend most of our life at work. We do.

Kandi Gongora (21:45.923)
Right.

Kandi Gongora (21:49.3)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (21:55.075)
Right.

Kandi Gongora (21:58.491)
Mm-hmm. Yes.

Corean Canty (22:07.366)
meet a lot of people at work and that's, but a lot of that is conditioned in us. And even when we need to take time to heal and when we need to do things for our body, even when I was sick, I was trying to, you know, you're telling me, what are you doing? I'm laptop on the bed. I don't have the camera on. Can't get up and walk, but I'm going to just listen into the call. Instead. I could have been doing a million other things to keep myself busy, to keep myself active, to work on my healing. But there's this.

Kandi Gongora (22:11.759)
Yes.

Kandi Gongora (22:22.647)
On the bed.

Kandi Gongora (22:28.247)
Right.

Kandi Gongora (22:32.443)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (22:37.154)
feeling that we get of needing to show up for everyone else, even when we need other people to show up for us the most.

Kandi Gongora (22:41.187)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (22:44.571)
And we won't ask for it either, right? But that's the thing, it's where, and think about this, the number one thing to help you heal is sleep and rest.

Corean Canty (22:46.346)
Right.

Kandi Gongora (22:56.931)
But I was not doing that. I was going back to work. And let me be clear. My last employers were amazing through my treatment, through my whole career. I was there for 16 plus years. This was me. This was my choices. Now it was so easy to sit back and blame whoever for expecting me to work or getting used to the output that I was giving them, but that was all on me. And so even in this scenario, it was on me. They didn't ask me to work.

They didn't want me to work, right? There were times where I was sitting at my desk working in between treatments and one of the presidents would come in and give me money and say, go to the spa today, you know, or go here today or go home or do that. Like they were constantly trying to give me opportunities. They were sitting in meals during holidays. Like they wanted me to rest, but I made the choice, right, to be there. Right. Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (23:44.739)
Yeah.

Corean Canty (23:52.03)
Yeah. And amazingly, you beat cancer. And we're very, we're very glad for that, despite all the work that you did during your challenge. And I'm curious, is once you got through that initial battle, because I know it's a it's a lifelong thing.

Kandi Gongora (23:57.035)
Right? Yes? Yes! Despite all that, right? Yes.

Kandi Gongora (24:07.791)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (24:11.586)
Did things change?

Kandi Gongora (24:15.375)
For a short period of time, for a short period of time. And again, as I reflect on this, some of the change was driven by, once again, my partner. Because he then would wake up, fix my drink, my coffee, make sure my office was set up. He did things to support me as I was going to work because he had more flexibility. He would go with me on errands. He just tried to take out stress.

the best he could. And so that drove some of the changes that we made. We were together, we didn't stress over things. We tried to make chores more fun and adventuresome. But during one of my sick times after chemo, I was obviously not feeling well.

And I was surrounded by my dogs, you know, all of my dogs. And so I had my puppies with me, my husband was with me and we're in this, my room, my bedroom, it was dark. And it just felt so good. Like even though I was sick and I didn't feel great, it felt good. That moment felt good. Being in my house with him and the dogs. And I just made the statement of like, I really wish I could be home more. I don't want to go back to work. But I was very clear. I was like, I wanna work.

I love work. I love doing what I do. I love my practice. But I didn't want to physically have to go somewhere and leave. Because in my mind, because I wasn't making the choices when I'm gone, I stay gone a long time and I have very little time at home. But I put that out in the universe. Just one statement. And honestly, I never thought about it again. I actually forgot about it. Because as soon as I got back, I was happy to

Corean Canty (25:33.731)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (25:48.398)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (25:59.055)
kind of get kind of back to normal and I got back into the swing of things. Like I said, he helped me somewhat. I wasn't working as long because for a long time you're tired even after you're done with treatment. So it took a while for my body to bounce back. But just a few weeks after my treatment ended, I got a reach out from where I'm working now. Somebody I had worked with before is the CEO of the company I'm at now. And he reached out and offered, um, a,

role or for me to apply for this role and they have been remote for a long time. And so I would be working from home and I actually looked at that as stressful thinking oh my gosh now I have to make this decision I just got done with this big thing in my life and my husband was like why are you stressing this is literally what you asked for you put it in the universe that this is what you want and this will allow you to be at home with your dogs with me.

and not have to be in traffic and some of the other things that you don't want to deal with that adds stressors to your life. And so to make it like, to just bring it back around, I did switch careers and for a short period of time, once again, I was really leaning into being at home and then I got right back to my bad habits where now it turned into, well, I'm at home so I don't have to do the commute hours so I can work extra or.

Let me just run back into the office really quick and answer this email and then I'm gone for an hour or two or all those bad things came creeping back in again within a few years.

Corean Canty (27:27.022)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (27:36.706)
Yeah, it's when we don't do the work, because we have a lot of these ahas, right? We have these moments, like in that one moment you had where you're fully present, your aha came, like the clarity came of like what you wanted. But then we jump back in the hamster wheel and when we don't do the work, even when we get the nudges and the whispers, even when we get the roars and we don't.

Kandi Gongora (27:47.109)
Yes.

Kandi Gongora (27:51.067)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (28:01.886)
intentionally design our lives and give ourselves permission to live the lives that we want to live. We've been doing these things for decades. We have these habits and we just recreate what we know. We can get in several different new environments. And I remember even like the first week when I left corporate and I literally had nothing. I had no emails. I had no IMs. I had nothing that I had to do.

Kandi Gongora (28:01.999)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (28:15.343)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (28:25.731)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (28:29.005)
Right.

Corean Canty (28:30.322)
I had to fill it with something to make me feel the pressure. I was creating all this like busy work and things and deadlines and I had to pause and be like, wait a minute, nobody's making me do this. I'm the boss. I don't have to answer to anybody. But my body was so conditioned to having to feel that pressure all the time. And I felt like I was lazy or I wasn't doing something like that whole grind hustle, work all the time mentality was so ingrained. Even when I knew and made the conscious choice to step away.

Kandi Gongora (28:40.705)
Right.

Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (28:51.993)
Right.

Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (29:00.394)
my body still wanted it. My body still wanted it. And so as you even created a new environment for yourself and got in kind of shifted into that next phase, same thing happened. We start recreating what we know. And so what helped you get past that?

Kandi Gongora (29:10.595)
Mm-hmm.

Same thing happened.

Kandi Gongora (29:20.323)
Well, once again, I started not feeling great and I've had things pop up again. And I, again, like to look for the root cause, like to dive in. I don't just accept it or just take medicine or just go to the doctor. Like I do those things, but I also try to figure out like what's really going on, what's happening here and start with myself. Cause again, I'm making the choices. No matter what happens, like I'm physically making these choices, physically and mentally.

And I realize that I'm not taking care of myself again, and I'm not putting myself first, even though now I mean, I literally have no reason. My partner, my husband, he does his fair share, if not more. I have great doctors, all the things, but it doesn't matter. It all comes back to me. So...

As I was getting sick more, I started questioning, and then I was questioning what's going on, but then I started hitting mental blocks. So my memory, after chemo my memory did change, but I could see it changing more. So I'm tired, have too much on my plate, I can't think. Right, so that was happening. I was having digestive issues, just a lot of things that were

not going to serve me and it scared me because if I'm not healthy, that's the one thing that I can control to keep the cancer away is being healthy, eating healthy, moving my body, keeping weight off, resting, resting is a big one and I wasn't doing any of those things and so I realized

Corean Canty (31:00.95)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (31:05.763)
I'm the few things I do have control over. I'm not managing. And so therefore I have no control over anything at the moment. And it became scary. And it was hitting me on all areas where, yes, I was doing the work and still coming to work and still, you know, having a good relationship with my family, but mentally I was drained and I was catching myself getting more emotional. I've always cried

Corean Canty (31:13.247)
Mmm.

Kandi Gongora (31:35.491)
when I'm angry like tears will come out which makes me more angry but these were different these were and it wasn't like boohoo it was just like this I was sad internally I don't know how to explain it I need to release and I could feel it because on the outside I'm fine but inside I was my body's sad like to your point and needed to get out and so having conversations with you or people who understand I was able to kind of articulate that and get it out there and then just almost like examine it like put it out there

Corean Canty (31:37.783)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (31:44.542)
You needed a relief. Your body needed a release. Yes.

Kandi Gongora (32:04.931)
Like when talking with you, we put it out there and we kind of look at it. What is it? What's going on? What's happening? And I decide, and I think that really hit me that I'm, I'm just repeating. Again, it's a trend and I'm the problem. And I'm, I'm aware of all these things. I, I study these things. I coach other people. I, you know, dive into the work that you do to learn more, you know, around things. And so it's not that I'm not educated.

Corean Canty (32:08.45)
Yeah.

Corean Canty (32:26.338)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (32:29.991)
I am, but I do have that tendency to put others first. In other words, I will jump up an opportunity to coach somebody or even personal train. Like I do kickboxing, I do conditioning work, I work out with your dog. I have a lot of side hustles. And I love doing that work and helping other people. I just never turn the mirror around to realize that I need to do it first for myself to take care of them. And this time, once I saw the trend and realized that

Corean Canty (32:30.027)
Yeah.

Corean Canty (32:38.434)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (32:50.199)
Yeah.

Corean Canty (32:53.718)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (32:59.879)
I asked for the environment I'm in right now. Nobody here at my current role is driving me to work tons of hours. In fact, they want, you know, we prefer to be more efficient and effective and do what you need to do. Nobody's counting your hours or seeing when you're online or anything. And so it's back to me. And so I've had conversations with my boss. We just talked about a sabbatical, you know? And he was like, just go. You were telling me the same thing.

But it's those mental blocks that just stop you and make you pause. I think that's where, now that I'm very conscious and very aware of it, I don't have to wait for the roar or the little signals. I catch almost like a pause in my thinking. And then I'm trying to like change directions then. And really question is, is this serving me? Because if it's not serving me, it's not gonna serve my corporate job either. I mean, if I'm sick, I'm not

Corean Canty (33:29.162)
Yeah, take the time.

Corean Canty (33:45.358)
Hmm.

Corean Canty (33:51.458)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (33:56.611)
doing the best work for them or our clients or our people. So it starts with me. And so now I'm catching myself. I'm being more intentional. I'm also looking at it. I'm very, very framework process, like got to have an action plan type person. So now that I see it and I know the works within myself, I've been doing other work around that. So

Corean Canty (33:59.255)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (34:20.335)
like learning about saboteur and sage. Like, you and I talked about that. We did that study together. That's helped me see like, oh, where does it come from? And I need to call it out, acknowledge it, and then take some little practices throughout the day to help me get that re-centered. But also, what can I do in my flow of work, whether it's my side hustles or my main job at the corporate world, what can I do to make sure that I'm leading my life and-

the company's not leading me. Let's be real, the company's not trying to lead me or ruin my life or any of those things. It's actually should be there to provide a benefit to my life, right? An outlet for my work, friendships, like our friendship, doing great work to celebrate, seeing people thrive and have huge success, seeing our clients do well. Those are all amazing things that should serve us well, but it's turned into something else, right?

Corean Canty (34:59.202)
Yes.

Corean Canty (35:04.528)
Yes

Corean Canty (35:14.89)
Yeah. It had, we've, we've talked a lot over the years about how, if you're working for a company, it needs to be a mutually beneficial relationship. And we've worked hard at building organizations to be that. And we have been advocates of people first programs and well-being programs in where our door is always open for everyone and everyone else.

Kandi Gongora (35:25.804)
Mm-hmm. Yes, yes. Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (35:38.662)
And like you said, we know, we know we've studied, we have the modalities, we have the certifications, we have the tools, we have the practices. Yet it's so hard to do it for ourselves. And that's why we all need mirrors, because we can't see our own face. We can know it. But we can't see our own face. And we sometimes we need reminders and tribes and support systems to help us remember that you can't pour from an empty cup.

Kandi Gongora (35:45.07)
Yes.

Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (35:51.939)
Right.

Kandi Gongora (36:00.091)
Absolutely.

Kandi Gongora (36:05.251)
You can't, and I think that was part of it too. So one practice I have is we do talk weekly, right? And so I can share like, this is what I'm thinking or this is what I'm struggling with. And sometimes you say nothing, but to validate me, but just be able to say it out loud in a place where it's accepted and not seen as lazy, or you need to stay busy, or all the things that society thinks we should do, like people who look at things differently. And so that keeps me on my path. But...

You know, now I really start with me and start with myself. And so one example is I look at my schedule a few weeks ahead and I schedule in my time, meaning I need to eat lunch and I need to be mindful while I'm eating, right? The basics, I need the basics. And what's crazy is that you hear people all the time, like, oh, you see them on calls. Once again, there is nobody at this company I'm at forcing you not to.

Corean Canty (36:41.198)
Mm-hmm.

Yes, the basics. I need to give myself the basics.

Kandi Gongora (37:00.035)
take a lunch or eat at your desk or whatever. I mean, our CEO, he's so smart. He leaves his house every day and goes by himself. And that's his time. It's his, where he can take time for himself, and just re-center and have a good meal and be mindful. And it's his time, it is blocked off. It's like, they're not expecting us to do something different but we have to create our own. We have to make sure one is the environment conducive to what we need, but then also we have to structure it. So I make sure I have time.

Corean Canty (37:01.101)
Yes.

Kandi Gongora (37:28.367)
for lunch, I make sure that I have a time, like I can move my body, whatever that looks like, and make sure that I walk outside every once in a while, go get the mail, don't schedule back to back, just block off some time and then block in, and then the work can fill in around that. And I have found, my fear was by doing that, I would not have time to get the work done. And what I have found is that actually have more time.

Corean Canty (37:32.163)
Yeah.

Corean Canty (37:45.417)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (37:56.579)
because I'm more effective, my brain's better. And so when I do have my time to do work, I'm fully present and prepared to do the work versus trying to eat, versus worrying about like, I haven't got out of this chair in six hours. And so I've tried to put practices in place where I can't go back and break the habits that my body and mind are used to, because there's still that little saboteur on my shoulder that when I do like,

Corean Canty (38:00.034)
Yes.

Corean Canty (38:21.342)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (38:25.755)
take a day off and do nothing that's sitting there going, you're being lazy, you're being lazy, you're not being productive. I just don't listen anymore as much.

Corean Canty (38:30.414)
Mm.

Yeah.

Corean Canty (38:36.254)
Yeah, it's time to learning how to reframe that into I'm getting the rest that will fuel everything that I need to do. And I think one of the points that you made throughout this conversation is how much choice we actually have. And so in, you know, leading teams and leading leaders and coaching a lot of people,

Kandi Gongora (38:40.691)
Yes.

Kandi Gongora (38:54.979)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (38:59.222)
The one thing I hear a lot of is, well, one day when I get this title, then I can make more time or I can't leave corporate because I need benefits. And the only way I can live the life I want is if I quit and I go become an entrepreneur and that's the only way. And we have all these other boxes and these ideas of these are the only ways to live the life we want. But I'm hearing you say that it's actually, no, it's realizing that...

Kandi Gongora (39:21.76)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (39:29.382)
we get to choose and create the environments that we're in and understanding first yourself and learning how to listen to your body and what you need and then learning how to actually ask for it and create space for it. And I know that you do a lot of this for other people at work in how you're leading. So

Kandi Gongora (39:36.571)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (39:48.428)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (39:49.93)
What would you say to someone who's feeling the exhaustion, they're feeling the whispers, they may be feeling the roars, they're thinking, oh, I'm going to have to find another job or I'm going to have to do something else or, you know, they're feeling in the relationship or whatever it may be. What would you say to them to help them start to find a way to shift and pivot and start to show up to the life that actually serves them instead of just the life that serves everyone else?

Kandi Gongora (40:18.503)
I think you said it is starting with themself, like really understanding what you want, like truly design, you have the ability to design your life. There may be some barriers and maybe trade offs, but ultimately it's your choices that you make. So I would start with yourself and really understand what are you trying to drive for. And maybe it's a big dream, a big vision, like eventually you do want to leave corporate and you want to start this thing and become

famous, well, what's the first steps to get there, you know, so it's not overwhelming. But I think just trying to write down what that looks like and for you to have that, what are some non-negotiables for you? And then look at where you're currently at. Because I do think that there's some really good organizations out there. There's some that are not, and I get that. But there are some really good organizations out there that have the environment that you can work with and within.

Corean Canty (40:51.743)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (41:17.539)
But you have to be clear on what you're looking for and what you're wanting. And so once you do that, then I would really question like where you're currently at. Is that reasonable? Can that happen? What do you have control over that you can make happen? For example, nobody tells me what I have to do at what hour or when I can go to lunch or when I can't go to lunch or how to schedule my day. I have full control over that. As long as I get the work done, I have full control. So I need to do that.

Corean Canty (41:39.555)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (41:43.083)
Right? So question and figure out like, where do I have control and what can I do? And then the areas that are conflicts have a conversation. Um, you know, do you, maybe you want to, maybe you need to work certain hours on a certain day because of family or something like have a conversation. So many times I think we assume it's not possible and maybe it isn't, but if they tell you, then you know, and then you have another choice to make and being really clear when you.

Corean Canty (41:43.851)
Yeah.

Corean Canty (42:05.316)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (42:09.878)
Yes.

Kandi Gongora (42:12.523)
are looking for a role. It's not, I think, myself included, it was about title, money, and the work I was going to do. And don't get me wrong, I need money to live on, right? I do want to be able to afford bills and different things. And I do wanna have success in my career, however that looks, whether it's gaining skills, certification, titles, whatever that is. I do want those things, but not at the cost of other things. My relationships.

Corean Canty (42:23.864)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (42:34.722)
Mm-hmm.

Corean Canty (42:41.182)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (42:42.147)
health, all those other things. So I don't think that we really, we focus on our resume when we're looking for work. Do we really focus on designing? Like what's our life design like? And then how do we make sure that we're using that wonderfully put together resume to apply to the organizations that could probably get you closer to that life?

Corean Canty (42:54.602)
Yes

Corean Canty (43:04.818)
Yes, I love that when I'm working with clients on life design, one of the main things that we do is we focus on understanding what's our ideal day, not what's our ideal job, not what's our ideal title. What's our ideal day from the time that you wake up in the morning until the time you close your eyes? What would really bring you the most joy, make you feel the most alive, give you all of the things that you really want to experience in this one big beautiful life that we're living right now? And

Kandi Gongora (43:09.507)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (43:14.351)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (43:32.41)
Right.

Corean Canty (43:33.202)
Once you get really clear on that, because the one thing I found is that sometimes that's really hard for people to answer because they answer with all the things that they should want, all the things that society told them they should want. And so we have to really do the work until they can really get back to like, but what do I want? What really fills my cup? What did I give up in exchange for checking these boxes? And then once they get clear on that, then you have the tools.

Kandi Gongora (43:44.408)
Yes.

Kandi Gongora (43:54.212)
Mm-hmm. Right.

Corean Canty (44:01.334)
to not only negotiate for getting paid what you're worth, doing the type of work that aligns with those things, but also how to negotiate for more joy and happiness, how to negotiate for the flexibility to be able to do the things to take care of yourself on a regular basis so that you can provide the most value, not only to yourself, but to the organizations. Because if we're constantly stressed out and in fight or flight, all those good parts of our brain are shut off. And so...

Kandi Gongora (44:06.896)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (44:14.809)
Yes.

Corean Canty (44:31.01)
They're not getting much from us anyway. And I think that's the thing that a lot of organizations have to learn and change their culture around and put wellbeing at the top of the list, because we all benefit from that.

Kandi Gongora (44:32.307)
Mm-hmm. They're not, no.

Kandi Gongora (44:45.763)
Absolutely. I never thought about there's trade offs, of course, but you know, as you're sitting here talking, I'm thinking through there's, I bet there's people out there. I've been there myself in the past where you actually feel like you deserve more money, more pay because of what you have to put up with or because of what

Corean Canty (45:07.47)
Ah, yes.

Kandi Gongora (45:08.247)
what the environment's like, right? Or you want the title. Well, if I'm gonna have to do this and work all these hours, then I need the title or I need more money. And it's interesting because that's not good trade-offs if you think about it. Everybody wants to be paid fair, but fair is around market, if you think from an HR standpoint, like market range, what's been the market and then what value do you bring? How does that fit in? Not, I hate it here, I don't have a life, and so I deserve more money. But...

Corean Canty (45:21.131)
Right.

Corean Canty (45:36.938)
Yeah, because that money doesn't do anything for you if all you're doing is working and you're not experiencing life.

Kandi Gongora (45:37.943)
Yeah, I never thought about that way. No.

Right, right, exactly. And so I think that's a key part of it. And then I think the other thing is when you're, when you talk about designing your life, what understanding who we are, you know, I shared that I was adopted, which drove a lot of things. And I didn't think about that for a long time, but there's things in our background that we either haven't worked through, thought about, or understand how it contributes to our, where we are at and how we show up. But I think I'll never forget, and this was an indicator for me too,

Corean Canty (46:06.774)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (46:11.895)
I told you about my coach at SMU. An exercise, the very first, very elementary exercise, I know this now, but, you know, gives me a piece of sheet of paper and says, list all your roles, like, who are you? And so it's just a blank sheet of paper that says, I am blank, I am blank, I am blank. And there's no really instructions other than just share with me who you are. And I went to, I am a director at the time I was a director. I am a director.

Corean Canty (46:33.09)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (46:40.307)
I am a soccer manager of two soccer teams. I am a mom, I am a wife, I am a whatever. All of it would look like that, right? And so when I took it to her, she was like, this is not who you are, these are things you do. Or roles you play. I'm like, no, that's pretty much who I am. It's just like, no, it's not. And that, I think, think about it from that standpoint too, like who are you and what,

Corean Canty (46:56.739)
Oh, yes.

Corean Canty (47:05.207)
Yes.

Kandi Gongora (47:10.211)
What do you bring to the table? And I think that also goes into your life design because none of those things mattered. I mean, they did, but not really. They're not defining who I am. But if I looked at it that way, that just drove in the perfectionism, working all the time, having to be the best at all the things, right? They actually drove in that mindset. And so I think that's a key part too, is when you sit down and figure out what you want. Like, who are you?

Corean Canty (47:19.52)
Yeah.

Kandi Gongora (47:40.379)
And that kind of leads into as well, like what do you want to achieve with this life and how do you use those things that are so beneficial because you provide them because it's who you are.

Corean Canty (47:46.347)
Yes.

Corean Canty (47:52.01)
Yeah, there's only one you and I love that. I love that so much because when people come to me and they say, I need to figure out my purpose. I don't know what I want to do. I, and it's always like, what do I do? I don't, I don't have a passion. I don't know what to do. And your purpose isn't what you do. Your purpose is who you be. And when you're fully being who you are, then by default, the things that you do will be fulfilling your purpose on this planet.

Kandi Gongora (47:55.124)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (48:02.619)
Right.

Kandi Gongora (48:12.432)
Right.

Kandi Gongora (48:16.676)
Mm-hmm.

Kandi Gongora (48:20.485)
Yes.

Corean Canty (48:21.394)
And so I love, love that. Thank you for sharing all of these little nuggets of your journey. I do have some rapid fire questions that I love to ask and they're just kind of fun. And I think it'd be the perfect way to wrap up this episode. And so the first one is what's currently your favorite part of the day.

Kandi Gongora (48:35.355)
Okay. Alright.

Kandi Gongora (48:43.279)
All right, I'm ready.

Kandi Gongora (48:51.711)
Mm. So as you know, we've recently acquired a lake house and we're probably gonna move out there as we're downsizing, but we have this new couch and the house is just small and cozy and it really can vary the time of day, but it's more or less when I have all of my need to do's done.

whether it's the chores that my husband and I agreed to do on a Saturday morning before we go play or it's my corporate job or maybe even just reading a book for myself, whatever it is, when that's done, just grabbing a warm cozy drink and setting on my new couch, which is so cozy and it has enough room for all the dogs and just being still for a moment. That's like my favorite time of the day. And sometimes it happens in the morning. Sometimes it happens in the evening, but

Corean Canty (49:31.999)
Yes.

Kandi Gongora (49:47.891)
I look forward to it and it's really and think about it. I'm not being lazy I'm right. I don't even think about it that way though, but I'm being cozy. I'm like I'm feeling all the feels I'm being with the people, you know, my husband joins too. Like we just thought we're gonna do next But it's like I'm surrounded by The things that are important with really no agenda but just being for a moment, it's It's amazing feeling. Mm-hmm

Corean Canty (49:50.368)
Oh, yeah.

Corean Canty (49:54.723)
No, no, you're not. Yes.

Corean Canty (50:09.206)
Yeah. You're being present and resting in the moment, which I think is beautiful. So you kind of answered the next question, but I'll ask it anyway, in case you want to clarify, but I'm thinking it's the couch and it's what's your current cozy?

Kandi Gongora (50:17.175)
Yes.

Kandi Gongora (50:24.087)
Yes. That's my current cozy. I got a Lovesac Sactional and it is so cozy and has deep seats. We're not getting paid to say that, but man, but I love it. But yeah, I think that's my cozy right now where I just want to, I could just curl up with a good blanket and I have lots of good blankets and just sit there for a long time.

Corean Canty (50:33.366)
And we're not getting paid to say that. That's just what you love.

Corean Canty (50:48.298)
Yes. And lots of cute little dogs to keep you warm. What is your, yes, what is your go-to feel good song?

Kandi Gongora (50:54.683)
Yes, and keep me company.

Kandi Gongora (51:03.743)
Well, I have so many as you know, I love music. I think right now and is kind of tied to my cozy right now my I'm when I wear like I'm celebrating or something fun's happening. I have love sack a shack almost it love shack that plays and my husband teases me now because he sings love sack instead since we're loving the couch so much but that one it just I don't know it's just kind of it's old school but it's

Corean Canty (51:20.171)
Ha

Kandi Gongora (51:32.759)
Right now that's just, that's what I'm feeling. Yeah, it is fun. I just wanna dance. Yeah, I wanna play and dance and sing like nobody's listening and don't care if they are. Right, that brings me joy.

Corean Canty (51:35.138)
Yeah, it's fun. We need more playful, fun things. Yes.

Corean Canty (51:45.034)
Yes. I think we should all have dance breaks. I've actually been doing like dance breaks before I wind down in the evening recently because I realized I hadn't been listening to enough music. So I weave it back in that way.

Kandi Gongora (51:51.921)
Ooh.

Kandi Gongora (51:57.371)
I love that. I'll tell you something. So one, when I celebrate something at work, a lot of times I'll send, I'll do a dance, a single dance party, record it and send it to my employees because they think it's funny. Right. When I, yeah, but we need more dance party. We do. But the video that when I saw you last and we're in the car and your other friends took video from time to time, I will pull that up just because one, the music's fun.

Corean Canty (52:08.079)
I love that. We need more dance and play.

Kandi Gongora (52:23.587)
But to seeing all of us dance and be so happy and carefree, it just, it brings me joy. So yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yes.

Corean Canty (52:29.266)
Yes, yes. And for the listeners, after my Ted Talk, Kandi is such a great friend. She flew to come see it in person. Me and her and a few of my other really good friends had a dance party in the car listening to like 90s dance music. And it was the best time. The cars around us probably thought, I don't know what they thought, but it was the best time. And that's all that matters.

Kandi Gongora (52:45.487)
Ha ha ha.

Yes, it was the best. It was so much fun.

Kandi Gongora (52:55.007)
Who knows? We were present. We didn't even look at other cars. Yeah. Yep.

Corean Canty (52:59.454)
Yes, we did. Yes, we did. What is one thing that you currently do for your 80-year-old self?

Kandi Gongora (53:07.527)
move my body. I'm thankful for my body. I'm thankful, right? I'm thankful for my health right now. So I move my body, even if it's cold, I'll walk or I'll find something to do. But I move my body.

Corean Canty (53:09.1)
Mm, yes.

Corean Canty (53:18.25)
Awesome. Very important. And the last question is, how do you remember to live?

Kandi Gongora (53:26.903)
When I wake up in the morning and I wake up and I'm feeling good, I'm breathing, I'm getting up that's when I remember when I actually when I literally my feet hit the ground because I know what it's like to not feel good and have pain and wonder if you're even going to live and so I've made that a practice of when I my feet touch the ground I tell myself that I have to make this day worth it. Not doing too much.

Just enjoy it. Just show up. Yeah, yeah.

Corean Canty (53:58.575)
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Show up to it. Yes. Oh, oh, this has been such a great conversation. You know, I could talk to you every day, all day, any day, but I'm so grateful that you joined me. And for all the people out there, I'd love for you to share where they could find you, connect with you, and tap into your expertise.

Kandi Gongora (54:07.457)
Oh, same.

Kandi Gongora (54:20.239)
Sure, two places are probably the best. One would be LinkedIn, of course, Kandi Gongora it's my LinkedIn. And then, if you, you know, I do Instagram somewhat, you'll see a lot of dogs, but I do some things on there from time to time, but that's @kgongora is my Instagram handle, but happy to connect with anyone. I love to continue the conversation with people who are on their journey or.

been on the journey a long time, they can share their practices, but love it when people reach out.

Corean Canty (54:53.334)
Thank you, thank you, thank you, my friend.

Kandi Gongora (54:55.971)
Thank you, it's been so much fun to be here with you today.